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Microsoft Switcher Ads: Part 2
burgburgburg writes "We all recall Microsoft's last attempt to emulate the Apple Switch ads. Well, it seems they're at it again. MacNN reports that Microsoft has sent out emails to those who have recently registered MS products, looking for candidates for their 'Sensible Solutions' campaign, which will 'highlight computer professionals that have recently converted from Apple Computer products to Microsoft based systems.' Do you qualify? You must be 'a US resident with a minimum of 3 years experience as a computer professional. You must have used an Apple Computer product and a Microsoft based system as part of your work'. So when does it just stop being the sincerest form of flattery and just become utter, pathetic laziness?"
I have been using computers since the late 80's. In fact, in the beginning we used AppleIIs, for artwork etc... now that im 17 years older, I have switched to Photoshop on a WinXP platform.
would that count O:-)
Sig- http://www.dreamhost.com/rewards.cgi?ayefly
You must also have a picture on a photo library CD.
Right about ... now.
I recently switched to Windows XP, because my Mac Powerbook is broken. So while I wait for that to get fixed, I borrowed a PC from work. I can't wait to get my Mac back.. oh wait, was I not supposed to say that? Do I still get paid?!
Why insist on calling it laziness? Maybe the switcher ads just work -- and it's always good sense to copy what is known to work well...
If Microsoft knows the ads are working for Apple, they'd be stupid not to use them themselves....
I was writing a paper, and it was, like, beep, beep, beep, beep, beep.
And then, like, half of my paper was gone.
And I was, like, heh. It devoured my paper.
It was a really good paper. And then I had to do it again and I had to do it fast so it wasn't as good.
It's kind of a bummer.
Microsoft is basically afraid because Apple has openly admitted their old OS wasn't so great, and the new MacOS has everyone switching to a Mac.. I used to hate mac's but now I use one for every day tasks, even work.. Microsoft may try a switch campaign, and they will get people to do it.. but for every switch ad microsoft makes, 500 more people just bought a mac and ditched their old PC's which can't run XP.
your "Sensible Solution" right here in my pants!
What Microsoft needs is an Ellen Feiss equivalent. How are they going to get her if they ask for 3 years experience as a computer professional?
Went to the local Apple store, and at the Genius Bar there was a man dejectedly putting a brand-new 15" TiBook back into his briefcase. The websites he visits are all optimized for Windows and the software he uses daily (he's a financial planner) comes in Windows-only (and yes, he tried Virtual PC, to no avail). He's selling his TiBook and going back to Windows. The lack of software I can almost understand, but companies that refuse to make their websites accessible and usable to anything other than WIndows IE are demonstrating either major ignorance on customer service, a blatant disregard for standards, or both.
"Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former."
But the adds will never have the pure appeal of the Mac switch adds. "TCO amoritized over the year saved us $$" is not "bleep, bleep, bleep, bleep, gone!"
I have an expensive Mac. It strikes me as slow, sometimes. I get annoyed when software comes out for the PC first. But I'm not giving it up for anything.
"A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming, is not worth knowing" - Alan Perlis
I suggest trying to find someone who is somewhat inebriated and/or high.
When you control 95% of the OS and office-suite markets, who else do you have to convince?
The remaining fringe is going to avoid MS no matter what.
Are they just trying to save face against semi-influential Apple ads?
Depends how much MS will pay me.
I've got a PC with XP sitting here, right next to my TiBook, 17" iMac, CRT iMac, G3 Powerbook, OS X Servers...
I'm sensable, I use my PC for the same things my GameCube and PS2 are for...games.
If they've copied everything else from Apple, why not copy their advertisements?
Well....I was using Mac and old Apple II for over 10 years and my current work is mostly on Windows platform. So I've been using PC's for 7 years now and I'm currently looking to go back to the mac.
So, what I'm wondering is....How much time will the switcher MS find will stay on MS platform?
Apple user are loyal users and I rarely found people moving to windows and staying there.
But, the other way around is also true.
So, I think it's really more a idea of being used to a platform....trying the other one and not finding what you are used to find...then moving back.
I think this is sad on Microsofts part. Their copying apple with a succesful campaign but coming too late to the party. A lot of it is in the timing and I think Apple's switch has done all it can in mindshare
The biggest part of the apple campaign is that people have left the common world of windowsk, one that people dont think of leaving because they see nothing else but MS MS MS everywhere. Then to switch to Apple or indeed anything smaller is a big task and it can be seen as an active choice
For a switch to windows sounds like 'I used to use X but then I joined the herd' and gave in to peer pressure. Its hardly the same thing
note: the slashdot user 'danamania' is a transexual. beware
So like, I had this Mac. But I started hanging with this "other" crowd, and they were all PC users, so like, I am too now. It's been good. But now I have leprosy. Is that supposed to come with WinXP? Is it a feature or something? My name's night, and I'm a bell-jingling diseased rodent. : D /my Karma has just committed suicide.
When does it just stop being the sincerest form of flattery and just become utter, pathetic laziness? A long, long time ago. You would think a company that has roundly trounced their chief rival wouldn't need to keep pursuing the same simian mimicry strategy over and over again. Isn't market share in excess of 90% about the time that blatant rip-offs are no longer necessary? It's amazing that the paranoia that has allowed Microsoft to succeed has become so ingrained as to be utilized in an effort to stave off a competitor with what... 3% global market share? Pathetic was indeed the right word to describe this shameless copycat behavior.
--
i mean, how else can you show off all the money you have, but by using lots of expensive stock photography from the photo library you absorbed.
is it just me, or is m$ just like Cartman's Trapper Keeper?? windows, combine with crappy media player, windows insorping . . . . . .
yes, this is what happens when you post at 3 am after you came home from a bar.
"You never want a serious crisis to go to waste." - Rahm Emanuel
From an Apple 2 to a C64 and then to a PC have been using various flavors of Windows since then, then came XP and the day my machine locked me out because I switched too many hardware components I had to call Microsoft to justify what I have done to my computer because their software locked me out was the day I bought a SuSE box. Does that count, I switched from Apple to Microsoft and then away.
"I got... your "Sensible Solution" right here in my pants!"
First time I ever seen a pair of pants, bluescreen before.
What "business" software do most people run that can't be run on a mac? Excel? Quickbooks? Quicken? Word? I mean I know people have personal preferences but honestly, I don't get it, whats so 'un business like' about a mac? Is it the fact that they don't look dull and boring like office supplies and cubicles?
I found out that the switcher's story is recursively enumerable. Below is the grammar. Feel free to use this for your application essay.
Hi, my name is <IDENTIFIER>. I am (a|an) <IDENTIFIER> [from <IDENTIFIER>].
I used (Apple|Macintosh) version <FLOAT_LITERAL> for <INTEGER_LITERAL> (years|months) doing (documents | spreadsheets | databases | video editing | MP3 listening | surfing the net | <OTHER_FUN_JOBS>)+. It was all (fun | very nice | pleasant experience) at the beginning.
But, later on I discovered that (it has only one mouse button | some software I bought wasn't supported | their hardwares are so expensive | <REASON_WHY_IT_SUCKS>)+. Since I was only (a yet another broke graduate students | an unemployed bum | a clueless luser | <REASON_WHY_I_SUCKS>)+, I found out that their solution is [completely | absolutely] unviable.
(Enter | Here comes) Microsoft. They provide me (MS Office | MS Windows | <OTHER_MS_SOFTWARE>)+. It is really (a panacea | working like magic | <REASON_WHY_ITS_GREAT>)+. Now I can (surfing a lot faster | do my spreadsheet even better | <OTHER_PRAISES>)+. Even more, I can get added bonus, like (the great blue screen | DRM constricted media player | compulsory activation | <OTHER_STUFF>)+, which makes my computer eXPerience even better.
Now that I switched. How about you?
--
Error 500: Internal sig error
someone that has used a mac for at least 3 years, then switched to windows, and has something nice to say about microsoft products!
they will have to send a whole lot of mail to reach one of those 3!
Acts@core.mailboks.com Acrux@core.mailboks.com Adam@core.mailboks.com Adar@core.mailboks.com Ada@core.mailboks.com
WRONG!
The correct way is 3 * 5 sqr
4 keystrokes.
Godfuckit people, thats like saying 2 * 2 =
4 keystrokes
5 Enter 5 Enter 4 Enter 2 Enter * * *
12 Keystrokes
But honestly now, how many times has the death bell "tolled' for apple? Every other year, it seems. I remember a quote right after Jobs released the iMac, something to this effect: "The iMac may be doing well, but it's just a momentary rise in the otherwise downward trend of apple. They're doomed."
I wonder when people will realize that Apple is the only tech company in this time actually doing well and not drowning in red ink. Apple will never die as long as it it has its hardcore section of fans.
Hell, they control more market share than Subaru, and they've been around since at least the seventies. No one's saying they're going bankrupt.
It's because nobody else but Apple can make anything as cool as this.
Apple leads. Anyone else watch the Macworld 2003 speech? Notebooks, Safari, Keynote, Firewire 800, etc. Sheesh.
(And I don't even use a Mac.)
LadyStar - Your Magical and Mysterious Adventure Awaits
LOL. Where did you read that? They can barely get Mac users to switch to OS-X, let alone grab a significant number of Windows users.
Uh.. do a little research into a tiny thing called NeXTStep.. It was quite robust for development of serious business apps. You are, quite frankly, pulling comments out of your ass.
I'd like you to provide some examples of why Macs are unsuitable for business.
slashdot!=valid HTML
I am a homosexual. I bought an Apple computer because of its well earned reputation for being "the" gay computer. Since I have become an Apple owner, I have been exposed to a whole new world of gay friends. It is really a pleasure to meet and compute with other homos such as myself. I plan on using my new Apple computer as a way to entice and recruit young schoolboys into the homosexual lifestyle; it would be so helpful if you could produce more software which would appeal to young boys. Thanks in advance.
with much gayness,
Father Randy "Pudge" O'Day, S.J.
well, if you were under 18 when Windows ME came out, then, yes, Gates did rape you as a child.
They're only admitting how hard it is to find professionals who switch platforms by having to resort to mail-outs.
When we were using Apple computers, my job was in serious danger of being downsized. They were easy to use and almost never crashed.
Fortunately, due to Microsoft license incentives, my company switched to PC's running Windows.
What a relief! The stress I was suffering over job security is gone! In fact, I just got a fat raise because the bosses have seen how hard I've been working.
Sure, I'm busier now, and I may not have the spare time to check Slashdot incessantly, but that's why they call it work, right?
My reasons are: PIII)Want games, want to add hardware when I want from just about whatever source I want. The PIII is mostly a frankenstein of parts either bought or traded from friends. Unfortunatly I could not do this with a Mac.
But...
iBook) Want small, only 12.1 inch screen, the thing is tiny, fits in my backpack no prob. My friend's dell required him to buy a new "laptop" backpack. Want tough, magnesium caseing, rubber mounted hard drive, the thing is like a small tank in the laptop world. Want Unix, without all the trouble linux causes in laptops. Yeah I know it is very possible to have a very workable linux laptop, but I don't think it is possible to have a very workable linux laptop that works out the box, and I can send back to the company when the DVD-CDRW drive goes kaput.
Would I own a Mac desktop, at the moment, hell no! They would need to be more competative in both the speed and the price arenas for me to even consider it.
But my point is this, there are people out there who have weighed the differences and made the choice of both. OSX is easy, and fast, and pretty. Win2K (sorry don't know about XP) is where most of my professional experience lays so troubleshooting it easy, and it plays games, and it was hella cheap ($50 OEM version when I bought my HDD).
Note to self: No more arguing with the faithful.
Go take a look at what's available for Macs these days, and then try to tell me that a machine/OS that can run M$ Office (though I prefer OpenOffice, even on Windoze) PLUS a ton of GNU stuff PLUS -- if you really realy need it a whole fookin PC or two.
I'm running Win2K Server (for SQL Server crap) and, just because I *can*: FreeBSD 5.0. Oh -- all at the same time.
I'm not one of those "creative" types, either -- I just wanted the best machine I could buy for getting stuff done, and after more than a decade of rolling my own PC hardware, I Switched(tm). Apple finally put something together that, taken as a whole, can't be matched on any other platform.
The thought of another Microsoft switch campaign strikes me funny, as I spent a good portion of my day trying to get XP to stop crashing every 5 minutes or so. I'm so very happy that I didn't spend the extra money and buy another Mac. *sigh*
Yes. Macs are slow. The ads are meant to sell to user types. As far as crashing goes, yes they used to,or so I hear, but my G4 hasn't crashed in 8 months. Windows sucked just as bad back then too.
You (and this is assuming you have the brains to make an informed, bias free decision), have the right to choose what's right for you. My choice of what's right ranges from Blade servers to Intel/Linux to Onyx's but the Mac is my workstation, and it's staying.
"A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming, is not worth knowing" - Alan Perlis
-1 Redundant ;)
and it was like expensive hardware and all coloured and stuff and i was like duh so i bought a PC and it's like way cooler cuz it dumps physical memory all the time and i thought thats cool and stuff but all my friends were like who cares which monopoly you give the money too when you just send like email and some AIM messages and i was like duh as if i could use an old dumb pengiun computer like my brother my friends might think im like a nerd or something /roll eyes
ok correct me if im wrong, which i very well could be, but when Apples shares were worth virtually nothing a few years ago i thought that i remembered something about M$ buying up bunches of the shares until they owned like 49%... so they really dont have any say in the company and they avoid the whole antitrust monopoly thing, but either way they win... right..??
sig is broken try again tomorrow
Couldn't they just get Sinbad?
If you think
Sometimes I get the feeling that MS has been so dominant in the OS market for so long, some of the old-timers still in charge actually miss the days where they had any adversaries.
So they keep their eyes too open and attack even the tiny companies that fight over whatever MS leaves behind.
What exactly does MS expect to gain from its campaign...? 30, maybe 35 people crazy enough to switch? Maybe, ooh, a 1% sales increase in the most wildly optimistic aftermath?
And besides, to take on MacOs X in its current form, you either have to have an incredibly good piece of software, or you just have to be stupid enough to try and spin truths to gain consumer loyalty. Since MS never had any of the former, they have to try the latter.
I have this to say:
1. Apple's switcher ads are dumb, as are Microsoft's. In addition, I find them distasteful.
2a. Don't you think that people who 'feel' things about their computer need to get out in the sunshine a bit more?
2b. Are said people really the best kinds to be trumpeting the superiority of your product on TV? Apple's marketing department has successfully sold the idea that our modern world is so devoid of emotion, what with all these techno-gagetry. Its sucking our humanity away! But Apple's not like that. No sir! Why, some of humanity's greatest heroes used Macs. People like Ghandi, and Einstein, even Martin Luther King! And look, here are some regular Joes just like you and me! So buy a Mac, and get some simulated love in your life. Or, if you are poor, a tamagochi.
3. This is wild speculation here, but my sense is that many people who buy Macs as a lifestyle accessory tend to have a bright-eyed, future-looking aspect about them that brings to mind some sort of cyber-squirrel optimistically gazing into a techno-utopia, Powerbook clutched tightly to their chest, only they'd really rather not have to deal with the icky messiness of a regular PC, because the overall lack of cuteness doesn't match their Jetta, lifestyle or vision of techno-Utopia.
"It's Dot Com!"
Why is it that you can be really stupid and worthless in your first paragraph and brilliantly insiteful in your second?
You're right, the world would be a much better place if we just nuked the fucking yanks!
It would hardly qualify as an 'ad' if the 'ad' was information-rich.
That would be called a manual.
I have to agree about the vomitous mass rising in my throat when I think about apple marketing. I never understood why anyone would want to celebrate their ignorance like that.
Would Yoyo Ma be down with a more "outside the box" brand of cellos?
Who wants to spend Christmas practicing cello? Now I can just put the cello between my legs and beautiful music comes out. It lets me get in there and tinker. It just works.
He painted a unicorn in outer space. I'm askin' ya, what's it breathin'?
I don't see Ellen Feiss switching back to Windows :)
So when does it just stop being the sincerest form of flattery and just become utter, pathetic laziness?
Approximately 15 years ago.
I have an expensive Mac. It strikes me as slow, sometimes. I get annoyed when software comes out for the PC first. But I'm not giving it up for anything.
I hear you about the performance issue. I've found the G4/MacOSX combo to have "baffling" performance. Many apps and many functions are zippy as can be, but yet there are still a few areas that can be slow. Resizing a window, for example, is pretty slow for all but the most lightweight applications. Apple's iCal calendar app also has a tendancy to chug pretty hard. Yet this very same machine is an absolute video monster. Final Cut Pro runs like a dream, I'm using "just" an 867 MHz machine, yet I couldn't really ask for any faster video editing performance. The app's gui is fast, scrubbing thru frames is fast, applying layers is fast. It's great! True, I don't do much compositing, so my render times are almost instant... but then, neither do most folks. (though I have heard that some folks are finding iMovie 3 to be somewhat slow) I've also found Photoshop to be extremely fast for the images I work with (never larger than 2048x2048). Others have reported zippy compile and run performance of command-line apps, though I haven't tried this out myself.
Perhaps Apple is still in the early stages of tweaking Mac OS X... maybe they're working on the demanding areas first and will eventually touch up the more minor performance issues (window resize, for example).
Look boyo, you cannot have it both ways. Are we talking cheap 4 banger alg, or TI graphics calc alg?
For a graphics calc, my example is correct. 4 bangers mostly use RPN anyway.
How would you do 1/ (1/5 + 1/6 + 1/7) on a 4 banger? I can do it with
5 # 6 # 7 # + + # = 9 keystrokes
where # is the 1/x key. Doing that on a 4 banger uses *much* more keystrokes.
Go on, prove me wrong. Give me an example
The unrighteous stumble against thee that they may be justly plagued, fleeing from thy gentleness and colliding with thy justice, and falling on their own rough paths. For in truth they do not know that thou art everywhere; that no place contains thee, and that only thou art near even to those who switch and go farthest from thee.
Let them, therefore, switch and seek thee, because even if they have abandoned thee, their Creator, thou hast not abandoned thy creatures. Let them switch back and seek thee--and lo, thou art there in their hearts, there in the hearts of those who confess and switch to thee.
And where was I when I was seeking thee? There thou wast, before me; but I had switched, even from myself, and I could not find myself, much less thee.
For my prayer is not for earthly things, neither gold nor silver and precious stones, nor gorgeous apparel, nor honors and power, nor fleshly pleasures, nor of bodily necessities in this life of our pilgrimage: all of these things are "added" to those who switch.
HAHA. Man...I wish I had some mod points to give out for that one. So true...so blunt...
I recall it being $120 million. (Purely nominal, as a "vote of confidence," of non-voting stock). Since sold, at a profit.
-Gareth
I'm a computer tech for a large global enterprise.
When we were using windows computers, my job was in serious danger of being downsized. They were easy to use and and everyone and their mother was an MCSE.
Fortunately, due to Microsoft licenses, my company switched to PC's running Linux.
What a relief! The stress I was suffering over job security is gone! In fact, I just got a fat raise because the bosses think that Linux is so difficult, yet I never work!
I've learned needlepoint. And I knitted a blanket. Oh, I WISH these darn computers would CRASH already!!! I'm so bored!
If you're not a Liberal in your 20's, then you have no heart.If you're still a Liberal in your 30's you have no brain.
Complain loudly and numerously to info@codex.lu.
Say no to software patents.
seriously - I've been at the computer thing for a while now, I have not known a SINGLE person that registered their windows. I mean, heck man - does that email list have a whole 7 recipients?
Of course, most of the replies otherwise would be like "I went from Apple to MS because I can pirate more software and play more games."
though - sadly, there is a bunch of people who are forced to use mycrudsoft. When the IT dept tells some apple die-hards that they are getting PC laptops or nothing at all, because they want to have "one platform" - though the powerbooks would actually cost less (seriously), last longer on flights, and preserve their values better. Sigh... maybe MS can base their campain on that: Switch - because we make you.
fuckers. (hmm... do I sound bitter?)
My life in the land of the rising sun.
Well I just ordered a AMD 2000+ with a motherboard for 90$
Have a extra 120 gig hard drive laying around
Extra case laying around/accessories
Ordered a Radeon 9000 for 100$
and got half a gig of ram for 60$ to build a computer...
And a copy of Mac OSX to put on it oh oh wait thats right...
Maybe some people just want to have a computer that does what they want, and think *gasp* they might be better served by a PC.
A typical case of YMMV. I find my Mac gets in my way a lot less than my PC (Windows *.*) does.
Pathetic Laziness? You mean like Linux desktop design and conventions?
From my experience, a huge number of people have at some point switched from Macs to Windows. While not as elegant for early computer users, you won't have the nasty incompatibility problem with everyone you know who's not a graphic designer... (I'm a graphics/development guy.)
-Money_shot
If I watch one of these ads with the knowledge that all of these people registered their software with Microsoft, I will have even less faith in their testimonials than I do in Apple's "Hey, you want to be on TV?" approach to choosing "switchers."
"I used to use *nix but then I joined the HURD"?
My IP is 192.168.1.100 Hack it if you want.
I think this campaign is not aimed at Mac users and convincing them to switch to Windows, but rather an attempt to stop the herd of Windows users out there from considering Macs. I bet these ads will be loaded with implied falsehoods (i.e., Word and Explorer doesn't run on Macs, can't network on Macs, etc.)
--Rick "If it isn't broken, take it apart and find out why."
"story based on an employee of an its marketing agency"
^M
-MacNN -- "looks good"
- should I make an example?
rehab, captain ahab, you're chasing the wrong fish!
Kewl dood
I'd probably do it like this
210 / 107 = 7 muthafuckin keystrokes
of course, you have to understand what the hell you are doing to do that. Kina hard when you're a HP jizwad
Oh yeah, it's called postfix you insensitive clod!!!
So.... what does that leave left to advertise? It must get pretty boring working in Microsofts adverts department. I expect they've got bored of spamming OSDN, that was a good wheeze for a while, but now they have to do something to make the long winter days go past right?
Anyway, it's not like MS are actually threatened by Apple, anybody who runs the numbers can see that. It's just a side show, an entertaining game to try and give the surface appearance that there's actually competition in the markets.
So, since you believe anything good should only be done by the original company to invent it, I assume you buy nothing but IBM parts if you have a PC, and would never think of using anything non-Apple with your Mac, and that if you have a PC, it would have to run an MS operating system.
Also, I must assume you drive a Ford, should you have a car. And that you haven't bought a modem since Hayes went out of business, and that your phone is made by Bell or AT&T, etc, etc.
In my opinion, if something works well, why _not_ use it? It's exactly that sort of NIH mentality that helps keep Apple at position #2.
If you could be told what you can see or read, then it follows that you could be told what to say or think - BoC
Kina hard when you're a HP jizwad
Do realise that you are simply a pawn of TI's extenstive propaganda, don't you?
I challenge you to give me a formulate that takes more then a keystroke to do in RPN vs ALG.
windows users are the only ones who dont have a strong connection to their operating system.
there's linux users who tend to be very anti-microsoft, there's mac users who in my experiance are very fanatical. then there's windows users like me. i use windows, it works quite well for me, and i've been using it as long as i can remember, but i dont feel the need to be pushy or get on other people's cases about using a different os, and i dont feel any reluctance to learn other os's as well.
i use windows, for no better reason than it's what's on my pc, and i dont like one button mice.
Fred Ghaller Piro from MegaTokyo, just switched to a Mac himself! (read his rant)
Owned that bitch's pathetic ass!
I challenge your sorry HP jizwad ass to give me a situation where it fucking matters.
Graphic calculators are for the weak to store notes in. And for crappy teachers to 'demonstrate' functions to even more dimwitted students.
To make this switch ad more interesting.
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
I RTFA, and started reading the comments, only to find myself being confronted with (what else but) Microsoft bashing. All those who say windows crashes all the time, i often leave win XP running weeks on end - and not a single crash (even though i use a lot of *cough*mostly-legal*cough* software)
/. worthy. It seems that any MS-Bashing post will make the /. frontpage these days.
One of the main reasons linux doesn't crash is that there's hardly any software TO crash it.
Ahem, now onto the article (hope the above rant didn't insult you too much)...
WOOP-DE-FSKING-DOO! Microsoft is using the same ad campaign that mac is. I hardly see this as
Sorry for the rant, but i'm getting sick to death of Microsoft bashing, especially XP bashing - dont like the GUI? There's an option to change it to the win 98 look!
Ok, must stop ranting now.
Yeah I had to give up, give in, throw in the towel, bow to the superior majesty, humble my self, capitulate, resign, fold, admit defeat, appreciate that a 'lingua franca' in computing was really a necessity, grow up, and finally stop being abnormal.
.Net developer. Finally I see things from a bitches point of view, and IBM's.
I will be a
I think I am happier now.
And my family and friends are proud that I have learned when to quit.
Don't hit me again.
The sanctions made me come to my senses, they really did.
Corporate Britain & America? You have been inspirational. Thank you.
I think the whole problem in your case is that Apple can't exactly deliver what they want to, at least until they ditch Motorola. The G4 is pretty nice, and I like the battery life, but raw performance just isn't very good.
I think Microsoft doesn't get it, here. They can't deliver better usability, and WinXP makes EVERY computer run like a dog. I've tried it on about twelve computers so far, tweaked it as far as possible, but there's no way to make it go faster. It boots nicely, but after that - forget about it. Who wants to switch to something that's darned near as slow as OSX? That's been my experience with XP, and I'll never switch. Long live Windows 2000 I guess.
- For price/performance, check the current prices you'll see that the Apple hardware is now cheaper than Wintel stuff of comparable quality and performance.
- Availability of software is another reason, especially because OS X gives you both the regular desktop tools (Photoshop, Quark, etc.) as well as the regualr UNIX tools.
- Apple rules Ease of use, hands down. You get the Apple GUI and, if you need it, the power and flexibility of scriptable command lines such as Bash.
- Apple also seems to rule interoperability, being able to connect easily to wireless networks, LANs, and various Macintosh, Windows and Unix machines.
- For laptops, they seem to have everyone beat with battery life, good large screens and low weight.
Value-conscious purchases are likely to result in choosing Apple, though I would not be surprised if many let ideology cloud their decisions and shell out more money for Bill.Beta is broken and the link to classic doesn't work. Stop wasting our time or there won't be anybody left here.
Apple should not "fix" sites that are optimized for IE - in the vaaaast majority of cases, such sites use ass-whacked HTML, your mother's activeX controls, and were built in FrontPage.
Apple should stick to its guns, and continue to work on STANDARDS COMPLIANCE for Safari, so that sites will work correctly in Saf/Moz/Konq/Op/etc. This will put pressure on MS to fix IE (as they have already started to do, thanks to Tantek Celik's excellent Tasman rendering engine for IE5/mac, and the standards compliance mode triggered via the presence of a legit DOCTYPE at the head of the file).
If you find a site that is *cough* "optimized" for MSIE, do the right thing, and notify the webmaster. I have done so on countless occasions with bank sites and the like, and often I get a response and eventual compliance in the long run.
long live standards. good night.
I so want to see an "Interpret bad IE code" button or option in Safari...
Stéphane "Alias" Gallay
Now, where did I put this witty quote?..
You should call up your sister and get her to turn off magnification and activate the auto-hide dock options for you.
Be like the twenty-second elephant with heated value in space-Bark!
I challenge your sorry HP jizwad ass to give me a situation where it fucking matters.
OK, seeing as you act like a student, I'll give you a college like example. You are in a maths / engineering / science test. Your aim is to complete the maths as quickly as possible without making mistakes. RPN helps by
1)Reducing Keystrokes
2)Reducing the liklihood of error due to mismatched bracketes
3)showing your trestults step by step thus reducing the chance of error still further
Graphic calculators are for the weak to store notes in. And for crappy teachers to 'demonstrate' functions to even more dimwitted students
I don't know about you, but I have never cheated by storing notes in a calculator. Graphics cals help alot by removing all the tedious work. Yes, I can do the maths like fourier / laplace transformers, but I'd prefer to use the calc to let me check my answer.
What exactly is your point anyway? Are you protesting the use of RPN or graphics calculators? FYI, RPN is found in non-graphics calcs
---E commerce? "selling widgets and/or widget servicing"=sales. OK, question, are you in sales or are you an "IT" guy? Here's a hint, people showing up at a site running osx are usually *not poor*, their demographics are leaning a lot towards "we spend top money and are known for brand loyalty if we are treated right".
Admit it-I got a point? Rhetorical question, I think I made it. Basic rule of thumb in sales 101, you have to get through the noes to get to the yesses. Part of any "yes" potential is , well, having da loot. The interest on the part of the surfer was there, you got the hit, they showed up at your URL, they are doing the customer's part. That's all they can do up to that point. The next step is up to you.
good lucksi
Btw, I bet you cannot give me a single calculator that will accept '3 * 5 sqr' *exactly* as input and return the right answer.
my name is borg. i had bought a nice new iMac and had brought it home.
...oh, shit. you said switch to _windows_!!
so i was trying to set up my new iMac to print to a printer on a remote lp queue, and i kep on getting gibberish from the printer. the first line was something like:
%!PS-Adobe-3.0
and then a bunch of gibberish. i called apple tech support, but they couldn't help me. they said it was the fault of hewlett packard. I called hewlett packard, and they said that it was apple's printer driver.
i didn't know what to do.
so, i searched on google and i found out how a bunch of people had ported some drivers from linux to OS X and could solve my problem. they seemed very helpful and knowledgable.
so i formatted the hard drive, installed gentoo linux, and was able to print within six or seven minutes of booting.
it was very cool. now i use linux for everything.
my name is borg, and now i'm a linux user.
Actually, I have a BS in CS and Mathematics; no longer a student.
I don't know of any type of "college" exam where the aim is to complete the maths (what are you, a European jizwad also??) as quickly as possible without making mistakes. No mistakes, sure, but who cares how long it takes as long as it is within the time frame set by the prof.
Points 1, 2, and 3 only matter in a calculator contest, which there aren't any except in your mind.
The best way to reduce error is to know what the fuck you are doing and not relying on HP jiz to get you through it.
Fourier/laplace transforms are not math(s). They are table lookups. Do you even understand why you'd even want to do a transform??
The answer is not available via RPN(postfix you insensitive clod).
My Athlon CPUs have not crashed on me either, it's normally just Windows that crashes
On the serious side, neither OS X on G4 and Linux on Athlon has really crashed on me to the point that requires rebooting. XP on Athlon though, sometimes just reboot itself :p
Michel
Fedora Project Contribut
It sounds like you have a BS in BS. I'll take this one step at a time.
don't know of any type of "college" exam where the aim is to complete the maths (what are you, a European jizwad also??) as quickly as possible without making mistakes. No mistakes, sure, but who cares how long it takes as long as it is within the time frame set by the prof.
You see, the quicker you finish the maths, the more time you have to check your answers. Basically problems are 3 steps: Figure out angle of attack, do maths, check errors. RPN helps you do parts 2 and 3 much quicker, leaving you more time think. Will RPN help if you are a total retard? No. But it does help.
btw, people generally use insults when they are threatened.
Points 1, 2, and 3 only matter in a calculator contest, which there aren't any except in your mind.
I'm really glad that you are so incredably fast that saving perhaps half an hour on a 4 hour final won't help you. Really. RPN costs nothing and gives you extra time so why not use it?
The best way to reduce error is to know what the fuck you are doing and not relying on HP jiz to get you through it.
Jizz, eh? Remarks like that show you do not know what you are talking about. I completely agree that one must know the material. A calc is not a subsistute. However is is a help. Only a fool wondn't use every tool at his disposal.
Fourier/laplace transforms are not math(s). They are table lookups. Do you even understand why you'd even want to do a transform??
Agsin proving you know little about maths. Thats like saying logs are table look ups because people once used log tables. I know perfectly well why you would want to do a transform. Solving diff equations springs to mind.
The answer is not available via RPN(postfix you insensitive clod).
Look, Postfix is a mathematical notation. RPN is the implementation. Postfix has no explict concept of a stack, nor any special relation to calculators.
You still haven't given me an example where your keystrokes would work. Be a man and admit that you were wrong - you need an equals sign at least.
You still have not provided an example where it fucking matters
Solving diff equations springs to mind
talk about not knowing what you are talking about. Yes transforms are usually brought up in an undergraduate diff eqs class for the first time. That doesn't mean that that is why you use a transform. Why does using the transform let you solve the "diff eq"?
You don't need extra time during a *gasp* 4 hour final if you know what you are doing. RPN will not help in those situations where you don't. In situations where you do know what you are doing, who cares what fucking calculator you use, if any.
I generally use insults when replying to RPN posts for the entertainment value. I'm usually getting paid to post those insults, you HP jizbag.
Postfix is a mathematical notation--true. I don't use it. Therefore, why would I want to use some half assed HP jiz implementation? If you are really saving 30 minutes on keystrokes alone, you do not know what the fuck you are doing You should drop out of school and pick up a mop.
Why does using the transform let you solve the "diff eq"?
I'm an engineer, I haven't used that stuff in years. Sure, I could have looked it up on the 'net to sound smart, but I'm not a fraud like you.
I'm usually getting paid to post those insults, you HP jizbag.
Proof that you are a worthless TI leech?
You should drop out of school and pick up a mop.
1. I'm not in school and 2. From an earlier rant of yours, you mentioned you were in a PC lab supervising kids. What are you, a glorified babysitter?
You still haven't admitted you mistake regarding the keystrokes. 4 keystrokes my ass
What Microsoft needs is an Ellen Feiss equivalent.
They had one, but he got arrested.
The theory of relativity doesn't work right in Arkansas.
"So when does it just stop being the sincerest form of flattery and just become utter, pathetic laziness?"
I don't know. When did the home computing world steal color graphics, stereo sound and true multi-tasking from the Amiga?
Oh yeah, Apple had that before? No, it was the PC, I think. NO! It was the Spectrum? No, no! I think it was Apple. Wasn't Atari... Nah, video games. It must have been the PC. Damn lazy Amigas.
to admit that you have sold your soul.
Great people don't need people to complete them, great people complete other people. -- Matthew Pawlikowski.
That was a different AC with the sqrt thing. I just jumped on the bandwagon.
The 'You's' you are refering to should have been 'one', as in one should drop out of school.
I don't babysit kids, must have been a different AC giving it to ya.
Engineer, riiiiight. Convenient to be 'out of practice' right now. Awww boo hooo.
Don't get too bent out of shape over it. Transforms just change the variable. Then the equation becomes easily solvable. That's the why. Engineers and their shortcuts. Tsk. Tsk.
Let's continue this in the next story where right now I'm slappin your ass =D
But what if I want to switch to Canada? Will they still put me in an ad?
Help us build a better map!
blakespot
-- Heisenberg may have slept here.
iPod Hacks.com
Agree wholeheartedly. I just switched to Mac after Linux, and before that I was on Windows. I've tried XP at work (no choice there really) but I just think it's poor. Once I new Apple were going to base on *BSD and saw that they were becoming sufficiently reliable, I couldn't wait.
I'm a Solaris sysadmin by trade so it's nice to get home to something that really just works. I think the platform is more than fast enough these days (hell it's nice to get out of the upgrade cycle). I can't see how much more mileage there is in speeding up and bloating the OS to suit.
What "business" software do most people run that can't be run on a mac?
Deltek and other serious accounting software (QuickBooks isn't enough for a medium-size business). Crystal Reports. ADP and other payroll apps. MS Project (there may be Mac and *nix replacements for some of these; indeed, if there are, post them). A lot of stuff that PHBs think are essential.
There's a whole world of stuff beyond Unreal Tournament and MS Office.
You don't understand the power of the Dark Side. I must obey my master!
One of my friends lives across the road from me, and to supplement his student loan, works for Microsoft. My server for the house to my ISP runs linux and his ran Win2k. We both decided to buy some Bluetooth dongles to bridge our houses and also to save cables following our laptops around. It took me 3-4 days to get the BlueZ BT stack working on linux. It took him 2 weeks to get his server to run Win2k, with WinXp running under VMWare to allow him to share his internet connection with his LAN and his BT apps.
;)
Not long after he has switched to Redhat 8.0 and is now my grasshopper. Needs some pictures before I submit it to M$ though I think
This is just another case of Microsoft's paranoia dictating their actions. In a consistently insecure attempt to keep everything under control, they are now inflicting their Borg-like assimilation techniques on other companies' marketing strategies, not just their technology. By flattening everything out, they take the magic out of what their competitors have to offer. Since they have the monopoly position, this gives them the advantage.
While you're complaining about all the wild-eyed, touchy-feely Mac enthusiasts it occurs to me that you my friend - yes you, mister - need a hug!
Seriously, I think there's a lot of Windows users who have entirely lost touch with the idea that one can like thier computer. I don't think there's anything wrong with doing so either; it's not like allowing such factors to influence our purchases and preferences is "stupid" or otherwise "uninformed." Hell, if it was we'd all be driving around in gray '87 Volvos or something.
I actually the fact that we like our computers annoys non Mac users. "It's a tool" they tell us with visibly strained patience. Like we didn't understand that. We should "grow up" and realize that there should be no fun, pleasure, or delight in the use of such a utilitarian thing.
It's a computer. Yes it's a tool and so is a furnace. But so is a Mini-Cooper. There's a difference. I don't work for Apple and I don't give a rats ass if you buy a Mac or not. But I do get tired of the "it's a tool" argument against computers with taste and style. Given the choice between owning something that feels utilitarian versus something that feels like someone put some love I'll take the love hands down. Ask any Harley-Davidson owner.
You like your Macintosh better than me, don't you Dave? Dave? Can you hear me Dave?
Why is there all this mouth-frothing over this. Let's actually put the truth here: the so-called fake one that Microsoft had before was a real user whom they used a publicity shot to be the face of. Yet good ole Ellen from Apple's campaign has been exposed that she went down to the shoot because she was a friend of friend of someone working on the advert and had never written that letter in the first place. But hey, Slashdot never lets the truth get in the way of a good bit of FUD.
Good G*D, that web site - where the article is - is beutiful! That's a really nice change from the dull and/or ugly 90% of the web.
:-)
(Yes, I know this is off-topic. But I'm really impressed!
It is impossible to enjoy idling thoroughly unless one has plenty of work to do.
- Jerome Klapka Jerome
Hostile Microsoft Policy Flailed
Pyongyang, February 14 (KCNA) -- The hostile policy of the Microsoft "corporation" has been assailed. It is none other than Microsoft imperialists in the lunatic guise of US imperialists who flagrantly attempt to defend interests none other than there own.
Noting that this guise has been seen through, the DPRK urges Microsoft to behave itself. Meanwhile, Microsoft continues its flagrant "embrace" and "extend" operations to incorporate none other than Apple "Macintosh". It must be understood that such moves are obvious to all but the aggressors. Until a peace treaty is ratified by the US war mongers, the DPRK continues to step up its careful preparations for full scale nuclear war. This is but more proof of the agressors real intentions.
Anecdote about Kim Jong Il
Pyongyang, February 14 (KCNA) -- Kim Jong Il took a walk on the grounds of a military academy and saw that many of his people were without valentines. He stayed up for two nights straight in order to get valentines for his beloved people. He then called his friends in Montenegro to send over some sex slaves. When the slaves arrived, Kim Jong Il toasted them with Hennessy VSOP cognac and a lobster feast and then brought them over to the factory.
But when Kim Jong Il and sex slaves arrived, they saw that all the workers had perished due to the cold winter and lack of heat. Kim Jong Il toasted his beloved people with more Hennessey VSOP and had another lobster feast and then ordered the slaves back to the house for a party.
The stock market fell only 5% this year.
The economy fell only 5% this year.
Your mortgage interest fell only 5% this year.
Only 5% my ass.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
Everyone who wants actual customers to talk about the products is just a big fat copier!
COPIER!
quit copying me!
Whiney mac owning elitist idiots.
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!!!!
How will this change the fact that the site is optimized for IE?
Sure, Apple may be able to fix it, and actually that code can even go back to KHTML and Konqueror on *nix, but that won't fix the site.
If the failure of proper display is due to the site, not the browser (non-standards compliant code), then the remark has to go to the site builders, not the browser coders!
...new games that is. Starcraft was the straw that broke the camel's back, and it was goodbye Macintosh. Oh, that and paying twice as much for my hardware and upgrades because I couldn't build a Mac from parts. And lockups at least once a day. Did I mention no games?
You can tell how much I miss Apple.
I'll never forgive Apple for the years I suffered before the powerMac came out. My Mac Quadra crashed every day, and win95 was a blessing despite it's flaws.
Apple is just as evil, if not more so, than Microsoft, because they lost and continued to allow the schism to grow instead of negotiating a new era of compatability.
"I only speak the truth"
Karma: null(Mostly affected by an unassigned variable)
managing Windows PCs and servers for companies with little to no understanding of what kind of deal with the devil they had signed, I bought a 600mHz iMac for home use. I was so happy with the intuitive design I began to help some of my smaller clients switch, which has led to even more business as I help my customers become more productive and save money. Oh wait, this was the ad I sent to Apple.com, sorry My name is Bob, and I'm not Bill Gates bitch any longer.
Speaking of copying, how about the recent Reebok commercial that starts out as an identical replica of the Nike "Streak" commercial, with the naked guy streaking at a soccer match. Just when you're thinking "oh, it's a continuation of that Nike commercial!" the dude gets SMACKED! Terry Tate, Office Linebacker, has just creamed him.
That's got to be one of the funniest crossover commercials I've ever seen. Credit to Reebok. Now I'm just waiting for Nike to respond with a naked Terry Tate streaking at a soccer match.
Err... no. Actually I don't if I'd wanna see that.
One would think that a company such as Microsoft, who has seemingly unexhaustable resources, would at least be able to come up with something a little more original than making their own "switcher" ads ala Apple.
Perhaps you were using GNU/Linux for the wrong reason(s)?
The G4 is a CPU and the name of a PowerMac model. :-)
It turns out that Microsoft had patented the Switcher ad in January 2001! The patent is known as "Marketing Device For Informing User Of The Low Quality Of Microsoft Products".
Microsoft attempted to prevent Apple and other vendors from performing competitive marketing.
Alas, Steve Jobs believed that there was prior art, namely in the Intellevision versus Atari marketing campaign. However, Microsoft claims that the Intellivision ads (1) do not address PCs, and (2) do not address Microsoft products. And therefore the patent IS valid.
In order to exercise their patent, Microsoft is (1) suing the ass off of Apple, in hopes that no one else will switch, (2) exercising their right to promote their patent in PRO-Microsoft marketing, and (3) creating products that generate documents that cannot work on Microsoft products.
. Therefore, Apple may no longer use it's switcher ads,
This comment is somewhat off topic - but it does relate to Microsoft advertising.
I find the current ad running for Microsoft, where the executive is saying he wants to send an email to everyone who bought a CD an offer of credit at his on-line store, to be very disturbing. Every time I see it I think - Microsoft is promoting how their >NET software can be used to create SPAM.
Do other people see it that way?
I have been using and programming Windows, Mac and Unix for over 10 years. Although I always prefer Mac myself because "it just works" , I couldn't really recommend evryone around me to pay extra money for the Mac experiences, knowing there are substancial weakness in the classic Mac OS.
A ppleStore/ and you will notice that every things are just simply beautiful and good value for money: from the $799 CRT iMac, the $999 iBook, to the $1799 PowerBook. The single CPU Xserve with OS X Server and WebObjects and dozens of programming and system tools plus unlimited client license is only $2799, and for $10,999 you can get a 2.52 Terabytes Xserve RAID - much cheaper than the similar products from Dell, HP, Sun or IBM.
.mac account, and basicly appeared to be a Macholic (she started reading about Steve Jobs and swearing at Bill Gates) last time I met her accidentally on a train to London. What's more, she gave away her Windoze PC to some idiot in the lab and persuaded her boss to buy another iMac for her in the office. Interestingly, after playing with my wife's iMac from time to time, the IT manager switched to Mac himself recently and now he can claim he knows Unix.
But with Mac OS X and the new generations of iMac, iBook and PowerBook, the Mac platform suddenly appears perfect for evryone - geeks and novices alike, and amazingly they cost no more than branded Wintel PCs. Take a look at the Apple Store http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/
Before any of the usual idiots whining that they can build these things for less, let me just put you straight - you just can't - not to the same level of style or quality. In any case, Apple is probably the best brands (well, the second best following Google according to a recent survey), and certainly not in the business to compete with any of the DIY box makers.
The real story I am trying to tell is that I have never seen a Mac user switching to Windows in my entire computing life, but have recently persuaded someone to buy an iBook for her first ever computer and witnessed 3 Windows users switching to Mac.
The lady who bought the iBook lives next door, and she just loves playing with her new toy. Being a middle-aged women and having never touched a computer before, she was initially very nervous and constantly worried that she might break something, so I spent about 2 hours explaining the basics, encouraging her to explore the iBook intuitively, and she kept noticing those clever and cute little touches like the bouncing icons, the magnified dock, the pulsing spot when the iBook is asleep, the amber light ring when recharging, etc. And the next time I met her a few days later, she was playing iTunes, burning CDs, listen to Internet radios, playing GNU Chess, and she was fasinated by the voice recognition capability (which I haven't used very much myself).
Among the 3 switchers, my brother-in-law has always been a Windows user until recently, and has 4 Wintel boxes at home. He had been using Eclipse for Java programming on a Sony Vaio bought a year ago which already shows its age - it feels really slow just running Eclipse alone and hardly anything else, typically used two batteries to get a reasonable usage. But recently he put some extra RAM to speed up the Vaio, but unfortunately the thing would get hot really quickly and the 2 batteries couldn't last more than 2 hours. So now he have got an iBook - lighter, prettier, much longer bettery life. And Java is so much better and more on Mac OS X.
The other 2 switcher are all my wife's colleagues: an IT manager and the secretary. When my wife started her new job, she asked for the LCD iMac, but many people including the IT manager and the secretary told her that Macs were no good because no one used them. When the iMac arrived, the IT manager didn't know how to set it up, so my wife (not a computer geek by any stretch of imagination) did it herself (she called me once about the IP address and DNS server). A few weeks later, the secretary quietly bought herself an iMac and an iPod at home, even paid for a
I'd qualify (mostly.. err.. except games...).
Or what about a switch-back campaign? Tried it, hated it, switched back? Strange thing, i don't know many people who actually switched back to MS, after working some time with a new system (there ARE a some who just try it for a week and give up).
Whew! Take it easy man!
That said... How are YOU not a "corporate tool"? You own a Windows PC, no? Are you sure that you just haven't had that "it's a tool argument" beat into your head one too many times?
Seriously... I know a lot of people in a lot of different professions, and most of them are pretty particular about what tools they use.
Come to think of it, the "it's a tool" argument could be applied to just about everything in our lives. Clothes are a tool, they keep us warn and protected from the elements. I'm sure you don't just wear any old clothes. You probably have some sense of style, whether you buy expensive, trendy crap, or whatever suits your taste. Food is a tool, it provides our bodies with sustenence, but I'm sure you eat food you enjoy.
Also, your screwdrive analogy is flawed. Most people don't care about screwdrivers, but some do. But more importantly, a lot of people really like particular power-tools. Find any carpenter, or anyone who uses a lot of power-tools, and I'm sure many of them will have a particular taste regarding what tools they use.
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
...I'm too busy switching from Microsoft-based systems to Linux. I might buy a used Apple and put Linux on it -- will that do? :-}
You sound like you know a lot about screwdrivers, can you help me? My screwdriver suddenly started stripping my screws. I don't understand. Did I violate my license agreement? Or did I screw in too many screws?
I asked my nephew about this, he's good with screwdrivers, and he says that it's because I'm using a cheap screwdriver and it's not compatible with my Philips screws.
I've been told that I should abandon Philips and use Torx screws in my doorframe. But Torx screws and screwdrivers aren't very common.
Help?
Sun could have avoided all this by making Java truly a public standard. Microsoft could have made
And if the "shell" bothers you, switch to a different one. My Mac has tcsh, bsh, sh, zsh, and ksh installed. You can use any shell you want.
Oh, did you mean the case? If the fucking case bothers you, put it under the desk! Not that you've ever used one, but Mac towers have bar none the best cases in the world. They don't have screws, they don't slice you when you open them, and so on. In fact, they have a fucking door you open. It doesn't get any better than that.
Ignoramus.
If you want a decent mouse, go buy one already. Haven't we been through this enough?
The aggravated tone of your response is out of proportion to what I'm saying. Chill out, man.
Furthermore, I think your reply is disingeuous. I think anyone can see that a car which looks nicer and is more fun to drive is worth more than a car that looks, well, utilitarian, with a driving experience that might be characterized as "bland."
Even if it doesn't get you to work any faster.
Even if it won't last longer.
Factors other than utilitarian ones inform the purchases of a variety of products and services every day. And - here is the point - that's not wrong or stupid.
Agreeing with the above, however, doens't mean you must buy a Macintosh. I think virtually everyone, however, will agree that the principle above is sound.
You like your Macintosh better than me, don't you Dave? Dave? Can you hear me Dave?
as I said above, this passion for using an OS/computer comes not from personality of the individual, but an us verses them mentality from a community based mind set. See here -> bandwagon
click me
You've made your argument based on outdated facts and hearsay. Nice work.
Fact is, my Mac burns CD quite well. I click the "burn" button, and it just happens. I didn't even have to install any software beforehand! Pretty steep learning curve there.
And what if I want to delve into my system more? Well, it's there waiting for me. Remember, it's a BSD variant at heart. I can even recompile my kernel if I want to. That's delving a lot deeper than any Windows user will ever be able to do. Oh yeah, I have a half-dozen different shells on the system, it comes with apache, perl, etc, and you can install the best X11 implementation I've ever seen or heard about with one click.
As for patches and drivers, OS X takes care of that for me (just like WinXP!). Shit just magically works on this system, and it fucking rules.
So next time you want to argue something, check around for some current facts before you put your foot in your mouth.
[Insert standard disclaimer about not being "for" MS here]
But . . . what if it was the other way round? Hailing the Apple heroes for their hilarious new spin on Microsoft's tired old advertising campaign? Turning the tables on the corporate giant?
O'course, I'm in the UK with one of those "dial-up connections" you may have heard about, so I wont get a chance to see them and make up my own mind . . .
P
MS imitates everything else that Apple was successful at, so why should this be an exception?
You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
I don't see why almost everyone on Slashdot is making fun of the idea of switching from the Mac to PC. I was an Amiga (2000, upgraded with a Picasso II+ and a 68060 accelerator) owner, then an iMac owner, and now a Windows user.
Two of my friends switched in the last two years from the Mac to the PC. Both of them were hard-core Mac zealots. One of them is married to a graphic designer, and he himself is a user interface designer, so he was naturally a Mac user for a long time. The other had been a Mac user since he was 10, and was a huge believer that Macs were superior to PCs in any and every way.
Well, eventually MacOS X came out, and my friend the user interface designer basically made the switch to the PC. Why? Because Macs are too expensive, don't provide the benefits they used to (let's face it - there's no difference between using Photoshop and Quark on the Mac vs. the PC any more), and because Apple broke all of its own great user interface rules with MacOS X.
My friend who had used Macs since he was 10 switched to the PC because Macs were just too fucking slow. He had a super-speedy Athlon for much less than a new Mac would cost him. He's a big geek, so he runs Linux most of the time, but he uses Windows for gaming.
And me? I like the fact that Apple puts a lot of thought into how the software works, and how the system works as a whole. I like the fact that the computers are cool looking. But, that is not worth the premium of the MUCH higher cost of Macs (I'm sorry, for what I want to do with my computer Macs are way more expensive). Additionally, I was really, really disappointed by MacOS X's interface. The MacOS had such a great interface, and now it's as lame as Windows. So why pay a premium for it?
On the other hand, a friend of mine who was a PC-zealot (he used to mock my iMac all the time, and thought Mac users were idiots) just visited an Apple Store and has become a total convert. It's fascinating.
Anyway, I guess the point is, it's not ridiculous for people to switch from PCs to Macs, and it's not ridiculous to switch from Macs to PCs. Seriously, different platforms have different advantages. MS showing people who went from Mac to PC is no more ridiculous than showing people going from PC to Mac.
(When I switched from Mac to PC, I found the PC annoying at first. But then I got used to it, and now I find the Mac annoying when I first start using it again. A lot of this is what you're used to.)
You're forgetting that our screwdrivers don't fit the screws the other 95% of the world uses. So we have to have our own screws made just for us.
They're more expensive, but we think they're better, because we've never really looked at the other side except to ridicule them. We know that whenever we insult the other 95%'s screwdriver, we get modded up on Screwdot. They must have a REASON for choosing that inferior brand, but we can't figure it out.
And I (unfortunately) spend soooo much time trying every new cool gadget and colored throbbing accessory that comes out for my screwdriver that I never get any real work done, but it feels like I'm really really productive.
Hi, My name is BlackBolt, and I guess I just love to screw.
Harry Rodman
Vice-president
Homosexual Liaison Services
Apple Computer, Inc.
Damn, that must be a 24 hour a day job!
Children...Microsoft is using a basic marketing strategy that all of us can understand. The general public will look at it much the same, but in a different light. If most of them don't have the experience that the average /. poster has, they're going to be looking for the "better" computer. Will it be Mac or a PC? The gimmick, though lame, will work to an extent.
Now, for those of you that use these articles, everytime, to proclaim that your dad can beat up my dad, or that your car is better than mine...Who Cares! You don't need to post that photoshop runs more efficiently on Macs. We know that. Most of us don't use photoshop so we don't care. Likewise you don't give a crap if my pc is 10xs faster than your Mac. That's not why you choose to use Macs. Why do we try to push one product on everyone that wasn't built to universally fit everyone. If you want to talk about why your OS rocks - Be specific about what you like, but not why it's better.
Speaking of tool, do you have any idea how much of a corporate tool you are?
Says the porno maven.
Nice things are nicer than nasty ones.
This, BTW, is no longer accurate. Mac users don't, in fact, need Software, (run VPC) and/or networking hardware, etc. that is specifically for the Mac any longer. While they can still make these choices, it's no longer necessary, w/OS X.
On the mac, you can now run software for Mac OS X, Mac OS 9 & earlier, any version of Win, and Linux.
Pretty flexible machine, IMO.
cares about their tools. Screwdrivers are an excellent example. Lousy screwdrivers have poor grips and the tips blunt quickly, while a good one lasts a long time and has a grip you can use to drive a screw through anything. Anyone who does a fair number of home repairs and is paying attention will have definite opinions on screwdrivers, and if they are craftsmen, they will find the good ones a joy to work with. (And yes, the good ones may cost more, but they're worth it.) Also, someone who likes their tools will talk about it more than anyone else would like to hear--I particularly remember a house painter holding forth *forever* about his brushes.
This applies to any tool--the lousy hacks will go for whatever appears to be cheapest and will try to make out that it is "just as good" as the better-designed tool that would do the job better. It often turns out that the better tool is also cheaper in the long run.
{-o-} ha!
Dude? Have you spent any time with a MAC? Do you have any idea how much work is done on these things? The main argument to using a Mac is that it allows one to be productive quicker. The idea is the Mac just gets out of the way of the user and allows you to get work done. No IRQ's, I/O Addresses, etc. As an example, I'm an MCSE 4.0 & 2000. I'm UNIX ceritified, Novell ceritified and only used OS 9.2 for about 3 months. Even I could see the appeal. If I ever scrape together enough money, my next system WILL be a dual proc PowerMac running OS X 10.2 with Virtual PC (98, 2000, XP). The fact that these systems are also more attractive is just icing on the cake. And what's wrong with liking the icing? You've already got the cake, so why not enjoy the icing too?
A web de-singer character.
Someone who is going out of their way to remove singing from the web. Does he work for RIAA? :-)
Cheers,
Toby Haynes
Anything I post is strictly my own thoughts and doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the opinions of IBM.
My god man, were are you from? What do you do? Do you do anything with your hands? Do you have a hobby you take seriously?
Every, EVERY, artist or craftsman or hobbyist or professional I've ever known has preferences of tools. Most of them can give you detailed reasons why they prefer Snap-On over Porter-Cable or KitchenAid over Oster or the B&O over Polk. Hell, man, don't you know about vi v. emacs? Ford v Chevy? Film v Digital? Gas v Electric? Stick v Automatic? Bong v Joint? Drip v Press? Each one has pros and cons, and as humans it's only natural to discuss and argue over which is better.
For Christmas, my dad tells me *exactly* which tool he'd like. To him there is a difference between a Makita and a Black & Decker sawzall. There's a difference between a fiberglass and a wooden handle hammer.
Almost every cookbook I own has a section dedicated to tools - knives, pots, pans, cutting boards, gadgets, cups, spoons.
My photographer friends are passionate about their cameras and film. The tools help them express themselves.
It's not "just a fucking tool." It's an extension of yourself that helps you work more effecitienly and creatively in the world. Go ask your local antropologist or biologist how important tools are to humanity.
You might think it's sad that people are passionate about their tools, but that only shows how ignorant you are. Look at yourself, and ask if you really don't have serious preferences for the tools you use? How would you react if someone asked you to do your job/hobby with tools you didn't like?
Gee, I don't need to read your entire post to realise you're really boring. What kind of clothes do you wear?
well now we know who to rob ;)
Dude? Have you spent any time with a MAC?
First of all, yes, I have an Apple. Many, actually. Second, it's not a MAC, it's a Mac, or Macintosh. But you're an MCSE, so you probably don't get it.
Apple's switch campaign used ordinary folks. Microsoft's practically requires MCSEs.
:-)
It's only fair, of course. That's pretty much how the two operating systems stack up as well.
What is being ridiculed is Microsoft's efforts which seem to all copy Apple's. It is widely known that MS has copied Apple features over the years and has even been embroiled in litigation with Apple because of that copying. Apple's Switch campaign was notable (not groundbreaking - you'll see why in a second) not because of the core message that you should use a Mac instead of a Windows system, but because it returned to an advertising concept that had largely been abandoned by major companies - customer testimonials.
Think about it. Before Apple's Switch campaign, when is the last time you saw someone on your TV saying, "Hello, I'm a real person and I use this product because it works for me." ?
When the first company returns to a tried and true method that was largely abandoned, the concept is seen as fresh. The second one to try it had better have a radical spin on the concept to truly make it unique else they will be accused of copying. So -- MS looking for real people who have switched from Mac to Windows to tell their stories? I don't see anything unique - I see Apple's campaign in reverse. After one faux pas with a reverse switch campaign, I would think that MS would at least try to come up with something a little original.
Laws affecting technology will always be bad until enough techies become lawyers.
To Sun and SGI. Lets face it, my Sun Ultra 2 with dual 400 Mhz ultra sparc IIs is just as fast as my old dual 800 PIII. And the SGI Octane with a 250 Mhz MIPS CPU is just about as fast as a 600 Mhz PIII. There is NO DRM and I'm 64 bit. The hardware lasts for many years and can be bought for pennys on the dollar in the second hand market.
"I bow to no man" - Riddick
Nice collection. Your Turbo Color station is in great shape. I wish my desk was regularly clean enough to take pretty pictures of my Mac and NeXT hardware.
Cost.
...
In the old days:
- Apple hardware cost more but it was very dependable.
- Mac OS upgrades used to be free for minor updates and major releases (every 2 to 3 years) were resonably priced.
- Lots of free stuff like hypercard and later iMovie and blah@mac.com accounts.
Now:
- Hardware is still ~40% more than similar PC stuff.
- Dependablity has dropped to "white box" levels.
- iMoive et all applications cost $100 per year (to stay up to date)
- blah@mac.com accounts cost $130 per year PER ACCOUNT PER YEAR.
- Software updates cost $130 per year.
$360 per year for the feeding of a Mac is IMO too much. I resently bought a Toshiba 1115-S103 laptop (1.5Ghz Cel, 20G HD, 256M RAM, WinXP Home and a 14" screen) for $750 (new after $200 rebate). A similar iBook would be $1540 ($1050 + $130 + $360) over two years as opposed to my Toshiba for $900 ($750 + $150 for possible OS update costs).
In other words: screw Apple until they drop the cost their software/.Mac costs. I love Mac OS X (on my iMac 400 DV) but my laptop (RedHat for work and WinXP for games) gets 90% of my time.
And yes, Mac OS X is clearly a better OS than MS XP but IMO just not worth the extra cost for me.
As for desktops, Apple loses again. Replacement parts for Macs cost way too much and take too long to get. I can replace any part in my desktop PC in less than 24 hours and do it myself. A Mac will cost you atleast twice the price for parts, require professional installation most of the time and take a minimum of one week to get the parts and one week for installation.
Now if Apple sold an ATX Mobo I might return
"note: the slashdot user 'danamania' is a transexual. beware"
Thanks for the heads up. I mean, uh,
What computers are you talking about? 486s? XP is perfectly snappy on an athlon 550, 256mb ram, ATI rage 128.
Maybe it says more about Microsoft's inability milk further revenues from people who no longer see compelling reasons to upgrade.
Vote Quimby.
For people that use a tool argument:
You're posting on Slashdot and attempting to tell us that computers don't matter to you?
Are you on the wrong site, or just self-deluded?
If it doesn't matter which computer you use, you won't mind if we make you use a Mac, will you? It's all the same, right? After all, you have already expressed your admirable emotional detachment.
"Give a man fire, and he'll be warm for a day; set a man on fire, and he'll be warm for the rest of his life
As an IT professional using Macs, I was constantly worried about my job, afraid the boss would catch me reading Slashdot, going for more coffee, or napping. It wasn't my fault, there just wasn't that much to do.
A couple of months ago we switched everyone over to Windows, and man has my life been fantastic! Now I have plenty to do. I've been coming in early and staying late. My days are now full of challenging and engaging problems that I just didn't get with the Macs.
I love Windows and everyone here just can't stop talking about it. People can now use their computers as an excuse again! It's great!
My job's a lot more secure now, too. In fact, I've heard I may get a promotion.
Microsoft - What's your problem today?
Think about it. Before Apple's Switch campaign, when is the last time you saw someone on your TV saying, "Hello, I'm a real person and I use this product because it works for me." ?
Um, all the time? I see customer testimonials all the time on web sites. The only difference between Apple's switch ads and most TV ads is that they use real people. But the point of most TV ads is "look how happy this person is using our product." And some do use real people. So Apple was hardly innovative with their switch ads.
Did anybody here see Chapelle's show the other night? It started out with him in a white background, talking about how he couldn't use his PC because it was too "clickety clack", then he goes on to say why his Mac is so much better for Internet porn. Why did he switch? Because he loves internet porn.
I'm sure you've all seen Microsoft's "Business at the speed of life" commercials or whatever they're called. You know, where the couple buying a car picks a color, the salesman clicks something on his Windows CE device and a second later a car is being painted that color in the factory, and other commercials expressing that same theme. Well, recently I got an invitation from MS to attend they're latest propaganda fest in my area. Look at the last paragraph describing how to remove myself from the list, particularly the last sentence. I've cut and paste this verbatim except for changing my e-mail address. Not exactly "business at the speed of life".: From: Microsoft To: mot@umsl.edu Reply-to: midamericaopencampus@email.microsoft.com Subject: Microsoft Open Campus Event in Nashville and St. Louis on February 10th Date: Tue, 28 Jan 2003 10:21:57 -0800 (PST) Dear Thomas, We are excited to invite you to an Open Campus event at Microsoft's Nashville and St. Louis offices on February 10, 2003. This event is designed to give you a look inside the Microsoft Operations and Technology Group. You'll learn how we use and manage our own technology to run our business and operations, and you'll hear about our experiences as customers of our own products. You'll come away with proven strategies to strengthen your organization's IT capabilities, and ideas for implementing them to gain competitive advantage. Hear from Senior Microsoft technology experts and learn how we: Operate a world class Operations and Information Technology group while maintaining business agility - Rick Devenuti, Chief Information Officer, Corporate Vice President Deliver trustworthy IT services utilizing Microsoft's own technology and IT facilities - Mike Carlson, Director of Enterprise Operations Develop and implement internal IT security strategies and initiatives that cover people, processes and technologies - Peter R. Boden, Group Program Manager, Corporate Security Maintain a global Exchange and Active Directory messaging infrastructure, and rollout product evolutions across the network - Derek Ingalls, Group Manager Messaging and Collaboration for Exchange and AD You'll also hear from Microsoft executives Rich Kaplan, Corporate VP, Content Development and Delivery Group, and Kevin Johnson, Senior VP, Microsoft Americas Sales and Marketing. Speakers will broadcast live to you from Microsoft headquarters in Redmond via closed circuit television. You'll get valuable insights from leaders within Microsoft to help you train, plan, deploy and maintain your IT environment, and improve the operations of your IT organization. We're looking forward to seeing you on February 10th at 11:30 to 4pm , and hope you'll find our presentations informative and valuable to the future of your business. Visit http://email.microsoft.com/m/s.asp?HB8090263535X17 62462X155624X
or call 1-877-MSEVENT to register and reference event ID
1032226817 for Nashville and
1032226815 for St. Louis.
If you prefer not to receive future promotional e-mails of this type,
please click below to unsubscribe. Please note that it can take up to
eight weeks to update customer information in our database;
therefore, you may receive e-mail from us within that time period.
http://email.microsoft.com/m/s.asp?HB8090263535X17 62463X155624Xmot%40umsl.edu
Apple's iCal calendar app also has a tendancy to chug pretty hard.
Amen, but I blame this on iCal being relatively new, not on Mac OS -- iCal is still 1.0. TextEdit can reflow text much faster, and iCal only has to draw a few vertical and horizontal lines and a few words of text. I hope they get their stuff together for a 1.1 or 2.0 that doesn't suck.
(How many 1.0 programs were very good? Few, if any. Not even Apple's, usually -- think iPhoto 1.0. Most of the iApps are up to version 3 now.)
I use Photoshop on a G4/500 for slightly larger images (more like 2000x3000, sometimes 16-bit-mode), and I wouldn't call it "extremely fast", but it's certainly usable -- it's not really slow, unless I'm running low on memory. Now if Adobe could just get their Illustrator and Photoshop teams to talk to each other so they don't have interfaces which look exactly the same but behave differently...
Apple's "switch" ads are cute, but seem to be rather ineffective.
Look at the market share that Apple has. It is unchanged since 1999 or so.
OS X hasn't helped... switch hasn't helped... no more fruit colors hasn't helped... I am starting to think people use what they want/like/have to. Marketing doesn't seem to play much of a role.
Look at the Madonna ads that came with the intro of Windows XP. Those flopped. Big time. And they were not horrible.
As computers become more and more common place (my 80+ yr old grandparents have one!), emotional buying decisions become less prevalent. People just replace what they had used in the past with the "latest and greatest" version.
HP has the "cool" new BMW F1 ads, and there market share has slipped over 1% worldwide since the merger with Compaq.
Sony is a huge company involved in many different markets (music, computers, PS/PS2 etc) yet 60% of their entire profits come from the Playstation sector.
You're happy with your tin box and McDesktop, that's fine. But d00d, don't get defensive when other consider it not enough. That they want better doesn't make you any less a person, it's all good. Some people take great pride in their tools as part of the pride in the work those tools facilitate. Know any master carpeneters or mechanics?
A very amusing parody of the switch ads. (fair warning it's in real media format)
Frylock: That's not a toy!
Master Shake: You say that about everything you own. You should own toys. They're fun.
If you actually think Apple "just gets out of the way of the user" prepare to be disappointed. They make computers-- and yes, by dumbing them down a bit they avoid some of the problems you mention, but they're still computers and they still have technical issues at times. FWIW, I just built a computer by hand and installed Gentoo Linux (from a stage 1 tarball, no less)... I didn't have to fiddle with any IRQs or I/O addresses. If I didn't have to touch that stuff on something as complicated as a homebrew computer and a built-from-scratch OS, I can't imagine the average Microsoft Windows user does either at this point.
I do not have a signature
I switched with my father-in-law for a week, his ibook, for my sony viao. ..
likes:
1.real cool interface.
2.access to unix programs(ie ssh ect)
Dislikes
1.In order to get any software that i own to work on it, i would have to pay another 110 for jaguar.(Dreamweaver MX)
2.No pcmia card slot(no wireless unless i spent money)
3.smaller screen(15 to a 10.5 sucks)
4.I already owned firewire video equipment and cables, none of witch was compatable.
In the end he got his laptop back. He was'nt happy with that. We hav'nt spoken since. Trying to switch ruined my relationship with my inlaws
If Apple can do this type of advertisement, why can't Microsoft?
If you bash MS on this advertisement, then you should also bach Apple.
Same goes for 'I switched from MS to linux' type testomionals.
That's probable just because you're ignorant!
Look at my karma - I'm bad, just like Michael Jackson!
is that the majority of people they will find will be switching from Mac OS 9 or before. If they have ads where people start talking about pre OSX macs, apple can point that out in their next round of ads, probably in print, cuz they seem to be more offensive-minded in print, IMHO.
Okay, playing devil's advocate here. I have a strong connection with Win2k. What is it that you're trying to prove? If you think OS is a religion, computers aren't for you. (How on earth is this insightful?)
Look what happend when this fellow made the switch!!!
You mean BMW. You need a hug, you anonymous person you. Come here!!!
>kisses
The car dealership has to be nimble in order to survive - interchanging features/functionality on a customer's whim.
MS is however, unable to adhere to this reactive principle according to the sad tails of woe given to the justice department regarding their inability to separate add-on functionality from their operating systems.
If there is going to be any nuking, us yanks will be doing it, thank you very much.
"The G4 is pretty nice, and I like the battery life, but raw performance just isn't very good." This is drivel. I want my moments back from reading it.
"My God, this must be a truly remarkable corn chip, to be so widely and confidently touted."
too slow for what?.. that kind of a blanket statement really needs to be qualified. Too slow to check your email, too slow to run MS Office, too slow to play games.. what? Are we talking about an iBook or an xServe? For some tasks, Macs are significantly faster than PCs, so this is pretty much a useless argument that others use to prop up their preferred platform, and both sides are equally guilty of doing it. At some point (sooner than you think), speed will be nearly irrelevant for 90%+ of consumers.. what then?.. checking email and surfing at 5Ghz??? Why??! It's the same as surfing at 3Ghz, is the same as 2.2GHz, etc.. The selling point will shift (is shifting) to 'how well can I get my stuff done', 'does the gui impede my work or does it stay out of my way', etc..
There will always be those needing every cycle they can possibly squeeze out of their processor.. fine. For some of them, it will come from the x86 camp.. Others will get faster performance from G4s and G5s for their line of work. You may want to revisit your statement.
i'd really like to assume that you're kidding about this.. Windows is YEARS behind Apple in this area. The OS X gui (quartz, aqua, openGL, etc), while not to everyone's particular taste, can do more than anything I've ever seen come out of Redmond. Now, maybe XP is 'better' than previous Windows gui's,.. but Christ, how hard is that to do?!..
'Sensible Solutions'? Initials: SS Now why does that sound vaguely familiar?????
It's all fun and games until someone loses the key to the handcuffs.
You are a fucking idiot aren't you, yes you are...whose a fucking idiot? yes ! yes! such a sweet fucking idiot. I love you fucking idiot, you have changed the world for me. I can't believe i survived without my own fucking idiot for so long.
Thus spake Microsoft's Mike Maples, who may have since left the company, "If someone thinks we're not after Lotus and after WordPerfect and after Borland, they're confused ... My job is to get a fair share of the software applications market, and to me that's 100 percent." (Emphasis mine)
Maples said this around 10 years ago, but that was and still is pretty much the mentality of everyone in power in the company-- even with 95% of the market, the greedy bastards still lose sleep at night at the thought of dollars going into a competitor's coffers.
The above quote either came from Cringely's Accidental Empires, or Wallace & Erickson's Hard Drive, I can't remember right now-- I recalled it verbatim because it was so galling to read that it has stuck in my mind.
~Philly
Burning Mac
this is all that remains!
[About 90+ per cent of testimonials...]
"Yes, I switched to MS.
"I was a happy Apple user until corporate IT said that we had to standardize on a single platform, and since PCs were in the majority, that's what we standardized on.
"I'm not sure how much our IT costs have come down, but certainly now, after the transition, I'm resigned, I'm unhappy and, with medication, I can tolerate the crap that MS puts on my monitor at least 40% of the time."
"Provided by the management for your protection."
I switched to Linux from windoze. WIndoze was to cluncky and was crashing and virus issue every day.
I got so tired of blue screen of death of windoze I decided to try linux and I love it. I do my word processing in open office and my image editing in gimp. Linux is so easy to use.
thanks linux
Seriously man, I haven't had to touch an IRQ on a PC since the day I ditched the 486 in 1997. It's called Plug and Play. The state of hardware over five years ago isn't really relevant, is it? Obviously your MCSE stands for Microsoft Certified Solitaire Expert.
Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
Very true, since the XP interface is only the third interface change MS has ever done (Win .xx-3.xx, Win 95, and now XP), and it's hardly a revolution. Outside of chaning icons for every app I can't see anything XP's interface can do that OS X can't, if anything OS X will prove the more extensible.
Odd, that's exactly the opposite of my machine. Mine boots slow as hell, but after that runs real nice. I've got a Athlon 1700+ (1.47 GHz) with 512 MB DDR.
I don't think anyone is calling the "Switch" campaign innovative. People refer to it more as refreshing, notable, memorable or some other mildly positive adjective.
Innovative is an overused and frequently incorrectly used adjective. It is used way too much on this board and in the tech sector in general.
Innovate really isn't something someone consciouly does. Something is usually declared innovative by someone other than the originator of the product or idea.
Think about it. When was the last time you woke up in the morning and said, "I think I'll innovate today."?
Chances are, that sentence has never come off your lips ever,
Pooty tweet
mbbac
It looks like real work to me. You have to go to considerable effort to hide M$'s loss of PC share. You used to hear silly things like "only 5%" of the world does not use M$ at the same time you knew that 7% of users were on Macs. Now we hear M$ say that about 10% of users have Macs and that Linux is larger than Mac. Hmmmm, how to juglgle those numbers and make it look like one in five people are sailing along just fine without any help from Redmond? I suppose you just keep on lying. It must work the same way the RIAA uses the media to blame "internet piracy" for declining sales of music. Ha! Just keep on putting out the same old BS.
The problem comes when people realize you are full of shit. Then no amount of spending can save you.
DMCA, Hollings, Palladium. What might have sounded like paranoia is now common sense.
Preferences => dock => turn magnification off => turn auto hide on. Yellow minimizes the window and places it in the dock next to the trash can (the little divider in the dock seperates applications from folders and windows). Maximize maximizes the window to fit the content, not to fill your screen. As for the commands, they all seem pretty universal to me, I think you're just trolling.
T Money
World Domination with a plastic spoon since 1984
He may have an entry-level computer with 128mb RAM or less.
:-( ).
... or should it?
My company bought Compaq 1.8ghz Celeron machines with 128mb RAM, which is double the amount of RAM we had with Windows 2000, and four times the amount of RAM we had with Windows 95 or 98, and it's definitely slow if you run more than one or two applications at a time, and even when you're not running much, it will slow down at odd spots such as performing routine tasks in the Control Panel. (I know because I have to do many of them
I know the Celeron isn't the sharpest chip on the block, but I'd think it should be able to beat a system that has a quarter the clock speed
Incidentally, I use a PowerBook G4/1ghz Superdrive system both at home and at work, and it's blazingly fast on everthing but window resizing. The problem, of course, is that most people resize windows a lot. When I started maximizing them instead of resizing, my troubles with MacOS X faded away fast.
Today, MacOS X is by far my favourite operating system.
D
If you press the green button to maximize (the yellow button doesn't maximize!), it will maximize based on the contents of the window. So if you maximize a page with a lot of table-based page layout, it will size itself based on the widest table.
The problem with this is that if the page is still loading, and there's even wider stuff below, it will not change to reflect it. Just maximize again to fix this.
In my view, this is actually a good thing because you retain the ability to see multiple windows on the screen at once. So maximizing sets the window size to the smallest size that lets you see all the content.
MacOS X performs extremely well for me, and I'm using a computer only a bit faster than the one I assume you bought. I have a PowerBook G4/1ghz with SuperDrive, and it's blazingly fast on everything but resizing web browser windows. I solve that problem by maximizing the windows instead of resizing. Works great for me.
Sadly, no computing environment is perfect. I think MacOS X is a lot better than the competition (Linux, Windows, etc). However I agree that there's plenty of room for improvement, on all sides.
D
"I used to be an OSX user. It was a lot of work being creative, and coming up with new ideas all the time."
"now I'm a dedicated XP user, and it's so much easier just copying other people's original ideas."
You're forgetting that our screwdrivers don't fit the screws the other 95% of the world uses. So we have to have our own screws made just for us.
Yeah, it's a bitch when I use my Mac and go on the internet -- I can only access Mac-compatable sites, and can't visit the other 95% that are written for Windows or Linux. Email's also a bitch, because everyone knows that it's all incompatable, and a Mac user can't send mail to a Windows user, or vice-versa. And don't get me started on JPEGs, MP3s, PDFs, or text files.
At least Apple was good enough to let my version of Appleworks read and write MS Word and MS Excel documents. And that new Keynote program of theirs imports and exports Powerpoint. Now if only Steve Jobs can get off his lazy ass and start making a Mac-compatable version of the internet.
--R.J.
Electric-Escape.net
I made the switch and is cost me $7,000.00+ but I could not be happier. Below is the list of systems I was using followed by the Apple systems I purchased.
.99, ran X-Windows on the 486 33Mhz upgraded to a DX266 chip at about the time those Stealth VESA cards were finally supported through XFree86!
Sony Vaio 1.8Ghz - WinXP Pro upgraded from WinME
Micron PC 400Mhz PII - Win2k Pro upgraded from Win98
3 Generic Clones ranging from 90Mhz to 266Mhz now running Linux exclusively.
Sun Blade 100 500Mhz SPARC 64bit - Used for learning Solaris and Sun hardware. Part time server for training purposes.
Gateway Solo 2500 333Mhz laptop - ran Linux for a long time, currently collecting dust.
The above is well over what I paid for the Apples that I will list below. Keep in mind that included with the above boxes I fully bought and licensed every version of Windows and a whole lot of Microsoft software such as MS Office over the years.
DOS/Win3.11
Win95
Win95 OEM.B
Win98
Win98SE
WinME
WinNT
Win2k Pro
WinXP Pro
MS Office 95/97/2000
I've been running PC's since my Atari ST 4meg became obsolete. My very first comptuer was an Atari 800XL 64k RAM. My first PC was a 486 33Mhz as my first home PC purchase. Used 8086 286 and 386 computers in my profession before I bought one. I've run Linux since Slackware with a kernel version prior to
So as you can see I've been there and done that. Just prior to MS Win95 I ran OS/2 Warp and was deeply impressed. It's a shame IBM blew it...
I've programmed in everything from BASIC to Java and all the languages in between except for LISP.
Here is what I just spent 7,000+ on from Apple.
- PowerBookG4 550Mhz (OS X 10.1.5 won me over)
- MS Office X
- PowerMac G4 Dual 1Ghz MDD
- 2 - 17" Studio displays.
- Miscellaneous accessories and things like memory and a Brenthaven laptop backpack, etc.
- Additional software such as CorelDraw! Suite
I switched because Apple finally came out with a professional OS that is Unix based. It combines all the advantages of WinXP or OS/2Warp with all the raw power and flexibility of Unix. Plus I can run mainstream software such as MS Office X and Corel Draw, Adobe applications, X-Windows software, etc.
The Apple hardware designs are truly superior, sure the Motorolla processors haven't kept up but that is not a major issue with me. This Dual processor G4 PowerMac does absolutely everything I need and is plenty fast enough. In fact, I am able to accomplish so much more in a much more efficient manner that my productivity has tripled!
History shows that I am not an Apple nutcase. I never took Apple seriously until OS X made the scene. I've been watching it closely since the earliest releases and drooling over it. I never could afford a NeXT system but I always dreamed of having one. NeXT was so far ahead of it's time that few understood it. Today, Apple's Mac OS X is the next NeXT and it is a tremendous accomplishment!
I refuse to buy anymore PC's (unless OS X is ported to the x86 Intel/AMD platform)! I will be replacing the Sony Vaio running XP with an iMac 17" before the end of this year. This box serves as a family PC and I am getting tired of fixing it and patching the security issues that come out every 2 weeks. I've got the damn thing firewalled twice plus I filter it's communications with the outside world for fear of spyware and trojans that NAV could miss.
It's a brave new world and Apple will get us there. Bravo Apple! I am a switcher!
Microsoft be damned...
I wonder if M$ will have a hard time finding stoner kids to star in their ads...
How is it "pathetic, and lazy" to provide an opposing viewpoint/counterpoint to a competitors direct attack on you? Seems like good business sense to me, personally.
"Politicians are interested in people. Not that this is always a virtue. Fleas are interested in dogs." P.J. O'Rourke
Expect Less, Pay More
Microsoft took Target's slogan and reversed it, I can't imagine how that is going to make any Mac user want switch to Windows. The campaign should be "Please Don't Lease Microsoft Campaign" instead. Look at the software facts:
$199 buys you the UPGRADE ONLY version of Windows XP Professional sans web server, ftp server, network utilities, rendezvous etc, etc.
whereas
$199 buys you 5 FULL VERSIONS of OS X with apache webserver, ftp client/Server, network utilities, ssh, better stability and so on. And as an added bonus it plays well with other OSes including Windows!!!
This info is from Microsoft's and Apple's web sites.......Do you still want to stick with Microsoft???
"You helped our nation celebrate its bicentennial in 17 -- 1976." --George W. Bush, to Queen Elizabeth, Wash
I'm a Windows user, and I'm downright FOND of my computers. I always call them by name, I tell them "Good computer" when they've particularly pleased me or worked really hard (which is often), and they reward me by loving me back. In fact, I think I'll go give them all a hug right now. :)
Seriously, tho, I do know what you mean -- and it's a user thing, not an OS thing (I know Mac users to whom the computer is just a tool, even tho they're fanatical about using only *one brand* of tool). Even some DOS users name their computers, and many of us notice that different machines have different "personalities". In my WinTribe, Dink and Gremlin "feel different" due to having far different histories, even tho their current core hardware is almost identical.
Some folk will say "you're just anthropomorphizing your computer" but if it's a choice between that and being afraid of the magic black box, I'll just keep right on talking to my computers!!
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
Exactly! apple makes the whole widget: the hardware, the software, the basic peripherals - the whole shebang. the widget is designed to work as a widget and is, thus, less susceptible to incompatibility failures.
dumbing them down a bit
well, i would submit that that is what we call "better design". saying the mac is "dumbed down" implies that it is less capable than comparable wintel systems. not true. my mac shipped with awk and sed and gcc and vim. i submit that that's not "dumbed down".
damn anarchist
2 1337 4 u!
It's not lazy... it's creepy.
Next you we'll hear is that Bill Gates has taken to wearing Steve Jobs' old shirts. Unwashed.
Super Villains switch to Linux (warning: it's Flash)
-Steve (not the Steve from the animation)
Hey, Windows users, there is no such thing as "forward" slash, there is only slash and backslash.
It's also a lot like a craftsman who likes the feel of one particular screwdriver over another, even tho to the eye, they appear identical. But the hand can tell the difference -- one tool just feels more "in tune" than the other. Some people never experience this, and to them, every screwdriver is the same and any in reach will do. Others find they work more efficiently with the tool that "feels right".
.22 semi-autos, just what I was looking for -- only diff being one was a couple years older, and slightly more worn-looking. But the older one felt like it belonged in my hand, and the newer one didn't. Probably some tiny quirk of balance due to prior age and use, but there was no question which one to buy.
It can be "but I'm used to THAT one" or it can be an instant response. Frex, one day I went forth to buy a pistol. The used-gun shop had two identical Ruger
To some of us, computers are also individuals, regardless of the model or the OS. Tho I expect you'll see more of this among PC owners who build their own, and not much among folk who buy OEMs.
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
Just as seriously man, I spent the last 3 days installing Windows on a PC at work, watching 'plug and play' consistently screw up the installation of an ethernet card, a graphics card and a sound card. Plug and play my ass - erm no I didn't mean that last sentence literally ;)
Photoshop 7 - G4 dual 1Ghz opens a 120Mb map scan from LandInfo (digitized topo) in 20 seconds. Same file on my 2Ghz PC - 1.5 mins. Actions speak louder than words. People want to use PCs? SURE! Less competition. Hell, buy TWO! (you'll need em).
iBook cost over two years: .Mac account: $200 ($100 x 2)
iBook: $1000
iLife: $50
Total: $1250
I still stand by the hardware repair issue which is the biggest reason not to buy a Mac. I recently needed to replace the internal iMac CDRW (my two year old shoved 2.5 CDs in it) and found out it would be $180 (parts alone and me doing the install)! The same thing in the PC world would cost me $60. Try find a PS for a Mac and a PC. The PC version will cost you $80 (for a nice one), available most anywhere and 5 minutes to install. The Mac is atleast $200 and needs to be installed by a service tech (for most folk). Two weeks of downtime. I once went 6 weeks w/o my iMac (bad PS which in turn fried the CRT) while Apple dicked around with it. And it was only a month old before it died. Yes, Apple sent me a new one and it has worked well since then but no system for 6 weeks sucked.
A reasonably priced ($200 w/o CPU) ATX Mac motherboard from Apple would bring me back into the fold. Until then I live on GNU/Linux and Win XP (which is better than Win98 and still years behind OS X).
Dude thats freaking genious.
Even if I say something insightfull or inteligent, it doens't matter cause I'm an ass.
The Switch ads have been an endless source of office comedy where I work.
We have one Mac user in the office and he has been quiet a sport about the ribbing he has taken.
We have had many votes on who these people are and if we should take away thier thumbs for the obvious threat their continued use of tools and other object present to the rest of the bipedal population.
I feel very sorry for the
like uh stoner girl who like uh lost her homework.
I am very sorry for the genetic mayhem released on the general population by the Woman who could not install a driver for her camera
And I am scared to death that a police officer with access to firearms can not plug in a cable.
I did however like the drunkgamers.com parady, upgrades are so easy on the Mac, you just unplug it toss it in the trash and go by a new one.
Blatantly, where do you get the idea that Macs are hugely more expensive? This an old myth and is now a fallacy, let it die.
Integrate Keynote and LaTeX
software not compatible
software not at my favorite store
not many software for mac
software more expensive
mac suk
you suk
troll you are
apple doesnt make the third party software you run. integration only applies with apple stuff. omni has no more integration advantage on mac than netscape has on windows / x86. everyone else in the world writes for windows / x86 standard platform - its well known and unchanging. software and hardware know exactly what they are going to get so they know what to write for. it all works just as good. mac advantage has disappeared. greets from israel. mac suk.
It's a lot easier to get plug and play when you design all the hardware yourself.
These arguments don't go anywhere fast.
...that can handle anywhere from 100,000 to 1,000,000 transactions a second?
Can a Mac do this?
Dolemite
Save the World! Use a Quote!
Meanwhile, Marketing's switch to dells and XP has left them miserable. Does that count? Sure was a sensible switch in my mind. Their loss, my gain! In fact I'm typing this in using Safari right now!
I said business systems. Not business applicaions.
Dolemite
Save the World! Use a Quote!
Read this post please.
Dolemite
Save the World! Use a Quote!
Wow. When I finish counting all the ways that statement was stupid, I'll yell at you. But before I spend the next three months of my life reciting numbers, here's a little useful feedback.
1 - Starcraft has been out for Mac for a long time. In fact, you don't even have to buy two copies to have both the Mac and Windows versions, as they're on the same CD.
2 - Only an idiot would pay "twice as much" for hardware upgrades. The only non-standard part in a Mac is the motherboard and the processor mounted on it.
3 - They don't lock up "once a day" any more than Windows does(more like once a week regularly and ten times in a single day when it's acting up), and judging by your time frame(before the release of SC), I'd wager you haven't even *seen* MacOS X. Don't bash it unless you've tried it.
4 - There are tons of games for the Mac. Unless you're looking for shitty games(like the latest no-name shooter or EQ clone), chances are, you'll find plenty of decent games on the Mac. Hell, there's even a game finder that puts GameSpy to shame called GameRanger.
Next time you troll, try trolling with one or two of your brain cells active.
I said business systems. Not business applications.
Dolemite
Save the World! Use a Quote!
Not such problem with my Dell. No one could care less about it.
"Under the spreading chestnut tree, I sold you and you sold me."
Hmmm. Last Mac I purchased didn't include awk, sed, gcc, or vim. What it did not allow one to do easily: add memory, change monitors, add more than four peripherals without buying a "hub" and having cables all over the desk, add any peripheral other than a USB device without also buying an adapter and praying that someone had written drivers for the device that would work on the system, change from an IDE hard-drive to SCSI, add a second internal hard drive, add an internal DVD player, upgrade the internal CD-ROM drive, swap out the video card and add a new sounds card. Yes, Macs can run all kinds of great software. I've got one running Gentoo Linux. But they are dumbed-down hardware-- at least the iMacs are. That's not better design, it's just less flexible.
I do not have a signature
I wonder when people will realize that Apple is the only tech company in this time actually doing well and not drowning in red ink. Apple will never die as long as it it has its hardcore section of fans.
Point taken. But what about new customers/markets?
Dolemite
Save the World! Use a Quote!
As far as reliability and repair go, I've found that the macs I've used have been fine, although anecdotal evidence either way is not really useful. A good survey that tells you statistically which is more likely to break, and which is more likely to break expensively, is going to be more useful.
You have to realize that most Mac users are really just Windows haters. Throughout the 90's Apple put out some of the worst computers and OSs ever. They finally have started getting things right recently and all of sudden they are forgiven for the years of torment they gave to their once loyal customers. I personally think that Apple was far more negligent than Microsoft ever was.
Switch to Linux.
I could not justify my existence if I were a turkey farmer. Would I terminate myself? Undoubtably, yes.
[grant@frymaster grant]$ ssh -l grantlee mac
grantlee@mac's password:
Last login: Fri Feb 14 06:10:05 2003 from tokyo
Welcome to Darwin!
MANPATH: Undefined variable.
[grant-and-lees-Computer:~] grantlee% uname
Darwin
[grant-and-lees-Computer:~] grantlee% which awk
[grant-and-lees-Computer:~] grantlee% which cc
[grant-and-lees-Computer:~] grantlee% which sed
[grant-and-lees-Computer:~] grantlee% which perl
[grant-and-lees-Computer:~] grantlee% which grep
stock install.
2 1337 4 u!
No, which computer I use doesn't matter. How I use it is another story. See, most "geeks" are "geeks" because they love with their heart and soul every damn gizmo they get. Call me nuts, but it doesn't take much skill or effort to go down to the store and buy a mass produced something. I prefer to get a tool, and do cool things with it (see below website).
And no, I don't care if I use a Mac or not, just so long as it's a good price, and I can get work done on it. If I bought a Mac 1. I'd have to spend 2-3 times as much and 2. most of my software wouldn't function.
Let me guess... a DOS based OS, huh?
"So when does it just stop being the sincerest form of flattery and just become utter, pathetic laziness?"
Are you talking about Microsoft copying the Apple ad? Or are you talking about Apple copying Windows? Or are you talking about the poster of the story?
I vote for the latter. Find something interesting to talk about rather than bash Microsoft - it is getting really boring seeing the same hipocritical judgements over and over.
Then maybe you should try something newer than Win95.
I didn't say I didn't believe you about the Unix toolchain-- I said the last Mac I bought didn't have those tools. In my case it was "too little too late" to get me to buy another Mac. I opted for a homebrew system which allows me all the hardware flexibility I've come to desire as a result of Apple's lock-in approach. That said, I, for my non-geeky friends/relatives I still suggest they buy Apple over Wintel-- in one case I could have built a buddy a Linux machine and provided him support for a lot less than he paid for his iMac, and I regret that I didn't because he is not finding Mac OS X at all intuitive. If you really wanted a Unix toolchain on your Mac, you could have had awk, cc, sed, perl, and grep on your Mac long before OS X was released by just running Yellow Dog Linux. But an offical Unix-based Mac OS is fairly new and still does nothing specific to mitigate the hardware issues I mentioned.
I do not have a signature
It's the new dialog boxes that drive most OS9'ers crazy. OS X definitely took a step backward in terms of navigation through the dialog boxes, which made a lot more sense in 9. I've gotten used to them by now but I saw a lot of frustration expressed on lists and so forth about the new dialog boxes; Apple should really rethink them, or Default Folder X should get a lot better....
Well, if you think it's nice to get home and use something that just works and you're a Solaris sysadmin think how I must feel. I spend all day wiping up after a network composed of nothing but Windows 2000 servers (and their 400+ Windows 2000 Pro workstations).
Not as bad as it was when they made us go to NT4 from NetWare but still it makes me appreciate coming home to the PowerMac. It's like a friggin rock it's so stable and simple. To me at least (and we're all different so to each his own) this is like the promised land.
Just curious if you get back to this post of yours and happen to see this reply I'd like to know how fast your Mac is. I'm always reading things where people complain about the speed of OSX but I've never really noticed it being anything other than "pretty darned quick". I've got a one of the dual 1gig Quicksilvers and this was really my first full time Mac. I did run it for a little while on an upgraded beige G3 that was running at 500Mhz and it seemed pretty decent there too. Like I said, just curious.
Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
Yes, the iMacs are dumbed down hardware. That was the point - entry-level computer.
However, my G4 (post-OS X) came with awk, sed, gcc, and vim. I can also add memory just by popping open the side of the computer (which can be done WHILE it's running! Though I do need to shut down to add the memory) and plugging it in. I can change monitors incredibly simply, same as you can with any other PC, and I never have to install a driver (can you say the same?), I can add a boatload of peripherals, including 256 USB or Firewire devices, I don't need to worry about cables since I've got an airport antenna built in (and if I had a new Powerbook, it'd also have 802.11g and Bluetooth), I can add any USB or Firewire peripheral - and if by some odd chance I want serial, I can buy an adapter for less than $10 (and as for SCSI, I have no interest in it, thanks to Firewire - including internal Firewire, thank you), I can put a second internal hard drive in with my eyes closed, add an internal DVD burner(!), swap out the video card (or run two of 'em, like I do now, to support my three monitors), and add a new sound card, or use a Firewire 8-channel interface such as the ones from MOTU or Digidesign.
Yes, the iMac is dumbed down hardware. But don't compare it to real computers, compare it to those super tiny minitowers on the PC side that you can't upgrade either.
For comparison of your expandable system, compare it to my expandable system. Then run my OS in an emulator window on your computer, and really prove that you can do anything, just like me. ;)
-T
Looks like Slashdot has switched to OS X too :)
I don't keep a lid on my coffee so when I walk around I look busy -me
Sorry, I don't like to wield numbers like that like weapons, but certain types of comments make me fly off the handle.
I found the meaning of life the other day, but I had write-only access.
Macs suck!! I work with 4 different mac computers and one windows nt computer in my video and computer graphics class. All four on the macs have crashed on me more than once; however, the windows nt (the computer i use the most) has never crashed on me once. The macs crash consistently on me sometimes not even allowing me to restart without unplugging and plugging it back in. Also, I have a windows xp platform running on my own computer which has stayed on and never crashed for the past 10 months. The only problem i had on my computer was not enough hard drive space. SO i easily installed a new hard drive which is working perfectly. Also, who in the heck is mac os x designed for. When ever i work on the macs i feel like i am working on something that was designed for preschool children. The only reason i would ever consider buying a mac would be because macs have Final Cut Pro. Windows are really the way to go!!
...and I use a Mac. The connection? Neither one ever lets me down.
and before that there was mk and openbsd for m68k... and even before that there was minix for the old motorola chips... i managed to get that onto an se/30. perfectly useless but it could be done.
2 1337 4 u!
Right on Xyde.
Apparently Amigaluvr was looking for a date for this V-day, hit on Danamania, and found an unexpected surpise.
Perhaps he's just overcompensating up for his own hidden transgender feelings. The biggest homophobes are usually closet homosexuals who take out their self-loathing on other people.
"Can of worms? The can is open... the worms are everywhere."
why bother? even M$ recognizes the future of gaming is consoles. Your a fool to let games be your primary factor.
If apple really wanted to put the hurt on M$, they would offer a PS2/mac bundle.
Hi, my name is Bill Gates. I switched from using a Macintosh about 3 years ago, when I was finally able to kick enough ass in my engineering department at Microsoft to make an operating system that didn't suck ass so completely that it was a pain to use. Heck, now with the economy like it is, when I go down to visit the engineering department most of my higher-level engineers just automatically assume the position when they hear me coming down the hall.
Of course then that nasty Steve Jobs came out with those lovely Titanium Powerbooks and OS X. So I twisted some arms over at Sony and they gave me one of those nifty new Vaios, and 'convinced' my engineering department to put a shiny new interface on the next version of Windows, Windows XP, so that it would be just like using a Mac with OS X. I can barely tell the difference, they're so similar! It's great! We even gave the interface a cool new name, Luna, like the Mac's Aqua!
The reason I switched is because I simply can't stand for anybody not to be using Microsoft software for all their computing needs! If I could just get you last few people to switch over I could finally control all web and network standards and squash that pesky IBM like the annoying mosquito it is, and with IBM out of the way, there will be no one left with enough power to stop me! And who does IBM think it is anyway, supporting OPEN-SOURCE software? If they thought that little OS/2 thing was painful, then they have no idea what's in store for them! DO YOU HEAR ME, IBM?
And once I control all the web and network standards, all other computer companies will bow down before my might! YES! THAT MEANS YOU, STEVE! BETTER GO BUY SOME KNEEPADS! CUZ YOU'RE GONNA BE MY BITCH! NO MORE MR. NICE GUY! WE'LL SEE WHO WOWS THE CROWDS NOW, STEVIE-BOY! YEAH!! Yeah... yeah...
I'm Bill Gates and I own a computer software company.
-----
Free yourself. Everything else will follow.
is here.
i just switched at work from a g4 w/ osx to a dual monitor debian box. the g4 was my first mac and this is my first linux. honestly, i liked the osx for the most part, its just that i felt like it was holding my hand the whole time (kinda lika aol, but not in the stability dept, hehe). the command line was awesome. the ftp even had (new to me, anyhow) lpwd for local pwd. for the most part, it seemed that osx was simply a mac-bastardized linux flavor. i dunno, make up your own mind. i didnt hate it
i sell illegal drugs
If a page is built to be HTML compliant it's going to render pretty much the same across all of the browsers.
It's the lame IE only extensions that people are always using that muck things up for other browsers.
Now on to the next target: http://www.lux-world.lu/. The good news is that in addition to running an IE-only site, these lusers also run an open mail relay (you need to specify an address @lux-world.lu in your mail from: command). Yum, spam, yum! Our team is currently busy registering them with a number open relay block lists, in order to diminish the customer value of their webmail service as much as possible ;-)
Say no to software patents.
What kind of Macs are they?
What version of the operating system are they using?
On the other hand, the Windows 2000 machine from which I'm typing this either crashes after using it for around two weeks, or becomes so unbearably slow that I'm forced to restart it. Maybe XP performs better (though I've heard it has similar problems), but the Fisher-Price interface certainly seems designed for preschool children. (Of course I know it can be disabled).
I don't own a Mac now, but I am really craving for one because of the "friendly" BSD integration. I regularly use Cygwin to run Unix programs on Windows (LyX among others) and VNC connections to Linux and Solaris to get the other programs that I either don't have for Windows or that simply suck on it.
But that is far form a good solution. Cygwin itself sucks, the other Unixes are good but too complex to configure, and Window's performance leaves a lot to desire. And it turns out that ALL the SW that I regularly use in the three platforms (four with Cygwin) actually exists or has an excellent substitute on the Mac.
If I only had $1800 to spare I would get a 12" Powerbook.
Homer: And, as usual, we Joe Twelve-Packs get the royal screw job.
Moe: [stands up] Homer's right. We're getting the Joan Collins special.
- None can love freedom heartily, but good men; the rest love not freedom, but license. -- John Milton
Because it is so innovative. They have this thing it is called mouse, you can move it. And they have actual windows in the monitor, yes windows. And all this cool stuff Microsoft invented, like the mouse, the internet,
and did I mention those cool windows you can move around. Ha, beat that Apple. You can never copy this thing which amuses me the most, this blueish thing which shows that the machine actually did something before it had to go to sleep.
I am Anonymous Coward and a computer professional
"So when does it just stop being the sincerest form of flattery and just become utter, pathetic laziness?"
Most of the switch ads have some person complaining about how difficult or unreliable pcs are and how reliable and easy to use macs are. Since the MS bashing in the commercials are overly subjective, it only makes sense to find people who will testify the opposite is true.
Vote for Pedro
Let the retard wars continue!
God you people are just f'kin HOPELESS!
The day someone posts one of these stupid news items about Mac vs PC and no one chimes in with their idiotic, retarded, sect-like, fanatical ramblings with empty "arguments" full of holes and circling logic, we will reach a new era in human intelligence.
Looking forward to it.
What the hell is it about the free world (and free software) that pisses everyone off anyway?
Stupid jealous fools.
"Sensible"
Fucking Ridiculous
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2004_U.S._Election_c
You're wrong. OS 9 was a pile of outdated dogshit, even compared to Win95. 95 at least had some semblance of VM, MacOS didn't. 95 had preemptive multitasking, MacOS didn't. OS 9 added a poorly done VMM in OS 9, but it was still an anachronism relative to win 9x, which is saying something. Only OS X is a really modern OS (ironically, considering that some of what makes it modern is decades old :).
...Back in '93. I had a sweet Amiga 3000 running AmigaOS 3.1. Sheer perfection... for a year or two...
It wasen't 'till a couple of years later when the nicer PowerPC macs started appearing on campus that I felt it was time to move on. But never since that time have I been so completely satisfied by a hardware/software combination...
One of these days I'll get ahold of a modern Mac and see if that level of "niceness" is attainable still...
This implies that Apple is feeding MS marketing info on people using Macintoshes... How/why did Apple get around to doing this???
OS Software is like love: The best way to make it grow is to give it away.
Who cares about him. Right now, *I'm* wearing yo mama's silk panties, biatch. And she's wearing my sweaty boxers.
SnoopDoggX
where do you get the idea that Macs are hugely more expensive?
From Apple's website.
Your lack of technical skill doesn't make Macs more expensive.
I am a believer of momentum and curves.
I'm quite a fan of MS' other lame ad campaign I've been hearing lately, mostly in radio ads.
"Office XP-- It costs less!"
Worst. Slogan. Ever.
I couldn't find a link, or even a reference anywhere. I'll try and soundcap it sometime tomorrow.
Fembots and Orbital Death Weapons are nice, but if you can't run Photoshop, nobody is going to want it. Get it?
-- 'The' Lord and Master Bitman On High, Master Of All
"Forget Insanely Great -- Here's Greatly Insane!"
"Say Hello To Your New Cellmate: Windows 'Bubba' XP"
"Britney Spears Explains How Microsoft and DRM Help Put Her 'In The Mood' For Responsible Fun!"
"More Than 60,000 Viruses Can't Be Wrong!"
All of the computers are simply tools. I enjoy what I can do with them, but I have no emotional attachment to them. But simply because they're a tool, doesn't mean I would like for anyone to make me use what are clearly inferior tools.
Gamespy is a piece of crap. Gamers use All Seeing Eye. Macs have a limited quantity of commercial games, and only whiny twits go out of their way to put down genres that thrend toward avoiding their low-performance hardware platform.
To: @hotmail.com
Cc: <address omitted>
Subject: Uh, you're owned
User-Agent: Mutt/1.2.5.1i
X-Spam-Status: No, hits=0.6 required=5.0 tests=NO_REAL_NAME version=2.20
X-Spam-Level:
Hey, I changed the password on your Slashdot account because apparently
someone's owned you, and this email address is probably owned as well.
check out slashdot.org/~amigaluvr/
If you wanna authenticate yourself to me somehow, I can give you the
new password.
green button, yellow.. i returned the thing a couple months ago. It ran like a dog, and the inconsistent resizing bothered me. No other OS does this; hell, even Linux has some better window sizing behaviours, and the KDE kicker dock doesn't resize, or need to be anchored, or have little icons that jump around seemingly to random positions depending on how I open an app. However, none of this really matters since I switched right back to Windows. I'll give Mac a chance again someday, probably around OSXI (or whatever they call the major number).
just like the humble blood clot... turboporsche@telus.net
My new machine - a HP Pavilion 750n, P4-1.8, 512MB RAM. It should fly, from everything I've read, but it simply doesn't. From video encoding to video playback, games, sound editing, etc. it just sucks compared to my homebuilt P4-1.6 GHz running Win2K. Can it be the motherboard, FSB speed difference, whatever? No, because the Pavilion runs like a champ with Win2K installed. I'd say the Pavilion with XP runs about as fast as my old P3-750 IBM Thinkpad laptop, which runs Win2K.
My main laptop is an older Compaq Armada, P3-600 with 192MB RAM. It runs beautifully with Win2K, but I've tried XP Pro (same services running, same paging file size, etc.) and there's no comparison. XP sucks. I've done enough testing with enough configurations, from stock to my personal tweaked preferences.
...I didn't know that.
blakespot
-- Heisenberg may have slept here.
iPod Hacks.com
I've got an Athlon 1800+ with 512MB of DDR, too, and on nForce-based mobo. It takes a while to boot, mostly because I've got a lot of services running on it, then it flies. Since I upgraded to release 4191 of the NVidia drivers, it's never crashed except when I'm pissing around with experimental ring-0 programs.
It runs Mandrake Linux 9.0 and I sleep well at night, knowing that I won't wake up to find my loopback interface renumbered to 169.254.42.69 because the damn silly OS spontaneously decided that my loopback interface needed to be auto-configured but for some reason couldn't find a DHCP server there (true story from an XP-wielding friend, one of many).
Not sure whether I want Adobe to port DreamWeaver to it, or whether they should wither on the vine for being terminally stupid about an exploding new market.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
I've cleaned and re-arranged since then, but this is why my desk typically looks like.
I worked for 5 years for one of the largest Apple dealers/Service centers in Western Pennsylvania. If you got a Mac fixed in the Pittsburgh area between 1996 and 2000, there is a good chance that I or one of my coworkers did that repair.
I was really gung ho Apple, until I discovered the wonderful world of Computer Gaming. I got sick of waiting for 2 or more years to find out IF a popular game that my Wintel friends were playing was going to come out for the Mac.
This was shortly after the introduction of Win95. It was not nearly as elegant or intuitive as the Mac OS, but it ran all of the games that I wanted to play.
So for years I ran a Windows PC and a Mac side by side. I noticed that when I wanted/needed to perform an upgrade, the PC was much cheaper to upgrade. In a few years I noticed that my PC had gone from a Pentium 100 to a K6-2 450 while my Mac was still a 200 mhz PPC 603ev.
The last straw for me was when Apple killed off the Clones and introcuded the iMac and the Blue & White Powermac G3. Steve Jobs had unilaterally decided that all of the peripherals that had served me perfectly for years were now obsolete. My printers, Scanner, Modem, Joysticks and ISDN adapter were no longer compatible with Apple's equipment. Since Apple insisted on "Thinking Different" for so long, I couldn't use them with any other type of computer. Apple changed their hardware to make it harder for companies like Sonnet and Newer to develop processor upgrades. You can't replace the "logic board" in their machines with an industry standard replacement. Apple fans cheer as brilliand strategy the same type of decisions that they label as monopolistic when Microsoft does it.
At that moment the reality distortion field ceased to have any effect on me. I have almost completely switched to the x86 PC format. I have an Athlon XP 1800 and a Duron 700. My Macs have been packed up for months and I have no plans on using any of them any time soon.
I have several friends who are still under Apple's spell. I can no longer make excuses for Apple. I don't care who is at fault, I want to run the programs that I want to run on my computer. I don't want to run Virtual PC so that I can kind of/sort of play games. I will run them natively on my Windows XP box. I have learned much about network services with my Linux box.
I don't need you any more Apple. Thanks , but no thanks.
Lord Kano
-Too Lazy To Log In
3 of them are G4 and the other one is a 17" iMac (the newest one and the one that crashes the most) 2 of the G4s and the iMac are running os X and the other one is using os 9. I also forgot to mention that we use two other macs that are really old, for teleprompters. They aren't to bad for running the small telepromting software. Now I still wonder why in the heck would you even have the smallest thought of putting 1800 into such a obsolete piece of hardware. I am looking at a Dell laptop with double the cpu and even greather specs on everything else. Plus it is $400 less than what you are willing to pay for a powerbook, but i guess when you get sick of using it you can make an apple pie with it. http://apple.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=03/02/06/ 1447229&mode=thread&tid=133&tid=180
Because the 12" Powerbook is a small portable that according to the reviews performs quite decently. It is quite costly, but not as obsolete as a cheaper iBook (which by the way performs acceptably for what I do).
The $1400 Dell runs either Windows or Linux (or some other Unix-like system), so to get all the programs I actually use daily I would have to reboot several times per day, or settle down for Cygwin. And although I really thank the Cygwin developers for their work, the truth is that it actually sucks (remember, I use it daily).
If any PC OS performed as nicely as OS X (and believe me, your problems are quite uncommon), I would probably not consider switching, but in the mean time I'm only waiting for the money to get an Apple.
to get all the programs I actually use daily I would have to reboot several times per day Umm duhh Its called a laptop. You don't use it constintely throughtout the day and if you are, why don't you just buy a desktop (a little cheaper plus easier to upgrade) You should turn it off when you are moving it and its not in use. Plus, if you use it daily wouldn't you want something it little bigger for less eye strain. I would have to reboot several times per day How many programs are you running? Do you you install a new program everyday? If you do then how much hard drive space left to do the things that you want? (and believe me, your problems are quite uncommon) and why should i believe you? are you some great god of the mac world? This isn't an isolated insadent. Everyone that i talk to that use macs say that theirs have crashed on them many times. And I thought Macs never crash?? Ha ha (believe me you are a blumbling idiot!)
You can change a setting so that the computer doesn't reboot itself. It is a safety feature built in so people that don't know what they are doing, won't damage their machine anymore than it already has.
Even more seriously, man, if it takes you THREE DAYS to install Windows on ONE PC, YOU ARE A RETARD.
And if you're installing Windows on a work PC, rip out the sound card. Employees do nothing but download MP3's and dick around if you let them.
This is the gayest FUD on the planet, or you're a complete and utter moron. Take your pick.
p.s. Hire a real network admin.
That's my NeXT poster. Can also be seen here.
blakespot
-- Heisenberg may have slept here.
iPod Hacks.com
Interesting. Not that I use Windows XP much anyway, and the latest ATI drivers seem to have fix that auto-reboot problem, but for reference, where do I change that setting?
Note: I still see BSODs when other components crash, just not the video drivers.
Thanks,
Michel
Michel
Fedora Project Contribut
To change this setting you go to the control panel then system properties. You then click the advanced tab. Then click the settings under the startup and recovery box. There should be a x that you can unclick the box that makes the computer automatically restart.
That would stir things up.
MS should just pay each Apple switcher 1 billion dollars to come back to Microsoft.
I guarentee that would work. Save face, the MS way.
My best friend and I are 25, we knew each other since kindergarden. We know each other. He has heard me talk nothing but praise about Apple my whole life. He just bought his first computer this year. I could see it in him. He had NO reason to get a PC but because everyone else has one.
It was pretty sad to witness.
The only people that want to buy Macs are those who admire quality. Not just those who admire quality, but those who are willing to give up a few dollars for it.
My friend is not one of those people.
What are you talking about? Precisely one of the appeals of a laptop is to move your work around (the building, the city, or the world) without having to reboot. You simply put it to sleep and wake it up when you need it (which in current Apple laptops takes less that 2 seconds), and every application is just as you left it.
Good point. If you are using a laptop as a desktop replacement you should get a 15" model or larger, or simply attach an external monitor when you are at your main workplace. The 12" PB supports a second monitor (not necessarily mirrored) of up two 1600x1200 (more than enough for me). But these small laptops are appealing precisely because they are small enough to carry everywhere.
Six applications on Windows. One is a VNC session to a Solaris box that is running two more. On weekdays I frequently run MUCH more simultaneously, some on Cygwin and sometimes one or two on Linux. Of course this is a desktop machine that is tied to the network to get all the programs. The PB could run them all, at the same time, in the same environment.
I've lost you completely on this one. I rarely install new programs, but I don't see the relevance of this.
I suppose I have as much credibility as your ever-crashing Macs. Back in the late 90's, when I was an undergrad, we had Macs (OS 7.5.x - 8.1), along with Win 98 and Linux/LinuxPPC machines. And boy, did those Macs crash! At least once a day, sometimes more. Of course, we were not so concerned because they crashed as much because the Win 98/95 machines that we used also crashed daily. Win NT 4 was very uncommon because the licenses were too expensive (OK, I suppose the university got educational prices, but anyway NT was not common on desktops). Linux and LinuxPPC never crashed.
Since 1999 I have used Macs very rarely. But I frequently talk with several people who use them (and who I trust), and they say that OS 9 still crashes a lot, but OS X is as stable as Linux. (Of course they can't prove it since they reboot at least monthly for upgrades, while I have had Linux installations being heavily used for six straight months.)
That's an important point: Win 2k and XP are acceptably stable. OS X is apparently more stable (although on both platforms there are huge exceptions). But most people still run Win 9x or ME or MacOS 8 or 9, so they will tell you that in stability their platform sucks.
By considering that everyone who has a different opinion or experience from you is an idiot, you close the door to new experiences that may change your view of the world (or at least make your day occasionally). And I am certainly not talking only about computers here.
MS should not bother with Apple - they are not a threat. Besides , if you just bought an applat (400% overpriced) why on earth will you leave something that "expencive" for a cheap (150% overpriced) equvilant pc ?
What is a threat to MS is lunix - and i can see it now "uhm, i was like confused the all the black and the gray command thingy, so I load windows xp"
What a bunch of loosers with an inferiority complex. First they became "very successful" copying everything from Apple, which of course coppied from Xerox... but thye havent stopped copying yet... still copying, copying and copying!
I've used Mac for years to do my job when one day Microsoft bought out the company I work for.
I continued to use Mac becouse they said I could. But I'd find people stealing my pens and every now and then someone would say "Your still using THAT?" and "No wonder your late". The later being very annoying considering I'm the only one on the team who is consistantly ahead of scedual.
Then project team members would complain they couldn't open my files. They would automaticly try to open my files in some funky format for the Atari 800 or Commodore 64 that Windows never supported anyway instead of the Microsoft office formats I saved them in.
Then I cought someone sitting at my computer trying to log in. I lock it down as a matter of habbit so I asked him what he's up to and he said he needed files I didn't have. He assumed becouse they were messed up that they came from me and were in a Mac format. Turns out to be a garbage file from someones experement.
After the monkey left in my cubical urinating on my Mac HQ sent down a Windows system.
Thats when I switched.
After that I couldn't get my work done as the computer couldn't handle the work load. I was eventually fired.
Now I work a a fast food place using Windows NT for the regasture. No I'm tech support.. opp there's my beeper again. Somebody must have ordered the super god burger specal 5 that always takes out the whole network.
I don't actually exist.
I read that and thought, "Aaaiieee! STOP THAT!!! Don't add memory to a running computer!!"
Though I do need to shut down to add the memory)
Oh, ok then. Phew!