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Mozilla Usage Doubles in 9 Months
TheBadger writes "Thanks to the success of Firefox, Mozilla now appears to have 14.9% of the browser share, double that of 9 months ago. Let this be a lesson in complacency."
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This is a completely non-story. W3Schools is a (good) site aimed at web developers, ones that actually understand and use HTML/CSS/etc rather than whatever Frontpage makes. Yes, it's good that more developers are using Firefox/Mozilla, but it is not indicative of average users. Google's Zeitgeist was a good measure of the average user, but they've dropped the browser stats. My non-techy websites get about 7% Firefox, and about another 3% of Mozilla/Netscape 6/7 users. Is Firefox/Mozilla usage increasing? Yes, but it is not at 15%.
The anti-trust suits against Microsoft would have resulted in at least one of two things. The first would be removing IE so the person has to manually install it from the CD or download it after install. Second, force all of Microsoft's web development tools to be 100% standards compliant. Instead, the Bush administration gives them a get out of jail free pass and California accepts coupons for MS products which is the anti-solution for software monoculture in schools.
How much longer will people vote for politicians who let corporations shit all over consumers in the name of profit?
Complacency != Apathy
Seriously? Hmm... they don't seem to have any category for Konquer/Safari users... or am I missing something? Either way nice to see Moz gaining ground... but... is this really true?
Congrats to Mozilla! Now don't get cocky...
Robert B. Marks
Author, Demonsbane in Diablo Archive
It looks like the percentage of users using IE6 went down while the percetnage for IE5 went up. I can't quite figure out what to make of this.
Just one thing, w3schools.com is a site for people who write websites, so they'd naturally have a much higher percentage of non-IE browsers than the more general browsing population.
Personally, I keep an eye on thecounter.com to see how Mozilla's market share is doing. It's certainly more realistic than the linked article statistics page. Pity Google removed browser stats from the zeitgeist page.
--- There isn't any problem that can't be solved by a small, low yield nuclear device, is there??
By the FEDS I noticed that he had a Mozilla Icon on the booking computer
Interesting that IE6 usage didn't actually decrease, IE5 usage did... I think that the IE6 users that move to mozilla are replaced by IE5 users that upgrade to IE6, thus keeping a balance. Also, how accurate can those stats be?
a webdesigners website is hardly a representative of the world at large
don't get me wrong any gain is good news but until someone like google's zeitgeist or thecounter.com confirms it (ie someone who has a huge userbase across all countries and languages)
this 14% stat is pretty meaningless
lets not go down the MS road of skewing stats in our favour, just keep doing what you are doing and good things will happen to those who wait (politics is exempt;)
--ajs
XP has also gained share as per the page.
So whose complacency is it, in that case?
Also, are these stats reliable - the google stats
seemed to be different.
The interesting this is that the browser with the biggest drop in usage from January to August is IE5. I wonder if this means that users of IE5 decided to switch rather than upgrade this year.
I am a steady user of Firefox, it is truely a wonderful browser that fulfills all my needs, is lightweight and does not crash every six seconds, like a certain, other, microsoft-produced, browser that I will not name.
Fitzghon
I installed it on two of my systems. That alone has got to push those numbers up significantly!
Look at July -> August 2004, IE6 went from 71% to 70.5, while IE5 went from 7.7% to 7%. Both went down.
What about Opera? I much prefer Opera, it's got a lot of features Mozilla/Firefox don't and like Mozilla it's cross-platform (Windows, MacOS, Linux, Solaris, FreeBSD, OS/2, QNX and BeOS!) and if you don't mind an ad banner (I don't at all), it's free.
Plus, since it's not open source, you can make Richard Stallman cry (I realize that among the general public this has less appeal).
Firefox is great, certainly in comparison to IE, but I truly like Opera better.
didn't the new version of IE that installs with SP2 come with a popup blocker and other advances? sure they don't have all the other nice things that one can get in firefox, but they're not entirely sitting on their behinds...
And so at last the beast fell and the unbelievers rejoiced. But all was not lost, for from the ash rose a great bird. The bird gazed down upon the unbelievers and cast fire and thunder upon them. For the beast had been reborn with its strength renewed, and the followers of Mammon cowered in horror.
from The Book of Mozilla, 7:15
Karma: Segmentation fault (tried to dereference a null post)
Um, your own chart shows that IE6 usage has barely budged in the past year and holds firm around 70%, near its high. Yes, Mozilla's increased, but at the expense of old IE5 installations only.
So, in this case, complacency is working fine.
There are two kinds of people: 1) those who start arrays with one and 1) those who start them with zero.
"Web Browsers Used to Access Google" graphic in google montlhy Zeitgeist shows an improvement as well, but not as big as mentioned
ehi! why in july report the graphic is not there any more???
When I've checked my personal site's stats (small gardening site, roughly 400-500 page views per day) over the past couple months: I've been seeing roughly 70% Internet Explorer, 5% unknown, and the rest are mostly Mozilla/Netscape variants. Safari makes up just a couple percentage points.
About a year ago hits from IE were at about 90%.
#DeleteChrome
Here's some statistics from a different source (which actually presents stats from 5 sources), where Gecko (mozilla) ranges from 4% to 27% - it's clear that the stats greatly vary from site to site:
http://www.upsdell.com/BrowserNews/stat.htm
I think these numbers also are aplicable for measuring the size of the OS migration that is going on. Even i hating its name (mozilla is a terrible name ... hehe) its the best browser around. Long Life mozilla.
ctrl+t RULES!!! best shortcut ever!
and THAT is why MS is "so great" for the software industry! [at least THEIR reasoning]
I've looked at maybe a half-a-dozen different aggregate numbers and the stats for a bunch of high-traffic sites (tech and non-tech). From what I can tell, Mozilla+Netscape are at about 14% combined on English language sites, maybe (this figure is much more tentative) half that in the rest of the world. Furthermore, pretty much every trend I ran into showed a doubling of use between early '03 and July '04. I haven't checked the August numbers, but I imagine it's gone up a bit.
Those are just my amateur calculations, though.
Stop learning! Only you can prevent esoterrorism.
Find free books.
Firefox is fairly new to most non nerd consumers. I never even tried it until about 5 months ago.
The news over last summer with banking information being stolen convinced my old man to ask my about alternative browsers. I burned him a cd with firefox since the New York times mentioned it.
My gf uses firefox on her old pc because she is worried about security after the scare this summer and due to the fact its an older machine and firefox is snappy on old hardware.
People prefer IE but if something like online trading and banking flaws get involved all of the sudden switching may not be such a bad idea.
http://saveie6.com/
In those statistics (and really any browser statistics like them) Opera's numbers are unfairly represented because Opera allows you to change what header it sends out allowing you to spoof other browsers such as IE or netscape. I, like many other Opera users, generally have my user-agent set to IE. This is useful in the case of sites that (stupidly) limit your ability to access a page based on what browser you're using. For example, when I go to staples.com in Opera with my user-agent header set to Opera, it tells me I don't have cookies enabled (yeah, WTF?) but if I change my user-agent to IE, I can browse the whole site perfectly.
Particularly since it shows Linux at 3% and Mac at 2.5%.
And it shows a fairly steady (if slow) increase.
Are these statistics showing the percentage using Mozilla, or the percentage reporting themselves as being Mozilla to webpages?
I dont know how real that info is, i mean it may just be that the sites im checking stats on are just a little off, but IE doesnt look like 78% on my sites , more like 95++ and that to, easily. Perhaps the list of sites that they are taking into consideration are just the geeky sites where people actually do have a clue as to other browsers. Im convinced the only reason MSN gets the number of hits that it does is really just because of the fact that so many users dont know how to change their home page ! Can anyone else provide feed back on their site stats ? I use FireFox for my browsing, love the tabs and the download manager, but it sure is memory hungry, i wish it would load up along with Windows and be quicker on the start, perhaps they should do what Winamp does, which is, start a winamp loader by default.
Many years from now, when this battle has long died off, I'm going to tell everyone I had a part in this marketshare shift (whether it's true or not at that point will be a non-issue). :)
Here's my proof - my piece on dumping IE that started making its rounds more than 2 weeks before the CERT stuff.
dmiessler.com -- grep understanding knowledge
Mozillazine stats showed over a 90% Mozilla/Firefox browser usage.
For anyone who doesn't get the reference, go to "about:mozilla" in a mozilla based browser.
I run two web sites, one of which gets 3 million hits per day, neither of which are tech-oriented, and have seen very similar results to W3schools. In January, 7% Firefox/Mozilla and 85% IE. In August, 15% Firefox/Mozilla and 74% IE.
I should buy some cement.
If you went with the first answer rather than giving respondents two chances, I'd say you would have had a lot more that answered, "I dunno, what's a browser", and another 30% that answered, "Windows."
After my 15y/o son went on about it, I decided to give it a try. The clincher was when I right clicked and had an option to look up a word. This after trying several browsers in the past.
"Let this be a lesson in complacency."
Thank you mother hen!
Do me a favor and report technology news. If I wanted sensationalism, I would have picked up a copy of the New York Post.
Thanks,
A slashdot reader
Let's your Slashdot stats. If you love your stats, you will set them free.
I just moved to a new highschool for my senior year and signed up for a java class. I was pleased when I found out that the computers in the lab have Firefox (and OpenOffice) on them. I guess word is spreading, even though most CS type teachers are probably nerds too...
i am truly happy to see a worthy alternative to IE. congratulation to mozilla team!
anonymous software engineer/code monkey
I'm looking at btowser stats for seifried.org, averaging 70,000 visits a month in the security area and I'm not seeing even a hint of firefox in the top 15 browsers for any month, "MSIE 6.0; Windows X" and googlebot are the clear winners. You think people interested in computer security and UNIX would have a tendancy to use FireFox or Mozilla but IE is still kicking their butts.
36.97%=Mozilla/5.0 ; 33.65%=MSIE 6.0 ; 6.45%=Pompos/1.3 http://dir.com/pompos.html ; 6.40%=msnbot/0.11 (+http://search.msn.com/msnbot.htm) ; 2.71%=Opera 7.5 ; 2.46%=Yahoo! Slurp ; 2.41%=Googlebot/2.1 (+http://www.google.com/bot.html) ; 1.93%=psbot/0.1 (+http://www.picsearch.com/bot.html) ; 1.49%=MSIE 5.5 ; 0.87%=Konqueror/3.2 ; 0.80%=Mozilla/3.01 (compatible;) ; 0.56%=Konqueror/3.3 ; 0.50%=MSIE 5.0 ; 0.43%=Konqueror/3.1 ; 0.41%=Opera 7.2
Here are the more normal Aug. results with about 0% hits coming from slashdot:
46.89%=MSIE 6.0 ; 16.82%=Mozilla/5.0 ; 7.92%=msnbot/0.11 (+http://search.msn.com/msnbot.htm) ; 6.50%=Googlebot/2.1 (+http://www.google.com/bot.html) ; 3.55%=Ask Jeeves/Teoma)" ; 3.14%=MSIE 5.0 ; 2.67%=Pompos/1.3 http://dir.com/pompos.html ; 1.86%=MSIE 5.5 ; 1.82%=psbot/0.1 (+http://www.picsearch.com/bot.html) ; 1.27%=HTTrack 3.0 ; 1.05%=Yahoo! Slurp ; 0.93%=Mozilla/3.01 (compatible;) ; 0.88%=Opera 7.5
I use this one. Tab browser, I especially like that you can have multiple homepages. I have 7 of them.
http://www20.pos.to/~sleipnir/
Unfair! Many IE users are forced to spoof their user-agent strings to represent themselves as Mozilla/FireFox users to make themselves looks hip and socially conscious.
Or not.
DCMonkey
Why do you think IE's user string starts with Mozilla? It was Microsoft spoofing Netscape to get their browser access to places designed for it.
Most people who visit w3schools.com are not the average user, they are developers: early adopters. It would take at least another 9 months for global Mozilla usage to reach half these levels.
I prefer to go by the stats published by OneStat.com in their Pressbox.
However, I do think the rest of the year will bring a significant change in browser usage.
the stats of this site will continue to grow in favour of Mozilla.
Even more interesting, do "about:mozilla" in IE6 on XPSP2 -- they took out the bluescreen!
Slashdot's dirty little secret? The vast majority of their users are using IE on Windows.
Schools and companies are the places where there are a huge number of computers. Those are the places where Mozilla can make inroads for quick jumps in market share. My school finally dropped Netscape 4 and is offering a custom Mozilla browser with its logo to every student. How long before others follow?
It works, but definitely not my brower of choice. It runs slow compared to opera and others. However, it does work on the myriad of broken sites with lousy coding. I guess its emulating IE or the Necromancia. T.
Not to Firefox troll, but I think everyone should make an effort to switch at least one person over to firefox. Then, see if they can switch at least one person.
I was happy using Mozilla, but since I switched to Firefox... I've been thrilled.
It flies, it has some nice plugins (I recommend FTPsync and Browser Agent switching for those annoying sites) and my experience has been nothing but great.
Just because I occassionally switch my user agent string doesn't mean I don't complain. I recently submitted a complaint to yahooligans (A yahoo kids oreiented site).
"You should always go to other people's funerals; otherwise, they won't come to yours." -- Yogi Berra
About 35% of the hits to my personal site are via referrers from various mountain biking forums (where my signature has a link to my site) and about 12.5% are from the MacNN forums. With these tidbits in mind, here are my site's browser stats, compiled since Dec 2003 and current as of today:
MSIE 6, 52.87%
Netscape 7 (this includes Mozilla and Safari, I believe),38.33%
MSIE 5, 8.24%
with others in vanishingly small numbers
Other interesting tidbits of note: 28.24%of my visitors use Macs, 1.55% are reporting running Linux 2.x, and no, the fact that I use a Mac and reload my own website does not account for the stats since reloads are only 13.84% of all traffic (besides the fact that my PC using friends reload as well).
I suggested to a friend to use Firefox a year ago. She's failry technically literate. She liked the browser enough that she's kept using it and ditched IE. I forgot to tell her about updates to the browser. I used her computer last week and she's been keeping up to date herself.
Not only that, but she tells me all many of her friends are also using it (there's at least 15 or 20 that I know of). So, after showing one person how much better it is, there's at least 20 new users now who use Firefox almost exclusively!
As has been said in many previous posts, those stats JUST represent ONE site, and a tech-oriented one at that, making the results hugely biased.
1 03 09
For a comparison as to how useless those statistics are, I checked out the stats for the most popular site tracked by NedStatBasic. It's startpagina.nl with about 2.8 million pageviews per day.
Here are the browser stats:
IE 5/6: 96.7%
Mozilla: 2.7%
Other: 0.6%
You can see the stats here:
http://www.nedstatbasic.net/s?tab=1&link=5&id=7
This is over the entire course of usage for my site.
It's a personal one, and I'm a computer guy...my guess is that about half of my visitors have computer-related interests, and that about half are from Slashdot. I'm getting 21.5% Mozilla, and 1.84% Konqueror (no one using Safari has yet visited). My guess is that Konqueror/Safari use is statistically negligible.
Here's my stats page.
Mod me down and I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine!
Google's Zeitgeist was a good measure of the average user, but they've dropped the browser stats.
Wrong, Google's Zeitgeist, showing 1% Mozilla, is at odds with every other source of browser stats I've seen. They have every reason to be ashamed of themselves on that count.
My non-techy websites get about 7% Firefox, and about another 3% of Mozilla/Netscape 6/7 users. Is Firefox/Mozilla usage increasing? Yes, but it is not at 15%.
It's a lot closer to 15% than it is to Google's 1%.
When all you have is a hammer, every problem starts to look like a thumb.
No one will really notice until Mozilla browsers have 20%+ of the market. Then MS will announce that the next version of IE will:
* do all the stuff mozilla does
* works with dot net better
* never gets dull, and can slice a tomato perfectly after trimming 4" off your car's muffler
* is a free download
* but wait... there's more (tm) ms will throw in MR. Paperclip browsing buddie at no cost to you.
-- $G
The most interesting thing is that slashdot is one of the sites it has the most trouble with. Take a look at the screenshot on this page! Most of the time it will render /. like that until I hit reload and that will fix it.
I've seen this behavior on Mac, Windows, and Linux. And there's a bug posted on it in the Firefox bug database. What perplexes me is why the /. folks with the necessary skills haven't fixed this problem yet!
Best Buy can have you arrested
I would hope that large organizations would eventually realize that the money saved on the back end through the hiring of cheap developers and development tools is more than negated when considering that you are also paying for the virus detection systems, support staff, and system recovery of 10,000 users, but this has not happened. And as more money is poured down the drain of IE only sites, it is just going to get harder.
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
What are the advantages / disadvantages of running the individual components (firefox and thunderbird) versus the unified mozilla suite?
Why are there some features that exist in firefox that arent in mozilla? (ex: view image link)
Win98SE IE still gives the bluescreen.
(Why should I give more of MY money to one of the richest men on Earth for XP, when it's a dual-boot and Win98SE is just there for the games? Answer: sometime soon I expect games to REQUIRE WinXP, but I'll keep MY money MINE until then.)
The living have better things to do than to continue hating the dead.
0.1% CowboyNeal
On the same lines, I wish /. would post their stats... (Cmdr Taco?)
/.'s stats compare.
It would be interesting to see how
Mozilla can start on boot, but that also means the time to finish Windows loading completely also takes longer.
And I believe Firefox is partly memory hungry because it caches more in memory, and IE already has more functions loaded at boot because of its integration with the OS.
home
August 2004: Win XP,53.2% ;W2000, 28.1% ;Win 98 7.0%.
I just cannot believe that Windows 2000 has half the number of users as Win XP.
evanchik.net
Sorry, but I don't believe it.
Give us the links
No surprise. It can do many things that IE and other browsers can't..ie PNG transparency. http://simcitysphere.com/
Safari is based on KHTML, so I don't think it would show up as Netscape 7.
I am a believer of momentum and curves.
When I've checked my personal site's stats (small gardening site...
400-500 hits a day, ehh?
Sounds like a:
M A R I J U A N A site to me
Sorry, lost my mind for a moment, please mod me down to preserve this fine news site from my abusive post.
Your hybrid is not saving the environment. Its purpose is to make you feel good about buying something.
Yeah, I was surprised at first too when I heard about it from a friend who runs this site-
IMAP for Gmail.
Here's the screenshot(2 days old) for the month of Sep.
On a lot of website statistics gathering tools KHTML and Safari aren't supported options so they usally get counted as gecko based(at least with mine).
-
Please Understand Why My Wife Can't Stand Mozilla
Well, crap, can't link to bugzilla from slashdot anymore. It's bug # 182221. It should work if you use "copy link location" and paste it into the URL field at the top of your browser window.Back when I submitted the bug in June of 2003, my wife was working as a freelance web designer, and tried to use Mozilla for her work after I stressed the importance of interoperable websites, but gave up in frustration because Mozilla had several UI bugs that made it unusable for her, bugs that no one seemed inclined to fix.
Well, flash forward to September of 2004, and now my wife is a happy user of Mozilla 1.7. She never touches internet explorer.
She's not a web designer anymore though. She found clients frustrating too.
The Mozilla people who commented on the bug were a bunch of grumps who never seemed to understand that my wife and I were genuinely trying to be helpful.
Request your free CD of my piano music.
not her fucker, i try to modify those bithes
Damn, missed the url
Browser_Stats
IMAP for Gmail
English is easier said than done.
I know you're not necessarily making that assertion, but I disagree that software is a natural monopoly.
What is likely to be a natural monopoly is the standards used for communication protocols. Microsoft knows this and that's where we get the first Halloween Document. But broadly, I'm referring to protocols for hardware, networking, software interoperability, whatever. As long as everyone is using the same protocols to move data around (and some organization OTHER than a corporation is controlling the protocols), the front ends and added value to those protocols are still a wide open field for competition, open- or closed-source.
But with the growing popularity (and existing dominance) of OSS software, the natural monopoly might go to the general OSS framework. The vengeful part of me wants to see Microsoft miss that boat entirely. The practical part wants to see them participate, because once in a blue moon, they do have a well-implemented good idea.
Certainly in Europe :) :
:)
Here are the stats from Poland
first all the guests stats
http://www.ranking.pl/rank.php?stat=browAL
then Polish users stats
http://www.ranking.pl/rank.php?stat=browPL
and outsiders stats
http://www.ranking.pl/rank.php?stat=browFG
as you can see Opera RULES in Poland (second after IE) with >4% steady rising userbase
Go grab those torrents.
I think that they should take a statistic asking people how many different browser names they know, then multiplying that by their favorite browser's score. I bet that Internet Explorer won't even be near the top of the list then.
Don't waste your vote! Vote for whoever you want, unless you live in a swing state it won't matter anyways
Not sure why parent was modded "troll"
:-).
When I create web content for my employer, I like to actually read and understand the code I create.
My 'web development tool' of choice? a text editor
http://request-header.info
Lots of people reply to this with "are these reliable?". The answer is simple. These stats are 100% reliable. These stats show with 100% correctness which browsers claimed to connect to this specific site.
Do these stats tell us anything about your site? Not much. It's totally ridiculous to take from this that you should or shouldn't support other browsers because of their share of this site's viewers.
The only stats that should influence your decision of which browser to support is the stats on that site. The stats from similar sites are interesting as an indicator but they're nothing but a very unreliable guess.
However what makes this interesting is the fact that this one specific site is seeing Mozilla usage grow at the expense of IE usage. While we shouldn't use this to imfulence any professional decisions it is good news if you're rooting for the underdog.
People are saying that IE has a 95% share and it isn't changing. But yet again that's on some specific site somewhere. No site is more reliable than any other but with these sort of trends it's always good to see.
Because frankly we are not interested in anybody's html code writing skills. We are sometimes interested in finding out what they think.
See, it's all about communication.
Your argument would appear to imply that anybody who does not hand code pdf files should not be allowed to produce well formatted documents, by, for example, using a word processor.
So you may be an elitist (I am as well), but you seem a remarkably short sighted one, who confuses ends and means.
Amen brother!!! This dude keeps posting the lamest things
Let me first say that I use Mozilla and Firefox almost religeously. I love the tabbe browsing and built in ad blocking (which only recently became available for IE in XP SP2) but...
I still find that at least once a day I run into a site that does not display right, or not at all, in these browsers. I know part of this is that "the site is designed for IE" and therefore "not following the standards" but you know what....if 90% of people use IE, then it IS the standard. Like it or not, a standard on paper is only as good as people make it through every day use.
I'd love to see Mozilla or Firefox come out with a version that runs all of the pages I need. Even if it is only a plugin or extension that "makes bad pages work" by throwing in some sort of hack to make Mozilla run like IE, it would help me to make the switch 100%. Until then, I am forced to keep that little 'E' icon in my quicklaunch for emergencies. And I dare not set Firefox as my default browser until I know it is going to be 100% compatible.
Anyway, just my 2 cents.
I've gently pushed Mozilla/Firefox whenever I can for the last few years. Whenever someone complains to me about pop-ups, I tell them about Firefox. Whenever someone asks how I've made my browser have such cool buttons, I tell them about Firefox. Whenever someone asks my advice about viruses, worms, spyware, adware, etc., from websites, I tell them about Firefox.
My experience is that most people think that the switch will be too painful. The tipping point is convincing them to download the thing and just try it for a week. After all, you can just delete it if you don't like it. Again, in my experience, the hurdle is just getting someone to try it. Everybody who's tried it has kept it. Maybe they could do some kind of "Pepsi Challenge" marketing event where they dare people to use only Mozilla for a week and go back?
Of course sadly they also have to keep IE (ay-eee!) for those sites with Active X, such as microsoft updates.
"Stop throwing the Constitution in my face, it's just a goddamned piece of paper!" - George W. Bush Nov. 2005
- Requests - Browser
- 402 - MSIE 4
- 42 - MSIE 3
- 2 - Mozilla M18
- 15 - Netscape 3
- 2 - Netscape 2
- 12 - Opera 5
My wife has done up a real nice redesign of what's presently a real haphazard site. Her new design is all validated XHTML 1.0 with CSS, including positioning.It looks appalling in Netscape 4. One reason we haven't posted her new design yet is that, until her 1996-era Mac died a month or so ago, Netscape 4 was what my mom used. I convinced her to buy an iMac. She likes the stylish design.
Something people need to realize is that there are still many people who cannot upgrade. Some people aren't permitted to by their IT departments, but more likely many are people like my Mom using ancient hardware where Mozilla won't run.
Request your free CD of my piano music.
Indeed, but Safari is a wily beast. Its default is "Mozilla/5.0":from http://developer.apple.com/internet/safari/safari
My web tracking service definitely seems to lump "Mozilla 5.0", and thus Safari, in with Netscape 7 since the other choices (Netscape 3, 4, MSIE 4, Opera and Other) all have negligible hit counts.
Dont forget that Gmail is still invitation-only, and therefore a very biased sample.
Whenever I hear the word 'Innovation', I reach for my pistol.
How are you checking for Safari? You do realize that it reports itself as Mozilla/5.0, no? http://developer.apple.com/internet/safari/safari_ faq.html#anchor2
IE 5 has decreased every month in their survey, from January 2002 through now. For example, it's down from 12.8% in January 2004, to 9.2% in May 2004, to 7.0% in August 2004.
On Blake Ross website blakeross.com at http://www.blakeross.com/archives/000241.html "Not even at 1.0 yet, Firefox already enjoys inbound links to its product page from a staggering 74,000 http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&q= link:GKeOz8LFGmYJ:www.mozilla.org/products/firefox / websites. This is 20,000 more http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&q= link:IPflJ8BuWUUJ:www.opera.com/ than link to Opera, 5,000 more http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&q= link:8zEU1IkyJ0UJ:www.netscape.com/ > than link to Netscape, 15,000 more http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&q= link:FprvSA3hHIAJ:www.microsoft.com/ie/ than link to Microsoft's IE page and 12,000 more http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&q= link:5iRmnZTn43cJ:www.apple.com/ than link to Apple. This is phenomenal!"
Sincerity, Brandon
I remember, i used to have to start IE all the time, now I am able to use FireFox non-stop and very very rarely need to use Internet Exploder (something that was impossible 9 months ago),
I think part of the problem with people switching to mozilla/firebird/firefox was that "it's too much of a pain in the (rear end)"
I think people are starting to realise that FireFox is now better (in most cases) than Internet Explorer.
I know people (myself included) that went from Netscape to Internet Explorer (because everything was MS friendly code) and now back to FireFox (not so much regular Mozilla).
Firefox has made tons of improvement in the past 9 months. and I know plenty of people in that 9 months that have started using FireFox. (and i started using FireFox more) (not to mention it is more secure)
So i do believe this story, FireFox is growing!
There are a few things that will be able to convert any IE user to firefox:
1. Make a "TRY ME!" program, allow it to run without installing anything (just so people can try it)
2. Bundle a few Extentions in with the FireFox "TRY ME!"(like AdBlock)
3. Have a tutorial that shows off the features of FireFox, (Firefox has so many features, I'M STILL LEARNING) Show the people every little feature of FireFox.
4. and the last thing: Add a file manager to it
(If you haven't) Try FireFox today, and if you like FireFox try to convert 3 people to FireFox.
I think he's just appealing to the groupthink mods.
I think you're in denial.
They make you use Amaya!
We know that U.S Patent Office is notorious of issuing patents (particularly software patents) that are clearly unpatentable. But very few are aware that U.S. Patent Office is violating our constitutional right by promulgating and enforcing a Microsoft-IE-only policy.
This little-noticed law really makes me mad and feel like crying--why a government agency can be so stupid.
Basically, when you file a patent application, if the Patent Office thinks that your invention is not patentable because it is not novel or nonobvious, it will send you copies of prior art patents so you can rebut their rejection.
Now the Patent Office has changed its policy and will not send you those hard copies. Instead, it requires you to download those prior art reference on-line.
Under ordinary circumstances, this would not pose any problem, except that we are dealing with one of the most stupid government agencies in the history of mankind. The United States Patent Office, without much notice, now requires that, in order to download those references, you must register with the Patent Office, then the Patent Office will install a program ON YOUR MACHINE WHICH MUST BE RUNNING MICROSOFT INTERNET EXPLORER UNDER MICROSOFT WINDOWS to allow you to communicate with the Patent Office before you can download those prior art patents that our government must furnish you as a matter of our constitution right and as part of the filing fees paid to the Patent Office.
Thus, basically it has boiled down to this stupid law: if you want to receive a patent, you are now REQUIRED BY LAW to have a machine with Microsoft Windows running Internet Explorer in your office.
In other words, in order to exercise your constitutional rights, you must have a machine that runs Microsoft Windows and you must set Microsoft Internet Explorer as your default browser.
What kind of stupid government agency is this? I know many banks used to have the same requirement (i.e., using Microsoft IE running in Microsoft Windows), but they have got rid of this stupid policy because they have to compete in order to survive.
The United States Patent and Trademark can implement and insist such a stupid policy because it doesn't have to compete. But what about those 4000+ patent attorneys? How come all of them are so quiet? Are all of them idiots?
Even our HomeLand Security Department has changed its Microsoft-only policy. It appears that our Patent and Trademark Office is the only government agency in the whole world that requires its users to use Microsoft Windows. Unlike Homeland Security Department, the U.S. Patent Office has to account to no one!
Microsoft survives and propers exactly because our government agencies are unafraid to abuse their power and unashamed of being idiots.
Heh, no, not "adult".
www.nationstates.net
I should buy some cement.
it's time to do this for slashdot
There is a spark in every single flame bait point.
If you look closely, you'll see that internet explorer 6 usage has been pretty level, but internet explorer 5 usage plumetted in almost exactly the same proportion that firefox / moz increased.
It appears, then, that these are people with old machines who won't put up with an increasingly exploited browser but who can't run I.E. 6... either from a power standpoint or an access standpoint. Windows 98 usage only dropped 3% in that time, so nearly all of the converts must be running the older platform.
I'd be interested to see statistics correlating the two, and whether or not the people visiting w3 skew towards having older computers than the average surfers.
Either way the conclusion is clear: Microsoft is losing people at the tail end of their product line, because they refuse to offer a low-power, efficient alternative for older platforms.
The ______ Agenda
Amen, brother!
This is good news, even if you work for m$ this is good news
If I have to explain why then your a bit thick
Imagine everyone used OS X say, would we thank jobs?
Nah we be out of a job...
Would you like a cookie?
MMM cookies and milk
A Java(tm) virus?
The non-tech-y website I work for has gotten 23.5% Firefox users so far this month and Safari is at 6.7%. I'd give you a link so you could judge for yourself but I don't want to be responsible for a slashdotting.
called me tonight to inform me that his father does not have firefox. My son was upset and downloaded Firefox for his browser. Apparently, my ex-husband has been having problems with my son's games while with dad. We are divorced. My son informed me that his father had a lot of problems with his computer but he was going to fix it. He downloaded Ad-Aware, Spybot Search and Destroy, Mozilla Firefox and he would explain these to his dad. Uhh....he is 10. I think we are making progress. :)
yeah I must admit last time I looked (May '04) IE had 97%h ing.co.uk
www.glamourbreaks.co.uk
www.swanbournefinis
www.orchidcuisine.co.uk
the other 3% was me checking it worked in firefox/kde/osx etc etc (ps, found transparent IFRAME was a mac osX ie fucker)
see if you can find my real name and post it here on slashdot before 11/sept/04
If he did that, his Mozilla/Firefox stats would fly up.
Actually... would they? What are Slashdot's browser stats? I know it's not indicative of the entire web, but it'd be interesting to see nonetheless...
I agree. My sites collect about 500,000 pageviews a day and my stats seem very similar to those shown above.
IE : 96.30%
Netscape : 1.96%
Mozilla : 0.98%
Apple : 0.64%
Opera : 0.07%
Other : 0.05%
My visitors are mostly joe bloe average people looking around on job sites.
My IE stats haven't changed much in the past year other than a rise in IE6 and a drop in IE5/5.5.
I think he is too - a day off with no pay, fabulous! If only my company had a policy like that, instead of "keep working, you peasants".
To all the people who are saying that these stats don't count because it is aimed at developers or whatever, you are not completely correct.
The statistics from both before and after are taken from people who are developers. So that means, that at the very least, developers have doubled their usage of mozilla. And if developers are twice as interested in making their websites compatible with mozilla, then web usage of mozilla has likely taken a significant increase of the browser share.
I've long been plugging Mozilla/Firefox on my websites, particularly, my anti-Microsoft site at www.freedomware.us
I'm also running for state office and making Microsoft and open source software campaign issues - in Bill Gates' back yard. See my campaign website at www.edrevolt.org.
I wish more web designers would take charge of their profession and start plugging quality (i.e. non-Microsoft) software!
David Blomstrom
Webmaster of http://www.freedomware.us/ Candidate for Public Office - http://www.edrevolt.org/
Agreed - gmail invites make for a very biased sample, especially considering that a bunch of people in the Mozilla community seems to have them. Heck, I got my invite out of the blog of one of the mozilla.org employees, for fixing a Mozilla bug...
I was lucky.
Oh, people can come up with statistics to prove anything, Kent. 14% of people know that.
It's very common for larger companies to specify what software they want their employees to use. And it's not uncommon for them to specify their employees use a browser other than IE.
Some companies went directly from NN4 to NN7, bypassing NN6 and IE entirely.
If you're an accounting company, your employees might need the web to access tax information, etc etc. They certainly don't need the latest IE widgets to do their job.
not Mozilla, not Geico.
People visiting W3Schools care about standards and those people are more likely to use a standards compliant browser. This is a bit like going to a Dave Matthews Band concert and asking people who their favorite band is. Or maybe doing a presidential poll at Berkeley. I work at a major dot com (millions of hits a day, you'd easily recognize the name) and we've moved from roughly 3.3% to about 3.8% over the last 3 months. I am measuring those user agents reporting Gecko. Most of the jump happened within a week of the IE exploit news & the news coverage of Mozilla. I've personally switched 6 people to FireFox and I will continue to do so. It rocks. I am hoping for the day we really do achieve 15 to 20% because then designers can no longer ignore it. I think we're getting the traction and I am hopeful. Keep up the good work on converting others. Interesting tidbit: I see higher Mozilla usage on weekends (about 1/2 a percent higher). Confirms that Mozilla penetration is higher in the home. Our site is a site that's used both by consumers and businesses.
Better a divorce than a lifetime of torment for all concerned.
Request your free CD of my piano music.
There is quite a bit of variation. My site gets a similar number of hits a day and most people that go there use mozilla.
http://www.popularculturegaming.com -- my blog about the culture of videogame players
Let that be a lesson in KARMA - to Microsoft ! ... And this is just the start!
Wait, and see !
same kinda deal, though it's screwy because a year ago I wasn't using SquirrelMail (yes, I am too lazy to filter myself out of my logs :)
.NET CLR 1 .NET CLR 1
.NET CLR 1 .NET CLR 1
August 04:
Pages per Day 569 871
Visits per Day 155 228
Top 15 of 652 Total User Agents
# Hits User Agent
1 9041 20.57% Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.7) Gecko
2 3653 8.31% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1;
3 3080 7.01% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1)
4 2966 6.75% check_http/1.24.2.4 (nagios-plugins )
5 1693 3.85% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.0)
6 1397 3.18% Pompos/1.3 http://dir.com/pompos.html
7 1019 2.32% Mozilla/4.7 [en](Exabot@exava.com)
8 1008 2.29% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.0;
9 803 1.83% Mozilla/2.0 (compatible; Ask Jeeves/Teoma)
10 754 1.72% Mozilla/5.0 (compatible; Konqueror/3.2; Linux) (KHTML, like G
11 714 1.62% Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.7) Gecko
12 641 1.46% msnbot/0.11 (+http://search.msn.com/msnbot.htm)
13 513 1.17% Mozilla/5.0 (compatible; Yahoo! Slurp; http://help.yahoo.com/
14 510 1.16% Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7) Gecko/2004080
15 452 1.03% Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.7) Gecko/2004061
October 2003:
Pages per Day 794 1290
Visits per Day 145 205
Top 15 of 799 Total User Agents
# Hits User Agent
1 8287 19.15% check_http/1.2 (nagios-plugins 1.3.0-alpha1)
2 4377 10.12% Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/2003063
3 3542 8.19% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1)
4 2467 5.70% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.0)
5 2295 5.30% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.1;
6 1428 3.30% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows NT 5.0;
7 877 2.03% Mozilla/5.0 (compatible; Konqueror/3.1; Linux)
8 586 1.35% Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.2.1) Gecko/20030
9 491 1.13% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.01; Windows NT 5.0)
10 480 1.11% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 6.0; Windows 98)
11 441 1.02% Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-US; rv:1.5a) Geck
12 435 1.01% Mozilla/5.0 (X11; U; Linux i686; en-US; rv:1.4) Gecko/2003062
13 402 0.93% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.5)
14 395 0.91% Scooter/3.2
15 386 0.89% Mozilla/4.0 (compatible; MSIE 5.5; Windows NT 5.0)
Or do some things work in MSIE but not in other browsers? Or will some things work better if they're told that the visitor is MSIE, even if it's really links or w3m?
Any of this would slant the stats.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
The appCodeName and version may be the same, but the rest of the User-agent string is different.
"Can of worms? The can is open... the worms are everywhere."
I have been using Firefox/mozilla for a couple of years now and am quite happy with it thank you very much. However, when I try to access my email account from home or on the road I have to put up with Microsoft Outlook Web Access (company choice I guess).
With Firefox I can look at email but I cannot respond. I hit the respond button and nothing happens. When I then log in using IE everything works fine and I can reply to my emails.
Does anyone know about this problem?
Is this a setting in my Firefox browser that I don't have set correctly?
Any suggestions?
Sig. I'm only qualified to be a nerd in my own field of expertise
"Truth is much too complicated to allow anything but approximations"
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Why don't I post the obvious. Since the majority of sites keep logs. Why not ask as many sites as one can? What are your browser stats? Then we don't have to keep saying "trust these guys", "no, trust these guys".
There's definitely a "geek factor" here.
The trick is that users of IE 5 are also using older windows. And it is a well known fact that those users are slowly moving to a newer versions of windowns -> IE6. Hence, if Firefox steals equaly from each, IE6 compensated by users from IE5, while IE5 is suffering the double blow.
Wait and see. As soon as IE5 user base is depleted, IE6 will start to drop much sharper.
Requests - Browser
402 - MSIE 4
42 - MSIE 3
2 - Mozilla M18
15 - Netscape 3
2 - Netscape 2
12 - Opera 5
Mozilla milestone 18 was released in October of 2000 (nearly 4 years ago) and superseded by Moz 0.6 in December of 2000. If that's the only Mozilla-based browser that's showing up in your logs, you have a seriously wierd user base. The lack of hits from MSIE 5, MSIE 6 or Netscape 7 make me think you analyzed wrong year's logs, or used a very VERY old version of analog.
Or maybe this is a pre-fab troll post that's getting a little out of date...
0 1 - just my two bits
Although I think this is great, the statistics from some servers that I manage and run show different and it depends greatly on the type of site. For example this link to a stats report for a site that was Slashdotted shows Firefox users as 26.8% of visitors and Mozilla 16.7%, a grand total of 43.5% against IE, which got 40.7%. All I can say here is well done Slashdotters for using a decent, and probably the best browser - it's excellent.
Looking at another site, not slashdotted, of general interest for all sorts of users, the stats reveal 9.1% Firefox and 5.4% Mozilla, which comes to 14.5% - a figure very close to that posted in the article. Good.
However, it's very different when moving to a commercial site selling a commerical product. For example, on site reveals just 1.6% Mozilla & Firefox users against 96.6% IE users and another, selling Jazz and Latino records, has 4% Mozilla against 87.9% IE.
I reckon that it depends greatly upon who your audience is as to what statistics you extrapolate.
Most people count Netscape as Mozilla, since Netscape is (currently) just a rebranded Mozilla.
It is not a bug in Slashcode. It is a bug in the Gecko (the rendering portion of Mozilla) code related to incremental reflow. It has been fixed in Gecko, but the latest version of Gecko has not been rolled into Firefox.
(Courtesy of another Slashdotter in the know.)
I'm not sure what the schedule is on rolling in the fix.
May we never see th
- 263277 - MSIE 6
- 11580 - Mozilla 1
- 5725 - Netscape 7
- 3250 - Safari 125
- 1662 - Opera 7
So this makes it more apparent that users of ancient browsers are a tiny fraction of my visitors, but there are enough of them to be noticed, and to wonder why they never upgraded.Request your free CD of my piano music.
Now I have to follow standards again.
Well, it was fun while it lasted. Thanks for 1/3 increase in development 2x increase in testing! Dont get me wrong, I dont blame mozilla for this problem but... shit!
My Firefox (0.9.3) does not display /. properly? Everytime I open a thread into a new tab I have to refresh it from 1 to 3 times to get the text from overlapped.
This is really the only site I have this problem with that I visit on a regular basis. It's strange that Slashdot doesn't render properly about 85% of the time for me.
Of course they answered "Windows." Microsoft said that windows is the browser, and the browser is Windows, and they can't be separated. If Microsoft can't distinguish between them, can you expect the average computer user to?
Ewige Blumenkraft.
here at BU, we're installing firefox on user's computers on a daily basis when they come to tech support, laden with spyware. we install adaware, and get them off IE... which is certainly one way to convert the student body :)
filter: +3. Hey, look! all the trolls went away!
Just one thing, w3schools.com is a site for people who write websites, so they'd naturally have a much higher percentage of non-IE browsers than the more general browsing population.
Sure, people with the most basic web knowledge know to avoid IE. If you filter out people with a clue you are left with 99.999% winblows users. I'm happy the cluefull are migrating in increasing numbers. It shows that whatever real and perceived barriers there are to using non M$ software are going away.
Do you suggest we get all our stats from the clueless and deluded? Perhaps we should just get the facts from Bill Gates.
Oh yeah, this is what they claim about their study:
The statistics above are extracted from W3Schools' log-files, but we are also monitoring other sources around the Internet to assure the quality of these figures.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
That last is a cellular 'phone. So obviously I attract a lot of maniacs. (-:
You also need to delete about 4.5% for automated hits from Lynx.
However, MSIE only gets 16.3% of overall hits (roughly 24% if you ignore my pages), Mozilla-ishes get the lion's share at 18.5%, Konqueror next at 4.3%, assorted known bots at 4%, Opera at 0.6% plus zillions of miscellanea at a fraction of a percent each. This is out of 383,000 hits for August.
The top two are steadily changing at about 1% per month each (MSIE is losing about 1%, Mozilla-ishes are gaining about 1%, which is a pretty hefty swing over a year or two), the others are wobbling around their figures, except that Konqueror and related are steadily gaining about 0.1-0.2% each month. June was the last month (hopefully forever) that MSIE was top scorer. That the top search string entering the server is "putty tunnel" and the next commonest entry is only 1/8th as common hints that the vast majority of users hitting the server are hitting it from MS-Windows based machines, but I haven't asked the stats program to itemise those.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Don't forget those nitwits answering "Word"!
(I've got that answer a couple of times to the simple question: "What operating system do you use?").
"It's too bad that stupidity isn't painful." - Anton LaVey
Or less like an easy mark. The problem is that it's easier to change your browser and easier still to change out your whole OS for something that works. Oh dear, that's what these statistics mean isn't it?
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
That's some funny math. The way I see it, IE has gone from close to 90% to close to 75%. That's a big difference, 9/10 to 3/4. You are also ignoring the rate of change, which is accelerating significantly. It's surprising when you consider the AOL (you know, world's biggest ISP) inclusion of IE and other changes which should have favored IE usage.
Predictions of more non M$ use are easier to make. These people are the kinds of "decision makers" that are going to tell people of their positive experiences. Web developers are obviously sick of M$, despite it's "market share" and are learning that other software works better.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
I think the primary reason why people ARE trying Mozilla/FireFox is the fact that you can do tabbed browsing, essentially opening multiple windows to view multiple web pages without having to open a new instance of the web browser.
A secondary reason why Mozilla has become more popular is the fact that with the release of Mozilla 1.6, Mozilla is actually usable on most web sites out there, even difficult-to-render ones like ESPN.com.
Given the major rumor that Microsoft may be working on a next-generation stand-alone web browser to replace Internet Explorer 6.01 SP1, if Microsoft incorporates tabbed browsing that will pretty much kibosh most of the desirability of Mozilla in a New York minute.
My organization is just about to switch 700+ desktops from IE to Firefox. :) :) :)
I guess in Mozilla usage is low in the UK, eh? BTW your name is Gary Havelock.
The real path to male liberation
Mozilla is one HUGE application. It is grindingly slow and painful, IE is lean and mean comparatively.
For a while Netscape 4.7x communicator was all that was available for AIX, Solaris etc. Firefox has changed things, and gained market share.
I used to use netscape 3.x back in the early days, then switched to IE because it was there by default, and also because Netscape 4.x was too slow for my brand new hardware. Browsing has to be fast, and most people multitask it with other things, so it shouldnt take 100% of your memory. I then started using Opera as soon as that was available, and now back to Firefox.
I'm not alone.
Many others who were capable of downloading and installing Netscape didnt for its size alone. I just hate to see Firefox called Mozilla because theres a big difference. Sure they share code but the philosophy is different.
I hope they completely dump the entire mozilla browser and continue the firefox line, and even produce something thats smaller, leaner and faster than the current firefox, for older machines.
"Give orange me give eat orange me eat orange give me eat orange give me you." -Nim Chimpsky
Its http://bugzilla.mozilla.org/show_bug.cgi?id=slashd ot (yes, id=slashdot actually works) I didn't make it clickable because it won't load a with Slashdot referer anyway.
Pardon me for being somewhat off-topic. I use/love firefox, but on slashdot I get some weird column overlapping every once in a while and have to hit reload to 'get it right.' Any slashdotters out there have this problem , and possibly know a fix on this?
Say hello to my little sig.
Seeing that the top link on your homepage was audaciously called Me and the WORLD'S LARGEST ORGAN, I had to click it.
Unfortunately, I think that any regular slashdot reader will be disappointed.
How come it is that all the anti-MS scrubs that inhabit Slashdot always make some outrageous claim that everyone and their mother has changed to Firefox or Linux. If over half of the comments on Slashdot were true and these commentors really got all these people to switch to Linux, Linux would be the dominant OS right now, all crap. Most parents especially if you dont live with them are not changing anything. Average users have no cares about the browser wars, they just want a browser thats gonna do what they need when they need it and IE does that.
Yet Opera accounted for 2.5% of hits, and doesn't work with GMail. Pretty interesting stats, I'd say.
I realize that the administration had their experts too, but they have a very bad record of firing their experts and analysts (or ruining their or their spouse's careers (cf. Wilson)) when they disagree with the administration.
The people they interviewed are extremely respectable *experts*, in contrast to you. And in contrast to Bush's analysts and experts now, they approached their analysis with an open mind, and without fear that they would be severely reprimanded and possible have their careers fatally impeded if that had too open a mind on the issues. You might do well to listen to what they have to say, if you haven't already made up your mind.
Here is one little tidbit for you. The administration said time and time again that Saddam Hussein had tons of Sarin gas left over from the gulf war and that he could use this to launch attacks within 45 minutes on neighbors. The trouble is, Sarin gas, according to the experts, has a shelf life of three years, and would definitely not be a threat to anybody 10 years later. Do you really think that the administration didn't know that, and knowingly lie? That's one of hundreds of similar deceptions about Hussein's so-called weapons of mass destruction.
I got my parents to switch (I don't live with them), I got my sister to switch, and even my grandparents. Thats a pretty good conversion rate I think. I've had numerous friends come over to the good side as well.
Er...honestly, who the fuck cares how trustable these stats are? How about you guys realize that any increase in Mozilla/Firefox usage is a good sign. It doesn't matter from where, or on how small a scale, or just from one site. Any increase is a good increase (for Mozilla products).
It doesn't look like Mozilla is catching on much among the general public.
I run a number of porn sites, and if I were more organized in my stats, I could give you precise numbers. But informally, a lot of the freeloader-oriented sites (i.e. sites with free porn, which attract repeat, veteran porn surfers) are getting a strong majority mozilla users. I'd guess pop-up blocking was the driving force, as free porn sites are notorious for pop-ups, and are quick to adopt work-arounds to the various IE toolbar-based pop-up blockers. (So that pop-ups still appear even with google's anti-pop-up toolbar installed). XP's SP2 offers solid pop-up blocking, so I expect that incentive will dissipate now.
The only true way to tell is to actually look at everyones comp, but 2nd best is check google.
u n04.html and you will see that it may be possible that mozilla has doubled but its hard to tell.
e rs.gif
Go here http://www.google.com/press/zeitgeist/zeitgeist-j
Here is the graphic itself. http://www.google.com/press/zeitgeist/jun04_brows
Its hard to tell since ie takes over the chart so much.
Even if it has doubled which i dought it has what does it matter?
IE still kills everyone else.
http://DiabloHeat.com | http://Kyle.TheOCSucks.com | http://TheOCSucks.com
Don't get me wrong. I advocate switching to another browser on my webpages because of IE's vulnerabilities and continued "patch update" nonsense wasting my time. My only problem with Mozilla gaining in usage %age is that the virus/trojan/spyware makers will aim their slime at Mozilla browsers now. I don't use Firefox or Opera or Safari, but i'm not going to advocate everybody run to the browser I use---Why would i want the scumbags to aim their slime at my browser???? :-)
* weedshare.com 50% to artists, webjay.org iuma.com CDBaby.com Epitonic.com ampcast.com
'Nuff said.
"Yes, Mozilla's increased, but at the expense of old IE5 installations only."
So you assume the IE6 number didn't change, but people upgrade from IE5 straight to Mozilla?
Sorry, but this poll doesn't include "transition stats". What I imagine is that about the same number of people run Windows Update and have IE6 installed as a result (or get XP instead of 98SE) as those who change from IE6 to Mozilla. That should be the reason why the IE6 stats don't change much - it gains from one side just as much as it loses from the other, but it gains and loses a lot simultaneously.
45 5F E1 04 22 CA 29 C4 93 3F 95 05 2B 79 2A B2
So what happens when they download the DVD Bootable Debian Linux with a little help from the scalable download mechanism and reboot ?
...for launching the initiative to create their own web browser after enduring several years of MacIE languishing, for looking to the open source community instead of inventing their own proprietary closed-source solution, for choosing KHTML and not Gecko, for publicizing their efforts and their decisions. Because of Apple, the Mozilla community was forced to re-examine itself, its mission statement, and whether its efforts were delivering any useful results. Because of Apple, the Mozilla community split the monolithic Mozilla into more useful components: Firefox for the web browser, and Thunderbird for the mail client. Or has everyone forgotten one of several Slashdot threads on the subject, or the media's take on it?
can u tell me this....
i hav firefox 0.8 and on dial up..
Although firefox does hav a download manager, it doesnt seem to be able to resume downloads after I restart the system....somethin i used to do with DAp.i could download file over a perod of few days .
is there a tweak in fire fox to resume download later....
Your ideas welcome.
Why does yahoo do this
Fuck yeah. I use KWrite for everything, personally. I use it to write articles, I use it to write python, I use it for xml, xhtml, you fuckin' name it. Everything! A good syntax highlighting text editor that supports searching with regular expressions is all that I need to do anything I want.
Hell, I'd use it to hand code Microsoft Word documents if they'd release some decent documentation.
Like what I said? You might like my music
...
>but it's mad to conduct our lives >and organize >our societies around the contention >that there >is.
>--
No, it's exactly the other way round,
It's scientifically irrelevant whether
there is "other side", however, conducting your life and organizing society based on the premise
has immediate and measurable consequences.
In other words, the very concept of "other side"
has evolved as, and is but an answer to
empirical problems.
You DON'T wanna do that, trust me =)
Sure enough, the Gecko-using browsers have crept up in recent months, but nothing earth-shattering - what started off as around 2.1% 6 months ago is now 3.2%. Perhaps more interesting is to note that home users are taking up Gecko browsers in a big way (now seeing almost 5% Gecko at the weekends), but on workdays, that slips to back down to under 3%.
Conclusion: Gecko browser usage is increasing on the average site, but only by about 0.2% a month (will take 3 years to reach 10%, which sounds about right).
...they haven't discovered aalib yet, so they can't see their pr0n.
Oddly enough, you can get versions of Lynx (and Links) which will display the graphics if they're run under X.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
http://www.blue.lu/other/blocker/
or
http://www.adblock.org/
...your tagline ("The scientific view of religion is not atheism") is precisely correct.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Does anybody else see the links on the left side of the page overlap the middle body section? I see it happen randomly. Does anybody know if this is a Slashdot issue or a Firefox issue or both?
ignore this, it has already been talked about.
Perhaps a lot of salesmen use sales figures to tally the number of users of each OS out there?
Typical bistromathematics from a salesman: "Let me see... 2000 seats of Win2k3 at AUD$139 and 2000 seats of (downloaded for free) Mandrake Linux equals 2000 MS-Windows users and zero Linux users. Microsoft is steamrolling the market. Job well done." <thwack!>
Sites that require IE and then say, Napoleon-style, "what Konqueror-on-Linux users?" are another classic statistical blunder. Of course the Konqueror (Mozilla, Opera, yadda yadda) users are either going to up-stakes or set their browser ID to MSIE-in-WinXX! <thwack!> (and <thwack!> again, that was really stupid!)
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Also, some of the big stats sites have made announcements along those lines in the last few weeks.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Except for this site which often looks screwed up in firefox with various columns of text overwriting each other.
Article I, section 8, of the Constitutuion provides: "Congress shall have power . . . to promote the progress of science and useful arts, by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries."
Unlike any other country in the world, the U.S. Constitution contains a specific language regarding the right to obtain patent(s). But with USPTO's June 2004 unilateral decision, in order to exercise such constitutional right, you must use Microsoft Internet Explorer and Microsoft Windows.
(How think about this: in order to register your software with the Copyright Office--so that when you sue somebody and win you will be able to demand attorney's fees, it must be written with Microsoft Office, and compiled with Microsoft visual junk.)
But I don't think our Library of Congress, or any other government agency, can be as stupid and backward as our Patent Office.
Here in Germany I'm observing that OSS Apps have gained a serious foothold already. Even if the people don't know exactly what 'a different OS' and 'Linux' means, quite a few of my customers and partners have already heard of Thunderbird, Firebird and Open Office or even are using it already. This combined with Windows Viry will probably cause the upcoming Linux migration wave to be stronger than expected.
We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
Do you meta-moderate? I do occasionally. I don't know if it's connected, but I seem to get mod points about every 3-4 days on average, sometimes as often as daily.
/.'s other bistromathematics, I'm not sure if that means anything.
Meta-moderating obsessively doesn't seem to produce any more or less mod-points than meta-moderating occasionally, but in light of
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
According to this accurate survey 60% of users use Firefox/Mozilla worldwide, except in the USA,where users are generally more stupid. Spoofing browser ID explains false stats.
Although the results from your (friend's) site do have a majority of Mozilla users, the hits aren't a staggering amount.. so it's more likely that the people who visit it share similar intrests and probably know eachother.. hence the browser stats may be a little unrepresentative.
e nshot)
The stat's for my own site are around the same as the summary percentages..
For this month (Up to current date):
IE: 76.6%
Mozilla: 16.2%
(Screenshot)
Since July this year (site launch):
IE: 80.8%
Mozilla: 14%
href="http://www.iceboarders.com/stats2.png">Scre
I introduced my frinds to FireFox for windows and they are absolutely hooked to it! Its lightweight,blocks popups,blocks adware,got everything IE has and is much faster.
Looks like the market share will only increase with the way things are going.Though mozilla would never have lost its market share if Netscape had'nt messed up.It was(is) exactly opposite of what FireFox is.
Lord of the Binges.
the stats shows a steady growing mozilla userbase. Thats good. And don't forget the influence the more "tech savvy" users have on the rest of the pack.
Never let other sysadmins dick with your server settings.
Please double all of the above stats, so... MSIE gets 32.6%, Mozilla and buddies 37%, Konq 8.6% (just got a hit from Konq 3.3 too, welcome to the bleeding edge), bots 8%, Opera 1.2% plus aforementioned miscellanea.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
My somewhat techy, somewhat non-techy site (mixed content, a combined 100K hits/month) has an MSIE share which dropped from 80% in January to 75% in August. Mozilla more or less got the additional 5% and is now at 23%. Opera and Konqueror stay at about .8% each.
You'll never look back. It'll be a while before that version gets ported to MS-Windows, though. It does all of the calendaring, the contact management, yadda yadda, and the crap tarty HTML email, and lots of stuff Just Works.
Examples? You can look at headers (few, many, fancy, all). You have a real choice of quoting styles. If you paste "fred at nurk dot com" into an email slot (e.g. the "To:" header), you get fred@nurk.com. You can set various levels of paranoia for viewing HTML mail (to prevent beacon graphics or image exploits from working, forex). You can automate heaps of stuff (e.g. play sound when email survives spam filters and has "urgent" in the subject). You have serious spam filters under your fingers. Local or remote mailboxes with hundreds of thousands of messages in them are no problem. Locally, it uses standard mailbox or maildir formats (known to LookOut as "Eudora" format). Multiple identities and/or multiple accounts over multiple protocols are all no problem. It can just about brew good beer or coffee as well. (-:
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
...have you turned off popup blocking for that domain in FireFox? (-:
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
I find it strange that Safari isn't listed as its own browser statistic. For example, amongst the OS stats, Macs are listed as being 2.5% of all net users (and Linux at 3.0%). It would be hard for me not to believe that at least 80% of the Mac users are using Safari almost exclusively. Thus Safari should be well above the 0.5% threshhold in terms of being counted in that statistical breakdown.
"Right now, somewhere in this world, Scott Baio is plowing a woman he doesn't love," - Peter Griffin, *Family Guy*
...how about JavaScript?
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Can be found here. "TheCounter" is a site where you can download one of those annoying page counters to put at the bottom of your web page, but at least they do something relevant with the information: they collate all the browser stats they can from the request.
This makes their stats really significant because a) they get millions and millions of requests per month (valid sample) and b) they are collating info across many, many site of all different shapes, sizes and topics (heterogenous sample). Their sample size is 223,437,657 visitors for July (the last month available), which I trust a lot more than the many posts on this thread saying "I see X% on my site".
I build e-commerce sites using full XHTML/CSS standards, and I use these stats to get a sense of which browsers/platforms to test in. If they have a bias, it is probably towards the casual user rather than the power user (after all, the sites that have a little counter on them aren't usually the most professional), but in designing for the general public, I'd rather be biased in that direction than towards the power user.
These stats are free and they've been kept for years, so you can spot trends (no charts, though, just tables).
Incidentally, their latest browser stats show Mozilla at 2%, which, sadly, is probably closer to the "truth" than 14% or 9% or whatever.
"Luck is the residue of design" --Branch Rickey
Yet Opera accounted for 2.5% of hits, and doesn't work with GMail. Pretty interesting stats, I'd say.
I have a friend who managed to use Gmail with opera 7.60b1 changing the identification of the browser to mozilla and activating cookies.
My heart is pure, but make no mistake, it's pure evil
I used to use StarOffice as one of my web browsers.
But, I still have friends who say that they don't know what is wrong with their computer. They run spyware this and it finds one thing and spyware that and it finds another. They are just clueless. I ask them if they realize that they could make there computer spyware free, monopoly/big corporation free (most are flaming liberals), fully functional and they still don't get it. It is just said.
People who visit commercial sites are much more gullible!
They actually like all of thoses interesting popups that advertise all kinds of interesting things, at random times of day. What a joy to have the boredom of the day broken up every now and then!!!
Thes are the same people who answer junk mail!
Why not? It's only a little more draconian that the policy where I work. We can install IE ourselves provided we purchace a valid licence and do all the fussing to get it to work under wine ourselves. And the company won't support it, or pay for the time we waste dealing with it. But IE isn't actually prohibited.
-- MarkusQ
Why does Slashdot render incorrectly in Mozilla? I would have figured that Slashdot would try to be Mozilla friendly? Guess not.
Is there a way to get browser statistics from akamai.net? wouldn't that be truly universal?
"What the masochist doesn't know can't hurt him."
...I'm switching to Lynx!!!
Firefox is a great browser, but it just can't measure up to Opera in many regards. Then again, Firefox is infinitely extensible, and Opera isn't.
Clever signature text goes here.
They list screen resolution. This is evil. The implicit assumption is that people run their browser full-screen.
Chernobyl 'not a wildlife haven' - BBC News
Problem is, most stats programs can't detect Opera even if it's possible.
Clever signature text goes here.
Extensions try to mimic Opera, but Firefox will never be able to "emulate" the complete Opera experience. That's simply because different extensions are created by different people with different goals, whereas Opera is created with a clear vision.
Both of these approaches have their good and bad sides. You happen to like installing extensions to get stuff done. A lot of people don't, so they pay for a smooth experience where everything is ready to use immediately after installing the program.
Clever signature text goes here.
You use Opera if you want the convenience of something that just works and has loads of useful features, as opposed to having to browse through hundreds of more or less buggy extensions and spend a lot of time finding the right ones.
Clever signature text goes here.
Your right. It's near 17% when you consider that Netscape is now based on Mozilla code.
And this survey is based on several sources, not just their own stats. I can tell you as a developer for a Microsoft vendor where 98% of our traffic is directly from the Microsoft employees, 5% of Microsoft employees use Mozilla.
So if it's that high even on the MS campus, you can easily expect that 15% elsewhere.
This is my sig. There are many like it but this one is mine.
IE was already installed.
fast forward a couple of years.. most people have broadband. takes all of 2 minutes to download firefox.
while that alone doesn't mean people will start treating the built-in IE as a convinient way to bootstrap a firefox install it does put people, for the first time in MS history, quite able to choose an alternative. but will they? that's another question entirely. insert the devo "choice" quote here. (as an aside, imagine if the OS didn't come with a browser. people would have a hard time installing firefox. If i were microsoft, i would take IE out of the OS, and have people buy it at the store. the reason being, if they don't buy it, there is no browser on their system to go download firefox with. and if they pay for it, well, since they've paid for a browser would they want to not use it?)
Where do you get it?
Posting anonymously because I can't actually say what I'm going to say. :p
/.'ed before (on the front page, no less) and when /. happens, the percentage of IE browsers dips significantly.. no surprise there, I think.
My site, an entertainment industry news portal, serves 200k pages/day to 44k unique visitors. 10% of our hits are Gecko browsers. We've been
Therefore, it's important to realize that depending on your audience (as well as their location) your browser %s will vary.
60% of our hits are from the US, 20% unresolved, 2% from Canada and Japan, and less from everywhere else.
Given that 80% of our readership lacks proper grammar, I'd say we're very typical in terms of our American readership, at least.
Article I, section 8, of the Constitutuion specifically provides that: "Congress shall have power . . . to promote the progress of science and useful arts, by securing for limited times to authors and inventors the exclusive right to their respective writings and discoveries."
Congress has the power to determine what can or cannot be patented (e.g., mathematical formulas cannot be patented, but mathematical formulas reduced to software code can, etc.)
Congress also vests in administrative agencies, e.g., the Patent Office, certain rule-making powers. Those rules, once promulgated, are equivalent to "laws", though they are much easier to be challenged in court. In order to exercise those rule-making powers, the agencies must follow certain well-defined procedure (e.g., publishing Official Gazette as Federal Register), AND those rules must not be violating the existing laws and our constitution.
In this moronic new "rule", in which the Patent Office requires that any inventor must have a computer running Microsoft Internet Explorer under Microsoft Windows in order to receive prior art patents to rebut Patent Office's rejection before a patent can be granted, the Patent Office does not go through the necessary steps (i.e., no publication in Federal Register). This process was done in a very stealthy way.
But most importantly, I don't think our constitution allows an administrative agency to mandate that we must use a certain commercial product in order to exercise our constitution rights. (Congress can allow the Patent Office to set up a schedule of fees before one can receive a patent, but never a specific directive to use a certain commercial product.)
I don't think our Patent Office is a Microsoft crony. It simply appears that our Patent Office is so technically incompetent and backward that it thinks Windows is the only operating system, and IE is the only web browser, and makes its decisions based on this fault preamble.
Learn something new every day!
I am a believer of momentum and curves.
One of my sites (which is still >97% Windows users even though I have software for most platforms these days) has MSIE at only 44%, Mozilla at 20% and Netscape at 25%.
I think the Netscape is too high, though... probably Analog fluffing one of the other browsers (which is another reason why browser stats aren't too reliable).
I use IE for the Megacorp intranet and Firefox for everything else.
If there are any security problems with the intranet then thats not my problem.
i would like to ask if there is a version available that is in msi extenstion? this will allow us to automatically distribute the firefox browsers through the domain and run in our permitted list and disabling internet explorer.
Live your life each day as if it was your last.
...with fixed Apache config, my main site (Linux-centric) shows 53.3% Moz (incl FF), 26.2% MSIE, 12.6% Konq, 3.5% NS, 1.6% Opera, 0.9% Safari and the balance bots and singletons including two hits from an "Avant Browser".
Another non-techie site on the same machine shows 63.4% MSIE, 21.3% Moz, 6.5% NS and the balance in bots. Mind you, it does have a badge advocating Firefox and an IE-only message urging an upgrade of the visitor's browsing experience.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
here
PHP is the solution of choice for relaying mysql errors to web users.
Next time I get mod points (had a gap of about 5 days, spent a set yesterday), I'll email you. Tell me what to do with which posts (send links) and I'll vote for you. Not as satisfying, but better than zilch. Use leon at cyberknights com au rather than the address linked above, which has long since drowned in spam.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
My main Linux site sees this:
2464 = 29.95% from Micro$oft Internet Exploder
2112 = 25.67% from Mozilla FireFox
1816 = 22.08% from Mozilla Traditional (ie, 47.75% for Gecko)
1077 = 13.09% from Konqueror
513 = 6.24% from assorted Search Engine Bots
159 = 1.93% from Opera
32 = 0.39% from Netscapeishes (ie Mozilla but not Gecko)
9 = 0.11% from Via anonymising proxy
Everything else is sub 0.1%
The corresponding non-techie site sees this:
559 = 44.12% from Micro$oft Internet Exploder
332 = 26.20% from Mozilla Traditional
276 = 21.78% from Konqueror (this is artificially high over the last few days)
61 = 4.81% from Search Engine Bots
33 = 2.60% from Mozilla FireFox (ie 28.8% for Gecko)
Everything else is sub 0.1%
Note that you'll need to delete probably 250 of the Konqueror hits for the second batch, because a couple of Konqueror users have been testing stuff (but about two dozen hits, circa 1.5%, are not from either of those), which will scale the other values up by roughly 1.2x, so 53%, 31%, 6.7% and 3.1% for the remainder.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Hummm..
It looks fine to me
Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.0; en-US; rv:1.7) Gecko/20040803 Firefox/0.9.3
Scott
©20014 angrykeyboarder & Elmer Fudd. All Wights Wesewved
As of today (September 08, 2004), Mozilla usage grew to 17.7% according to http://www.w3schools.com/browsers/browsers_stats.a sp.
It's amazing!
I heard about a very large government agency that has an exclusivity deal to use IE in place. Our own government sold us short, imagine that. Users are policed to make sure nobody uses Mozilla. These deals are artificially skewing the numbers for IE. It's places like your school that help will make a difference, but will it ever be enough with these exclusivity deals in place? I bet MS will be on hand the minute these deals expire (if they ever do) to make sure they get renewed.