Green Security Clearance Laser Pistol Available

nazgul000 writes "You thought those green laser pointers sold by ThinkGeek and others were pretty cool, didn't you? Well, think again." It seems obligatory to point out that even laser pointers, and certainly anything more powerful than those, are capable of causing real damage.

Comments

way different lasers

[ack154]

Ok... let's compare.

Lasershoppe.com Laser: >100mW (one tested was 191!)
Thinkgeek.com Laser: 5mW

Yes... there is a 20x difference in power here (about 38x with the tested one). While lasers in general can be harmful, the one this guy is selling should really be considered a weapon.

Also worth noting about the lasershoppe one: "this laser is not legal to use in public."

Re:way different lasers

[BWJones]

Mod parent up.

Look. Many things can be made into weapons. In the case of lasers, it is never good to be looking into a laser beam of any wattage especially as the damage to your retina (likely the retinal pigment epithelium initially) may go undetected for years, but could establish a starting off point for macular degeneration. But like the parent said, pump it up 20X in power and you are starting to be able to cause some real damage immediately.

Re:way different lasers

[jd]

Pity you can't use sed to upgrade them from mW to MW.

Re:way different lasers

[wo1verin3]

Actually the ThinkGeek one can be made somewhat more dangerous...

The following very large number is designed to impress: The power density of a 1 mW laser beam when focused to a spot of around 2 um (which isn't difficult with a simple convex lens) is around 250,000,000 W per square meter! Don't let that spot be in the back of one of your own or someone else's eyeballs!

Now multiply by 5...

Re:way different lasers

[jeblucas]

Hey BWJones, this is your forté, right? Isn't there some minimal power below which you can blink faster than the laser can deposit enough energy to damage the retina? I'm having some vague recollections from physics courses.

Re:way different lasers

[entrigant]

It has come to my attention that you may have missed the point of what was said in the summary. The point was the thinkgeek laser is no longer cool BECAUSE of the difference. The thinkgeek laser cannot be used to burn holes in paper cups. Armed with this new information, you should be able to deduce that the story submitter realized, in fact even depended on, the difference between the two products.

Re:way different lasers

[voxlator]

Look, it's not lasers that cause retinal pigment epithelium damage to people, it's people that cause retinal pigment epithelium damage to people.

:o)

--#voxlator

Re:way different lasers

[MindStalker]

Don't forget this one is also powerful enough that isn't simple reflection even off a non mirror surface could cause some damage.

Re:way different lasers

[ack154]

That's great. I was pointing out exactly what the difference is... and that yes, you can burn out your eye with it.

Re:way different lasers

[BWJones]

Well, retinal degenerative diseases and remodeling is my forte, but I do recall that red lasers in the 3-5Mw range should cause no retinal damage per se. I qualify that because the long term studies have not been done, only short term studies to my knowledge. The thing you have to remember is that lasers are coherent light that "packs" much more energy into their beam than does say a 200 watt halogen lamp which throws its energy all over the place wasting about 90% of its energy as light. So, as I recall the threshold for damage is 10Xs the acceptable wattage for lasers assuming that people will guard by blinking when exposed to a bright light. (blink time being somewhere about 2/10ths of a second). So, the currently accepted wattage figures on the threshold of immediate tissue damage are in the 30-50Mw range. But you have to remember that the criteria are somewhat vague and no long term studies (to my knowledge) have been done as to the effects on the retina and RPE of brief exposures to low wattage laser light. I might suspect that you could increase your chances for having dry macular degeneration, but that is hazarding a guess.....Regardless, a good rule of thumb is to never stare into a bright light source. (oh, and always invest in good quality sunglasses).

Re:way different lasers

[BWJones]

Funny.......truly funny.

Mod parent up!

Re:way different lasers

[cpt_rhetoric]

Exactly. I have first hand knowledge the devastation that common school room supplies (a rubber band, pencil eraser and pin) can cause.

Re:way different lasers

[LWATCDR]

Hey you could put somebody's eye out with that!

Re:way different lasers

[Tackhead]

> Well, retinal degenerative diseases and remodeling is my forte, but I do recall that red lasers in the 3-5Mw range should cause no retinal damage per se.

...on account of it being hard to examine the retina when there's nothing left of the head but some vapor.

There are, however, red lasers in the milliWatt range for which the blink/aversion response is (probably) fast enough to prevent damage.

> So, the currently accepted wattage figures on the threshold of immediate tissue damage are in the 30-50Mw range.

True. Because on the battlefield, there's no such thing as overkill!

Re:way different lasers

[Dorsai65]

lasers in the 3-5Mw range ... in the 30-50Mw range

Megawatts? Or should that have been mW for milliwatts?

(yes, I'm being picky and semantic. This is Slashdot, remember?)

Re:way different lasers

[AviLazar]

Hence, back in my bouncing days I told the stupid girls, who thought they were being cute, that if they did not stop using their laser pointer - I would own a laser pointer.

Not to mention the bar i worked at was loaded with FBI agents who get really trigger happy when they have a laser pointed at their forehead (and yes, if you point a laser at someone, and they shoot you - you cannot hold them legally liable)

Re:way different lasers

[Tolookah]

MW != mW Please try to get the units right, otherwise, we'll have people running around with 5 Mega-Watt Lasers... only 1,000,000,000 difference... Would easilly take out someones eye... or arm... or house...

Re:way different lasers

[BWJones]

Yes, milliwatt not megawatt. :-)

Re:way different lasers

[evilviper]

Isn't there some minimal power below which you can blink faster than the laser can deposit enough energy to damage the retina?

This is exactly how lasers are classified.

You are refering to a Class II laser. It has the potential to cause damage to your eyes, but it is low enough power (and in the visible light range) so your blinking reflex will protect your eyes. Though, like looking into the sun, people can fight that reflex (usually children) and blind themselves.

Class III lasers are the most dangerous ones, resulting in instant damage. I believe most if not all laser pointers are class 3 devices.

Class I lasers are so low powered that you can look directly into them for a long period of time, and not cause any damage at all, as a result.

Re:way different lasers

[khrtt]

The actual Class IIIa standard allows up to 5mW CW output, with higher allowed peak power for pulsed lasers. The allowed peak power grows as 4th degree root of duty cycle, and decreases as 4th degree root of rep. rate. Or something like that. They assume blinking time of 1/4 second, and the formula gives 5mW with 4 rep/sec pulse rate and 100% duty cycle.

Re:way different lasers

[arose]

The thinkgeek laser cannot be used to burn holes in paper cups.

The sun however can be, ban lenses and convex mirrors!!!

Re:way different lasers

[networkBoy]

I do believe you have that backwards.
class I = most damage
-nB

Re:way different lasers

[Ann Elk]

100mW? Ha!

Re:way different lasers

[Daniel Dvorkin]

and yes, if you point a laser at someone, and they shoot you - you cannot hold them legally liable

I don't want to sound like an asshole, but do you have references for court cases that have established that? Sounds a lot like one of those urban legends along the lines of "An undercover cop has to tell you he's a cop if you ask him, 'Are you a cop?'" I've heard that vice cops and FBI organized crime agents get a lot of mileage out of that one ...

Re:way different lasers

[b1t r0t]

So does this mean that if someone took 20 or 30 of those ThinkGeek lasers, and had half as many people point them on the same point of a styrofoam cup, it would still burn?

Re:way different lasers

[AviLazar]

unfortunately, no i do not - i am going by word of mouth from a reliable source (fbi agent). Now he could have been bsing me, but i can't see why. I will actually take a quick look on google. If i find anything (pro or con) i will repost.

Re:way different lasers

[JollyFinn]

YES!!!
I can play with 1kW metal cutting laser since its WAY under 3MW, so its safe.
no more fuzzy 3mW lasers. Lets play with real thing that can cut metal.

Re:way different lasers

[forevermore]

While lasers in general can be harmful, the one this guy is selling should really be considered a weapon.

Which might be why he says that it "must be treated like a loaded gun at all times."

Re:way different lasers

[AviLazar]

I found a couple of links from a couple of states.
Here
Here

Please note that it mentions putting the person in a sense of danger - I believe the link occurs when a person is in a perceived sense of danger - they can react in a defensive manner. So if a police officer thinks someone is targeting him with a laser sighted weapon, they can pull and shoot.

Hope this helps
Avi

Re:way different lasers

[evilviper]

I do believe you have that backwards.

And I believe you are wrong.

http://ehs.uky.edu/radiation/laser_fs.html

Re:way different lasers

[Anonymous Coward]

Don't forget this one is also powerful enough that isn't simple reflection even off a non mirror surface could cause some damage.

That sentence just caused some serious damage to my brain.

Re:way different lasers

[networkBoy]

Well then, I stand corrected. :oops:
-nB

Re:way different lasers

[iamhassi]

"Ok... let's compare."

yeah, let's see who's is bigger?
My last batch of them measured 154mW, 159mW, 173mW and 193mW. My personal unit measures 191mW, and I sold a 193mW unit a few weeks ago!

whoa, his personal unit measures 191mW, and he sold a 193mW unit a few weeeks ago!

Wonder how big the unit I ordered will be? :ponders:

Re:way different lasers

[bodrell]

Sounds a lot like one of those urban legends along the lines of "An undercover cop has to tell you he's a cop if you ask him, 'Are you a cop?'" I've heard that vice cops and FBI organized crime agents get a lot of mileage out of that one ...

Still, there are effective ways to sniff out a cop. I have heard from multiple people that prostitutes (and sometimes other criminals) demand that their customers pull down their pants before any transaction can occur. The rationale is that although cops are allowed to lie (not illegal), they are not allowed to expose themselves (definitely illegal). Likewise, some drug dealers insist their (untrusted) customers sample their wares before finalizing a sale.

Sorry, I can't divulge my sources for any of this information, since they broke the law. It is also true that cops can just break the law, bust you, and deny everything afterwards. No law can really protect you from police corruption.

Re:way different lasers

[aahzmandius]

Um.....not to nit-pick too much, but you might want to properly abbreviate here. Mw is Megawatts, not milliwatts. Remember your metric abbreviations, lowercase m for milli-, upper case M for Mega-.

I suspect a 3-5 Megawatt laser would be MUCH more damaging than a 3-5 milliwatt laser.

Re:way different lasers

[Kaboom13]

There was a case here in Florida where a young teenager pointed a laser pointer at a cop at night and the cop shot and killed him. The cop was cleared of the killing, as the situation gave the cop reasonable belief he was in danger. I couldn't find the article with a quick search as it was many years ago, but I did find this http://www.thebackup.com/archives_newsdetail.asp?i d=-1141952145 which is about a similiar case where the officer wounded a teenager in the thigh. Pointing a laser pointer at a cop is a serious threat to that cop, and if the situation is already tense might get you shot.

Re:way different lasers

[jebell]

In my experience as a former prosecutor, many police agencies use a realistic-looking - but fake - ummm... phallus when busting hookers.

As for sampling "product," I never had any cop admit to me that he actually ingested some, but I imagine some do. Many drug officers, however, are adept at sleight-of-hand manuevers and will only appear to consume the drug.

Re:way different lasers

[mcc]

While lasers in general can be harmful, the one this guy is selling should really be considered a weapon.

It would make things easier for him if they were. Then he'd have constitutional protection, plus the vehement support of a vitriolic organization with a budget of $100 million a year.

Re:way different lasers

[jstott]

Class III lasers are the most dangerous ones, resulting in instant damage. I believe most if not all laser pointers are class 3 devices.

Class III means the laser is an eye hazard. Class IIIa are hazardous if focused, class IIIb are focused as-is. There are also class IV lasers, which are burn hazards (I've worked with both) and are more dangerous than class III lasers. Most laser pointers are class IIIb, although I've seen lower. Note too that laser classification is based on power at the output, not at the source.

"Instant damage" is a bit over-stated, but class IIIb lasers (especially at the >100mW levels in the original article) are most definitely capable of causing retinal damage.

-JS

Re:way different lasers

[kd5ujz]

Class 3a(1-5mW) ( laser pointers) are deffinatly not the most dangerous, and studies have shown long periods of exposure cause nothing more then a temporary after image. Class 3b(5-100mW) can cause damage,but still not the most powerfull. Class 4 lasers are used for industrial and medical purposes, and WILL cause damage.

Laser pointers and the human eye: a clinicopathologic study. Robertson DM, Lim TH, Salomao DR, Link TP, Rowe RL, McLaren JW.
Department of Ophthalmology, Mayo Clinic, Rochester, MN 55905, USA.

We report the absence of photic retinal injury after exposing the retina to light from class 3A laser pointers for durations of up to 15 minutes. Three patients with uveal melanomas were scheduled to have an enucleation. Each agreed to have his or her retina exposed to laser light from a class 3A laser pointer prior to enucleation. Continuous exposure was directed to the fovea for 1 minute, to the retina 5 degrees below fixation for 5 minutes, and to the retina 5 degrees above fixation for 15 minutes. Ophthalmoscopic evaluation of the cornea, lens, and retina and fluorescein angiographic studies of the retina were conducted before, 24 hours after, and 11 days after laser exposure in the first case; before and 86 hours after exposure in the second case; and before, 96 hours after, and 15 days after exposure in the third case. Other than transient afterimages that lasted only a few minutes, we were unable to document any functional, ophthalmoscopic, fluorescein angiographic, or histologic evidence of damage to any structures of the eyes. Transmission electron microscopic studies of retinal sites targeted by the laser pointers in the second and third cases revealed ultrastructural abnormalities in the outer retina and the pigment epithelium that were similar to abnormalities seen in the retina approximately 8 mm away from the targeted sites. The risk to the human eye from transient exposure to light from commercially available class 3A laser pointers having powers of 1, 2, and 5 mW seems negligible.

Publication Types:

* Case Reports

PMID: 11115266 [PubMed - indexed for MEDLINE]

Re:way different lasers

[bodrell]

In my experience as a former prosecutor, many police agencies use a realistic-looking - but fake - ummm... phallus when busting hookers.

So is that a confirmation that cops are not allowed to actually expose themselves in the course of an undercover investigation?

BTW, interesting to know about the fake phallus technique. I was not aware.

Re:way different lasers

[Nick Harkin]

The sun however can be, ban lenses and convex mirrors!!!


Why stop at that? Maybe Mr Burns had the right idea.... even if he got shot for it.

Re:way different lasers

[passthecrackpipe]

That would be Class IV lasers that are the most dangerous. I have worked with with many class IV laser on account of having run an entertainment laser show outfit for some time. I do believe the article linked to (the FAQ from the Sam bloke) is a bit hysterical though. I used to get guys over from Coherent to get the core optics a proper cleaning, and they always used to freak out about the fact we didn't have goggles. Although I have quite a few burn scars on the side of my arms from working on live optics tables in crammed conditions, neither me, nor anyone I know of, have ever had any eye issues. I did have some cowboys work with me a few times, but they usually get asked to leave real quick. When you work with 10, 15 or 20 Watt argon/krypton tubes you have got to simply take care of what you are doing. In the conditions we worked in (sometimes hoisting the bloody things into the trees), it is a general rule that if you need goggles, you are not right for the job.

Re:way different lasers

[AK Marc]

Class I lasers are so low powered that you can look directly into them for a long period of time, and not cause any damage at all, as a result.

My understanding is that the Class I lasers are the ones that can cause no damage under normal use because the device contains a laser, but the laser is not visible. The laser in a CD player, for example, is never visible under proper use. Even if the laser was powerful enough to burn CHA into the moon if it were pointed there, if the device contains the laser completely so that no laser is visible out of it, it is a Class I laser.

Oh, and as an aside, when did LASER become laser? I must have missed it, but everyone else is using laser, so I'll go with that.

Re:way different lasers

[Daniel Dvorkin]

Interesting. If I'm reading it right (and IANAL, so it's quite possible I'm not) it looks like you can use a laser pointer in self-defense -- er, to the degree it's useful for that purpose; I think I'd have more faith in a rock or a large stick -- but it's not clear at all that pointing a laser at someone is in the same class as pointing a gun at them, justifiable-homicide-wise. [shrug] I suspect that most juries would take a dim view of someone whose sole defense was, "He was shining a $9.95 laser pointer at me, I had to blow him away!", but of course the circumstances for these things are not always clear-cut.

Re:way different lasers

[PurpleFloyd]

Not quite. As referenced in the Laser FAQ (linked from the article), laser classifications are as follows:

• Class I. Totally enclosed within some other device, with safety interlocks to prevent the laser from powering up when safety covers are off. Interestingly, even a really dangerous Class IV laser falls into this category if it is completely contained within an OEM device with the apppropriate safety interlocks.
• Class II. Reasonably safe to look directly into the beam. I think that the threshold is 1000 seconds continious exposure without permanant eye damage, although I could be wrong.
• Class IIIa. Lasers which would cause near-immediate damage to eye tissue, but which are blocked in time to prevent damage by the blink reflex. This is the category of most laser pointers, although probably not the monster which is sold at the linked site.
• Class IIIb. These are lasers which can cause permanant eye damage before the blink reflex kicks in. This is where lasers start getting Dangerous with a capital D.
• Class IV. Dangerous to look at the reflection of the beam, even from matte surfaces. Can cause damage to flesh or other objects in the beam path. Eye exposure will probably cause immediate and permanant blindness with lasers in this class. Very dangerous stuff.

Re:way different lasers

[Nogami_Saeko]

A CO2 laser is completely invisible, but you can cut steel with it... It makes no difference whatsoever if the beam is visible or not. It's the power rating that determines the laser class, not the wavelength of the beam.

http://www.asu.edu/radiationsafety/laser/appn_C. ht ml

What they DO say is that class 1 lasers sometimes have more powerful beams inside the device, so opening it may expose you to a more powerful beam than what's coming out of the aperature.

N.

Re:way different lasers

[BlueJay465]

...wait, do I smell popcorn?

Re:way different lasers

[StarKruzr]

Keep us posted. I want to hear burn-through-apple stories :)

Re:way different lasers

[ceejayoz]

Sounds a lot like one of those urban legends along the lines of "An undercover cop has to tell you he's a cop if you ask him, 'Are you a cop?'"

I'd bet my life savings that one was started by undercover cops. :-p

Re:way different lasers

[ekuns]

My understanding is that the Class I lasers are the ones that can cause no damage under normal use because the device contains a laser, but the laser is not visible.

That cannot possibly be correct, because a UV laser could be invisible to the eye, yet cause blindness quickly if it were powerful enough. Also, you said:

My understanding is that the Class I lasers are the ones that can cause no damage under normal use because the device contains a laser, but the laser is not visible. [snip] Even if the laser was powerful enough to burn CHA into the moon if it were pointed there, if the device contains the laser completely so that no laser is visible out of it, it is a Class I laser.

If a laser is powerful enough to burn CHA into the moon (great Tick reference!), then is it not powerful enough to vaporize an eye looking into it? Or in the latter part are you saying that the laser beam is not allowed to leave that enclosed apparatus? When you say the laser is not visible outside it, you don't say whether or not you mean the laser's beam is entirely contained, or whether it is invisible because it is outside the visible light range.

Re:way different lasers

[AK Marc]

When you say the laser is not visible outside it, you don't say whether or not you mean the laser's beam is entirely contained, or whether it is invisible because it is outside the visible light range.

By "invisible," I meant "not radiating outside the container." I went for concise and forgot to take invisible lasers into account.

Re:way different lasers

[NormalVisual]

Putting the lasers in the trees is one thing, but in the course of working several years for a large laser integration company that dealt with everything from 5 watt green YAGs to 5 kilowatt CO2s, I learned that it's really a good idea to have goggles anytime you're going to be exposed to *any* high-power (i.e. more than 10 mw or so) system - you just don't know when you're going to have a stray reflection that catches you in the eyes or when some idiot working on something fails to put a proper backstop up or disables the shutter and fires a beam at eye level across the work area. While you can see Ar/Kr/HeNe beams pretty easily, it really sucks for IR and UV lasers - your vision gets damaged before you even know you took a beam in the eyes. Near-IR units are *really* bad about that - a CO2 will burn your cornea and hurt like hell, but at least it can be fixed in a lot of cases. A YAG will burn your retina beyond repair and you won't feel a thing until it's too late, and even the green and UV YAGs will still have a pretty substantial IR component unless they're filtered, which I've never seen on a Class IV YAG.

Re:way different lasers

[Cpt_Kirks]

I wonder how powerful a laser it would take to kill a person? Are we to the stage yet where anti-personnel lasers are looking likely?

Re:way different lasers

[NormalVisual]

While the individual in question could possibly escape criminal prosecution on the argument that he believed there was a gun at the other end of the laser beam, he almost certainly would not be able to avoid civil liability. On the other hand, if cops were allowed to blow away every asshat that pointed a laser at them, maybe that would do a lot to control said asshattery. :-)

Re:way different lasers

[Mad Marlin]

Big friggin' lasers are easy, it is the problem with the batteries required that causes the Marines to still carry M16's.

Re:way different lasers

[ErikZ]

Yep. Although a laser just isn't that useful for personal defense, it would be. You have a problem with that?

Re:way different lasers

[fbg111]

Pointing a laser pointer at a cop is a serious threat to that cop...

Most likely b/c the cop thinks the laser is attached to a gun aiming at him, rather than to just a dumb kid trying to blind him, especially at night as in the Florida case.

Re:way different lasers

[Kaboom13]

I agree, I was not being sarcastic, I think the cop had every right to shoot that kid. At night, in a potentially dangerous situation, the cop has to protect himself and has every reason to believe it is a laser sight.

Re:way different lasers

[Harry's Dad]

"I went for concise and forgot to take invisible lasers into account". Only on slashdot could those words be strung together!

Re:way different lasers

[danila]

The cop has to protect the citizens, not himself. He chose the job, he is paid to risk his life, so unless he can be reasonably sure he is in real danger, shooting anyone who shinesa laser pointer at him is unjustified murder.

We don't give cops guns to make cops safer. We give them guns to make us safer. If they abuse our trust killing innocent children, they should be jailed for 10+ years.

Re:way different lasers

[AviLazar]

Yea well Civil courts, imho, are as broken as they come. You can sue a man who was given a 'not guilty' verdict for millions and win (OJ comes to mind). Civil court is another way to ruin a person - no they don't lose their freedom - just their "pants".

That and you can sue anyone for anything with very little chance of retribution for making a bogus claim.

Re:way different lasers

[jebell]

I don't know that any cop who exposed himself would be arrested and charged. Technically, I suppose it's illegal (for indecent exposure but not soliciting prostitution because they don't have the requisite intent to commit a crime). Regardless, it would certainly look bad if one of them actually whipped it out. Judges and juries typically don't like cops with "unclean hands," even if they didn't do anything illegal.

As for the fake phallus, I've never actually seen it but have read it in their reports. I don't know how realistic it is, but keep in mind that most prostitution busts happen at night in areas with poor lighting, so it probably doesn't have to be all that real-looking.

Re:way different lasers

[BlueNovember]

a 200 watt halogen lamp which throws its energy all over the place wasting about 90% of its energy as light

What? You mean all these lights are only giving me 10% useful heat energy? What is the world coming to. :P

Re:way different lasers

[BlueNovember]

a 200 watt halogen lamp which throws its energy all over the place wasting about 90% of its energy as light

What? You mean all these lights are only giving me 10% useful heat energy? What is the world coming to. :P

Re:way different lasers

[Cpt_Kirks]

How much laser power would be required to instantly punch a hole through a human torso or head?

Have any non-classified studies been done on this? Since humans are basically just walking bags of fluid, how would evaporation of fluid effect the damage?

Re:way different lasers

[Bob Uhl]

Any citizen has the right to protect himself. I'm no fonder of cops than most people (they exist solely to project force on their fellow citizens, and most of them are military wannabes, and the majority support the enforcement of unjust laws), but cops have no fewer rights than the rest of us. The guy had a reasonable fear of danger, and took reasonable steps to neutralise that danger. It would be just as legal for you or me to do the same.

Re:way different lasers

[NormalVisual]

"Not guilty" didn't mean he didn't do it, just that the state couldn't meet the required burden of proof. In OJ's case, the verdict was largely due to the ineptness of the LAPD during the initial investigation and the incompetent prosecutorial team.

In a civil trial, you have to prove your case through a preponderance of evidence, and that *is* an easier burden to meet, but then we're not talking about putting someone in jail for the rest of their life, either. Having said that, the plaintiffs in OJ's civil trial were able to put forth sufficient evidence that OJ was involved in the wrongful deaths of Nicole Simpson and Ronald Goldman such that the jury felt it was more likely that he was responsible than he wasn't.

Re:way different lasers

[AviLazar]

Unfortunately in civil case you can prove that someone was partly at fault (10% of it was his fault) so he should pay 10% of the damages.

So on that note - lets say you get run over by a car when you crossed an intersection. Lets say if you crossed that intersection two minutes ago you would not have been run over. Well prior to crossing the street I happend to speak with you for two minutes - if we didn't speak you would not have been run over. While this example is ridiculous - a jury could say it is my fault for preventing you from going on your way earlier.
I do not know if OJ did it or not - but the courts didn't prove that he did. In our society it is innocent until proven guilty. Apparantly the civil courts felt that even though he was "not guilty" in criminal court - he was somehow responsible. Sorry i know this is off topic - just inane things (our civil courts are flawed) really irk me; especially when they can really hurt people.

Re:way different lasers

[Kaboom13]

In the situation, the cop was responding to a crime in progress. It was night, and suddenly he sees someone pointing something at him and the laser dot at him. He thought it was a laser sight and drew and shot him. In that situation he had reason to believe he was in danger. If you make a motion to draw a gun, a cop can and should shoot you. IIRC at the time laser pointers were like $50-$100, and weren't as common.

Re:way different lasers

[Politburo]

it is a general rule that if you need goggles, you are not right for the job.

If that's the attitude you had towards safety, I'm glad you're no longer in that line of work. I suspect your insurance carrier wouldn't have been too pleased, either.

Re:way different lasers

[Fortran IV]

The cop has to protect the citizens, not himself.

A) The cop is a citizen, in addition to being a cop. B) Protecting the citizens involves stopping criminals. Someone who points a laser-sighted gun at a cop is a criminal who might just as readily point it at a civilian.

The cop has no right to protect his safety (life) by any means necessary. It is his job to risk his life.

Interesting--how do you feel about all that expensive, taxpayer-funded $afety gear for firemen? How do you feel about your city paying the ho$pital bill$ when a cop gets shot in the line of duty?

Cops are people too. They don't abandon all of their civil rights when they willingly (and for far too little pay) take on the responsibility of helping to protect yours.

Re:way different lasers

[rzebram]

Bummer, if you look at the site now it looks like the seller has taken them down after hearing about the cockpit laser pointer problem http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/12/29/laser.plane/index .html

Re:way different lasers

[dreamchaser]

Wrong, wrong and wrong. First of all, the main purpose of a cop is to catch criminals, *not* to protect anyone. Second, cops have every right to use lethal force in response to a threat. A laser is a threat, as it could quite reasonably be a sighting device for a weapon.

You should really think before you shoot off your text :)

Re:way different lasers

[cbr2702]

lets say you get run over by a car when you crossed an intersection. Lets say if you crossed that intersection two minutes ago you would not have been run over. Well prior to crossing the street I happend to speak with you for two minutes - if we didn't speak you would not have been run over. While this example is ridiculous - a jury could say it is my fault for preventing you from going on your way earlier.

With a case like this you could claim that you had no way of knowing. If a "perfect person" with your sensory information (including what you "should have known") would do just as you did, you can't be liable. Also note that delaying someone by two minutes on the street can just as well keep them out of the way of an accident.

Re:way different lasers

[Asmodean]

And this is the reason that someone should only be able to sue for actual damages and not punitive damages. All punitive damages should go into a big pool and handed out like tax rebates once a year :p

As it is you have a much better chance of winning a huge punitive damages suit than you do of winning the lottery.

Re:way different lasers

[Sj0]

I suspect that when you're dealing with lasers in the 20 Watt range, the goggles are a formality, because even though your eyes will be OK after a blast, that nasty hole in your head could cause problems.

Re:way different lasers

[The Dodger]

> on the battlefield, there's no such thing as overkill!

Not strictly true - read your Geneva Conventions.

Captain D.

Re:way different lasers

[Sj0]

Wouldn't an anti-personnel laser be circumvented by a particularly shiny surface on a soldiers armour?

The nice thing about a bullet is that even if you stop it, it does something. It seems to me that a laser would bounce harmlessly off any defense greater than an austin powers style shiny jumpsuit making it largely unsuitable as an antipersonnel weapon except against antiquated troops (who admittedly, seem to be the only people fought today).

Re:way different lasers

[AviLazar]

I agree about the lottary thing.

Why do you think some complete and total stranger who had absolutely nothing to do with the case receive any of the punitive damages award? Sometimes actual damages are very small (i.e. costs of loss of work, and surgary) and does not include pain and suffering, and other (arguably) major inconveniences (i.e. missing arm).

Its all fun and games.....

[Unloaded]

....till someone uses one of these as a cat toy...

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[SnapShot]

Luckily, the use of a laser pointer as a cat toy is patented and therefore you are required to get a license before engaging in such an activity. A reasonably responsible corporate entity would never grant such a license. (God, I wish I was joking).

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[SnapShot]

Some ignorant fucker accused me of being a troll... Here's the patent, my dear friend.

United States Patent 5,443,036
Amiss , et al. August 22, 1995
Method of exercising a cat

Abstract

A method for inducing cats to exercise consists of directing a beam of invisible light produced by a hand-held laser apparatus onto the floor or wall or other opaque surface in the vicinity of the cat, then moving the laser so as to cause the bright pattern of light to move in an irregular way fascinating to cats, and to any other animal with a chase instinct.

It looks like they've gotten more sophisticated.

United States Patent 6,651,591
Chelen November 25, 2003

A pet toy and exerciser which produces an automatically movable, outwardly projected laser beam. The function thereof is to provide virtual "prey" for the stimulation and exercise of an animal. The device, which does not include a conventional motor, is small (e.g., can be handheld), lightweight, battery operated and silent, and has an extremely long potential cycle life. Electrically energized nitinol wires deflect a visible laser module to produce a virtual laser light target moved through three dimensions.

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[superstick58]

Oh man I am in trouble! Lucky for me it is the person who received the patent's responsibility to enforce it. Now don't tell anyone but my cat loves the laser light. My dog does too, but I don't have to worry about that one. Or do I???

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[Soporific]

So do those keychain lasers ruin your cats eyes? I use one and until I read the Laser Faq in the article I wouldn't have though there was enough power to do much unless you sat there and pointed it into the eye for a while. So is there a safe way to use it, or is it best to give up?

~S

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[SnapShot]

Don't be a dick. It's hillarious that they got the patent. It's tragic that the USPTO granted it.

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[sharkey]

Then it's a sport.

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[AbbyNormal]

Bah,

Someone pointed this out... That's not a cat toy, THIS is a Cat Toy!

Stupid Cats...

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[noidentity]

United States Patent 5,443,036
Amiss , et al. August 22, 1995
Method of exercising a cat
Abstract
A method for inducing cats to exercise consists of directing a beam of invisible light produced by a hand-held laser apparatus onto the floor or wall or other opaque surface in the vicinity of the cat, then moving the laser so as to cause the bright pattern of light to move in an irregular way fascinating to cats, and to any other animal with a chase instinct.

Man, I should patent a version that uses visible light!

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[khrtt]

....till someone uses one of these as a cat toy... ..and the cat cathes on fire? You don't need a laser for that - just some gasoline and matches
*diabolic laughter*

Serioisly, if you think stupid people's ability would be enhanced by having access to odd dangerous objects, like 100mW lasers, just think how much damage one can cause with readily available dangerous objects like a $1 bottle of rubbing alcohol and a book of matches.

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[c0p0n]

OMG!! they've really patented _that_?

I must be quick if I want to patent my *flesh obelisk* as a girl toy...

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[mcg1969]

Who needs a laser? Now THIS is a fun cat toy, even if it looks like one of those Pokemon thingies. My cat will testify: this is the only thing that can keep her from her next nap.

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[SoCalEd]

Lasers are all fun and games for cats, but never try this with your dog as prolonged use can make them neurotic. Our dog trainer is working with a family's pup right now. Poor thing flinches and jumps whenever any lights blink or flash and will only eat in a dark room.

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[Desert Raven]

Strange dog you've got there.

Half of my greyhounds wouldn't react to the laser dot at all, the other two thought it was pretty entertaining for a few minutes, and have completely ignored it ever since.

Now let a cat or rabbit loose in the backyard, well, that's a whole different story.

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[beej69]

the same company that makes the laser in the ebay auction makes another that has a significantly higher power output. check out this 5.2 kW model.

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[Herr_Nightingale]

the patent specifically refers to "invisible light" which obviates the patent as regards any commonly available visible laser pointer light. Clearly the patent is referring to CO2 lasers or other invisible light source. It'd be too easy to make such a case, and argue that the patent effectively doesn't cover anything at all.

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[khrtt]

not as many as youd hope know lasers are dangerous and how to handle them safely.

Really? I don't think too many people would be stupid enough to shine a laser into someone's eye once they realize that it actually burns through plastic cups. Not people that would blow $700 on a laser toy, anyways:-).

Re:Its all fun and games.....

[JonTurner]

Yeah, but how much fun is a blind cat?

For Adults only

[spac3manspiff]

Wow, they say the laser can cut holes and then say...
We are offering this laser for sale to responsible adults only. This laser is not a toy.

Re:For Adults only

[Toby The Economist]

Tell me if I'm wrong, but in the States, don't they sell GUNS to everyone?

And now some bozo brings out a 100mW laser pointer and everyone is like "oh no, think how dangerous they are!!"

As Bill Hicks would have said: huh?!

--
Toby

Re:For Adults only

[bStrom]

You need a background check to get a gun. You don't need one for a laser.

Re:For Adults only

[silentbozo]

In the US all buyers purchasing firearms from licensed dealers must pass a background check. Some states have also mandated that private party transfers must go through a licensed dealer, thereby creating a background check. Also, there's enough information out there to tell people that aiming a gun at people, animals, buildings, vehicles, etc. is a bad idea (fewer people seem to realize that the same rules also apply to BB guns, crossbows, etc.) I'm not so sure that some of the target market for laser devices are sufficiently well educated (I'm not sure some of those who purchase firearms are educated enough - perhaps there should be a mandatory weapons safety class in junior/senior high school?)

Certainly there are enough people who can be a serious ass without incurring the wrath of law enforcement for this to be a problem - next thing you know some politician has to "pass a law" to restrict something that already had existing safety regulations to govern it.

Re:For Adults only

[jebell]

Tell me if I'm wrong, but in the States, don't they sell GUNS to everyone?

Yes. Everyone in the U.S.A. is sold a gun at birth.

Fear us.

Re:For Adults only

[tylernt]

Nope, purchasers of rifles and shotguns still need to pass the federal NICS instant background check. The main difference between handgun and longgun purchases is most states require you to be a certain age to buy a handgun.

See:

http://usgovinfo.about.com/library/weekly/aa010200 a.htm

Re:For Adults only

[Anonymous Coward]

Some "red" States are now issueing guns at conception (background checks are easier that way). I heard that the NRA is challenging Roe v. Wade as infringing on the fetus's 2nd Amendment Rights based on this, but have yet to see a write up on Groklaw regarding the specifics.

Re:For Adults only

[metamorphage]

This must have been modded by non-Americans. "Informative" indeed.

Re:For Adults only

[paganizer]

Close.
Actually, it's the parents responsibility to provide their children with training and access to firearms, at the age the parents deems prudent.

Thats the way it was in the country, at least.

Re:For Adults only

[bar-agent]

Yes. Everyone in the U.S.A. is sold a gun at birth. Fear us.

I'd worry more about Switzerland. Every household is required to have a machine gun & ammo.

There is one place in the United States where gun ownership is mandatory, also by household. Kennesaw GA.

Switzerland has the 2nd lowest crime rate in the world, and Kennesaw has seen a decrease in crime with an increase of population since the law was passed 16 years ago.

Some remarks.

Dr. Evil Thought So.

[Skynet]

He wanted them attached to sharks.

Harmless

[mrbah]

What, these things? No, they're completely harml...AHHHHHHH, MY EYE!

Re:Harmless

[Walt Dismal]

You should have paid attention to the blind, burning CATS!

Must... Buy....

[AndyFewt]

I want one, but only for entirely professional and responsible purposes... yes, I would *never* use such a thing to burn holes in cups and other fun things like that. I think its a bit expensive although I dont know the actual costs of lasers of this power/type/whatever.

Kinda went overkill on the safety features built in my opinion. But I guess safety is a must with lasers.

Re:Must... Buy....

[AndyFewt]

Forgot to mention it would be a good $699 cat toy.. only joking!... I like the warning "This laser must be treated like a loaded gun at all times."...

also missing an "in" from my post.. suck

Re:Must... Buy....

[BLAG-blast]

I like the warning "This laser must be treated like a loaded gun at all times."...

And what are loaded guns for? FIRING!!!

ooowww over there, a rat!

Re:What's a green security clearance?

[Anonymous Coward]

Sorry, that is beyond your clearance level citizen. your Friend, the Computer, would appreciate it if you would report for termination immediately. Have a nice day!

Disclaimer, ie, don't sue us if you're dumb.

[Anonymous Coward]

This laser is not legal to use in public, and while we are not asking for any proof that the buyer is qualified to own this device, we trust that it will be used in a responsible fashion.

Bwahahahahhahahhahahahaahah!

OMG

[LiquidCoooled]

from the article/sales pitch
- There is a 2 second delay after you click the "on" button before the laser will produce a beam.

Click.
Click.
Click.
(Peering into lens)
Hey why isn't this worARGHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH HHHHHHHHHHH!

Re:OMG

[vanyel]

Amusingly, last weekend, I watched part of an old Matt Helm movie (James Bond spoof starring Dean Martin). He had a regular pistol with a 10 second delay timer on the trigger, and used it several times in exactly that way to get bad guys to shoot themselves.

Re:OMG

[Vicsun]

Your sig is quite appropriate ;)

Re:OMG

[TheSpoom]

Dude, that's not a bug, that's a feature. I can just imagine the designers grinning to themselves when they made this :^D

Re:OMG

[danila]

There is no ARGH. Burning your retina is painless, that's why it's so dangerous to look at the Sun. You can go outside on a sunny day and stare directly at the Sun. It doesn't matter how long you do it, there is no pain, just like cutting your brain with a knife. There was simply no evolutionary reason for nature to make these experiences painful, because until we humans got intelligence no animal was smart enough to harm itself in such an ingeniuos way. :)

Re:OMG

[Carewolf]

Odd, I find it quite painfull to look at, or in the general direction of the sun on a sunny day. Maybe I've evolved further than you?

Re:OMG

[danila]

Interesting... I've googled and there are clearly some passing mentions of it being painful to look at the Sun, although I haven't yet found the details covered adequately.

It's said that it's painful (although it isn't explained what kind of pain it is), eyes tear up you get blind spots (afterimage) for seconds or minutes afterwards. I can confirm (from looking at a incandescent lamp filament, although I looked at Sun in the past, like everyone did) that there is an afterimage (kinda obvious), there is definitely some amount of tears, but I don't feel any pain. There is an unusual sensation, which does motivate to look away, it's somewhat unpleasant, but not by any means painful.

On a sunny winter day the discomfort is much more pronounced, as looking in any direction is extremely uncomfortable with all that bright snow (particularly, for the first minutes after going outside). But looking at the sun itself (or in it's direction in summar) is not.

May be you did evolve further (or I lagged behind). Could you elaborate on what kind of pain you experience when looking at bright objects (such as a lamp filament).

When I was a kid, I definitely stared at the sun on several occasions. Can't tell the exact durations, but probably no less than 10-30 seconds at a time looking directly at the sun without blinking. 10-15 years after that my vision is good. I wonder how much time one needs to spend to experience the blindness...

Re:OMG

[Carewolf]

I was kidding. I didn't think you meant it seriously.

Many people find strong sun painfull if not just very unpleasant. Sunglasses have been invented for the very same reason.

Warning!

[pegr]

Warning! Do not look into laser with remaining eye!

Re:Warning!

[savagedome]

Too late. Damn.

Re:Warning!

[BLAG-blast]

Warning! Do not look into laser with remaining eye!

Recent safery changes will probably not discourage this:

• - There is a 2 second delay after you click the "on" button before the laser will produce a beam.

Somebody thinking, "Hmmmm, last I used one of these it came on straight away and I lost my right eye, this unit must have something wrong with thiARRHRHGHHHH, my eye!"

Re:Warning!

[Hoi Polloi]

Look into what? Where?

Re:Warning!

[Hogwash McFly]

Brings a new meaning to

Nothing to see here, please move along

Re:Warning!

[FriendComputer]

<mcbain>
My eyes! The goggles, they do nothing!
</mcbain>

Re:Warning!

[Alan Livingston]

...and an apostrophe in the contraction of "It is" that leads off this non-sentence.

Re:Warning!

[john holycrow]

A couple of weeks ago, a caught a red flash in my right eye. I quickly realized it was a couple of kids sitting at the bus stop across the street playing with a laser pointer. I got to my office, from where I could still see the bus stop. We called the cops, told them which bus, they intercepted it and scared the living crap out of the kids. They were only 11; a year older, and (in Canada) they would be charged with assault. The after-image lasted only about 15 minutes, but I'm going for a check-up anyway.

Re:Warning!

[nxtr]

Evolution at work!

Re:Warning!

[ObiWanKenblowme]

I once had a truck driver and his passenger bouncing a red laser into my eye off of my rear view mirror as I was driving down the road!! Unfortunately they didn't have a "how's my driving" sticker and their tag was so crud-encrusted I couldn't make out the number. I would've loved to have been able to tell the FHP exactly who to go nail though - it's very scary when you're driving along, minding your own business, and all of a sudden are literally seeing red. Lucky for me, the afterimage only lasted a couple seconds and there was no (apparent) lasting damage.

Re:Warning!

[Majik Sznak]

Actually, natural selection at work. :)

Re:Warning!

[windex]

I would've locked up my brakes. He'd get fired and I'd of likely lived through it with a new car to boot.

Fuck 'em.

Re:Warning!

[maxdamage]

Sounds like he may be a future Darwin Awards candidate.

Re:Warning!

[Anonymous Coward]

There is a 2 second delay after you click the "on" button before the laser will produce a beam.

Holy cow. That's the dumbest idea I've ever heard. It will cause people to do exactly what you suggest. "Hmm, is this thing on?"

Re:Warning!

[myowntrueself]

(Obligatory ATHF reference coming right up)

Computer: "Retinal scan commencing"

Oglethorpe: "aaaarrrgghhhhh my eyes! Wrong laser! Wrong laser! I thought I told you to label those buttons, Emory!"

Emory: "Well you said not to label them because of security or something"

Re:Warning!

[drinkypoo]

The best part is that this is apparently a requirement for making the device legal for licensing. Reminds me of how the US mandates that any soot in diesel exhaust here now has to be under a certain size, but the bigger particles are filtered out by lung cilia and the smaller ones aren't. Makes you wonder who makes this shit up.

Re:Warning!

[the angry liberal]

I have shined myself in the eyes countless times with a laser pointer and the visual artifacts never last more than 15-20 seconds.

And no, I have had no loss of vision as a result. This only goes for the "pocket" class of laser, not those funky green or commercial ones.

Re:Warning!

[binarybum]

uh, make sure to have a really great new years eve this weekend. with that kind of logic in action there's a good chance you will not see a great deal more new years celebrations.

one does not fuck with a truck less they wish to be fuckeed.

Re:Warning!

[john holycrow]

I suppose you're right. I'm an old guy who has had laser surgery and two lens implants, so I tend to woory.

Re:Warning!

[fireman sam]

I've been hit in the eye by a CD player laser. I was cleaning it and my "friend" decided to plug it in a turn it on while I was inspecting the laser surface for any remaining dust.

After about 5 years, the "floaties" are still there, and will be there for ever.

"Floaties" are the dead cells that were cooked by the laser. Not fun.

Re:Warning!

[the angry liberal]

After about 5 years, the "floaties" are still there, and will be there for ever.

The floaters aren't caused by laser exposure. Floaters are known to form as a result of the breakdown of macular fluid in your eye, which occurs over many years. It is most likely you never noticed these before you were zapped and actively checked your sight for problems.

I, too, have floaters. They suck.

Re:Warning!

[ErikZ]

You had to call the cops on a bunch of 11 year olds?

That's...sad.

Here's what you do. You go up to them, tell them to cut the crap, and take their laser pointer. I know people from socialist countries have a lot of trouble doing things without governement intervention, but sheesh!

Re:Warning!

[Chrontius]

Energy weapons are hard enough to use properly; I can't see a firearm that fires two seconds after you pull the trigger being legal, so...

Re:Warning!

[macshit]

Huh? It's absolutely the right thing to do. The cops aren't going throw them in jail, they're going to scare the crap out of them, which is the only thing that will prevent them from doing the same dangerous, obnoxious, moronic thing again.

If they were doing something that was just obnoxious and moronic, calling the police is perhaps an overreaction, but this was beyond that, and Joe Random yelling at them is simply not going to have the same effect as the police talking to them calmly.

[I'm not sure what your problem with the police is anyway, in most areas of the U.S. (maybe not central LA :-o) they're pretty reasonable and perfectly capable of dealing appropriately with such situations -- including telling you to get a grip.]

Re:Warning!

[Lord Flipper]

Yeah, remember that when you're dying from cancer, because corporate 'special interests' were let off 'the hook', and you're too fucked up on morphine to say goodbye to your kids.

Oh, and have a nice day. Heheh...sucker

Re:Warning!

[Macrolord]

Not sure what specifically caused them but when I was in 6th grade, I was having migranes pretty regularly (still do, but not as often) so my mom took me to the doctor. I was then refered to an eye doctor thinking it might be eye strain (it was the 70's, ok?). When the doctor asked me to tell me what I can see when looking at a plain white wall, I described seeing glass worms floating.

That freaked him out enough that he immediately started discussing possible drug usage with my mom. It was too funny because I was a really good kid and never messed with stupid stuff like that, I was just good at being creative with my observations. (Nowaadays, the tinfoil hat helps reduce the level of those observations). So anyways, they went ahead and gave me glasses. The headaches continued, no noticiable difference in vision between glasses and no-glasses so they went into a box, never to bee seen from again, afaik.

Anyways , I still have the couple "glass worms" which are just a bit off center from my eye so if I try to follow them my eye just rolls off to one side. kinda like chasing a banana hangin from a stick attached to me head.

My guess is they came from looking at the sun at an earlier age and have some kind of scar tissue or something that is in a fixed position relative to my retina/lens/etc...

Re:Warning!

[Mr. Slippery]

I described seeing glass worms floating...My guess is they came from looking at the sun at an earlier age

No worries, many of us have those "glass worms". Often it's the remains of the hyaloid artery, not a sign of damage.

I'm 20/20 in both eyes, but sometimes I can see an occasional transparent worm or dot float across the field of vision, really only noticeable when looking at a blank surface.

Re:Warning!

[Mr. Slippery]

You go up to them, tell them to cut the crap, and take their laser pointer.

Then they, or there parents, press theft or even assault charges against you for your vigilante action.

Tell 'em to cut it out is fine, and might be effective, though the little brats might well just tell you to fsck off. Stealing their stuff is a bad idea, however badly they might be misusing it.

Re:Warning!

[kellytubby]

It's not natural selection

As David Blunkett proved, you can be blind and still get the ladies to accept your genetic emissions ;)

Re:Warning!

[drinkypoo]

Blind people can still fuck, and are more likely to have ugly children. On the other hand, if you are stupid enough to put the switch someplace that puts you in the path of the beam, you deserve to be burned - and removed from the aforementioned gene pool. The only thing a requirement like this can accomplish is making the stupid (or young) suffer, and I think they suffer enough already just being themselves.

Re:Warning!

[Politburo]

Do you have a cite for that?

The reason I ask is that it simply doesn't make sense and it doesn't jibe with the rest of environmental regulations in the US. Despite the best efforts of the Bush administration, most of the US environmental regulations do make sense, though they're far from perfect.

Particulate matter is classified based on the size of the particles. PM (or TSP) is the set of all particulate matter (Total Suspended Particles). PM(x) is the subset of particulate matter less than (x) microns. You'll typically see PM10 and PM2.5 as common boundaries. PM2.5 is also known as 'fine particulates' and is the most recent focus of air pollution control efforts by EPA and state DEPs.

Finer particles are worse than coarser particles for the reason you specify: Finer particles are able to travel deeper into the lungs and cause more damage. As such, regulations for finer particles are more stringent. For example, in New Jersey you are allowed to increase potential TSP emissions by 25 tons over a 5 year period without any offsets. You are only allowed to increase potential PM10 emissions by 10 tons over the same 5 year period. Remember that those 10 tons of PM10 also count against the 25 tons of TSP, since PM10 is a subset of TSP.

Of course, the oil lobby is extremely powerful, and we are all well aware of their influence inside the Bush administration. It's also easier to filter larger particles, but certainly not impossible to filter fine particles. In any case, what you describe it is a departure from most regulations, which tend to say 'larger particles are better'.

Re:Warning!

[drinkypoo]

Unfortunately I don't, though I will probably come across it again by accident in a couple weeks. I do believe, however, that it predates the current presidency.

Re:Warning!

[rakslice]

Well, at any rate their children are more likely to have redeeming features other than visual beauty, if you know what I mean.

I have a sudden urge to watch Love at First Sight again...

Re:Warning!

[CharlieHedlin]

Didn't stop a jackass from pulling in 25 yards in front of a 24' panel truck I rented while moving, then slamming on their brakes. This was on a nearly empty freeway at 65mph.

25 yards was enough to slow and change lanes, but not with a lot of extra room.

DAAAAAMMMMMMMNNNN!!!!

[Anonymous Coward]

I have got to get me one these! It will facilitate my plans immensly!:D

PLEASE!

[af_robot]

Any links where i can also buy some fricken sharks?!

Re:PLEASE!

[MarkRose]

Right here. Laser beams sold separately. ;)

Re:PLEASE!

[Greyfox]

Give the guys at http://www.petsorfood.com a holler. They usually deal in koala and baby seals but I'm sure they could hook you up with some fricken sharks, too...

Obscure RPG Ref

[BrynM]

I can't get past Red clearance according to the beloved and benevolent Computer. After my last clone was killed by the room-blender-bot, the evidence of him not being a commie mutant traitor was destroyed. Red lasers for me until the next clone as I have to give my life to the needs of the Computer in a spectacular blaze of glory to redeem myslef... or volunteer to go outside for experiments! Eww!!! That fireball in the sky scares me. The Computer should have it destroyed!

What do you mean I said too much?!?!? I'm not a traitor! I'm not a commie spy! Nooooooo...........

Re:Obscure RPG Ref

[willfe]

Citizen, you are not authorized to disseminate this material to Infrared clearance citizens. You are also clearly not authorized to visit this underground "Slashdot" secret society network system. Please report for termination.

For your next clone's reference: there is no "fireball in the sky." There is no "outside." There are no "green lasers."

Thank you for your cooperation!

Re:Obscure RPG Ref

[Mr. Competence]

Citizen, you have revealed too much.
Go here or here for re-education.
Remember, the Computer is your friend.

Re:Obscure RPG Ref

[AvitarX]

We will always remember you [Name deleted due to traitorous information dissemination] for your noble works and experiments in the [Region Deleted due to non-existance] with the big [object deleted] in the [object deleted].

Crap like this...

[Anonymous Coward]

really has very little real world value and should be pulled off of the market. As you can see here, this stuff can do REAL damage.
http://washingtontimes.com/national/20040 928-11135 6-3924r.htm
If someone wants a pointing device, fine, but to make it so powerful that it can burn holes in objects is crazy.

Re:Crap like this...

[Shippy]

Agreed. I don't think this guy should be able to sell these things to just anyone. Well... he says "responsible adults", but I doubt he's doing background checks. Assuming our Department of Homeland Security isn't a complete joke, shouldn't they have some issues with this?

Re:Crap like this...

[ePhil_One]

If lasers are outlawed then only outlaws will have lasers!

Re:Crap like this...

[TomorrowPlusX]

Shhhh! Shut up! Shut up!

Re:Crap like this...

[Shippy]

even a BB gun that is just as dangerous as this laser is.

Uh, can your BB gun permanently damage the eyes of pilots from the ground? Didn't think so.

Re:Crap like this...

[Jah-Wren Ryel]

Uh, can your BB gun permanently damage the eyes of pilots from the ground? Didn't think so.

Unless those pilots happen to be standing on the ground, not moving around, this laser can't hurt them either.

It takes sophisticated tracking equipment to keep a laser aimed at a distant moving target like a plane or a car - significantly beyond the capabilities of human eye-hand coordination.

Given the divergence of the beam over a couple of thousand feet, the "dot" will probably be about the size of a CD, thus significantly reducing the amount of energy per square inch. Combine that with the near impossibility of tracking a distant moving target by hand there is no way Joe Blow could keep this laser aimed at an airplane cockpit long enough to damage a pilot's eyes. That's assuming the pilot was too stupid to turn his head away either.

Now, if this laser's output was in the 10s or 100s of watts, then you'd have another story.
But, at a max of 0.2 watts, you are just being a hysterical pussy.

Re:Crap like this...

[Ageless]

Nope, and neither can this laser.

I don't know if you've ever played with a laser pointer or not, but I can't even hold one still enough to keep a dot within a centimeter from one side of my living room to the other for a few seconds. That's about 11 feet. Now, I suppose that if you could get within 11 feet of the pilot you might be able to blind him if he didn't see you standing there with a laser but from that distance you could just throw a rock into the turbine and blow the engine up.

More likely, if you are in the pilot blinding business you are going to be a good few thousand feet away. Add in to that that it's going to be difficult to find a place where you can stand and get line of sight into the pilots eyes. I don't know about you, but when I look up at a plane I see the bottom, which is usually made of metal, not glass. I'll give that if you tried real hard you might be able to find a tall hill within a few thousand feet of the airport that would give you line of sight to the pilots eyes.

Now that you've got your hill, and your laser and a plane is taking off (or landing) facing directly at you you just need to aim it right at his eyes. I'm assuming here that you have mounted some huge scope to the laser so you can *find* the pilot's eyes from 1000+ feet. And probably a tripod. All that's left is to hold that beam right on his eye for several seconds while he's moving, the plane's moving and you are moving. Don't forget the beam is going to be spread out some at that distance, which means less power per square centimeter which means you have to hit him longer.

Is it possible? Just barely with great resources and planning. Is it likely? No. Once again, just buy a $150 rifle from Walmart and shoot holes in the fuel tanks.

Re:Crap like this...

[flashgc]

So by the time the beam reaches Mars it's about the size of a laundry basket and the Martians see a benign green light which means the invasion is on right?

Re:Crap like this...

[halbritt]

Unfortunately, in spite of all your speculation, you are wrong. Please refer to this NTSB incident report. Particularly the line that reads, " Fifty-one prior incidents of laser irradiations to pilots have been recorded by the Las Vegas air traffic facility over the past 2 years."

Re:Crap like this...

[lachlan76]

Those are light shows, and are somewhat different to one person with a laser/scope.

Re:Crap like this...

[Shippy]

You are naive. Read this: http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/12/29/laser.plane/index .html. Just came out today and it's very relevant.

Remember, the 9/11 commission found that our biggest failure was a lack of imagination. Don't be so narrow-minded.

Re:Crap like this...

[Ageless]

Too much imagination gets us things like the PATRIOT Act. I'd like our administration to have a little less imagination now and then. You'll note from the article you linked that no damage was done. The entire point of my posts was that no damage could be done with that laser and that it didn't need to be regulated. I never said it was impossible to bounce a laser around at a plane. I said you couldn't do any damage with the laser from the link.

Re:Crap like this...

[vettemph]

Also, don't forget that you will have to put the beam through a plane of glass that will reflect a lot of the beam away.

Yes, reflected and refracted rays need to be accounted for along with beam divergence. This can easily be worked out. Note the divergence of the beam over the intended distance, compensate by adding more laser pointers.
Two things happen as your imperfect beam diverges. First, your beam covers more area so you don't need to aim as well. Second, you loose wattage and need to add beams. If your 1 square mm beam of a given power becomes 2 square mm at your intended distance, you would need to quadruple your number of beams and have them converge on the same "point" in order to have the same power per square mm. now picture a huge array of laser pointers.

About that beam reflcting of the windows. given the location of the beam (end of the runway?), angle of the plane descending and the angle of the window mounted relative to the planes body, you could compensate for the wattage of rays that reflect off the outer surface of the glass and the rays that have Total Internal Reflection off the cockpit side of the glass which means you might double the number of lasers for the given job.

Lastly, You need to do so, near an airport, WITHOUT GETTING NOTICED!! have fun.

Re:Crap like this...

[halbritt]

Good point. How about this?

Re:What's a green security clearance?

[hyphz]

It's a joke based on an old classic RPG called Paranoia.

Security codes were assigned based on the UV spectrum, with Infrared being the lowest, and Ultraviolet the highest. The clothing and similar worn by people had to match their colour (or Black for IR and White for UV).

Lasers were the standard weapon in the game, and were coded according to the clearance of the firer. Reflective armor, protecting against lasers, was also coded by colour and couldn't protect against any laser of a shorter wavelength - so people had no protection of those of higher clearence than themselves.

Whoa..

[ShadeARG]

That sure makes this guy look real smart :)

green laser "pointer"

[KidCeltic]

Here's a weapon I guarantee I wouldn't carry "Mexican style" (tucked in the front of the waistband).

Re:green laser "pointer"

[smart.id]

You've got to be kidding. So you're saying you wouldn't carry that "weapon," but what would you rather have? A loaded gun? How about not carrying anything there?

Re:green laser "pointer"

[linuxwrangler]

Yeah, wouldn't want to go off "half cocked".

(Yes, I know it's a line from "Fun With Dick and Jane")

Re:Good Job, Slashdot

[Shadow Wrought]

Brag when servers are taken down by the Memepool effect.

Capable of causing real damage..

[bludstone]

..you do realize that that makes them EXTRA cool, not less cool, right?

If I was thinkgeek, I'd double the price, or at least up it to $150.00

Re:Capable of causing real damage..

[bludstone]

Now that its been slashdotted?

Oh hell yes. :)

Re:What's a green security clearance?

[Anonymous Coward]

I have found a commie mutant traitor giving out classified information to other traitors! Termination ahoy!

Re:What's a green security clearance?

[Anonymous Coward]

I am sorry, but knowledge of what the security level of this information is, is beyond ~your~ security level. You are obviously a Commie Mutant Spy. Prepare for vaporization.

Have a Happy 5000 (tm) day!

Eh?

[voidptr]

The laser pointer at TG is 5mW, the primary link is selling ones 20 to 30 times stronger. What's the similarity again? I thought we already knew lasers were dangerous.

Re:Eh?

[Haydn Fenton]

Enough posts like this, it's just the way the summary has been written that's confusing people into thinking it implies the parent's point.

Let's break it up, shall we?

"You thought those green laser pointers sold by ThinkGeek and others were pretty cool, didn't you? Well, think again." - This is in italics, probably meaning its what the poster wrote. Clearly, all it says is that the powerful laser is cooler than the ThinkGeek one.

"It seems obligatory to point out that even laser pointers, and certainly anything more powerful than those, are capable of causing real damage." - This is not in italics, just to show the end of the article and a little bit of extra information, or possibly even a lil message from an editor. This part says that pointing lasers, as well as ones that are more powerful than it, are dangerous.

FDA approved...

[ZSpade]

This laser must be treated like a loaded gun at all times.

I wonder when the FDA is going to start treating devices like this as such. I'm sure it won't be long before you have to start registering these things.

Re:FDA approved...

[aminorex]

The food and drug administration? Probably when
people start eating small appliances for lunch.

Re:FDA approved...

[Rhinobird]

Why would the Food and Drug Administration have anything to do with either guns or electronic devices like this?

Re:FDA approved...

[FuzzyBad-Mofo]

I think you mean the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (Yeehaw!)

And yes, something this powerful should probably be regulated by them. But hands off my little 5mW pointer..

Re:FDA approved...

[j_kenpo]

No, hes right, it is the FDA. The Center for Devices and Radiological Health (CDRH) are part of the FDA. They are the bastards who will pull the plug on public laser shows if they do things like scan the crowd (which is legal in Europe), have laser set-ups that do not have a safety kill switch, have scatter beams from using lasers with AOM crystals, etc..

More information about them is at http://www.fda.gov/cdrh/

You may even find interesting info on the from the International Laser Display Association (ILDA). Im sure some of those guys can tell you about their experiences with them.

Are these really stories?

[duckpoopy]

because they seem like advertisements...

Re:Are these really stories?

[OverlordQ]

This guy's site got hammered once when it was on a couple different link sites last week. Now it's getting hammered by slashdot. Anything he makes will probably be offset by his hosting bill.

Re:Are these really stories?

[CreatureComfort]

Ob: You're new here, aren't you?

Re:Are these really stories?

[gad_zuki!]

Actually slashdot linked to the coral cache of his page:

http://64.252.62.40.nyud.net:8090/lasershoppe/in de x.htm

See the nyud.net:8090 in there? Smart move. Hopefully submitters will be doing this more often.

Re:Are these really stories?

[OverlordQ]

yea but that still re-polls the page every 5 minutes, so it's not helping *that* much.

Re:Are these really stories?

[Kent Recal]

One hit every 5 minutes instead of n hits per second?
That *should* help a lot.

Re:Are these really stories?

[bar-agent]

In Korea, only old people have stories. Everyone else has an ad that they tell.

rut ro

[kevinx]

...Hooked up to a scope, this could be a very deadly tool. This would easily blind someone at a distance.

I hate having strict regulations on everything..but.. the thought of a couple of kids playing a prank and permanently blinding me while I'm on my way to work is very scary.

Re:rut ro

[Delphiki]

They could also run up to you any number of hazardous chemicals you can find around the house in your face, or hell, just throw a pencil and have it hit in an unlucky way. You can do horrible things to people with just about anything, if you want to be a dick. Should we need a license to buy peanuts because so many people are allergic?

Re:rut ro

[ubera]

Except that other household chemicals have a variety of obvious uses other than attacking people. Most people favour licensing guns, this is effectively a gun.
This weapon prompts serious temptation to the irresponsible. It's like the laser pointer, but way more dangerous.
It's a fair point you're making, but I feel that in this case we have a very serious weapon with no obvious harmless uses, and a considerable range (unlike the chemicals).

Re:rut ro

[d_strand]

the thought of a couple of kids playing a prank and permanently blinding me while I'm on my way to work is very scary.

as opposed to to a couple of kids shooting you through the head with a 30-06 which they could just as easily do?

Re:rut ro

[jd_esguerra]

the thought of a couple of kids playing a prank and permanently blinding me while I'm on my way to work is very scary.

I was at an ice-cream place with my brother and his girlfriend. Some kids in a passing car "illuminated" us with an ordinary laser pointer. My brother called the cops and gave them the information on the vehicle and what they had done. Not sure what ever happened...

Even those red laser pointers (1-mW) can fuck up your eyes under the correct conditions. Someone shines a greenie in your face (even the 5-mW pointers), and you could probably consider that a legitimate assault-- as far as I know, they are NOT eye-safe like the red pointers. (Any laser people out there willing to post a laser safety evaluation to back me up?) I'm just waiting for them to become mainstream enough that kids start damaging peoples eyes. Then you will see additional constraints on sales, or maybe a requirement that the beam divergence be low enough for use in the board-room, but high enough that they are eye-safe a few meters out.

Re:rut ro

[Moofie]

Thanks, nanny. I'll be sure to ask you whenever I do something that you might think is dangerous.

Can I have your home phone number?

Re:rut ro

[SharpFang]

the same can be done with a cheap red laser pointer instead of $700 green laser.

Re:rut ro

[myowntrueself]

"Should we need a license to buy peanuts because so many people are allergic?"

You may well laugh... but some people are so allergic to peanuts that they get a reaction just from walking past someone who happens to be chewing a peanut.

Re:rut ro

[Geoffreyerffoeg]

Should we need a license to buy peanuts because so many people are allergic?

If you only knew how many times my classmates have tried to sneak peanut butter into my lunches, you wouldn't think that so preposterous.

Re:rut ro

[kevinx]

Well.. the difference between a gunshot and a lazer comes down to forensics. That and lack of regulation. Someone shoots me in the head and there will be a bullet that is traceable to a murder weapon and GSR will be left on the shooter. There also might be people who hear the gunshot go off and can place the location of the shooter.

Granted, you could probably snipe me and get away with it... but....

It would take an emotionally disturbed person to shoot you in the head for no reason. I see kids pointing lazers at peoples eyes all the time. They don't see the consiquences as with shooting people.

Re:rut ro

[jrockway]

Well damn. Isn't that too bad for them then?

If you're allergic to common foods then don't go outside.

Given that the "old" ones weren't used responsibly

[popo]

I remember reading that traditional "red laser" pointing devices were being banned from British football matches because fans would point them in to the eyes of goalkeepers. Someone told me that they were at a Liverpool match once and one of the goalkeepers had about 8 red dots all over his body when he made a save.

Now we've got something that can fry the friggin ball itself...

Anyone want to bet on the "responsible adult" factor for international soccer fans.

These things are a bad idea....

Uses and mods for this laser.

[Baron_Yam]

I see a pistol grip, collapsable stock, and a scope as excellent mods for this laser. A 'clip' could be added to replace the regular batteries with something with better capacity. Mount three or four lasers with a dialable control to adjust the range at which the beams cross. Imagine, burning a guy from kilometers away without having to worry about drop, drift, or leading the target. No spent cartridges, no rifling marks on a projectile. Sweet.

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[Danse]

Yeah.. but it wouldn't be very good as a sniper rifle.. hard to get them to hold still for 30 seconds or so while you burn a hole through them...

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[winkydink]

Yeah, you'd just have to worry about barrel stabilization and beam diffusion due to particulate matter in the air. But hey, why bother with details?

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[stupidfoo]

Terrorist!

I'm calling the DHS!

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[harrkev]

Check out the video which is the first link on this page

Green laser burns a hole through a cup. But I admit that it could be staged.

More discussion here

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[AndyFewt]

You know someone will mount it on something..

But I dont think it would be able to burn a guy from a few kilometers away due to beam dissipation and spread due to the air. A beam generated by a small lab laser spreads to approximately 1 mile in diameter if shone from the Earth's surface to the Moon. I know thats a long distance but I couldnt find the equations to work out the dissipation/spread/etc..

Sure the military have some lasers which can do damage over long ranges but they are huge (truck mounted in most cases) and require a load of power.

I doubt this laser could actually be used as a weapon, sure it burns over shortish ranges and can blind people but apart from that it sucks as a weapon.

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[StalinsNotDead]

Not if they're asleep.

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[justkarl]

Don't you think they'd figure it out after the laser burned about halfway through?

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[justkarl]

Mount three or four lasers with a dialable control to adjust the range at which the beams cross.

Remember what they said in Ghostbusters: Don't cross the streams.

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[over_exposed]

Except for the fact that they can see the ENTRIE BEAM... Wouldn't make for a very effective weapon when your target sees 1-4 green beams converging on his/her foreheard from a distance... Once he/she starts moving around, good luck keeping it focused AND targeted.

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[over_exposed]

E-N-T-I-R-E... I'm an idiot.

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[khrtt]

It's a lot more fun to watch a 1 joule pulsed laser blow a hole in the cup, and blow the cup off the desk (by ablation pressure) in the process. At one point in my career we got a hole of a pulsed ruby unit, and played with it a bit.

If you shoot at a lightweight object that ablates easily, the object is knocked away. The darker the color the better.

If you shoot a pulse at your hand, it makes a 0.5mm diameter/0.5mm deep pit, with no blood, and you can barely feel the pain.

Oh, and it detonated firecrackers, killed bugs, and pretty much did about nothing to about anything else we tried:-).

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[TummyX]

spelling issues aside, they can't.

If this is a true laser, you _cannot_ see the beam unless is it being used in a diffusive atmosphere (dusty, lots of vapour, etc).


Wrong. The atmosphere generally has quite a bit of dust, water vapour etc. You can see the entirety of the green laser at night because our eyes are more senstive to green light compared to red light.

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[harrkev]

Some guys have all the fun!
*Harrkev turns green*

Re:Uses and mods for this laser.

[zev1983]

You would have to worry about a small amount of atmospheric distortion in some conditions at long ranges.

Austin Powers Moment on a college kid's budget....

[hcob$]

The Alan Parson's Project......


--Poor college student in monologue-- Now comes the time to blackmail the US for 1 Miiiillion Doooolarrs... However since I only have 700 dollars and no reusable launch vehicle, I shall buy this green "laser" and a bathroom mirror to reflect the beam from the general direction of the moon and hope they don't notice the large black shadow.


--The RA walks in the door-- *Ahem!* (RA walks up and snatches 120 dollars from the kid's hands) I thought you would have the money you owed me by now....


--College Kid-- Damn, guess I'll just go watch some porn on the internet instead.

Public service

[confusion]

Posting a link to buy a high-powered laser on slashdot is certainly a good way to keep them off the streets... er shelves.
That being said, I really want one. I wish the site hadn't died so soon.

Jerry
http://www.syslog.org/

Re:Public service

[name773]

you can buy a pretty good computer (sans monitor) for that much (they're ~700usd).

Re: Public service

[djdavetrouble]

That being said, I really want one. I wish the site hadn't died so soon.

Riiiiiiight, because we all know that once it is off the front page of Slashdot, it doesn't exist anymore....... ;)

Re:What's a green security clearance?

[Allen Varney]

Anyone care to explain the color codes of security clearances?

The headline refers to the tabletop paper-and-pencil roleplaying game PARANOIA, originally published in 1984 by West End Games (New York City) and recently republished as PARANOIA XP by Mongoose Publishing (Swindon, UK).

PARANOIA is a satirical science fiction RPG set in an underground city, Alpha Complex, ruled by an insane Computer. The Computer has imposed an unbreakable system of security clearances that represent how much it trusts a given citizen. The security clearances are keyed to the colors of the spectrum. The lowest security clearance is INFRARED, meaning The Computer doesn't trust you at all; INFRARED citizens wear black. RED Clearances is the next highest, followed by ORANGE, YELLOW, and so on up to VIOLET. Above VIOLET Clerance are the illustrious High Programmers, the ULTRAVIOLETs, who can program The Computer itself. High Programmers wear white.

PARANOIA sold over 150,000 copies in its first couple of editions, and the new "XP" edition has been well received. You can find out a lot more about PARANOIA at the fan site Paranoia-Live.net, and follow the progress of the game on the PARANOIA development blog.

Could this be used as a soldering tool?

[ravenspear]

i.e. is it strong enough to melt metal?

Re:Could this be used as a soldering tool?

[dark_requiem]

Yeah, time to throw out the dremmel.

Re:Could this be used as a soldering tool?

[human bean]

Sure. You just have to focus it finely enough. Chip vias and leads are often soldered or cut with just five milliwatts worth of laser light, but they are focused down to dots of less than a thousandth of an inch or so in size.

A decent soldering iron is only about fifteen watts, and you lose most of that to the surroundings rather than the work.

Re:Could this be used as a soldering tool?

[crhalpin]

It's doubtful.
A typical soldering iron is in the 20-40W range. This one is only 100mW. However if you had 200 of them all aimed at the same spot... :-)

Re:Could this be used as a soldering tool?

[Novous]

Of course! Until it reflects and solders your eyes...

Re:Could this be used as a soldering tool?

[Moofie]

Power output is not the factor. Power DENSITY is the factor.

If you focus that 100mW on a small enough area, you certainly can solder with it. That 20-40W soldering iron is heating maybe 50 grams of metal, in addition to your teeny tiny mass olf solder.

Re:Could this be used as a soldering tool?

[zymurgyboy]

Or aimed one beam through a decent rifle scope.

Coming Soon: Laser TV

[VernonNemitz]

Just need three lasers, red, blue (not yet widely available), and green, and means to switch their (big not needed!) output power to 256 levels very rapidly. Then a fairly simple arrangement of horizontal and vertical rotating mirrors can scan the flickering beams across, say, an ordinary home-movie projection screen, rather like we do with electron beams and electromagnets in a CRT. Somehow I think somebody somewhere has been working on this...but the lasers have so far been too expensive. But not much longer! Remember Blu-Ray? That diode laser is the last piece needed!

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[avandesande]

spread out over the large area of a tv screen this would appear pretty dim

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[superstick58]

Ah! the dawn of the blue laser is apon us. The GaN diode laser is now becoming common(though still relatively expensive).

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=gan+laser&btn G=Google+Search

Blue diodes are a very nice color. My friend used one on his modded Xbox and it makes for a nice touch.

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[joeyjoejo1200]

Actually in professional laser shows they use a white laser fired through a special crystal that will change the color of the laser when bombarded with an RF wave www.neostech.com (variable prism). It actually can create 281,474,976,710,656 different colors 6 different colors: red green blue near infrared near ultraviolet and this very odd green color The only issue to overcome is the scan rate and high enough bandwidth to the neos and scanners.

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[takev]

I believe you can not easily change the power level, however you can do pulse width modulation. There are also now laser light modulators, that can change the frequency of a laser to an other color.

And yes, people are working on a projector build with a single laser and that gismo to modulate light. There have been expensive two laser versions helium and argon. The argon laser actually produces 4 colors, blue and green.

The green laser pointer from thinkgeek also uses a frequency divider to change the color of the second laser. The thinkgeek Laser is actual a red laser that pumps a ultraviolet laser of which the frequency is divided by two to get green.

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[alienmole]

On the macro scale, the idea of raster-based laser TV is a non-starter, because that horizontal & vertical arrangement of mirrors and the motors which drive them can't even remotely compete with the electrically-controlled magnetic field which modulates the electron beam in your TV CRT. You get a horribly flickering, low resolution picture at best. Notice that the laser light shows which use this technique are invariably vector-based, rather than raster based, and they flicker a lot too, especially on larger images (images that take longer to trace).

On a smaller scale, the DLP chips in many projectors are actually an array of microscopic mirrors controllable by a piezoelectric effect (or some such), and those work pretty well for systems based on ordinary light. So I suppose you could use laser light as the input to that. That could be interesting -- sounds like a /. project waiting to happen, all it needs is someone willing to sacrifice a DLP projector in the name of science!

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[jmkaza]

Finally, when mom's yell to their kids that they'll go blind if they sit too close to the TV, they won't be lying.

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[GoRK]

Several companies already have laser projected displays in development. Most use MEMS switches to adjust light levels and aim the beam. The best part of these systems is that there are little to no optics between the imager and the surface being projected, meaning that you can control focus and image distortion and the like all in software. This will make for some pretty neat possibilities: rear projection tv's that are only a couple of inches thick, front projection screens that you can walk in front of without distubing the image, projecting onto highly deformed surfaces (spheres, domes, etc)

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[badmammajamma]

"That could be interesting -- sounds like a /. project waiting to happen, all it needs is someone willing to sacrifice a DLP projector in the name of science!"

Sorry, /. projects only happen when linux is somehow involved. If you want to get your TV to boot linux or something, then this is the place.

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[rco3]

A white laser? What the hell is that?

If its output is white, it's not a laser. Lasers are monochromatic (or very nearly) and coherent. White light is by definition not monochromatic.

White LEDs, FYI, use a monochromatic (or nearly so) LED die and a phosphor similar to those in fluourescent lights to produce white light - the light from the LED itself isn't white.

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[rco3]

Allow me to point out that there ARE some lasers capable of emitting a red, a green, and a blue beam simultaneously. That is more properly termed an RGB laser, but I can see where the distinction might be irrelevant under certain circumstances.

Apologies.

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[kabocox]

It actually can create 281,474,976,710,656 different colors 6 different colors: red green blue near infrared near ultraviolet and this very odd green color

Ahh, just what I've always wanted a tv that would show me outdoor scenes with infrared and ultraviolet.

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[nothingx]

Yes. It's been done by the Eastman Kodak group.

Researchers at Eastman Kodak (Rochester, NY), for example, have developed a grating electromechnical system (GEMS), a diffractive-MEMS spatial-light modulator for use in printing and display applications. The GEMS modulator contains a linear array of pixels capable of high-speed digital operation, high optical contrast, and good efficiency. According to its developers, when coupled with RGB laser radiation, the GEMS is capable of producing spectacular still and motion images that create a new visual experience. Images are life-like having a smooth continuous quality with no "screen door" effect, high contrast, extended dynamic range, high resolution, and vivid colors. In addition, computer-generated motion images can provide a unique experience by using the expanded available color gamut to produce highly saturated colors.

"The primary advantage of lasers for display applications is color gamut," said Greg Niven, director of marketing, graphic arts and display, at Coherent (Santa Clara, CA), which is supplying high-power solid-state lasers to the display industry for applications such as rear-projection TV and digital cinema. "With lightbulbs and microdisplays, you can achieve 40% of the color your eye can perceive. With lasers (RGB primaries), you can get up to 85% of the colors your eye can see. So there is much wider color gamut, extremely high resolution, greater contrast, longer lifetimes, and a much better viewing experience."

http://lfw.pennnet.com/Articles/Article_Display.cf m?Section=ARTCL&ARTICLE_ID=216621&VERSION_NUM=2 http://www.insightmedia.info/news/Kodak'sGEMS.htm

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[srleffler]

There are actually lasers with very broad bandwidth that can be considered 'white' lasers. I don't think they are used for laser light shows, though. I've never heard of them being used outside a research environment. As another poster pointed out, there are ways of getting red, green, and blue light out of a single laser cavity. That's more likely what they are using.

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[StikyPad]

The argon laser actually produces 4 colors, blue and green.

Maybe I'm not using the same number system as you, but where I'm from...

Re:Coming Soon: Laser TV

[takev]

4 colors, blue, green, green, green :-)

Good luck buying one

[SJasperson]

If it took him 4 weeks to supply a working unit before all you SlashDotters went to visit, what's the backlog going to be like now?

Re:Good luck buying one

[LordPhantom]

Umm.... slashdotters don't make money you fool!!! (*Sorry I don't have the rent again mom*)

I RTFA'd and here is what I understand....

[wo1verin3]

(well I read part of it until I fell asleep)

When you graduate to higher power lasers (e.g., argon ion) rated Class IIIb or more, additional very real dangers are present of both instant damage to vision and with Class IV lasers - the possibility of burning or setting fire to flesh and other things. The smallest CO2 laser is going to be rated Class IV!

For Christmas next year I want a Class IV laser!

Re:I RTFA'd and here is what I understand....

[superstick58]

A CO2 laser is even more dangerous because it emits light in the infrared range. Therefore you cannot see it even if it is being shined directly in your eye. Basically, you will just be looking at something then everything will go dark as your retina is burned to a crisp. You won't even see it coming.

Re:I RTFA'd and here is what I understand....

[stratjakt]

Sure, just like staring at the sun, where the fluid in your eyeballs will literally "boil" and become opaque.

People dont realize that there are no nerve endings in the eyeball itself, it can't feel pain. They keep gawking at the sun, or welding without a visor because it isn't hurting them to do so.

Now here's a real laser -

[slusich]

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&cate gory=25278&item=3862662804&rd=1

Let's see what that does to a paper cup.

Re:Now here's a real laser -

[stratjakt]

The link was to a $350,000 industrial laser cutter, not a modified pointer or other ebay scam.

Re:Now here's a real laser -

[ebrandsberg]

And someone didn't follow the link. It was an industrial cutting laser, 3500 watt for over 300k. Probably not a scam.

Re:Now here's a real laser -

[Barlo_Mung_42]

Shrink that thing down into something gun shaped that makes a neat blaster sound when I fire it and you've got yourself a deal.

Re:Now here's a real laser -

[saintp]

And someone's a humorless boor.

Re:Now here's a real laser -

[bill_mcgonigle]

The trouble with /. is that when you post something funny there are half a million people who get it, but still twelve who don't, and they need to post about it.

Re:Now here's a real laser -

[utexaspunk]

...and twelve more who have to mod those other twelve up...

Re:Now here's a real laser -

[Doppler00]

You call that a real laser?

Try this:
http://www.llnl.gov/nif/

500 Terrawatts.

I don't think they'll be making a hand held version any time soon though.

Re:Now here's a real laser -

[selfsealingstembolt]

500 Terrawatts

Terawatts, not Terra, dammit!

Re:Now here's a real laser -

[slusich]

500 Terawatts? Damn. Sounds like we're building that to go on the new Death Star.

Re:Now here's a real laser -

[crabpeople]

" The trouble with /. is that when you post something funny there are half a million people who get it, but still twelve who don't, and they
need to post about it. "

no no.. thats the reason one ATTENDS slashdot. unless you love hearing 10million monkeys screetching in unison

hmmm.

[the arbiter]

Very Bad Idea. This thing is a damn weapon, not a "laser pointer".

Re:hmmm.

[dark_requiem]

So it could be used as a weapon. So what? Does the constitution not enumerate the right to keep and bear arms? Sure, we've trampled the bill of rights into the ground, but it's still technically there. Besides, a gun is a much more dangerous weapon than this laser.

Re:hmmm.

[phasm42]

It says something about you when the only use you can think of for a laser is as a weapon. Fortunately, not everyone is as narrow-minded.

Re:hmmm.

[user32.ExitWindowsEx]

yeah.

shame.

anyway, if i got four of these, wired them into my car, and put one in front of each tire (pointed at the ground), would they be likely to melt ice (or at least weaken it enough to let me drive over safely)?

Re:hmmm.

[vadim_t]

Would definitely melt some, although I'm quite certain you wouldn't get any real results from it, as it'd melt very little. At most it'd make a hole in the form of a very thin line in the snow.

If you really want that, wouldn't it be easier to just wire resistors or light bulbs and use that instead? That will generate a lot more heat than the laser can.

Re:hmmm.

[lachlan76]

If you really want that, wouldn't it be easier to just wire resistors or light bulbs and use that instead?

Because we just KNOW that electricity and water are meant to go together ;)

Re:hmmm.

[vadim_t]

Well, duh, what do you think an electric kettle is? A container with a resistor inside. Also see lava lamps, which use a light bulb as the heating element.

All you need is to take one of those, and wire them to the car. You need the heck of a laser to get the same power, and if you get one like that it will make holes in the asphalt besides of melting snow. Besides giving little useful result, I'm sure that the relevant authority would be rather unhappy about the holes in the roads.

$699? SCO License or Killer Laser?

[Anonymous Coward]

Choices, choices, choices...

Nice

[j_kenpo]

That's not a bad deal for a 532nM laser. You can't find air cooled Argon putting out anything near that for less than a thousand bucks (ignoring the crappy Ebay American lasers where the tubes are all over preasure). Make a nice beam show if you can find a good set of actuators or a set of scanners for some atmospheric affects if you had a fog machine.

Legality?

[Thunderstruck]

How much more powerful must devices like these become before they are subject to oversight in the United States by the ATF rather than the FDA? Does anyone know where the dividing line is between the two?

(assuming they're sold in a way affecting interstate commerce.)

Re:Legality?

[dark_requiem]

I don't believe congress has yet legislated laser ownership, nor has the ATF decided to unconstitutionally grant itself the right to regulate lasers, but I'm sure it's coming. Whatever they decide, you can be sure of one thing: it will be arbitrary and patently unconstitutional.

Re:Legality?

[Linker3000]

Ah, yes, America - land of the free, where everyone has the right to bear high powered narrow frequency optical emitters.

I can see NRA members country-wide strapping these lasers to their hunting rifles so that if they don't manage to shoot the crap out of something at least it will become road-kill when it wanders blindly into the path of an oncoming 40 ton truck. Yeah for outdoor sports!

Re:Legality?

[terrymr]

Another rocket hobbyist?

Re:Legality?

[crawdaddy]

You, sir, have obviously never owned a portion of the sky before. While you are limited in how high you can build a wall around it, as far as what you do in that portion of the sky is completely up to you. In fact, the sky's the limit!

Re:Legality?

[AragornSonOfArathorn]

hmm... do you know where I can buy some sky? Also, I'm interested in purchasing the Brooklyn Bridge; I heard it was for sale. If you have any info, that would be great.

;-)

Re:Legality?

[Archangel Michael]

You say that, like its a bad thing.

Finally!

[Boyceterous]

The bug-zapper I've been waiting for! Can wait to spay some ladybugs!

Slashdot Effect 200mW

[noidentity]

The Slashdot effect seems to have burned a hole in the server's retina, because none of the images are showing up.

COOL

[rm999]

"You thought those green laser pointers sold by ThinkGeek and others were pretty cool, didn't you? Well, think again. It seems obligatory to point out that even laser pointers, and certainly anything more powerful than those, are capable of causing real damage." Hey, anything that can cause real damage is pretty cool in my book. \didn't rtfa

All fun and games

[shadowsurfr1]

It's all fun and games until someone loses an eye. Then it's just a game. Find the eye.

Check CFR Title 21 and CDRH

[human bean]

http://www.fda.gov/cdrh/index.html for the governmental take on this sort of thing.

Aside from that, It's pretty easy to bang together anywhere from one to thirty watts or so of genuine tm00 when you need to. The laser diode bars out of high-end (real) laser printers do an pretty good job of pumping either gas or solid phase lasers. Microwave oven parts and glass tubing can be recycled into a pretty good nitrogen laser, and you don't even need a vacuum pump...

Re:Check CFR Title 21 and CDRH

[superstick58]

Interesting, but how about aligning those damn mirrors. Also, pumping gas lasers with laser light isn't all that common as far as I know. It would be cool to make a solid state laser though. You think you could put a Nd:YAG together?

Re:Check CFR Title 21 and CDRH

[human bean]

Depends on how you build and pump it. Sometimes you don't need no stinking mirrors, as in the case of certain gas (N2) lasers.

It's cheaper to just buy solid lasers, but they are interesting to build.

Re:Silly non-USAnian...

[Cryptnotic]

Actually, he did say "British football", which is of course different from American football.
Later, he referred to "international soccer".

2 second delay

[Evil Poot Cat]

How the hell am I supposed to defend a flag with a 2 SECOND delay? Even heavies can jink out of that.

$699.00 !! Same price as an..

[the_rajah]

IP license from SCOG. Coincidence?? I don't think so.

"Do the Right Thing. It will gratify some people and astound the rest." - Mark Twain

Poor Guy

[OverlordQ]

This site was hammered last week went it went up on a couple different link sites, now it's getting hammered again by /. Oh well, hopefully he sells a couple.

Re:What's a green security clearance?

[bckrispi]

Cizizen, would you mind explaining to me how you came about this information?

Comment removed

[account_deleted]

Comment removed based on user account deletion

Friggin Lazers

[aceofaces_ts]

Finally I can get sharks with Fricken Lazers on their heads!

Re:Endless road rage/vigilantism uses...

[Marxist Hacker 42]

At >100mw, 540nm, if your window is reasonably clean, there should be no need at all to roll it down.

Mickelson Morely

[superstick58]

Ahhh, Finally I have a green colored laser to use on my interferometer. Maybe this is what I need to prove the existence of the ether. That darn red laser light must behave differently thus I will debunk relativity and measure absolute rest in the ether. With pretty greeeen light.

Re:One question...

[Marxist Hacker 42]

According to the cache of the website on google- their primary REAL use seems to be for amateur astronomers pointing out details in the night sky (at 100mw, this laser is strong enough to oxidize nitrogen, and thus you can see the beam in the air for quite some distance).

Re:Given that the "old" ones weren't used responsi

[HangingChad]

Oh, boy, now you've done it. Football fans over here will be thinking about blinding the wide receiver or the qb. Or batters at the plate. Just enough to distract them.

Pretty freaking sad when athletes and musicians have to start wearing these any time they're in front of a crowd.

Even more fun...

[badfrog]

I just want the laser from 'Real Genius'.

Re:Given that the "old" ones weren't used responsi

[Mantorp]

Someone told me that they were at a Liverpool match once and one of the goalkeepers had about 8 red dots all over his body when he made a save.

So that's the excuse they're going with now at Anfield.

The problem is persistence of vision

[Anonymous Coward]

In a regular CRT, phosphors "hold" the image, continuing to glow between electron beam strikes. Still, there is a certain amount of flicker. With a laser, there is nothing to keep glowing, so the only persistence comes from the viewer's retina and perception, which doesn't seem to be enough to prevent flicker. Have you ever seen a laser display? It's annoying to look at...

Re:The problem is persistence of vision

[badmammajamma]

There's no phosphers in LCD tv's, and they seem to manage just fine. Sure, it's not the same thing but neither is your comparison. :P

Re:The problem is persistence of vision

[gordyf]

He made a perfectly legitimate comparison.

Both lasers and CRTs scan a beam across a screen. In the CRT's case, phosphors continue to glow for a short time after the beam continues on. In a laser display, however, each spot will only glow as long as the laser remains there. This would indicate that a scanning laser display will appear to flicker more than a CRT display, if they are running at the same frequency. The solution would seem to be to use higher scanning rates for the laser display.

LCDs don't scan a beam at all, and have no flicker, so I don't know why you brought them up.

Re:The problem is persistence of vision

[badmammajamma]

My point was that just because there's no phosphers involved, doesn't mean it can't be done.
And thanks for the lesson in how displays work...might have been interesting if I didn't already know it.

Re:The problem is persistence of vision

[gordyf]

Then you still make no sense. Go back and read the original comment, he didn't say it couldn't be done due to lack of phosphors, he said it would flicker annoyingly due to lack of phosphors. You said "Har har, LCDs don't have phosphors", but LCDs don't have to scan a beam like a laser display does.

The original point still stands.

Re:Its all fun and games.....(Nerd Alert)

[midav]

A method for inducing cats to exercise consists of directing a beam of invisible light produced by a hand-held laser apparatus

Just to point out that the green laser beam is visible. So, exercising apparatus employing a green beam laser seems not to be covered by this patent (IANAL, though, hire the real one for the real legal advice.)

Blindness sucks as a weapon?

[cnelzie]

What would you do if you were walking along and suddenly went blind because some heartless bastard pointed one of these into your eyes?

In an instant, your entire life would immediately change and not for the better, I might add.

This would bring new meaning to the term "Blind Rage" to you. Now, imagine this happening while you were driving an automobile or were walking across a dangerous area, like a mine field or nearby a cliff face...

This would be extremely dangerous as a weapon.

Do you know how much you rely upon your eyesight for just about everything that you do? (Bearing in mind that I am presuming that at this moment you have some use of your eyeballs...)

Just imagining what being on the receiving end of such an attack is extremely scary. Out of all of my senses, I value sight the most.

Re:Blindness sucks as a weapon?

[itwerx]

What would you do if you were walking along and suddenly went blind because some heartless bastard pointed one of these into your eyes?...Just imagining what being on the receiving end of such an attack is extremely scary...

OMGWTFBBQ, I hope this is meant to be funny, 'cause if not, you're an idiot! That entire post could have referred to anything from a beach pebble to an assault rifle to a well-aimed overly stale marshmallow.
Or to put it another way - it's a real world out there. [shock]
(Still chuckling... :)

Re:Blindness sucks as a weapon?

[Catbeller]

Hm. Not many cases of people trying to intentionally blind people with marshmallows. Or rocks. Or pebbles.

Lots of cases of people being blinded by lasers fired by people who want to cause such trouble.

The Army tried a weapon system called the KLAW back in the 80's and 90's. It was a laser system mounted on a pole. It fired continuously at eye level with the intention of blinding anyone who looked at it.

To my knowledge, they did not test a marshmallow gun for this purpose.

Not that funny. Different weapons, different purposes. A weapon that does nothing but cause blindness is a terror weapon.

Re:Blindness sucks as a weapon?

[ErikZ]

What if you were just walking along and some heartless bastard shot you in the head with a normal gun?

Do you know how much you rely on your brains for just about everything you do?

Re:Blindness sucks as a weapon?

[cnelzie]

Having my brains blown out would be much better then being blinded, at least until medical science can completely replace damaged/non-functional eyeballs. At that point, I would rather be blinded everyday of the week then ever have my brains blown out.

If I had my choice between permanent blindness and instant death. (Permanent supposing that medical science will never come up with a replacement eye.) I would choose instant death.

I am sure if you were into photography and other visual arts, like I am, you would also equally value your sight over your own life. If you were into musical and sound art, you may value your hearing and then your sight, in order of importance. If you were into gourmet cooking, you might value your sense of taste and then your sight, in order of importance.

Re:Blindness sucks as a weapon?

[ErikZ]

My point is, if you can trust people with a leathal weapon, you can trust them with a laser.

Legality?

[AragornSonOfArathorn]

from the site:

"This laser is not legal to use in public"

then they say:

"it makes for a great way to point out objects in the night sky"

Isn't that sort of thing usually done in PUBLIC? heh

Of course they're dangerous

[lnlypaladin]

There have always been warnings about lasers being dangerous. Any laser beam emitted from a device, no matter how weak, is potentially damaging to stare into. That includes the bar code scanners at the store. Don't believe me? next time you pass an unoccupied register at sears, pick up one of those scanners and take a good look at the yellow labels around the window the beam comes out of.

You're right, the green lasers, being more powerful and of a higher frequency, will probably cause damage to the retina faster than the red lasers. However, there's a big difference between a 2 AAA battery powerd 5mW laser pointer and a 2 C cell battery powered 100+mW laser with safety construction, emission delay, and a necessary cooling fan. How much power is put into a laser directly affects how hazardous it is when you're talking about two lasers of the same type and frequency. The frequency just decides the color and how fast you can read data with it (as well as a list of other things relating to more advanced physics explanations than I care to go into). The 5mW laser pointer is slightly excessive and on the bright side, but it's not really dangerous unless you're pointing it at a reflective surface and/or looking into the beam, just like a red laser. The 100+mW laser, on the other hand is physically dangerous to anything within say, 100 meters (I approximate roughly on the side of caution, I hope it'll only itch a little at that distance) and within 10 meters is fully capable of burning holes in cups, screens, fingers, etc.

All lasers are dangerous, it's just a matter of understanding the danger and taking safety precautions.

I do, however, share your worries to a point as I can just see some idiot attempting to modify a pointer so that he can get a higher power output and hook it up to a car battery to get a quick and extremely dangerous burn of the smaller laser before something inside the device melts. Maybe we're lucky and It'll just melt before it gets to the beam emitter.

Re:One question...

[Momoru]

Now you can perform that costly laser eye surgery your mom wanted for Christmas from the comfort of your living room!

Plastic cup?

[sharkey]

That's all well and good, but can it be employed as an airborne popcorn popper?

really?

[Blob Pet]

It seems obligatory to point out that even laser pointers, and certainly anything more powerful than those, are capable of causing real damage.

Isn't that the point? Get it...point? Laser pointer...point....eh just mod me down and forget it.

Soon? must be a misprint in my catalog here

[human bean]

This has been in use at auditoriums and high-end video projector for some time. Most of them use dye-based lasers, LCD or Kerr shutters, and some sort of moving mirror arrangement for the scanning. Difficult to get set up, and often lose sync if you thump them while thay are working.

Re:What took them so long?

[Second_Derivative]

Note that the entire line of the laser is somewhat visible with these things. That would make it kinda obvious where the operator is located.

You would think...

[aeroelastic]

You would think that for $699, they would just drop the $4 shipping charge.

Certainly a better way...

[SharpFang]

...to spend your $699 than purchasing a Linux license from SCO.

Re:Yeah

[MindStalker]

Yes, but very low powered lasers might do the trick. Yes it will still be bright but theortically no brighter than current projection technologies. Basically your switching from trying to use omnidirectional light to project and image, meaning some of the light will scatter and the image will be slightly blurry, color will run (etc) no matter what you do. To laser projected pixels. Yummy.

Similar Article Text

[Anonymous Coward]

http://www.cnn.com/2004/US/12/09/terrorist.laser.a p/

U.S. warns of terrorist lasers
Pilot group: Increase in laser incidents
Friday, December 10, 2004 Posted: 6:28 PM EST (2328 GMT)

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Terrorists may seek to down aircraft by shining powerful lasers into cockpits to blind pilots during landing approaches, U.S. officials warned in a bulletin distributed nationwide.

The memo, sent by the FBI and the Homeland Security Department, says there is evidence that terrorists have explored using lasers as weapons.

There is no specific intelligence indicating al Qaeda or other groups might use lasers in the United States, they added.

"Although lasers are not proven methods of attack like improvised explosive devices and hijackings, terrorist groups overseas have expressed interest in using these devices against human sight," the memo said.

"In certain circumstances, if laser weapons adversely affect the eyesight of both pilot and co-pilot during a non-instrument approach, there is a risk of airliner crash," the agencies said.

In September a pilot for Delta Air Lines reported an eye injury from a laser beam shone into the cockpit during a landing approach in Salt Lake City, Utah. The incident occurred about 5 miles (9 kilometers) from the airport. The plane landed safely.

FBI and other federal officials are investigating. It is not clear if a crime was committed or if the laser was directed into the cockpit by accident.

Steve Luckey, a retired airline pilot who is chairman of the Air Line Pilots Association's national security committee, said pilots are concerned about a recent increase in laser incidents, but do not know what to make of them. He said he has learned of two or three cases in the past 90 days.

"The most recent incidents appear to be aimed at pilots in the vicinity of airports," Luckey said. "A few seem to be intentional, and we're wondering why and what's going on."

Lasers can cause temporary blindness and severely damage the eye by burning the retina. The bulletin notes they are "relatively inexpensive, portable, easy to conceal and readily available on the open market."

Lasers are commonly used in a number of industries and are featured in outdoor light shows. A variety of more powerful military-grade lasers are produced around the world, but there is no evidence that terrorist groups have managed to obtain one, according to federal officials.

The bulletin was sent late last month to law enforcement officials and key government agencies and industries. A copy was obtained Thursday by The Associated Press.

and this one:

www.harktheherald.com/modules.php?op=modload& name=News&file=article&sid=36048

Delta pilot's eye injured after laser beam shines in cockpit
Thursday, September 30, 2004 - 12:00 AM
Mark Thiessen THE ASSOCIATED PRESS

SALT LAKE CITY -- Federal officials are investigating a Delta Air Lines pilot's claim that he received an eye injury from a laser beam that was shone in the plane's cockpit while on approach for landing.

There were no other reported injuries in the late-evening incident on Sept. 22, and the plane from Dallas landed safely.

The pilot, a first officer who has not been named, reported the injury to local officials after the beam was directed at the cockpit of the Boeing 737 about five miles outside Salt Lake City, said local Transportation Security Administration Director Earl Morris.

Neither FBI Special Agent Bob Wright nor TSA spokesman Nico Melendez would confirm published reports that a doctor who examined the pilot confirmed he had suffered a burned retina from exposure to a laser device.

But Morris said it was his understanding the pilot is on restrictive leave until his eye heals, and TSA has been working with him in the investigation. The other pilot was not injured.

Part of the investigation will involve determining whether the laser light was beamed acci

This means WAR! (We Are Right)

[MikeyVB]

This is going to bring "Laser Tag" to a totally new level. No more having to wear those stupid vests! Of course, you can always wear a green shirt, but that would just take away all the fun. (FYI - A green shirt is green because it reflects green light, which is the colour of the laser)

Re:What's a green security clearance?

[forand]

That was one amazingly stupid and amazingly fun game, I wish I was 15 again.

Re:Given that the "old" ones weren't used responsi

[lxt]

True, but it was sure as hell better as what us Brits usually do a soccer matches - chuck bricks :)

Burn in?

[ANeufeld]

Just pray your rotating mirrors/motors don't stop all of a suddened, or you'll encounter a new meaning for "burn in".

laser classes

[SuperBanana]

But like the parent said, pump it up 20X in power and you are starting to be able to cause some real damage immediately.

The classifications are based upon wattage levels which will cause damage to the eye before your brain reacts AND the eyelid closes.

Anything over a certain class (II or III, I forget which) falls into the 'damage will happen before you blink" category. That's why they usually require a keylock on a shutter or output control, a lasing indicator light, etc. OSHA regs then mesh in with this- lasers in operation over a certain level mean guards on equipment, goggles for anyone in the room, blah blah.

Over a certain level in mW also requires approval from the FAA to use outdoors [at night] as it could blind pilots. Sounds silly for a single point source, but it's intended for laser light shows where hundreds or thousands of beams- which often sweep/scan out into the sky- stand an excellent chance of blinding a pilot.

Pretty much all the FAA does is say "sure" and then put out a NOTAM (NOtice to AirMen) saying "there be lasers here". NOTAMs are automatically pulled up if your flight plan crosses through the area the NOTAM applies to.

Re:laser classes

[srleffler]

Lasers of class III and above can damage your eye before you can blink. Class II lasers can damage your eye if you force yourself to stare into the beam. Class I lasers won't damage your eye.

Re:What took them so long?

[Catbeller]

True. But ballistic-weapon snipers have that sort of problem too. They'll figure out something.

Anyhoo, snipers aside, just using it (or the next-gen version) as a short-range pistol is pretty nasty. No chemical residue on the gunman after firing. No ballistics tests possible -- no bullets. Pretty useful for all sorts of bad.

What's this on ThinkGeek?

[stratjakt]

# Can be used for skypointing, projection on low clouds, signalling, detecting explosives

How does a green laser detect explosives, does anyone know?

Re:What's this on ThinkGeek?

[MrP-(at work)]

Shine your laser at random objects, if something explodes it must be an explosive. =P

Re:What's this on ThinkGeek?

[psyconaut]

Photoluminescence spectroscopy.

-psy

Re:What's this on ThinkGeek?

[smellystudent]

Point the laser at the object suspected to be an explosive. If you wake up in hospital, it used to be an explosive.

How come all the cool toys...

[GeneralEmergency]

...come with the admonition, "Hey there young fella, be careful where you point that thing or you'll put someone's eye out!"

First it was rocks, then spears, bows and arrows, BB guns and now lasers.

Why green?

[RyatNrrd]

All the cool bad guys had red laser guns. Only inept daleks and wimpy good guys had green ones.

I suppose it's to try and prevent us from using them for evil.

Lawn Mower

[Corrado]

Ok, I know I'm not the only one who has thought of this, but why not build a lawn mower out of this laser? It would be silent, energy efficient, compact, lightweight, non-polluting, and cheap to build and maintain. Just mount a spinning mirror to the bottom of a regular power mower and shine the laser down on it. You could even diffuse the beam so that it becomes "non-lethal" after 1 meter or so. It wouldn't even have to have an grass discharge outlet (clippings (c|w)ould burn up completely?) that usually let's all kinds of objects fly out at you.

This would be a much safer lawn mower than the one you have in your garage right now. Think about it; how many times have you run across rovers dog bone remains and had them shoot out at high speed? What about accidentally sticking your foot/hand in the path of the blade? At least with the laser it will make a clean cut. :)

Hell, I'd pay $1000 for a power mower with those qualities! I recently paid $300 for a crappy mower and good ones are going for $500. Then there's the upkeep (spark plugs, oil changes, fuel consumption, etc.) that rack up at least $100/year. In 5 year's time, this mower would pay for itself.

Hmmmm...I gotta go now... /me runs to USPO!

Re:Lawn Mower

[JonyEpsilon]

Isn't grass green because it reflects green light ?!

Re:Lawn Mower

[Jonathan_S]

Hah, I knew I'd seen a laser lawn mower before. As always google is your friend. picture here

Re:Lawn Mower

[Corrado]

Wow! That's a little more, umm, involved than I was thinking. That thing costs $30k - $50k US! Yea, a $1000 mower is looking better all the time.

Re:Lawn Mower

[danila]

Check out RoboMower from Friendly Robotics. It doesn't have lasers, but your hands and legs are safe, because you don't need to be near it while it works.

Re:Lawn Mower

[_Logic_]

hmmm... Grass fire?

OMFG! Ban frozen poultry too!

[CreatureComfort]

Good thing that before this eeeevil laser was invented, the world was safe from stupid kids

Laser TV already here...[caveat]

[Venner]

...just not mass produced or affordable.

I'm really hoping there is a push to market for these things. Sony has exclusive rights to the technology, developed by Silicon Light Machines. I've read anecdotal accounts from people who've seen the technology demoed that the images were amazingly crisp and vivid.

This link for a little blurb & small picture

This link for an abstract & link to a semi-technical pdf

Kodak just introduced a similar, competing system, as you can read here. Maybe that will drive the pricepoint down...if the demand exists.

I know I want one.

Video mirror

[ministry92]

Here is a video mirror of the burning cup.mpg

It is neat, but is it THAT much more exciting?

Re:What's a green security clearance?

[brandonY]

I'm sorry, bckrispi, the information on how he got that information is not available at your security level.

Mirror of video

[artemis67]

Here's a mirror of the video demonstration of the laser:

http://www.mothership.ws/stuff/BurningCup.mpg

Illegal in public ? not with a CDRH variance

[Anonymous Coward]

All you need to do is apply for a variance from the CDRH http://www.jklasers.com/Variance/CDRH_Variance_Inf o.htm

I used to work for a company in Cleveland that did laser light shows and built laser light show equipment. we had to get a variance for the shows but it really wasn't that big a deal.

Did anyone here attend the opening of the Skydome in Toronto ? It was our equipment in the CN tower that "coned the dome" and it was not a mere 100mw Laser it was a 20Watt Argon Ion Laser.. you want to see a laser do damage at close range that thing would ignite a 2x4 instantly upon the beam touching the wood. not to mention it hurt like hell when you got your hand in front of the beam while making adjustments..

the 600 Pound Power supply roughly 3'x3' and 200 Pound Laser head approx 8 feet long from Coherent coupled with the large water requirements for cooling the whole apparatus significantly reduced the mobility of the device for use as any sort of weapon though...

It was still a lot of fun to work with.. especially when you mixed the 20Watt Argon Ion beam (green and blue spectrum) with the 7 Watt Krypton Beam ( RED ) to get the full spectrum or pretty close to it anyway.. big fun back in 86-90 for me.

Hrm what did Dr. G refer to the laser as.. A Massless vector boson generator if I recall.

Re:PLEASE! (200mW required for shark lasers)

[gliph]

Sorry, but in order to use with sharks, i think at least 200mW is required. Here's one... hmm, can i just mount this directly on the shark? or are other parts required? these are only $50... add in a $10 admission to the zoo... this is a 1/10th the price!! :)

Re:holy crap...

[Anonymous Coward]

Alert! Alert! Illegal christmas Activity suspected!

There's a reason they call it "DoHS" - Homer S.

[jabber01]

A laser like this could indeed be a great threat to our strategic Dixie cup reserves.

Re:What's a green security clearance?

[swartze]

Of course, The Computer told me to tell him.

Super-U-SER

seen this before

[Internet_Communist]

being a regular viewer of candle power forums and such I've actually seen this before a while ago, as well as the laser's original manufacturer, which is here:
http://www.cnilaser.com/_private/ep_pgl3.htm

you can find a review of it here:
http://ledmuseum.candlepower.us/second/pgliii.htm

remember while this laser is a lot more powerful than a regular laser pointer it's a far cry from what a laser that's truly powerful can do. 190mW compared to a 20W Co2 laser (which is on the low side for CO2 Laser power) and the difference is quite substantial. Sure you could blind someone, but you certainly aren't going to be using it like some kind of stun gun or what not. I don't even think a Co2 laser would work that well for that.

"Hey mister, stand still! I'm trying to burn you here!"

if you wanted to do some real damage with something you could actually carry around, check this site out:

http://www.amazing1.com/burning-lasers.htm

Could you get the same result with 20 pointers?

[DieByWire]

Just curious...

A previous post did the math and said that these were about 20 times more powerful than your basic pointer laser.

Question - could you focus 20 of those generic laser pointers at the same spot on a plastic cup and melt it, or would the fact that the waves would not all be in sync diminish the effective power?

OT Question about the link.

[FreeLinux]

The link in the article seems to be a DNS nightmare. I'm not talking about the port(thanks anyway AC), I'm referring to the use of a pseudo IP address in the DNS name which then resolves to a series of equally strange aliases. Observe:

[nobody@sys1 ~]$ host 64.252.62.40.nyud.net
nyud.net DNAME http.l2.l1.l0.nyucd.net.
64.252.62.40.nyud.net is an alias for 64.252.62.40.http.l2.l1.l0.nyucd.net.
64.252.62.4 0.http.l2.l1.l0.nyucd.net is an alias for http.l2.l1.l0.nyucd.net.
http.l2.l1.l0.nyucd.net has address 128.143.137.250
http.l2.l1.l0.nyucd.net has address 128.59.67.201
http.l2.l1.l0.nyucd.net has address 128.59.67.202

Can anyone explain to me the reason/advantage of such a complex and convoluted hostnaming scheme? What admin would willingly do this to himself?

Re:OT Question about the link.

[IceCat12]

The strange "DNS nightmare" is actually utilizing the Coral caching system. Featured here . The Coral system is a large scale distributed research network of 400 servers and you can find out more information about it here. This is actually an attempt at preventing the "SlashDot effect" on the poor webmaster who runs this site.

Green laser weapon is a stupid idea

[khrtt]

They can see the beam in the air, in addition to seeng the spot it hits. Invisible IR would be a much better option, IMHO, and high power IR laser diodes are VERY available (unlike green), so you could just make a weapon out of one those, without going to the expense of a 100mW DPSSFD. Just get a bigger communications diode laser.

If you want to see where you're shooting, just use a low power red dot laser sight, like on a normal gun.

If you want to make it more practical, use 50 lasers for a 5W CW unit, and converge the beams automatically using one of the laser beams as a rangefinder.

The whole gizmo wouldn't be all that expensive and large. It would be able to set flammable things on fire remotely with more stealth than a tracer bullet, and at longer distance than an arrow with an oil-soaked rug on the end.

Still, pretty stupid use of technology if you ask me.

Re:Green laser weapon is a stupid idea

[jacksonj04]

The trouble then is collimating it - getting all the useful power emitted by the diode into a single beam could be fun since there's only so much light going in the same direction.

a link to the video...

[Satcho]

here's a link to the site with pictures, and a link to the video

Re:What's a green security clearance?

[earthforce_1]

So what does ultra violet clothing look like anyway?

Here is the diode if you want to build your own

[Anonymous Coward]

Go to this webpage you can order the diode for $20 if you feel like making your own.
http://www.amazing1.com/laser3.htm

Re:Given that the "old" ones weren't used responsi

[badmammajamma]

Yeah...well, they could just shoot the goalkeepers with sniper rifles too. That technology is readily available.

Re:What took them so long?

[Catbeller]

"Troll"? This comment was meant to list a few thoughts on the implications of a laser weapon. It's meant to make people think and comment. We're going to see such weapons really soon, in the hands of the military and the police -- who are becoming interchangeable.

Don't like the homeland security comments? That's not what moderation is about.

Why regular laser pointers are dangerous

[Stonent1]

The lense in your eye focuses and sharpens things as much as 100,000x. Remeber how a 20x magnifying glass can burn a hole in a piece of paper? So if a 5mW laser goes to your eye it can really do some damage. Compare it to trying to balance a 1 kilogram book on your head vs a 1 kilogram pole with a sharpened point.

Laser as a Weapon.

[JollyFinn]

There is some geneva convention or something similar international agreament that blinding lasers are banned as military weapons. So the end result for laser warfare is that they make a STRONG laser intended to burn through tank, and the reflections from the tank that hit eye will have blinding result, but thats not the lasers MAIN purpose, an equipment destruction lasers are allowed in the agreament. BTW: If someone uses missile defense lasers near your city, then you should have strong curtains just to make sure that any weak reflections wouldn't pass inside your house. And blind someone.

Re:Laser as a Weapon.

[Nikkos]

If you're looking at a tank and it's targeting lasers sweep you, you will be blinded.

Re:Laser as a Weapon.

[myowntrueself]

"BTW: If someone uses missile defense lasers near your city, then you should have strong curtains just to make sure that any weak reflections wouldn't pass inside your house. And blind someone."

Surely ducking and covering works for lasers too?

Re:Laser as a Weapon.

[Shadowlore]

There is some geneva convention or something similar international agreament that blinding lasers are banned as military weapons. So the end result for laser warfare is that they make a STRONG laser intended to burn through tank, and the reflections from the tank that hit eye will have blinding result, but thats not the lasers MAIN purpose, an equipment destruction lasers are allowed in the agreament.

Wouldn't suprise me. On the 50 cal range in training this actually transpired:

"The Geneva convention disallows the use of the M2 as a weapon against personnel, only equipment. [pause] Your first target is that group of troops at 75 meters. Commence firing.

/me opens fire sending slags of metal into said targets.

instructor: Private, why did you open fire on those troops after being told it was illegal to do so?

me: Drill Sgt. I did not fire upon those troops. I opened fire on their LBE, weapons, and the tracked vehicle behind them! Those are all equipment and therefore legal targets.

instructor: Carry on, Private!

/me opens up again. *budda**budda**budda**budda*

You know, used right a ma deuce can be used to put out small range fires.

On the laser issue though, lasers used for rangefinding or guided munitions are perfectly legal. Hey if it happens to get blocked by someone's eye, oh well. Not like the incoming munitions wouldn't be finishing him off any moment anyway.

Re:Laser as a Weapon.

[shadowbearer]

The Geneva convention disallows the use of the M2 as a weapon against personnel, only equipment.

Not according to this guy

Not like the incoming munitions wouldn't be finishing him off any moment anyway.

Yup, if you're in the beam cone it's prolly time to grab yer ankles :D

SB

Re:Laser as a Weapon.

[Legion303]

If a tank is targeting you, you may not have to worry about your eyesight for very long.

playing with cats 10 years ago in the army...

[notany]

When I served in Finnish army and our tank participated in parade we played with our tank laser range finder. We selected really beautiful feamale butt from audience made that cat jump really high.

They find out. We got fined and diciplined. There was story in news and all.

Some of the worst pain I felt.

[FauxReal]

I was at a Chemical Brothers concert and as I walked in a red ceiling mounted laser just happened to hit me right in the eye. It was an instant searing headache so painful I couldn't think while it hit me, all I could see out of that eye was a redish-white haze. Luckily it was moving around so it lasted just under a second, but it was very disorienting.

Re:What's a green security clearance?

[mrjb]

[...] meaning The Computer doesn't trust you at all; INFRARED citizens wear black. [...] High Programmers wear white. Drifting offtopic, but the Wachowski brothers once again got it right.

keyring laser pointers safe?

[seven of five]

One of my in laws made a big stink when he found out we gave his 12 year old son a little laser pointer. If these things are really harmful, how can they sell them on the impulse rack next to the breath mints, gum, and playing cards?

treated glass for airplane cockpits???

[seven of five]

There's beens some comments in the news recently about jet pilots being dazzled by bright light (apparently laser light) just as they were about to land. Would there be a treatment for cockpit glass that would prevent the pilots from being blinded, but still letting normal light in?

Re:treated glass for airplane cockpits???

[cbelt3]

You can expect airline pilots to start asking for them, especially after this Cleveland incident:

uh oh

[catdevnull]

Don't my mom read this...I'll *never* hear the end of "you'll shoot your eye out!"

As seen on the weird little TV in my head:

The 2086 remake of "A Christmas Story" on TNT

Santa: What do you want for Christmas, little boy?
Ralphie: A Red-Writer Highly Collimated Power Laser Rifle With a Compass in the Stock!!

Santa: You'll shoot your eye out, kid...(pushing Ralphie down the anti-gravity shoot with his moon boot). Ho..Ho...Ho...

In other related news:

[Vvornth]

Kitchen knives may cause violent gashes. Beer can rings tied to slashed thumb injuries. Car doors likely to cripple hands and fingers. Forks discovered to be deadly weapon when stabbed into eye. Bear defecate in forest area. Lame slashdotter aiming for 5: Funny gets -1: Troll

Re:OMFG! Ban frozen poultry too!

[shade2600]

You have to have a license or a permit to drive a car but they will let any idiot have a kid.

Party on.

You know, I have one simple request...

[PhotoBoy]

...and that is to have sharks with frickin' laser beams attached to their heads!

Look at the counter at the bottom...

[mOoZik]

5 hits per second and more! Holy crap, the Slashdot effect at work!

Re:Endless road rage/vigilantism uses...

[The Master Control P]

"We are offering this laser for sale to responsible adults only."

right or wrong

[fozzmeister]

these are banned in the uk

When useless dangerous prank toys are outlawed...

[fm6]

...only outlaws will have useless dangerous prank toys!

Not a too good idea

[joda]

I wouldn't like the soldering iron i use to burn out my eyesockets by pointing it onto a roundish surface.

article is a straight rip off from metafilter

[kayen_telva]

Think those new green laser pointers are pretty spiffy?
Think again. posted by squidlarkin at 11:14 AM PST - 66 comments

metafilter

If you want to make a laser

[Landak]

For legit purposes, of course, I recommend you read "Build your own Phaser, Laser, Ion-Ray gun and other working space-age projects" by Robert Ianni. Link here.

I know it may appear insane at first- it was written in the 80's- and phaser refers to an ultrasonic device, but some of the things in there are really, really, bonkers. A 1gW ruby laser sound good? CO2 welding lasers?

Enjoy.

And please don't sue me. Please. I don't condone making a 1 gigawatt laser and obliterating things, I haven't made any of them- but I did make my local library reserve me a copy. It's a good read.

Re:What's a green security clearance?

[greenreaper]

You know, this was my first thought when I saw the post title. That's kinda sad, but cool at the same time. :-)

Re:Austin Powers Moment on a college kid's budget.

[flycrg]

as an RA, I resent that, I'd contribute another $500 and up the stake to $1.6 million

Two words ...

[ScrewMaster]

Specular reflection

Re:Two words ...

[SlimFastForYou]

Given a controlled environment, this factor could probably be taken into account. The moulten solder would reflect the beam like a mirror, but I think an appropriate backdrop could take care of the stray beam.

Couldn't make for a practical soldering iron replacement, at least not for amateure soldering. Seems like it could be useful for industrial manufacturing though (if it isn't already being practiced).

Re:!!!WARNING!!!!

[Landak]

Lol. Its only 1GW in the tube, for about a nanosecond, but...yeah. You are probably not inaccurate!

DPSS

[sploxx]

Lasershoppe.com Laser: >100mW (one tested was 191!)
Thinkgeek.com Laser: 5mW

Yes... there is a 20x difference in power here (about 38x with the tested one). While lasers in general can be harmful, the one this guy is selling should really be considered a weapon.

Except that the green Thinkgeek.com one is very probably a DPSS laser (diode pumped solid state laser), where the energy goes like this:

Battery -> POWERFUL IR Diode -> Nd:YAG crystal -> rather inefficient frequency doubling crystal -> IR filter -> Lens -> Air

And it's the IR diode, in the 10-100mW range, that's the problem. If one removes the IR filter, all the IR light goes out of the laser pointer and it would be possible to burn things with that.

I have seen auctions on ebay where someone explicetely stated that it is possible to remove this filter and showed that is possible to burn plastic foils with the modified pointer (including pictures(!))

As there are already too many assholes with red laser pointers running around in public (trying to point into your eyes) and green ones constantly drop in price, I'd rather like it if manufacturers of such pointers would be obliged to glue the diode onto the YAG crystal onto the filter. In a way that it would be impossible to remove the filter without destroying the laser.

This would probably also prevent too harsh laws for powerful lasers used for research and other legitimate purposes.
The first 'accidents' which happen with modified green pointers will give the word to those activist politicians who state 'Oh my god, let's do something about it! Think of the children! BAN ALL LASERS!!'

Re:Ban frozen poultry too! (totally offtopic now)

[CreatureComfort]

Amen to that. I firmly support mandatory, reversible sterilization for everyone at the onset of puberty. Then when, and if, a couple wants to have children and can prove the resources, and go through the training to have children, the sterility would be reveresed.

Because grass is green.

[Ungrounded Lightning]

Ok, I know I'm not the only one who has thought of this, but why not build a lawn mower out of this laser? It would be silent, energy efficient, compact, lightweight, non-polluting, and cheap to build and maintain.

Unfortunately, grass is green, and so is the laser. So most of the laser's energy will be reflected rather than deposited on the grass, and the grass won't be cut.

As Niven pointed out in his Ringworld series, an enemy with a shirt the color of your laser sword might as well be wearing mirror armor.

It might be good for cutting out the DEAD grass and leaving the live blades. B-)

Re:Because grass is green.

[utexaspunk]

so, what color shirt should someone wear to block an ultraviolet or infrared laser?

Re:Because grass is green.

[Neoncow]

Tin foil?

=P

Re:Because grass is green.

[Corrado]

Yea, I know, but the _idea_ is sound (I think). It would probably have to be another color, but that can be arranged.

Re:Because grass is green.

[danila]

To humans it would look deep violet or dark red.

Re:Because grass is green.

[srleffler]

One with dye that reflects UV or IR, of course. What color that dye would appear to the human eye is completely arbitrary.

Re:Because grass is green.

[mdielmann]

Only if that is the only colour it reflected. A shirt that reflected pretty much any (visible) colour you threw at it would look...white.

Re:Because grass is green.

[mdielmann]

It's actually a good idea, with two missed points.

1. How long does it take to cut the amount of grass found under a typical lawnmower? Or, more precisely, how fast can I push this and still have it cut the lawn? This will be the guide to the wattage of laser you need.

2. You raised this point, but missed the patently obvious (and hopefully not patent-able) solution. How do I keep the laser from harming anything else, including my legs? House it in a lawnmower, and have the beam hit the housing at the perimeter, where the grass usually hits in a normal laser. Of course, there's the discharge hole, but that can be patched. This has the great side-effect of giving you an easy way to adjust the beam's height, as well.

Another point which you've touched upon is the colour of laser to use. That answer is easy, whatever wavelength grass (and hopefully other plant matter) absorbs. It wouldn't be too hard for someone with the right tools to find out that answer for both living and dead plant matter.

Now, if you could find a wavelength that is safe for grass, and not safe for just about every other plant, you could make a great adjustment to your mower and kill weeds, too. Just adjust it to hit the ground instead of the mower rim.

Re:Because grass is green.

[shadowbearer]

A couple points:

A discharge hole would be unnecessary if the laser ashes the grass after cutting it.

I think a circular configuration would be inefficient. A better one would probably be a laser that sweeps back and forth along an arc centered forward. I'm not an engineer, but I'd think it'd be easier to control your cutting height that way, especially on lumpy ground.

A laser lawnmower - one the public could afford - is a helluva idea tho. Think of the peaceful Sunday mornings :)

This sucker would have to have a pretty good sized battery tho...

SB

Re:Because grass is green.

[mdielmann]

Another poster pointed out an idea a step more advanced than yours: Don't sweep at all, don't use a mirror, just have it point straight across. Add an (adjustable) absorption plate for your desired cutting width, and you're set. As for power, I'd have no problem using an extension cord for a mower like this. It's just another kind of electric mower, just quieter.

Re:Because grass is green.

[shadowbearer]

Hmm. I still think a forward sweeping beam would be more efficient - remember, you want to catch what isn't caught on the first sweep and vaporize it again before it has time to fall (maybe it's a particularly tough little bugger to vaporize and takes some hits to reduce it ash). A perpendicular-to-travel beam wouldn't do so, as it only has one chance. Several perp-t-t beams wouldn't work either, unless you want to change your cutting height. Visualize it with grass under the plenum, and what the beams would have to cover while the mower moves forward at an unpredictable speed - and we might as well try to compensate for ground height variations if we're trying to design something like this - massproduced, the hardware would be cheap, it's the software that'll be a lot of fun :)

Several such sweeping beams might even work better. I'd have to think about the geometry a bit. One wants to cover everything within the mower plenum from as many angles as possible, yet not have overlap. Argh :)

Agreed about the extension cord... but one might as well think ahead, eh? lol@the cordless fad - dangitall, we REALLY need a breakthrough in amp-hour storage...

Cheers!!

SB

Re:Because grass is green.

[Corrado]

Hmm. I still think a forward sweeping beam would be more efficient - remember, you want to catch what isn't caught on the first sweep and vaporize it again before it has time to fall (maybe it's a particularly tough little bugger to vaporize and takes some hits to reduce it ash).

This only works if the mower is moving forward. There are several places on my lawn that I move back and forth over (under the swing set, near the fence, etc). Although I agree with you that a sweeping beam would be better than a static one.

Several such sweeping beams might even work better. I'd have to think about the geometry a bit. One wants to cover everything within the mower plenum from as many angles as possible, yet not have overlap. Argh :)


Again, I think a rotating beam would do this quite efficiently. Also, I was thinking of making a square deck so that you could get into those tight spots (corners) that you need a weed eater for today. Just another advantage. :)

A few differences.

[cnelzie]

First, a laser beam is easier to aim then a rock or 'overly stale marshmellow'.

Secondly, I have seen semi-retarded bastards very willing to zap people in the face and eyes with lower powered laser pointers then they would be to throw a pebble or something else into someone's face. It was done to me once and the moron was fired the same day.

Lastly, the laser described in the main article could permanently blind you far quicker then a cheap tiny little laser pointer. It could cause blindness in a very short amount of time.

When you put a laser pointer or similar device into a moron's hands they don't conceive of the possibility that 'harmless light' could possibly hurt anyone. Regardless of whether or not they know that throwing a rock or something at someone could bring them harm.

You are putting to much faith in the brainpower of the vast majority of idiots out in this world.

Not so Obscure RPG Reference

[xero314]

What? There is something past Red Clearance? Sorry fellow Citizen, you should report to for immediate exterm... Err... corrective training immediately.

You appear to have missed your daily meeting with the Happiness Officer. Sorry fellow Citizen, you should report to for immediate exterm... Err... corrective training immediately.

In Service to the Computer,
Howard-R-EWE (my friends call me "how")

Persistence of vision and mechanical scans

[VernonNemitz]

First, while the parent to this message is the one out of many is the one to which I am replying, I have read through all the replies and I do thank you all for them.

I would like to address the two major objections here. First, regarding the persistence of vision, I do agree that that could be a problem. However, there is a reasonably simple solution. Just cover the projection-screen with 3 colors of phosphors like inside a CRT, and then replace the 3 lasers with one UV laser.

Second, regarding rotating mirrors, I do think this is not so tough as has been claimed. Let's look at a bit of math: If in a high-quality CRT there are 1000 scan lines at 70 frames per second, then that is 70,000 scanned lines per second or 1/70,000 second per scanned line. If we took a somewhat cylindrical mirror, but it actually has 7 sides (heptagonal instead of circular cross section), and we arrange the optics so that while one rotating facet is reflecting the laser(s), one line is being scanned, then the cylinder needs to rotate at 10,000 revolutions per second to duplicate the CRT. Yes, that IS extreme. But there are ways to rearrange things. What about 700 facets to the cylinder and a rotation of 100 revolutions per second (6,000RPM)? what about using RAM as an intermediary between the video input and the output system, to hold one whole frame, such that can then scan the RAM to multiple lasers to divide the work even more?

The other rotating mirror, that causes the scanned lines to be incremented vertically acros the screen, is much less of a problem (may need some special angling so its rotation doesn't throw off each horizontal scan).

I think you naysayers take too little time to consider variations on a theme. But still, Thanks Again!

Re:Persistence of vision and mechanical scans

[srleffler]

UV lasers are even harder to make than blue ones.

The Lasershoppe Guy

[WormholeFiend]

I think he's buying his laser from CNI Lasers

Specifically, one of the models on this page

Also note the special remark that CNI is "Developing Laser Module for Underwater".

You know it. Sharks. With freakin lasers. For real.

Re:The Lasershoppe Guy

[Ed_1024]

I was shopping for some high-power LED's for a home lighting project, when I came across these. 15KW should be just enough to stop next-door's cat peeing on my vegetable patch...

Re:How common are bad guys' laser sights?

[NormalVisual]

I wouldn't expect that it's very common, and I can't recall ever hearing of it happening - a laser sight for a pistol usually runs around $250-300 from the manufacturer, and is usually put on a $500-$1500 pistol. The average crook simply won't put that kind of money into a weapon, hence the popularity of Saturday Night Specials and such among the low-lifes.

Re:How common are bad guys' laser sights?

[thief_inc]

That entirely wrong you buy red laser sights that fit on your trigger for $50. I am sure just about anyone can come up with that. The one I saw were at a military surplus store.

Re:way different excuses for cops to get violent

[thief_inc]

I am in no way denying these things do not happen. I just don't think you are giving the cops or the military a fair shot. Most of of our serviceman and cops(like 99.999%) are great people, ethical people only trying to do what is right.

By your same logic all computer geeks are bad too because the ones we read about are all h/crackers, Spammer, and ID thieves.

scary: And other laser experiances.

[John Sokol]

I have alway predicted we would soon have banks robbed through bullet proof glass by someone using a small laser.

About 10 years ago a friend of mine managed to get a surplus 1 watt IR laser diode and operate if from a couple of 9v batteries in something the size of a flashlight. We were able to ignite a paper bag from 10 feet.

Also with the 10 Watt white light laser(krypton argon) that Steller Designs has you could easily light a cigarette, it was about the same as one of those blow tourch lights in teams of heat.

But the real threat is instant and permanent blinding of people. When I was at Stanford we found medical reports of one small middle eastern army(Which I will not mention) using the laser range finders on it's tanks to blind 10's of thousands of enemy foot soldiers permanently!

The IR laser we had was particularly scary since your eyes would start bugging out like you were looking into the sun, when watching something like a bag burn, but since there was no visible light my eye's wouldn't instictivly look away or squint like when using the white laser.

Wow, just strap 100 of those puppies together,

[NeuroManson]

And you can write "Chairface" on the moon!

Spoooooon!

Re:Wow, just strap 100 of those puppies together,

[Legion303]

Whoa, imagine a Beow...sorry.

Re:How common are bad guys' laser sights?

[felonius maximus]

Yeah, also I have seen several laser sights come through my shop, they have all been reflective red-dot sights, so the red dot is only visible to the guy with the gun (the principle is the same as with an iron sight, only using a bright red dot instead). These too are pretty cheap.

Personal experiece

[hashwolf]

Once while I was drunk my best friend's bastard brother decided it was real fun to shine a laser pointer into my right eye....

The results were the following:
1) Complete blindness for more than a week
2) Decreased dioptres (increased short sightedness) in the affected eye.

Fortunately I did not suffer any significant/permanent retinal damage, however, my right eye is still slightly worse at focusing than my left one.

Re:Personal experiece

[jrockway]

Bullshit.

I shined a HeNe lab laser into my eye and it didn't do anything other than looking like a bright red thing was taking over the lab...

A laser pointer simply isn't powerful enough to do damage. You said you were drunk, that was probably the problem.

I just shined a laser pointer into my eye, and it's fine. I can see fine and it didn't hurt...

Re:What took them so long?

[inKubus]

Anyhoo, snipers aside, just using it (or the next-gen version) as a short-range pistol is pretty nasty. No chemical residue on the gunman after firing. No ballistics tests possible -- no bullets. Pretty useful for all sorts of bad.

PFT! It would take an hour to kill someone with this thing. They would be able to run over and punch you in the face in a few seconds.. The worst would be a tiny burn or maybe some minor eye damage, inside of 15 feet... this is no more dangerous than a regular BB gun.

Re:Movie torrent

[jesser]

Thanks for the fast download. I think I'm seeding now, but the Bittorrent client I used to download it doesn't make that clear.

Re:Good Job, Slashdot

[Com2Kid]

Actually this is a dupe from a few weeks ago....

Damage?

[Master of Transhuman]

Why the hell do you think we want them?

Of course we want damage!

Duh!

I'm an ex-Federal felon. I can't go near a gun without doing another ten to twenty years. If I can burn some asshole's eye out in seconds with a laser pointer, bet your ass I want one!

I'd really like one with about a MEGAwatt! I don't care if it looks like the Ghostbusters' backpacks!

The Shark...

[mousse-man]

The guy doesn't sell the shark that goes with this laser.....

Rotating mirror? Not needed...

[mtm]

You just need a linear beam, maybe adjustable from 12" - 24". Nice simple design and easy to maneuver. Sort of a Light Saber for your yard. Wait, I just thought of a name for it: the "Lawn Saber" /me also sprints to the USPO (and the tradmark office!)

Re:On/off switch...

[sail4evr]

maybe it was a small truck

Re:Endless road rage/vigilantism uses...

[DennisInDallas]

driving too slow in the fast lane would seem to be more of a courtesy issue rather than an actual infraction. So you're right in that it doesn't warrant lethal force to defend yourself from this crime. On the other hand, drunken driving or speeding do seem to be the sort of crimes that endanger peoples lives and therefore one would be justified in using lethal force to defend themselves

Re:On/off switch...

[sail4evr]

who knows, maybe the kids were children of radical Islamists practicing on their way to the airport to try and blind a few airplane pilots.
a) thee cops nipped it in the bud
b) the kids learned to be more dicreet next time.

Between throwing turkeys in the front of oncoming cars and dropping watermelons off of highway bridges, a few malcontents can go a long way with laser pens

Re:Yeah

[srleffler]

If you're going to raster scan the lasers, spreading their power across a whole projection screen, you need that much power to get a bright enough image. This is one of the problems with laser displays: if the lasers are bright enough to form a good image on a screen, they are powerful enough to burn through it if the raster scan system jams. Of course, laser displays and light shows have interlocks that shut off the laser if the raster scan stops for any reason...

Re:Endless road rage/vigilantism uses...

[WillDraven]

Maybe if it wasnt for the fact that the US has made speed limits a joke by imposing that national 55mph limit and then forgetting to lift it on roads that used to be 80mph roads. I'd say that on about 85% of american roads the speed limit is lower than it could be safely.

Re:On/off switch...

[ObiWanKenblowme]

It was a panel truck, so not huge, but certainly a lot larger and heavier than the Sentra I was driving. Probably not a good idea to have let one of those barrel into me, regardless of whose fault it would have been.

Re:How common are bad guys' laser sights?

[NormalVisual]

I'm talking about a decent laser unit, such as those made by LaserMax or Crimson Trace, not some trigger-guard-mounted crap that's going to jiggle out of alignment after a couple of shots and won't fit into a standard holster, or that has wiring that will wear through after a short period of use.

Re:How common are bad guys' laser sights?

[NormalVisual]

That sounds more likely to be a reflex sight, as a true laser sight is visible to anyone nearby (unless it's an IR laser sight and you have the viewing hardware). Reflex sights use a piece of glass or plastic to reflect a focused LED to the shooter's eye, allowing the shooter to put the dot on his target without having to defocus his eyes from it - they're basically a tiny HUD. They're a *lot* cheaper than laser sights, but that's largely because there's not much to them other than a piece of glass or plastic and a red LED, and possibly a plastic lens.

Obligatory Cronenberg reference

[Kris Magnusson]

Spectacular Optical

Recent incidents of aircraft being targetted...

[redwoodtree]

Just this week an aircraft was tracked for a while with a laser pointed into the cockpit. I don't really understand how this is possible given the angles and so forth with a plane travelling at 8500 feet.

The article is here at SFGate Newspaper . They say that "interfering with a commercial flight is a felony punishable by up to five years in prison."

Re:ATHF???

[bar-agent]

That's a question I ask myself every time I see an episode on the Cartoon Network.

I still have no idea.

But it is weird.

Re:Rotating mirror? Not needed...

[shadowbearer]

If you can figure out how to produce an adjustable length fully coherent laser beam without some hardware at the other end, that'd be the invention to patent! :D The uses would be endless.

SB

Silly yankee...

[juhaz]

No, he means football.

Despite yanks constant raping of the English language, the two words making up a composite word "football" are still rather well defined, don't you think? It is a game where you primarily use your feet, it also features a ball.

Considering US "football" does not do either, I'm not entirely sure what it should be called, but football it ain't.

Re:Given that the "old" ones weren't used responsi

[izomiac]

Well, now that we have both green and red lasers readily available, how would these goggles help? They seem to only reflect one frequency of light.

Try taking the co2 laser to a keg party

[vaepor]

ya, but you an't carry that in your pocket to a keg party and shoot holes in people's cups. Hilarity would surely ensue.

Maybe not

[suso]

Interestingly, this article from just 2 days after this slashdot article, may prove you to be wrong in that assumption.

Its interesting that these two incidents (slashdot article) and pilots reporting green laser light are so close together.

Uh oh

[LOKIOLR]

How much do you want to bet that this is the same laser? http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=51 9&e=2&u=/ap/20041230/ap_on_re_us/laser_beam_airpla ne

In the News today

[Netrunner1987]

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=51 9&e=2&u=/ap/20041230/ap_on_re_us/laser_beam_airpla ne/

CLEVELAND - Authorities are investigating a mysterious laser beam that was directed into the cockpit of a commercial jet traveling at more than 8,500 feet.

Protective lenses

[Weird_one]

I think I understand that laser light is covailent or along the same polar plane, and the normal light is not.

Would it be possible to create a lense that allows only non-laser light thru?

should I post this to ask slashdot?

laser tag

[demon411]

who is up for some laser tag?

Re:Rotating mirror? Not needed...

[smithmc]

If you can figure out how to produce an adjustable length fully coherent laser beam without some hardware at the other end, that'd be the invention to patent!

Who says there has to be no hardware at the other end? (For the lawn mower application, anyway...)

Re:Rotating mirror? Not needed...

[jrockway]

He's talking about making a Light Saber.

Directed at over 3000 feet?

[Random832]

The FAA mandates that laser light shows must register their locations and the lights cannot be directed above 3,000 feet. Lasers are also often used by construction companies to line up foundations.

How do you not direct a light at above 3000 feet? Unless it's horizontal [and even if then, the curvature of the earth can affect this], a straight line will reach any height.

Re:How common are bad guys' laser sights?

[Elvisisdead]

There are also models that will fit on a full-size pistol's accessory rail on the frame that are pretty inexpensive. However, you can't carry one in anything but a tactical holster when one is equipped. When they're integral to the grips or recoil spring guide, they're usually well over $300. It's a pretty common sentiment that the money is better spent on ammo for practice, because if the laser goes out, you better be able to put rounds on target anyway.

Interfering with a commercial flight

[sl4shd0rk]

"Interfering with a commercial flight is a felony punishable by up to five years in prison."

Does this include sucking up a bottle of Tequila and getting beligerent?

ummmm, ok

[deft]

"BTW: If someone uses missile defense lasers near your city, then you should have strong curtains just to make sure that any weak reflections wouldn't pass inside your house. And blind someone"

I'll keep that in mind if umm, they start ysing missle defense lasers in my city, because, yeah, I'll be more worried about the reflection than the MISSLES FALLING ON LOS ANGELES.

Of cours,e something tells me if there MISSLES FALLING I'll be doing something besides watching the laser show.

Re:How common are bad guys' laser sights?

[PitaBred]

It's not. It's because the cop can't see what you're doing, and that's an active way of preventing him from doing that. That's the reason cops ALWAYS have backup if they pull you over at night. More than one. They need to see what's going on and be in charge of the situation. If someone's trying to blind you with a laser pointer, there's no guarantee what else they may or may not do.
I think it's a case of idiot civilians playing armchair officer.