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Do Gamers Enjoy Dying in First-Person-Shooters?

Ponca City, We Love You writes "Brandon Erickson has an interesting post about an experiment on players' emotional reactions to killing and being killed in a first-person shooters (FPS) with a group of students who played James Bond 007: Nightfire while their facial expressions and physiological activity were tracked and recorded moment-to-moment via electrodes and various other monitoring equipment. The study found that "death of the player's own character...appear[s] to increase some aspects of positive emotion." The authors believe this may result from the temporary "relief from engagement" brought about by character death. "Part of this has to do with the intriguing aesthetic question of precisely how the first-person-shooter represents the player after the moment of death," says Clive Thompson. "This sudden switch in camera angle — from first person to third person — is, in essence, a classic out-of-body experience, of exactly the sort people describe in near-death experiences. And much like real-life near-death experiences, it tends to suffuse me with a curiously zen-like feeling." An abstract of the original article, "The psychophysiology of James Bond: Phasic emotional responses to violent video game events" is available on the web." Obnoxiously this alleged scholarly research is not available for free, so we'll just have to speculate wildly what it says based on the abstract.

309 comments

  1. You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by LiquidCoooled · · Score: 1, Funny

    You might enjoy dying in normal games, but imagine if http://www.collegehumor.com/video:1803224/'>this spreads to your local LAN game.

    --
    liqbase :: faster than paper
    1. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by omeomi · · Score: 1

      not all FPS games switch to third person when the player dies. Many just move the first person camera to the ground, sometimes tracking the person who killed you, which helps to nullify campers...

    2. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by BadAnalogyGuy · · Score: 1

      So on some games, after you give up the ghost, it's kind of a letdown. The other player gets to keep running around, and your teammates essentially desert you.

      You know who wouldn't do that?

    3. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by plague3106 · · Score: 4, Funny

      You know who wouldn't do that?

      Why, the Flying Spagetti Monster of course! He'll never leave you room for desert, always quite satisifying!

    4. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by omeomi · · Score: 4, Funny

      So on some games, after you give up the ghost, it's kind of a letdown. The other player gets to keep running around, and your teammates essentially desert you.

      You, um, want your teammates to gather around your rag-doll body or pile of giblets mourning you until you press the space bar and come back to life?

      You know who wouldn't do that?

      Um...the Marines, I guess?

    5. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by LecheryJesus · · Score: 0

      That's just downright unholy!!

      --
      Jesus was an invention of the Romans - watch "The Pharmacractic Inquisition" for something more credible...
    6. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by Tiber · · Score: 2, Insightful

      Hitler.

    7. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by 19thNervousBreakdown · · Score: 1, Insightful
      --
      <xml><I><am><so><damn>Web 2.0</damn></so></am></I></xml>
    8. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by Slashdot+Suxxors · · Score: 5, Funny

      Halo 3's camera system is phenomenal. It gives my victims a good view to watch me teabag them.

    9. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by MrNemesis · · Score: 4, Funny

      Dessert is the anti-spaghetti, to believe in it is Pastafarian heresy. Honestly, I'm surprised bigoted religious tripe like your post is allowed past the /. lameness filter! There are NO false idols before, or after, the divine Flying Spaghetti Monster. So you're going to leave your bolognese to make room for dessert? I'm amazed you're allowed to live. One Nation, Al Dente!

      ;)

      --
      Moderation Total: -1 Troll, +3 Goat
    10. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by Telepathetic+Man · · Score: 1

      Which is great, as desert isn't very pleasant to eat. All that sand.

      --
      Just because you can, does not mean you should.
    11. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I went almost a whole freaking week without being Ric Rolled... FUCK YOU!

    12. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by e03179 · · Score: 1

      Phenomenal? I guess you don't play FPS's on the PC. Free cameras and spectator modes have been around for 15 years.

      --
      -516
    13. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by Trogre · · Score: 1

      I hope rigor mortis sets in before you're done.

      --
      "Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
    14. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by Jesus_666 · · Score: 1

      Yeah, but I think that only applies if you are a hyperactive black bartender. Don't know which games allow you to play that particular archetype; I'm not really into the online FPS scene.

      --
      USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
    15. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by MagusSlurpy · · Score: 1

      What always amazed me about teabagging in the original Halo was how all these frat boys that I just knew had never played a single game online before all managed to come up with this act independently. If only they had just demonstrated that much independent thought in the rest of their lives. . .


      Of course, then they probably wouldn't be frat boys, either. . .

      --
      My sister opened a computer store in Hawaii. She sells C shells by the seashore.
    16. Re:You wouldn't enjoy it against this guy by The+Analog+Kid · · Score: 1

      Hitler.

      I know what you mean, if his reaction here is any indication, you best be staying out of his way.

  2. I prefer instant blackout by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I've always preferred servers and games (DoD for example) that provided an instant 'blackout' effect on death.

    It always annoyed me to spend a great deal of time moving my character into a unique hiding spot, only to have someone suicide rush me after my position was betrayed by the after-death features that pointed directly to my location.

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    Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
    1. Re:I prefer instant blackout by orielbean · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Camper. Real snipers are trained to take the shot then move immediately to another position to avoid being detected.

    2. Re:I prefer instant blackout by phantomfive · · Score: 1

      Ha, the camper's lament. While I can see how you feel, on the other hand, when I play, I am usually in the opposite position and quite happy to know who killed me, so I can avoid such traps in the future. Probably helps everyone get better.

      As for 'enjoying' death, I can't say I particularly enjoy it, but I know it's going to happen eventually, and I would say it's not happiness so much as 'satisfaction.' I feel satisfied if I have a good run before dying. On the other hand, if I get knifed right outside the spawn point, I can't imagine I would get a very happy look on my face, because it doesn't make me very happy, no matter HOW out-of-body my experience is.

      --
      Qxe4
    3. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Brian+Gordon · · Score: 1

      Oh of course- but then games like TF2 that explicitly zooms in on who killed you aren't real battlefield simulators. There are no respawns in Counter-Strike so it doesn't matter that you can spec after death. I also prefer the instant blackout though.. I've been playing a ton of Insurgency lately and my roommate can attest to how many times I've perched over my laptop barely breathing for minutes then jumped a mile high at the sound of bullets ripping through my insurgent's flesh. The Ins death effect is great.. some insanely well-done post process effects kick in for half a second to simulate your eyes glazing and closing as the point of view rolls over.. and you hear bullets through flesh or hitting your helmet and your body rolling over in the dust.

    4. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Anghwyr · · Score: 1

      Real snipers don't have to deal with respawns ;). They have however, other problems: http://blog.wired.com/defense/2007/04/darpa_countersn.html

    5. Re:I prefer instant blackout by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 5, Insightful

      Camper. Real snipers are trained to take the shot then move immediately to another position to avoid being detected.

      I typically do, but 'Real snipers' aren't faced with an opponent who can resurrect themselves within 30 seconds and reach your old position in another 15.

      My preference has less to do with playing the game as a sniper (my least favorite role actually) and more to do with playing the game as a commander and being able to hide my team's movements from the opposing team. Unfortunately that isn' really possible against an organized team unless you are at a LAN party and strictly enforce rules regarding 'speaking with the dead'.

      --
      Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
    6. Re:I prefer instant blackout by esocid · · Score: 1

      That's sort of what I thought about, not the exact game, but I was just wondering what the differences, if any, would be between the 3rd person death compared to the 1st person death sequence.

      --
      Absolute power corrupts absolutely. indymedia
    7. Re:I prefer instant blackout by irc.goatse.cx+troll · · Score: 1

      There are no respawns in Counter-Strike so it doesn't matter that you can spec after death.


      It matters when my friend dies and tells me where the person who killed them is (or that they all ran back after he died..or that they ran in and had the bomb, etc).

      I personally think it would lead to a more skillful game if you needed to communicate what you saw BEFORE you get killed, but thats never going to happen as even if you convinced your team not to ghost, you know the other team will do it against you.

      Theres an mp_fadetoblack cvar, but in the time it takes for the camera to go black you can still pan around and see exactly what happens. What would be needed would be a mp_instadeath or similar where as soon as your health hits 0, you're teleported outside of the map with your screen black for 5 seconds or so. This way you can't see or even hear what went on, but then you could go back to normal spectating so as not to be bored out of your mind.

      Of course then you would need to fix the problem with switching between two live players dragging the camera through the wall allowing the spectator to see through walls temporarily and call out whats on the other side.

      Back on topic though: Dying doesn't negatively impact my emotions, failing does. I don't care that I died if the person defending with me cleaned them up, I care when I get ran over without so much as getting a shot off, then we procede to lose the round due to my actions.

      Team games are inherently different like that though. In a 1 vs 1 game its an entirely different feeling since your death is directly your score, but at the same time as soon as you die you need to get back up and recover. There isnt any time to sit around and mope in a close game, but if you're losing 0-10 you probably will feel pretty awful with each additional death knowing your goal of winning is further and further away.
      --
      Pain lasts, kid. Its how you know you're alive. Sometimes I think this growing up thing is just pain management-TheMaxx
    8. Re:I prefer instant blackout by eonlabs · · Score: 2, Interesting

      TFP mentions that they use a few metrics for determining 'arousal' or interest. Mind, I did not read through the whole thing, nor can I post the whole thing here, but, I think this is a reasonable excerpt:

      "The facial EMG is an
      established index of hedonic valence; that is, increased activity over corrugator supercilii, which
      draws the brow down and together into a frown, is associated with negative emotions, whereas
      increased activity over zygomaticus major, which pulls the corners of the mouth back and up into
      a smile, is associated with positive emotions during affective imagery and when viewing pictures
      (for 6 s) or other media stimuli [e.g., 15, 19, 29]"

      I'm wondering if those are valid measures considering that in order for some people to say the word 'SHIT,' I would think they would have to use the same muscles which pull the corners of the mouth back into a smile.

      Can anyone who knows anything about anatomy confirm that?

      How does the feeling of exasperation come across on those sensors?

      They also talk about using skin conductivity as a measure of excitement.

      --
      I wouldn't consider the mad hatter mad. Just reality impaired. He sure can make a mean cup of tea.
    9. Re:I prefer instant blackout by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 1

      When I'm playing a game like TF2 I don't mind the death scenes. It fits the feel of the game. I identified DoD because it was one of the more 'accurate' FPS games around at the time. Before I cut back on FPS games, I tried Red Orchestra and liked that one alot.

      I do love TF2, but it is definately a world apart from games like Red Orchestra.

      --
      Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
    10. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Insightful

      My understanding has been that they move after taking a shot, not because they seek to avoid being detected but because they seek to avoid being -located-. Taking a shot in and of itself will usually give away the presence of a sniper.

    11. Re:I prefer instant blackout by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 4, Insightful

      For me, death in a game is a chance to get a brief pause in the action, and reflect on my experience for that spawn period. I can joke with friends, curse, and plan what to do in my next 'life'.

      In fact, I would say that death can be considered part of the game.

      --
      Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
    12. Re:I prefer instant blackout by orielbean · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I can definitely sympathize with that! I think it would be fun to have just a C&C position, with no presence on the BF (like a spectator), and you could order the UAV scans, air strikes, helicopters, etc as your team earned different abilities. Also included would be the ability to listen in on enemy chatter and relate that info to your team. That way, both sides would keep the chatter low or use codephrases, etc to be more efficient. To be more real-world-based, you might add in the C&C as a position on the map, like the flag, that could be disabled, blinded, hindered, destroyed, etc in order to hamper the enemy.

    13. Re:I prefer instant blackout by The+One+and+Only · · Score: 1

      My understanding is that they move because the target was killed the first time they took a shot.

      --
      In Repressive Burma, it's not just your connection that dies. slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=314547&cid=20819199
    14. Re:I prefer instant blackout by daveywest · · Score: 1
      I know Starcraft isn't a FPS, but its where I learned about sacrificing an occasional death for progress.

      There was one Terran level I couldn't get past. I was able to build up a ton of battleships, but they were so expensive I never wanted to lose one, so I couldn't beat that level.

      I finally got frustrated and sent the full force in. I traded a few deaths for a breach in the defenses and an easy win.

    15. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Pojut · · Score: 5, Funny

      I always find it hilarious if I am resurrected in the middle of a firefight in Battlefield 2. Just last night, the following happend to me:

      There is a MEC manning the machine gunner position right next to the train wreck on Karkand. I manage to move around and get behind him, so I rush up on him and slice him with the knife. 1 kill. I then run around the other side of the concrete barrier and slice up a sniper who had been laying next to him on the other side of the fence (and somehow didn't see me.) 2 kills. I whip out my assault rifle and pop another MEC running down the bridge straight in the face with two three-shot bursts. 3 kills. Load up the grenade launcher attachment on the rifle, and take out a group of two MEC running next to each other across the bridge. 4 and 5 kills. By this time, four of my squad-mates have joined me in trying to cap the point...and I get sniped. Exhilarated, I sit back for a second...5 kills in a time span of ~30 seconds...I'm quite pleased with myself.

      A medic revives me, only to have me instantly die from a grenade. Well crap, it happens. I spawn literally in the middle of a firefight near the large concrete ramp, in that little town square...end up getting teamkilled (i forgave the guy because his grenade got 2 MECs as well). I get rezzed, and get sniped. The same medic comes back and rezzes me. I take one step forward, and blow up a claymore. I respawn right next to the tracks this time, and before I can even move I get killed by an artillary strike.

      I never took more than a step after respawning before I got taken out again. This went on for a total of 7 times. I had to disconnect from the game, I couldn't stop laughing:-)

      Spawn camping bothers me...these kinds of things humour me.

    16. Re:I prefer instant blackout by SatanicPuppy · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'm with you...If I get killed by something lame over and over, it's just frustrating. On the other hand, if you're charging along and turn a corner right into a rocket spray fired by someone who didn't even know you were coming, it's entertaining.

      I don't know...I can take pleasure in someone else's skill/luck, same as I can take pleasure in my own skill/luck. I can take pleasure in my own hilariously improbable death, or my own stupidity. Rocket bounce a sniper off his high camping perch, and have him nail you while falling through the air a second before he dies SPLAT on the ground...I don't know, it's entertaining.

      --
      ad logicam Claiming a proposition is false because it was presented as the conclusion of a fallacious argument.
    17. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Lumpy · · Score: 3, Funny

      I prefer to be a suicide bomber. I love playing urbanTerror as you can bumrush a room with a grenade in hand. if they kill you when you enter the room they die as you drop the grenade and it bounces over, if you make it to them they die.

      It's great. I love it when people get really pissed because I do it to them over and over because they cant pick a new spot to camp.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    18. Re:I prefer instant blackout by GreggBz · · Score: 2, Funny

      Not me!

      After this camper gets shot in the head, I like to watch the angry guy who I fragged like 4 times shoot up my dead body in rage and stand statue while he types something obscene.

      I then usually quip, "Not dead yet! Go back and shot me some more!"

    19. Re:I prefer instant blackout by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 4, Interesting

      You should give Natural Selection www.unknownworlds.com/ns/ a try. When I played it was based on the HL engine and gave you two options, marines or aliens for a team.

      One person on the marines was the 'commander' and had a top down C&C style view. He could give orders, set waypoints, hand out weapons, and progress through an upgrade tree. The rest of the marines were just plain old FPS style, but relied on the commander to keep them supplied as they fought.

      The aliens on the other hand, had no leader, but information was shared between them (If one alien saw an enemy, the rest of the players could 'sense' that enemy, and you would receive notification that an area was under attack, etc. Just no central leadership mode)

      It was a game that I greatly enjoyed. I remember it when it was fairly beta, had a few chats with Charlie Cleveland (he likely won't remember, but I did appreciate his discussions about building up Unknown Worlds). I sincerely hope that it grows since it got a lot of things 'right'.

      --
      Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
    20. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ahem, *deep breath*

      nnnnnnnnneeeeeeeeerrrrrrrrrrrdddddddd

    21. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Andrew+Kismet · · Score: 1

      That'd probably be the 10th Terran Mission in the original campaign, "The Hammer Falls", where you have to take out the Ion Cannon. The only risk with the Battlecruiser Rush tactic at the end of that level are the Ghosts with the Lockdown ability. Once a significant number of Battlecruisers are locked down, you're completely boned.

    22. Re:I prefer instant blackout by meringuoid · · Score: 3, Insightful
      I prefer to be a suicide bomber. I love playing urbanTerror as you can bumrush a room with a grenade in hand. if they kill you when you enter the room they die as you drop the grenade and it bounces over, if you make it to them they die.

      Suicide bombing can be a brilliant tactic, at least in fantasy worlds where death is survivable and you get to respawn immediately afterwards; a bit unrealistic unless you can imagine some fool convinced that that's the case in reality, so not one for those of us who like a simulation more than a fragfest. I remember a Quake map that had a big ol' moat around a central keep. A lot of warren-like tunnels dropped people into that moat, so there were generally quite a few in there. So, the plan: First, find the electric gun. Second, jump in the water. Third, ZZZZZAP!

      Sure, I take a penalty for killing myself, but I took a half-dozen guys with me. Oh, how it pissed them off.

      --
      Real Daleks don't climb stairs - they level the building.
    23. Re:I prefer instant blackout by caramelcarrot · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I also recommend NS, though it's probably a bit dead these days - it's given me some of the deepest, most intense and most tactical FPS/RTS experiences. Proper team play, not just helping a team mate because you'll get extra points, I'm eagerly awaiting NS2.

    24. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Ced_Ex · · Score: 1

      I play on an Instant Respawn TF2 server... I don't have time to die! It's more like a teleportation effect back to a spawn room for me.

      --
      Live forever, or die trying.
    25. Re:I prefer instant blackout by hairyfeet · · Score: 1
      See,it is guys like you that got me to quit playing Mechwarrior(and all online games).I took three forevers designing my perfect mech(a stripped down Atlas with two big cannons,damned if I can remember the names),I would get ONE shot because it took a while to reload.Of course,I only needed one shot,I hit and you're toast.Lamers would get pissed because my slow assed Atlas dropped their Madcat so they would get their buddies to suicide attack.Pretty soon it got to the point that I would get on the field and that was all I'd get,waves of suicide attacks.


      If you want to drop someone,do it because of skill.If you don't have it hook up with a team and learn.To me the suiciders were the ultimate lamers because that was typically what the 14 yr old would do when they got their ass handed to them. Worst of all,you hand their ass to them a couple of times and they'll follow you around making your game suck(I think they are called griefers now,we called them asshats).And all it takes is a few lamers to ruin a game.But as always my 02c,YMMV.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    26. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Emetophobe · · Score: 1

      I've been a long time FPS gamer (Wolfenstein 3D, Doom 1 and 2, Quake 1, 2 and 3, Duke Nukem 3D, Unreal Tournament 2004, Half-Life 2, Team Fortress 2).

      Nowadays I play a huge amount of Team Fortress 2. I really enjoy the death effect where it shows you who killed you and how they did it. It allows me to learn from my mistakes and do better the next time around.

    27. Re:I prefer instant blackout by foo+fighter · · Score: 1

      I personally prefer Savage and now Savage 2.

      Same basic concept, though NS is based on Half Life while Savage was developed independently.

      And it can be really frustrating if your commander doesn't know what the hell they're doing.

      --
      obviously no deficiencies vs. no obvious deficiencies
    28. Re:I prefer instant blackout by dougisfunny · · Score: 1

      There are 3 cvars that can be used to solve this. mp_forcechasecam mp_forcecamera and mp_fadetoblack. The forcecamera you force it to spectate only your own team, and forcechasecam for forcing a first person spectate.

      --
      This is not the funny you're looking for.
    29. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Auckerman · · Score: 1

      You have just described Call of Duty 4 with a team member spectating.

      --

      Burn Hollywood Burn
    30. Re:I prefer instant blackout by thatnerdguy · · Score: 2, Funny

      ...death is survivable...

      Best line I read today

      --
      I saw the Sign, and it opened up my eyes
    31. Re:I prefer instant blackout by mav[LAG] · · Score: 1

      A little-known modification of this trick is to do it in deep lava. Most of the time you would take out the people standing next to it. Worked like a charm in crowded DM4 games if you needed a few easy frags but wasn't 100% reliable so you looked like a real muppet when it didn't come off.

      --
      --- Hot Shot City is particularly good.
    32. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      skill/luck Am I the only one who read that as "skullfuck"? I am? Damn, I'm in the wrong section again.
    33. Re:I prefer instant blackout by LeonardsLiver · · Score: 1

      Using a silencer (at least in the greatest online game ever... GRAW(1|2)) will hide your location. You gotta disable kill cameras, which any decent host will do. :)

    34. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Buran · · Score: 1

      Sounds a lot like Battlefield 2.

    35. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Lumpy · · Score: 1

      If you play right, I dont do it. I'm also the guy that will instantly frag a team mate that is constantly shooting team players. If you are a n00b and shoot the guys on your team, I'm taking your butt out so you dont ruin that round, too many asshat 14 year olds quit and rejoin on your team and then shoot you in the back to get giggles. At least a suicide bomber can be taken down with skill. An again, if you like "simulation" it's as real as you can get.. There are lots of 14 year old "noobs" thinking they get to visit allah and 40 virgins by doing it in real life to our troops.

      I actually find that in Games like UT-III and UrbanTerror you are far more successful if you take terrorist tactics instead of US army tactics. If two of your 6 man team are suicide attackers you are way more effective than the guys trying to keep the whole team alive and play US army guy tactics.

      --
      Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
    36. Re:I prefer instant blackout by modecx · · Score: 1

      If you're the Lumpy I've encountered in UrT, which judging by that statement, you probably are... I've bought it by that exploding monkey far too many times. *shakes fist* ;)

      --
      Constitutional rights may be respected, repealed, or modified; but they must never be ignored.
    37. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      The HL2 mod most similar to NS would be Empires. If you like the RTS/FPS combo, this is no better mod than Empires.

    38. Re:I prefer instant blackout by hairyfeet · · Score: 1
      I have NO problem with those who occasionally employ the suicide attack as part of an overall strategy.What I have a problem with is asshat 14 yr olds that get all pissy because "there is NO F*cking way some old sh*tty Atlas pwned my elite Madcat!!!" and then spend a week or more just trying to make your life hell.


      The reason I finally gave up was some asshat(had to be 14-16 yr old) got p*ssed because my old Atlas showed him up in front of his friends.I wasn't even trash talking,I was just there for the challenge.So he got together with 3-4 of his buddies and simply made sure I couldn't play.He and his friends would show up on whatever server I was on and just ram,over and over and over.And they would often crapflood my connection with hacker crap like malformed packets,just to slow it to a crawl.Finally I just got tired of dealing with them,they had sucked the fun right out of the game.The few times I have tried different online games since there have been WAY to many "I got you,faggot motherf*cker!" kind of crap for me to deal with it.There is just way to many spoiled 14 yr old punks out there with fragile egos for me to deal with the crap.

      And I apologize if any are offended by the language,but in the heyday of Win9X there was a lot of us just out to have fun,and I would laugh and compliment those that gave me a fair ass whupping.But somewhere along the way it just got filled by 14 yr old punks,and the old guys like me that were there for a good fight just got tired of dealing with the little punks. But as always my 02c,YMMV.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
    39. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Architect_sasyr · · Score: 1

      One of my step fathers (heh, mum got around a bit) was a sniper and he always used to tell me that you move so they can't draw a line back.

      If you snipe someone in an open field and it kicks them around that's fine, because the odds of working out where you are located are small (unless there is only one or two clumps of bushes of course!). However if you snipe someone just as they walk around the corner (think the sniper chick in "Full Metal Jacket") then it isn't as hard to work out where they are. Especially if you don't move.

      Same goes for a machine gun nest really, though people don't think of those as stealthy. If you don't move, then lobbing grenades or artillery becomes that much easier to target.

      --
      Me failed English...
      FreeBSD over Linux. If my comments seem odd, this may explain...
    40. Re:I prefer instant blackout by PrescriptionWarning · · Score: 1

      Pretty cool device, but I'm sure someone will just come up with a scope that doesn't reflect the laser light in such a way that the device can pinpoint it. Either have it refract in a different direction or absorb the light into the scope, away from the snipers eyes somehow.

    41. Re:I prefer instant blackout by PrescriptionWarning · · Score: 1

      Quite a profound statement indeed, maybe its similar to that theory about how our dreams have us run through real life scenarios while we're unconscious to better prepare us for events that may happen during the day based on prior events or knowledge.

      However I have to wonder if there's a certain amount of time that is needed for it to make a difference. For instance if I play a respawn game of Call of Duty 4, you have only about 10 seconds before you come back to the action. However, in Search and destroy games where you spawn only at the start of each new round, you have minutes at times before the next round. some may find it boring, but its certainly more time for reflection.

    42. Re:I prefer instant blackout by The+One+and+Only · · Score: 1

      My dad was in the Marines. He wasn't a sniper, but he had to deal with a fair number of them (on the other side). He told me that a sniper only takes one shot. If you only take one shot, they're taken by surprise and don't know where you are. Take a second shot without moving and they've found you. Same lesson, pretty much.

      --
      In Repressive Burma, it's not just your connection that dies. slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=314547&cid=20819199
    43. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Dan541 · · Score: 1

      I've always preferred servers and games (DoD for example) that provided an instant 'blackout' effect on death.

      It always annoyed me to spend a great deal of time moving my character into a unique hiding spot, only to have someone suicide rush me after my position was betrayed by the after-death features that pointed directly to my location. I have to agree with you!

      Death shouldent offer an advantage.

      --
      An SQL query goes to a bar, walks up to a table and asks, "Mind if I join you?"
    44. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Dan541 · · Score: 1

      I really hate the Medics in battlefield2 sometimes because they will hide behind a wall and keep resurrecting a teammate who is just beyond the protection of the wall the result is the the team mate being resurrected is instantly killed each and every time, and when you have 64 players per server its not uncommon to simply be stuck for a long period of time because some selfish person keeps resurrecting you for points in a place you cant get out of instead of just letting you die and comeback for real at a proper spawn point.

      Medics can sometimes do more harm to the team than good when they hold teammates out of the game like this.

      ~Dan

      --
      An SQL query goes to a bar, walks up to a table and asks, "Mind if I join you?"
    45. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Samah · · Score: 1

      > Sounds a lot like Battlefield 2.
      Except NS was publicly released at least a year before Savage and four years before Battlefield 2. I believe the FPS/RTS concept had been implemented long before NS too (can't put my finger on the exact game though...)

      --
      Homonyms are fun!
      You're driving your car, but they're riding their bikes there.
    46. Re:I prefer instant blackout by symbolic · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I agree with you - I used to play America's Army quite a bit, and even though I thought it was generally a fun game, one of my favorite maps was always inhabited by morons whose sense of skill came from nothing more than spamming grenades in a certain spot.

      If I die because of an opponent's skill, it's fun to be able to sit back and admire the effort. If I die because some idiot thinks good gamesmanship is a matter of finding the shortest and easiest path to a kill, the fun stops and annoyance sets in.

    47. Re:I prefer instant blackout by WK2 · · Score: 1

      It is only a flesh wound!

      --
      Write your own Choose Your Own Adventure. http://www.freegameengines.org/gamebook-engine/
    48. Re:I prefer instant blackout by Anzya · · Score: 1

      You might want to try a game like Team fortress 2 or City of Heroes. The amount of deaths in TF2 is so high that another doesn't matter that much and I have never had any trouble with 14 yr old n00bs.

      Granted, CoH isn't FPS but at least the european english servers has a very nice community. During my soon to be 3 years of playing it I have in total met 2 persons that I disliked enough to make me mad. Of course I have played with people who was too far below my "skillz" that I left the group but lack of skills is not enough to make me mad :)

      But of course as you said, YMMV...

      --
      "This message was brought to you by Sarcasm and Troll Feeders United (or STFU, for you un-hip people)."
    49. Re:I prefer instant blackout by hairyfeet · · Score: 1
      I'm afraid I really don't play enough to make one of those "pay by the month for the privilege of playing" worth it.CoH is one of those,right? I would just steal an hour where I could and hook up with my buds for a little clanning.And the whole Quake/Halo "everybody run like a maniac while throwing rockets" just never appealed to me.When I had a flight stick I loved the thought that went into a good mech design,but I haven't really seen any newer games that did anything for me.Maybe if the new GTA has an online mode(and they don't bone the controls like they did with the pc version of GTA:SA) I might give it another whirl.


      But at 40(just turned yesterday) I'm just getting too damn old for the "everything blowing up in under 30 seconds" that is online FPS(at least last time I looked,about 3 yr ago).With Mech,it was like being part of a fleet-I was an aircraft carrier,surrounded by light battleships,destroyers,and frigates.A good 5-6 man clan could easily turn a pack of lone wolves twice its size into scrap,if they worked well together. It really is a damned shame that MSFT bought and destroyed the goodness that was Mechwarrior.You really had a sense of planning out a hard campaign,you really needed to know your guys strengths/weaknesses in battle to do well.I just hope EA doesn't buy Take Two.It seems every time I like a game series,some big corp buys it and takes a big old steaming dump on it-Mechwarrior,C&C,etc. But thanks for the advice,if I get a chance I'll check those out.

      --
      ACs don't waste your time replying, your posts are never seen by me.
  3. Perhaps... by Kagura · · Score: 3, Interesting

    Perhaps they enjoy the emotional transaction that takes place at time of death? I enjoy making small bets often and challenging other people to tiny competitions for no reason, simply because of the "Awwww, I lost and you won" transaction that takes place. I don't know if other people feel this, but I know that I do. For small things that don't matter, I am not terribly concerned with winning or losing.

    1. Re:Perhaps... by sm62704 · · Score: 2, Funny

      Well for me, it's travelling towards the light, then seeing all my long-dead friends and relatives.

      The searing heat is a bother though. Wish they'd install air conditioning.

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    2. Re:Perhaps... by Ced_Ex · · Score: 1

      Wish they'd install air conditioning. Yeah... when hell freezes over... maybe.

      --
      Live forever, or die trying.
  4. Maybe it's like gambling by wattrlz · · Score: 4, Interesting

    When you loose it makes you the underdog, so your final victory will just be that much more glorius when fate smiles on you once again.

    1. Re:Maybe it's like gambling by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Or maybe it's like a spelling contest, you know, the one where you *lose*.

    2. Re:Maybe it's like gambling by vertinox · · Score: 1

      When you loose it makes you the underdog, so your final victory will just be that much more glorius when fate smiles on you once again.

      Actually, the really good games make it feel good to loose or at least you made the opposing team pay for every inch of ground. There is a popular mod turned retail called "Red Orchestra" in which some maps are impossible to win, but very difficult to win.

      Moltke Bridge is a good example in which the Germans are defending Berlin from the Russians in where the Russians have superiority in fire power (they have tanks and the Germans don't). However, the map is so well done that there are so many ambush spots for panzerfaust ambushes and PakGuns will usually make the Soviets go through at least 100 or more tanks per round. Invariable on the larger 50+ player server the Germans will loose capture points (they are not recapable) and get low in reinforcements and will fall back to the last point called the Moltke bridge in which its basically a machine gun fest against the infantry trying to cross the bridge with the Soviet tanks with the cover.

      Invariably its hard for the Germans to win by time running out (its a 70 minute map) at that point (though I've played a game in which we held the Soviets for 30 minutes on the last cap point) but you can really take joing at the other side howling in rage as you ambush them as they try to send HE shells through all the windows in hopes to take out the MG42 snipers.

      In that sense... You feel like if you held them down til the last 5 minutes that you've accomplished something. There are plenty of other maps like that in which are defense and offense maps were one side never wins but make the other side pay dearly (almost like the real war).

      --
      "I am the king of the Romans, and am superior to rules of grammar!"
      -Sigismund, Holy Roman Emperor (1368-1437)
    3. Re:Maybe it's like gambling by RonnyJ · · Score: 1

      Like in TF2, when you 'dominate' someone you become their 'nemesis' - and so they'll come back seeking revenge... :)

    4. Re:Maybe it's like gambling by ark1 · · Score: 1

      Perhaps it is the fact that there might just be 72 virgins waiting for you on the other end once you have sacrificed your life. I know that would put a smile even on the biggest prude geek.

    5. Re:Maybe it's like gambling by ultranova · · Score: 1

      Perhaps it is the fact that there might just be 72 virgins waiting for you on the other end once you have sacrificed your life. I know that would put a smile even on the biggest prude geek.

      Wouldn't it be better if at least one partner knew what they were doing - and no, having watched japanese porn cartoons doesn't count ?

      --

      Forget magic. Any technology distinguishable from divine power is insufficiently advanced.

    6. Re:Maybe it's like gambling by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      "lose", not "loose"

    7. Re:Maybe it's like gambling by Ced_Ex · · Score: 1

      Like in TF2, when you 'dominate' someone you become their 'nemesis' - and so they'll come back seeking revenge... :) I hate getting dominated. The only way it could be worse, is if instead of being dominated, they replace it with being "Owned". *sigh*

      --
      Live forever, or die trying.
    8. Re:Maybe it's like gambling by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      ur so pwned

    9. Re:Maybe it's like gambling by Kamikaze+Chipmunk · · Score: 2, Funny

      Yeah, but nobody ever said they'd be virgins of the preferred gender.

      --
      If government were a product, selling it would be illegal. - P.J. O'Rourke
    10. Re:Maybe it's like gambling by wattrlz · · Score: 1

      It will never cease to amaze me how so many people fail to consider how these 72 souls promised to them managed to live their entire lives as virgins. Sure, maybe one or two might've been vestal, but by now they've probably had to start padding the numbers a bit.

    11. Re:Maybe it's like gambling by Torvaun · · Score: 1

      I'm sure they'll have gotten the hang of it after the first few virgins.

      --
      I see your informative link, and raise you a pithy comment.
    12. Re:Maybe it's like gambling by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Learn to spell you illiterate fucktard.

  5. not with every game... by Floritard · · Score: 5, Funny

    Yea not if it's a fucking spy and my medic just got uber. Nothing zen-like tends to follow that.

    1. Re:not with every game... by rootofevil · · Score: 1

      similarly annoying when its a crit rocket - especially when shot blindly or at someone else (ie you walking right into it)

      --
      turn up the jukebox and tell me a lie
    2. Re:not with every game... by MagPulse · · Score: 1

      You mean the spy got you before your medic was able to right click? Or can spies get you while you're ubered?!

    3. Re:not with every game... by ShakaUVM · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Yeah, I'm not sure why Valve thought it would be a great idea to let you take screenshots every time you die. Is that *really* what people want to record during a FPS?

    4. Re:not with every game... by Ailure · · Score: 1

      *shrug*

      Sometimes the deathcam shows a rather hilarious moment, so urging the player to take a screenshot isn't a bad idea. Besides F5 takes a screenshot at any time, though it's only on the deathcam where it have noticeable flash and sound effect.

  6. Do gamers enjoy kimchi in first person shooters? by leftie · · Score: 0, Offtopic

    The experience of violent death, and the experience of eating kimchi is kinda similar, after all.

  7. I like it if I get pwned by Pojut · · Score: 1

    I recently started playing Battlefield 2 on the PC again. I had forgotten how many truly skilled people there are that play this game. I was always decent at it, but never great. Still, I can hold my own. I tend to stick to clan servers. Even though I am outclassed by most of the folks I play against, it's almost 100% assured that it will be a mature and hard-fought round.

    There are some people who are almost inhuman in their ability to aim with a mouse. This is recognizable depending on the situation I am in...if I get copmletely pwned by someone, I love it. I don't like the fact that I was bested, but it's always great fun seeing talented folks work up close.

    1. Re:I like it if I get pwned by sm62704 · · Score: 1

      There are some people who are almost inhuman in their ability to aim with a mouse.

      Those "people" are more properly called "bots".

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    2. Re:I like it if I get pwned by Pojut · · Score: 1

      Not on the servers that I frequent. They definitely make mistakes, and they definitely miss sometimes. Most of the time, the servers that I play on have a very high level of coordination and tactics displayed by both sides...the commander-->squad leader-->squad member chain of command is utilized very effectively, and it's quite obvious that these folks are good at what they do.

      Not everyone that is outstanding at an FPS is a bot. I have a friend who is very much like FPS_Doug (from Pure Pwnage) in that he almost always comes in first and usually only dies from grenades or teamkills. I met him through other friends, and he became a regular out our little LAN parties (anywhere between 10-20 people). The guy is unnaturally good with a sniper rifle...and he is just as good no matter which computer of ours he was using. Through him, I have met many others just like him.

      Besides, spotting a bot user isn't all that difficult...I would say that it is downright obvious in most cases. The folks whose servers I frequent are just people that have taken a lot of time to perfect their abilities and their performance shows it.

    3. Re:I like it if I get pwned by WeeLad · · Score: 1

      The deaths I appreciated in BF2 were when I was sniping. I would turn my focus to a new rooftop only to realize that another sniper was looking directly at me. As soon as I recognize them as a sniper and see them fire, I'm toast.

      --
      Seriously, Don't take anything I say seriously.
    4. Re:I like it if I get pwned by Pojut · · Score: 1

      Many times, if I'm playing on a sniper-only server with really skilled people, it's almost like they wait until I turn to face them and THEN shoot me. Most of the time when I get sniped on those servers, I usually see the person only just barely before I see the muzzle flash (and the expected death scream)

    5. Re:I like it if I get pwned by sm62704 · · Score: 1

      Sssh, don't tell anybody but it was an OLD JOKE. I was never a great Quake player but even I got accused of being a bot at times!

      Now I see why sometimes when I'm shooting for "funny" I get "+5 insightful." So just to prevent that from happening I'm reprinting one of the Christmas Carols I ran every December back in the now-defunct "Springfield Fragfest" (it's still at archive.org, or at least a lot of it is). I hope I don't get the lame "You have too few characters per line" lame filter. Give it a bit of thought and you'll see how it relates to bots.

      Rudolph the four legged Stroggie
      Had a very deadly tongue
      And if you ever saw it,
      You would prolly die real young.

      All of the other stroggies
      Used to laugh and call him names
      They never let poor Rudolph
      Join in any deathmatch games

      Then one bloody Christmas eve
      Shambler came to say
      Rudolph with your tongue so long
      Come take care of Dennis Fong

      Then all the stroggies loved him
      And they shouted out with glee
      Rudolph the four legged stroggie
      Come on up and play with me!

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    6. Re:I like it if I get pwned by Pojut · · Score: 1

      Once my kids are old enough to sing songs...oh yeah:-)

    7. Re:I like it if I get pwned by sm62704 · · Score: 3, Funny

      I think my youngest was 12 when I did those, I recorded her singing "Grandpa got dismembered by a shambler" and "I saw Mommie Fragging Santa Claus" and posted MP3s.

      The ex freaked out over the second one; it had someone in a Kenny skin getting fragged with a sample from South Park saying "you bastard!" The future Evil-X was not amused. "That better not be one of MY kids!"

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    8. Re:I like it if I get pwned by X0563511 · · Score: 1

      That's not Quake. That's Quake II.

      Long Live the axe!!

      --
      For large sets, this will be our guide even unto death, for the LORD will work for each type of data it is applied to...
    9. Re:I like it if I get pwned by sm62704 · · Score: 1

      That's not Quake. That's Quake II.

      Ssh, none of these kids will know the difference. And dammit you're right, the ax was my favorite weapon!

      But I liked the chain saw in DOOM better.

      Somebody's going to frag that mod for that "offtopic" moderation when the metamods get hold of him.

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
  8. death for a good cause is satisfying by Kristoph · · Score: 4, Interesting

    I don't know about first person shooters but I must say that in WoW I get a certain satisfaction from dying 'in the name of the cause', like causing an alliance wipe in AV on Galv with a last ditch fear or dropping from the cliff onto the GM to keep the flag from getting capped.

    ]{

    1. Re:death for a good cause is satisfying by halivar · · Score: 1

      Very true. A good paladin uses BoP, LoH and DI for his friends and takes it for the group. It's very satisfying to get it right when the crap hits the fan.

    2. Re:death for a good cause is satisfying by Peeet · · Score: 1

      I agree with the part about self sacrifice for the benefit of the team, but as for the rest, I hope I speak for some of us when I say ... What??!?

    3. Re:death for a good cause is satisfying by Jedi+Alec · · Score: 1

      Don't know about WoW, but in EvE Online, Stiletto's are cheap are plentiful. Fellow players will know what I mean ;-)

      --

      People replying to my sig annoy me. That's why I change it all the time.
  9. Ups N Downs of Dying by flyneye · · Score: 2

    Dying in the commision of my objective isn't so bad.
    Spawn killing and Tking piss me off,M'kay?
    Urban Terror Rules!

    --
    *Repent!Quit Your Job!Slack Off!The World Ends Tomorrow and You May Die!
  10. Re:What? by Floritard · · Score: 1

    You commented. Apparently it provokes discussion.

  11. Only when interesting... by i.r.id10t · · Score: 4, Insightful

    Only when it is an interesting death, or a particularly cool suicide move - sorta like the teleporter "accidents" in classic Quake/QuakeWorld

    --
    Don't blame me, I voted for Kodos
    1. Re:Only when interesting... by viper66 · · Score: 1

      I quite enjoyed doing kamikaze jeep runs in early versions of BF1942. If you hit a tank just right with a jeep going full speed it would explode. It was the most effective way to eliminate a tank. They 'fixed' this is later versions though.

    2. Re:Only when interesting... by IndustrialComplex · · Score: 1

      It's been a while since I did this, and it was hard to find someone who had 1/2 a brain to cooperate with you on a public server, but...

      Spawn as an engineer, take the jeep and get it at the back of your base, toss in a few explosives and have someone else drive it. Detonate it at the proper time. :D It was great for nailing tanks.

      (You had to have someone else drive for the best effect since your explosives would vanish on the death of the engineer, but it also gave you a good view of the best time to detonate)

      --
      Out of modpoints but really liked a post? 1BDkF6TtmmeZ3yqXbz9yhdYVqRYnwFoXDj
    3. Re:Only when interesting... by Blancmange · · Score: 2, Interesting

      I agree. A couple of my favourite deaths:

      From a nice wee sniping spot, I zap Lerc into oblivion at long range with a railgun as he's running across my field of view. While I'm giggling like a maniac, I failed to notice that he's launched a rocket at me an instant before he snuffed it. Three second later, I'm staring right into the nose cone of a rocket that appeared to grow out from the crosshair, wondering what on Earth could the strange, symmetrical object be. "Hey, isn't that a..." (Shades of The Noah's Ark Principle)

      Lerc and I are fighting on an elevated, moving conveyor belt. He knows I have a BFG so he hides in a small room off to one side of the belt, depriving me of a line of sight. I step off the belt and onto the rail and bounce a grenade from the far wall and into the room in which Lerc is cowering.

      I turn to gain some extra distance from the imminent explosion and find a big crate in my face. Although I'm not actually on the moving belt, the crate (being carried by the belt) has caught the edge of my body and is pushing me in Lerc's direction. "Arrrgh! No! No! Stop it!"

      Shortly there was Lerc and me standing in a small space with a grenade on the floor between us. Sheepishly, I manage to say "Hi!" just before the grenade performs its giblet-making function.

      This is one of the reasons I like physically oriented games. Stuff happens that the programmer never explicitly coded.

      --
      Blancmange
    4. Re:Only when interesting... by wildstoo · · Score: 1

      Sounds like you're talking about Q2DM8. I gained notoriety amongst my clanmates for being utterly useless in that area of that level. I was basically banned from playing clanmatches on that map because I was a liability.

      I'd be going for the BFG (because I was so lame and found it almost impossible to get a kill with any other weapon) and I'd misstep or someone would fire at me and I'd be trying to dodge and almost every time I'd end up between a moving crate and the wall. Gibs ahoy! The console would just be filled with lines and lines of "StOo was squished".

  12. tail end of a quake quad rocket by Brigadier · · Score: 3, Insightful



    I recall the glory days of quake world. There was no feeling like camping in the dark and seeing a quad rocket launcher coming in your direction. You just knew it was over the only thing you could do was pay homage to whichever POS it was who sighted you hung on some rune in a dark corner.

  13. Sometimes I like dying in an FPS by halivar · · Score: 5, Funny

    Like when someone sticks me with a plasma grenade, and I chase them down and take them with me. That's satisfying.

    1. Re:Sometimes I like dying in an FPS by sm62704 · · Score: 1

      The Department of Homeland Security will be paying you avisit shortly, Mr. Suicide Bomber!

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    2. Re:Sometimes I like dying in an FPS by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      I'm in the closely related "nade of doom" camp... I've got dropping a live grenade upon death down to a science.. and surprisingly it still gets people about a third of the time.

      Tip: move AWAY from the corpse for a few seconds, THEN pick up the ammo.

  14. Zen state my ass... by provigilman · · Score: 5, Funny
    Obviously, this guy has never me at a Halo party... I don't go into "Zen" when I die, I just do a lot of cursing.

    For example, spawning on a grendade that kills you about 0.5 seconds after you come back usually elicits the following response: "&%#! you mother #@%!$&, that was bull$&#!"

    --
    "Life's short and hard, like a body building elf." -- The Bloodhound Gang
    1. Re:Zen state my ass... by rant64 · · Score: 1

      Most of us who DO practice Zen tradition are invulnerable for three seconds after respawning.

      You should be working at that.

    2. Re:Zen state my ass... by fm6 · · Score: 1

      You're just one data point. There are a lot more out there.

      Probably most people are like you. But there are definitely folks out there who fantasize about dying. Everybody's familiar with the Japanese cultural obsession with suicide. Japan is not actually all that unusual — they're just more honest about it.

      Go troll the web sites and IM channels that cater to people who do sexual role playing. You'll find lots of people with very violent, cruel fantasy lives. OK, that's not surprising, but the fact is these folks have no problem finding other folks to play "victim".

      Did somebody just yell out "Sick"? Please. Everybody's sexual practices offend somebody. That's why we (well, most of us) do it in private. Keep it between consenting adults, and there's no harm. Quite the opposite, in fact: the line between sane citizen and serial killer (or, in this context, kinky role player and suicide) is often just finding a safe way to express your bents.

  15. A different analysis by digitalderbs · · Score: 4, Insightful

    The study found that "death of the player's own character...appear[s] to increase some aspects of positive emotion
    I have a much more simple explanation. Players like it because it means that they're not being ignored. Having "friends" that pay attention to you is a huge plus for geeks.
    1. Re:A different analysis by sm62704 · · Score: 1

      Having "friends" that pay attention to you is a huge plus for geeks.

      Having friends that pay attention to you is a huge plus for anybody.

      --
      mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    2. Re:A different analysis by gsslay · · Score: 5, Insightful

      It sounds to me that the researchers here got way too involved with gameplay "dying", simply because it's called "dying". Would they be attempting draw the same conclusions if it was called "5 minute time-out", which is what it has more in common with real life?

      "Dying" in an online game is nothing like dying. You are not faced with any finality. It is not the ultimate sacrifice and not the grim reaper that comes to us all, without option. It's just part of your participation in the game, a small set-back, a respite from the action.

      So any comparison with the zen of after-life experience is the biggest load of hooey you're likely to encounter this week.

    3. Re:A different analysis by Mr.+Sanity · · Score: 3, Insightful

      I agree with this sentiment. Really, in most FPS games, you need to divorce yourself from the thought of "dying." Very often, it is to your (and your team's) advantage to perform tactical self-sacrifice. Scout and a Soldier about to cap Point A? Hop onto the platform to pause the cap. Sure they're shooting at you. But if you can take one or both with you, great! If not, at least you paused the cap long enough for teammates to show up and stop the cap. Besides, if you "die", you have a few seconds of watching the action and seeing hotspots on the map before coming back good as new. Hell, sometimes dying in combat is more convenient that hunting down a medic or waiting for a med pack to spawn when on your last point of health.

    4. Re:A different analysis by evanbd · · Score: 1

      You, sir, need to play more Nethack.

    5. Re:A different analysis by mh1997 · · Score: 1

      "Dying" in an online game is nothing like dying. You are not faced with any finality.
      No, dying in an online game is exactly the same as in real life - except you get 72 virgins, or at least that is what they tell us at the mosque.
    6. Re:A different analysis by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Its Monday and there's a presidential campaign going on... Give it time. The hooey ain't even ankle deep yet.

    7. Re:A different analysis by 3mpire · · Score: 1

      "Dying" in an online game is nothing like dying. ever get killed right off the bat in a game type that has no respawn? having to sit there for ten minutes while your team mates flail around trying to defuse the bomb is maddeningly close to eternal damnation.

    8. Re:A different analysis by bensode · · Score: 1

      Re-do that study with EQ play prior to the Planes of Power expansion. Yeah ... 3 day corpse retrievals in Plane of Fear. I remember those. Talk about finality ...

      --
      "Keep at least 3-6 full bottles of hard alcohol on hand, a 2 week resignation notice,..." - Poetmatt
    9. Re:A different analysis by dwpro · · Score: 1

      I think they should do the study on "hardcore" mode on diablo, where a char is lost forever when you die. I can remeber disbelief, regret, and sadness when dying there as opposed to some fps where I respawn in 5 seconds.

      --
      Millions long for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon. -- Susan Ertz
    10. Re:A different analysis by ozbird · · Score: 1

      Would they be attempting draw the same conclusions if it was called "5 minute time-out", which is what it has more in common with real life?

      Do you mean "Counter-Strike"? No respawns suck.

    11. Re:A different analysis by RobinH · · Score: 1

      That's a good point. It's kind of like getting caught in a game of tag, or getting hit with the ball in dodge-ball. You know you're out, so you take a deep breath and relax a bit.

      --
      "I have never let my schooling interfere with my education." - Mark Twain
    12. Re:A different analysis by electrosoccertux · · Score: 1

      Um, how about counterstrike?

    13. Re:A different analysis by Tranzistors · · Score: 2, Interesting

      you need to divorce yourself from the thought of "dying."

      You don't believe in reincarnation, now do you? Nor do you feel like a part of something grater, where your life holds no special value. Joy of death is nothing new. I don't talk about spawn kills (that is how infants in India must feel like), I am talking about a) honourable death; b) natural death.

      a) Dying in battle for greater good is quite a popular theme. Freedom fighters with suicidal tactics comes to mind. And Valhalla is not always necessary.

      b) Not everybody thinks of the death as the ultimate horror. Maybe for some the thought of respawning seems natural (And who knows, maybe they do), in this frame of mind death is soothing.

      Self test: if you were sure you would reincarnate and would find yourself in tough battle for something you hold valuable, would you not "enjoy" it?

    14. Re:A different analysis by humpolec · · Score: 1

      Permadeath in roguelikes is MUCH different; and the fear of dying and losing several hours of gameplay makes the game much more exciting, as every decision becomes significant. There is no zen-like feeling after you die, though. Only a lot of swearing and rage.

    15. Re:A different analysis by CSMatt · · Score: 1

      Having "friends" that pay attention to you is a huge plus for geeks. "Friends" is nice.

      Women would be nicer.
    16. Re:A different analysis by LoztInSpace · · Score: 1

      You've already got access to the 72 virgins who you're online with.

    17. Re:A different analysis by Ghaan · · Score: 1

      Very true. A few times while playing CS I just rushed blindly to "get killed" asap meaning I needed a few mins for bathroom break...

    18. Re:A different analysis by wildstoo · · Score: 1

      Yep, dying in the game can be very convenient. In TF2 I frequently make suicide runs deep into the enemy base as Scout so I know where the turrets are located. When I inevitably die I respawn as a Soldier and go destroy them.

      I doubt any real-world military forces use similar tactics with much success.

      On the other hand, sometimes I plan my deaths to minimize inconvenience to myself. In World of Warcraft (PvE) often when I know I'm about to die and will need to run back to my corpse, my final moments will be spent trying to move to a convenient, easily accessible and safe place to die so my resurrection will be less hassle.

      No matter what tenuous metaphysical/psychological spin you put on it, personal "death" in games has almost no relationship with death in the real world. The fact that you can use it to your own advantage attests to that.

  16. So much for training on FPSs... by aslvrstn · · Score: 1

    Nothing's better on the battlefield than that moment of relief before your next respawn. Oh wait...

  17. Re:What? by moderatorrater · · Score: 2, Interesting

    Because there's an interesting study of psychology here, and finding out how the brain works is one of the most important things that we can do this next century. It's an interesting result because death is usually considered bad in these games, so why would gamers enjoy them? Is it to get a respite from the action? Is it because they feel they've achieved something by their death? Is it because that segment of action is done and they feel the fulfillment of everything that happened that life? There are applications beyond gaming and, honestly, even if it didn't, it's pretty damn interesting.

  18. Obnoxious? by s20451 · · Score: 1

    That was easy.

    http://www.digra.org:8080/Plone/dl/db/06278.36196.pdf

    (It's an earlier version of the work.)

    --
    Toronto-area transit rider? Rate your ride.
  19. Yeah I enjoy dying by Cornflake917 · · Score: 4, Funny

    I enjoy dying so much that a few times in college, when dying in a Counter-Strike game, I picked up my monitor and threw it. I was smart enough to throw it on my bed, however. My roommate was kind of scared of me.

    1. Re:Yeah I enjoy dying by boyko.at.netqos · · Score: 1

      I'm kind of scared of you now.

      --
      I used to work for NetQoS. I no longer do, but want to keep the excellent karma attached to this account.
  20. Yeah right by the+computer+guy+nex · · Score: 1

    The study found that "death of the player's own character...appear[s] to increase some aspects of positive emotion."

    The study needs to listen to the endless stream of obscenities on Xbox Live after a Halo 3 death (me included, unfortunately).
    1. Re:Yeah right by jbeaupre · · Score: 1

      The study found that "death of the player's own character...appear[s] to increase some aspects of positive emotion."

      The study needs to listen to the endless stream of obscenities on Xbox Live after a Halo 3 death (me included, unfortunately).

      Therefor swearing has positive emotional aspects. No surprise there.
      --
      The world is made by those who show up for the job.
  21. Utter bullshit by sm62704 · · Score: 0, Offtopic
    I used to be heavily into Quake (the domain the archive.org link was far has long since lapsed; I think it's a porn site now). The games are fun. And "dying" in the game is part of the fun!

    The worst part about Quake was when the shambler pisses on you carpet. Ok, that only happened at my site, in the daily updates that were not too unlike my slashdot journals. Today's has a lunatic attempting murder, if you can believe that.

    Whoever did this poor excuse for a study needs to fail whatever course he was taking.

    -mcgrew

    hulkawire frags webmasters
            Went out Friday night, and when we got back, windoze didn't know the PC had a modem.
            "What did you do to my computer?!?!" Heh heh, the modem's in Becky's PC. I felt sorry for the kids. "Leila was on it after I was!" Leila was asleep.
            Of course, I have to fix it. Damned plug n pray, windoze would only install the stupid modem into a port it was already using.
            It was pretty late before I could get windoze to understand that it was supposed to see not only a modem but another port. Which is why there was no nooze yesterday.
            So when I did get online, I found I had not only lots of mail, but more than I expected.
            Hulkawire is online! I may never have to surf for nooze again!
            If you have a gaming news page, you owe it to yourself to go there. Here are a few tidbits of FPSers:
            Gibworld is reviewing Earth worm Jim. Here's a quote- "...some sound effects are played FAR too much! The waiter aliens, for example, squeak as they walk, and in a small gang of them can sound like somebody sexually molesting a dog's chewy toy."
            If you're a UO2 fan, The Nethergate opened its "doors" as the newest Ultima Online 2 fan site.
            PC Paradox has another editorial. The article is a little rant about the age old topic of UT vs. Q3. Sure it's been beaten to death, but so what? Get out your whips and flog the dirt where the decomposed horse used to be, and may the best FPS win!
            The Frag Pipe has just added an additional 9 Team Fortress 2 Screen Shots, having a total of 67 Screen Shots. They also have a calendar by Marc Lange available for download. 1/30/2000
    --
    mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
    1. Re:Utter bullshit by b3m87 · · Score: 0

      The best part was that last bit "The Frag Pipe has just added an additional 9 Team Fortress 2 Screen Shots, having a total of 67 Screen Shots. They also have a calendar by Marc Lange available for download" I guess TF2 was released on time.

  22. not this gamer by Ogive17 · · Score: 2, Informative

    I cuss like a sailor when I die in a game... typically followed by accusations everyone else is cheating.

    Imagine that German kid from the youtube video (i'd link if I wasn't at work).. and that's basically me.. except I'm a bit older, not quite a pudgy, speak English.. and only rant for about 10 seconds.

    --
    "Action without philosophy is a lethal weapon; philosophy without action is worthless."
    1. Re:not this gamer by XanC · · Score: 3, Funny
    2. Re:not this gamer by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Aye. I've never experienced anything approaching zen-like clarity after a death, especially a gank. I see red, spew invective, smash table, repeat. Like shampoo, but with anger control issues. :)

      Also, is this an academic study? Kind of a waste it seems. Comparable to an English prof who explicates Jim Morrison's poetry and something that I'll never, ever read.

    3. Re:not this gamer by Cruciform · · Score: 1

      The German kid was just acting though.
      He made a series of videos of "characters" like that, and that one spun out of control.

    4. Re:not this gamer by Trogre · · Score: 1

      Interesting watching the translated version. It claims in the summary:

      From his blog: http://www.was-willst-du-tun.de/

      I am not mad (translated)
      http://www.google.com/translate_c?hl=...
      "I am not sick or mad, I only have a sense of humor not everyone immediately understands. In addition, I have acting talent. I can do something so real that many think it is real. For this reason I will be insulted by many and hated. The aim of my videos or movies is to entertain people, not provoke. Nobody should take my short videos on the Internet seriously - they are merely for entertainment. No matter what people think or say, I am a very normal boy with acting talent."
      - N. K. (aka "Slikk" or "Der echte Gangster")

      How it started (translated, how the character was born)
      http://www.google.com/translate_c?hl=...
      _____________________________________

      Video information:

      This video was made as a response to some German politicians attempting to restrict access to violent video games. He was trying to show how they view gamers. Very amusing and intelligent. Too bad most people missed the point.

      "Journalists" from Focus TV (Germany) used this as an example of an internet addict, claiming the kid to have been secretly taped by his father and to be undergoing therapy in addiction clinic. Naturally, this was not what "Leopold" understood to have agreed on when he gave approval for airing it on TV.
      Source (translated, click "SCHLIESSEN" if add comes up):

      --
      "Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
  23. 007 Nightfire by comm2k · · Score: 5, Funny

    With a crappy game like 007 Nightfire of course I'd be relieved as well if could take a moment and not have to play this crap.

    1. Re:007 Nightfire by realthing02 · · Score: 2, Insightful

      interestingly enough, this is what I was thinking. Why not pick a game that, you know, more people play? I didn't read TFA but i'd like to see more/better games. maybe Call of Duty, Halo, etc, because they employ the similar disassociation upon death that the summary mentions.

    2. Re:007 Nightfire by 644bd346996 · · Score: 1
      The game they used as a control was Super Monkey Ball 2.

      Also, from TFA,

      Participants were 36 Finnish undergraduate students (25 men and 11 women; age range = 20-30 years). All participants played video or computer games at least once a month. They participated in return for three movie tickets. Where can I sign up?

      They apparently also measured how psychotic the participants were prior to the experiment. They found that the more psychotic gamers were less affected by successfully wounding an opponent.
    3. Re:007 Nightfire by instar · · Score: 1

      Odd control to use, imo.

      Dying in games like that make me MUCH more angry than dying in an FPS, because if I fail it's wholly due to my own skill (or lack thereof). At least FPS death has the potential to be humorous and/or satisfying (dropping a grenade as you die and taking your killer with you, for example, or choosing the right moment to kill yourself as a tactical measure). I bought that stupid Kororinpa marble game for Wii (similar to Super Monkey Ball, IIRC?) and by the time I'd fallen off the track for the 18th time in a row, I was ridiculously frustrated and cursing. Yet my friends and I still get together to play classic Halo deathmatch regularly.

    4. Re:007 Nightfire by mrb000gus · · Score: 1

      So if they were playing Goldeneye Rogue Agent they'd have enjoyed it even more?

  24. New players? by Dan+East · · Score: 1

    Perhaps this is true of new players, for whom the change of POV and death animation is new and thus entertaining. For someone used to the game, dying means losing, and most people don't play to lose, thus it doesn't make sense that they would find that enjoyable. When I play FPS games, the period after dying is often spent beating on my keyboard until I respawn, not enjoying an animation sequence I've seen plenty of times before.

    --
    Better known as 318230.
  25. Depends Call OF Duty 4 Example by Buzz_Litebeer · · Score: 4, Insightful

    When I die in COD 4 while defending an objective, or simply beat out by someone more clever/luckier than I am when running the map, it is fine. Especially if the death is in a last ditch effort against a group of players while defending in Headquarters or Domination.

    What gets me angry, cursing and fuming, is dieing pointlessly to helicopters, martyrdom and other elements which detract from skillful play. I also dislike dieing after spawning with my back to someone pointing a gun to my head, or dieing from a grenade that landed right where I was spawning.

    So I think it really comes down to what kind of "death" it is.

    --
    If you don't vote, you don't matter, so don't waste your time telling me your opinion
    1. Re:Depends Call OF Duty 4 Example by Aqualung812 · · Score: 1

      What gets me angry, cursing and fuming, is dieing pointlessly to helicopters, martyrdom and other elements which detract from skillful play.

      How does that detract from skillful play? Helicopters are only granted after a 7 kill streak (go get that camper before he gets there!), and after they are called, a SKILLFUL RPG and a few shots from a rifle will take it out.

      Martyrdom takes away from other benefits, so there is give and take there. Either go to the Harcore games where some idiot with that on will kill his own teammates, OR learn to "hot potato" that nade toward the bad guys.

      It is still skill.

      --
      Grammer Nazis - I mod you "troll" unless you actually add something on-topic. Yes, I know I have mispellings in my sig.
    2. Re:Depends Call OF Duty 4 Example by metsu · · Score: 1

      CoD4 rewards campers by giving them helis and airstrikes more often.
      They're nice features, but they end up being used mostly by the campers.
      You get less rewards by advancing (more deaths), but it's more fun in the end.

      Matyrdom just contributes to the spam. and it magically makes a grenade even if you used up all of them.
      It's just a silly score crutch. but at least you can see who is using it.

      The grenade launcher addon is another crutch for easy kills.

      It's not fun getting killed by crutches, the throwback feature doesn't help much. 8 times out of 10, it's already too late to throw back.

    3. Re:Depends Call OF Duty 4 Example by WeeLad · · Score: 1
      Definitely too many airstrikes, especially on the larger servers where there is almost constant bombing. There's nothing satisfying about spawning in the middle of an airstrike. I haven't seen much of a respawn invulnerability on most of the servers I frequent.


      Though, if you want satisfying deaths, I recently learned about the zombies mod. Apparently it was done in Call of Duty 2, but CoD4 is my first experience with it. Get killed by a zombie and you turn into one. Eventually, nearly everyone is just one of the horde streaming into buildings to get at the remaining few survivors.

      --
      Seriously, Don't take anything I say seriously.
    4. Re:Depends Call OF Duty 4 Example by Buzz_Litebeer · · Score: 1

      Heheh sure sure sure. My friends and I have studied how to game the system, especially in hardcore Headquarters mode where you can force the respawn of the enemy team if you have 3 players working together to do so.

      You get 3 kills, then 5 kills (which is pretty easy to do if all your doing is Dming in Headquarters) then you call in an airstrike which usually gets 5-6 kills because your using your buddies to pull a UAV.

      Then, it becomes a string of helicopters a string of airstrikes, over and over and over.

      It is not that helicopters are _bad_ per se, but because they allow momentum in most of the game types that is nearly impossible to turn around. This is also related to spawn camping, which is essentially the root problem. If you can figure out where the enemy is spawning, you just camp outside of it. and BAM game over.

      --
      If you don't vote, you don't matter, so don't waste your time telling me your opinion
    5. Re:Depends Call OF Duty 4 Example by StargateSteve · · Score: 1

      Don't forget the FN P-90 noobs that go on suicide runs with martyr or last stand. A goddamn RPG to the face should kill the guy, but NOOOO! he goes down, pulls a pistol, and kills me. Then some bastard comes along and steals my kill before he dies.

  26. Further research. by fahrbot-bot · · Score: 1
    And much like real-life near-death experiences, it tends to suffuse me with a curiously zen-like feeling.

    I'm not sure I can agree as I have few points for comparison, so a little research is in order. Let me get a warn bath going and a straight blade and I'll get back to you in a bit ... #`%${%&`+'${`%& - NO CARRIER.

    --
    It must have been something you assimilated. . . .
  27. Do players enjoy dying in first person shooters? by bk4u · · Score: 1

    Only the emo ones

    --
    Remember kids, with great power comes great opportunity to abuse that power
  28. Goldeneye by Kamineko · · Score: 2, Informative

    That's Nightfire. Of course, in a better multiplayer FPS, such as GoldenEye or Perfect Dark, you're stuck inside the character with 'blood' streaming down your screen. (Not forgetting the musical cue!)

  29. Text of Journal Article (1 Table and Plot omitted) by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 5, Informative

    The Psychophysiology of James Bond : Phasic Emotional Responses to Violent Video Game Events
    By: Niklas Ravaja
    Center for Knowledge and Innovation Research, Helsinki School of Economics, Helsinki, Finland
    Marko Turpeinen
    Helsinki Institute for Information Technology, Helsinki University of Technology, Helsinki, Finland
    Timo Saari
    Center for Knowledge and Innovation Research, Helsinki School of Economics, Helsinki, Finland
    Sampsa Puttonen
    Department of Psychology, University of Helsinki, Finland
    Liisa Keltikangas-Järvinen
    Department of Psychology, University of Helsinki, Finland

    Acknowledgement: This study was supported by the Finnish Funding Agency for Technology and Innovation and European Community NEST project 28765: "The Fun of Gaming: Measuring the Human Experience of Media Enjoyment."

    Correspondence concerning this article should be addressed to: Niklas Ravaja, Center for Knowledge and Innovation Research, Helsinki School of Economics, P.O. Box 1210, FIN-00101, Helsinki, Finland Electronic Mail may be sent to: ravaja@hse.fi.

    We know very little about phasic emotional responses elicited by violent video game events, although they might mediate the potential harmful effects of violent games (Ravaja, Saari, Salminen, Laarni, & Kallinen, 2006). Several (although not all) authors have concluded that there is a causal relationship between violent video game play and aggressive behavior, cognitions, and affect (for meta-analyses, see Anderson, 2004; Anderson & Bushman, 2001; for an alternative meta-analysis, see Sherry, 2001). Violent games may elicit not only self-reported aggressive affect (i.e., feelings of anger or hostility) but also anxiety (fear; Anderson & Ford, 1986). An apparent limitation of the studies using self-report to measure emotional responses is that they neglect the fact that different game events may elicit different, even opposing, emotional responses (Ravaja, Saari, Salminen, et al., 2006). Prior studies have also shown that exposure to violent video games increases physiological arousal (e.g., Ballard & Weist, 1996; for a meta-analysis, see Anderson & Bushman, 2001). However, these studies have used tonic measures (e.g., 1-min mean physiological values) that give no information on responses elicited by specific, instantaneous game events.

    The present study was designed to examine phasic psychophysiological responses indexing emotional valence and arousal elicited by violent events in the first-person shooter video game "James Bond 007: NightFire." Facial electromyographic (EMG) activity over zygomaticus major and corrugator supercilii was used to index positive and negative emotions, respectively (e.g., Lang, Greenwald, Bradley, & Hamm, 1993; Ravaja, 2004a), and orbicularis oculi activity was used to index positively valenced high-arousal emotions (Ravaja, Saari, Kallinen, & Laarni, 2006; Witvliet & Vrana, 1995). Electrodermal activity (EDA) was used as an index of arousal (Ravaja, 2004a). Obviously, violent video games (e.g., first-person shooters) involve at least two different types of events that might elicit differential emotional responses: (a) The player (or player's character) wounds or kills an opponent and (b) the opponent wounds or kills the player's character. Given that wounding or killing an opponent represents a victory and a success in the game (and in a real gun fight), these events might elicit positively valenced arousal as indexed by facial EMG activity and EDA (Hypothesis 1a). However, the deeply ingrained moral code says that injuring or killing another human being is wrong, and symbolic aggression enacted by the player may elicit anxiety (see Anderson & Ford, 1986). Therefore, an alternative hypothesis would be that wounding or killing an opponent would elicit negatively valenced arousal (i.e., anxiety) as indexed by increased EDA and corrugator EMG activity and decreased zygomatic and orbicularis oculi activity (Hypothesis 1b).

    Individuals scoring high on the Psychotici

  30. Re:What? by Cctoide · · Score: 1

    It's better than yet another piece about crazy Microsoft marketing schemes and how the year of Linux on the desktop is coming, not to mention the week-long global warming flamefest and... you get the picture.

    --
    "Let's face it, it's a good story. Accuracy would kill it."
  31. Research? by hyades1 · · Score: 2, Informative

    I hope they didn't spend a huge amount of money on this research. Unless you're the rankest amateur, your character will probably survive until you get into a fairly impossible situation. So basically, you're 100% focussed, concentrating, fingers going crazy on whatever control mechanism you're using. I almost guarantee the last thing you did as that final bad guy popped up and you couldn't get your sights on him in time was pound on the fire button in a futile attempt to do the impossible. Then, all of a sudden, you're done. You take a deep breath, blink a few times, roll your shoulders, relax all those cramped muscles and maybe reach for your beer.

    Wouldn't that pretty much account for whatever readings they're getting? Or, to put it a little less elegantly, "I got your 'intriguing aesthetic question' right here".

    --
    I've calculated my velocity with such exquisite precision that I have no idea where I am.
    1. Re:Research? by jdigriz · · Score: 1

      Total agreement here. When you're playing, you're doing your level best not to die and to frag other players. It's fun, but it's also stressful. When you finally get shot, you can chill for a bit because you're not intently trying not to die at that moment.

    2. Re:Research? by Atriqus · · Score: 1

      Don't worry, they didn't. I just skimmed over the article: they just monitored the facial expressions of 36 finnish students playing 007 and super monkey ball.

      --
      Hey, look! It's Bono's brother.
  32. Dying means you're being challenged by MooseMuffin · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Have you ever played a FPS where you're on the clearly better team and you just clobber the other guys for several rounds? For me it gets old real fast and I'll go find a more balanced server. If you're dying, you're at least being challenged. Its motivating and sometimes it gives you a particular opponent to gun for.

    1. Re:Dying means you're being challenged by aitikin · · Score: 4, Insightful

      I was seriously just about to post something similar to this. Dying means that there's still a reason to play. It's like when you played Super Mario and couldn't get past that blasted level. You died time and time again, but finally found a way through.

      I know when I die in multiplayer games, my face kinda lights up like, "Aw, shit! How'd he get me!?" It's just kinda the nature of the beast, isn't it?

      --
      "Don't meddle in the affairs of a patent dragon, for thou art tasty and good with ketchup." ~ohcrapitssteve
    2. Re:Dying means you're being challenged by metsu · · Score: 1

      I don't mind dying, if i can see my flaws... that's why i like deathcams and the-like.
      Feedback is great.
      I froze, i missed a corner while backing up/stuck, i completly failed to see someone coming from the side, i was just out-twitched.
      The frustrating part is when the game allows impossible circumstances.
      not talking about the quad coming around the corner..

      I'm talking about games mmorpgs like WoW or lotro that for some reason the developers sought that it would be fun basing pvp on 'incapacitation' primarly.

      -where the player is just able to see themselves getting killed, with usually no means to counter out
      -lack of proper twitch counters against multiple enemies. where you can can see them coming but there's nothing you can do because of some global cooldown bs

      though, I understand is mostly the laggy nature of mmorpgs that disallow any good realtime counters to occur.

    3. Re:Dying means you're being challenged by orielbean · · Score: 1

      I like how TF2 has that Nemesis indicator when you are owning one person or vice versa - it definitely adds to the fun to single out some dude and stick the knife in when they have thwarted you for several spawns!

    4. Re:Dying means you're being challenged by esper · · Score: 1

      That was my immediate thought as well. I'm surprised it took so long for someone to suggest it.

      This could be validated by comparing reactions to deaths to seemingly random one- or two-shot attacks that the player had no chance to see coming or attempt to defend against (which I find frustrating) vs. reactions when taken down in a hard fight, especially one where the loser appeared to have a chance of winning and/or was trying to hold off an impossible foe for as long as possible for the benefit of teammates (which I find exhilarating and highly engaging - but not as much as when I somehow manage to win against those tough odds).

    5. Re:Dying means you're being challenged by Onymous+Coward · · Score: 1

      I suspect the domination struggle is a huge factor for many players. There are inherent pack mentality mechanisms at play in our brain and I bet that beating the crap out of another player or getting the crap beat out of you each have deep brain chemistry effects.

      Maybe what the researchers are seeing is something related to that more than a superficial, "well, I can relax now" response.

      I bet the Nemesis indicator exacerbates those effects.

    6. Re:Dying means you're being challenged by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Really, to me "dying" in a game is purely cathartic experience. Usually, I'll have been becoming increasingly tense for at least a good few seconds before someone can "finish me off," so the final blow represents a major release of stress, at which point I'm a heck of a lot freer to revel emotionally in the experience.

      I think that comparing it to basic dramatic theory has at least as much validity as the article's theory, especially if you take the in-game context of any given death into question. I get a big "up" after going on a wildly successful offensive. If I'm being particularly demonstrative, you might see me cheering or laughing at such a point; other folk sometimes clap, drum on the table, or even jump up and down in some sort of free-form victory dance at that point. In any case, there you have rising dramatic tension broken at its peak. However, if my avatar is, say, getting spawn-raped in an FPS or taken down by an MMO character 15 levels higher than itself, I'm pretty likely to utter "Bull$#!@" even in an empty room, and many folk are much more demonstrative than that. I take those events as disruptions to my personal "gaming narrative;" my story's hero just got beat down without cause. And, if I'm wiping the floor with all comers, well...nobody likes a bragger, sometimes least of all the one bragging.

  33. I enjoy dying in FPS games? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Says them. Nothing annoys me more than going on a huge killing streak in TF2 and it getting ruined by a stray Crit Rocket/Frontstab/Being bounced to my death.

    I also assume they haven't been locked into spawn by a Demoman. I've had it happen to me and I've done it. Annoying when you are on the receiving end and gratifying when on the giving end. Much like many things in life.

  34. Re:Do gamers enjoy kimchi in first person shooters by sm62704 · · Score: 1

    Flamebait? Ouch! It seems the mods have eaten kimchi. Does that to my ass on its way out, too ;).

    Mexican is worse though.

    --
    mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
  35. Re:Do gamers enjoy kimchi in first person shooters by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Wow, mods are pretty touchy today.

    Well I, for one, had a good laugh at this. Parent can has (+1, Funny)?

  36. You mean people ENJOY playing games by antifoidulus · · Score: 2, Funny

    stop the presses!

    1. Re:You mean people ENJOY playing games by Cctoide · · Score: 1

      The constant internet whining marathons had me fooled for a bit there!

      --
      "Let's face it, it's a good story. Accuracy would kill it."
  37. Oh, I get that satisfaction... by HerculesMO · · Score: 2, Funny

    When I take out 20 guys before I finally die :)

    That way I can use the voice chat to rub it in their faces after the fact :p

    --
    The price is always right if someone else is paying.
  38. Missed Point by zzsmirkzz · · Score: 1

    It could also be the joy in finally seeing (or causing) James Bond's demise. He's been around so long, had so many movies and games, you just gotta want him to die at least once. ;)

  39. End of the Ride by Gunslinger47 · · Score: 2, Insightful

    If you run the same test on roller coaster passengers, I suspect that many might show a similar response at the end of the ride. At that point, you might reflect on your total experience. If you had a good time, you might smile desire to go again. If you're disappointed, your face might sag into a "What? That's it?" expression.

    When I played Counter-Strike, I'd be very pleased upon my death if I managed to take down more than two opponents per round. Death is just the end of the ride and getting upset by it every time seems rather childish to me.

    I can understand the disappointment from a poor death, though. Fsking AWPs. ^_^

  40. Enjoy dying? It depends. by dr_wheel · · Score: 1

    I've been playing online since the original Quake days (and modem-to-modem games like Doom before that) and I've probably logged tens of thousands of hours of FPS gaming. Do I enjoy dying? Generally speaking, no. I'm a competitive player who enjoys playing in online leagues. I don't like losing. Dying == losing.

    I also believe that when you've played so much (as I have) that you are, in fact, desensitized from the whole kill/death thing. I don't think of it as "killing" the opposing player, but rather as stopping them from achieving their goal for that match/round.

    However, there are many instances where dying is enjoyable or outright hilarious, especially when playing casually with friends. Getting blown up and sent rocketing into the air when you fail to defuse a bomb or getting stabbed by a zombie in games like Zombie Mod can be a fun and enjoyable experience.

  41. Mr. Toad's Wild Ride: ends in hell by dpbsmith · · Score: 5, Interesting

    The former Walt Disney World attraction, "Mr. Toad's Wild Ride," ended with the car breaking through railroad crossing gates and heading down the railroad tracks, apparently directly toward an oncoming train. In reality, all that is there besides the sound effects is a dazzlingly bright headlight, making it almost impossible to see that you are heading toward a doorway in the black-painted room.

    As you emerge after your "collision," the final scene in the ride show numerous devils with tridents.

    If Walt Disney, always a good judge of such things, thought that kids would enjoy the virtual experience, not merely of dying, but of being consigned to eternal damnation, it does not seems a far stretch to assume that gamers may enjoy it as well.

    1. Re:Mr. Toad's Wild Ride: ends in hell by geminidomino · · Score: 5, Funny

      Hey, man! Fucking SPOILER warning, ok!?

    2. Re:Mr. Toad's Wild Ride: ends in hell by Aqualung812 · · Score: 1
      While your comment was pretty funny, I think you misunderstood the word FORMER from the OP:

      The former Walt Disney World attraction, "Mr. Toad's Wild Ride,"
      --
      Grammer Nazis - I mod you "troll" unless you actually add something on-topic. Yes, I know I have mispellings in my sig.
    3. Re:Mr. Toad's Wild Ride: ends in hell by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Mr. Toad's Wild Ride is only a "former" attraction at the Magic Kingdom in Florida.

      Disneyland still has it as a ride, including the train crash and the trip to Hell. In fact, it's one of the few Disneyland rides that have been there since the park opened in 1955.

    4. Re:Mr. Toad's Wild Ride: ends in hell by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      In fact, it's one of the few Disneyland rides that have been there since the park opened in 1955. Yeah, that's one of the coolest things about the original Disneyland. Those attractions even have little plaques next to them that say "Class of '55" and "Original". Like this (scroll down to "Lot #9). I hope that auction doesn't mean they've taken them down.
    5. Re:Mr. Toad's Wild Ride: ends in hell by The+Second+Horseman · · Score: 2, Interesting

      Now, having been on the former "attraction", I'd quibble about how attractive it really was. It actually sucked. Sort of like the Disney version of "The Wind in the Willows" sucked. Luckily, in those pre-video days, I actually hadn't seen the lousy movie. So I went on the ride, spending the whole time wondering "what does this have to do with the book?" And, having to use a C ticket or whatever it was to sit in a stupid car and see devils and other junk painted on plywood flats was pretty lousy. Even in 1975.

  42. Negative consequences by SamuelA1337O · · Score: 0

    are priceless in our current nanny state.

  43. Team Fortress 2 is a perfect example by spyrochaete · · Score: 5, Insightful

    Sure, everyone prefers winning a game over losing, but as Hunter S. Thompson said, "Learn to enjoy losing." The best example of this in recent memory is Team Fortress 2. I haven't enjoyed a multiplayer FPS since the original Quake, mainly for the reason that everyone is better than me and I didn't enjoy consistently placing third-to-last. I'm really not any better in TF2 but the game is so well balanced, so stylish, and fast-paced that I smile or laugh every single time I'm defeated. It's a pleasure that keeps me playing.

    A good game is one that acknowledges that the task you're given is too big for just one guy, but that's all you are. Play in the world and try unconventional tactics. If you fail, fail spectacularly. It's less fun to do so in the real world.

    @ -- your liver

    1. Re:Team Fortress 2 is a perfect example by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      And Hunter S. Thompson clearly was the sort who found relief in death!

    2. Re:Team Fortress 2 is a perfect example by daydr3am3r · · Score: 1
      It's true that the game's humor and style alleviates if not tips the scales over on the frustration of dying.

      However like stated previously, subconsciously we all take into account on how fair we think we died. Personally, if it took me 2 minutes of game time (a HUGE amount of time given the round's length) to reach the opponents' spawn point with a spy, something that on a crowded server is a feat on itself, only to die while invisible from a totally random demoman grenade...now that's just plain wrong.

  44. Blaze of glory by mrderm · · Score: 1

    I think thats the point. Having the opportunity to angrily smash at the keyboard is a release of the tension from the moments before your death. It would be much less fun if you respawned instantly, and were deprived of that release.

  45. Duh! by DarthVain · · Score: 1

    Of course I like dying! Thats why I have holes in my drywall next to my computer and fist shaped indentations on my desk!

    Of course I keep coming back for more, so you never know...

  46. What about appreciating a good kill? by trdrstv · · Score: 1

    I've had times where a buddy killed me in an FPS, or made the last turn in a race by the smallest of margins only to beat me. I'd didn't like being beaten, but I appreciated the skill/move/chance they took in trying to kill me.

    1. Re:What about appreciating a good kill? by MikePikeFL · · Score: 1

      I second this! It's like, damn, he got me but what a good shot!

      Although if it happens too many times in a row I doubt the meter would register joy as my mouse goes flying across the room... ;-)

      --
      "Never underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of tapes hurtling down the highway" -Andrew Tanenbaum
  47. No. by CaptnMArk · · Score: 3, Funny

    I have ruined at least one mouse in Q3A because you have to click for respawn only after one second delay
    (clicks before are ignored).

  48. In related news... by themoneyish · · Score: 1

    ... as study shows that people enjoy dying in the real world. The authors believe this may result from the temporary "relief from engagement" brought about by death. It is temporary relief because soon they are born again as a poor child and 4 years later OLPC hands you a laptop with Quake 3 on it.

  49. Re:What? by Chode2235 · · Score: 1

    I also think, respect and appreciation for the skills of the other players. When I get killed, I sometimes am impressed by the shot or the move that my opponent made. There are some pretty impressive gamers out there, and to witness that first hand can produce positive emotions. "Damn, that was impressive."

    That is likely also an emotion experienced and undocumented.

  50. Zen-like, indeed by Empiric · · Score: 1

    I often taunt my opponents with some ancient Bassui...

    Your end which is endless is as a snowflake dissolving in pure air.

    ...as an added bonus, it tends to confuse them long enough to move into position for a second kill.

    --
    ~ Whence do you come, slayer of men, or where are you going, conqueror of space?
  51. It Could be Much More Simple by ronadams · · Score: 1

    Maybe the release just comes from being out of the heat of battle; your stress goes down, your adrenaline flow calms, heart rate decreases, you don't have to worry about dying anymore, because now you're dead, and there's nothing you can do about it until you respawn. At least, that's how it feels for me. I can't ever recall feeling anything metaphysical about watching my guys spatter the walls of DM-Rankin after some asshole with a Flak Cannon blows me apart.

    --
    Appended to the end of comments you post. 120 chars.
  52. kudos by bazorg · · Score: 1

    for good sportsmanship :)

  53. CS by BigJClark · · Score: 1


    I play CS religiously, and I'd have to say, I've never felt "good" about dying... especially early in the round. Perhaps there can be a correlation between players who enjoyed dying and the amount of time till respawn.

    I relate CS to golf. Good fun once you get good at it, but incredibly frustrating for those who lack "good golf clubs" and experience.

    --

    Hi, I Boris. Hear fix bear, yes?
  54. Article text by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 1, Informative

    There are advantages to being a university student.

    Graphs: http://img245.imageshack.us/img245/6251/emo81114fig1adz7.gif
    Table: http://img340.imageshack.us/img340/4416/emo81114tbl1aev4.gif

    Abstract

    The authors examined emotional valence- and arousal-related phasic psychophysiological responses to different violent events in the first-person shooter video game "James Bond 007: NightFire" among 36 young adults. Event-related changes in zygomaticus major, corrugator supercilii, and orbicularis oculi electromyographic (EMG) activity and skin conductance level (SCL) were recorded, and the participants rated their emotions and the trait psychoticism based on the Psychoticism dimension of the Eysenck Personality Questionnaire--Revised, Short Form. Wounding and killing the opponent elicited an increase in SCL and a decrease in zygomatic and orbicularis oculi EMG activity. The decrease in zygomatic and orbicularis oculi activity was less pronounced among high Psychoticism scorers compared with low Psychoticism scorers. The wounding and death of the player's own character (James Bond) elicited an increase in SCL and zygomatic and orbicularis oculi EMG activity and a decrease in corrugator activity. Instead of joy resulting from victory and success, wounding and killing the opponent may elicit high-arousal negative affect (anxiety), with high Psychoticism scorers experiencing less anxiety than low Psychoticism scorers. Although counterintuitive, the wounding and death of the player's own character may increase some aspect of positive emotion.

    We know very little about phasic emotional responses elicited by violent video game events, although they might mediate the potential harmful effects of violent games (Ravaja, Saari, Salminen, Laarni, & Kallinen, 2006). Several (although not all) authors have concluded that there is a causal relationship between violent video game play and aggressive behavior, cognitions, and affect (for meta-analyses, see Anderson, 2004; Anderson & Bushman, 2001; for an alternative meta-analysis, see Sherry, 2001). Violent games may elicit not only self-reported aggressive affect (i.e., feelings of anger or hostility) but also anxiety (fear; Anderson & Ford, 1986). An apparent limitation of the studies using self-report to measure emotional responses is that they neglect the fact that different game events may elicit different, even opposing, emotional responses (Ravaja, Saari, Salminen, et al., 2006). Prior studies have also shown that exposure to violent video games increases physiological arousal (e.g., Ballard & Weist, 1996; for a meta-analysis, see Anderson & Bushman, 2001). However, these studies have used tonic measures (e.g., 1-min mean physiological values) that give no information on responses elicited by specific, instantaneous game events.

    The present study was designed to examine phasic psychophysiological responses indexing emotional valence and arousal elicited by violent events in the first-person shooter video game "James Bond 007: NightFire." Facial electromyographic (EMG) activity over zygomaticus major and corrugator supercilii was used to index positive and negative emotions, respectively (e.g., Lang, Greenwald, Bradley, & Hamm, 1993; Ravaja, 2004a), and orbicularis oculi activity was used to index positively valenced high-arousal emotions (Ravaja, Saari, Kallinen, & Laarni, 2006; Witvliet & Vrana, 1995). Electrodermal activity (EDA) was used as an index of arousal (Ravaja, 2004a). Obviously, violent video games (e.g., first-person shooters) involve at least two different types of events that might elicit differential emotional responses: (a) The player (or player's character) wounds or kills an opponent and (b) the opponent wounds or kills the player's character. Given that wounding or killing an opponent represents a victory and a success in the game (and in a real gun f

  55. Oh, there's just one problem here... by FreelanceWizard · · Score: 3, Insightful

    ...which is that the authors are basing their conclusions on the premise that physiological responses are purely indicative of specific emotional states. This is a position people like Ekman take as well, and it's easily falsified. Russell reviewed the literature around 2000 or so and found that, in fact, emotional displays are at least somewhat socially motivated and don't always equate to specific emotions in a one-to-one fashion (especially in speech). To put it more simply, you may smile because you're happy, but you might also smile because you're being sarcastic, because you're covering up frustration, etc. However, this study rests on the assumption that people only smile because they're happy -- period. (In all fairness, they're not exactly talking about smiling here, but the principle is the same.)

    So, sure, if you're willing to accept that premise, then this study is great. If not, it's just another in a long line of studies that suggest, but do not convincingly prove, what emotions can be generated by particular events. Really, this study just again points out how insanely difficult it is to get to a "ground truth" of what emotions people experience.

    And yes, I've read the article -- I happen to have electronic access to the journal.

    --
    The Freelance Wizard
    1. Re:Oh, there's just one problem here... by Thugthrasher · · Score: 2, Insightful

      I'm not able to read the article at the current moment, so I'm not really commenting on this particular experiment because I don't really know what physiological responses they were measuring. I don't think, in some cases, it's as easily falsified as you make it seem, though. Although it may be impossible to tie physiological responses to emotional states 100%, it is possible to do it with a reasonable degree of certainty. Just because you can fake smiling does NOT mean you can fake brain activity or heart rate changes or any of the more automatic responses to various emotions.

  56. Feeling by cmarcond · · Score: 1

    I don't know about this game, but some FPS games that I've played sometimes give a strategic advantage after death. The user is teleported to another room where he can start fresh and rethink his errors.

  57. What really made them happy by usul294 · · Score: 1

    What really made those feelings of relief was that every time they died, it was one death closer to not having to play 007:Nightfire anymore.

  58. A matter of "fair" by ShinmaWa · · Score: 4, Insightful

    I think you hit the nail on the head. The gameplay geniuses over at Valve touched on this very concept on their commentary track for Portal.

    According to the commentary track, they closely watched the reaction of play testers when they died or otherwise failed. If they laughed as they died, they know they did the right thing. If they swore like a drunk sailor, something may need to be tweaked.

    It all boiled down to a matter of perceived fairness. In your case, even though you were bested, you had fun because you knew that, fundamentally, you lost fair and square. However, if you discovered that kid with the unbelievable aim was cheating, I'm guessing you'd find that a lot less fun simply because it wasn't fair.

    Same thing goes for puzzle games, single-player games, and MMO's. If the game is fair, you can have fun even if you fail. If the game isn't fair (i.e. the player has almost no chance of succeeding or the difficulty is far far too high), then no amount of playing will make it fun.

    --
    The /. Effect: Thousands of users simultaneously accessing a site to not read its content.
    1. Re:A matter of "fair" by Jesus_666 · · Score: 1

      If the game isn't fair (i.e. the player has almost no chance of succeeding or the difficulty is far far too high), then no amount of playing will make it fun.
      Also if the game requires you to play in a very specific way that is incompatible with what you normally do. That's why I absolutely hate Civilization - the game is unbeatable unless you spend the first fifty years doing nothing but building cities. I don't want to micromanage twenty cities, though. That's not the part of the game that appeals to me. I want to build up my stuff step by step - however, if you do that you end up having to "fight" stealth bombers with musketeers.

      I know, I could focus exclusively on tesselation (ie. trying to cover the world map with city influence areas as efficiently as possible), but that feels more like work than play. In the end, I just avoid the game and instead play Colonization, which is much more relaxed.
      --
      USE HOT GRITS WITH STATUE OF NATALIE PORTMAN (NAKED AND PETRIFIED)
  59. Dying means you're being challenged by trdrstv · · Score: 1

    If you're dying, you're at least being challenged. Its motivating and sometimes it gives you a particular opponent to gun for.

    Absolutely. My bestfriend and I had a great day playing paintball against off-duty marines. We went for the day and just joined up with the group, so all of their team and the rest of our team were marines. Needless to say we both died A LOT that day, but every kill we did get; hell every minute we survived out there against them was immensely gratifying.

  60. Re:What? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    You could call the emotion "awe."

  61. Depends on the game by night_flyer · · Score: 1

    if its a single player game, hell no...

    if its a multi-player game durring a LAN party.. maybe.. cause it would be a good time to re-fill my glass

    if its a demolition derby (Flatout) Hell yeah! cuase it is usually pretty damn entertaining to watch the rerun!

    --


    Thanks to file sharing, I purchase more CDs
    Thanks to the RIAA, I buy them used...
  62. Science? by longacre · · Score: 1

    Thank goodness our nation's smartest are performing such vital work.

    1. Re:Science? by gmuslera · · Score: 1

      Understanding ourselves IS a vital work.

  63. maybe by KrazeeEyezKilla · · Score: 1

    maybe this study would be more accurate if they chose a game that fps players actually ENJOY playing

  64. Well of course by jockeys · · Score: 1

    You've been twitch gaming for a couple of hours, you're running low on caffeine in your bloodstream, your eyes are gritty, your hands are shaky, and your pulse is up...

    Getting killed is disappointing. But it might also be the first time in 30 minutes you can unclench your sphincter and take a deep breath, maybe lean back in your chair while the respawn counter ticks down.

    --

    In Soviet Russia jokes are formulaic and decidedly non-humorous.
  65. Because of the audience? by VickiM · · Score: 1

    No, I didn't read the article, so I don't know what kind of controls they used or the setting or anything like that. And I don't play FPSers so I may be off base here, but I do know that when I'm playing a game with people in the room, I'll try to take something like death or failure in stride, at least the first few times. If I'm by myself and I fail I'll get very frustrated, but when someone's around I'm more likely to be embarrassed or see the funny side of it. Obviously the test subjects knew researchers (read: authority figures) were watching their faces and taking notes. If my boss watched me get beaten in a game, would I throw a fit, or give him an embarrassed smile? And when I give him that smile, I'm sure he'd think I'm having a great time.

  66. Do Gamers Enjoy Dying in First-Person-Shooters? by tristian_was_here · · Score: 1

    Do Gamers Enjoy Dying in First-Person-Shooters? Yeah I seriously love waiting 30 seconds to respawn.
  67. Full Text of Article by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    THE PSYCHOPHYSIOLOGY OF JAMES BOND: PHASIC EMOTIONAL RESPONSES TO VIOLENT VIDEO GAME EVENTS

    DOI: 10.1037/1528-3542.8.1.114
    ISSN: 1528-3542
    Accession: 00130470-200802000-00011
    Authors: Ravaja, Niklas; Turpeinen, Marko; Saari, Timo; Puttonen, Sampsa; Keltikangas-Jarvinen, Liisa
    Publication: Emotion Volume 8, February 2008, p 114-120

    Abstract

    The authors examined emotional valence- and arousal-related phasic psychophysiological responses to different violent events in the first-person shooter video game "James Bond 007: NightFire" among 36 young adults. Event-related changes in zygomaticus major, corrugator supercilii, and orbicularis oculi electromyographic (EMG) activity and skin conductance level (SCL) were recorded, and the participants rated their emotions and the trait psychoticism based on the Psychoticism dimension of the Eysenck Personality Questionnaire-Revised, Short Form. Wounding and killing the opponent elicited an increase in SCL and a decrease in zygomatic and orbicularis oculi EMG activity. The decrease in zygomatic and orbicularis oculi activity was less pronounced among high Psychoticism scorers compared with low Psychoticism scorers. The wounding and death of the players own character (James Bond) elicited an increase in SCL and zygomatic and orbicularis oculi EMG activity and a decrease in corrugator activity. Instead of joy resulting from victory and success, wounding and killing the opponent may elicit high-arousal negative affect (anxiety), with high Psychoticism scorers experiencing less anxiety than low Psychoticism scorers. Although counterintuitive, the wounding and death of the players own character may increase some aspect of positive emotion.

    -----

    We know very little about phasic emotional responses elicited by violent video game events, although they might mediate the potential harmful effects of violent games (Ravaja, Saari, Salminen, Laarni, & Kallinen, 2006). Several (although not all) authors have concluded that there is a causal relationship between violent video game play and aggressive behavior, cognitions, and affect (for meta-analyses, see Anderson, 2004; Anderson & Bushman, 2001; for an alternative meta-analysis, see Sherry, 2001). Violent games may elicit not only self-reported aggressive affect (i.e., feelings of anger or hostility) but also anxiety (fear; Anderson & Ford, 1986). An apparent limitation of the studies using self-report to measure emotional responses is that they neglect the fact that different game events may elicit different, even opposing, emotional responses (Ravaja, Saari, Salminen, et al., 2006). Prior studies have also shown that exposure to violent video games increases physiological arousal (e.g., Ballard & Weist, 1996; for a meta-analysis, see Anderson & Bushman, 2001). However, these studies have used tonic measures (e.g., 1-min mean physiological values) that give no information on responses elicited by specific, instantaneous game events.

    The present study was designed to examine phasic psychophysiological responses indexing emotional valence and arousal elicited by violent events in the first-person shooter video game "James Bond 007: NightFire." Facial electromyographic (EMG) activity over zygomaticus major and corrugator supercilii was used to index positive and negative emotions, respectively (e.g., Lang, Greenwald, Bradley, & Hamm, 1993; Ravaja, 2004a), and orbicularis oculi activity was used to index positively valenced high-arousal emotions (Ravaja, Saari, Kallinen, & Laarni, 2006; Witvliet & Vrana, 1995). Electrodermal activity (EDA) was used as an index of arousal (Ravaja, 2004a). Obviously, violent video games (e.g., first-person shooters) involve at least two different types of events that might elicit differential emotional responses: (a) The player (or players character) wounds or kills an opponent and (b) the opponent wounds or kills the players character. Given that wounding or killing an opponent represen

  68. Re:Do gamers enjoy kimchi in first person shooters by 19thNervousBreakdown · · Score: 1

    This is South Korea's Mohammed.

    --
    <xml><I><am><so><damn>Web 2.0</damn></so></am></I></xml>
  69. I know I enjoy dying in FPS by Puffy+Director+Pants · · Score: 1

    because I sure do it a lot....oh wait, no, I just suck.

  70. Homorous deaths by MobyDisk · · Score: 1

    Death can be funny. This is demonstrated in movies and games all the time. Unfortunately, it is permanent IRL. Some games even capitalize on this by making death the main part of the game. Worms Armageddon, for example. Death was constant and funny.

    I used to play the original Quake, and I was so bad it was ridiculous. Custom levels with pits became a constant source of problem. The funniest events where when you got 200 health + 200 armor + regeneration, and you are buffeted about by multiple rockets only to fall to your death in the lava. Those moments had me ROLFMAO because it was just so absurd and unlikely.

  71. Shows that you have real opponents by Nerdposeur · · Score: 1

    In your case, even though you were bested, you had fun because you knew that, fundamentally, you lost fair and square.

    Right. I think it also gives a little bit of satisfaction to feel that you're playing against a worthy opponent. Part of the fun of a FPS is the constant feeling of danger. If you never get killed, you don't feel threatened at all, and it's just target practice. Getting killed affirms that the competition is real, and increases your resolve to fight harder or smarter.

  72. Re: Do Gamers Enjoy Dying in First-Person-Shooters by kc2keo · · Score: 1

    I for one do not like dying in FPS games. If I do die I would rather die taking somebody down with me. The FPS game I play is BF2. Being bombed or C4 bombed by jeep or plain C4 in itself really gets me upset. Being killed by the chopper TV rocket or running over mines get me angry but less so. I think LAG just gets me real upset. I can say that I am not always angered by dying in the game. It largely depends on my mood prior to playing. I play the best when I can keep my cool and think clearly and of course have no LAG.

  73. Well obviously it will be positive... by mad_minstrel · · Score: 1

    Your health is at 100, your clip is full, and the guy who snuffed you is not too far away. What's there to be negative about dying?

    --
    May the source be with you.
  74. Enjoy being killed? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Its apparent to me they didn't gauge the emotions those being spawn killed repeatdly.

  75. 3 Situations for me by rickatnight11 · · Score: 0

    I classify death reactions in three categories: 1.) Pissed off because I'm too involved in the game to take it light-heartedly 2.) Humorous because I am not taking it seriously and get killed in a humorous way (ie 13 sticky grenades in Halo) 3.) Relief from the above mentioned reason of "relief from engagement" ("Finally, I'm dead. That was intense.")

  76. IANAP (Psychologist), but... by skelly33 · · Score: 2, Interesting

    it seems to me that the psyche knows the difference between phases of a video game and actually facing mortality. I find it hard to believe that "video game death" can in any way be related to real world psychological patterns surrounding death - for one, there are actually no consequences in the video game world, thus no real fear nor moral struggle.

    1. Re:IANAP (Psychologist), but... by Chili-71 · · Score: 1

      it seems to me that the psyche knows the difference between phases of a video game and actually facing mortality. I find it hard to believe that "video game death" can in any way be related to real world psychological patterns surrounding death - for one, there are actually no consequences in the video game world, thus no real fear nor moral struggle. Well, yes there are consequences. Not nearly as terminal as actually dying, but the FPS games I play are all about points and team work. You die - you give the other team points and you cost your team needed resources. In the case of Search and Destroy, you have cost the team resources until the end of the round - you don't respawn. In the rest of the formats the lost is temporary.

      In the big picture, dying is consequential - it can cause you to lose the game.
    2. Re:IANAP (Psychologist), but... by skelly33 · · Score: 1

      In the big picture, dying is consequential - it can cause you to lose the game.

      I hear you - In the grand scheme, someone who loses the game could become frustrated, arm himself, and go Columbine on his school mates. At first glance that looks a lot like there really are significant consequences attached to losing the game. But if you tear down cause and effect in this example, losing the game is not a direct cause for the effect of dead school mates. Rather it is an intermediate catalyst for a pre-existing cause, that being mental instability. The cause of mental instability results in the effect of dead school mates.

      I assert that if to "lose the game" directly bears no tangible effect and is limited only to emotional responses that there are no direct consequences for dying in a game.

  77. I have to ask by Mr.+Vage · · Score: 1

    Nightfire? Why?

  78. Definitely by DoofusOfDeath · · Score: 1

    Thank for asking. First of all, those guys getting killed are *definitely* not Ninjas. The odds of a Ninja getting killed in a FPS are like the odds of a movie based on a popular video game not sucking.

    So do these definitely-non-Ninjas enjoy getting killed? Only if they're not getting killed by a Ninja. If you get killed by a Ninja, you don't have *time* to enjoy it.

    Next question!

  79. stupid research by kingsteve612 · · Score: 1

    Dying doesn't bring joy to gamers. Never did, never will. No real FPS gamer wants to die. The only reason any sort of "positive" reaction comes when a gamer dies is because they had a good round and felt like death should have come a while before they died. So its positive to think "I should have died a long time ago, but i kept going out of luck/skillZ" If a gamer dies over and over because his opponent gets lucky, any real gamer is not going to be happy.

    1. Re:stupid research by linux_geek_germany · · Score: 0

      Dying doesn't bring joy to gamers. Full ACK. I played CounterStrike in the past for quite some time, never enjoyed dying and never saw someone enjoying it. This really makes you wonder what kind of meaningless research is performed there as it's either complete non-sense or the testing group consisted completely of no real gamers.
    2. Re:stupid research by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      It'd be a little different if you were playing an instant respawn game, that waiting time is nightmarish.

  80. Re:What? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I don't mind when it happens if I'm out of good ammo. Much easier to die and get all your M16 bullets back than run around with a pistol.

  81. Gamers enjoy dying? No. Duh! by SoTerrified · · Score: 1

    I could list my qualification (starting with Quake) but trust that I am a veteran of FPS games. (In fact, my alias comes from a game of Counterstrike where I was accused of camping, and I responded voice "I'm so terrified, I'm frozen in fear and can't move." and that's what the team called me for the rest of the night." And I absolutely, 100% do NOT enjoy dying in a FPS shooter game. But I do agree that the moment of death is a "release" of sorts. So I can see the confusion.

    When I'm playing, a million things are shooting through my head. (Pun intended.) I'm dodging, weaving, doing quick peeks around corners. I'm also thinking of larger strategy. Trying to think where the enemy team is set up, remembering the map danger points, etc. It's fast, furious action with not a moment of relaxation. Every sound, every movement needs to be processed and reacted to. At the moment you die... You no longer have to do that. And of course blood pressure goes down, respiration goes down, and all the signs of Zen might appear. But at the same moment, I'm also likely tossing a controller and shouting 'M*****F*****'. Does that sound like "positive emotion" to you?

  82. Personal experiance... by Kazrath · · Score: 1

    I've been playing FPS games for quite awhile. In any competitive activity losing is not the objective. In Playing FPS games I find that random lucky shots from obscure distances or angles early in the match is pretty frustrating and can really take from the enjoyment of the game. In situations where a hard fought battle took place even if you are shot and die it is exciting and fun. In the rare situations where you have a close battle and both players are pulling out every trick in the book being the winner or loser does not really matter to me personally.

    Well thats my thoughts on it anyway.

  83. There is a reward... by rickb928 · · Score: 1

    In most BF games, defending a point is useful. I don't mind sometimes spawning into a contentious point just to force the enemy to keep killng me. Eventually, if 2 or three of us are spawning in, we can tie up a larger force trying to take 'our' point. Meanwhile, ther est of the team is holding enough to drive their tickets down. I get massive deaths, but hey, the team wins.

    Sometimes, though, spawn camping is just spawn camping. I'll entertain one now and then just to see if they are sharp, while the rest of their team gazes in awe at the kills they are piling up. When I'm tired, I'll have one of my buddies go nail them.

    And yes, sniper is my favorite role. Snipers are sort of the h@xrs of the battlefield. Silent, unexpected death, paralyzing a much larger force, and clogging pinch points. Not to mention that in some games, snipers avoid the FPS penalty for having a lame rig. Now if only they would upgrade to the M82A1 to the M107, or the M82A1A, and let it shoot through brick, stop jeeps, and kill through a standard Humvee. It does in real lif... oh, nevermind.

    --
    deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
  84. Who you gonna call? by Quiet_Desperation · · Score: 1

    while their facial expressions and physiological activity were tracked and recorded moment-to-moment via electrodes and various other monitoring equipment. The study found that "death of the player's own character...appear[s] to increase some aspects of positive emotion." The authors believe this may result from the temporary "relief from engagement" brought about by character death. Did anyone else get a flashback to the scene from Ghostbusters where they have Rick Moranis hooked up to equipment made from kitchen utensils?

    Seriously, did any tax dollars pay for this study?
  85. teabaggers? by poetmatt · · Score: 1

    I would guess the ones that teabag the corpse wouldn't leave him, yes.

  86. Philosophical gamer idiocy by Cathoderoytube · · Score: 1

    Who are these people that write this philosophical crap about gaming? Every so often on /. they have these bloody articles 'what are the social implications of the start button?' or 'what is the meaning of jumping in games?' To save the idiots who're working on this paper some time I'll refer them to this. http://youtube.com/watch?v=R7ublMEYWx0

    --
    I have nothing compelling to say
  87. Re:What? by flimflam · · Score: 1

    You could call the emotion "awe." Yeah - that's also pretty much the emotion I feel when I get struck by lightning IRL as well.

    --
    -- It only takes 20 minutes for a liberal to become a conservative thanks to our new outpatient surgical procedure!
  88. An idea for a modification by entrigant · · Score: 1

    Place an armed "researcher" behind each players head. If the player dies in the game, they die irl. Then, measure those responses and see how they take it.

  89. Hook Me Up -- I'll Show You Who's "Relaxed"... by ewhac · · Score: 1

    Do Gamers Enjoy Dying in First-Person-Shooters?

    No.

    This has been another edition of Simple Answers to Simple Questions.

    _____________

    Okay, some more detail:

    My game is QuakeWorld deathmatch/free-for-all, with occasional forays into Nexuiz. I used to also play TeamFortess Classic before Valve held a Flag Day and willfully broke all the clients. (No, I will not install Steam. But that's another flame.)

    Perhaps I have some deep-seated pathology, but it doesn't take very many frags against me before I become absolutely livid. I become utterly convinced that the server/the other players/the Universe is out to get me. I mean, how many times can one realistically expect to approach a corner, only to have a grenade sail in from out of view, bounce off a floor and a wall... And score a direct hit? Not merely splash damage -- a direct hit? Honestly? One time in a hundred? One time in ten? Every other time?

    Just how probable is it that a player can hit you with the lightning gun and keep it perfectly trained on you no matter how you're moving until you die? That a player can do that to everyone else on the map?

    What are the chances that another player can take two direct rocket strikes, a nearby splash, and still survive to kill you? Especially when you yourself picked up the only red armor on the map less than 30 seconds ago?

    And before you know-it-alls start shouting 'n00b', I've been playing the $*#@^&%!! game for well over ten years now, so I can hardly be called a n00b. I also have a respectable gaming rig with decent input peripherals. I can't blame my equipment, and I can't blame lack of experience, so there's no justification for me still sucking at the game. So either I suck for absolutely no good reason at all... or something else is going on.

    "Relaxed?" "Relief from engagement?" I wish I knew how these people did it -- it's an experience unknown to me.

    Schwab

  90. My Collected Data by capitalj · · Score: 1

    The data collected from my broken keyboard says differently.

  91. only the headshots though by kevgaxxana · · Score: 1

    otherwise the kill or death wasn't good enough

    --
    In Soviet Halo, the game kills you (socially anyway)
  92. I think... by popmaker · · Score: 1

    ... it's just cool to be able to fly through walls and stuff.

  93. Re:What? by mpeskett · · Score: 1

    Yup, sometimes you get killed in a way that just makes you go "damn... that was a classy kill". Skilfully shot pipe bombs can be almost an art-form. Other times is the damn bastard spy with his knife in your back (or even more annoying, your face) or the damn bastard sniper or a lucky crit rocket, or the pyro who *just* managed to set you on fire when you were ever so slightly too far from the nearest medpack. Those times you just want to find and brutally murder/rape that person/their character.

  94. results open to interpretation... like a polygraph by wolferz · · Score: 0

    Usually, right before you die, your concentration is very high and if your a skilled gamer you can likely see you are losing whatever fight you are participating in. Then when you die you relax. After all there is no need to be tense once the fight has ended. It's the same as how a polygraph machine works. You anticipate the bad thing (dying in the case of a game, lying to a dangerous question in the case of a lie detector) by tensing up then you relax once it's over.

    Lie detectors show the increase in tension and sudden relaxation... the test taker then marks that point to identify that is the moment where you answered a question. Later he goes back and based mostly on his opinion and some loose training he decides whether or not the build in tension and sudden relaxation is indicative of a lie.

    They have done the same thing here but have draw conclusions WAY too far from what the evidence shows.

  95. Crazy talk by RomulusNR · · Score: 1

    Dying in a FPS, particularly one like COD or Ghost Recon or Halo, when dying means you have to go back about 20-30 minutes and do it ALL OVER AGAIN, is insanely maddening.

    The thing is, in an online multiplay, when you die, you wait a couple seconds, then come right back to the same action. You don't have to do anything over again. It gives you a chance to rest, refocus, and jump back in fresh.

    But in a solo play, it's the worst thing ever. Worse than losing your electricity, frankly.

    --
    Terrorists can attack freedom, but only Congress can destroy it.
  96. Temporary relief by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    "This may result from the temporary relief from playing James Bond 007: Nightfire brought about by character death." Fix'd

  97. Ghosts? by Midnight+Thunder · · Score: 1

    I wonder how a ghost mode would work out? When you die you turn into a ghost and get to haunt the other players or turn into some sort of undead that requires decapating to "kill". Then again there is always using the reincarnation approach and turning into all bunch of mythical creatures until your next turn as a human.

    -- Now switching off crazy imagination mode. --

    --
    Jumpstart the tartan drive.
  98. ban videogames! by circletimessquare · · Score: 1

    as well as promoting homicide, rape, and pedophilia, it is now proven scientific fact they promote a positive feeling about suicide!

    --
    intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
  99. Its all about immersion by Aliks · · Score: 1

    From Everquest days, when you were fighting like crazy, and it was touch and go whether the Mob went down first . . .

    Dying was like the opening scene in Terminator where they arrive in the present day, naked, kneeling and the first thing you did was look round to see your team respawning around you having all met the same fate.

    The release of the tension followed by the inevitable thoughts about how to retrieve the corpses was all part of the game.

    IMHO

  100. Blowing shit up... by Nick+Driver · · Score: 1

    ... is the best part of playing FPS games.

    And I'm not talking about motherboards, video cards and PSUs from too much overclocking either!

  101. Speculate? Never! by ginbot462 · · Score: 1

    Obnoxiously this alleged scholarly research is not available for free, so we'll just have to speculate wildly what it says based on the abstract.

    Isn't this what we normally do around here? Except we usually don't RTFA(bstract).

    --
    Atlas Shrugged : Thematic Story :: Battlefield Earth : Organized Religion
  102. They Missed The Point Entirely by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I've played FPS shooters for years. The whole gambit from the original Doom to unreal and quake and B1942 and the MMO versions as well.

    The smile when I die isn't some metaphysical though process about dieing and relief or even the relief from the action.

    It's because when I die it's usually because I have been wailing on the opponents for a while and racking up score and kills. When I finally go down, my reaction is the mental equilivent of sitting back and appreciating a job well done. Enjoying my success that led to N dead opponents and them eventually ganging up on me as a group of 5 and killing me. It's satisfying to know I did well. I suspect that's the joy they are detecting and in an attempt to put more meaning into it than there really is, they went in teh wrong direction.

  103. Bill Gates by yoprst · · Score: 1

    I use nickname Bill Gates in Call of Duty UO (yes, some people still play that game). Death per se is not enjoyable, but other players reaction to having killed me often is.

  104. If I was playing 007: Nightfire... by JohnnyBGod · · Score: 1

    ...I'd like to die, too. That game sucks!

  105. Truly Dumb Researchers by oistrakh · · Score: 1

    How about the reason people may have had "positive" reactions is because sometimes in an FPS you get killed in really funny ways? Like accidentally 'nading yourself because you threw a grenade through an open door and you hit the wall instead and it comes right back at you? Or you try to sneak up and knife someone but you miss and then snipe you from point-blank range? Games are a fun competition, and sometimes you lose that competition in really funny ways, and so sometimes you're "dead" but smiling. There's no stupid "zen" moment, no out-of-body experience. Researchers need to stop putting their own dumb biases into their interpretations of things. If they simply played FPS games, they'd know exactly why sometimes you die and yet you're laughing.

  106. I prefer the old school style... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I like it when video game death is more final, such as in some original NES games where you only had one life, or in some newer games like Replicore from http://cyborgarm.com/.

  107. Death Fetishes? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I guess this explains vore...

  108. This is stupid. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Actually I think it's less of a question of "enjoying death" as it is a momentary relief from the stress of staying alive in-game. For the few seconds between your respawns, you don't have to worry about treading carefully and being shot just before you reach the high-powered weapon that can turn the game around. The tension of regular play ends, the body relaxes, and the physioligical response is very similar to light mood elevation.

    The worst part is, I can figure that out in 30 seconds of thinking about, and this dumbass writes a whole paper and still gets it wrong.

  109. Other Physiological Data on 1PS Play by DrSpike · · Score: 1

    People interested in the analysis of the physiological response of players might find the 2006 paper from my lab interesting: http://seal.tst.adfa.edu.au/~vesl/publications/SimTecT06heartRate.pdf We looked at the heart-rate of 1PS players. In general we found that average heart-rate changed very little; though there were individual differences - with a couple of players showing a small drop in heart-rate, and only one showing a significant increase. This came as a bit of a surprise - particularly in light of other data we collected which showed that players were immersed/engaged.

    --
    To stimulate creativity, one must develop the childlike inclination for play ⦠- Albert Einstein
  110. Empathy & appreciation of skill by tmh+-+The+Mad+Hacker · · Score: 1

    I enjoy a good, skillful kill (or an incredibly lucky one) -- even if I'm at the receiving end of it. I don't have so much invested in the game that I can't cheer for a real-life buddy that just cooked my carcass.

  111. So many possible causes by dreemernj · · Score: 1

    Relief from engagement? If they are new to the game, and they get any kills at all before dieing, there's probably a sense of accomplishment. If you kill at least a couple people for every time you die, it feels like you are kicking ass.

    This goes for someone that knows the game pretty well too. Deaths are a gauge of success. The more you do before you die, the better you are doing and the happier you feel when you do eventually die. I favor CTF and VCTF in UT2K4 and if I get a couple caps without dieing, when I do finally die, I don't get angry, I'm happy to see how much ass I kicked before they were able to take me down.

    --
    1 (short ton / firkin) = 89.1432354 slugs / keg
  112. Yawn.... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Not me!

    After this camper gets shot in the head, I like to watch the angry guy who I fragged like 4 times shoot up my dead body in rage and stand statue while he types something obscene.

    I then usually quip, "Not dead yet! Go back and shot me some more!" You should both go to the quartermaster's office and requisition a life.
    1. Re:Yawn.... by Meski · · Score: 1

      Not me!

      After this camper gets shot in the head, I like to watch the angry guy who I fragged like 4 times shoot up my dead body in rage and stand statue while he types something obscene.

      I then usually quip, "Not dead yet! Go back and shot me some more!" You should both go to the quartermaster's office and requisition a life. I tried that, but they only had wrong sizes.
  113. In some games... by Jack+Conrad · · Score: 1

    ...you are. Take hardcore diablo II, after you've been significantly leveled up; granted, it is still just a game, however, 'dying' results in a massive loss of time and energy for the individual involved. The same can be said of old platformers where you only got one life and had to start over back at the beginning when you died.

    --
    [insert witty comment here]
  114. Or... by argStyopa · · Score: 1

    It could be something as simple as the fact that, as one plays a first-person shooter, the tension ratchets up significantly. Particularly the longer you 'last' without dying, there is a performance anxiety.

    So finally when you do die and the tension is resolved, it really is quite a relief.

    --
    -Styopa
  115. Not zen at all by Xazak · · Score: 1

    The only positive feeling I get when I die in any game, be it Team Fortress 2, Unreal Tournament, Half Life, STALKER, Max Payne, or Halo, is the one I get when I imagine the other guy swearing at the computer when I spawn again and finally clean him out of that camping spot or off our capture point.

  116. Might be able to read paper here... by Buran · · Score: 1

    Obnoxiously this alleged scholarly research is not available for free, so we'll just have to speculate wildly what it says based on the abstract.
    I do think it's important to understand how people respond to something as common in today's lives as computer games. It's important to someone; other research might not be important to you, but science isn't always about finding a practical application for everything right away. Science sometimes just asks "why?" or "what if?".

    As for being freely accessible, the research wasn't funded by NIH, so its rules requiring publicly-funded-by-US-taxpayers research to be released under Open Access doesn't apply. The paper states that "This study was supported by the Finnish Funding Agency for Technology and Innovation and European Community NEST project 28765: "The Fun of Gaming: Measuring the Human Experience of Media Enjoyment.""

    Fortunately, the trend these days seems to be more toward open access in the past, so have patience, young Padawan...

    I can get to the article, because I work at a university. This link may or may not work for you:

    FirstSearch: Full Text
  117. Looking at a *very* popular FPS by kitsunewarlock · · Score: 1

    People don't like dying in team-elimination games almost ever. With the exception of "great deaths" (i.e. you both use all your clips and pull out knives to finish each other off...or an awesome grenade death at just the right time), its aggravating to spend the next 30 seconds - 2 minutes watching the "defensive" members of your team (and occasionally the really skilled players, if your team is just dominating) screw around and wait to die/kill as you think about what gun you want to use next round. It usually gives you just enough time to get pissed off, and not enough time to get anything accomplished (especially since playing cstrike now-a-days in full screen usually prevents alt-tabbing to another window, lest you want to risk sound loss and texture screw-ups).

    Counter-Strike doesn't kill. Waiting for your team to finish the fuck up does.

    --
    Ginga no Rekshiya Mata Each page.
  118. "That which doesn't kill me..." by KlaymenDK · · Score: 1

    "That which doesn't kill me makes me stronger.
    That which does kill me I'll deal with when I respawn."

    This used to be my tagline back when I was playing Day of Defeat (nowadays, I'm playing BZFlag).

    The study found that "death of the player's own character...appear[s] to increase some aspects of positive emotion."
    I can vouch for that; I always get the urge to get just that little bit better to dodge the bullet, to make the first hit.

  119. Re:What? by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I like how you threw in that you're an IT Director, "who cares"?

  120. Quite the opposite by ^_^x · · Score: 1

    I used to not mind so much for 10-15 years, but now I'm absolutely sick of it.
    It seems like a miserable, pointless, inevitable end. No matter how well you do, sooner or later a dozen guys are going to shoot at you at once and you go down, or some guy you can't even see is hundreds of yards away and gets you in an inattentive moment, or any variation of the factors. If it's single player, you get to go back to your last save point and retry and retry and retry and retry the spot you died, failing in slightly different ways until you finally clear it - so you can go die somewhere else.

    I don't know... I used to love the genre, and I won't attack it or the gamers who play it - it's just another game type. But personally after seeing so much of it it just strikes me as a kind of perverse VR meat grinder. Kill kill kill kill kill kill die respawn kill kill kill kill die respawn repeat. I'm so burned out on that basic gameplay mechanic that I don't get pleasure from dying in game OR killing the other guys.

  121. Re:What? by Stargoat · · Score: 1

    There's a movement in modern psychology that states all human actions are the results of humans attempting to avoid death. If the player dies but avoids death, is the player not in some way cheating death? And if this is the case, is not the player acting this out?

    --
    Hoist Number One and Number Six.
  122. Re:What? by Killjoy_NL · · Score: 1

    Heh, I usually think Aw shit then, but that's just me :)

    --
    This is the sig that says NI (again)
  123. you had me at death.... by RU1DT · · Score: 2, Funny

    but then you lost me somewhere after alliance wipe and before cliff.

  124. Go under by PenGun · · Score: 1

    I'm still playing Doom. I've played em' all and I'm back to single player Doom, I've got over 1000 wads and 6 or 7 full 32 level efforts, Momento Morti being among the best. The H2H competition mudfest stuff is almost mind blowing.

      I's pretty well always the same. Ultra Violent skill and mad craziness. I usually bite it with a mad crowd all around me dying and killing. A lot of Doom is getting the monsters to kill each other. One recent one had 6 cybers and a crowd of barons and when you die it's usually very funny.

      Throw it up on the big Sony at 1280x720 and nothing touches Doom for pure fun. Thanks John.

  125. it's a GAME by pbjones · · Score: 1

    people who start to 'feel' too much during a game should consider giving up. It's just a GAME. There is enough to depress people in the NEWS on TV and in the 'papers. Go and play a nice game or read a book.

    --
    There was an unknown error in the submission.
  126. Gears of War: Mad World video by Toe,+The · · Score: 1

    I cannot believe that this thread does not yet contain a link to this video (that I can see):
    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=8198147178670424207

    "And I find it kind of funny
    I find it kind of sad
    The dreams in which I'm dying
    Are the best I've ever had"

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_World#Popular_culture

    1. Re:Gears of War: Mad World video by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

      Best. Ad. Ever.

      (Even if it is Microsoft-related.)

  127. Reminds me of a family joke... by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Heh. This is the basis of a family joke -- back when the Nintendo 64 was the latest and greatest gaming machine, my brother got Goldeneye. After just a little while, it became clear to me that I would never actually win a game. Accordingly, I adopted a new strategy -- the next time I got a grenade, I rushed in to throw it at point-blank range. My brother was alarmed. "What -- What are you doing?!" he cried! "I'm not gonna stay alive," I replied. "So instead, I'm going for a very good dead."

  128. Quote Kinison by maz2331 · · Score: 1


    "You don't have to leave yet do ya? You didn't stick a chainsaw up my ass yet! My head's still on my torso! I'm glad you fuckers can handle your high!"

    All caps scream reccomended, but /. lameness filter prohibits posting that way.

  129. Tetris The Grand Master 2 is a perfect example by tepples · · Score: 1

    Sure, everyone prefers winning a game over losing, but as Hunter S. Thompson said, "Learn to enjoy losing." OK, so you buy the new Tetris game. Then you find out that half the people who play online are this good, or a tier up, or a tier up from that . Some could beat you with their eyes shut. How many players would want to buy such a game?
  130. HD version by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Dude. You can't watch that video unless you watch it in HD. Just ain't right.

    http://xboxmovies.teamxbox.com/xbox-360-hires/3820/Gears-of-War-Teaser-Trailer-HD/

  131. Answer to Title Question by l33tlamer · · Score: 1

    Yes if you got fragged by me.
    No if you are me.

    --
    If I can do it, its probably not worth doing... probably
  132. I don't. by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    I get super-p*ssed off.

  133. Another source for the full article text by Bipedal+Shark · · Score: 1
  134. What about MMORPGs? by issaco · · Score: 1

    I wonder what response someone dieing in an MMORPG like Lineage or something where there is a XP cost or Dieing to a raid boss in World of Warcraft where there is a repair cost.

    FPS deaths are a joke because of the lack of a death penalty.

  135. Facial muscle response doesn't imply feelings by zealot261 · · Score: 1

    After reading through the paper, I find the methods suspect. EMG of facial muscles are not always a reliable predictor of emotional response. They say they also perform skin conductivity tests, lets hope that the participants don't sweat a lot. I know that during most FPSs (Call of Duty 4 anyone?) people have a tendency to sweat more due to increased adrenaline and nervous system response. Also, I may have missed it, but I do not think they were playing against each other, just the AI. And, the participants were told they would get an extra movie ticket for being in the top 3, extra motivation to succeed, definitely can skew a study.

  136. Re:What? by Anzya · · Score: 1

    You get hit by lightning often? :)

    --
    "This message was brought to you by Sarcasm and Troll Feeders United (or STFU, for you un-hip people)."
  137. Re:What? by Killjoy_NL · · Score: 1

    I have a rich imagination ;)

    --
    This is the sig that says NI (again)
  138. James Bond 007: Nightfire must really suck! by Anonymous Coward · · Score: 0

    Players were actually relieved to be able to stop playing...

  139. Re:Text of Journal Article (1 Table and Plot omitt by BeanThere · · Score: 1

    "... although they might mediate the potential harmful effects of violent games ... Several ... authors have concluded that there is a causal relationship between violent video game play and aggressive behavior, cognitions, and affect ... Violent games may elicit not only self-reported aggressive affect (i.e., feelings of anger or hostility) but also anxiety"

    I wonder how much of these effects would be evident if, say, sport (e.g. football or ice hockey) were studied in the same way. Or even any other games, like chess (many people can get angry from just about any type of game). Are so-called "violent" video games really "violent" in any sense other than being a simulation of what would in reality be violence? There is nothing violent about using a mouse/keyboard while looking at a screen. "Dying" in a video game is no more like "dying" than time-out on a bench in sport, should that be called "dying" too and studied as if it was something drastic? Surely running on a field where you physically bash into and tackle other people is far more of a "violent game" than any computer game. It seems to me that people are irrationally scared of computer games and anything 'computer-y' or even technological, if you ask me as an emerging 'tech society' we'd be better off doing studies to uncover the reasons for these irrational fears, than wasting money on silly studies of all the "harm" computer games are causing (seemingly not, since millions of people play them now and there hasn't exactly been a sudden spike in violent crime - in fact, the rise of computer games has generally coincided with a steady drop in violent crime).

  140. RE: Paid article by Xiaoxiaofreak2 · · Score: 1

    "Obnoxiously this alleged scholarly research is not available for free, so we'll just have to speculate wildly what it says based on the abstract." And how is this different from what slashdot does for articles that [i]are[/i] available for free?

  141. They are asking the wrong question by TooMad · · Score: 0

    It isn't that we enjoy dying or enjoy not dying. It is the competition, if it was impossible to die then there is no fun. Without dying there is no win condition. You can mask 'dying' by saying you are merely injured or so other mechanic like clones in planetside but it really still is dying, the end result is the same. It wouldn't work too well in a multiplayer enviroment but in a single player game monitor a player using 'god mode' and never dying but doing plenty of killing and with the same game a player playing as normal. The majority of the test subjects would likely enjoy dying more than the ones who are not. There might be the initial burst of excitment for a player in god mode but it wouldn't last.

  142. In other words... by nefarity · · Score: 1

    In other words, gamers relax during lull in fighting.