Slashdot Mirror
Getting Rid of Staff With High Access?
HikingStick writes "I've been in the tech field for over 15 years. After more than nine years with the same company, I've been asked to step in and establish an IT department for a regional manufacturing firm. I approached my company early, providing four weeks notice (including a week of pre-scheduled [and pre-approved] vacation time). I have a number of projects to complete, and had planned to document some of the obscure bits of knowledge I've gleaned over the past nine years for the benefit of my peers, so I figured that would give me plenty of time. That was on a Friday. The following Monday, word came down from above that all of my privileged access was to be removed — immediately. So, here I sit, stripped of power with weeks ahead of me. From discussions with my peers in other companies, I know that cutting off high-privilege users is common, but usually in conjunction with a severance offer (to keep their hands off the network during those final weeks, especially if there is any ill-will). Should I argue for restored access, highlight the fact that I am currently a human paperweight, request a severance package, or simply become the most prolific Slashdot poster over the next few weeks? Does your company have a policy/process for dealing with high-privilege users who give notice? What is it, and do you make exceptions?"
Your situation kinda sucks as it sounds like you are a diligent worker who wants to help the company. But as long as they are paying you, it's really their choice how they want to use your services. All you can do is when your co-workers ask for your help in passing the torch, mention that you are hand-cuffed by the lack of access and have them request it for you.
P.S. Some activities to pass the time would include Watching Grass Grow and/or Watching Paint Dry.
Hulk SMASH Celiac Disease
I would imagine those sorts of working conditions might be enough to flare up your old back pain condition, making it difficult to attend work on a daily basis.
Please read my Canon EOS tech blog at http://www.everyothershot.com
Wow, I will have to remember to give four weeks notice next time instead of two.
Thanks for the heads up!
I Am My Own Worst Enemy
They don't want to let you do your job? Okay, well, sit around, get paid for doing nothing. Screw 'em. Compile your "obscure bits of knowledge" send it off to your co-workers and sit around and do nothing for the next three weeks. What are they going to do? Fire you?
My blog
You're possibly getting paid to surf the Internet all day, the best job there every was, and you're wanting to go back to working hard for the Man?
So you have a new job lined up in 4 weeks & they are going to let you soak up cash until then? Sounds like you are working for a bunch of morons.
Slashdot FTW.
Also, you could do a lot of mental planning for your new job in 4 weeks time.
There is a war going on for your mind.
In the early nineties, my dad was a high-privilege employee at a bank. Anyway, due to office politics, he pretty much got the boot because one of the higher ups didn't like him. (You know, how easy it is to fire someone if you really want). He had been working there for nearly 20 years, and according to local law he had 6 months notice. He was disallowed to go to the bank during those 6 months: from one day to another he sat at home.
I heard this is pretty much the rule with high-privilege employees. So, I'd suggest, sit back, enjoy yourself and troll on slashdot as if there were no tomorrow.
I'd argue for restored privileges, if that fails, ask for severance, and if that fails, fall back on option C.
Should it result in option C, make sure you turn up for work late, drunk, and unshaven (assuming this is de rigueur in your workplace anyway)
Policy is policy. You are no more important then any other "key" personnel. If it were a "key" contracts person or finance person who knows all the in's and out's of that field, why wouldn't they want to minimize their access as well. You have to have a break point and there is never a good time to do it. Better sooner then later IMO.
There are no loopholes. It's either legal or it's not.
if you think that this will make you the only person taking a pay check to sit around all day and do nothing more than post to slashdot, you are sorely mistaken.
It's hard to believe that's how Micronians are made. Why don't we see it right now by having you both kiss one another?
I think this is the new norm in the SOX era.
-- if you mod me down, I will become more powerful than you can possibly imagine
a delightful term I learned from my UK counterparts. Essentially you're still under employ by the current company so cannot do work for your new one or any competition, and you relax at home while getting paid. It's like paid vacation, except not, since you could theoretically be called in to work at any point.
AKA. request to work from home if your access is revoked, since you can't do anything at that location now anyway.
It doesn't mean much now, it's built for the future.
We look forward to hearing from you...frequently.
I've calculated my velocity with such exquisite precision that I have no idea where I am.
I have worked for 3 hosting companies. My experiance has been: If you are not considered a risk, you are allowed to work your final weeks with full access. If you are REMOTELY considered a risk, you are imediately walked out, although you are paid for your final weeks.
Any good admin/manager knows if you have physical access, you might as well have root/admininistrator access.
It's in the company's interest for you to do nothing. They actually will prefer if you do absolutely nothing because of their own liability. As a regular employee, if you mess something up it's just negligence (oops). On the other hand if the company terminates you and still gives you access, and then you mess something up, they're criminally liable because they should have restricted your access.
For example, I worked on banking software and had god-rights. If I as a regular employee steal all of the customer data and sell it, then I am the criminal. If I have been terminated and do the same, then they are at fault. Now yes, I realize that it's a pedantic difference, but the banks which run the software see a world of difference and will sue the my employer accordingly.
Believe me, it's cheaper to pay me 6 months severance than it is to be sued for my actions.
It really depends on level of access and what they can access. In many cases however they have been escorted out the door with in minutes of giving notice. Typically they get the two weeks notice they gave as paid time (Two weeks is standard).
Power Corrupts,Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely, leaving one person(group)in charge is absolutely corrupt.
It's nice that they didn't walk you to your car. Most employers (at least here in the states) are at-will, and if you're a potential security risk, will say "Goodbye" and have security walk you to your car.
:-D
The plus side of this is they pay out your vacation.
I'd take it as a hint to do nothing work related unless explicitly asked and do all that tech-reading and skill development I never get to.
Look at it as 4 weeks of paid training by your old company for your new employer
It seems to be common now for companies' to strip users of all their privileges ASAP. If you think this was bad, be glad you're not be laid-off. I've often many people tell me that they learned they no longer had a job when their sessions were terminated in the middle of the work day.
Welcome to the work-world of the 21st century.
Steven
http://www.practical-tech.com/
http://blogs.computerworld.com/sjvn
Rumor has it that step 4 has something to do with becoming a highly-paid consultant for the old company.
If they want to keep you from doing your job, they're only going to be hurting themselves and their isn't really much that you can do about that. But what you can do is to do what you can to leave on the best of terms. Just because they decide to be dorks doesn't mean that you have to respond in kind. It's really important to not burn bridges as you might need them for a reference some day. Document whatever obscure bits that you need to and do knowledge transfer with those you can work with. Then you can move on with you conscience clear.
This is my opinion. To make sure you don't steal it, it's covered by the DMCA.
I'd ask for "gardening leave" (i.e. be allowed to go home rather than forced to sit twiddling your thumbs all day). You might also offer to sit down with a co-worker and tell them about all the stuff you were doing so they can take it over.
This is almost certainly not personal. Your senior management has obviously made a policy decision that the risks of leaving you with access to the systems are more important than the costs of locking you out. Obviously *you* know you are honest and safe, but they can't take that risk. If you think about the amount of damage you could have done if so inclined, you might see the point. There are quite a few horror stories about disaffected employees and computer systems.
You are lost in a twisty maze of little standards, all different.
...because everyone is saying "go ahead and sit on your ass." Well, you know what? Fuckin' A Right. It's not your fault they're morons. If they don't understand that you could have done any malicious shit you wanted before giving them notice then nothing you can say is going to change their tiny minds. Sit back, collect your money for nothing, and enjoy the slashdot.
If you don't have good bandwidth at home, this is an epic opportunity to catch up on some downloading...
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Throw your knowledge down on paper/docs first. Then, spend the next 3 weeks getting ready for your new job. It sounds like you already know what the game plan is, but if your current job is not allowing you to do you current work, at least get ready to be rockstar when you land at your new job. It does suck but hey, I, as a state contract employee, only get paperweight days on days like today.....or tuesday....or when my boss takes 3 months leave....say, where is this manufacturing company's IT going to be?
import system.cool.Sig;
Why would you want to do that, if you could surf www.kinky.com 8 hours a day???
You could level a character to 70 no problem in 4 weeks. Enjoy!
Make it a malt liquor. I want to be as clever and handsome as possible.
get your work ip address banned by slashdot and wikipedia.
Do you even lift?
These aren't the 'roids you're looking for.
Unless you make it clear that you're not going to a competitor, there's no reason for them to give access back. Document the things you need to, working with other IT people at their stations. Pay attention to whatever "right to work" laws your state has as failing to show up for work can mean that you have voluntarily resigned your position in some states. Bring the paper everyday, put a few novels in your office, etc.
In many countries (certainly in the UK) what they have done could be considered constructive dismissal - ie that they have acted in such a manner as to essentially terminate your employment by making it impossible for you to carry out your duties. That you have given notice is irrelevant to this.
If the company feels that it is too great a security risk to continue to employ you they should have the honesty and decency to put you on "gardening leave" until your notice period is completed - ie send you home on full pay (plus the value of any benefits included in your normal remuneration).
Really, you aren't.
You should spend the next 3 weeks documenting your projects. That is what the company needs from you. So few companies get this, want you coding until the last minute.
What happens when your stuff breaks? The next folks start at your documentation and go from there. Internal wiki's are great for this.
I'm surprised at your reaction. I understand you are a diligent employee and don't like to see your talents effectively put out to pasture for 4 weeks but this is standard practice in many industries. Basically in any job that involves 'knowledge'.
It's slightly unusual that you're still required to come in every day but I guess they could ask you to do low level IT tasks for the duration.
If you were in a job where IP is more of an issue you'd be lucky to even get to clear your desk. Your belongings would be shipped to you.
Take the opportunity to enjoy life (one friend of mine took up jogging). And prepare yourself for your new job.
if it was me then I would immediately work on experimenting with new tech and maybe learning a new language for my CV/Resume.
I find there is never enough time to learn things.
Choose a programming language you do not already know, then try and code up the knights chess board problem, or something similar to test yourself and add more CV space.
As another poster commented this is their choice not yours. Unless they give you work you can do then you owe them nothing. I sympathize with your problem I have always tried a graceful exit and knowledge transfer myself as well.
Get everyone organized on the way out and leave a lasting impression! Organize the workers in your workplace. Technology workers are the least represented sector in the US and should be able to reap the benefits of collective bargaining.
Highlight unfair labor practices, working conditions, unsavory boss types, gender inequality in pay scales, and anything else that brings pain to people's lives. Gender inequality is a great one, because it exists almost everywhere. Distribute pamphlets, circulate emails, stick things up on whiteboard, announce your demands loudly.
If you can get 75% of the workers there to sign a petition to join a labor union the organization has to deal with the union by law. Offer people a cookie to sign the petition and you will hit that number. An affiliated union can get an organizer in there after you leave to keep things going.
Coders of the world unite!
M
I've left two jobs in my life where I had administrative type access to high importance parts of the system. Company A when I gave my notice (three weeks in this case) said thanks, but told me to take the three weeks off with pay and disabled my access immediately. I have had great recommendations from my manager at that company which has helped me get other jobs, so I'm pretty sure it isn't a person issue.
Company B, which I left a couple months ago, let me work my entire 4 weeks notice with full access.
I don't know how big a firm your talking about here, but a lot of companies have a pretty firm HR policy on asset access for short timer employees. Before you get too upset, check into the policy and see if your being singled out or if that is just the way the organization works. It certainly sounds to me based on your snippet the latter is much more likely.
I spent those two weeks typing documentation on everything I did, and in training one of the junior admins to wrangle SMTP until they found a replacement. The only real benefit I got out of the deal was that I didn't have to carry a pager anymore.
The other benefit? The folks there were okay with me burning off paid sick days to arrange for the U-Haul and to tie up loose ends before the move.
Most companies that I've worked with in the past were similar - you only really lose access to the vital stuff, but there's usually plenty of non-vital stuff that still needs done until you bail.
Quo usque tandem abutere, Nimbus, patientia nostra?
That would be the ethical thing to do. At this stage you don't need the high access as your replacement has the access. I would work closely with your replacement explaining things to them that may not be nessarly documented, even if they are documented people most likely don't want to read it. So use the time to give your replacement the upper hand. There is a lot you can do without having root/administrator access.
If something is so important that you feel the need to post it on the internet... It probably isn't that important.
Ask to be relieved and go home, I'm sure it's standard procedure in a lot of businesses to cut off all access to employees that could potentially steal customers and ideas, but they shouldn't expect you to be able to be productive after that.
You have already gone out of your way to be mature and helpful, if they refuse your offer you have no more obligation. There is no need to go out of your way to make someone accept kindness from you. New plan: bring some "brownies" to work and enjoy your new paperweight status!
1) Never, never, never give more than 2 weeks notice.
2) You have your own ass to protect, first and foremost. You owe nothing to your soon-to-be former company.
3) If you want to do a mitzvah and do some documenting before you leave, do it before you resign.
I have a friend who is an accountant. When he turned in his notice to a Fortune 500 company (2 weeks I believe), they gave him 1 month's pay and told him (fairly politely) that he could leve immediately and good luck on his next job. However, note I said that he's an accountant.
It does seem to me that there's little point in removing access and keeping an IT guy on. If they need to remove access they should just pay you for a month and let you go. The fact that they want you to stay and took away your access says a lot of negative things about them. They don't trust you, but they want to keep you to the bitter end anyway.
Knowledge transfer as much as you wish during this time. If I was being treated this way, it sure wouldn't make me want to seek people out to give knowledge to, but I would probably help anyone who came to me with questions. I do suggest to you that you not ask for your access back. If your company wants to be a jerk about this, let it be a complete inconvenience for them and play by those rules. A company that has already shown that they don't trust you is not going to look favorably on any requests you make for restored access. In fact, they might find it suspicious that you need the access and they might suspect you of planting trojans, etc. Just live with it. In fact, you probably should fight to not get the access back and here's why. If something goes wrong after you leave, your company has shown you that they don't trust you. They might blame you for whatever happens if you get your access restored.
Most companies do not act this way. I've worked in IT for almost 22 years now (since college) and we've either just sent people packing the same day (never for IT staff, but it has happened for sales people and such) or they got to keep their access until they left.
People leaving on good terms maintain access through the last day.
Now people we want to get rid of immediately are either fired or promoted, depending on how many systems they could potentially break back into... Yes, our department follows a variation of the Dilbert Principle.
Hey, look! It's Bono's brother.
Explain your situation to your supervisor. He can either argue for your restored access, or not. He will be the one continuing with the company, and is your spokesman for the companies policies. Abide by whatever he says.
As far as upper management is concerned you have now gone on floating contract for a prepaid four week period. They absolutely don't care what you do to fill your time. However, during this window they expect you to be available for any knowledge transfer or training that should arise by you no longer doing your day to day or longer term tasks.
Wanna learn something new? Got some books to read? Near a park? Enjoy it!
--- I do not moderate.
As mentioned upthread, most people are sacked and possibly given severance. Removal of privilege shouldn't be regarded in a negative way. Post a lot. Catch up on your communications. Tell everyone your new email address. If they require you to be in the office, do a good job and get a good reference. If you can be at home and there are no strictures on what you can do there (e.g. employment contract), then do what you want to.
Most IT staff are unceremoniously sacked. They either have high standards or you're there in case you're needed to do something they haven't thought of. In any case, don't be bummed by lack of access. Learn how to beat Freecell in under 60 seconds or something, or do your job search, or whatever you're inclined/motivated to. And enjoy it, as you're luckier than 95% of the IT staff I deal with.
---- Teach Peace. It's Cheaper Than War.
Hacksaw. Meat grinder. Crab pots. You can never be too careful when getting rid of someone...
If you still have access to a word processor, open a new document and write down every thing you could think off that could ease the task of your soon-to-bee-ex coworkers when you're gone. IMHO this is the only morally acceptable behavior in your situation. And hurry up because 9 years of experience is quite a lot, 3 week wont suffice anyway.
Your company sees your access as a huge risk, which is entirely reasonable. That kind of access/power with someone departing imminently is very dangerous for a company. Regardless of your outward intentions, that's too big of a risk for them. It's a ripe situation for theft of company data, trade secrets, or sabotage.
What you can do is explain to them the situation, and maybe they'll have you train someone, who will really be responsible for the final tasks (using their access). That's really the only reasonable solution.
is considered to be a security "best practice" and so people should not feel offended or surprised when they encounter it. Now, feeling offended when you encounter the phrase "best practices" is another matter entirely.
Policy varies a lot, and depends on the situation. However, typically, I would expect someone to be escorted to their desk to pack up, and then to the door. No bitterness, no mistrust, just the company covering their ass. HOWEVER, keep in mind that if they accept your resignation letter and date, they have to pay you so if it happens, enjoy the paid holiday.
That said, in my last position I was working up until the very very last second of my last day of my notice. I'd been in that role long enough that they had no choice but to trust me--if I was going to do something evil, I'd have done it years ago, when they started making the job so miserable.
The other thing is that what your group/manager/department head knows to be reasonable, HR and the CEO might not accept. Just roll with it, and check your stocks for the next few weeks.
"People who do stupid things with hazardous materials often die." -- Jim Davidson on alt.folklore.urban
Good lord, man, do you know what you're doing? College just let out...
But if you're serious, I'm willing to take odds -- and willing to see if a challenge like that changes the character of slashdot during the event.
Now we just need sponsors and a catchy name, any suggestions out there?
"Trolls they were, but filled with the evil will of their master: a fell race..." -- J.R.R. Tolkien on Olog-hai
I work for an IT vendor, on a Navy site. When someone puts in their two weeks notice, Navy policy dictates that their privileges are taken immediately. You do not get one iota of computer access.
This happened to one of our ex-employees about a year ago. After sitting around for about a day, he just left. He couldn't do anything, but just sit around.
How does the company know that you are giving 4 weeks notice so you can train other employees or finish projects? How do they NOT know that you aren't going to spend the next four weeks setting up timebomb scripts or sabotaging equipment? By giving any form of notice, you have told the company that you nolonger have interest in working at this company, and so they have taken the proactive measure of ensuring that you cannot work at this company. Once you give notice (which is a purely optional measure) the company has the option of letting your stay around or not.
In many companies, the day that you 'give notice' they company will then escort you to the door. Why would they want someone on their last 2 weeks (or 4 weeks on your part) hanging around the office. You could be trying to steal information or recruit your coworkers to your new job.
Don't fight it. Inform them of exactly which tasks you won't be able to do without privileges, and then do the things you can (getting knowledge onto paper and into hands of your co-workers is the primary thing).
Their policy is their problem, and you're no longer responsible for the company's long-term welfare. But if you're as friendly and helpful as they allow you to be over the next few weeks, you maintain relationships that may be helpful in future years.
In the end, most tech companies I've been with have accepted my 2 weeks notice, spent one day with me handing off information, then asked me not to come back (but they pay out those weeks anyway). It's a policy designed to make sure the employee doesn't get bored enough to cause any mischief.
But if they want you to come in anyway once everything you have left to do is off limits, come in to be available for your co-workers questions. A coupe of weeks of letting other people's hands do the work while you just are available for questions is actually a very valuable training period for handing off your gig, and probably should be in your transition plan even if they'd left your access on. And spend the bored time prepping for your new job.
Put your feet up on your desk and enjoy the next few weeks. It is unbelievable how companies routinely screw themselves when it comes to termination of employment situations. I can understand an organization's concern about sabotage or espionage, but at the same time there is such a thing as cutting off your nose to spite your face.
I was in a similar position two years ago having given 8 weeks notice (including some holiday time) . I was hoping the company would follow their already established practice of showing IT folks the door after a couple of days. No such luck. I was too trusted and good at my job said HR. They wanted me to work right up to the final day. They even waited until my scheduled last day to bring in the new guy. I found this most annoying. Seems IT is a fickle field to work in. Most management hasn't got a clue and don't want to get a clue. If you are good you get shafted... if you are bad you get bonuses and promoted. This last point is my observation that good IT people who keep everything running smoothly with preventative work get hosed because management thinks they don't do anything. On the other side IT who foster a crisis environment and are often seen fighting great fires (often caused by their own earlier inaction - because they spend to much time posting on "/."?) get positive recognition from management. It is a cruel world working in IT. OK, now flame on people!
Hope your World of Warcraft account is and paid up. Web browsing gets pretty old in a few days.
This has to do with internal controls ... call someone, preferably a CPA or CIA, in the accounting department and he or she can probably explain the ins and outs of it.
Personally, I'd sit back in my little space and grind toward level 70. You figure 8hrs a day, for the next 20 days you should get pretty far. I mean, you get to play WoW or any other game and you'll paid to do it. No point in worrying about your responsibilities in light of the fact that they stripped your access.
To avoid corruption, one must remain dishonest.
Perhaps you should explain to your highest up that you wish to help the company by writing a manual and will need your access returned to assure accuracy? :)
Really, it's no skin off your nose if you can't get any useful work done for your last two weeks because of their policies. Enjoy the lightened workload.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
This goes on all of the time - it ain't personal!
You shouldn't be surprised that they terminate access early, especially in the SOX-era we live in. Every employee is nothing but a number and a liability, as I have found out early on. You have to look out for yourself, and not for the company. When you find a better offer, move. Company loyalty does NOT EXIST and hasn't for decades. Do what is best for you, not them.
My only question is this:
How on earth did you manage to keep a tech job for more than 5 years? It's nearly impossible to stay employed at one place in these unstable times without getting laid off, outsourced, downsized, and what-not these days. I average about 2 years at each job before I'm laid off in this yucky job market.
As it says on the label :)
I've got root to all of our group's developement systems, as well as many production systems. I'm also know for my practical jokes and sometimes abilities to by-pass security systems. Though I've never presented myself as a risk to the company where I work (for almost 16 years, now), when I give notice, I expect to be immediately straitjacketed, put in leg irons, and wheeled to the door on a a hand-truck.
For whatever reason, they stripped your access. Could be they think you're a risk, could just be legal CYA. Don't worry about why--it's business, nothing personal.
You have a job to do now--make the transition as smooth as possible. They made this significantly harder, but that's life. Deal. Do what you can. Either live without your access, or borrow a coworker's login who's staying behind. It may not be approved according to policy, but it's obviously in the best interest of your soon-to-be former coworkers for you to document as much as possible. Sometimes work gets done in spite of policy instead of because of it.
Don't be afraid to bend a few rules to smooth the transition.
I've gone through a number of similar transitions. Some companies will just give you the severance, but that doesn't happen often, since most companies are smart enough to know every employee will have little bits of information that only they know.
What your company is essentially doing is asking you to transfer your knowledge to other staff, by requiring you to utilize others to get your job done. You should now view yourself as a teacher only, allowing your coworkers to gain experience by doing your work, and guiding them when they run into trouble. Restoring access would give you the opportunity to do hands-on work up until the last minute, but would your coworkers be able to manage it immediately after you left? If they're smart enough, of course they'll catch on, but it might take a few days/weeks, and in that time there might be a critical outage, etc, where they need to know the information.
--
Luck is just skill you didn't know you had.
Seriously, just roll with it. If you don't have access, then you can't be the one responsible if things go wrong just before you leave, right? Yeah, maybe it's kind of insulting, but at the same time it gives you a lot of deniability.
Dewey, what part of this looks like authorities should be involved?
Since they are not being reasonable, id just sit there and collect the pay.
It's not your fault.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
But if they want you to come in anyway once everything you have left to do is off limits, come in to be available for your co-workers questions. A coupe of weeks of letting other people's hands do the work while you just are available for questions is actually a very valuable training period for handing off your gig, and probably should be in your transition plan even if they'd left your access on.
One job I tried to do something like that, and even had a guy sitting there taking notes and asking questions afterwards, and it lasted all of half a day... then they got pulled off to fight fires.
Actually having your access cut off might be a good thing, since it'll force them to go through with this kind of training period.
Seriously. Just be 'on call' if they have problems. Since you can't do much by physically being there, what difference does it make?
if they won't do that, ask for severence and be on your merry way enjoying the time off.
I wasn't so lucky. I was 'fired' (new management didnt' understand my role as lead network security analyst, and even worse, feared my knowledge). But because of that fear, I got a severence package and most of the bonus I was promised for helping an outsourcing initiative (no, it wasn't me who was replaced through that). I was also able to collect unemployment. The downside is that I had to explain why I was fired in all of my interviews.
It is reasonable to cut access of a high permissive security user until they leave. That way, they have to work through anyone to do any work. It improves training and helps limit anything that can happen in the transition period. It is a good risk mitigation technique.
In God we trust, all others require data.
If i was treated poorly like this, why would I really care?
---- Booth was a patriot ----
I say, just sit tight and take your checks. Read. Do crosswords. Whatever. And as others have said, it couldn't hurt to let the other employees know (if they ask for help with something) that you're cut off. It would be a welcome warning about the company where they will continue to work after you're gone.
You're not the one who changed the rules -- they are. I don't advocate anything spiteful (taking office supplies, undermining morale, whatever), but if they're not going to accept all of the expertise that you're offering, I say just wait for your checks and then go.
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue.
In a past job I was a LAN administrator for a group that likely thought much more highly of themselves than they had any right to. But one time they came to me with a request that I could not fulfill, because it conflicted with my hiring terms (they wanted me to give all the root passwords to a a manager who was not in the IT department). I repeatedly asked for an explanation and was given none, so I continued with my job since I had more important issues to deal with anyways.
Then one day I came in and found my keycard no longer worked, my workstation had been rebooted, and my network account disabled. Interestingly enough I found this because I got in and found the server room door was wide open and someone else was logged in as admin on our servers. This was how they decided to tell me I was fired, with no advance notice.
Thankfully, the HR person was privileged to our conversation and at least granted me the vacation pay that I was owed.
So I'd say there is probably a non-IT person at work here in the situation that fears you and/or your abilities. Just take what you can get and leave with a smile, you'll likely do better wherever you're going next anyways (I know I am).
Damn_registrars has no butt-hole. Damn_registrars has no use for a butt-hole.
Put your feet up, have a coffee and read. If you feel like it, wear a loud shirt and golf shorts to work.
Start your vacation early. When management sees that they're basically paying you to hold down the floor (literally) they'll probably want to know why you're not doing anything.
In all seriousness, give them the benefit of the doubt. A miscommunication may have occurred, and someone along the line might have been told "this guy is leaving now, so cut him off."
If your company truly thought you were some kind of "risk" they would have given you immediate "gardening leave". The fact they haven't means, as another has suggested, that they want to see what happens without you being in the daily operations. In short they ARE respecting you and will use you as and when they feel something is "broken" and needs your guidance. In short enjoy the R & R that the company has offered you as a parting gift. Be respectful and courteous, don't burn bridges (you don't appear to be that type anyway) and best of luck in your new job:) Meantime I have a problem with WM11 not syncing to my MP3 Plarers...Are you available?;)
Your current company just issued you a license to slack off. If they complain that you aren't getting any work done, you can easily fire back and tell them that you don't have access to do any work. Of course, I'm not aware of what type of work you do and how removal of such access would affect your ability to meet your job requirements. Basically, do the work that you can. If you have to find a workaround to complete the task at hand, don't bother. Delegate where you can. Enjoy it. Consider it "At work vacation".
Actually, what I did was closer to the following:
1. Recommend a good strategy
2. Get Fired, Company wanted other (bad) strategy
3. Start new job
4. Get Hired back as an expensive consultant to fix the bad strategy and recommend implementing the good strategy.
5. Profit!!!
6. Keep a straight face until the bank cashes the check. (This step is hard.)
Remember, after you quit, you can't get fired! Enjoy the months of complete freedom.
Listen, mate, if they want to pay you to sit around and do nothing; by no means should you correct them!
In Soviet Russia jokes are formulaic and decidedly non-humorous.
One company had me continue to work on/finish projects until the day that I left(a Friday), and I started with the new company the following Monday.
The second company that I worked for they had me continue on as if I was going to be there forever, of course they thought that I might be, as on my final day a director broached the topic of what would make me stay? Unfortunately for them, they were about a month late in attempting an offer. (In retrospect, I should've fished for what they were willing to cough up as they had an awesome vacation plan more akin to what government bureaucrats and university faculty get... One year I had so much vacation that I pretty much took the whole month of December off, which is usually a slow time anyways, i.e. nothing gets done in December in that business, realistically.)
A third company had me leave immediately with a severance package.
If you have any hobbies or like gaming, I'd suggest bringing in a portable console, e.g. a Nintendo DS or Sony PSP, or reading material, etc. Of course the "work" from home idea sounds like a plan.
I'd say chill out. If they want to pay you for doing nothing, well do nothing. Don't go in the vendetta part, just .. do nothing. As someone stated, if something breaks, say you don't have access anymore so you can't help. If they don't ask question do NOT provide the information by yourself.
I have a rule: have as much loyalty for your bosses as they have for you. If they sent a notice like "Due to oue firm policy, your account will be suspended in order to blablabla" then it would be fine trade. Cutting without notice is like telling you they don't trust you. they think you will leave some kind of virus/trojan horse in the system and don't want it to happen (I know it since it's what is being tought in some security courses).
So do whatever you want. If you really want to send a message, get a book to work, put your feet on the desk and read all day long in front of your co-workers. Just make sure they know that you do WANT to help, but just CAN'T help because the company no longer trust you. That will hurt the company even more than anything else you could imagine and you keep the good part: you didn't do anything wrong, just stated the truth: the company prevent you from working.
Although I was only with the company for one and a half years I gave 4 weeks notice. They are a major Fast Food Chain in the U.S. I had over a month of vacation they wouldn't pay me back for so I took three weeks off. Then I came back to clean out my desk and make sure my direct super who I really liked and was always good to me had everything he needed about what I did. Other than that I said screw 'em. I saw people there for years that would be let go a few years away from retirement because they were too old or people fired on a whim from senior management. They have no loyalty to you, why should you have any to them? You don't even have to be bitter about it. I left with a smile and shook the CIO's hand to make sure I didn't burn any bridges. But still there is no reason for you to feel any obligation, I assure you they do not. That is evidenced by their own actions.
This is 100% SOP where I work. Exceptions are made for 1 or 2 days for "knowledge transfer". But nobody with high level infrastructure access will finish out their two weeks.
I don't know your location, but in the UK employment contracts automatically have what's called an implied term of a mutual duty of mutual trust and confidence. Your employers would probably be in breach of that term by removing your access.
Implied Terms of ContractIf you give notice, and then do something bad, the company is exposed to large insurance increases and possible lawsuits. The contributions you can make in your remaining four weeks may not be worth those factors.
It would almost be better to leave, and then offer to do work on a contract basis after you leave successfully.
She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
Use this time to inconspicuously troll around the office to determine the highest rate ever paid to a consultant. A few well placed lunches with some underpaid payables clerks can be quite beneficial here (who knows? you might even reap some other benefits ). Then when you're gone and the company comes calling for your services, simply multiply their best rate by pi and Viola! you have your billing rate!
Seriously, just relax. Catch up on your online reading/posting. Play some Solitaire.
Put the ball in their court:
Ask how you can best serve the company. Maybe you can be a fill-in for some clerk on sick leave or maybe they just want you to stay home.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
Here is my story, that I posted to /. a couple years back:
http://ask.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=05/12/08/029257
Similiar situation. I went directly to HR, and told them I had no access, and I couldn't do any work. They sent me on my way (unexpectant) with a little bit of severance.
YOU'RE WINNER !
Another lame blog
So, let me get this straight. You've given 4 weeks notice, expressed an interest in doing due dillegence to make the transition as smooth as possible and your current employer has decided to revoke all your access and make you a human paper weight?
If they are really intend to pay you to stay there for 4 weeks and do nothing, I would seriously use this to your advantage. You know all the technologies, programming languages, whatever that you never seem to have time to catch up on? Now is your chance to do it AND get paid for it!
I would bring books and a personal laptop in and start cranking away learning new things that would advance my career and hopefully get me to retirement faster.
Perhaps you are in a situation now where you'll be working less hours. Go home early. Spend more time with your family and friends. Spend more time working on your hobbies.
Time is precious, use it wisely. Before you know it, you'll wonder where it all went.
We'll make great pets
See what he says. If he wants you to do something then do it.
If he can't find anything worthwhile to keep you busy, find a personal project. Learn something useful - preferably something that looks like work.
Take the time and use it for study and professional enrichment.
Yes it's stupid. Yes it's common throughout the industry. Yes if you're the one giving your departure date and you're smart enough to actually be successful in I.T. then you've already thought this thing out and put into place any malware before you gave them your departure date. And yes, they're morons who are going to pay the price for not having you finish up your tasks before you depart.
You've upheld your end of the deal by giving them proper notice. Now finish out your end of the deal quietly and completely. Show up, do what you still can do, and shut up about it. They don't want to hear how stupid this all is. Either they know it already and did it anyway, or think they're smarter than you are. Either way, silence is your friend.
Lastly, find out what the absolute highest I.T. consulting rate for your area is. If you're not in NYC or Silicon Valley, don't take their rate. Just find the highest rate for your area. And when/if they call you back to help out with the "tribal knowledge" you still possess that you couldn't impart or complete before your departure, tell them up front that this is your rate per hour and would they like to sign a consulting contract. Just point out quietly that you'd like to deal with is in a professional manner.
Oh, did I say, they're idiots - and this is typical throughout the industry, including where I have worked before, and where I do work now? In fact, until you've been terminated with no notice, and then been escorted out of the building 15 minutes later by a guy with a gun on his hip you really haven't worked in I.T. yet. I've had that experience too, and it wasn't atypical at all for that employer.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
For real??
Oh, you mean and translated in to BorkBork?
They probably want to keep you around long enough for your "if I am not in the payroll database then rm -rf *" to execute, at which time they can take you to the basement for appropriate corrective action.
When we have someone even moving from one team to another we often have their access cut down. The reason we do this is so that we know the team will function without that person. The person is supposed to document, demonstrate and advise. You want information transfer not hands on work. It's much better if you have to talk other people through these processes.
After giving three weeks notice, I was once stripped not only of root, but of any login at all, AND they took the workstation off my desk.
Three weeks of flirting with the (admittedly few) hotties in the office, long lunches, taste tests of the various corporate coffee machines, and bothering people trying to be productive.
Such is life.
I would engage in shenanigans BEFORE giving notice if I were so inclined. But whatever.
I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
Notice is for sallies, real men just quit. After all -- do they give you notice when your going to be let go? No.
The one time I was laid off I was told it was effective in six weeks. I spent much of that time documenting and training coworkers on projects that I had worked solo on. My network access and other privileges were not affected. I asked the VP of engineering if I could take some of the source code home for reference so that I could answer questions over the phone or by email after I left. He drafted a letter stating that I was allowed to keep the source for this purpose only and that it remained company IP and could not be disclosed to anyone else. We both signed it.
This was about a 150 person company owned by a large international conglomerate. The VP was originally from the conglomerate's corporate headquarters and joined us two years earlier when we were acquired. The rest of management was local. I had been there about four years. A year after my layoff the situation at the company had improved and I was asked to return.
The moral of the story:
I don't deny that it is common to be immediately cutoff when you resign, but it is not a given.
Don't burn bridges.
It's a waste of money to pay someone who doesn't even want to be working for you. Obviously their output is going to be nill so their pay should be nill.
Myself and at least one other poster have demonstrated diligence training those who will be taking over. I think it is far more of an individual judgement call based on past projects and the individual level of trust.
If you are going to be involved in managing those family businesses I would suggest a less black and white perspective. Sorry, but management is not easy and such a black and white perspective often indicate the less capable managers or someone in an unforgiving bureaucratic/politicized environment who needs to cover their ass with policy compliance. That said, I agree that it many cases the proper decision is immediate cutoff, immediately issuing a final check, and wishing them well as you walk them out in a friendly manner. My point is merely that in some cases keeping them around for a little while can be beneficial to the company.
It's not like you don't have a valid cause for a protest ;-P
Contrary to the popular belief, there indeed is no God.
...write elaborate DnD adventures and play them with coworkers during their lunch breaks.
Machine9dotNet
If you are in an at-will employment, why bother to give notice? Management doesn't have to do so, so why not reciprocate their rules?
The longest notice I ever gave was about 1 hour.
I always laugh at these policies. It makes people in the organization feel like they are 'doing the right thing.' But, as it seems in this case, it's the wrong thing. And in so many cases it's the wrong thing.
Just because a few terminations have caused someone to screw up networks, does it necessarily follow that these kinds of policies make sense? Especially when the employee is the one giving notice?
Someone prove to me that in all the cases of internal 'IT sabotage', the soon-to-be-gone employee is a big risk. I'd bet dollars to doughnuts that currently-employed-and-anonymous employee is the biggest risk by far. SO why don't we just remove access from everyone? That would solve the problem, wouldn't it?
Just mentor your peers, document, and kick back and enjoy the time "off". The policy is in place for the protection of the general good of the organization so one diligent workers time lost for a month is a drop in the bucket.
Don't believe that the organization will cease because you do not have access and cannot complete your projects. I see this many times in this field where people think they are expendable.
Your company sent you a clear message that what they want you to do for the next 30 days: 1. Pick up a bonzai tree that needs some love and attention. 2. Pick up a good book, like MacMafia. 3. Pick up a new hobby. 4. Work on inner peace. I hope you realize that your company knows that you know where "the bodies are burried".
Do your work as best you can. Finish the time with them as happily as you started. You must have liked them or you wouldn't have spent that many years with them. Don't burn bridges! EVER!!
let someoen up top know that the company needs the information you have and they are hurting the company. Also point out that this is likely to get people to just walk off in the future.
If they don't care, then document this fact(don't assume it's obvious, not matter how obvious it is) and use the time to brush up on any skills you new position will need.
This assume you ahve been reasonaly reated over the years. If you haven't been , then let them know, don't push it and read a good book.
Really, they ahve said "We don't trust you."
If you think they won't try to screw you, approach them, tell them you can't do anything and ask for a severance. If it is within your means, maybe cutting it to a two week severance would make it more agreeable to them. Don't approach them with two week, try to get them to give you 4, but settle for two.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Sounds about right for corporate paranoia.
hey if they want to cut your access let them, sponge a paycheck for a few weeks of in office vacation.
enjoy the last few days and good luck with the new job.
As one of the things you were planning on doing anyway was documenting some of the obscure knowledge, this gives you time to do that.
Depending on your access, you can type out a Word doc, or chisel it into clay tablets. I would suggest two large tablets, with no more than 5 rules each.
**TODO** Steal someone elses sig.
Your company is within its rights to disable your access. It owns the underlying resources and everything you've produced so far. From the post, it sounds like your slightly incredulous that your company would do this to you, get over it. You gave 4 weeks so spend it documenting and talking with everyone in the company to make sure they have as smooth a transition as possible. When you move on, show good faith by providing a way for them to contact you. If your new job doesn't work out, what you do over the next 4 weeks may be a deciding factor if you want to try and come back.
Offering to contract back for 4 weeks to get everything in line might be an excellent solution.
Bear in mind, that in some state if you get fired without severance after giving notice, the you can sue the company. Obviously if you do something destructive your not going to get anywhere.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
If a company withdraws privileged access from personnel nearing termination, how are those people supposed to disarm all the time bombs they've installed in systems over the years?
But seriously: The last company I was laid off from never stripped me of any privileges. Upon termination, I was expected to (and did) return my secure token generator, so now I can't log in through their firewall any longer (this assumes that I'm not aware of any back doors). But, during my career, I had administrative responsibility for several servers. I had installed some simple monitoring programs on these systems in my personal accounts that would page me and e-mail me at work and home if problems were detected. Prior to leaving, I prepared instructions for my replacement which included changing the notification e-mail addresses. He never did so. That was in 2003. Occasionally, I still get status messages from these systems, indicating that my user accounts, including e-mail routing rules, are still active.
Have gnu, will travel.
Holy crap! You just fell into a huge pot of money (1 month salary) to do NOTHING.
Don't look a gift horse in the mouth. Buy a Nintendo DS, pick up a few classics at your local used video game store, kick back and get paid.
"I'm high level... blah blah blah" "My knowledge is very important... blah blah blah"
Whatever; forget that noise -- it's none of your business, not anymore. The only important thing is that being high-level, you probably have high-level pay. That's a win for you.
Sabotage is one thing, but that's not what you are doing. The company is sabotaging itself. Are you a VP? President? CEO? Shareholder?
If not, STFU. If you are a shareholder, sell now, and enjoy an even greater payout.
You got The Man(TM) by The Balls(TM) and you're complaining or wondering how to let them go? Forget it man! EPIC WIN FOR YOU! GET PAID!
The company I work for routinely fires people upon receipt of their 2-4 weeks notice.
Top notch way to build morale for the remaining employees though!
Just another ignorant American.
didn't read thoroughly.
You're not entitled to be given interesting work, worthwhile work, or any work to do. The company has no obligation to you other than to pay you once you tell them you're leaving.
They actually have no obligation to anything else while you work there, but I digress.
Get over yourself... you're actually complaining publicly because your ego is bruised. How dare they take away your access before your last minute! Don't they know how valuable you are? It's insulting.
Get over it.
Is this in some high-level manager's training handbook? At the top level of management do the courses teach you especially how to handle I.T. departures as a special case? This approach appears so common that one is left to believe that it must be being taught in secret (secret so that I.T. doesn't rebel overall when they find out about it) to managers everywhere.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
I had the opposite experience. I was given 4 months working notice. That meant that in 4 months I would be let go without severance.
I developed a lot of software in those 4 months, especially since I was the "walking dead" and people tended to leave me alone. I would have loved to just quit, but I had bills to pay.
It would have been easy to put small but critical flaws in the software had I so wished. Indeed I could have degraded the performance of the system with perhaps no one ever finding out, much less suspecting that it was intentional.
Of course, I am above all that. But it was remarkable how much trust the company had.
Poster gave notice of resignation. He was not terminated, and he is still a regular employee of the company until the date on his resignation letter unless otherwise released by the company. The company has no additional liabilities regarding restricting access during your twilight unless specified by laws covering specific industries (like possibly banking).
Now I agree it is probably best to turn access off immediately and pair you with an employee so the company can learn to live without you. But it seems the points you state are irrelevant to this specific post question, unless it is also a high risk industry like banking.
When that has happened to me it was always them laying me off. Whenever I gave notice I was always allowed to finish up what I could and do a brain dump to someone else. This last time I was laid off they came in the middle of the day and laid off a bunch of people by calling them into another room, and the rest of the company into a company meeting. When we got back to our desks they had removed all access to the network. I had about a week's worth of work I could not checkin. Their loss.
Of course, by laying me off they were essentially telling me that they no longer valued my contribution. I was not allowed to do a brain dump either - I was to pack up my stuff and leave with a minimum of interaction with my friends and colleagues. They were in turn told not to say anything to us about what was going on in the company or what was said in the meeting. Pretty cold.
The best thing to do is just move on.
And employers wonder why some people treat their job as just another job.
F**k 'em! Use the time to do some reading, "bone up" on some subjects you have never had time to. When a company I was working for folded and I had 2 months of nothing to do but babysit the coffee machine, I spent time learning about stuff I have never had time to before, well that and ripping music off Kazaa ( shows how long ago it was!) on a works connection!
with /., Fark, Kongregate (if your firewall will let you), and slavehack. Those are my best suggestions if you can't work.
Absolute power corrupts absolutely. indymedia
Wait, are you saying you don't have some backdoor access set up that they don't know how to revoke? Noob! :)
Actually, if they're paying you to do nothing, I'd go with "become the most prolific Slashdot poster over the next few weeks". But if you've been their for 9 years and your smart, why don't you have everything running like clockwork so you can just sit and read slashdot all day anyway except for the semi-weekly "outage" that you cause to convince them that you didn't have your job completely automated within 6 months of starting. I guess if it was that kind of an IT job, you probably wouldn't be leaving in the first place.
In my previous jobs I've always been told that I can just go ahead and leave any time I've turned in a notice. Usually with a security escort by my side. Except the last one. They put me on the help desk answering phones for a week. Now that is some cheap, easy entertainment that makes your last days at a company just so much more enjoyable.
If they've stopped you from working then don't work.
In fact, I'd ask them if it's OK if you stay at home or telecommute for the next four weeks, seeing as they've removed your ability to work.
I gave 4 weeks notice since I was a key employee. Not only was my access to the network continued, it was extended a week after I officially quit in order to finish a few project I agreed to complete but ran our of time during my 4 week notice period.
My point is I guess how you are treated varies compay to company and person to person.
----- There are two kinds of people in this world, my friend; those with loaded guns, and those who dig.
We have it set up right now, so that at a large corporation (we have about 4000 employees), everybody that's low level can make AD policy changes at a whim. And to boot, they use a 'generic' account so it's difficult to track who is doing what, making what changes.
Your job sounds like it's going a bit far and fast with the access cuts, but honestly be glad they do it that way instead of the other way around, where if you leave the company -- the passwords don't even change because it is "inconvienient".
I'll be laughing if we ever get a proper audit. Because I have been telling them this for two years.
The price is always right if someone else is paying.
I'm usually the one who takes access away and I only do it when the supervisor says to, and it's typically me who is helping them transition the former employees account data to someone else (files, emails, etc.). I've had people with high-level access for months after they left there jobs because that is how their supervisor wanted it handled, typically they just tell me the last day for the person and I do it on that day. The only time I do an immediate account termination is when something serious has happened, like a firing. There is a VP who has the authority to request an immediate account termination on anyone, no questions asked. Besides that everything is just handled on a case by case basis.
... would have given you your 4 weeks' pay and said good bye. Oh, and have me* cut you off asap, no login at all. He would have politely asked you to leave all your papers in your office, empty out the company car, and not contact any of *his* customers for a decent period of time, say 3 months.
One ops manager emailed the boss on a Friday evening telling him he was done, car keys were under the front steps, have a nice life. We called his clients Monday morning (excpet for a few I could call Friday night) and informed them that so-and-so was no longer employed by us, we would like to meet to discuss our relationship, blahblahblah. About half told us that they would be cancelling their contract and would work with our ex-ops mgr directly. And he had a nice business going. I convinced one key client to meet with me and explained the circumstances of his leaving, the email, the abrupt notice. Surprise, the client knew he was leaving for weeks, and had been told a long tale of abuse, threats, and then that the boss canned him Friday at 5:10pm over the phone. I assured my client that this boss would have canned him in person, at noon, in his office, with his last paycheck in his hand, straight up like a man, just business, and by the way don't let the screen door hit you in the backside. And he would have called all affected clients beforehand to tell them that so-and-so no longer was employed. Before he was no longer employed.
Sounds like your outfit is a little schizo in this. They should just send you home. Lingering is always bad, and can only lead to you either trying to do the right thing, or trying to do something else.
And you should be choosing whether to start early at the new place, resting up and painting the bedroom, or learning something new. Like COD4.
PS- does your work PC have a decent graphics card?
* When I left, it took me three days to get my replacement up to speed on how to manage the network, keep the boss happy, fix his ACT! software, and then how to keep me out of the network when I was gone. He asked me about 6 months later about some logging question, since he was suspicious that I hadn't tried to access the network. I explained that I didn't much care to, it wasn't worth a frak to me. I was busy with my life. He still doesn't believe me. I taught him well. He's still scared to death someone will break in.
deleting the extra space after periods so i can stay relevant, yeah.
When anyone in the IT department gives their notice we send them home with 2 weeks paid.
believing the big bang requires a certain amount of supernatural faith
Are you going to a competitor?
If not, I'd approach my boss, say "I understand that you want to protect all the data that I have access to. But, I hope to be able to serve this company in the time that I have left and without at least some of that access, I can't do that. Here are the things that I still have in progress: X, Y and Z. If you give me permission to do A, B and C, then I can complete these projects before I leave.
"Others might have given you much less notice, But out of loyalty, I wanted to give you ample time to find my replacement and handle the transition. Would you please consider reinstating the access I need to finish these projects? If you cannot, please tell me how I can serve this company until my departure."
They probably won't give you the access. But, this at least creates a positive impression in their minds. Pulling some of the other stunts suggested here doesn't.
Don't take it personally. Especially if you are leaving a large company.
So.. what to do with your new free time? If you really want to not burn a bridge, spend the time documenting all the little ins and outs of the stuff you really think is important, or that you have had some nagging concerning about. Find out who will be picking up your tasks, introduce them to the folks that you interact with on a routine basis. If you have direct interaction with end users, let your replacement know which end users requires a little more attention, or have difficulty with things. Give your replacement(s) a little "tour" of the more obscure tasks that you do. All systems have little quirks, transfer those bits of knowledge. Any special configurations, unusual setups, etc.
Why would you want to do this. Because it's a professional way to respond. And it is possible that years later it might come back to you. As a personal antidote, when I left my first company (after 13 years), I didn't burn any bridges. They let me keep my system authorities, but what I did was to set up a new account for my replacement and with my replacement looking over my shoulder I started to remove my old accounts, just to make sure that things would still work. I worked closely with my replacement in "cleaning up" all the little hooks that my old admin accounts had and made sure that he had the same access that I did. A few years later in the new company, I was laid off as part of a large downsizing - several hundred people (everyone was literally given notice, told not to touch any system, make one phone call, grab your personal stuff and escorted out of the building - in a very unprofessional manner). My old manager from the original company contacted me and asked if I was part of the downsizing and let me know that "there is a desk here if you need it". (As a final note in this, about 6, 7 months after I was laid off, I received a call from the company that laid me off.. asking for my skills again.. my response was "hell hasn't frozen over yet") -- so the karma works both ways..
There's the key phrase... Whether you are 2 or 10 levels removed from your management team you are insulated from the policy makers. Chances are you were never a person or peer in their eyes, just a resource. That resource is now a liability.
You are done. Speak to your immediate manager for your options, whether that's a severance package or leaving after two weeks. Or decide for yourself and leave. Effectively you no longer work there. Do what's best for you.
Take heart. I have worked for many firms. For one of them I was only 1 removed from the CEO and President. We had regular meetings. I was still ordered off the premises in my own office after I asked for 5 minutes to grab my books and a poster. When I didn't comply in 30 seconds the President picked up the phone and started calling the police for trespass. I waited for 5 minutes on the curb to hand them their keys and security card when he came down to "chastise me" for my decision. I was "de-invited" from a co-workers going away party. That was in 1998.
To see folks continue their positions after giving notice is still a surprise to me. It all depends on your experience.
You can't argue against ignorance and paranoia. If it really matters to you then you will need to negotiate these matters for ending your job at the beginning. Else be glad they donot call the cops or worse, blame you for errors or problems after you leave. I still received threatening phone calls from that firm because they didn't secure the passwords upon my leaving and were still demanding them 2 weeks after I left.
Earn a high wage. Buy awesome toys. Die happy.
Well wishes to you.
"Don't fear death... fear not living..." -me
When you put in your two weeks at my company, and you're in IT, they walk you out and give you two weeks worth of pay. That way they're sure you don't do anything, and you get your pay for the two weeks you would've had to of worked.
The policy with my company is when you give notice of leaving the business that is your last day. They will have your final check waiting for your the next day. Due to the type of business they can't risk allowing anyone to cause harm to the system. True someone could cause damage without the notice but its just one of those things.
You have know idea how much knowledge we have escorted out of the business over the years.
I was laid off from the University of Washington on Tuesday. They said that we had until the end of the week to tie up loose ends in the office, but my access to my home directory was cut off when I got back to my office.
I packed my personal stuff, said my goodbyes, and left. For better or worse, my projects are done.
66 of us lost our jobs. Most had been working there for decades. Many were stoic, some were mad, some were in tears. A lucky few were able to take early retirement.
http://seattletimes.nwsource.com/html/localnews/2004429972_webuwlayoffs22m.html
Because there is only one of you?
In an ideal world managers would only manage people doing jobs they at least had a clue about.
Obviously we don't live in a ideal world.
John McAfee 'It was like that time I hired that Bangkok prostitute; to do my taxes, while I fucked my accountant'
I would request that access be restored while you prepare documents for the company. You gave them ample notice (when I left my last job, I was disgruntled and gave one weeks notice... on Monday), so you obviously don't intend to do harm. If you had, you would have done it BEFORE giving notice (or at least I would have). If they refuse, go the slashdot route. They seem to want to pay you to sit on your rump instead of doing anything anyways.
"Trust that little voice in your head that says 'Wouldn't it be interesting if...' and then do it." - Duane Michals
Your play is to do whatever is in your own personal interest (which would include the interest of your family and friends, and perhaps innocent bystanders).
"Not an actor, but he plays one on TV."
They apparently have no clue (if you had any ill intentions, you'd have acted on them before handing in your resignation), so play on that:
Tell them you can cause harddrives to erase by knocking on the case in a special way, and access the high-security database with a paperclip and two pens. They'll probably believe it, judge it too high a risk to let you stay even without any access, and make you an offer.
Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
Tidy up as best you can. Check out the folks you like and see if you can do something which makes their life better/easier/more fun. Then move down your list to the folks that haven't made your life a pain and do the same. You have to work through others - it is their job and not yours any longer.
ps As to those few who have been a misery, hold at arms length - they're the ones who will blame you for their shortcomings as soon as you hit the door.
Lost in space at an early age. Survived the vacuum. Now rebuilding castle in air.
I believe that when someone makes a mistake like this, it's generally wise to give them a chance to fix it-- and when it comes to asinine crazy-making policy, that means _one_ chance. I'd go to my current boss and explain it-- here's the plan of what I was going to do these four weeks, these are the parts I can't do, what can we do to fix it?
It's very well likely that the Policy that comes from On High cannot be fixed, but I do think it's a requirement to try-- once. If they can't fix it, I'd do the things in the plan that I can do, and then I'd implement a telcommute policy for the remaining week or two.
From the beach. I've done my due diligence.
I mean, what're they going to do? Fire me?
I am the owner of a seasoned IT company, and I find this post very interesting. When we unfortunatetly have to fire someone, we lock access immediately. When a trusted, long term employee gives notice, we keep access open and come up with a transition/knowledge transfer plan. It sounds like your company had a knee-jerk reaction. You are in a good spot. Don't make a fuss, don't burn any bridges, and wait for them to come to you. Be upbeat, offer to help, but otherwise I suggest using these four weeks to relax and do what you can with what you have. Don't surf the web, post on slashdot, etc., if you think they will be following or logging your access. Take the time to document what you think they will need to know. They may end up asking you to leave earlier than four weeks, but you should be holding your head up high when you finally do walk out the door. This may only bring you good karma, but taking the high road is always a sound plan.
It's highly unusual to allow a person with high access to remain on the premises after giving notice. Even if management follows the general procedure of removing access, someone who has worked for many years in a trusted position of authority may very well have alternate means of gaining access. Physical access to the premises, following someone who has recognized your face for many years into a secured data center is not that difficult in many corporations. Standard security policy for any security conscious company upon receiving someone's notice typically involves a short exit interview. During the exit interview all access to systems get revoked, while management explains the severance package, unused holidays, paying the employee 2-4 weeks to not come in... After the exit interview security can escort the person off the premises.
When I left IBM to pursue a life worthwhile, I was well aware of how they dealt with folks who intend on giving notice. I knew when I planned to leave and started working on finishing my active projects that could be finished and bringing in more of my employees to co-develop on the projects that would continue to exist after my departure. A couple of key trustworthy developers I clued in to my general departure plan. I did not inform anyone of my specific departure date, in order to give them plausible deniablity.
Management saw me as a wonderful mentor. When I did turn in my notice, I did it on a Friday as I was walking out the door. I came back in on Monday with an escort to officially say goodbye. To my knowledge, everything continued to operate normally without the guy who never got to take any vacation because he was critical to the success of the business.
It was a win win. The corporation had trained personnel in place to continue without disrupted services. I left knowing that any of the projects I had any emotional vested energy would be properly looked after. I happily cashed the paychecks they sent without a twinge of guilt.
OK, I guess I'll de-cloak and jump in. First background, I'm a CTO with a small software company. By small I'm talking about 30 bodies total. I mention this only to provide some data on my experience/viewpoint (CTO, not developer) and my environment (dev shop, small company) and even with all that said, remember YMMV.
OK, our policy falls in to two categories/buckets:
1 - your privs are removed and you are sent home with pay for the notice period, goodbye don't come in to work.
2- you keep all your privs and you continue to work, thanks for staying during the notice period.
Nothing else makes sense to us. Removing your privs and having you come in just creates a distraction while you talk to other staff, not useful to us.
As to whether you fall into bucket 1 or 2 is the result of conversations among management. Any doubt that you will play nice - goto bucket 1 immediately. Any doubt that you are really needed to complete work - goto bucket 1 immediately. If you both can and will contribute to the project and we do not expect any issues with you working during your notice (poaching employees, causing trouble, etc.) then go to bucket 2.
We have had people we assigned to bucket 1 that were great employees and I'd like to keep. They were not really needed for the project and we sent them home as sort of a last 'paid vacation' from us. No ill will, I'd hire them again. We've also sent people home and taken a hit on the project as the distraction, productivity, or trust factor outweighed the usefulness factor.
Removing your privileges and still having you come in makes absolutely no sense to me. Seems to be the worst of both worlds, you can't really be productive and the low work load can cause you to create distractions for other staff. I just do not get why they want to do that.
Hope that helps.
Do not take your situation personally. You should be as helpful as you can just what they seem to expect you to do, as well as you can under the circumstances. Arguing about your situation will almost surely gain no result other than distracting management more than they already are, and not help anybody.
Essentially, they don't want you to fish for them anymore, they want you to teach them to fish.
Aside from the many security and legal reasons for changing your status immediately, this is probably the best way for your employes to find out *before* you leave exactly where they most need your knowledge, and what help you can provide to those who continue on with your projects, so that you can provide it before you are gone. This is much more valuable than having you merely provide another few weeks of work.
Speaking more generally, everyone should always carefully plan your departures. When you walk into the manager's office to give notice, you should be fully prepared to be immediately walked to your desk to grab your box of stuff in 5min, and then be walked out the door. Although it does not unusually go that way, it is frequently enough done that you should be ready for it. I.e., take most of your non-obvious or bulky stuff home ahead of time, get copies of work product that you are entitled to keep for reference, clean up your files and email, etc.
Also be prepared to deal with vacation time, personal time, benefits and other HR issues. Obviously, one of the best ways to prevent being hosed by evil HR drones is to use up all your vacation before handing in your notice. However, if this is impractical, you should know that in most states, "cancelling" vacation and not paying the amount owed is a violation of labor law. If your employer tries this, them *immediately* call your state labor board (or whatever the dept is called in your state), or a good labor attny, and get the problem resolved. Also, know what you need to do about Health Insurance (e.g., take coverage at your next job, sign up for COBRA coverage, etc.).
And, of course, it goes without saying to be nice, even if they aren't...
Sure you could slack off and do whatever you want, but don't burn your bridges with you old employer, especially after you worked there for 9 years. 9 years is a hell of a chunk of time to screw up because you acted like an idiot during your last weeks. Perhaps this is time to get a letter of recommendation from your boss (if you get along well). I have had bosses do that for me before.
Isn't it ironic that we complain about having to work, but when there's no work to do, we complain? Shouldn't being paid to do nothing be a dream?
"During My Service In The United States Congress, I Took The Initiative In Creating The Internet." -Al Gore
I previously worked at a small web company when I was in college. After college I found a higher paying job. I turned in my notice (3 weeks at that employer). I was within an hour stripped of all privileges. I then met with an the 2nd in command and offered that I leave today, they agree to pay me 2 weeks and they save the other week. That I would be available via cell phone for the full three weeks. They agreed to it. I started my new job three weeks early. So for those 2 weeks I got paid double. Took a bad situation and turned it into a great one for both. They saved money, I made more money. They got my knowledge, they got their data security.
Since you have 4 weeks to get the myriad of projects handed over, the lack of access will let you focus on doing just that. That was ostensibly the reason for giving the length of notice you did, so use the time in the way you planned on rather than in fixing user "lost password" issues.
Your time is better spent (and your value to the company) in ensuring a smooth transition of those projects.
Insanity is a gradual process; don't rush it.
...hit up on that office co-worker, and say, Hey now that I no longer work for the company, I say we relax those rules about inter office dating. Friday sound good?
WARNING: Smartphones have side effects--most of them undocumented.
Here is how you deal with the situation, it's no longer your problem. Yeah, you put in 9 years at this job. You're a hard worker, want to accomplish what you had set out to do but can't refuse the new gig.
So write your documentation and take two hour lunches for 4 weeks, you're getting paid to practically do nothing.
I had this happen at a job when presented them with a two week notice. I had already written my documentation and had a project that would have only taken me like a week to complete. At first they said yeah, finish it. The next day, nope, don't do anything but write documentation. I was like, I already wrote my documentation for everything I did and was going to do for this project which was straight forward.
So what did I do, took long lunches, left early, got there late. I practically just did nothing for two weeks.
So enjoy the downtime, starting a new IT at new job sounds like you'll be busy.
Where I work, you pretty much work as-usual (with added handover tasks) until your last day. Then, around 17:30 on that day, you get root and remove your account from the system, just to keep things tidy. And we're a multinational!
Depending on my relationship with the company, and the size of my employer, I have sworn off ever giving notice again.
Well why should I? They aren't required to give ME notice! And I've been burned the last three times by immediately being let go with no time to look for another job.
So, screw it. I'll start giving notice when they do.
"They said I probly shouldn't fly with just one eye," "I am Bender. Please insert girder."
This IMHO is another argument for treating your soon-to-be-former employer the same way that they would treat you were your roles reversed; by that, I mean going in to HR on your intended last day and saying "Oh, by the way, here's my ID, I don't work here anymore, good luck in the future". You are not required to give your employer notice when you quit, just like they're not required to give you any notice (or severance pay.)
It sounds negative and a little bridge-burn-y, but remember that the employer/employee relationship is not equitable under most circumstances; this case, where you're expected to waste a month of your life being useless, is a pretty extreme example of an employer causing grief for an employee because the employee DARES to take steps to improve their situation.
Personally, what I would do in this situation would be to call my future employer and offer to start sooner than the current starting date. If it's possible, do so. It'll leave your current employer in the lurch, but IMHO in this case they deserve it.
Never underestimate the power of stupid people in large groups.
Why do you care so much? Don't you think they knew you'd be essentially useless without access? Document what you can (I trust you still got Word), leave your cell number and tell them you'll come in if they need anything but that you won't be spending those weeks sitting on your hands.
___
No power in the 'verse can stop me
Slashdot is (was?) mostly read by geeks. You know, those guys who keep your IT systems up and running and handle technical issues with technology? When they give notice, prudence (and common sense) would indicate that you continue to use them to resolve those issues until you can get someone else up to speed.
Much as I support capitalism, it's funny how some two-bit entrepreneurs who own "businesses" start acting like oil barons the minute they get the chance.
It's certainly taught to me than once (not as a manager) that it is good security policy to do this for terminated IT employees. I suspect some companies just don't make a distinction between terminated employees and employees leaving voluntarily.
At one of my old jobs, I remember them doing this specifically in the case where they found out the employee was going to a competitor.
I was a "key" employee with 17 people reporting to me while stilling running the servers, SAN storage and all internet facing servers for the company. Oh, plus my cross platform C/C++ development work.
... After you've put your notice in, it is difficult to hold your tong about current management, their body odor and stay professional. Really, it is.
I put in my 4 week notice before becoming a highly paid consultant. They kept me on the entire time with full access (dumb), but I am and always will be a professional. I passed on as much information, documented as many processes and TODOs and even helped interview the 4 people they tried to hire to replace me. Somehow nobody was hired and the company was bought out a month later.
I liked working there. I liked the people and my management. Some of my current "best friends" still work in the company that bought us out.
Based on what I've read here today, it appears the world of IT has a mix of immature idiots and really professional people. I can only recommend a company slowly remove access to systems for anyone who will behave professionally and escort any idiot out immediately. You don't know who will behave or not, so the safe thing is to cut most access and keep them until they misbehave - surfing inappropriate sites would be grounds for early termination even after notice was given.
Whenever word gets out that someone on the team is leaving, they usually become a cancer on the rest of the group and need to be cut out sooner than later. We've all been there - you hear Joe is leaving so you ask him "where" and whether they have any other jobs
My long term contract ended (over 8 years) about 6 months ago. My last day was very well known and I worked up to that date trying to cleanly hand off all my projects to whoever management decided would take them. The projects didn't all go in cleanly, but most did. I had lunch last week with the ugly project guy and he wasn't mad at me at all. Sometimes projects just don't go well. We're still friends.
You can never get your reputation back, if you do something stupid in a moment of rage or even sadness. Don't forget that. IT is a small world. I still run into people who I worked with at NASA 20 years ago - on line. I'll need their help when I finally decide to get back to work.
Companies don't know why they work.
I'm serious. They really, truly, have no idea. They pay a bunch of people to do various things, and at various levels of influence correct errors, but that is not the same as knowing why they work.
Think of rogue employees damaging everything on their way out as shark attacks: There are people who are truly terrified of sharks, and indeed, it does suck to get bitten by them. It's not exactly common, however. But think of loss of institutional knowledge and goodwill as a car accident: Huge loss of time, potentially enough damage that experts (mechanics / consultants) need to be brought in, but common, manageable, and often someone else's problem.
It doesn't really work that way, but by then it's too late.
I'd think that if they want to cut your hands off, there's not a lot you CAN do for them, right?
I would just come in to work on time, think of whatever you did that needs to be documented for the next guy, and be there when people come asking questions about the same sort of thing. Otherwise, enjoy the vacation...
But definitely the better a state you can leave them in when you go, the higher they will think of you, and it will only make them a better reference either directly, or through IT personal networking.
Doesn't this mean that the company's intellectual property is of no value?
I'd ask future employers while interviewing with them about their policy. If they screw the people in the trenches this way, keep interviewing other employers...
One time I modified an application to log everybody's windows password to the database when they login. I didnt have any malicious plans when i did it, just wanted to see if it would work and play a prank on somebody. I admit I was acting a bit manic (damn bipolar) and at the time I didn't know I was going to leaving :P
That was a few years ago and I don't think anybody has discovered it, and I didn't even try to hide it.
I've been tempted to try to hack back in and get rid of it, but don't want to risk getting caught, and it might look like I was trying to go back in for the passwords.
I've thought about doing the right thing and telling them that I left a huge security hole, but dunno what the consequences would be.
I wonder if when somebody discovers it will they keep it quiet or come after me?
Having left all of my jobs under friendly terms. I have to say that you really need to read and understand company policy before you resign. I gave three weeks at my last job. I was going to give four, but thankfully someone talked me out of it. I didn't have all my access yanked, but giving your resignation really is basically asking to be ushered out the door immediately. Thankfully in all cases despite having privileged access I was allowed to stay and be productive till my last day.
But as most of the stories above point out, if you don't know your companies policies, e.g. yank privileged access immediately, you could be in for a boring few weeks, or a frog march from the building.
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The worst thing you can do is take it as a personal sleight, that won't make you feel good about yourself or make your company/coworkers feel good about you. And it's funny how you end up working with people again in the future.
So take it calmy and be utterly professional about it, treat it like an exercise and learn from it to start building leaving-staff policies for the It department of the firm you are about to join.
To start with write a document with a work plan for the remaining four weeks:
Set out all of projects that are close to completion and which you feel need to be completed before you leave if your current company isn't going to have difficulties completing.
Set out the bits of knowledge you want to document.
Send that to your boss together with a description of the minimum system access you will need for each task, and possible workarounds if that access isn't available.
As your boss to decide whether he/she would like any of this work done.
If the answer is yes, you will have started a constructive conversation on what needs doing and how you can do it. If the answer is no, you can become a prolific Slashdot poster with a clear conscience and start planning out the initial elements of your new job.
It's really just a pending break-up, so it's whoever's decision makes it first. If you give them 2 weeks notice and they keep you around for 2 weeks, you both decided on 2 weeks. If you give them 2 weeks and they walk you out the door, it's their decision that you leave immediately. If you go in and tell them you're quitting, it's your decision.
Anybody with high-level rights should have absolutely ZERO problem with giving their employer no prior notice, and their employer should be ecstatic that they don't have to make any decisions about whether to keep them around with limited access, no access, or kick them out. It certainly doesn't "burn bridges" (whatever the fuck that means in a world with almost 7 billion people). You just do it like any other business decision, professionally and with due respect.
In addition, let them know you are available for consulting work for the next 2 weeks before you start your new job, but you won't be available at all times as you have other responsibilities, etc etc etc, blah blah blah.
In fact, I already told my employer that I won't be giving them any notice if I decide to leave precisely for the security and liability reasons that sr. management is always stressing about. He has no problem whatsoever with this, and is gracious to have expectations of what to do if I leave already set ahead of time.
Protector of Capitalist views,
Meorah
I was laid off from a state university about a year ago, along with the rest of my IT department; about 27 people. They gave us four weeks' notice that we would no longer be employed there, and asked us to help transition to the new support system. Fortunately for that university, we are a bunch of good, honest people; otherwise, we could have wreaked anonymous havoc across the board. Personally, I think your company was wise in revoking your access, just as a failsafe. A better use of your skills and time than using you as a chairweight would be to have you train your replacement (if they have one).
Evil is the money of all root.
At the top level of management do the courses teach you especially how to handle I.T. departures as a special case?
You're the only one thinking IT people are special. I've seen program managers leave, and in their last couple weeks they spend a lot of time doing nothing but transfer their projects.
The California Supreme Court that legalized gay marriage, by the same logic has now legalized Polygamy as well.
Don't even bother imagining that the right wing bases any of their arguments on logic.
No exceptions, no excuses. Someone even hints at leaving, they're gone immediately -- escorted from the building. If you gave me four-weeks' notice, that's nice and all, but you'd be gone in ten minutes.
Here's the kicker, it's got absolutely nothing to do with you.
It's not that I'm thankful to finally get rid of you, or even that I'm worried about your doing anything evil in your remaining time. If either of those were true, I wouldn't have kept you in the first place.
It's simply that we have clients, and each one has us sign a number of confidentiality clauses. Should something go wrong, legally speaking, in those next four weeks, it doesn't have to be your fault or have anything to do with you, you become the scape-goat for everyone else, and the client asks how I can trust an employee who won't be around long enough to be held responsible for their mistakes.
And that's all it really is. It's always been about the client, and it still is about the client. I can't start explaining to them how great you are, and how much I trust you, even in your final days. After all, they are "always right", even when they aren't at all correct.
So don't take it personally, or take it personally, but know that doing so is as effective as trying to solve an algebra equation by chewing bubblegum.
It's kind of like what Bill Cosby said: People with only one child aren't really parents. If you come home, and the lamp is broken, you know who did it.
So take it as a compliment that you were trusted with such high access in the first place.
It's time for you to go.
Same as that. I was made redundant, given 3 months to wind everything up and then given the equivalent of 10 months wages (tax free). Those 4 months were boring and depressing. I took some holiday leave and some 'sickness' leave. I was also given the opportunity to take time off for interviews but I didn't bother. None of my privileges were revoked; I could have done some damage but that would have been pointless.
12 months after leaving I received an email from an old colleague, who'd just been promoted, asking me if I wanted a job. I returned as a contractor on similar money and 2 years after that I was given a staff job on more money than I was on originally. Being taken on would have been quicker but there would have been tax implications that neither I nor my employer wanted.
This all happened in the UK and is pretty standard stuff.
"Don't burn bridges" - spot on advice.
This post contains benzene, nitrosamines, formaldehyde and hydrogen cyanide.
to show you the door. Besides you have told the company you are leaving why should they want someone to be there if they aren't willing to stay long term.
Yes I understand the desire some have to pass on knowledge, it sounds real nice till you ask the flipside, why weren't you passing/sharing knowledge the whole time you were there before? Siloing knowledge is a common defense mechanism, there are a few people I have dealt with in the pass that were painful to get information out of. Either it was a sly way of hiding their lack of knowledge or they really felt it made them more valuable.
Back to the title of my post. Sarbane's Oxley has really made security miserable for some. Combine that with auditors who don't truly understand each platform's security ability and it only piles on the paranoia. Still it comes down to one thing, if your leaving then the company is right in moving you out quickly and under their own conditions.
Frankly if I had someone telling me they were quitting I would drop their access and put them in a debriefing mode of around two to three days. If they can't do turn over of knowledge of outstanding issues then I have been doing something wrong in the working of my shop. I shouldn't need two weeks to get what I need from an employee, if I did I am putting myself at risk of lose from emergency medical issues to death. In a company as large as I work for neither are things I can afford to ignore, it just happens.
* Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
There's plenty of other things you can do with the time, without access that could actually be useful to the company.
-If they have a replacement found all ready. Go over the useful bits you found with them including contacts and whatnot.
-As above, assist your replacement. There's a lot of grunt work involved with switching everything over to a new person and that's on top of the learning curve. Help the person out.
-If there is no replacement yet, document everything you can think of in reason even if it's in the form of cheat sheets or quick references for the next person.
I have to admit the question is kind of funny. Generally all of your job duties would not necessitate the high level access. You can still do all of the 'other' stuff that's part of the job.
And here's a funny story along similar lines. I was the login administrator for a site, the job duties included test running which permissions were needed for which job on the client systems. So when I was leaving I was the one who got to cut my own access off at the knees. That was actually pretty nice as it let my replacement and I set a schedule for a hard and fat date for when each job responsibility would be transferred over to their sole control.
Though a lot of how a company handles things like this depend on previous experiences in the situation. I was tapped to kill the previous login administrator's access during the meeting they had with management when they found out they were fired.
You chose to leave your current employer so why should they pay you extra money for leaving?
Typically you get a severance package when you are fired/laid off, not when you willingly switch employers. So why would your current employer offer you a severance package for up and leaving them?
Perhaps because they are doing some code or scripting that they might need to finish? If you let them do it..you'll have it done in 2 weeks...whereas if you're paranoid, you can wait who knows how long, to have time in their schedule, to look things over that are done so far, have to learn what was being done, and try to finish the code, etc.
I'd dare say not everyone gives there notice only after they've completed all of their assignments.
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
Am I the only one who has a copy of the CVS repository on his iPod?
My guess is the bigger the company the more likely this is to happen. When I left my relatively small company (250 emplyees) I was 'instructed' to write a book containing everything I could think of from working there 27 years. I'm the one who took out my own access and erased my own e-mail account. I assume they changed root passwords after I left. Not really my problem, but even though I diodn't leave on the best of terms, we still trusted each other to do the right thing, which we both did.
How about a moderation of -1 pedantic.
Prolific Slashdot Poster,
My advise to you is:
1) Come in late
2) Bring the newspaper
3) Read
4) Be available to answer questions
5) Leave early for lunch
6) Enjoy the 5 course restaurant next door
7) Come back in at 2pm
8) Leave work at 3:30pm!
Spend some time documenting an open source project.
It sucks but is understandable. If I were in your shoes, I would go to my boss and ask them how they would like me to procede. I would explain that while I understood and sympathized with their security concerns, I would also like to finish the projects and work that I had previously been assigned. If the company would like me to cease work on those projects, that would be fine; but I would like to know what they would like me to do in the next 3-4 weeks.
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Same thing happened to me. I was working as a UNIX sysadmin for a major grocery store chain in Pennsylvania. On Monday I gave notice and they acted surprised that I was leaving and started to organize an orderly transition of knowledge. On Wednesday they decided I couldn't be trusted anymore and I was escorted out of the building and given 7 days paid vacation.
"Politicians always tell the truth, when they're calling each other liars."
I have! I was working as a data processor on computers running windows 3 and dos. No internet connection at all. There were times I'd go for months with nothing to do. To make things worse, I used qBasic to write myself out of my job. When I did have work, I just loaded the raw data, ran my program, put the results on a disk, then read/programmed for the rest of the day. By the end of my second year there, I had an assembler and a simple OS interface written entirely in qBasic.
BTW: My boss was pretty mad when I showed her the program I wrote for my job. She told me to delete it and not to show it to anyone else. So I kept it secret and held onto my output disk until then end of the day. (Or longer if it was a big file)
"That's so plausible, I can't believe it!" - Leela
Always have all your personal effects removed from your workplace before ever handing in your letter of resignation. Be prepared to leave immediately... well in advance of the date you give them formal notification. Try not to be too conspicuous while you "sterilize" your office before that day either.
And most of all... turn in your letter the very last thing at the end of the business day, and make it a Friday. Never, ever turn it in first thing in the morning, especially on a Monday or early in the week.
Sit there, smile, and collect your check.
Dang, I gave three weeks notice at my last job, but they let me keep all my access right up until the end and I had to do detailed documentation to hand off all of my projects.....
Ah, but don't you know? No individual (without an executive title) is ever considered 'important' to a company. Proving that fact is far more important than meeting deadlines :)
And for those thinking to flag troll - i've seen this actually happen numerous times. Besides, if you miss a deadline because of someone who's no longer around it's pretty easy to blame them eh?
You can get rich if you own a politician, but you have to be rich to buy one in the first place.
Audible.com
if you hit one of the podcasts sponsored by audible, you can get a link to a free audio book, too.
This is common practice in many industries including accounting. As soon as you give notice, they stop you from doing work 'just in case' there is any possibility of you doing not-so-nice things before your last day. They just include it as cost of losing a person. Enjoy surfing the web for a month
Get a red stapler. Carry it everywhere in the office. Don't let anyone else touch it. Don't do anything else different. Politely help everyone as they start learning about your projects.
You just might get them to revisit their policy without saying a word.
Invenio via vel creo
Wage and hour laws typically don't cover vacation. Whether someone gets paid for not working doesn't really affect order in the labor market, which is what really concerns the ruling class.
Were the US actually interested in the welfare of persons or people, paid time off would be mandated with laws covering the corner cases, instead of a moth-eaten privilege to be granted or revoked on a whim.
/. -- the Free Republic of technology.
but make sure stupid fees, golden parachutes, and the "Japanese tourist discount" apply.
/. -- the Free Republic of technology.
If there were ever a Slashdot article that needs a poll for it...
Personally I think you should endure and become a more prolific slashdot poster.
It's their (un/wise) choice to run their company as they see fit, and if they want to cut your access so you have to twiddle your thumbs till your time is up then so be it.
http://slashdot.org/~tf23/journal
In any big project, there's always more documentation that can be written, and more details to pass on.
If you've got an employee that can turn over all their knowledge in two or three days, you've been hiring the wrong people.
One answer to your earlier question about "why weren't you passing/sharing knowledge the whole time you were there before?" It's not always about hoarding knowledge - often, there's simply nobody to turn it over to. In a busy environment, it's difficult to find time to sit down and train someone in a system they're unlikely to use. Those other employees all have their own projects to get done, too. Documentation and cross-training, while good to have, often slip in priority compared to getting the newest patch out.
As a contractor, I tend not to have this problem as much. Since I know from the beginning that I won't be there long, I can be meticulous in my documentation and training, planning from the beginning to get my work ready to turn over to someone else. Most regular employees, though, usually don't have that luxury.
If the masses can keep you down, you're not the Ubermensch.
I've worked at companies where they didn't have a difference between terminated employees, and employees who were leaving on their own accord. Both were put under the same guidelines, so an employee who might be retiring, moving to a contractor position, or moving to a completely different position at another company, with plenty of notice given will get the same bum rush out the door as someone who was fired for lighting farts in the executive washroom.
Consider it a compliment. I was taken into a room for a "meeting" while my staff removed my access. Once that was complete I was given my papers, escorted out the door, removed of all keys, all building doors locked. In my case it was an un-announced layoff. 30% of the employees were let go, presidents on down to floor workers. But I was one of the first because of the access and ability, not desire, to destroy electronic data, etc. It has nothing to do with trust, but access and ability. As pointed out it's good for the company and YOU, liability wise.
Really, why go to work at all? What are they going to do, fire you? I suppose they could try to not pay you for that last four weeks, but that's just asking for a lawsuit or labor relations complaint, so they probably won't. If you feel like being a bit more conservative, go in late, leave early, and take long lunches. Or just show up each day, or even once a week, long enough for people to see you're there.
You're not really helping anyone out if you're sitting bored at your desk because you can't do your job. Not your co-workers, not the company, and not yourself. It's just a combination of stupid policies.
There is a real breakdown in logic here... To lock someone out (and escort them off of the premises as some commenters have discussed) aims to prevent vandalism since the employment relationship has been severed. What is illogical is that the employee knew they were going to give notice for an undefined period of time before they gave notice, and therefor could have reaped all of the havoc that they cared to reap before giving notice. It just doesn't make any sense to me. A company is always vulnerable to their emplyees and employees are always vulnerable to getting fired by their company. Its a symbiotic relationship. Its very interesting how the element of time and the imminent end of the relationship suddenly changes it.
If you're an IT person, and can't keep yourself busy at a computer for 8 hours a day (without supervisory planning), then just give it up now. I'm regularly learning something new from the Internet while at work and without missing schedules.
A short list of fun stuff I do at work along with work...
* Study LISP (read the "Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs" online for free!) - Granted I'm still no good at it, but it's interesting.
* Study Smalltalk (though, like LISP, I'm not very good at it. also has a free e-book online. And, seaside looks really interesting).
* Study math (Maxim is fun. And, yes, I'm a Geek with a capital G).
* Study processor design (No you don't need physical hardware to do this. There's hardware simulators and HDL)
* Study electronics (also has some fantastic free online e-books).
Hell, if I was in the posters situation, I'd start a blog and go to town ranting about all my office annoyances (#1 - Slurping coffee. God, I hate those slurpers. Let the stuff F'n cool down before you drink it! Okay!).
I'm more inclined to believe that a lack of creativity and desire to learn are the real issues here (not lacking 8 hours of supervision).
Nope. Well, not on my iPod. But I did rsync the whole repo to my home machine right before I left. I know at least 2 other coworkers who did the same. Sometimes you get attached to your code.
Or, they could fire you on the spot. I had a friend who worked at a dentist's office - the policy at that office was that you were immediately fired upon turning in your 2-weeks notice.
While it is courteous to give more than 2 weeks notice, particularly in some fields, you have to be careful in case your company decides that it has had enough of you.
I say rather than debate with them over the decision, that you do the best you can do for training the other people without access. If they end up face down in the dirt the minute you walk out the door, that was their decision, not yours.
If they call you after you start your new job charge them a consulting fee lol.
Saying Java is nice because it works on all OS's is like saying that anal sex is nice because it works on all genders.
The biggest problem is that if the person is going to a competitor it is already too late. They most certainly have copied everything they could possibly need before giving notice.
So other than preventing sabotage (which would be a stupid thing to do) there is little point in locking them down.
In the past, I've considered the idea of trying to schedule in some "break time" between jobs like that -- but it hasn't really worked out for me.
In some cases, I felt like the new company trying to hire me was really interested in my ability to start almost immediately. Telling them I'd be "ready to go after the standard 2 weeks' notice" with the last employer was a big "selling point" for them hiring me in the first place.
And other times, yes, I DID need the next paycheck ASAP. It's not about being fiscally irresponsible, necessarily. It's about having been forced to live paycheck-to-paycheck because the previous job didn't pay enough to do more than scrape by. (That's why I was trying to get something else!)
This makes sense - if a valuable employee is committed to leaving, you want to maintain your connections. If I had been in a position like yours (just quit, starting somewhere else soon), I'd expect that I would be interviewing people to replace me too. This is the sort of thing that creates loyalty.
"We returned the General to El Salvador, or maybe Guatemala, it's difficult to tell from 10,000 feet"
>Why does noone take a break between jobs - tell the new job you'll start in a month, and go to the beach.
>Or skiing. Of just play D&D for a couple weeks straight. Whatever.
>And if you tell me that you need a paycheck to pay the mortgage, electric bill, or whatever, you aren't being
>fiscally responsible having no safety buffer. If you think that it doesn't matter unless something goes wrong, well,
>your life sucks more that it needs to because you aren't taking the vacation.
Well you answered your own question. Most people live paycheck to paycheck, hence most people don't have the luxury of losing a job and taking a nice month-long vacation before starting something else.
A work that expires before its copyright never enters the public domain and thus enjoys eternal copyright protection.
Whats unusual is they didn't let you go immediately after announcing your intension to leave. It's not personal; it's the way things are done at this level. It's normal. When you're at a protected level, never give notice and expect to stay.
The month notice is what's probably what did it. That's too long. If it had been the standard two weeks they probably would have. BTW: They escort you from the building but you still get paid for those two weeks. Spend this time documenting procedures. Maybe training a replacement. I'd personally stay away from the Internet or other computer access. Read a technical manual and get caught up on the newest and greatest.
It's not personal, it's not a reflection of your ethics, credibility or trustworthiness. It's difficult not to feel insulted but don't be. Thank them for it. It's for your protection too.
-[d]-
As I tell my kids: "boredom is a choice." When I was in my 20's I decided I needed to learn the virtue of patience. Lineups suddenly became an opportunity to plan or daydream. Red lights are an opportunity to drum or fiddle with the stereo. Not having obligations is a release, not a burden. The only obligation is to better yourself.
Boredom is a "glass is half empty" situation.
Seriously, use the time to learn or create. At best, learn the skills you'll need soon. At least, blow off steam writing funny ascerbic useful commentary on protocol, policy, or management strategies, as a parting gift to your cow orkers.
Damn those pesky terrorists
If I recall correctly from my undergraduate days, it's possible (i.e., I did it) to write a knight's traversal algorithm that finds its solution with no backtracking, for reasonably small boards (including 8x8). No stack required.
"Not an actor, but he plays one on TV."
I got the opposite at a place I used to work at. I had just gotten a job as the sysadmin for a high school, I did not have local administrator rights to anything, and my now-resigned predecessor said "You don't need local administrator rights! You should be going around and connecting workstations to the network, not playing around on the servers!"
Conversely, when I resigned [in disgust over office politics], I had my replacement disable my account. The principal was pretty technologically inept, and I could have easily kept my account if I wanted to.
Your problem is that you actually care about this company. Yes, you've been there for a long time and put in a lot of time, but once you give your notice, that's the end. Let them do whatever they want and enjoy your long lunches for the next month.
Recently I gave notice at my company. I am retaining access "in case" as I've been key in developing some systems used company wide. However, I've been instructed to "do nothing" except when asked by my supervisor.
I've seen it both ways. Usually I see the access revoked but with the explanation that it is to make sure they know what to do without you. An employee would be kept on, close on hand documenting and able to hop up and shoulder-surf/assist replacements with fixing anything.
It is kind of odd that no one gave you that information in the company, usually if you're in good standing they at least are polite about it.
I'd say, chill, don't ask for access back and document/train as appropriate.
deliver in person this letter to the President or CEO of hypothetical company
summary: see Philosophy question
problem:
leave job, cannot complete projects
classification:
lose-lose(worst situation), not win-lose, not win-win(best)
framework:
Sun Tze: Art of War/Strategy
those who gained allies well , did not take up position
those who did not take up position well, did not arm
those who armed well, did not fight
those who fought well, did not die
allies mean PEOPLE - employees and partners
classification of sins of the company:
give authority without responsibility - Enron
give responsibility without authority - deny passwords
cost to company:
give responsibility without authority (passwords)
future employees: tell everyone in the industry
leadership: lawyers run the company,
technology nor entrepreneurship projects are left in 'hung state'
technology analogy to operating system
best to worst. high load performance. normal. stopped. crashed.
hung - database left in 'inconsistent state'
strategic advantages given to COMPETITORS:
best way to cripple the company is to offer forty percent increase
in salary. Offer 100% and key project manager is suspicious.
Allow the employee you are hiring at least six weeks notice.
options are a dilemma:
resign immediately and take a NO PAID vacation.
likely, your wife will give you hell.
start documented unimportant documents that are misleading.
your successor will waste his time looking through unimportant
documents, thus sealing the fate of your projects.
cost to company:
BAD NEWS spreads fast. The company message is clear:
YOU CAN BE REPLACED AT ANY TIME.
YOU ARE just another cog in the wheel mechanism.
Russian Communism: They pretend to pay us and we pretend to work.
company strategy:
any project that take a long time is doomed because of personnel
turnover.
Mr. 'scrambled, inconsistent state', FACE REALITY:
your important projects were not well received. they were
a 'great idea whose time has NOT yet come.'
your sentence (as a wage slave) is 'the rubber room' - where
teachers sit and do nothing.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/10/10/education/10education.html
Stop thinking about the old company, think only about the new.
Many of your friends and colleagues NEED their job. They cannot afford
to be seen with you. Thus, they may OSTRACIZE and possibly bad mouth
you. It is all part of the game.
Start your own company, free yourself from being a 'wage slave.'
contribute to google.org
Simple solution:
FINISH ALL YOUR PROJECTS. only then notify the company.
GIVE ONE WEEK NOTICE ONLY. in some cases give ONE DAY NOTICE.
As a project manager ABSOLUTELY KNOW when colleagues are going to
leave when
They're making it impossible to do anything useful. So come in as late as late as possible. Leave as early as possible. Take long lunches, preferably "going away party" lunches where somebody else picks up the tab. Waste time on-line. Chat up co-workers in the hallway--talk about sports, politics, cars, anything that's not work-related. Google old friends and classmates you haven't heard from in a while, and send them "what's up" emails telling them about your new position and when to change their address books. A week or so of this, and they should be happy to pay you to stay home!
Clearly the solution is to prepare for your exit in your last weeks, and tell them one day before you go. Your co-workers may wonder why your passing on all this information on how to do your critical responsibilities, though. Maybe you should schedule vacation to allay suspicion. ;-)
Seriously though, if this is a contest to decide the best way to wrap up your duties, you might as well have your input.
Give them one week notice - Prudent
Give them two weeks notice - Generous
Give them three or more weeks notice? You do realize they might give you two weeks severance pay on the spot and escort you out of the building, right? Or, if you mind being a paperweight for three or four weeks in a row, you only have yourself to blame when this happens to you.
Those are my principles. If you don't like them I have others. -Groucho Marx
Your lucky. At my previous job, they never even told me I was fired! They just kept moving my desk around the building...
No one cares what your captcha was
Houston TX, USA
Okay, so your company is paying you to twiddle your thumbs... Pick a good open source project, install it on a desktop machine, fix some bugs, or add a needed feature, etc. Submit some patches, etc. Or, if you're feeling charitable to the employer, start writing documentation...
- "History shows again and again how nature points out the folly of men" -- Blue Oyster Cult, 'Godzilla'
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Add one more to the list
I worked for a company for 5 years and then decided to go back and get a masters degree. I told my manager a full year ago that I may be leaving (I needed her recommendation letter) and then gave official notice to the company after 6 months. All the company asked me to do was to start working on a transition plan, hire a replacement and continue working on whatever else I had time for. I worked till the day before I left to school.
I think the trust has been mutually beneficial. I still know people who could work at my earlier job and refer them whenever I can, and my ex-managers (I had lots of them) introduce me to their friends/contacts whenever they are in town.
http://slashdot.org/submission/1062723/Cheap-mobile-data-plan?art_pos=2
Once you break the news, you are no longer an asset to the company. You are now nothing but a liability. They took the appropriate action when faced with any liability. They minimized its destructive potential.
And now you know, this is EXACTLY what you should have expected, and EXACTLY what they should have done. Now you can take this lesson to your next venture.
Modding Trolls +1 inciteful since 1999
. . . On company time unless you have written permission from your employer and a copy of the open-source license for the project signed by the President or General Counsel of the company. Seriously, the parent's suggestion just sounds like an invitation for another SCO-style 10 year lawsuit, to me.
I read the first 50% of the comments, but didn't see what I'd do. (and I have to get up really early tomorrow)
Just tell them what your intentions were, and what they are forcing to do (i.e. nothing). Then ask them what they want. Volunteer to be paid to sit at home. Offer to have the cell phone handy for questions.
I work for a subsidiary of MTV Networks, and if you tell management you're leaving, you retain all your access until you leave. (If you're fired for cause, we revoke access immediately, of course.) What you do during your last few weeks (two weeks is not standard, but it is the usual minimum; we've had people give notice two months before they left) is up to you and your supervisor.
You might expect that MTVN, being part of Viacom, would act like any other giant evil corporation, but as far as HR policies go they're not bad. What problems our HR has are entirely due to, shall we say, mistakes, not malice.
"Destroy science and religion. Science would re-emerge exactly the same; but not religion." - Penn Jillette, paraphrased
To believe that removing network access AFTER someone has handed in their notice will somehow protect the company from malfeasance is idiotic. We are talking about someone who has made a conscious decision to leave the company not somebody who has been fired. I have only known of one incident of computer sabotage in 20 years of tech and IT experience and that was someone who got canned and were pissed about it. I have never heard of anyone having their network access revoked if they were leaving of their own free will. In fact we have had people who took voluntary severance work right up until their leaving day. But maybe I just work for a company that gives their employees respect.
At the Fortune 500 company that I work at, we have an intranet that is dwarfed only by the DoD. The majority of employees have access to pretty confidential business info. Anyone that has access to the network instantly has their privileges removed, their badge is deactivated, they are removed from the company directory and escorted to the door. This is for any employee that quits or is let go. Of course they will still give severance in most situations, but they try to limit their liability as much as possible.
10 years ago I was running IT at an ad agency. I had one person working for me and I also ran the prepress production area. I resigned to take a job near my home that would advance my career (after 6 years there), and gave six weeks' notice, with a week's vacation that was pre-scheduled in the mix. I spent the ensuing month working really hard to make sure all my knowledge was documented for my successor, worked on managing a good transition, and a decade later I still occasionally do work for them and have keycard access to the building. I gave them everything I had in me, and I was well-rewarded for it and remain on very good terms.
I then spent five years at my next employer. It was a mid-sized insurance company that was acquired after I'd been there a year and a half. For the first year we remained fully independent, and I managed the IT department there. After a year we began integrating functions, and over time it was obvious to me that the center of gravity for the combined company would be far away - I made it known that I had no interest in relocation when they asked about it and then, ultimately, they eliminated my department at the office I was at.
Most of my staff were given departure dates - I was sent out immediately, though, since policy said that IT management had to be booted out right away. I didn't take it personally - it just got me an extra two months' paid vacation with benefits.
Whatever, the point is to be as professional as you can and don't take things personally. You did your job, you were paid your money, and if they want to make do without you during your notice period, fine. Enjoy the Slashdot posts, tell people how to do things if they ask, and get ready for the new job.
-- Josh Turiel
"2. Do not eat iPod Shuffle."
Go for the "most prolific slashdotter". For Honor!
Defining Statistics and Social Research
When I was in the Military my last post was at a secure communications station. The kind with man traps, armed guards, windowless rooms under ground and the whole nine yards. I had a top secret security clearance with an SBI (Special Background Investigation). It took 2 years to get my security clearance. I was scheduled to transfer and reenlist in 2 months but I changed my mind. It was no longer fun anymore. The day I changed my mind about reenlisting they stripped my security clearance, my building access, communications network access, computer network access, everything. After a week of sitting on my ass in the barracks because I could no longer go to work I went to the commanding officer and told him here is my home address and phone number. That is where I will be if you need me and got on a plane and went home. A few months later my dd-214 (military discharge papers) showed up in the mail. It was like a 2 month paid vacation on Uncle Sam.
How are they "sure" you didn't do anything? There seems to be a rather disturbing leap of faith here in assuming that someone wouldn't do something nefarious before they turn in their notice.
Have a little imagination. You don't need root/enable to make a difference. In fact, stepping back from it, and working solely through others, should give you a new perspective on what's important. If you're moving on to establish an entire department, then that's a very good thing; departmental chiefs that get bogged down in details are not only misusing their time, they're stealing opportunity from those just getting started.
My peers, my peers....
/. (but good articles only please, not some more bullshit about Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of Mediocre Movies).
Look, your peers will be fine, either you document things or not. If you did not document things for years I frankly would not lose sleep for not doing so know. The shit may hit the fan, your peers will sort things out, they may curse you a bit, but life will go on.
It is all very nice to be thinking about others, but I see a monumental elephant, no, mammoth in the room: your company is telling you in no uncertain terms they don't trust you anymore.
For bunnies sakes, either reach an agreement and get out of there now or post like a mad bunny in
Trust and commitment has to be reciprocal, if one part does not need it get the clue and move on.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
That company should be glad you were out of the door.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
Here is an idea. Sit down with your boss (I feel certain that you have one), discuss the situation, and ask him what he wants you to do for the next 3-4 weeks. Give a list of what you were working on and how he wants it to be handled. Does he want you to finish or train someone else? Since you are leaving, it is probably best for them that you get someone up to speed, not implement it yourself. I know. Crazy ideas.
Period.
End of discussion.
The original poster is a cowboy of the profession.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
So on top of running with your own username you did it on a a live production system!
Have you ever heard the terms QA or UAT?
I reiterate: cowboy behaviour.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
Only in the US ....
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
I refreshed a couple of important skills when I was made redundant earlier this year. I came and went as I pleased (within reason) and even managed to save their asses one last time.
I had the machines at my entire disposal (because in the UK not all companies are annal retentive, they have trusted me for years, there is no objective reason why the trust should not continue just because they made me redundant).
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
... if companies, specially big ones, were not uttering so much bullshit about how a valued employee you are, about common values and all kind of nonsense to make you feel part of the "team".
I learned the hard way what you explained above (by watching family and colleagues treated like dirt), but many people, specially younger employees that have not yet opened their eyes, should know that all the corporate propaganda is utter bullshit, because at the end you are nothing but a number with a salary in a database.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
And after enough years in the industry I have never met anybody from previous jobs (clients, colleagues) later in life.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
Anyone who was leaving on good terms had their access up to and including their last day to facilitate knowledge transfer and cleaning up of lose ends during their last two weeks with the company.
Maybe we do things differently up here in Canada. I find it illogical that a company would stop trusting someone suddenly when they announce that they are leaving for another job especially when the day before that same company had trust in them to have high level access to the system. I could understand removing access from someone who was behaving erratically but it seems a bit strange to not trust someone who has given you no reason to not trust them.
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
They were planning to get rid of U anyway & your notice just let them speed up the process. Now suck in your ego, stop whining about it on Slashdot, & move to the next gig.
if you give 2 weeks notice, they pay you for the 2 weeks and ship you home. Short timers are bad for the morale of others. If you have done your job right, everything is documented so you dont need to be around. IS this good or bad? For me, after I've given notice, I don't want to be there anyway. Even if its a great job and co-workers. Heck, you've moved on so don't linger around the water cooler. Leave the building, get in your car, throw a BIG finger at the place and split!
Meanwhile, I suggest slacking-off to whatever degree you can get away with. Why not? If management doesn't want to you to do your thing anymore, spend your time reminiscing and joking with the co-workers you count as friends. Stare at your desk a lot, take plenty of coffee breaks (excessive use of coffee helps the time pass, too, at least for me), and seriously consider sleeping in a little and leaving early. I am not saying you should try to hurt or cheat the company, since you've stuck with them long enough to indicate that you are valuable and like the company, but your time there is effectively done, even if they expect you to show up for a few more weeks. Seriously, it sucks that you can't finish strong or how you'd like to, but you have to acknowledge that your work there is done. Relax and give yourself a pat on the back - you'll be glad you did when the stress of having to do something new and adjust to new characters begins to set in.
This is a hacked account, for which the owner can not be held responsible.
I worked at a large telecommunications company and their policy was a little sneakier. You would go out to lunch. When you tried to swipe your badge to get back in, it wouldn't work. Security would show up at the door with a box in hand, escort you to your desk so you could get you personal belongings and then escort you out of the building.
It was policy and anyone who quit or was terminated has handled the same way.
I have been reading several of the postings now, and I am astonsihed by what I see. I can't help wondering whether these things are due to differences in cultural norms between the US and Europe. I have worked in computers for more than 25 years now, and although I have been fired more often than I can remember, the scenarios you describe are rather alien to me. Perhaps this is partially due to the fact that office workers generally have 3 month's notice (this was in Denmark) if they are made redundant; but I think there is a difference in culture as well.
As far as I can tell it is all about trust and confidence. In most Danish (and possibly other European) companies the hierarchy is not very steep - I have always known that I can go and talk to anybody as my equal - even the managing director (or CEO, if you prefer). That builds confidence and trust - the managers are much more prepared to trust someone they see as their equal, even when they leave. Also it makes sense to have trust as one of the basic building blocks in a company - after all, as a programmer you are entrusted with the most important asset of the company, and if they can trust you that far, you must be worth it, I would have thought.
Now I work for the UK branch of an American company, and I can see that they are different. For one thing, the people I manage keep treating me as if I was royalty even when I tell them to stop calling me "Sir" - in my opinion good leadership is not about bullying, but about being able to build trust and motivation. And I do remember the first time I met our CEO and told him that I didn't give a flying fuck about what he said when he didn't know what he was talking about - it seemed to leave him somewhat baffled. But I am still here, seven years later, so he must have got used to it by now.
It seems to me that around the time companies stopped feeling an obligation to keep their employees, the also started to become paranoid about what a mad employee could do to them. This is very similar to giving two weeks notice, and having a security guard and someone from empoyee relations show up at your desk an hour later to escort you to the door. Modern companies usually have contracts with their employees and consultants. No ethical IT person would even dare to do anything actionable before leaving because reputation and referefences are so important in the industry. An IT personal with a reputation of sabotage might never work again. I guess what seems odd about this is that we think we have an obligation to give notice so the employer can arrange for replacements, and years of trustworthy service can evaporate in a second once you say you are leaving. In the world of security, we have what you have, what you know, and who you are. When you are leaving, they want what you have, they change what you know, and they wish they could do something about who you are. Most employment contracts have specifics about what you are restricted from doing with what you know. Like business methods, contacts, etc... In all my years of experience, I have never met anyone who knows anyone who has ever damaged an employer's network. I think it is a rare happenstance.
The point of this long drawn out story is that expecting an honest reference for years of 99.9% critical service uptime all came down to the emotions of one man who happened to be the only American manager left in what was suddenly a Taiwanese satellite corporation in America. In retrospect I can see he had his problems too. I was honest and gave notice because I could not support his new infrastructure. My passwords were changed, people were told not to talk to me, management wouldn't accept or return my calls. They ripped the buttons off my uniform, so to speak. Aside from my emotional reaction, I had to start trying to answer questions from prospective employers like, "What have you been doing for the last few years?
This raises a few questions in my mind. For instance, Is providing IT services a good career move? One manager's changed opinion can invalidate the long term benefit to your resume. What I needed was my client to tell the truth. That I was able to provide a solution that worked reliably for years. I felt like a prostitute. Here I said, are my tax documents showing I was paid as a consultant for years. Was that enough? No, not by a long shot. In a tough job market I really needed was a glowing written testimonial of excellence. It's my bad... I didn't take care of my long term needs. What about cutting off my access to the equipment I was maintaining. That wasn't such a good idea either.
The focus of TFA was about handling how to handle the departure of staff who have high access to important infrastrfucutre. In this case there were several things done poorly from the aspect of the corporation. Having one employee singularly responsible for the management of the one critical consultant supporting the entire Internet infrastructure of the company, there were too many points of failure in that chain. The first failure was for the company. If my manager stepped in front of a bus and was run over, there was no one but him that understood the full scope of my duties. From my standpoint, if my manager stepped in front of a bus, there was no way for me to prove the successful completion of my work. Each month the one manager would sign my invoice which implied that I had been doing something.
When I was in the service, at least there was a service record which contained evidence of my completion of training. It contained letters of appreciation for periods of enthusiastic valuable efforts. When I had a Secret clearance, there was a piece of paper that said
Are you planning to burn down the building if they don't return your stapler?
For a site about things like basic rights, Slashdot users sure do like to censor "dissent".
Those who can't, write
Those that can't write, work for government contractors,
And those that can't hack that, work for the government directly!
Your faulty assumption is that government workers do anything of any real value.....
Companies are staffed by humans. Humans are irrational and often legislate and make rules for the small number of situations that can go wrong rather than the broader positive experiences. Go and see HR. If they cannot help or won't, be philosophical. You did the right thing and they did not accept your very decent approach.
You are basically being paid to sit and wait for questions to come your way. Obviously you want to leave on good terms so just go into the office every day and do as good of a job as you can with limited access. I would suggest just taking long lunches with your co-workers and doing a brain dump. Alternatively schedule brain dump meetings with your co-workers and make them do the work to document everything.
Telecommute :)
Especially in companies that handle confidential data there is a preference of getting you out of the door asap and paying you a month over giving you a month the opportunity to copy interesting bits for a bit of extra pocket money.
:-).
The underlying assumption is IMHO questionable: if you were really the type to get creative with company info you would have simply done that before you announced your resignation but I guess that's too advanced for HR
What amazed me is that the article author was still allowed entry. Also, the guy could have been given an offline copy to work with..
Insert
In one small start-up, there were two geeks doing the coding and sysadmin. When the cash ran out, one of them put bios passwords on their IBM servers. I'd say you def want to block off the sysadmins at the very least.
Confucius say, "Find worm in apple - bad. Find half a worm - worse."
As long as you can do your job, don't say anything. Your boss has come to rely on you and is acting very immaturely. Just do your job to the best of your ability the the "handicap" given to you and forget about the extras. The fact that this has happened to you should give you an idea of your worth to the company and take this as a reverse compliment.
Sys Admins often have access that go above and beyond what any developer or even DBA would have with the ability to grant or remove access to network resources. Usually, what they know is not terribly specialized or undocumented.
For this reason, I understand why companies will remove access from "IT" staff while business people, developers and other career employees require more time to transfer not only their technical knowledge but proprietary business knowledge and experience to their replacement.
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
... that companies make all the time. If they want to treat you like a potential criminal after 9 years of service... well... Age of Conan just went live. I say enjoy some R&R ;)
You need to approach changing jobs like driving. If you are overly nice, people don't know how to react and you can end up pissing everyone off since the person you are trying to let into the traffic, won't trust you to take the favor... you both end up waiting for the other to make the first move, eventually you just go anyway because they won't take their chance. You'd have been better off just being like everyone else and not being nice.
Same with jobs. Two weeks notice, period. That's what employers expect and that's what they are prepared to deal with. If you give them a month they think something is up and don't know how to react.
One of the things you forgot to mention is what you do... are you a developer, administrator, manager, director of security? What?
-AC