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MPAA Looks to Sniff Internet2 Traffic for Sharers
Danathar writes "It looks like the MPAA is pretty scared that Internet2 users are able to trade movies at high speed without them being able to know what's being traded, since you have to be a member of the Internet2 network to have a connection. As a result, they are asking to become a member."
No.
Love,
Internet2
okay, they can join, but they have to sit in the back of the class room and no raising their hands, got it.
Anyone seen my jagged little pill?
So they're asking to become a member of a limited group, for the sole purpose of suing other members of the group?
Can you say: "Hell No."?
first subpoena!
Laws are designed to help us co-exist with each other, to respect one another and bring order and a set of rules to abide by so that we can pool in our interests and progress as a civilization.
People or "things" like RIAA and MPAA abuse these laws, which were written to help bring progress. They abuse them into filling their coffers with wealth that is meaningless when it does not really help anybody. More so when it happens at the expense of others, and at the expense of progress.
Internet2 is primarily designed for scientists and research organizations, to pool in their resources and create a powerful network to facilitate better research interaction. Experimental particle physics data goes over several gigabytes, cosmic ray measurements are tremendously huge, gene databanks are big -- this is the kind of information that these networks are built for. Sure, some kid may be misusing them, but the percentage of people doing this would be far too less to be of any consequence (it has come down from 30% to 7%).
People like MPAA just will abuse the system, bring in more bureacracy, more rules and more regulations that will hinder how genuine users will use the system. They will wrap it nice and dandy around money and laws, and buy out our corrupt politicians who will dance to the jingle of wealth. And in the progress, they just will affect real people doing real work.
They are dragging everyone to the level of technology that they can control. Rather than adapt to the new technologies and grow with it, they try and exert their control by legal battles and money. Why can't they admit and move on to an era where their policies and principles encourage the technology, rather than deter it?
I sincerely hope that they are not let on board the Internet2. And I sincerely hope that one day our society is rid of parasitic savages of the likes of MPAA and RIAA. They're the scum and a disgrace of our civilization. They are the true deterrents to progress.
I hereby volunteer to let the MPAA install a camera in my livingroom and bedroom to insure I do not fast forward past ads, initiate a public viewing, or copy any of their bread-and-butter.
or have lawsuits become their bread-and-butter? *Sigh* either way.. I want to do my duty.
** "It's not my job to stand between the people talking to me, and the ones listening to me." -- Pego the Jerk
without them being able to know what's being traded
So, they want to know WHAT's being traded. Does this mean that they're trying to establish some new rating system based on how many people pirate their movies? I mean, shouldn't they be trying to STOP file-swappers instead of just looking at what they're swapping?
From TFA:
Recently, researchers successfully sent data from Switzerland to Tokyo at speeds of 7.21 gigabits per second. That was enough speed to transfer a full-length DVD anywhere in the world in less than five seconds, researchers said.
So does that mean with this new technology that hollywood movies might get cheaper to purchase using this sort of streaming technology? Anyone? Anyone?
's what I thought....
in saying "FUUUUUCK!" Internet2 is the best part of college. Streaming movies on demand at only the price of your conscience.
Yawn.
The article mentioned "researchers successfully sent data from Switzerland to Tokyo at speeds of 7.21 gigabits per second" ... and if they want to watch the traffic for "neferious" content, that is gonna require one heck of a Network IDS (Intrusion Detection System - SNORT is a popular open source IDS) to keep up ... and the vast majority of the traffic will be about as exciting as watching grass grow
Hulk SMASH Celiac Disease
First they take the Eternet speed record out of context ( "Recently, researchers successfully sent data from Switzerland to Tokyo at speeds of 7.21 gigabits per second. That was enough speed to transfer a full-length DVD anywhere in the world in less than five seconds, researchers said." ) and make this seem like the standard. I'm sure there just TERABYTES of DVD and mp3s sitting on Internet2 using their "new math".
Just say NO!
From internet2.edu: Internet2 is a consortium being led by 207 universities working in partnership with industry and government to develop and deploy advanced network applications and technologies, accelerating the creation of tomorrow's Internet.
I don't want to give them any ideas, but the MPAA has a chance at getting in by claiming to want to devise a method for distributing movies legally. However, hopefully I2 will look beyond that and deny them entry...
Robert Bindler
A Computer Science student's views on technology.
"We've been working with Internet2 for a while to explore ways we can take advantage of delivering content at these extremely high speeds
Funny how that's conveniently left out of the submission.
The crowds at Slashdot are speechless due to this unforseen move by the MPAA, you insensitive clod.
So just because they think swapping is going on they should automatically get access?
Bullshit
so if nasa playes music I wrote on the next space shuttle, can I tag along to make sure they dont abuse it?
I think if it's private, you having a copyright means nothing... can I get access to all private property in my area to make sure no one with portable cd players is listening to my music illegally?
MPAA Shut your mouth, and keep out
Sometimes the majority just means all the morons are on the same side.
Internet2 was designed (and funded) for use by universities and educational facilities, as well as governments so they could "[develop] and [deploy] advanced network applications and technology, accelerating the creation of tomorrow's Internet." It doesn't really seem as though the MPAA has anything to bring to the table. Their membership application should be denied on that basis alone. Plus the fact that there is simply no evidence that there is anything untoward happening on Internet2, just that it's *possible*.
Get a life, MPAA.
Where can I apply to be a member of Internet2? I want to help .. uh .. sniff for .. uh .. illegal stuff. I REALLY want to help the MPAA out :)
Right now Internet2 is primarily a research network, and I think it should stay that way. It's useful for shuttling (large amounts of) research data back and forth, as well as examining new router/switching/etc technology. (No coincendence that many of the speed records are set on Internet2).
What it doesn't need is the massive commericalization that has occured on good oi' internet 1. Yes, piracy and filesharing that is unmonitored is definately a problem. But the real problem is not that it's unmonitored, it's that students with no need for access to the network have it. Why can Joe DormLiver piggy back on Internet2? Does he need research access?
They should politely tell the MPAA to fuck itself, and then develop some controlled access. I suggest only connecting research computers to the net, along with a few proxy servers so professors and grad students (and undergrads also doing research) can still use it remotely.
It would be interesting to do bonafide p2p and network research over Internet2, but that is not what the MPAA is looking for.
-Ryan
AUWYHSTOT (Acronyms are Useless When You Have to Spell Them Out Too)
This must just be a rumor on the Internets.
Would being a member even make it technically possible for them to "sniff" the traffic? I'm a member of the exclusive Internet One club, and I can't sniff arbitary traffic.
Get your own free personal location tracker
Tell them that you've made them members of Internet2 but really make them members of Internet0, wherein there is naught but a group of Haitians trading the complete collection of Ernest movies (Ernest Goes to Camp, Ernest Goes to Jail, Ernest Goes to Haiti and Becomes a Zombie, etc.).
You are in error. No-one is screaming. Thank you for your cooperation.
.. someone were tuning a remote deep space dish, and accidently hit upon a video stream from a commercial satellite... would they end up being sued?
In any case, if someone can transfer the contents of a DVD within 5 seconds, they they would probably figure out some way of converting the files into something less noticable than an obvious archive of video and audio files. Convert everything into a tar file and convert that into something less noticable like floating-point volume data.
Vintage computer adverts: http://www.vintageadbrowser.com/computers-and-software-ads
from TFA:
"At least one studio, Warner Bros., is already a member of the group, as is the Napster online music service. The two groups have been discussing potential collaboration since."
Looks like they already have the key. Else somebody forgot to BOLT WB and Napster out.
check it now, bitch. Also, learn how to punctuate. Its
*-anonymous mouse-*
This is why the plural use of the word internet by George W. Bush makes sense.
Please vote for natrium's's entry and against stupidity.
There are many good reasons for the MPAA to join the Internet2 research project. Huge bandwidth, multicasting architecture, realtime multimedia: all these features might have a legitimate association excited about the future, and their role in bringing better service to their members and market. Instead, the MPAA has become interested only as a cop, not in contributing to the development of the technology itself. They'll just wait for Internet2 to be developed, at great expense in time, money and inspiration, by others - then they'll eventually cash in. Their only attitude towards the future is fear, emboldened a bit by greed.
The great lesson here is that Internet2 is only a litmus test. The MPAA acts exactly the same way on Internet1, and everywhere else. We're just witnesses to the miracle of the birth of their racket on Internet2. Burn, Hollywood, Burn (our should I say "Stream").
--
make install -not war
If the MPAA is allowed on Internet2, where else will they want access to? Your college's intranet? Your corporate network? ISP's LAN networks? There are many other fast network connections where piracy could take place.
Do they have any idea what kind of equipment would be needed to monitor all Internet2 traffic in real time? And how exactly do you determine that a specific bitstream is a copyrighted movie, especially if it is encrypted? I don't think they wan't to "sniff" Internet2, I think they just want to look at everybody else's file shares for any file name with the word "Grudge" or any other word used in a movie title, then sue the owner of the file share. FTP passwords, anyone? How about IPSec?
"Freedom means freedom for everybody" -- Dick Cheney
This question is strictly for research purposes. I have no ulterior motive.
i can't remember the last thing the mpaa or the riaa developed that was advanced. unless you count the practice of suing those you rely on to make money, but i think sco has prior art there. they're not interested in innovating anything beyond the scope of a new process for suing people that allows them to file suits more efficiently. this is, frankly, the most disturbing news i've heard in a while (including all the legislative bullshit) because they'll probably get it. this is disgusting.
The only way to get rid of a temptation is to yield to it.
-Oscar Wilde
Internet2 is the best part of college. Streaming movies on demand at only the price of your conscience.
And I think I can speak for the MPAA when they say, "Congrats, you guys are precisely the reason we are doing this."
I didn't say that they don't have a reason to be on I2. I just said I'm not pleased.
Yawn.
Sure, Internet2 is 'members only'. But I think it's safe to say that most if not all of the members have standard commodity connections as well. So anything you can get to from I2 you can get to from the regular Internet, just at a reduced speed. There might be a small number of exceptions, but in general it's true. Being on I2 only affects the path taken by the traffic. It doesn't affect what's reachable.
I suspect the MPAA wants to be a member more so they can go to the member meetings and make a stink. Keep an eye on things from the inside so to speak.
I've got about 300 DVDs, and I probably buy at least 1 per week (if not more when I visit the Wal Mart $5 bin). It concerns me that they focus so much attention on the few who download movies. I would prefer that they.....say.....spend that money to develop enhancements to the DVD experience (something that isn't included in an encoded pirate version of any particular movie).
,like cockroaches, will ALWAYS exist) could be better spent to enhance their own industry....or (more likely to peak the interest of the MPAA) line their own pockets. Litigation isn't cheap, nor is computer/network forensics.
/. crowd would stop hating us"
There have been times that I've downloaded a movie from the Internet, enjoyed it, and purchased that movie from a local store so that I could watch it in higher quality and benefit from the additional DVD features (Southpark Movie). Other times, I've realized that the time spent downloading a particular movie (Blair Witch Project) could've been better spent playing solitaire.
Sometime soon, I hope, the MPAA will realize that the money they spend sniffing out pirates (who
Somewhere, there is an MPAA representitive reading this article who is thinking "Hmmm....he's right...I could get a raise and people like Trey Parker and the
"Lame" - Galaxar
1) An ass, and abusing a serious network.
2) Part of the 'problem' that has the RIAA/MPAA sniffing around a network they should stay the hell away from.
DAMN YOU OCTODOG! DAMN YOU TO HELL!
While it seems ridiculous to include MPAA as a member of Internet2 under the pretense that it is helping research, we still cannot let Internet2 turn into a free-for-all of file sharing and illegal movie swapping. There is a reason that sharing copyrighted material is illegal. Intellectual property forms that basis of our society, and certainly it is critical for research institutions that "trade" in information. Being a member of Internet2 should be a privilege, and one with responsibilities taken seriously. Governments and universities are spending millions to get their systems on I2, and it is not the public's job to finance piracy. It would be terrible to see I2, which is quite powerful now, turn into another (regular) internet filled with all its trash, and with all its bandwidth consumed sharing movies.
That said, I cannot support commercialization of Internet2 or an invasion of it by MPAA just to allow them to sue I2 users. But in order to keep internet2 aligned with its true goals of promoting research, we will have to give some governing council the authority (even imperative) to fight this piracy and THEN take it to the respective IP owners like MPAA. I think it is silly that the burden should fall on MPAA to regulate such things, and it is because of this lunatic system that we are forced to deal with lawsuits from companies who snoop at file sharers. Pirating movies should have a penalty similar to stealing them physically: go to the city court and explain yourself in front of a judge your crime and regret, rather than dealing with expensive lawyers and publicized cases as is happening now.
Internet2 is the best part of college. Streaming movies on demand at only the price of your conscience
I can hear the Jiminy Crickets of the world crying out in pain!
in girum imus nocte et consumimur igni
The DMCA was used to threaten Ed Felton and his students into silence when they was about to present a research paper on the weaknesses of digital music security. The case sent a chilling tidal wave through the educational system.
With the spirit that Internet2 is designed for educational and research purposes and the precedent set by the Felton case, Hollywood's membership request should be denied in about three nanoseconds.
They are not welcome.
Eternity: will that be smoking, or non-smoking? I Corinthians 6:9-10
...storm the offices of the **AAs with tar and feathers.
"A great democracy must be progressive or it will soon cease to be a great democracy." --Theodore Roosevelt
I guess Bush was right, the "Internets" do exist! But this never came up during the elections! figures....
I don't see any membership level listed in the I2 bylaws that would allow even a collaborative level of membership within I2. All of the current corporate members have something technical or educational to offer to the membership. The MPAA doesn't as far as I can tell. In fact it want sa regulatory voice within the oranization. Article I, Section 2 of the bylaws prohibit all non-Regular Members from having voting rights. Unless of course the I2 Board of Trustees rolls over and lets the MPAA in. Grrr...
Fuck them, charge them $9.75 per byte of data sent or received while burying them with mindless infomercials.
Nice to see the MPAA has Congress in their wallets. Remember this next time you re-elect these scumbags.
The MPAA has the same unrational fear that got our president 4 more years
"Plans are for fools! Oglethorpe, the plutonian (Aqua Teen Hunger Force)
I though Internet 2 was ment soley for gov't
and universities and created because "internet 1"
is "overcrowded", commercialized, etc..
"1) An ass, and abusing a serious network."
Yeah, a network that I pay for in my tuition... it's not all paid by government grants you know. Undergrads subsidize portions of almost everything at research universities.
"2) Part of the 'problem' that has the RIAA/MPAA sniffing around a network they should stay the hell away from."
A private network is a private network. The sharing community on I2 is incredibly small compared to public p2p networks. It's not as though people discourage the MPAA from being worried about I2 when they measure speed records in seconds per full length DVD.
Finally, I didn't mod myself insightful. I don't think the tone of my first post really should have encouraged that kind of moderation.
Yawn.
Internet2 is a hotbed of IPv6 as well.
:-)
Wait till they get a taste of "privacy enhanced addresses" on IPv6 and find out some of those machines can change their addresses at random and not be tracable (only tracable to the subnet and no address server required or logs kept). They'll have to track'm down by MAC address (assuming no one is spoofing and morphing MAC addresses - how long will that take?) and wire by wire, switch by switch, once they're on the subnet itself, with the "cooperation" of the local techie staff. That's not even counting the really wicked stuff you can pull with multiple addresses (thousands, if you like) and different client and server addresses). BitTorrent already has IPv6 patches and some v6 BitTorrent seeders and servers.
Hmmm...
Internet2 + High Bandwidth + IPv6 + Privacy Enhanced addresses = good time to buy in stock in antacid vendors.
The MPAA and RIAA and going to make for a run on their wares...
Oh... This is gonna be good...
Maybe Verizon can help the MPAA dig down to some of those lines.
0 8&tid=95&tid=1
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/11/17/17472
"We've been working with Internet2 for a while to explore ways we can take advantage of delivering content at these extremely high speeds, and basically manage illegitimate content distribution at the same time," said Chris Russell, the MPAA's vice president of Internet standards and technology. "Those would go hand in hand."
What a horribly unsuccessful attempt to marry two completely disparate goals. The MPAA should be allowed to join the consortium as they have a justifiable interest in high speed delivery research. But monitor traffic? Come on . . . Those goals have about as much in common as Richard Stallman and Carmen Electra (respectively). They have no right to monitor traffic, and as a fairly democratic organization I don't believe the endnode members providers/sponsors would consent to it.
And for those of you wondering if monitoring of such gigantic flows is possible - of course it is. Netflow export can dump flow data to any number of IDS facilities. Even if you can't watch a single 10GigE link, watch the ten (10) GigE links that feed into it.
so they can get info to prosecute criminals
just give me a second to lower my drawers... (___)*(___) ---sniff this!!
Whatever happened to learning stuff?
End of Line.
The real reason they want to be on: to scare college students off of i2hub. If you can, try it, you will start hating the normal p2p networks. Research be damned, I want to download a movie in 15 minutes!
2*31*37*263
It is possible to let them be a member so they can test their high speed apps but not be able to "sniff" traffic. Just because you become a member does NOT mean they will let you put SNORT boxes at every maxgigapop on Abiline/I2
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I2Hub only allows clients on I2 to connect. I'm not sure how they do it; maybe with WHOIS data or a BGP looking glass.
"All it's going to do is get a bunch of researchers pissed off to the point where they'll set up honeypots filled with all sorts of mis-named files."
The researchers should be pissed off...at the people illegally filetrading on a research network.
Take your illegal filetrading ass over to the regular Internet were it belongs.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I created some software or music or something, and I'm just about positive professors are giving it to each other for free on Internet2, so I need to get on it so I can sue them.
When can I expect the guy to come by and install my connection?
Want a job with Google?
Click here or here.
The MPAA doesn't want to sniff Internet2; as you pointed out that would be really expensive. They just want to log on to I2Hub and see who's sharing what.
I just got through reading the latest New York Times magazine which featured many long and detailed articles on DVD and the movie industry.
The amount of disturbance to the industry caused or even potentially caused by Div-X converting and downloading is so tiny compared to the amount of resources and ill-will generated by their heavy-handed response to this so-called threat that one must come to the conclusion that the MPAA leadership is mentally unbalanced.
They are acting like the people who wash their hands ten times after touching a public door handle. They just aren't being rational.
The NYT Magazine articles mentioned that each DVD sale of $15 brings $9.00 of pure profit to the film studios that they don't have to share with anyone. This is the source of all the profit in the film industry. This is the fuel that is making the current entertainment boom possible.
Hundreds of millions of DVDs are sold each year and billions will be sold in the coming years.
Why are they so obsessed with ten thousand or so people sharing rotgut quality Div-X copies? Especially when each one takes several hours to download?
Even at minimum wage the wages for the amount of time spent downloading a stupid DivX is more than the price of a pristine DVD of the same title.
Nothing about this makes any sense.
It will probably just fade as embarrassment when the MPAA actually examines the real numbers involved and comes to its senses.
How far will they take this?
MPAA has learned of a thing called a BBS that could be used to trade movies at blazing 56k speeds. They are asking all SysOps to grant them user accounts and give them the phone number to the BBS. Hopefully they do not get admitted to Internet2 since their goal to is sue people on it.
What in the world is wrong with these people? I think that there is no need or reason for the MPAA to become a member of Internet2 at all. The Internet2 connects schools and learning institutions such that science and technology can be furthered using the wealth of bandwidth the Internet2 provides. The MPAA doesn't want to contribute as far as advancing technology and science they just want to snoop. Therefore, I feel they really shouldn't be members.
Isn't there a way that they can get some sort of search warrant to get temporary access to the Internet2? I really think that something/someone needs to force the MPAA and RIAA to better define their evidence for how much they say people are downloading. Furthermore, I feel that a long-term solution to piracy other than their constant "snoop and sue" technique. It's just like the stupid money in an air-booth carnival game; the more you try and grab and hold on to all the dollar-bills flying by, the more slip out of your fingers.
I feel nothing is really being accomplished through what the MPAA and RIAA are doing. I still don't understand how movie and recording studios use P2P download data for their marketing campaigns and then hypocritically sue everyone in sight afterwards.
MPAA & RIAA: Either be FOR it or AGAINST it, there is a conflict of interest in being both.
Not to mention the simple fact that the vast majority of people in the entertainment industry aren't paid very much at all. This leads to quite a bit of piracy occurring in the entertainment industry itself. I know I saw enough of it during my time in Hollywood.
You've already addmitted they give you an enhanced experience. You can even rent before buying. What more do you want from them before you stop pirating? Come to your house and suck your dick?
AC comments get piped to
Seriously, I know it will slow down your connection.. but use encryption for heavens sakes. Make sure they can only READ the things sent to them.
The DDOS'ers will be able to take down the MPAA alot more easily with all that bandwidth handy.
The bastards, they're going after two of the internets! Let's hope that President Bush doesn't tell them about any of the others...
-Waldo Jaquith
I sincerely hope they're knocked back. Why would it serve the public to have a special interest group with a history of skullduggery and legal strong arming, attempting to get in on a technology that by it's very design is supposed to be freely diseminated and unrestricted? The Internet is the antithesis of media property and what the MPAA stands for.
Hollywood can't even be trusted enough to turn out good movies with any decent intellectual or cultural content whatsoever. Why would they think they would be able to contribute to something that is so obviously out of their intellectual, cultural and moral league.
Si tacuisses philosophus mansisses. If you had kept quiet, you would have remained a philosopher.
I'm sorry, but if the MPAA wants to create a legal model for distributing movies realtime over I2 then I'm all for it. While I definately realize that an attempt to get into I2 is probably at least partly to track content, I think they're also eyeing the potential big bucks when it becomes a replacement for current modes of television transmission. Why go to blockbuster when you can stream a movie to your TV realtime? Hell, why go to the theatre to see Spider Man 5 and sit through the obnoxious kids in the back throwing popcorn... DVD quality instantly.
Yes, I realize that both the MPAA and RIAA severely in lawyers pockets when it comes to enforcement, but of the two the MPAA seems to adapt a little better to technology once they realize the battle is lost.
The way tuition prices are going, the only people who can afford college are the ones who are rich enough to pay someone else to learn, for them.
Dear Institutional Bureaucracy,
I would like to inquire about how and where one might apply to become a member of your Internet2 community. I have plans to develop a network application that would require tremendous bandwidth. I believe that my vision of on-demand, interactive holo-porn would be a credit to your institutions and humanity. Thank you for your consideration, I look foreward to hearing from you soon.
Maybe the Research Consortium will allow this but with a very heavy entry price? After all the MPAA is known to do that with its members who are outsiders so how about a hundred million dollar setup fee? Think how much research and new gear that could cover. I know in most parts of the world, its typical for a company that wants to join and eudcation group to help its own bottom line will tend to be charged a substantial amount to join.
Actually...
The best strategy for them to prevent piracy on internet is stay out of it. In some region they've already stopped distributing movies in VCD, so as to make law enforcement's job easier in identifying illegal copies, and on the other hand making the production of illegal copies more costy(in DVD). They could do the same for internet distribution.
They're still distributing contents on internet because they found it profitable! Deal with it, you choose to make profit out of internet, take care of your own problems.
Companies could save billions of dollars in utilizing fully secured digital transmission at lower cost. The benefits of Internet2 to the economy outweight the lost of such small self-interest profit group. MPAA, go away, would ya.
No, I don't trust you. The universities put their own money into research as well as using grant money. I dare you to prove otherwise.
What! There are two internets!? Well, Bush must of been right during the debate... "rumors on the internets"...
the RIAA and the MPAA will be given the right to search all laptops, portable hard drives, and flash drives.
There is a Burger King commercial where a cop stops some teenagers in a car and ask them if the music they're listening to was downloaded from the internet. It was a joke, but it IS our future!
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
Oh, the irony of a bunch of dicks wanting to be a "member"...
A republic cannot succeed till it contains a certain body of men imbued with the principles of justice and honour.
"You just don't get it do you? The reason that this becomes a yro issue at all is not the "right" to trade in copyrighted materials, it is about the right of network owners not having to waste their resources turning their own equipment into snitches for the MPAA and network users not having to worry about accidentally naming a file "usher" and getting their node shut down."
Apparently neither do you. If this issue was about concern for network owners rights, and resources? Then the legitimate users should be pissed that illegal filetraders are using their network, and their resources for illegitimate uses. That means that one way or another something the illegal filetraders don't like will be done. be it the RIAA, MPAA or it's like. Take a hint because MY taxes are paying for it.
We're going to charge you for every hop just like you charge us every fucking time we buy a new format. That'll be $10 per 4Mb thanks. You can re-purchase your own music at roughly the same pricess we can.
Internet2? Is that thing still around?
3) a Canadian looking through the National Film Board archives. remember the log-riders song? or The Big Snit?
Screw "learning stuff" - what about getting drunk and getting laid?
You can learn a lot about human anatomy with all that bandwidth!
Let's get drunk and delete production data!
"Why? Because as the consumer, I've the right to choose what I like, before buying. And the new medium lets me exercise that right - to see if the content is worth buying."
Blockbuster, Hollywood video, Netflick.
"I download 20 songs off an album, and realize that there is just ONE good song in that album. Why should I pay $25 for that one song? Instead, I'll just get it off iMusic. If it's not available, I'll just keep that one song that I like."
The story is about the MPAA, not the RIAA.
"Remember - give the consumer good quality and do not try to rip them off. And they will be happy to help out the artists."
Quality sound and video. Additional material like "how we did it", and even games and other material. All for a reasonable price.
Now tell me again why you're justifying the abuse of a taxpayer funded, research network?
Geeks never get laid, and with all that bandwidth on I2 who has time when they could be downloading kewl music, games and p0rn? ;)
There was a full page ad in our university newspaper today from the MPAA that basicaly said "The lawsuits will start soon. Fear our wrath. Stop sharing or else!"
It was quite impressive... and... stupid.
tell me the internet2 is not just on a hub...
Who knows how I can get in on some of that high-bandwidth, free-flowing movie action?
Incidentally, Snort isn't "SNORT" or "Snort!" or anything other than Snort. Snort isn't an acronym, it's an IDS. :)
Helevius
Whatever happened to girls without curfews? :P
You're stealing their fucking product!
When will you stupid assholes get this? P2P is not some competing business model, you're stealing their product right out from under them. They can't compete with people who do NOT Have the rights to distribute, taking their product and distributing it for free. The only way they can address that, is through the legal realm.
I'm working on a CS degree... so I have to substitute the lack of sex with more beer, it makes the code jump out of the screen. Honest.
Blockbuster, Hollywood video, Netflick.
And the Internet.
The story is about the MPAA, not the RIAA.
I'm aware of that, I used that to indicate that the economic model has gone anachronic with the new medium in place.
Quality sound and video. Additional material like "how we did it", and even games and other material. All for a reasonable price.
Never denied it. That's why I buy the DVDs for.
Now tell me again why you're justifying the abuse of a taxpayer funded, research network?
For the same reason that we are not locked up in cages and allowed to do nothing but work during our working hours.
Because we're not drones to abide by a set of rules and follow it to the dot. People use the network primarily for research, a small percentage use it for other purposes too. So fucking what?
When the rest of my taxpayer money is used to wage wars that I do not support and not in stem-cell research that I do support, you're more concerned about a bunch of kids using it for entertainment purposes.
And oh, Internet2 is not entirely taxpayer, it is supported by money from several companies -- AT&T, Intel, Sun, Cisco and the like.
(My lawyerspeek is weak, but you get the idea.)
End organization license agreement
I believe these terms will keep the **AA in check against the legitimate research that happens on this network.
At least this will demonstrate that Internet2 made a good faith effort to accomodate the **AA and their oft-stated goals and balance them against the rest of the other Internet2 members.
The Roman Rule: The one who says it cannot be done shall not interrupt the one who is doing it.
That internet 2 looks kewl.
Certified.
MPAA Free.
As seen on TV!
The following two quotes are from the MPAA's own 11/11/04 press release:
Must be terrible...the industry is losing $3.5 BILLION a year in revenue? They must just be drowning in the losses!
Wait a moment. This industry, suffering these massive, crippling losses from piracy, is doing BETTER than most sectors of the economy?
Here's the problem, and that is that the MPAA's figure is grossly inflated. Effectively, the MPAA figures EVERY download as a lost sale. (The MPAA's figures on downloading are also inflated, but that's pretty technical and better left to someone who can explain it comprehensively.) However, even provided that they're correct, they presume that EVERYONE who downloads a movie would have, instead, gone to a theater or bought a DVD in place of every download. (They also assume that these people don't do that anyway, and look at a lower-quality download to decide if the movie is WORTH seeing or purchasing on DVD.) This is, quite simply, not true.
It's time for the **AA's to quit whining. DESPITE widespread downloading, and bad business practices that turn customers away in large numbers, their revenues and market shares grow daily. Given that, it's hard for them to claim that downloads, whether on Internet1 or 2, are threatening to put them out of business.
To fight the war on terror, stop being afraid.
Like from where I'm sitting most of the law makers are a tad further to the right than me, and probably most people on /..
Now,
being to the 'right' generally means you believe in ownership and laws should be designed to protect YOU from the horrors of the world (well those that we havn't made extinct).
and being on the 'left' means that you believe in giving and that laws are designed to help eveyone get along.
The problem is, being a bit of a lefty means that you'll just, well, put up with the stupid people on the right(I expect they think your stupid too), so they get away with it.
Now, unless you go a little to the right, pop down the local gun shop and start taking out the MPAA there ain't noone comming to your rescue, there all, well, putting up with it.
The man on the left said lets talk, so I hit him. never was one for talking to strangers.
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
Well, as much as the MPAA would probably love to come sniff around my network, they can shove it up their ass.
And here's to hoping I2 tells them the same thing.
e to the pi i plus one equals zero
A, um.. friend of mine, has downloaded probably a dozen movies off the Internet. He's bought 4 movies on DVD at full retail from Best Buy as a result of seeing these movies and wanting to have a DVD quality copy/support the makers/etc. Of the other 8 or so about half were bad movies, and he did not buy DVD's. The other half he only downloaded because they were still in theaters, and hollywood's idiotic policy means you can't watch it at home for months after the initial release, so he bought the DVD's once they were out. For example, he had the first 2 lord of the rings on full quality DVD almost a year before the actual DVD was out. These movies he saw in the theater more than once each, and has purchased both the normal versions and extended.
Again, him pirating movies has led to more purchases, and therefore more revenue for the MPAA.
My Linux Command of the Day site : LCOD
"I didn't say that they don't have a reason to be on I2. I just said I'm not pleased."
Is any crimminal ever pleased at having to obey societies laws? Or suffering the consequences of not doing so?
In DVDs per minute, soon it could be DVDs per Second.
*BOOM* *SPLAT*
(that was Dan Glickman's head exploding)
"Screw "learning stuff" - what about getting drunk and getting laid?"
And paying how much in tuition for the privlege? Can you say foolish?
Internet2 is the best part of college.
You poor deluded loser. You must have totally missed out on the casual sex from eighteen year old girls away from home for the very first time. I should have gone to a party school.
"We returned the General to El Salvador, or maybe Guatemala, it's difficult to tell from 10,000 feet"
SO let me guess, if the Internet2 body of members rejects them, then the MPAA will take that to mean that they are hiding something and should be watched. So the MPAA lobbyists will harp on congress to pass laws that make it required that all networks that are paid by tax dollars be monitored by any industry advocacy group that requests it.
Let the good folks at Internet2 know that the MPAA is a threat. We've all seen organizations fall for this kind of trickery before, so let the people over at Internet2 know (in a calm and respectful manner) about the true nature and intentions of the MPAA, the widespread implications of accepting them, and the precedent it can set for the future. A contact list for Internet2 representatives can be found on their site. Also, students at universities should find out who they can talk to about this. Many of these people are quite likely oblivious to the MPAA/RIAA's tactics and would take the MPAA at face value. The MPAA is counting on this, don't let them get away with it!
Could you please provide me your address? I would like to come over and borrow your car and the contents of you wallet.
After all, its the new way to do things because laws do not matter any more.
Gee, ya know, I think these guys finally figured it out... in one week they've tracked users, sued them and even started looking at emerging technologies too see what hazard they might pose... all in ONE week! Talk about waking up from the stone age...
We get complaints every once in a while from the MPAA or their lackeys, claiming that some host on our network is sharing copies of movies -- The Matrix, Harry Potter, Star Wars: Revenge of George Lucas's Crack Pipe ... you name it.
Here's the funny thing: they're all wrong.
Every one of them. Wrong. I have never received an MPAA copyright-violation complaint that even had the slightest chance of being correct.
Here's how I know: We have a ridiculously big IP allocation, several times more than we need. Most IP addresses in our space are not used, and have never been used. Like, say, X.Y.1.1, or X.Y.64.64. And yet it is for addresses just such as these that we get complaints.
As far as I can tell, the cause of it is that shitheads somewhere in the world abuse our IP addresses behind NAT, instead of using RFC1918 private addresses as God intended them to. And just like with SIP or any other protocol that uses IP addresses in the protocol level to name hosts, file-trading protocols leak NAT addresses.
The abused addresses get published onto file-trading networks as places to get files. The MPAA's drones pick up these leads, and -- without checking -- give them full credence, and fire off complaints to us. They do not even bother to ping the host and listen for our router screaming back, "You blithering fool, there's no such host. There isn't even such a network!"
Any network operator who still gives any credence to these complaints is a fool. They are all wrong. Even if I got one for an address that actually had a host on it -- or, at least, had ever had a host on it! -- I expect it would also be wrong.
Every once in a while I get a complaint from these losers on a slow day, when I have some spare time and am feeling bored in the office. So I put on my slowest, laziest "I've been working a cushy, do-nothing public-sector IT management job for years, I don't know my ass from a router" tone of voice and phone up the MPAA lackey whose number's on the complaint.
I'm oh so very concerned. There's a pirate on our network? Is he breaking the law? What's his computer? You know -- what's his computer? Yeah, I mean, his eye pee. How do I connect to his eye pee and prove he's got these files? Do I need kazz-uh to do that? Wait ... can I do that legally, or am I breaking the Constitution? What's a pee-to-pee anyway, is that some kind of sex perversion?
You get the idea. I thoroughly encourage every other research and educational site network operator to do the very same. Waste their time. Get your stupid out. Stall 'em, stymie 'em, but be very concerned that you don't want any of them Internet pirates pirating your Internet. (Or ask if they know where to find hot lesbian porn.) Most important -- keep the stooge on the line; the MPAA is probably paying him hourly.
Completely flawed analogy.
This is a new medium, one that allows for copies to be made because it is information. That cannot be changed, and you cannot go back.
But - people still watch good movies. People still buy good DVDs. People still buy good music.
The kind that only download and rip off music and movies are the kind who probably used to record stuff on to cassettess and videotapes without buying in the days gone by anyway. Now, people can download your content, and if they like it they can buy it.
If I can make copies of my wallet and my car, I'd gladly give them to you - and if you like it, I can give you a better quality version of my car at a small price. However, if I have twenty cars that I offer, and only one of them is worth it - why should you have to pay for all twenty when you're going to drive just one?
Just yesterday, I ordered all the seven seasons of Stargate off eBay. Why? Because I liked it.
Until a while ago, I'd not watched it at all - so I just borrowed the first couple of seasons from a friend, who highly recommended it. And then, I downloaded the rest because I wanted to see how it went. How is this any different from borrowing it from a friend? And I liked the series and wanted it for myself, so I just went ahead and purchased the *entire* seven seasons.
I don't see anything wrong in what I did - if anything, I've helped the MPAA make more money.
Good content will always have paying customers, no matter what. And there will always be a percentage of people who will abuse any system to get by without paying - you're affecting those that are willing to pay by going after a few who would not have paid anyway.
Who the hell is "David Shapel"? :)
Karnal
Since no one wishes to pay for viewing films we're halting all film production and investing in the stock market like everyone else. I'm afraid you'll have to turn to books for future entertainment. Guess this means you'll have to learn to read.
It's a bit like starting a secret club in your basement. You invite all your friends to join and everything's cool. Suddenly that smelly kid across the road decides he wants to join, when you ask him why...he tells you it's because he wants to listen to you bitch about your mum so he can go tattle on you.
I am a software publisher. I am pretty sure that college students are pirating my warez. I even have evidence of it. Now with the MPAA precedent I can get Internet2 access and be able to police the network for people pirating my warex.
-weld
Done!
Okay 3 strikes your out.
Remember when they were saying VHS and DVD's would ruin Hollywood.
Funny how things change.
Wow, what a stereo type, so ' serious researchers', don't listen to music of watch films and so have no interest in file sharing.
Most researchers I've known do like music and films, in-fact there probably not going to be able to make it out and would probably download stuff instead.
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
The best part of college is the whole CFF series.
Sure! It'll be 29.95E6 per month.
Here's your IP: 192.168.1.1.
Or:
Psss... Everybody nullroute MPAA's IP, it's x.x.x.x
I don't read AC A human right
In short, they want to use a research funded network for their own personal profit -- those bastards!
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
Not only are you buying DVDs to support the MPAA, but you're buying them at WAL-MART?????
We all know that P2P networks violate copyright on Internet Classic. Internet2 currently offers better bandwidth and some element of privacy (due to membership being exclusive)...does anyone here really think that it's not contributing to copyright violation? There are apps like i2hub that are Internet2-specific P2P clients. We all know there are copyrighted works being traded on i2hub. And I'm sure all the folks doing file-sharing on Internet Classic would rather be doing so with the resources available on Internet2 if they only could.
The MPAA/RIAA (or the FBI/police/courts) should be able to investigate. If there was a university-only trucking company that we all knew was transporting stolen goods*, would we all be claiming they were unsearchable, simply because the stores being stolen from aren't a "member" of the trucking company?
Personally, I think the MPAA/RIAA should get a court order for this, not unlike a search warrant.
Lets not let our shared animosity toward the MPAA/RIAA cause us to actually endorse and defend piracy. I wouldn't be surprised if the software I develop for a living was being distributed on Internet2, and for me (or the company I work for) to be completley unable to stop that simply because we're not an "academic or research" company is absurd.
* Yes, I know, copyright violation isn't stealing, but that doesn't hurt the analogy.
Sure we can invite you in, but we require each member to share at least 1 TB of their own wares.
From the article:
Recently, researchers successfully sent data from Switzerland to Tokyo at speeds of 7.21 gigabits per second. That was enough speed to transfer a full-length DVD anywhere in the world in less than five seconds, researchers said.
Too bad it'll take me upwards of five minutes to write it to disk. Yet more proof that hard drive speeds are dragging the rest of the industry down. Damn you Hitachi/Fujitsu/WesternDigital/Seagate/Maxtor. Damn you all.
https://www.eff.org/https-everywhere
If this doesn't work, the MPAA can be expected to try to force the schools to simply prevent residential networks from using Internet2. Nobody is doing research from Resnet. One of my jobs is to perform network monitoring to establish throttling guidelines on my university's network. We have found that during peak hours, 26 percent of all traffic is porn-related and practically all of the rest is P2P. There is no good reason for these people to have Internet2 access. The traffic on faculty/staff systems is monitored and we do make sure that unusual amounts of traffic created by those systems is legitimate. We throttle several ports on Resnet, but it's like the wild west in terms of content. It will be interesting to see what happens.
Whatever happened to learning stuff?
You can do that with the internet too.
You can get 10X the information in a tenth of the time with NONE of the credibility!
Sure $30K/year is a lot to pay for an internet connection, but if you figure in the amount of free beer you'll drink it probably evens out.
Life is too short to proofread.
...this may be a little of topic, but i saw an add from the MPAA in the local college newspaper that listed a bunch of usernames and partial IP's ala star wars opening back story. in bold it said 'is this you?' then at the bottom it was rated 'I' for illegal copyright infringment. the most disturbing part was the tag line at the very bottom. 'lawsuits begin in one week'. all i could say was WTF?
always mosh clockwise
If they want to spy then flood them with garbage. Let the DOS begin!
The college students that may or may not be downloading all of these movies, are NOT hurting the business model. Remember, these are kids eating off of lunch cards because they probably can't afford lunch everyday. So the MPAA shouldn't be disturbing university traffic so they can hunt down the dude downloading "Team America" while he fixes a grilled cheese with a clothes iron. He probably doesn't have the $300,000 fine money.
"Plans are for fools! Oglethorpe, the plutonian (Aqua Teen Hunger Force)
While we are still a LONG way from seeing any actual damage caused by this... perhaps the MPAA is doing this to pre-emptively. As "media center" type computers become common, it's foreseeable that there could be actual losses caused by downloaded content. At that point, downloads could possibly cut into DVD sales and box office takes... as it is now, there probably is a .5% or so hit they take at the box office, but a gain they see in DVD sales. Everyone I know that downloads movies, does so to watch movies once instead of renting them... and would even buy the DVD if they liked the movie enough.
That said, the only people that should be even slightly worried about the present are the rental chains. Heh, maybe they're putting pressure on the MPAA and causing all this grief.
Internet2 looks to me like it transfers data faster than my hard drive can even write...
-----
120 chairs?! What the hell am I supposed to do with 120 chairs...?
One of your fallacies is that you presume that the RIAA is being "hurt" by internet downloading of music.
They'd like you to think that they are being so hurt.
But all the studies say otherwise, citing no statistical variance in sales compared to the general economic condition before, during, or after peak Napster use.
The fact is that the "harm" only exists in the feevered dreams of averice fixed firmly in the deluded heads of RIAA executives.
The harm to the MPAA might be higher, as really bad movies dont' get purchased or re-rented. Heck, most people who buy DVDs don't watch them more than once or twice. So if somone downloads a marginal movie, they are less likely to buy/rent it by a wide margin.
Music has a much lower commitment-to-engage than a movie. You can listen to music in your car or on the bus or while you are doing any number of other things. Movies you have to stop and watch.
Since Music is more re-usable the purchase-after-download factor has to be pretty high.
I would think for movies it would be otherwise.
To some extent the MPAA's strongest argument to stop downloading would be to first _GUT_ the RIAA's claims to harm and then show why it's different for movies. Without that infighting the "**AA" effect will damn the MPAA with the RIAA's brush.
Sucks to be them.
Solidarity with shit-covered losers will likely result in you finding yourself covered in shit, think about that MPAA...
Innocent people shouldn't be forced to pay for inferior software development.
--"Code Complete" Microsoft Press
Is pirating a loss of revenue? I doubt pirates would buy movies if they couldn't dowload them.
I have downloaded some old, foreign movies that have not been available on DVD nor tape for 30 years. Now am I breaking the law?
OT rant: DVD regions is robbery on their customers.
The MPAA gets admitted to I2. The MPAA begins distributing films digitally to theaters via I2. The theaters play astounding digital quality films. The MPAA saves oodles of cash by not having to make prints of the films. The theaters save oddles of cash by not having to buy the prints. Consumers of movies still have high ticket prices and commercials, since most of them don't have a significant share of voting stock in studios or theater chains.
And the I2 folks find out how their designs work under quasi-real world use.
Simple Machines in Higher Dimensions
Part of the reason the internet2 is so fast is because its not bogged down with porn, movies and crap (in general). Granted there are hardware differences, but really, a fair chunk of the reason is lack of congestion.
The MPAA wants to turn an academic/research network into a sales machine under the guise of stopping piracy.
As soon as you let the MPAA in (and napster, et al), you're no longer on the internet2, they just merged.
Seems to me, researchers and others should self-police and keep the network free of illegal material in the hopes that it will stave off the commercial machinery.
This post is just FYI... It is pretty logical to assume they have been watching torrent networks for a while now, but from what I have heard, they've never taken action against torrenters. Paramount called my ISP the other day for downloading a movie. Suprisingly, but not that they are good guys all of a sudden, they just told them to give me a warning. I'm not too worried about being sued, but now that I know they are monitoring and taking actions on torrenters and contacting ISPs, I think it is time to move on to the next network. After all these new network technologies and protocols, I can't believe I'm considering going back to where most of it started, IRC.
You know, I've (mostly) avoided getting copyrighted stuff off of i2hub because I thought there would be a chance I'd get caught. Now that I know otherwise, well, I'll have to get another HDD.... Thanks for the tip MPAA!
For the same reason that we are not locked up in cages and allowed to do nothing but work during our working hours. You obviously don't work for Electronic Arts :)
And here's why: even if the I2 people tell the MPAA to go fuck themselves, the MPAA will likely start bribing college kids at member universities to install their monitoring software.
..RIAA and MPAA have their heads so far up their butts in regards to emerging technology, because if they were actually forward-thinking people they would be great members of Internet2. However, the article give me the impression that they are on a litigation manhunt first and foremost and that research into how the new technology can be applied to content delivery and the industry in general is a distant second in priority.
I suspect that any copntribution they may acually have on the matter would be focused on ways to restrict content---encryption, DRM, etc---instead of revolutionising the business model of the industry. It's a shame they want to stifle progress and innovation like that and the **AA's philosophy at this point seems at odds with that of Internet2. Instead of seeing the exciting opportunities in being able to transmit a DVD-quality feature film across the globe in minutes or seconds, the MPAAs first reaction to this progress is that it is a threat and that we have to "innovate" a solution to contain the technology so that it will conform to their pathetically outdated business model.
Sad really, but what can you expect from a bunch of businessmen lobbyists who represent people who think Britney Spears can actually sing and act and that the winner of the American Idol TV contest could star in a quality movie.
have you actually listened to some of that stuff? I mean, really, that's a pretty accurate description.
Someone you trust is one of us.
(this would apply if internet 2 goes public sometime in the future)
If these people at the film industries would stop and think for a moment, they might see the potential gold mine of internet 2. A person can download a movie in a matter of minutes. MINUTES! That's much less than the time it takes to go to a store. Shoot, I'd pay $10-15 if I could download a high quality movie from a reliable source in just a few minutes.
This would be much better than p2p, where if you're lucky you'll find what you're looking for, get decent download speeds, and if you're really lucky, it will even be what the filename says.
Don't take life so seriously. No one makes it out alive.
"You know why? Because those file traders are morally right! The point of copyright law is "to promote the Progress of Science and useful Arts," not to allow cartels to force us to pay them for our own culture. Copyright law has become so perverted that it is almost completely unjust, and I have absolutely no problem with violating an unjust law."
In other words your post is basically "mob justice", or being a vigilante. You and yours couldn't be bothered to doing your civic duty in the first place, so now you're taking it out on everyone else like a petulent child. Whaaa, societies not giving me free movies, music, or books. I'll get what "I" want by ignoring the prescribed ways of effecting change, and simple become a thief. That'll show them I'm right and their wrong.
That sounds like an even greater waste of money on MPAA's part than trying to stem piracy on the regular internet since there are so few users on it. But hey, it's their money to waste...
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
1) An ass, and abusing a serious network.
The same things were said about Internet 1 back in the days, but you were getting pr0n off usenet like the rest of us.
2) Part of the 'problem' that has the RIAA/MPAA sniffing around a network they should stay the hell away from.
If there aren't such asses, then their sniffing yields nothing, so why not allow them to waste their time, if a waste it should truly be?
"As for the person who modded me down as flamebait, perhaps you should look up what that word means. I wasn't trolling, I was making a rational, if unpopular, argument. Have the balls to actually respond if you think I'm wrong, you pussy."
I don't think your wrong. In fact I believe your post (and it's rating) simply proves my point that Slashdot is biased. Despited the "we're not a Borg collective" excuse that gets trotted out. Both the total number that are for copyright infringement PLUS the moderation and meta-moderation that places those views in the public eye, while hiding the unpopular ones simply proves our point to all those who have eye s and a brain. That's why I've always said Slashdot should be treated as entertainment. No more, no less. You go for facts, and intelligent discourse ELSEWERE*.
*Usually a place that doesn't have a moderation system based on mob rule.
Fuck you sideways.
My legal name is available with your proof of affiliation with the RIAA. I download and redistribute music I have not paid for and welcome your lawsuit. I will be defending myself.
If their bid to get a direct I2 connection fails. They could just buy a member university.
Acesss denied....
They are just try to get access to Internet2 so they can sniff illegal stuff
Kinda like what they are doing at the moment
Maybe what we should do is acknowledge the breakdown of human society? Everything you've been witnessing for the past twenty years is human society breaking down. There's no longer any respect for our fellow humans, be they stranger or family. We've cast God out of our lives, and put ourselves in it's place. Piety is now just a word, instead of an ideal. We've said greed is good, and more greed is better. You are measured not by the quality of your spirit, but by the fruits of the flesh. We pollute because we can, not because we should. Our disagreements are battles of armies. not words. We use to be educated, now intelligence is both unfashionable, and costly. Self-control is no longer a virtue, but an impediment to the desires of the flesh. Discipline and Righteousness imposed from without, instead of residing within. These are our failures.
No man will ever set right the failures of the spirit, for the answer doesn't lie within.
"The amount of disturbance to the industry caused or even potentially caused by Div-X converting and downloading is so tiny compared to the amount of resources and ill-will generated by their heavy-handed response to this so-called threat that one must come to the conclusion that the MPAA leadership is mentally unbalanced."
...they work in system where everybody knows the rules, and follows them. and the MOST IMPORTANT part of their business model is control of distribution, and once that is gone, their current business model goes with it, and they are ACUTELY AWARE that broadband and digital distribution MUST , over time, render the distribution model that has evolved over the last 50 years ABSOLUTELY WORTHLESS...
I agree and working here in the belly of the beast and having collaborated with some of the people and corporations involved, they are indeed "mentally unbalanced", but not by concerns of customers dissatisfaction, or even by concerns of several percentage points of lost sales, though with a movie that might earn $100 Million in DVD sales, over the course of ten years, several percentage points of loss are nothing to spit on.
THE ESSENTIAL REASON THAT THE MAJOR ENTERTAINMENT CONGLOMERATES CARE ABOUT FILE SHARING, WHETHER BY IP, SPINNING 'GLASS OR ANY OTHER DIGITAL FORMAT BASED MEDIUM, IS THEY SEE THEIR ENTIRE BUSINESS MODEL SLIPPING AWAY DOWN A PIECE OF OPTICAL FIBRE.
despite the legal fiction of a separation (Chinese Wall) between production, distribution and exhibition, the VERY SMALL NUMBERS of actual players who control all the previous listed key aspects of entertainment "manufacture" share something nearly as valuable as the ability to actully actively collude (which is VERY MUCH forbidden by law, and they wouldn't even think about active collusion, as they could lose EVERY NICKEL they've ever earned)
they have something nearly as good as cartel behavior, and completely legal...
any day you can go to lunch at The Grille or dinner at Koi or Ivy, and there will be seen many/most of the people who control production and distribution of film, TV and music...
HOW MANY other multibillion dollars industries can say that nearly ALL the key decision makers live in the same town, eat at the same restaurants, go to the same health clubs, vacation at the same resorts and SEE each other socially several times a month?
NOT telecom, not software, not healthcare, not wireless...
how much collusion can you imagine between Linus and Bill and Scott and John and Carly and Steve?
So, H'Wood will fight every inch of the way, i'm asked several times a month "When will DRM be unbeatable?", the look on their faces when i say "Never" is priceless...they simply don't believe me
they are waiting for that "Silver Bullet" combination of OS, Network and Desktop software that enables that "Unbeatable DRM"...and by the way, there are legions of technologists out here telling them that "Silver Bullet" is going to get here RealSoonNow...
SO, When will the E! Industry wise up and stop these bizarre anti-customer pogroms against a small number of file sharers?
My guess, is that until the current management teams of these companies are either replaced by a new generation, willing to see the promise and potential of digital distribution, or (MUCH MORE LIKELY, IMHO) the acceptance of easily available digital distribution will have to wait until the market capitalization values of these companies are lowered to the point where they have to make peace with the digital world in order to just survive.
Ten quid, she's so easy to blind. And not a word is spoken...
We are not sorry to say
NN N OOO
N N N O O
N N N O O
N NN OOO
to your application,
ours,
Internet2
Free ?! Does that mean I can't get a Discount ?!
This message was
I guess it will be just a matter of time before they demand access to the US Army's own Internet..:) (Global Information Grid)
2 8
http://slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=04/11/13/18342
Isn't this best left to the authorities? When did the MPAA think that it was their job to be police? Maybe if they came up with better products, better pricing, different marketing ploys, piracy might go away?
-- No sig for you!
and knocked on the little pig's door and said "Little pig, little pig, let me come in."
i hope this is the house made of bricks
But at least Metallica songs are still free to be distributed, right?
Obligatory note: in most jurisdictions, that is at best an assumption that has not been tested in court.
IANAL, but YHBT.
If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
Lots of SSH tunnels on the Internet 2.
There you are, staring at me again.
So, if I mistakenly label my research work as "theIncredibles2004[DiVX].avi" and share it to another university across internet2 (assuming the MPAA gets access to it) I could be receiving my very own lawsuit! yay!
Okay... *You* try getting sex from college girls if you're not a frat boy or a football player.
You have two hands and one brain, so always code twice as much as you think!
Don't try to stand behind the constitution to justify illegal activity.
It's a bit harder now, since I'm 29, but it's not too hard. First, you have to talk to them.
"We returned the General to El Salvador, or maybe Guatemala, it's difficult to tell from 10,000 feet"
Any one atempting to become a member with the sole intent breach privacy and sniff around should be denied on those grounds alone.
=1000101
Were they allowed in, the first thing I (and other netadmin types on I2) would do would be to look through the I2 router configs for their connection info and block them at the border. Presto... no MPAA traffic over I2 for us.
I2 is pretty open about it's information, anybody with half a clue could find their allocation info and block them.
Well as it seems to be time for another Slashdot "*AA debate" I'd just like to add my tuppence worth to the debate.... as in the future there won't be just "the internet" ( or indeed "the internets") to contend with.
What about networks of bluetooth enabled phones/portable MP3 players/car stereos that each hold several gigabytes of music and which can automatically connect to each other ?
You want a particular song ? You want all songs by a particular artist ? You're interested in a particular genre ?
Put search criteria on your devices wanted list and when you come into proximity of another devices that holds what you're looking for it transfers it over while you walk past/are drinking at a bar/are in a club/are sitting in a traffic jam etc. etc.
"Walkabout" short range P2P.
And for added social interaction then if someone elses device show the same sorts of preferences as yours it give both of you a little beep so you can start up a conversation.
Also how about "slightly more powerful than today" local neighbourhood wireless LANS ? Even if you're not part of the full time local network their might be guest channels/log ins/local broadcsts so when you drive through a neighbourhood you join in the local "neighbourhood swap shop".
But the best is yet to come. How about when storage capacity is available on something approaching, or even on, a nano scale ?
Maybe someone will create a "smart sticker" which is slightly thicker than todays regular sticker but which holds several gigbytes of data plus a small, solar powered, short range, transmitter.
Pop that up in a public place and everyone passing can pick up what's on it (so long as they have a compatible device). Guerilla marketing at it's best and a killer way to advertise new bands "come see us at club x on x and here are a few full tunes to whet your appetitie"
Who knows maybe this "fantasy tech" could even be incorporated into clothing, beer cans, grocery cartons, bricks... you name it.
So these *AA imbeciles can legislate, bribe and sue until they're blue in the face but they are simply pissing in the wind.
If they think they're having a hard time with todays technology, then think what the future will bring.
Sky subscribers are morons. They pay to be advertised at !
Next we'll be reading about AOL doing the same. And now another set of coasters advertising I2 FREE! for 1024 Hours!.
does this mean that the MPAA is laying off on internet(1) probing? Somebody say yes...
If the MPAA can develop cool methodologies and technologies jointly with consumer electronics manufacturers to deliver "next generation" media, then that is a good thing. The only people that should be bothered by the MPAA "probing" are the pirates. If you're not a pirate, you won't be caught.
To know is to have knowledge....to understand is to be enlightened.
You've got the makings of a chain letter there, and one that could actually make money for its participants.
"I sued the MPAA in small claims court and got a judgement against them for $$$, and you can too.
Please sue the MPAA in small claims court for your time in responding to meritless claims as its billable value. When they default, collect your money. Once you win a judgement against the MPAA, please make n copies of this letter and send them to other people you know who may have received meritless claims from the MPAA.
If you do not comply, you will be cursed with a lifetime of bad luck and abuse by media megacorporations."
When I'm kidding people think I'm serious, and when I'm serious people think I'm kidding.
Assembly is the reverse of disassembly.
Internet 2 is used for research in medical and academic fields, it could also be ideal for use in transfering large amounts of data essential in movie post production and editing.
Don't confuse the MPAA with the RIAA. They have been pretty cool about the whole thing for awhile and not petty like the RIAA was. They are more concerned with early releases ala Academy screeners and commercial pirates than casual downloading.
Some people make a business out of sharing movies though.
I'll be the first to say it that I can't stand downloading movies from the internet. I think I have downloaded 2 movies and both had the crappiest quality.
Personally I don't mind buying the DVD, actually I prefer it. I want to have the best quality, I want the box art, the insert and everything that come with it. I can't stand it when I go over a friends house and they pop in a DVD that the movie title is written on it with a sharpie.
I guess I forgot to use the words "reputable" or at least "unbiased". Anybody can construct a "study" to verify virtually any economic proposition.
For instance, I can track the behavior of someone I know will not buy no matter what, and then "Correlate" that non-buy to any factor I wish including available downloads. But that would be disingenuous.
The "particular cases" are not significant. For every guy who downloaded because he doesn't want to have to pay, there's a guy who bought because he stumbled across something neat in his downloads. It is a chaotic system, and no matter how much anybody screams otherwise, the measurements need to be broad. After all, in a chaotic mass of particles, the individual particles don't matter. So all the arguments are "oh oh, that particle went south, I'm being harmed" "nah uh, I'm a particle and I never went north until this came along."
It's absurd.
The more honest studies just chart sales vs economic climate, because both metrics are equally broad and fuzzy and equally fair indicators. IF there were more particles going south now (to a degree that was statistically significant) the outer-surface studies would show that. And they don't.
Part of the poisoned mind-set is that "create a lost sale" and it's cohort mis-understandings.
You cannot "create a lost sale" nor can you measure the presence of "lost sales" because you have NO INFORMATION about whether the particle in question "would have bought if not for X". Did the guy not buy because he could download? Or was it because it wasn't worth the asking price? Or because he didn't think it was worth the asking price? Or because he couldn't afford the asking price?
Each particle has his own reasons (or unreasonableness 8-), but the facts are simple.
By no near measure can one honestly turn "number of downloads" into "number of lost sales". Even "safe ratios" that appear to be over generous aren't legitimate because we have no information. We don't know how many downloads created sales either. So there when some guy says "well lets say that just 1% of these downloads represent lost sales" if he doesn't then say "and lets say that just 1% of these downloads caused new sales" he is being a "political hack".
We don't even have a _model_ on which to base a _guess_ of harm.
That all sorts of people claim to see all sorts of numbers, the honest studies that chart the sales and the economic conditions and then look for perturbations in those numbers coinciding with trends in downloading show "no statistically significant correlation."
I think music downloading is a push.
I think that movie downloading would be different because the re-watch value of movies is so low that the download-led-to-sale component would be disproportionately low compared to the download-prevented-sale numbers. That's just a gut feeling based on the different levels of user commitment required by music and movies and so to the likelihood of the guy, having just watched the download, thinking to himself "I gotta have a good copy of that". I could be wrong, as gut feelings often are.
But if the MPAA doesn't separate itself from the RIAA by a good bit, the statistical disproof (well, demonstration of lack of proof anyway) of harm from music downloading will prevent the MPAA's separate issues from getting the separate consideration it deserves.
IMHO of course.
Innocent people shouldn't be forced to pay for inferior software development.
--"Code Complete" Microsoft Press
Dear MPAA,
You are starting to piss me off. Don't make me spend my movie money on collecting NERF whifflebats or something stupid like that. I'll do it....
HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
I get mine mailed to me. Get it, burn it mail it back. No chance of a partial movie, no waiting forever because the guy went offline. It's working out great(for me)!
***snip*** "...Here's the funny thing: they're all wrong. Every one of them. Wrong. I have never received an MPAA copyright-violation complaint that even had the slightest chance of being correct. ..." ***/snip***
Not to say that you're wrong about YOUR institution, but we have an I2 connection on our campus as well. And I can say with 100% certainty that every college campus with an I2 connection and a CS program is sharing not only movies but other copyrighted content as well - 24/7/365. If you really want to find out what's being shared on your campus, pay more attention and spend time with the students.
Further, the argument over whether the RIAA/MPAA/acronym-of-your-choice obtains MEMBERSHIP to I2 is not related in any way to their ability to sniff the traffic and trace the source IP of potential shares. They don't need direct membership in the organization to sniff traffic - all they need do is pay tuition for ONE student to take ONE class on an I2-connected campus and they'll have access and capability to find what is being shared and who is doing the sharing. P2P is just that - peer to peer. Once they become a "peer", game over.
Thanks for playing.
Filesharing is used by a large number of scientists in a certain manner that may be unknown by the Public at large. Any hard drive searching that goes beyond normal file sharing searches would potentially cause infringement upon secret or confidential data owned by other entities. Mpaa could end up with hundreds of billions of US dollars in return law suits.The actual status of file sharing networks, contains worlds within worlds, like an onion, it has become part of the freedom of the internet.
These Pop-ups are everywhere from the MPAA and it's nothing but SPAM - Thought this was being made illegal.