German IT Outfit Bans Whining

theodp writes "German IT outfit Nutzwerk Ltd has come up with the perfect solution to whining in the workplace - it's made cheerfulness a contractual obligation, advising those who don't measure up to the prescribed level of jollity in the morning to stay at home until they cheer up. The plan was prompted by a female employee whose constant complaining prompted the other staff to complain about her complaining."

Comments

Movie quote time.

[suso]

Mayor of New York: "Being miserable and treating other people like dirt is every New Yorker's God-given right."

Re:Movie quote time.

[appleLaserWriter]

Maybe New York and Germany both need some more happy product.

Re:Movie quote time.

[ThaFooz]

Public urination too. It seems to be a God-given right over there, for reasons I don't quite understand.

Re:Movie quote time.

[Anonymous Coward]

You evidently don't drink enough beer.

Re:Movie quote time.

[Anonymous Coward]

Gotta love the Ghostbusters =)

Re:Movie quote time.

[Elrac]

Urination is a God-given right. Our ancestors did it all the time, all over the place, until some religiously motivated tight-assed sourpusses decided it would damage fragile minds to accidentally see a tip of flesh. This kind of irrational repression is what we like to ridicule the Muslims for.

When a German's gotta go, he gotsta go. There is a reasonable modesty mechanism in place, i.e. I will feel uncomfortable about it and seek out a dark corner, the back of a preferrably windowless, non-residential building, behind a tree or wherever. And I'll be more likely to do this at night than in broad daylight. If I'm out walking in a "public" forest where I'm likely to be seen by joggers, cyclists or families taking a walk, I'll walk 20 - 50 feet off the path and into the woods so no one will see me in profile unless they follow me in. On two or three occasions, I've been in the woods with a girlfriend when she had to go, and she asked me to look out for passersby and shield her from view if necessary while she pulled down her pants and squatted to do her thing.

As a net result, you'll sometimes see the back of a man standing by the side of the road or up against a tree, with his legs spread and pelvis pushed forward. If you look closely, you may even see a yellow stream. But why would you want to look closely? You accept that the guy apparently had a hard time holding it before finding a proper convenience, turn away and ignore him.

I rarely heed Nature's call in the open, maybe once or twice a year; but when I do, I don't worry my head about it. By contrast, I understand that doing this in the US may get me arrested on charges of sexual misconduct and branded for life as a sex offender, with incriminating bulletins sent to prospective neighbors and employers. I find public urination as distasteful as the next guy, but... sanity check, anyone?

Re:Movie quote time.

[dindi]

my dog urinates in public all the time too ... the smaller one does it with pleasure on the rugs, and on the bathroom floor - no shame.

And my big male urinates whereever he can .... he is in the garden all the time though because of this GOD given right, while the others enjon being in my bed ...

My point is: if you want to urinate IN public, there are places for it, but you might miss out on some better and fun activities .... and I do not mean country club dinners, just regular NORMAL social life

Re:Movie quote time.

[Class Act Dynamo]

I agree with you on how puritanical we have gotten about anything remotely sexual, but I think the reason we prefer to evacuate our bladder and bowels in designated locations is because of sanitation considerations. There was a time in Europe when being naked in any situation was considered sinful, so people stopped bathing and relieved themselves in buckets that were dumped in the street, or they just obtained relief in the street itself. Then there was this plague and someone suggested that everyone take baths, that they designate locations to heed Nature's call, and that waste products would be stored in a predetermined location. That being said, I am totally with you on those emergency situations when waiting to find a bathroom is not an option; however, do you know of anyone that was caught peeing and branded a sex offender?

Re:Movie quote time.

[Kaboom13]

Public urination has nothing to do with modesty, it has to do with the fact that noone wants to clean urine off their wall. Human urine also has some nasty chemicals and if concentrated in any particular area is pretty bad for the enviroment. Public urination is generally punishable only by a fine in the U.S., and if you hang out at seedy bars (or the NY subway) you will see plenty of it. The only thing thats gonna get you charged for some sort of sex crime is if you go out of your way to go pee on the playground at an elementary school. Restrooms available to the public are very common in all but rural areas so it's not like it's a big hassle to find a restroom.
If you were to ask a random sample of Americans, they would say that public urination is rude and kinda disgusting but not something that should be a serious crime. Oh but thats right this is slashdot where you can take a story you heard from a friend of a friend and apply it to an entire nation.

Re:Movie quote time.

[Elrac]

Living in Germany, I'm unlikely to. But I've Googled around a bit:

• Obscene conduct can include indecent exposure and urinating in public if police convict a person of the charges three separate times, said MSU police Detective Earl Barringer.
• Jones also said that not every person on the sex offender list has necessarily committed an egregious crime such as rape or molestation because a conviction of indecent exposure, even in cases such as public urination, can land someone on the list.
• Michigan's sex-offender registry currently includes teenagers prosecuted for having consensual sex with underage girlfriends and a woman convicted of urinating in public.
• Violations ranging from groping or fondling to more minor offenses, like public indecency -- which includes urinating in a public park -- are posted on the sex offender registry for 10 years. More serious offenses, such as aggravated criminal sexual assault, are posted for life.

In summary: Looking at only the first 2 pages and without digging thru the lists themselves, I was only able to find mention of one woman who's registered as a sex offender for public urination. But (a) I think that's one person too many and (b) I'm confident that where there's one, there's more.

Re:Movie quote time.

[Elrac]

Public urination has nothing to do with modesty,

I find your statement hard to reconcile with the fact that public urination, in the US, is met with punishment for a sexual offense. From earlier digging, I remember that in Utah, public urination is a "Class C Sexual misdemeanor".

it has to do with the fact that noone wants to clean urine off their wall.

Understood and agreed. But when I think of "public urination," I tend to think of "outside." When I think of "outside" I think of "rain." Guess what? All the constituents of urine are water soluble! Still, it would take a pretty bad urge before I would let go in a residential area.

Human urine also has some nasty chemicals and if concentrated in any particular area is pretty bad for the enviroment.

Do you live in the Washington, DC area? Do you know how much arsenic is in your tap water?

Yes, the salt and urea concentration can make grass turn yellow. And in really massive concentrations (like if you directly pipe a public outhouse into a river), the phosphate can cause algal bloom - just like most fertilizers. Incidentally, I live not far from some small farms. Once in a while, the farmer sprays the strawberry plants with -would you believe?- cow piss.

Having taken the trouble to research, at least on the 'Net, I take offense at your snotty put-down about Slashdot that's aimed directly at me. Pray tell, which friend told you that urine is an environmental hazard?

Re:Movie quote time.

[scbysnx]

you are unbelievably ignorant in so many ways but I'll point out one of them.. the attack wasn't on new york, it was on america the reason they attacked the twin towers was because they were a symbol in our country and taking them down was supposed to make us feel vulnerable. Whoever moded this insightful is equally as ignorant

Re:Movie quote time.

[Anonymous Coward]

Yes, a symbol of America created by a Japanese architect. Also the Chrysler Building was conceived by an Indian architect.

Re:Movie quote time.

[miyako]

A couple of years ago I was at a concert with my cousin and a friend of hers (male). The concert itself was in a pretty out of the way location, surrounded for a few miles by wooods and fields and whatnot. When we arrived at the concert the line to get in was pretty long, and he had to pee. Near the parking area there were some woods, so he went into the woods to releive himself. Apparently a police officer followed him for some reason (The cop said he thought he had gone back there to do drugs before the concert), but anyway he went in far enough that standing at the car right at the edge of the woods, and having seen the general direction that he walked, I couldn't see him. A few minutes later the police officer was leading him out in handcuffs. He was charged with and conviced for a sex crime. He was forced to sell his house and move because he could not live within so many feet of a school, and is also now for the rest of his life a registered sex offender. Has to register with any county he moves into, alert the neighbors, etc. This was his first conviction for anything too btw (never even had a parking ticket AFAIK), so it's not like he was a habitual offender.
So yes, I know someone who was caught peeing and is now branded a sex offender and had his life ruined because of it.

Re:Movie quote time.

[ThaFooz]

I think you misunderstood me. My comment was a dig at NYC, not Germany, where public urination is frequent despite it being an obvious hygiene issue given the population density. It has nothing to do with modesty.

Re:Movie quote time.

[Intruger]

Oops, I meant the Sears Tower, not Chrysler Building.

Re:Movie quote time.

[dajak]

Yes, the salt and urea concentration can make grass turn yellow. And in really massive concentrations (like if you directly pipe a public outhouse into a river), the phosphate can cause algal bloom - just like most fertilizers.

It also seriously damages centuries-old brick walls for some reason. You can literally piss a hole in a wall. Here in Amsterdam you get fined EUR 160 for urinating in public, because it causes millions a year in damage to old churches and houses. In addition to that home owners obviously hate it when their multimillion-dollar 17th century canal house entrance smells of piss. No connection is made to sex offenses.

The stupid thing is that foreign tourists often just get warned if they are caught doing it, even though they are the idiots pissing against brick walls. A civilized local will piss into a canal, which is of course more 'indecent' but doesn't really inconvenience anyone.

Still, it would take a pretty bad urge before I would let go in a residential area.

Obviously, assuming that it is possible to move out of that residential area or to a waiting queue for a public toilet or toilet in a bar or restaurant in a reasonable time, which is not always the case during festivals. I once made hundreds of euros in two hours charging people EUR 5 for using my toilet.

Re:Movie quote time.

[eric76]

Back in the mid 70s, I knew one guy who was arrested by the same cop two Saturday nights in a row for taking a leak on the same telephone pole outside a bar.

I've wondered whether or not he has to register as a sex offender now.

Another guy I knew was arrested once for taking a leak at a road side park. His brother, a lawyer, requested a jury trial. The charges were eventually dropped because the prosecuting attorney knew that around here, most of the people who might be selected for the jury would think he had lost his marbles for putting the guy on trial for such a ridiculous charge.

Re:Movie quote time.

[rolfwind]

Couldn't he appeal? I would have sued the P.O., the state, and anybody else involved on that witchhunt.

Re:Movie quote time.

[Lew Payne]

"Couldn't he appeal? I would have sued the P.O., the state, and anybody else involved on that witchhunt."

You would not have been able to sue the P.O. (post office), the state, or anybody else involved... because you were never convicted of that crime... he was.

Re:Movie quote time.

[Lew Payne]

"you are unbelievably ignorant in so many ways but I'll point out one of them.. the attack wasn't on new york, it was on america the reason they attacked the twin towers was because they were a symbol in our country and taking them down was supposed to make us feel vulnerable. Whoever moded this insightful is equally as ignorant"

Last I knew, the twin towers (that symbol in our country, as you referred to them) were designed by the Japanese. Had they been designed by Native American Indians, then they might have been a true symbol of our country's ancestors.

Re:Movie quote time.

[rolfwind]

P.O. = Police Officer in this case.

And in America you can sue almost anyone at anytime for anything;) If you are successful or not is a different matter.

Remember that OJ was sued by the family of his ex-wife for unlawful death and they won. He was never convicted and they were technically not involved.

Re:Movie quote time.

[Lew Payne]

"Remember that OJ was sued by the family of his ex-wife for unlawful death and they won. He was never convicted and they were technically not involved."

Cite me a case in which a slashdot reader sues the police officer (or post office) because he doesn't like how the P.O. was portrayed on slashdot. Until then, cease and desist your conjecture, or I'll file for a TRO.

Re:Movie quote time.

[rolfwind]

I meant in my original post "if I were him I would have sued the PO, etcetera."

Not as a simple slashdot poster:(

Re:Movie quote time.

[Anonymous Coward]

not "the" japanese. a japanese guy. that's part of america, ya know the whole integration and 'melting pot' thing. and american indians aren't my ancestors, they moved here just like my ancestors did except mine did it later, big whoop.

you are such an idiot it's almost unbelieveable

Re:Movie quote time.

[ScrewMaster]

Phooey on you. You might as well say that the Statue of Liberty has no meaning to us because the French designed and built it. As it happens, that particular construct was a powerful symbol of the respect that both nations maintained for each other, once upon a time (the American Revolution wouldn't have been successful without France's backing.) The original poster was correct: the attack was an attempt to demoralize us, and the Towers were chosen for their symbolic value. The fact that a Japanese architect designed them is ... well, meaningless in that context and I don't know why you brought it up, particularly since Japan is one of our allies.

Re:Movie quote time.

[renehollan]

Appeals cost money.

I know of a green card holder with two American children very close to deportation because he once pled guilty to a charge of domestic abuse, while quite innocent (as in, his mentally deranged wife's sister and aunt were witness to her calling 911 claiming abuse because he left the hosue to spend time with his friends). He pled guilty on the (bad) advice of an lawyer not familiar with immigration issues in the belief that the short term effect of a fine, or a short stint in jail was better than going through an extended trial. IOW, he pled guilty in the interest of expediency, not knowing the long-term consequences for a non-citizen of a spousal abuse conviction.

In fact, a traffic violation can be considered "moral turpitude" as far as an immigration hearing goes, and so, when I was charged with an illegal lane change, I sooner paid $350 in legal expenses to fight (and win) the charge than pay the $85 fine. Of course, I had the $350 to spend on a lawyer. Not every one does.

In this case, the deportation is being appealed by the narrowest ability to fund the appeal, on the primary grounds that the circumstances of the abuse conviction (including sworn affadavits by said sister in law and spouse's aunt) were never made known to the judge hearing the deportation case. It is hoped that the appellate judge will either throw out the deportation (criminal convictions do not automatically mean deportation under the law -- the judge has discretion), or at least stay it until a judgement is rendered on reopening the prior abuse case to see if an innocent verdict might be at hand.

But, all that costs $$$ - $3500 just to file the appeal.

Re:Movie quote time.

[CAIMLAS]

Yep. I know three people that have been similarly fucked over by this idiotic law.

Re:Movie quote time.

[Lew Payne]

"I meant in my original post "if I were him I would have sued the PO, etcetera.
Not as a simple slashdot poster:( "

I don't know about slashdot posters, but I do know where you can get some slashdot bumper stickers.

Re:Movie quote time.

[Anonymous Coward]

Where?

Re:Movie quote time.

[scbysnx]

really I don't understand it.. are you just trying to sound intellectual by knowing that the twin towers were designed by a japanese man?

Re:Movie quote time.

[scbysnx]

that anonymous post worked out real well for ya didn't it slick ;-)

Re:Movie quote time.

[Anonymous Coward]

If they were up your ass you'd know.

Re:Movie quote time.

[torpor]

no, the point is, american pride is false. new york is an international city, it shouldn't be viewed as a sctricly american posession ..

Re:Movie quote time.

[Lew Payne]

"you are such an idiot it's almost unbelieveable"

Stop your whining. Move back to Germany.

Re:Movie quote time.

[SMS_Design]

I was arrested for urinating in a park once. I wasn't actually urinating. I was standing in the park and had spilled some water on my pants. It was late at night, and the police were swarming over the park searching for a guy who had beat someone up and stolen a truck. Instead, they took the six officers and arrested ME. Luckily, it's just a $100 ticket, no sex offender registry or anything. Still, it was a big pain in the ass. Had to be bailed out at 1 AM because a cop approached me from behind, assumed I had been pissing on a tree, and then proceeded to keep his flashlight shined in my face and refuse to identify himself after multiple requests.

Re:Movie quote time.

[kalirion]

a dark corner, the back of a preferrably windowless, non-residential building You realize urine has a distinct and unpleasant odor to it, don't you? I'll accept going behind a tree, but not on the floor or a wall, where it will evaporate and inconvenience everyone nearby. There's a reason buildings have restrooms.

Re:Movie quote time.

[I_M_Noman]

Public urination is generally punishable only by a fine in the U.S., and if you hang out at seedy bars (or the NY subway) you will see plenty of it.

Which subway line do you ride? I've lived in New York City almost my entire life and never seen anyone peeing in a subway car, or on the platform, for that matter -- lots of other things, but never someone peeing. Even the homeless folks who live down there tend to be pretty private about that sort of thing. And I tend to live in fairly marginal neighborhoods, too, not anyplace trendy and sexy.

Re:Movie quote time.

[I_M_Noman]

I find your statement hard to reconcile with the fact that public urination, in the US, is met with punishment for a sexual offense

This isn't a federal law. There may be states or municipalities where this is true, but it certainly isn't true in New York. Public urination is illegal here, yes, but not a sexual offense.

Re:Movie quote time.

[AllahsAvatar]

JERRY: I've had this condition since I was eleven! I've been in and out of hospitals my whole life. I have no control over it. Doctors have told me that when I feel it, the best thing to do is just release it. Otherwise, I could die.

SECURITY GUARD: Well you're still not allowed.

JERRY: Do you hear what I'm saying to you?! I'm telling you that if I don't go, I could die. Die. Is it worth dying for?

SECURITY GUARD: That's up to you.

JERRY: So you don't care if I die.

SECURITY GUARD: What I care about is the sanitary condition of the parking facility.

JERRY: It was life and death.

SECURITY GUARD: Uh huh.

JERRY: Oh I'm lying. Why would I do it unless I was in mortal danger? I know it's against the law.

SECURITY GUARD: I don't know.

JERRY: Because I could get Uromysitisis poisoning and die. That's why!...Do you think I enjoy living like this?...the shame, the humiliation...You know I have been issued a public urination pass by the city because of my condition. Unfortunately my little brother ran out of the house with it this morning.
Him and his friends are probably peeing all over the place. You want to call the Department of Social Services? Oh, it's Saturday. They're closed today. My luck.

SECURITY GUARD: You can tell the police all about it.

Re:Movie quote time.

[Alsee]

some religiously motivated tight-assed sourpusses decided it would damage fragile minds to accidentally see a tip of flesh

Tip? Tip?! I pull my equipment all the way out... balls and all! Balls And All!

Ahhh... damaging fragile minds, such fun! Especially those religiously motivated tight-assed sourpusses. God, they have such fragile minds.

-

Re:Movie quote time.

[Anonymous Coward]

That response always slays me. "You've presented an anecdote that challenges my world view! You are therefore lying!"

Some cretins once spray-painted kill all nigger-lovers on the sidewalk behind my house (at the time my daughter was two years old, and the only black person living in the neighborhood). If I mention the incident in front of a "conservative" US southerner, they invariably respond exactly the way you just did; because I live in a northern state, after all, I must be lying to make a point.

This is my first post in this topic, doing the AC thing out of respect for my daughter's privacy.

Oh good

[geoffeg]

Next, they'll require employees to wear flair! 20 pieces "minimum"..

The beatings will continue until morale improves!

Re:Oh good

[Anonymous Coward]

You know what, Stan, if you want me to wear 37 pieces of flair, like your pretty boy over there Bryan, why don't you make the minimum 37 pieces of flair?

Re:Oh good

[Nasa Rosebuds]

20 pieces "minimum".. Actually, 37 is the minimum. Didn't you get that memo?

Re:Oh good

[Anonymous Coward]

it's "flare". As in "the bright thing that disctracts the eye"

Re:Oh good

[yog]

Beatings... heh... ;)

If the headline were rephrased it would not be that unusual a situation. In the professional working world people need to and want to behave "professionally" toward coworkers and associates. A business can be made or broken over lack of diplomacy among its staff and towards its customers.

In the corporate world, anyone can be promoted over you. The annoying person in the next cubicle who drives you crazy with his nail biting and overly loud headphones might be your manager next year so you restrain your natural desires to complain to him or about him. If he's not a TOTAL moron, he'll try to restrain his mouth around you, as well. And you both are painstakingly courteous and helpful on the phone to customers and associates from different departments; the last thing you want is someone complaining that you were rude or difficult to deal with, either inside or outside the firm.

I have heard for years about how the vicious behavior of people in TV stations and the broadcasting industry in general. Not having worked in that field, I can't say for sure, but I know people who have been to a local TV station for some one-off show and heard one anchor say to another, "You f*cking b*tch! Don't you ever cut me off like that again!" and that sort of thing. It's hard to believe that people would put up with each other talking that way but they apparently do.

The last thing I want to hear when I go to work is someone complaining. Life is not fair. Suck it up. If something's broken, fix it, don't just whine about it. Complaining is a way of broadcasting how powerless one is, as well as an indication of one's lack of initiative and creativity. Let such people go work elsewhere.

Not sure I agree with "official policy" on whining but the reality is that people self-select away from whining so it's probably unnecessary (and will only damage a company's morale in the long run).

Re:Oh good

[Anonymous Coward]

No you retard, it's "flair", as in USE A DICTIONARY you moron. What possible excuse could you have in an era of instant information access and universal computing????

Re:Oh good

[siliconjunkie]

As far as I know, your sig is incorrect. Apostrophes are used for contractions AND possessives. It's PLURALIZING where you do not use them. Bob the angry flower can help.

Re:Oh good

[Pete]

"it's" can also be "it has" (as well as "it is").

eg. It's flapped its wings. ;-)

Re:Oh good

[shatfield]

"...aaaannnd Peter... we need to talk about your TPS reports... didn't you get that memo? I'll send you another copy.... riiiiight."

People at my work passed the "Office Space" VHS tape (no kidding, heh) around the office, and you can't even say "That'd be great" in a meeting without getting snickers, even 5 years later! It's amazing how 1 movie has changed the perception of the American workplace so much.

Re:Oh good

[Chrax]

You're wrong. His sig is accurate.

Also, if you would, could you use the plural of "it" in a sentence?

Re:Oh good

[ceoyoyo]

No, he's correct. Its and it's are exceptions. In this case the contraction takes precedence -- it is -> it's -- and is not appropriate in formal writing. The possessive -- its -- does not have the apostrophe in this case, although you're right, except for the exception it would. "Its" is appropriate in formal writing. There is no such thing as a plural of "it."

Re:Oh good

[Anonymous Coward]

Neither are exceptions. "Its" follows the normal rule of not having apostrophes in possessive pronouns: "his", "her", "my", "your", "their"...

Re:Oh good

[ceoyoyo]

Good point. You meant "hers", "yours" and "theirs" though, right?

Re:Oh good

[Anonymous Coward]

These two its were walking down the street...

Re:Oh good

[siliconjunkie]

Also, if you would, could you use the plural of "it" in a sentence?

Indeed. My bad.

Re:Oh good

[siliconjunkie]

Nevermind my stupid comment about your sig. I forgot the exception and I have had my grammar nazi card revoked.

Re:Oh good

[Anonymous Coward]

I dunno. There are some people who seriously need 20 pieces of flare, minimum.

Four years old

[Anonymous Coward]

According to this press release (German only, sorry) this policy is four years old now.

Re:Four years old

[jzeejunk]

were the translators whining (and getting fired) all these years?

anyway here's the google translated version of the german release
http://translate.google.com/translate?u=http%3A%2F %2Fwww.nutzwerk.de%2Fmedia%2Fecho%2F05_11_03_t-onl ine1.html&langpair=de%7Cen&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8 &prev=%2Flanguage_tools

Re:Four years old

[Philmeeh]

But it's not a dupe so the editors are making progress!

Re:Four years old

[mongoose(!no)]

But /.ers don't go around reading those. The article if you take a look at it was written (or at least posted) on the register on Thursday of last week, so you can't blame /. for it.

Re:Four years old

[44414e-DE]

The company and this concept where also mentioned in various TV magazines here in germany.
I always wondered how cheerful the people really are if they are threatend to be fired if they are in a bad mood.

Re:Four years old

[Elektroschock]

Well. You probably know that Nutzwerk is known to sue everybody who negatively reports about their business, including media and NGOs like FFII. So they probably want to impose their no-complaints-policy on the whole market.

See e.g. http://nutzwerk.ffii.org/

Re:Four years old

[spir0]

only four years old? this sort of mind control has been happening in Germany since the 30's!

Re:Four years old

[Lucractius]

your link has been censored as of 3 days ago. all info is gone unless the lack of info was your point.

Re:Four years old

[EachLennyAPenny]

You're obvously new to Slashdot.

Re:Four years old

[Anonymous Coward]

Slashdot, News For Hadrosaurs.

Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[ThaFooz]

is over the top, but there are few things more irratating & detremental to productivity than an angry/whiny co-worker.

dangerous territory

[MetalliQaZ]

Might as well ban women in the workplace.

-d

Re:dangerous territory

[sound vision]

Come now. You know this is funny.

Re:dangerous territory

[jzeejunk]

slashdotters don't have women at their workplaces anyway ;) and you being a slashdotter don't know enough about women to make that claim

Re:dangerous territory

[Anonymous Coward]

Zing!

Re:dangerous territory

[nihilogos]

Might as well ban women in the workplace.

Why stop at the workplace? Ban them from your life. It's not like there will ever be any in it anyway, and as a bonus you can claim some legitimacy for the status quo.

Re:dangerous territory

[pipingguy]

But only for 1 week per month. Hmmm, maybe this has something to do with the directive...

Re:dangerous territory

[Anonymous Coward]

I'm reminded (only offhandedly) of an australian study of men & women in various work & social situations, where the participants were brought together and recorded, then afterwards asked to estimate the amount that other people spoke, or spoke over them. The results were quite curious. When speaking in social situations, men spoke 40% of the words women the rest - but the men estimated the women to speak up to four times as often as the men, and women also estimated women spoke more often than their measured percentages showed, guessing that other women spoke up to three times more often than men.

In work situations, the amount of speaking (by time and words) was much closer to 50/50, but the perceived percentages were similar. Men and women spoke an almost equal number of words for an equal amount of time, but all employees still perceived women to be talking four times more often than men.

Re:dangerous territory

[Anonymous Coward]

That's my plan, actually, as I don't want kids and treasure just leading my own life.

Re:dangerous territory

[Anonymous Coward]

I know this is a "funny" thread, but you guys know that a lot of women who work instead of being stay-at-home moms take birth control shots that keep them from menstruating, right? Of course, the drug itself can have mood affects, but we're pretty far technologically from being able to blame all the problems girls have on their abusive Aunt Flos.

Re:dangerous territory

[baryon351]

This was on Australia's Radio National at the start of this year. People's perceptions of how much another person spoke seemed more closely related to the content of what they spoke. If two people spoke equal amounts counted by time and number of words, but one person spoke about a wider range of topics, than the person who spoke about the wider range of topics was perceived to have spoken for a longer period. That much wasn't gender based, except that women did tend to talk about a wider range of topics.

However when it came to men & women speaking one on one, if a woman disagreed with a man in a conversation, the man's perception of the woman's speaking was that she completely monopolised the conversation by time, despite using the same number of words and speaking for a similar amount of time to the man. From the woman's perception, it was still roughly 50/50.

Re:dangerous territory

[Anonymous Coward]

Works for me. Thankfully in addition to the routines supplied at birth we possess a source reprogrammable module capable of overriding the core routines, allowing us to exit the biological imperatives that are solely a function of our genetic history, not a directive for the future.

Re:dangerous territory

[ThaFooz]

I'm reminded (only offhandedly) of an australian study of men & women in various work & social situations, where the participants were brought together and recorded, then afterwards asked to estimate the amount that other people spoke, or spoke over them. The results were quite curious. When speaking in social situations, men spoke 40% of the words women the rest - but the men estimated the women to speak up to four times as often as the men, and women also estimated women spoke more often than their measured percentages showed, guessing that other women spoke up to three times more often than men.

Well what's missing from this is WHEN the women talked. You see, women have the ability to talk and listen at the same time. Men can't do it - they call it "interrupting" and percieve it as attempts to dominate the conversation ;)

Re:dangerous territory

[Locke03]

HEY!! Us rare slashdotters that do have women in our lives don't like to be steriotyped like this all the time. I'm calling the ACLU...wait...I'm male, middle-class and white....

Re:dangerous territory

[Anonymous Coward]

Well what's missing from this is WHEN the women talked. You see, women have the ability to talk and listen at the same time. Men can't do it - they call it "interrupting" and percieve it as attempts to dominate the conversation ;)

Hey, I can talk and listen simultaneously when zero information is being actually conveyed too!

Re:dangerous territory

[Macgrrl]

slashdotters don't have women at their workplaces anyway ;) and you being a slashdotter don't know enough about women to make that claim

Looks down front of shirt.... Cleavage, CHECK; Breast count equals 2.

I'm fairly sure I'm a woman, I was when I got up this morning....

Re:dangerous territory

[Anonymous Coward]

But you write "grrl" when you mean woman, as if you were an ADHD afflicted dyslexic teenage girl in a chat forum about horses, so you don't count.

Re:dangerous territory

[Elvis77]

They tried but she complained about them complaining about her

Re:dangerous territory

[advocate_one]

Looks down front of shirt.... Cleavage, CHECK; Breast count equals 2.

carefull, there are male slashdotters who pass that check...

Re:dangerous territory

[Macgrrl]

Women have balls - we just wear them higher :)

Re:dangerous territory

[Lucractius]

And id call them too.... but im not american... ! wait... thats discrimination too! who do i call for this gross injustice!

Re:dangerous territory

[Lucractius]

Obviously your labouring under a stereotype that says men are incapable of learning this skill. Im prefectly capable of having a conversation, Listening and Gaming at the same time. I grew up with irritating people that wanted answers while i wanted to keep blowing sprites up with many hours of dpad and button mashing.

Re:dangerous territory

[jzeejunk]

Women have balls ...

Sedra - "They're real and they're spectacular"

Re:dangerous territory

[skiman1979]

if(Cleavage.Checked() == true)
{
        Breasts.Count = 2;
}
else
{
        Breasts.Count = 0;
}

Don't take my stapler!

[mishehu]

Obligatory Office Space Quote:

"Sounds like somebody's got a case of the Mondays"...

Re:Don't take my stapler!

[jmb-d]

Or to make it more culturally appropriate:

"Töne wie jemand hat einen Fall von den Montagen." (tip o' the hat to BabelFish)

Re:Don't take my stapler!

[bumptehjambox]

German to English:
"tones like someone has a case of the assemblies."
I think we all have a case of the assemblies, but that's life.

Wenn ich Million Dollar hatte, würde ich zwei Mädchen gleichzeitig tun!

Love,
BabelFish

Re:Don't take my stapler!

[Stuart Gibson]

For some reason, I always felt that it should be spelled "Mundays".

Regardless, I believe you'd get your ass kicked for saying something like that.

Stuart

Re:Don't take my stapler!

[mikael]

Obviously, if everyone has be cheerful, they will also have to look cheerful and demonstrate that they have plenty of personality by wearing badges and colourful clothing, which will undoubtably lead to this conversation:


Joanna: You know what, Stan, if you want me to wear 37 pieces of flair, like your pretty boy over there Bryan, why don't you make the minimum 37 pieces of flair?

Stan, Chotchkie's Manager: Well, I thought I remembered you saying that you wanted to express yourself.

Joanna: You know what, I do want to express myself, okay. And I don't need 37 pieces of flair to do it.
[flips off Stan]

Re:Don't take my stapler!

[jmb-d]

Thanks for the sanity check. Oh, and good luck on the millionaire thing.

Re:Don't take my stapler!

[Hurricane78]

> "Wenn ich Million Dollar hatte, würde ich zwei Mädchen gleichzeitig tun!"

Tell this to a girl and she will smile if she loves you and you will end up with twin girl children instead of fucking with two girls. Because that's he ony sense this scentence makes. ;)

Maybe you meant ", würde ich es mit zwei Mädchen gleichzeitig tun!" But then still "Million Dollar" makes no sense because the quantity is missing. Maybe she will buy you a sticker with "million dollar" on it, put it on her nd say "let's go fuck!" if she has humor. :)

But as I said you ain't gonna like the result. *gg*

Sued FFII

[slashflood]

The same company that sued the FFII.

Re:Sued FFII

[labratuk]

Indeed, and I think it's a disservice to call them an 'IT Company'. 'Patent Farmers' is far more appropriate.

Re:Sued FFII

[Anonymous Coward]

Not only did they sue FFII, they also registered the domain yaho.co.uk to generate advertising revenues (a fact they now try to suppress), they built sites with anti-semitic content to show up in respective search results, are highly supportive of software patents and generally sue everyone in sight who disagrees with their views.

Re:Sued FFII

[Anonymous Coward]

You're absolutely right. Just last week FFII and Nutzwerk settled in a German court about, amongst others, FFII referencing to the translation of a Dutch article by WebWereld, also published in English on the site of the author, Brenno de Winter. De Winter published statements by Nutzwerk CEO Holzer where he called FFII Chairman Pilch a "catagoric lyar".

WebWereld reports(Dutch) that in the settlement FFII and Nutzwerk agreed that FFII stops commenting on Nutzwerk and Nutzwerk stops sueing them.

An interesting detail about Nutzwerk is that they used to maintain a link farm in order to get high ranks in Google. Amongst the files in the farm, was a file scheiss_juden.htm which was apparantly meant to increase the probablility googling jew haters would find their anonymity services. According to a German article, the link farm was set up as to allow only web-crawlers to the farm contents and at some point Google had 51.000 links pointing to the Nutzwerk site. At this moment only 908 remain, after apparantly the Google cache has been wiped.

Now some fun: Google for the combination of "Rene Holzer" (Nutzwerk CEO) and "Michael Koustiniko". You'll probably find this post, where Mr. Koustiniko signs as "Rene Holzer". Digging a little further shows that our friend used this alias to advertise his products.

What's also interesting is that in their previous legal actions against Cobion AG, during which 2 of Nutzwerk's software patents were invalidated, Nutzwerk was represented by Günter Freiherr von Gravenreuth, an attorney well known in the computer scene. For instance, he was was behind the much publicised Tanja campaign where he tricked computer users into sending a list of pirated software to "Tanja", on the receiving of which he sent them a cease and desist notice along with a request for payment, he shut down emule.de (German), extorted SuSE, demanded Linus Torvalds to drop the Linux name and last but not least was involved in the cases around MobiliX as the registrar of the trademark Obelix.

would be cool if......

[free space]

I was allowed to stay at home as long as it takes to become happy before going to work ;)

Like my Dad used to say:

[Anne Thwacks]

"Enjoy yourself or I'll beat you!"

Re:Like my Dad used to say:

[emjoi_gently]

Be Happy You Miserable Bastards!

Re:Like my Dad used to say:

[Anonymous Coward]

Respect your mother, you son of a bitch.

Re:Like my Dad used to say:

[TheGratefulNet]

the beatings shall continue until morale increases...

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[ari_j]

If there are few things more detrimental to productivity than whiny coworkers, then why is this over the top?

What if...

[RAMMS EIN]

What if people start complaining that they don't have the basic right of complaining?

Re:What if...

[LiquidCoooled]

You can complain about not having the right to complain, but you have to do it with a song and a dance.

Re:What if...

[Brown Eggs]

I think a more interesting question is, if people are in violation of the no complaining rules, how do you complain about THEM without breaking the rules?

Re:What if...

[Angostura]

Well it struck me that the management policy was actually self-referential to the extent that it counts as whining about whining. I'm not sure whether they could actually implement it without instantaneously disciplining/firing themselves.

Re:What if...

[Anonymous Coward]

>I think a more interesting question is, if people are in violation of the no complaining rules, how do you complain about THEM without breaking the rules?

Like this:

Guess what??!:)!)!:)!:)!:) We get to fire Bob for breaking the company policy against complaining! That's AWESOME!! :-) Now we all get to sing the you're fired song!...

o/~ La la la la la la YOU'RE FIRED, BOB!!! o/~

Re:What if...

[Anonymous Coward]

What if there were no rhetorical questions?

Plagiarism

[Lord of Ironhand]

Let me complain for a minute and point out that it was the Reg, not "theodp" who wrote that blob of text, contrary to what the post suggests.

Don't call in sick...

[Anonymous Coward]

Call in ungrateful!

"Sorry boss, I felt like complaining today so I decided to take the day off. I should be better soon..."

Heard this name before

[Aim Here]

Nutzwerk - aren't they those litigous fuckpigs who censored the FFII website for telling the world that this company, despite being held up as the model company for software patents, was actually guilty of all sorts of ethically dubious internet practices?

I think the management there has control-freakery issues...

Re:Heard this name before

[Elektroschock]

Apparently they managed to scare away or delete all negative reporting from google index. Nutzwerk are court injunction specialists.

Cheerful at the office?

[Anonymous Coward]

Son of a bitch! I'd never make it out of the house!!!

Service Level Agreement

[totallygeek]

I know a company with an SLA that states something to the effect that a smile must be given in a face to face meeting before any work is to be performed.

WARNING

[Anonymous Coward]

Slashdot GROUPTHINK violation...

nutzwerk?

[Anonymous Coward]

Anyone remember?
http://lwn.net/Articles/145972/

There's also a nice article @ heise.de/telepolis unfortunatly is german...

GROW UP

[a_greer2005]

Everyone has a bad day or off moment, happyness shouldnt be requiered!

We have all had one BITCH of a co worker at one point or another, you just learn how to deal with/ignore the person, and if their whining is hurting their proformance, they get let go for under preformance.

I am normally a chearfull person, but I have my down moments, If I happen to be a little grauggy, or, in a moment of utter frustration, froun and maybe grumble I can now be FIRED!!! WHAT THE FUCK?

Re:GROW UP

[Landshark17]

happyness shouldnt be requiered

No it shouldn't, but proper grammer and spelling should.

Wait, sorry, forgot I was on /.

Re:GROW UP

[cdrdude]

How about you just calm down, and not log in to slashdot for a day, until you feel better. Then you can be back to being "a chearfull person" posting on slashdot instead of working.

Oh man..

[Anonymous Coward]

Fuck that!

ACK Nutzwerk GmbH

[Anonymous Coward]

Oh great, Nutzwerk. Most people who're following german IT news ( heise.de etc.) probably know that Nutzwerk is some kind of shiny MAKE-MONEY-FAST company that *somehow* managed to survive the burst of the bubble. They also love suing everybody who damages their perfect image of a successfull new economy company like the FFII.org (for documenting their abuse of software patents) and the Heise Newsticker (for giving them bad press about it). Google for "ffii nutzwerk" for more info. They even set up a special web site just for calling Heise.de liars: http://www.nutzwerk-heise.de/

PS: One last thought: If everybody is forced to act happy, then how are we ever going to find out if they're *really* happy about this new part of the contract?

An Official Complaining Day

[trollable]

Okay, so now you can complain at home. That's great, maybe not so enjoyable but at least you're still paid. Well, how many complaining days will have per year? Also, wouldn't be cheaper to have a national complaining day? So every one could complain at the same time. My 2 cents ;)

Sketch

[Dante Shamest]

Artist's Sketch of the Female Employee

But...

[ksandom]

But WHYYYYYYYYYYYYYYyyyyyyy???? ;-)

These guys are evil!

[alba7]

If you can read German, see http://www.heise.de/newsticker/search.shtml?T=nutz werk

In any case, mod parent up.

I guess these would be banned?

[AndroidCat]

Despair, Inc.

A rule-of-thumb in software development: If a place has too many Dilbert cartoons on cubicle sides, have an exit strategy. If it has none, RUN!!!

Re:I guess these would be banned?

[Null Perception]

http://despair.com/demotivation.html

Re:I guess these would be banned?

[tbuskey]

I look for all the samizdat cartoons. You know "I've got one Nerve Left..." "Bang Head Here"

Anyone know how to google these? I had a link to an archive once.....

Re:I guess these would be banned?

[AndroidCat]

I'm sure that there is an undiscovered cave painting somewhere that when the iconography is deciphered, it will turn out to say "You want it when...?!" or "You don't have to be evolved to work here, but it helps!!"

I'd like to whine about this article...

[eyebits]

...but I am under contractual obligation to not whine.

I can imagine that being under contract to not whine will mean that people will come up with creative ways to whine without really whining. Reminds me of a conversation I had last night. I am recent transplant to The South and was told that there were phrases in use here that didn't mean what they really mean. For example, if you tell someone something like "I just inherited a million dollars" they will reply be saying "That's nice." ...which really means F*ck you.

So, image code words and phrases will be created to allow whining without breaching the contract.

Re:I'd like to whine about this article...

[Anonymous Coward]

This sounds like how the british came up with bloody to go around saying 'fuck'.

Re:I'd like to whine about this article...

[mrchaotica]

I am recent transplant to The South and was told that there were phrases in use here that didn't mean what they really mean. For example, if you tell someone something like "I just inherited a million dollars" they will reply be saying "That's nice." ...which really means F*ck you.

Yes sirree, us here Southerners invented sarcasm! I heard tell once that other folks use it too, but I dun't believe that for a minnit!

Re:I'd like to whine about this article...

[otomo_1001]

Us northerners use: Good For You
(Go f*** yourself)

Re:I'd like to whine about this article...

[Anonymous Coward]

That's not a southern thing you idiot, it's sarchasm.

Re:I'd like to whine about this article...

[eyebits]

That's nice.

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[Ebirah]

This is true, but for a lot of places where I've worked, nobody at all will come in to work if a rule like this gets implemented...

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[ThaFooz]

Because overly cheery co-workes are almost as irritating.

I mean, telling people not to whine to the point of being unberable is one thing. Telling them to pretend to be cheery all the time is another.

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[xstonedogx]

but there are few things more irratating & detremental to productivity than an angry/whiny co-worker.

One thing more detrimental is an angry/whiny co-worker (or employee) who is pretending to be cheerful.

This really just sounds like management doesn't have the skill or the emotional maturity to actually deal with the problem, so instead, they sweep it under the rug.

If an employee is angry/whiny, there is a reason. Maybe that reason is internal to the employee. Maybe that reason is the result of something in the work environment. Force the employee to pretend to be happy, and the employee will probably more unhappy. Then you have an employee not working to the best of their ability, who may even be acting out passive aggressively. That attitude can spread just as quickly as overt angry/whiny behavior, and can be even worse to tolerate because it is harder to pin down.

Whinning verboten?

[KH]

It's kind of hard to believe this is real with the name like Kuwatsch (rhymes with the word quatsch, "bullshit"). But if this is real, I'm sure that the co-workers try to be as jolly as possible with the famed german seriousness.

Re:Whinning verboten?

[Lucractius]

thats why the call the company Nutzwerk... cause its Nutz Werkin there damn it!

Too bad their web site isn't ASP...

[ArsenneLupin]

... because this one company would actually fully deserve a goatsing (or worse...), for its dickness wrt software patents!

Happiness is mandatory.

[Imajica]

Ah, sweet memories of playing paranoia...

Ve have vays...

[Anonymous Coward]

...of making you talk. Err, I mean happy.

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[Soko]

Because emotions aren't something that one can always control with impunity? Besides, no whinging means you can't complain about the PHB or you cow-orker while on the job - you end up being a good little robot. IME emotions - both good and bad - spark thought, and thought leads to greater productivity. I can see a policy of dealing directly with someone who does _nothing_ but complain and then offers no creative solutions, but trying to program happiness? No thanks.

Soko

There's Only One To Blame...

[Sephiriz]

"The plan was prompted by a female employee whose constant complaining prompted the other staff to complain about her complaining." Weiber...

Awesome

[MicroBerto]

It's their company and their rules, they can do whatever they want.

There is nothing more aggravating sitting next to a whiny coworker. Negative energy drains EVERYONE. Recommended reading: "How Full Is Your Bucket?"

Re:Awesome

[Anonymous Coward]

Fuck you. Fuck you and the stupid fucking company mantra you rode in on. Had it occurred to any of you fucking happy-clappy droids that your "whiny coworker" might just have a POINT? Like, maybe the team IS a actually a dysfunctional nightmare from your worst pyschoanalytical nightmare. Maybe the company IS actually fucked into a cocked hat, you just haven't noticed it yet.

I just hope you're actually in the fucking office when one of us finally goes postal with a contractors nail gun. Hope you don't mind your nuts stapled to that stack of paper in your in-tray. Hey, once I've fucked up that ugly HR cunt with the nearest blunt object, you could be next. This could be your lucky day, mothafucka!

Re:Awesome

[tedrlord]

You're being so negative about negativity, man. It's bringing me down.

When people around me complain incessantly, I take the opportunity to cheerily irritate them until they shut the hell up. It really brightens my day.

Re:Awesome

[Anonymous Coward]

Had it occurred to any of you fucking happy-clappy droids that your "whiny coworker" might just have a POINT?

If they were worth listening to, there is a good chance they'd know how to address the problem and would be working on solving it. The likelyhood is though, they are vaguely aware of a genuine problem, but that they fail to understand it correctly and/or can't express the problem a coherent way.

That being the case, it's entirely possible (even likely IMO) the problem is their attitude or simply their lack of ability to deal with rountine aspects of their job.

Like, maybe the team IS a actually a dysfunctional nightmare from your worst pyschoanalytical nightmare.

Well, if it's a team your in, that's kind of a given.

I just hope you're actually in the fucking office when one of us finally goes postal [...]

Bit late for that in your case.

Re:These guys are evil! MOD PARENT UP

[Anonymous Coward]

Yeah, but remeber heise has also an English Portal site but without the commentary system...
--> http://www.heise.de/english/

Not just an employee but ....

[max born]

The plan was prompted by a female employee whose constant complaining prompted the other staff to complain about her complaining.

Wonder why they felt it relevant to point out it was a woman?

Re:Not just an employee but ....

[Anonymous Coward]

because women nag and winge

Many guys reading that line would sit there and nod knowingly - but in todays politically correct environment put up with the spoilt child behaviour that is the attitude of many women today

Re:Not just an employee but ....

[Anonymous Coward]

Wonder why they felt it relevant to point out it was a woman?

No?

And in other news..

[ahodgkinson]

..Beatings will continue until morale improves.

Excellent.

[Anonymous Coward]

And of course in return the company is contractually obligated to treat employees with respect and dignity, right? No, I didn't think so.

I think that's the point.

[TheSpoom]

If you complain about anything, your boss can just say you've broken your contract by not being cheerful and fire you.

Germans Love to Complain

[putko]

Germans love to complain about things -- it is part of their culture.

I saw this in Germany, when I worked their for years as an expat.

The fact that they had to put it in the contract, rather than just a management directive, is typically German too: it has to be in the contract, so that they can have something to point to when they need to discipline someone.

As should be clear from their inflexible style, and their lack of focus on the needs of the customer, German customer service is pretty bad. It has gotten a lot better in the last decade though.

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[capicu]

While we're on the subject, what qualifications do you need to get a decent job in the expat industry in Germany? I've been living abroad for a few years now, but with the growing number of dual nationality people living there, with their insanely unfair advantage, is it even worth trying?

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[Elrac]

As someone living in Germany who just got back from a business trip to the US, I'd like to make a clarification about customer service.

Especially in the big cities, customer service people are surly at best and sometimes downright hostile. I recall walking up to a salesperson for some help, and he quickly walked away just as I opened my mouth. I recall the story of my girlfriend, who bought a tail light cover from an auto shop. When she asked them to install it, they refused and told her she could do it herself. That said, when you actually manage to get service in Germany, it's usually competent.

On my trip Stateside, I was met with nothing but courteousness and friendly smiles. It took me a moment to get used to being called 'Sir' all the time. On the other hand, many of those I dealt with were mind-bogglingly incompetent. Many operated by a fixed set of written rules and were unable or unwilling to deal with any situation not dealt with on their crib sheet. Another anecdote: I mailed the webmaster of an outfit that mails me an informative blurb on a daily basis when I noticed that the 'Subject' line was (all of a sudden) being truncated if that subject was more than one word. Thought I'd give him a heads up so he could fix this embarrassing little bug. Days later, I got a response to the effect of, "we can't do anything about this. Our software always shortens the subject to one word when it's more than one word."

So between Germany and the US (and from my admittely limited sample space), one gets the choice between the devil and the deep blue sea; between knowledgeable but lazy and annoying service people, and smiling minimum-wage goofballs.

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[Elektroschock]

Well. It is thinking in 'worst case' scenarios.

Not hard to understand for a nation which survived two world wars and at least two totalitarian governments in the last century.

Germans always feel like living in the worst economic situation. "German customer service is pretty bad" is like Germans regard themselves. At least those who never crossed the border. This is what makes their success. "We have to do better."

If you are pleased with your current situation you will not improve it. So they are always looking for what goes wrong.

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[Anonymous Coward]

So, just to clarify:
Germany has the best customer service you can't get,
and the US has the worst customer service you can get?

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[Anonymous Coward]

I can just confirm the script-reading happy folks here in North America. Usually they hire people on an EQ basis instead of IQ basis. If you can talk nicely, you can do tech support. These folks are - as you mentioned - working for close to minimum wage. Usually you're better off reading the manuals (if there are any).

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[Crouty]

Well observed! At the bureau this complaining attitude can quickly gain momentum. People complain -> boss takes this as criticism to his management and slowly drops his fraternal attitude which in turn gives the workers more reason to complain. You end up with a boss without respect but with power and workers who don't consider their work worth doing if it was not for the cash. These few easy steps lead to an unproductive "timebomb" department.

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[Anonymous Coward]

I was in Germany for 5 days on holiday and had no problems with customer service. Except for people _smoking_ in shops. What the hell? It was the strangest thing to be _inside_ and be served by a cashier with a lit cigarette in their mouth. Wow.

I'm from Australia, where smoking is banned pretty much everywhere except for nightclubs (whose days are numbered).

Of course, 5 days isn't much to go by. Perhaps when it's obvious you're a tourist and don't speak German, people are extra nice.

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[Tablizer]

I got a response to the effect of, "we can't do anything about this. Our software always shortens the subject to one word when it's more than one word."

But

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[_Sprocket_]

Germany has customer service that you can't get and the US has customer service that you don't want.

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[Cederic]

As someone that has lived in Germany and has visited multiple times this year, I find customer service in shops, hotels, restaurants to be extremely good.

It's not the intrusive service you get in America, and nothing like the offensively intrusive service you get in India, but it's certainly not normally 'bad'.

Where I do have problems is when I'm offered assistance but am unable to describe my needs because my German is so shite. I don't think it would be fair to blame others for that.

~Cederic

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[Tom]

Germans love to complain about things -- it is part of their culture.

It is (and I am a german). But it's also one of the reasons Germany does so many things right and is well-known for its excellent engineering and science. We complain and then we strife to make things better. Many other countries complain less, but even when they complain they don't start doing anything about it, they stay at complaining.

German customer service is pretty bad.

Depends on your expectations. Yes, we don't have minimum wage slaves behind the cashiers to bag your groceries. But then again, we don't have a sizeable percentage of our people living off minimum wage, and we all consider that a good thing.
I've seen more friendly customer service in many countries (I've been around some, on all continents except Australia), but friendly is not always equal to competent. And since most people around here might not be overly cheerful, what they usually are is neutral, not grump or unfriendly, so I'm usually happy with that as long as the service quality is good - and it mostly is.

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[QuestorTapes]

> On my trip Stateside, I was met with nothing but courteousness and friendly
> smiles...On the other hand, many of those I dealt with were mind-bogglingly
> incompetent. Many operated by a fixed set of written rules and were unable
> or unwilling to deal with any situation not dealt with on their crib sheet.

Regrettably, a lot of this is not due to the incompetence of the customer service people, but the incompetence of their superiors.

In many cases, the moronic rules and the "cast-in-stone" nature of them is mandated by managers who are certain they know best.

I recall a time some years ago, in my last "customer service" position, when management decided to change the rules on a particular type of product return. All of us working customer service knew this would piss off our customers. All we asked for is for management to allow us to inform regular customers -before- the change occurred, to ease the transition.

We didn't even want more time, just the chance to tell them prior to beginning the transaction. Management decided this would cause "confusion", and it was mandated as a surprise.

I really got sick of being called a racist white mother-bleeper that first day.

> So between Germany and the US (and from my admittely limited sample space),
> one gets the choice between the devil and the deep blue sea; between
> knowledgeable but lazy and annoying service people, and smiling minimum-wage
> goofballs.

Well, as many people here can attest, a lot of American businesses have tried to use technology to replace the reasonably intelligent service people. On many occasions, I've listened to managers request that our software be so simple they can hire monkeys to do customer service.

You get what you ask for; they wanted monkeys, they got monkeys.

Re:Germans Love to Complain

[Mordantos]

Germans also love David Hasselhoff.

But they really love to Complain about David Hasselhoff...

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[ThaFooz]

This really just sounds like management doesn't have the skill or the emotional maturity to actually deal with the problem, so instead, they sweep it under the rug.

Fair enough. But that begs the question - what do you do with a talented employee who is unbearable at times due situations outside the company's control (personal/psychological/etc problems)? It seems to me there comes a point where all you can do is say "get yourself together or don't bother coming in".

I'm so going to work there ...

[ta ma de]

Without the right to complain, sexual harassment can continue unhindered. I will be able to make happy comments about personal appearances related to sexuality all day long. All positive and complimentary; Awesome. May the best skirt win. Bonus points for obvious thongs and diaphanous clothing.

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[Antique Geekmeister]

But the big problem that contributes even more to an unhealthy and unhappy workplace is refusing to respond to legitimate issues and complaints caused by a specific problem employee, often the CEO, then censoring them as "whining" and "negative thinking" and using them to start a paper trail to dump that "unfaithful" employee who was actually trying to fix real problems.

I've actually seen this, when an engineer started doing a real hardware audit to bring deployed systems into the inventory and hardware management. It could have expanded the company's computer available hardware by 15% re-commissioning lost and "disabled" machines without spending money on new hardware, but it also turned out that it would have revealed the incompetence of the shipping manager, who had been losing machines and even stealing machines by sending them to his buddy and losing the receipts. The engineer got laid off with a new pair of twins to support and three weeks severance: two months later, when caught in the act, the shipping manager got an "oportunity to pursue other career options" with a six month severance package, his stock options intact, and polite references in order to avoid any press coverage of his theft.

It can be quite damaging.

[Anonymous Coward]

We had a really grouchy lab tech (who has moved on). This person had a really bad influence on the students. The remarks were something like: "Why are you here, there won't be a job for you when you graduate." (We usually have 100% placement.) or, "Those profs are all lazy." (Lazy like being up 'til 1 AM marking assignments.) or "None of the local industry has any respect for this program." (That's why they come looking for grads four months before they graduate.)

The aforementioned lab tech probably caused a lot of students to give up and quit trying. It cost them a lot in terms of money, time and self esteem. Bitchy people really can be quite damaging. Maybe we shouldn't be able to insist that everyone be a cheerful Charlie but at least we can ask for professional behaviour; and yes, I do think non-professional behaviour is cause for dismissal.

Re:These guys are evil! MOD PARENT UP

[sploxx]

Or, for example, see this article.

Python quote time

[Hope Thelps]

Once upon a time, long, long ago, there lay in a valley far, far away in the mountains the most contented kingdom the world has ever known. It was called Happy Valley, and it was ruled over by a wise old king called Otto. And all his subjects flourished and were happy, and there were no discontents or grumblers, because wise King Otto had had them all put to death, along with the trade union leaders, many years before. And all the happy folk of Happy Valley sang and danced all day long, and anyone who was for any reason miserable or unhappy or who had any difficult personal problem was prosecuted under the Happiness Act.

Happy Valley

Re:Python quote time

[socrates09]

Happy Valley is real, and not far from where I live...

http://www.whereis.com/whereis/mapping/geocodeAddr ess.do?advertiserId=&streetNumber=&streetName=&poi Type=&suburb=happy+valley&state=South+Australia&x= 17&y=6

Re:Python quote time

[SpoonDog_SVT]

OMG, my bro/sis-in-laws live there... and they're a cooky kind of bunch...

Re:Python quote time

[Bazman]

How come this posting gets moderated up to 5 but my posting on the same subject gets modded as 'Off Topic'? I would make a fuss about this, but, um... my IT outfit has banned whining....

Re:Python quote time

[Anonymous Coward]

Correction: Happy Valley is ruled by Joe Paterno.

Re:Python quote time

[Hope Thelps]

How come this posting gets moderated up to 5 but my posting on the same subject gets modded as 'Off Topic'?

Because the moderators like me best :p

didn't BitKeeper have a license like that?

[Anonymous Coward]

You can use some of this source code, under the condition that you don't whine about it. I was actually looking forward to some of the court cases that would have come out of that.

Ahh the Morning Jerk...

[joel8x]

I used to work with a guy who was the biggest a-hole until about 2 or three hours after he was in. Problem was he didn't start until 11:00am, so by the time he got to work everyone else was bright and chipper. It got so bad that I even a wrote a song to cheer him up (well, make fun of him really): Good Morning Ali

Layoffs will continue until morale improves

[melted]

Layoffs will continue until morale improves. Good luck to those dipshits in management who came up with this. Pretty soon they'll have to do the "real actual work" themselves, because employees will be gone.

Terms of Service

[ewg]

Time to amend the Slashdot Terms of Service!

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[ari_j]

So don't sign the contract. Nobody is holding a gun to your head requiring you to take that job.

python sketch

[Bazman]

The Monty Python foot has rarely been so appropriate!

Happy Valley

Prosecution: Caspar Schlitz, I put it to you that you were, on February 5th this year, very depressed with malice aforethought, and did moan quietly, contrary to the Cheerful Noises Act.

Schlitz: I did.

Defence: May I just explain, m'lud, that the reason for my client's behaviour was that his wife had just died that morning.

I have the soloution...

[jonr]

A complementary pint of beer to start the day...
They better not hire me, I'm really depressed/grumpy/whatever until noon...

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[vsprintf]

there are few things more irratating & detremental to productivity than an angry/whiny co-worker

Actually, the person most irritating and detrimental to productivity is the cheerful, optimistic sysadmin who continues to do upgrades and apply patches while saying, "It won't affect anything," no matter how many times he has broken everything. I can ignore the angry/whiny people that aren't breaking stuff (well, except when it's my boss :).

Been there, done that

[william_w_bush]

My apologies.

I hope you like Natural Ice(tm).

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[b100dian]

It's human nature...
I would have been that engineer if I were to speak loud all my thoughts...

But I keep them inside.

Solved?

[ellcry]

This has striking contrails to another form of contractual obligation: marriage. History has shown that faking vivaciousness, love, jollity, etc is a recipe for disaster. You'd think a construct as ancient as marriage would give this corporation something that resembles a clue... apparently not.

Besides, I worked at Harris Teeter when I was in high school and trust me: perpetual, absurd happiness was definitely a criterion!

Yeah, uh...

[Luigi30]

I can't come into work today. I'm not happy enough. I might not be able to come in for the rest of the week.

Re:Yeah, uh...

[failedlogic]

But that's okay, it's part of the contract!

Apply today, don't get the job and keep complaining until you get hired. By then you'll be too tired to complain.

All those who are not cheerful at work...

[rinkjustice]

must TOUCH MY MONKEY!!!!

Disclaimer: I have no idea what that means (but it doesn't sound good).

Re:All those who are not cheerful at work...

[Anonymous Coward]

But it is funny

Paranoia...

[denubis]

Are you Happy Citzen? Remember, happiness is mandatory. Being unhappy is insuboridination. Friend Computer suggests taking HappyTymNow pills -- guarenteed to improve happiness! Unhappiness is a tool of the commie mutant traitors! Be on your guard! Report those who are unhappy, as they could be communists!

Thank you for your cooperation, Citizen.

They should have just said

[jalefkowit]

"The beatings will continue until morale improves."

Failure of Management

[NetSettler]

My personal sense is that whining is too subjective to be a legitimate contractual criterion.

But even if we accept it for discussion's sake, disagreement and dissatisfaction can be natural and healthy in a company. It seems to me a manager's job is not to say "no one can whine" but rather to say "this whining is helping us" or "this whining is not helping us". Good QA departments, for example, are often filled with constructive whiners. The decision to blame the ousting of a non-constructive whiner on policy sounds to me like a failure of management to make the necessary Hard Decisions and then to stand by them. Instead, the manager is trying to hide behind policy that may seem to serve at one moment, but that may have adverse effects on other occasions. Also, my bet is that when push comes to shove on matters unrelated to whining, the same manager will fail to make other critical Hard Decisions, too, then blame their inaction on some equally silly smokescreen.

Re:Failure of Management

[Anonymous Coward]

Using the phrase "quit whining" to someone who has a legitimate complaint, as far as I'm concerned, amounts to nothing more but an ad hominem fallacy. Sure, you use the phrase "quit whining" or "don't be a whiner" to someone to shut them up, but you've basically lost the logical part of the argument and it will probably bite you in the ass in the future when you're the one who is in need of help.

I can just hear it now...

[Landshark17]

"Sie sind glücklich!!!" rougly translated, "YOU VILL BE HAPPY!!!"

It seems that the Germans...

[Anonymous Coward]

..are always about eighty years ahead of the rest of us.

Even worse

[game kid]

Even worse: If the whiner is your science lab partner, whining about how to do $this and how they are gonna shoot themselves because of $that.

I know a few like that; they should probably not take a research job after college.

Re:These guys are evil! MOD PARENT UP

[sploxx]

Or, another, very interesting german article!

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[BoredByPolitics]

To be honest, it shouldn't need to get to that stage, that is, if the company in question has a decent occupational health department, or is prepared to send an employee to see the company doctor (who actually has the power to do something).

The company I'm working for currently is a case in point - doesn't have an occupational health department, but does retain a doctor. The last 12 months have been an absolute nightmare for me, on a personal and health front, but my employer's attitude has been to try and help where possible, and they have, to the extent that I'm still a viable employee, with the end to the nightmare in sight.

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[ari_j]

If you're getting tired of this response, and I'm not the only one exhibiting this response, then maybe you are the one who ought to leave.

Hmmmm

[Anonymous Coward]

So that's why I'm being fired!

Always figured it was my manager who didn't like me, but nope, it the 'happiness quotient' not being filled.

Good. That makes me feel better ironically.

-me

And zis ist how vee say goodbye in Amerika!

[Y-Crate]

Sam's Club/ Wal-Mart fired a woman who would not smile at customers as she handed out free samples of food.

The reason she did not smile?

Her face is partially paralyzed and is no longer physically capable smiling at anyone for any reason.

Re:And zis ist how vee say goodbye in Amerika!

[tumbleweedsi]

Well then she was not physically capable of doing the job... you would not hire a person with no arms to be a bell boy/bag carrier would you?

And no... before you try it, this is not flamebait... it is an opinion which I am entitled to have so stop waving your mod points around like somebody cares.

Re:And zis ist how vee say goodbye in Amerika!

[whitehatlurker]

I hope she got a good pay-out.

Let's put this even more offtopic ... retail outfits should not make their employees smile so much. It just gets either tiresome or creepy ... or both.

Re:And zis ist how vee say goodbye in Amerika!

[JumperCable]

I wouldn't smile either if my name was Molly Beavers.

Re:And zis ist how vee say goodbye in Amerika!

[Anonymous Coward]

I never understand why people have a problem with this sort of thing. Yes, its unfortunate that she is handicapped. However, if she is physically incapable of coming across as friendly, she isn't qualified for a service job!

Its a National Problem in Germany: "zu Meckern"

[MadCow-ard]

The problem is actually a serious issue in Germany.

The transition occured in the early nineties in the USA, when the last of real manufacturing went tits up for IT/service jobs (Of course that's tits up too, but that's another issue). In the US, the last of the lifetime jobs went out in the 70's, in Germany, these transitions are just now arriving. And engineering and manufacturing is part of the German image of self-worth, so it hits home particularly hard.

The problem in German culture is that it is a change in the economy which no one wants to acknowledge, but are being forced to. The last 50 years of a boom economy after the war has now more or less come to a grinding halt. Germany is now evolving, but its eating into peoples morale. The whole country is bitching and moaning, and that in itself is pulling the economy down, not to mention an individual business as is mentioned in this report.

I know you can't regulate someone's mood but at least they are pointing to where the country should try to go (and if anyone would try to regulate someone's mood, it would be in Germany). I applaud the idea, and laugh at the fact they are trying to regulate instead of inspire. Typcal German (and now I'm starting to "meckern").

"To Meckern" means to bleat or baa like a goat. This is the term used to describe what Germans do when they bitch and moan. They "blaaaaa" (you need to skip on the gutoral to really get the effect). Anyway, it fits, and its a problem. Really... :-)

Nazis

[michaelmalak]

You know the Nazis had pieces of flair that they made the Jews wear.

Re:Nazis

[fireman sam]

According to Godwin's Law I should not reply, but I must give you a big thumbs up for that one; And remember, 15 pieces of flair is the minimum.

Whiners unite!

[payndz]

Pah! In my former employment, the one thing that united all the people in my department was their utter loathing of one of the senior managers. Without him and his horrible, rude, aggressive, belittling, vindictive and arbitrary behaviour to bring the workers together in their detestation of him, nobody would have had anything in common!

Not long enough in Gremany...

[hughk]

It is exceptionally difficult (and expensive) to fire anyone in Germany once their Probezeit is over. Most Germans carry legal insurance and will quite happily take an employer to court for unfair dismissal even when there are good grounds for doing so. The contract of employment would be seen to be invalid as a worker cannot be obliged to have a good attitude.

Re:Not long enough in Gremany...

[Anonymous Coward]

What you are telling is just not true. Regarding to all statistics published, only a really small percentage of german people do carry legal insurance. Consumer protection agencies usually advise against getting legal insurance as such insurance is considered expensive, unnecessary and does not cover the real important legal problems. There are some people, though, who see suing companies etc. as a sport and get legal insurance, but they usually get kicked out of insurance rather fast. And even if a person does carry legal insurance, job contracts are usually NOT covered, so the legal insurance will NOT help with the problems described by you.

So better get your facts straight before posting untruth.

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[UnahaClosp]

I totally agree, in my opinion the most annoying person in my office is also the one that's the most cheerful. And I also believe that she is deliberately trying to make me insane with her complete inability to foresee other people's needs despite constant reminding and not to forget lacking of any knowledge of things technical or logical. I should mention that she is one of my project leaders and that the company we work for only deals with IT solutions, mostly within web publishing.

She constantly does things like such as
* NOT filling out a task description for tasks with extremely narrow deadlines.
* delivering totally irrelevant information about tasks.
* asking why layouts looks strange on her laptop when she has accidentally increased the font size in the browser to ridiculous sizes (this happens way to often)
* making very annoying exercises every 30 minutes for all to see in front of her desk
* breathing my air

Maybe I should mention that I at work hold the unofficial title "High priest in the church of whine"

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[EnronHaliburton2004]

but there are few things more irratating & detremental to productivity than an angry/whiny co-worker.

An angry/whiny CEO is even more annoying. "I want it next week, and I want it done cheaper, better, faster. Now, I'm going to go play golf with other CEOs, get to work."

Somehow I doubt this anti-whining requirement applies to the management team

whining comes with the workplace, not the work...

[dindi]

you have to be in the office -> on time
to be on time, you need an ALAMR CLOCK -> worst creation ever, I mean I want to get up when my body tells me : "you got enough sleep" not when the BEEP BEEP BEEP starts.

On the other hand, unless you are the owner of the company, who in most cases makes the most money and drives the nicest car etc.. etc.. you will in many cases feel that life sucks. You might also hate some of your daily tasks. That is a reason to whine.

In a workplace you might not have such a cool office as some other more successful person - that is a reason to whine.

Then there are the folks who wanted to be "somebodies" and are sitting at a work they completely hate.

I am neither of these, but by some cultural mistake I always liked to whine or complain after a certain time at a workplace, be it salary, office environment, the secretary's boobs, the speed of my computer ..... in Hungary people like to whine a lot.....

Well I quit my jobs and moved to an other country and now run my own 1-man projects and I stopped whining.......

I also figured that MR Smith was right, and some humans find their pleasure in misery. Some people love to whine, and complain; that's their life and when everything goes OK, they somehow mess something up so they can whine. I talk to friends back at home, and at 35 they still whine about the same things and are willing to do nothing about it. I guess they enjoy it at the end.

I lost some friend to this, as I was sick of the "let's get a beer in a dark cheap bar and discuss how much our life sucks" events.

Well I guess you also have to find out if you like whining or like to do something about the things you want different.

Obligatory Simpsons ref

[homerthemoe]

So now the Germans are all smiles und sunshine? I'm confused...

From a recent session of Paranoia

[j0nb0y]

Player: Doesn't the computer want me to be happy?

GM: No. The computer *demands* that you be happy.

Work Visa in Germany

[putko]

I think you just need to be skilled at what you do. If they need the work to get done, someone will hire you to do it.

It is not magic.

Re:Work Visa in Germany

[stuckinkiel]

You are thinking like an American. In Germany, they have an extremely regimented education / work training system. For every possible job description there is a work training program (Berufausbilding) that takes between 2 and 4 years to complete. To qualify for a job, you must have a certificate (Schein) or you are not considered for that job. This is in contrast to the more flexible American system of on-the-job training, and is one if the reasons that the German economy continues to perform so poorly. The German work force is simply not allowed to be flexible.

Re:Work Visa in Germany

[putko]

Well, I'm only saying what my experience was.

Yes, it is very regimented in Germany. I got hired as a consultant by a guy who needed to get some work done. He pulled some strings and made it happen.

But he wasn't ethnic German, and he didn't care about rules; he cared about making money.

I got the feeling, from working in Germany, that if you really were the guy to hire (due to having needed, specialized skills --- e.g. kernel hacking), you got hired. And, by the way, the Kreisvervaltungsreferat was really easy about the work visa. I never had any problems with them. They just seemed to be going through the motions.

How to be happier on the job..

[Javaman59]

Step 1 - Count your blessings Step 2 - Stop complaining Step 3 - Stop thinking about complaining Step 4 - Stop complaining about those who complain It took a looooooong time, but it worked for me :)

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[rlauzon]

If an employee is angry/whiny, there is a reason.

While I will agree that when a normally pleasant employee is angry/whiny that there is a reason. It's not always true. Unfortunately, I've dealt with cow-orkers who seem to have complaining as their #1 task.

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[Billly Gates]

I think this solution sums it up more nicely in my book than to be all bubbly in a scary sort of way.

Vee hav VAYS off Makving you SMILE!

[Anonymous Coward]

Vrowning ist Verboten!

And who said that Germans didn't have a sense of humor?

I live in germany, I have seen this kind of bosses

[Anonymous Coward]

and I do not comply. It is deeply buried in our peoples soul to complain about just everything. If I was introduced to such a stupid rule, I would go to court. Freedom of speech is also a basic part of our law as well. I write as anonymous coward, because, I must fear my Boss just would implement this crap to piss me off. She (what a coincidence also a woman) hasn't been working for the company as long as I do, so I'm kind of in her way.
My Point is : No this is not typical for Germany, we freaking complain all the time. And we usually wil not let anyone let this take away from us. Who the hell does Mrs. Wonneberger think she is?

Whoa!

[rinkjustice]

Remember Deiter from "Sprockets" on Saturday Night Live? That's where the line "touch my monkey" is from. The boss of that German company kinda looks like Deiter, which triggered the flashback.

No need to get sicko perverted.

Reminds me of this quote:

[trurl7]

The floggings will continue until morale improves.

when was it

[seabreezemm]

When was it that a legitimate complaint became whining? Those that keep their mouths shut get run over, used and abused.

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[jcr]

I don't see why they couldn't just fire the whiner. Ability to get along with your co-workers is a perfectly valid criterion of job performance.

-jcr

Promotion?

[Anonymous Coward]

In the corporate world, anyone can be promoted over you.

What is this magical thing called 'promotion?'
I haven't worked for a single company that promotes staff anymore - you just hire cheap graduates to fill any position instead. The 'corporate ladder' died out in the 80s. The most you can hope for is that you move horizontally to another position, rather than being sacked, after your original job is outsourced. Usually, this requires a pay cut.

Of all my friends working for large corporations, none of them have any management opportunities at all. All managers are recruited from outside the company and have (usually) just come straight out of university. It's one of the biggest causes of most of the complaining and friction in almost every large company I'm aware of.

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[Ex-MislTech]

No one should need to leave, and supressing ppls freedom of speech
in the workplace is just the beginning .

Soon it will be politically correct to suppress it elsewhere .

If the person does not do their job that is one thing, but
for them to be silenced for expressing discontent over maltreatment
or inequality is a bad idea in my humble opinion .

Ex-MislTech

I like that idea!

[Anonymous Coward]

Now I'll be able to accuse my boss of violating the contract when he complains about my not sufficiently done work! ;-)

Alternative: STFU! and GBTW! (n/t)

[Anonymous Coward]

When you work for other people in order to make ends meet, this is what one faces practically everyday in today's hypercompetitive business environment. If you are 100% self-employed and making ends meet, count your blessings and keep on keeping on....

Food for thought.

P.S. Corporations hold allegiance to no one except the owners, stockholders, and any politicians that can secure them favorable legislation--everyone else is expendable!... :(

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[ari_j]

If qualified people left because the employer refuses to hire them without a cheerfulness term in their contract, then the companies that require such terms would go out of business.

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[ultranova]

If qualified people left because the employer refuses to hire them without a cheerfulness term in their contract, then the companies that require such terms would go out of business.

Unless all (or enough that there's less open jobs than there's employees) companies require such terms, in which case the employees will either agree to them or starve to death. It is good to have a monopoly on employment >:].

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[ari_j]

Somehow I doubt that this company has such a monopoly, or even enough market leverage to force anyone to smile who wasn't smiling already.

Reminds me of a TV commercial

[defile]

Commence relaxation... NOW!

Demotivation: sometimes the best solution to ...

[clayasaurus]

Demotivation: sometimes the best solution to morale problems is to fire all the unhappy people.

http://despair.com/demotivation.html

Sounds like they need a few of these posters ;)

MOD PARENT UP!!

[CaptainPinko]

no text

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[JemVai777]

Besides, no whinging means you can't complain about the PHB or you cow-orker while on the job

Ah yes, those legendary cow-orkers with their loads of bullshit...

Finally!

[Anonymous Coward]

Holy crap I hate complainers. Why, I remember the first such incident I heard a complaint, it all began in 1962... I wore an onion on my belt, which was the style at the time...

First thing that came to mind

[Captain DaFt]

After reading the article, the first thing that came to mind, was this:
http://www.crapville.com/toon_holder.asp?ID=179

re: just fire the whiner?

[King_TJ]

That's rarely a solution either, but places do that all the time already - despite not spelling out a "mandatory happiness" type of rule. The question you have to ask yourself is, why was this "whiner" hired in the first place, if he or she really exhibits such a constantly negative attitude? Most likely, he/she WASN'T initially that bad! Sometimes, all the complaining is an expression of "the squeaky wheel gets the oil" attitude. Something is wrong and needs fixing, and this is an employee who actually cares enough to keep griping - instead of sitting down, shutting iup, and letting the inefficiency, mis-management, or other issue continue.

To an extent, I think it depends on the type of job one holds, too. If you work in a customer service capacity, you obviously are expected to get along with and listen patiently to your customers. Not being able to do so means you're not performing your job properly. But in a number of office jobs, being a "team player" is highly overrated. People concentrating on getting their work done instead of chatting it up with all their cubicle-mates are more efficient.

Beatings..

[SmileeTiger]

Sounds just like:

"The beatings will continue until morale improves."

or the newer version:

"The meetings will continue until morale improves."

Re:Beatings..

[Bushido Hacks]

Isn't that from that new KMFDM album?

Well...

[TheSpoom]

They have succeeded again

Actung!

[Bushido Hacks]

I vill hear no more insinuations about the German people. Sie werden sich hinsetzen. Sie werden ruhig sein. Sie werden nicht beleidigen Deutschland. (You will sit down. You will shut up. You will not insult Germany.)

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[drewxhawaii]

there are few things more irratating than an angry/whiny co-worker

ironically, one of those things is an overly cheerful co-worker

Whow Cool

[Anonymous Coward]

Whow cool, lousy old software, a bag of marketing speech and a pack of lawyers that prosecutes all who dare to criticize. Fine.

You like?

[Bushido Hacks]

I Don't care if you like!

(I just had to say it again.)

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[Pollardito]

i can put on a fake smile with the best of them. i'm pretty sure that having all your coworkers smiling creepily is not a better thing than normal moodiness

Office Space

[Llywelyn]

Anyone else immediately think of the "flair" from Office Space?

Looping workplace conversation...

[pookemon]

10: PRINT "Awwwwww"
20: GET "Don't come in on Monday"
30: PRINT "Woohoo! Three day weekend!"
40: GET "See you on Monday"
50: GOTO 10

sounds like...

[Anonymous Coward]

Anyone here ever work as a Walt Disney World/Disneyland cast member? It's the same deal.

Ha!!

[catdevnull]

Germans? Cheerful? That is, indeed, funny.

His girlfriend gave up her, toe.

PRs summary of the policy

[Anonymous Coward]

You vill vork, and you vill like it!

Fuck you bitches

[gelfling]

kiss my ass.

Whoa, re whining. I know how to be professional.

[daaltje]

I have a hard time seeing why the responses are all whiners. (All that I read.)
    I know how to be objective and helpful. I know how to work with "what is". I know that life isn't always easy or the way I think I would design it for my own personal singular comfort and amusement. I have some flexibility and my Liver works.

    Let me quote from one of my teachers, "Don't complain to anybody who can't do anything about it."

    Either you get the picture or you don't. It's not about smiling, it's about being. Not being demanding and needy and co-dependent.
    Deal with it.

--- Consciousness is a goal and a process. --- (next I correct the sig)
        Consciousness is in the process, that is HOW you do it.

20 pieces of flair ...

[willtsmith]

Yes but that's really just a guidline. We're all sure the managers will be pointing out how happy harry has 50 pieces of flair and you must measure up.

Wah wah wah!

[Dwonis]

Shtarker! Zis iz KAOS! Ve don't "wah wah wah" here!

Babelfish + German "Be Happy"

[Easy2RememberNick]

Seien Sie glücklich!

  Good ole Babelfish (99% chance it's wrong though).

Re:Babelfish + German "Be Happy"

[dunkelfalke]

actually it is correct

No Germans at Nutzwerk

[dogbreathcanada]

Contractual cheerfulness? They might as well just fire all their German employees now.

Gender

[Nintendork]

"The plan was prompted by a female employee whose constant complaining prompted the other staff to complain about her complaining"

Other than sexism, was there a reason to point out that the individual is female?

Re:Gender

[Dread_ed]

How is it sexist to reveal someone's sex in a news story? I am sure that everyone who was involved in the situation knew without a shadow of a doubt that the person was female. The coworkers, the story writer, the parents of the coworkers probably as well, all knew that she was a "she." I even bet that the woman in question would proudly declare that she is a woman if asked. Why should the jornalist hide it? Is it not a fact? Is it not part of identifying with the person in the case?

Maybe the writer did it to try to generate some sympathy, maybe the writer did it to tug at the heartstrings fof other women who feel that they have been unfairly condemned for similar activity?

Maybe you feel is is sexism because you connect "complaining" and "female" or the subject of "undesirable characteristics" and "female" metally and feel that this one, single, insignificant case disparages all females and they need to be protected from the depredations of journalists everywhere? Of course that raises the question, do you hold women in such low regard that you think that something like this (mentioning that they are female!) will harm them irreperably?

However, have you considered that maybe the woman in question had something that was legitimate and valid to say? Maybe she was the only person who would stand up to the management and tell them the truth about what their sorry organization. Judging from the other posts about this company they probably needed some outspoken vocal criticism from within. The neutrality of the statement dosen't speak to the content of the complaints. However, when making an accusation of sexism it is best to assume the worst, right? It's sexist because the writer is trying to attach some invalid form of action and methodology of thought to the female persona, right?

Sorry, but whan I see a simple declaration of fact that is obvious to anyone who witnessed the events in question referred to as "sexist" or "rascist" it makes me question the individual making the claim. She made no attempt to hide her sexual identity, why should anyone else?

Or do you think it would be more proper to say a "nondescript individual having no discernable external sexual identificaion, nor bearing any resemblance to any racial group that you could identify was unreliably reported to be possibly saying things at their workplace that someone might possibly construe as complainig." Ahhh, fact filled journalism at it's finest. Strawmen and sarcasm aside, a woman is a woman, a man is a man, and it's a fact, a detail, not a sexist manifesto, to mention it.

A better question is what about this person being a female immediately inspires you to think that it is sexism when someone mentions her sex? I have never heard such comments when the person in question is a man. Ever. /end anti-sexism rant

Re:Gender

[Nintendork]

How about something like:

"The plan was prompted by an employee whose constant complaining prompted the other staff to complain about her complaining"

It's not that they revealed the gender of the employee. It's in the way that they did it. There was absolutely no reason to say "a female employee". How about if they said "An employee with freckles"? Does that add anything to the story? Is it relevant to the situation? Even if the writer was raising awareness that the employee was female to gain sympathy, it's sexism just like affirmative action is racism.

*Ring Ring....*

[SeaFox]

Hello Boss?

Yeah, I'm just calling in to say I wont be in today.
I just don't feel very cheerful, and since being chipper is a contractual obligation, I'm not fit for work right now. Besides, I wouldn't want to bring everyone else at the office down, moods are contagious.

So I'll see you tomorrow then, bye.
[click]

Since it's sunny and 82 degrees out, after a day at the beach I should be feeling a lot more cheerful so I'll be in great shape for work tomorrow!

This is exactly why..

[Anonymous Coward]

I am a Libertarian.

Seriously, I'm tired of all these stupid rules and laws such as the Jolly Law that we have to follow.

Pretty soon we won't be human.

Nutzwerk, Ltd.??? lol... the name says it all!!

[v3xt0r]

I figure it would be a contractual obligation to be insane if you take a job there.

Sounds like that is just a pre-requisite for the interview?

Been there done that

[Hal9000_sn3]

A place I worked started firing people that called in sick, that were seen to be out and about the day they called in. The offense was 'falsifying company records'. But, there was no reason to claim to be ill in order to use paid time off. So, I called in and told my boss I was 'feeling too well to come in' and that I would be in the next day 'if I am not feeling so good'.

Apparently the cow-orkers that were near his desk heard him mumble something about someone calling in that needed a mental health day.

What ever.

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[MarkKnopfler]

I have also encountered people in my professional life who continually whine not because THEY are miserable but they want to make YOU feel miserable for the present situation that you are in. Slightly sadistic actually. With time you learn to see through their words.

so what?

[YesIAmAScript]

I feel sorry for the woman. She shouldn't be discriminated against, she should be able to get any job she is capable of doing.

But she isn't capable of doing this one.

Equal opportunity means that. It doesn't mean a free pass for something you can't do.

I hope they offered her other positions at the company.

I have to say having RTFA now, it seems like they'll have a tougher time of it than my explanation makes it out. If she couldn't smile, why did they keep her on for a couple years, then fire her? But I stand by my statement that just you don't deserve compensation for being fired for not doing a job that has requirements you cannot satisfy. I mean, it is well known that people with disabilities cannot do every job able-bodied people can. If this weren't the case, there'd be no Social Security money paid to disabled people.

Re:so what?

[Bodhammer]

So what you are saying is "The bleatings will continue until morale improves"?

I don't think you're happy enough!

[ken-guru]

Happy happy joy joy, happy happy joy...

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[Lucractius]

Hey thats MY title give it back... you didnt earn it fairly... I demand you give it to me ! ... everyone likes you more... its not fair!

Stifling emotions

[FreakUnique]

I'm a designer. It's my job to design. To design you must be able to feel what the client wants from talking to them. The client doesn't always know what they want. When they do it's often a big bonus and help. To feel you must have emotions. To stifle emotions would be to stifle the design. If the design was stifled then every site would look the same. Anyways even out of a designing environment, emotions are the result of a cause. Sadness happens because something sad happened like a death in the family, Anger happens because someone did something rude like nearly t-bone you on a roundabout. To effectively deal with emotions you must deal with the root cause. This is where medicine is going wrong. If you're not sleeping right it's usually because something is praying on your mind. Instead of the doctor finding out what is bugging you they shove pills down your throat. Trust me they do this. It's happened to me and the side effects stank worse then a US state full to bursting point with fresh manure. Please excuse the length of this post but that is why emotions are so important.

Not even a real IT company

[Anonymous Coward]

Their products appear to be stuff like an "Internet Speed Booster", and "Safer Surfing" (yeah, right!). Given the timing of their attacks on the FFII, and the amount of money they seem prepared to spend on lawsuits, I believe they are a bunch of scamming scumbags who take money from anyone, without too many moral concerns. Most probably a large chunk of their money comes from certain large US interests who are known to want patents and have spent a lot on European firms willing to stand up as "pro-patent". Problem is, not a single *real* European software company except the few very large ones wants patents. So the cash has had to go to scammers and scumbags like these shining examples. /Posting anonymously to avoid being sued

What's discrimination

[k2r]

>But she isn't capable of doing this one.

Well, I'm sorry bothering you, but what you do is exactly what discrimination is.

You have absolutely no clue how she did her job.
The fact that she worked as a food presenter having this medical condition for many years MIGHT be a hint that she did a good job.

You conclude from her physical status that she did a bad job because she isn't a blonde 1.80m high 20yo girl who smiles like an idiot.

On an even more subjective note: I'd personally alway prefer somebody competent and friendly telling me something about her products than a beautiful drone trying to distract me of them.

And "friendly" is as much in voice and habitus as in grinning until your face hurts.
This may be a cultural difference.

k2r

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[Anonymous Coward]

One of the few things that is, is being inexplicably excessively cheerfuly...

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[darthmundt]

Unless all (or enough that there's less open jobs than there's employees) companies require such terms, in which case the employees will either agree to them or starve to death. It is good to have a monopoly on employment >:].

Technically this is known as a MONOPSONY. See the wiki article for a detailed description.

"In economics, a monopsony is a market form with only one buyer, called "monopsonist", facing many sellers. It is an instance of imperfect competition, symmetrical to the case of a monopoly, in which there is only one seller facing many buyers....."http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Monopsony

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[Random Walk]

This is Germany. It's not easy to fire anyone over here for any reason short of 'we're closing shop', or some really major issue (murdering your co-workers may qualify ;).

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[flyinwhitey]

"Because emotions aren't something that one can always control with impunity?"

Perhaps, but whining is a behavior, not an emotion.

I sincerely hope the follow up isn't a post dedicated to how difficult it is to control one's own behavior...

"IME emotions - both good and bad - spark thought, and thought leads to greater productivity."

I don't think the research is as conclusive on this as you seem to think. If you would care to show me the studies that support your point, we could discuss them in more detail.

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[flyinwhitey]

"No one should need to leave, and supressing ppls freedom of speech
in the workplace is just the beginning ."

When has freedom of speech ever applied to the workplace?

I don't understand why people are citing rights they never had as an argument in this case.

job requirement: smiles

[YesIAmAScript]

She can't smile, she can't do the job.

Q.E.D.

I never said she did a bad job, you inserted that yourself.

No, it doesn't mean she can't be friendly. No, it doesn't mean she can't sell food like a champ.

What it does mean is she can't fill the job description.

It doesn't mean the company isn't making a mistake removing her from this job.

If what I am doing is discrimination, then not hiring very nice, very smart 300lb people with flying experience as flight attendants because they can't fit down the aisles is also discrimination. The Air Force not hiring people over 6'4" as pilots because they don't fit in the cockpits is discrimination. CostCo not hiring blind people as forklift drivers because they can't maneuver them around is discrimination.

Re:job requirement: smiles

[k2r]

Thanks for answering.

> She can't smile, she can't do the job
> What it does mean is she can't fill the job description.

I can't find the exact job description in the article, but even if "flex your mouth for at least 30 degrees" was in - this woman was not APPLYING for a job at Sam's but worked there since 1984.
She did - whatever she did - quite good, because she earned full benefits until 2003.

Sam's Club bought the shop in 1993 - 10 years before she was fired, 9 years after she started working there and AFTER the medical treatment caused her physical condition.

Sam's Club didn't fire her then - instead she reached full benefits at least in 2003, maybe before (we don't know).

So it looks as if she did her job well for many years after she lost her smile.
Either suddenly the job requirements changed and they are trying to get rid of employees that don't fit anymore - bad sam.
Or they fired her because "Her demonstration cart and microwave oven toppled over on her[...].[She] filed a workers' compensation claim.[...]" - very bad sam.

Your points (fat flight attendent, huge AF-pilots) do not work because she was already employed there and her condition was basically the same since >10 years.

k2r

The floggings will continue...

[Kelson]

...until morale improves.

MOD PARENT INFORMATIVE

[Medievalist]

It's like, got links and stuff.

One Reason?

[jgoemat]

To get more lonely slashdotters to click on the link hoping to see a picture of a female?

Re:Cheerfulness as a contractual obligation...

[jcr]

If you can't ever fire anyone, I'd expect that the "we're closing shop" situation must come up frequently.

-jcr

I do concede the oddness of this example

[YesIAmAScript]

That was in my original post. Not sure why you need to go two rounds to try to hammer one of my points home to me.

I was talking about the princple in general, then this case in specifics. It doesn't sound like we disagree on this case in specific, it does seem suspicious they waited so long to remove her if she couldn't fulfill her job requirements.

But that's all for the lawyers to decide. My main point was about job requirements and equal opportunity not meaning job guarantees.

Sounds like...

[Tellalian]

Someone has a case of the Muundays.