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Why Japan Hates the iPhone
Ponca City, We love you writes "With a high level of technical sophistication, critical customers, and high innovation rate, Japan is the toughest cell phone market in the world. So it's not surprising that although Apple is the third-largest mobile supplier in the world, selling 10 million units in 2008, in Japan the iPhone is selling so poorly it's being offered for free. The country is famous for being ahead of its time when it comes to technology, and the iPhone just doesn't cut it. For example, Japanese handset users are into video and photos — and the iPhone has neither a video camera, multimedia text messaging, nor a TV tuner. Pricing plans in Japan are also very competitive, and the iPhone's $60-and-up monthly plan is too high compared to competitors; a survey lat year showed that among Japanese consumers, 91% didn't want to buy an iPhone. The cellular weapon of choice in Japan would be the Panasonic P905i, a fancy cellphone that doubles as a 3-inch TV and features 3-G, GPS, a 5.1-megapixel camera, and motion sensors for Wii-style games. 'When I show this to visitors from the US, they're amazed,' according to journalist Nobi Hayashi, who adds, 'Carrying around an iPhone in Japan would make you look pretty lame.'"
In Japan, only old people use iPhones?
Taking guns away from the 99% gives the 1% 100% of the power.
Oh no, it has become self-aware!
Swedish plasma phys. PhD student; MSc EE; knows maths, programming, electronics; finance interest; seeks opportunities
After all, what's japanese for "but it's shiny and pretty and I WANT ONE NOW
politicians are like babies' nappies: they should both be changed regularly and for the same reasons
Japanese products have been so over-the-top and over-engineered for the past 25 years, this hardly comes as any surprise. I mean, just take a look at the current Honda Civic dashboard and compare it to a German car's dashboard. The Honda is all gadget-y and digital-y and the German car is just, well, Teutonic-ly svelte. Maybe the saying "there's no accounting for bad taste" doesn't ring true in Japan.
For one, the Japanese are well ahead of the West in terms of cellphone technology, as witnessed by the description of the P905i. For the Japanese, the 3G iPhone is old hat.
In addition, unlike in the U.S., where we love Japanese products, the Japanese hate our products. They're very biased towards home-grown stuff. They typically steer clear of imports. Imports are generally more expensive in Japan due to tariffs and such, too.
Have you ever noticed that they speak some strange version of the Mexican language and look unlike us? Also their food is expensive because we eat cows which are large, plentiful and docile animals, while Japanise people only eat fearsome and rare SHARKS to boast of their manliness. In conclusion, Japan is a far away place somewhere in Mexico where smart people do not eat cows. Thank you will you marry me.
Why don't we get these type of phones in Europe or the US? I think we have a large market as well and some of these phones would be welcomed. Instead we're stuck with crappy phones and the iPhone is nearly the best well known product we can get. Where is our 3G? Where is our full speed internet and cable tv on a phone?
Custom electronics and digital signage for your business: www.evcircuits.com
The iPhone is inferior in lots of ways. It has NO stereo bluetooth support! It also lacks bluetooth IP networking for tethering to your laptop, and it doesn't use the standard USB mini-B cable.
The iPhone needs a lot of improvement before I would consider it.
A slashdotter who didn't build his own computer is like a Jedi who didn't build his own lightsaber.
The iPhone is not currently able to compete with the Japanese technology!
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http://google.blogozz.com/2009/02/27/blogger-connects-to-google-friend-connect/
While I love the iPhone and think it's damn cool, things like this are (to me) just another piece of proof that the North American (and western society, in general) cell phone markets are set up to discourage innovation and advancement and are, instead, designed to ensure lock-in with particular vendors and suppliers. We _NEED_ regulators to step in and start putting companies in their places. That will open up innovation and encourage manufacturers to make better products to compete for consumer dollars. Also, regulators need to force carriers to provide better plans at reasonable rates. But, since a lot of people are getting rich off of the current stifling system, I won't be holding my breath for that sort of change to happen... We will continue to remain behind the times.
Because the Japanese are smarter than Americans.
Everyone still drools over the iPhone as if it has every feature of every phone and more! When it's just an on par smart device. Sure it has a lot of great features and the app store from apple, but there are far better phones in existence and its sure not going to get people who are being described as the peak of technological civilization(true or not).
I am happy with my HTC Vogue, it plays music...and has internet...I think it even makes calls...oh wait its the sprint network...so no, no calls...
Apple makes cell phones now?
The Panasonic phone runs Linux.
It's also buggy as hell (as all Japanese phones are), but I suppose if 3 inches of Japanese TV gives you a woody, get a plane ticket, man.
and features 3-G, GPS, a 5.1-megapixel camera, and motion sensors for Wii-style games. 'When I show this to visitors from the US, they're amazed,'
Android G1 owners wouldn't be "amazed". After all, it they are describing a G1.
apple wasnt able to sell a product on the premise of being 'hip' and 'cool' for once. japanese preferred function over cool factor. hipster ads didnt cut it. to the extent that apple didnt see any issues with offering the phone almost free with various subscriptions. all the while customers in u.s. being locked in, tortured, and belittled if they wanted to do more with their phone by unlocking it, after paying exorbitant amounts. there's nothing to defend about apple - only way one can do this in this thread and subject, would be probably due to sheer fanboyism. bad. fanboyism is little different from religious fundamentalism.
Read radical news here
...seriously, why don't people just either burn their money or donate it directly to Apple? No flash? No Java? Apple decides whether or not someone can sell/distribute an application? Have to buy a Crapintosh to develop for it?
Why do people accept this kind of behavior from Apple, but not other companies? Weird...
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They don't like the iPhone because it doesn't have 100 tentacles that spring out of it and rape every school girl within a hundred feet. Also, there's no Bukake Cartridge so you can squirt your friends. Isn't it obvious how far we are behind the Japanese in innovation? If I want to violate a girl with my iPhone I have to put it on vibrate, stick it into her nether region, and keep calling myself.
>Carrying around an iPhone in Japan would make you look pretty lame.
Correct me if I'm wrong but carrying around an iphone anywhere is going to make you look pretty lame.
I could be wrong but I thought AC was making an attempt at a South Park reference. Apparently mod(s) agrees with you.
I can't believe you don't know what a Hasemalphaginnojinglanaporphomism is.
"'Carrying around an iPhone in Japan would make you look pretty lame.'"
God, how I wish I could get that Japanese cellphone with built-in 3" TV (Panasonic P905i) because I've always chosen cellphones out of regard of what Japanese teenagers might think of me! :-p
Sorry, I'll just stick with the iPhone, and upgrade to a phone based on Android when it matures. I would have love to have gone with an openmoko phone but that platform was pretty much stillborn. :(
Japanese cellphones are way way ahead of ours? Next thing you know, you'll be telling us that third-world countries have faster interweb access than we do - without bandwidth caps. This is old news.
The Christian Right is Neither (Christian nor right). See: Matthew 23, Matthew 25, Ezekiel 16:48-50
"Japan is immune to Reality Distortion Field"
The Japanese are buying a list of features: screen size, TV, radio, motion sensors, pedometer, email, circle of protection etc etc. A lot of tech-heads in the West like that approach and also make their decision based on the number of ticked boxes on the back of the display container.
The rest of us just want a phone that makes phone calls without having to click through 50 damn menus. And that looks kind of nice. That's the iPhone.
Classical Liberalism: All your base are belong to you.
The user "twitter" is a twitter sockpuppet.
Outside of North America, the iPhone and other popular phones in North America (like Black Berry, G1, Windows Mobile phones, etc) are just another phone. People prefer other phones. In countries that use GSM, Nokia is still the king. In places, like countries like Japan and South Korea, the reason why the iPhone is not popular there is that the dominant cellphone network standard in use is not compatible with the iPhone (which uses GSM).
Take-off every
multimedia text messaging
Japan has never even used "text messaging" as in the horribly lame and limited SMS - they use normal email for that. I don't think anybody is missing some kludgy extension to a protocol they never used in the first place, either.
Softbank is now offering the 8GB iPhone for free (with two year data plan). I saw this yesterday, and translated a quick summary on my site for the Japanese language-challenged: http://www.davejenkins.com/
davejenkins.com |
Japan is unique in the fact that it's a sizeable market. Most western companies have attempted to market products there and failed. The only market that does well is American and European fashion.
I think this has to do with a little bit of NIH (not invented here) and poor understanding of the country. Hell even Microsoft with billions of dollars sunk into the XBox marketing can't make a dent there and there is only 2 competitors. On the other hand Sony did so poorly in the international mobile market they had to team up with Ericcson to bail them out. Product marketing in Japan is like the LOST bubble. We can't seem to get in and they can't seem to get out.
http://omoshiroi.info/omoblog/index.php/2007/08/04/konata_s_cell_phone
From the link:
Rundown of the basic specs:
Width: 50mm
Length: 111mm
Weight: 143g
Displays: 3.0" Main LCD, 0.8" Sub LCD
Cameras: 2.0MP main camera, 0.1MP secondary camera (video conferencing)
It also has a built in FM transmitter (for the car), a DVR mode for recording broadcasts, and a whole list of neat features that are pretty much standard on Japanese phones these days. Meanwhile, my phone is 4 years old and was obsolete when I got it. It can hardly make calls these days. I need a new one...
Oh, by the way, this phone was from 2 years ago. In Japan, it's already obsolete. Eat your heart out, Steve Jobs! X-3
I'll be honest, I own an iPhone so I'm a bit biased here, but this Japanese P905-whatever may have every feature under the sun, but it doesn't change the fact that it looks clumsy and (I'm assuming), like all Japanese phones it has a buggy non-intuitive mess of an OS.
Sure, I wish my iPhone had A2DP/HDTV/Satellite Whatever, but sometimes I just want to
get things done without being flashed by a bunch of LEDs
Kanji input on the iPhone is as good as the other cell phones. Given that text messaging is a major use for cell phones, this is a big problem.
The UI on the iPhone blows away Japanese cell phones (I live in Japan and I use them all the time). The reason the iPhone isn't taking off as well in Japan is the kanji support and Softbank's piss poor marketing support. They have not done a good job of differentiating the iPhone from the other touch screen phones and, in fact, SoftBank carries several other touch screen phones which is confusing.
with the switch to digital tv signals in the usa this month, putting a receiver in cellphones for that signal is a no brainer
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
Although the Japanese and a number of Asian countries are "ahead of us" (read USA) when it comes to technology, most Americans I know of still regard the USA to be the most technologically advanced country in the world. It baffles me.
Just last week, I was in Shanghai and I can say that from the Magnetic Levitation train to the technology that runs and manages public transit, those folks are way ahead of us.
When I rode the subway in New York on return to USA, you could not blame me for thinking I am in a country of the fifties. What's happened to the USA?
Why do others (America especially) put up with old technology? It didn't take me a week to realize the iPhone was nothing more than a gateway to the iTunes store with a touch screen an accelerometer and some basic phone features.
The Panasonic P905i wouldn't appeal to me at all. I really don't think of a cell phone that doubles as a portable TV is particularly innovative; I think it's rather sad.
I saw this all over Japan, people watching TV on the subway... and meanwhile the Internet access and web capabilities of this phone, and others in Japan, are quite poor relative to what the iPhone or G1 can do.
I'm sorry, but being able to watch live TV on a cell phone is not "OMG, it's so advanced, I want it" in my book.
'Carrying around an iPhone in Japan would make you look pretty lame.'
It doesn't do much for your reputation in the U.S. either...
I like to use the old Bluetooth headset analogy.
Old Techie: "You know how lumberjacks will sometimes put a big red X on trees?"
Young Techie (who is wearing a bluetooth headset): "Like, yeah."
O.T.: "That big red X is a sign to other lumberjacks that the tree bearing it needs to be culled from the population."
Y.T.: "Culled. That's not really a word, is it?"
O.T.: "The bluetooth headset is the human equivalent."
/s/bluetooth\ headset/iPhone/g
"I'm just here to regulate funkiness."
well... they may be selling panties in vending machines but there's still some wisdom left in Japan... iphone is after all just a toy in comparison to many phones out there and only people using it are either too stupid to use anything more sophisticated or simply do not need any more than iphone has to offer; that is fair enough but there's no point calling iphone high-end imnsho; and don't get me wrong, i'm not saying that it's not a good (for some) product or it's not innovative, it's simply not as awesome as many people may seem to believe
Coulda fooled me. I'm pretty active with the Japanese community on campus where I go to school (including having a Japanese roommate) and a lot of them are going to Softbank as soon as they go back home to take advantage of the free iPhone deal.
Japan's culture of usability is "different" from ours to say the least.
Having worked in the electronics industry, I can tell you that Japanese users place high value on features and technical complexity. Mastering a technically complex device is viewed as an accomplishment.
Look at some of the electronics designed for the Japanese market - rows and rows of tiny buttons, incomprehensible menus, difficult to read displays; then look at electronics designed for the US market - touch screens, big legible fonts and buttons, simple - easy to navigate menus.
(Most of) western society places a high value on ease of use over functionality. Apple does very well in those markets. Japanese culture is very detail oriented and places value on technical complexity and function.
It's a culture thing, and Apple needs to understand that if they want to succeed in the Japanese market.
-ted
Android phones? Johnny-come-latelies. The Nokia N95 was massively superior in many regards at European iPhone launch (even compared to its later 3G re-launch), but Europe doesn't really consider technical capabilities in what's 'cool'. Nor price (the N95 deals were also much better).
Apple is in absolutely no way the "third-largest mobile supplier in the world".
Not even close.
The top are: Nokia (40%), Samsung (14%), Motorola (14%), Sony Ericsson (9%) and LG (7%). Apple is well down in the single digits.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mobile_phone
On the other hand they have captured a surprisingly large share of the revenue, but only because the iPhone is a high margin product and they don't compete in the high volume area.
How do I mod the entire nation of Japan down as trolls?
The tailgate on my 89 Ford LTD Wagon does the same thing. I don't know about the TV tuner, though...
Apple is not even top 5, although they did make the top 10. Last time i checked, USA was not the whole world...
There, fixed that for you.
Saying your "phone ran out of batteries" is like saying your "car ran out of gas tanks".
They gave their lives only to become a nation of dudes with man purses. If they only knew before. Or maybe they saw it coming and decided death was better.
iPhone is popular in Japan, but the market works against it: It's carried by Softbank, the #3 player in the market after Docomo and au. Softbank's market share means that the #1-selling phone on the Softbank network for any particular month is around #25 among all phones in Japan. For most new phones, the peak sales period is the first 6 weeks after release. After that, the numbers plummet. In contrast, iPhone has been Softbank's best-selling phone month after month. The only product I've identified with a similar sales profile is Softbank's 815T, a Toshiba product with replaceable covers that has been selling in reasonable numbers for around a year. Therefore, in terms of the market available to it (i.e. Softbank subscribers), the iPhone is a very successful product. It does miss many features Japanese take for granted, such as 1seg, but it succeeds despite that. In Japan, form over function can win through.
i have a blackberry with built in gps
the gps is disabled. why? because verizon wants me to buy their retarded cell phone tower triangulation location service for $10/ month. the gps chip is sitting right on my phone. free. locked. i downloaded the free gmail app (amazing they let me do that, huh?), and all i can do is a get a rough approximation of my location. i've got the hardware, on the phone, to get the free signal. and verizon won't let me
fucking evil, fucking retarded. it does nothing, dear verizon, except fill me with a burning hatred for you
now i can understand a cell company competing with the services of another cell company, and blocking this or that signal that is a PAID service
but when they go out and start squashing well-established FREE signal services, WHEN THE HARDWARE TO GET IT IS ALREADY ON THE FUCKING PHONE, i begin to channel my inner communist. that is the most evil retarded bullshit there is. free market business practices at their most evil
so i agree with you, i can see them blocking the free hdtv digital signals. 100% possible
the only redoubt i can consider is that, being a free market, t-mobile, sprint, etc., should unlock free gps and unlock free tv signals, if they aren't already, and make a marketing bonanza on that fact
you'd see verizon quickly lose customers, and quietly reverse their fucking evil shit sucking behavior
they already lost me, i totally hate them for that, and have told them in no uncertain terms
evil motherfuckers. blocking free gps in order to sell me their half assed triangulation service. the hardware is already built into THE DAMN PHONE you fucking asswipes
die you sleazy shitsucking verizon, die
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
When I found out that the iPhone lacked MMS I couldn't help but laugh. No MMS? Seriously? How can a mobile phone be released and not support that oh so basic functionality. Every single phone released has MMS but not the iPhone. Why exactly?
Why America hates the iphone? Simple answer AT&T!
I wanted an iphone but refused to do business with AT&T. Recently I was comparing rates between my provider Tmobile and AT&T because Tmobile does not yet have the Blackberry Bold.
My current rate plan is $60 a month and the equivalent rate plan with AT&T is over $160 because they nickle and dime you do death. AT&T's business model is to get exclusive deals on handsets in the hope that consumers will be so obsessed with the handsets they will forget all about their overpriced service. I will be keeping my Blackberry Curve.
This is the main reason why our Cellular market is so uncompetitive. In Europe you buy a handset and then shop for a provider. The handset lock in allows providers to sell their overpriced services and force you to buy one of "their" crippled handsets because of the customized firmware.
And of course since America has the best government system money can buy the Telco's have politicians bought out so that this monopolistic anti competitive behavior will continue forever keeping us behind the curve so that our "cutting edge" phones like the iphone get laughed at by the world market.
FFS, the iPhone isn't "free" in Japan, and probably close to no phone is anywhere in the world. The cost is just spread by the subscription fee over a number of months.
I'm sure they would pick one up if it was actually free, I for sure would.
I hate all the morons which says "omg the G1 / iPhone / Nokia N82 / whatever" isn't expensive, I only paid bla bla... Idiots, please go kill yourself.
I also hate all the fucking ads which mentions the price you pay when you receiver the phone and not the total price.
I'm sure you could get a Hummer for $1 to if you accept to pay $2.000.000 / year for the next five years. Omg! Free car! Take one! ...
Not weird your economy is fucked up if you can't even understand the freaking phone isn't free.
Even the phone which I got for free from T-Mobile, has a built in camera. With the iphone supposed to be an advanced device I do find it quite pathetic it lacks such a common feature. I never really like iphone because its closed platform nature and fisher price design.
Not trying to troll but I think it is not just phone's or technology. Americans are less fashion oriented in my experience (I am an american). This does not suprise me. I find the iphone nice but also a bit lacking.
The Japanese word transliterated "kawaii" is usually translated "cute" in dictionaries, and is composed of two kanji (borrowed Chinese characters), the first meaning "to be able to, to be allowed to" and the second meaning "to love" or "love". The Chinese word written the same way (ke3 ai4) is also translated as "cute" and the implied meaning from the order of the characters/words is "loveable".
Yes, that would most likely be the word used by Japanese tweenies and teenaged (and even older) ladies. Just remember, this is the nation and culture that brought us "Hello Kitty".
Actually, and surprisingly, the Xbox 360 has outsold the Wii and the PS3 for the past 4 weeks. That could simply be explained away by every gamer in Japan already owning a Wii, and nobody anywhere being particularly excited for the PS3, but it's still a pretty interesting development.
Comment of the year
I'm no expert in the Japanese cell market but as far as I am informed they have a huge competitive market for mobile applications ranging from astrology calendars to serious navigation apps or multimedia functionality. Stepping onto that turf in a software NaziTunes/AppSStore uniform is probably not the very best argument to sell devices.
The Japanese cell market sounds a lot like the Korean market, which makes me think that it's not just "features instead of UI" that makes the Japanese dislike the iPhone, but instead the UI itself. In Korea, when someone wants to get a specific feature of his cell phone, which may be through several "ugly" list menus, he flips open the phone, takes about a quarter second to hit the memorized sequence of hotkeys for menu choices on his hardware keypad without looking at the phone, and by the time he gets it out of his pocket and up to his head the feature is waiting for him. An American with an iPhone will take five more seconds to navigate through pretty menus to get to the same thing. The iPhone looks more friendly and advanced, but the guy with the archaic lists navigates his UI 10x faster. Even Americans, at least the more techy ones, can get used to their phones to the extent that the UI which looks clunky to us at first actually _works_ much better for them than an iPhone's can.
"I zero-index my hamsters" - Willtor (147206)
...that a particular American product isn't cutting it in the land of the rising sun. These days, there's only four things America does better than the rest of the world: music, movies, microcode, and high-speed pizza delivery.
AT&T is the problem with the iPhone. If I could get an iPhone with Verizon service I would have bought every generation so far.
-fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
I knew the American consumer was being screwed when I got a 5 year old model cellphone at 4 times the price plus an exorbident 2 year contract after coming back from Japan. It's a scam and one that is hurting us as a nation.
The reasons cited (aside from the TV tuner -- who needs that?) were the same reasons I passed on the iphone. I keep hearing about coolness and "the experience" on the "jesus phone" but beyond the GUI -- seriously, now -- it's a mediocre phone, even by American standards, let alone what they have over there. I suspect the difference between their consumers and ours is that ours are more likely to buy into mindshare. Hmm. Maybe that's why in so many cases they're the producers, and we're the consumers.
Oliver's law of assumed responsibility: If you're seen fixing it, you will be blamed for breaking it.
I guess it's all marketing strategy failure. Each different countries have different needs, habits and interest. The marketer should now their market first. There's no point, for instance, selling woolen sweater in tropical countries.Or just targetting to sell IPhone to a certain market niche. Btw, i wonder if they really sell it for free.. I could fly there lolz
This is all wrong. In Japan they have two distinct internets, which are not compatible with eachother: the regular internet, which we are used to, and the "keitai" (mobile) web. It's my understanding that the Japanese public mostly cares about the Keitai web, which is packed full of proprietary technologies. The iPhone, following global standards is completely incompatible with the Keitai web, and thus is why people don't want it.
There are a lot of American things that seem to be chic in Japan, but technology has never really been one of them. It's like trying to impress a German with your precision-engineered American luxury car or something.
10 PRINT CHR$(205.5+RND(1)); : GOTO 10
Simple Explanation: Star Ocean 4
You'll probably see a similar phenomenon when Dragon Quest 10 (eventually) comes out for the Wii.
Check out the dash of the Nissan GT-R:
http://gizmodo.com/gadgets/cars/nissans-gt+r-data+dense-dashboard-explained-324672.php
Compare the GT-R dash with the dash of the Corvette ZR-1:
http://www.automobilemag.com/reviews/chevrolet/0802_2009_chevrolet_corvette_zr1/photo_03.html
Or this radio made and sold in Japan (its a bit older, but it illustrates the point):
http://japan-auto-sound.com/images/206-0606_IMG.jpg
I was not apologizing for Apple - I was faulting them for their lack of understanding Japanese culture and what the Japanese value in usability and functionality. They may need to design different phones for different markets if they wish to succeed in those markets.
-ted
I lived in Japan for about 4 years so i own like 5 different cellphones. these Cellphones are sold like GUM in the U.S. But now that i compare any of my old cellphones to my iphone they are not even close to my new apple device. My IPHONE does have a videorecorder! it can send MMS messeges !!!! The resoulution is amazing IT IS NOT A fake 10mega pixels!!!! YES! JAPAnese has some good ideas that our cellphones companies do not have! like TV , Using ur Cellphone as ur debit card. and live news broadcasting right into your palm/ BUT THE IPHONE COULD DO ALL THIS AND MORE IF ATT or VERIZON had this kind of broadcasting. now the true about cellphones in japan is that ..
yeah they are cool cellphones but they feel sooo cheap becuase they come up with a newone every month. they are not as easy to use and as powerfull as the iphone.
Japanese people are just pissed cuz the iphone could be named the best cellphone ever the start of a new generation of cellphones!
GET OVER IT JAPANASE PEOPLE!!!! APPLE MADE A FCkIN KICK ASS PHONE!
Whenever I see an iphone user, I see somebody who is into Femdom, BDSM - somebody who gets pleasure from being tortured. And so far, not a single iphone user I know have been able to give me a good enough reason why they so much love their phone to prove me wrong.
I loved that part in Sixteen Candles where you go, "No more yankeee my wankee. The Donger needs food!"
If anyone is qualified to comment on the contrast between American and Japanese cultures, it's this famous exchange student.
Seth
$5 / month hosted VPS on linux = awesome!
I happen to live n Japan and I also own an iPhone.
Sure Japanese phones have a lot of features that the iPhone doesn't have: better camera, mobile payment system, video calls...
However regarding MMS for instance, Japan is a civilized country and as such they've been using using emails on phones for years.
What's dumb on the iPhone for Japan is not the lack of MMS but the presence of SMS!
Regarding the iPhone being lame in Japan, it is the exact opposite of my experience. Almost all the Japanese who have seen my iPhone were impressed by it, even compared to local standards.
The reasons not to buy it in Japan: no mobile payment, the carrier who offers it (Softbank) doesn't have the best reputation, emoji (pictural characters) are mostly incompatible with other phones/carriers.
Again, one last time, to me the reason the iPhone blew away everybody when it came out is ONLY because it had the first mobile useable full web browser. I've seen a lot of crazy features on Japanese phones, but never that simple one.
1. like i knew they did that beforehand
2. uh yeah, i'm a l33t hardware hacker extraordinaire, like everyone else, and have the 50 hours a week to tinker
3. who said i was venting to make a difference? i was respinding to a guy's point in an ongoing internet thread, like hanging out in a bar. why do my words have to have some sort of utility expected of them? to turn your question on yourself: why the hell are you venting?
in short, fuck off
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
From his post (warning: Strong Language):
"There you have it: the most objective comparison of two cellphones ever made. I think I'll take the rest of the afternoon off and copy and paste text on my cellphone because I can"
http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=iphone
Wow. All you're english anal-agies are getting way to much for me!
...on 45+ GBP per-month plans.
Not quite the same as "giving it away", but the plans are decent and the hardware is free.
fuck you verizon
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
While I dont anymore, I used to live and work in japan (first went there around 2000), and im really not that supprised.
As someone else said, there is a certain amount of nationalism (buy Japanese!), but its really not as bad in the corporate work culture as people make out, they promote the best people for the job (gaijin or not), but its hard to be the best person for the job when your competing against the japanese who are willing to do 18hrs a day to get ahead.
Now the japanese are ahead of the rest of the world in electronic gadgets - true, but computing wise, they're quite a bit behind (because of nationalism mostly).
However, when it comes to mobile phones, the japanese were doing email and had data connections to their phones (in the hdspa range) when the rest of the world were doing WAP, SMS and that first data technology (GPRS?). For me when i first arrived it was techno-culture shock because they had these amazing gadgets we only dreamed of, while computers were slow and felt like antiques.
But the defining characteristic of any japanese phones is the ability to input text (japanese) well - not something i imagine the iphone does. They also are able to install anything they want on their phones - again, not something you can do on an iphone. But it doesn't end there. There are so many things about the iphone that make it useless to the japanese compared to the competition. Coming from a non-japanese manufacturer, you really have to be a step ahead in order to get any market share and the iphone just isn't, its also expensive (in an on-going sense).
Now the last 4 phones i've had have been the HTC TYNT II, the Dopod D810, the Sony Erricson 810 and a nokia (who's model i cant remember). The HTC has been one of the worst phones i've had, its slow and has many problems (my boss chooses to reboot his every morning just to make sure) so when the iphone 3g (we didnt get 2g in AU) came out (and i had an ipod touch), i was KEEN, the interface is fast (dont care intuitive or easy to use - these often hinder rather then help). My iPod can pull down all my email (3 different accounts, exchange, imap and google) while my htc has barely made a connection to the local exchange server (even when plugged up via usb to a machine on the network). But when apple started charging for firmware updates and locked out the ability to code my own apps (or download anyone else's) i was disgusted. "oh, but its not firmware update, its a software update" - believe this if you will but your an idiot if you do.
Surfice it to say, the iphone just wont stack up against the local japanese models in terms of what the japanese want and its too "locked out" for a tech-savy (almost all of them) Japanese - did apple really think they were going to get the japanese to pay for "apple tv" - shear stupidity.?
Goodness--only 9% of people might want to buy an iPhone when Apple is looking for 1% of the market.
What a disaster!
Since when did not liking something equate to hating it?
This reminds me of a story by Bruce Sterling in the collection "A Good Old-Fashioned Future", where a US government agent with her builky PDA is harassed and overcome by Japanese coordinating their efforts through "Pokecon" smartphones.
I completely agree with you about the TV thing. Low tech compared to the high tech their phone COULD be using.
You'd have to add 20 or 30 buttons on the iPhone before even thinking about making it popular in Japan.
One of the things that I looked for this most recent time around was a phone that didn't feel like a brick in my pocket, and make my keys smash into my leg. That phone does some cool stuff, but it's darn near a laptop. No thank you.
Wake up - the future is arriving faster than you think.
I can't believe this - yet another "the iPhone failed in Japan" article with NO SALES DATA to support the claim. Maybe it is selling slowly here in Japan. Maybe flopping miserably. But why make that claim with no numbers to back it up? Get the numbers first!
There are other reasons why Softbank might cut the price. End-of-season (that'd be now) goals. Inventory clearance for a new model. Or the biggest reason of all: a lousy economy. If the iPhone is sluggish in Japan, it's not the only thing; everyone from Toyota on down is bleeding money and laying off workers as sales slump for just about everything.
Even in a good economy, maybe the iPhone wouldn't succeed here. Maybe it would. Sadly, without any data upon which to base intelligent comments, we're still going to get non-stop uninformed punditry about market potential and breathless unproven claims of "cultural differences".
... first .... solid ... usable ... viable ... end all be all ... good ... the best ... slightly above average, .. (personally) ....
With exception of the "first" adjective, all the rest of adjectives that you use to describe this marvel phone are completely subjective judgements.
In other words you drank the KoolAid and instead to look at hard objective facts you are just using the same market speech used to promote this gadget.
The marketing people at Apple should really give themselves a pat in the back.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
They've gotten used to doing things in a certain way on there keyboard cell-phone (ike very painful ways of entering kanji) and dont want to change. It the same as getting people off of qwerty keyboards in the US.
The gold standard isn't some magic that makes currency have 'real' value. Gold itself has very little intrinsic value. Its rarity doesn't justify its price--that's due to speculators who know there are people like you around and can keep the price high.
Gold's only got a high value because there are a lot of people who hold (not use) it because of its high value. If it had to be valued on its use (like most other commodities), it'd be valued by rarity and would be worth a couple of bucks a brick.
In short, gold is just like poker chips--it has value because someone else said it does.
Umm, PS3 has shifted several million units now, just FYI.
No, not as many as Xbox, but it has shifted a lot. And we're seeing some really interesting stuff (e.g. Flower) come out on it.
(Also it's a lot shinier and quieter...)
Anyway, I have all three so I'm not going to say "OMG!!! Ur so wrong xbox suxx!!!", but the PS3 is not a failed product by any means.
I'm beginning to think that a lot of stuff coming from Wired is crap reporting.
I'm pretty sure it's the Fujitsu 905i, a joint venture between Fujitsu and NTT Docomo:
http://www.nttdocomo.co.jp/english/product/foma/905i/f905i/index.html
And it's going to be introduced in Taiwan soon, with Taiwanese language localizations.
Who are you replying to? I never said the PS3 was a failed product. (I did say it's an unexciting product.)
Comment of the year
Most people complain about it at first, but I think it's just the learning curve. Both my wife and I have iPhones, and we text as fast on these as we did on phones that had full keyboards.
..........FULL STOP.
The imode fans will be disappointed by the advanced elegance of the iPhone... but almost EVERY gaijin I know (and Japanese who work closely with gaijin) has or is seriously considering an iPhone. 1-seg.. BAH!
Knowledge is valuable. Ignorance is dangerous. Censorship is unacceptable. http://slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=10
"That could simply be explained away by every gamer in Japan already owning a Wii, and nobody anywhere being particularly excited for the PS3"
You implied nobody was buying it. Not quite the case.
Also, as I say, there are some exciting developments. Noby Noby Boy for instance. Though personally I don't care for it.
æé話-ãããã(TM)
If you name a product "Panasonic P905i", you should be shot. At least a little in the foot. Everyone remembers "iPhone" or "Eee", but I've already forgotten what that PQW9592391IE-phone was called...
The iPhone needs a lot of improvement before I would consider it.
Certainly, but in its second generation form it is already got many things right. Heck, I would have been surprised if they had managed to create the perfect phone. Even with what it has got wrong, it is offers a better experience than some of the other smart phones in the North American and European markets. Chances are there will be another iPhone come September, given Apple's release schedule and their approach that makes competitors feel like they need to play catch up. Apple is a newcomer to the market, so it is in many ways amazing that they have managed to pull off what they did. Motorola, Nokia et al. can say what they want, but they were meant to be the experts in that market, but they did not play the cards to their advantage, though there is still a chance for them to do so.
The truth is if batteries were better than they are now, then I am sure Apple and many other cell phone companies would being offering different products, since anything you put on a phone is going to have a negative effect on the battery charge. Then again, even with a better battery life companies want to offer a product that appeases half the market, while giving them a reason to buy the next version when they release it down the road.
Jumpstart the tartan drive.
To people living around New York, saying cheese pizza is redundant, and is like saying a meat steak or a wooden tree. Pizza is understood to have cheese on the surface.
Often people just say pie, as in pizza pie. "Give me a large plain pie"
..........FULL STOP.
Maybe you should stick to reading what I actually type instead of things I "imply." ("Imply" in this case meaning, apparently, "stuff I made up then attributed to you.")
I never said the PS3 is a failed product. I never implied it was a failed product. Stop replying to things I never said, please.
Comment of the year
It also has to do with the fact that in Japan it's somewhat rude and inconsiderate to talk to phone in public transport or so I've understood. Wish people here understood that aswell and didn't have their ringtones set to max and yell in the bus. I've had my phone on vibrate/silent for as long as I've owned it.
Maybe you should stick to reading what I actually type instead of things I "imply."
"Actually, and surprisingly, the Xbox 360 has outsold the Wii and the PS3 for the past 4 weeks. That could simply be explained away by every gamer in Japan already owning a Wii, and nobody anywhere being particularly excited for the PS3, but it's still a pretty interesting development."
Hmm, we're talking about sales figures and you're postulating the reason for the xbox being ahead is that everyone owns a wii and nobody is interested in owning a PS3. It's pretty clear.
"("Imply" in this case meaning, apparently, "stuff I made up then attributed to you.")
Fucking pompous git.
America is a BIG country, and not that densely populated. Trains will never catch on for MOST of the country ,because the passenger density is too low. On the coasts it has made grounds because the population density makes it profitable.
Europe (Western from England to say Poland) would comfortably fit in the USA in about half the space of east of the Mississippi.
..........FULL STOP.
I like my telephones wired to a wall... so I can get away from them!
When I was in Japan a few months ago, I got a hell of a lot of "iPhone? Sugoi!" (cool!) in response to using my iPhone in public. The Japanese public may reject it for technical reasons (original lack of emoji support, tv, video, etc.) or pricing reasons, but "lack of cool" is not one of them, I don't think.
Tigarah is Japanese and she loves her iPhone.
The iPhone's getting much more love from Japanese developers than from Japanese consumers, it seems. Microsoft set unbelievable piles of money on fire to get a handful of Japanese developers, but without any particular plan on their part to be a gaming system Apple already has a Final Fantasy game (I guess CD isn't nominally FF but it has all the Moogles and fixins of an FF) and a Metal Gear Solid game lined up. It's a really weird contrast, perhaps th iPod touch will take off as a gaming platform there...
Sendou Wave Kick!!
I So Called This.
This pretty much confirms the cause of my frustrations with US Phones.
To follow up on my tribulations with the US phone situation, I'm opting not to overpay for crap and still use a Virgin Mobile phone with a $6 plan finally breaks even with the $30 plan at about 300min or so. I was using a Kyocera for the longest time, but finally upgraded to a much newer Kyocera that cost $20. The old one's battery died. I still don't have nearly as many features as my free W41CA had. In fact, I still use my Casio for taking pictures occasionally and as an alarm because of the really nostalgic ring tone. I like my current Kyocera because it's very simple and seems durable...and has a new battery.
"There are some people that if they don't know, you can't tell them." ~ Louis Armstrong
It seems Chen used an old article to quote Hayashi thusly, "Hayashi's cellular weapon of choice? A Panasonic P905i, a fancy cellphone that doubles as a 3-inch TV. It also features 3-G, GPS, a 5.1-megapixel camera and motion sensors for Wii-style games."
The none-too-happy Hayashi reports, "My cellular weapon of choice, of course is an iPhone... I can't agree with what Brian's article had to say and here is how I view the iPhone market in Japan."
http://blog.nobi.cc/2009/02/my-view-of-how-iphone-is-doing-in-japan-by-nobi-nobuyuki-hayashi.html/
iPhone Mattters today also has a related report, "The Japanese hate the iPhone so much they start four iPhone magazines."
http://www.iphonematters.com/article/the_japanese_hate_the_iphone_so_much_they_start_four_iphone_magazines_173/#When:12:42:00Z/
I HAVE CUBIC WISDOM THAT TRANSCENDS AND CONTRADICTS ONE DAY GODS
I'm tired of this myth about technology being more advanced in Japan. This is simply not true.
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
That kanji spelling of kawaii is ateji (= employing kanji that sort of match the sound and meaning of a word, but have no grounds in its etymology). The word "kawaii" comes from "kahohayusi", which then evolved into "kahahayusi", "kahayusi", "kawayusi", and finally into "kawaii". "Kahohayusi" is a compound of "kaho" , meaning "face" (kao in modern Japanese), and "hayusi", meaning "bright".
;)
Much like "mabayusi" (=> modern "mabusii") indicates a brightness so strong that you have to avert your eyes, "kahohayusi" literally describes a sight that you can't face. By metaphor, the original meaning of the word was "pitiable", "a sorry sight". This meaning is retained in the modern word "kawaisou", while the meaning of "kawaii" changed into "lovely, cute".
As for how that happened, we can conjecture something like this: small, weak things are pitiful, but they can also elicit a feeling of wanting to help them; the reaction changes from "turning your face away" to "extending your hand", so to speak, and thus the feeling becomes one of attraction.
(if you don't believe me, check the Gogen Yurai Jiten)
Who knows, maybe someday Japanese buyers will be moved by the pitiful, weak iPhone, and grant it a place inside their hearts.
Another fanboy is talking without any clue...
The "Amerika is roooral" argument does explain why we don't have high speed trains or high speed internet access between Bumfuck, North Dakota, and Jerkwater, Wyoming. It does not, however, explain why we don't have those services on the highly populated coasts.
No, the real reason is that movement conservatism has turned us into a cheap nation. Tax cuts didn't pay for the Tennessee Valley Authority. Private companies did not build the Interstate Highway System, the U.S. government did - with tax dollars.
When we stop putting the ability of the top 1% of 1% to make more money than the bottom 100 million Americans combined, you might start seeing things like 1 Gpbs duplex connections to your house and be able to take a high speed train from Boston to Miami.
It looks like someone is playing with statistics again to try and make things look worse than they are...
91% sounds pretty bad. But that's of the whole cell phone market. What is the percentage among people wanting to have a smartphone?
If you looked at the total US cell phone market you may well see a similar figure, where 70-80% of people just want a phone and not a smart phone. But as is, we have no way to compare the percentage given with the relation to the U.S. market. (which would be inetresting).
I'm not saying the iPhone has actually been a giant success there, but it's done better than that number would make it appear and I would imagine Apple has done better than any other non-Japanese phone maker in that market.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
People tend to exaggerate just how sparsely populated the US is. While it's true that the US as a whole is much less densely populated than Europe as a whole, it's not like the US population is spread evenly across the country, just like it's not in Europe. The state of Ohio is about as densely populated as France. How much rail service does Ohio have? Little to none. France? One of the largest high speed rail networks with speeds up to 320 kph, and at least hourly service between major cities.
And Ohio only comes in at no. 9 in terms of population density...
This poster is absolutely right: the article is a hit piece that misquotes and completely contradicts what the Japanese journalist Hayashi has actually been writing! Mod kalel666 up! Take a look also at http://macdailynews.com/index.php/weblog/comments/20290/ on why the Japanese don't hate the iPhone.
But it's a Sony!!!
this has been covered before. iphone's not popular in japan for three reasons: 1. no video phone 2. can't pay for stuff with it. (critically important. credit cards are sooo yesterday.) 3. no TV tuner (it's not a bad feature to have) also, it doesn't help that iphone cost as much as other phones that better cater to the japanese lifestyle.
My cellular weapon of choice, of course is an iPhone and my cellular weapon of choice to the foreigners is INFOBAR2 and I don't even dare to charge my P905i these days.
This from the guy misquoted in both the article and summary. The author actually asked for his opinion, but then took something from an old interview.
Lars T.
To the guy who modded me down from perfect to terrible Karma - Apple haters still suck
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Its just kind of cool to know that there is an advanced civilization out there where people actually scoff at the iPhone.
Some of the stuff that comes up on this website just kills me some days. Every time a story comes up about Japan, and why something isn't selling there, a bunch of posters go on about what a bunch of xenophobic dicks Japanese are and how no western companies can do well there.
To those people: You obviously don't live here, and you should consider the merits of spouting off on things with which you have no direct experience.
I live in Tokyo. I've been here for about 6 years and have worked helping to restructure a well-known Japanese company.
So, on to some random points:
1) Do Japanese have a water-tight sense of national identity?
Yes.
But they are not the only ones with nationalistic issues. See also "We're #1 motherfuckers" in the US and the vague but pervasive smugness of Europeans.
2) Are some Japanese people arrogant, screaming racists?
Yes.
And like there aren't arrogant and screaming racists in the US or Europe... No siree...
This is often thought to be more widespread than it is, partly because foreigners are not always welcome in a number of establishments in Japan. In some cases this is indeed because they are racist.
This is way more often the case because Japanese are not good culturally with dealing with the unfamiliar or strangers, even other Japanese. Letting the foreigner in who doesn't know the right way to behave and will freak out all the patrons is not good business.
They are not totally unjustified in thinking that foreigners will not behave themselves, given the massive number of westerners who come here and act like total dicks, in the same way people are known to act like total dicks when visiting the Amish. I don't know how many times I have had to cringe when reading the news or standing on the train because of the obnoxious behaviour of other gaijin.
All that said, I've seen a little old Japanese guy body-check my friend, for no other apparent reason than he was a Gaijin.
3) Are domestic Japanese businesses insular and hard to do business with?
Yes.
Domestic Japanese companies tend to cluster together in groups, solidified with cross shareholdings. It's often times difficult for Japanese companies to work with other Japanese companies, so don't feel so picked on.
Granted things were waaaaaay worse in the 80's. They used to rebuff ski equipment makes with bullshit excuses like, and I'm not kidding, "Japanese snow is different". It seems that Japan has collectively grown up a little since then.
4) Japanese hate foreign brands. They only want to buy Japanese things.
No.
Here are a list of things that are insanely popular in Japan:
- Starbucks
- Louis Vuitton
- Virtually any European fashion brand
- Krispy Kreme (2 hours lineups just to get one)
- iPod
- McDonalds (there is a word for meeting there)
- Apple products (amongst designers)
- Hollywood movies
- Microsoft software
- Dell hardware
- Cisco routers
- etc etc etc
Do I really need to say anything more?
5) The XBox 360 failed in Japan because of X.
No.
Unless X happens to be the fact that MS massively screwed up the launch in Japan by not having a single game Japanese people wanted to play in the initial line-up. JRPGs, fighting games and simulators of all kinds. That's what they like.
In Microsoft's defence, they have done their best to recover like champs. They obviously went right out and commissioned a bunched of JRPGs, which have all hit in the last 6 months, taking XBox 360 to the top of the hardware charts three times, including this week.
6) Japanese don't buy the iPhone because their phones are super wicked.
Yes and No.
Japanese phones have been waaaaaay ahead for a long time. The phones in the US, until the iPhone and Android have been pretty much a total joke.
That said, the
Too bad the journalist Nobi Hayashi was misquoted. The entire premise of the article is false. From his own web site:
"Anyway, I can't agree with what Brian's article had to say and here is how I view the iPhone market in Japan."
Read his response to the article here:
http://blog.nobi.cc/2009/02/my-view-of-how-iphone-is-doing-in-japan-by-nobi-nobuyuki-hayashi.html
http://www.ilounge.com/index.php/news/comments/japanese-iphone-hate-disputed-by-wired-tokyo-based-source/
Wired's journalistic standards seem to be getting worse and worse. It is too bad this gets posted on Slashdot.
I work developing software for a japanese company that sells Japanese domestic phones. They cant compete in the world market because nobody wants to buy their shitty phones. If you like a phone that has a laundry list of features that youll never use -- not the least because you wont be able to work out how to find and operate them - then get a japanese phone. then go bang your head against a wall because youll probably enjoy that too. They have NO IDEA about useability. Japanese consumers havent been exposed to any other type of mobile phone in their little walled garden, so they dont know any better. If the iPhone isnt selling well - yet - its because it doesnt support the langauge properly and it hasnt been marketed properly. The head of of my comapnies mobile division owns and uses - an iPhone.
Korea will be more or less the same. Koreans love taking pictures with their cell phones and if you've ever taken a trip on the Seoul Metro subway you'll notice something like 80%+ people watching TV on something. Not all of them are using their phones, some of them carry other portable devices and watch pre-recorded TV or movies. PSPs are far more popular here than I saw in Canada, but more for movie watching than gaming. Even the elderly are doing that (which is a direct contrast from the mass technology phobia the elderly seem to have in NA). I can't imagine the iphone being a big hit here. I believe its scheduled to come out here in 2 or 3 months.
What did Nobuyuki Hayashi really say before he was so badly misquoted by Brian Chen?
Read his blog: (hint his real cellphone of choice is . . . an iPhone!?!!):
http://blog.nobi.cc/2009/02/my-view-of-how-iphone-is-doing-in-japan-by-nobi-nobuyuki-hayashi.html
-- My apologies if the above facts contain any opinions, or vice versa! --
It isn't a piece of crap. That's just ridiculous. The data plans are what suck. I simply can't afford > $1K/year to use a phone.
The iphone is a nice piece of engineering. It doesn't do much more than what some of the other touch screens do, but it does have one advantage over any other handheld device: The applications. Of course, this has little to do with the iPhone's hardware as with its ubiquity. But the iTunes store is what sets it apart.
The iPhone isn't revolutionary. But to say it sucks is just flamebait.
Slashdot "libertarians": Small government for me, big government for those I disagree with. -1, I disagree with you
I have been in Japan for about 6 months now, and all I see are useless extensions and small screens. It's a bit comical saying that watching Japanese TV is a boost since Japanese tv is so vapid it makes American tv look absolutely philosophical. I can't think of anyone actually ever playing games on their phone either, outside of tetris-style games.
The Japanese may love random useless features, but I have yet to see them use them. Further, if they are using the internet really at all, they will be paying well in excess of $60 a month. In Japan there is no such thing as a cheap cell-phone package. I cost $18 a month, and all I can do is send text messages, since actual calls are a buck every 30 seconds on top of that.
My brit expat friend has an iPhone and is loving it. From what I've seen, it's still clearly the best phone on the market for usability and slickness.
Japanese mobile phone industry is over-hyped.
Yeah. They've become addicted to the keypad.
I got my first cell last year (an old model p903itv that was cheap) and I hate the keypad. Too much of the interface guessing too much and too much of the interface erasing back too far when you tell it it guessed too much.
But the Japanese are used to having the input device buffered by an input method. They just don't _get_ that the guessing ahead limits what they are typing.
Computer memory is just fancy paper, CPUs just fancy pens with fancy erasers; the 'net is just a fancy backyard fence.
1. not one unified OS, but series 60 80 90, or whatever junk...
2. some of the 07 phones had utter crap GUI defects.
3. cheap plastic feel.
4. top end nokias - too pricey.
5. i dont see a menu called Nokia Store on my nokia.... Sure there are telco specific crap, but thats just means most telcos wont bother making anything decent.
Liberty freedom are no1, not dicks in suits.
my blackberry world edition
gps locked
purchased oct 07
replaced jul 08
locked, locked, locked
locked you arrogant assumptive motherfucker. understand?
you want me to fucking bring it over to you and show you you fucking twatstain?
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
then you will understand who is really 'living in the 50s'.. more like the 1850s.
Well, some people consider the lack of a delete-left function a bug.
So to speak.
I hate my P903itv for a variety of reasons. I'll easily lose ten minutes of painstaking typing if my concentration wanders, and I'm unwilling to pattern the thumb-torture people call one-handed-texting into my brain, so, for me, the interface itself will remain a bug, not a feature.
I've thought about the P905i for the linux, but only if it gives me a shell, and only if there is either some way to hook up a keyboard or some way to use it tethered so I can send e-mail from my notebook through it.
(No way to get a shell on the p903, as far as I know.)
I really don't plan on buying another Japanese phone.
Computer memory is just fancy paper, CPUs just fancy pens with fancy erasers; the 'net is just a fancy backyard fence.
I never use it.
I've thought about watching the NHK language programs during my commute, but my commute takes me from one area to another, so I'd have to reset the receiving area. (Lock-in strategy like the area codes on DVDs, I guess.)
Besides, the train companies keep telling us how impolite it is to use phones on the trains, and how using the phone in the lead or tail car might mess up their controls systems somehow, so we should completely shut the phone off (and log back in later) on the front and back cars.
wansegu (one-segment) is a bust. Serious silliness.
Computer memory is just fancy paper, CPUs just fancy pens with fancy erasers; the 'net is just a fancy backyard fence.
I think, less than the not understanding the country, is the country not understanding.
Can you get a PC pre-loaded with a Linux OS in Japan? No.
Can you get a phone pre-loaded with a Linux OS in Japan? Yes, but, until recently, the GPL was completely ignored. (And you couldn't get access to the shell, either.)
Do you want the text from your mail on your P90x? Here's what you do.
You save it to your SD via the extension menus in the phone. Then you mount the SD on your PC and go hunting through directories with numeric names and files with numeric names until you find a few files that look the right size and have the right date. Scan through those files with hexdump -C and eventually you start seeing mail text instead of tags in some tagging format that you don't have docs for.
Then you have to decide how much you want the text in its original form, because you're going to have to write a filter to get it out.
Yes. Pathological NIH.
Computer memory is just fancy paper, CPUs just fancy pens with fancy erasers; the 'net is just a fancy backyard fence.
Note to our American-speaking American readers: the parent comment appears to be from one of those wiley shark eating Japanese people from Japan (Mexico). It may look like gibberish to people who speak American, but I learned a little Mexican back in high school and the Japanese dialect, while difficult, is decipherable with some effort. This gentleman seems to be telling us, "You have offended my ancestors. Prepare to cleave to the fighting hive of bees." Well, sir, I respectfully tel you that here in America, we do not cleve to bee-hives and we respect the cultural diversity of our neighbors, even the Japanese who live in the semi-tropical jungles across the Rio Grandi. Good day!
It's the software IMO ... http://tinyurl.com/d5n928
its locked
gps hardware, locked out by the software
its 4.2
no 4.5 available
thanks for playing
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
its an 8830 world edition, not a curve
i have 4.2
you go to the website, you ask to download the latest software, verizon says 4.2
why do you somehow think you know my own business better than i do?
you want me to download something from sprint onto my verizon phone?
you tell me what happens, you're the expert
zzz
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
an os, for a different model phone, unapproved by verizon, from sprint, i download to my different model, different cell provider phone... i'll have no problems
you're going to warranty that?
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
"tells people being born in the US somehow makes you special and you don't have to work as hard."
You think we don't work hard in the US? We work harder and longer hours with less vacation that any other civilized country. Americans are killing themselves working hard just like their parents did. Maybe now they take a bit longer to reach maturity but once they do, think 30 instead of early 20's, everyone I know pretty much works their asses off trying to get ahead. Then again I don't live where school boards fight Evolution, so maybe it's a Regional thing.
Anyway there is for sure a sense of entitlement out there but most adults I know work plenty hard and are very much concerned about the state of this country and where its going. Neocons who constantly push for their own entitlements to the exclusion of all others obviously excluded.
If you wanna get rich, you know that payback is a bitch
HI I am Nobuyuki Hayashi (aka Nobi) referred in this article. I have to point out you are using the quote I have never mentioned. Perhaps, Brian, the author of Wired article thought I would never read his article but I did. After I blamed him for this, he redirected that "iPhone = lame" quote to Daiji Hirata which made him upset because he never said that either. :-(
Anyway, to see how I really think iPhone is doing, read the post on my blog:
http://blog.nobi.cc/
If you want to keep arguing the delusion about Japan, you can stay here. If you want to do a serious discussion, please come to my blog or quote from my blog and forget about that "iPhone look lame in Japan"; it's not just me and Daiji but I haven't seen one person in Japan who would say iPhone looks lame.
And I have been lecturing how big a threat iPhone is to the Japanese handset manufacturers almost 4-5 times a month since Jan. 2008; I have shown the device to 12 months x 4 lectures x 150 or so people + many parties (I had one big iPhone party yesterday celebrating the launch of Evangelion application for iPhone and I will have another one tonight with 100+ people in Mita, Tokyo ).
Compared to most inexpensive cell phones in Japan, the iPhone is a few steps backwards in terms of its feature set. I have a better feature set with my Toshiba W45T. The only advantages to the iPhone are the touch screen and its built-in Wifi, but that is not enough to make it seriously competitive here in Japan. Even more problematic it its price tag: the phone itself is over-priced, and the service plans are likewise a joke.
When confronted by an iPhone-brandishing evangelist, smile while pulling out your Android-running HTC Touch and tell them, "At least MY phone didn't have to be jailbroken to run whatever software I want"...
it is locked
and has been locked
by verizon
for over a year
but i know some troll on a message board who says it can be unlocked, by installing an unsupported os for a different phone model (oh no wait, sorry, same phone model, he says, even though its fucking NOT) from a competing cell company
he guarantees its kosher and painless
i think this is an iq test that i'm going to pass with flying colors, by passing on your glowing back alley offer
how's that rub you?
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
So there are a few crucial Japanese features that the iPhone totally lacks:
1) Real time email: SMS is over in Japan. All phones send and receive EMAIL in REAL TIME for FREE.
2) Phone wallet: Riding a train? Just cast your phone over the sensor. You can even buy drinks, or use it at some combini's. Your phone is an ATM. the iphone does not have this feature.
3) Camera: The iPhone has a web cam that can only take stills in comparison.
4) Bars: It is true, the AT&T equivalent of Japan has the sole distribution license. The reception... sucks. If Docomo sold the iphone, more would have bought it.
The iphone has everything else, and then some. The iphone isn't really a phone. Everyone I know who owns one, keeps their regular phone. So they have two phones. So it's for those who can afford it as a second phone. And that makes not so many.
In reality, the iPhone is thought of as a great new gadget/toy, but many simply question Apple and Softbank (the provider) their seriousness when it comes to competing with other mobile companies. Maybe Softbank though the iPhone had enough to make others give up features they depended on, but alas that was not the case. So many look at the situation as a huge screw up by Softbank for paying Apple so much for so many, when the product was insufficient to even replace existing phones.
You can't really blame Apple for accepting a lucrative deal with little downside.
The major discounts are due to the overstock that can't be returned or sold anywhere else for being SIM locked. At this point Softbank is just cutting their losses.
Hi all,
I'm Daiji Hirata, quoted in the WIRED article. I DO have a iPhone and I don't feel most Japanese hates the iPhone.
When I read the article, iPhone = lame was as my words. I have NEVER said so. I have not have any contacts with the author by NOW. The author seems to have modified again after my comment in the article.
I have written my opinion: http://daijihirata.com/aboutwiredarticle.html
Thanks,
Daiji Hirata.
They don't like phones made by NOKIA too. I don't Why. Just hate Japanese.
Just to keep the record straight, I have a Panasonic P905i (carrier is NTT DoCoMo) which is great but it is easy to rack up serious monthly bills, I pay well over US$100 for mine (and forget roaming.. I spent $500 in a week in Europe). Of course with that I get everything the poster said, plus unlimited internet. There are some expensive streaming media channels too I don't subscribe too. The iPhone is quite nice looking, in particular the ability to get all your email on it is great. The P905I has a neat large screen that can fold out horizontally but still the email client only lets you see the top 15 lines or so of an email, which is silly. Anyway, the iPhone looks neat in other people's hands but not sure it is more compelling for me personally than if I had say a full keyboard. The things that have kept me getting anything besides the P905i are not wanting to have to use an onscreen keyboard to dial, wanting a good size screen, needing to roam overseas, etc. Also I got $100 off the list price from having a docomo phone for a couple years. But most women are buying KDDI's au brand which is cheaper and cuter. Businessmen are mostly docomo, I believe.
Lets start with Apple being third largest phone supplier with 20M phones. Have a look at the Gartner research here.
I've got a lot more to say but got to cook lunch now. No matter how much you tell people to check their facts, they won't, and I've got a kid to feed.
My phone is an old monochrome Nokia and I've just tried what you explained after I went to the main menu. I can't get 1-2-1 to work (after the first 1 it seems to be waiting for more numbers e.g. to form 11) but the fact that there exists number shortcuts is spot on! I always wondered what those numbers at the top right of the screen meant...
Thanks!
Yeah AC, that was my (old techie) reaction as well. Along with - "What an irresponsible asshat, to drop a CRT into a regular trash bin". Around here (and I think in most of the US nowadays), that's a huge non-no - CRTs contain wicked amounts of heavy metals that are verboten in regular landfills, and the implosion risk aka a face full of glass shards to a trash collector (the professional, paid-to-do-it kind) is non-zero enough to warrant the proscription.
If you'd tried to pull that stunt at the MIT Electronics flea mkt (third Sunday every month april-oct Albany st garage - best of its kind in North America), you'd been thrown out on your ass - for good.
What is this a turing test? Is that you HAL?
Oh, you can get them here in Europe as well. The important sentence here is
as of 2004, are installed in more than half of Japanese households.
I think that is pretty impressive.
See Obama's speech in both houses last week...
I realize there are many reasons why a person would need or want to do all the great things that are being discussed here and that's fantastic. But can I really be the only one who just uses his cell phone for making and receiving phone calls? I know this is /. and the discussion is about advanced phones, but I'm getting the vibe that everyone here thinks a phone without apps or touch screens or internet or feature #9 is somehow inferior. Is there anybody else here that still uses a plain Jane featureless phone?
Both Japanese sources quoted in the article were misrepresented.
See
http://blog.nobi.cc/2009/02/my-view-of-how-iphone-is-doing-in-japan-by-nobi-nobuyuki-hayashi.html
and
http://daijihirata.com/aboutwiredarticle.html
for their rebuttals of Brian Chen's Wired blog entry.
Nobi owns and uses an iPhone. I've seen him use it in person. The reason he was using a DoCoMo P905 in June 2008 is because the iPhone wasn't sold in Japan until July 2008.
lol, they buy things like sony products which have had a history of being user friendly as dirt.
much of the technology is poorly implemented. features that you don't use are useless.
...when you focus on the stupid logo for years ignoring the product, the product turns out as crap. Fortunatly you have the cult to buy it and make you feel good.
May be you feel rejectec by japanesses, but one thing is true, compared to japan you are in the third world. So do not feel offended if one of your tech products is rejectec. Improve it!!!
Lenny rules!
I have never had anyone really steal my debit card, and I think I only lost it once.
But when I visit bigger cities, I use a "trick card". It only has about $100 live on it, basically to cover monthly fees and some silly little munchie purchase.
When I want to buy anything serious, the bank has a really good phone-transfer system that the petty thief won't know about, and couldn't crack in a day if he did. I simply transfer the big balance into the "Trick Card" as a one shot.
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
Successful troll is successful.
They who would give up an essential liberty for temporary security, deserve neither liberty or security. --Ben Franklin
Who cares what a bunch of random talking heads say? The degree to which the Japanese like or hate is measured by market share.
http://www.thebestpageintheuniverse.net/c.cgi?u=iphone
It is not only the Japanese who dont like iPhone.
~_~v
well that sounds way to hard to do to only upload and download some files. I dont need to know any kind of Java skills or japanese language to be able to do that in my iphone. All its the program that you can dowload for Free . Put my computer IP address on the program of my device and i can control my fucking PC from the other side of the world! Im not saying that there is not cool Cellphones in Japan. im just saying that I know how to apreciate an amazing cellphone when i see it.
I think most critical fatal mistake Apple made when releasing this thing in Japan is that they didn't add a hole for attaching a wrist strap.
Without that, if you want to hang dozens of little charms on your phone, you need a third-party case of some sort.
Other than that, people here don't keep a phone very long or use many of the features. Lately I've been seeing a phone advertised on the basis of having some little piano keyboard app that looks suspiciously like the "Band" app for the iPhone. Who is really going to use that for more than a few minutes?
Other than the TV tuners, I doubt many people actually use the clever features that are so touted when they bring out a phone here.
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Thank you.
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