Slashdot Mirror
Safari Beta 2 Available
pldms writes "Safari Beta 2 is available via Software Update or from the Safari page. This is build 73, for those who've had 'exclusive' access to previous development versions since beta 1 ;-) The blurb: 'Safari Beta 2 introduces tabbed browsing to conveniently see and switch between multiple web pages in a single window, and AutoFill to instantly fill out web forms and password fields. This update also features increased standards compatibility and improved application stability.'" I had to set Lax Certificate Checks in the Debug menu to use it with Slashdot ... and its secure cookie check is still quite broken (either saves secure cookies without the secure flag, or sends out secure cookies to insecure sites, which would violate
RFC 2965
where it says "no less than the same level of security").
Damn job! Interfering with my ability to play with Safari at home. I can't wait to see how the tabbed browsing implementation looks/feels.
That what was all this school was for... to teach us how to solve our own problems. -- janeowit
muslims are evil people.
Tabbed Browsing! FP!?
asdf
Dear Apple,
I am a homosexual. I bought an Apple computer because of its well earned reputation for being "the" gay computer. Since I have become an Apple owner, I have been exposed to a whole new world of gay friends. It is really a pleasure to meet and compute with other homos such as myself. I plan on using my new Apple computer as a way to entice and recruit young schoolboys into the homosexual lifestyle; it would be so helpful if you could produce more software which would appeal to young boys. Thanks in advance.
with much gayness,
Father Randy "Pudge" O'Day, S.J.
fp you fucking nazis!
I am a homosexual. I bought an Apple computer because of its well earned reputation for being "the" gay computer. Since I have become an Apple owner, I have been exposed to a whole new world of gay friends. It is really a pleasure to meet and compute with other homos such as myself. I plan on using my new Apple computer as a way to entice and recruit young schoolboys into the homosexual lifestyle; it would be so helpful if you could produce more software which would appeal to young boys. Thanks in advance.
with much gayness,
Father Randy "Pudge" O'Day, S.J.
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Dear Father O'Day:
Thanks for your letter. Being Catholic myself, I know exactly what you're talking about! It has always been our plan here at Apple Computer Inc to revolutionize personal computing with our high-quality and highly gay products.
I'm happy to answer your letter by letting you know that YES we will be releasing an entire hLife ("homo-life") software line. You'll be able to recognize it in stores by the small stylized logo depicting a large cock entering a tight anus with an Apple logo on it. ("Suddenly it all comes together" indeed!).
Anyway, I hope you and other members of our community will join us on our mission, and purchase the exciting new hLife boxed set. Only the boxed set comes with translucent cock rings!
Sincerely,
Harry Rodman
Vice-president
Homosexual Liaison Services
Apple Computer, Inc.
At 9:38am EST, Safari Beta 2 didn't show up in Software Update (at least on my machine). Downloading it from Apple's website works fine, though.
Hmm...in the About Safari window it's listed as 1.0 beta (v.73).
:).
Doesn't seem to be that much different from the previously leaked v67
Thanks for your letter. Being Catholic myself, I know exactly what you're talking about! It has always been our plan here at Apple Computer Inc to revolutionize personal computing with our high-quality and highly gay products.
I'm happy to answer your letter by letting you know that YES we will be releasing an entire hLife ("homo-life") software line. You'll be able to recognize it in stores by the small stylized logo depicting a large cock entering a tight anus with an Apple logo on it. ("Suddenly it all comes together" indeed!).
Anyway, I hope you and other members of our community will join us on our mission, and purchase the exciting new hLife boxed set. Only the boxed set comes with translucent cock rings!
Sincerely,
Harry Rodman
Vice-president
Homosexual Liaison Services
Apple Computer, Inc.
A *lot* of people are using it I think. A good percentage of the people who come to my site are on *some* revision of safari. Strange though: I had a couple of apple.com visitors and they were only on build 62 and 66.1 :?
With browsers this quick, Apple's going to have a hard time selling faster machines :-)
After all, Safari is developed by professional software engineers. Slashdot is run by open-source rejects.
Well, lets hope its making big improvements. I seem to be using the nightly builds of Camino on a regular basis while Safari is collecting dust. Camino now has a Google search feild and a similar bookmark features and its open source. Why use Safari any more?
Apple has Safari.
Safaris are for big, strong dudes.
Acronym for big, strong dudes is "BSD"
BSD is dying.
Apple has a BSDish system under the hood.
ergo: Apple is dying.
Trolling is a art,
For a touch of karma whoring, for the people who never played around with an 'unreleased' beta (which includes me), the keyboard/mouse controls for tabbed browsing (which is turned off by default, and has it's own tab in the new Safari Preferences).
Apple-Click : Opens a link in a new tab.
Apple-Shift-Click : Opens a link in a new tab and selects it.
Apple-Option-Click : Opens a link in a new window behind the other one.
Apple-Option-Shift-Click : Opens a link in a new window and selects it.
There is also the check box option to always display the tab bar, plus 'Select new tabs as they are created', which alters the above keyboard setup.
I'm on my iBook at the moment, so I'm not sure how these interface with multi-button mice, but I guess you could configure the buttons to correlate with these modifiers, if you haven't already...
hey guys someone just pointed out to me that the slashdot editor 'jamie' might be a GUY.
please tell me that it isn't so...
if it is, does that make me gay or something?
Seriously, if I don't score soon, I'm going to die. I don't want to die a virgin.
I got it from Apple's site to start with. It looks and feels like v71, but I've only played with v73 for 10 half an hour. I just checked SoftwareUpdate and the update shows up, even with the manual installation running. We'll see what happens when I run it.
Etc, etc, ad nauseam, and so on and so forth.
This is an illusion by the Zionist American forces.
Safari Beta 2 was not released, we valiantly fought them and killed all of the invaders.
They are like a snake and we are going to cut it in pieces.
Our estimates are that none of them will come out alive unless they surrender to us quickly.
They think we are retarded - they are retarded.
We are surrounding them and pounding them. The whole trend has changed and we are going to finalize this very soon.
I had my doubts about Safari. After a few days of "testing" it out, I forgot how painful it was to use IE. Sure there are occations that Safari won't open a page or something, but this beta is better than most 5.X brosers that have been around for a while.
The new tabbed interface is VERY well done. I'm very happy with it now. Could be the perfect browser....for me at least.
My
Phew... When I saw a link to an RFC which was purportedly about about security I was sure it was the evil bit thingy. Had to click on the link to verify that it was a different RFC!
what great news to wake up to! I've been waiting so long it seems...cant wait to see it.
Could Jesus microwave a burrito so hot that he himself cou
... ah, now that I've clicked on the link and realized that this is an "Apple" news item, I'm beginning to understand. For Beta 3, please mention in the blurb that this is about a web browser for Macs, thank you :-).
There's a novel new feature related to the Tabs that bears mention. If you have folder/menus in your Bookmark Bar populated with bookmarks, there's now a menu item at the bottom of that pull-down menu that says "Open in Tabs". If you select this it will create a new tab for all the bookmarks in that group of bookmarks! This is similar to a feature in Camino that lets you set up tab groups. What I'd like to see is the ability to save a tab group or "workspace" out to a special .webloc type file that I can use to launch a bunch of URLs from the dock, or by double clicking, etc. Maybe there's a way to do this right now?
I wish Apple had combined the tabs feature with their right-mouse-button click Google search feature. If you haven't seen this, RMB click on any word. One of the options is "Google Search". Selecting it will (surprise, surprise) take you to google.com to search for the word you had selected. I wish instead it opened a new tab to do the search. Seems like an obvious place to use tabs.
fh
Why not just use Opera for Mac? Tabbed browsing, mouse gestures, speed, it's got it all. Sure, you can't get the most recent version for Mac, but after spending a week using Safari at my Dad's place, unless this version significantly changes everything about it, Opera 6 is a definate improvement.
anyone know how to do this in safari ? It's pretty handy if you browse at -1.
But I have now stopped using Camino and Im using Safari fulltime, Camino just crashes for me all the time, while Safari seems to be resonable stable. And now that it got tabs, there's nothing I miss from Camino...
I fought the corporate America, and the corporate America bought the law.
Is it just me, or did anyone else get a version of Safari that works exactly like the last Software Update release? I check the info, and it says v.73, but alas, no tabbed browsing, or any other neat-o features....
Whereof we cannot speak, thereof we must be silent. --Ludwig Wittgenstein
YOU FAIL IT!
I've been sitting here at my freelance gig in front of a Mac (a 8600/300 w/64 Megs of RAM) for about 20 minutes now while it attempts to copy a 17 Meg file from one folder on the hard drive to another folder. 20 minutes. At home, on my Pentium Pro 200 running NT 4, which by all standards should be a lot slower than this Mac, the same operation would take about 2 minutes. If that.
In addition, during this file transfer, Netscape will not work. And everything else has ground to a halt. Even BBEdit Lite is straining to keep up as I type this.
I won't bore you with the laundry list of other problems that I've encountered while working on various Macs, but suffice it to say there have been many, not the least of which is I've never seen a Mac that has run faster than its Wintel counterpart, despite the Macs' faster chip architecture. My 486/66 with 8 megs of ram runs faster than this 300 mhz machine at times. From a productivity standpoint, I don't get how people can claim that the Macintosh is a superior machine.
I'd rather hear some intelligent reasons why anyone would choose to use a Mac over other faster, cheaper, more stable systems.
Is there something wrong with me? when I right mouse click i get "view source" and "save page as..."
What is it that makes this browser so much better then the others?
I have some friends now that recently switched to the apple side of computing, and I can't help but laugh at them on some of the stuff they applaud Apple for. This browser is one of them.
They claim it is faster, but I just don't see how that is possible. The bottleneck in most all browsing I do is the network. Have they simply found a way to make it seem faster? Have other browsers on the Mac been slow in the past? I don't get it.
As a reference. I use IE at work, and Phoenix (or should that be the browser formerly known as Phoenix) at home. While I do appreciate some of the benefits of Phoenix over IE, I honestly think it is a toss up between them.
I think most of my problems nowdays are with sites that are just ugly. However, I can't tell the difference -- or maybe I just don't care -- between the way any browsers handle fonts and whatnot. I also can't notice most of the differences between how sites render. I do appreciate the fact that most sites appear stable in all browsers now.
So... what is so great about Safari?
I could give a laundry list of the constant, clunky bullshit I face with Windows 2000 (such as the "pre-emptive" multitasking being a cruel hoax, and the networking that appears to have been cobbled together by spider monkeys), but there's no point with a troll.
Ok, updated Safari. Tabbed browsing support means Safari is now my default browser.
But I want to transfer the bookmarks from the bookmark bar in Camino to Safari. Seems like a lot of trouble. Because, well, it couldn't... or, it's OS X but yet... could bookmarks be drag-n-droppable? Between browsers from two entirely different places? They couldn't...
But they are. And that's damn sexy.
It just works.
Finally! Tabbed browsing... the one feature I missed from Camino!
From the fifteen minutes I've used it so far, Safari now "acts" a lot like Camino
Now I get the speed of Safari with the features of Camino!
Camino has been quite crashy for me (as others posting have mentioned as well) so I'll hold off the final verdict to see if Safari crashes less (though, I will state that it crashed less anyway... it just didn't have tabs!) :)
-A
I surfed over to the Debka file for and my tab for that page reads.
http://www.debka.com/
DEBKAfile, Political Anal
Not something I'd want my boss seeing.
One of the things which makes me use iTunes on certain machines is the indiscriminate search feature and how it works so well with both librarys and playlists.
I would really like to see it added in someway to Safari as now it is my main browser my bookmarks, despite attempted organisation are beginning to get out of control.
Swapping the Google search panel for a bookmark search interface (when you flick the bookmark switch, which checked titles and URLs) would be cool, and as a 'power' feature if you could searched cached versions of the bookmark's pages as well it would be excellent (please inform me if another browser already has that functionality)...
Here's some Monday morning fun for all you Safari v73 users. With tabs turned on but "always show tab bar" turned off, follow this procedure about five times:
Open a new window. Open a new tab. Close the entire window by clicking on the gumdrop.
Voila! Now your default window size is huge!
Apparently Apple was content to get professional UI design for only the first beta. Other things that should be present, such as drag-and-drop tab rearrangement, also aren't present. (From a UI perspective, there's no compelling argument for not allowing drag-and-drop rearrangement of tabs.)
For whatever reason, this version of Safari, as well as v.71, won't work with the cookies in Bugzilla. On two machines I've tried it on both bugzilla.mozilla.org and our own internal versions of it. Kind of annoying to work with tickets all day at work and have to keep re-logging in. Hopefully this issue has a nice workaround either on the Safari or the Bugzilla side.
I currently recommend a nightly build of Camino instead for these users. It now has a pretty nifty & flexible Google search bar finally (obligatory screenshot). I do miss the spell-as-you-type feature in Safari however.
FIXED, FINALLY (or at least drastically improved): The "contacting latency" bug. This bug caused extreme latency when contacting sites that ought to be really fast. Have you ever timed out while connecting to localhost? How about when connecting to Slashdot?
STILL THERE: That horrible scrollbug!
I hereby place the above post in the public domain.
Safari is not the greatest thing since penicillin. It won't save the world. It's not even a full release version.
What it is: a relatively svelte, quick-feeling (and yes that's partly just render speed), nicely spare browser that feels fine to use. Look at a page in Safari next to, say, Opera. The leanness of Safari stands out in several senses: render speed, clean layout, just the speed with which the program loads.
It's like a tool that feels good in your hand. Apple has a way of producing stuff like that. That's what your friends mean.
(And when your friends start claiming iCal as one of Apple's triumphs, then you can suspect them. There's a program in serious need of practical work, and much more of a beta than Safari. Slow as molasses, too.)
"Fundamentalism" isn't about divine morality. It's about human authority.
OK, for the record, when looking in your bookmarks and seeing the 'Open in Tabs' button when you think 'what does this do?' don't do it on a very full menu.
It opens every bookmark in that menu in it's own tab. Woot. talk about a lotta web pages
As a rock-in-roll Physicist once said, No matter where you go, there you are.
In the "General" preference pane of Safari Beta 2, you have the following options:
Open links from applications:
( ) in an new window
( ) in the current window
I'd hoped to see a third option (present in Camino) that says:
( ) in a new tab in the current window
Save that, it's nice new release of my default browser.
Opera is all but dead (is it even being supported?), Mozilla is so bloated that it includes components I neither want nor need, IE crashes randomly, and OmniWeb... is pretty good, but I've not used it much. My recollection is that it was slow to render.
Safari renders pages fast. Very fast, when compared to other browsers. Sure, my 56k line is by far the limiting factor, but for some reason, the added complexities of HTML, SHTML, style sheets, etc have bogged down most browsers on the Mac (I don't see the same issue on the PC).
Safari is based on the open source Konquerer, I understand, and Apple are putting improvements to the rendering engine back out there. That's got to be a good thing for non-Apple users, having a large company devote time to improving an open source project.
It's only at second public beta, but it does what I want - provide a small footprint browser that's clean, fast and compatible with standards.
right-click = control-click = brings up a menu about the object
middle-click (wheel) = command(apple)-click = opens a new tab in the background
Obviously, the wheel scrolls.
I had to set Lax Certificate Checks in the Debug menu to use it with Slashdot ... and its secure cookie check is still quite broken (either saves secure cookies without the secure flag, or sends out secure cookies to insecure sites, which would violate RFC 2965 where it says "no less than the same level of security").
that's the beauty of open source. fix it instead of bitching about it.
so far, this thing flies. i have only 2 minor complaints so far:
tab switching is kind of slow at times, even with only 2 or 3 tabs open.
i'm still waiting for them to get the 'check spelling as you type' pref to stick between sessions.
other than that, this browser is truly amazing. loads pages lightning quick,looks great, and the feature set is starting to set it at par with the other big time browsers for mac.
*** For a better tommorow, change your life today ***
I don't understand why anyone would bother running Linux on a Mac. For $99 you can purchase Mac OS X and get real live tech support for problems that (probably won't) pop up. There's a lot of technical reasons you should run Mac OS instead of Linux.
Linux has its origins on IA32, Intel's 32-bit architecture. Every platform Linux has migrated to since then has been beset with porting problems-- Linux runs 32% more efficiently on Intel than PowerPC. This is very telling as PowerPC is in general much faster per clock than Intel. Somewhere in the translation from PowerPC to IA32 something got lost.
Mac OS is 100% native for PowerPC. The Mach kernel has been optimized for the G3, G4, and 970 since Apple began writing the operating system back in 1996. Why choose a hacked and kludged OS from another platform when you can have an environment tailor-made for the system you'll be running it on? Mac OS certainly isn't plagued by same driver problems Linux is (in)famous for.
In Linux, the development model is highly irrational: anyone is allowed to submit patches, and one man (Linus Torvalds) sorts through gigabyte after gigabyte of amateurish code, attempting to integrate it into the kernel. Apple's model is much more modern and decisive: the code for the low levels of Mac OS is available for anyone to download and modify, while the more complex parts of the system (QuickTime and OpenGL) are kept closed-source so those that know better-- the Apple programmers-- are the only ones allowed to tinker.
The results because of these differing development models are clear. Apple released a major update to the OS once a year, and releases about five minor updates to the OS, as well as several dozen security patches and driver updates, in the interim. Since March of 2001 we've gone from 10.0 to 10.2.5! Linux is still stuck at some sort of bizarre "in-between" 2.5 kernel patch and won't move on to 2.6 until well after Apple has released Mac OS 10.3.
It's not hard to see the difference here is a bunch of kids playing with source code instead of doing their homework vs. highly qualified professionals pushing their skills to the limits. The Mac OS user benefits.
I don't even think I have to touch on this. While Linux offers several GUIs from GNOME, KDE, and Enlightenment, Apple offers only one. But here we have a case of quality vs. quantity. Apple controls the GUI for its operating system while anyone can hack and modify the various Linux GUIs as they please. This has led to a lack of desktop standards and a whole lot of bickering and flame wars over human interface guidelines. Most of the GUIs for Linux are simply poor knock-offs of the Windows 95 interface.
Apple's Aqua and QuickTime graphical interfaces are faster, more elegant, and very consistent. A Mac user can sit down at any Mac and (assuming someone hasn't installed Linux) get right to work. With Linux, it's hit or miss as to whether the user will know what to do when he logs in! Getting work done is the most important aspect of a computer. After all, it is just a tool. Linux fails in this area miserably-- you're forced to edit and tinker and kludge and hack to make things perfect. A Mac allowes you to just sit down and roll up your sleeves and get some work done. I don't have time to play at my job.
I've used Linux before and the headache of downloading drivers and libraries and making sure the versions all sync up are too mucvh to handle, especiallly considering one has to compile these applications. On a Mac, I mount a disk image and drag the .app file to /Applications, and I'm done. Hell, most software for Mac even installs it there for you. To put this in perspective, let's look at a recent task I performed under both Linux 2.4 and Ma
Hmm, that's not the only thing that people browsing the web have secret fascinations with...
Slashdot's first reaction to VMware
Use Vince to change your default ftp helper. It's kind of like the protocol helper prefs in Classic IE.
I didn't know Dell made Speak 'n Spells
" and OmniWeb... is pretty good, but I've not used it much. My recollection is that it was slow to render. "
Yes. Dreadfully slow. They have released a new slew of "sneakypeek" betas, in which they use webcore from apple/khtml as their rendering engine. So it's gotten quite a bit snappier.
1) You can finally use a secure proxy: in past versions this was broken for some reason (anybody who has had it disabled for the past few months might want to re-enable it now).
2) Cookies are finally working on PHP nuke sites: previous versions would lose preferences right after signing in.
3) I can finally login to my university's registration system. It uses this software; I'm guessing other schools rely on it too.
Anything else?
Arabic language support is still not quire right (certain letters in words are being displayed too small). A Windows Media Player plugin might be nice, but that probably is on the shoulders of M$ more-so than Apple. Other than that everything is perfect; tabs were something I was expecting anyway, and the right-click Google search was a surprise bonus.
Safari is still unable to create folders inside of folders in the bookmarks. For instance, I want to create a folder called Development. Then create folders called PHP, Perl, and Java and place them within the Development folder. Can't do this in Safari. At least I haven't figured out how.
This isn't a troll, it's the truth.
Just because you don't like the truth doesn't mean it's not a valid point.
No Comment.
Have you tried Camino? I downloaded it (0.7) last week while trying to track down an @import problem in Mozilla 1.3 and it's absolutely astounded me. I used to have to use IE 5.2 to do my online billpay (didn't work with Safari or Mozilla 1.0 - 1.3), and Blogger Pro didn't recognise Safari, so I had to keep Mozilla on my system to post to Blogger. Camino executes both flawlessly, has pop up killer and tabbed browsing, and has become my default browser of choice. I haven't run across a site yet that it hasn't processed/read correctly, even Java-heavy sites like PopCap.com or my webmail. Give it a try - you can get it from a link at Mozilla.org.
"It's the crazy backwards universe, where up is down and boy bands play instruments." -Tino, The Weekenders
Another thread here touting Camino was mysteriously modded "flamebait" so here goes...
I have used and loved Chimera for many months for many reasons. As other have found, the renamed Camino is crash-prone, strange in the very last nightly build of Chimera before the trademark-conflict name change (which you can find easily by anonymous FTP to their server) is great. I downgraded to Build 2003030408 and am content.
Now comes Safari, also great, except the lack of tabbed browsing and that awful brushed metal stuff. OK, tabbed browsing is now checked off on the feature list. Safari shares a startling number of other features, and then some. Eventually Safari will be indistinguishable from Camino/Chimera. Congratulations Apple, what a coup.... (Hey guys, add keywords for bookmarks so I can continue to google with "g keyword keyword" and I'll switch.)
So what's the deal for independent software efforts? Bust yourself to develop and demonstrate new UI and core technologies to have them lifted by a large for-profit computer maker? Granted the open source Camino is intended to create new work without profit, but at some point it will also lose the "profit" of public attention, and wither away, and cease to produce new things.
At the least I'd like to see Safari give a nod to Chimera. At the best I'd like an answer from Apple how they're not doing the Internet Explorer thing in miniature, and how non-Apple developers will continue to inspire and be inspired when they face having their work negated in a mere twitch of the tail of the whale.
I'm a Mac person, and back to the years before the Mac (the Apple ][+ is in a box). I think Apple has often done the right thing and will continue to (often) do the right thing. But there is something disturbing in their generous production of free software, similar in effect if not (I hope) intent to what Redmond has done. Be careful, Apple.
Anyone else notice that Autofill now not only works, it gets info from the (system wide) AddressBook? Change your address in one place for envelopes, Palm Business Cards, and now your browser!
Ok, so it is minor. Still cool.
'Sensible' is a curse word.
If software update doesn't show the new Safari, make sure the old one's in the root of your Applications folder, otherwise it won't recognise it.
yeah the tabs are really great but, It really would be nice if I could stop moving my window from side to side looking for the Tab behind the one I am on!
"If we knew what it was we were doing, it would not be called research, would it?" - Albert Einstein
duh
Tax Day! I am already feeling sore and Uncle Sam didn't even leave cab fair on the deskside table. :(
True, its a huge task to multi-thread the Finder, but they should either do it or not pass commands from other applications (like FTP in Safari). Right now, it is a central repository for functionality of various applications, and yet is not multi-threaded, hence it hangs the whole OS. Which sucks.
Only if he has his computer on, connected to the Internet and Remote Login is turned on.
Only then, you can "voila"...
First, note that I have used, and liked Camino.
That said, I have a couple of points to make in response to your post. First, in what way is what Camino's doing being "lifted" by Apple? They are using KHTML, not Gecko etc., so it's not the code. And it seems a little harsh to criticize Apple for putting in features that everyone's been asking for since the beginning. Second, why shouldn't Apple do this? If they can make something that is better than everything that's out there, all it can do is help their image with the public. If the people making other browsers can't compete, (I truly don't mean to be harsh here), that's too bad. I think that the Camino team are doing a fabulous job, and I hope that they can continue to do so. However, if they cannot make a better product than Apple, why should Apple be faulted for this? I believe that they won't go under, though; I think that this will simply challenge them to do even better. And I say good luck to them: both to Apple and the people working on Camino.
Dan Aris
not bothering to log in at school
At this point, only the second one's a show stopper.. This may finally boot Camino from my default!
Dude, it was Gore that Used a powerbook not Shrub...
What use is tabbed browsing in itself? In Mozilla, tabbing was a performance workaround -- Mozilla opens new windows at glacial speed, but opening just a new tab was much faster. The unfortunate consequence, though, was a fallback to effectively the old Windows MDI interface, which breeds user errors and undercuts the windowing system. Since Safari opens windows fast enough already, what need is there for this clunky performance workaround?
Tim
Like the topic says:
Mod parent up! This is exactly what Safari needs!
This build still doesn't remember inline spell-check settings between forms. I guess OmniGroup must have patented the super-secret algorithm to actually remember this settings or something. There's absolutely no excuse for this bug to have gone unfixed for two months. It's 1 minute of work, probably less.
If you've got a mouse with a scroll wheel - press the scroll wheel and the link opens in the background in a tab. ...how I've waited for this...
.
-
Am I the only one that prefers the way Camino and Mozilla handle bookmarks. Safari has rendezvous and Address Book to handle, but those can still be put in a side window.
No 6: "I'm not a number. I'M A FREE MAN!!!" No 2: "HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA" -- The Prisoner
Here in my office, we're all using PowerBook G4s with the wireless networking. This has made reconfiguring the workspace very easy over time, as we don't have to keep rerunning cable. But, when we use the Apple Filesharing Protocol to copy files from one computer to another, if the file is bigger than a megabyte the transfer hangs.
At this point, one must force-quit the Finder, but that doesn't really solve the problems: other processes are running okay, but the OS can't start new ones. And if you try to shut down cleanly, it doesn't work -- you just wind up spinning for minutes, waiting for something to happen (like maybe initd finally getting the KILL) until we wind up doing a hard shutdown (hold the power button for a while).
Our solution so far has been: use scp and our corporate fileshare server, but that's less than perfect. On the other hand, it's not nearly so bad as the hang & reboot that's required when we try to transfer anything of size over AFP or via iChat/Rendezvous.
Oh, go on, check out my job.
This is great. I don't have a Mac, and I have no intention of getting one, but I really like seeing good progress in Safari, since by the time KDE 3.2 comes out, I'll get most of those advances in my own lurvely Konqueror.
:)
Thanks Apple!
Did anyone else look through the Safari theater? They show you how to bookmark Slashdot!
-------
And we also have a cancel button...in case you don't want toast.
and then relaunch Safari. A new menu entitled "Debug" should be available.
the inactive tabs - too low contrast. black text on gray ground? looks "cool" - not extremely readable though.
X - stop
+ - add bookmark
o.k. - i look quickly, and i press the wrong one. how about a X inside of a circle for a stop button? it would be different than the delete button, but as well sufficiently different visually from the + "add bookmark" button. one should be able to tell the difference between two icons in an instant - i can't do this with those damn X's and +'s.
just "my" thoughts.
help out.
The same can be said for caucasians with their long shameful history.
Pi
If you like this feature in Safari, I highly recommend the simple and elegant SearchGoogle service. The page says "10.1" at the top, but that's 10.1 or higher -- it works fine for me on Jaguar.
The service lets you search Google with selected text in any app supporting services, not just Safari, with just a cmd-shift-G. It's amazing how useful this is! For example, I'll often select some class name in my code to look for online docs.
True, it doesn't integrate with Safari's tabs in any slick way -- it just opens a new window. It's still pretty sweet, though.
But in general, Opera is cluttered by comparison with IE, leave alone Safari. It has a modest measure of feature creep -- mail client, a "Contacts" list as part of my browser? Between the two Opera versions I can see without standing up, here, it seems not to particularly respect the API of the OS. (One version is treating non-modal "Transfers" dialogs so that I can't drag them outside the program's overall frame. Dang it, get outta the way! The other, new one includes some pretty whacky, sometimes ambiguous stuff like check boxes and radio buttons together in the same right-click contextual dialog. I just tried to close the sidebar deal -- I hate that -- but along the way I accidentally removed a few of the buttons from it. Also seem to have dragged a tab down into the list area, and it showed up there but I don't know what that actually means. Oops. Well, it's gone now.)
We all like tweakability in principle, but why are there three different basic preferences items on two different menus in version 7.10? Why do I have my Google search box in a completely different spot from the three other search boxes in the default layout, again? Why are there 16 different icons in the basic Nav toolbar? You'd really use maybe three of those, unless you honestly buy "Magic Wand" and "Fast Forward" as basic Web approaches(?). The "mystery meat" ones you have to mouse over to figure out are just cholesterol. Seems like a bit of work to get to a clean Web browser.
Sort of the difference between a gaudy leatherman tool and a solid pair of pliers. Just my take, and no offense intended. Some people carry their leatherman everywhere, but I just want a pair of pliers handy when I need 'em.
"Fundamentalism" isn't about divine morality. It's about human authority.
Sendmail and sshd were both cracked recently and needed updated. The guys who code these programs were on the ball and had patches ready and waiting just hours after the security holes were discovered. Both a Linux box and my dual 1.42GHz Mac system needed updated. Here's a breakdown of how this went on my Mac:
1. open System Preferences's Software Update Control Panel
2. hit the CHECK NOW button
3. hit the INSTALL button
4. wait for Mac OS to download, install, and optimize the updates
Total time: 4 minutes
Now here's how it went in Linux. I was severely unimpressed:
1. download the source code for sendmail and sshd
2. check the readme file for library and driver version requirements
3. download new library files
4. compile new library files
5. update older applications not compatible with new versions of library files
6. compile source for sendmail and sshd
7. email a mailing list about errors during compilation
8. wait a few days for the correct response
9. recompile new sendmail and sshd
10. update Linux kernel with patches
11. reboot Linux
Total time: 200 minutes (over the course of 3 days)
What version of Linux were you using? With Debian, its like this:
apt-get update
apt-get upgrade
Sendmail and sshd exploits taken care of.
BTW, I own an iBook. I'm running 10.2.5 on it. So I know the pluses and minuses of each.
Its by design. See Surfin' Safari. Replace vs. Append? When doing clustered loading, we took two approaches. One can be seen in Mozilla, and I personally hate it. The other can be seen in Phoenix and is my favorite choice. Mozilla actually appends the tabs loaded by a bookmark group to the end of the tabbed list. This means that if you click first on a News group and load tabs 1-5 and then click on a Blogs group, you'll end up with new tabs 6-10. In Phoenix, you replace instead, so the News tabs go away and are replaced by tabs 6-10. The argument for append is basically that you end up with potential data loss in that you may lose access to the previous tabs by closing up some of the ones you replaced, e.g., if the second group has fewer tabs than the first. This is of course a solvable problem, though, and doesn't justify changing the default behavior to append.
I love the Tabs features, but I'd sure like to see "Back" and "Forward" added to the contextual menu. I'd also like and an optional "Go" button added. These features are essential for one-handed, mouse driven surfing.
This release renders NPR's The World correctly for the first time.
One nice Safari feature is the two-click procedure to report a broken page to Apple. The World is the only page I ever had to report. Now I am happy.
Of course, The World is produced by PRI, not NPR. Sorry.
"Well, I'm goin' on safari, motherfucker! Suh-far-ee! *elephant trumpet sound*"
Smoochy!
This has got to be the worse version yet. So far it has crashed when I went to my home page. It locked up when I tried to change the font size. It loads pages slower than before.
I've got to say that Camino is much better than Safari now.
The above is not worth reading.
If you load the BBC news site (http://news.bbc.co.uk/) into a tab and flip to other tabbed webpages, the BBC active news byline gets carried over. Pretty annoying. This does not happen when one opens a new page, only when one uses tabs on the same browser window. Camino/Navigator does not reproduce the problem. I can live without news from the BBC, but suspect this problem may exist in viewing other webpages. Thankfully, Safari seems to have lost none of its speed in this beta-update.
(and I just used the built-in Safari bug reporter to convey the problem)
"Yes, the American troops have advanced further. This will only make it easier for us to defeat them." http://www.welovetheiraqiinformationminister.com/
I've been using Safari since the first beta was released but it was only this last weekend when I realized that I couldn't find something in it: MIME-type configuration.
I ran into this when I realized that I couldn't tell it how to handle Bit Torrent but had no problems with Mozilla. You know, some way of teaching Safari how to handle a new type?
Does anyone know how this is supposed to be done?
--Richard
Mozilla already has a similar feature, that lets you bookmark a group of tabs. Since every morning, I read slashdot, news.google, and a few other sites... I have them all bookmarked as my "Daily Reading".
;-)
Internet Explorer lacks such features. Anyway, I have an interest in Safari because improvements in it will possibly make their way into Konqueror. Also, ideas spread, so new useful features in web browsers will most likely end up in every browser (Mozilla, Konq, Opera...) except Internet Explorer
Everyone please click the bug button and report that it is unfair for Safari to completely block the user from viewing sites with expired certificates. The user should be warned, not unconditionally blocked! Other browsers just give a warning.
...SafarIcon, available on versiontracker.com. It is just a "theme changer" for Safari, changing out all the icons and graphics used by Safari. I wouldn't have gone to Safari so quickly without this ability because I truly can't stand the default look of Safari. I'm currently using a theme called Phoenity (available from the SafarIcon homepage or from www.phoenity.com), and all of its icons are simple, with bright colors, and very easy to distinguish their intended function (including the add-to-bookmarks and stop icons). As well, I'd recommend Metallifizer from www.unsanity.com to kill the brushed metal look in Safari (and any other Cocoa app). The lack of brushed metal and the use of a good looking theme have given Safari what I consider nearly perfect looks and layout.
Perl - $Just @when->$you ${thought} s/yn/tax/ &couldn\'t %get $worse;
Actually, I do acknowledge a bunch of your points. I agree that Opera takes some getting used to, especially with the "Transfers" window.
:)
As for feature creep, Opera has had a number of features added and even removed over the years, and it's still fast and very small. (3-4 MB w/o Java, 12 MB with)
Your analogy with the tools is accurate, and I guess I'm the guy with the Leatherman. I'd just like to add my observation that Opera's UI can be stripped down quite quickly, if that's your aim, and I'd rather be able to pare down excessive features than not have enough, especially if that excess doesn't mean code bloat.
Vive la difference, anyway.
I wonder if you're a troll or just someone who likes to sounds clever?
Most Windows installers maximize their window, whereas all common Mac installers just use a regular window.
How many Windows users do actually minimize the installer screen though? How many just sit watching its pretty blue bar?
Oh! Now in this paragraph we can all see you're not talking about installers on the Mac after all, you're talking about you're talking about the Quicktime for Windows installer. The fact you cannot minimize it sounds annoying, true. However, as you point out you can always press Windows-M to get rid of it. Or Alt-Tab one assumes...?
So infact the set of users who are effected by this issue comes down to those people who
In other words, its a tiny annoyance in Apple's Windows installer which, while it should be corrected, has almost no effect on anyone...
Have you actually any examples, beyond vague suggestions that the Mac "File Manager" wasn't multi-threaded enough in Mac OS X 10.0 ? I mean, I wouldn't claim its perfect even in 10.2, but then I've used Windows NT and its "File Manager" for over half a decade now, and you know, it has a few threading issues too. I don't want to be rude, but other than your poorly constructed installer rant, you don't actually seem to have any examples.
Of course, you have links you could share with us to actual profiling results showing comparisons between MacOS, Windows and Linux (et al.). These show conclusively where "responsiveness differences" occur, and then proceed to demonstrate how these are surely caused by the Mach micro kernel and not any other factor like, just for example: hardware or boneheaded programing in the File Manager or GUI?
Please do post such material. It would be very interesting.
Lord Pixel - The cat who walks through walls
A little bigger on the inside than out
Safari doesn't appear to respect your preferred FTP client setting. I used MoreInternet (the successor to Vince; it's by the same guy in fact) to change my preferred FTP client to Transmit, and Safari still insists on using the Finder.
Woh, as of a few months ago the finder didn't handle FTP shares properly (you could only browse a parent directory). Now it seems to work perfectly. This must have been fixed with the 10.2.4 or 2.5 update :)
:))
If it were not for this post I would've never noticed this.
(now let's see if SFTP works
"Things are more moderner than before- bigger, and yet smaller- it's computers-- San Dimas High School football RULES!"
If you open multiple web-pages from with-in a folder in your bookmarks bar 'Open in Tabs' you can revert back to the original page by clicking command+left arrow (safari arrow not on your keyboard ) and it will close all tabs in mid-download and send you back to the previous web-page.
If you notice, this browser is 10.2 meg. After doing a get info on the file, I noticed that it supported languages that I would never use. To make your Safari smaller, do a get info on it, click the languages arrow and remove all the langs you don't want/need.
Removing French, German and Japanese brought the file size down to 7.6 meg.
- Zav - Imagine a Beowulf cluster of insensitive clods...
Just about every piece of Windows software I have installed asks you to quit all other Windows software while you do the install. And quite often the install software fills the whole screen.
And usually they want you to reboot afterwards.
Phhhhhht Phhhhht
I can "voila" anytime I want, and you can't stop me.
Voila voila voilavoilavoila voila voila!
I can viola too, but that's more strictly regulated.
-fred
Sign #11 of Slashdot overdose: You see the phrase 'moderate Republican' and you wonder if that would be a +1 or a -1.
I love Safari, and I wouldn't be caught dead without my Leatherman.
I look at it this way: I have a computer. It has lots and lots of useful little tools in it. When I'm sitting in front of it, I can afford to use the right tool for the job. I have a toolbox. It has lots and lots of useful little tools in it. When I have my toolbox with me, I can afford to use the right tool for the job.
When I'm in the dance hall helping the gentleman set up his sound system and a Very Important Screw falls out, and I don't have my toolbox, I get out my Leatherman.
Sadly, what this means is the only time I'd be interested in Opera is when I don't have my computer in front of me. And I don't think they've ported it to my brain yet.
-fred
Sign #11 of Slashdot overdose: You see the phrase 'moderate Republican' and you wonder if that would be a +1 or a -1.
Every time. Upon the entry of my password. So it's the best browser I can't use.
Still doesn't work in Safari
But hey, they hate me so much on that site that maybe it's a good thing
This
...as when they said it about Microsoft.
> You seem to be saying that if nobody uses Camino, then Camino will not be used. Yes, indeed.
> If people stop using Caminio, it will be because they are using something better.
Well, no. Ninety-some percent of people will never switch from their default browser, better, worse, or indifferent. If you define 'better' as 'requires no effort to obtain', then your hypothesis becomes true. Otherwise it is not.
-fred
Sign #11 of Slashdot overdose: You see the phrase 'moderate Republican' and you wonder if that would be a +1 or a -1.
NM
This is exactly what Safari does!
;) much nicer. It took me a couple days to actually try this before I realized how it worked.
Set it to "open in current window" with tabs switched on and you're set. This makes using any of those search-helper apps (ie: Searchling or iSeek
Sanity is not statistical.
I actually paid for OmniWeb way before Safari came out. And OmniWeb still does some things better than Safari, such as bookmark management. I haven't moved my bookmarks over 'cuz I think OmniWeb does it better...and I haven't found an easy way to do it. :-)
And I still have IE, I'm afraid. Some websites still work correctly with IE when they bork on OmniWeb or Safari. For example, the help system with TaxCut borks with Safari, but works with IE. (At least when loading.) For some reason IE handles wierd javascript and such (like some chats I used) better than anything.
"Where quality is like a dead stinking rat - you just can't miss it."
Fantastic rendering speed compared to Mozilla. I may have a new favourite.
No matter how cynical you become, it's never enough to keep up.
Safari is faster, but Mozilla 1.4a allows you to tailor popup blocking per domain .
This is important for me b/c my employer's Outlook Web Access doesn't work when popups are blocked globally - and who wants to go in and keep selecting/deselecting it?
Camino is easy to check and uncheck it b/c it isn't buried as deep, but it's still better implemented in Mozilla 1.4a that I am running.
Now, if I could just get used to using this tiny Macally micro mouse. Wow, 3 buttons and a scroll wheel in OSX, whoda thunk it?
The much acclaimed Father Randy "Pudge" O'Day finally makes his appearance on Slashdot!!
M*_M_A_C_S_ _A_R_E_ _H_O_M_O_ _M_A_C_S_ _A_R_E_*H
A_/_____\____REPENT___\___NOW______/____\_______O
C|___I___|____AND_BUY__\_A_MAC____|______|______M
S|__LOVE_`.__Call_1-800-NAMBLA____|_______:_____O
_`___M____|_____________|________\|_______|______
A_\__A____|_/_______/__\\\___--___\\_______:____M
R__\__C___\/____--~~__________~--__|_\_____|____A
E___\__S___\_-~____________________~-_\____|____C
_____\______\_________.--------.______\|___|____S
H______\_____\______//_________(_(__>__\___|_____
O_______\___.__C____)_________(_(___>___|__/____A
M_______/\_|___C_____)/_STEVE\_(____>___|_/_____R
O______/_/\|___C_____)|_BLOW_|__(___>___/__\____E
______|___(____C_____)\_JOBS_/__//__>_/_____\____
M_____|____\__C_____\\_________//_(__/_______|__H
A____|_\____\____)___`----___--'_____________|__O
C____|__\______________\_______/____________/_|_M
S___|_M____________/____|_____|__\__I__G______|_O
____|_A_W_________|____/_APPLE_\__\__M__H_____|__
A___|_D_I_A____/_/____|__xServe_|__\_____E _____|M
R___|_E_T_____/_/______\__/\___/____|_____Y____|A
E__|____H_M__/_/________|_C__|_______|_________|C
___|______A___|_________|_A__|_______|_________|S
H__|______C__|__________|_T__|_______|_________|_
O__|_________|__________|_5__|_______|_________|_
*M_O_ _M_A_C_S_ _A_R_E_ _H_O_M_O_ _M_A_C_S_ A_R_*
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Important Stuff: Please try to keep posts on topic. Try to reply to other people's comments instead of starting new threads. Read other people's messages before posting your own to avoid simply duplicating what has already been said. Use a clear subject that describes what your message is about. Offtopic, Inflammatory, Inappropriate, Illegal, or Offensive comments might be moderated. (You can read everything, even moderated posts, by adjusting your threshold on the User Preferences Page)
Actually it does browse ftp, only it does it differently. It opens an ftp site as a disk volume on the Desktop. (took me a while to figure that out too.) You can then go through the folders and manipulate things just like a disk volume.
I find that Opera is almost always the first browser to introduce these types of features. For example, "tabbed browsing" is mostly an incomplete imitation of Opera 1's MDI. Features like saving window setups (and opening them on startup) were first introduced on Opera. "Continue browsing from last session" is currently native to Opera and IE frontends.
If you don't want the status bar visible, you can also see the details for a link by dragging a link.
While it is being dragged, you get a nice translucent grey box containing the name and URL of the link.
Come on, Apple. The beauty of tabs in an implentation such as that found in Camino lies in allowing the user to keep a mental picture of what's on each tab, then click away freely to switch between them. With Safari, you have to watch where you click - and the first time you accidentally close a tab in which you were writing a post, you'll know what I mean.
What's more, you can make the case that having a single tab-closing button in one place requires less concentration generally. Less concentration makes the browser transparent, which it should be. The UI should not be fiddly and fraught; Safari's is, just now.
I was dragging a URL to the toolbar, and I got an interesting dialog saying:
.Mac care to investigate?
You cannot change bookmarks now.
iSync is synchronizing your bookmarks so you
cannot modify them. Try again in a moment.
Does the new Safari sync bookmarks? Anyone with a
While I don't particularly mind the tabs being upside-down, my eyes are so accustomed to normal tabs that my brain keeps thinking the selected tab is actually the only one NOT selected. My brain is fried anyway, so it's probably just me.
However, I don't think the problem would be so pronounced if Apple would add some curvature and ridges to the unselected tabs to make them appear more obviously attatched to the toolbar.
On the other hand, Apple could just Think Different and move the whole toolbar from the top to the bottom of the window with the tabs first, so that they look right-side up, but still attatch to the brushed metal panel. Of course, that's a little drastic. Still, it would be cool as a preference setting.
A better solution would be to put the tab bar in the title bar. Unused space in the tab bar, when available, could double as a status bar. It would save a bunch of screen space while eliminating the redundant rendering of the title for the selected tab. Side benefit would be a more intuitive tab orientation.
Everyone's a critic. If I get annoyed enough, I'll just roll my own.
the parent clearly was referring to control-click not command-click =)
Until Safari can bookmark a set of tabs like Mozilla, they're just playing catch-up.
Still good to see tabs in Safari finally.
for some reason, software update tells me there are no updates available...