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Low-power FM Transmitters Banned in UK
Acey writes "The BBC News is reporting that the Griffin iTrip falls foul of the UK Wireless Telegraphy Act 1949 (PDF). In short, the iTrip is an unlicensed FM transmitter and that's not allowed. The UK distributor, A M Micro, have pulled the iTrip. More ominously they warn that "Use of the iTrip in the UK therefore constitutes an offence and can lead to prosecution of the User". Guess that makes me an outlaw, because you'll have to pry my iTrip from my cold, dead hands."
Any rewards for turning people in?
sounds like they want to keep the air free of interference. Aren't there lots of pirate radio stations in England?
How exactly will they enforce this? Will it be like a second degree offence, like seat belts are in some US states?
"What we have here is a failure to communicate"
The Warden, Cool Hand Luke
For all you people (like myself) who had no idea what iTrip is/was, here's the link from googles cache.
From the page: You are looking at the coolest iPod accessory in the world. The iTrip FM transmitter for the iPod can play your music through any FM radio in your car, at a party, wherever the mood strikes you - and you have a radio.
How can someone with nothing but a CD player/radio in their car, listen to their iPod on their car stereo, except by using the iTrip?
Corporation, n. An ingenious device for obtaining individual profit without individual responsibility. - Ambrose Bierce
Walkie-talkies should be banned as their signals can be picked up by an FM receiver (at least my old action man ones could, although the range was about 3 metres)
What about the Neuros' built-in low-power FM transmitting capability? Are those illegal to use in the UK also? It all seems a bit excessive to me, considering the tiny range.
Ita erat quando hic adveni.
This could/can be the begining of eclectic microstations. You can tune into a 24/7 iTrip at work/your building/bus stop etc., instead of listening to one of big conglomerate boring stations.
My other sig is an ambulance!
Some early/mid 90's cars with cd players added in the trunk broadcast on like channel 88. something, which is what the user tunes to, to listen to cds.
(This is before 6 cd changers in-dash existed)
This is the same thing. Would these be illegal in the UK too?
There's **SO** many places where you can BUY FM bugs in the UK despite the fact that to USE them is illegal, and the position on radio scanners and traffic speed detectors is pretty much the same -- yet you don't read about the suppliers being prosecuted day in day out, so I guess AM Micro is being a tad over-cautious.
AT&ROFLMAO
Seems excessive, but if you lived in an apartment complex, you could have some serious fun with one of these things broadcasting to the station your neighbor happens to be listening to. :)
This law was written in 1949! Probably to stop people from setting up unlicensed radio stations (ie. commercial FM). These devices didn't exist!
On the one side, I can understand the Governments position:
Thou Shalt Not have Unlicensed Radio Transmitters.
This is important, because if just anybody set up shop, soon the radio waves would be a mess of people just putting stuff out, and nobody could hear the station they wanted too - just the one with the biggest pen- ah, broadcast antennae.
On the other hand, I think the range of this thing is - what - 10 to 30 feet? Watch out, Britian! Those pirate radios will be able to be heard from the other room! Anarchy and chaos as Julie tries to dance to Nsync while Dad's got his iPod broadcasting the Spice Girls in the other room! Mum - you'd best be keeping that "Black Mages" heavy metal to yourself!
This seems more like an issue of someone in beurocracy[SIC] getting a bug up their ass and not using common sense more than anything else.
52 Weeks, 52 Religions with John Hummel
So, like, is a Mr. Microphone illegal in the U.K.? And did I just date myself by mentioning Mr. Microphone?
It Is the Nature of Information to Transgress Artificial Boundaries
-Guess that makes me an outlaw, because you'll have to pry my iTrip from my cold, dead hands.
No, it would just take a uniformed constable. Let's not overestimate ourselves here.
I've tried a few such devices for hooking my MP3 player to my car, and they all sucked. Interference, bad tuning, low power etc.
Just suck it up and either get a head unit with AUX inputs (usually a headphone jack on the front) or get the neat doodad that allows you to use the inputs for the trunk-mounted CD changer that you don't use any more since you bought your iPod. Google PIE and AUX for distributors of those boxes.
Works the same in sweden, and it works good too.
Imagine, watching good TV without brainwashing commercials every ten minutes.
Warning: This sig contains a small bug. ==> *
GriffinTech should be paying for this spot because I never heard of this thing and I just plopped down my credit card! $35 + Shipping. It is the coolest thing around. I can't wait to use this....no more wires plugging into a tape deck!
Ignored Since 1973
Many years ago I remember reading a British electronics hobbyist magazine which had an article on how to build a metal detector. There was a warning that before using it you needed to go to a government office and get a pipe finders license.
This is no exaggeration. I had no TV for 6 years and those gits hounded me relentlessly. They kept sending me threatening letters warning of a possible 1000 fine for not having a TV license even though I didn't have a TV. They made me sign a form declaring that I had no TV set, which I did, and then they sent me another one, and another one, and I phoned them and told them and then they sent and inspector to my house!
When I moved house, they started sending the letters again, which I signed and returned. A week or two later a poster went up on the billboard across the road saying "3 addresses at Himalayan Way do not have Television Licenses. We know who they are."
I was so tempted to go out with a can of paint and write "At least one of them has no TV set" but I didn't. A year later I bought a TV and a damned license. Now I spend too much time as a TV zombie and not enough time writing code.
Television is a powerful opiate and population control machanism. I admire people who can control it. I'm succumbing again.
Stick Men
It seems like the legislature, the broadcasters, and the consumers, ought to be able to work out an exception provision to the existing laws.
Specifically, they ought to allow unlicensed transmitters below a certain output power (anyone know what the iTrip's broadcast power is?).
I mean, the spectrum licensees have a vested and understable interest in keeping their airwaves free of interference, but I don't think low-power transmissions like these had been envisioned when the law was codefied (receivers were a wee bit less sensitive and precise in 1949, methinks).
Xentax
You shouldn't verb words.
You'll have to pry my iTrip from my cold, dead hands.
Whatever you say, Charlie
I mean, can't they ratify laws to allow low power FM devices access? The transmission radius of the device is a meer 10 to 30 feet. Indeed, it runs off an extremely low power input and wouldn't have the power to transmit very far anyway. I'd be surprise if it *COULD* interfere with other cars' radios.
I think it'd be simpler and more economically beneficial to ratify the law to allow LPFM devices on the market. They're obviously allowed in the USA. Indeed, take a look at the 300-in-1 electronics kits from Radio Shack, which allow one to build one's own LPFM transmitter.
I just checked the specs - there's not going to be any frequency drift (it has a PLL) and complies to FCC specifications. Granted these are US specifications...
I simply don't see the point in denying a market for a neat (and harmless) transmitter.
I'm not even sure that it's possible to boost the power on these devices to expand the transmission radius -- this would likely cause a need for circuit redesign. Those are my thoughts, anyway. IANAEE.
www.sitetronics.com/wordpress
According to reports, two other countries - Austria and Iceland - have also stopped sales of the iTrip because of problems with radio frequencies.
I remember building FM/AM transmitters as teen, cool to be my own DJ...America still home of the free!!!
Wise men speak because they have something to say, Fools because they have to say something!!!!
Geeze, just think about it. I don't know the laws in the surrounding (ok, nearby) nations, but think of the black market for these now. An easy 500% price increase to anyone selling one. Remember when blue jeans were going for $500 or so in the USSR? So will this create a nasty black market for a simple, innocent device or will it force the legislators to review the law?
"He uses statistics as a drunken man uses lampposts...for support rather than illumination." - Andrew Lang
Why is this marked as informative? It shows gross ignorance. The BBC is independent of the government via mandate. In fact, the BBC seems to institutionally take the stance when reporting the news that anything from the government must wrong, irrespective of whether they're left, right or centre. The BBC isn't owned, or controlled or funded by the government. The only possible hold the government has is over the renewing of the BBC's license (is the right term?), which is generally valid for longer than the maximum length of time the current government can sit before they have to call a general election.
How will I pick up the chicks? How will I karoake? How will I LIVE?!?!?!
In short; more paranoia from the music regulatory authorities. A couple of milliwatts of power - an iTrip probably has less range than the average infra-red remote control.
I'm patiently waiting for them to begin outlawing that part of the electromagnetic spectrum ... :-/
Alison
"It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education." - Albert Einstein
The FM range 88 - 108 MHz has been used for wireless microphones for ages - how are these Griffin Itrips any different?
Video Game cheats, hints a
Isn't the iTrip just like any of the dozens of other low power FM transmitters on the market today? I recall using one years ago with my JVC DiscMan, and I know they were around even back to the handheld cassette player days, for playing those on your car stereo. I've personally got an iRock for my pod for road trips.
The USA has a limit (what is it, 10mW?) that anything running under that transmit strength doesn't have to be licensed because it's too weak to cause interferance. My iRock has a range of about 15 feet from my truck, on an empty station. I sometimes have to switch its channel though because even sitting on my dash, 2 feet from my antenna, it can still be overpowered by local radio stations along my route. I don't see how the UK's equivelant of the FCC seriously considers this any kind of hazard.
I understand different countries will have different regulations etc., but is this a case of the UK completely banning any such devices, or is it just a case of Apple neglecting to get a license for the iTrip in the UK, and the UK deciding to make an example of 'zero tolerance' of their airwave laws?
I work for the Department of Redundancy Department.
Why the fuss over low power FM? Because it allows anyone to become a broadcaster or content creator. By raising the specter of 'interference', broadcasters and others can FUD the legislatures into banning enabling technologies like this.
I want to delete my account but Slashdot doesn't allow it.
The BBC does not have a monopoloy on broadcasting in Britain.
erroneous: look me up in a dictionary
Only rich ponces have automatic door openers. Anyway, haven't you been to Britain? You'll find virtually every road in residential areas are half blocked by cars parked in every which way possible. No need for automatic garage doors.
"Use of the iTrip in the UK therefore constitutes an offence and can lead to prosecution of the User". Guess that makes me an outlaw, because you'll have to pry my iTrip from my cold, dead hands."
This view seems to becoming more prevalent. An illegal action or device is banned or otherwise action taken against, and people just ignore it because it doesnt suit them. This device is illegal, and it hasnt even just been made illegal, its been illegal for a good number of decades, so under what premise do you think you should be allowed to continue using it? I bet you will be crying foul if you get caught!
Yes this device is low powered, but that doesnt matter. Under the aformentioned act, it is illegal, and if you want to use one, then please speak to your local MP! Do not start ignoring laws that inconvienince you, as this is where anarchy starts to creep in.
I can hear the cries for compensation for these now useless devices already, either from the UK government or the company that sold them. I dont think you should get a refund or compensation from either source, as they are covered under an already existing law, and you should have checked the legality of these items before you purchased.
Your best course of action now, to recover your costs? Ebay the suckers i think.
Indeed. I live in the US, I don't own a TV (CNN and Faux News? No thanks). I get much of my news from the BBC's website. Government-controlled? Is that why Blair and Alistair Campbell and friends are so upset with them lately?
The UK has *not* just passed a new law banning the iTrip specifically or deliberately, as half the posters on slashdot seem to believe.
The distributors of the iTrip, having taken legal advice, have decided that use of the iTrip probably constitutes a breach of an old law about FM broadcasting and have therefore chosen not to distribute it here.
Nothing has actually changed and British police are not about to start hunting down people with suspicious bulges on the top of their iPods.
erroneous: look me up in a dictionary
You would be correct if the BBC was the only game in town, but then we have a number of independant broadcasters as well. If you watch any of the BBC's output you will find the government has little to do with what the broadcast. In fact, if you are following the news at the moment over here, there is a major row going on between the government and the BBC over who said what over Weapons of Mass Destruction and the suicide of Dr. Kelly.
Television is a powerful opiate and population control machanism. I admire people who can control it. I'm succumbing again.
Dude, it's time to kill your TV!
Alison
"It is a miracle that curiosity survives formal education." - Albert Einstein
It's really cool and broadcasts a LOT farther than it says in the manual - it supposed to only broadcast within 10 feet but when we went camping, it was transmitting w/o any problems up to 60 feet. We had two cars' stereos tuned to the same station and playing music ranging from old-school rap to Skinny Puppy and other weird stuff. People who were walking by were very confused.
Has anyone tried this in heavy, slow traffic?
All countries regulate use of the wireless spectrum. It's just that in Britain the exemptions for low-power devices don't happen to cover this kind of device, unlike the USA apparently. Nothing to do with the music industry at all.
This has nothing to DO with the FCC. We're talking about the UK here.
Honey, I shrunk the Cygwin
And we all know the FCC has a lot of power over in the UK... ;)
I dunno who it is
but it prolly is fhqwhgads.
Balls: then we'd get the sham that passes for mass media in the US. It's bad enough we have to put up with the crap pumped out by Channel 5, ITV and Sky.
The BBC is about as trustworthy as broadcast journalism can get.
I don't own one, but my brother does; IIRC, the iTrip can broadcast on one of four FM frequencies: 89.1, 89.3, 89.5, or 89.7. This is because frequencies that low are usually only taken by local college/community stations, and most commercial stations use a frequency from 90.1 on up.
A conversation a friend of mine who lived in W1 (Very central London) recounted having:
"Sir, do you have a TV license?"
"Nope."
"Do you have a TV?"
"Nope."
"We detected a TV from our van, inside your property."
"No you didn't. Must be a mistake."
"Sir, I can hear the EastEnder's theme coming from inside your appartment."
"You must be imagining it."
"Sir, if we need to, we can get a warrant to enter the premises and be back within the hour."
"No you can't."
"Yes we can Sir, the courts look very favorably upon our requests."
"They look even less favorably upon giving search warrants to enter property belonging to the Queen."
"Oh. Well... You really should get a license."
The joys of the royal family owning half the best properties in the city.
Knowing the RIAA, they will most likely follow suit... We wouldn't want anyone thinking they have become 'softies' would we? Honestly, I don't see the problem here, since it seems that this transmitter/jammer is of low power consumption, it is reasonable to assume that it's transmission properties could not spread to far from the source of the Jammer itself... Not to say the RIAA won't want in on this as well. After all, they have the image of 'Big Brother' to uphold...
Business \Busi"ness\, n.;
A scam in which all people involved perceive as beneficial...
Why not just use a tape adaptor? I had one that came with my DiscMan, and I use it with my iPod in the car all the time. Just plug it in the iPod's headphone jack.
Seriously, I don't see what the fuss over these mini FM transmitters is all about. They're bulky and require their own batteries. For car use, I'd much rather use a tape adaptor.
Err... doubt it, for a start the UK isn't part of the US (for the time being at least).
Secondly the BPI (British Phonographic Industry - UK equivalent of RIAA) is surprisingly pro-downloading (legally of course) see this BBC News Story on downloads eventually replacing record shop sales of singles. To quote Mr Jamieson - executive chairman of BPI (on erradication of kazza "in due course") "I think you've got to grow viable legitimate alternatives so you can genuinely say to the consumer 'hey, stop stealing."
Bollocks! It's no worse (probably better) than in America where some people have to pay association fees just to live in their house and have their environment controlled by nazis running around with clipboards quoting the rules. That isn't anything to do with the government either. Haha! The land of the free!
Hmm yes the Recording Industry Association of AMERICA traveled BACK IN TIME to post-WW2 Great Britain and wrote legislation to ban devices that make use of the FM spectrum so that 54 years later they could force a distributor of an iPod accessory in the UK via a mole they planted in the company to read the law and after speaking w/ the Radio Agency conclude that the device is illegal there.
Next they'll use their nifty time travel technology to go back and assure that Victrola loses to Eddison so that his proprietary cylindrical records become the standard instead of the easy to use flat Victrolas...
COME ON MAN, GET A GRIP
Maxim: People cannot follow directions.
Increases in truth directly with the length of time spent explaining them
"Dude, it's time to kill your TV!"
After you kill your TV, you can burn all your books, toss your radio in the river, and shred your magazines.
The joys of censorship. Can't have those bad ideas enter, ever!
BBC is not the only broadcaster.. but AFAIK you must pay up if you want to watch absolutely anything on TV (even if you plan on NEVER watching BBC), and the money goes ONLY to the BBC, right?
In Britain.
In 19-frickin-49.
Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
Yes I realize you're not a guy, so don't take the 'Man' bit personally. ^_-
Maxim: People cannot follow directions.
Increases in truth directly with the length of time spent explaining them
Really? Where is all that TV-licensing money going, then?
In the UK if you operate a TV set or other device capable of recieving and decoding TV signals you have to have a TV licence to pay for the running of the BBC, including radio. Note, you don't need a TV license if you only have a radio, even though the BBC has several radio stations, one of which is excellent and far better than any TV station I've ever seen.
Stick Men
That's a privately owned village. It's on a steep hill on the coast, they have land rovers to take people up and down.
It's the same in Germany. I call this TV/radio license thing THEFT.
And now it's the best part, let's say you have a TV, you pay the licence. HAVE YOU EVER WATCHED for example "Seinfeld" in GERMAN ?!?!
I am about to get one of these, and the fact thats its illegal wont make any difference (see: hash). Dispite thinking its a little out of whack, I can see the reasoning. If I lived next door to someone who had one of these, and they played spice girls on repeat, and coincidently on my fave band, I think it would piss me of somewhat. Paul.
BBC Monopoly
WTF planet are you on? There is no monopoly. On Sky I can receive hundreds of TV channels - mostly trash.
I doubt many commercial channels would screen 2 hour quality documentaries on Gaugin, Orwell or Larkin (just 3 examples from the last month or so)
For less than 0.30/day you get a variety of TV stations, radio stations, digital channels, one of the best news websites in the world and relative impartiality
--
This sig is inoffensive.
no Channel 4 / S4C also gets some i believe
The wireless telegraphy act makes sense. We're only a small country and a typical radio FM transmitter can cover a fair proportion (about 1/10-1/20) of the population. Just my twiddling a screw in most FM transmitters, you can get it to broadcast on any frequency, and (for instance) stick it in your local neighbourhood and broadcast something other than your local radio station on a specific frequency. Video senders (boxes that transmit video signals over UHF and FM bandwidths so a TV upstairs can pick it up) were banned for a while for similar reasons. They found a way to make them legal and everything was fine :-)
The UK government announces a total ban on these additional products that emit energy in regulated broadcast frequencies including: electric razors, motorized childs' toys, internal combustion engines that use spark plugs, bug zappers, light dimmers, flourescent light fixtures, arc welders, and any toy rubber balloon that is marketed primarily for rubbing against wool or hair. Additional banned items may be announced in the future as more products are evaluated.
There are plenty of licensed frequencies for things like that - 458MHz for starters (if my memory serves) - just they're not in the FM band. UK X10 RF controllers (eg, from www.letsautomate.co.uk) use 458MHz.
Come to think of it, I don't think garage door openers in the states are in the FM band either.
The US is more the exception than the rule; many countries ban transmission in the FM band - it's just the US has a get-out for very low power transmitters.
Since the laws require a licence for any body to run a radio station,UK and more commonly London have a lot of pirate radio stations mainly in the FM band.
. .almost everything on earth.In fact some of the more popular pirate stations have made it mainstream.
Take your radio and scan and you can listen to latin,salsa,spanish,french,grunge,garage,hip-hop.
So this is no big deal except that you cant buy this little gizmo anymore in the high street.
Wanted : A Signature.
But how do they open garage doors in the UK?
Using a very small band around 413Mhz which is a licence exempt free for all for low powere transmitters.
There are still unlicensed frequency bands over here, just not in the range that FM radio uses.
Mostly high frequency... around the frequency that Wifi broadcasts is considered to be useless for commercial exploitation, so doesn't need the license. You can get video senders that broadcast over the same frequency, for example. Sucks if someone in a nearby house has a microwave, or a taxi goes past, or a train, or just about anything else that uses RF.
The CBC in Canada is owned by the government, and although there are still commercial stations, the CBC often times has much higher quality news and entertainment programming because they don't have to worry as much about making shitty television to just get ratings and advertising, so they can take more risks.
Besides that, Talking to Americans just plain kicks ass.
"Congratulations Canada for getting FM Radio" - Random AmericanWe use stuff that works in permitted frequency bands so it's not illegal.
AT&ROFLMAO
and the money goes ONLY to the BBC, right?
Nope. ITV, C4 and C5 get some money, as do the various ITV channels
You pay for the fact that with the BBC you're not always getting the lowest common denominator and the fact they're not allowed to use advertising.
--
This sig is inoffensive.
Common mistake. In the UK if you operate a TV set or other device which recieves and decodes TV signals Orignating from the UK you have to have a TV licence.
The money raised from the TV License goes to several areas, including the running of BBC TV and Radio, subsidising public service broadcasts on other channels (Channel 4), and running TVL.
Sheesh, they have programs on US television? Whenever I've been in a hotel I channel-surfed for ages but could only find advertisements.
Dating yourself is a tradition among slashdot readers, and...oh, you meant...I thought that you were talking about...never mind
I live here in the UK (London) and I have never heard so many pirate stations. They are the only good radio stations here. As if this will matter.
-- Karma Karma Karma Karma, Karma Chameleon - Boy George
How does this affect CD changers that use the same trick - namely transmitting a low power FM signal that your car stereo can pick up?
No, nobody is going to bother to enforce the law. It it doesn't cause a problem who cares? It is a complete non-story.
Like the ability of Freemen of London to heard sheep (or not) over London Bridge lots of laws lie around long after the environment they related to has changed out of all recognition.
I think the range of this thing is - what - 10 to 30 feet?
Excuse my ignorance - information please. Would the iTrip be broadcasting on frequencies that might be used by emergency services (fire, ambulance, police..)? This is usually one of the 'safety' reasons for being unhappy about illegal broadcasting that UK gov. gives when having a go at pirate radio stations.
What is the distance these things can broadcast to? In the UK, 30 feet can quite easily mean from your room right into the middle of the town high street (lots of UK towns still follow mediaeval street plans). So I guess if they *do* broadcast on channels the govt. wants to use, and they *do* broadcast 30 feet, the govt *will* be upset. Don't want dead spots down the street where old Bill can't pick up base station...
...or like the huge cockroach in MiB:
"Your proposal is acceptable!"
...not something that will ever catch on in the US.
The part of the US radio regulations which make these devices is Part 15, which specifically addresses low-powered unlicensed devices on a variety of bands. It spells out maximum power outputs and antenna lengths for these devices on AM, FM, the 49 MHz kiddie walkie-talkie band, and so on. Obviously Britain has no such analogous regulation, which is a shame because Part 15 devices seduced many a kid into exploring the magic of electronics.
Brackets contain world's first nanosig, highly magnified:[.]
I don't imagine too many people want to listen to silence. Seeing as the UK is not within the footprint of the XM birds it would be awful useless to have an XM radio there.
Barring that, it seems to me that there is no provision for low-powered FM devices. Remember those FM microphones that you could use as a kid to annoy your parents and everyone else within ear shot and radio range? What about those too?
Heh, I was just trying to remember which episode that was ...
Radio Bart
YS
"Arrr! The laws of science be a harsh mistress." -- Bender
stop ... makingfunof ... William. Shatner.
... inspiration. to ... us ... all.
Heisan
In the US, Part 15 of the FCC regulations governs unlicensed radio transmitters, and basically says two things: first, there are specific bands where you can operate unlicensed with specified power levels (like the 902-928 and 2.4GHz bands), and second, you can transmit anywhere else, including the broadcast bands, with much lower power levels (not specified in actual transmitter power, but in microvolts/meter of received signal strength at a specified difference).
Thus, all these very low power transmitters that talk in the broadcast bands are legal here.
Many other countries don't have nearly so liberal a policy about unlicensed transmitters -- that's why WiFi isn't technically legal in some places (like the Caribbean island that was the topic of an article a few weeks ago) and gadgets like this aren't allowed in the UK.
Although we like to bitch about "big gummint" in the US, at least in the communications arena US policies are far more open than in other parts of the world.
Another (off topic) example: radio scanner enthusiasts here like to complain because it's illegal to listen to cellular phone transmissions. But we can listen to damn near anything else, including police radio, while in many countries listening to any non-broadcast (or non-ham) radio service is strictly forbidden.
Wow.
What if (like me) you only watch DVDs on your TV? I'm not using the signal, would I still pay a licence?
Here in the US, I'm hounded by the cable company, but it's not like they can fine me.
Section 1 of the WT Act 1949 forbids the installation or use of wireless telegraphy equipment (radio) in the UK mainland including Northern Ireland and territorial waters, the Isle of Man and the Channel Islands, unless:
- an appropriate licence has been obtained from the Secretary of State,
- there are in force Regulations exempting it from licensing.
Short range radio devicesMore and more convenience devices now utilise radio in their operation. Car alarms, wireless door chimes and garage door openers are common examples. Unfortunately not all of these are manufactured in accordance with the relevant technical requirements. The use of non-compliant equipment, is an offence and can lead to interference to authorised users of radio.
It is an offence contrary to the RTTE Regulations to place on the market non-compliant apparatus.
The whole point is spectrum is regulated in the UK and unless the equipment is licensed, then its illegal to use it.
If this thing worked at an exempt frequency, it would be ok, but because it uses the FM Broadcast bands, its not approved for use.
I would also presume the importer wont sell them simply because they could be prosecuted and would have zero defence.
I hate to be a RTFA kinda guy, but I will. Really, anytime you want to bash the RIAA is fine with me, but just get the facts right. This is in Britain not the US and the RIAA stands for Recording Industry Association of....(wait for it)....America
I just visited the Swedish Mac storeMacoteket. They had the iTrip listed on their front-page. After describing how wonderful the iTrip is they wrote this: OBS! Denna produkt far ej anvandas i Sverige da det kan innebara storningar pa andra FM sandningar! (Quick Translation: NOTE! This product cannot be used in Sweden since it can create interference with other FM broadcasts!) However, you can still buy it if you wished (I have no money for an iPod, so there is little sense for me to get one).
In response to "you'll have to pry my iTrip from my cold, dead hands."
Your Proposal is Acceptable.
Now, where's a giant space cockroach when you need it.
myke
Mimetics Inc. Twitter
You yanks just don't get it
The BBC is separate from government by issue of it's Royal Charter.
If you think they're government lapdogs, speak to Alistair Campbell.
--
This sig is inoffensive.
... that the British Nazis are harassing people into getting a TV?
;->
George Bush is going to have to pick up on that one. It's a ton cheaper than the mind control satellites, now that we don't have a space shuttle to service the uploads (remember the bandwidth of a space-shuttle full of backup tapes...)
Okay, and as per a previous "funny" response to one of my posts, just so you know whether to laugh with me or at me...
Correct Horse Battery Staple: 72 bits of entropy. Enter "Correct H" into google. When it generates the phrase, that's
It also has nothing to do with the RIAA. The spectrum is much more closely regulated in the UK than it is here. That's all there is to it.
I guess Britney and all the other pop stars are screwed now that they can't use their wireless microphones in the UK!
"Freedom means freedom for everybody" -- Dick Cheney
Ok, so a Ronco "Mr. Microphone", or an iMrMicrophone would be illegal... should Karaoke in general be outlawed ? I wouldn't want that one put to a vote !
And what about those McDonalds drive-thrus, I think they us FM band ? So do garage door openers and baby monitors !
"Whoever would overthrow the liberty of a nation must begin by subduing the freeness of speech."--Benjamin Franklin
Um, it's the UK, dipstick!
I've tried to use these FM transmitters before, and I find them completly worthless. Sure you can find an empty radio station and broadcast your pirate music there, but if you're traveling around, I find that I need to find a new "blank" station every 1/2 hour or so.
Pick the strongest radio station in your city. If the transmitter can't overpower that station while you're driving around, then I don't see the point. Especially if you drive long distances, and the radio stations keep changing.
The bulk of the Wireless Telegraphy Act seems to be aimed at preventing the interference of communique to & from commercial and transport vessels.
That's fine and dandy, but the iTrip does not transmit on frequencies outside of the F.M. spectrum.
If telegraphy is the use or operation of a telegraph apparatus or system for communication, then how is transmitting a low-level FM signal viewed as an interferance? Following this logic wouldn't high-level FM signals be violation of the same act?
You need a license to own a device capable of receiving television signals, whether broadcast via cable, satellite, FTA, or internet. This includes VCRs, teletext/CC decoders, TV capture cards, etc
Unless you are watching a DVD on a dumb monitor, you have to pay.
If the RIAA was dark-hearted enough to go after broke college radio stations and really small internet radio stations, they'll flip about this.
Couldn't happen to nicer folks.
Go, Springboard, Go!
Godwin's law. Now shut up.
In Briatin you have to pay for a license for anything which lets you watch a TV signal.
As to whether that sucks...IMO what really sucks is having TV shows, movies, even sports games interrupted every 10 minutes for a 5 minutes commercial break. In return for a 190 annual fee, Brits get 2 free-to-air TV stations and 5 national radio stations with NO COMMERCIAL BREAKS. And we're not talking marginalised, underfunded US style public broadcasting - they're the most popular stations in the UK, with rights to most major sporting events, movies, music etc. So you can sit down and watch a 3 hour movie (with stereo sound) right the way through, just like in the cinema. Or a 5 set Wimbledon final, without missing any shots. Not to mention all those original BBC geek classics like Monty Python, Fawlty Towers, Blackadder, Red Dwarf, Hitchikers Guide (originally a BBC radio show), Dr Who...Oh, and the BBC also has several (free) digital radio and TV channels as well.
Another bonus is that because of the competition with the ad-free BBC, commercial broadcasters in Britain restrict themselves to one commercial break every 15 minutes, so even on the 3 free-to-air commercial stations you can follow the plot of most shows without being constantly interrupted by life insurance salesman. Plus they have to compete with the BBC on breadth and quality, meaning that they can't get away with the endless repeats of Frasier and Seinfeld that seem to define primetime on most major US networks.
Now what I don't understand is this: the BBC can put out about 6 TV channels (including the digital ones) and dozens of radio stations (including local radio) for a charge of only 190 per year per household -- without needing any advertising income. This is far less than the cost of most cable or satellite TV subscriptions - and yet cable stations usually have as many commercials as free-to-air stations, and the programs rarely better BBC quality. What do they do with their money?
I guess it just goes to prove that with the right management and funding, publically owned services can outperform the private sector. Although actually I don't have a TV anymore...a DVD player hooked up to a computer monitor supplies the movies without me needing a TV license, radio and the net gives me the rest.
The author of this post asserts his moral rights.
In sweden, it would sound like this:
"Hello, we've noticed you don't pay a television license. Do you have a TV?"
"No"
"We detected a TV from our van, inside your property."
"No you didn't. Must be a mistake."
"Sir, I can hear [insert name of crappy US sitcom here] theme coming from inside your appartment."
"You must be imagining it."
"Sir, if we need to, we can get a warrant to enter the premises and be back within the hour."
"No you can't."
"Damn you right. We can't. But if you don't pay your license we'll taunt you again!"
The television license inspectors do not have the right to enter your house unless you admit them. And they would not get a warrant even if they tried. Only crimes above a certain severity can give them a warrant to enter your house.
Unless I'm going crazy, there are low power radio transmissions entering the Earths atmosphere 24/7. Are they going to make these illegal too? When will it end? When there is no longer anything to make illegal? Good god people. Electromagnetic radiation is something that has exisited in nature long before some "wise guy" invented it. Fruck, how long until the combination of Oxygen and Hydrogen making up breathable atmosphere is patented? Wasn't there a movie where air had to payed for? Next time there is a high solar activity, I'm suing the Sun.
[Loser] No your honor, I didn't realize that I was breaking the law...
[Honor] Order... Order... I will not let this illegal behavior continue in this court... Contempt... Contempt... By talking you are continuing to contempt this court... if you continue, you will pay dearly... now how do you plead?
[Loser] Uhh, I guess I will...
[Honor] Order... Order... there it is again. Plaintiff, constrain this defendent. Now, one last time Loser, how do you plead...
...beat me to it.. that word 'capable' is important. L3K
AT&ROFLMAO
The whole of the world can benefit from the BBC free of charge and advert free (not least the excellent BBC web site; linked from this very /. story) and yet, for some reason, they feel the need to bash the system that allows them to do that. I can understand UKers complaining but then again, the UKers who do complain seem to think the licence fee funds BBC1, BBC2 and nothing else.
Personally, I think the licence fee is outstanding value.
Well you didn't seem to think it worth while.
a 190 annual fee does not seem to be to bad overall it is about the same as basic cable what I wonder is how good is it when you live in the middle of no where england. How many stations do you get then. Or is no where in England that middle of no where?
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
They sent an inspector to me too, but of course I was at work. So I wrote back saying they were welcome to inspect our place, but would they mind visiting after 6pm or on weekends since... surprise surprise, they never called back. I guess they're not _that_ keen...
At the time though I felt a twinge of sympathy for Saddam Hussein. The British government kept telling me that it knew I had banned equipment (an unlicensed TV set). When I denied this they told me they knew I was lying and were going to send in inspectors. And when I offered to cooperate with the inspectors (though on my terms - I'll be damned if I'll be subject to unannounced inspections of my home at any time of the day or night - though Saddam even agreed to that), they pulled them out.
Luckily for me the analogy stops there. Otherwise my flat would be occupied by government agents triumphantly brandishing my laptop as proof that I had a mobile TV-development laboratory that could be turned into a fully functioning device within 45 minutes by the addition of a simple TV tuner card, which they had documentary evidence that I was trying to purchase from Niger...
The author of this post asserts his moral rights.
Whilst there is Middle-England, there are few places in England where you can't get decent TV coverage.
Scotland's a different story though...
--
This sig is inoffensive.
Athletic Scholarships to universities make as much sense as academic scholarships to sports teams.
Besides, this is a stupid device. Using the FM broadcast band for short-range transmission is obsolete technology. In the 1950s, it might have been tolerable. Today, there are too many RF devices around. A product like this should be transmitting in an ISM band using spread-spectrum, like Bluetooth or WiFi. That's legal in the UK. More modern systems handle interference much better.
In the early days of computing, before the FCC cracked down on unwanted emissions from computers, there were major electronic incompatibility problems. If you brought a Milton Bradley Big Trak within a few feet of a TRS-80, both would crash. The FCC clamped down hard on junk RF from computers, which was a big help in making computers a mass-market product.
The mini transmittors of which iTrip is an example, has NEVER been allowed or legal in UK or in the maority of European Union.
In practise you probably can bring an iTrip woth you there, or sell it to someone living in Europe, and he/she/you are not likely to get to trouble with it. But I can't recall the iTrip-type electronics EVER have been allowed there. So, why did it make to the news only now?
In America, it would sound like this:
Officer: Do you have a TV license?
Person: Nope.
Officer: Good, because we don't have those here like in some unfortunate countries.
Person: Damn right. You think they need licenses to read books too?
Officer: Probably. You know how much it sucks over there.
Person: Over where?
Officer: Who cares?
Person + Officer: Ha hahahah hahahahahhaha!!!
Person: Hey, wanna beer?
Officer: Whoa there! I'm on duty...so no more than two or three.
Just because the U.S. is the greatest country in the world doesn't mean we're superior...oh wait, yes it does.
Specifically, they ought to allow unlicensed transmitters below a certain output power (anyone know what the iTrip's broadcast power is?).
Should be a couple of nanowatts. In order to be legal in the U.S., the field strength needs to be under 250uV/m when measured at a distance of 3m. Plugging that into the conversion formula, assuming that it has a 1/4 wave antenna (which it doesn't because the device is too small) this would give you a power level of 18.75nW. Given that the thing has a much shorter antenna than 1/4 wave (1/4 wave would be 75cm long), it may have more power to compensate for this.
(For those that actually look up the conversion formula linked above, we're solving for P, E is 250uV/m, or 250e-6, and D is 3m. A 1/4 wave antenna has a gain of 0.15dB or 1.035X. As such, I set G to 1 as "close enough.")
www.wavefront-av.com
190 what?
From the TV Licensing site:
Using HTML in email is like putting sound effects on your phone calls. Just say <strong>no</strong>.
Common mistake. You need a TV licence if you have equipment capable of receiving television signals and it is used for that purpose, eg. a detuned TV used for watching pre-recorded video cassetes or closed circuit televison would not require one. A televison monitor (not necessarily with a UHF tuner) connected to a satellite receiver pointing at a satellite which is not uplinked to from the UK and used for watching, say, high quality Swedish erotica would still require one.
Gareth
I lived in the states for years and I don't remember the beer being free. Hell, I couldn't even buy beer without showing government-issued ID. Nor could I drink it on the sidewalk outside my own home (not to mention outside downtown bars on a hot summer evening). I bet that even in soviet russia you could enjoy a vodka by the river
in the summer, without being forced to show your papers. Looks to me like in the US, beer is not only not free as in free beer, it's not even free as in free speach.
What I do remember is the TV being shit, apart from a handful of good shows. I was particularly unimpressed by the way Fox news would advertise its lead stories several days in advance. How did they know...BTW, you do realise that commercial US TV is not truly free? How do you think Jennifer Aniston's hairstyle is funded - by YOU paying more at the stores for all those products that have to recover the millions of dollars spent on TV ads...
The author of this post asserts his moral rights.
you get 2 commercial free and 4 commercial stations for 190 (pounds? dollars?) a year and we get ~30 commercial free and ~100 commercial for $300-$400 a year.
I bought an iTrip for use in my 2000 VW Golf GLS (no Raintronic, so no weird coating on the windshield). It doesn't work. It never has. The car's stereo can't pick it up, even if I hold the iPod up through the open sunroof so the whip antenna on the back of the car can see it directly without the sheet metal of the car in the way. I have a European radio retrofitted into the car but that should have no effect as the only difference in the FM band is that it will try to tune to even-numbered frequencies as well as odd ones. (Too bad transmitters won't broadcast on those freqs, as I guarantee no regular commercial station in the US will be licensed for an even numbered frequency.)
Anyone want to buy it? Seriously. I want to get rid of the thing. My solution is going to be hardwiring an adapter to the car's CD changer plug and adding a switch that lets me toggle between the CD changer (I got one used off another VW owner, cheap) and the RCA inputs.
And the other FM transmitter I have, a Belkin TuneCast, doesn't work either -- if a radio broadcast so much 'looks' at it crosseyed, it's static hell.
Low-power FM transmission is, in my experience, a joke and a marketing tool. It ranges from nonexistent to having more static than an interplanetary broadcast from Martians.
i am a soviet space shuttle
Can you imagine broadcasting your entire MP3 collection throughout your entire college dorm building for everyone to hear. Every student could have their own radio station that could only be picked up in the dorm. Why bother downloading the songs when you could actually just tune in to somebody elses ipod broadcast. Don't tell the RIAA.
while living in England (1989) the old guy next door had all sorts of problems with TV licenses, he got busted for having only a Black & White TV license which he'd bought because he had a B&W TV, but they said because he had a VCR which could record in colour, he had to buy the full license... couldn't play it back, wasn't interested in colour.
I recall they gaved a couple of pounds off if you were blind.
Used to see the van come driving through our suburb every once in a while.
This begs for a reiteration of Slashdot policy on the disclosure to governments of the identity information of criminals, and the policy on reporting to the authorities evidence necessary for law enforcement.
The REAL jabber has the user id: 13196
What you do today will cost you a day of your life
but as to this
I have found that I can do both. I have my TV in the same room as the computer, I write plenty of code while watching sporting events, movies etc...
I would imagine they give it to shareholders in the form of dividends, or give it to executives in the form of whatever perks the executives want. The BBC doesn't have either of those outgoings. It also makes money by licensing its programmes to broadcasters in other countries, and by selling videos and DVDs of them to the public. A cable or satellite company that (generally) broadcasts programmes made by others wouldn't have those options.
Also, consider that (probably):
number_of_TV_licence_payers * tv_licence_fee = k * number_of_cable_subscribers * average_cable_subscription
where k is some large value. The BBC also receives a subsidy from the Government, although I'm not sure how large it is in relation to the income from the licence fee.
Just another wannabe fantasy novelist...
The inclusion of the mention of 1949 just drips with condescension, like spectrum management is some statist anachronism. Oh, those Evil Governments with laws almost as old as my Dad!
And if there were only a single FM frequency, then we'd all be screwed. However, there are actually 100 possible FM stations. So, if the iTrip device reaches 30 apartments in your building, then we can have 3 people in each unit all using iTrips on different frequencies before this becomes a problem.
This is allowed in the US, and from what I can tell people love their iTrips, and frequency collision doesn't seem to be a problem currently. One could certainly predict the collision rate based on transmitter power, density of users, and available spectrum. I think there's more than enough spectrum to allow, say, a 50 foot transmitter for such devices.
-Looking for a job as a materials chemist or multivariat
"The BBC is separate from government by issue of it's Royal Charter."
Oh. I see. The British government does not control it, the Crown does instead!
"If you think they're government lapdogs, speak to Alistair Campbell.
The government media in the United States (NPR and PBS) dumps on G W Bush all the time.
Heh heh. We all got sent those in uni. All of us ignored the letters asking us to say whether we had a license or not. Except one person who wrote back and said she didn't. She of course got threatenning letters saying they didn't believe her while the rest of us got on with our lives.
When I moved house, they started sending the letters again, which I signed and returned. A week or two later a poster went up on the billboard across the road saying "3 addresses at Himalayan Way do not have Television Licenses. We know who they are."
Those posters did seem rather odd, chastising people in public for not owning a television. Granted, some of those named might have been using a television without a license, but given the ease of detecting such things, it seems unlikely.
For those not in the UK, the television licensing authority is an office of clueless twats, who spend their life threatening people with prosecution if they don't pay their television tax. Theoretically the tax is optional, but the TV licensing authority don't seem to have been told this yet. They claim to have sophisticated equipment to track unauthorised televisions, but the most sophisticated tactic they have is to just write to any address without a TV license on the assumption that they're criminal bastards using a TV without permission. Rarely is their assumption given any sort of sanity-check, hence those of us without televisions end up with piles of red printed letters in bold capitals.
"I get much of my news from the BBC's website."
Oh yeah, and good luck with the RealPlayer [spit!] video clips on the BBC website...
Well, the BBC isn't funded purely by the license fee. They sell a lot of shows oversees and have a lot of very marketable merchandise. Books, tapes, CDs, videos, DVDs, toys, etc. from BBC shows all sell pretty well. In some cases (e.g. Red Dwarf) because it's very good. In other cases (e.g. Teletubbies) because children have no taste.
Dreams? I'm listening to BBC Radio 4 right now. They also stream over the web, so hop on the bandwagon. Radio 6 is cool too, a comedy and drama channel, with a fair amount of SF in the mix.
BTW, your TV isn't free. Advertising costs money, you pay for it when you buy the products.
Combine a low power FM transmitter like the ITrip or IRock with a MouseCaster(FM radio reciever inside a PS2 mouse, and comes with software that can record FM) and behold, instant peer-to-peer shareing via devices.
Except for the microbreweries. At least one of their radio stations (kexp.org) is very good too.
I played with them as a kid, and they still sell them today. They have a range of 200-300ft out of the box (further when I added uhh... modifications...) and could be picked up by an FM radio. As I recall, the ones I bought from Tandy used to interfere with Radio 1. That's far further than the iTrip's range.
Woohoo! The unitied states isn't country where short sighted idiotic laws are passed!
There are some people that if they don't know, you can't tell 'em.
Well, the BBC does have executives. I imagine that they are handsomely paid. I'm not sure if domestic output is subsidised by the government, the World Service probably is though.
there have been cases where owners have successfully argued they watch no TV broadcasts even though they have the equipment.
Not quite. Yes, they successfully proved they did not watch TV broadcasts. However, they still got fined, because the letter of the (bloody stupid) law was being followed, rather than the spirit.
(I can't find a source for this, so it's your word vs mine, but I do recall hearing the outcome on these cases.)
publically owned services can outperform the private sector?
This must be a joke.
Mandatory BBC? 190GBP.
Optional HBO? 144USD.
Returning back into reality from the socialist illusion? Priceless.
This is unusual.
I'm not sure of the laws in practice here (perhaps I should have RTFA) but I do know that some short-range FM transmitters are allowed in the UK, depending on power and frequency. It is of course illegal to transmit anywhere in the FM broadcast band (87.5-108MHZ) and this seems to be where this iTrip is broadcasting. However it's power is such that it can only transmit 30ft, which I thought was legal in the UK, I mean the signal from this thing is not going to leave your house, and we've been able to buy FM hi-fi senders in the UK for years now (though mostly through mail order and thus probably not legally).
This law is not heavilly enforced, and I believe that it's outdated. The law should be changed to allow domestic transmissions of a certain power, though this will be difficult to do since what happens if you drive up the highway with your iTrip or take it to work, you're bound to interfere with what someone's listening to. Perhaps a domestic FM frequency at the top or bottom of the commercial broadcast band could be reserved for such devices, provided they do not exceed a certain power level. This would be a great solution to the problem and would allow a flood of currently pointlessly illegal devices to enter the market.
Those posters did seem rather odd, chastising people in public for not owning a television.
Not only that, but the cost of putting up the full-size advert mentioning how many (all the ones I've seen have been <5) houses have no TV licence almost certainly costs more than the amount they'll get if that number of people pay a licence.
Thats right, just the world service has some sort of government funding. The rest is via TV licence and BBC worldwine profit.
This will solve the interference problem, as well as give much better sound quality. Also it will allow easier hook-up of other equipment, like much less wiring to install carkits, voice-over for navigation systems, etc.
The Hacker's Guide To The Kernel: Don't panic()!
Its 116 - giving you 2 normal tv channels, as well as 2 (4 if you ignore the fact they are half time channels) and annother 2 channels for extra interactive stuff on certain programs and sporting events. This also funds the BBC website, Ceefax, digital teletext as well as all the radio stations.
Actually that's not true. There aren't 100 possible stations. The FM band is almost full as it is, since you have to put your station on a slightly different frequency in different parts of the country if your station is nationwide. This is to prevent cross-modulation or (interference as the carriers from two different transmission stations on the same frequency overlap when you're situated between them). This is why some stations say that they're on a frequency RANGE and not an absolute frequency (radio 4 is on 92-95MHz).
Also since the FM band is divided up into individual possible stations every 0.5MHz, there's actually only 41 possible stations (the band is 87.5 - 108 MHz).
Yes and so is RS232 but both are useful to interface to legacy equipment. I.e. how otherwise can you get a signal to a car stereo that has no input jacks available?
Imagine all the fun I could have by broadcasting to a station my neighbors were listening to!
... moron .. Go get a girlfriend.
It would be the best time I ever had in my life! Loads of fun.
- Voxel
Modesty is one of life's greatest attributes
well, lets not be misleading. you mean 116 pounds, don't you? which is about $185.
also, the HBO price that the previous poster mentions gives you 7 channels for that price (just follow his link).
I'm not saying the bbc sucks. the bbc is cool, but it's not like high-quality for-pay television programming doesn't exist outside the UK.
I think it's a historical thing. Back in the '60s, when colour TV was introuced, it was more expensive to produce, so those equipped to receive it paid more than those still struggling along with 405-line VHF sets (like my family).
It used to be the case that people registered blind could have a colour set and only pay for a black & white licence. Nowadays, they just get a 10 quid reduction. So I suppose if a partially-sighted person wanted to save money, they could get an old black & white set from a junkshop and only pay 28.50.
(Totally OT, but I've always thought it mildly amusing that one of the first BBC shows produced in colour was The Black & White Minstrel Show ;-)
Using HTML in email is like putting sound effects on your phone calls. Just say <strong>no</strong>.
Back in the early '80s, AIWA used to have a little FM trasmitter that plugged into their walkmen, and you used FM radio headphones to listen to it.
I don't recall the UK having a problem with people using them.
Could they set a precedent?
Max.
Max.
Just a question, but does HBO also have advets on it, and can you get it with having to pay some other fee first?
Good enough :-)
Using HTML in email is like putting sound effects on your phone calls. Just say <strong>no</strong>.
I remember once reading a book on basic electronics which had plans for a simple radio transmitter. It included a disclaimer that suggested that by linking the aerial of the transmitter to the aerial of the reciver you could avoid violating the regulations.
I know it seems overly simplistic, but would it get you off the hook?
HBO has promotions for its other shows, but not traditionaal advertisements. Also, it shows the promos between movies, not during them.
fees depend on the cable provider, but most won't let you get only HBO (i.e. you have to get regular tv plus hbo) so you have to pay for the regular stations, which aren't much. sattelite providers may let you buy only the channels you want, I don't know.
I think this is an excellent pun, and deserves to be congratulated.
Slashdot entertains. Windows pays the mortgage.
I know they're aiming it for the iPod market, but it really hurt them to list some basic compatibilities? I'm not going to buy in iPod just to use this thing, so all they're doing is cutting themselves off from any potential sales.
This Space Intentionally Left Blank
eg. a detuned TV used for watching pre-recorded video cassetes or closed circuit televison would not require one
When exclusivly used for watch CCTV/DVD's etc. Indeed, a tuned TV used in that matter is also fine without a license, however I'm not sure where the burden of proof comes in.
A televison monitor (not necessarily with a UHF tuner) connected to a satellite receiver pointing at a satellite which is not uplinked to from the UK and used for watching, say, high quality Swedish erotica would still require one.
That's not how I understand the wireless telegraphy act (AFAIK it only applies to signals broadcast from the UK), however IANAL, or a UK resident.
A better headline for this article would be "Low-power FM Transmitters Still Banned in UK". Nothing new here.
As for the atory submitter's comment:
"Guess that makes me an outlaw, because you'll have to pry my iTrip from my cold, dead hands."
If you're willing to lose your life over a mere techno-gadget, I worry about you. But then again, this is Slashdot...
Like the lengths you go to deny the church and state are linked when most of GWBs campaign funds are form the Christian Right?
I hereby inform you that I have NOT been required to provide any decryption keys.
Re the BBC - the corporation was set up by statute (a law was passed) with a set of rules to follow and given certain rights - e.g. the License. The BBC was created by Act of Government but is not part of Government, there is no day to day involvement of Government in BBC function.
The coming problem is that the BBC has irritated Tony Blair and his unelected Minister for Information (sorry 'special advisor') when the franchise is up for renewal - which is the only realistic time the Gov of the day gets to mess with the BBC, unless they get really annoyed and pass a new law.
It may be unfamiliar to US readers, but the BBC is independent as far as is possible.
Claiming the BBC is part of Government is analagous to claiming that Ford and GM are part of the USGov because USGov builds the Interstates and regulates the use of autos.
I hereby inform you that I have NOT been required to provide any decryption keys.
It's the same in Germany. I call this TV/radio license thing THEFT.
So do I, its exactly the same as a tax. I pay tax which funds schools, yet I dont use schools. I have no choice but to pay that tax. Taxes are theft.
However If you are a left wing knumbskull that thinks taxes are right, and not theft, they you cant call a tv license theft.
To quote from the BBC website:
"The BBC is run in the interests of its viewers and listeners. Twelve governors act as trustees of the public interest and regulate the BBC. They are appointed by the Queen on advice from ministers.
The BBC's governors safeguard its independence, set its objectives and monitor its performance. They are accountable to its licence payers and Parliament, and publish an Annual Report assessing the BBC's performance against objectives.
Day-to-day BBC operations are run by 16 divisions. Their directors report to the director-general, forming the Executive Committee. It answers to the Board of Governors."
If anyone wants proof that the BBC is not controlled by the UK government, they need look no further than here.
Please, could you provide some specific examples of bias and uninformed reporting by the BBC? The allegation you make is serious, either provide some supporting evidence, or shut up. Incidentally, I notice that nobody from the UK has mentioned yet that you get a discount on the TV licence if you're registered blind.
Instead of my usual rants about pretentious non-tv owners, now I just refer people here:
v ision.html
Area Man Constantly Mentioning He Doesn't Own A Television
http://www.theonion.com/onion3604/doesnt_own_tele
144 USD for one station, with commercials.
116 GDB (got my original figures wrong - about 180 USD) for 5 national TV stations, 5 national radio stations (plus dozens of local stations), the best news service on the web (not to mention radio and TV), live coverage (TV, radio and web) of all the major sporting events, and not a commercial or fund-drive in sight or earshot.
Not to mention that many HBO dramas are coproduced with the BBC (eg emmy-winning Gathering Storm), so you're also benefiting from our license fees.
The author of this post asserts his moral rights.
Are you saying you don't ever buy products advertised on TV? Which products would those be? I don't think I could think of any right off the bat.
i just bought one! i live in alaska and no one cares :)
You are an idiot, Mr. AC. Satellite receivers also PASSIVELY receive broadcasts, as does cable TV and every other form of TV. Yet it's illegal to receive either satellite or cable without paying a license fee.
I'd like to have an el-cheapo car stereo with a "line-in" function and an AM/FM radio. Why fool with klunky low power radios and cassette adapters? It's not like the interface is bulky or expensive -- look at cheap sound cards.
If anyone has seen something like this, please let me know.
GF
Lots of petrified grits
Such an intelligent comment. When one has nothing substantive to respsond with, one resorts to name calling. Always. Thanks for proving my point.
Here in NZ we seem to be somewhere between the UK and the US (as in many other things).
The top and bottom 1 MHz of the FM band is reserved for unlicensed transmission with an effective radiated power of less than 300 mW. So as long as you tune your iTrip to 88 - 89 MHz or 107 - 108 MHz you're fine.
I've been wondering about getting an iTrip once the version for the new model iPod is available (Apple changed the connectors on the top...), but my car's radio.casette has a line-in (marked "CD") on the front panel anyway, and that's better quality.
Thanks for the info. I have only been to London myself and was not lucky enought to see the rest of England. Here in the US we have someplaces that are REALLY in the the middle of no where. :)
A friend of mine bought some land from his grand parents to help them out. This land is really in the middle of nowhere. Afer landing at the nearest airport they could find they drove for 6 hours to a tiny town that he claims had a population of 6. There at the local bar (one of two buildings in the town) the local bar keep offered to show him where his land was. After two more hours in the car he found his land. Nice rocks:) Even thought the town had all of 6 people the bar had a dish to get satalite tv
See my blog http://ilovecookes.blogspot.com/ for light hearted technical information.
Most of those stations don't have origional programming, which has fixed costs (production) vs invented sums (licensing for movies, reruns etc). The BBC has gobs of origional programming in addition to other peoples.
"See that boat over there? It's rebroadcasting major league baseball with implied oral consent... Not express written consent!"
"Government-controlled? Is that why Blair and Alistair Campbell and friends are so upset with them lately?"
There is only upset because the BBC didnt tow the lie for once.
If they were not expected to it would not be an issue.
Try the british C4 for news that offends Conan Powel (www.channel4.com/news)
This perpetual motion machine Lisa made is a joke, it just keeps getting faster and faster. - Homer
"I guess it just goes to prove that with the right management and funding, publically owned services can outperform the private sector."
If by "management" you mean, "pass legislation to force people to pay for state-run programming" then yes, this is a much better solution.
There are good puns?
Charles K. Clarkson
Many people truly want to help. Unfortunately, many people truly suck at it.
Radio 6 is music not talk.
Radio 1 - "Youth" music programming
1 Xtra - Black music
Radio 2 - Popular music programming
Radio 3 - Classical and alternative music programming
Radio 4 - Speech radio
Radio 5 - News and Sports
5 Live Sports Extra - Extended coverage of live sports events
Radio 6 - 80s and 90s Rock to Indie style music programming
Radio 7 - Archive talk and comedy Programming
Asian Network - Asian broadcasting
Not to mention a network of regional stations, and 8 national TV stations. This includes thte UK version of C-SPAN, a 24 Hour TV rolling news channel, 2 childrens channels, a youth TV channel and a more high brow TV channel for arts, films, documentaries and the like.
The government pay for World Service and BBC World programming
Matt Thompson - Actuality - Insert product here.
First of all, I'm Canadian.
Second, I am not suggesting that the BBC is owned by the government.
I want to know where the TV-licensing money goes. To the BBC (and other channels), right?
Therefore, the BBC is getting funding from the government. Is there something I don't understand?
I have an iRock, which works pretty well, but sucks down the batteries, and I liked the look of the iTrip as well as it's ability to tune any station.
In reality, the iTrip rarely works, and having the radio stations on my iPod ends up sucking as I like to have my song list on random, so now I have 50 or more songs that periodically play a few beeps.
Overall, the iRock works far better, and is worth having to replace the batteries every 15-20 hours or use rechargeables.
Doh, quite right. I meant BBC7.
First of all, I'm Canadian.
Apologies. Your accent sounds the same on my monitor ;-)
The license is paid to 'TV Licensing' a part of the BBC
The BBC has a charter guaranteeing its independence from government which is reviewed every 15? years or so
Given that the maximum possible term a government can serve is 5 years it's quite hard to for a political party (and they've had serious run-ins with all 3 main parties) to bear pressure onto the BBC
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This sig is inoffensive.