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Microsoft Allows Pirates to Install XP SP2
mkraft writes "On the tail of the previously asked question on whether Microsoft should support pirated copies of XP, comes the answer.
According to Computer Times, Microsoft will allow SP2 to be installed on any copy of Windows XP including copies with invalid license keys.
Microsoft decided "that even if someone has pirated copy of Windows, it is more important to keep him safe than it is to be concerned about the revenue issue."
There is no news of whether or not pirated copies will be allowed access to the Windows Update site afterwards or just allowed to install SP2."
sixty percent of software priates STILL won't install it, because they're white-knuckling their tinfoil hats screaming IT'S A TRAP! so loud that Admiral Ackbar thinks he hears an echo.
REM Old programmers don't die. They just GOSUB without RETURN.
I can't wait to see how people here try to twist this into something malevolent on MS' part. This is gonna be some mighty cool logical contortionism...
Good for your Microsoft.
http://www.rayn.net . Funny. Stuff.
the new DRM stuff being added has nothing to do with them letting everyone have it.
*tinfoil hat*
"You worthless post!"
-Shakespeare, 2 Gentlemen of Verona, 1. 1. 147
Of course, were they to deny access to SP2 to those with copyright infringing copies, those using them might migrate to OSS. Or Microsoft might even be sued for having allowed infected machines to exist, when they had the means to patch them.
One CPU cycle wasted on digital restrictions management is ONE TOO MANY.
What MS didn't say was that the pirated SP2 will remove the TCP/IP stack. This will help the poor unprotected pirates.
Now, this seems like a genuinely nice thing to do by Microsoft. I can't wait to see how the Slashdot hordes of RMS fanboys are going to spin it to make Microsoft seem like the bad guy again...
(this almost made fp, too!)
Quality, performance, value; you get only two, and you don't always get to pick.
This isn't about keeping people safe it's about making sure that people don't switch away from windows to the alternatives http://linux.org http://freebsd.org http://openbsd.org http://netbsd.org and even http://mac.com .
I had to use a pirated version of windows on my vmware because my damn laptop came with a version of XP that could only be installed on a SONY, laptop. Which is crap - I was forced to pay for XP with my laptop - it should be mine to run on:
1. Another computer should I not use it on my laptop.
2. My vmware virtual machine on the laptop it was meant to run on, although not in the manner originally intended.
Well, allowing everyone to install SP2 would make worms and viruses that spreads due to OS voulnerabilities to be slowed down. And i doubt MS would sell more Windows if it wasnt possible to install SP2 on pirated windows-versions.
this is probably the most boring sig in the world
I'm gonna play Devil's advocate here and say that they may allows for downloading SP2, but who thinks that when Windows Update realizes that you have an invalid/pirated key that it will dial home and let Microsoft know? A week after installling SP2, you get a nice little letter from the boys in Redmond kindly asking you to refrain from stealing Windows. As an added bonus, they'll give you a coupon for 10% off the cost of Windows that is good at your local stores. Then Microsoft can make some more money off of people buying Windows to make up for the fact that the next version won't be out for a few years. This all of course is just a hypothetical situation.
I think we're going to see a little more of this. MS is starting to notice that people care about security, they care about FOSS, they care about being treated more like grown-ups. They're having to deal with the open-source movement, and that's a good thing. It'll make competing harder, though.
I think what they meant to say is that they realized it's more important to keep OTHER Windows users safe. By allowing users of invalid copies of XP to patch, known vulnerabilities that might be exploited and used as points of attack against other Windows installations are addressed. It simply makes sense for them to do this.
"that even if someone has pirated copy of Windows, it is more important to keep our future revenues safe than to worry about coypright infringment."
You're reading Slashdot. Of course you like Linux and pc hardware
If they really wanted to keep u ssafe, they wouldn't let us install windows AT ALL. ;)
sonds like a PR gig to me
"The universe is my dwelling place and my house is my only clothes! Why are you entering into my pants?" - Liu Ling
From the headline:
If someone is using a pirated copy of Windows, seems to me the "revenue issue" has already been decided. ;)
The Dalai LLama
...on a pirated copy of Linux... hope my service packs will install...
My sig could be your sig!
Microsoft decided "that even if someone has pirated copy of Windows, it is more important to keep him safe than it is to be concerned about the revenue issue."
What they mean is "it is more important to keep us safe from the media when the next round of viruses hit any unpatched machines by saying we allowed anyone to install SP2"
Bob
Listen to my latest album here
Why can't Microsoft settle for allowing people who have not purchased a valid key for XP/Server 2K3 to have the upgrade, but also make any TCP/IP connection drop after a certain time?
That is, except for more updates from Microsoft.
This way people can still "try" Windows, use it for the programs they need, but if they want to go online or play games, etc., they'll have to do it in the time frame before Windows needs to reboot or wait a certain time before connecting again, or purchase a key.
Human nature is the same everywhere; the modes only are different. -- Earl of Chesterfield
I bought a whitebox from a dealer, and it turns out that the XP Pro was the illegitimate "FCKGW..." version. I've wanted to go "legit" on this. Is doing this as simple as buying a proper XP Pro installation CD, and will it install right over the top of everything, with no difference in the end except that I'll have a legit registration number?
This shows just how important SP2 is to Microsoft - and I don't mean from security perspective. Security is an excuse. We'll have to keep an eye on this thing.
This is fairly selfless. This stance could be interpreted as Microsoft putting aside its own interests in order to improve the current state of home computer security and the poor security levels on the net. Even though they caused those problems in the first place, this move is one which should be met with approval.
Free iPods - now in the UK!
Many corporate cdkeys were locked out of the last sp2 build to try to fight piracy. The build would allow you to install the service pack but immediatly after login it would force the activation screen to you which you can not get around. Only solution was to format and install with a different key. More info here.
For those that will say "big deal, we could've done this anyway", remember that while some people with invalid keys could install SP1 by just downloading the patch manually, many couldn't. Many of the pirated copies of XP used one of two keys (one of which started with FCK...), and Microsoft's SP1 download checked the PCs license number to make sure it wasn't one of these two keys. If it was, it wouldn't install itself. Trust me, I tried... I ended up having to change my license number by using a script provided by Microsoft itself.
Since SP1 didn't stop anyone from using pirated copies neither will SP2 even if they tried, so spin it like they care.
"If any question why we died, Tell them because our fathers lied."
"that even if someone has pirated copy of Windows, it is more important to keep him safe than it is to be concerned about the revenue issue."
Bullshit. What they really mean is:
"Even if someone has a pirated copy of Windows, we will grudgingly forego the revenue and allow it to be updated because the proliferation of morons with compromised machines further erodes the already declining credibility of our OS. For now."
"...all the labours of the ages, all the devotion, all the inspiration, all the noonday brightness..." yada yada
...I would imagine any of the decision makers are probably using pirated copies themselves.
Who do you think the B4llm3r who created the torrent at SuprNova is?
I also heard that the version of TCP/IP in SP2 is compatible with RFC 3514
:)
Theats sure to get them some credibility in the slashdot world
Microsoft decided "that even if someone has pirated copy of Windows, it is more important to keep him safe than it is to be concerned about the revenue issue."
Just look at the spin- they aren't concerned about the pirated user being safe, but other legitimate users being safe from him!
...because SP2 would be cracked anyway.
It's quite obvious when you think about it. As long as Microsoft makes it possible to pirate windows it keeps linux down. Remember, piracy makes things more popular, like music. As long as people can get windows for free the freeness of linux is not so attractive. Microsoft knows that people who are pirating XP probably will never pay for windows ever. So by doing this they can keep their market share from going to linux or some other os. Someone using windows, even if not paying, is still using windows. And there's a chance they just might pay for some other windows software. Maybe the pirated windows and bought an EA Sports game. Doesn't help Microsoft directly, but every windows program sold makes a small difference.
Microsoft probably has the power to completely disable every internet-connected PC with pirated MS software on it. But imagine if today all pirate copies of windows stopped working. You would have a large large number of people with useless computers. They would all follow one of two courses of action. Either go to the store and buy windows for $100+ or download a linux or some such for free. More people would do the latter than Microsoft would like.
The GeekNights podcast is going strong. Listen!
even if someone has pirated copy of Windows, it is more important to keep him safe than it is to be concerned about the revenue issue.
Of course Microsoft don't care about being kind to their pirates, but to save their asses and get a better rumor about providing secure operating systems.
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
Better get me one of those scurvin' patches for me eye.
But what about me land-lubbin' mateys? Guess the scallywagin' Microsoft haven't thought about them.
Arrrr, who cares about them anyway? Pass the grog, ye son of a biscuit eater!
What a fucking troll.
I guess the sign at my store will have to change from:
"If you are running windows XP with this key (pirate key here) you are vulnerable to the blaster virus -- fix it buy buying windows XP here!"
to:
"If you are running windows XP with this key (pirate key) download SP2 to fix your sasser/blaster/etc virus".
Oh well. About time I suppose.
If you could be told what you can see or read, then it follows that you could be told what to say or think - BoC
I think I speak for my fellow pirates when I say thanks. My open seas piracy just wouldn't be the same without the ease of use and stability of Windows XP. It works incredibly well with the booty we steal from passing ships.
I thank you, and my parrot Petey thanks you.
Greenbeard, son of Yellowbeard III
what a responsible, admirable decision to make.
Running a pirated copy of Windows XP Proffesional here.
.NET have patches for what breaks, those are rather vital programs for me.
All I had to do was search out a clean license key and instructions on changing it- that was trivially easy to do. 15 minutes of searching the web, maybe five of running the windows programs(all built into windows) that manipulate the license key and activation system. Anyone able to follow simple directions, they go step by step not leaving anything to your own prior knowledge. Well, you have to be able to read, but thats about the only skill you need. My mom could probably do it.
I've got SP1 and all the security patches, most of the general use patches as well.
I'm holding off on SP2 though until Visual Studio and
95% of Windows users dont even know what a patch is and in result SP2 will never be installed and nothing will be resolved
When the laws become un-stupid.
All the good solid laws get actioned.
I don't think I would let people have it if it were pirated. Or maybe I'd let them have it but permanently remove TCP/IP. Someone would just figure out how to put it back in I'm sure.
The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. - Benjamin Franklin
At least the Evil Empire shows a little good will..
Of course, they probably embed and activate a back door...
= Grow a brain...
I'd say that this is just good business for them.. Making sure that people who probably wouldn't pay for an OS anyways aren't helping to spread worms and infecting people who DO pay for the OS is just going to help MS.
:)) that windows is insecure.
On the other hand, denying people service packs is not likely to induce them to pay for a license (it certainly wouldn't have convinced me, back when I ran windows), and just contributes to the perception (if you want to call it that..
Microsoft will allow people to install SP2?
I hate to bring it up, but Apple does it the smart way. Install all the patches that you want, but if your key is considered invalid, the next time you try to run it... it prompts you for a valid key. Problem solved and all software is secure(but possibly not working).
It does suck because a few of my "Hi-End" software does not work, but you get what you pay for(troubles).
...but why do I have to be an Administrator in Windows XP Home just to use the f***ing debugger? Why do I have to have 2 redundant copies of the .NET SDK? Why separate all command line programs into 10 different convoluted file trees and throw everything else together into C:\Windows\system32?
Why pay money for their software when you have to put up with this sort of junk? Grrr!!!!
They will be able to tell at least the IP of users who download the service pack and don't register it. So they might be able to find the pirates that way.
sulli
RTFJ.
Great, so now we have to have MP9 on our computers if we want SP2. The only media players i use are winamp for audio and media player classic for films. and ocasionally vlc if mpc doesn't work.
I hate windows media player with a passion as it is horrible bloatware that takes seconds and seconds to startup. Instead of 1s like media player classic.
SURELY NOT!!!!!
As far as I know there are a couple different pirated copies of XP out there. There is the original DevilsOwn patched version, then there are the VLK/Corporate versions and so on. I am going to guess that the majority of people pirating XP are using the corporate version which AFAIK currently has no problem connecting to WindowsUpdate.
Now - even if Microsoft does block everyone with any kind of pirated version of XP out - what is stopping someone from setting up their own WindowsUpdate server (I have done so at my office) and allowing people to update themselves from there (unless of course the WindowsUpdate allows for the person to download and once it attempts to install finds the illegitimate key and then stops there).
With the piracy scene these days it shouldnt take but a couple days for someone to figure out a way around all this activation stuff and sometimes even MS makes it easier to get around. Take Office XP - it requires activation which can be gotten around and if you attempt to install updates (esp. Service packs) it will ask you for the original CD. However, if you just download the entire SP3 for Office XP you can install the service pack without ever needing the original disks for XP.
If you can program some sort of protection - someone else will figure out a way around it. MS Activation, PGP, etc, etc, etc. Almost everyone wants something for nothing and will spend a lot of time to figure out how to do it.
-
aphex
I Steal Music!
And its even more important to keep people who won't pay for additional copies (or upgrades) of Windows away from Linux (hope no one heard that!)
Microsoft is only doing this because if they didn't all the pirates would probably switch either:
1. Find a way around it
2. switch to Linux
Pirates have the correct personality to be switching to Linux and Microsoft realizes that even though they are not buying their operating system they are still stuck with Microsoft while using it and they may buy other Microsoft products
I really would wonder what the entire reasoning was internally at M$. Is this purely a PR move that also just happens to greatly benefit them in that they don't deal with the negative privacy activists as well as the embarrassment of a slow but steady stream of workarounds to get out of the lockout problem anyway? Or even the benefit of the fact that the fewer screwed up computers there are the better they look.
Maybe they believe they have done something truly well with this OS. Win98 sucked. Win98SE sucked a LOT less. They do have a lot of talented developers who can do some considerable damage to any problem.
Or is there someone who has considerable power over a decision like this with a true altruistic nature.
Their PR people are real good man...they said everything that was to be said. Touched on all the topics...
Mad, adj : Affected with a high degree of intellectual independence. Ambrose Bierce - The Deveil's Dictionsary
You're right about MS' motivations, I'm sure.
But remember, also what they are doing is helping slow the progression of worms across the internet. This is good for all Windows users (legit ones included), ISPs, backbone providers, and internet users in general.
Show some goddamn appreciation.
As already pointed out, SPs don't require any old update in contrast to "Rollup Packs".
Well thanks to Microsoft's Product Activation, there is no such thing as a pirated copy of Windows XP, right? Oh, there is? And its easy to get around? Well thanks for wasting all the legit users fscking time, Microsoft!
give us a list of warez sites we can download SP2 from in case traffic to MS site gets too busy or hacked. it's time for them to make things easier for us. I'm sick of their rip services.
What if I purchased a laptop that came with a copy of XP Pro. I'd own a license for it. What if I installed the patched copy of XP Pro that completely removes activation BUT use my real CD key?
That's not piracy.
Should those people be denied updates? They paid for their LICENSE just like everyone else.
We have secretly replaced these Slashdot mods' sense of humor with a rusty nail. Let's see if they notice!!
Its likely that pirate "cracked" versions of XP SP2 would appear (if the real thing wasnt able to install on a "pirate" XP version)
Plus (if it wasnt able to install on "pirate" XP versions), the pirate users would probobly just grab one of the many "XP CD key changers" and change their key to somethibng not detected as "pirate" by XPSP2
this whole arguement of letting people with illegal copies of Windows OSs have access to Windows Update for patching. I mean can't they just point their browers at Microsoft.com and search for the patches that they need and download them manually? There is nothing to stop them from doing so right? The benefit of purchasing a legal copy of Windows is that you get access to their Windows Update Service. I highly doubt that those who take the time to buy or "steal" an illegal copy of Windows will still take security seriously and will still get hit by future worms and other malware. Many home users of legal copies of Windows still don't "get it" so this will probably only put a dent in the problem. At the end of the day I guess Microsoft is more worried about people switching to Linux/*BSD(more so Linux though) then people using illegal copies of their OSs.
Before SP1 came out, copies of XP Corporate Edition (which doesn't require on-line activation) had been circulating along with a few known keys or key blocks. It was a simple matter to block that relatively small set of keys in the SP1 software package.
Now, key generators have been out for some time. While Microsoft could graze the newsgroups looking for key lists, the number of "known keys" would be enormous. Combined with the fact that the key generator is widely available, disabling pirated copies in an off-line version of the service pack would be impossible without including all known (and ever-to-be-generated) keys in the new service pack.
It might be more complex than that, but if the goal of your key generation algorithm is to not require you to record every generated key (i.e., it's effectively just a string and a checksum), then this is bound to happen eventually. Best to just roll with the punches, and assume that the pirates probably wouldn't pay for the product if they had to.
-Scott Hutton
I downloaded the sp2 build 2120 and it reset the activation on my machine. So i ended up formatting and reinstalling. Here is the link to that file if you wanna try it http://www.tcmagazine.net/download.php?det=59 reaper2
The government should require from Microsoft that it doesn't serve thieves with a silver platter.
XP, or anything else from Dr. E.V.I.L.(tm)..
Nice try Billy boy but no sale here...
Many viruses cause distributed DOS attacks against Microsoft, so this could be more about keeping Microsoft itself safe than keeping other Windows users safe. I bet they spend tons of money fending off DDOS attacks, plus having slow or nonworking websites due to these attacks gives them a negative image.
Manufacture in China
Anyone who pirates Windows probably isn't going to buy a copy anyway. However, by denying them patches, Microsoft would simply make it that much easier for virus writers to inconvenience Microsoft's PAYING customers. Having millions of unpatched windows machines floating around harboring all the latest virus/malware payloads just waiting for some unsuspecting paying customer to plug into the Internet is just bad business for M$.
Seriously.. The issues of internet protection are much larger then the revenue lost from a few 'pirates'... ( though it is debatable if there really is a loss, since most 'pirates' wouldnt have purchased the product anyway )
This was a good and responsible move on their part.
Assuming there wasnt some underlying motive we dont know about.... I hate to be too trusting of a company that has a history with hidden agendas..
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Just install Trumpet Winsock.
geez, that was old...
Dear aunt, let's set so double the killer delete select all
install x-setup pro, a free tweak utility that allows you to easily turn off info being sent to MS before the update begins
to linux in less developed contries that depend on pirating Windows. As the Internet becomes more and more important to computing, you just can't get by running an operating system without at least patchs and a firewall. It doesn't matter what Linux's TCO is, Unpatched and unprotected Windows is gonna cost more. And Yeah, I know you can add a firewall, but the point of SP2 is it's on by default (the two best words in the english language).
It's bait and switch though. As soon as Microsoft feels they can get away with it they'll bring down the iron fist. I've seen several posters liken it to a crack dealer giving you the first hit free, and I'd be hard pressed to argue that analogy.
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
My god, with 250mb i could create an entire operating environment...
Something is wrong with that, being as the SP is mostly bug fixes.. ( not all, but mostly )
Will not be practical for dialup users, and they will have to pay for the ( by then late ) updates..
And give Microsoft their home address for future 'license verification sweeps'... how convenient...
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Oh please! You just can't stand to give Microsoft credit where credit is due. This has nothing to due with trying to prevent DDOS attacks against Microsoft and everything to do with trying to ensure that all users are able to upgrade SP2, which is a better scenaior for Microsoft's paying customers. Less insecure and vulnerably systems means less points of attack for Microsoft's paying customers. You absoutely refuse to give Microsoft any credit at all. In the end it hurts your own credibility.
You could smuggle in letters or mobile phones through the assistance of either the restricted passing through, or the restrictor letting through.
But you can't smuggle in a virus if everyone's immune. Service packs and patches give immunity where there was susceptability before. Firewalls merely contain the susceptability and reduce the chance of contaminiation. But not to absolute zero.
click-clack, front and back. I'm not moving this car otherwise.
The first is simple. MS can't ban them. SP1 was easily installed when you had a keygen. So basically they are allowing something they can't stop anyway.
The second is more sinister. Has MS ever lost from piracy? Or has piracy helped them become the owner of the desktop. If everyone really had to pay for every bit of MS software they ran would they still be so widely used?
If they ever manage to create a windows you can't install without a license people might just choose not to use windows. It is a radical idea I know but MS can't risk it. They can afford piracy, they can't afford losing dominance on the desktop. Hell Gates himself has boasted that MS fortune is big enough to last them years without a single source of income.
Unix was once very popular because it was practially free to everyone working at a university. There were other OS'es to work with but unix was free for students, teachers, researchers and other people with no money. Same with the C programming language.
Dominance is worth a lot more then getting every user to pay. Just ask apple. Apple made sure you had to pay for their OS because you have to buy their hardware. How big is their share again?
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
Well dur, if there are 1000's of unpatched machines out there they will be spreading worms and getting owned for DDoS attacks. Not to mention the importance of future DRM 'upgrades' having 100% roll-out. But every day more people come one step closer to ditching windows.
This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.
I'm assuming that a certain percentage of Windows installs are pirated, what would happen if a majority of those people were infected. It's not as if there's any specific virus/worm out there that'll work only on legit copies of Windows.
.smell my feet.
what about people with more than one machine? i don't just mean a family with a few computers, but i know some people that still keep their older machine around for whatever reason. they may test software on it or put it in another part of the house or whatever. technically they have to buy windows for each machine to keep it current. i'm not talking about keeping a 486 running for kicks, i mean a gamer that upgrades every 2 years or so and their "older" machine is still faster than some bargin box and is capable of running the current M$ OS. i wonder how many of those people really bought 2 or 3 boxes of XP.
Once more, the link between illegal copies and Windows Update has been made. Many people believe that these updates are the only way Microsoft could tell that they run some illegal copies.
A few of them will refuse to use online updates because they fear that it might reveal their illegally obtained software copies to Microsoft or the BSA (not Windows, Windows is quite hard to pirate these days because it's so ubiquitous, but full Microsoft Office, and other BSA software).
What's to keep Microsoft, if they choose, from grabbing the IP addresses of pirates attempting the Windows Update, and going after them RIAA-style? It seems like that would be real tempting to their legal department...
They say the first thing to go is your penis. Well, it's either that or your brain. I forget which...
....those linux people give it away for free! They're undercutting Microsoft in order to chain people to linux!
Thats how stupid you sound.
If you buy something that has licensing restrictions, then there is no *should*. There's either "I agree to the licensing restrictions and buy the product", or I tell (whoever) that their bargain is insufficient for me and I tell them to fuck off and dont give them any money for the good/service they are offering.
Think about buying an airline ticket--if I buy an airline ticket from new york to london for $256, then I accept the fact that the dates and times are non-changeable and that the ticket is non-refundible. I understand and accept that this is true even though the guy sitting next to me on the same plane and eating the same airline meal and watching the same movie COULD HAVE changed his dates and times or could have gotten 100% of his money back. Of course, he paid $1900 for his ticket.
MOD PARENT DOWN
You weren't forced to buy anything; you chose to buy a laptop with such restrictions and now are bitching about it.
...they're simply trying to find a balance between:
a) Making hardcore pirates that simply won't pay for anything no matter what switch to something else.
b) Making casual pirates annoyed enough over small updates and such they can get, that they'll buy a licence.
Don't kid yourself. Microsoft could easily keep a database over all valid, registered keys and deny upgrades to everyone else, upgrades that suddenly come from thousands of people and all over the world and so forth.
In this, as in many other cases they've found it preferable to let some slip through. The opposite would que the Star Wars quotes: "The harder you tighten your grip, the more systems will slip through your fingers."
Don't think that MS is doing this out of the goodness of their hearts, or because they really care how much havoc unpatched machines make. They're doing this because it makes business sense.
Kjella
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
It's nice to see that a company cares about the big picture enough to not worry about revenue lost at the moment. Of course, they will still go after pirates, but they understand that if the software isn't patched then it can help spread more viri, allow attacks. +1 Karma for Microsoft, IMHO.
"Hard work never killed anyone." -- Some Dead Guy
Then the next worm that exploits unpatched Windows machines will just intall a non-broken TCP stack. A lot of non-techie types would gladly allow their machine to be turned into an oozing blob of backdoors, DDoS servers, IRC bots and spam relays in exchange for being able to chat on AIM for more than 15 minutes at a time.
Microsoft decided "that even if someone has pirated copy of Windows, it is more important to keep him safe than it is to be concerned about the revenue issue."
Roughly translates to:
Microsoft decided "that even if someone has pirated copy of Windows, it is more important to keep him locked into the platform than it is to be concerned with the legality of the license."
..There's a-dooin's a-transpirin'
dont you see !
My company decided that windows 2000 was the last Microsoft operating system we would use unless Microsoft removed activation from its products. Sure, we use open-license corporate edition software, but the risk of being locked out of updates is too great to consider windows XP. Our machines will easily last us 3-4 years. If Microsoft still persists on using product activation at that time, we will probably move to Mac OS X (we'll need new hardware anyway) or Linux.
We are actively evaluating both products. In 3-4 years, those products will be even better than they are today. Microsoft needs to start realizing that they aren't the only game in town anylonger.
-ted
...is the only one that matters.
"What if I purchased a laptop that came with a copy of XP Pro. I'd own a license for it."
No, you'd own a limited license for an OEM version, the documentation for which states clearly "Not for resale, not for use on any other equipment" or words to that effect. Learn to read fine print; its an important life skill.
"What if I installed the patched copy of XP Pro that completely removes activation BUT use my real CD key? That's not piracy."
Actually, since you'd have circumvented the copy protection scheme you could be prosecuted under the DMCA, regardless of whether or not you own a legitimate license (in fact, if you have a legitimate license, why would you need to circumvent the copy protection? Thats exactly what a judge would ask). The DMCA makes it illegal to circumvent copyright protection schemes, valid license or not.
"They paid for their LICENSE just like everyone else."
No, they didn't. If you got Windows free with your computer, its because the manufacturer did a deal with MS to get it cheap, on the condition that it only installs on that manufacturer's machine. By buying that machine, you are buying Windows FOR THAT MACHINE, AND THAT MACHINE ONLY, not a general install version (which is not free). The reason OEM versions are free is because, without the original equipment, those versions are worthless (or become pirated).
Don't get cranky at me for pointing this out; its the law, and the terms you agreed to. Personally, I believe that all patches & updates should be available to everyone as stand-alone installers, simply because not every computer is connected to a network. Frankly, this kind of crap makes legitimate service work a PITA.
Come on people - figure it out! M$ is all about $$. It was too costly to put in the security so they didn't do it. Plain and simple.
It's also an image issue - M$ doesn't want to have more infected machines out there (pirated or not) when they are on the "secure" initiative.
Yes Piracy of Windows and other Microsoft products has gained MS more marketshare. When those organizations get audited, they have to pay fines and fees and buy the software as well.
I wonder if the SP2 upgrade can phone home that the copy is not legit and log as much information to Microsoft about the system in question that they can identify the organization using it and call for an audit? Obviously they can check the key with their database of generated keys to see if the key is a pirated key, or one that was not generated by Microsoft (IE a pirate keygen program).
Remember, Slashdot does not have a -1 disagree moderation, and no, troll, flamebait, and overrated are not substitutes.
Prevent email address forgery. Publish SPF records for y
Someone I know *ahem* downloaded an XP Pro ISO from KaZaA (took nearly 2 weeks on modem) then used WinISO to slipstream it with the Service Pack 1 full installer
This individual was going to try and google a key but then went into his local bank (Barclays) to arrange a loan for a car, and noticed that the Dell PC sitting on the adviser's desk had the usual Dell label on it, with serial numbers for Windows XP and 2000 on it....
And there was a pile of complimentary notepads and a pen on the desk. And the adviser was off getting some forms.
Priceless...
I have been a user for about 10 years. This ends Feb 2014. The site's been ruined. I'm off. Dice, FU
How else will they get the whole Windows world cleaned up, if the pirated versions are still open to attacks?
To see Microsoft taking an economic hit for poor software design. If it had happened a little more often, they'd have done a better job in the first place.
Good move for everyone involved. More computers will be safer, which means less hacker intrusions and internet viruses, and, Microsoft will not look like the bad guy. At least not for the next five minutes or so. Well done, Microsoft. Now let's see some greatly improved security on Longhorn - you should have learned quite a lot from 9x/NT/XP, right?
People in thier comments seem to just be regurgitating the same old piracy drivel about the company not losing revenue streams: "Well, its not like the pirates would actually buy the software anyway." This might be true for some apps like 3d studio max and photoshop to an extent, which are high-priced, luxury software.
But if Windows had been impossible to pirate, these people would have bought windows. Sure, some of them might have gone the *nix route, but most likely a very small minority. These pirates dont balk at spending money: they spent 1000-1500 dollars on the hardware for their computers. Spending an extra 100 bucks on some software that makes that hardware work and function wouldnt even be a second thougt if it were impossible to pirate windows.
So sure, microsoft is gaining marketshare, which is arguably more important to them than revenue -- especially at this point -- but recognize that they have lost a significant revenue source because of piracy.
There's an English version and a German version, but the english is 13 megs heavier. Anyone know why? Perhaps some nasty little bit of snoopware they know they couldn't get away with in Germany?
I had mentioned that you can order a cd from them, and of course give out you home address and WAIT for it to arrive... while you sit vunerable.
Yes its nice they offer it, as they should.. im only commenting on the ramifications of the file size and its implications of having to wait for the 'free' cd to arrive.
I belive 'free' will still mean shipping cost.. So its not truly free..
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Just so we're clear, pirates CAN use windowsupdate--no, you can't install SP1 at the moment, and updates that SP1 depends on, but other, namely security updates, you can install. I used Wup last week to install the security fix for Sasser on a Pre-SP1 pirated box.
Well, fine, then. You meek can have the earth.
:)
Us skeptics get everything else.
Deal?
SB
It's old. The more humans I meet, the more I like my cats. At least they are honest.
Neither is "boxen", but do you think we care? no.
Thank you, and everyone else who helps out A LOT (yes, those are TWO words *shockhorror*) with
the cause of correcting worldwide errors.
Even Eve Second Genesis uses loose instead of LOSE
when they should. *sigh*
Lose a game
have A LOT of time.
helping correct crappy High School typoes, one typist at a time.
It's pretty dumb not to allow XP SP2 upgrades for pirated installations. They *will* get infected with viruses and worms and therefore help spreading the worms, cluttering network links, openinig backdoors for spammers and causing havoc for other users. If at least some people with pirated copies will install SP2, the outbreak will be somehow reduced.
Microsoft made a very smart move this time.
Almost sounds like an arrested person being buckled up in the cop car for their safety.
Windows Update Privacy Statement (Last Updated 10/17/2003) Windows Update is committed to protecting your privacy. To provide you with the appropriate list of updates, Windows Update must collect a certain amount of configuration information from your computer. None of this configuration information can be used to identify you. This information includes:
-Operating-system version number
-Internet Explorer version number
-Version numbers of other software for which Windows Update provides updates
-Plug and Play ID numbers of hardware devices
-Region and Language setting
The configuration information collected is used only to determine the appropriate updates and to generate aggregate statistics. Windows Update does not collect your name, address, e-mail address, or any other form of personally identifiable information.
Windows Update also collects the Product ID and Product Key to confirm that you are running a validly licensed copy of Windows. A validly licensed copy of Windows ensures that you will receive on-going updates from Windows Update. The Product ID and Product Key are not retained beyond the end of the Windows Update session, unless the Product ID is not valid.
To provide you with the best possible service, Windows Update also tracks and records how many unique machines visit its site and whether the download and installation of specific updates succeeded or failed. In order to do this, the Windows operating system generates a Globally Unique Identifier (GUID) that is stored on your computer to uniquely identify it. The GUID does not contain any personally identifiable information and cannot be used to identify you. Windows Update records the GUID of the computer that attempted the download, the ID of the item that you attempted to download and install, and the configuration information listed above.
For the moment my machine runs Win2000 perfectly fine (even though it was quite a bitch to install due to some crappy drivers, notably Creative Labs Soundblaster). I now have a Playstation and the main reason I have Windows is games and I don't play on that machine anymore.
Ahhh...the great dumpster continuum. Many a free computer will be found there. -- sowth (748135)
Bravo MS. Good move.
Anthony Papillion
Advanced Data Concepts, Inc.
"Quality Custom Software and IT Services"
Pirates ye be warned!
How many greedy people told me it was a stupid business move and that I was a "dumbass" for even suggesting this is what Microsoft should do in the previous
Congrats to those folks, you're greedier than Microsoft.
(Posted as AC so as not to be too trollish)
To all the people who say that users would NOT buy legit Windows XP "licenses" (or whatever) if their pirated versions ceased to function at all: Where is your proof? Oh, right. Here at Slantdot, we only require proof for things that put Linux in a negative light; not Windows.
Article: Linux has a higher TCO.
Slashbot: Show us the proof!/$COMPANY is biased!/Funded by M$!
Article: Windows is teh sux0r!
Slashbot: This proves it!/$COMPANY finally "gets it"./Wasn't bought by M$!
I hereby call for the execution of all Slashbots. Begin!
...your mom with an eyepatch?
So will I ever hear "Kudos, Microsoft" on slashdot? They deserve it this time, IMO.
But if Windows had been impossible to pirate, these people would have bought windows.
Fortunately for them, Windows will never be impoosible to pirate, no matter how hard Microsoft tries...
How do you feel as a legitimate user of a MS Operating System when DOS attacks and Spam and Viri take down your system.
....
When Microsoft Decided to close off Service Packs to pirate copies. They also gave approval to attacks on their legal Customer base or at least gave the appearance they don't give a
unpatched machines are vunerable(more vunerable?) than patched machines. This isn't so much helping the Pirate users as its own customer base Who do have a right to complain when Microsofts actions cause their systems to go down.
Blarney Quality Restaurant, Plants
Good job, MS.
All data is speech. All speech is Free.
Because otherwise "pirates" stuck to SP1 might no suffer from all the wonderful SP2 viruses to come...
But they should still bring up a single pop-up box/warning when it's installing/starting up. Many people who have 'pirated' copies don't know they were pirated at all. Often, a friend or relative builds them a computer, and just installs a pirated copy rather than buy one.
This one student at the college purchased the computer, and it had a pirated copy on it. Apparently, the person who was assembling computers was just installing pirated copies instead of buying a copy of windows XP for each computer he was making. Therefore, they bought a computer with what they thought was a legal copy and ended up getting ripped off.
I told them to contact the person and inform him that they would like a full registered copy in a sealed box that they could use with a non-activated key. Without attempting to install SP1, they would never have known.
-=Lothsahn=-
See some of the recent articles about SCOg for examples.
We don't see the world as it is, we see it as we are.
-- Anais Nin
...the security features of XP have been overhauled (new security "dashboard" control app, vastly improved firewall, and lots of "default off" security settings in Messenger, Outlook Express, etc.)
Wow, this must be a new record for longest time elapsed between the horse getting out and the barn door being closed.
which will be first to market? Haven't we all been waiting
on this SP2 for about 2 years now? I guess its hard to
do a SP when you have to release patches every 2 weeks..
perhaps in fact it will be really SP4 when its released!
Software pirates will pirate a good antivirus and firewall software too, don't worry about them! :p
So this means Microsoft wants another monopoly? "the most pirated software company ever"!!
gtkaml.org
If Microsoft said "we will not allow pirated copies of XP to install SP2", you'd yell out that they're compromising security for the sake of revenue. Now they're saying SP2 can be installed on any machine, people are looking for every possible ulterior motive and sinister conspiracy theory they can. They can't win!
Can't we once in a while praise MS for making a good decision?
...and it automatically pops up and won't stop popping up until you tell it how you want updates to be handled.
Now, if the users decides to turn off automatic updates--or even just letting Windows tell you there are new updates--that's not Microsoft's fault.
A lot of the Slashdot articles about worms and holes involves flaws that were already patched at least a month ago. My corporate network and home computer have never, ever been hit with a worm, virus, or trojan. Guess what? I just let Automatic Updates install anything critical. That easy.
Often it can be more time consuming to patch Linux, too - find and download RPM, potentially requiring you to find and download dependencies, etc., and installing, while in Windows, for most users, it's "click on Windows update button.
With Red Hat Enterprise 3, 'up2date -u' will get you most patches, unless it is Audacity or something most people never use.
I'll say it, even at the risk of burning my karma.
Most (I said most--if it doesn't apply to you, disregard) of the posters here are high schoolers and college students who don't work and have absorbed into the hivemind groupthink that dictates that everything Microsoft does is silly and ridiculous, and everything OSS does is cool and cutting-edge. It's "hip" to your IRC buddies to hate Microsoft and use Mandrake. Then you can say, "Windows sucks because a buggy driver crashed it once...by the way, I'll be back in three hours while I set up my sound card in Linux."
VA Linux-owned Slashdot has a certain interest in posting as many negative Microsoft articles as possible, and seeing as how Taco's excuse for calling his "news" site a hobby is supposed to be an explanation for the outright falsehoods and propaganda that gets posted, it's a convenient way to discredit Microsoft no matter what they do.
Outside of Slashdot, the world is very different, but a lot of people have adopted a worldview that is based entirely on Slashdot headlines. Google Zeitgeist shows Linux at 1%, Windows is still around and Longhorn is definitely coming, but if you come to Slashdot, Linux is somehow taking over Mac usage and Longhorn is "vaporware" with no useful technologies whatsoever. Just one example of many (don't get me started on the pro-piracy bullshit...violating copyright holder rights is "justified," while violating the copyright of the GPL is "evil").
I've seen sigs that stated, "You use Linux if you're anti-Microsoft, you use BSD if you're pro-UNIX." It extends to this website, which is not pro-OSS or pro-Linux, but merely anti-"M$." We're still seeing Clippy and BSOD jokes in 2004. It's like this place is firmly stuck in 1998 and absolutely will not let go. Meanwhile, the late 90s free software golden child that Linux was to the press has subsided, and now people have moved on, expecting actual results and not just cute ideologies that look good in a Wired article. I merely bring all this up because I believe it has an effect on the attitudes of the Slashdot editors and most of Slashdot's devoted readers.
Less and less do I even bother reading the comments of stories anymore...I'm about ready to just skip them entirely. So much uninformed opinion, outright false memes that never stop spreading ("640K is enough for anybody" is just one example) and bullshit that I could start a manure farm...
Has MS ever lost from piracy?
I hear constantly how Microsoft is supposedly pro-piracy for dominance purposes, yet never an explanation why they added activation to Windows XP, Windows 2003, Office XP, and Office 2003.
And why did SP1 not install on invalid keys?
Clearly, this is simply a turnaround based on the fact that the keygens out there make it impossible to detect an invalid key, and the need to plug certain holes that have been spreading things is more important than making sure the user has paid for what's running. Their own dominance through piracy is becoming a security clutch, and this is their answer.
At first glance I was thinking "Wow, MS is actually starting to worry about their image..." Then I snapped back to reality and realized how handy it would be for MS to install software on the PCs of the pirates which could collect enough information for MS to find them out and prosecute them.
My suggestion is to watch the license agreement carefully.
Also, it's not that tough to get a key. A tech I know that works for an ISP was helping a customer call MS to get a sockets problem in XP fixed... They got MS to help her for free, and, after the MS tech learned it was a burned copy (the customer came right out and told them), the tech put her on hold, and got a key for her.
I dunno, I still don't trust MS with this. Beware.
"when the free ride is taken away"
I sleep very well at night, and I haven't paid for Windows in quite some time.
Corp IT departments are often as guilty as Grandma Jones of this; Like most Slashdotters, I work on machines in both environments, and can say quite categorically that the corporate IT department has nothing to feel smug about. It's one thing to delay the roll-out of a major new SP for a few weeks while you evaluate any potential adverse affects on a stable machine/network, but quite another to be to lazy or stupid to run WinUpdate every once in a while.
When I'm discovering 30+ bug-fixes and critical updates awaiting installation from 2 years ago, then I say some outfits are waiting too long. Or are clueless. Your choice.
"You weren't forced to buy anything; you chose to buy a laptop with such restrictions and now are bitching about it."
He's not forced to buy anything, but every OEM version of Windows is now locked to the computer it came with. There is no exception to this. Every one has it. Every one.
Is that clear? There is no choice. Every one has this restriction.
Lets move on to the next point.
He is running under VMWARE. Go to www.vmware.com because you seem to be ill informed as to its purpose. He wants to run Windows XP on the same computer on which it was licensed, but since he's running VMWARE, then Windows says "Gee, this isn't a Sony laptop, I won't install. Therefore he can't install it.
I recommend he just get a pirate version and laugh at MS and Sony.
You seem to have crawled up on a high horse, and fallen off and impaled yourself on a spike of ignorance. If you're not sure what you're talking about, its probably best not to reply; you look like a jackass when you do stuff like this. But I'm sure I'm not the first person to tell you that.
This is about SP2 not checking valid product keys.
What do pirated copies of Windows XP have to do with people caring about security and the FOSS movement? What does any of this have to do with the open-source movement?
Typical Slashbot spin...
Deal with it
Yo!
SP2 has the new improved back door in it, so of course MS will let pirated users install it!
No tinfoil hat needed, just common sense.
Well, considering Microsoft hasn't made mention of whether or not SP1 will be required before SP2 is installed, it's a non-issue. SP1 gets to be the bad guy. So if you managed to get around the problem for SP1, then SP2 won't cause any more trouble, but you still have to do the dirty work the first time.
The court decision in the spring gun case is well known, see Hooker v. Miller. Also Katco v. Briney is another well known case (SC Iowa, 1972, 183 N.W.2d 657) in which a criminal trespasser successfully sued for $30,000 in damages.
Further, Lee v. C.T.A (SC Illinois, 1992, Case No. 71304) resulted in a judgement of $1.5 mill for a death that occurred while trespassing.
Reasonable duty is more or less the legal standard. IANAL... just a techno-MBA student. Even *we* cover these sorts of cases!
what's my beloved slashdot server trying to do? using a win2k box (don't know if it's pirated, not mine), and the pf tells me this:
/.org. humhum ;)
Someone from 66.35.250.150, port 32916 wants to connect to port 8080 [...]
fake ip? nslookup tells me it's
beer as in "free beer"
I'd like to say that these people are insane. They want to hate everyone, even though they are not conscious of it. They want everyone to love them, even though they are not conscious of it. They don't even realize that they are alienating themselves from the world. All that they know is that everybody is out to get them.
It's too bad that these people are allowed to roam around freely in society. Such incoherant people ought to be locked up so that the rest of us can get on with our lives. But what do I know? After all, I'm posting on slashdot.
testing out my trending skills
Um, you do realise that activation is not required for the corporate editions of Windows XP, right?
-- "I believe the human being and the fish can coexist peacefully." - George W. Bush, 29 September 2000
New technology allows it to dynamically open and close ports on demand. For example, when an approved online gaming application is given permission to send or receive data over the Net, the port is opened for it, and when the application shuts down, the port is closed.
Damn it Microsoft, how long until hackers utilize this to just open up those ports you automaticly close???
Quite frankly, I think you do it because you love the attention and enjoy karma whoring/trolling. I seriously doubt that you could stay away from it for more than a few days.
Well I may be anit-microsoft (and uses it), but even though I am a hypocrit, my whole purpose behind hating them is the fact that they ruined my favorite game series. It started when they got the license for Mech Warrior and used it with 3... and all down hill (Activision did the best job).
bonch, (enter inspirational phrase here).
I tried to install the beta of sp2 on an fckgw machine the other day- no joy. some msg box about an invalid key, and it refused to continue.
So are they lying, or are they leaving the keycheck in until they go final with the service pack?
graspee
Huh? Corporate (volume) license has no activation requirements.
Your company is whiny.
That's not the issue. If our corporate key gets compromised, MS has the ability to lock out our "legit" copies from windows update.
Microsoft hasn't up to this point, but the fact remains they could.
We don't like that idea.
-ted
DEB system is better at this problem I wish RPM based system will catchup.
The Debian system auto finds and downloads the Dependances because of the improvement in apt system ie the rpm system needs it.
You totally missed my point.
I my only point was that most pirates wouldn't have been purchasing the product in the first place. Most are hobbyists and 'kids' that cant afford 99% of the software they copy. The #'s of companies that are getting away with not purchasing is a small percentage of the total numbers. ( no I don't have proof, just speaking from experience )
If a pirated copy wasn't available to the majority of the hobbyists, they would be using something else.. or nothing.
The *few* small businesses I know that copy, would have to compensate in other ways, like dropping an employee to pay for overpriced software. ( and as they grow, they pay for their software as they can )
Neither have bottomless pockets.. Unlike major corporations or wealthy 'kids'.
Also, I neither said nor implied anything about legality of the action, only that it's not an actual 'revenue loss' to the software company in most cases. ( not all, but most )
---- Booth was a patriot ----
They don't have to. It can't be easy to stop an upgrader, but to OK it is not a bad thing
MS puts Spyware in Media Player and other Windows programs. How hard would it be then to modify the Windows Update to find the XP Key and send it in to Microsoft for examination if it is a valid key or not? That way they can see how many pirated copies of XP are out there. The personal info they collect this way can tell them what the typical pirate is like.
Remember, Slashdot does not have a -1 disagree moderation, and no, troll, flamebait, and overrated are not substitutes.
If I had to guess I'd say the decision was made after the latest beta was released and that the final version will install. We'll have to wait and see though.
Since Microsoft has agreed to this, which by the way:
Thanks Microsoft for putting Internet Security ahead of profit. I think it will help you in the long run.
Idea::
How about making a clear way available for people to buy CD's that have most of the patches on them, and a local copy of the Update utility?
There are lots of people that have dial up and cannot (or will not) afford the cost of spending an hour or two downloading. Not everyone can get the full 56K either, so what is painful for normal dial-up is excruciating for others. And, for the record, I'm talking about Ohio, not areas even more remote.
If local Universities could offer free (or direct cost fee) copies of this package, you'd have a further chance of getting at least some patches done to machines. It might not bring you all the way up to date, but might reduce the pain to a manageable level.
Imagine being able to reduce the download time from 2 hours for all the Service packs, to running a CD, then spending 15 minutes on the net for only the last two patches. It does not have to cover all the bases in order to make a difference.
MS could also let computer stores cut ISO's of the up-to-date WinUpdate package, selling them for $2.00 each, say, and the store can build them on an as-needed basis to keep the stock fresh.
Hint: a link to an ISO from the Update page would allow Broadbanders like me to cut free Update CD's for friends who are on dialup.
Dammit, I would but I can't get it to compile
and load right with the new init-tools. If you
bite tinfoil it hurts your teeth. Oh, but I
thought.....?
They're going to do it. They might as well do it protected.
I'm sure this is an unpopular sentiment, and that many will disagree with me (I might even earn the so called 'troll' ranking), but this is a 'good thing' and microsoft are being downright decent about this.
Seriously- it woudlen't be that hard for them to break the upgrade cycle for those who have hacked there product, doing so would surely convince at least a few of the freeloaders to go off and buy the real version, it's costing them bandwith to provide it, but it's making the internet a safter place.
I can't find fault, and I'd like to find fault- microsoft often makes a lot of very ethically interesting decisions that I cannot support, and they are a favorate company to pick on (cause it's easy), but in this particular scenario, they are doing the 'right thing'- maby it's a hopeful glimpse of the company microsoft is growing into?
Maby not.
-Millions of Monkeys, Millions of typewriters, 6 hours of sorting through faeces encrusted pages to find: This post
However, some people seem to be under the illusion that MS have made a charitable gesture to those users and almost sanctioned the use of pirated copies of XP in the future - this is not the case.
Everything that MS does is purely for financial reasons, nothing more. The fact is that their reputation has taken a beating recently with regard to worms & viruses and, as many people have already said, it makes sense to allow all users to apply updates to limit the spread of those across the Internet in the future.
However, MS's ultimate aims are to sell more copies of XP and deep down MS knows full well that the struggle to keep Windows in and Linux out of the desktop is going to get more and more difficult over the next few years - so from a financial perspective, it makes far more sense to keep all users working with MS products now (and taking a financial hit as a result) rather than risking them seeking an alternative OS. This decision is therefore purely a business one, not a charitable one.
Finally, I also believe that the people here who are proudly proclaiming some kind of victory because they can continue to run updated copies of illegal XP installations, need to grow up and join the world of adults.
Piracy achieves nothing apart from making things bad for everyone. Any piece of commercial software released today has a price that factors in some assumptions based on the amount of illegal copies that will be run of it - the upshot is that the price is higher than it should be and honest users suffer.
A lot of people need to grow up out of this childish "must have" attitude. The only way to force the hand of any business is to hit them where it hurts - in their profits. In other words, if people don't want to pay the full price for a product, they should contact the vendor or manufacturer and tell them exactly why their product is overpriced and and why they will not use it, rather than simply copying it. The same goes for a product that restricts rights to fair usage - don't use it or buy it if you don't like what it does to your freedoms.
Pirates are nothing more than cowardly sheep who are ultimately responsible for driving prices up and allowing all manner of restrictive technologies to get in through the back door. In a few years time, when these same people still need their Windows "fix", they may not be congratulating MS so loudly when they find that all their data is DRMed and the ability to copy & share data, something they took for granted previously, has disappeared.
Gentoo Linux - another day, another USE flag.
I applaud MS for allowing SP2 to be available to all. But one thing Im curious about is how hard would it really be for MS to stop at least 98% of the pirated copies of MS products out there (not just limited to windows). If you look at Win XP keys, they have 25 characters in them. Each character can hold either A-Z or 0-9 for a total of 36 possible choices. So if my probability serves me right, this gives a keyspace of 36^25 which is ~8x10^38!! Now im not sure of the number of Windows XP copies that have been sold, but lets just say its 1billion which I believe is pretty giving. I would also assume that somewhere MS has recorded all those 1billion serial numbers that have been used. To store 1billion keys, you would need 25chars * 1byte/char * 1billion = 25Gigs of space. Thats a pretty trivial amount of storage now a days, especially for MS. So it would seem to me that it would be more than feasable to set up a system that would check your serial# versus the known used ones everytime sombody goes to windows update. Even though there are keygens out, they produce keys using the entire 8x10^38 keyspace. The random chance that a keygen would produce a key in that range of the *real* 1billion with so many posibilities has to be infintesimally small.
Agree with me or DIE!
In the next batch of banned keys will be yours included.
All they have to do is check their Windows-Update logs, to see that more than one machine is using the same key _simultaneously_. They can even track down your ip and make a request at your ISP.
The main problem that I can see in your argument is that not all 8X10^38 keystroke combinations are valid kys for win XP. Once you take into account all of the valid keys I'm sure the number is much lower.
Just a thought
-Mike
I don't know about elsewhere, but I don't recall seeing even one single `legal' version of Microsoft (or any other thing) software in my country, during the past eight years. Although that the world is not my country (Iran), but it is still a part of the world. And I quite beleive many third-level countries are the same. The security issues as far as I concern, is over having your Yahoo! ID hacked or similar over here. It is also very stupid for companies to run Windows or any other pirated software, because that they won't be able to receive complete support. They don't have [= can't afford] the code, so they can't tell their clients: ``I am really sorry that your entire buisiness website was replaced with ..... Probably Microsoft will fix it some time.''. Even if they do so, Microsoft will have to give away their patch again. And, sometimes, one comes back to think: Do these things really help security? Or are they written with such a haste that they even waste what you have already? I am not against Microsoft, but anyone that wants `guaranteed' security should come to OSS. At this point of time, the Iranian Government has elected Linux as the national OS, but there is still a `way' long way to go. Already, many of the Universities and webservers have switched to Linux.
Face It: Untill the time that Little Jimmy and her Grandmother are sitting behind PCs, there will be _no_ security available to anyone at the PC level.
The real debate is not if micro$$$$$$$ 'opens' their update center or not. Micro$$$$$$$ could just make a zip or self extracting zip available for download if it really wanted to help contain the sasser worm.
Regrattably this is not what micro$$$$$$$ is about. What micro$$$$$$$ wants to do is revenue enhancement and data mining in the face of a data security emergency. Sounds quite greedy to the point of being counterproductive if the result is an army of zombies ravening at micro$$$$$ doorstep. This could really be the case if sasser really contains a hidden backdoor to infested systems.
Microsoft by its actions discounts that very real possibility. Therefore I must conclude that it is an equally likely possibility that micro$$$$ has no fears of attack from this particular digital vermin. Now THAT makes me suspicious that micro$$$ has a double game. Aim 'one' is to get
numerous 'unregistered' (+ pirate in their eyes) users to pony up their digital souls to the Gollem Gates by allowing their systems to be invaded online. Aim two is to infest those systems with not only the 'patch' but also new hooks to XAML and DRM and 'trusted computing' (XPify their
computers). So beneficial to micro$$$ are these putative aims that I suspect that the real perpetrators of this and future worms are micro$$$ themselves. OH! Yes!! I know all about the poor German that was arrested for 'authoring' it. Kinda caught him kinda quick don't ya think, pilgrim. I really BET he's guilty. Probably planted evidence on a cheap machine belonging to a disposable nobody. Could be the bum really even
WORKed for micro$$$$. If you believe the guilt
of the German fellow, let me tell you about all those 'unsolved crimes' down south in the United States that used to be 'solved' when some small town 'sheriff' arrested some unknown drifter with no friends or family and proceeded to charge, convict, and hang the guy before he even knew what hit him until the trep door dropped out of the gallows.
Personally, I think it just burns your ass that an alternative point of view to yours got modded up +5, so you have to do *something* to try and tear it down. BTW, I thought you were so disgusted with Slashdot that you weren't going to post here anymore? I think these guys were on to something.
1 - All the small business I work with don't qualify for a site license. They are *small* business, get it? They are forced to purchase retail. And a company of a size of 10, if you add up all the costs of software, would come close to the cost of a person such a secretary for a year. So yes, it DOES impact employment.
.Show me the object that has changed locations.. show me the actual money lost... you cant.. it doesn't exist. And I really don't care what some court has decided. I am talking what *I* believe here, not some overpaid lawyer that now sits on a bench pretending he knows what is going on.. I don't respect 'laws' that I don't agree with..
2 - Software purchases tax deductible? I never claimed I did the books for clients. I work in their computers that's it.... So while you may or may not be right, claiming I don't deal with business because of this statement is ludicrous.. Also just because its deductible, doesn't mean a company has the cash flow to support waiting for tax time, at least in the beginning.
3 - I'm tired of people comparing pirating software to staling a car. Its NOT the same.. Show me what you have stolen if you copied something.
4 - I will give you that TODAY there are some alternatives to some commercial software, but in many cases its not enough of an option. Due to many factors, but highest on the list is the lack of compatibility. Is this changing? yes. But its not here yet in all cases.
5 - Do I use the 'amount of profit' as a indicator on if its ok to pirate? No. Its based on what I stated earlier. And if a company goes out of business because of piracy, then too bad. Again I don't believe they actually lost any revenue. A non sale is not lost revenue.
6 - Actually this whole exercise is pointless, as we are diametrically opposed in our beliefs here. And I will continue to act on mine, and will copy freely when its appropriate. Perhaps something a company you work for produces.. that would be rather fitting I think.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
You could try installing Linux on those older machines, which could help lengthen their life. Sure, KDE or Gnome probably won't be too speedy, but a lighter window manager might do the trick.
I've never tried installing Mandrake with anything other than KDE, but I hope that the install would still be pretty simple.
You truly have a dizzying intellect.
http://www.winnetmag.com/windowspaulthurrott/Artic le/ArticleID/42640/windowspaulthurrott_42640.html
This week, Microsoft verified that Windows XP Service Pack 2 (SP2), the company's long awaited security update, will not install on pirated copies of the best-selling operating system. Press reports had suggested that Microsoft was going to allow pirated versions to install the update, but the company says this isn't the case, and that SP2 will behave much like its predecessor, SP1.
Yep, that's what your momma did. AC Pussy.
~S
So why did they then bother with the XP activation when piracy has only benefitted them? Afterall activation didn't stop piracy, cost hard cash to develop and only upset paying customers?
Just because piracy has benefitted MS doesn't mean they like it. In MS ideal world they want every PC to pay a subscription fee to run their DRM software on DRM hardware. Activation was the first attempt. It failed, kinda like how Internet Explorer failed completly for years. (well felt like years).
I am a suspicious bastard when it comes to MS but perhaps XP activation was just a test, not of how to stop pirates but of how paying customers would react. A test to see if the DRM hardware of the future might be accepted or not. As far as I can see XP activation passed with flying colors. People cried for a bit but they all swallowed it. So MS is another babystep closer to their ideal world.
Remember activation didn't have to work. MS is not some game company one step away from bankruptcy. If no-one had paid for XP at all then MS would still be around.
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
Wow.
~S
Blame the victim, typical MS group think....
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
This is true, and likewise to yourself.
~S
I am sick and tired of people that make the claims that Linux is just a passing fad.
Look pal, get over it, Linux is here to stay not because it is hip (which it is) but because addresses many pressing problems with the IT industry.
Firstly, MS does not do many things silly and ridiculous, in the contrary, they are a company convicted of abusing its monoploic position and punished (wrist slapped) in both the US and the EU, so do not dare to ask me to have any synpathy for such an entity.
It is tremendously telling tha the only hope of the IT industry of getting any sembalnce of competition and innovation is for individuals to compete for free against such mamooth, misbehaved companies.
It is not hip to be anti MS, it is a need if you want to have any kind of control in your own computing infrastructure in the future.
Hip, my a@@!
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
I don't get that...