Slashdot Mirror
Looking Beyond Vista To Fiji and Vienna
Vinit wrote in with an article that describes Microsoft's strategy for future versions of Windows. It begins: "As we all know that Microsoft Vista was originally scheduled to be released in 2003, after two years of Windows XP, but it got delayed by over five years due to various reasons. Definitely, Vista is very very improved OS over the previous versions, but the delayed in the launch has cost Microsoft, billions of dollars. Now the question at the moment is, what exactly after Vista? Microsoft can't afford to wait another five years for an operating system. People are becoming more aware of the choices they have, and Linux is no longer a hobbyist OS, and that day isn't far away when it becomes simple enough to be a viable alternative to Windows. The competition is fierce. That is why, to stay at the top, Microsoft has planned a 'Vista R2', codenamed 'Fiji' which will be released some time in 2008. And after Fiji, there will be Windows 'Vienna'. Windows Fiji, will not be a totally different OS from Vista; but it will be an add-on. Whereas Vienna will be totally different from Vista."
'Vista R2', codenamed 'Fiji' which will be released some time in 2008
Why not in Fiji?
Fiji is where Bill plans to take his money and retire. Nothing to do with an OS.
...by the time Fiji is available, our bones will have long turned to dust...
Palm trees and 8
Apple are progressively upgrading the OS having smaller releases. This is closer to the Linux way of working.
Once you get your basic design right you can gradually improve and alter things. This is where Microsoft failed, their security model was flawed, so with Vista they've fixed it (or so they say).
The really big question for next year is: Will Vista be ready for desktop?
How do they figure five years? 2003 to 2007, that's four years at best, not "over five years." If you include all of 2003 AND 2007, that gets you right up to five years (but that's not how it worked anyway).
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by a grue.
Ok, so from TFA: "One thing is for certain, Vienna won't be just an operating system, but a new generation in computing."
.Mac. Or, come to think of it, do what I've already done; use LiteStep and mod my current XP install.
How, we all ask, will it achieve such wonders?
The answer: "Windows Fiji will feature a more powerful sidebar, Monaco, a music authoring tool similar to Apple's Garageband, default playback of HD-DVD, more advanced Speech Recognition, and new themes, icons, wallpapers, games, and minor tweaks to almost everything."
Mmmhmm. I can't be the only one sitting here thinking 'what a load of bull'. I mean, really, if I wanted to get this apparently 'new generation' of computing, I'd go out and buy a
A illiterate intro based on a brief article from a random blog that doesn't quote any sources. That's what I call credibility.
"While in Windows Vienna the current interface will be completely stripped, no more explorer shells, and taskbars. No start menu. Probably no toolbars, or menus and Speech Recognition will become a major input device. One thing is for certain, Vienna won't be just an operating system, but a new generation in computing."
Yeah, great...DragonNaturallyDOS.
A source at MS told me they're planning on releasing Fiji as Windows Me2.
Zing!
Fiji: Microsoft gets an extension from the teacher to turn in its Vista homework late.
Vienna: Microsoft takes a philosophy class. Wonders why it did everything a certain way for the past 15 years. Gets high. Oooo...look at all the pretty colors and new interface paradigms.
REAL article with actual meat: http://jameskyton.wordpress.com/2006/12/29/beyond- windows-vista-fiji-and-vienna/
Don't you hate reading the whole thing and getting to the end and seeing SOURCE? I wish I could digg this article DOWN!
this sig limit is too small to put anything good h
So after basically admitting that windows had jumped the shark, they're still going to release "Fiji", ie a glorified service pack that you have to pay for. *sigh* maybe they'll be adding some of the features they scrapped in Vista, like WinFS.
On the plus side, at least Vista did ship with "improved shortcut support". Gotta give Microsoft that.
Witness the release of Vista, and then witness a re-release a couple of years later with bug fixes, feature improvements, security improvement rollups, and a few new (probably non-exclusive) applications rolled in to make the pill go down more sweetly. Everything old is made new again. Move along.
What? Does Taco get kickbacks on the ad revenue from blogs he kicks to the front page? The "article" is all of two paragraphs on a blog :(
- windows-vista-fiji-and-vienna
Ahh, if one looks at the end of the blog, it points to where that guy got it from and lo and behold, another blog, but, in this case, precious content including details of each hypothetical version.
http://jameskyton.wordpress.com/2006/12/29/beyond
They can bury new versions of the OS in bells an whistles, but some of us will still be happily running Windows freakin 95 because it does what we need. I think there really isn't much more they can add to Windows that people actually need. Of course they currently have the advertising dollars and power to convince people otherwise.
Whereas Vienna will be totally different from Vista.
Vista is weird enough. I can't see how Vienna can be any different.
And I hear it's a good, operating system, but it has, some stunning, similarities to OS X. Also, the, author of the snippet, uses a few too, many, commas, and comes up, with wonderfully original, sentence, structures.
Real link to story
Not without inflicting majok dammage to US and international business. Regardless of how you feel about them as a company they are an economic force affecting jobs, pensions and service sectors.
> Microsoft can't afford to wait another five years for an operating system.
Why not?
> The competition is fierce.
What competition?
Definitely, Vista is very very improved OS over the previous versions, but the delayed in the launch has cost Microsoft, billions of dollars.
I'm not looking for Shakespeare here, but the submitter is what, eight?
sic transit gloria mundi
One of the most important facets of usability is consistency. If you don't want confused users, DON'T CHANGE EVERYTHING WITH EACH RELEASE.
The cake is a pie
Will it be Fiji or Vienna that come bundled with Duke Nukem 3D?
apologies to pigs everywhere
Windows Fiji will feature a more powerful sidebar, Monaco, a music authoring tool similar to Apple's Garageband, default playback of HD-DVD, more advanced Speech Recognition, and new themes, icons, wallpapers, games, and minor tweaks to almost everything.
:)
While in Windows Vienna the current interface will be completely stripped, no more explorer shells, and taskbars. No start menu. Probably no toolbars, or menus and Speech Recognition will become a major input device. One thing is for certain, Vienna won't be just an operating system, but a new generation in computing.
So Fiji is going to rip off all the cool features of Leopard and incorporate into Vista while Vienna aims to be the next generation of computing. Why does this sound so familiar... oh wait....
And didn't we just recently have an article on stupid movie uses of computers that blasted the "talking computer" from Star Trek as being a completely useless interface? So why is this a good thing?
But it's also Microsoft. "2003" was codespeak for 2007, so "2008" means 2015 or something... and all the cool new features will be dropped for reasons of infeasibility anyway.
Exactly what is the basis for spouting this load of crap? How about this list of why Vista is inferior to previous versions of windows:
.doc
No Support for IPX, Appletalk, WebDav, or NetDDE
Even less capable backup built in than XP, which itself had inferior backup to previous versions
High cost
Bloat #1 - takes over 10GB of hard disk
Bloat #2 - 2GB of RAM needed
Crippled wordpad can't read
Obtuse menuing requiring going in half a dozen or more levels in for basic controls
Stupid ReadyBoost trying to do what would be better done by simple swap/page to usb device, except RB is MUCH slower
Hardware vendors not in hurry to support Vista
in short, you'll gain nothing and lose functionality by going to Vista. save your money, just say NO.
Until the day Vista ships, MS is getting huge amounts of cash from Windows XP licenses on almost every new PC sold. Most people don't run out and buy a new OS for existing PCs, they usually stick with whatever came with it. How exactly will Vista increase MS's revenue to the tune of billions? Had they released something sooner, what new cash flow would that have provided and would it have justified the expense for development?
I'm sortof dancing around my real point here: I think the *real* reason so much time has gone buy since XP is that Microsoft really hasn't had much incentive to release a new OS.
...why should we believe anything that Microsoft says about the feature set of a distant-future operating system? Furthermore, the days of geek dominance of the computer world are long over -- average people simply don't care what bells and whistles an OS has. They want to send email, play games, browse the web, play movies, organize their music, and write a few reports. Without having to worry about their computer being infected. All of those things are properly OS-agnostic: Firefox with Gmail and Flash, VLC and OpenGL work much the same on any modern OS. The only reasons for MS's continuing OS dominance are inertia, the forced tie-in with its flagship business apps, and DRM.
There are two kinds of people: 1) those who start arrays with one and 1) those who start them with zero.
One of the things I remember Gates talking about excitedly for the past 10 years is his R&D in Speach Recognition. He's been dreaming about the seamless and natural interaction of computers and humans for a long time. I wouldn't be surpised if Vienna really happened because it's the one thing Bill has poured his life and energy into for over a decade. Anybody who follows Gates knows that he has been serious about speach recognition for a long time.
Were Star Trek writers involved somehow?
OK so Fiji is a stop-gap measure, let's face it none of the things listed there are going to make people rush out and buy it - more than likely anyone who wants those things will have already got them via third-party apps long before this ever sees the light of day. It's of little relevance.
Vienna, as it's described in TFA, seems unlikely to happen. As the article tells it, it's basically replacing all visual interface for speech-recognition. Huh? If this is intended to be the next proper OS from Microsoft and they're talking about it not being another delay-ridden feature-stripped letdown then I can only presume we're looking at a 2011-2012 release for this at latest? In order for speech-recognition to work as the primary interface for an OS, as in the thing you'll be working with all day long, it's going to have some bitchin' speech-recognition. We're talking HAL9000-style in terms of ability to understand the context of what someone's saying and whether they're speaking to the machine or to someone else in the room. So is the hardware to do all that going to be around by 2012? I doubt it very much. In short, if TFA is accurate in it's description and I haven't misunderstood, Vienna looks like vapourware.
A far more likely (IMO) future for Microsoft is the non-Windows MS-WebOS that they've hinted at as being the future of computing. Not because it's good for the consumer, far from it. Because it's good for Microsoft. As each version of Windows comes around it gets more and more complex and expensive to create, it takes longer to build and each time it gets more stable and secure. Windows being genuinely stable and secure is bad for business - why would anyone update their OS if the one they've had for the last five years is still running fine and the hardware can still do everything they need (which 5yr old hardware generally can these days). Point being that since the death of Win9x, Microsoft have reached a base level of security and stability that actually has them competing with their own products with each new release. Far better for them then to talk-up the future as being Web-based desktops so that they can pull out a Microsoft-WebOS that has Windows compatibility and can be charged as a service instead of a product. That way they can effectively guarantee a long-term income with a monthly service charge instead of having to compete with themselves.
Of course this is all rabid speculation and assumptions and I'm probably 100% wrong about everything etc. etc.
Spelling mistakes, grammatical errors, and stupid comments are intentional.
Aren't windows code names traditionally cities? The fact that they are using a contry name for an upgraded version of Vista that experienced a military coup d'état a year ago (while vista development was in full swing) makes me wonder if this is a bad omen.
Talk about an article summary that serves it's own conclusions... "linux is a viable alternative on the desktop". Hunh?
having had an R2 of Windows 2003, which given some companies went to Windows 2003 only weeks before R2 was made available, one wonders "Why go to Vista, when they are going to R2 it".
Given most of the computers I deal with still have Windows 2000 (and some 95), and are only just going Windows XP, we know we wont be in the "Vista support cycle" for at least 2 years (and to be honest, as a business you dont want to be an early adopter, and stability wise until at least the 2nd service pack) I dount we will allow Vista on the desktop
Then again, there is the hardware cost, most PC's on the market at present (ie those from HP, Dell, IBM) cant run Vista in its full version (with all the bells and whistles).
Me, I'd wait until R2 was out before even considering buying/allowing Vista on any desktop.
What's not simple about using Linux? People always seem to view any Linux distro as a failed attempt to emulate the current Windows UI, which isn't what it's designed to be. Any OS is simple if it's the one you've always used.
It's ironic that so many people reject Linux based on the occasional need to drop the menus and graphics in favour of the CLI, when that would logically be the "simplest" an OS could get.
I find Windows XP a pain to navigate, and never understood why so many people regard it as the easy option.
Have you ever thought about how huge of a leap it would be for Windows to support multi-language speach recognition as a primary interface? Over 90% of the world's computer users use Windows. Think about how much money it requires to go through the painful learning process that's needed to develop a speach recognition engine that can handle the scope of languages Windows requires. And ease of use? For it to be able to handle not only hundreds of languages but hundreds of dialects and accents for each language really boggles the mind. If MS pulls this off with a success I'll be amazed.
But. punct!u,a(tion; is " fun!
As for "file locations" being managed by applications - mmm, no thanks, I rather group files by projects which can involve many applications. What I'd really love is a return to the functionality present in Word for DOS, where the application would look in the current working directory for project specific configuration files.
Stay with our cruddy platform!!! Don't switch, because in the coming years, when "Vienna" is released, you'll be glad you stuck with us!
...So with decades of programming and billions of dollars, you still need to be using Vaporware to sell your current product offering. Way to go.
Lets hop in our time machine:
You'll be glad you stayed with Windows 3.1 and didn't switch to any of the mmu-capable operating systems out there, because "Chicago" is going to be great!
Why stick up for big business?
As we all know that Microsoft Vista was originally scheduled to be released in 2003, after two years of Windows XP, but it got delayed by over five years due to various reasons.
My first comment is that Vista's release date (last time I checked) is around 30/1/2007; if it was originally scheduled for a 2003 release, that's not a delay of "over 5 years", it's 4 at most.
My second comment is that grammatically speaking, that sentence is awful (as is much of the rest of the summary). I know this is a technology site, not a literature one, but it'd be nice if we had *some* standards...
It's official. Most of you are morons.
Yes, this easy to use OS called Windows Vista will create $$$ McJobs doing license auditing and applying updates. Meanwhile as Microsoft dependent "service-sector" economies support a monopoly, other countries are going to be busy generating wealth.
Anybody who follows Gates knows that he has been serious about speach (sic) recognition for a long time.
It's hard for anyone who does not "follow" the cult of Gates to take anything he says seriously. He's been promising the moon and stars for decades but has yet to deliver anything but mild UI modifications. Generally, his company writes down a wish list of competitor's features and promises to deliver them bigger and better in his "next" release. As the years roll by he drops all of the features until he's left with something like Vista, which offerst the user little beyond DRM madness and a UI upgrade, which he then invariably promotes as "revolutionary".
Despite all of that, I thought he liked to talk about handwriting recognition. You know, the tablet PC, that' he's promissed the world since the Apple Newton. Palm, OpenZarus and Xstroke all beat him to the punch and his tablet PC has yet to catch on.
He might as well claim his next OS will have AI and do "seemless" speech recognition. He won't loose much credibility that way. At this point, he's got so little to use, I'd sooner believe penis pill spam.
DMCA, Hollings, Palladium. What might have sounded like paranoia is now common sense.
Microsoft isn't stupid. Even if it can't excite the masses over Vista, they might as well start talking up their new products.
It sounds like Fiji is going to what Vista should be, if Vista was allowed to be bug-fixed before being released.
And Vienna is so far in the future, that Microsoft can promise us anything they want, then scale back the features to meet the ship date, as always.
I hear that 2K3 R2 is a good OS. Maybe that's what I will have to upgrade to once my 2K machine can't load the drivers written for new hardware.
Hey, it was just a week ago, and it summarizes all the struggle pretty well:
Eveyone will switch to 64bit hardware by the end of 2008, it's impossible otherwise. The moore's law tells us what will be the memory capacity by 2008. And with 32bit it's impossible to address more than 4GB. Yeah, go ahead and tell that it will take a bit more, like just one year more. No problem. We will not see a working 64bit version of windows by then.
That article is great and gave me a lot of thought
#
#\ @ ? Colonize Mars
#
"There are lies, damned lies, and Microsoft promises."
We've heard it all before. Seriously. And it happens just like that: "Yeah, we know XP isn't that much of an upgrade to MS-Windows 2k, but you should see Longhorn! Oh, it's gonna be great! It'll milk your cows, skim the cream, and make fresh ice cream! It'll put your kids through college! Oh, and it'll, uh, make your complexion clear up, and get rid of your herpes!"
Every time Microsoft releases a less-than-stellar product (which is invariably), they start bragging about how great things will be in the *next* release, on which they haven't even started working. That's the Microsoft modus operandi: promise more than the competition currently has, and deliver less. Wash, rinse, repeat.
Microsoft is to software what Budweiser is to beer.
Of course, since Vista shipped on time, we should all believe that 'Fiji' will be out in 2007 and 'Vienna' will be out in 2008.
I see you laughing in the back. Stop it. We're serious.
When Vista is released to the public, it will not ape all the features of Apple's OS X until R2 (codenamed Fiji), scheduled for release in 2008. Innovation will be part of a subsequent product "Vienna", still over 3 years away at a minimum. Although of course if it were to be delivered inside 5 years, you might feel justifiably ripped off if you purchased Vista, as it can be assumed that similar upgrade conditions from XP to Vista will apply re Vista to Vienna.
"There is nothing nice about Steve Jobs and nothing evil about Bill Gates." - Chuck Peddle
In a bold move Vienna, will all be in German. Wunderbar! This release was originally codenamed Windows "Archduke Ferdinand", but they quickly killed that idea.
Take the points in the parent posting, and add:
50+ millions lines of code bloat
lots of stupid, unnecessary eye candy
alleged security features, some that have already been broken ("most secure o/s ever", my ass)
a virgin ip stack
DRM silliness
kernel restrictions that keep third party security systems out -- said systems having done a much better job than Microsquish at keeping the bad guys out. You can, of course, pay extra for windows "defender" -- somewhat like buying an antidote from the people that poisoned you in the first place
As Ren and Stimpy might say to Ballmer, "you eeeediot!"
It's Linux, damnit! Pay no attention to renaming attempts by self-aggrandizing blowhards.
So by the time large companies have started to deploy Vista, there will be a new version of windows out that they'll be plugging to mr and mrs Corporate world, pointing out, in the process, all the things that were wrong with Vista or needed changing, in order to get purchase orders in for the new stuff.
Somehow I don't see this as a viable plan.
Incremental service pack based improvements to Vista? Yes indeedy, but a completely new OS? What a stupid idea. They do, after all, sell to the Corporate world, and that does not like complete change in IT infrastructure every two years
Even Babblefish, could, translate better than, this if it, were completely broken on, a bad day.
Paraphrased: "The next two versions will get all the deleted features we promised for vista, honest!"
So essentially, vista won't be launched until 2008?
Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence.
"and Linux is no longer a hobbyist OS, and that day isn't far away when it becomes simple enough to be a viable alternative to Windows"
I think that day is still very far away and that it is still a hobbyist OS WHEN IT COMES TO THE DESKTOP. For servers, it's fabulous but it just come close to Windows or OSX for desktop usability. If you're not a geek it's just not gonna be your desktop OS. And if you are a geek you probably have Windows/OSX installed someplace for your real desktop use.
Since Win2000, I have been disappointed with Microsoft's continual failure to depart from their OS kernel model that makes them persistently vulnerable and unstable. I recall attending some Microsoft presentation discussing the upcoming release of Windows 2000. I raised my hand to ask a simple question:
"Will Windows 2000 have the drivers running at ring-0?"
The answer was initially "what does that mean?" and eventually, "yes it will."
This isn't Win32's only source of vulnerability and instability, but it's certainly among them. And the obvious solution was virtualization. Back before Win2000's release (and each release thereafter) I had hoped to see something along the lines of WINE or some sort of virtualization mode for compatibility and a "native mode" for all modern releases of applications.
And when MacOSX came out and did precisely what I had hoped Windows would do, not only was I pleased to discover that my idea wasn't unique but that it was workable and functionable. (Well, sort of... I have been supporting a production environment that involves MacOS in Classic mode and while it basically works, it's not quite stable... no more stable than Windows is in its present form anyway.) But it also served as proof that Microsoft COULD have done this and probably SHOULD have done this.
Perhaps they WILL do this eventually, but will it be soon enough?
I love to hate Microsoft, honestly, but for the good of the IT world at large, I'd just rather see Microsoft fix their crap and let's just get on with things. If Linux continues to grow and improve as it has been, I'd rather see further adoption based on its present and future merits rather than because of the faults in Microsoft products.
I find it ironic that with all Microsoft's huff about opening up standards they code name their next couple of OSes after islands! It's even funnier considering Vienna is in the EU.
.... are the ever-increasing hardware requirements of the new "operating system" costing consumers?
IPX and AppleTalk are dead. Vint said it best... IP Everywhere.
Please note that of all the things in the article that M$ is promising to do " in future releases", the only one they are workingon really hard right now is Palladium aka TCP et al. They are really pushing to get the hardware vendors on board ASAP so the DRM they want to push can be implemented. Yes I know that Vi$ta has a lot of DRM on board already but they want to tighten up even more by linking the hardware into the verification of the OS and apps. The fact that Vi$ta is a POS doesn't bother me near as much as when all the M$ club members start putting out hardware and apps that will only run on Vi$ta. IIRC Phoenix and Award BIOS already have the necessary components on board they just need to be activated.
The competition is fierce.
What competition? In my small business, there really aren't any viable competitors, as far as the OS goes, due to price, and software availability.
Windows 2000 = NT 5.0
Windows XP = NT 5.1
So Fiji is like Vista +.1 probably. It sounds likes more of what they have been doing already.
1 (short ton / firkin) = 89.1432354 slugs / keg
though it clear that vista might be the best rehash of windows thus far they have abandoned all of the inovations originally promised such as the new filesystem.
so what it looks better, needs me to buy a whole new computer and will have direct x 10. i say micro$oft should give us what they promised us 7 years ago and untill such a time as they do it, not waste time delivering crappy new OS's. just give me DX10 for XP and i'd be happy i'm sure you all would too.
-Sebastian
-Sebastian
And here's the timeline for 'Vienna':
2007 Q1 Vista released; work on Vienna begins.
2007 Q4 Microsoft announces Vienna will contain innovative new filesystem
2008 Q2 Microsoft projects release date for 'Vienna' as late 2010 or early 2011
2008 Q3 Microsoft announces Vienna will revolutionize the internet desktop
2009 Q2 Microsoft announces Vienna's filesystem will make search irrelevant
2009 Q4 Microsoft projects release date for Vienna as second half of 2011
2010 Q1 Microsoft announces Vienna will be inherently more secure than Vista
2010 Q2 Microsoft announces Vienna's new API will make developers' jobs easy
2010 Q4 Microsoft announces Vienna will have built-in internet telephony (VOIP)
2011 Q2 Microsoft projects release date for Vienna in early 2012
2011 Q3 Microsoft announces Vienna will work with next-generation security hardware
2012 Q1 Microsoft announces partnership with wireless internet provider to enhance Vienna's
internet telephony, allowing users to go "unplugged"
2012 Q2 Microsoft projects Vienna release date pushed back to 2013
2012 Q3 Microsoft announces Vienna's wireless internet telephony will make cellphones obsolete
2013 Q1 Microsoft announces Vienna's wireless internet telephony will be more secure than cellphones
2013 Q3 Microsoft announces Vienna kernel will be most secure OS kernel ever
2013 Q4 Microsoft projects Vienna release date in early 2014
2014 Q1 Microsoft announces the new filesystem may not be ready for RTM but will ship
just after Vienna in a service pack
2014 Q2 Microsoft announces Vienna public beta will be forthcoming later in the year
2014 Q3 Microsoft announces the new developer API will be spun off as a separate project from Vienna
2014 Q4 Microsoft promises Vienna release no later than 2015 Q2
2015 Q1 Deal with wireless internet company falls through
2015 Q2 Microsoft announces innovative filesystem will be in release after Vienna
2015 Q2 Microsoft announces Vienna will still feature "unplugged" internet telephony,
but user will have choice of third-party wireless providers
2015 Q3 Microsoft releases limited beta of Vienna to select individuals and companies
2015 Q3 Reviews of Vienna start coming out; reviewers note internet telephony not present
2015 Q4 Microsoft announces final product name for Vienna will be Windows Fiesta
2015 Q4 Microsoft confirms internet telephony will not be ready to ship with first release
2016 Q1 Microsoft releases public beta of Fiesta to a wider audience
2016 Q2 Microsoft announces final release date for Fiesta in November; nobody believes it
2016 October Microsoft announces Windows Fiesta will be available to select customers in
November, retail version will ship in January
2016 November Microsoft announces Fiesta now available to select customers
2017 January Microsoft actually releases Windows Fiesta
Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.
So why didn't they call Fiji by it's real name - "Vista Service Pack 1"? Must be because the words service pack smell of fixed bugs and removed vulnerabilities - two things Microsoft claim are more or less inexistent with Vista now (yeah right).
:(. Lovely collateral damage to Linux in Microsoft's eyes.
As for the other one - I can't wait! Major new features: more BLOOD! (Bigger Larger Overly Outrageous DRM)
The sad part of the story is that even the current Vista DRM will force hardware vendors to make worse hardware and keep drivers closed
I'll do my part: help people switch to Linux, report+fix bugs to Linux software, and if I have the time, start a free software project. I wish more people would do the same.
Is 'Vinit' eight years old? Because that is one of the only excuses that can justify the sack of shit that is the article summary. There have to be at least five different types of grammar and spelling errors in that one paragraph. The cherry on top of the turd of a summary is the fact that CowboyNeal is the "editor" responsible for unleashing it. I would be a bit less amazed if it was someone else, but CowboyNeal? Talk about dropping the fucking ball...
"We may face a scorched and lifeless earth, but they're accountable to their shareholders first."
"We know we haven't offered much -- and it's cost us BILLIONS (*sniff*) -- but we're really, really gonna blow your socks off next time!"
Sounds like Windows 1.0 and on post-release announcements. Trouble is, fewer people will be willing to put up with the crap anymore.
Look, Windows is a platform to run Microsoft office automation software (Office, etc.). With Mac OS X and Parallels, Standalone Windows Vista is unnecessary.
End of an error.
-- @rjamestaylor on Ello
MS don't know what will be in Vienna, because Apple haven't invented it yet. This means nothing to me.
Patriotism is a virtue of the vicious
So why remove .DOC from Wordpad if not to devalue .DOC as an interchange format? Now to use it you automatically have to have a fast internet connection. I buy Vista and it doesn't do something XP did, GP is right.
.exe and you know what? I decided I don't trust Microsoft to run that exe to see what it does. Weird huh, but all the shit they pull, I view .exe from Microsoft in the same light as spyware from porn sites. Don't run it, don't want it corrupting my system with any nasty DRM, don't want little tweaks to the OS breaking stuff.
Also something else, I followed the link, downloaded the
So Micro$oft has taken Apples lead, and are going to charge you for what are essentially Service Packs? I wonder, if like Apple, they'll immediately drop support for the 'old' version of the OS...
I think you have a major problem when you can post half of the source story in the story preview panel. This article tells little and says nothing. *goes back to sleep*
Slashdot: Playing Favorites Since 1997
I have no use for Vista or any of it's follow ups.
I have no interest in an operating system designed to protect content owners, protect microsoft with horrible activation functionality and little to no benefit to myself.
If I didn't require Windows for work I'd have nothing to do with it. I've been a long time Windows user since Windows 3.1 and each release seemed to be such a major improvement over the previous. Until Vista. Vista is not a users operating system. It's more of a prison.
"As we all know that Microsoft Vista was originally scheduled to be released in 2003, after two years of Windows XP, but it got delayed by over five years due to various reasons." 2003+5 = 2008. Man 2007 went fast.
Or maybe not. Who knows,maybe Microsoft paid lots of dollars to the Fiji Government and the City of Vienna.
I have to wonder if Vista has similar side affects.
Only 'flamers' flame!
Does slashdot hate my posts?
Try 2 hours ago, asshole. Cute 21 year old taiwanese - a change from my usual diet of japanese, so that was nice. A bit too much hair but she promised to fix that before next time. I'd be willing to bet your entire net worth that I've had more pussy in the last 6 months than you ever have, or ever will have. So go jerk off somewhere else, loser.
Must be the new math.
> Linux is no longer a hobbyist OS
since when is Linux is no longer a hobbyist OS ??
Linux is and will always be a hobbyist OS, and one day maybe it will be a viable alternative to Winblows.
Any story about Saddam's execution on /. would most likely just be people debating the quality (or lack there of) of the knot used on the rope he hung from. (Looked pretty mean!)
Sugapablo
Children .... play nice now. You obviously both babies.
break compatibility with all applications and force non m$ code to run it sandbox mode.
Good luck selling that.
"Vista sucks, it's just an OSX knock-off, nobody is going to buy it, who cares about it - so let's have a discussion on post-Vista Windows."
Linux while a good os, is not an alternative to windows and will never be because its far too open ended and overly complex to use for the average person.
How about a new os all together? Any new projects in the works by anyone? Why is it either linux or windows? What makes linux so perfect? We all hear about what makes windows so bad.... What makes Linux so perfect hmmmmmm?
Its not. Linux is not perfect and yet it is always put up on a thrown as if it were.
Linux is not even close to winning over windows users. A few high end users, perhaps... but they all have their windows installs as well. If you dont, you're definatly outside of the mainstream and proof that there is no chance in hell linux will take over the windows market.
Linux needs a few things first. Lets start with hardware support and shelf space in stores. Lets start with games from major developers, and then ultimately the ease of use problem. Linux is not easy, and it is overly complicated, often bloated in some places, full of silly program names no one understands.
Again Why Linux? Why is Linux so perfect when it fails to do so many things compared to windows? It lacks the software, it lacks the hardware support, and its messy to use in many respects. Why Linux? Why is it so perfect in many peoples eyes, and they cant see how badly it needs to change?
I thought it died around the time of XP's release.
Speech recognition is 'nice' - but that's it. I cannot imagine an office full of people all gabbling at their PCs without going nuts.
Few things I'd like to see are:
1) Tight integration to client devices. I stuck MCE onto my PC and it really was a pleasure to see my TV stuff picked up by their lovely BDA drivers and all that Tivo stuff appear. Whilst that was nice, it was nowhere near the f'in quantum leap when I pointed my 360 at my big PC over the wifi and got all those features suddenly appearing on my 40" screen.
Wifi implementation is very cheap and MS are normally good at allowing 3rd parties to access their tech (unlike Apple), yet have not quite managed to sell it very well. I'd like a clock radio that played my podcasts etc - I think I just like the idea of having a big central PC that can do all the heavy lifting and a number of thin clients that can all access it (and not all have to have their own bespoke software running on the back end).
2) Haptic stuff. Look at the Wii. Could be basic stuff like a laptop just turning off the screen if there's nobody sitting infront of it or mouse gestures like strokeit integrated into the GUI.
3) Telephony. I've no idea why I have an IP deskphone and laptop sitting on my desk. They have messenger which provides perfectly good person to person calls, they have outlook that provides a centralized mail and calendar resource - can't they just bolt on telephony? Point my deskphone number to my laptop wherever it is, divert to mobile if my PC is off, hold calls if I'm in a meeting etc?
4) Have some balls when it comes to hardware manufacturers. Apple is able to say 'right, we're using the new bios thingie' and make the hardware. MS tentatively seems to make steps towards it, but continuously supports old stuff. Now I know they have to support the old stuff and I know many people appreciate it - but they need to clearly define what hardware they want people to use to optimize 'the experience' and tell Dell. They have started to do this with the Vista certification - I've no idea why people bitch abotu this, but if you want flashy graphics, you need a decent PC and you need people to be able to buy that decent PC with confidence. The quasi-flash drives supported under Vista are a good thing - but I WANT MORE.
5) Better implementation of Bluetooth (and whatever comes along next). I'd love to be able to have my PC boot up (maybe into hibernation) when my phone walks in through the door. Popup on my phone screen with a summary (at least) when I get an email.
Just reading through my points, it seems I want integration. I may be in a minority as most people here seem to get their knickers in a twist when MS bundle a browser with XP - but I want all my stuff to just work together nicely and out of the box. I can't expect MS to support every device, but maybe if they just published some open standards (or formally adopted the perfectly good open ones we already have) hardware manufacturers WOULD comply (as I would buy).
**** People are becoming more aware of the choices they have, and Linux is no longer a hobbyist OS, and that day isn't far away when it becomes simple enough to be a viable alternative to Windows ****
Lol - the Linux fanbois have been saying this for how many years now?
All MS should do is do like Apple. Take *nix as a base, make Windows the interface on top of it, release the OS portion for free, and bam. There you go. Sell software and go. If MS were to do that, they could then say they are Linux based, can run all linux apps, and have 100% compatability of all current and future Windows apps. Then all other flavors of Linux dry up...
This sounds more like Service Pack 1 of Vista. Of course, calling it that would be admitting that maybe they didn't get everything right the first time. I'm sure the very idea that Microsoft wouldn't get something right the first time comes as a major shock to Slashdot readers. :-p
Seriously, though, announcing a new "updated" version and your next-generation OS strikes me as a really good way to tank initial sales, particularly in the business arena. A good many CIO's have finally gotten it that it's usually a good idea to wait for SP-1 of any MS OS before rolling out, and "leaking" that an SP1 (by whatever name) is being released in two years pretty much seals it for them. Not that there was tremendous enthusiasm for migration in the first place. This is actually a good time for Linux to start trying to push itself onto the business desktop. You have MS not releasing an OS on time, let alone reliable hardware requirements until the last minute, there's no compelling application which can't be run on XP, and they're hinting at a new release in two years. All of which is not calculated to be endearing to someone who's in charge of a major rollout.
The "next generation OS" sounds like a bunch of wishful thinking, more than any actual code.
As a user of applications, there's no reason why any of the applications that I use could not run beautifully and likely faster and leaner on older generations of Windows. In fact, if they M$ had simply focused on updating core systems (interfacing with new graphics hardware is a good example) things would be good. I had to migrate to a new OS several times just because of DirectX compatibility. "We just couldn't make DirectX 9 work on WinXX! Bullshit. Fix your architecture to anticipate changes. Highly payed software architects can do that. I do that. Why can't you?"
And of course, instead of focusing on continuing to polish and upgrade the OS in a simple fashion, M$ takes the approach of complete overhaul every time, lately in the interest of security. Well, news flash for the company that can afford to pay security "experts" hundreds of thousands a year: a really bad way to secure something is to completely rewrite it again and again. If you cannot make progressive refinements to a system, it has extremely poor design and you need to bite the bullet, own up to that, and fix that.
Just look at evolution. It is an interative approach with progressive refinements that are responses to the environment (e.g. the human body's response to pathogens from generation to generation). There is a very good reason for this approach in nature. The notion of generating radically different (i.e. screw inheritance and your body gets a random set of DNA) genetic sequences from generation to generation would be genocide. It's STUPID on a universal scale.
But that is M$ and Windows for you. Oh, yes. We'll come to terms with it because the OS is still largely monopolized. Yes there is light at the end of that tunnel thanks to Linux and MacOS reaching a greater consumer base, but the fact is that M$ approach to OS development is an evolutionary screw up which must eventually give way to a saner approach. The only reason it exists is because of what can be seen as an extinction or genesis event where it was the only show in town (PC). It was there initially in the absence of competition, but the "proprietary" approach will collapse under the weight of its own inability to adapt and interoperate. It's like a town that only permits marriage within the town. Eventually, you end up with fatal problems because the genetic sequences are adapting slower than pathogens and environmental factors that have no problems whatsoever with moving all over the place and sharing information.
See M$? You and proprietary software are retarded. I just proved it by reduction to evolution. Take your new OS and shove it.
How can anyone in their right minds mod this "interesting"??
Linux is hobbyist OS, a server OS, and an embedded OS. The next natural step would be to make it a corporate desktop OS (which is quite ready for), and then the continuation as a casual home user desktop OS would follow naturally (cause dad want the same software at home as at work).
Linux is not yet ready as a small office, gadget lover or gamer OS, that would require more support from application and hardware producers. But this should come as soon as Linux win the corporate desktop. Which will happen when Microsoft screws up. And they will, sooner or later.
Let's review the lead poster's inane claims...
As we all know that Microsoft Vista was originally scheduled to be released in 2003, after two years of Windows XP, but it got delayed by over five years due to various reasons. Definitely, Vista is very very improved OS over the previous versions, but the delayed in the launch has cost Microsoft, billions of dollars.
Cost them? How has not releasing Vista cost MS anything? Did they stop selling Windows XP after they started working on Vista? Also, MS makes FAR, FAR more money selling MS Office than they do Windows. So please let us know what methodology you used to determine how much the delay of Vista cost Microsoft.
Now the question at the moment is, what exactly after Vista? Microsoft can't afford to wait another five years for an operating system.
1. who cares what comes after? What exact feature is Vista lacking which you view as an essential feature not being addressed?
2. Why can't MS afford to wait another five or ten years to release a new OS? Where is the burning need which cannot be addressed by service packs? Why do you view a constant stream of shiny new operating systems as a need?
Feel free to post the data you based your claims upon, and the methodology used to interpret that data.
People are becoming more aware of the choices they have, and Linux is no longer a hobbyist OS, and that day isn't far away when it becomes simple enough to be a viable alternative to Windows.
So you are stating, all in one sentence, that...
1. Lunix is supposedly ready for prime time, and can easily do everyone Vista can do
2. Even though it is ready, it's... um... not quite ready yet... and isn't quite... just yet... a viable alternative. But "That Day" isn't far away!
Your sentence, and claims, are self-contradictory.
That is why, to stay at the top, Microsoft has planned a 'Vista R2', codenamed 'Fiji' which will be released some time in 2008. And after Fiji, there will be Windows 'Vienna'. Windows Fiji, will not be a totally different OS from Vista; but it will be an add-on. Whereas Vienna will be totally different from Vista.
So let's see. You start off complaining that MS isn't releasing totally new operating systems fast enough... then you show how they have plans in the works to offer FREE upgrades to Vista users... and that they are working on at least one new version of Vista which will have a completely new or different set of capabilities.
What exactly is your complaint again?
Thanks, Slashdot. Every time I think it will be impossible for you guys to top your latest stream of stupid, inane, brain dead anti-MS FUD, you guys whip out a new one and prove me wrong.
How can we look beyond what most ITicians are calling the Apocalypse?
Windows 98 and Windows ME anyone?
[expletive deleted]
Vista has been officially released on MSDN for over a month now.
So what? It's been officially released on Gnutella for almost three months.
Microsoft is to software what Budweiser is to beer.
I really don't understand that. Can't they dick with Vista ensuring an endless stream of 'fixes' and evermore hardware requirements for 5 years? If it's just about money perhaps MS should look where we all know they are looking anyway: DRM, content and Xbox.
Since there are about 10 different versions of Vista in the pipeline, I'm sure they could spend the next 5 years making silly distinctions among them as they gobble up a few security companies and maybe a movie company or even a TV network. That way the next turn of the crank of the OS machine can be something so closely tied to content you will in fact be watching MS movies and TV channels, all for a nominal subscription fee.
>>> Microsoft can't afford to wait another five years for an operating system.
> Why not?
Well, I agree on that one: they got money to be idle for some time...
>>> The competition is fierce.
>What competition?
Pre-installed Linux, Firefox, Openoffice.org. What rock have you been living under?
Insightful my a... that's what you get with automatic +1 scoring: clueless moderators.
Scrappleface is so all over this one:
WMD Found Hanging from Rope in Iraq
We're all taking one last vacation.
Then it's back ti eating thoose little weiners in a can.
Wanna fight ? Bend over, stick your head up your ass, and fight for air.
Linux shared libraries are quite different from DLLs. The shared library mechanism on *NIX systems has features that mitigate a lot of the problems of "DLL hell".
A deep unwavering belief is a sure sign you're missing something...
if they couldn't even finish WinFS in 5 years, then how in the hell are they gonna have "seamless speach recognition" within the next century?
Everytime one of these articles pops up, every geek I know start spouting LINUX! Linux is fine, if you're a geek or a large corperation looking to save money; but the fact is that for the normal user; Linux isn't going to replace Windows. Linux has a Stigmata that's been associated with it since the very beginning; it's a pain to configure properly. Now before every one starts shouting "BLASPHEMY!" and linking to 8000 different distro's that auto configure; let me explain. No amount of new distro's will solve this problem, and in fact; with every new distro that comes out, the world of Linux gets more and more confusing. To the average user; this is a nightmare. Which distro do I pick? What advantages does this distro have over this other one? The field of Linux is just too broad for the average user to even understand. You say Linux at a mainstream user; and they're likely to get scared off by just the name. THIS is the stigmata of Linux; and it's major detriment. Now amount of changing Linux will solve this problem, because it will still be Linux; and still carry the same stigmata. It is for these reasons that I NEVER foresee Linux becoming a major force in the mainstream market. If something is going to come out and topple Windows(market acceptance wise); it's going to have to be something COMPLETELY new without the stigmata. Of all the OS's out there now, the only one I see having a chance is OSX; and that's only if Apply can coax developers over to their side again (Not talking about the minority of companies that dev. apple stuff now). Don't get me wrong; I'd like to see a move away from Windows, I just don't see it happening with Linux. I think Linux needs to ride off into the sunset, and make room for something new.
I firewalled it, and used Firefox, and Thunderbird so I'm not exposed to Microsoft risks and didn't get the IE7 patch or any other superfluous patches.
Without the forced 'upgrades' and resultant security holes they opened, I not longer have problems.
http://secunia.com/advisories/22477/
I'm an ubuntu linux user, perhaps 80% of the time. I boot into Windows XP for certain things (graphic design, gaming, webcam). It took me some time to switch from Windows 2000 to XP. I've seen some speed increases, but not many. The main reason was application support... things like Windows Live Messenger seemed neat.
Now, I run on a mediocre system. I have a pre-geforce nvidia card, 768mb of RAM, and a 1.4ghz Athlon 1600+. I tend to run a lot of apps at once, and this slows down windows XP enough as it is. Are there any real benefits for me switching to Vista?
It almost seems to me that every new Windows version to come out is just a hidden charge, a snake in the grass of what appears to be free (as in beer) software brought out by Microsoft. Talking specifically about IE7 and Windows Live Messenger here.
This could just continue to fiji and what not... And I'm more than satasfied with my current computer.
Adjusted for the technology of the times, Eindows 2000 was the best OS they made.
The rest has been desparte grabs to retain their earnings. Microsoft is dead, and they know it.
Open systems, open formats and RESTful, web-based systems will make their busniess model no longer work. Even if they change their model to try and keep pace, they have lacked innovation for so long, there is no way they will maintain the revenues they need to pervent wall street from dumping them like last years fashion.
corporate version: 2006 - 2003 = 3. consumer version: 2007 - 2003 = 4.
awesome, dude. how much did you end up having to pay her?
Microsoft is following the "same old, same old" policy begun by Gates back in the 1980's - promise potential customers "the next one will be AWESOME! You'll See!" (quoting Jake Blues)...
Bullshit.
Microsoft has shot its wad. There's nothing left to pull out of a hat.
They've peaked with this crap.
They're done.
All that remains is slowly sinking into the West...
My only fear is that Linux will follow suit...ruined by crappy, poorly tested distros and the lack of focused, critical enterprise applications infrastructure software because open source developers would rather work on 3D eye candy for end users like themselves...
If you want Linux on the desktop in corporate America, we need enterprise infrastructure software FIRST - the "killer app" for corporations who will then switch their desktops to match their infrastructure - just as they did with Windows. (Yeah, I know, UNIX was on the servers - but mainframes OSs more so and nothing was going to match the mainframe anyway. Corporations switched to Windows when the OEMs put it on corporate bulk purchase machines - and they also switched to "Microsoft Back Office" when the mainframe went down to defeat against the PC. UNIX servers hung on because they were cheaper than mainframes - but if Linux hadn't arisen, Windows Server would be running the enterprise now - crappy as it is.)
If we don't take over the corporate infrastructure, Linux will stay a niche for geeks. Which is fine by me in most respects - I'll still use it - except that I'd prefer to make money working with corporations and end users to develop IT operations on Linux, rather than having to continue futzing with Microsoft crap. I'm not just a user, I'm IN the IT industry, so it would be better for me if Linux did well in the corporate space.
Linux fanatics who WANT Linux to fail in the corporate and end user market do so because they want to feel superior to those users - they want to be "elite". They want to be big fish in a small pond. I'd rather be a big fish in a big pond, thank you. I could use the money better than Gates does.
Rate this "flamebait"! Rate this "troll"! Is that all you've got? Are you nuts? Come at me!
Richard Steven Hack - This sig is TOO GODDAMN SHORT TO DO ANYTHING USEFUL WITH! MORONS!
Our shared libraries support useful versioning. A program gets linked against a library by name, but it records the major version of the library that it used. When you run it, it looks for the newest library with that name and major version. Libraries get new major versions when they change in non-backwards-compatible ways and only new minor versions for bug fixes and backwards-compatible improvements. Also, when a version is supposed to be backwards-compatible, it's generally actually backwards-compatible.
DLLs are only bad because you can't set up a system with a sufficiently complete collection of them at the same time that every program will get the DLL it needs. Just because Microsoft's implementation of something is terminally broken doesn't mean it's not otherwise a great idea.
All this incredible lack of insight by MS is why my next computer will be a Mac.
-Kinsey
I've been reading slashdot for a long time. Probably since the days when I had to recompile a kernel to watch a DVD or burn a CD on "desktop ready" Linux. Everytime the Microsoft/Linux/Mac argument comes up I reread this paper prepared by Rob Pike and I die a little inside: http://herpolhode.com/rob/utah2000.pdf Also you might want to check out this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem These threads are the MySpace of constructive criticism.
Wait... are they already admitting Vista was a bad move? ;)
Or just sentence fragments. Sometimes it can be so difficult. To tell if the author is simply illiterate. That he can't tell where commas go. Or sometimes just spaces. That makes it confusing. As well as looking dumb.
couple of drinks at 1200 yen each .. so what's that, about $25?
oh yeah i paid for coffee too, so add another 500 yen for about $30 total.
If Windows Vienna is supposed to be mainly menu-less and controlled by voice recognition then I think those of us who use Windows are in trouble when Vienna comes out.
Remember this video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Y_Jp6PxsSQ/Yeah voice wreckignition is more like it. LOL!
zero
You appear very fast to judge things, but I think you might be missing a big piece of the action there, or the potential action, most likely because you are younger and still fit. I am guessing on that though.
In a perfect world what you said makes some sense, but think on this: In the US the population is aging. Younger folks are a minority, and guess what? You'll get old, too. With aging comes afflictions like arthritis. Once you get it, even a twinge, you'll understand how incredibly $valuable$ and how incredibly useful a voice activated system could be. The first company to really nail it will be rich beyond the dreams of avarice as the expression goes.
MY GF has it in her hands, sometimes she just sits and cries because her hands are on fire,that's how she describes it, like being on fire, and then she can't do anything, nothing that requires any dexterity at all. She used to do fine painting, a lot of intense sewing, etc, stuff like that, but can't anymore. Typing is just out, and there are many many millions like her out there now. It's like having no fingers at all, but it hurts. She can only type very slowly and painfully and because of that hardly uses her computer anymore.
Now, how abvout blind folks? Think it might be a handy option for them as well? How about folks with anything like palsy? Heck, I am thinking for me, say I am out working on some vehicle and I want to look something up. Spend 5 minutes with the degreaser before I go touch the keyboard, or just yammer at it to get to where I want to get, and print it out? Useful there too.
Sure, I'm grasping at straws here, but...
Vienna, in the local language, is spelt 'Wein'. If you pronounce that as an English speaker, you might say it in the same way you say 'Wine'. Wine, as a few people know, is an Open Source implementation of the Windows API on top of X and Unix. Perhaps Microsoft don't like the idea of such software, and want to produce a product that confuses users of Wine. Or maybe they'll do away with their development line completely, and Wine will become the next version of Windows.
Then Microsoft will be able to expand out the acronym to something like:
"Windows Emulator, it's not!" or "Windows Is Not an Emulator"!
Ask me about repetitive DNA
As much as this might be true, I doubt that the writer actually did the math. A related question to anyone how knows anything about MSFT finances -- how long could they survive if their income suddenly dropped to zero?
I mod down anyone who says "I will be modded down for this", regardless of the rest of their comment
Now that the next version of Windows has been announced, I think that Slashdot should start taking wagers on the ACTUAL release date. Profit from Microsoft's ability to ship an OS on time!
:)
Anyway, I'll start the pool by putting $5 on October 12th, 2010. Any other takers?
- Go into
r entVersion\Run
-
Create a new REG_SZ key with any name you want.
-
Enter data in this new key
Was that so hard? Now you have a shortcut to a Drive X:\ pointing to one of the classic deeply-buried MS directories.HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\Cur
C:\Windows\system32\subst.exe x: "C:\Documents and Settings\wintermute1974\Desktop"
substituting wintermute1974 for your username.
After Vista, Winux! Microsoft buys Novell, re-brands SUSE and thanks the online community for writing their newest OS....
sic transit gloria mundi
Since when is "Definitely, Vista is very very improved OS over the previous versions,.." a given? It's just been released to businesses, it has NO track record outside of the beta program and it's yet to be established if there is any compelling reason for businesses or homes to purchase it. It'll gradually be deployed as MS leverages it's OEM agreements and forces game designers to support DX10 but shoving something down someone's throat doesn't mean they'll like the taste of it or that it will be good for them.
As we all know that Microsoft Vista was originally scheduled to be released in 2003, after two years of Windows XP, but it got delayed by over five years...
...but the delayed in the launch has cost Microsoft, billions of dollars.
Call my math fuzzy (it's happened before) but if it was originally scheduled to be released in 2003, and it's being released in 2007, then the delay was less than five years...
I've heard similar figures thrown out before, but where do these figures come from? How has the delay cost them? One could argue it has resulted in lost revenue, but XP was still selling well during that time and Vista will be making its sales now. Delayed revenue perhaps, but lost? Are they talking perhaps money spent on developers and such? That might be a point, but billions? What would be the reference for that?
I love my sig.
...makes perfect sense. The respective locations are where the execs plan on getting drunk and laid when the complaints in the US reach critical mass.
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
"According to a Microsoft spokeswoman, Microsoft recently placed an order for 500,000 CD labels, CD sleeves, and packaging boxes labeled 'Windows Server 2007', but has also ordered an equal number of small '8' stickers, 'just in case.'" - from www.gullible.info
Has Microsoft given up on Vista already? Has Microsoft agreed that the DRM-laden Vista is really a no-go?
Is there a single shred of evidence to substantiate any of the claims made in the so-called “source” article? Following a number of speculative bullet points (with dubious technical merit), we are left with “[f]acts are hard to come by about Windows Vienna”. Indeed, so what worth is there to any of it?
Why bother.
http://www.digg.com/software/Windows_Vista_to_boot _in_2-3_seconds.
Wndows Vista to boot in 2-3 seconds, remember in 2005.
If they want to kill off the current gui let them. Then someone else can move in. Because that is the worst thing they can ever do.
"Blind folks can type just fine"
Short answer
Orly? Blind folks have the magic cure for arthritis? Got a link? Or do you mean to say, "blind folks who's hands and fingers are still in good shape can type just as well or poorly or better than average sighted folks, but if/when/once they get arthritis bad they can't type really well at all and it just sucks rubber donkey dong to use the computer then"
Which is the more accurate statement?
longer answer
Sure, some can,and I am sorry if I didn't take the time to note that previously, but how do they know what is on the page to reply to or about, or is all they do one way typing?? And blind people don't get arthritis in their fingers, making it hard or impossible to type, back to my original point?
Let me say it again to be precisely clear, some people have a hard time typing, especially as they get older, because arthritis is a painful and *incredibly common* affliction, and that applies to the fully sighted, the blind, folks who can walk and people in wheelchairs,and etc., eventually your dang fingers don't work as well or at all like they did when you were younger and healthier. You need alternatives for day to day stuff then. Which sort of makes keyboards not very useful at all, despite someone else on the intartubes being able to type 120 WPM with perfect accuracy, so they assume everyone should or can. We are all different. I know I in no way can type as well as I could when I was younger and by the end of the evening, like right now, I fat finger things and my hands ache a scosh. And using new tiny cellphones is such a TOTAL PITA with those stoopid lilliputian keys that I won't even consider one now, I'll stick with my old bricks as long as they work, new features be damned. And it's worse for my GF, can barely use any of them at all if she has to rely on the lame one micron sized buttons.
A certain large segment of the above named population could find good audio interface to be useful and a practical replacement for the keyboard, at least in some situations. And how about folks, younger folks who program or write for a living, who get carpal tunnel bad and need a rest for a few weeks or months but still need to go to work? Whaddyado then? If they had the ability to switch to an audio interface, at least for awhile, it might help, yes?
Anyway, big biz has noticed and will take it from there, the market potential is just way too huge and you have to look at it this way, from that marketing angle, rough general demographics and current reality, the older folks who might want an audio interface because their hands get stiff buy 250 grand RVs as toys, while the younger folks who can still type like a big dog and don't currently give a crap about an audio interface because their hands are fine and they aren't thinking about it buy 250 buck ipod toys.
Very broadly speaking and plenty of exceptions to the rule, etc, but I think you know what I mean there.
I'll say it again, the first group that really *nails* a pure audio interface that works, I mean really works,beyond what is out there now, is gonna be swimming in loot because the market is there. And tip to webmasters, "accessibility" coding for your commercial websites will do you no harm whatsoever, now and into the future.
People don't write or talk in the same way they use IM. Perhaps "speech recognition" as a way of interacting with a computer will not evolve as form of dictation, or as Star Trek's Enterprise AI, but something new and unexpected.
I'd not be surprised if Gates is on to something here.
All the research into the many of the new technologies like winfs filesystems, the removal of the bios and many other things that are whats likely going to be added to the new operating systems... Seriously I think just from an analytical point of view and watching what microsoft has been doing for so long shows that they have achieve many different directions that are promising add ons to the next operating systems... They tried to include them all in Vista way before they were ready for mainstream but you can bet your quad-core that they will be ready by the next release. Vista and future platforms are built from the ground up... and its only a matter of time before we see mainstream with new technologies... The only thing I can see that really needs improvement from Microsoft at this point in time is -Zune commercials -Retail agressivenesss +Seems like they've been getting weak at retail lately - less POP - less employee positive
Which helps a lot in reducing carpal tunnel.
...
It also doesn't exist in a form like your GF has for many people at all, so it is hardly a major advantage, is it? If it were, then why isn't your GF using linux? Use command line so no mouse fine movement, damn good support for assistive technologies, etc, all before Windows got it.
For the blind, if it was such a massive thing, why didn't they move to SuSE 6.2? It allowed bootup into a baille terminal (this would be about 2000, I think) and you could use that terminal for the system.
Or maybe these people put up with the problems with Windows because
a) marketing: never hear about other OSs
b) inertia: nobody has windows so nobody buys it
c) monopoly pressure: don't develop for windows only and get cut out from the MVP
d) monopoly pt 2: don't install anything but Windows or you're out of pocket a LOT
e) the problems aren't a massive problem after all, you can muddle through
f)
Much like all this guff about disabled users telling Mass. that OOo isn't suitable because the Word2000 assistive tech doesn't work with it: neglecting that they don't work with the Visa word either and that there are much better ways of getting this access than reverse-engineering a closed spec.
It's bloat if you have 300 MB of DLLs installed when the hardware isn't there. It's bloat when you have 10MB just to check that the system isn't running untrusted code when the user doesn't benefit from it. It's bloat when you have 1GB of movies to show how gee whizz the system is. It's bloat when you must install WMP when you want to use VLC.
It isn't bloat if these are left available but don't have to be installed to the HDD.
Much like IPX/Appletalk was.
I wonder if Ballmer will try to use Microsoft Godmachine included in Atlantis Ultimate, turn into a ghost and then blow up the Microsoft campus..
"and then she can't do anything, nothing that requires any dexterity at all" .. which means it concerns you in a physical way, too. I feel your pain.
Choices between Linux and Winows will balance when microsoft releases as many version of the next Vistas' as the actual one has. Then there will be as many flavors of Winodws as there are Linux distro's
When my Karma level reaches 0 I feel in piece with the Universe
Write this down and let's see with how many years they miss this one -- 5 years? 6 years? Will Duke Nukem Forever still be in development?
THIS IS THE INTERNET. PLEASE PICK UP YOUR SERIOUS BUSINESS SUIT AT THE FRONT COUNTER.
I don't mean 'specific' hardware - in the way Apple do. I mean specific in a 'If you want Aero, then you need to buy a card that supports these features - and let graphics card makers put a 'supports Aero' logo on their cards with those features'.
Current situation where I can double my memory, spend £500 on a graphics card and windows still looks and behaves exactly the same just seems a bit well..'wasteful'
...is roughly equivalent to someone pleading with you to stay married to them because if you do, you are going to receive a gift of the "wonderful flying car". Well, years pass and the promise is repeated many times. Dates for the unveiling are set and broken countless times. Then one year, a few days past Christmas, Microsoft makes good. The car is rolled out and to the casual observer, it looks kind of different; short wings, more aerodynamic, lots of features and gadgets, but it doesn't really look like what you'd dreamed a flying car would look like! Instead it looks a lot like some of the other cool cars on the road from companies that have been turning out new models every year (and you've had fantasies of owning). Still you're intrigued. Does it really fly, you ask? And you're assured: "this is the wonderful flying car". So you put aside your doubts and get in. Driving it is different but familiar. It's even a little dangerous because many of the knobs and switches are new or repositioned. Still, you want to believe. So you get up your courage and take it to a small cliff with a hairpin turn. Gathering speed, you go into the turn much too fast to make the hairpin, and off the end you go. To your surprise, you're floating! Kind of. The short wings and aerodynamics kick in and for the first 100 feet off the cliff the car actually only loses a foot or two of altitude. Then your worst fears kick in. The car plunges into the ravine below.
At the bottom, an EMT who looks remarkably like the soon to retire Jim Allchin uses the Jaws of Life to pull you out. During the rescue, as he straps you to a backboard, he explains that this is only model 1.0 of the flying car and they only had time to perfect the gliding. The flying will come on an unspecified date and model in the future. He slides you into his Macintosh ambulance and you fly to the hospital.
Cake or Death? Cake Please!
my employer has state government agencies that still use Novell with IPX protocol, and we also have client companies with marketing departments using Macs with appletalk. Not everyone buys software for 2 to 3 years use.
Not really. Well, that whole notion is just rather silly. Everyone gets older, including you. And the human species has gone through population fluctuations before just fine. And "boomers" as a group are just as diverse and varied in social outlook and accomplishments as any other generation. In other words, some good, some bad, a lot mediocre, same as the generation before us, and the generations to follow. Hey, we got the draft ended, by getting n the street and not sitting around playing games, we got civil rights beyond the theoretical into actual practice, and there's a ton of some really fine rock came out of the boomer generation, don't forget that, hahaha! Boomers now are leading the way to alternative energy and have been in the forefront of getting organic growing from a fringe business to now mainstream. Boomers wrote a lot of the code you use, and started all the open source stuff you might like, got the ball rolling in other words. Boomers got us to the moon, and developed most of the really good satellite remote sensing that we use now for climate research. And so on.
Sure, a lot are fucktards, I won't deny that at all, but try to name a generation that doesn't have its own proportional share of fucktards. You can't. Show me a generation that was composed of all "nice guys". Go ahead, double dog dare ya.
Redmond, Washington. April 2009:
..."
"We are announcing the Christmas Season release of Windows Klagenfurt. Designed as the replacement to what was code named Vienna, we wanted to draw upon the more phonetically inclusive nature of that town as a metaphor to reflect the diversity of rich experience to be found in this newest Windows release.
***
Remark from Steve Jobs:
"Windows Klagenfurt, hmm? So they picked a name that's as easy to pronounce as it is to maintain the security."
My first Journal Entry ever, in 8 years! http://slashdot.org/journal/365947/aphelion-scifi-fantasy-horror-poetry-webzine
This "upgrade" is not Vista. It's just called that, because they had to have something to ship before the train left the station. Part of the time consumed is that they were trying to push the envelope, and then the strategy changed to; "um, let's get it done already, AND have legacy support." So they probably got as far ahead as they had to backtrack, and then make that stable.
So the REAL Vista, is probably two years in development (like that Database file storage idea). Unfortunately, they'll have to backtrack on a lot of it, because things like ZFS will be almost required in a modern OS.
I think Microsoft has a serious culture problem. The hordes of programmers and money are not going to make up for "elegance." Embedded devices are going to do 90% of the functionality that 90% of the people demand (web, email, text writing, picture viewing) -- yeah, like then next Apple iPhone, except without all the viruses, the support headache, and the DRM nonsense. Microsoft kind of has the right idea that home users are going to want to orchestrate all these embedded devices -- but they bring their legacy of shovel-ware with them, and they can't manage the "Elegance."
Just look at the Zune... that has got to be an example of a company with talent, brilliance, resources, and on the way to doom.
The XBox, however, will capture most of the market. Microsoft should seriously consider breaking itself up to maintain shareholder value. Their monopoly on the OS is becoming superfluous.
>>"ad space available -- low rates!!!"
Fiji's biggest problem for the past several decades is that it's had a culture of coups, and of radicals overrunning the democratically elected governments because they're frustrated that things aren't going the way they like. Even though the coups so far have been mostly peaceful (at least in terms of people ending up dead, although the 2000 coup came close), the recent coup is just a continuation of that culture. The last generation or two of people living in Fiji have been growing up with role models who demonstrate to them that if they don't like what's going on, it's okay to change things by force.
This isn't to say that the Fijian governments are perfect; the recently-ousted government most likely had its share of corruption from what I hear, and it's very likely that Commander Bainimarama feels he's doing the right thing for his country... but when a country can't maintain a stable government, whether it's due to gangs of locals taking parliament members hostage and threatening to execute them, or due to a military hierarchy that believes in democracy in theory but not in practice, it has serious problems somewhere.
Why Microsoft would want to code-name its flagship OS after Fiji, I wouldn't have a clue, unless it's just through ignorance which seems most likely. It's a very nice place to visit as a tourist (I've been there), and the majority of people who live there are great, as well as relying on the tourist trade which plummets every time they have a coup, but it's not exactly known for stable government.
Of course, the corresponding Word release will not allow you to mix german and slovenian text in the same document.
Free as in mason.