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Windows 7 To Come In Multiple Versions
Crazy Taco writes "Tom's Hardware reports on newly discovered screenshots that reveal Microsoft is planning to release their newest version of Windows in multiple confusing versions ... again. The information comes from the latest version of the Windows 7 beta, build 7025 (the public beta is build 7000), and shows a screen during installation that asks the user which version of the OS he or she would like to install. Who's up for guessing what the difference is between Windows 7 'Starter' and Windows 7 'Home Basic?'"
Windows Starter edition comes without the Pipes screensaver?
I, for one, won't be buying it.
If I had an Ass, I'd call it Fanny Bottom, then I could slap my Ass; Fanny Bottom, on the Arse.
I mean, my copy of the beta from TechNet says right on the login screen 'Windows 7 Ultimate'.
That would imply a product selection similar to Vista...
If I remember right, starter is a stripped down version they just sell in developing countries at a big discount in at attempt to combat some piracy by giving users a low priced option. Home would just be home again like in XP. Business would be enterprise. It is the ones after that where it gets pointless and confusing. They would do better to stick with home and pro. Then an ultimate after that if they just MUST toss in extras.
?
I've got big issues with artifically crippled software, where all versions come on the same install media.
It's like buying a car with 12 cylinders and having a switch hidden under the hood somewhere that controls the number of cylinders used. You buy the budget model, still have to cart around the weight of all 12 cylinders, but only get to use 4 of them.
- There is no point, it's like a sphere -
I don't think the main problem with Vista is the multiple versions. Having different versions at different price-points is a legitimate form of price discrimination. It's just a slightly more advanced version of having to choose options with your automobile purchase.
Also if you think about it, the leading alternatives all force the user to make certain decisions on what features they get or not (linux).
I always wondered why they didn't just call it Windows 7 or whatever code name and then distribute it with application packs, which would include application packs such as:
server app pack
home/media app pack
basics/offic app pack
The way they do it, joe public can't really be sure what version they have. Hell, there are a lot of end users that don't know if they are currently running XP or Vista (but you can tell by complaints about performance LOL).
I think that Ubuntu, Fedora and others could use with that sort of packaging also. By simply distributing the basic distro and setting up repositories for each application pack. That would make it easy to get a media server based on abc linux set up and maintained.
Support NYCountryLawyer RIAA vs People
Priced low enough that you couldn't be arsed to ask for a refund
Engineering is the art of compromise.
...you may actually see people start to give Windows up.
Why guess? LOOK IT UP. If you're uncertain about Vista differences for example, there's plenty of info (Microsoft's site and wikipedia's entry for Vista) about what a certain version has or doesn't have. Yes some versions are useless (eg. starter), but Microsoft isn't trying to trick anyone, all the info is publically available. Has been for Vista and I'm sure Win 7.
Don't anyone bother doing a little googling before buying something? It's not that hard. One size doesn't always fit all.
This just in: cookies now come in multiple flavors, people will be coming in multiple skin tones, and TV is going to come with multiple channels!
This may just be copying some of the vista bits. I hope not but still it may be what we get. Consumers in the US will probably never see Starter. It is just for developing countries.
I wish they would just get rid of Home Basic and just go with Home Premium as "Home" so then we would have 3 versions, Home, Business and Ultimate.
Every time I help someone that has Home Basic my first advice is to upgrade to premium and the normally do and are rather happy with it.
I want peace on earth and goodwill toward man.
We are the United States Government! We don't do that sort of thing.
Why? Just download ubuntu and play with it, you'll figure it out in no time.
You hear that Mr. Anderson?.. That is the sound of inevitability.
Oh well, keep fighting it MS. Your only going to have to play catch up, that much more in the end..
Who's up for guessing what the difference is between Windows 7 'Starter' and Windows 7 'Home Basic?
"Starter" won't do much more than, well, start, and "Home Basic" will let you get your email.
The higher the technology, the sharper that two-edged sword.
It does appear that MS is making the same mistake again, though take the following into consideration.
As an SA, I do my fair share of on-call support for systems that I have no idea how to operate. It's not that I'm dumb, it's just that I don't have time to learn the intricacies of the 50+ custom written J2EE apps running in my enterprise. One person cannot be a MSSQL, Oracle, MySQL, Bea WLS, Tomcat, Apache, Jboss, IIS, ATG Dynamo, Unicenter, CFengine, Nagios, Zabbix, and Samba expert, and if they are, they make more than me.
Anywho... When I receive support call, I do what anyone else that doesn't know WTF they are doing should do. I look at the ticket, ctrl-c the relevant bits of the stack trace, and put that string into the JIRA (our ticket system) search box. From there, I do exactly what the last on-call SA did to fix things.
This ensures that if it was done incorrectly before, it is done incorrectly again in _exactly_ the same way.
I have a feeling MS is stealing my work methodology.
BBH
In court, Gates also argued that multiple versions of Windows would essentially stifle competition by confusing consumers and putting developers "into a situation like the computer industry was before the PC came along." He said consumers would face a jarring experience due to multiple Windows versions customized by PC makers and uncertainty about the interface or whether applications would run on them.
So what changed, Bill?
To confuse things further: many of those versions also come in both 32 bit and 64 bit flavors.
Why Win7 is not purely 64 bit is beyond me - any recent machine can run the 64 bit version, any older machine should be running XP anyway.
Oh Christ. When this came up in my RSS Feed I let out an audible groan. They still have time to wise up and hopefully they will.
WINDOZE! i use linux. im better than you
If you really want to know the different, pop into add/remove windows components on Windows 7 beta. You'll see a motley connection of odds and ends relating to business and home use. Most of them aren't installed and are somewhat irrelevant to you.
Basic is baseline (like XP home)
Home Premium includes media center (like XP media center edition)
Business is basically XP Professional
Ultimate is XP professional + media center
They didn't actually add any new editions except for Ultimate. I am sure the home users will really be lamenting their lack of NFS client/server capabilities.
Most of the guification will remain and all the desktop essentials are now under the Live Essentials umbrella, so the versioning should be irrelevant to everyone except people on slashdot who make it into a massive philosophical crisis.
Oh my god! They've made spins of their operating system with a feature relevant to the market and usage scenario!
Oh my god! Media center costs extra!
Oh my god! enterprise-level networking features aren't included on my mom's compaq!
This is a COMMERCIAL operating system. This is similar to the complaint that Ubuntu and Kubuntu are separate distributions because they have different software sets except they cost a different amount of money because commercial systems COST MONEY.
Let's break this down further:
Basic is for low-end bargain PC's
Home Premium is for middle-high end PC's
Business is for Business PC's
Ultimate is for enthusiasts (like beta testers and people with pony tails and translucent panels on the side of their tower-- it exists because some people will pay for it)
By offering different levels of product at a different price point, they've made their product more accessible to people who would rather pay less and just have an operating system. If you use mostly F/OSS on your windows system, you should get Basic. It's not that complicated!
It is interesting how this post came directly after the one about US UAV flight control. cough.. cough... windows7 mobile: seek and destroy cough...
All I care about is that my new machine is Windows 7 Compatible!
</snark>
Fnord.
Windows Basic - everybody's doing it, can't hurt to try, right?
Windows Money - Big money! I'm going to improve my profits with this! I made $10000 last week!
Windows Ultimate - My monstrous wad in my pocket does all the thinking for me!
Descriptions are Gratis! from g0st. :P
There is only one Linux kernel. The different distributions, to oversimplify, are like software bundles. Different window managers etc. And for telling the difference, there's always distrowatch. It even highlights beta components in red.
I support the Slashcott and will not be reading or commenting from 2/10/14 to 2/17/14. Beta is steaming pile of dog shit
Home Basic - OxyContin - You still aren't going to make a commitment to the drug culture, but you need a stronger fix. Because it comes as a part of package, you don't need to find a dealer. If you are arrested, you can always claim it was prescibed or that the arrest is politically motivated.
Home Premium - Meth - You are know a dedicated member of the drug culture, maybe supporting pro drug use sites. Maybe you manufacture a few extra copies in your barn and deal them up on ebay, hoping the copyright police don't catch you.
Business - Cocaine - You are moving up in the big league. Money is not a problem, uoi just need the fix. You have dealer contacts, and long term contracts. Life is good.
Ultimate - Trip to Amsterdam - You have an office to make the plans, an expense account to pay for the trip, all you have to do is fly high.
But seriously, I know I am going to have to move from XP at some point, just like I had to move from NT and before that 95. It just does not give me a lot of confidence when more work may have been done creating various and arbitrary builds to meet certain price points than creating a stable OS. I mean, creating a single stable OS is hard enough. In Windows 7, MS has to build, debug, and correct dependencies of 5 different OS.
"She's a scientist and a lesbian. She's not going to let it slide." Orphan Black
Salesman: Now, I can sell you this command line only version of Buntu, but of course you want more than that don't you? You are a Man who knows his Linux. Am I right?
...
.. but 'Pen-Ultimate?'?...
... bandwidth, you have to share the release till you have handed out 4 full copies?
The Mark: Um, yeah.
Salesman: Good, I can also sell you this full version of Ubuntu, all the Gnome goodness one could ask for.
The Mark: What about Amarok? Does it come with
Salesman: OOOoooh, you want Kubuntu then? Not a problem, we can sell you that too.
The Mark: But, I like the partition editor in Gn....
Salesman: Buntu Pen-Ultimate...gotcha, just a little more cash for a Gnome/KDE love fest.
The Mark: That sounds great
Salesman: Oh, you want the goodies, like an SSH server, and extra packages?
The Mark: Yeah, I um..
Salesman: Not an issue my good man, we even have financing!
The Mark: Does that include things like databases and Apache?
Salesman: Oh, no. That is just a bit more, sorry. Tell you what though, you have pluck, I like that. I'll cut you a deal.
The Mark: Really!?
Salesman: Sure, Lets see....2000 add 98 carry the 7 and ME oh my! Lets go talk to our finance department, do you prefer a 5 or 7 year loan? Things are rather tight these days I hope you have colateral like a house?
===
Epilogue
===
Friend: So the price was
The Mark: Yeah, go figure.
Friend: For 7 years?
The Mark: Releases, but they come out twice a year, so 3 and a half.
Friend: Harsh, I am just going to spend my $300 plus software costs on 7.
The Mark: You do that man.
Sera
Slashdot, where armchair scientists get shouted down and armchair theologians get modded up.
http://www.downloadsquad.com/2009/01/26/multiple-versions-of-windows-7-not-new-to-beta-build-7025/
...but the single, common user experience is a big selling point for fruity products among people I know. Microsoft obviously can't attain a similar degree of this without controlling PC hardware, but having a single version of Windows 7 would help immensely. Joe the User won't understand why his PC is different from his wife's under the same operating system. Most people can't be bothered with learning about the different versions of the same thing. Windows should be Windows should be Windows.
Where "OK" obviously means "down $500, and stuck with a bloated 3-legged dog".
Yes, different versions of Vista and Windows 7 are far more confusing that the 233 different *buntu versions or 29,015 Linux distros in general.
Will one of the versions be numbered correctly? There is no reasonable numbering scheme that lands on 7 with Windows 7. Consider:
1. Windows 1
2. Windows 2
3. Windows 3.0/3.1/3.11/etc.
4. Windows 95
5. Windows 98
6. Windows ME
7. Windows XP
8. Windows Vista
9. Windows 7
Are they trying to consider 95, 98, and ME to all be one version? That seems silly from the perspective of the consumer, because they were definitely not presented to the outside world as the same version, and yet Windows 7 is an outside-world marketing name that breaks with the earlier marketing. Why not just go with Windows 9?
Or, perhaps they are pretending 95, 98, and ME never existed, and putting NT 4.0 in one slot between Windows 3 and Windows XP? It is odd that with all the hype I've seen around Windows 7, I've not once seen anyone take up the question of why the heck it would have that number.
I know everyone here thinks they should offer Windows free -- or just disappear from the universe -- but if you were them, how would you structure your pricing?
We all know the same code base can run anything from a simple (i.e. "starter") PC running Wordpad, Outlook Express and Firefox to an enterprise server running AD on 32 cores managing thousands of workstations.
Would you (as a "for-profit" company) price the former at $1,000? Or the latter at $100?
What other alternatives do they have for a pricing structure?
No. Well...maybe. Actually, yes. It really just depends.
Can someone explain to me why MS doesn't win by releasing one "loaded" version at some low price ($49 or something)?
The low price would work against people who might be inclined to pirate it to get some more "loaded" version, one version without artificial limitations would make it easier to support both at the end-user organizational level as well as at Microsoft level, as well as promoting a unified, less bullshit-enhanced image for Windows 7 as compared to Vista, which was an incomprehensible Medusa of marketing and phony choices.
I work for a SMB VAR and the XP home/pro split actually loses business for Microsoft when customers with a half dozen or so XP home PCs decide whether they want something like SBS and we tell them it will have limitations with XP home clients. They don't want to buy new XP licenses for the same hardware already running XP Home on low-cost boxes bought retail, but they have to if they want domain mebership and some of the gee-whiz features that come with it. They often opt out of the SBS option because they have Home and can't join machines to the domain. Seldom does anybody spring for more than 1-2 XP Pro licenses to clean up the XP Home installs.
Thus, MS loses SBS sales and almost never gets XP Pro upgrades from XP Home, either. Stupid. If there was only one version, I can think of at least 5 customers off the top of my head that would have spent money on servers & OS licenses.
I can live with the "Server" and "Desktop" OS differences, which are probably just as artificial as Home/Pro desktop if you think about it. Those seem legitimate or at least based around rational reasons and purposes. But it would be nice to rid ourselves of the Pro, Deluxe, Media Center, etc. subdivisions within each category.
Windows 7 is a marketing attempt to remove the negativity associated with the Vista marketing campaign and name. Instead of rolling out vista with a new service pack, they are rolling out "windows 7". In reality, windows 7 is a bunch of delayed features and vista bug fixes. They HAVE to keep the same versioning system as windows vista becuase of licensing tools already in place and the way the development teams are setup. The vista team is working on the Windows 7 stuff too, as opposed to having a seperate dedicated team (which will come later). So from a business standpoint, the internal resources have no need to be rearranged for a simple marketing change.
Trying to install linux on my microwave, but keep getting a kernel panic...
If you download Windows 7 via MSDN, there is a note when you retrieve your Windows 7 Beta key, which reads:
Product keys made available for the Windows 7 Beta program are for the Windows 7 Beta Ultimate edition which is the only real beta edition being made available. Please install Windows 7 Beta Ultimate edition and use the Ultimate edition with the product key provided. The SKUs you are seeing in the checked build are legacy SKUs of the Windows Vista SKU plan, and do not represent the Windows 7 SKU plan. We recommend and encourage you to focus testing and development on the Ultimate edition only.
Just remember, if you're buying Windows and you're at all, just go for anything that has "Ultimate" in it and you'll probably come out OK.
Sure, but should I go for Ultimate, Ultimate Basic, Ultimate Home, Ultimate Business, Ultimate Premium, or Ultimate for Workgroups?
(Sung to Surfing USA)
Everybody is turfing',
Cross the USA,
Everybody is turfing',
Turfing' USA.
What a non-story. Windows 7 should be the next service pack for Vista, but then they wouldn't get to charge for it.
With all the advancements in Windows 7, especially the new taskbar, we can't help but think that users of the lower-tiered versions of the OS would feel even more left out if such new UI changes were excluded.
If it means the Ribbon gets left out, I'll go for Windows 7 Base Bones Budget version, thanks very much.
Sad news. I hate their tiered approach. They purposely cripple the cheap versions so that some key function you need requires you to pay a hundred bucks or more for a single feature.
I'm actually pleased enough with Ubuntu and Gnome that I think I have installed my last Windows image at home, except for my work box, and that license is paid for.
MS has simply become too expensive for too little in return, and the options out there in Open Source, and even on the Mac side with it's more up front cost for hardware offer more bang for the buck with less stress and lost time spent fixing the OS.
Thanks but no thanks...
Depends, do you have 32 or 64 bit architecture?
I support the Slashcott and will not be reading or commenting from 2/10/14 to 2/17/14. Beta is steaming pile of dog shit
Not true.
The version numbers have been very consistent through the years, as has always been reported by ver at the command prompt.
The line of Windows that ran on top of MS-DOS was a different product with different version numbering (3, 3.1, 3.11, 95, 98, ME). Windows NT uses the following version numbering:
1.0: initial release (useless)
2.0: second release (nearly useless -- competitor to IBM's OS/2)
3.0: first useful release
3.5: beginning to be pretty useful, actually
4.0: NT4
5.0: Windows 2000
6.0: XP
6.1: Vista
7.0: Windows 7
At least I think that's all correct....
PS: note that Vista wasn't even considered a major release!
No. Well...maybe. Actually, yes. It really just depends.
Go by kernel version (of NT) and you will see:
3. Windows NT 3.1
4. Windows NT 4
5. Windows 2000
5.1. Windows XP
6. Windows Vista
7. Windows 7
"I refuse to believe that everybody refuses to believe the truth." -- Lisa Simpson
I somehow got roped into the Microsoft Partner Research Panel. It's essentially a mailing list with highly detailed surveys about their products. I figured this ended up in some statistics that are eventually bleached and skewed in their Executive Reports, but heck, it's worth it for the possibility that I might a little bit of my opinion voiced.
Yesterday they sent one out that asked very pointed questions about XP, Vista, 7, 98/ME/2009, Linux, and Mac OS. Things like "On a scale of 1 to 9, rate how likely you are to develop solutions on one of these platforms".
They included questions about likely we would be to upgrade systems to Vista if 7 were released soon (Yup, I answered "Extremely Unlikely"). There were also focused questions on the versions available and if it was more/less confusing. I specifically wrote a comment on how the multiple versions serve as an obstacle.
I wonder when this starts to eat into real profit. I mean, if they have to un-bundle IE for European distribution, they just multiplied their versions by at least 2. Checking MSDN, there are a huge number of flavors for XP when you also add in the 32/64 bit, Embedded, Media, Tablet, Volume License, and other types beyond Home and Pro. At least 50. Yup, 50! And that's XP!
It's perfectly clear
Windows 7 Ultimate Super Deluxe has the Pipes Screensaver
Windows 7 Super Duper Version does not
---- "Logoff! That cookie shit makes me nervous!" - A. Soprano
Windows 7 is just Vista with new lipstick. The versions are similar, Windows 7 is just new marketing for Vista.
Windows 95 = 4.0
Windows 98 = 4.1
Windows ME = 4.9
Windows 2000 = 5.0
Windows XP = 5.1
Windows Vista = 6.0
Arghhhh.... wrong again:
It's XP that was the .1 release, not Vista. Thus:
5.0 Windows 2000
5.1 XP
6.0 Vista
Mea culpa...
No. Well...maybe. Actually, yes. It really just depends.
Following this argument linearly, wouldn't linux be better off with just one version? Or are we omitting the fact that Windows is aimed towards the stupid people?
I don't know what all the flap is about. No matter what distinctions Microsoft will impose it'll boil down to just two versions... Server, and Bot-net!
If you want to know the difference read the fucking box!
The textbook says, if a company is in a monopoly position, the best way to maximize revenues is for them to differentiate their output so as to take away as much consumer surplus possible under the demand curve.
So, of course, they differentiate their product.
What they've failed to understand is this factoid completely relies on the consumer's ability to differentiate between the products! If 100,000 Joe Schmoes don't know the difference between Home Basic and Home Premium, then guess what, revenue from the two will just be the average prices between the two as Joe Schmoes around the world toss coins to decide which to buy. Some will buy the "better" (more expensive) one because they can't tell but want to "be safe", while others will get the cheaper one because they can't tell and want to save some money. MS will have been better off just selling an all-encompassing "Home" version at a price set at the averages of the Starter and two Home versions and not incur the overhead costs of differentiating the two versions in the first place.
Bottom line:
The people who can differentiate between Start, Home Basic and Home Premium won't bother with either, and the people who can't won't care which one they get.
I mean, three different versions for non-geeks?? Of all products to differentiate, they choose the one aimed at the customer demographic who are least equipped to make an informed decision between all options.
Geez, God help you Microsoft.
This is the stripped down version of XP you want.
Windows 7 Home Basic is compatible with domestic chairs (but not office chairs). Windows 7 Starter is only compatible with stools and high chairs. Windows 7 Pro is compatible with office chairs, including leather executive chairs.
... and then they built the supercollider.
Redmond, WA (/.) Microsoft announced late last night that Windows Seven will come in not five versions, but sixteen version. CEO Steve Ballmer says "It gives the consumer more choice. It allows them to select the version of Windows that'll best fit their needs and income." Meanwhile Windows XP still remains the most popular OS in the world (with over 60% of market share) and Linux based netbooks becoming more popular each month.
First of all, all of those flavors were available for Vista as well. Starter was only marketed for emerging markets.
Second of all, all of those builds have been available since the early days of Windows 7. This isn't something they recently added in to 7025, it's been there the entire time as a carry-over from Vista.
Just because these versions are randomly available in a pre-release version of an OS doesn't mean they'll still be there by the time it's actually released.
This game will waste your life. Don't clicky!
"But there is more than one vendor" is no excuse
No, it isnt. But you forgot that linux is priced 0,00$, comes with lots of software preinstalled and each distribution is varied by look&feel and purpose.
Dont worry though, just buy the "ultimate" one and be happy
Is this really news? This is exactly like Vista, minus the Starter Edition.
Move along people, nothing to see here.
Please spread the word, Windows 7 should be called Vista2.
Not looking good to ever buy another microsoft OS. And before I get marked troll, the gap between linux and windows in not very big any more. I am surprised that microsoft would even attempt this with how their products have done over the last several years and the improvements that have come to apple and linux.
Can't wait to not buy it, just like I didn't buy Vista. Unfortunately one or the other will find its way into my house when my wife's laptop gets replaced.
The confusion is quite ridiculous. I mean really, when the fscking salespeople need to look up tables to determine which windows versions include which features, you can tell someone somewhere in marketing has screwed the pooch badly.
Amen to that. THANK GOD that Linux only comes in one flavor. The choice is so much easier.
Typical Microsoft. Anyone remember Windows 3.0 real mode, protected mode, and virtual mode? At least there was some excuse for that. But it had the beneficial effect (for Microsoft) of soaking up most of organizations' development efforts just trying to target, optimize, and SQA products for three different kinds of Windows, leaving precious little bandwidth for work on, oh, UNIX or OS/2 or Mac OS.
I once worked for a Fortune 500 company where people literally used the word "port" to describe what needed to be done to keep a piece of software working under Windows, as in "We're porting the code from Windows 3.1 to Windows for Workgroups."
IBM did the same thing when they were dominant. Multiple versions of everything and small changes mostly for changes' sake. Big organizations couldn't afford to ignore IBM, and were kept very busy tracking all that stuff.
People build careers on the personal knowledge of the various changes IBM kept making, and people build careers now on their personal knowledge of the changes and variations in Microsoft products.
Lousy engineering. Great way to exploit a monopolistic position in the marketplace.
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
who cares?
We don't believe in radical loony monotheistic religions from the middle east -- we're Christians.
Silly me!!!
After reading comments from those obviously more knowledgeable on the subject than I, I now realize, the options were to select differing forms of "Windows" RATHER than a different form of Linux in stead. Must have been a Blonde Oldzheimers Moment.
As long as they have Windows 7 AIDS Edition, I'm set.
The cost should be 10% the cost of the hardware or less, the current pricing is out of this world, buy a $400 quad core computer and having to spend $200 for an os that can use all your cores, and still allow you to run ie and visit all those lame ass websites with crap dot net/asp programmers that can't write for a normal browser is crap.
> It was limited to 800 x 600 resolution, classic mode only - no theming, only three applications running, and a network restricted to an internet connection, not home networking.
Ouch! Why would anyone bother with it? Presumably Microsoft think by splitting Windows into an absurd number of variations, they'll make more money. Does it? I remember lots of laptops sadly loaded with Windoze Home, but do you reckon anyone is going to pay for a Pro upgrade? No. They'll either keep it and get peed off about the reduced function, or borrow and load a copy of XP Pro instead. Why not? They've paid for it.
You really have to wonder what idiots at Microsoft think this stuff up? Presumably some idiot proposed crippling it to absurdity as "a way to combat piracy" and the co-idiots in the room nodded enthusiastically: "Hey! That'll work." They really needed someone, as Bill used to say, to tell them "That's the dumbest thing I ever heard. You're fired, and everyone who worked on Vista too." (I made up the last part, but it's true).
Just stop it with all the pointless Windows 7 stories already. That Windows 7 will come in several versions is not news, it's standard Microsoft practice.
Get back to me when they actually release the OS, maybe the RC.
Addressing the clearly biased and stupid summary, there's no need to guess; a Google search for "Windows Vista Editions" has a link to Windows Vista: Compare editions as the first result.
This outlines what the major differences are between the four main editions. I can only assume the poster isn't familiar with search engines. Yes, there are others, but they aren't for everyday consumers, so you don't need to know about them except for certain specific circumstances. If you meet those, look up the additional details on Technet.
That being said, I do agree that the number of editions is excessive, and should be reduced, not because I find it confusing, but because it's just unnecessary. I'd suggest reducing down from six to four, with only two of those as "mainstream" versions.
Windows 7 Home Premium (equiv. to XP Home, remove the Premium suffix) and Windows 7 Ultimate (equiv. to XP Professional). They can have their Business/Enterprise edition for corporate customers, and finally, a Starter edition for emerging markets. As such, the everyday consumer only chooses between two, business has their own one tailored for business networks, and the asian/middle-east markets have their thoroughly crippled edition that no one will buy.
For the record, XP is even worse than Vista, here's a list of XP editions:
Windows XP Embedded (not the same as below)
Windows XP for Embedded Systems
Windows XP Home Edition
Windows XP for Legacy PCs
Windows XP Media Center Edition
Windows XP Media Center Edition 2004
Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005
Windows XP Professional Edition
Windows XP Professional x64 Edition
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition 2005
Windows XP Starter Edition
It's possible I've missed some, and of course, this doesn't include region specific releases, such as the European mandated "N" editions.
This trend of having an enormous number of different editions didn't start with Vista, it started with XP, and isn't anything new as some would like to think.
Like that oft-misused descriptor "Entry-level". A euphemism for "the cheapest one". As if someone who's getting their first *whizbangitem* by definition should get one of lower quality or reduced functionality. Regardless of intended use.
j'ai découvert une démonstration vraiment admirable (de ce théorème général) que cette si
This is old news. Engadget and Digg both had this info last Friday/Saturday. There hasn't been any confirmation that this is real or that this will be what the final version will end up having.
The boot.iso image I mentioned was a minimal one (5 meg) on the Red Hat Enterprise linux distros (rhel4 and rhel5). But it looks like it is a 129-meg file on Fedora 10. This matches the "fedora-10-i386-netinst.iso" image found in the regular iso directory. I haven't looked at this yet, but based on the name it should do the same net install. If not, you can generate a small boot iso by grabbing the files from "http://download.fedoraproject.org/pub/fedora/linux/releases/10/Fedora/i386/os/isolinux/" directory and following the "making an installation boot cd" section of the Red Hat Enterprise installation guide (available on redhat.com -- support -- documentation). This will create a 2-meg iso image.
If you want, I'll try both and report back the differences.
What I find funny is I use Vista Business at home. The main reason is I use RDP everyday, and none of the Home versions come with it.
As far as I can tell is that the Home Versions come with Media Center, and I could care less. I just use iTunes and VLC for all my needs. (iTunes sucks, but I loves my iPod).
Image a Student, Gamer, Travel, and Green version.
A Student version can be split into three. A k-6 version, 7-12 version, and college edition. The k-6 could be limited to the basic things that a elementaty school student would need. And the college version would be the same as a 7-12 version, except with more of the Office products.
A Gamer version could be stripped down to the bare essentials. No browser, no Office products, no anything. It would be locked down, so game programs can be ran, and connected to the Internet, but no browser would be on it. That way it's efficient, with no clutter.
A Travel Version, with the ability to run the OS in such a way that if your laptop gets stolen, all sensitive data will be deleted or something like that.
And the Green version, which, in an effort to be environmental, doesn't boot up.
As you can tell, my attempt is more at the humour side, rather than the serious side. But, all in all, the more versions there are, perhaps the more Microsoft could sell. Then again, given how well Flight Simulator has been doing, and that there gaming systems never once had a problem, and that they never had to face antitrust issues, I'm sure Microsoft is doing well enough to just give out an all-around custom version you can do what you want with. *cough*
the answer is presumably because they consider piracy to be wrong, but don't want shell out money for the full version.
Presumably, but if that's the case it's not terribly smart.
In most developing markets you'll find the consumers to be less savvy about high tech IP issues like copyright violation than other developed markets. Far less.
Hell, less than five years ago here you had a significant percentage of the online population in the states copying music left and right with no clue that it was even illegal, much less wonder about the morality of it. You still see that defense come up from time to time, too.
And MS expects some preteen in Singapore to know better? Good luck with that.
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
That would be cool. Sharing is good. I just figured out that in SeaMonkey email client you can do a search for messages that are less than one day old, then save that as a search folder. In fact, you can save lots of search folders. I use a lot of personal folders and filters, so this is a trick that works like the inbox folder but much more useful to me. I'm not sure if that feature is in other email applications (yet) but it's pretty awesome. Once filtered to a personal folder, they won't show in the inbox, and with the search folder I can specify folders to search and folders to ignore. Very useful.
Support NYCountryLawyer RIAA vs People
Who's up for guessing what the difference is between Windows 7 'Starter' and Windows 7 'Home Basic?'"
If it's anything like earlier versions, it will be whether or not you can actually see or affect any of the network settings.
Do not mock my vision of impractical footwear
Which only has one version and a single standardized desktop environment. Clearly multiple versions of the same OS are bad.
Abandon All Hope, Ye Who Enter Here
Ok it looks like the bigger boot.iso image (129-meg) contains an "install.img" file. With a smaller boot.iso image (that you create by using the "making an installation boot cd" instructions), you get prompted for the server containing the Fedora installation files, in which you would feed "http://download.fedoraproject.org/pub/fedora/linux/releases/10/Fedora/i386" (or your own local server if you mirrored the install directory locally). The large boot.iso (which is the same as "fedora-10-i386-netinst.iso") is hard-coded to go after a random public Fedora mirror, so it is not suitable for working off a private installation copy.
Both Toyota and Ford have both held news conferences today, in which they both reveled that in the year 2015, they would continuing to manufacture cars with the same names as before. Furthermore, The majority of their cars are going to run on an exciting type of fuel; instead of the old boring gas, they will be running Gasoline!
I get really frustrated when reading the comments on Slashdot. Why must Slashdot be so desperately anti-Microsoft? I can't find another area of interest where people are so passionately opposed to a particular company. Furthermore, why is it that when I go to another tech site like Neowin, they have NEARLY POLAR OPPOSITE views to those expressed on Slashdot? Sure, Neowin is a somewhat pro-Windows site anyway, but still. I just wish people on Slashdot had more mixed opinions.
People on a lot of other tech sites don't CARE about the multiple versions. It's not just this issue, it's others to do with Microsoft. Particularly on Neowin and even Ars Technica, most people don't side with the EU when it goes after MS; in fact they're rather aggressively opposed to the EU's actions. So why does nearly everyone on Slashdot have a differing opinion?
It annoys me because I can't tell who's being a dick and who's not. I can't tell if the Slashdotters are right in their hatred of Microsoft, or if the Neowinites think Microsoft are an unfair target I'd like to think people would be a little more understanding, but there's something about computers and technology which makes people either not see clearly or refuse to accept a certain perspective.
So why do I keep reading? Sure, I could just not bother but something draws me back. It's like looking at a car crash and the victims inside - you know it's bad, but you just can't help take a gander.
(I admit - often I'll obtain an opinion due to the comments I read. I accept that this is fraught with peril - the best opinion is one made by their own research and rational judgment based on the evidence, but it's hard not to be swayed one way or the other with the passion people put towards their hatred of a certain organization... private or Governmental).
Microsoft is finally getting hip to the Pokemon/Magic card phenomenon- only about 12 years late. Features will be sold in randomized booster packs with commons like "Borked Registry", and rares like "Uptime: all day".
"If I remember right, starter is a stripped down version they just sell in developing countries at a big discount in at attempt to combat some piracy by giving users a low priced option."
Should read:
"If I remember right, starter is a stripped down version they just sell in developing countries at a big discount in at attempt to combat LINUX by giving users a low priced option."
There ya go.
SIGH!
(Mod me insightful baby, cos I know just like me that's what you did when you first read the post)
Windows Hitler: Basic version, crummy UI, poor functionality.
Windows Stalin: Better user interface, more network control.
Windows Mao: Excellent for multi-user. Allows administrator to set UAC on various online and offline resources.
I was disappointed to discover that Windows Vista Home Premium edition doesn't support Services for UNIX, whereas XP Professional did.
Hopefully they provide SFU (which I think they now call SUA) on all editions of Windows 7, or at least make it clear which ones don't.
Saying that a distribution of Windows is going to come in an array of different versions is like saying the sky is blue; it's about as obvious as things get.
...Server 2010, Server 2010 Web Edition, et cetera, ad infinitum, ad nauseum... LOL.
Why can't it just be Home, Pro, Server? Nothing like confusing people into buying more out of the fear they'll lose someone useful...
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Will Micro$oft replace all current Vista owners with Windowz 7 ?
Cos lets face it, money spend on Vista was a complete waist!
> Starter is basically the version you ask for if your going to replace with Linux.
Or even replace it with a pirated copy of Windows. Anything but actually use it. Starter has totally arbitrary limits like a maximum number of apps you can have running at once. And that's after they strip out pretty much every feature they can think of, the stuff that might actually make Windows of some value compared to a random Linux distro.
(Ok, of value to those who don't understand or don't care about issues like Freedom.)
Democrat delenda est
They have to do this to prevent against a disruption by the Linux product family for entry level customers. As long as Linux is "mostly free" as in beer, they are seriously threatened by entry level consumer, and especially business, customers traveling up the food chain, and eventually subsuming the whole market using open source.
Get used to this. They're deliberately stratifying a monopolized market as a defense against a potentially disruptive technology.
--
Toro
guess what guys since build 7000 you have been able to dothis, just the keys MS gives you are only for ultimate.
They should drop all of these crappy names out and instead have:
Hobo Edition - For people who lack money
Box Dweller Edition - For generic home users
Empire Edition - For your business kingdom
Just God Like Edition - For the man who eats rocks for breakfast!
It's consumer releases (not business, server, mobile, etc.):
1) 3.1
2) 95
3) 98
4) ME
5) XP
6) Vista
7) Win 7
That never made sense to me. Why would anyone put up with a hopelessly-crippled-to-the-point-of-being-nearly-useless version of Windows when they could buy a bootleg of a Pro/Ultimate edition on a street corner for almost nothing or even torrent it for free?
Instead of buying a bootleg copy of Windows, why not install a good BSD/Linux distribution, that has not limitations and comes with office software, all for the low, low, price of Zero dollars.
And of course by doing this you aren't breaking any laws, and getting a superior, virus proof operating system.
Sell a single version for crying out loud. Microsoft is showing their dinosaur teeth. The multi-version business model has seen it's day. If they care to compete they should only release a single version that has everything. Just my opinion. I think they realize that the OS is no longer on their level of interest. Is Windows 7 the final desktop OS?
Step right up for Windows 7 Business, Business Premium, Home, Home Premium, Home Chocolate, Home Strawberry-razzle, Super Deluxe Premium, Deluxe Premium Berry-blast-blizzard, and even hot fire ultimate cheese deluxe! All flavors, all the time!!
There still is a high percentage of people in the States copying music left and right - who don't give a c**p about copyright. Nor should they. "Piracy" isn't immoral...copyright is.
There is nothing inherently wrong with copyright. It's actually a great idea. Protect the creator of a good with an exclusive right so they can make their money off of it.
What's immoral is what has been done to that original great idea.
Now it's large record companies that hold the copyrights on the works its represented artists have created. They get a percentage which is determined by a cartel. And copyright has been extended by such insane lengths as to create a revenue stream for those companies that will typically last longer than the artist will live.
And they pay the artist pennies on the dollar. IMHO, that's why people pirate music. They know that 99% of that $15 they just plunked down on a CD will wind up in some corporate jackoff's wallet. The artist you actually like will probably get a thin nickel from your cash. So why bother?
What we need is copyright reform. If the artist got a fair percentage of the sale, and these useless bags of skin that sit between me and them were somehow cut out of the picture, I'd start buying music again.
Disclaimer: I don't buy music, but I don't copy it either. I simply do with what I already own until such time as the marketplace will allow me to buy directly from the artists I like without giving a penny to organizations like the RIAA. Soon as they die, I become a customer again.
Weaselmancer
rediculous.
No, it used to be called the recovery disk. Windows crashes so often they know you will pay the extra.
Windows 7 will come in multiple versions, and one of them is called KDE but will be free, both as in free beer as well as free speech.
The point is that most people don't care about the OS as long as they can do what they want. And, most people
For example, my 78 yo grandad runs xubuntu on his 600 MHz PIII w. 128 MB RAM. He doesn't like it, it is too slow, but he is not prepared to shell out $150 on top of a laptop for $500.
This is why KDE is the next version of Windows, even if it might have xfce under the hood for those who never notice the difference. :)
...Is that you, Ted?
HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
Then why don't they call it "Windows Netbooks"? If "Windows Starter" is supposed to be the netbook edition, then they've managed to give it a name that actively misleads you as to what it's intended for.
Sounds like it will be a repeat of Vista Capable. At this point, however, there can't be that many people left on the planet who don't know that it's just crap. The choke-hold on OEMs is starting to break, this time all at once instead of a manageable one or two at a time. Any remaining MS revenues are starting to be only from those locked in through formats, protocols or ideologies.
Beta is broken and the link to classic doesn't work. Stop wasting our time or there won't be anybody left here.
Is it really that difficult to distinguish them? 1 has games and multimedia related progs and lacks a fax/scan/remote desktop app. 1 has fax/scan/remote desktop app and lacks games and multimedia progs. 1 has it all. 1 has very little of anything. 1 has just enough to get it into a low power computer. I don't find it that confusing at all, and I'm sure that many other people don't either. It's not rocket science. Many of these features people will find in a 3rd party product anyway, in the end you're paying for saving space and time....and you're paying for what you can afford. I personally think that Starter and Basic as stand alones could serve to die off. Rename Home to something like Prime or Select and allow it to install different versions (ie: Value (the new basic) Premium (home premium), SOHO (mix of business and home), Business (business), Enterprise etc.) and sell 32 and 64 bit versions together, ie: allow 1 key to activate either 32 or 64 bit version. Then just sell 3 versions. Allow 1 key to activate Value, Premium and SOHO and 1 to activate Business and Enterprise, and then of course 1 to activate Ultimate. So for retail or OEM purposes, there would theoretically be 3 product boxes.
Even if you shell out some bucks, their os is still worthless. Case in point:
Go out an grab a copy windows server 2k3, enterprise edition. Sounds like it is just like the ship, right? Tons of phasers, holodecks, and fun toys. It will have everything you need.
Set it up as an application server, and see how many connections they allow. You have to buy a friggen extra license if you want to say set it up to allow more than a couple of people to log on. AND...you have to install a special service somewhere on the network to manage it.
Just think of that: it actually takes writing extra code once you set up the service protocols to limit the number of connections, and make sure that you aren't exceeding the number of connections you have paid for. They paid programmers to limit the number of connections that the OS would allow, to make more money off licenses. If I set up a Linux server, I could open connections (for free) until my RAM exploded.
Even when you try to play the game their way, and buy the biggest, most expensive OS on the shelf, they will still try to fuck you over with an incomplete product.
Go read my old posts. I am generally easy going in regards to MS overall, and I will not advise anyone to buy their operating systems. They are utter garbage.
HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
I can hardly wait to see how many pissed off Vista users there are going to be when the difference btw W7 and Vista is merely lipstick and they're offered the NEW W7 when they just got done paying an outrageous price for Vista.
Bite me
Windows performance has been declining since Windows 2000, the most important reason I upgraded to XP was stability, with Vista came performance disaster and I've looked at benchmarks which claim the exact same thing in 7, why the hell would I upgrade? no support from microsoft? boo hoo.
Windows Seven Comes
In Seven Stupid Versions
Like Windows Vista.
Multiple versions? How the hell am I supposed to tell the difference? What am I supposed to read the box to know what I'm buying?! Why should I have to spend 30 seconds looking up something on google that will affect me for the next few years! I just want to spend spend spen! Jesus fuck why dosnt bill gates shoot me in the testicles with a six shooter and light me on fire!
People- Grow the fuck up.
It would be newsworthy if Windows _didn't_ come in multiple flavours.
I don't understand completely why Microsoft doesn't just release one version, or possibly two, one for the home users, and another for the business users. Splitting the home sector into the 3 they have it now(starter, basic, premium) is ridiculous. Do they really make that much money off selling a better version? It would make it a lot easier on the customer. I guess it just makes some people feel like since they won't be using the fancy aero, or the media center that they won't be paying for it. idk, could be rational. lol
Thousands of flavors to choose from: how would you like your Linux?
/..
Seriously, I love Linux and open-source in general, but when does something like Pro/Home/Ultimate/EXTREME/Slim/Micro/Mobile/ME/2KWTF compare to the massive number of available distros and install choices (most distros I've dealt with have at least the choice of server vs. desktop), and I know "A *nix user will know what they want the OS to do, otherwise they wouldn't be using FREEOSSOSNAMEHERE," but some people who actually AREN'T familiar with Linux get it anyways, just like some people aren't familiar with Windows (granted, not as many n00bs there), so choosing between 3 versions of Windows 7 vs. LOTS of versions of Linux - give me a break,
The confusion is quite ridiculous. I mean really, when the fscking salespeople need to look up tables to determine which windows versions include which features, you can tell someone somewhere in marketing has screwed the pooch badly.
Don't ever try to discuss Labview licenses with National Instruments... Even their sales reps can't figure out what kind of licenses we need in many cases. This debacle recurs every year in different ways (we're a significant customer for them, since we sell a lot of stuff with embedded Labview).
Those who can make you believe absurdities can make you commit atrocities. - Voltaire
If I want to pay a bunch of money extra I'll just buy apple products, be done with the confusion and insanity and get a product that works (mostly). If I want the hot cheapness I choose between Linux distros. I won't be buying anything with Windows preinstalled if I can avoid it (even if I think they are doing interesting stuff in their Win7 interface). Adding to that, I can't even be bothered to PIRATE microsoft products anymore. How bad is that?
You guys forget the "?" in the article title, like in the source you're citing.
The thing is, is that these SKU's may all be placeholders.
MS has not yet confirmed what the Windows 7 SKU's will be.
Almost all, if not all, comments here ignore this.
I sometimes don't like modern Slashdot, at all. :-(
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
Starter version just includes the start button.
Basic version comes with free GOTO statements.
I'm very happy with Steve Ballmer as CEO of Microsoft. What's bad for Microsoft is good for everybody else.
Beauty is in the beholder of the eye.
Who's up for guessing what the difference is between Windows 7 'Starter' and Windows 7 'Home Basic?'"
Ok, I'll have a go:
About $120 - the price you pay for an upgrade from the OEM-bundled "Starter" to the "Home Basic" which you need to get anything meaningful done that's a tiny bit more demanding than minesweeper.
Assorted stuff I do sometimes: Lemuria.org
With all the time spent dealing with the licensing, a company could probably save money if Microsoft had a 'dumptruck licensing plan' where you simply drove them a dump truck full of money every 6 months and you could use whatever software in whatever situation.
This does actually exist, although not quite in the terms you describe, as the enterprise licensing agreement.
The investment bank I recently worked for paid MS a fixed amount per "seat" per year, which gave them carte blanche to deploy as much end-user and server software (Office, Server OS, MS-SQL, Exchange, Sharepoint, Virtual Server, HyperVisor and so forth) as they wanted.
Developers are handled in a similar fashion - you pay x per developer, and that gives you MSDN access, all the dev tools, documentation, and support.
In passing, this is why VMWare ended up making their server editions no-cost - any company on the enterprise deal gets as much virtualisation as they want for effectively free... the VMWare reps would turn up and ask what it would take for us to use their product in our server consolidation projects, and the answer was always "be the same price..."
This sig left unintentionally blank.
To me, at least, Windows has just become a front end. Windows - The welcome mat to the Internet, endless web services and a few essential applications. Frankly Windows deserves to be about 100Mb big and start in 0.33 seconds. If there are a few versions of Windows 7, perhaps not as many as the silly number of Vistas available, but enough to cause concern, at least make a good one. See, I'd be happy with the Windows 7 (insert real name here) Ultra-skinny-super-deluxe-lite version please. Price it around £30 ($42 - at this precise moment), please add your own browser, security and web apps. Think of it as going to Subways, choose the boring brown roll of an OS, then add all your own funky, juicy, meats, salads, peppers and sauces. Full rant here
If he's the Walrus then can I be a penguin please?
More Linux misinformation.
linux is priced 0,00$
It's a very rare business case where the cost of the license is a significant factor in choosing the operating system.
comes with lots of software preinstalled
Pretty much everything you can compile for Linux, you can compile for cygwin. Of course, you probably got Windows in the first place because of software only available on Windows, or because Windows software is generally better integrated, or has an easier interface, or better documentation, or better support, or a larger pool of trained users/administrators/developers, or any number of reasons relevant to the businessman rather than the geek.
and each distribution is varied by look&feel and purpose
And why the hell would I want a different directory structure, or incompatible configuration files, or incompatible package files, just because I've tweaked my OS for look&feel and purpose? Linux is a joke in this regard.
Aw, no "Windows 7 DVD-Personally-Autographed-By-Bill-Gates and Thrown Across The Room By Steve Ballmer" Ultimate Edition, then?
"If you think the problem is bad now, just wait until we've solved it." --- Arthur Kasspe
Arguing that the difference between server and client operating systems is the same as the difference between Microsoft's various marketing attempts to make higher margins in different segments of the client operating system is a strawman argument.
The various flavours of desktop Windows are PURELY a marketing concept and have no basis in customer needs. You charge more for a so-called Ultimate version which has some extra doo-dahs, a little more for Business so you can do a Citigroup on businesses and a basic price for low margin OEM marketing speak Home Premium, and finally, you attempt to make a buck off OEM makers in areas where everyone pirates Windows in any case with Home Starter, Home basic etc.
This marketing differentiation is one of the reasons why Microsoft is perceived, even if incorrectly, as becoming increasingly irrelevant in todays market. Paying more than a $100 extra for some doodah that you can replace with some freeware doesn't make you any friends.
Customers don't care. No one gives a shit why MS does this. All it does is enforce people's opinion that Windows is confusing, and above all "" doesn't just work.
...would be, simply...well... Windows7 Advanced Home Networked Gamer Professional Multimedia Edition... Guess we'll be seeing MSCA (Microsoft Credit Acceptance Corporation) sometime in the not-to-distant future, to assist people in paying for their new Operating Systems...
In this 2.6ghz time with 800mhz ram I still cannot believe that I can see a windows desktop update its icons from blank icons to real icons at a rate of 5 per second.
Did MS write their code in VB for most of windows? Or use ridiculously tiny caches?
1.5 gig of ram available, only 50% used, and a 1gig swap used for stupid cache, if it used zero swap until ram 100% it would be faster.
Liberty freedom are no1, not dicks in suits.
When I say that this is rubbish.
It was a stupid idea in Vista and it is a stupid idea under Windows 7.
It's all fine and dandy for the sales and marketing people to whip up this fancy idea and the beancounters but the real people affected by this are us, the tech people supporting, implimenting or cursing it - plus the coders at Microsoft having to fix up all these versions too (yes, believe it or not, some of the poor programmers in the Windows team are humans too - poor bastards)
XP had it right, there should be 2 versions, 'crappy' and 'the worksburger' the crappy version should still have all the visual wank the end users want but be missing say the ability to attach to a domain, remote desktop fucntionality, that kind of thing.
(ideally, there'd be ONE version but I doubt they'll ever do that again)
Any more than 2 versions is lunacy.
Sigh.
Microsoft has spent so much time bending over backwards for governments and lobby groups that they have lost touch with what their customers are actually doing with their products.
In most retail customer's minds there are only two versions of windows:
1. The one installed on the computer I bought
2. The one not installed on the computer I bought
That's it. How many people do you know of that made a stink about what version of Vista to buy? I don't know of a single person that bought a boxed copy of Vista. Every Vista user I know bought a computer that came with Vista.
Business users have similar simple requirements. Most volume license customers buy the version they can get cheapest. I don't know of a single volume license customer that bought Vista Ultimate. Why you ask? No volume license pricing exists for Vista Ultimate. Vista Business or Enterprise is what volume license customers buy.
Microsoft can't find their butts with both hands these days.
-ted
It worked so well for vista, expanding on the idea they started with XP.
---- Booth was a patriot ----
What else did you think licenses were for? As a cool certificate to stick on the wall and show to your friends?? Jeez...
The "pirates"/infringers will rip the Ultimate.
The users will be too confused and buy Ultimate, just to be sure!
The MS snobs will buy Ultimate, to stay one-up!
The noobs will buy Ultimate, 'cos the guy down at PC World told them too!
The companies will have to buy Ultimate, albeit on corp-wide licenses, to get all the features they need!
End result? MS "distrbutes" lots of high-end copies of it's crapware and the shareholders sleep better at night!
Think of Windows 7's relationship to Vista as Windows 98SE was to Windows 98.
How smart are the marketeers in Redmond?
Not very, smart people learn from their mistakes.
Professional Politicians are not the solution, they ARE the problem.
if(isNoob()) { sell them the ultimate version } else if(isNaive()) { sell them the business version } else if(isIdiot()) { sell them the home version with two global constants changing the OS on them and let them all beta test for us }
Would views of Microsoft change if they only offered one version of each operating system (equivalent to the Professional or Ultimate edition) and they charged only $50 per license?
A lot of Microsoft supporters might think such a scenario is impossible. Is it? Really? How much time and money is committed to code, configure, and market the different versions? How much support time is lost to customers who call in and ask "Why can't I do this...?" when the answer is "You need to upgrade to a different version of the current operating system. Hasn't Microsoft figured out that an increasing number of home users are starting to have complex networking needs at home, and that the idea of a "simple" operating system for home use is as antiquated as a manual typewriter?
I hope that someone from Microsoft reads this and has an epiphany. The company's bottom line could be even better if they standardized on a single operating system platform,
And to all you who will argue that even $50 is too much to spend for a proprietary operating system, is it, really? My guess is that most consumers, myself included, would be far more likely to buy a Microsoft operating system if the price was reasonable. Hey, if I can drop $50 for a Wii game, why not $50 for my PC? There will always be reasons to consider Linux or other operating system alternatives, but if Microsoft's prices were to drop, the Linux community would need to concentrate more on giving consumers a better user experience, rather than one that just mimics the functionality of Windows (okay Apple people, don't get your dander up--I'm just making a point here).
I use irony whenever I can, but my shirts are still wrinkled...
But it doesn't work, most people call their geek friend and have a pirate copy of XP Pro or Vista Ultimate installed.
Compared to the 5 versions of Windows 7, how many distributions and versions of Linux are there to choose from? Look at Ubuntu/EduBunto/Gobunto/Xubunto as an example. If it's so obvious that multiple versions of Windows 7 are going to confuse the masses and doom it to failure then what does that say about Linux?
I am confused as to why this is somehow a bad thing. Seriously. Live in linux but still need a wintendo partition? Buy Starter. Live in windows, but not a power user? Maybe you are a grandma? Get him. A little smarter than the average bear? Get home plus. WHY THE FUCK would giving a consumer the ability to NOT pay for what they DONT want be a bad thing?
There are like a gazillion different flavors of linux, some tiny and bare bones, some robust and bloated, some specializing in a particular sphere of influence. If it is BAD for MS to have more than one version of it's OS then what about linux in general?
Fucken Asshats, I swear.
So which one is with the Hitler?
Does it still come with that other fancy screen-saver? You know, ah... what's it called? Oh yea, the BSOD screen-saver? That was a really fancy one.
Why would anyone put up with a hopelessly-crippled-to-the-point-of-being-nearly-useless version of Windows when they could.....
why would they use it on a netbook-crippeled-piece-of-hardware-that-barely-can-vista-and-for-that-reason-still sells-with-xp?
The various flavours of desktop Windows [...] have no basis in customer needs.
Uh, market segmentation is pretty basic economics and common practice. See, for example, any car manufacturer [...]. Any company that can do this, will do it, because they'd be stupid not to.
So it's in the seller's interest, and to hammer the point home you give a car analogy involving price gouging. Does this mean you agree with your parent that it's not out of a consideration of the consumers' interests it's done?
Because that's what it sounds like...
I still like this one from Apple. It explains it from an average persons perspective.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
There is only one Linux kernel. The different distributions, to oversimplify, are like software bundles. Different window managers etc. And for telling the difference, there's always distrowatch. It even highlights beta components in red.
There is only one Windows kernel. The different editions, to oversimplify, are like software bundles. Home Premium and Ultimate include Media Centre, but Home Basic and Business don't, etc. And for telling the difference, there's always Microsoft's website.
"You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war." -- Albert Einstein
Just remember, if you're buying Windows and you're at all, just go for anything that has "Ultimate" in it and you'll probably come out OK.
Sure, but should I go for Ultimate, Ultimate Basic, Ultimate Home, Ultimate Business, Ultimate Premium, or Ultimate for Workgroups?
Considering the fact that only one of those actually exists, I guess the answer is obvious.
"You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war." -- Albert Einstein
The more stupid shit like this Microsoft does, the more market share they lose. You'd think they'd want to differentiate it from Vista as much as possible. Windows 7 may rock but the public just doesn't like stuff like this.
Wohooo... Windows XP will be popular even unto windows 7.
I disagree.
The real problem is that record companies exploit musicians. That's what we want to solve.
Forbidding corporations from holding copyrights will be ineffective: your employment contract will state that you give your employer permission to exercise all the holder-only rights, and promise not to exercise any of them yourself. The fact that you're still the copyright holder means nothing: the implications of that have been superseded by a contract.
You can try to squash the dodge by saying the rights can be signed away, but then you're playing Whack-a-Mole.
What's really needed is for musicians to have (and use!) more bargaining power. The musicians should be able to tell the record companies that they don't need the record companies and are able to do all the not-playing-the-music work on their own, and they should be able to follow up on that.
That's a bit difficult if the record company execs play golf with the radio broadcaster execs. Fortunately, there are no Internet execs, as long as there are ISPs who will sell you a pipe restricted only by the amount of bytes you send each second.
The Mac OS has different versions for server and workstation. The server version removes the (as far as I can tell) arbitrary restrictions on the number of users allowed to share and adds some pretty GUI for configuring the servers. I don't know if they did any different stuff for tuning as a server or not. Perhaps the person who uses a Mac server in a real production environment (anyone? anyone?) could explained how the Mac server is tuned differently than the workstation.
Or is it just "marketing" tuning--by adding $100 or so.
Microsoft knows the tiered system is bad for consumers. An idiot could tell you that. But they;re doing it on purpose and here's why.
When Joe the Plumber goes to buy Windows and sees so many different versions, he's going to be confused. Then he's going to sit there and say something like "Well, the cheapest one is $250, but it's only $50 for this upgrade. Then it's only another $100 to get this one in the shinier box and then it's only another $100 to get this cool looking black one that says ultimate on it."
Essentially every version of Windows is there to make you think it's not as expensive as it really is and to trick you into paying more then you ever would have before. It's an old psychological trick, people will spend more if there is a cheaper option (it's a trick Wal*Mart is practically based on - cheap up front options and expensive stuff sitting next to it).
Nobody is going to buy basic when they don't know what they're going to need. You'd feel ripped off if you did.
The tiered system is Microsoft's way of getting people to pay $500 for software that isn't worth half that.
or else!
They're NOT confusing, if you consider Vista has exactly the same SKUs.
Starter Edition is basically for India and South America and such. It's basically crippled - you can only run a certain number of GUI apps at once, get 1GB of memory maximum, no ability to run servers (it won't accept incoming connections so you're limited to passive web browsing) and won't run on "high end" processors (tops out on non-HT Pentium 4).
I got that from the bloody Wikipedia article and plenty of press releases for it are abound. I can't believe anyone could be so confused when they have Google :D
And the clue of the beta saying "Windows 7 Ultimate" wasn't enough to realize MS was going to fragment the release again? I'm just hoping there are less options and more reasonable prices - ditch Premium and offer Basic, Business, and Home or Ultimate. The original retail price for Windows Vista Ultimate was ridiculous (something like $459). The value add was negligible over the cheaper Business edition. Premium was crippled vs XP Media Edition (and I'm specifically referring to the Disk Management utility that doesn't allow dynamic disks). Basic mostly just removed bling like Aero.
It's gotten so bad, it's not even any fun to mock them anymore - machine-gunning fish in a barrel is a challenge by comparison.
I'll say.
As soon as you pull the trigger the barrel explodes, and then all the fish escape!
Just remember, if you're buying Windows and you're at all, just go for anything that has "Ultimate" in it and you'll probably come out OK.
Sure, but should I go for Ultimate, Ultimate Basic, Ultimate Home, Ultimate Business, Ultimate Premium, or Ultimate for Workgroups?
Dude, you have to go for Ultimate Ultimate.
1) It wasn't my group.
2) It probably was bad code. I know you and I and none of the people reading ever write bad code, but, Sturgeon's Law, most of the code written in this world is bad.
3) And I've known people who were personally whipsawed by lobbying their managers for extra time to follow Microsoft "best practices" only to have Microsoft do a 180 on best practices. The specific case I'm thinking about in particular had something to do with .INI files. I'm not a Windows programmer and I may be wrong on the exact technical details, but I think they spent time moving everything out of .INI files and into the Registry, according to Microsoft guidelines, only to be told by Microsoft a few years later... without any acknowledgment that this was a change... that the Registry "wasn't a database" and wasn't suitable for this purpose, and program settings should never be stored in the Registry, but rather in the .INI files which, Microsoft said, were designed for that purpose.
I'm think they had some issues with different formats, string-length capabilities, and so forth between .INI files in different versions of Windows, too, inexplicable as you'd think the code for reading and writing .INI files could have been written in portable C and work identically across OS versions.
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
The main page shows exactly 640 comments for this story. I guess this one won't get modded up, since 640 posts should be enough for anybody.
I think only one version (usually home/basic) will be available without (the shortcut to) IE.
Like there was only one N version of XP.
I can't speak for Taiwan, but I lived in Tokyo for several years, and can say with some reasonable certainty that there are plenty of grey- and black-market goods still floating around, if you know where to look. One of my favorite examples was a streetside stall, I think it was near Ueno station, proudly displaying its selection of CDs with pretty liners showing famous guitarist Elic Crapton.
Ah, Japan...
Cheers,
"What in the name of Fats Waller is that?"
"A four-foot prune."
It maybe that in the beta they are looking at these options. Hopefully they will just have home, business and ultimate as those make sense. Maybe a basic version if you have older hardware or meet the minimum system requirements and don't want all the eye candy and multimedia. At least we can hope they are more "honest" in the system requirements section. Running Vista on anything short of a dual core CPU is going to be aggrivating and at least 2 gig of ram (32 bit) or 4 gigs of ram (64 bit). Anyone know if there will be a 32 bit version of Windows 7? They had talked about going strictly 64 bit after Vista.
Lame.
Starter- emerging markets. Basic desktop, limited functionality.
Home Basic, No media Center, no Aero. Otherwise, same as WHP.
Home Premium - Aero, Media Center.
Just because *you* can't figure it out doesn't mean the rest of the world is that clueless.
why is this article even posted? The beta shows ultimate, this clearly shows they will stick witht he multiple versions. What is so fscking hard about multiple versions? Home users get home premium, business users .. yep get business.... retards with to much money who want more eyecandy ... get ultimate.
This does not need to be posted on slashdot EVER again. Buy the version you like or stick with xp or vista or linux or whatever the hell you use, just stop whining!
oh wait ... this is slashdot.
It's sort of like an operating system or something, right?
XKCD:Xeric Knowledge Comically Dispen
1(one) core version for basic computing, with add-on packages that integrate.
If you want a quick adoption of W7, sell one complete version for 150 bucks, 99 bucks if upgrading from Vista.
They must realize that to move forward with new products they need a very wide adoption of a 64 bit common platform to launch from. Making that platform expensive and confusing only slows or halts adoption.
It would seem to me that need to gt rid of XP and earlier version from the market place. Right now they are certianly good enough so you need a perceived value for adoption.
Man, I would love to be able to spend a day with the MS VP's and get answers to why they do some of this stuff.
Yeah, I'd prefer Linux to gain ground, but no company seems to be moving in the aggressive manner that is needed to properly leverage MS mistakes.
ONLY sell them in 64bit.
We need to move into 64 bit, go beyond 4Gigs of RAM, and get IPv6 for as many people as possible to continue to progress. The industry is starting to stagnate, and it will get worse if we don't deliver new power and tools that allow people to find great ways to utilize the this new potential.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Apparently it is okay on Tuesday for the EU to mandate multiple versions, but on Wednesday it is a crime if MS offers multiple versions.
Keep up the good work! We're that much closer to determining the speed of hypocrisy (currently somewhere between sound and light).
and pay, and pay, and pay, and pay...
It's their new subscription-based business model. Continual torment and financial hemorrhage are labeled as 'features'. Bugs and viruses are, as ever, an integral part of the platform.
I guess it's not really a 'new' business model for them.
Who's up for guessing what the difference is between Windows 7 'Starter' and Windows 7 'Home Basic?'"
More to the point, who cares?
Windows XP 64-bit Edition Version 2003 (English)
Windows XP Embedded with SP2 - Evaluation Version (English)
Windows XP Home Edition (English) - ISO CD Image
Windows XP Home Edition N (English)
Windows XP Home Edition with Service Pack 2 (English)
Windows XP Home K with Service Pack 3 (x86) - CD (English)
Windows XP Home KN with Service Pack 3 (x86) - CD (English)
Windows XP Home N with Service Pack 3 (x86) - CD (English)
Windows XP Home with Service Pack 3 (x86) - CD (English)
Windows XP Media Center Edition 2004 Update (English)
Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005 - CD1 (English)
Windows XP Media Center Edition 2005 - CD2 (English)
Windows XP Media Center Edition CD1 - Checked/Debug (English)
Windows XP Media Center Edition CD1 (English)
Windows XP Media Center Edition CD2 (English)
Windows XP Professional (English)
Windows XP Professional (VL) ISO CD Image (English)
Windows XP Professional K with Service Pack 3 (x86) - CD (English)
Windows XP Professional KN with Service Pack 3 (x86) - CD (English)
Windows XP Professional N - VL (English)
Windows XP Professional N - VL with Service Pack 3 (x86) - CD (English)
Windows XP Professional N (English)
Windows XP Professional N with Service Pack 3 (x86) - CD (English)
Windows XP Professional with Service Pack 2 (English)
Windows XP Professional with Service Pack 2- VL (English)
Windows XP Professional with Service Pack 3 - VL (x86) - CD (English)
Windows XP Professional with Service Pack 3 (x86) - CD (English)
Windows XP Professional x64 Edition - Checked/Debug (English)
Windows XP Professional x64 Edition - VL (English)
Windows XP Professional x64 Edition (English)
Windows XP Professional x64 Edition with SP2 - VL (English)
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition 2005 (English) - CD1
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition 2005 (English) - CD2
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition 2005 CD 1 - VL (English)
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition 2005 CD 2 - VL (English)
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition CD1 (English)
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition CD1 (English) - VL
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition CD2 (English)
Windows XP Tablet PC Edition CD2 (English) - VL
$50.00 USD
Very cute, but also wrong. Windows started out as just an interface, a window manager for MS-DOS, in versions 1 and 2. The Linux kernel was an OS from version 0.0.1 (even if it only ran on a few systems). Also I'm pretty sure that Linux 2.x has more in common with 1.x than Vista has with Windows 3.x.
I support the Slashcott and will not be reading or commenting from 2/10/14 to 2/17/14. Beta is steaming pile of dog shit
VirtualBox is good software - Windows 7 not so much.
Except that the discussion has nothing to do with Windows from 20 years ago. It's about the various editions of today's Windows. Any discussion of Windows 3 or earlier is irrelevant, because nobody actually uses those.
"You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war." -- Albert Einstein
Yeah, that's why Windows 3.x support ended only last year. It was being used in embedded applications for decades.
Besides which, the AC I was originally responding to seemed to be implying a long history of criticism, which only correlates to a long history of architecture changes. Do not confuse the topic of a thread with the topic of an article.
I support the Slashcott and will not be reading or commenting from 2/10/14 to 2/17/14. Beta is steaming pile of dog shit
Well, I guess the original comment is open to interpretation, as I didn't read it as implying history involving architectural changes. I read it as a criticism of Windows having multiple editions of each version, which is a criticism that has been around for a few years now -- and directly relates to the article to which the post was replying.
As for Windows 3 support ending last year, I also took the original post as being about the confusion that occurs when purchasing Windows, which again directly speaks to the multiple editions. Therefore, my comment about nobody using Windows 3 should more accurately have been that nobody's buying Windows 3.
"You cannot simultaneously prevent and prepare for war." -- Albert Einstein
All the reviews I've seen seem only to compare it to Vista, but it sounds like the speedup from Vista is minor -- nothing like the downgrade from XP.
So is this the new MS approach -- to put out a really bad product (Vista), then give us something 5% better and watch all the reviews "Oooh" and "Ahh" over how much better it is than Vista?
This sounds like Windows ME all over again. Though XP did eventually come up to speed and was worth it because of the extra HW it supported. Win64-XP should be able to handle all the new HW (except HW deliberately disabled by manufacturers to not work with legacy systems).... ;->
It's amazing that Microsoft has not learned from the Vista fiasco. Having multiple versions of Vista infuriated users almost as much as the functionality of Vista itself. Microsoft needs to get rid of basic and have only premium and business. Ultimate is a waste of money most of the advanced features such as bit locker are available as open source. It's almost as if the licensing division was dictating how the product was packaged. The licensing schemes could prove to be Microsoft's downfall. They are so greedy to try and extract every dollar from licensing that they don't recognize much infuriation it creates with their customers. This will drive more customers over to Linux and open source.
I hesitate to read threads about any Microsoft product on Slashdot. I know I am going to see 700+ messages about why Microsoft sucks.
Could you all just save the time and mod the first post "Lemming"
Linux has many flavours indeed; However If install a lightweight distro no functions are artificiality neutered, just not installed. And if I change my mind, I can always install the feature that I want. Apples and Oranges.
Browse at -1 to keep an eye out for abuses.