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File Extensions And Monopolies
A_Non_Moose sent us an article from Salon that talks about how file extensions are one of the tools used by Microsoft to extend their mind and market share. It's a very simple idea but its honestly something I'd never thought about. Definitely worth a read, and a few neurons to realize how its really the simplest of things that will guarantee that this monopoly isn't stopped even if Microsoft's deep pockets didn't let them buy the law.
Can't read full article :(
Anyone want to post content here?
"...and generally behaved in a manner one can only describe as despicable." - February 27 2001, Michael Sims
If not just for the virus running abilities alone!
"Someone think of the children!!"
just kidding guys!
In Windows 3.1 and presumeably 3.11(Workgroups), it was very easy to change the extentions. You could right click on ANY file and I think there was an option for "Open With..." and you could set it to always do that.
Then with Windows 95, you started to have to struggle.
We don't need no stinkin' file extensions!
"A sample size of one is really just statistical masturbation."
Short of a complete re-write of the entire FAT-32 filesystem there is no solution to this, aside from teaching new users that "Hold down shift, right click, then hit Open With..." will solve this problem.
Honestly, this seems like some Salon.com columnist had nothing else to do and decided to bitch about Microsoft for a while cause, hey, it'll get on Slashdot!
Over time, I got irritated with soundjam and went back. I got rid of the program but the association is still there. I know how to fix it, but if someone was a little less knowledgeable or someone writes a program to change all my associations, I'd be quite.. irritated.
I know, its possible for any dos/win program to change my PC file extensions too, but its more obvious and probably a lot less likely.
-
ping -f 255.255.255.255 # if only
Remember when Netscape and IE fought for .html and URL rights EVERY time you opened them?
RealPlayer, Winamp, Winzip, photoshop, even stupid ass AOL all do this . . .
Installation defaults of all these apps try and steal file extensinos away from programs. Its just a matter of knowing what boxes to uncheck during the installation. Ordinary users simply dont know what they're clicking through during an install.
Once a program gets a hold of an extension its almost impossible for a normal user to fix it. You cant expect users to know where to reassign file extension ownership (in the file association tab under folder options).
you won and i admire you can i be your boyfriend thanks ok bye
and apparently 2nd p0sts too. :-)
Shift-Right-Click on the file, choose Open With on the menu that pops up, and pick a program. Wow. That's tough.
LOAD "SIG",8,1
LOADING...
READY.
RUN
hmmm, maybe someone on the inside could sneak .sux under PHB radar in the Micro$oft camp? Anyone feeling adventurous?
"If I wanted your input on my pet project, I'd stick my hand up your ass and use you like a sock-puppet." - Muse
Even in windows XP... right-click icon, choose "Open With", choose "Choose Program...", then click the "Always use the selected program to open this kind of file."
Hardly only buried in the "folder options" as the article indicates.
.:diatonic:.
This "attempt" at a monopoly through file extensions is something that would only be successful for those who know nothing about the OS at all. Using Win2k as we speak, right clicking on any file and going to "Open with" seems easy enough. Better yet, it has a check box of "use this program to open up the file as default". Very easy. Of course, if no one bothers to look for it, I'm sure it can be considered hard.
I agree that Microsoft does things specifically to retain a monopoly, but does everything it do have that purpose?
I doubt it.
Every program messes with file associations:
RealPlayer, Winamp, Quicktime etc...
What's the difference when it's MS programs?
You can easily change the assocation by holding shift while right clicking on the file and choosing 'Open with'. You then check 'Always open with...' and there you go!
Changing the icon is way harder and is a way more annoying thing in windows.
A.D. 1517: Martin Luther nails his 95 Theses to the church door and is promptly moderated down to (-1, Flamebait).
Personally I think that if you find doing this too complicated, you shoudln't even be allowed near a computer!
------
Sig
The writer's problem is that the default file association points to a Microsoft program.
.mp3 file, for example, he'll have to navigate through an "Open With" dialog and try to find the .exe for whatever program he wants.
So what does he propose as a solution? Eliminate the default file association? So when a user clicks on an
If a user is savvy enough to know where the RealPlayer executable lives, she probably knows enough to set the file associations from within RealPlayer, bypassing the whole issue he's talking about.
In any case, last I installed them RealPlayer, Winamp, etc. all gave me the option of reassociating file types so that they were the default player.
"People that quote themselves in their signatures bother me" - athakur999
What happens if I don't have the application that created the file?
For example, Bob sends me a plain text file he created with WonderText
My preferred text editor is WhizzyText and I don't have WonderText installed.
Am I unable to open the file, or is there an equivalent to file extensions where I can associate WonderText files with my WhizzyText editor?
I lost access to JPG and GIF files after uninstalling some scanning software...
Three days later...I was still no closer...I tried recreating JPG extensions just like JPEG extensions...no go. Trying to create a correct file type was a nightmare.
Finally, I just said screw it...I open up photoshop now to see my stuff. Who needs I.E. to look at GIFS and JPEG's anyway.
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ah honey, we're all resplendent - Bill Mallonee
Much more annoying is having every new application try and make itself the default for a million other filetypes.
Mirosoft is just so deeply entrenched, it's like trying to cut out a cancer without hurting any friently tissue. Weakening Microsoft's grab on the industry will take a long time and their efforts to move into related industries (media, music, etc..) definitely makes this a lot more difficult. Linux is definitely a god-sent, but is it enough? Probably not - at the very end it is maybe the growing ubiquity of technology itself that will make companies irrelevant. The more we agree on standards and the more we push for inter-operation of disassociated technologies, the more difficult it will be for Microsoft to bully itself into every market that proves to be lucrative...
We should embed the associated application information into datafiles. That'll break Microsoft's monopoly.
Doing stuff like actually providing a better alternative to Office of WMA wouldn't work... Nah...
This is just plain ridiculous... I'm not a big fan of Microsoft, but saying their anti-competitive because people would have to spend about 5 min learning how to change a setting, but because they're too stupid or lazy to do so microsoft should be forced to hold their hand while they do it?
What next... Saying that its unfair to have microsoft.com be the default home page for a newly installed copy of ie just because some idiot might want to change it but doesn't want to take the time to figure out how...???
This goes beyond a legitimate argument to just finding something to complain about because complaining about microsoft is the thing to do.
Ben
"Windows makes you go on a mad hunt through menus and folders and options to find the dialogue box that lets you make any such change"
If you want to change a file association, you can just Right-Click in Windows 2k and select "Open With...". If you are using Windows 9x, you can Control-Right-Click and select "Open With...". Then, choose your application and "Always use this program to open these files."
If that's difficult, perhaps the author should use a different OS...
Another article that picks at Microsoft because they have a feature that is too hard to find.
Bullshit
I can find the thing quite easily. Under my comptuer and under Folder Options.
The file tabs aren't hidden, they are easily visible. Just look up at the tabs like every other menu tab in windows.
Not all comptuer users are comptuer-smart, and if they decide, "oh hell, lets open mp3 with wordpad" and they won't even get the damn thing to do what it is supposed to do, instead, you get a text full of symbols and such.
Most people already know about the big programs out there and will ask how do they get the programs they want.
Believe me, lots of people STILL use winamp, even after MS' bundling of WM into the system.
I use emacs and vi for development, not visual studio, for my programming.
I use xchat, not mschat. (All of the progs are on a win2k computer)
And it goes on and on.
Its not just up to us to tell ms how to make their own product, but to educate others on how to use the computer and so on.
And stop bitching at microsoft for the littlest things.
Next they'll bitch for having IE in the start menu
popup
Slashdot Hypocrisy at work?
People will start to realize this; Even your grandmother.
Got Rhinos?
from the salon article:
.3 extensions sucks, and I agree that microsoft's interface for changing it sucks.
The trouble is, even if some court orders Microsoft to throw Real Player into the Windows package, it doesn't make much difference if most users can't figure out how to switch the default player of music files from Windows Media to Real. When Joe User clicks on a music file, even if he likes Real Player and prefers to use it, Windows Media Player will open and play the file. Unless Joe is a power user or an extremely persistent fellow, he will eventually give up on Real. The competitor's software will sit on the hard drive, unused, while Microsoft takes over yet another market.
When the author resorted to this argument, they lost some credibility. RealPlayer asks you, repeatedly, if it can set itself to be the default player for ALL of it's supported media types.
I agree that file typing via
But I think RealPlayer making itself the default program for mp3 files (which nobody in their right mind wants) is more of a problem than other media types defaulting to WindowsMedia player.
Afterall, what do you really want to use RealPlayer for besides playing their propritary file format (which will be asigned to it anyway!)?
I realize it CAN play other files, and it makes an attempt to set itself as the default program for other types of files, I just don't think anyone actually wants to use it for those.
I mean, to play mp3s I could use winamp (for free) or I could use RealPlayer (pay or be subjected to annoying ads).
___
The way to see by faith is to shut the eye of reason. --Ben Franklin
File extensions and associations were a way of reconciling between a GUI interface and the matching of files to apps.
What bothers me about this whole rant is that this time, Microsoft is not forcing users to do anything. Admittedly, it's not easy, but even I managed to do it well before the time I became a "power-user".
Microsofot is simply taking advantage of user inertia. Want a simple solution? Pass around the information in the article on how to change registered file types and gain users' attention by expouunding on its conveninece - convenience on using the app you want to do your task.
I like fire ants. They are very spicy!
Scott Rosenberg, the author of the Salon piece, says Windows "makes you go on a mad hunt through menus and folders and options to find the dialogue box that lets you [change the app that opens a given file type]". Well, yes, it does, unless you shift-rightclick a file and use the "Open With..." option.
:-).
This doesn't really weaken Rosenberg's argument, of course, because this is just one of the zillion and three Windows shortcut thingies that Joe Average doesn't know about. Joe's no more likely to use this than he is to fish his way through to the long-form File Types dialogue. But all of us windswept and interesting Slashdotters who choose/are forced to use Windows ought to know it
Dang it, I used to use an Amiga. Directory utilities on the Amiga just looked at the darn file header. Your IFF image could be called notapicture.txt and it'd still display JUST FINE. A 1Gb footprint for WinXP (which, I hasten to add, I _am_ going to install when next I upgrade my Tiny God), and it still can't do that?!
Come to think of it, that'd be an anti-Sircam-ish sort of feature. "You have attempted to open a file whose extension is PIF, but which appears to be an ordinary executable. That's odd. Would you like to check this file against the new and wonderful Microsoft Proprietary Crushing All Opposition Virus Database to see if it's one of the many things that takes advantage of our monopoly almost as well as we do?"
Maybe the author didn't realize it, but this very concept has been touted as one of the "improvements" in Windows 2000 - you can choose "open with" and change your default right there and then. You can even register multiple applications with filetypes.
This is an annoyance, but I don't think it's such a dark conspiracy. Like others have pointed out, many programs play the "fight for the extension" game, especially for multimedia, and usually the last one in wins.
Of course it's silly how hard it is to "roll your own" file associations, you have to use this weird macro language.
I think smarter programs will always have a preferences screen that let you regrab the extensions. IrfanView is a good example of that. And well behaved programs won't keep trying to intrusively ask you if you want to use them instead.
SO YOU'RE GOING TO DIE: The Comic for Dealing with Death
Uh! Another shabby article that paints Microsoft to be The Evil Sheriff of Nottingham on the basis that most users wouldn't bother to read their manuals or the online help file, or even use their heads once in a while. The Windows Developers haven't tried to obscure the process of file re-association, they haven't made it difficult for software vendors to code in their own file associations...All they are guilty of (in this one specific instance) is putting a seldom used function off to the side, possibly requiring a user to do a little investigation to change an association...Would you want casual users to have the easy ability to change file associations at a whim? I don't know who your users are, but I certainly wouldn't want to afford that ability to every "Joe Mouse Click" that I support.
"The BeOS Bible" by Scott Hacker has a 3 page blurb on why Mac and Windows buggered up file extensions. (Mac assumes that the viewer of a file is the same as its creator. Windows has the problem that if you rename the file, double-clicking on the file no longer brings up the proper app. Window's "Open With" is a hack, but a workable one.)
Be's solution was to use the mime class/type. Even executables use this! i.e. If there is no app to handle image/jpeg it looks for apps that can handle image/*
I can quote more from the book if people are interested.
- I've spent months trying to figure out how to turn of auto-indenting in numbered lists within Word 2000 with no success.
- Using typeid() and other RTTI features is disabled by default in Visual C++ 6.0 and requires finding a very hidden, nested menu to turn it on. This took hours to find.
In general most of their products seem to lack a good Human Computer Interaction factor. But to go as far as calling bad design, some sort of attempt to keep a monopoly seems rather excessive to me, especially since it's fixed in Windows 2000 so that right-clicking on a file brings up the shortcut menu complete with an option that says "Open With..." where you can specify what program to open the file with and if you want the program permanently associated with that file extension.There are times when you need to know kind of file extension it is. ExtSearch is useful. It helps you to determine the file format. :)
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
I thought about this some (before this article), and came to the realization that any program I create should steal as many extentions as possible under Windows. Why? Because once you steal the extension, the mindshare is shifted to your program instead of Microsoft's.
By the same token, would I want Real Player to automatically take over my Desktop? Not a chance. The difference is that Real Player is a piece of bloated s**t that deserves to die. They have not produced a GOOD product in a very long time. Netscape 6.1/Mozilla and StarOffice OTOH, should detect all the extentions it supports, check if they are not registered or registered with "System defaults" (read: Microsoft) and automatically switch them. As long as it doesn't switch any non-M$ software, people will hardly notice and just come to expect the new software. Then and only then will you start hearing "You're still using IE/Microsoft Office? Geez. Go get some real software."
Javascript + Nintendo DSi = DSiCade
The arguement is really not an issue for most people. The people who know they can change a file extension asociation, will. The people who want a different program to open it, will learn. Last, the people who don't know, don't care.
My greater gripe is programs that change extensions be required to display a "warning, proceed?" message during installation (much like a security grant for Java or ActiveX) if the extension is already associated with a different program. It burns me every time I install some software and it becomes my cd and mp3 player. Yes, I know how to change it, but it's still irritating.
I never considered the extensions menu particularly difficult to find or use. Not everything can be in the Start menu.
In short, Windows applications are a textbook example of competition at all costs. Spyware and "gator" controls install themselves, behind the scenes, and mess with every other application. Many applications install "quick start" programs in the system tray or as services, wasting your resources and time in the vain hope that you'll use their software more often. It's no-holds-barred capitalism. Applications fight with each other over eyeballs and control of your system, and you're left with a mostly-unstable computer that blares ads at you and has a dozen security holes.
And that is why I run Linux. Because the coders who wrote my applications had respect for me, the user.
-sting3r
(quote) Shift-Right-Click on the file, choose Open With on the menu that pops up, and pick a program. Wow. That's tough. (end quote)
I don't always see the Open With option. But even when it works, it lists *all* applications, not just those relavant to the file extension or type.
A better solution would be to associate *multiple* applications to a given extension, and then have it list that set upon Open With (with the option of adding to the set from the entire pool of applications.)
(begin rant)
I want a Table Oriented OS where I can issue any fricken query I want to find and manage files, directories, etc. I am tired of being stuck with Linus' or Gates' version of OS collections.
Free the collections!
(end rant)
Table-ized A.I.
It's not really that big of a deal. If you want to use a different program, all you have to do is start that program, and open the file that you want to use. All Microsoft is doing here is making things easier for the end user. If you want to stop using Word to open .doc files, remove it, and install Corel Office.
Other companies (as was pointed out in the article) have been doing this for years. Why is this suddenly such a big deal? Because the author needed to come up with a column. Pick something that wasn't a big deal, and turn it into one.
Microsoft should not be painted with such a black brush simply for trying to make it easier to be a user of their software.
"Microsoft has always done its best work when faced with real competition"
Does the author mean their best software? If he did, then that would be MS-DOS 5.0, circa 1990. I would truly take this statement to mean their best marketing work. Gates has admitted it before, that when the going gets tough, they throw some more money into marketing.
I don't find this surprising in the least. The few times I have "worked" on windows, it seemed to me that the constant, irritating changes to what file extension means what got very old very quickly. Linking the file extension to the program that uses the file is simply stupid unless you want to limit yourself to 46656 total apps .ass and .fck of course. Extensions can get longer than three chars, but it's been that way for so long in windows that few know how else to do it.
/. article on that, I am sure). Then you don't even need extensions. None of my MP3s have extensions. It certainly confuses LimeWire, but strangely not Hotline.
in the world. And someone gets
The better way to go is to link the file itself to a program via some sort of metadata (someone will remember the
Too bad Apple is abandoning this metadata.
Do not touch -Willie
Ugh. I'm sick of programs fighting each other for the user's attention. Who would buy a blender that detected other blenders in the house and tried to disable them? Should my Sony TV ask me every day if it should take over the remote control for my Magnavox? Why do we put up with this?
We should have a file typing system that incorporates the creating company/software package into it, like how UPC symbols list COMPANY/PRODUCT_NO so both Jiffy and Food Lion can both sell peanut butter and the register knows the difference. That way Joe Shmoe can double-click on his RealMP3 and it won't open in WMP.
http://kered.org
Not to mention this guy sounds like a moron. I wouldn't expect add/remove programs to have the file extension list, nor would I expect to have the poperties for a particular file provide the option to change what file types get opened by what.
And as far as mac's having a more elegant solution, I don't buy that. Number one I'd rather be able to look at a file and be able to tell exactly what kind of file it is than to have it hidden withing the file. Number two, it's simple and easy to change the associated program to a file by changing the extension, is there a program to do that on the Mac? (I'm not bashing the Mac, just pointing out the flaws in this guys article).
I'm the big fish in the big pond bitch.
The problem is not merely that file extensions launch programs, and the association between extension and application is difficult to change.
The larger problem is this: new application software for Windows is typically file-extension oriented, and it's Microsoft that defines the important extensions. For example, I was evaluating a Windows full-text desktop document indexer recently, written by a small Windows development house. It was fast (written in assembly), and it could even do PDF and ZIP files.
But then I discovered that the years of files I had saved under legacy systems, starting with DOS, were completely invisible to this package. They were ASCII files, and I used my own file-naming conventions for the extension, so they weren't easily convertible to *.txt files. I had just been punished by this application for not going along with the Redmond game plan.
And here's another nightmare:
Consider, if you will, what happens when you ask Explorer to save a web page to disk. It uses a huge filename, and saves the images in separate directories. There's basically no way to get the thing back from the disk without using Explorer. That's why I take the trouble to Lynx-strip everything I want to archive, and put it into ASCII with a short filename.
Have you ever considered what it would be like to convert to Linux if all the filenames on your Windows system were around 80 bytes or so? Both Windows and Linux will accept filenames up to 254 bytes, but no one except a masochist would ever use a command-line system on filenames that long.
It's a conspiracy, I tell you. You gotta use a mouse, you gotta be using it in Explorer, and you gotta be interested in approved Microsoft files only, or you can forget it.
patent the idea of crappy software design. that way they could have their monopoly and enforce it too!!!
The above post is not true. It is a blatant misinformation troll.
No this is not silly. Last night I had to spend 10 min explaining to an intelligent lawyer friend why suddenly sh could no longer paly CD using WinAmp. The Realplayer had registered it self for that as she hed used it to watch a Realplayer News clip on CNN. Maybe the program warns you but few reads it as they are requesting the clip. One solution would be if you could block all file registration during install and then activate inside the application you are using.
Help fight continental drift.
F$ck off.
My central point remains: What Windows needs is a plain-English set of choices, in plain view, one that any novice user can easily find and understand, to tell the computer which program to use to open different kinds of files. There is no good reason under the sun that Microsoft has not provided such an option.
Well, the reason is obviously that it would look mighty suspicious if it was only hard to grab extensions from Microsoft applications.
__
Do ya feel happy-go-lucky, punk?
My experience with file extensions and registered file types with Windows have never been good... but for that mater, I really haven't had greate experiences with KDE either. Their registered file system is built into the Control Center and require you to fully understand nameing conventions and extensions, as well as the names of programs.
For example, if I want mpgs to be play by KDE's Media Player by default, I need to understand all of the various forms that mpgs can come in and the associated extensions... and to make it all the more worse, I need to know that the KDE's Media Player run command is noatun.
It seems that this is an issue that crosses all OS operating systems (yes... even Macs, anyone remember fighting over conflicts with Claris Works and early version of MS Word?) and one that is probably never going to be within the relm of the "average" user. The solution lies with the developer and whether they wish to play fair or not. An example of a company who still plays be the fules is Nullsoft and their mp3 player Winamp. After a succesull install it asks what kind of files you wish to play... in plain english.
That kind of behavor is a far cry from installing Word and having it automatically associate mp3s with Window's Media Player.
Only 120 characters... who can summarize their entire world understanding in 120 characters?!
The remedy Salon suggests? "It would probably take one of Microsoft's developers a short afternoon to build a simple, forthrightly labeled control panel that sits right on every user's desktop and asks, in plain English, 'Which program would you like to open Web pages? Or text files? Or MP3 audio files? Or photo files?'"
So these users, who the author seems to think are too stupid to know what right-clicking is, now have to know the difference between a text file (*.txt) and a Word file (*.doc) and which program goes with which extension (no, wait, which program they want to use to open which file types!)
Microsoft isn't even the real perpetrator of these things. It's companies like Real, which have programs like RealDownload (click here and here for examples) that really go overboard with the registered file types thing. RealDownload attaches itself to your web browser in such a way that the only way to stop it from popping up every time you try to download a file is to uninstall it. It also comes preinstalled on a bunch of OEM computers, so people are afraid to uninstall it. That's just one example...
There are lots of horrible pieces of software in the Windows world: spyware like the stuff that comes with BearShare and Morpheus, the Real "suite" of products that tries to take over your computer; AOL, which tries to eat your TCP/IP stack for lunch and replace it with its own TCP/IP stack. Instead of focusing on how Microsoft is horrible because it HAS registered file types, let's focus on programs (Microsoft ones included) that abuse their privilege and try to force you to use them for everything under the sun.
Finally, please continue to educate our user base, instead of just assuming they are "ignorant" and unable to take control of "where they want to go today" (and what program they want to use to do that.)
Has he ever tried to change the file association on a Macintosh file? He mentions how "easy and convenient" it is on a Mac...
On a Mac, without special 3rd-party hack programs (like ResEdit or Snitch), it CANNOT BE DONE AT ALL! Talk about monopoly power!
Man... if he can't handle right-clicking on a file, and selecting his own alternative with the provided "Open With" dialog (recent OS's), then he shouldn't be running a computer at all!
MadCow.
I used to have a sig, but I set it free and it never came back.
I would have to agree with the majority of the people here that this was a ridiculous argument. However, one thing not mentioned is the fact that with "Open With...", you have to hunt down the .exe file in order to make an association. Perhaps something Microsoft could do better would be to allow multiple associations and one default association, a la GNOME's mime-type handlers. Trying to find the right .exe can be a real pain in the neck, especially if you don't know where in the file tree to start looking.
While I agree with most of your arguement, the vast majority of irritating software is designed for Windows because that's what 90% of their target audience is running. I like and use Linux, too, but frankly it's not as popular and widespread as Windows.
Give it time. When Linux becomes mainstream, the same programmers that made crappy Windows software will begin to make crappy Linux software. Some of it will disturb/disable other programs, take up resources, and open security holes.
The review seems to hold the MacOS up as a shining example of how file-typing should be handled. I haven't really used the MacOS, but if you read this great article at ArsTechnica you'll see how the MacOS uses metadata associated with a file to determine the type of file it is, and therefore the program that should be used to open it.
On the MacOS, although the implementation seems cleaner (metadata vs. file name extension) the same issues of applications fighting over file types can arise in OS X, since an application can "claim" file types. The older Mac OS's seem to have opened a file based on the software that created it, which has its own set of problems. (Just because I created a JPG in Photshop doesn't mean I want spend 90 seconds firing up Photoshop every time I want to see it)
Keep in mind I have almost no Mac experience, please correct me if I'm wrong. I'm just trying to check out the authors claim that the Mac offers a better way of filetype/application binding, and after looking into the way Macs do things, I'm pretty unconvinced. I think I actually prefer Windows' "Open With..." right-click option to create the associate itself, although I don't like the way applications can repeatedly reclaim file types without asking the user. So how do other OS's do it?
OtakuBooty.com: Smart, funny, sexy nerds.
To everyone saying "just right click and hit 'open with...'".
You're forgetting one detail. "Open With..." appeared in Win2k. Everyone still using 9X/NT doesn't have that option, so they have to do it the hard way, as referenced in the article.
Faith Of The Heart Lyrics
It's been a long road getting from there to here
It's been a long time, but my time is finally near
and I can feel the change in the wind right now
Nothing's in my way
and they're not gonna hold me down no more
No they're not gonna hold me down
Cause I've got faith of the heart I'm going where my heart will take me
I've got faith to believe I can do anything
I've got strength of the soul and no one's gonna bend or break me
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It's been a long night trying to find my way
Been through the darkness, now I've finally had my day
and I will see my dream come alive at last I will touch the sky
And they're not gonna hold me down no more no they're not gonna change my mind
Cause I've got faith of the heart I'm going where my heart will take me
I've got faith to believe I can do anything
I've got strength of the soul and no one's gonna bend or break me
I can reach any star, I've got faith, I've got I've got I've got faith....faith of the heart
I'm going where the winds so cold, to see the darkest days
But now the winds are free...only winds have changed
I've been to the fire and I've been to the rain
But I'll be fine cause I've got faith, faith of the heart
Cause I've got faith of the heart I'm going where my heart will take me
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I've got strength of the soul and no one's gonna bend or break me
I can reach any star, I've got , I've got I've got I've got faith....faith of the heart
faith of the heart I'm going where my heart will take me
I've got faith to believe and no one's gonna bend or break
I can reach any star, cause I've got faith, cause I've got faith, faith of the heart
It's been a long road....
I have experienced this many times. I can recall many a time when I went to open a file and it was opened by a shotty sharware program that I downloaded to play MP3s or edit hex. I do not change it and I am a power user on windows. The reason I never change the settings back is because I do not want to spend 5 minutes changing my settings when I want to listen to a new CD. This problem would be insane if there were a competitor to MS Office. What if you liked Word's competitor for some documents and MS for others? 2000 has a solution in the RUN PROGRAMS option but most users, not all, of win 9x/Me don't know what a file type is.
- Kill Yourself, spare us all! -
if you right click on an icon holding the shift key you can change teh extension type and even run it as a different user(W2K AND XP). This guy either didnt try hard enough to find the answer(not very hard) or just wanted to bitch and moan about M$. Not to mention in most programs, such as realplayer winamp winzip and just about any other program that uses thier own extensions, there is an option under the tools menu to change the association for you. M$ may be evil but bitch about things that really screw the user over. Dont be blinded by hate as to not be able to find the true evil in your enemy.
"All I can tell the "lesser of two evils" folks is that if they keep voting for evil, they'll keep getting evil."-Lp.org
It would probably take one of Microsoft's developers a short afternoon to build a simple, forthrightly labeled control panel that sits right on every user's desktop and asks, in plain English, "Which program would you like to open Web pages? Or text files? Or MP3 audio files? Or photo files?" Then, instead of Microsoft making choices for users to promote its new businesses, users could decide for themselves "where they want to go today."
It seems to me if this is so simple why not make it simpler? Just make a freeware app for those computer users that can't handle right clicking?
Sometimes it's a cultural shortcoming, but too many people are stuck in the rut of thinking without Set Theory... only one answer per blank to be filled. *NIX variations are a terrific start for departing from this, but sometimes the programmer hasn't learned from history, or just doesn't have the time to do better then M$.
This fits politics, too... The unfair will never 'get' pluralism. Notice how Bin Laden pigeonholes all Americans as faceless criminals deserving of indiscriminant destruction. Meanwhile, NATO forces are trying to bomb the Regime while simultaneously giving humanitarian aid the Afgan people. America is all about a melting pot of cultures cohabiting the planet harmoniously... Not a Monopoly to say "there is but one God, and our one people has the monopoly on what He's about..."
Harmony is a good thing.
Ok, the author did point out that other applications set their own extensions, but is this really some sign of MS conspiracy or just another example of anti-MS hysteria? There are plenty other ways MS controls mindshare in their software, most notably bundling their own version of an application.
Yes, changing the file type can be a bit daunting to the average user, but the average user is also the one who uses IE and WMP without bothering to look for alternatives. They don't care if a file opens with app A or app B, just as long as it opens. MS preys on that by providing a quick and easy way to open files. Those of us who do care know how to change the file extensions.
Can we, just for once, not go with every bit of anti-MS hysteria that comes down the pipe and focus instead on the real issues? The article started out good, then dropped into an almost laughable Lone Gunmen style conspiracy argument.
Electronic Frontier Foundation for online civil rights information
Although I also think (like so many other posts here) that the article goes overboard, and that, yes, it's easy for a user to get at the menus that change the association, there are some issues.
1) After finding the menu option to change the association, it's not always clear how to change it... for one thing there are Open, Print, PrintTo and New options attached to DOC files... and all these need to be changed. Then there is the DDE thing... what's that?
2) After actually changing the registry stuff, any upgrade of MS products will clobber your change, and the default if existing products find a change is to change it back (with a promp, sure). Although this is a good idea for inexperienced users who use a purely MS system, this can drive people like me insane...
I use Opera for browsing, IrfanView for Picture viewing, and Agent for email and news.
My programs are all at war!
:P
How I DO miss my Amiga... -sigh-
The article does have some good points, IMO. But why not take it a step further. MS has the Windows Stamp of approval that goes to software as long as the software follows certin guidlines. By following these guidlines, developers know that their software will run on the Windows platform and the users know before buying the product. (This is very important with Win NT and 2000 actually.)
Anyway, perhaps one of these guidlines should be that the installer registers what file types it is capible of handling. This is different from registering it as the default viewer.
Then, all MS would have to do is create, say, a control panel applet for the file types. Shouldn't be too hard. It would present you with a file type (sorted into say, images, video, audio, documents, etc...) and what applications are able to handle that file type. Then you just select the program you want from the list that support it, instead of having to remember what program views what.
Go a bit firther and require installers to prompt before changing and you should be set.
This would be an improvment to the current setup, and I can't imagine that the talented Windows developers (they have to have some talent, the OS does run rather decently...) could do with the next service pack.
I'm going to go back in my box and will think within the limits of my box: MS Sucks Linux Good I read too much Slashdot.
Maybe the program warns you
Not likely if it is RealPlayer. Just opening that program will prompt it to add itself to your systray and start automatically and attempt to connect to the internt every time you start your computer. No warnings, no requests for permission. The only way to stop it that i've found is to us msconfig. This must be done every time you open the damn thing.
Hey, I'm just about to go and patent .MS and .Microsoft as my file extensions! What do you think? :-P
===> An eye for an eye makes everyone blind - MG
This article is just stupid. As the guy already addended, it's an extra key to hold down to "Open With..." and calling the File Types tab "hidden" because it's three clicks down is absurd. It takes a few clicks to get to the network settings, but I don't see anyone whining about MS having a monopoly on that.
Or sounds settings.
Or mouse settings.
Or opening a program.
Stupid.
I'm assuming that you've never spent time working at a help desk anywhere. The majority of the users are dumb and just don't have a clue. I've literally had to explain to people what "click and drag" meant. And forget telling them to right-click, that's way over their heads. You tell them to right-click and they double-click the left mouse button. (and don't even get me started on people who say that they "probably wouldn't even know how to turn on a computer". If you haven't got enough smarts to push a button, you shouldn't be owning a computer)
Anyways, even if it's a simple task that takes only 5 minutes to learn, it's too complicated for most people to try and figure it out. Try changing the settings sometimes... it's next to impossible if you've never done it before and just have to guess. And I've seen people who couldn't open documents because they lost the associations and didn't know that they could open the program and then open the file that way, instead of just double-clicking on the file.
And THAT my friends, is why this helps M$ keep their monopoly. Because people install some microsoft software that takes over part of their computer. And instead of fixing the problem, they just go out to buy and install whatever latest version of software that microsoft recommends because they don't know that there's anything better (and generally cheaper) out there. And the problem snowballs... people who don't know how to change what programs they use, then do things like email their files to other people who do have a clue. This forces other people to use the same version to be compatable.
Now, if you think that I'm totally wrong here... why do people pay $300+ for Microsoft Office, when a $30 text editor on steroids will do basically all that they need? Though this wouldn't even be an issue if the majority of the people out there knew how to change the settings, but they don't. It makes no difference if one out of 3 million people knows how to change the settings, but they don't. If the majority of the people knew what they were doing instead of vice versa, this would just be a moot point.
I have an M$ natural keyboard pro, it has all sorts of shortcut buttons along the top. One of these is the Media button. The default action when I press the media button is to bring up a menu of "deluxe CD player, Realplayer, Winamp, Quicktime, and Windows Media Player". The M$ application that set up my keyboard actually searched my system and found all of the different media programs on the system and gives me a choice of these. I don't think M$ is doing this for a devious purpose.
I hope that someday we will be able to put away our fears and prejudices and just laugh at people. - Jack Handey
I had more thoughts prepared 15 minutes ago, but /. expired my page after I had to take a phone call.
Summarily, the story here and from Salon is pure FUD.
The Mac filesystem (I think) had more overhead because the file's header needed to be read to determine the associated app. Seems to me that just reading the directory entry and comparing it against the registry is more efficient.
db
Cig:
ôô
I just mailed a letter to the editor of Salon about this article before it popped up on Slashdot. I believe it is dangerous because this whole thing is really a non-issue. File-type mapping is a convience, not a curse, and the article is very misleading about how hard it is to change these mappings...
Below is the text of my letter:
---
I think Scott Rosenberg is way off the mark in his article regarding 'registered file types' for Microsoft Windows. In reality, it is not as hard to change these file mappings as he portrays.
To begin with, the user would very rarely want to change one of these file type mappings; it is the sort of action you tend to perform once and then leave alone. As it is such a rare event, it makes sense for it to be somewhere deeper within the UI than an action that you would want to perform very often. There's only so much space within the UI for quickly accessible items, and they should always be items that are used regularly by a majority of users.
Further, it is a lot easier to change these file-types than he portrays even if you want to change them. Since Windows 98, at least (I don't remember far enough back to know if Win95 supported this), you can right-click a particular file, choose "Open With.../Choose Program" and an easy-to-use dialog pops up which allows you to pick which program to use to open that file-type and even change the file mapping for that file type by choosing 'Always use this program to open these files'. Making this change is not exactly rocket science.
And lastly, while it is true that the process above may not be completely intuitive for new computer users, virtually every application released in the past five years will check the Windows registry to determine file mappings when it is launched and offer the user the option to change these mappings so that the program just launched will become the default for the file-types it supports. When this occurs, it is generally via a simple dialog box popped up when the application is launched, it is hard to argue that this interface is too difficult for users. One of Scott's own examples, RealPlayer, is adamant about informing users of file-type mappings at startup, and offering the choice to remap files to RealPlayer (using a simple Yes/No dialog), ditto for Netscape (and IE), and countless other applications.
I believe Microsoft has many questionable business practices, but file-type mapping is not one of them, and highlighting such a non-issue just detracts from the real problems via crying-wolf-syndrome.
Seems simple to me... What does this guy want, dialog boxes everytime you open a file?
"You are opening this file with Windows Media Player, do you want to use another program instead?" ['click' NO]
"Are You sure? You may actually like Real Player better, or maybe WinAMP." ['click' YES]
"OK, Your default player has not been changed, but we will check back with you to see if you've changed your mind next time you open a file."
Besides, if a user likes Real Player (example he used), when he opens the program it will notify him that it is not set up to be associated with certain file types, and ask to correct this. This is in no way anything that contributes to MS maintaining a monopoly. This guy is probably just hacked off because it took him 1/2 an hour to figure out because he couldn't use help. Musta been a slow day over at Salon...
...in n months, I can look forward to the next headline: "Windows Releases Utility To Alter File Extension Associations" along with the predictable banter.
"Why is this not standard?"
"The bundling of this software is anti-competitive towards [insert party of choice here]."
"Just another example of M$ bloat."
"The latest Mozilla milestone release KIX AZZ! LINUX R00LZ, WIND0ZE LU$ER$!!!"
Just practicing my Kreskin-fu.
Easy does it!
This comment has been submitted already, 276865 hours , 59 minutes ago. No need to try again.
Shut up, shitslinger.
FREE MUMIA
Shift right click, or right click in 2k its quite simple. The standard complaint that users don't know what they're doing thus MS is even more evil because it doesn't pay for a class or whatever is groundless. When someone needs to change the file extension they call their PC-smart buddies or asking on a web board or newsgroup.
This would be monopolistic if MS disabled this fuction, but instead this article is perfect for the mindless MS bashing that makes slashdot look so prejudiced. There are real MS complaints and this isn't one of them.
Maybe I'll get a job at salon. "Hi I'm the Slashdot baiter and I'm thinking of writing something inflammatory about the two button mouse. Think about it dudes, Mac has one button. MS is trying to confuse people for their own ends!"
The "Open with" option only appears on file types that don't already have a default handler program selected. If they have one, you just get the "Open" option instead. If you want to change it, you have to know how to change your file associations in Explorer. Most people have no idea how to do this.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
Was the article actually READ before posted?
.mpg to a program that is isn't even installed on my workstation yet!
.mp3, but as soon as you install Winamp, IT gets control of .mp3!
:)
Ok, so if I understand this correctly, M$ has godly powers because its OS designates what programs are associated with which files? UMMMM... MIME anybody?!?!!
Can you imagine an OS that couldn't tell you what files did what? What WOULD you have the OS do when you opened a file.. try to execute as a binary.. or open it in a text editor? You would have to specify each file manually.. including BINARIES/.exe's!! Even Linux assignes files to certain programs... my new install of Caldera don't do it worth a shit.. but it does it! Hell,my install assignes
And guess what, with Windblows.. when you install a program, it can TAKE OVER the use of the file!(something i wish linux could get right!) Take Windows Media Puker vs. Winamp. By default, WinMP is assigned
Normally, i'd never defend M$, but geez, THINK for a bit before posting please
The use of .htm by MS was to exactly the same end, if you save your work as .htm by default then netscape editor wont even think of opening your files because it doesnt really know what they are.
In short, MS was trying to bypass the association war by sneaking in a new extension and bypassing the fight altogether. Unfortunately Frontpage sucks, and they lost.
Anyway, an "index.htm" file usually never loaded by default as the folder root html doc.
"There are millions of Windows users who barely know what "right-clicking" is."
;)
I think he meant Macintosh users
Konq is the *only* file manager I've ever used that made changing file associations easy - just right-click on any file and hit "Edit File Associations" (or something like that). Konq then takes you straight to the File Associations editor, with the filetype of the file you clicked already selected and ready to edit. And if you want to change a different file type, you can do searches with globbing to find the FileType(s) corresponding to any given extension.
Still, extensions are a fundamentally broken and archaic way of handling associations. Bring resource forks to Linux!
--
CPAN rules. - Guido van Rossum
I have to disagree with him that it is an abuse. The main
arena where this could be theoretically leveraged over the user is in
media - especially video and audio file types. However, the main
alternatives, RealPlayer and QuickTime for video, and Winamp and Sonique for
audio, all make it very *easy* to change the default registered file types.
For example, if you take a Windows installation and then install QuickTime
on it, QuickTime will assume control of the
during installation. If you decide later you want to change it, then you can
do so easily from within QuickTime's controls.
And this is how philosophically the Operating System should operate. The
default settings should be for native apps that are bundled, because that
way you can be fully functional immediately. However, then if you prefer a
separate program, you simply install it and let that program assume control
(which all media apps do, especially Real, which is actually sometimes TOO
aggressive).
For non-media applications, like word processing, who really wants to open
an Excel document in Lotus? The truth is that there are so many programs,
all of which try to define their own new extension, that it's basically a
zoo. The less we users have to deal with it the better, honestly - and I say
that as a power user, not a newbie
Don't blame me - I voted for Howard Dean. http://dean2004.blogspot.com
It's so difficult to change the associated program for a file type he is able to describe the procedure in exactly one, awkwardly written run-on sentence.
Scott Rosenberg is a nim-wad for writing this article. Not everything is a conspiracy.
GEE.ppt
YOU.xls
ARE.doc
PARANOID.htm
!!!.mdb (wrong file name)
An analogy:
/*Unix*/
char fname[PATH_MAX]; strcpy( fname, "foo.c" );
char fname[9]; strcpy( fname, "foo" );
char exten[4]; strcpy( exten, ".c" );
Don't label something "offtopic" unless you know the topic well enough to tell what's on topic.
Rosenberg claims it's hard to change registered file types, then explains how to do it in twenty one words. Like many of you, I'm not all that impressed. (Some Windows programs, such as the wonderful IrfanView, offer to grab or give up the registered file type for various types, at installation or whenever.)
.HTM association! If you've told all your browsers to fight over the default like a pack of starving pit bulls, they'll offer to change it back and forth all too often. Otherwise, you can edit a dozen or so obscure registry entries. There's a commercial (but cheap) utility, BrowserSwitch, that doesn't do anything but this.
The real problem is, not all interesting associations can be set via Windows Explorer. Programs can tell Windows, "I want to open up a Web page" or "I want to start sending an e-mail message"; what programs do they use?
Setting "the default browser" is more than just setting the
How do you change the default mail program? I honestly have no idea. Heaven help someone with both Outlook and Eudora installed, who would prefer to use the latter.
Various movie formats can be handled by Windows Media Player, and RealPlayer, and QuickTime. Assuming Microsoft hasn't banned the latter two, how can you tell your browser which one you want?
Any solution would need to be at least partially technical. It's not clear how much of a legal solution is necessary; I'd like to hear arguments on both sides.
I agree with Rosenberg in one way: Windows users would be better off if they could make such choices more easily.
Stupid job ads, weird spam, occasional insight at
What a bunch of losers, everyone should know about shift-right-click, it's plainly described in the Windows User's Manual. Oh wait, there is no user's manual. Microsoft, being so enviromentally sensitive, doesn't want to burden the end user with useless frills like documentation.
Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
actually I believe if you dig through the options, you can fudge with the settings to disable smart center on startup, and to tell it not to check file associations every time it runs. Once you do that, that's half your battle right there.
Uhh. So because *REALPLAYER* gave you fits, this is an example of *MICROSOFT* pushing their monopoly? *MRRRRRRNNNNNNN* please try again. I don't think Microsoft would make it hard to switch BACK to their products in order to RETAIN their monopoly.
Read the article through to the end of it. He *does* know about the right-click method.
Don't label something "offtopic" unless you know the topic well enough to tell what's on topic.
The article never even mentions the important point, but prefers to blast away at Microsoft. It's much better to blast away with some reasonable aim...
Smarter users would be even better, but we know that's not going to happen any time soon, don't we? :)
I'm starting to see the same calls with the IE users, for some odd reason. It doesn't appear to be server side with them but the number of calls have been fairly low thus far, and I don't do Windows. Once we start seeing a number of them, my PHBs will start demanding that I make IE work just like Netscape currentl does. Joy.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
The article makes an interesting point, though MS is not the only one guilty of abusing file extensions.
Of course, it also makes the absurd assumption that there is someone out there who actually LIKES realplayer.....
Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.
Besides "Open With..." Win2K has an option called "Send To." If you right click any file, you can send it to any application. The "Send To" folder is located at:
C:\Documents and Settings\[username]\SendTo
It actually comes in quite handy. Oh, and I agree with most of the sentiment here, that this is just silly.
If all you have are silver bullets, everything looks like a werewolf.
What exactly makes the entry in the control panel so much easier and more accessible than right clicking (or shift-right clicking)? He makes a reasonable case concerning why we shouldn't have to deal with file extensions, but if right clicking is too advanced a feature for some I suggest we find these people and educate them in how to use their computer. Look for them going around and around in revolving doors.
Ben
OddManIn: A Game of guns and game theory.
Why does everyone out there seem to think that because the justice department was ordered to stop pursuing a break up, it won't happen? Its not the prosecutions position to decide the sentence. If judge Kollar-Kotelly decides that breakup is the only effective solution, it will be the decision made even if the justice dept. doesn't ask for it.
Personally, I am pretty confident that breakup will probably be the only acceptable solution. We already know that restrictions on behavior aren't enough to tame this beast. With all that in mind discussions about file extension management in the name of antitrust are kind of pointless don't you think?
Slashdot is an anagram for Has Dolts, and I am Dolt number 468543
And change away the associations of any document file-type extensions to your heart's content.
You can also refer to the Windows 95 FAQ :
Commonly Asked Windows 95 Questions and Answers (Q132737)
This is stupid. Say you have a large collection of text files and you want to use a special editor instead of Notepad from now on. Right-click any text file, choose "Open with", select the editor and click "Always use this program to open these files". Wow, that's real hard!
"Maybe the program warns you but few reads it as they are requesting the clip. "
I think that's the key sentence here... if people would read what they clicked on then this wouldn't happen. People think that they should be able to do whatever they want with their machine, not have to read anything or actually figure anything out and every thing should work fine. When you behave like this and and click "ok" without reading what you jsut oked, and something goes wrong -- you blame the OS or the program...? I don't think the problem is with the OS or program. Now you would have a valid complaint if a program changed a global setting on your machine without asking first... if nothing else that's just plain intrusive. but that is different from a default setting or from changing a setting with your permission.
Ben
Make the "Open" option into an expandable menu instead of a single option. List all the programs that are registered to handle that file type in the menu and let the user select the one he wants. You could still select one app as a default for when you double-click on a file, but this way users could select a specific program a lot easier.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
First of all, I don't know what the deal is with "shift-right click". Maybe I'm missing something simple here, but all I need to do is right click. If I shift-right click, I get the wrong menu (I get a menu that refers to the space around the file (desktop, file manager view, etc.), not the file itself). If I right click, I only get the "Open With..." option if the file extension doesn't already have an association. Once the file has an association, the "Open With..." option is replaced with an "Open" option, thus removing your ability to change the association via this menu.
Also, under the File Associations tab under windows explorer, not ALL file extensions are represented. Example:
Someone asks me to look at a script created by program FooScripter. The the file he sends me is called script.t (notice the ".t" extension). I do not have FooScripter installed on my machine, so I right-click on the file and choose "Open With...". I choose notepad, but I forget to uncheck the "Always use this program" box (which I think should be unchecked by default, but maybe that's just me). So now I have this file association that I didn't mean to make. According to windows, it is now a "T_file". It is, however, for a reason I can't figure out, not an association that has representation in the "File Associations" tab in windows explorer. This is the first place I looked to get rid of it. To make a long story less long, the only way to fix this was to change it by hand in the registry. (Lesson in mind numbing tediousness, try searching your registry for the correct instances of "t".)
Anyway, based on this experience, I think the Salon article makes a good point. Changing file extensions is not always as easy as some of you are trying to imply.
are the worst designed user interfaces I have ever used. Cram an 800 character include path into a small 40 character NON-RESIZEABLE text box and try to find a typo in it sometime! Hey Microsoft - ever hear about RESIZEABLE dialog boxes? God - Motif, Qt, GTK all have them. Setting TCP settings on all the different flavours of Windows is another nightmare. To my delight yesterday after 3 hours of trying I learned on Windows 98 there were TCP properties on the dialup dialog as well as more properties on the dialup dialog icon (but not if it is a shortcut placed on your desktop). If you specify the DNS settings on the system TCP stack - they are completely ignored by the dialup icon which has its own TCP settings. This user interface of Windows should win awards for being cryptic. Man - screw all these dialogs and put it all in XML flat files so they don't change from one Windows version to the next!
just run the handy dandy uninstall program and it restores your old settings. honestly, how difficult is that?
Only the State obtains its revenue by coercion. - Murray Rothbard
if MS is at fault (or even attempting further monopolizing the market) we (the linux folks) are in deep shit indeed. we don't even let people switch printer with the lpr command if the user don't know how to -P. cvs seemes to be illegally tied to vi (unless you change the $EDITOR or something silimar) and the list goes on and on... get a grip. if you don't know enough to change a setting you don't deserve to change it. ie. you're better off being spoonfed. at least MS let's you be spoonfed. as long as MS let's apps like real-player change the file associations when they are installed i don't smell a foul play. if MS hadn't allowed any application to change the associations, then scott's arguement would hold water. this 2 page article in one sentence is "MS is furthering it's monopoly and killing is't competition in the process by providing a *default* setting that points back to it's own application." that sound foolish if said in those words, doesn't it? the interface is there to change it. he argues that it's 'hidden' deep down. but then, even if MS were to comply, couldn't we argue about every registry entry the same way? what then? bring up 10000+ item menu on a right click to access every entry in the registry? if you can't make heads or tails of what's inside the hood of a car, much less change the engine, are you going to call a car a 'bundled' product? after all, you can't simply switch the default engine that comes with it without going thru major pains.
Just wanted to point it out. There are plenty of people at my job that do not set Windows to show file extensions. This is one reason why some viruses/worms can spread so quickly. "Oh, here's a cute icon, I think I'll double-click it, it's called 'readme,' after all..." By having this the default, it saves some users from having to know certain things, but it probably causes more harm, ultimately, than good.
If all you have are silver bullets, everything looks like a werewolf.
On the other hand, one should never attribute to malice or evil what can be easily explained by stupidity and laziness.
On Mac OS 7.6/8.x/9.x there is a Control Panel called File Exchange that has an index of every common file extension and lets you pick the application for it. Under the Internet Control Panel there is a similar feature for picking "helper applications" for Internet related file types and applications.
Or if you like, you can drag the file to the alias or the icon of the application you wish to open the files in. This works for the Desktop, Finder windows, the Dock (OS X) and the Application Switcher (OS 9.x).
Funny... I've told RealPlayer to disable QuickStart (I think that's what they call it), and have never had a problem since.
Dinivin
I would have expected the the article dealt with the strong tendency in the Microsoft Windows camp to ignore MIME content types in favor of file extensions. You have to keep this in mind constantly, especially since there is still some software (admittedly, not by Microsoft) which truncates a file name to 11 characters and uses the last three characters as extension to decide which application to start. If you don't pay attention, you can easily compose a message which people running Microsoft Windows can't read. Perhaps this is evil conspiracy against all these *NIX people, to make them to appear as if they can't properly send email with attachments?
And the claim that the MacOS is superior in this context is a bit awkward: it's much more difficult to change the File Type/Creator fields with a Mac. I even doubt there is a central registry in which you can make an entry that all your Adobe Illustrator shall be opened from now on by Corel Draw (yikes).
Most users are tech illiterate.
Think about this for a second, because it's really quite scary. Back in the day computers were the domain of technically skilled people, who understood how to pull out instructions when they couldn't figure something out. People who weren't scared that every mistake was going to be fatal. And most importantly, people who believed in learning how to use their expensive technical resources.
The only way to justify Salon.com's arguments is to recognize that everything that enters mainstream use is suddenly suppose to be idiot proof. The US has warning labels that coffee is hot for God sakes. For some reason many people think that everything they do in life should be fundementally intuitive. Making tools which are both intuitive and versatile is hard in any environment.
Perhaps what we really need is Windows Idiot Edition, with no powerful options and no allowance for 3rd party software. Just give them a word processor, browser, and instant messaging, and not worry about anything else. Make it as intuitive as possible and have instructions in baby language for anything that you can do with such a system. MS would love this strategy if they really could get away with having total control over software. But of course it would never work because the same idiots who don't want to actually learn about their computer, are also the idiots who will buy anything simply because you tell them its more powerful and versatile.
This problem only affects Windows users. "Fixing" it by forcing MS to make Windows easier-to-use, doesn't really fix anything, because the fix is applied too late. The user is already running MS Windows.
MS Windows is a closed proprietary platform, like a Nintendo game machine. You should only run MS applications on it. If you don't like this, then use a platform made by someone who doesn't think of users as enemies.
The Windows Problem has the same fix as most other problems in life: Just Say No and suffer/enjoy the consequences. Living w/out Windows is very easy if you haven't already been indoctrinated into it, and even then, the "deprogramming" isn't very intense.
As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
That's the way to fix that little bugger!
What microsoft is doing is laughing the American judicial system in the face - it's the typical "i'm powerful geek - you can't touch me" response.
What needs to be done is nothing short of demolishing microsoft - force them to shift to open source. Sure, it's radical, but spoilt brats need radical approaches.
"Never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by incompetence." -- Napoleon Bonaparte.
-Andy
with it says
"It's not in the "add/remove programs" control panel, where you'd expect it. It's not under "properties" when you right-click on a file. It's not in any obvious or easily accessible location."
It IS under the right click on a file in Win2k if you right click on any file and go to properties you will see a "Change" button where you can easily change the file type. I do admit however that it was very difficult to do in Win9x
Really! I mean, what is the point on posting a story such as this?
Firstly, you can change registered file types! What's the problem?! It could be a lot harder to do.
Secondly, the article hints at taking them to court for it... How ignorant.
His rebuttal to readers' arguments at the end appeals to the fact that there are users out there who have little computer knowledge. If that is true, they aren't going to be worrying about file extensions. If they install a new piece of software and it won't open up the file, they will ring technical support and get help. Duh!
Nevrar
But the problem with Windows' "registered file types" is just the sort of subtle but nasty Microsoft practice that many of us hoped a forceful antitrust ruling and a tough remedy would finally change.
...
Once upon a time, PC users opened documents only from within their application programs.
Associating data with applications so it can be accessed and manipulated in a "direct" manner and not using a software to mediate between the user and his/her data is not a bad practice for any Operating System.
Allowing users to forget they are actually using an OS or an application to use their data is the right way to go.
Users want to control their computer much like they use their TV, or other simple electronic appliances. They don't change the volume or channels by interfacing with a software that deals with TV broadcasting, they simply press a button.
Same goes for Game consoles, and lately we even start to see this in Windows - Windows XP finally have an interface that makes the casual user forget he uses an OS. Everything looks like a familiar web page and there is even a striking resemblance to game consoles screen interfaces (especially the use of colors and "toy-like" buttons).
It took MS about 10 years to move in the right general direction, yey. We should definitely cry for the abuse of their monopoly, but calling a downright OS/software usability feature a monopoly abuse is way out of line, neverminding the actual side effect.
-Omer Lahav
but then, hey, I wouldn't feel right running that monopolyware on my machine so it's kind of a non issue. BUT...try setting your default web browser using the open with dialog, can't be done to my knowlege. seems odd to exclude the options for setting a default web browser from this list doesn't it?
"The Most Fun Possible on 4 wheels" is at SunBuggy in Las Vegas
Draw a parallel to the terrorist attacks..
MS has been literally bullying the software world and terrorizing companies who refuse to comply.
Something needs to be done.
Now everything opens in Emacs, or if it doesn't, I have an "Open in Emacs" option on the right-click context menu in Explorer
We don't need no stinkin' file extensions!
So you mean: We do need stinkin' file extensions?
It appears with registered file types as well... look again.
The people that the article is refering to are most Windows users.
And working techsupport for one of the largest OEM computer makers around I deal with this type of people all day, everyday, and he does have a vaild point.
When I try having a customer right click on anything 85% of the time they left click, then if they did right click every time I tell them to click they feel the need to ask "Right or left".
These are the people that have 15-20+ icons running in the taskbar and don't know why the are running out of memory when their hard drive is half full.
These are the people that don't reallize that if you don't type a password the first time you started the computer you wouldn't have the logon box poping up.
These are the people who have yahoo!pager, msn messanger and ICQ constantly running and haven't got a clue why they have Connect to AOL poping up every 5 minutes even though they were writing a word doc.
Try telling them that you don't have to use media player for your cds and dvds, you can hear their jaw drop over the phone, and change the screen saver or the background colors for them and you are a God.
So yes, he does make a vaild point, as far as the Mac system being better or easier I couldn't say, I haven't used a Mac in years.
That can be a nuisance (of course, you can still open the Photoshop file in JPEGView or drag it into an IE window, or you can change the creator code for the file). But it can be extremely useful to have different files of the same type associated with different applications: a tab-delimited data file opens in Excel, a large ASCII text document opens in Word instead of giving a SimpleText error, the README file for something I'm coding opens with the CodeWarrior editor I'll likely already have open, even though they're all .txt files .
In Windows 95 and 98, the list of file types was sorted by _description_, not extension.
Say you wanted to change your association for
One thing I like about Windows 2000 is that the list is now sorted by extension. Better late then never I guess.
That is because Linux still uses the same primitive mechanism of using filename extensions to indicate both concepts of
A few months ago there was an article and big discussion about metadata. Given the way slashdot readers reacted to that, I predict that Linux will fall into exactly the same set of traps.
[Those who won't learn from history are doomed to re-implement it.]
Those who would give up liberty in exchange for security and DRM should switch to Microsoft Palladium!
Well shit. . .don't I look like the asshole.
Doesn't anyone drag and drop anymore? Wasn't DnD the big advantage to using a GUI?
.html file on to the text editor icon: it's open for editing. Double-click and it's opened by the default browser. Want to see it in an alternate browser? Drag it over to that icon. Drag it over to the printer icon for a hard copy.
On both my Macs and my Windows computers, I use DnD to override default file associations. Drag the
Lately, I've been using DnD to extract strings from all of the Sircam-infected Word documents that show up in my mail by dragging the attachment link embedded in the mail message on to the TextEdit icon in the OS X Dock (not that SecretPlans.doc.pif would execute anyway if I clicked on it).
Why bother with the overhead of having a GUI if you're not going to use all the features?
k.
"In spite of everything, I still believe that people are really good at heart." - Anne Frank
I understand people are upset about someone finding the process of going to "Open with..." a little too unintuitive for the average user, but you have to remember: do you really want to deal with these people constantly asking you how to open a file in such-and-such a program because they forget every few minutes? I know I don't. And other people say that you can go to "Folder Options" but I personally find that very confusing to use, seeing as it lists literally hundreds of file types, and they aren't always titled in a way that makes sense. Yes, this would be one more tool to make me say that I don't mind using Windows. I don't mind saying that I might someday even prefer Windows, because I believe they still have the power to redeem themselves. Please also think of average users when attacking a story like this, not just average Slashdot users.
Two things are infinite: the universe and human stupidity, though I'm not yet sure about the universe. - A Einstein
Well to be fair, Real only started getting Nazi with file extentions AFTER Microsoft released a version of WMP that hijacked all of Real's types, even though it couldn't play them.
In his postscript, the author says that although it's possible to change associations in windows, it's too complex for the average user who "...barely know[s] what right clicking is." If this user does in fact know so little, it's highly likely he/she doesn't even care what program opens his file, as long as it is opened. While this may aid microsoft, other programs almost always change association on installation. So if this inept user does in fact install RealPlayer, RP will make sure that he associates all media with RP. And if he doesnt download/install realplayer because he doesnt know how, this doesn't build on Microsoft's monopoly at all, because Real would never make money off of him anyway, regardless if it was preinstalled... he's too stupid to figure out how to register, remember?
Once upon a time...
No, you don't.
This whole business of loading itself automatically and stealing relevant extension should be set to "OFF" by default.
I have fucking more interesting things to do than search for some obscure config tab just to prevent RealPlayer from taking over half of my machine.
RealPlayer is one of the most fucked up and annoying apps ever.
...if you think about it. The file extension is just a method of storing the metadata in the filename. Actually, file extensions have some advantages. The file extension (metadata) can be easily changed by renaming the file. By separating the metadata from the content of the file, via file extensions, you have a simple non-application specific (or OS-specific) method of viewing/modifying that metadata. In other words, if you used metadata to determine the application, it would then require all applications to support that metadata. By using file extensions, you simply offload that from the application to the file system. I like file extensions better. Enough MS bashing, already!
It's funny that there is actually truth here, and for some reason everyone is sticking up for M$.
... etc.
I'm writing this in windows now, but I don't agree with most people saying this isn't a problem
Have you ever noticed that M$ [almost] always comes up with a app right after someone else has become huge at it?
Real Player got big, and suddenly Media Player got a HUGE upgrade. AIM went outside AOL and MSN Mess came around.
The difference with MS and lets say linux is: Linux depends on third party software to operate and M$ depends on windows to destroy third party software.
Look at the situation more deeply than described by salon.com - i have to run out the door so i can't type anymo
Get your Unix fortune now!
Not that most M$ users would bother to read it, but where exacly are such user friendly features documented? Last time I tried to use M$ help I had to talk to that stupid paper clip, who's more of a salesman than a help agent.
You think it's easy but it really is more of the same abuse. All of those left handed tricks, and the way M$ made all of my favorite applications vanish ... now they let others set your registry from accross the web? Barf. Who's going to fill the "open with" folder? I'm sure it will work just as well as the start button itself. "Send to" is the only thing that makes using NT at work tollerable. If they kill that, I'll have to figure something else out. Most people won't. The anoyance factor is going to run joe user off computers for good. The rest of us will simply move to less obnoxious platforms. When people ask me, I tell them it's easier to use Debian.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
ok. Maybe you can have the program you install set itself up as the default program.
But think of it from the average home user's point of view....
You've just installed this program and then when you open say Internet Explorer you get the message "Some of the registered file types are not associated with Internet Explorer. Would you like to correct this?"
What are you going to do? OBVIOUSLY, the natural response is:
"Yeah, correct it..jeez I don't know what that other program did"
OR
what do most of us usually do? Just press enter to get rid of that annoying dialog box. And guess what pressing Enter blindly does? Right. It tells IE to go ahead and restore the file associations.
So this is a valid case.
Sorry if this was already pointed out, but MS does this great trick by hijacing ".mov" and then when you actually try to VIEW a .mov file it doesn't have the codec.
And then when you try to dl quicktime and install it over again, you don't have admin! *sob*
Reason #213921 to hate MS.
Slashdot 's editors are dickheads
Do you get something cool that I'm missing from holding down shift?
It's actually much easier to use msconfig to trash it. (Well, if you're used to msconfig.) Once upon a time, you could right-click on the Real icon and choose "disable". Now, RealNetworks has made is purposely difficult to get rid of the icon. Each new version of RealPlayer seems to add another new dialog box to the process, in order to make the option as difficult to find as possible. In the latest version, the relevant menu item has changed from "Disable" to "Preferences", and once in the Preferences dialog, the user must determine that he is looking for the "SmartCenter" button, click it, read the dialog that pops up, choose the "turn the darn thing off" option, at which point another dialog box pops up warning of the impending apocalypse that will result from the selection of the aforementioned option... and when the user figures out that "yes", this is what I really want to do, he must confirm that choice, OK the SmartCenter dialog, OK the Preferences dialog, and then close RealPlayer, which in the meantime has decided to launch itself for no apparant reason. No wonder everyone I know who doesn't have a PhD in Computer Engineering still has the Real icon in their system tray.
1) When a new app is installed, just put a dialog box that allows the user to associate the extensions with the new program.
2) Also, put this code in the program itself, accessable from the menu.
3) Put an article in the help file about how to do it manually. There are ways to easily re-register an application. The article makes it sound so difficult (it's not).
How do you change the application on the Mac? Why not provide a GPL'ed program to do this task for grandma, and publicize the hell out of it?
This sounds like nitpicking to me.
Remember, You are unique...just like everyone else.
Not really... It's a PITA to get to and disable
Dinivin
i can't read it it's not a pdf or doc file hehe
http://www.goodtimetickets.com
http://www.vanillaafro.com - take me seriously and I will shoot you
I don't see the problem at all. Here are screenshots of what happens when I right-click a file without any kind of shift-holding-down or other party tricks.
This is NT 5.0, I'd assume it works the same in NT 5.1:
Picture 1
Picture 2
Picture 3
Dead simple. And it really, really works. I can only assume this shift-right clicking business is something happening in Windows 9x, which is, by all means, obsolete.
I completely agree with the columnist on this one. I just recently upgraded my video and sound cards.
When I installed the sound card (SoundBlaster Live X-Gamer 5.1*), it installed a "Creative Control Panel" on startup (without asking) and reassociated all of my sound files with the Creative player (.mp3, mp2,
I move ahead and install the new video card.
The video card is an ATI Radeon DDR 64Mb model (yeah baby!) When I installed the driver software for the video card, it added a "quick launch" bar on my desktop (without asking) and reassociated DVD playback with the new DVD application (which sucks). In addition, it reassociated
This whole process took a couple of hours (including a screwup that should have been warned against, see the footnote). The hardware change took a grand total of 20 minutes (including opening and closing the case twice), but the drivers and getting my system working the way I like it again took several hours. If I hadn't had those hours, I'd still be using ATI and Creative's players.
And don't get me started on Quicktime... Nothing like getting the "Upgrade Later" question with EVERY file.
*If you already have a Sound Blaster Live! and you're going to replace it with a different model (like a SoundBlaster Live! X-Gamer 5.1), make SURE you've COMPLETELY uninstalled the old one first (drivers too! Remove the device from the device manager.)
The Dopester
"Yes, I'm a Karma Whore, but I'm doing it to pay my way through school."
I'm not an HTML guy. All my code is back end server stuff. I finally managed to get out of the Windows world completely, I'm not about to go get an MCSE now just because Windows is now an option 3 levels of code away from what I'm doing. I'm passing familiar with Windows but I'm not an expert and I have no intention of becoming an expert because if I do someone might ask me to actually do something with it. Ugh.
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
If I install a program that takes another program's extensions, then uninstall it, I'm left with bad file type associations. Window's needs to be smarter about this and roll those associations back. It already uses so many resources that this would be a trivial addition.
In Windows Explorer, Click on 'Tools' and then 'Folder Options'. Now you have the Folder Options dialog box, click on 'File Types' and you get "a simple, forthrightly labeled control panel that sits right on every user's desktop and asks, in plain English, "Which program would you like to open Web pages? Or text files? Or MP3 audio files? Or photo files?" "
there are 2 kinds of people. those who divide people into 2 kinds, and those who don't.
In win2k it does, but in home-based OSs (Win9x) it does not show the "Open with..." option unless you hold SHIFT while you right-click.
Now, how many simple users are smart enough to do that?
Make even shorter URLs - 8LN.org
as in LAME LAME LAME post to slashdot
/. tagline should be
'slashdot, news for nerds and any worthless filler material attacking microsoft'
I use linux realplayer... no problems there.
I guess real understand which users are more intelligent....
Make even shorter URLs - 8LN.org
He probably couldn't understand you because of your questionable syntax and god-awful grammar.
Hi, I'm a pretentious cock who will make some gay comment about ignoring AC posts here.
No wonder everyone I know who doesn't have a PhD in Computer Engineering still has the Real icon in their system tray.
:-)
It may not be the easist thing in the world to disable from RealPlayer, but it's hardly that difficult. I only have my bachelors (in Anthropology, nonetheless), but even I could figure it out
Dinivin
Consider, if you will, what happens when you ask Explorer to save a web page to disk. It uses a huge filename, and saves the images in separate directories. There's basically no way to get the thing back from the disk without using Explorer.
There's a drop-down menu in the "save" dialog box that lets you choose to save just the HTML. It's no problem at all.
On the other hand, I actually like the save-with-images-and-all option a lot. It's painless and I use it all the time. Sure, it would be easy to write a script to do this, but I'm glad the people at Microsoft saved me the effort.
Even if the answer (in 95/98) is a simple right-click, that's a skill that I bet a high percentage of users don't have or understand
Really, now.
I sympathize with people who think a command line is too hard (although I suspect it won't be for their kids), but RIGHT-CLICKING!?! The second most important button on their thousand dollar device, and you are annoyed that this proposed solution requires people to give up their ignorance of it's existance! How ridiculous is that?
Who the hell would want to install real player? That program has become the most bloated, ad-ridden piece of crap... just like ICQ.
At least you don't get annoying ads with Windows Media Player.
--
"What do you want me to do? Whack a guy? Off a guy? Whack off a guy? Cause I'm married."
The author tells us how WinXP is evil and furthering MS's monopoly on (among other things) file extensions. How come I can right click on ANY FILE in my copy of Windows XP, and either...
Select the "Open With" dialog box and be treated to a list of all the programs on my system registered to handle that file type (for instance: *.doc gives me Word, IE, and Notepad. *.mp3 gives me Winamp and Media Player. *jpg gives me Windows Picture and Fax Viewer, Paint, Macromedia Flash, IE, and Paint Shop Pro!)
If I want, I can further select "Choose Program..." and I'm given the choice of every installed program on my computer, and whether I want to just use it this time, or make it my new default viewer.
I could additionally add programs to my "Send To" dialog, which will give you the same effect as "Open With" but will show for every file on the system (good for compressing files, sending email, etc)
As far as I can remember no other OS I've ever used has given me this much control, and made it so simple (certainly not Linux :)
The article says this about filetype associations...
This quote describes almost every operation of every kind in Windows. The only reason anyone calls it user-friendly is because of their perception of the crushing effects of group psychology steered by a monopoly. It's like living in a technological ghetto -- some people whose course is altered under this influence are weak minded, but many of them have no reasonable alternative without radically and permanently altering their lifestyles with no help or prior evidence for success. Like nationalistic propaganda, it's heavily reinforced at just about every level of society. Having a monopoly that pervasively influences every aspect of society is like having narcotics in the water supply.
It's not a general fix for all files, but Internet Config (formerly freeware, now part of MacOS) lets you select which apps to use to view all common WWW and MIME file types.
The article stated that issues LIKE file extensions--small things that are so standard and obvious that nobody concerns themselves with them--are the things that help MS retain their monopoly status.
To everyone who said "This is no big deal", or "It can be fixed this way"--I have trouble believeing you actually read the article. He essentially said that this was one of many SMALL easily fixed little things that add up to a big problem.
Does anyone actually disagree with this?
That is a really great analogy... Imagine if all your kitchen equipment would randomly move around or change into a different model (or device) when you bought something new. That's something laypeople are very familiar with, and can grasp much more easily than file extensions when you try to explain it.
This "problem" also exists in GNOME and KDE. Trouble is, it's not a "problem", it's a feature.
Back in the days of application-centric environments, such as DOS and pre-desktop Unix, you first opened the application then used it to open the document. But today's computing world is document-centric. You open a document and the appropriate application comes up with it. This is a Good Thing(tm).
If it's Evil for Windows to do this type of stuff, then it's equally Evil for KDE to default to KView instead of GIMP when you open up a jpg or png. But of course it's NOT evil for this sort of behavior. We know that we can choose "Open With..." or change the default behavior. The situation is exactly the same for Windows users. If there is a problem, it is that Windows users tend to never bother trying to find out how to change things.
A Government Is a Body of People, Usually Notably Ungoverned
hmmm... that's not a bad idea...
It would also be cool if the OS would somehow enforce uninstalls leaving the system in it's original state... some programs don't have very good uninstallers and they leave crap laying around all over the place.
--
"What do you want me to do? Whack a guy? Off a guy? Whack off a guy? Cause I'm married."
If anyone actually cared about this "problem", there would already be tools to solve it. Oh wait, PC magazine did an article, and came up with this: Freedom of Association. Good luck actually getting a copy.
P.S. Thanx for your effort A_Non_Moose, try again when it's illegal for me to write a piece of code to do this...
He is claiming that Microsoft makes it hard to change file extensions and then bases the arguements further from there. That is just the point of view of someone that apparently is computer retarded. Windows has that option to associate files in *every single folder*
it hardly seems like a hiding tactic.
this argument makes me think of someone that just runs into a door, then keeps trying, and then complains when they can't find the doorknob even though they've flipped all the light switches in teh room.
and as usual, someone makes an asinine comment with the Mac as a defense of the right way to do something. They somehow magically detect what it is and you are forever saved - WTF?! Mac just has a descriptor in the file type, but it isn't part of the command line descriptor of the file - big deal - it is still associated with some program, and if you are too stupid to know how to change it, then you will use whatever it defaults to.
I usually respect what CmdrTco says, but in this case, it seems like he agrees with this article, and it seems an obvious bash at microsoft, fine, but it is a lousy argument, at least give better points.
There are some odd things afoot now, in the Villa Straylight.
Not sure when this got implemented, but I hadn't noticed it before. We just upgraded to Win2K at work a few weeks ago. This may be because it only seems to work for certain types of files, and it doesn't work for text files on my system. I've been used to changing my file associations manually when necessary.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
The problem is that Microsoft is allowed to dictate to OEMs precisely how the OS may be configured. The OEMs are the ones with the most at stake, as they are going to be the ones who are contacted by customers with problems. But for some reason MS is allowed to dictate the OS installation configuration.
MS should be in the software sales business, not the "restrict how a PC builder can configure the software on the hardware" business. This is perhaps their greatest weapon in monopoly maintenance, and if it were revoked I expect we would see a great deal of competition arise. OEMs should not face restrictions from Microsoft on icons, software pre-loads, business partner tie-ins, splash-screens, etc.
Even neverminding monopoly issues here, I don't believe you. In a situation where there are only 4 or 5 choices (MacOSes, *nix + X, Windowses, BeOS - what else?) each of which has thousands upon thousands of features and thousands upon thousands of flaws, most of those individual features and flaws will be effectively ignored by the market.
The OTHER issue here is that the only people who are evaluating this feature are the ones who realize it's an issue, and already know how to change associations as is. Meaning that their opinion is "sure, it could be a little friendlier, but no big deal". It's not them that this is about.
Trees can't go dancing
So do them a big favor
Pretend dancing stinks!
I don't give a shit about MCSE - why should I take a course to change some fucking obvious TCP settings? This kills me about the computer field - programmers and lusers take PRIDE in making things cryptic and memorizing cryptic key sequences and dialog combinations. Congratulations, asshole. Your memorizing of useless Windows dialog box trivia is really advancing the state of the world. Microsoft just loves people like you that just lap up all the shit they give you without questioning WHY it is the way that it is - or God forbid - make a suggestion to improve it.
Again... my bad. I just started using Win2k a couple weeks ago when we upgraded at work. I hadn't noticed this until now. For some reason it doesn't seem to work for certain file types. Some give me the "Open with" menu, and some just give me the "Open with" option that brings up the file association dialog. Text files don't give me the menu. MP3 files do. Not sure what criteria their basing this decision on.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
The problem with changing the default program is not so big, I think. There are however two other things that M$ does:
.doc files. Changes format for every version of Office.
1. Creating newfiletypes all the time. Just look at the latest media-file-types comming out from Redmond.
2. New file formats for existing file extensions. The best example being Words
/ The Arrow
"How lovely you are. So lovely in my straightjacket..." - Nny
No, no, no - hold your right dick as you shit-click.
the postscript to the article is the worst... if you just read the documentation, changing the program that opens a file is easy. this article is terrible
Heh.. ok.. i'm apologizing left and right here. I've only been using Win2K for a couple weeks now and I hadn't noticed this until now. But it doesn't seem to work for all file types. MP3s give me a menu and that "Choose Program" option. Text files don't. I don't know what criteria they base the decision on.
It's not enough to bash in heads, you've got to bash in minds. - Captain Hammer
Not only that but its sound quality is shit even at the highest bitrates.
*yawn*
must be news shortage...
and that's probably why Gates is richer than Taco ;-)
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
The Internet Options dialog is also accessible as the Internet Options Control Panel applet.
I can't honestly believe that microsoft 'hid' the file types dialog box for some evil purpose. they're quite frankly: pretty bad at intuitive interfaces. i mean, c'mon. if they could make a good interface, they would. it sells better. it'd be an improvement, and they can sell improvements.
/. heading that there'd be a rational article behind that link that looked into the ways that companies try to thrust their proprietary file -formats- onto the world, and squeeze developers later on. (a la Compuserve/Gif, and the concepts behind RAND)
and most media programs now (real and winamp included) have code to check the program associated with the media they deal with, and incessently remind you that they can usurp control of those files if you just click 'ok'.
i can't honestly believe that microsoft is going to forge a monopoly through file association. hell, i thought reading the
it's easy to hate the winner, to call them a cheater. much easier than admitting that they're better; that they did the work and deserve it.
// "Can't clowns and pirates just -try- to get along?"
Because the same users who don't know how to change the file associations, won't know how to install (or even find) the freeware app.
-- I have monkeys in my pants.
The problem is that at my work everyone sees to think it's such a great program that Novell always sticks the shortcut on my desktop. Every day I delete it, every day it comes back. Soon I'll be able to permenently remove it from my system as I'm going to be in charge of the Novell servers. Then I shall get my revenge. I'll use VI to edit the "text" of the .exe so it can never harm another soul.
MUWAAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!
This sig isn't original enough, it's time to come up with something witty...
Windowsupdate is one example of a site that must be viewed in IE to work -- MS has added more such pages to the OS as time as gone on. They make a link to windowsupdate in the start menu. But, in an act so dumb I can only imagine it is malicious, they make that link a proper URL. That means that it will be opened by whatever program is registered to open URLs.
So if you change your default browser to Netscape or some other non-ActiveX browser, you can't do anything useful with that link. That entry in the menu should be an explicit command to open IE with the proper link.
It's certainly possible that MS is simply being dense, but I find it much more likely that they are seeking to punish users who change their browser as an example to others. (Of course, you can still open windowsupdate.microsoft.com in IE manually, but many people don't ever realize that it's just a normal web page and not a special program)
This applies to Win32, Linux, and Mac OS...
USERS BEWARE!!!
Actually, on Linux, this misfeature is quite easy to disable. In order to crash the system, the extension invokes the program /bin/laden. Simply removing that nasty program makes your system immune against this exploit:
I use a File Extensions Editor ( there are many around, like ZDNET MenuEdit. It's an old freeware, but still works for me. ) to manually add the context itens I need for each file type.
For instance, right-clicking on an HTM/HTML file on my system yelds this:
- Open with Internet Explorer 5
- Open with Internet Explorer 4
- Open with Mozilla
- Open with Netscape 4
- Open with Netscape 3
- Open with Opera
- Edit with HomeSite
- Edit with DreamWeaver
- Edit with DreamWeaver UltraDev
- Edit with Adobe GoLive
- Edit with NetObjects Builder
- Edit with 1st Page
- Edit with TopStyle
- Edit with PHPEd
- Edit with Notepad
Very handy...:-)The meat of the writer's ire is how buried are on/off switches and options. Frequently there's one path to them.
Take for example what was fretting me a couple weeks back. Icon placement. Simple right? Auto arrange or not. Ok, I'm running Win98SE and I forget how to do this and go into help. I spend about 15 minutes in there and find NOTHING on the subject other than for topics I'm not interested in. Finally is disgust I put the words 'icon autoarrange' in a Google query and get the answer off the web in less than a minute. (Right click on desktop, move pointer to arrange icons, click off the check.) Nothing tricky there, but try to find that nugget in the Help. I did find one thing in my search of Windows help, I finally found the way to disable One-Click which had been driving me mad (what an incredibly bad idea to ship that defaulted on ON to a public accustomed to double-click. If you don't already use it and like it: try it, you'll hate it.)
Don't even get me started on spending 20 minutes trying to disable all the automatic crap in Word everytime I get a new system with it installed. Sheesh.
Some good could be done with little effort on the part of Microsoft. Ship things like word with the auto stuff disabled and highlight in a handy card what features there are, what they do, and how to enable/disable them. For all the glowing reviews I've ever read, here and elsewhere, about Microsoft books and documentation, I still say Bull, it's some of the worst. Disorganised, inappropriately indexed, combined examples which confuse the reader, etc. Yeah, they have a great site full of help, which I generally don't visit because there's dozens of far better sites on the web. The key to wisdom is knowing where and how to get the information you really need, that is the Zen of Google.
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
How do people usually meta-moderate false Informative/Insightful posts? The above poster is clearly wrong (as apparent to anyone who has used a Mac). But I am not really convinced the moderators who marked it as Informative, were really acting in bad faith (i.e. they weren't trying to increase noise) -- they were simply wrong.
Fair? Unfair?
I'm leaning towards Unfair, the rationale being that modders shouldn't mark something as informative unless they know it's informative. But that rationale may be bad, since it requires moderators have as much expertise on a subject as a poster. On a trivial thing like how-to-use-a-Mac, that's not an issue, but in other discussions, it is.
Thoughts, anyone?
It doesn't matter if it is easy. What matters is is it intuitive? What's Joe Schmoe going to do about the fact that when ever he opens a *.html file, IE opens. It works, he can see it. Who cares that he has Mozillia and Opera installed. ****He isn't even aware that there is a choice. ****
please don't feed the monkey
here is my email to the author:
"It would probably take one of Microsoft's developers a short afternoon to build a simple, forthrightly labeled control panel that sits right on every user's desktop and asks, in plain English, "Which program would you like to open Web pages? Or text files? Or MP3 audio files? Or photo files?""
It would probably take most people a short afternoon to make such an application. If this is a feature you want, build it! If you think everyone should be able to have it, put it up for download on the net!
it is this close minded thinking (that only microsoft engineers can build windows applications) that is keeping the monopoly. NOT file extensions.
MARIJUANA, SHROOMS, X: ONLINE?! - E
This didn't occur to you earlier? Shit! .DOC for Document as if only MS Word could make documents? .WAV for Waveforms as if only Windows knew waveforms? I haven't even read the article, but even I can tell that .LIT for Literature has meaning beyond its quaint deference to archaic 8+3 madness.
Well I could go on, but this is already the 450th+ comment so I'm sure either somebody has already said it or nobody will ever read it, so peace.
Personally I think that their products stink: the audio/video quality is poor, and the UI, well.. it blows. But the bottom line is that Real(tm) products are 10X worse than most other applications for file associations. (Not to mention that the default setting for their programs leaves them running all the time for no reason!).
Fuzzybad
Most users I've been around wouldn't know where to find a file to click. They click "Start", "Programs", whatever their favorite program is, and start typing in the blank screen.
A few have figured out how to use "File", "Open" to get an existing file. But they still don't even know that the Windows Explorer exists, or that the My Computer icon is useful for anything.
This isn't an issue for the huge majority of people who are buying computers and software.
You never really know how close to the edge you can go until you fall off.
Okay, so right click an MP3 in Windows XP. Regardless of your chosen and installed MP3 player, you'll see 3 or more hooks back to Microsoft products (4 with a CD burner), 2 of which don't mention which product they're actually hooking to. (Why should they? It's all *integrated*...)
The right click used to be a tool to get instant access to basic functionality. But now it's turning into Microsoft's first line of defense against non-MS applications handling standard files.
Good Idea: Using the Right Click to send a folder full of MP3s to your preferred application, such as WinAmp.
Bad Idea: Using the Right Click to send a folder full of MP3s to MSN with your passport account to purchase every CD your MP3s came from, regardless of whether you have legal copies of them or not.
Lets not forget that Microsoft has set up the Windows Explorer not to show you what the extensions are on "recognized" files anyway. On Windows 98 you can't change the extension of a "recognized (microsofized)" file without disabling this setting...
Winamp is gay for CDs anyway, because it finishes one track and the player starts the next track by itself, but then Winamp notices the track is done, stops, and starts again, it is incredibly annoying. MS CD player is best for playing CDs, unless you want fancy shit.
in post-98 Windows, pull up the "Internet Options" appelet in the Control Panel, and go to the "Programs" Tab. From there, you can select the default e-mail application in a drop-down menu labeled, simply enough, "e-mail."
The drop-down list only has those programs that told Windows that they are e-mail programs, but the feature's been in so long that most apps should be able to do it.
In Windows XP, this same feature affects what shows up on the Start Menus as well--and both Netscape 6.1 and Mozilla 0.9.4 show up as choices when they are installed. I don't know about Eudora, though.
This isn't quite as elegant as the Mac approach, but it works -- until you want to switch the program you use for a particular file type.
Then, you're basically at Microsoft's mercy. Because Windows makes you go on a mad hunt through menus and folders and options to find the dialogue box that lets you make any such change.
Errr... maybe this is different under Win9x, but under Win2K this isn't hard at all. Right-click on the file in question, pick "Open With." It has a menu with the programs that have previously been used to open that file type (Notepad, IE, and WordPerfect for the text file I just opened to try this). At the bottom of the list is "Choose program..." That brings up a list of apps installed on the machine. Pick the app to open it with. If you want to make that app the default for that file extension, click "Always use this program to open these files."
That's so freakin' hard about this? It fits just fine with the "right-click on it to see what you can do with it" paradigm that Windows uses throughout.
"The Greens lynched a hacker in Chicago. Last month, but I think the body's still hanging from the old Water Tower."
Here is how to do it on MacOS X 10.1:
1. Select icon in Finder or on your Desktop
2. Hit Command-I (or select File->Show Info)
3. Select the "Open with Application" tab
4. Click Icon, select new Application
and if you want, click on the [Change All] button labeled: "Use this application to open all documents like this".
Not very hard.. much easier for newbies than Windows, imho.
Hehe... number 500 or so.
:/
The author of this article claims that Microsoft is being mean (for lack of a better paraphrasing) because they haven't created a tutorial that introduces users to the windows environment, etc....
Obviously the author hasn't seen Windows XP. Not only does WinXP have an excellent tutorial OOBE (no longer for people who buy a Compaq or a Dell or some other evil computer) that shows the end user how to use windows, it senses mouse/keyboard activity during the OOBE, and if the user sits there for long enough, it'll launch a tutorial that teaches them how to use the keyboard and the mouse.
While I know it's impossible, MS really has tried very hard to make the system idiot-proof.
At the risk of being redundant (well... I am being redundant), this author really should do his research before he makes himself look like an ass.
As a side note... I've actively tried to crash WinXP with no success... anybody have any suggestions? I couldn't even crash it when I was surfing the internet (160 IE windows, just for the hell of it), burning a CD, and listening to MP3's at the same time. Right click stopped working, but it didn't crash.... The CD played in my car CD player, too....
If you believe everything you read, you'd better not read. - Japanese proverb
Every program tries to steal extensions. Screw those who don't know how to change them, they won't miss what they don't know about, and if they're motivated enough, they'll learn.
Also, I'm not terribly concerned with Media Player taking file extensions from RealPlayer, because, quite frankly, real player blows. They load up the window with all sorts of useless crap, (the channels) and you can't fast forward or go back in the videos.
How the hell am I supposed to find my favorite parts in all the pr0n clips I have?
Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms should be the name of a store, not a government agency.
if I had any mod points I'd give them to you...
Is that it generates feedback for MS to put somewhere on their list of things to do.
Eventually, all these common sence things will be somehow owned and controled by MS.
Instead people should be making these sort of better than MS user choice options more
readily available in Linux.
I mean if Linux is so anti-MS why are so many telling MS what to improve?
When I bitch about MS's monopoly, my dad always has the same answer: "But I don't want competition. I like that I can just use Microsoft for everything. I don't want to have to think about which word processor, or what operating system I'm using. That's too complicated. I just want it to work."
This is why MS is on top, and will stay there for some time to come. They understand that their users are deeply uncomfortable working with computers to begin with, and even something as simple as installing a new Web browser is often too much for them. Users will take the path of least resistance, and will chose the Hell they know over the Hell they don't every time.
[This is what I sent to the author after reading his article]
While I agree that it would be beneficial for Windows to implement a system such as the one you suggest, and while I agree that generally Microsoft qualifies as The Evil Empire, I do disagree with one of the points of your article. You say "The reason Microsoft has never done this isn't technical; it's pure business hardball cowering behind the camouflage of a technicality." Actually, I would claim that it's neither a technical nor a business reason. I think it's simple inertia. It's a relic from much earlier versions of Windows, and no more arcane than most of the functionality available in those days. While it's possible that they made a conscious business choice to leave it as is for monopolistic reasons, it doesn't strike me as terribly likely. For people who've been using Windows a long time (like me, and, presumably, like the people at Microsoft), the file associations menu *is* in an obvious place. I'll grant your points that a new user would have trouble finding it, and that that's a problem deserving of being fixed. But I think that trying to paint this (non-)action by MS as being an act of deliberate market manipulation is misguided, especially when there are so many *provable* examples of such behavior out there.
I submitted this to slashdot as a headline, but it was rejected.
This is probably irresponsable reporting, but you should know. After it was reported that a second Florida man had been exposed to anthrax in Florida, I tried calling my local clinic (Valley Medical East Team, Kent Wa.) to get myself and my daughter vaccinated against this horrible disease. I was told they don't have it and that it isn't available to the general public.
What?!?
While the Feds investigate whether it was terrorism or not that exposed the two men to the fatal disease, incubation time keeps on ticking. Pretty much by the time you realize you are sicker than the common cold, it's too late. Why on earth haven't they started vaccinating people?
Better to vaccinate and find out later that it was not terrorism than to wait to find out... when some people may be to late to save.
I really don't care if my insurance will cover it. I will pay for the shots. Just let me have them, is that so much to ask?
Come on CDC & FBI, let us get our vaccinations! I urge folks to call their congress man or woman and begin demanding the availability of these vaccinations. Because if it was terrorism, who knows how wide spread? I don't want to wait until it is too late.
Here are the CDC information pages on this.
You can lookup and call Valley Medical yourself to confirm this.
This sig intentionally left blank.
"Registered file types" are there because Windows was designed for non-techie users. It's not part of The Grand Conspiracy, since file typing is still done in Windows XP the same way it was done in Windows 95, and the way to change registered file types is still the same too. I'f they'd made it harder, I coyuld go for the argument. But they didn't--they kept it the same.
;-)
Registered file types were just a typical Microsoft hack designed to get the system to do essentially what Macs did, but without all the coding overhead and file/creator nonsense. Personally, I'm glad they cheaped out instead of doing file/creator typing, because I like to be able to change a file extension merely by clicking on the filename and changing 3 letters (after setting the newer versions of Windows to show the file extensions, of course--hiding them was another hack to be more like Mac, but a stupid one).
And the average user will never have to change what kind of program opens a certain type of file, manually. See, when you install new software on a Windows box, the new software almost always asks the user whether he wants documents with such and such extensions to open in this new application. Yes is the default and that's almost always what the user selects. No manual changes necessary. It's only computer literate people who should be tinkering around with registered file extensions anyway--because illiterate yahoos can "accidentally" make it so that double-clicking things does nothing, or opens a file in the wrong application. That's why Microsoft put the feature where it did instead of into a separate control panel, where "average" users would no doubt fsck themselves up.
Is MS evil and a predatory monopoly? Yes. Is their handling of registered file types part of their bid to rule the world? No. It's set up just like it should be--literate users know where it is, and average yokels can't ruin their systems by messing with something they shouldn't touch, and installing new apps to handle that file type will give the user the chance to change to opeining files of those types with that program. Or should we put a big shiny button in the control panel that performs a full fdisk just because that functionality is hard to find for the average bloke? No? Didn't think so. The writer of the Salon article is just blowing smoke up our collective arses at best, and at worst is a blundering moron. Nothing personal, of course...
Chasing Amy
(We all chase Amy...)
"The more corrupt the state, the more numerous the laws"-Tacitus
Quit pandering to these nimnulls.
Linux is just not that hard to install.
is when a program (i'm talking to you winamp) registers half a dozen different file extentions (wav, mp3, mid...) all under the same file type. So if you want to register just one differently, you have to redo the other 5 as well.
Go green: turn off your refrigerator.
Very off topic. But to add fuel to the fire, it is very well known from current news articles that the vaccine is not in sufficent quantities (only 7 million or so I read) to allow mass vaccinations to take place. The CDC has requested the creation of more, however this will take years. Yes, it's quite a problem.
I swear by MacOS X. Although I use to swear *at* MacOS 9...
I'm sure it's redundant by now as I didn't real all the other posts and there were so many, but this article is clearly giving MS too much credit. Perhaps 8.3 naming is a DOS convention, but it's not an exclusive trademark of or patent by Microsoft Corporation and I assume it predates them by many many decades. .net stuff. The net IS unix. That was such an idiot move you know there is nobody at the helm. The ship is heading for rocks and has been for ages.
And file extensions in general are used in all OSes, and there was no reason you couldn't have used them with the original Macs if you wanted to. You didn't have to. But if you wanted to, you still could. So, pinning this on MS is like saying they control the ASCII code standards or something ridiculous like that. They may have a stake in these things and maybe a big stake, but these aren't very productive battlefronts from my perspective. More like trying too hard to be cute. Or, no wait, it's karma whoring on Salon.
Besides, what's better than giving MS too much credit is giving them too much rope to hang themselves with and I think they've already picked up the rope with this
Then, you're basically at Microsoft's mercy. Because Windows makes you go on a mad hunt through menus and folders and options to find the dialogue box that lets you make any such change. It's not in the "add/remove programs" control panel, where you'd expect it. It's not under "properties" when you right-click on a file. It's not in any obvious or easily accessible location. (For future reference, here is where it is: In Windows 98, open Windows Explorer, find the View menu, look under "Folder Options," then find the hidden "File Types" tab -- which may not even be there, depending on what you have selected in the Windows Explorer window. In Windows XP, the feature is similarly hidden behind the cryptic "Folder Options" label.)
untrue. in windows XP (and i believe win2k), you can simply right click a file, go to "open with" and "choose program."
True, Winamp is not best for playing CDs. Unless you use digital mode to read the CD... then Winamp kicks ass, IMO. You gain access to all the visualizations, plugins, and graphic equalizer capabilities of Winamp at a small cose of some extra cpu time.
"I will trust Google to 'do no evil' until the founders no longer run it." Hello Alphabet.
open apple-I on the file to get the "Get Info" window and then use the drop down menu and you can change either the extension type or the application to open the file with. Pretty simple.
Blame M$ because they are supposedly making computing easy. They are not, they are chiefly concerned with controling how users operate their computers. We shouldn't be worrring about hacks to get around file extensions and proprietary file formats. We should be focusing on getting our work done. Apple is to blame as well. If we have basic interoperation between apps and progams, which is real ease of use, we can put our energies into pushing the tech envelope.
True, but I would predict at least that patches will appear a lot more quickly than they would under Microsoft, simply because there are a hell of a lot of dedicated Linux programmers who, fundamentally, want Linux to succeed through merit. I like to think their dedication runs high enough to keep Linux software in a premium condition.
Microsoft can afford to leave holes and whatnot in its software because of its monopolistic position. If and when Linux becomes mainstream, I don't think this will be the approach for its software; many of the people seriously developing for Linux will probably have developed for Windows, and will want to take advantage of an opportunity to do things right this time. It's practical as well as ideological: why exchange one buggy set of software for another?
The coolest voice ever.
That doesn't work on Win2k. I just tried it and there's no "open with.." option. But hey, as long as it's in some of the Windoze OSes and is as simple as shift-right-click-select-app-select-box, hey, who am I to complain?
Anyone remember Workplace Shell? How every file was just another object that could be associated with any number of apps? How you could - if you wanted to - associate through filename suffixes, but what you really did was to associate through the object class hierarchy?
Boy, do I miss that!
A fully CORBA compliant desktop manager.
GNOME/KDE folks should really spend a couple of weeks to discover all the implications of that.
//TheToon
My Karma: ran over your Dogma
StrawberryFrog
All it is, is a ease of use feature Apple did with the Macintosh even before MS did it with Windows. The Mac was the first computer I remember that would open an application based on the data file. Don't bitch about something till you make sure you have your fact right.
Certainly microsoft prefers if you use there software, but if you don't take the time to educate yourself about your computer then it is your own fault. My best example is the following question "How do I remove all the porn from my history and recent docs ?" I know I've answered this question at least 50 times. And it is asked because in this scenario people care to educate themselves so they can cover thier tracks. If you don't ask the question and get caught by your parents or wife it's your fault not microsoft's for making it easier
I like beer.
Ahhh, but wait!
Here's how to get around the RIAA, motion picture association, and the likes.
Embed mp3's, mpegs, etc, files within standard file types, in particular Word Documents, pdf's, and gif/tiff/jpeg images...
Doable?
Ok, do it.
fslg503-985-8686503-985-8686503-985-8686503-985-8
Then, you're basically at Microsoft's mercy. Because Windows makes you go on a mad hunt through menus and folders and options to find the dialogue box that lets you make any such change.
Right-click, Open With... I'll go through a mad hunt by spawning new windows for links from your story now.
It's not in the "add/remove programs" control panel, where you'd expect it.
And the recycle bin isn't in the start menu, so what? Unlike in Mac land, we mostly separated code from data a long time ago.
It's not under "properties" when you right-click on a file.
Wow, we can right click on a file to complain about the lack of application choice under properties but we can't see the Open With... menu command.
The remedy is obvious: Force Microsoft to make it easy to change registered file types in Windows. It would probably take one of Microsoft's developers a short afternoon to build a simple, forthrightly labeled control panel that sits right on every user's desktop and asks, in plain English, "Which program would you like to open Web pages? Or text files? Or MP3 audio files? Or photo files?"
... and convieniently ignore (freeze out) file types the application (or MS) doesn't characterize. Brilliant!
What makes me think this person's just a frustrated Mac user in PC land.
It really doesn't take much a surplus of nerurons to figure out how to reassociate the file type. People who can't figure it out probably don't give a damn about Microsoft's stranglehold on them anyway.
If they are too stupid to right click and rename the file to a different extension then they deserved to be forced into what they use and treated like sheep.
If this guy had bothered to poke around, he would have found the shift-Right Click trick. Simply click the icon so that it is highlighted then hold shift and right clock the icon. The resulting menu will have the option "Open With". Select the option and the resulting dialog will ahve a list of all registered apps and a check box labeled always use this app. Reassociation for the masses.
Windows 2k even keeps a secondary association list. Once you have forced the file open in a specific app the open with menu will be there with that app.
Looks like Mr. Mac guy needs to check his references.
Str8Dog
using System.Darkside; public
...of things to bitch about.
Seriously. This is ridiculous!
First off, the damn thing IS NOT hidden. The ability to change the associations is in EVERY SINGLE explorer window that is open. I found it in less than a minute the first time I tried to use it.
And guess what else: Its mentioned in the HELP program too! (that was a tough one, wasn't it?)
Also, the reason why its the last option is probably to deter morons from changing mp3s to opening with Notepad or Fdisk.
I could go on, but I'll spare you this time.
"A plan fiendishly clever in its intricacies"- Homer Simpson
Well, u know, the concept of file extensions was invented/patented by an independent company way before MS DOS. In fact, I believe MS pays a licencing fee for using it in Windows.
Customize those context menus. Or just change the assotiation on the fly. When I used Windows, I read all of the site (mainly around 1995/1996).
:)
(Aside) MS really did pack in a lot of useful features (even if the UI never tells you things like F2 = rename in explorer). The closest file manager tool I've found for Linux that's as useful on the get go as Win95 Explorer is Midnight Commander, which I spend most of my time using (even in Gnome/KDE). No GMC, Konq, or Nautilus for me
--
Internet Explorer (n): Another bug -- that is, a feature that can't be turned off -- in Windows.
With WinXP just right click any file, choose Open With and a list of possible programs shows up and you can choose any program you want. It actually works very well.
Oh, and this has NOTHING to do with FAT32 or the filesystem in general. I'm not sure what the original poster was talking about when he mentioned FAT32. Windows could easily be patched to recognize files based on file magic rather than extension.
No. Real have been steaing associations for a long, long time.
You CAN control what programs open which file extensions.
Have people become so lazy and stupid they can't change the preference themselves?
I know the people of Salon have mental disabilities so I won't get after them.
People should be tested before they can buy computers.
> The trouble is, even if some court orders Microsoft to throw Real Player into the Windows
> package, it doesn't make much difference if most users can't figure out how to switch the
> default player of music files from Windows Media to Real.
I really don't think that this is possible. While most users probably don't know 'of the top of their head' how to change the config, windows does have extensive help and various guides are available (I got a manual with my copy of win98 for example) that detail how to do this.
e.g. (Win98)
Start->Help->Index
Type the word 'file' in the box and a short way down the list the topic 'file extensions' appears with sub-topic 'associating with programs'.
Also, it is easy for programs to check file associations themselves and question the user whether to change them, as we all know (Preferably with an option to disable such a feature).
Now if Microsoft removed the API calls to do this...
Sounds to me like the reporter had a bad day with this in the office and decided to moan to the world.
-- Mike
Hear, hear! RealPlayer is the most diseased, bloated, sick-cow of an application to ever come slouching out of WA, and it gets worse every revision. Sneaky always-on behavior that rewrites the autoload reg key even if deleted by the user unless explicitly disabled through a nest of buried dialogs and a very official-sounding warning and a lengthy installation process that includes the app phoning home (checked on by default), mounds of ad-driven "content" (checked on by default), and mandatory registration.
When it's all said and done, the thing sucks up resources, harasses you constantly to "upgrade" to the for-cost application, and spews out horrible video and audio.
Heh, watch my own reply to a story I submitted be modded as a troll (Just kidding...kinda).
.doc was synonymous with *WORDPERFECT*, first) is only a minor foot note amongst all of the other "Bad Stuff"(TM) they have been convicted of. But, if anyone that "gets" the mind/market-share or memes (sp?) that leads to the "Bill Gates owns Apple" type of think (don't laff, I've heard it uttered before).
Have not seen anything posted about "iron fisted control" of MS extensions a la the windows file manager.
(side note: did not read very far, forgive me...600+ replies in ~3 hours. I love this place).
(Anywho) Just do a Start->run->winfile, then do a File->Associate and pick any extension and its program. The association will *never* be broken.
Heck, winfile is even in windows NT (IIRC) and supports LFN's oddly enuf. (not sure about win2k having winfile).
You see; the whole point of all this is:
A) we're geeks, we do this for a living and don't carry much "inertia" as it was put in the article.
Average users aren't going to know this stuff.
B) Hijacking of extensions by Microsoft (If my memory serves me properly,
C) It is scary to think that with all these "minor" offenses coming into light, no on has thought of bringing it up in the current trial or even into a different trial(s) (or heck, more of them...yeah, I know, I want to smack me to for saying it, but bear with me, pls).
Reason being, unless remedies take care of things like this extension issue, bootloader issue, "me too'ism" like copyright violations, theft of IP, copyright theft ad infinitum... it ain't going to stop. It is like Kudzu, it is just going to "grow back" only much stronger/faster.
Think about it. Seriously, think about it. Unless Microsoft is brought to the brink from "death by a 1,000 cuts", the bad blood will still be there. Not like the current court case has done anything to modify their behavior.
Moose.
I'm talking and I can't shut up.
Have you read the moderator guidelines? Well, have you, PUNK? (and I want a Karma: Gnarly option)
Since I have USB speakers (and no sound card) it should be obvious that I ALWAYS use digital mode.
piece of broiled shit that i've ever read. I won't even waste my breath trying to rip this retarded article to shreds. It's not my fault that the average Joe Shmoe isn't smart enough to figure it out on their own, or ask someone that does. Check the file properties, open the file types tab in folder properties. use the "open with" choice on the alt menu to pick a new program to open the file with. Use the programs file associations tab in the properties panel. That's 6 different ways to accomplish a file association change. What's the problem? to make things even easier, programs ask you what file associations to use when installing, and a good amount of progams even actively check their file associations settings, and PROMPT you to correct them if they have been changed. It's the users fault for not paying attention if the associations get changed. How many of us can honestly say that they actively do anything during an installer routine but look to see where the "next" button is. I'll admit it. At one time, I didn't know how to change file associations either, but I had the capacity of mind to use the tools provided to me to find out how. It's not my problem, or MS's if Joe retard is too stupid to simply open the help system (hint, it's right on the start bar) and type "File associations" in order to get instructions on how to do what he wants.
Double Click this 8==D - - -
554 5.0.0 <scottr@salon.com>... Service unavailable
Apparently he's not allowed to receive messages with a clue.
(Possibly also, messages are blocked if they contain; "stupid", "truly dreadful article", "suck", "say you're sorry" or "computer illiteracy is a pre-requisite for management positions".)
If I may ask: In a postscript to your article "The Devil is in Windows' Details", you point out that it is irrelevant that the program used to open a given format can be changed by right-clicking on a file of that type, because there are many users who don't even know what right-clicking is.
That's certainly true, but at the risk of sounding like an elitist, why should we (the computer-literate people) care? It is really not that hard to learn about the "hidden" features in windows, through one's own experience or research on the Internet, or even in the Dummies books. I agree that the concept of hidden features is anti-competitive, but why should we lose any sleep over people who are, for whatever reason, unable to learn enough to make windows do what they wish? Isn't it best for them that they aren't faced with choices that could tax their limited understanding of technology beyond the breaking point? You and I, sir, and the legions of other competant users, will use whatever software and operating systems we like, no matter what Microsoft does. It just seems to me that people who are being hurt the most by "hidden" features are those who shouldn't really be playing with them anyway, because they have no idea what they are doing.
I know that sounds - well, assinine, to put it mildly - but I'd like to cite an example from my work. I am a part-time computer tech at my high school, and one of my duties (and hobbies, when I am not on the clock) is to assist teachers when they have technical problems. About half the calls I get that don't boil down to "You didn't plug in the power cord" are related to incidents where teachers install some new word processor/media player/whatever that a friend (or email spam that sounded "friendly") recommended. All of a sudden, "My Microsoft looks different!" they cry, and they are hopelessly confused.
Most users really do benefit from using an OS that limits what they can do, because most users lack the initiative to learn how to use a less constricting system. Being held by the hand allows computer illiterates to do, for the most part, what they want to do (word processing/games/web browsing). For those who are capable of a greater degree of computer literacy, the modern versions of windows are simply not appropriate - they are not targeted at us. For computer-literate users to complain Windows over-limits the user is like a racing bycyclist to complain that training wheels greatly limit his/her speed - it's true, but what the heck is he doing with training wheels?
BeOS and Linux are both more powerful, inexpensive operating systems without the penchant Windows has for assisting Microsoft megalomania. I would assert that a user who feels constrained by windows should simply switch - and if he/she has documents or other files Linux or Beos can't run, to complain is inappropriate - find or start a project that is working on what you need, and help it however you can. Don't just sit there.
I'm the stranger...posting to
However, I was a little annoyed to find out last night that I couldn't set a WinAmp association for mp3s in Explorer ("Always use this program to open this type of file") because the newest version of Windows Media Player overrides whatever preference you set in Explorer; you have to go into Windows Media Player's application preferences and explicitly tell it to not associate itself with mp3s. This means that other programs cannot "reclaim" mp3 association or set it in an installer because wmplayer overrides the setting externally.
It seems arcane to think that most users are to ignorant, or so unwilling to learn the OS in more depth, but it is true. Most computer users that actually have a clue about how to manipulate the OS will be inclined to do so. I personally always set the defaults to be what I want them to be, but not everybody knows how... that's just a fact, and a fact that covers a HUGE percentage of computer users. I think his solution has a valid point, even if it doesn't acomplish anything. Users are not given the choice obviously enough for most of them to figure out how to switch default applications for file types, and knowing M$ history, I would think that most people here would believe that they (M$) would be inclined to take advantage of this. Once again, it's M$ taking advantage of user's ignorance, just like that have all along. I'm not saying that if the court ruled his way on this subject, that it would change things, but it would give people more control over the applications they use without having to do additional learning of the OS. Just my .02, flame away if you must.
in windows 2000, it's similar. if I wanted to use gvim to open all perl files, for example, I can:
.pl in windows explorer
.pl file in windows explorer
1. right-click on a
2. choose 'open with...'
3. find gvim in the applications listing
4. select that app and then check the box 'always use this program to open these files..'
now prior to 2000 (NT4, 95, maybe 98), it was much more difficult, step one becomes:
1. hold SHIFT, then right-click on a
Yes, that little thing that always got installed (I dont know if it still does). In Windows 95, the Online Services folder was always there, on your desktop to "help" you choose an ISP that microsoft liked.. later on, in windows 98, there was an option in the installer to choose whether or not the Online Services thing got installed... It didnt matter if you ticked it or not it was there anyway. So, even if Microsoft did add an easy to use/understand method of changing what opens what would it make any difference? They could add that feature, but then just as easily add some code to revert back to the microsoft program which can load those files once a week.
Fact is, in windows 2000 professional it's beyond easy to change the file type assiciations.
In fact, while the artical mentions that you should be able to change the file association by going into the properties of the file... well, truth is, in Windows 2000 Professional... you can.
Nice little thing. First page of properties... filename, type of file, and "Opens with" listing the application associated with it... and then a nice sized "Change" button.
I haven't a clue if this is the same on ME or XP, but it's certainly there on 2k Pro. `
You guys sound like a bunch of morons. "The second mouse button is too complicated" "Context menus are too complicated" "Open With... is too complicated" How did you guys manage to get to this website?? I'm not even gonna ask if you installed Linux yourselves.
The article brought up Real Player vs. Windows Media Player. I for one HATE Real Player like the black plague. Every time I upgrade it I get ALL of the following added to my system:
- 2 icons in the quick launch area next to the "start" menu
- a folder in the "start -> programs" menu
- a system tray icon that launches every time windows starts
- an icon on my desktop
- 2 links stuck in my "Favorites" folder. One in the main folder and another in my "Links" folder.
- a stupid control panel applet dedicated to real player configuration. why do I even need it there?
- a lame pop-up ad when I close real player
Now is THAT going too far? I really dislike this Real Player. I hope they go to hell with Bin Laden fast.
eTrade SUCKS
how many of my colleagues (in the software development field) still have a Microsoft property for their home page. Many immediately click out of it, but many also eventually get tired of that and instead follow the customize links and customize their homepage on msnbc.
Just cause it's in the OS, doesn't mean its better. Unfortunately, convenience matters most to all but the most vigilant users.
A while back I was setting up some computers at school. I was told that MS Office needed to be on these machines for various reasons so I went ahead and installed Office 2000, I also installed abiword because it is my wordprocessor of choice. I was feeling like I should shove my opinions on those who didnt know the difference so i tried to associate .doc files with abiword. Whenever I tried to change the association from MS Word to AbiWord MS Word ran and changed it back. If this isnt an unfair business practice I dont know what is. If anyone needs proof of this for a good reason I can try and reproduce it.
Ok, wtf! First of all, it's really easy to change file type associations. If you can't, then maybe you just don't CARE what program opens your documents. Secondly, the author compares the system of associating files with programs on Windows to that of the one on Macs. I must say, it is damn near IMPOSSIBLE to change the program that opens certain file on a Mac. You need a program like ResEdit and more than basic knowledge of Macs.
Not only is this guy extremely biased about the point he's making here, he's also wrong. I assume because nobody here who's complaining about MS has actually used XP, nobody here seems to have brought up this point yet:
In Windows XP, it is easier to choose which program opens which file than ever before.
All you gotta do is right click, and choose Open With. All programs that have registered their ability to run the file you've selected will be listed, right there. And if there's a program that didn't register itself for a file type, you can select Choose Program and it'll let you select the one you want. No holding shift, no hunting through menus. Right-click, move mouse, click. Now if you're saying Microsoft is monopolistic because this isn't easy enough, apparently you've not noticed the progression from Windows 3.x to Windows XP. Which means you're uninformed. Which means you shouldn't be writing columns bashing MS. Quit blowing smoke, and admit that you've never even seen XP in action. You call yourself a journalist. I wrote better-researched articles in grade school.
ZB
note: although I, for one, have actually used Windows XP, I don't like it as much as Windows 2000, whose file associations are much harder (read: have to hold shift button when right-clicking) to change.
Synergy is your friend
is that MS changes the terms they use and the way the menus are arranged in each succesive version. This is what prevents casual users from being familiar with the OS. Programs have options, settings, and preferences, all of which are the same thing. Win98 to Win2000, well, find changed to search, Dial up networking lost it's icon status and is now a hyperlink called Network and Dial up settings. etc. , etc. There are so many changes that it makes it prohibitive to even know the full vocabulary you need to operate a computer.
yhbt. ywl. hand.
for the record, this works in WinMe too.
~A
Linux, Vai, Satch and Guitars.. that is the life ICQ# 7357858
I may be going out on a limb here by actually giving out useful information about an M$ product, but what the hell...
If you want to change file types and associations from the command line in NT, you can do it with the FTYPE and ASSOC commands. It's especially useful since I don't use Windows explorer at all (I even play MP3's via CMD).
Even though I think Microsoft is rather monopolistic I don't think that this is a deliberate attempt. They just suck at user interface design.
To prove my point: Mr. Clippit (Clippy) the talking paper clip. Need I say more?
As mentioned before, you can use drag and drop to open the file in whatever application you want. In addition, if the application you want to use is already running and you double-click a document, it'll open in said application. Works great for opening PDF files in Acrobat instead of Acrobat Reader!
This is so stupid I'm surprised those morons at slashdot posted this story, its unbelievable that this made it as far as to the front page of a website real people actually visit. Ehh, i dont know what else to say, its just stupid, moronic...etc..
I'm not a smorgasbord.
Right Click -> Open With -> Choose Program
Select your program and check "Always use the selected program..."
How much easier can it get?
This is the dumbest article I've read. I'm not suprised Taco posted it.
-- until you want to switch the program you use for a particular file type. Then, you're basically at Microsoft's mercy...
"Uh...Yea, Scott...Absolutely..."
Scott Rosenburg is smiling because he is being payed to write spoo for tech consumers with point and click anxiety. I doubt he gives a hoot about file extensions or monopolies. It's his job to succeed in "informing" you with this kind of rump roast.
Sorry, but a "call to arms" over file extensions?
Scott, I'll assume you don't really care what you write as long as someone takes you seriously.
Ok, did anyone realize that windows 3.1 had a registry? Yes, it did. In the heady days of win 3.1, I found a text editor (shareware) that would, ironically, open up a 5Meg text file of MS's ftp site. (would note pad do it...oh, hell no).
... shitware editor is not installed, please re-install (ok, this is the exception, not the rule to winfile rules all).
/. knows that...guess what, people...most people don't.
/.'ers are so far removed from the real world/ the 'trenches' / the 'average user' that they *conveniently forget* what being a newbie is about. It is about fear of the unknown, or at minimal, not knowing what to do and hoping for some guidance.
... some one is usually helpful.
Well, after figuring out that this text editor sucked, I un-installed it. Double clicked on a text file...shareware editor is not installed.
Associated it via the file manager
Ok, so I write the programmer and bitch him out saying "WTF did you do to my machine?"
I de-installed your program and *IT REFUSES TO GO AWAY*.
Well the response was a walk thru into the registry to remove the association.
(he was offended by my language, but that was the point, however could not refute my claims of screwing up my machine...let me repeat *MY MACHINE*)
Back then the registry was just another idea to give *programmers control of machines* not the person who owned/used the fricking thing.
These were in the days when if a program, oh, say deleted critical dll's (like a solitare prog that would delete vbrun*.dll) if you fiddled with it or tried to fool it. Malicious intent, I believe it was called.
Yes, I know I can "right click, open with or drag and drop or drag a file from explorer, hover it over an open programs taskbar icon and drop it on the title bar {did you know about that one? probably not} to open the file". 1001 and one ways, same goddamn cat gets skinned over and over.
I know that, most of
Case in point: 2 graphics artist I used to work with...one was a "mac veteran" the other a windows user, on a mac @ work... neither one knew you could drag a file (just about any) onto a program/alias(aka shortcut) and have it launch/open the file.
I was dumbfounded... the "newbie", ok, the "mac vet"... You're kidding.
Hell, 90% (and this is being kind) of the users I've run across will find a file in windows explorer and then run their program to open it and do the "File->open" and *renavigate* instead of double clicking on the *file*.
OMG... the shame, the shame...
I ask why? Why? the answer is usually along the lines of "that is what I know".
No matter how many times I show them the easy way...the always go back to what they know (right, wrong or indifferent).
(Sigh)
And what is even more appalling is the
With mac's, it is there to an almost zealous extent.
Unix? there is some community nature, ignoring the RTFM's/flames
Windows? Hah! It is an *industry standard*, on 9X% of computer in the world...you should be *born* with the knowledge! Seems to be the opinion even from windows users themselves.
Yeah, mucking with extensions is not high treason.
But, we've been here before (at least I have).
Usability and Control over your own system (or that of the average user "we" seem to be wanting to protect and help and free from being a "slave to MS/dmca/sssca/riaa/mpaa" are the same one we are shunning with "they should know this..."
Tell me how many unix systems you could run from the CLI less than a year after birth?
Uh, huh.
I don't know all the answers, but dammit, some of us are trying to find the right questions.
Moose.
"You ain't pretty, and you ain't strong. So, dammit you better be *smart*.
Elenor Roosevelt's Mother to her daughter.
Have you read the moderator guidelines? Well, have you, PUNK? (and I want a Karma: Gnarly option)
it is very simple to associate file types with programs ... there are even many ways to go about this task ... hold shift and right click pick open with ... or click properties on a file and then click the button that says Opens with X Change ... and of course in the registry and in the folder options ... i don't think there is some sort of attempt to hide these options ... however there is software (not necessarily by MS) that is very persistant about modifiying these assosciations.
... mac files never want to open with the right program unless they were created on that computer and you have the software installed.
And as far as elegance goes it's a much better sytem than on a mac
there is nothing wrong with file extensions , they are a standard, and i don't believe MS overly takes advantage of file type assosciations.
MoRe... LaTeR... -=PJK=-
Ok, first off, I don't get how this article is "worth a read". Maybe you don't realize, Taco, that MS is designing an OS for total incompetents. I have worked in an office full of middle-aged women who were so computer illiterate, they were almost to the point of calling the mouse the "pointy clicky thingee". Changing file extensions is something that can hose the system up, not in a dangerous way, but it can prevent files from opening properly. I think it's just right in W98 - it's hidden from the lusers and anyone with any curiosity will easily find it under folder options.
Secondly, I don't see how you "honestly never thought about" is before. I'm "honestly" disappointed in you, Rob. =P
Forcing MS to quit hiding OS functions won't help things. Forcing them to stop embracing, extending, and crushing open standards, WILL.
-Kasreyn
Kasreyn: Cheerfully playing the part of Devil's Advocate to hairtrigger
I hate that piece of trash too. I only install realplayer, well, cuz there's always some moron who thinks its the best (and only) way to distribute video/audio via the net.
Here's how you can stop it being so hoggy (RP8 in this case):
- Click View
- Click Preferences
- Click the Geneneral tab
- Click the Settings button under start center
- Uncheck the Enable StartCenter checkbox
- Click OK
- Tell RealPlayer that you know your computer will set on fire for doing that
- Exit RealPlayer
- Free Bonus: If you choose "remind me later" as the registration option twice, the third time it will add an option "Do Not Register". Click it and enjoy. This also works with the plus players, BTW.
If you could be told what you can see or read, then it follows that you could be told what to say or think - BoC
- Power users (who aren't really affected).
- Novice users for whom the concept of file associations is still beyond the scope of what they can (or want to) understand.
- Novice users who fit into the gap between #1 and #2.
I believe that anyone sophisticated enough to understand and make changes to file associations can already be classified as a power user. I'm thinking that the concept of registered file types is beyond most novice users -- regardless of how easy it may be to change the associations. Let's say that I'm a novice user and want to open an MP3 file with WinAmp, but Windows Media Player comes up if I double-click. What are my options? I can run WinAmp and drag the MP3 file to it. If I'm a persistent novice user, then I may want to change the association. A quick trip to the WinAmp preferences will give me the ability to do that. And what if Microsoft had made it very easy to modify associated file types? Would I right-click? But a lot of novice users don't know much about right-clicking, especially if they were Mac users. Right-clicking is more of a power user thing. Would I go to the control panel? But a lot of novice users don't even know of the existence of the control panel, much less how to use it. The control panel falls into the system administration arena. By the time my hypothetical novice user learned enough about Windows to change the file association, I believe he/she would be well on his/her way to becoming a power user.I suggest that group #3, above, is a relatively small percentage of computer users, and the solution presented in the article would not solve the underlying problem of Microsoft's dominance.
Check out Chad's News
I think the guy that wrote this article is a weakling. It's easy as hell to change the registered file types. And the people out there that may have problems changing the registered file types are most likely people that are not very computer savy in the first place, and therefore would have no reason to change that registered file type anyway. And when someone wants to open a document in a program other than what was designated to open it, 90% of the time they open that program and go to the file->open menu. You have to remember, windows was made for the idiot user. It was made to let the people of the world that do NOT want to learn what rm -rf, or mkdir, or chown do (didn't want to use dos commands, they are bartely useable anyway), it's for people that like purty buttons and pictures to guide them around the internet and tell them how to do things, and they don't care. Because if they DID care, they'd learn how to change thier registered file types.
I'm not drunk, I'm just in touch with pi.
Our friend keeps saying there needs to be a way to let YOU decide
what gets opened with what by default. A program that will let you
map a file type to whatever application you wish.
So someone should write this program. Make it freely downloadable.
License it freely to third party software developers who realize this
is one of the best things they can include with their program to insure they aren't steamrollered by Windows. Heck, write your own version of Code Red that installs this program on every machine it encounters. Or release a report that tells IT departments how much they can save in terms of time or TCO if they'll just deploy this in their organization (see, there's default installs, and there's default installs).
Sometimes I've wondered if it would be possible to seriously combat how microsoft does their dirty work by setting up a website to the effect of "http://www.betterthandefaultinstall.com". Tips, tools, and free software for the user who wants to get the most out of their computer! This app could go on it....
Libertarianism is rich wolves and poor sheep playing gambler's ruin for dinner.
we all know that
i was going to the
my blog
File extensions are not a Microsoft ploy to maintain their monopoly. This is a misinformed and ill-researched article that undermines the cause it ostensibly promotes.
.." approach doesn't always work. If you have IE on your machine, try opening a ".xml" file using notepad - you will get various error messages. This is because the "Use DDE" flag is set to on for .xml files' default mapping to IE. I agree that any end-user would have a problem remapping xml files to any other application. However this seems to be an evidence of bad design, not evil intentions.
Having said that, the "Open With
If the author has picked on file formats rather than file extensions, he would have a much stronger case...
mime types are nice when possible, but I will take extensions/suffixes over magic bytes any time!
Guess what MS has listenned :-) In XP the open with menu is always available witha right click wether the file is already associated with a program or not. Even better if you openned it once with notepad and once with IE both are not available to you under the open with menu... along with a 'pick another program'. You could not make it more easy.
./
All this 'Ms is doing this and that to strenghten their monopoly' is pure BS when it's done by a stupid I-dont-have-aclue-with-my-mac-and-I-hate-Ms "journalist" who want to get posted on
Nuff said.
GloP
When you try to open a file that the OS doesn't know how to handle, it presents a window that shows the applications that say they can handle the type and you get to choose. To change an association click on the file -> get info -> Open with application -> then pick from a list of apps that say they can handle the type. If you want the change to apply to all documents of that type instead of just that one file, press the change all button. It's not perfect but it beats MS's system.
It should be simple enough to write a program that, upon install, adds an additional key under HKEY_CLASSES_ROOT\*\shellex\ContextMenuHandlers that gives the user another context menu of "Change which program opens this file".
n install) , perhaps with those known to open the given file type listed first.
:)
The program would bring up an interface perhaps somewhat like "File Types" dialog now, but with simpler options. Something like:
"This type of file [MP3 music file] is currently set to open with Windows Media Player [insert icon here]. Would you like to change this behavior? "
If the user clicks "yes", they are presented with a list of programs out of the Add/Remove Programs list (hklm\software\microsoft\windows\currentversion\u
It would have to be AOL-easy, of course, as that would be the target audience...
Any VB/VC/BP/tk coders out there wanna take a crack at it?
nuclear presidential echelon assassination encryption virulent strain
Whizzmo
if you on the file, select 'open with', select your app and tick 'always open with'.
Very easy to do.
-- hjw http://puzl.info/
Congratualions you just described the OS/2 System object model. It does pretty much exactly what you said however it had more features then just that. Apps could also register themselves as filters or conversion routines. So you could right click on a au file and convert it to a wav without having to open any application. It was never really taken far enough but damn it kicked ass.
What I like about kde is that it seems to be growing closer to the os/2 object model over time but with some nice newer additions. However I feel metadata on a file is not likely to appear in linux for a while simple because of lack of good filesystems for it. It looks like reiserfs4 will support that but it is a year off at best.
Computer modeling for biotech drug manufacturing is HARD!
...when it's broken. At least on the Windows machine I can (fairly) easily reset *one* file type (shift-right-click). If the Mac ever gets a file type wrong, or I download a file that has a messed up creator tag, I have to go through hell to get it to work again. Open ResEdit (download it if I don't have it), look up the correct creator codes from an existing file, apply these codes and save the file. Now I can open the file. Sheesh. All I want is a simple way to choose which application should open a file. Is that too much to ask? :)
KangarooBox - We make IT simple!
Like, almost literally what you suggest. Maybe Microsoft innovates occasionally after all.
Having recieved a porn bomb in Outlook yesterday that exploded from my preview pain when I tried to erase it, I'm suddenly interested in the default behavior of certian files. We run NT, service patch 6, here at work, and the company has been very good about applying Nimda, Code Red, Mellissa, I love you and all of those freaking virus patches.
Well, imagine my disapointment when I could not find file types .jse, .js, .vbs, .vbe, and .wsf, to set the default application to notepad. What a supprise! The default dialog box has hidden those file types from me. Nice security, I can't keep anonymous emails from running as root.
I imagine this same kind of behavior being pushed onto other filetypes soon. Monopoly? They would like to be, but I tell my friends that Debian is easier.
Twitter, posting as anonymous because because the auto login did not work. I hope that this post gets through the other 850 denial of service posts stuck onto this article by the MicroTurds. I'll repost as soon as I can.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
PaintShop Pro has one of the best method of managing file associations. After running it the first time, it brings up a list of all the files it can open and asks you which ones you want to associate with it. At any time you can go to the File menu and relinquish these associations.
As for the shareware period expiring, I don't know about the latest version, but older version would keep right on working, allowing you to remove the file associations if you didn't like the program.
The Windows Managed Installer is one of the worst things to have ever come out of Redmond! I've had a problem with almost every program I've ever installed under the wmi...and the problem could only be fixed by a reinstall. This became such a problem that I had to copy the setup files of one of my most commonly used programs to our network. Whenever the Office 2000 help system crashed, none of the other programs installed with the wmi worked anymore. ARGH!!
Here at work, I no longer have access to file types .jse, .js, .vbs, .vbe, and .wsf. Why not? Because the little "file types" dialog did not show them to me. So there, a great and grevious abuse you can expect as a MS user in the future. What makes you think MS does not own "Open With", "Send To" and any of those other closed source convenience applications?
I found this out after getting a mail bomb from a porn site. It opened two browsers and did God knows what else before I could kill it. Yes, the company has applied ALL of the MS patches. NO, I DID NOT DOUBLE CLICK ANYTHING! As a corporate user, I am powerless. XP, I'm sure, will duplicate this situation with M$ as remote Admin, and user as powerless.
This goes beyond a legitimate argument to just finding something to complain about because complaining about microsoft is the thing to do.
I don't think so.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
Windows Me and Windows 2000 make it extremely simple to switch registered file types.
Right Click on a file,
choose Open With >
you are presented with a list of already
associated programs AND an option to choose a
new program.
Also you should note that a similar facility was available in earlier versions of windows when you hold shift and right click on a file.
So please do your research before you start microsoft bashing. It just makes us look as bad as they are with their speaches likening GPL software to Cancer.
As an aside:
I have no idea if this works on Windows XP. And I don't want to know as I never intend to deploy it in my office. Bwahahah!
Ever thought the one might have something to do with the other? Their not immuzining everyone cause they don't have enough... Jackasses
Micro$oft has had an ongoing campaign to push their own file types over those of "competing" file types. A distinction only the PR Nazi's at M$ could make. HTML to HTM? DOC incompatibilities? GIF files future a short one?
The worst thing about the Internet is that it took less than a decade for this publicly created resource to become a commercial battleground for around three giant multi-international-hyper-mega-Net bullocks companies.
And we customers are the losers.
Some customers are getting hip to this crap. And they are looking at the technology and beginning to wonder if this is really of any use at all. I mean, why should anyone (anyone laying down his hard earned cash) put up with this sillyness?
Dear M$, you treated me like a chump once too often, you stole my money, you played games with the Internet (something I cared about) and your products suck. I'll never buy your carp again and should anyone in government, business, or personal life ask me, I'll tell 'em to go Linux or MacOS. Heck, I'll recommend FreeBSD too!
There are several easy ways of doing this when you have had a knowledgeable tech mess with your machine.
.reg file and then on their right click miraculously appears an Open in IE and an Open in NN options for local HTML files.
:)
The 2 options I use are to edit the CLSID settings within the registry and give myself an option. Export that registry key and then anyone else just double clicks the
The other is a cleverly crafted shortcut in the windows\sent to folder. These are great if you are advanced.
But can easily be set up so that those not so advanced can easily use for ever more with additional freedom. Not that there are too many non techs who actually want to use more than one product to do any given task. They like one thing to work and they stick with it, (well that has been my experience).
As always each to their own
"I don't know half of you half as well as I should like, and I like less than half of you half as well as you deserve."
I noticed this in the article:"Postscript: Several readers have e-mailed me to outline what they feel are holes in my argument. They point out that in the most recent versions of Windows, a right click on file names will offer you an "Open with" option, and that if you navigate this properly you can check a box that says "Always open files of this type with this program," thus effectively changing the default option."
This isn't entirely true. I've noticed that with Windows2000 (which I'm forced to use at my workplace) will REFUSE to allow another program to open grahic files from the Outlook email program. I prefer AC/DC to browse GIF and JPG files, but M$ insists on bringing up IE for GIF files.
Micro$oft has, obviously and once again, hidden code that forces a user to the M$ ways in spite of any efforts the user makes to control his own computer.
This has always been M$'s arrogant stance. They think it's thier desktop, not yours.
Really? That's interesting. I didn't know.
For those that didn't catch it the first time, I was describing the MacOS model.
I'm not a smorgasbord.
I can't believe nobody has told this: the file type are registered for the Windows Explorer, not the Windows itself. That's why they are under the 'Options' menu in Explorer (on my NT box) and not under the Settings in the Windows Start menu. Of course it's somewhat hard to completely get away of the almighty Explorer (think of standard dialogs) but for normal file browsing you can use something like FAR or whatever. May be we should stop take Windows as a bunch of unreplaceable utilities, that thing is still an OS...
As a hobbyist programmer, I have to say that I feel it is my duty NOT to dance - and nauseate the other dancers - unless one of these two cirumstances applies:
1.)An attractive member of the opposite gender requests that I dance - thus instantly causing me to lose the self-resraint and dignity I normally cling to desperatly, all in an effort to make a favorable impression.
OR
2.) I am attempting to impress a member of the opposite gender who has not yet expressed an interest in me.
Of course, I am only a high school senior, which may have more to do with my opinions on dancing than my sometime-programmer status. Can anyone tell me if this is the case?
I'm the stranger...posting to
The UI for changing file type registrations is not the issue. A court can't order that this be made more intuitive (what's "intuitive"?). However, a court CAN order that Microsoft applications play by the same rules as third party applications and don't get any special preference. For instance, a court can order that preinstalled Microsoft applications DON'T get to commandeer file associations by default - just leave them *undefined* until the application launches first. This is what every other third party application has to do at install, or runtime. Why should Microsoft get a special privilege. There is no technical barrier to this (or at least there shouldn't be one), and if there is one, it only underscores Microsoft's ugly integration and promotion of its own applications. If Microsoft wants to own certain file types, it should have to compete with everybody else on a level playing field - not commandeer them beforehand and then force everybody else to try to take them away. The author briefly touches on this point at the end of the article, but is mostly caught up in the muddy UI issue.
It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?
1. Explorer is one of the worst Windows applications. This is just an example of it's badly designed user interface.
2. It's been like this from day one - long before it became an advantage to Microsoft with the introduction of Windows media player
3. There is nothing at all stopping some one writing a user friendly application to change the registry entries. In fact I would be suprised if this isn't already done
4. When you install an application with an associated file extension, normally it overwrites the existing asociation. Therefore installing Winamp would probably overwrite the default app for MP3 files (haven't tried it)