Slashdot Mirror
Microsoft Plans Deliberate Xbox 360 Shortage
An anonymous reader writes "To ensure an immediate "sellout" of the Xbox 360 on launch day (therefore getting lots of media buzz about their new console), Microsoft will simply restrict the supply down to a trickle. My favorite part of the article: "In addition to limiting the per-store stock of consoles and having the retailers prepare to prominently note the unit's "sold out" status, Microsoft has allegedly asked Norwegian retailers to sign an agreement that they'll sell out of the consoles on the launch date."
Looks like it's not a rumour.
Oh, boy. This sort of dishonesty is becoming more and more rampant in corporate culture. As companies become larger and more powerful, they are less susceptible to the consequences of their actions. Remember Microsoft's use of fake "grassroots" letters to the editor in city papers nationwide? Or how about Sony's more recent debacle where they were caught red-handed installing rootkits on their customers computers? Of course it does not help that the US is headed up by an equally dishonest administration....
But ah well, Sony probably does the same thing. It's the media/customers that are kinda stupid for falling for these schemes...
This just in, Slashdot proves that it has no shortage to the number of dupes it posts.
I am defenseless. Use your button. Mod me down with all of your hatred.
Nothing to see here move along.
Hulk SMASH Celiac Disease
The force that blew the Big Bang continues to accelerate.
This is crap. They know demand will be high but they are restricting this anyway? Personally, I would be happy if stores would only let you reserve 1 360 per person to prevent the idiots buying 4 boxes and profit taking from desparate people on eBay. Granted, I don't feel for anyone trying to get this thing AT the launch day or soon thereafter. After Jan, they will be more available.
Gorkman
It's not exactly original or unheard of. Plenty of other companies have done this, including Slashdot's favorite company, Apple.
I know slashdot and the nutjobs will make this out to be some part of evil conspiracy, but it's really just simple economics.
If anybody rails on MS over this, you'd have to scream about every oother company that does this too. But they won't because Microsoft is the devil.
It's not like you could ever not buy into the hype and let the things rot on the shelf by not going out to buy them on day one!
Curb CO2 emissions: Kill yourself today!
Not buying one anyways.
I don't own an Xbox but I am super pleased that they are coming out with the new version because it then means that the regular Xbox games and console will be coming way down in price. That means I'll be able to finally afford a console that plays games pretty darn well... probably under the current $150 going price for a new unit, and games will be relatively cheap either new or used.
:-)
Of course, I have missed out on a couple of years of playing the console but it'll still be fun for me. After all, Halo is brand new to me and I'll get the same enjoyment and playability out of it that you all did a while back.
p.s. I am the guy that buys all the games in the $5 and $10 bin, including the triple packs you can sometimes buy at Marshalls and TJMaxx.
This post brought to you by your friendly neighborhood MBA.
Isn't it about selling as many Xbox 360's as they can? SO why stop people from buying them, by only selling a few?
To dare, is to do.
Just because of that I will hold out and buy the new Nintendo system next spring. I hate crap like that. /meh...
"Hey remember back when the PS2 came out? They tried to sell it earler than the competition, so they released a sub-par console quickly rather than wait, and didn't have nearly enough consoles to cover demand."
"Yeah, and they're the leaders of this generation..."
"Exactly, so you know what we have to do to beat Sony... release it even earlier, even buggier, and in even shorter supply!"
"Yeah, in fact, let's make the supply so damn low that it will sell out even if it fails sales targets! Then people will be impressed and buy the console once it gets back in supply."
"But how about the people who get one at launch? When they pay so much for a buggy system because of its short supply and there's barely any good games for it, won't they get pissed?"
"Yeah, but what are they gonna do? They already bought the console. And they'll completely forget about it once the good games come out (around the PS3/Revo launch)."
"Sounds good to me."
"When the atomic bomb goes off there's devastation...but when the atomic bong goes off there's celebraaaaation!"
Really, if I were thinking about buying a console, I would wait for the Play Station 3.
Meh.
I don't know why you would call this "crooked". They are taking a gamble for a marketing strategy. They could just overproduce and hope they sell all of the first batch or they could sell a bunch first week and sell out there by creating more of a buzz. They are the only ones who could possibly be hurt in this. Crooked? No, but stupid? Maybe.
MS is already the largest developer of software on the planet
No, that would be IBM
Auctions would reduce problems with insiders who buy multiple copies of the product at retail and sell scarce goods on eBay. It would also avoid mob scenes in which desperate parents storm the doors of stores known to have the much-sought product. Finally, winning bidders would have some assurance that they will be able to get the scarce item.
Two wrongs don't make a right, but three lefts do.
Pretty cool interview with mechanical engineeer for the 360.. You can almost sense his disgust when talking about the environmental standards the new system has to live up to:0 theguts.htm
http://www.xbox.com/en-US/hardware/xbox360/xbox36
~jennifer.k~
Who cares?
:-) like fire hazardous power cables and the like. Being an early adopter just qualifies you for "sheep" status.
It isn't as if Sony and Nintendo don't do the same.
That and I'd wait for a while before buying it anyways. Let them work out the rev.1 bugs
That and who cares? If your friend gets one instead of you it means you can spend more time out of your house. It's all good.
Tom
Someday, I'll have a real sig.
Usually the 1st realease of most consoles are a) buggy b) overpriced c) lacking in game support.
Its not until 6 months down the track when the amount of games increase, prices drop and they bring out a revised and bug fixed version anyway.
federal price-fixing indictment?
Remember the PSP launch? Remember how there was ridiculous prices on ebay and for presell? Do you remember what happened launch day? The local walmart sold hardly any and had a lot left over. It makes you wonder if these companies systematically engage in PR that gives the appearance of big demand to stimulate buzz.
The Xbox360 is the same way; it looks to me that at launch there are no games worth buying combined with a high price and an admission that later consoles will be better because they'll have an HD-DVD built-in and you get the impression that this will lay a big egg on launch.
Really, is anybody chomping at the bit to get one of these *now*? Maybe in about 6-12 months, but there's nothing compelling about this right now.
You were mistaken. Which is odd, since memory shouldn't be a problem for you
Stop bitching, it's not like Microsoft is the only one that does this.
Every year, there's a toy that's extremely popular, but impossible to get.. like Tickle Me Elmo, Furby, and etc. This is just normal business tactics to create hype and demand.
Now, how many other M$ things have they done this with?
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
This has been going on for DECADES!!! Does anyone remember the Furby?! No, but due to its "shortages" it was the hottest toy of the year. The same was true of the Tickle-me-Elmo. Pet Rocks. Beenie-Babies. It's well known in marketing that the appearance of scarcity increases demand.
Heck, look outside all the hot clubs. The mere fact there's a line makes people think it's the cool place to be. People are sheep. Get used to it!
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
for Microsoft if after this kind of rumors, it does not sell out at all. And to do this thing around Christmas is really not a good idea anyway. People are not going to wait till the end of januari before they can buy a Christmas present for their kids. They will buy another console, or they will wait for the next birthday/vacation.
My wife's sketchblog Blob[p]: Gastrono-me
So, the slashdot summary seems to imply that this is simply an evil marketing ploy by Microsoft. Instead, I see it as a way of keeping the new Xbox in a position where consumers don't forget about it.
If the new Xbox sold out the first day (or two) & there weren't any more units for another month (like the PS2), how many consumers are going to forget about it? How much marketing momentum do you lose when everyone has to wait a month before they can hope to get the "next big thing"?
If, on the other hand, it sells out on the first day, but customers are told that there will be another shipment in 3-4 days, they'll be a lot less likely to forget about it. Not only that, but when when they do get one, they will still have the excitement of being an early adopter - and I'm sure that will translate to more accessories being sold.
If I were a Microsoft shareholder, I'd be happy with this rollout...
The money is not going to be made by the console, it'll be made by the games, so rather than go for maximum console sales, put the limitation in place to generate hype and now the console is part of the advertising scheme and ends up being a better value for MS.
And anyway, who cares? If you understand this is a ploy it will not really affect you (unless you really really really wanted a 360 on day one). But, I doubt they would do it without having reason to believe it would boost the console's appeal to some people. People that might not have realized tactics like this are used regularly. And those people need to read some books, like "How to Lie With Statistics," to gain some perspective on advertising in genenral.
1 (short ton / firkin) = 89.1432354 slugs / keg
Ah, Linux on the Cell processor !
Hey, everybody! Check out the all new Cartmanland! It's our Graaand Opening! Cartmanland has over a hundred fabulous rides , six roller coasters , and tons of great surprises! And the best part is: You can't come!! That's right, because at Cartmanland, only I, Eric Cartman, can get in! That means only I can ride the all-new Tornado Twister, a roller coaster that splashes in the water! Wow! It's the greatest amusement park in the Colorado area! And nobody can go!! Especially Stan and Kyle!! HAHA!! So come on down to Cartmanland now! But don't plan on getting past the parking lot, 'cause remember:
So much to do at Cartmanland, but you can't come! Especially you, Stan and Kyle.
... because they got a contract clause demanding to first put out the console version, and eevn worse, get a dumbed down PC game for it as well, I sure wont buy any console. The trend seems to be rising that games are produced for consoles first, most notibly XBox, and then crappily "converted" to PC with all the limitations that exists on consoles. Why would you buy an XBox considering that it consists mostly of regular PC hardware?
I spent 3 seconds on the arstechnica article posted and see that Microsoft has two options
1) Ship a boatload at once, then have a period where none are available
2) Stream out the shipments so that a constant, but limited supply are available
They saw from the PS2 launch, that the public reaction to option 1 wasn't very good.
So....they choose option 2.
It's a business choice made when weighing manufacturing constraints vs customer reactions.
Of course Slashdot wants to hype this up as yet another reason why Microsoft is evil, and people are biting.
Tell me, which organization here is the one playing psych games with their customers?
Help me take back Slashdot. When did 'News for Nerds' become 'FUD and Conspiracy Theories for Extremist Nutjobs'?
It is a basic human instinct to aggresively persue what is in short supply (i.e. want what you can have, a.k.a. : "wow, its sold out, it must be really good")
I am perfecting the fine art of stating the obvious.
I'm a huge gamer, I drool over ps3 info, and think the Nintendo Revolution is looking interesting. Yet for the life of my I can't get excited over X-box 360. There are plenty of original X-box games I saw that made me want to buy that system. This time around is really just looks boring. It's an overpriced system, where they went out of their way to restrict the uses of it hardware. Can anyone tell me why this system is worth buying?
This is actually quite a good idea from Microsoft.
Hold on, let me explain, put the pitchfork down.
Most consoles have huge date one allocations and sell out. There is then a huge gap while the manufacturer re-supplies, eventually things settle down to normal sales figures and supply can match demand.
If MS limit the number of sales on day one, they can keep units flowing into stores instead of having a slump. You'll keep people coming back and retailers won't have dry periods when they've sold out and are waiting for more stock.
It's a crazy plan, but it might just work.
-- I like the cut of your thinking, young man. - me.
I've figured out Microsoft's hidden motto: "Try not to give the customer what they want."
If they just spread rumors and hyped media bullshit, I wouldn't be terribly surprised, but knowingly limiting the number of consoles available? Maybe they're banking that what happened with the PS2 will happen with them, but they seem to miss a lot of why the PS2 is as it is now.
To ensure an immediate "sellout" of the Xbox 360 on launch day
That could be one way to look at it. Another is that even Microsoft doesn't think they'd be able to sell out in higher quantities.
Enough is enough!
I was previously planning on purchasing both the Revolution and the PS3 - but not anymore. I guess it's Nintendo all the way, this time around.
I have yet to see any launch titles that seems an upgrade over the existing xbox. As the existing xbox division has lost 4 billion dollars so far, I don't have a lot of faith this new generation is going to do much better.
Who wants an xbox360 and why? Where is the draw? All I see is a huge marketing effort to generate a buzz.. but about WHAT?
Consumers have all the power, they just don't realize it. Marketing makes people think they NEED something, when they really don't. Who needs a game console? Most of the games are recycled tired crap anyway. There's lots of other entertaining ways to spend time.
I don't buy ANY Microsoft products anymore - and my life is better for it.
Also, I don't buy industry music - independants are more interesting anyway.
With Sony's rootkit - there's another company off my list!
Avoiding unethical companies is fun, and not as much trouble as one would think. You really need very little of the crap they try to sell you anyway. Try it, it's very emotionally rewarding!
Seems to me that they're leaving money on the table if they can't meet demand. I'm no economist, but if you get people all worked up over a launch, then string them along for a few days, wouldn't that make the frothy lather you've whipped them into fall a bit flat?
By Microsoft saying they are doing this it makes a pre-buzz and thats what their after, My prediction: Microsoft made this anoucement which makes a buzz that their will be a limited amount of xbox 360's so people will be considered it rare and rush to get it, only to get a surprize when the store starts selling them there is way more than enough stock...
Microsoft wins word of mouth that the product will be rare.
Microsoft wins a huge rush for the product.
Microsoft makes sure everyone in the rush gets the product, by accully having enough stock.
Microsoft 'give' the end user the joy of thinking that he got something rare.
Microsoft milks everyone...
Put it short Microsoft is messing with everyones minds... and so is Sun Microsystems but thats for another comment to another article.
Sorry if I didn't explain this in the best possible way I have been awake for 37hrs and am just about to goto sleep... if someone who understand what I am trying to say please explain it in making sence way I would be more than greateful.
Gates is the wealthiest man on the planet
No, that would be Ingvar Kamprad.
this is just once again proof on MS's crooked business "strategies"....
How is this "crooked?" They make the device. It's theirs. This is not some natural resource that only they have access to. They don't have to let anybody profit from selling it. There's no burden on retailers for this - those stores make money when people stand in line at their stores to buy things. If they don't want to be part of that process, they sure don't have to. They can sell plenty of competing products from other companies (providing, as they sign contracts with Sony or Nintendo, that they like the rules that those manufacturers expect them to follow - and don't think they're not just as restrictive).
But just like book stores that know they'd be foolish (despite a tightly controlled marketing/release plan from the publishers) not to sell the next Harry Potter book, or movie theaters that only have so many seats and have to wait until midnight to sell tickets for a new release, XBox retailers can either work with the product's manufacturer or not. They can agree to terms, and make the money, or not agree to the terms, and find another way to make money. Crooked? Crooked is telling a game manufacturer that they have to deliver a product according to your demands, and not their own wishes. It's so simple: if you don't like MS or how they deal with a product debut, then don't buy their game product as a form of entertainment. If everyone does that, then MS's wishes don't mean anything. But then, no one gets the cool toy, either. But let's try to keep a little perspective, here. It's a toy. You're getting cranky about a toy debut marketing plan.
Don't disappoint your bird dog. Go to the range.
Why is this any different to Apple's launch of the iPod, Sony's launch of the PS2 or Nintendo's launch of the Gameboy Advance? All of these "sold out" on the day of their launches.
I have no love for Microsoft whatsoever but they're just a big corporation marketing a product that they just want to sell lots of.
And if they leech money from the countless sheeple who just *have* to have something before anyone else in their street, then I say good luck to them!
Gentoo Linux - another day, another USE flag.
In several recent magazine articles, theyve said that their "will be no shortage on launch day" and "Especially not an articifial one." Either way it wouldn't surprise me but it also still sounds like a rumor to me.
Yes?
Microsoft is a hugely successful company because they take absolutely every opportunity they can to damage their competitors, legally or illegally. Whether it's a publicity stunt, hostile takeovers, or just plain stealing technology, Microsoft will do whatever it can to make sure it maintains an edge.
It's simply upgraded its self-trolling "feature."
Eh, so to sum up your blog post, you're not buying an Xbox360 because you're not a gamer and you only bought your original Xbox to run Linux on it? I understand people like you less than I understand people who derive pleasure out of getting kicked in the nutsack... just go on eBay and buy a used Pentium III for under $100 and you'll have zero problems loading Linux on it.
Newly hired management team is probably taking it more serious, who can blame them?
Actually, it's understated. "Supply shortage" means that there's not actually going to be an XBox360 at all, people will just think that there is.
See, Microsoft has perfected selling vapourware over the years, so this is a natural extension for them.
Xbox.com: Tell me another cool thing about the guts.
JR: Well, we want to discourage hackers, so this time around we didn't put any screws on the outside of the box and have multiple tamper evident labels. So with Xbox 360 we'll be able to tell if they've cracked the case.
Cool. And by cool I mean totally sweet. I was gonna hold out for a PS3, but this killer feature has swung it for me!
nice sig. drop the 'of' in 'all of your hatred' break it into the standard three line 5-7-5 syllable form and you have a nice haiku (in the American sense, though maybe not in the strictest sense)
oh maybe the Oil companines? Maybe the Flu Vaccine makers? Create a preceived shortage, to bolster the supply side of the supply & demand theory and reap the profits. See example "http://www.arkansasnews.com/archive/2005/10/29/We sleyBrown/330272.html" why we were paying $3.50+ at the pump BP Exxon & others were making off like bandits. Why shouldn't Microsoft resort to this?
when they ban enctryption only criminals wi$21*J *#JF$%!@#$':
Perhaps the artificial shortage will be beneficial to those individuals who are planning on purchasing the system just for the sake of purchasing it. Hopefully it will cause a portion of M$'s target audience to reconsider facilitating the company's near monopolization of yet another market.
Part of the hardcore faithful who believed in Apple long before it was cool again to do so
I have been in this business 37 years, so I can assure you - Microsoft loves the xbox. In fact, the company focus is more towards gaming software and hardware than data security. Just about every Windows patch description contains the phrase "allowing the intruder to gain complete control" or words to that effect. Not just a little control - complete control! If anything holds-up the xbox for the holidays it might be that some /.ers figured out how to run Non-Microsoft programs on the thing. By the way, the new xbox is desiged to self-destruct if unapproved programs are used "allowing the intruder no control" over the xbox. This is very important security issue - for games.
he idiots buying 4 boxes and profit taking from desparate people on eBay
Hey, what a good idea! Hmmm, now let me see, where can I find 4 360's quickly?
Yes, I am the one with the legendary sig.
...by not bothering to buy the old Xbox or any other console. I haven't purchased a console since the Dreamcast and couldn't be happier. Whenever I upgrade my computer, I buy a game that occupies my time for, at the most, $50. And no, I don't upgrade just to play the new games. Personally, I think the video game industry is currently overrated.
Someone tell me why a post about the article being a dupe got modded to 5-Informative? It says nothing about the article, dupe or not, nothing about the topic, and yet its still modded up to the maximum. It should be 'offtopic' since it has nothing to do with the content of the article.
/. folks are human? OMGWTF, call the police.
For me this wasn't a dupe since I hadn't read it already, yet the first comment I see is some offtopic crap about a duplicate post. What? You mean the
Note this is also offtopic, but I refuse to hide behind the AC mask, because, well, I just damn well feel like it.
And they said zombies weren't real!
Microsoft are just managing to upset gamers again. I can't remember my source but Japan's famous big 3 gaming stores refused to sell Xbox after Microsoft dishonourably refused to replace disks that where faulty on sale.
If they keep this up they will end up annoying the biggest gaming sector of all. The Rising Sun burns brighter then the setting sun.
Also after having held an Xbox pad I hold few hopes for the 360 if that controller's going to be as big as it's predecessor.
There have been many times when dealing with people that I wished I could kiss my own butt goodbye
This has been done in the past many times. Parents are at the will of the companies.
1) Parent promises child Thing for Christmas.
2) Parent cannot get Thing.
3) Parent buys many other (and/or more expensive) things to compensate.
4) Parent goes out in January (when the stores have many Things in stock) and buys Thing for child.
5) Profit... for the company that makes Thing.
This is all in addition to the media hype surrounding Thing. It's a great way to drive up sales after Christmas when sales are at a low. Most companies just aren't this blatent about it.
1. Get in line to the store, first.
2. When the date comes, buy ALL of the supply. Just come to the counter and say "I want to buy XBOX 360. All of them."
3. Get outside, and sell them all to the crowd waiting, for $499 a piece.
4. If you have any left, sell on EBay.
5. Profit!!!
For better effect arrange the action in cooperation with a bigger team, so you would dry up whole city or a state, and you won't compete with each other in terms of price.
Shortage in supply and excess in demand naturally leads to increase in price. Not exploiting artificially lowered supply with fixed lower price would be unamerican.
Anagram("United States of America") == "Dine out, taste a Mac, fries"
There's nothing sneaky about this - it's a brilliant marketing ploy that has been done again and again. The most recent example is Mazda, who sold out of their new MX-5... By only releasing 300. Of course they were going to sell out, but it's a slow newsworld, and any big manufacturer who sells out of anything nowadays gets headlines.
It's all down to PR, and in war, love and PR, everything is legal.
I think it's an excellent idea.
The Mini Repository - more links
This kind of crap along with making people pay an extra hundred bucks for backward compatibility with the original X-Box is the reason I'm not buying one.
Fuck you, Microshaft. I'm not doing business with you any more.
"Xbox.com: Let's talk about the power challenge first. Is Xbox 360 really twice as powerful as Xbox? JR: Yes. Xbox had less than 100 watts of power; Xbox 360 has over 200 watts."
Seems he has the scientific definition of power in mind, whereas we sort of just want to know how many polygons it'll push.
I mean, in reality, who cares about how much power you need to run the thing? I could make it take 500 Watts and just dissipate 300 Watts as heat. An X-Box-Spaceheater combo.
Plenty, if you're into retro games. I bought Tekken 3 for a fin and a PS1 memory card for $2. I also bought Street Fighter Alpha, Grand Turismo 2 and I think even the PSX re-release of FF I&II for the same price.
Video games haven't made huge leaps in graphics and frame rates since the induction of the 32 bit era, and it's arguable whether these next gen games are any more entertaining either. Point is, the deals are out there if you can lower your standards a notch.
SEO Copywriter. Just Say ON
Typically diabolical Microsoft marketing.
I'm really thinking about switching to anything else. Unfortunately, I've had bad experiences with Apple in the past, and the Linux options remain immature, especially in Japan.
[And what was all that bizarre junk before the preview? CSS problems on top of the moderation-based attacks? (I had 28 moderations in my last report, and many of them were extremely peculiar.) It seems to think that my Firefox has switched to some sort of accessibility mode?]
Freedom = (Meaningful - Coerced) Choice != (Speech | Beer^2), and sad sock puppets' bad mods avail them naught.
Revolution for the win. I'd rather have gaming be about GAMING. Not bullshit specs and broken promises.
Ubuntu- Linux for human beings.
But how many of the others are artificially creating demand by dropping production levels?
...Microsoft starts rumors of planning to deliberately cause an Xbox 360 shortage, in order to drive up preorders.
The XBox 360 will ship with a regular DVD drive unline Sony PS3. People will wait for the XBox 360 v2 that will ship with a Blue Ray drive.
I can't wait for the marketing faces at Microsoft to turn from red to blue...
What would be really funny, is if they still don't run out. I know it's a little far fetched, as most people would buy into the marketing, but it would be interesting to see microsofts reaction. Besides, who has that much money to spend on a new system anyway. let's see $300 for the system that actually has everything, plus $60 for another controller, plus $20 (X2) for those battery packs so you don't run out of power in the middle of the game, plus $60 per game, maybe you should buy 2 or 3. Now you're up at $520 for a nice usable system. $300 isn't a bad price for a system, but once you add on all the extras you need to buy, it really does fall outside many people's budgets.
Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
Heh. This reminds me of the opening scene in Max Barry's novel, Jennifer Government. In it, some (fictional) Nike executives get together and decide that they're going to:
a) restrict supply of their new super-super-hot Nike Mercury shoes to a trickle, so the kids go *nuts* for them, then:
b) unload a few hundred thousand on the market at a hugely inflated price, and THEN:
c) since Nike knows they'll lose that "can't-find-'em-anywhere, selling-like-hotcakes" prestige once people realize they can get Mercuries anywhere, they start shooting a few of the people who buy them to further build street cred.
d) PROFIT!
So, uh, if you're lining up to buy a 360, just watch out for snipers.
Writerati
There's no conspiracy here. Microsoft expects lower sales, and the PR machine is trying to explain why. Are they trying to spin the lower sales in the best way possible? Absolutely. Are the overzealous microsoft markedroids trying to turn the limited availability into positive thing? Of course. Are they deliberately driving down supply? No. The only news is that analysts and microsoft are restating sales estimates. Microsoft says that it's due to a late start in production (believable, given how late the new dev kits were). That might be the reason, or perhaps it's because the 1st gen content is lacking. However, it would be moronic to purposefully drive down supply in order to create "buzz".
I know I'm required to hate Microsoft, but come on. As long as we're throwing out logic, why stop at "Microsoft Plans Deliberate Shortage" when you can have "J Allard Responsible for Lingbergh Baby Kidnapping"?
Could someone who is familiar with the FTC please enlighten us here in the USA if this "planned shortage" is even legal here?
Can they just do that? Help us out here.
I'm a 2000 man.
Unfortunately, the media is already kissing MS ass when it comes to consoles, and they somehow have built up a sizeable rabid fanboy cabal (in four years), so no, there's really no reason to do this, other than to somehow give themselves validation to these two groups (and possibly astroturf some positive spin to the rest of the public).
In the October issue of Electronic Gaming Monthly, MS were quoted as saying they wouldn't use any shortage tactics to promote the XBox 360...
Twinstiq, game news
Seems like MS and Sony are determined to shoot themselves in the foot repeatedly this time around, leaving the door open for the quirky 'Revolution' to step in and catch everyone by surprise. Oddly enough, I can see Nintendo execs laughing their arses off seeing their two main competitors makes all the same mistakes they did generations ago!
From that article: "Xbox.com: Let's talk about the power challenge first. Is Xbox 360 really twice as powerful as Xbox? JR: Yes. Xbox had less than 100 watts of power; Xbox 360 has over 200 watts."
Ow! I feel like someone just sucker punched me in the marketing center of the brain. It's twice as powerful because it consumes twice the power...
Dewey, you fool! Your decimal system has played right into my hands!
Environmental standards are rarely/never so stringent as to impede engineering--they just represent higher input costs for the producer. And as an engineer, he gets the satisfaction of making a product that makes more sense.
are going to provide a free copy of Dianetics, to go with the new XBox. Why get one bestseller when you can get two?
Get thee glass eyes, and, like a scurvy politician, seem to see things thou dost not.--King Lear
And as I've tried to post to slashdot, TWICE, and been rejected. The XBox 360 is causing enough wireless interference to cause walmart's portable computers to be inoperable. Can't come within 40 feet of the xbox, something the unit is doing is blocking the signals of wireless networking. Microsoft is actually sending out cd's and techs to fix the problem by turning off features... Thanks slashdot for actually paying attention to stories that MIGHT MATTER TO PEOPLE WITH WIRELESS NETWORKS...
~~ Please keep your arms, legs, and outright stupidity inside the ride at all times. Thank You ~~
Well, when you can sink no lower, and will do anything to push your product, I guess that this is a viable option. Doing this does a couple of things that will benefit Microsoft:
* They can claim that their consoles "sold out" on the launch date.
* They can keep the price high because, due to the above effect, it will remain in "great demand" for a long time.
Sadly, many people will fall for this, and Microsoft fanboys will gleefully use these "facts" to prove that Microsoft is "the best."
Summary of RoHS legislation from Farnell.
Basically, most electronic products shipped to Europe and operating under 1000V (military and medical products except for now) must not contain 6 restricted substances. One of the biggest is lead. There is a large push in many electronic industries to convert their electronic products to RoHS compliant products. It's a lot of work.
Sony and Nintendo have to do this too if they want to sell their units to Europe. From a general industry trend, Japan tends to be ahead of the game compared to US companies in terms of RoHS preparedness.
Eventually most of the entire world will have this type of legislation.
Uhmmm...Apple does this all the time with iPods. It's marketing, and one reason I'd lump salesmen with lawyers and politicians.
You don't really know what price fixing is.
If you don't know where you are going, you will wind up somewhere else.
What's the diff?
Release All Stock at once
If 100 people want to buy an xbox 360 on 11/22, but there are only 90 to be had. The other 10 people are going to have to wait until more are produced; meanwhile perhaps more people want to buy one creating more people that those 10 would have to compete with when additional systems are released.
Trickle Release
If 100 people want to buy an xbox 260 on 11/22, but only 30 released by MS and another 60 that will release in the near future. 70 people will have to compete with each other and the new interest buyers every time MS sends out a few more system. When all 90 of the original produced systems have finally been released theres still only 90 people with system and the original 10 plus new people interested are left without a sytem. I bet those people aren't buying many xbox 360 game while they are waiting their turn to fight for a system.
I don't get it, What does the trickle release accomplish?
Which option is more evil (and therefore more likely)? I'm guessing that they'll only make the crippled version, but will make and distribute plenty of the bits that turn it into a usable system at a grossly inflated price.
What would you rather do? Wait indefinitely for the real system (knowing that they might never make enough for you to get one), or buy the retared one plus the (let's face it, required) add ons today?
If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
You're right, nobody in the marketing business has ever said something to confuse the competition, and microsoft has never ever lied, ever.
Are you talking about the Japanese version (localization) of Linux distros? Or does Japan not have access to the same Internet as the rest of the world? If you can use an English operating system, then all the mature Linux distros are out there, no matter where you live. If you need a Japanese version, the best way to make it happen fast is to help them with the translation.
After 3 days without programming, life becomes meaningless
- The Tao of Programming
Good luck with that all you potential vultures!
I saw through this last year with the DS and the PSP.
1 of 2 things will occur, neither good for you.
1. There will be too many consoles and the extra console will sell off at or below cost.
2. There will be SO many other people doing what you're doing that you won't be able to stickout from the crowd, and any potential profits to be made on the sale will get eaten from competition.
The idiots who start auctions out on items at 200% or higher of retail cost are the ones who'll learn the lesson hardest.
Good luck!
... then that.
Microsoft may indeed want the hype.
But the reality is is that they can't afford to sell to many Xbox's. This is because they are a publicly traded company and they are paranoid that they can't meet Wallstreet's next quarter financial expectations if they sell to many Xbox 360's. They had a good last quarter due to people renewing long-term subscriptions for Windows server, but they need to do it again to prove that this last quarter wasn't a fluke and that they are making enough money to justify their 22 years price to earning ratio.
This is because each Xbox they sell is _sold_at_a_loss_. They are delibrately losing money on the Xbox 360. They did the same thing when the original Xbox came out.
They are keeping the prices low and attractive to gain market quickly and make the Xbox more competative with the PS3. They plan on making their profits by selling games, and game-related licensing, to owners of Xbox's.
However if they can't meet Wallstreet expectations then that will pretty much doom their stock market prices for another 6-12 months of flat-to-slowly-declining progress that they've been plagued with for the past 4-5 years or so after their stock lost about a 3rd of it's value after the 2000-2001 bubble.
If they sell to many Xboxes... it won't look good to the average investor that doesn't give a shit about gaming and doesn't understand the potentional profitability of game licensing if Microsoft is able to muscle Sony out of a substantial part of the market.
Sony on the other hand knows that Microsoft is faced with this financial delima and has recently raised the PS3 budget substantially in a attempt to get it to market that much quicker.
Of course Sony has the same problem, they are selling the PS3 at a loss.. but I don't think that it will make nearly the impact on Sony's bottom line that it would for Xbox and Microsoft.
...and you can't go. Especially Stan and Kyle, 'cuz I hate those guys.
Just don't buy one. Problem solved!
You can't blame the customer in situations like this. All they are are consumers who want a product.
You can't blame the profit-driven corporations, if people want to be sheep/consumers, if they want to be told what they need and what they want, and not act like the free-thinking, self-realized human beings that they have the potential of being, then f*** 'em, let them be treated that way. Round 'em up.
I figured out during the PS2 rush that if you get out of the city, you have a much better shot at getting one. In the city where I live, there was nary a PS2 to be found just after release. I discovered (by accident) that a smaller community 40 miles away had scads (well, 2-3) sitting on the shelf the first week of release. Friends visiting their folks even further in the sticks confirmed the availability at their local store as well.
I'm heading out to the boondocks on day one to try my luck there. I'll be damned if I pre-pay for something that has no guarantee of being there on day one.
by Mike Buddha -- Someday the mountain might get him, but the law never will.
Getting off topic, but when I say "mature" I mean in the sense that I don't have to spend too much time on system issues and can spend most of my time on doing actual things. Trying to keep this brief, but I think that for me to go with Linux it either needs to be pre-installed by the maker with high assurance of software equivalents for all of my primary applications *AND* the ability to import my old data, which has mostly been trapped in Microsoft formats, or I need to be able to install it as an upgrade that will retain convenient access to my existing Windows software. Cross-booting is not convenient enough, and WINE has very low "assurance" value, and I don't know of alternative approaches...
Freedom = (Meaningful - Coerced) Choice != (Speech | Beer^2), and sad sock puppets' bad mods avail them naught.
Guy1: Hey, did you hear that Microsoft is going to purposefully limit the number of 360's at launch to artificially generate launch buzz?
Guy2: Wow, I can't believe that Microsoft would be so low as to purposefully limit the number of 360's at launch to artificially generate launch buzz!
Guy1: Did you just say that Microsoft was going to purposefully limit the number of 360's at launch to artificially generate launch buzz? My God, this is the second source I've heard this from. Confirmation!
Every hyped gadget release is like this. Why do people buy into the hype? It's better to wait and gauge the reaction, especially after the hysteria has died down and been replaced by more level headed reviews and the number of game titles has increased.
Man, I hate when game companies do this.
:(
Many older consoles (Nintendo, I'm looking at you) use tamper-proof screws for this supposed reason. Of course, any half-serious "hacker" will find a way in, usually because these screws aren't that hard to find bits for, thanks to the Internet. A lot of the original reasoning, which I can sort of understand), was to keep casual users from opening them up and messing with them.
Unfortunately, as our Zelda cartridges age, the built-in batteries (CR2032, for anyone who cares - one of the most common "watch" batteries out there) are mostly all dead. In order to use these games anymore, you have to open them up and replace the battery.
Tamper-proof screws make this VERY difficult.
Put labels all you want, if it's warranty you're worried about. But please, understand that these things do need repair from time to time, especially after they're out of their expected lifetime. ESPECIALLY with moving parts inside (Sony, I'm looking at you!). There's nothing worse than having to wreck the casing just to get in and fix a few loose wires
Endless arguments over trivial contradictions in books written by ignorant savages to explain thunder in the dark.
Has anyone here ever been to a club in NYC? Ever waited in a long line to get in only to find a half empty place when you finally enter? The appearance of high demand/low supply can itself generate demand. I'd love to bash M$ as much as the next guy but this goes on in all sorts of businesses.
http://www.worldsoccerbars.com
Honestly, who didn't see this coming? And not only that it is truly a shortage due to poor planning, however they are doing their damndest to spin it their way.
/. but it was rejected as always.
Last week Microsoft made their most telling announcement in their stock talks, stating that they will have much lower eranings and sales in their game console area. They claim it is part of a "rolling-thunder" campaign, but it is utter B.S. I submitted the story to
So as it stands, we have fals shortage, stupidly expensive pricing, cheaper crippled consoles (which will hurt developers utilizing the HDD no matter what MS says), spotty backwards compatibility, numerous graphical issues/artifacts (as reported by Wal-Mart Kiosks), no optimized launch titles (not even first-party titles), no Japanese interest, and countless other nebulous facts/figures... not looking good.
Have all the fake shortages you want, when there is no demand after the initial fanboy's flock, shortages will be the least of the concerns.
http://teasphere.wordpress.com - A little spot of tea
Micrsoft IS the Devil , and has its cock deeply implanted in your Anus. But you U like that , don't you ?
How dare they limit the numbers being sold. I just won't buy one. Oh, wait. I wasn't going to buy one anyways.
...oh my.
;)
So if I judge correctly based on all the "sheep" comments I see, then a person who buys a shiny new Xbox360 on opening day is just an uneducated lemming marching onward in the direction 'the machine' tells them to?
Man, I hadn't thought about it like that before... I guess I'll just give up playing games on their platform. After all... if they decided to do something as dirty as keep supply constant over the entire holiday season by throttling shipments, then there's no reason for me to believe their games or online play will be any good. The way that the units are marketed and sold are very indicative of gameplay and functionality, after all.
(ok, sarcasm aside now...)
If hardcore gamers with $400 burning a hole in their pocket want to drop it on the single newest and most advanced video game console (to date)... that's fine. Before you get ready to throw all the sheep in the pen, just consider how much _you'll_ be shelling out for this system in 6 months... I doubt waiting half a year is going to improve your bottom line by any significant amount--even if it does keep you from the ranks of those who go "baah".
I thought most people would eventually stop expecting 'a sense of fair play' from Bill's creative PR crew and just embrace the product if they want it, and blow it off if they don't.
Besides... when was the last time you fired up Halo 2 and thought about all the dirty and underhanded business practices going on in Redmond. Get real... sometimes a cigar is just a cigar... and in this case, a new video game console is just that... a new video game console.
(take your coat, it'll probably be cold out when you're standing in line)
P.S. -- Are you expecting much better from Sony? Maybe instead of shady marketing ploys, they'll just give us a CPU with a native DRM root-kit built right in... free of charge.
Therein lies the challenge for a manufacturer auction, as their motives and marketing practices would be suspect (hence the parent post).
RichM
Data Center Knowledge
How is this "crooked?"
It is "crooked" in that it is deceptive. They are trying to use product supply and marketing to trick people into thinking something that is not true. Some of us think when a company blatantly lies to it's customers and potential customers, you know that is a bad thing. Yes, yes, I know all marketers are liars and "everybody is doing it." That is not an excuse.
I looked for a PSP for over a month since the Sept 1 launch. Huuge billboards advertising the PSP, but every store is out! (finally found one only to return it for a full refund with 3 dead/lazy pixels and Wipeout pure producing garbled graphics after a couple of minutes play)
-adnans
"In short: just say NO TO DRUGS, and maybe you won't end up like the Hurd people." --Linus Torvalds
Would you rather Microsoft pay more to their suppliers so they can pass those costs along to you?
MS appears to me to be independent of passing costs or savings on to consumers, they simply charge what the market will bear.
Me neither - I think Microsoft is being bloody crooked by telling anyone in the first place that they're even developing a console. I think they should just set up a booth in each city where they want to sell it then leave people to come and look if they want. If they like it, they'll buy it - simple, no need for this evil advertising malarky.
If medicine were ever perfected, we'd all be the same.
One of the best comments I've read in months.
I feel the same way. The good news is that companies in the far east have recently taken to making replacement cases in various colors for most of the consoles, if you can stand giving up the stock look.
{ - Generic Guy - }
I sent this article over to the product guys here at Rhino Video Games and it seems they sent out a memo to all of our stores, oops. Hope that doesn't generate any bad press... I typically don't have much of a problem with Microsoft as most people on here do, but when something this deceptive occurs I can't help but feel angry. Just another reason why I won't buy an X-Box 360.
I will forever be a student.
Look, I know that Slashdot is an aggregator, just like Google News is an aggregator and sometimes Ars Technica, but Ars didn't write that story--Reuters did. The Ars post would not exist without the Reuters story. So for Christ's sake, simply click through _find_ the Reuters story, and link it!
JR: Definitely. Xbox 360 had to meet the Lead Free requirements and be RoHS compliant. Xbox.com: I'm thinking that probably has nothing to do with the Rodents of Unusual Size from The Princess Bride.
Does God treat us as servants or friends? Check my homepage.
Of course the sales will be slow:
1. Parents won't see a need to buy another X-box for $300-$400, when the current one looks just fine to them.
2. Half of the launch titles are sequels, remakes, or updated sports games. The others look like regular Xbox titles with better graphics.
3. The PS2 will drop to $99 very soon.
It's a good thing we have Sony who doesn't play dirty games like that. No, the Japanese companies are all clean and honest. Just ask Kodak how fair it was to try to compete against Japanese film companies in their country. And if you don't agree then we'll send the Gasaraki Super Force Happy Thursday to sick their tentacle monster on you!
You ridiculous fucking twat. Slashbotting at its most pathetic. In what way exactly does this...
...count as marketing gloss? He was asked if it used twice as much power, and he said yes, it does. It doesn't 'purposefully gloss over the distinction', because to a normal human being, unlike your aspergers-riddled self, its fucking obvious that they are talking about power of the wattage kind.
Xbox.com: Let's talk about the power challenge first. Is Xbox 360 really twice as powerful as Xbox?
JR: Yes. Xbox had less than 100 watts of power; Xbox 360 has over 200 watts.
Beautiful. So Microsoft plays marketting games. As others have pointed out, it's just business as usual (fucking businesses-- their charters should be revoked).
And what do I see at the bottom of the webpage?
Advertising is the rattling of a stick inside a swill bucket. -- George Orwell
Suuuu-EEEEE. Suuuu-EEEEEE.
Microsoft is to software what Budweiser is to beer.
What a great marketing plan. If only they put as much into actually building good product...
Considering how much they will be losing on each unit and how questionable the quality might be, this is a very good move for them. But it does follow their typical process of providing new releases before the products are ready. Especially when there is someone else already in the market( Sony in this case ).
OT. Something to watch with this release is if MSFT can get hardware OEMs to take the hardware losses and how the device and software vendors are willing to give MSFT more of their profits. These are all plans MSFT has had in order to try and stop the losses in the Xbox division. After 9 years, they finally have the WinCE division losses down to double digit( millions ) per quarter. Lackluster investor interest in MSFT is not going to be helped by more massive quarterly losses in the XBox div. IMO.
LoB
"Anyone who stands out in the middle of a road looks like roadkill to me." --Linus
Anyway, an email went out around the agency asking for people who were available and didn't mind "helping out" on launch night. After responding, I discovered that the company were asking for staff to go out to the midnight openings around town and buy up consoles, games and peripherals. They wanted to make sure that at least London (which is where the media would be doing all their reports) would sell-out nice and quickly. We were told, if we brought the receipts into the office the next day we would be given a full refund and would be able to do whatever we wanted with the hardware itself. I ended up buying 6 consoles, which were given away to various friends and family.
In all seriousness, the Microsoft story would be more newsworthy if they actually made an effort to provide satisfactory stock for everyone. Seems pretty par-for-the-course to me.
Dude, it's totally not deceptive! Obviously we know exactly what Microsoft's doing. Are we being decieved? No! We know exactly what they're doing! If Microsoft didn't want this information to leak out, they could have stopped it. But the information is out. Just because they're not coming directly out and saying that this is what they're doing, that doesn't mean that they're deliberately lying to people! It's three weeks till launch. News of this is already out among the Slashdot community. It won't take long at all before the rest of the world gets wind of this. So nobody is being decieved here.
I hope you're a troll. Slashdot is not the world and most news agencies don't bother to print articles like this. They will print, "Xbox360 sells out in 3 hours!" because it will sell more papers.
Here is one place where Microsoft is NOT a monopoly. The award of make a "huge splash the have a shortage" goes to Apple.
They perfected that business model.
Well, I have mixed feelings on this story. On one hand, yeah - we all know Slashdot is going to latch on tightly to any news item that puts Microsoft in a negative light, so it's immediately suspect.
On the other hand, the part that bothers me is the accusation that MS is intentionally ordering stores to "sell out" on a pre-agreed date, or trying to ensure that the "sold out" notices are prominently displayed.
There's a difference between announcing a new product and not really having much supply of it for a little while after the announcement, and orchestrating the whole thing into a sales gimmick.
I'm an Apple user/fan myself, and I think all of us are aware of Apple's "standard practice" of announcing new products before production is ramped up enough to really supply the demand. But to the best of my knowledge, Apple never pressured any resellers to sign agreements to guarantee they were "sold out" at preset dates/times, or to handle the fact they sold out in a particular fashion. That goes far above and beyond simple inability or unwillingness to supply initial demand for a new product.
I like it how when Sony pulls this crap, no one says a word. But when Microsoft does it, everyone pounces.
I think there's some cultures where that's called "hypocracy."
Hey thanks! Although if I come off as intelligent maybe slashdot has gotten soft ;-)
The iPod? You mean the initial sale? The original iPod only sold like 300,000 units in 7 months. There was no shortage. You mean the recent launches? That nano? The one where an "analyst" wrote an article that said the nano must not be selling well because they were still on hand in stores a week after it came out?
The GBA? You mean the original GBA launch? Or the SP launch? I bought both at Toys R Us the first day with no pre-order, and there were just stacks of them behind the counter. I even exchanged my original GBA on the first day late in the day (because it didn't work) and they still had stacks of them back there.
I'm not saying MS is evil for doing this, and I'm not saying it has never been done before. Some say the N64 launch was like this, and on purpose.
But I find your examples questionable.
Another poster covered it well below. The PSP has produced zero buzz because you could find one anywhere, any time. It failed to be interesting. Now, the best way to be interesting is to have good games, but often consoles don't have that option on launch day (PSP, DS, Xbox, 360), so maybe creating a little fake shortage is the best way to get buzz.
http://lkml.org/lkml/2005/8/20/95
parents wanting to make sure that their kid gets what they want for christmas
Isn't Perfect Dark Zero the only Xbox 360 exclusive launch title worth mentioning? And isn't it rated M?
You mean Microsoft is repeating what Sony do with every product they launch? Just like how they first prolonged the release date of the PSP to try and make more people eager to buy it and then didn't give the shops enough units and left the rest of the produce on the factory floor so the shops could sell out? Yeah naughty naughty microsoft .
Was anyone on Slashdot planning to buy an M$ XBox 360 anyway?
"Never risk a sale today for a sale tomorrow." A salesman will always make a sale today. I wouldn't say a bad salesman is devoiding of speculating. Instead of being a salesman, they are acting as a broker which is riding the supply as a commidity market. As a broker they have different goals than a salesman mostly which servicing the consumer is secondary to making sure you maximize your distribution pool.
In previous cases with Apple, Sony, Nintendo, etc is that they were honestly out of product and production couldn't ramp up immediately. UPS would show up with a delivery of 10 units which where automatically sold. 10 more units would not show up till next week. There were simply no more units to buy no matter how long you stood in front of the electronics store or how many times you clicked refresh on Apple.com. What the article is suggesting is that MS doing is putting an artifical ceiling on supply (otherwise known as rationing). Is it a good thing to put rationing on a non-essential item?
I would perferably see a spike than to have MS trying to artifically monkey around with the market. In one case the worst they are accused is that they misjudged demand (hey it happens). In the other case there is something more meleviant is going on. I think that if they artificially hold back warehouses full of product they are looney. Make a sale today you have cash they can use now to reinvest. What would they possibly reinvest in you ask? Something wacky like increase production? If you bank on a sale tomorrow you might have twice as much cash...or they might go off and buy something else.
(For those who couldn't catch a clue with a mitt, this is sarcasm.) (And yes, I do need to include this disclaimer.)
The Independent: Reverend Spooner Arrested in Friar Tuck Incident - ISIHAC, Historical Headlines
Look, the 360 has been on a short launch cycle. There just aren't going to be a lot of good games for it at launch. Just like for Xbox, PSP or DS (three consoles that launched in the US simultaneously, instead of building up a title database with an early Japanese launch before coming here).
Would you like to have everyone able to buy one, have them buy two games, realize at least one sucks, and there aren't even any other ones to buy? Then they turn the unit off for weeks and you have to "relaunch" the unit to get them buying titles again. Like with Xbox (relaunched in the Halo era and again in the Mechassault/Live era).
Or would you like to have a lot of people wishing they could get one, not knowing that if they did have one, they'd be not using it anyway due to the bad titles available? Those people generate tons of angst buzz, and once more titles become ready, you open the gates a bit and they buy one and get some titles and all is well.
Yeah, it's a scam to create artificial buzz. But MS didn't invent it, and it isn't really going to hurt anyone.
BTW, the stores seem to already have gotten the message. Some stores are calling pre-order people and explaining how "with the shortage" they might not get theirs first day if they don't pre-purchase (as opposed to pre-order) it. I find this lame, although I had pre-purchased mine.
http://lkml.org/lkml/2005/8/20/95
I mean, buy the new XBox anytime just after launch? It'll be full of bugs! Never buy v1 of ANY hardware/software at launch date.
I'm thinking of getting of of those green XBox thingies, should be pretty stable now...
It's going to be in even shorter supply if these guys get their hands on one: Smash My Xbox
Are they literally saying that they're going to stockpile units during christmas, in hopes that more people will buy them after christmas?
Yes. As an AC pointed out, more and more people are giving gift cards for Christmas. Selling something in January is a good way to reach people with Best Buy gift cards burning a hole in their pockets.
Grass still green, water still wet. More at 11.
Sony or Nintendo could shut down XBox 360 with a one page ad in a gaming mag like EGM and then do another spot in New York Times. The ad would just have to say:
1 million units made, less then 100,000 unit sold. Do the math.
You say things that offend me and I can deal with it. Can you?
There are some sellers asking higher prices, but none of them have any bids. Sellers can ask any "reserve price" they want, but it's not a real price unless someone will pay it.
New Coke, anyone?
are the first two subjects i saw and how redundant at that... i'll always read slashdot for the few worthwhile articles in there and my comments are really at a minimum these days but it's just beyond me how people strive to put microsoft down. dishonesty? how about business. apparently the big boys at microsoft know a lot more then half the poor broke ass slashdot population. aren't geeks supposed to think outside the box? i think microsoft has created many products, maybe not the best, maybe not the worst but in most of the worlds eyes, products that for the most part deliver what people want. the majority. not the hordes of slashdot geeks that need linux so they can feel like they matter in the universe... microsoft might be just another money hungry corporation but they didn't get that way because of nothing. there has to be some give and take... at least in my opinion. let 'em fucking sell out, you'll either go against your anti-micrsoft ways and find a way to get one or you won't buy one. who cares. it's a business strategy, if it's even real cause god knows what you can believe on slashdot. so how about sitting back to see it's effect. you think i'm on an off topic rant then open your eyes and read everyone else's stupid ass comments. at least i have the balls to stick up for what i think and not have to do it anonymously. so here goes the modding down cause i wanted to comment ABOUT the topic...
fact: microsoft > linux
Holy shit I better run out to the store and bidder on it right away.
http://saveie6.com/
I learned supply and demand fromd day1 in both my micro and macro economics classes. Its the basis of how the whole market works and its not dishonesty at all.
The sole reason we have price tags is because we have limited resources.
The economy works by supply and demand and if too much supply hits a market which erases demand then competitors leave and it self corrects. Its Microsoft's job to maximize every penny of profit as possible to establish its price equilibrium. To do that it must limit its supply so it can make more money.
But its an industry wide practice and not dishonest. Suppliers all the time decide how much to produce something and use what consumers are willing to pay for to set the price.
http://saveie6.com/
TRue but ms does not have total leverage in the console market.
If xbox360 is $700 then sales of the PS2 will increase. Also if marketshare is down for ms because they want to make more money for the sales of the console then they lose money for games. After all if more people own ps2's then sony will make more money off its games than microsoft.
http://saveie6.com/
The innocent interpretation is that Microsoft is expecting a global shortage, but not necessarily a local shortage. Accordingly Microsoft does not want individual locations hoarding a large pre-ordered shipment, when for example Moosefactor, Ontario didn't receive any. The 'guaranteed to sell out' clause is probably just an aggressive posture to demand accurate forecasts.
Sony, Apple, Google (gmail!), IBM, etc... they've ALL controlled prices artificially, and certainly controlled supply and demand to extract the best possible outcome.
John Maynard Keynes: "When the facts change, I change my mind. What do you do?"
But by doing this, online stores have sold out of their initial supply or bundled them together into outrageously priced bundles. They are not taking pre-orders with a sane wait-list methodology they just say to check back latter. For my convinience, as the customer, if you aren't willing to put me in a line so I don't have to monkey around myself, then I am not sure I want to be your customer anymore. Companies that I have seen this done on the Xbox 360 include Amazon, Gamestop, Walmart, Costco, BestBuy, and many more. I feel this customer unfriendly "check back latter or buy a big bundle" attitude is much worse than details of when stock arrives.
Well the article, for not being a rumor, sure does seem to lack anyone going on the record about anything. "We heard it from this guy, and we saw it on this game blog..." But it also makes a lot of logical leaps. If what is stated in the article is true, it could be that Microsoft has more units to ship to retailers than it intends to, in order to make a deliberate shortage. I think that's bad business and probably not something MS would do (there will be plenty of buzz and the system will sell out even if they ship more), but that's not the point. Could MS also be "limiting supply sent to retailers" because it doesn't have that many to ship? Yes. Could MS be working with retailers to "ensure they sell out" because they don't want to allocate units to a store where they WON'T sell out, while other stores have a long waiting list? Yes. Could Microsoft be trying to capitalize on a bad situation (selling fewer than there is demand for) by promoting the sold-out status as a good thing; a sign of the console's gotta-have-it status? Yes. Could Microsoft also be trying to ensure that the launch day goes "smoothly" and no riots or disturbances form by making sure retailers are prepared to put "sold out" signs up and keep their customers informed before they all wait in line for two hours only to not get a console? Yes. I'm not saying all those things are true. But the specific things noted in the article have other explanations than simply "Microsoft is creating an intenttional shortage." Making a big shortage is a bad idea, and MS knows it. It is in their best interest to get as many units in the hands of gamers as fast as possible - to have the biggest launch day it can, followed by a steady stream of shipments until the PS3's launch, whenever that is. Generating "buzz" by shorting out supply only works when you have no real competition, and the Xbox 360 has plenty.
If you object to this tactic of artificial shortages, then start the counter-spin about the 360. If you dont' care, then buy the machine. Although I think that there is enough counter-spin already to sink the 360 at launch.
I know a friend who has seen the dev kit, worked on it, and is thoruoughly underwhelmed. He's going to wait till halo 3 comes out to get it instead of picking it up at launch. He's not particularly pro anything (except sega btu they went undeR) he has all 3 current systems, plus nearly every major system before that. He has always bought them at release but will wait this time.
"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, than are dreamt of in your philosophy."
Oooh big bad boogie-man microsoft...come on people, every game company does this with every game. I remember when Gran Tourismo 2 came out, I had to go to like 12 different stores because Sony had limited the shipment to each store so that it would "sell-out" -this is standard marketing today, it's not the evil empire of Microsoft.
If there are any problems at all with the 360's, then only a small percentage of potential buyers will have purchased it when it starts.
Personally, I do not see the value in buying ANYTHING on release day any more. Frequently if you wait as little as a month, you can get the same product for 25% off. If you wait six months, you can almost always get 2 for 1.
She was like chocolate when she drank... semi-sweet at first and then increasingly bitter.
The demand for the 360 is already there, we know that. Microsoft has stated there will be a supply problem and we can see why. They havent been making these things for long and they can only make so many per day and they are doing a WORLDWIDE launch so there can only be so many. What Microsoft is doing is saying to these stores..."Look, we will send you these systems but we cant send you 200 of them, if you bundle them with 2 games we can promise to replenish faster" This makes perfect sense, the better markets get more systems. Hell look at the PS2 launch, I worked at EB back then, in order to get a PS2 you had to buy the following... PS2 $300 Mem Card $30 2 games $100 Warrenty $50 Controller $30 There was a huge supply problem with PS2 for the first 6 months and these bundles continued even past that, if the market will support it you cant really blame a company for doing something like this, it makes economic sense. 90% of people who buy a new console buy it with at least 2 games anyways so whats the big friggen deal, and so what if MS wants to create a little buzz with sold out signs, the damn things will really be sold out, how many do you think they can make!
This has nothing to do with any of that, if your RTFA.
Normally, what you do when you launch a product is make a lot of noise, put a lot of boxes on the shelves, and hope you've got enough out there for everyone, because selling more units means more money in your pocket. You don't want people to go home disappointed, because they might not come back. It hurts the consumer's trust in the retailer as a reliable source, and the customers have this money burning a hole in their pockets that may well go to a competing product. Retailers know that customers like to walk into a store and see full shelves.
People take that kind of behavior for granted. So when a product sells out they think, "Wow! People really want it!" They get a sense of scarcity. They want the product because other people want it and can't have it.
Now the plan MS is being accused of is cynically manipulating people by throttling supply back to create the illusion of high demand and consumer excitement, making an illusionary fad for people to get swept up in. Rather than putting 100 boxes on the shelf on the first day, then putting out the 10 more boxes every day they can manufacture, they're going to only put out 10 boxes on the first day, hoping and planning that most of their enthusiastic customers will be disappointed by empty shelves, and people will mistake their unusual launch strategy for overwhelming, unmeetable demand.
People don't like to be manipulated. If people believe MS is really doing this, they are going to get pissed off. They're going to rationalize that if MS needs to pull a trick like that, then their product isn't any good.
Now it could be (and probably is) that MS is doing this for other reasons entirely. Maybe they just won't have time to store up 2 weeks of production to fill the shelves before their desired Christmas season launch date. But if they decide to spin this in marketing as a shortage due to unusual demand rather than unusual launch distribution tactics, it's dishonest and could seriously backfire on them.
> This is not some natural resource that only they have access to.
Yes and no. It is an artificial resource (supply of XBox units), however it relies on natural resources for labor and materials. They (MS) don't have exclusive access to the natural resources, but they are the only company that has access to the XBox supply.
> They don't have to let anybody profit from selling it.
Even themselves? I think they do have to let themselves profit from selling it, otherwise it doesn't make sense to sell it unless it's a philanthropic venture.
> There's no burden on retailers for this
Except that whole supply and demand thing, which is either natural forces (free market demands pitted against scarce resources) or manipulation (artificial supply shortage to increase demand).
> If they don't want to be part of that process, they sure don't have to.
Is "they" Microsoft, the retailer, the customer; or all three?
> How is this "crooked?"
crooked: False; dishonest; fraudulent; as, crooked dealings.
If the natural resources needed to make the XBox are a scarce supply, then a scarce supply of XBoxes is honest and certainly part of the process known as supply and demand in a free market. If the supply of natural resources are not scarce and Microsoft is manipulating their artifical resource it is part of a process that should be called a creating demand in a controlled market, but instead it is called a free market that responds to supply and demand.
I'd say that is false, dishonest, and/or fraudulent. YMMV.
I know from a gamestore manager here in Denmark, that they are only allowed to take home preordered numbers from their headquater. They are not doing any guesswork at all, they are taking in orders for a while longer, and soon they will stop taking in orders for the first round.
There isn't much like the scent of a fresh harddisk
No pun intended?
SoundTimer makes you sound busy.
Bill Gates:
'Yup, all 3 that were put out on the market were sold in less than 1 minute. I bought one, Ballmer bought one and I gave one to my buddy Jack Abramoff.'
They aren't limiting supply to "ensure an immediate sellout"; they are limiting supply to keep the number of returned defective units down to a managable level long enough to figure out how to make non-defective units. Microsoft doesn't profit from the extreme markups seen during an artificial shortage; those markups all go to the retailers instead. Microsoft would never intentionally do anything that would limit their own profits! (Also note that ramping up production very quickly almost always results in more defects per unit.)
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
Now I'll have to wait longer before I refuse to buy the Xbox 360.
"Destroy science and religion. Science would re-emerge exactly the same; but not religion." - Penn Jillette, paraphrased
Let me put this in simple terms. The free market is based not only on an unregulated market based on supply and demand. Two other key components are rational actors and those actors being adequately informed. Clearly, in the real world there isn't perfect information. So, various metrics are used by the consumer. Manipulating these metrics to intentionall disinform individuals is clearly antithetic to the free market. This is instead a clearer example of capitalism, which doesn't have the requirement of an informed actor. This is one reason I see capitalism as crooked and cringe when people speak of the free market and capitalism as synonymous.
Eurohacker European paranoia, gun rights, and h
That's not the fun of Linux though. The best bit about Linux is the home car-kit type vibe. This modularity is why it can be so secure, even though say Windows has a better fundamental design(but a pisspoor implementation).
OpenOffice is pretty good with MS formats. It's not terrific, but it's more than good enough for most uses. I use it instead of MS Office now on all platforms just for the consistant interface.
Anyway, if you wanted to switch to Linux you're looking at really digging in and piecing together a completely custom system to get everything you want. And you can get it to within about 99% of perfect for you. But it takes a heck of a lot of time. I'd start fiddling around with it on an older machine for like an hour or two a week, and gradually replacing your windows apps with cross-platform apps as you find ones you like.
If you want PC gaming though, forget it, you're stuck in Windows land.
The key to the enjoyment of pop music is to replace any instance of "love" with "C.H.U.D."
> "Never risk a sale today for a sale tomorrow." A salesman will always make
> a sale today...Instead of being a salesman, they are acting as a broker which
> is riding the supply as a commidity market. As a broker they have different
> goals than a salesman mostly which servicing the consumer is secondary to
> making sure you maximize your distribution pool.
You make a good point. I've done both; straight sales and manipulating the local market. In my case, it was to try to regulate uncontrolled oversupply and undersupply of merchandise (requiring all of my limited freezer space) from our brilliant corporate fuhrers.
Selling a commodity item is different from selling an item where a significant portion of the "value" is bogus or transient.
In this case, MS wants to try to create a fairly high degree of "bogus value" based on intangibles. I'm not saying it's a good idea; I am saying their perception that the XBox lacks the intrinsic value to drive the kind of buzz they are looking for (without this kind of thing) may be an accurate assessment.
> Make a sale today you have cash they can use now to reinvest. What would
> they possibly reinvest in you ask? Something wacky like increase production?
> If you bank on a sale tomorrow you might have twice as much cash...or they
> might go off and buy something else.
All true.
Then I guess I won't be able to buy one.
There is nothing inherently safe about liberty. That's why so many people died protecting it.
First, a supply shortage of what? Each store gets more premium consolse - the ones that have more involved production wise, as well as a higher margin - which would argue against a lack of supply.
Also, the whole idea that purchasers have to buy two games with the console (remember when a console had a FREE game?)has no basis in supply-demand. It is simply marketing to an extent that is greedy to the core. I can't see a convincing argument that this is anything other than marketing trying to create a buzz. Watch- "new xbox sells out on first day" will be news story in USA Today.
I am curious to see how they dealt with Wal-Mart. I can't imagine a Wal-Mart accepting only 20 units in each store. Two companies accostum to bullying thier business partners - who wins that one?
In the zealotry-soaked eyes of Slashdot, Microsoft is damned whatever they do and suddenly Microsoft is evil, abusing their Xbox monopoly and is out to rape children. The overwhelmingly negative reaction to any of Microsoft's slightest move makes absolutely no sense at all.
I've been reading Slashdot for what must be 10+ years and have a small-ish UID - but I'm starting to hate reading Slashdot as there are far superior news sources at this point. The "Microsoft is automatic evil" thing is starting to piss me off and at some point I'm not going to come back.
Article: "Microsoft gives saves puppies and kittens from certain death!"
Slashdot: "Microsoft clearly intends to do evil with their enslaved puppy and kitten collection!"
Article: "Microsoft software found useful by 95% of people who use computers for a living to feed their families."
Slashdot: "Plucky underground resistance that pretends they use Linux magically teleports green Star Trek chicks into their parent's basement!"
That's the current world. All content is free.
What's protected by copyright is expression, not content.
And what the writer meant to say here was Google envisions a world in which all written or created material is free. The content, if any, of that material is free now, no vision needed, it's a reality.
Run to the store and buy buy buy!! Get there before everyone else does and get in first! !! !
There is nothing new about the marketing logic behind this.
Next they'll be announcing that people breathe air!
C'mon, Microsoft isn't the first company to do this. You can't tell me Nintendo didn't do the same with the DS.
When the Sony PSP3 comes out, the Xbox will suddently be known as brand 'X' that no one cares about any more. Let them 'trickle' the supply, march isn't that far off for a far superior game console. MS is stupid if they don't think the geeks and gamers won't spread the word in internet time about this ruse.
Yeah, like this tactic is anything new. Sony does exactly the same thing. With the PSP, they only released so many units, and of those units, a larger number were given to companies which followed sony's advertising guidelines more carefully. This is a common tactic, and shouldn't be seen as only something Microsoft would do.
BeauHD. Worst editor since kdawson.
would be to say "Xbox 360 sells only A units 2 weeks after launch compared to the PS2's B units" where A is much much smaller than B. So who's more popular? Of course microsoft has the mainstream media eating out of its hand.
Maybe they could have clarified it more, I am not an anti-Microsoft zealot, but I also interpreted that as a question in terms of system power.
But unlike the others, the watts parts makes it obvious the replier is NOT implying or saying that the system is more powerful graphics/computing-power-wise/etc due to it's larger wattage use.
Maybe it would have been better if they asked "Is Xbox 360 really twice as powerful [electricity wise]/[computing power wise] as [the first] Xbox?"
I know Slashdot's not the world. There's too many liberal hippies on here to make it "the world". But if you bothered to research at all, you'd see that there are other reputable news sources out there as well posting this information, Cnet News not the least of them...the mainstream media will catch wind of this, just you wait.
Why would anyone be excited at being an early adopter? Isn't it common sense to let a product reach a certain level of maturity instead of playing the part of a ginnie pig / extended QA arm of a company, having to pay for the displeasure of finding and experiencing kinks in the offering?
Observe and adopt when the time is right I say... When the flawed fans have been replaced, the heating problem resolved, the availability of enough accessories to add proper value to the offering etc. You know, the typical scenario for new products.
In a society that believes in nothing, fear becomes the only agenda ~ Bill Durodié
So let me get this straight. We have this vile, evil corporation that is denying us the opportunity to give them money. How dare they?
I think a boycott might be in order.
pornking
A good example of supply and demand taking their toll is the Wizards of the Coast selling of Magic:the Gathering cards. When M:tG first came out only a few thousand sets were made. People went crazy over the game. So the next set was double the first, the third doubled that again.
;-)
:-) Like politicans - when they start saying they are going to lower your taxes what they really are saying is that they are going to increase your taxes. Soft of a bassackwards way of talking to people. Or maybe they just took classes at the Tower of miniTruth school.
Then the complaints began coming in. It seemed that some distributors were hoarding boxes of cards until the price had risen sufficiently to where they could break the box and sell the individual cards. WotC decided, therefore, to break the cycle and mass produce all of one expansion set. They choose Fallen Empires. A small set that was massively over ordered. There were six waves. The first wave of cards sold out completely. The second wave sold almost all the way. But the third, fourth, fifth, and sixth sets could not be sold. This caused many dealers to go out of business which kind of backfired against WotC who had wanted to teach the distributors a lesson. Instead, the distributors had agreements with the dealers and it was the dealers who ate the cost - not the distributors. M:tG never really recovered from this debacle and Hasbro, Inc. finally bought them out. Hasbro now controls how many cards are produce and the time schedule, and even arranges the large conventions.
Who knows - maybe Hasbro will buy Microsoft? Gack! I can see it now - instead of a paperclip we get toys that talk to us! AHHHHHHHH!!!!!!
Anyway, Microsoft is just trying out flipping the directive by the DOJ people. DOJ said they could no longer force people to sign long term contracts that gave M$ an unfair advantage by locking them in. So now they are trying the opposite. That is: to create an artificial state of panic on the part of the people who want to buy an XBox 360. By restricting the flow of widgets - er - XBoxes, they create a void which they are hoping a lot of people will come rushing into thus causing an increase in price. Sort of like how the oil companies in the 1970s faked the oil crisis and caused gas prices to go sky high, long lines, etc.... Or maybe you'd like to talk about Reliant Energy's rolling blackouts in California. Amazing how companies say to our faces "Trust us" and then stab us in the back time and again. Let's see....what are some of those slogans?
Trust us...You can rely on us...We bring good things to something or other...
Do you ever feel that you are a cow who's visiting the slaughterhouse for the second time?
Someone put a black hole in my pocket and now I'm broke.
You could always try to use a modern Mac now then. I've had bad experiences with Sushi in the past, but I do actually enjoy it now.. ;)
MALEVOLENT, damn you. Meleviant isn't even nearly a word. Malevolent is not only the correct English word but actually makes vague sense in French.
I will BUY PS2 on that day if I don't get Xbox360!
So, they could a) dump them all on the first day, tough luck for the people who missed out, no idea when the next shipment will arrive (PS2-style), and so when people find out this is what's going to happen the rush will be on as you describe, or b) they supply what they can while ensuring that they can continue to make regular shipments, so that those who miss out on day one can be assured their machine will be arriving as scheduled in 3 weeks, just in time for Christmas. Less of a panicked rush, more of a controlled release.
If you get past Gizmodo's take & read TFTAs that they link to, you'll see MS chose option b), not a) as you imply. It's ludicrous to assume they don't care how many are sold because they're trying to make the most PR out of their limited stock. You can be sure that if they had enough for everyone, they'd sell them all.
Why would anyone engrave "Elbereth"?
Who cares. They'll be worth 100 bucks in a few months and it will just start to have a few games worth owning.
"We've got the supply, and we can demand whatever the hell we want!"
Oh for the PS3 to be released within a week of the 360...
Is Capitalism Good for the Poor?
Your friendly neighborhood AC says:
1) Offtopic.
2) You're wrong.
Have a nice day.