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Flat Panel Linux Box for $99?
A reader writes "Found an interesting site which describes a hack to modify the $99 Iopener internet appliance to be able to run Linux. Flat panel LCD display, small footprint, 56K (non-win)modem. No ethernet, but a built-in parallel port (for PLIP?). Just add 2.5" HD. The perfect X terminal! "
But will it run text mode quake?
Chaos, Mayhem, and Destruction: Not
What's the resolution of those things? 640x480? I know plenty an X dialog box that can't fit in 800x600, never mind anything less.
Still nifty, though.
Perfect - both a hardware hack, and a cool operating system. Why would any user want to run the proprietary OS it comes with?
X over a parallel port? ick
... they just installed Linux on a hard drive and plugged it into the IDE port graciously provided on the I-Opener's main board.
Not groundbreaking, but interesting nonetheless.
NO CARRIER
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Mainly, it needs an ethernet port.
Looking at the site, i see the modem is some plug on thing. Could someone find a way to use an ethernet card with it? If that were the case, I'd buy one today.
Chaos, Mayhem, and Destruction: Not
suppose you put a touch-screen keyboard overlay on this thing. Further suppose that you add a DC power supply (battery :) Portable Linux webpad! and it would play Quake! for $99!
"We apologize for the inconvenience."
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Nicotine free Amish .sig.
I love when I hear about people hacking equipment like this. A very good use of creative energies.
It may be a good idea to put this thing in a bathtroom for an uninterrupted "experience" while on a toilet. It'd probably be an even better idea to trick the host home server to emulate i-opener's dial-up service and be a proxy.
BUT... 10" 800x600 "crisp" screen (old passive LCD technology?) makes my eyes worried.
The fact that they're calling an x86 chip a "WINChip" exemplifies a marketing strategy that takes advantage of a consumer market that thinks P.C.=Windows. Of course, the WINChip seems to completely suck in tech and marketing, and most of the zombies will still look for the Intel Inside sticker. Still, I am thrilled to see that there are products in existence with a 10" LCD for a total cost of $99. Now, if only laptop prices would come down...
WARNING: there is a trojan on your
That's tight. Looks like Larry Ellison's dream of having cheap NCs has finally come true... While running a superior operating system at the same time!
It even comes with a flat panel screen, and that for only $99. Impressive. I remember having to do an NC demo a couple of years ago for California ex-Governer Pete Wilson, and the NC we set up had a $4,000 flat panel. From about $4,000 to $99 (I'm sure the flat panel quality is less, but still) is a great improvement.
Oh C'mon people, give him credit, he did a nice job so stop understating the hack. sure it was easy, but that IS the beauty of it. just because it doesn't take a rocket scientist to do it, doesn't mean the you rocket scientists out there should say it's a piece of crap!
after all, it's the creativity and inventive that counts.
There are two kinds of people in the world: Those with good memory.
So... install *BSD. Or OS/2. Or Windows. If you noted, there's nothing saying this only works for Linux.. you could even install x86 Solaris if you were so inclined. :> And yeah, so it might be just putting a hard drive on the motherboard as someone else mentioned, but it still took this person(s) time to figure out that the plug was mirrored I'm sure. It's still a hack (and one that I might be looking in to soon)
Three dits, four dits, two dits, dah!
Radio, radio, rah rah rah!
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online services? The article mentions that it is a custom dial-up but makes no mention if it's the hardware that's been customized or if it's simply that they don't support other connections in the software. I suppose for the price I can assume it software-braindead but if it's not a winmodem and it IS on COM1..
I would question the need for Linux on a device that is limited to 640x480 (no - it doesn't make sense to put Linux on everything, just most everything) not to mention just how useful it would be in everyday life in as limited a manner as it currently exists. Though- on the positive side I can see application where this would be very useful. At $99 bucks it would be the cheapest "smart-typewriter" ever and the added advantage of being able to do not only typing but spreadsheet work and presentations might make it a very useful tool for some administrative staff...
I purchased one of these for my wife's grandmother. Nice easy to use platform, does e-mail well and surfs. Javascript, no java, no PNG. Does fine on slashdot, CNN, etc...
:-)
Its a slick little box as is. The pointing device is not suitable for arthritic fingers, but they can take an PS/2 pointer as well.
The LCD is VERY sensitive to viewing angle, but if you only have one head on your neck that shouldn't be too bad. Its also very susceptible to ducking. Moving items vanish.
Their original plan was to sell them for $400 with a $5/mo ISP service. That didn't fly so they flipped to $200 and a $20/mo ISP at their xmas time introduction.
Now at $99 for a linux terminal I'm really excited. I feel a bit bad, since they are probably losing money at $99 and won't be making it up on the ISP service. Not bad enough to refrain from buying a couple though.
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Geez man, look at the site you at, Slashdot, News for Nerds! Of all those posts where people complain about non-nerd news this is one piece of news that is nerdy! This is really interesting stuff. If you're getting tired of linux maybe you shouldn't come to slashdot, interesting thought...
Billy Transue
bill-transue@NOcoolmailSPAM.net
Open Source, Open Standards, Open Minds
wow! This is the first time I have been able to read a story before the site got slashdotted! Most people argue this is useless and has not practical application, so what? Its fun, easy and costs $99! If not anything else, it is a cool weekend project. Now, if only somebody could post info on 2.5inch hard drives and switching ide cables, this is something I would do today!
if not anything else, this would make a nice way for sharing one internet connection don't have much money left after my 850 athlon order and when it gets here my roommate can have her own x-terminal and stop bugging me.
x term $99
freedom from roomie $priceless.
what are the chances of using a usb cable for this?
"what kind of a rescue mission is this?!!"
- Mission to Mars
The page says that these terminals have a 16MB Sandisk on board. If so, forget the internal hard disk (although you're going to need it to do the Sandisk install) that's enough to get it booting.
On top of that, if the USB-to-Ethernet support in the latest development kernels is at a reasonable level of stability (I haven't checked them lately, so no guarantees), you should be able to boot the kernel and a minimal system from the Sandisk, and mount the rest of your system over the USB connector. OK, it's not gonna be superfast, but it'd do as a second screen for a server.
I know that alot of people here think the EULAs are junk, but in reality some of them are legitimate. Although I think this is very cool, isn't this a blatant misuse of their device. I assume that there is somewhere where they say you can't disassemble them, and in this case, where they are selling them at a loss, they have a legitimate reason to request this.
On a second note, what are the terms of their contract. Assuming you are buying the product, and not just on an indefinate lease, how long are you required to use their internet service before terminating the contract?
I just called their customer service line. The operator was a bit confused when I asked her if I could order the appliance without the ISP service, but assured me that I could cancel it at any time. So, you don't need to subscribe to their service. Woohoo!
"We apologize for the inconvenience."
There is an ethernet card that is supported by Linux that attaches to a parallel port.   It's pretty steep in price (around US$100+) though.   One of my buddies was considering buying it since his old XIRCOM parallel port wasn't supported.
Can't think of the name of it off hand but will look it up in a hurry unless someone already knows it and posts...
-- Win2k: "It's not so much that it's only 65,000 bugs, it's just that they stopped at 65,535 to prevent an overflow."
I tried to call them, too. But they seem to be slashdotted... I wonder if they are willing to send this thing to Germany :-)
Prolific manufactures a range of USB chips, including the PL2301 and PL2302 devices that allow two USB host controllers to be linked, providing a simple point to point link at up to 5Mbps. This driver supports both PL2301 andPL2302 chips.
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Can't think of the name of it off hand but will look it up in a hurry unless someone already knows it and posts...
Replying to my own post!   Found the name of the parallel port ethernet adapter - ADDTRON.   Supposedly the DE-420, 450, & 600 are supported on Linux.
[ Reply to This | Parent ]
-- Win2k: "It's not so much that it's only 65,000 bugs, it's just that they stopped at 65,535 to prevent an overflow."
I love PC's, and something like this would really be the perfect complement. Why settle for an information appliance hard coded to do one particular thing, when you can a bunch of sleek little x-terminals that can do anything a stand-alone appliance does?
I can think of plenty of uses for something like this around the house, in a business setting, the uses multiply.
So if anyone with the means is listening, build them! The market for appliances of this type will fail until they're cheap enough ($200 would be my price point, can I reiterate that enough?), and as long as they're tied to proprietary systems. Who else would buy a generic, sleek, flat paneled x-term for $200?
Well, 32MB is kinda small nowadays, even with swap.
I wonder if this thing could handle a 64MB or 128MB or even a 256MB SODIMM?
It's got a USB port. You can buy a decent USB->10BaseT adapter for $70 or less. Linux has experimental support for some of these in 2.3. This is a really cool toy.
"Q: Can I use my current ISP or any other ISP of my choice with i-opener? A: To ensure a pleasant customer experience, i-opener includes Internet access service in order to provide automatic software updates and instant offline access to news, weather, sports, finance, and entertainment news." I take it that's a no? Why can't they just say no?
- Can I get my hands on one in the UK? I just took a look and you have to subscribe to their ISP thingy to get one, and that's only in the US. I was about to buy one to play with when I saw that they won't ship out of the US.
- At $99, it's worth it just for the LCD screen to attach up to rackmount machines. Anyone managed to rip the head off one of these things yet?
- And a thought: these things would make excellent cheap EPOS machines by the look of it. And certainly a lot cheaper than NCR's offerings.
If anyone succeeds in getting one to the UK, drop us a line will you? Ta.Smegma.
This would also make a great subscription box in cases where you do not need a keyboard. Just plunk the lcd on the kitchen counter with a trackball and write a script where it will dial up my isp and refresh slashdot every ten minutes or so! Or keep it next to the tv for quick headline updates on the hour.. no keyboard required!
Or just keep it in a corner and run x-dali clock on it to complete the shaggy pad look. Or make it a stockticker on your desk!
iopener $99
get me away from my computer $priceless
Yup, I do believe they do. You can get 2.5" drives anyway, without buying laptop, or get the IDE interface -- and IDE is a standard, after all.
Even if it's repackaged iOpeners. Buy 'em for $99, pop in a small drive, sell em for $200. Even $250. That should cover a small drive, and with modest economies of scale, the labor too.
timothy
jrnl: http://tinyurl.com/c2l8yr / foes: http://tinyurl.com/ckjno5
The connector is the same (pin spacing/diameter), save for 4 "extra" pins. These pins provide the voltage. Notice there isn't a standard power connection on the laptop hdd.
;)
You don't need to buy a laptop to get one though. Xerox isn't the only company to use laptop hdd's in copy/print centers
signal, noise, to me it's all the same.
Ship it to me, then drive down and get it, presuming you live in Ottawa, Montreal, or anywhere in-between.
-russ
Don't piss off The Angry Economist
...they're IPO'ing next week?
Now I really will have to work on a device driver.
The real silver bullet to good programs is caffeine; lots and lots of caffeine! *twitch, twitch*
has anyone ever been denied the right to purchase the unit without service or hidden extra charges?
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"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
I was on the point of buying one of these, but while I was thinking about it and taking a shower I came up with a progression in mind...
Now unless you're violating a license agreement by not using their internet service you aren't doing anything illegal by turning this machine into a Linux box. Sure, it seems very stupid to me that the company would sell these machines at what can only be a loss assuming they would make up their loss with the internet service -- but that's not the point here.
Whether or not the people buying this machine are doing anything wrong, think of the bad publicity this thing could cause, not to mention the potential moral guilt of destroying a dumb company. It would be different if this company were selling millions of units and only a small handfull of people hacked it and installed Linux, but Slashdot is a big site now, and our "Slashdot Effect" can do more than just take down a small web server.
Something to think about anyhow...
I'm wondering if the internal modem is a serial device working through a UART on the board, or if it is on an ISA(possibly PCI) bus, like a normal internal modem.
If the later is the case, it should only be a matter of a little solder work to get a normal ethernet NIC in there.
All this talk of a $99 Linux box puzzles me. I have yet to figure out how such a thing costs $99. If you purchase the unit for $99 and it require mods... will it not be more? Maybe all of you out there have a few extra 2.5" HDs in the scrap parts box... I don't... I am afraid that will be a few extra dollars... you can probably pick a small one up for $75 - $100... by the time you start adding things up (include your time)... you could have purchased a 400 mhz eMachine.
Small footprint... yes... flat panel...yes... $99... no.
I think this thing is awesome... I am going to track one down this weekend... I want to perform the mods... but I'm not fooling myself... this thing is not $99 when all is said and done... I figure to do it right, $350 - $400 to get it up on a network.
Side note: If someone can find a way to retro-fit this thing into a notebook case for under $400... let me know... make this thing portable and keep the modem and I am a happy Linux camper.
Just my $.02
"Perhaps most amazingly, votaries of 'diversity' insist on absolute conformity." -- Tony Snow
This looks *way* interesting! I really'd like to buy one of these, but I just bought a G4, and have a hard time rationalizing buying another computer.
:)
In any case, that could be used for many things. It's good to see people thinking out there!
Working toward a usable PDA environment in the spirit of Newton OS: Dynapad
Yamaha YMF715 Stereo Speakers Doesn't say anything about the sound chip, though? Is it any good [or upgradable?]. I don't think that PLIP could get the bandwidth, but with USB ethernet, I could also plug this into my home network to play MP3's stored on my server!!
I'd be interested in getting this thing netbooted. Hooking up a HD looks like too much expense and trouble for a $100 device. I know I could get it working with PLIP, but based on my past experience with it (slow, interrupt hell), I'd prefer to use the USB port for connectivity.
Does anyone know of a way to do a PPP-kinda thing over USB? Can two PCs be connected to the same USB bus and talk to each other?
You can do other things while that's running...
...and stop complaining. Putting linux on everything (including Palm Pilots) is just a geek game. Welcome to Slashdot.
If it wasn't for people with this hackish spirit, we may never have had PC's in the first place. Do you have any idea how useless early systems like the Altair were? All you had was switches and lights, but hackers went nuts over them. Over time, they improved them, and now we have our modern PC's.
I think its an interesting post. The hack wasn't very technical, but it is kind of cute.
--Lenny
Since you can bridge USB to Ethernet, why not just use Win98 or something with some drivers that allow USB Ethernet? Since gettting it to work under Linux is definately quite a challenge right now?
:)
VNC to an X session on a real linux box... all your problems are solved. (Except local stability, but you can always resume your X session(s))
I'm buying one of these and I'm gonna use my beta Dual Link modem from 3Com to bridge the Ethernet to USB
x-empt
Ever need an online dictionary?
An IDE CD-ROM is a lot cheaper and easier to work with than a 2.5" hard disk. If the BIOS supports the El-Torito Bootable CDRom stuff, that's another way to get your favorite linux distro on it -- especially if you can get the 16M flash to work as well. Nifty!!!
I assume the QNX/Software comes on the 16MB flash chips, there is no disk to nuke. This page doesn't say anything about needing to re-flash, so when you decide you're done with it, you can just yank the HD and give it to a family member to use as it was originally intended.
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"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
The page says that you have to install a 2.5" hard drive unless you can find a way to use the 16mb flash. The thing is, it seems like you could use the flash. Anyone have any pointers here?
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I think there is a world market for maybe five personal web logs.
Circuit City's web site says you can purchase products online and pick them up at one of their brick and mortar stores. They call it "in-store express pickup."
-Entropy [think outside the system]
This would actually run FreeBSD or NetBSD really well since the USB Ethernet drivers actually work. I've got one hanging off of my second desktop and it works great, the box has been up for 60 days with no burps. Granted its only 6mbps because of the USB lameness, but hey you can't really go wrong for the cheap factor. I can even take the DIMM I pulled out of my powerbook to upgrade that thing.
I think I'm gonna go try to buy one...
USB serial is pretty good, so you might even be able to get a serial-serial type connection over USB. So far as I know, there hasn't been any real work on any of the USB NIC drivers yet, tho.
I bet it does, so will all computers be like this?
I've been hunting around mailing lists and howtos for the status of Ethernet USB in Linux kernels. I've found quite a bit about the USB->USB networking.
:)
Here is a post that Free/NetBSD have drivers for ten devices. Close, you can compile free software, and it's not Windows.
because they probably sell these things at cost or below, expecting you to buy their service.
This thing uses a Yamaha YMF715 audio chip. As far as I know, it is not supported under Linux.
I am running Debian 2.2 and have seen no way to get the audio working.
EC
EverCode
... I was looking at doing a PERL-based app for my store that'd run off of Apache on a Linux box that I could access off of a web browser. (The Apache box would also hold the servers for Half-Life and serve as a fileserver for our in-house gaming network.)
But with this, I have an excuse to learn enough GTK (or maybe Perl/TK?) programming to do my app and have it run on a nifty desktop -- along with big GNOME panel buttons for in-house e-mail and maybe some HTML pages with our procedures, for employees that seem to have trouble with the way our Windows machine is currently set up.
Plus, it gets this clunky monitor off of my counter, and a box from underneath it...
Jay (=
(still geekish enough to get a tingle out of this story...)
the screen is the new sharp dualscan 800x600 16bpp you can fdisk and format the internal flash disk it will boot off the flash disk if there is no hard drive plugged in.. and you can replace the kb it just uses a ps2 plug thats how you get into setup ctl+alt+esc ! i use a dlink de620 par either net adapter and it works well.. the cpu does about 80 bogomips i swaped the winchip whith a itel 200 pre mmx 3.4v core and bogomips when about 3x i will update the page and fix the forum tonight thanks for the ./ codeman
My plan is to hack one into a wireless LCD screen Linux system for less than $200. I believe this can be done, but I will need some help. Here is the known specs:
Will anyone who has seen the actual board, or who knows anything about it, please comment on my idea? If anyone can identify the connection of the modem daughterboard to the motherboard, it's even better. Some people suggested that it was PCMCIA, in this case, does anyone know which PCMCIA controller is used?
If this can be done, and we have access to the ISA bus or a PCMCIA connector on the i-opener, possibilities are endless. The i-opener has barely enough space inside to house a small ISA card with the metal bracket removed. With an ISA Ethernet board with a boot ROM, you can build a diskless X terminal; or you can try adding a wireless LAN card like me.
If I can pull this off, I will post it as an article on my Bluetooth Central to share.
--
BluetoothCentral.com
A site for everything Bluetooth. Coming soon.
Zigbee Central: A Zigbee weblog
Just get an USB-Ethernet adapter. They will probably cost more than the machine though ...
I don't think X would easily fit in 16Meg. Now, you could just NFS mount /usr and get rolling ... that's cool indeed!
Here's a thought... Has anyone (company) out there tried to make an insanely cheap computer (same specs as this thing would work), require the $20/month connection, i.e. it's a service, not a computer, and just include the HD in the first place? Then just put all the word processing and stuff plain 'ol everyday non-nerds would need on it, perhaps some internet upgradability... Sounds like a good way to get some technophobes into Linux if you ask me...
(And no, this idea is not patent pending, but I bet it could be...)
I just purchased one directly from 3Com with 2 day shipping for 76.00!!!
Time to start hacking some USB Ethernet...
We all love linux, but wouldnt it work better with something like Windows 95 SR2? (With USB Support) because anything more would really choke on 32Megs, then we could use things like usb zip drives, usb cdroms and usb network cards, as it appears thats the only way to attach devices to the system.
Although, since it has an IDE port, wouldnt it be possible with some power hacks to attach a pc cdrom/zip/superdisk (after all, why wouldnt it support MASTER/SLAVE)? leaving the question on where to put them..
Another interesting idea would be to use these systems as part of your house perhaps on a wall like a picture (discard kbd and control remotely via. Linux/PLIP), or even part of your CAR! (That is a DC input correct?) some more simple hacks and you can probably wire in a Audio Out jack, (Can you say MP3Car?)
I just checked out their website. All three locations nearest me and their shipping location are out of stock. Not sure what to make of this, but I doubt they'd respond this quickly for NetAppliance.
Swap in a small hard drive, and it's a cheap computer for my neices. The whole cost, under $200 including parts...sweet!
No CD or ethernet -- that could be a problem -- but not much of one. My sister likes her Linux box, and it is only moderately better and cost a lot more.
On a commercial angle, can you immagine buying a few dozen of these and using them as firewalls? Use the hard drive to reprogram the flash disk, yank it back out, and it's ideal!
A firewall can not protect you from yourself. Turn off what you do not need. Do not use the firewall to do your work.
Would it be possible to put alphapaging software on it and dial in to paging services?
_____________
in the bay area, at least ;-(
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"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
After reading the hack, I ran out to Circuit City. They were out of stock, as were all the Circuit Cities in the area. I haven't found any other stores that carry it. But I _did_ get to look at the display machine, and it looks like it'll be a lot of fun.
So I called I-opener and bought one over the phone. They specified that I wouldn't be charged for the internet service until I actually started using it. Sounds good to me.
I was a bit disappointed by the high shipping and handling fee -- a little over $30. But I want to get one before they raise the price, so I paid it.
One note: If you're on their phone system listening to the long description of I-opener, just press "1" to buy. The description of their service goes on for minutes!
Anything worth doing is worth doing badly -- G.K. Chesterton
for my dad to replace his old packard bell machine.
Only if it came with 10/100baset so I could plug it into the network. If anyone gets the ethernet hack working on it, I am going for it (I dont have the money nor time to work on it myself, unfortunatly, and probably not the knowledge either) if it is cheap enough, I would love to put a coupla of the around my house. IE in the bathroom, etc.
-Pfhor
I have been reading up on car-based MP3 solutions lately, and most of the sites I go to say to get a certain $100 6" lcd, plus you have to buy the computer.... To me, this setup, with linux, seems like a VERY good solution for a MP3 player. Seem feasable?
Does anybody know, do they ship internationally?
Yes! I called them up, because i live in the UK and they said yea, they ship via Fedex. You would have to pay shipping.
Dan Rowe
Speaking of hardware, why does everyone keep saying to get a 2.5" drive? Is it just because of the size? Don't 2.5" drives and 3.5" IDE drives work the same? I have several 1GB drives laying around collecting dust, but they're 3.5". I don't care if I have to bolt it to the outside of the box... will it work?
--SONET
Any fool can criticize, condemn and complain and most fools do. --Benjamin Franklin
SanDisk is otherwise known as CompactFlash, or PicoFlash. A lot of digital cameras use it.
You can read/write to it like a regular hard drive.
They've got a way to go to catch up with Linux then *:op
Of course, you could just use QNX, the os the iopener is _actually_ using. -William Bull bbull@qnx.com
As I mentioned above, SanDisk is accessible just like a standard hard drive. No programming required. It's visible as a 16MB ATAPI device.
For 99 bucks
Those who dare open the box
Run Unix for cheap.
I've been looking for some kinda cheap LCD xterm like this. I'm thinking about picking one of these up and moding it. Hmm, extra RAM for the Powerbook or an i-opener...such decsions. Some people have asked in Netpliance is going to go out of business because they'll sell a bunch of boxes without selling the internet service that comes with them. I highly doubt it, scores more people will buy the i-opener to use in its standard configuration with a small small handful (one out of 400) buying them to modify them. Oh well, it would be their own fault, not ours. I wonder if I could replace the processor in it...
I'm a loner Dottie, a Rebel.
Can you somehow connect an external device through the LPT port and boot from it? Also is there any way to hook up a PCMCIA card to this device? I have a wireless PCMCIA ethernet (11mbps Lucent) card that works great under Linux.
We just picked 2 of them up. They require no contract at purchase time, so we own the units without being required to purchase service.
To be nice I thought I'd be provide some links to 2.5" HDs and Accessories:
eCost - A listing of some notebook (2.5 mostly) hard drives
PriceTrack - A listing on 1.0 to 3.9 gig Hard Drives (some may not be 2.5)
More 2.5 Drive Comparisions - Just more of the same
IDE Connectors - May or may not be what your looking for
Hope it helped,
I just went to Circuit City and the salesperson said i did NOT have to sign up when buying the machine. Meaning of course that it is not required and I can do whatever i want with the thing. Excelent =)
My local Circuit City store is out of these (sold their last one this morning, probably courtesy of ./), however they are willing to guarantee the price of $99. Just ask for a "no money down special order". Good luck!
Well you should check out this story about turning iMacs into kiosks with USB touchscreens.
Touchscreen iMacs
Should be able to purchase something that would give you a pressure sensitive screen. I don't think the voltage based ones will work. Heck I'm not sure pushing your fingers into a flat screen is such a good idea...
"I have a cunning plan..."
On http://www.usbstuff.com/network.html there's a 3Com USB NIC, which would probably be my best guess as a supported device.
If this would work, and you could get decent speed across it (anything's better than a modem IMO,) why fiddle around with parallel networking, or trying to hack an old ISA card where the modem is (provided that the modem _is_ connected via ISA...)
Why bother? It'll take a few months to change the design, and by then nobody will bother hacking them.
A firewall can not protect you from yourself. Turn off what you do not need. Do not use the firewall to do your work.
This is super cool as well, although way more expensive than the i-opener:
http://adirect.advantech .com/asp/systemsel.asp?Catalog=PPC
Advantech sells a lot of stuff like this that have tons of hack value. =)
Imagine how well this fits under your seat in the car?
Talk about an EXCELLENT Car MP3 player.
Im going to get mine tonight.
Ryan
Instead of using a HD, why not just have the 16 Meg Flash boot and mount root over NFS?
-- I'm the root of all that's evil, but you can call me cookie..
Nobody complained when Microsoft had to give away $400 to a lot of people in California and Oregon in MSN rebates because of their careless lawyers. Netpliance's selling these devices at a loss is not a lesser screw-up, especially considering that their technical people should have definitely known that the i-opener could be easily hacked.
But let's assume that the numbers are greater, and the loss from hacked i-openers is hurting Netpliance's bottom line. Is the Linux community to blame?
IMHO, the company's business model is totally flawed and they have made some critical mistakes, and as long as what we do is legal, I wouldn't feel any guilt destroying their business. Some of these mistakes are:
It has to be admitted that trying to sell these devices at a huge loss is not a good idea, especially when there is nothing but a flipped IDE port to stop knowledgeable people from hacking the system. Just because of this screw-up and their bad business model, I guess the financial loss will just serve Netpliance very well.
They have recently filed for their IPO. Now if they are smart, they can perhaps show some wisdom and jump on the speeding Linux bandwagon by offering the same or similar appliances for a reasonable price ($200-250) with a custom Linux version that will allow the use of any ISP; or bundling the device with home gateways or any other appliances they might have in the pipeline.
--
BluetoothCentral.com
A site for everything Bluetooth. Coming soon.
Zigbee Central: A Zigbee weblog
At least on pricetrac... For the same price as a 300MB 3.5" IDE disk from them I could go to Fry's and get a brand new 10GB disk.
Hemos observed that this would make a perfect X terminal with a 2.5 inch HDD.
Why would you need the hard drive? 16meg is PLENTY of room to make this thing boot off the network. In fact you could even boot locally, though you might have to get X off of NFS. (I honestly don't know how big a basic X setup for use as an X terminal is. I kind of suspect that it would also fit in that 16megs.) This eliminates the expense (and pain in the ass, did you see how the IDE cable has to be rigged?) of buying and installing a drive, and still gives you a nice X term.
I would get one, but I am doing the same thing with my old Toshiba notebook (using the included 2.5 inch drive.)
I'm living in the Netherlands and I'd like to purchase a couple of these things, but I can't order them if I don't have an US adress, anyone knows a solution for this or maybe there's a company that is specialized in this problem?
Regards,
They aren't just making money off of the ISP. If you look at the keyboard, where the function keys are, there is instead hotlinks to various services - shopping, email, even a pizza button. They probably get money from every sale made via those hot buttons, similar to amazon's web partnering.
LetterRip
It's 16bpp
It's amazing how there is always some piece of shit do-gooder who must announce to the board, as if by spite, what he has done. I hope that you feel good about yourself since nobody gives a crap about you anyway.
...a non-threat, IMNSHO.
There is nothing wrong with this hack, and there is no way that it would run that company out of business, since I don't see enough people doing it to make a difference. Literally thousands would have to do this to cause a problem, and frankly I see no more than a few hundred buying this thing to hack it.
If the company responds by changing the agreement or the design, then I think they will just be wasting their time "reacting" to a perceived threat.
==============================
Windows NT has crashed,
I am the Blue Screen of Death,
I sure wish that CompUSA or Best Buy carried these things. I may just have to drive about 250 to the nearest Circuit City to get one. I've even got a 340M 2.5" hard drive sitting around idle (ripped out of a laptop to replace it with a bigger drive), so all I'd need would be the cable and to make a mounting bracket...
I want one, but they will not accept my UK phone number ;-(
I can lie about the phone number but then I may have trouble when I give a UK delivery address... I do not think it is enough of a draw to make me consider moving to the US just yet but I will start badgering my US friends for one 8-)
I love stacking my barbecues in the shed at the end of summer - you can't beat a bit of grill on grill action.
I just got back from the local Circuit City (Reading, PA), and they were completley sold out except for the display model. The salesperson checked the inventory of the surrounding stores. The locations at King of Prussia, Lancaster, and the area warehouse reported zero IOpeners in stock. These locations were hours away in both directions from me. I asked for a rain-check order, but he told me it would take two weeks to receive one. I didn't order it because by that time, they might enforce in-store ISP sign-up.
/. community and internet, or just pure ignorance amused by the nice LCD. I have no doubt that both were the culprits. If I, as spend thrifty as I am, would go purchase one, I assume that thousands of other Linux users would also. But the fact that the warehouse was depleted of IOpeners, means that they must have been selling well before the /. post today. At only 100 dollars that is practically an impulse buy for anyone, computer-ignorant or Linux guru.
Is this a result of the
I know this is a bad thing to say on slashdot, but I got win 98 SE running on my i-opnener. I already had an i-opener (won at a trade show) I took a 1.2 gig IBM 2.5 HD that had all the cab files on it, booted off it, and was able to get windows 98SE installed. The Modem is yet to work, but from having An iMac 333, i have a USB Superdisk drive that runs on the USB port, and an USB to Ethernet adapter. I already have office 2000 running on it. One other thing, You can use any iMac Rev a-d memory in it. I popped in a 64 meg chip for the 32. I do think that the bios only allows 64 megs of ra, to be adrressed though.
If you have any question email me, I will try to get linux on a spare HD to Install.
Welcome to the Entropy Bar, may I take your order?
from the pictures, it looks like they've used an old laptop mainboard design and rejigged it a bit. thus the nonstandard kb/mouse connector and teh use of so-dimm's. be interesting to find the original manufacturer.
so I ordered one via the phone. even with the $39 'shipping' charge, its still a bargain.
...as long as they don't get sneaky and change the internals so we can no longer use this as a linux box ;-(
--
--
"It is now safe to switch off your computer."
We bothered the local Circuit City here in the ghetto, and they had a display model but were out. The salesguy let us order two just by putting down $20 a head. The price tag said $299 but he agreed it was actually 99 right now. He said they'd be about a week, and they'll call us when they get them.
We fiddled with the display model a little. The 'screen' is actually the whole unit. All the metal and plastic beneath is just a stand. It looks like you could wall mount it easily enough, or tuck it and the keyboard under an arm. The included keyboard has lots of special hotkeys (including Pizza?). The pointing device seems pretty nice, simmilar to webtv keyboards. It's a bulb on the right side of the little keyboard, with two buttons on the left side.
Adric says he's going to feel a little rotten nuking QNX off this thing, but he doesn't think he can mod the QNX code without expensive tools we don't have. :(
We will post more when the buggers come in..
-CactusBob With adric
The whole west coast area, from my understanding is out of stock at the warehouses.... Ask to buy floor models.... I did, but couldn't... Luckily I got a guarenteed price of $99 with no service and the system will arrive within 2 weeks.
x-empt
Ever need an online dictionary?
So, does anyone know how I could get my hands on one of these units living outside of the United States (in Stockholm, Sweden, to be more precise)? Is anyone of you US residents interested in selling me a couple for, say, $125 each?
Blog Ho
Better than using plip, how is the current linux support for USB based ethernet adapters? Sorry I haven't kept up with the 2.3.x development, but USB would seem to make more sense as a network interface than the parallel port, if for no other reason than its faster and could more easily interface with a currently built network than the parallel port could (which would require another computer to connect to, extra routing, etc.
:)
Another thought... 16 megs might not seem like much for filesystem storage, but its enough to hold the kernel, and ALL filesystems can be loaded off the network once its up and running. Granted, extensive filesystem exporting can drain a network, but if the only current networking option is plip, a single computer could be set up to serve several of these screens without draining any other networking resources.
Just a thought
Cool hack.
-Restil
Play with my webcams and lights here
I wouldn't worry about bankrupting the company, apparently they are about to IPO. A sudden surge in sales will probably look very good to investors (which investors are going to suspect where these sales are actually going?).
I live right across the atlantic pond. (.dk)
Any suggestions on purchasing one of these gadgets?
I, for instance, need a valid (?) phone number to get through the ordering sequence.
Best regards,
Steen Suder
Best regards,
Steen Suder
-- for email: send to
Well, we stopped by Circuit City this morning to get our units--they didn't have any, but we placed the orders. Should be here within a week.
They have no way of even signing you up for service according to the gentlemen we talked to.
I have been trying to come up with the best Ethernet situation on these things. And for Linux at least, we're looking at Parallel port adapters as pretty much the only way to go. Eventaully, however, there should be a supported USB network interface that will work out well.
After talking it over with my brother, we concluded that BeOS might be the best OS to install on this thing--the USB support for the network adapters is there, so we're probably going that route instead of linux for the time being. Also you should be able to get Windows on there as well, if you want. Going to be tight on 32m of RAM, however.
I am actually planning using these for two purposes:
1 MP3 machine for my car. Looks like I won't even have to get a DC Inverter, because it currently uses an AC Adapter to plug into the wall. But its 19V, (little under 2a, if I remember correctly), which may prove to be a little difficult to get going in the car.
2 I'm also using going to be using one as a super small footprint terminal for co-located Racks. Basically hang this unit in a rack or cabinent for when we do maintaince work on the headless workstations. Otherwise you have to drag a KB, Mouse, etc, or notebook computer to work on a machine that is co-located. Not fun. With this, I can spend $100, use a couple extra 2.5" ide hard drives I've got and have a monitor and diagnostic type machine. Can control and manage the routers, switches via serial (with a USB to serial adapter) and the servers via IP on a network adapter. Pretty slick.
-k
Could it be AMR? (=Audio/Modem Riser)
It is a standard endorsed by Intel and based on an AC-97 serial interface to the codec.
If this is the case it means that something else on the board is doing the actual DSP work and presenting the result to the CPU as a standard modem.
ZZ
----
Stop worrying about the risks of nuclear power and start worrying about the risks of not using nuclear power.
I cracked open my netpliance a few hours ago and found a bank of dip switches. What could these possibly be for?
I have a parallel port zip drive, would it
be possible to boot linux off that?
The Inscrutable Gargoyle
2.5" are too expensive, why not just go external. Im sure most of us have old 2gig hd's lying around...
cut a small strip into the case and feed the ide cable out. You might not want to run off it though, i imagine the larger hard drives dont care too much about saving power... maybe use a real external hd case...
"i want to transfer to theory, everything works in theory"
I think the point was maybe that the trick to programming the flash is that an IDE device is required to boot, etc so you can run FDISK. So the "trick" would be to reprogram the flash without opening the case.. :-) e.g. using QNX to blast a boot image into flash.
More than one USB ethernet should work under NetBSD, but I don't know of anyone who has tried it. It would be a bit slow, but for a firewall with only an ISDN/cable modem/DSL, then maybe 3Mbit/s would be fine.
Just went down to Circuit City and bought two I-Openers for $99 a pop (one for me and one for my boss). There wasn't any kind of contract or anything -- just $99 for the thing. Mine has a 180 MHz WinChip, 32MB ram, and a 10" 800x600 display.
/etc
/app/start-photon
/app/start-photon ! I did this, and now my system does nothing. I will have to get a harddrive to boot from now.
Fun things to do with an I-Opener:
1. - Plug in a normal PS/2 keyboard (one with an ESC key). Or, you can take a laptop PS/2 "Y" cable and plug in both the mouse and keyboard (the mouse and keyboard are reversed, ie., plug the mouse into the keyboard connector and the keyboard into the mouse connector).
2. - Wait for the system to boot up and go into the tutorial. Let it get far enough into the tutorial that it waits for your input so that it doesn't keep getting in your way.
3. - Press ESC-4 a few times. This will bring up a shell with root access. You are now in the QNX operating System.
4. - The first thing you will want to do is allow root to login.
: cd
: chmod +www passwd
: vi passwd
(delete the first "x" in the root entry)
: chmod -www passwd
now you can login as root without a password. Note that this change is not permanent. To make the change permanent you have to make the change to the passwd~ file. Note, the system won't let you make the change to the passwd~ file, so you have to mv passwd~ to passwd_old and then copy passwd_old to passwd~ and then make the change.
5. - do a "ps". Probably the very last thing you will see is something like "/app/start-photon".
6. - kill the
You will now be at a text-only screen where you can login as root.
Notes:
- Don't delete
- Hitting the power button to power off only powers off the display (it might also put the processor into sleep mode, I dunno). Powering off doesn't "power off". You have to disconnect power to do a hard boot.
- These things have a telnet daemon and a www daemon running in the background by default.
I'm sure if you knew QNX well enough, you could just use the underlying system there to dialup to the internet, download a linux kernel and install it onto the flash directly. But seeing as I've pretty much hosed up my system by deleting a startup file, I'm going to have to hook up a hard drive anyway.
--
Mark Fassler
fassler at verinet dot com
Have you seen the number of hits on the linux-hacker.net page??? its going up like nuts!! im thinking there may be just a wee bit more than 1000 or so people getting these for hacks... -zr!
Please respond! I'd really like to have the little toy...
Of course you can put several Ethernet adapters on USB. At least with the *BSD drivers. Just remember that the total bandwidth of USB is not that incredible.
But it should work fine for your application.
... I forgot to mention :-(
See this post.
According to this guy, it can use iMac DIMMs, but the BIOS is limited to 64MB.
You are supposed to install everything on the hard drive before you put the drive in.
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
-=-=-=-=-
-=-=-=-=-
My mom's going to kick you in the face!
Correct me if I'm wrong (and I probably am) but, if the flash RAM is really just a 16MB CompactFlash card, couldn't you just replace it with a larger CompactFlash card (I think they go up to 128mb) or even one of those tiny IBM CF-slot microdrives for 330mb? More than enough to put all your basic Linux+Xwin into...
Is it QNX4, Neutrino, or what?
Is the software completely static and embedded, or can you install more apps on it? Like, oh, say ... bash and gcc? Might this be a good starter QNX box instead of just a single-purpose web surfing box? Inquiring minds want to know.
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As copyright owner of this comment, I authorize everyone to defeat any technological measure which limits access to it.
does it have enough juice to decode mp3s?
16 megs of flash to speedly boot from, an IDE CDROM for the mp3s.. At that price, I should get one for the living room and one for the car..
does any company ship those suckers out of the US for a reasonable cost?
Sound like it would make a good Windows box. I wonder if you could play everquest on it , with a one of those 19.2kps wireless modems and a battery pack.
I can make these machines do anything I want. Make this world anything I want it to be. Just so long as concentrate hard
I'll be happy to deliver one to you - just buy my plane ticket from Dallas. :)
This is *such* a damned cool hack! And who cares if it's got 32 MB of RAM? You lamers think that all Linux will do is run X? X is for wimps. I can run in console mode with 4 MB of RAM on a 486-DX4/100 and blow the doors off X.
-- Ed Carp, N7EKG erc@pobox.com PGP KeyID: 0x0BD32C9B What I'm up to: http://intuitives.mine.nu
What is interesting is how no one has suggested PicoBSD or embedded Linux for the 16 Meg flash disk.
If it was said on slashdot, it MUST be true!
Now this just leaves connecting it to a network, might be able to use a USB-ethernet adaptor(?), since the kb has a two-plug hub built in.
What is the robbing of a bank, compared to the founding of a bank? -- Bertolt Brecht
You walk into the living room, and see a pretty, scenic 8"x6" picture hanging on the wall, with a nice picture frame. You blink, and realize the picture just changed. You walk over to the picture, and notice that, in the wall just below the picture, is a panel that matches the rest of the wall perfectly (sheetrock, painted to match), but you can't see how it's actually attached to the wall. You press it gently, and it flips out at you, rotating, the same way a self inking stamp does (you should play with one of those for a half hour sometime, they're cool). Behold, a keyboard and trackball. This process disabled the screensaver slideshow you just saw, and you find an X desktop. The "picture" was one of these iopen things, mounted into the wall, so that the surface is flush with the wall, with the case removed, and a picture frame mounted around it. 8"x6" was my calculation, based on 10" diagnal, I could be wrong.
--
--
"Insert witty quote here."
One of the nicer features of Win98 is that it can use a generic notebook disply driver to drive the monitor, sure the screen redraws are slow, but it still works. I beleave that it is actually based on a Trident chip set so it uses a Generic Trident Driver.
Welcome to the Entropy Bar, may I take your order?
The consensus: The SanDisk is NVRAM, not flash. The IDE connector must be fabbed via the instructions here. USB will support multiple NICs but is an I/O bottleneck. Stated by MrBlaq: If you bought the box from IOpener, do NOT boot the machine while it is connected to a phone line unless you want to start ISP service. You can see a dmesg at the URL above.
In fact, here is a link about using the Cyberblade i7 drivers on an NEC PC notebook for those who are skeptical about running win 982 000_press_releases/nec_cyberblade_i7.htm
http://www.tridentmicro.com/html/press_release/
Welcome to the Entropy Bar, may I take your order?
I'll bet everybody went to circuit city last night. I asked the girl behind the counter to try to find me one, she called all the circuit cities in the state (VA) then told that not only are they out, but that their warehouse doesn't have any. I was told to expect two weeks.
I've checked netbsd.org and there don't seem to be any mini-distro's like there are for linux. Pointers, websites, FAQs on installing Free/NetBSD onto a 16MB Sandisk, where?
if at first you don't succeed, shoot the consultant who suggested you try in the first place...
Well I live in PA (East Coast). What do you mean by 'no service'? Do you mean they're not requiring you to purchase this ISP plan deal? Or that circuit city (et. al) won't provide service at that price? I was curious about that myself. If, when you purchase one from circuit city, they also make you sign a contract to purchase the ISP service stuff, or something to that effect...
> [ lots of very valid stuff about how this will likely not put Netpliance out of business,
> but how their business model is, at least presently, flawed, and how it's too late for them to do
> much about it now anyways ]
He also writes one thing with which I disagree:
> I would like to hereby congratulate the Netpliance engineer who invented [ the flipped-pins
>on the IDE port for "security" ] . It would be too bad if he went back to
> flipping burgers just weeks before the IPO.
Hell, I'd like to thank said engineer. For making it possible for all of us to enjoy a really cool toy for $99.
I'd also like to point out to his bosses that Netpliance's sales may well skyrocket before the IPO. Even if Netpliance doesn't see the kind of revenue it originally projected, by using a relatively open architecture with no real effort made at preventing re-use of the hardware, it's made a name for itself among geeks.
The poster to whom I'm replying also made a suggestion: that Netpliance consider selling general-purpose versions of these machines in the $200-250 range.
I'd like to echo that suggestion. It's a damn sexy box. Hell, it exudes sex. I, along with many other Slashdot readers, am probably gonna buy one of these things at $99+$30 shipping in order to hack it to run Linux and skip the built-in ISP part of the equation. That's because I'm not afraid of voiding a warranty with a soldering iron.
But given that the hack will likely take a few hours, and given that an even larger contingent on Slashdot may question their ability to re-pin a ribbon cable, I'd think there'd be strong and widespread interest in buying the unit unencumbered for $200-250. Truth be known, even though I enjoy mucking about with a soldering iron, I'd probably have preferred to pay a little extra and buy the unit that way myself.
If you're a Netpliance exec and you're reading this, and if there's a reasonable price point at which you can sell the unit and still make money - please consider it as an option. What looks like today's disaster may simply be tomorrow's opportunity in disguise. There's a reason your call volume and web site traffic just soared tonight.
So don't fire him. Give the guy who thought up the pin-swapped IDE connector a helluva bonus. If you'd built the box on a wholly-proprietary architecture, it would have cost far more to build, and would have had no geek appeal whatsoever.
But as it stands - it runs UNIX (whether QNX or Linux) and it's a flatscreen and it's expandable - it's bloody sexy, and I'm gonna buy one. I'll buy it for $99+30 and hack it -- but only because I didn't have the option for buying it at $200-250 without the ISP tie-in.
Anthrax just came through portland last month...
-- 100% MS-Free as of 4-4-1999, 11:47:38 PST. "The lapdance is always better when the stripper is cryin'" Free Kevin,
Linux version 2.2.14-15mdk (root@kenobi.mandrakesoft.com) (gcc version 2.95.2 19991024 (release)) #1 Tue Jan 4 22:24:20 CET 2000
relocating initrd image:
initrd_start:0xc0faa000 initrd_end:0xc0fff935
mem_start:0xc0274000 mem_end:0xc1e00000
initrd_size:0x00055935 dest:0xc1daa000
Detected 200462336 Hz processor.
Console: colour VGA+ 80x25
Calibrating delay loop... 79.87 BogoMIPS
Now how is that possible?
Since I can't buy this stuff from here in Belgium (you have to give a dial in number) I'm wondering if anyone could contact me to buy one together; I pay you and you send me one... please?
/pyder.....
please ignore the horrible spelling... it's still very early for me...
Best regards,
Cpyder
++32-486-676-007 or e-mail
_
/
\_\ sig under construction
I have a friend who works with the tech support for the netpliance i-opener. He has mentioned a few interesting points that I shall pass along.
1) They apparently cut all sorts of corners in bringing this baby out to the world before the competition. The units apparently cost them ~$600 per unit and they sell them at 199 (99 on sale right now).
2) They don't require any sort of contract because they don't need to. Theoretically they are the only ones who can provide the service for them.
Definitely a loss up front, but they plan on making it up in the service.
3) Netpliance is set to have their IPO sometime really soon. One wonders if they'll postpone this or not.
4) As of today there was no official netpliance party line on the situation.
basic summary of the interesting posts:
1) winchip 180mhz chip with 32 meg ram/16 flash
2) ram is upgradable to 64 via standard laptop type memory upgrade (hear that imac memory will work) bios might restrict use of more ram
3) I bought a USB->Ethernet controller from ChumpUSA for ~40 today and it came with a Turbolinux CD (SMC EZ connect USB) so I presume there is usb->Ethernet support on the cd 8-)
4) There is a 44 pin IDE header that will only work with the 2.5" notebook drives. Normal IDE uses 40 pins and have seperate power input, whilst the 44 pin versions provide power on the last 4 pins to the notebook HD's (one will notice the lack of a power plug on the notebook ide drives).
5) 10-inch 16bbp color bax res is 800x600
can't think of much else. looks neat, I gotta get me one of these babies!
what about USB zip drive? this would make the HD issue moot...
If there's one IDE connector, and there is a memory device on it (as the master, presumably), would there be anything preventing one from rigging up a cable and attaching a hard disk as a slave device?
You need to find video drivers for it there friend. BeOS dosn't support the I-Opener's chipset yet. XF86 does. That means that *BSD and Linux will work, BeOS won't. FreeBSD-Current has good usb ethernet support I hear...
Desperation is a stinky cologne
You can run VESA 800x600x16 on BeOS
According to the dmesg output on that page, the chip is running at 200Mhz. So there. If that parallel port ethernet adapter works correctly, I'd be interested in one of those things as a quake box.
Diehard
QNX Demo disk Two version of the 1.44MB disk LAN/Modem
Is there any way I could attach a parallel network adapter or something and use the 16meg of flash to have the system network boot?
I personally can't see why not... but...
I was thinking, just hook up a regular hard drive to it with linux installed... setup the flash area to boot the system with network support and mount a NFS share from a central machine.
That way, I could have a dozen of these suckers around my house.
- Hugh Buchanan
- Userfriendly.com
i plopped down $20 as a down payment. and they didn't make me sign any isp contracts. If they make me sign an isp deal when i go to pick it up, i'm gonna raise hell.
The store demo is an actual working unit, as soon as you plug it in (check for the sticker on the back) it resets the demo.
--
Insert Witty Sig Here
My friend Rob and I went to Circuit City up in Nashua, NH this afternoon to buy a couple. They were sold out. In fact, every Circuit City within an hour's drive of Nashua was sold out of them - most had been sold in the last day, as far as the sales rep knew! We went onto a backorder list, with 8 more people ahead of us.
/. effect applies to meatspace, too. This is probably the first time that a consumer electronics chain has been slashdotted...
So now we have proof that the
Imagine the faces back at headquarters when they see the weekend sales figures. They'll be so excited, waiting for all the new ISP subscriptions that they'll expect to be getting - I feel kind of sorry for them.
- -Josh Turiel
-- Josh Turiel
"2. Do not eat iPod Shuffle."
Check out the new screen shots on www.linux-hacker.com/iopener.... windbloze 98 is running and if you look in the corner you can see the modem internet connection....
Just spent the last 15 mintues on divixcity, er I mean circuitcity's web site looking at "Express Pickup" locations for Florida. Sold out at every location. I'm going to head down to my local CC and see about picking up a floor model. Anyone in Florida get one of these beauties, or did we just have none to begin with? Bry "No PC Should Run With The Case On" Mayland
I ordered two today. A friend ordered two also. I checked it out at circuit city, it looks sharp. 1.48A @ 19V. Could possibly power it in your car... have some mapping software on it and an mp3 player. In any case, after hearing the sales guy chuckle when I asked if the service subscription was mandatory, I let him admit that Netpliance knew exactly what was going on. He mentioned that it was an organic process... that the /. effect really hit home, and that certain patches of areas were ordering more than others. Another chuckle came out when he was taking down my address and informed me that the engineers at the University of Illinois at Champaign-Urbana were snatching them up like mad, along with some research park in Raleigh, NC. While processing my order, we made smalltalk and he mentioned that they were IPO'ing within the week and I asked if they were worried about all the recent developments. He said that despite the fact that "the engineers and executives have been up for 2 days straight," presumably working on a technical or marketing "fix" most likely, the PR people were going to sell it as a positive thing. Don't know how they'll put that one off though. Later he comically asked me what I was going to use it for and we discussed the logistics of installing it in the car. At least they have a sense of humor about this situation. Hope the execs have better luck with their next startup...
--lithboy
http://snoopy.net/mailman/listinfo/iopener
:O
Check it out... full-featured listserv.
I am the list mom.
"What have I done?"
SlashSigTheorem: Humorous, Political, Critical, Constructive- If you have a
standard vesa 2.0 mode. No accel.
Desperation is a stinky cologne
I would recommend creating two partitions, one OS and one data. You could copy the setup files of any apps you want to install in the data partition. I would strongly recommend the latest edition of Juno, as they offer free internet access. Copy the 9x Yamaha driver to the data partition. Just don't try to install Office 2000 on this thing.:) Find some nice GPL software for it, maybe install LiteStep. As an aside my 9x installation at work has a nice, clean LiteStep desktop geared toward the semi-monthly Friday Night Fragfests[tm] we hold.
If you're interested, you could copy the install file for 98Lite, which can remove just IE5, or Active desktop as well. A quick test at work showed IE5 using 6Megs of memory, and Opera using only 1Meg. My machine has the power, but that's a matter of choice. Yeah, put the Opera setup files on the data partition too.
Start the 9x install in a regular box. After it asks you to reboot the first time, shutdown the machine and pop the HD in the Iopener. The setup should extend it's feelers and detect the hardware on the box. After the install, run any installs/deinstalls you care to, and you're off and running with 9x. I'd recommend the parallel port Ethernet until a better solution presents itself. You could torture yourself with serial to serial connections if desired for updates/additions.
The party's over
#i-opener-linux experimentation reveals the
:(
interface to be a standard serial port plus
four extra lines, two for incoming phone line
and two for outgoing phone line.
so, you've got a COM1 port to play with. no bus.
sorry
it has a USB port though. lots of stuff can
fit in a usb port. like a $4o USB to ethernet
adaptor. also available in wireless.
Why don't somebody buy a truckload of these machines and put them up on eBay? Preferably someone who is prepared to ship internationally.
I think they're both on the same controller.
From the website's DMESG output...
VP_IDE: IDE controller on PCI bus 00 dev 39e irqs later
VP_IDE: not 100% native mode: will http://www.linux-hacker.net/iopener/dmesg.txtprob
ide0: BM-DMA at 0xe000-0xe007, BIOS settings: hda:DMA, hdb:DMA
hda: TOSHIBA MK2103MAV, ATA DISK drive
hdb: SunDisk SDTB-128, ATA DISK drive
ide0 at 0x1f0-0x1f7,0x3f6 on irq 14
hda: TOSHIBA MK2103MAV, 2067MB w/128kB Cache, CHS=525/128/63
hdb: SunDisk SDTB-128, 15MB w/1kB Cache, CHS=490/2/32
Also, if you take a look at the picture, you can see the connector above the chips. Top of the pic.
I finally ordered mine directly from NetPliance. The Circuit City locations in Portland and all the way up to Seattle were sold out and had them backordered. Apparently when the price dropped to $99, everyone and their dog decided to buy one. BTW - Does anyone else think that their shipping charge is a little steep? $38.00 to ship a 5lb. package!? And it's not even next day or 2nd day.
I am doing and have done several similar "conversion" projects with embedded computers and Linux.
/. before, but in a nutshell:
.1" used by pretty much all other header connectors - damn metric system!)
My first conversion of this type (other than laptops, which I was running Linux on way before it was cool, and when video drivers were a really ugly problem) was an Epson IM-403 cash register computer. (Available from Timeline, the surplus guys, for $99.) It's got a lot less stones than the iOpener, and no screen, but it does have a nifty if tiny little UPS that lets it ride out most power glitches. I've posted about this project here on
- 486SX33 CPU, pretty nice little BIOS
- nice little Chips and Tech video controller will do 800x600 max to std VGA connector
- four serial ports (great for control projects!)
- a parallel port
- socket/tray for a 2.5" IDE notebook hard disk (will accept even the tall 17 or 19mm drives, so you can put IBM's latest monster in it)
- a single ISA half-card slot for the obligatory network card.
- Socket for up to 32MB of RAM (plenty for a decent Linux system - I've run several versions of Caldera on the box, but recommend sticking to slim WMs for obvious reasons.)
- Flat ribbon connector for Epson floppy (know where to order one, if you need it.)
- Tiny little NiCad UPS built in. This is one of the coolest features, and the reason one of these is my primary file server at home. It will only keep the box alive for a few minutes, but that's always been enough so far.
These run Linux fine, or if you just need vNC, you can run the DOS vNC client with the packet drivers or a stripped Linux with the SVGALIB vNC, either of which should fit on a floppy. [As an aside, I have one extra IM-403 with a 3GB HDD that I'll sell for $120+S&H in the US, if anyone's interested.]
(BTW, anybody know where I can get a multiport network card (2 or more Ethers, 1 half-size ISA slot) that works under Linux? If so, I've got my new firewall...)
Also, I'm just starting to hack on a little ARM-based *touchscreen* webphone. These were built at enormous cost by AT&T and Philips before they decided they cost more than the market would bear. (They would have had to sell them for about $600.) They run AT&T's Inferno operating system, and are pretty darn nice speakerphones in addition to finally having the holy grail I've been searching for: a *touchscreen*. I think I can lay my hands on a couple hundred more of these at ~$200 each +S&H, if there's interest. They aren't speedy, but they have a built-in web browser and use one of those little WebTV-style wireless keyboards. Although I don't know of anyone that's replaced the OS (althogh ARM Linux is out there...), but there are hacking instructions available that show how to get root in Inferno. They don't have E-net connections, but do have two PCMCIA slots, so decent networking should be possible.
I've done a lot of hacking with laptop hard disks, and it's extraordianrily difficult to get the 44-pin cables for these things, especially if you want a cable to support two of the little drives. (Which I'd like to do for several machines I've got, including my FIC Sahara Databook, which uses a notebook CDROM on the secondary IDE channel that could give me a place to hang a backup drive. I can't even find anyplace to get a cable like that *made* anywhere here in Austin! You can get the connectors from Jameco, but I haven't found out where to get the dinkier ribon cable these need. (The 44-pin IDE 2.5" drive header uses 2mm pin spacing rather than the standard
Also, a local computer shop once had sockets and little plastic cases to allow a 2.5" HDD to be plugged into a 3.5" drive bay socket. They don't have them anymore. Anybody stumble across these in your searches?
"The future's good and the present is nothing to sneeze at." - Roblimo's last
Can anyone give the the inner dimension of the monitor base. I put a USB Hub inside.
There is no spoon.
QNX was also a real-time OS; not many Unixes could do that. For lots of applications, just being fast is fine, but if you're trying to control hardware that wants its interrupts handled in N microseconds so you can tweak physical behavior, it takes lots of support from the interrupt handlers and schedulers. Masscomp was one of the early players in the field, and some of the later System V releases had optional real-time schedulers. There were POSIX real-time specs around 1990, but I got the impression nobody much cared about supporting them. It's nice to see that there's some real-time Linux work going on as well.
Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
This arti cle describes Larry Ellison's newest spinoff which is going to manufacture $200 Linux Net Computers. side note: here in Richmond, VA (corp. hq of Circuit City), they ran out of the i-opener and told me even their warehouse did not have them.
Hello! I'm not clear from reading the posts, if after installing a new OS if you will be able to log into your regular ISP (earthlink, etc.) via the built-in modem? I thought there was some discussion that the modem is not standard and would not work? Is this correct? Is the modem still a mystery? I have one on order at CC. and today I got my Mother to order 2 more. I better be able to get this hack to work or I'm in deep water:-) Thanks Jerry
Check out the verbage on http://www.netpliance.com after clicking on "buy One" button. "By purchasing the i-opener you are agreeing to use the i-opener Internet service. The fee is $21.95 a month and will be billed approximately 2 days after the i-opener is shipped to you. Modification of the i-opener in any way is no longer physically possible and is in violation of our terms and conditions.
SecurityGeeks.com story points out that Netpliance has changed the rules on it's cool flatscreen machine.
Eve Fairbanks says I drive a hybrid!LOL
I-opener on ebay
Yes, but whats that got to do with the price of tea in D'ni?
I just when to check that the price had not changed for the I-Opener and was greated with a message stating that I would have to obligate for their internet service when I purchased the box. Ok, no prob pay for a month then quit. It also stated that the I-Opener was no longer able to be hacked as stated on the internet. Anything shipped after 3-20-2k is supposidly un-hackable. Can anyone verify this statement?