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Red Hat 7.0 Beta Is Out
Thorkild writes: "The subject says it all. They just opened up the directories on
the mirror sites." If you can't find it without me telling you where it is, then you shouldn't be running a Beta Red Hat 7.0 ;)
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I presume thats a carefully selected snapshot.
Has the IA32 c++ ABI been finalised (and implimented), or will there still be one more round of c++ program breakage?
I like to download slightly buggy debian packages and write to an author and say, "hey, this is a little bit messed up"
Sure, we listen to those, as well. If you don't want to use bugzilla for whatever reason, just pick the latest name in the changelog.
Chances are you'll get a reply, even if it takes a while (we get a lot of them, I'm admittedly about 500 mails behind at the moment).
I also like a minimalist base install
We've fixed that up for 7.0. (Pick custom install and select individual packages, then don't select anything).
We're down to 30 or so packages in a minimal install.
Why do distros feel the need to come with a shitload of software?
In some countries, net connections are terribly expensive, and the average computer store (unfortunately) still doesn't carry a lot of Linux software or mirrors of Linux ftp servers, so we're better off including a lot of things.
Including it on the CDs doesn't mean you have to install it... That's what custom installs are there for.
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I'm all for allowing fresh faces to come use Linux. And if they want to use wizards, that's fine, too. I think that most 31337 Linux users feel the same way, as long as their methods of unbreaking things are still available.
How could it not "stay true to the look and feel of Unix"? Red Hat does not remove your ability to hack your system from the command line any more than Slakware does.
It does however provide simpler tools to do it. I learned how to use linux on Red Hat. I used the tools to do what I didn't yet know how to, and I used the command line to do whatr i had already learned as I learned more I used the Red Hat tools less and less until I finally switched distros (Red Hat won't miss me I never paid them for it anyway). If I couldn't do it that way, I (and many others) would still be using, god-forbid, Windows.
And if more people start using linux with Red Hat, well that just makes me happier.
Devil Ducky
Devil Ducky
MY peers would get out of jury duty.
I just got sarchastic at some asshole who dissed on me, it's not like I really said, "Everybody, come read this gem I wrote, it's better than fucking Moby Dick and all the works of Shakespeare rolled into one."
Eh...
I've actually had a look at that before - but since I couldn't find any license in there, we can't ship any of them.
Who can guarantee that the fonts we pick aren't taken from some company that will sue us for stealing?
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StarOffice will NOT bw open source until the 6.0 release upcoming. As for most of the rest.. RH usually tries for a STABLE server-ready platform, that doesn't include things quite as unstable as the 2.4 test kernel... I would REALLY like to see ReiserFS and some of the LVM packages included, at least as options though.
"You never truly understand a thing until you can explain it to your grandmother" -Albert Einstein
No prob man. Like I said, I love your product. I just haven't used much more than the base install in a while since I haven't really loaded it for anything other than to say "Look, that's RedHat, nice OS, back to work." You know? It's all a question of taste, and mine is pretty random, so my opinions are about as valuable as bottled water at a water purification plant. You know?
Eh...
Tux is still being worked on. Apache is probably being held for Tux.
They've been burned by bind once already.
Staroffice will be Open Source in October. It's not open source yet.
Which LVM tool?
Probably marked it as over-rated because (s)he didn't want to get marked down in meta-moderation. Although I haven't looked hard for it, this is probably a copy-and-paste, and the proper moderation could be argued to be "Redundant". (Probably afraid of "inbred clueless meta-moderators".)
Anyway, the metalab link was wrong. It can actually be found at htt p://metalab.unc.edu/pub/Linux/distributions/redhat /redhat-7.0beta/pinstripe/.
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--
We have fought the AC's, and they have won.
5.2 shipped with more holes than a breadboard, dude.
Fighting the War on the War on Drugs.
http://smokedot.org/
I truly do not understand the purpose of releasing commercial beta code unless... Unless they want to use all their users to do their work for 'm
No matter how large a company is, it can't possibly have all combinations of hardware, so how are we supposed to find bugs that occur only in systems that have the MyNet 2000 network card in combination with a Weirdo UW-SCSI card?
That's (part of) why public betas are absolutely needed.
As for supplying beta testers with the final version, I'm all for it (no, I don't have any say on this), but it's probably hard to do - how do you determine who did "enough" testing? 10 Entries in Bugzilla? Then what about someone who found only one bug, but submitted a perfect fix?
You'll probably always end up being unfair to someone.
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I am surprised that the 2.4 kernel is not supposed to be ready for next redhat, which I suppose arrives october 1, as always. The fact that KDE is in and will be finished in the middle of september also indicates this date. It is sad that 2.4 is not ready, I have been using it since last october whith nil problem, what could it possible be that makes 2.2.17 more suitable for distribuiton ????
In fact, sometimes I just pick a point and argue it to see what people will say, it's a subtle form of trolling sometimes, whereas other times, I just want to see what conversation will come of it. Almost a social experiment if you will. Heh. Still, I do love your product.
Eh...
RedHat kicks Mandrake's ass into next week, but I don't think I can go back to a system without ReiserFS in the install? Is this going to be in the installation? Those RedHat-Reiser bootdisks really don't cut it.
Interested in open source engine management for your Subaru?
I presume that's a carefully selected snapshot
For the beta, yes.
Everything in there except for the kernel and some compat packages has been compiled with the snapshot.
For the final, we hope to include the final release.
Has the ia32 c++ ABI been finalised (and implemented)?
Implemented: yes.
Finalised: Hopefully, but there might be some more changes (which will of course make it into the 7.0 final).
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gave me a chuckle, just picked up and started reading 'second foundation' last night. Could it be that the MS anti-trust trial going to the supreme court at the same time Linux 2.4 is approaching release is just the latest Seldon Crisis?
There is much cruelty in the universe, John.
Yeah, we seem to have the tour map.
well.. there's debian :)
javajawa# sleep
Meh
Don't get me wrong. I really like RedHat, I just think that development has moved more towards the common user rather than the advanced user. I still like the distro, it just didn't have the general look and feel to it that I generally like. I really like what you did with your base install of X. I don't really like that it boots to X as default. The implementation of enlightenment is great. I don't remember what they were, but I had a couple of compile problems, and a few problems finding things in the directories that I expected them to be in, which made it difficult for me to do a few things. I am really more BSD oriented, so that setup feels a bit more native to me. I still really love the company and the product, it's just not the product for ME. I think that it's not so much the actual product as to where it sets in my mind. I haven't looked at the more recent releases, so maybe I'll burn me an ISO of the new one. I didn't mean to be insulting of course. RedHat has given a lot to the community, and it was my first distro.
Eh...
I knew this was coming, because my local Computer Store is now selling 6.2 for 30 dollars. 30 mail in rebate, 20 instant savings. Hopefully because of the 7, and them not using 6.3 they'll include kernal 2.4! I just can't wait!!!!!!!
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--
We have fought the AC's, and they have won.
The ultimate question being is RedHat going to stay true to the look and feel of Unix and the power and useability of it or not? Each coming version seems to cater more and more to the uninitiated (good) and less and less to those who seek to immerse themselves in the goodness of a unix environment (bad). I am heartily support RedHat, and am begginning to view it as a portole into the real world for windows (l)users (and I used to run it), than your regular linux distribution. This is ok, there are many linux distros these days that are like that. I still have stock in RedHat (believe it or not). Congrats to the RedHat team, even though I don't run ya (though I set up roommate up with your OS), I still love ya.
Eh...
SuSE 7.0 (split into professional and personal) will be out in August according to www.suse.de - and I was going to buy 6.4 soon. Don't think I'll bother now. "Release early and release often" is fine, but I think these two leading distros are releasing a bit /too/ frequently.
The reasons are simple - you don't want a mission critical server to crash because of a broken kernel.
I guess, then that this would lead to two comments.
1) It has been observed that with each major kernel release, a relatively major reconfig was required of certain packages to get optimal performance. Since this is a beta package, why not include the beta kernel with a product not expected to ship for another few months? Why rush 7.0, when it can be the equal of upgrading from 1.2 to 2.0, in every way? So, when things are final (KDE, Kernel 2.4, etc), RedHat 7.0 will be optimized for 2.4 and all its wonderful improvments.
2) I do not see how an argument about running a mission critcal server could apply to a distro marked beta. Not many would run beta in a mission critcal situation.
Bryan R.
Bryan R.
The price of freedom is eternal vigilance, or $12.50 as seen on eBay.....
I bet RH really really wanted to put XF86 4.0 and kernel 2.4 into 7.0. Can you imagine the problems if the kernel release schedule was dictated by RH (or any company)? They would be shipping 2.4.0-test3 (or whatever test we are at now)--with all the problems that implies. Long Live Open Source!
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Linux MAPI Server!
http://www.openone.com/software/MailOne/
(Exchange Migration HOWTO coming soon)
We're compiling some selected packages with optimizations - that way, we can still run on a 386, but get most of the speed out of optimizations.
Also, since we're using gcc 2.96, the generated 386 code is probably somewhat faster than the "optimized" code earlier versions produced.
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I knew if I reinstalled 6.2 on one of my machines that 7.0 would be out RSN.
I apologize, this is not a flame, but there are a few things you missed. StarOffice will not be open source until october from what I understand. Redhat has never been in the practice of putting beta kernels in their distros, nor any other beta things for that matter. Mandrake, on the other hand, is known for this ;)
And don't get me wrong. I would love to see all of these features, but often redhat does not go that cutting edge
-- Who is the bigger fool? The fool or the fool who follows him? --
I think this point has already been discussed - nVidia's drivers include stuff for licensed components/algorithms/etc. they use in their chips, and opening the source isn't an option at this point. It would be a nice option to have the RH Xconfigurator automatically configure the new nVidia drivers if you download them at least - any thoughts about this?
You can choose not to install X. Seriously, just don't install the X packages. However, most newbies want to use X because it provides an environment that is similar to what they are used to.
I think the point he is making is that the installation is done in X (is it?), in which case, it may be very slow on older PCs. Haven't downloaded it yet, so I don't know if you can only use X to install. I hope not.
For 6.0, there are located here; in fact, their entire support area is pretty well done.
Agreed, it is good. However, the point here is that if you download RedHat 6.0, you are still getting all the bugs and still have to to go the website and download the fixes.
Yeah, I know, you can just get 6.1, or 6.2, or soon 7.0. But when bugs are discovered in 7.0, we will still be downloading the buggy 7.0 until 7.1 comes out.
T.
>Besides, how else am I to get my official redhat sticker?
Go to an expo, or get one from your local LUG.
8^)
--
"It's tough to be bilingual when you get hit in the head."
Unfortunately the Adaptec AIC7xxx SCSI driver was REALLY broken and 6.2 won't even install
It is my understanding that some cards using the AIC7xxx chipset are really broken and 6.2 doesn't have the right workarounds (it definitely works on my home machine with an original Adaptec 2940).
Did you try the patch from http://people.redhat.com/dledford/ai c7xxx.html? A couple of people have reported that fixes the problem (use the driver at the BOTTOM of the list), so I guess it's actually resolved.
I don't have the actual hardware to verify this myself.
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Yeah. Well, I do think that RPM is a very convenient package manager. I will give the new release a whirl and see how I like it.
Eh...
That's why distro inflate their numbers. Unfortuantly the commerical market thinks that higher numbers means much newer (and better). Its the very reason that Slackware jumped from 4.0 to 7.0 (they've openly admitted this). Just like your comment about Caldera, they didn't want people to say "Redhat 6.0 MUST be better than Slackware 4.1." Even Perl is doing it. Instead of making 5.006 they are going to 5.6, because people don't realize the significant change from x.005 to x.006
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Why are they jumping from 6.2 to 7.0 now? I would have thought that the logical move from 6.x to 7.x would be when the 2.4 kernel is released. Unless just beta testing 7.0 with the 2.2.17 kernel and will release 7.0 once 2.4 (& kde2) becomes available.
HH
I agree with most all of your points. I have long thought that Linux was too "unstable".
I feel that Microsoft Windows NT is too "unstable" and it only changes major components once a year.
Major releases generally cause stress amongst IT shops, both trying to deploy upgrades as well as retest and develop software against the new changes. Ye olde Mainframe went for years without major changes, allowing IT to focus on solutions to problems rather than upgrades.
Now I have to correct your FUD...
Windows 98 is #2 in terms of retail sales of business software, at least according to www.pcdata.com. It's in the top 10 of all retail software sales.
Windows Me is supposed to ship this fall, not two years from now, more like two months...
RedHat 6.2 is #17 in business retail sales.
Windows 2000 is #18 on the retail sales charts.
As far as noone likes Windows 2000... That's not true. Personally my trials at home show it to be great. It's slow in sales right now only because corporations are slow to upgrade, due to the difficulties I pointed out above.
Also given that most sales of Windows are in the corporate and OEM markets, it's not doing bad at all...
Who was it that had a shit eating fetish. It was some big rock star... I can't remember though. Nasty eh?
Eh...
What about OpenSSL/OpenSSH? Are there issues with distributing the crypto that are stopping from being included in the distro? The first thing I always need to after a fresh RedHat install is install OpenSSL/OpenSSH.
Umm... I think that was a bad example ;-).
.. not by version numbers. Clueful people (i.e., Slashdot readers) understand this. Non-clueful people (i.e., John Q. Katz) by and large do not.
Not the point. You can make the case that IE 5 is better than Netscape 4 (I cannot make this case because I've never used IE 5, and cannot use it on my platform of choice) but if you claim this, it's OBVIOUSLY not because the version number of the software is higher. THIS is misconception that must be addressed.
Software quality is judged by functionality, stability, performance, and value
If you know about the news and can find it out without reading slashdot, then you shouldnn't be reading slashdot.
I was talking to someone who hires support staff, and he actually considers such certifications on a resume to be black marks.
So in some cases, those certifications hurt your chances of getting a job.
Each time the version number of glibc is increased by 0.0.1, Red Hat grabs the new version and uses it to bounce up its version number by 1.0
Entirely untrue.
We increase the major version number when there are changes that will prevent stuff compiled on the new version to run on the old version without being recompiled.
For 7.0, that's caused by the change of compilers (C++ binary incompatibility) and glibc (2.2, not 2.1.8).
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It seems that the latest windows ME beta was just sent to interested people. And somehow i got a copy. Didn't work. And in typical microsoft fashion, there wasn't even an option on their survey "it didn't even install" hehe.
I can't talk in geek speek, but if you are installing RedHat you just ain't cool.
You gotta install like something that nobody else does.
If you want to be really cool, get ahold of an SLS distribution from 1992, and run one of the early XFree86 versions.
Then you'd be really cool, and you could get close to your 3l33t friends!
The bonus for a retailer is that if the product sells, they get to sell it once or twice a year...not just once every 3 years. If the product doesn't sell, then swapping stock is something they begin to hate. In some cases, they get kick backs for 'old' versions and use some of that money to reduce the price of stuff on the shelves instead of returning it.
These policies differ on the software producer's side and the retail outlet side...usually to the benifit of the retail outlet (don't want to piss those folks off!).
Also remember that Linux distros don't have the artificial 'upgrade' versions -- they're all 'full' versions.
A firewall can not protect you from yourself. Turn off what you do not need. Do not use the firewall to do your work.
What's missing:
sendmail 8.11
Missing from the beta, present in our current tree (and definitely the final).
kernel 2.4test5ac
Actually it's there, on the 2nd CD and not installed by default because it's known to have some critical bugs.
tux 1.0
Needs kernel 2.4
apache 2.0pre4
Chances are 2.0 won't be released in time for 7.0. It'll probably be in 7.1 (and I'll make RPMs for 7.0 available as soon as I have the time).
bind 9.0
Same as for apache - I'm actually using the 9.0.0 release candidate to host bero.org, but it has a couple of problems, like some missing utilities, and requires all master zones to be changed because the TTL stuff is now mandatory (and most people haven't used it with bind 8), so there's no really clean update path. Not something we could do in the couple of days between the 9.0.0rc1 release and the beta.
staroffice
It's still binary-only, they've just announced they'll GPL it by October 13th. We'll include it once that happened, until then, it will be on the Linux Applications CD in the boxed sets.
LVM
It's present in the 2.4 kernel we're shipping.
reiserfs
Too unstable at the moment. They keep changing the journal format, and the recovery tools aren't quite where they should be.
Yes, reiserfs is nice while it works (I'm actually using it on one of my machines), but if something doesn't work and a journal replay doesn't fix it, you're usually in trouble.
I'll make a kernel RPM with the patch available over at people.redhat.com/bero/experimental when I have the time (probably shortly after the 7.0 release) for those who want to play - but for now, we don't feel we can support it.
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"Pinstrip" as in "more business oriented"? ;)
And what clueless moderator marked this as "Troll"?
It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?
Red Hat Beta 6.0, 6.1 and Alpha 6.2 which include the newest and most unstable of all releases.
You must be using a different 6.2 than the rest of the world then...
If you have any issues with 6.2, report them - we can't fix problems we aren't aware of. Considering my web server (running 6.2) has had an uptime of 103 days before I rebooted it for a kernel upgrade, I'd hardly call it alpha-quality code.
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Ok, to clear my flustered head. It was a bit more of, who are they trying most to cater to. I, quite frankly, am greatful that you are bringing more people over from the dark side. I just like distros that look and feel a certain way, and are run in a certain way. I like to contribute code, build CVS, and feel like that's what the other users are doing to. That's the main thing about the feel of it for me. The other stuff is there too, but that's just me. I really like your company and the educating, the awareness, the contributions. I just don't like the feel of a Linux that feels more in the hands of the few, you know? I like to download slightly buggy debian packages and write to an author and say, "hey, this is a little bit messed up." You know? I like to have a hand in the final distro. That's what I'm looking for in a dist. I also like a minimalist base install. Give me the OS, and I'll decide what I want in it. What use is JunkBuster to me if I don't know it's there, and didn't put it there, and don't care that it's there? It's just taking up space (Debian is guilty of this too of course). Why do distros feel the need to come with a shitload of software? I realize that you want to say "look, we do all of the shit that windows does," but with windows, it all comes in different boxes. I'm not saying to do that, but you could have it not all dumped in on the user at the start. I am not any more for charging $30 bucks a piece for 20 boxes than then next guy. I like having a lot of neat quirky pieces of software. I don't really need to have the moon phase indicator installed in the base setup of X though, even though I do run it.
Just a few ideas.
Eh...
You mean there is a version of Gnome that *is* stable?
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-- SIGFPE
Good point. I see what the previous author was most likely talking about.
With almost all distributions (including Red Hat), most drivers are built as modules. Because you often need those drivers at boot time, Red Hat puts the modules you need into a ram disk image that gets used before your root partition is mounted. Personally, I like to rebuild my kernel with all critical drivers built in so as to avoid this ram disk.
So how do you find out what drivers you need?
Well, to start, use the command `lsmod` to see which modules are loaded. That should tell you which network driver you need to build.
Side Note: RedHat's mailing lists have *always* sucked. I did just get a note a week or so ago that they'll be moving all their lists to mailman RSN. Hopefully, that'll fix their poor archiving problems (among otehr things)
Red Hat is a great product, but I have two computers and the big one runs windows because of Adobe software, the Quake3 and the homeworld CD I got. It's also got a RedHat partition... but I have no use for it...
That's because the other computer runs OpenBSD, it's got all I need to develop & test BSD and UNIX applications. I feel "affinity" with it, I like the Buqtrack record it has, gives me the feeling its secure.. and I drool over it. I don't know why.
To me GNU Linux is in the middle, like OpenBSD it doesnt have the Adobe aps I crave, doesn't run homeworld. It does run Q3A but I dont have the right CD. Like OpenBSD I can do any development task on it but OpenBSD is a lot more secure, and definately much more apt to fulfill the roles I require from it.
And GNU Linux would want to be everything to me, the best of both worlds, but it doesn't yet deliver that. For fun and adobe power its mac or windows, for the raw emanations of unix power its openbsd.
Of those to whom much is given, much is required.
Any yahoo can download and patch the kernel source for ReiserFS support. The problem comes with not having a viable method to install onto a newly formated ReiserFS partition through a RedHat install procedure. This is what people are looking for, not generic kernels that run on ReiserFS (though this would need to be part of the install, of course).
Interested in open source engine management for your Subaru?
Dude, notice any sarcasm???
Postgres and MySQL are great inclusions, but what about Interbase? Hasn't it been released with an acceptable license? In any event, ya gotta love these choices!
Update the packages as they come out do to erratas and bug fixes.
Update the packages YOU USE MOST as they come out.
No need to start over or buy and upgrade everytime there's a new "release" by Red Hat or any other vendor. You really only need that if you want a "clean slate" to a known-version.
I run a few 6.0 systems that are well beyond 6.2 and on par with 7.0 even. It does what I need, the packages I use and rely on are current. That's good enough for me.
Of course, in production situations, your needs will vary...
Nonsense. Large and small retailers are allowed to exchange unsold versions of packaged software when a new version is released. This makes complete sense, as the production cost of software is essentially zero; the "value" of the software isn't added until the cash register drawer slams shut. Thus, a shelve full of $25 copies of RedHat is *worth* about 25 cents. Perhaps free software returned to the distributer will be handled differently, in that old versions can be donated to charity, instead of being destroyed. . .
If it helps, my older one only has 5.
Eh...
send flames > /dev/null
Only 'flamers' flame!
Personally, if I look at a resume and see such a "certification" it does nothing for me...
You are one of the intelligent few. But most ppl in the position of hiring an "intelligent" programmer are impressed w/ all these certifications.. I, for one, am not.Why does there need to the start of beta? Should not all distributions be continuously in beta?
Yes. And we are. Check out Raw Hide, which is actually a snapshot of our current development work, updated every couple of days.
Our official betas are when we decide something has all the features we need in the final version, and generate ISO images to make it available to a broader group of people.
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So if the patent expires later this year, can we expect to see it in 7.1?
You'll never see a version 13 of anything.
Go on, name a software package that has made it
to version 13!
AutoCad is the only one that springs to mind.
Too many anal-retentive marketing types getting
involved, IMHO. Tch! Number Envy. How sad.
Nonetheless, it all works out in the end. Maybe retailers will start selling the $2 redhat CD's instead of the silly boxed sets in order to minimize their losses.
Markets, they work.
Amazing magic tricks
I have been keeping up with RawHide and I haven't seen anything going which would warrant a 7.0 designation
All the major number increase means is that an application compiled on a 7.0 system won't run on a 6.x system without being recompiled (because of the glibc and compiler upgrades).
Binary compatibility throughout a major number release is very important to us (do you think we LIKED keeping egcs 1.1.2 as the primary compiler in 6.2?).
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Why does a multi-million dollar software firm seem to have no idea about major/minor software versioning? A quick pass over the binary packages included in this release tells me that the only major changes here are XFree 4 and gnome 1.2. For this we're going to version 7.0? Shouldn't this 7.0 release have included KDE 2 (not beta) and kernel 2.4 (not beta) at least to make it a new major version?
You box and sell it by taking a snapshot, and selling the current state as of the time when the snapshot is made. However, you continue to continuously upgrade all of the components so that, having purchased the 'snapshot', users can keep their code up-to-date and with all of the bug and security fixes.
The least RH could do is grant those users a small refund or another small gesture for their hard work.
Let's see...how exactly do you give a refund on a free download? A refund implies a monitary transaction. If I were to submit a bug fix or some suggestion that actually made it into the final distro, I couldn't really ask for a better "small gesture"
Does the XFree 4.0.1 in RH 7.0b come with it's own free TT fonts? (Freetype IIRC)
Freetype is a LIBRARY that supports handling truetype fonts.
We've been including it and patching XFree86 to handle it since 6.0 or so.
However, there are no TT fonts included ATM (neither with the 7.0beta nor with Freetype) - if you can point me to a place that has good and free TT fonts that we could include, do.
It's hard to find any high-quality free TT fonts.
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Perhaps. I always buy the latest Redhat I'm using for the same reason I always register shareware I use often. Though selling the actual distro may no longer be RedHat's bread and butter (service and support is) I have no desire to see them go under because the planet is sitting in uffish thought while they download it. ;)
Besides, how else am I to get my official redhat sticker? I think I have one on every major appliance in my house at this point. <g>
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with each major kernel release, a relatively major reconfig was required of certain packages to get optimal performance
:>)
We're ready for 2.4 in these terms.
Everything in the distribution has been compiled with 2.4 kernel includes, and all packages have been updated (we're even including iptables, the ipchains replacement for 2.4 kernels).
why not include the beta kernel with a product not expected to ship for another few months?
We don't expect to see a 100% stable 2.4.x release before going gold on 7.0. Therefore, we need beta testers to check how well our updates to the 2.2 kernels work with all sorts of hardware. That's why we're including the kernel that's closer to the default kernel for 7.0 final.
If you take a look at the kernel source RPM, you'll see we've added a number of patches, such as USB support - we don't want to include them in 7.0 without having had any public beta testing on that kernel.
Why rush 7.0
I'd rather delay 7.0 by a few more weeks to wait for some projects, but it's out of the question for the business side.
Not many would run beta in a mission critical situation
Right - but the beta is supposed to be as close as possible to the final, and the final will have 2.2.17 by default (with 2.4.0 included on the CD for those who want to play).
We can't go "2.2.17 is tested well enough, we'll just throw it in if 2.4.0test9pre7 isn't stable enough at release time" because we don't want to ship untested kernel patches. That would be suicide... (Then again, maybe not, seems like Microsoft has done it all the time
This message is provided under the terms outlined at http://www.bero.org/terms.html
Well its a redhat 7.0 beta which means it has two strikes against it. First being that it is beta. The other that its the beta to a redhat .0 release. I really agree with the security article that was posted a while ago that the redhat .0 releases arent usually that good, and tend to be the real bleeding edge.
/*
that said, i like their short release cycle. Debian(prob. my favorite) has a *long* cycle **long** ***long*** (you get the point). I wish they would take an example from redhat.
*Not a Sermon, Just a Thought
*/
*Not a Sermon, Just a Thought
*/
I am running prereleased version of SuSE 7.0. SuSE 7.0 is on 4CDs of RPMs + 2CDs of SRPMs. It is rock stable (kernel 2.2.16) and all of my computers run much faster after upgrade.
Hmm, I've had to review a lot of resumes, and sit in on interviews. The certifications are no different from a college degree, they won't guarantee you a job, but they are a factor in a positive manner.
Having worked with a lot of really bad people in the IT industry, and some really talented ones. What I have found is that between the two groups... those who are certified and those who are not. Whether this be CNE, MCSE, RHCE, Cisco, etc. The group that is certified generally has a higher percentage of talented employees than the one which doesn't.
I think a large factor in that is those who take the time to read the books and obtain the certification are generally more committed to the profession, are more disciplined, are more interested in furthering themselves.
That's not always the case, but in general it holds true... similar to say having a college diploma... such that it's a factor in prescreening resumes. Not a sole factor, but it is a positive factor.
Oh, and BTW... I have a MCSE along with a BSCS.
Unfortunately I've found that those who argue against certifications are generally fairly new to the industry and don't have the experience to really be making that judgement. That's another stereotype, if you wish to dispute... send me email.
>reiserfs
Will RedHat consider an install disk that supports this from the start? Those RedHat-Reiser disks really don't get the job done, and I'd like to be able to use ReiserFS from the get-go.
Interested in open source engine management for your Subaru?
Are there any mirrors of the rawhide stuff? Redhat's main ftp server is hard enough to look at, much less when there's a beta announcement on slashdot.
I can not understand why redhat doesn't include any of the two available free (speech) SECSH (ssh2) implementations in their standard distribution. This would be a very simple step towards a much more secure out-of-the-box product. The crypto-regulations in the US shouldnt be a problem since OpenSSH and others are distributed by default.
Oh come on, we can all see straight through that!
:-)
We all know the REAL reason you release so often is because is gets announced on slashdot and you write replies to everyones comments. Your replies all get modded up to +5 and your karma soars.
THAT is why RH really releases so often - You simply want more karma.
-- MartinG To mail me: echo kewyjlcxyzvjfxbqwh | tr bcefhjklqvwxyz
Gorkman
Can anyone tell if OpenSSH is part of the standard install now? Licensing issues resolved, etc etc ... ?
Sig (appended to the end of comments you post, 120 chars)
It would seem readily apparent that some postings here are only present to start pissing contests. Hopefully this is not one of them.
.. now how much would you pay ? All the distros have that built in.
...
Please stop arguing about which distro is better. Any Open-Source OS that can be tuned to YOUR needs is the one you should use. It's not about which one, its about all of them.
It's getting boring to read _lame_skript_kiddie_ complaints about how *pick-your-distro* doesn't have a 2.4 kernel, or StarOffice, or whatever. Did you know you could go get it yourself, review the code, configure, make, and install too?
If you didn't like it, you can change it, yep, learn a little programming, and make it exactly how you want it
Can you do that with MS ? nope nope nope, You get it Bill's way.
Anyways
So Beta 7 is out, great, RH is taking a positive step towards decreasing the MS marketshare on the desktop. I think that a 6 month turnaround is about right, remember, MS released new OS's what, about every 3 years (95->98, 3.51->4.0->2000). That is one of the benefits which is driving *nix up the marketshare ladder, server and desktop.
Lets pull it apart boys !!! (and girls)
-BrewX
Does RedHat still pimp out Applixware? If so, why would they even think of including StarOffice with their distrobution?
It would be like Microshaft including Nutscrape Navigator in their next OS instead of including Internet Exploder.
[Connection closed by foreign host]
While Red Hat just announced their 7.0 beta, SuSE ist already posting ads for their 7.0. But I don't understand this major jump in version numbers, for there is not much new in both of the distros... obviously, kernel 2.4 is still missing, KDE 2 is still not done, etc. 7.0 sounds important and like a big step, but all SuSE has to offer is their yast2 graphical install and admin tool, which is a pain in the wrist to use...
hmm, caldera is still at 2.4, does that mean they are about 1/3 as good as Red Hat and SuSE?
It was my impression when I looked at the RHCE that you could only take the tests at the Redhat offices in North Carolina?
Take into consideration travel, hotel and the one week class and it's like a $5,000 investment. Obtaining an MCSE or CNE is only like maybe $500-1000 to buy some books, self study and take the tests at the local Sylvan Learning Center.
If that's true that the certification only lasts basically two years. Hmm, that seems like kind of a rip.
Especially considering that RedHat hasn't really changed signifigantly from an install and administration point since the beginning of time. What's the point in this expiration?
I guess this is part of their revenue stream for their business. I rather doubt Microsoft or Novell ever make money off their certification program, except for ancillary sales of product.
Does that come with a phaser and a communicator? Will I need to call Jordi when it breaks?
Go not unto/. for advice, for you will be told both yea and nay (but have nothing to do with the question)
The ia32 distribution is compiled with optimizations for PentiumPro and above, but they don't use non-i386 instructions so that they can be run on i386 as well (actually, the only i686 non-i386 instructions which the compiler emits are conditional moves; most of the stuff have been compiled with -march=i386 -mcpu=i686). The few exceptions like glibc and kernel come in a few different package editions. The new gcc used in the distribution has a new ia32 backend, so it should boost things even further.
This comment happily reminds me of a young priest that tried to teach me at my Catholic High School. He was a very intelligent man, but he just couldn't handle 30 teenage boys. One day, near the end of the year, we finally broke him. He stood, almost in tears, at the front of the room pounding on the podium, whimpering, "But I have a masters degree from MIT, I have a masters degree from MIT...."
Cheers.
Yes, it should.
Why fix what isn't broken?
It /is/ broken. /etc/rc.d/rc?.d does not meet the FHS. To make RedHat more compliant with the standard, the change had to be made. Look at the other RPM-based distros. They use /etc/rc*.d, not /etc/rc.d/rc*.d. This should theoretically simplify things, in terms of having RedHat and SUSE more alike.
- I want to upgrade to a more recent kernel, like 2.2.16
- I want to add optimizations for my CPU
- ALSA says I need to have some kind of sound kernel module built (or whatever its called), and it appears that the stock kernel doesn't have that enabled, so I need to compile a new kernel with that feature enabled. (Never mind that I already have audio working with the normal drivers, that's still not good enough for ALSA).
Ok, maybe that's only three reasons, but I think others can add some more reasons.--
And the men who hold high places must be the ones who start
To mold a new reality... closer to the heart
Both are right actually - the main dist consists of the two CDs, but for a normal installation, the first will suffice.
This message is provided under the terms outlined at http://www.bero.org/terms.html
...negate the previous - a rip-roar of a release (I've been waiting on 7.x to configure a couple of new workstations) will renew interest in the green monster...
M$: "We're #2!"
I think it's cool that the Red Hat folks take the time in their busy schedule to come here, in Slashdot, to keep us informed -- right from the true source.
People who say that RH have sold out are plain wrong.
In fact, sometimes I just pick a point and argue it to see what people will say, it's a subtle form of trolling sometimes, [...]
It is not subtle, and it's not just a form of trolling. In fact, this is the essence of trolling, my friend. You may be naïve, living under a rock, or simply just lying (my guess) but all good trolls are based upon this principle: finding (or constructing) an argument about which enough people will care and then dilligently proceed to fan the ensuing flames.
There's no denying you have the dilligence. All that's lacking is a little subtlety and, quite frankly, a better writing style.
--
Information wants to be beer, or something like that.
What do we have here? We mozilla,kde,redhat,linux 2.4,Xfree86. Beta Beta Beta all over the place we should do something about this and get these things up and running so we won't be stuck in the mud for to long
OK, it's nice to know how you work ... still I think that new releases of software should be included only after they have been thoroughly tested instead of including a lot of really fresh releases. Either that or you should make clear that the RedHat X.0 and X.1 releases are not meant to be reliable and that users should wait for the X.2 release until switching.
On a somewhat related note, lsmod says:
- 3c59x 18980 1 (autoclean)
but- Ethernet controller: 3Com 3C905B 100bTX (rev 36).
So do I have a 905B or a 59x?--
And the men who hold high places must be the ones who start
To mold a new reality... closer to the heart
Oops, you caught us... :)
;)
Yes, the plans are to get a user account with karma > whatever the code currently supports, thereby causing a buffer overrun and taking over Slashdot, and thereby WORLD DOMINATION!
Oops, now I told too much.
Guess I'd better do something to make at least some people believe we're releasing because we're actually improving something...
400th post!
I'm currently pouring hot grits down my pants and looking at a Natalie Portman poster!
Your favorite Linux distribution sucks, all real people do "cat >/dev/hda"!
Hope this qualifies as Troll, -1.
Obviously, I'm not after Karma.
This message is provided under the terms outlined at http://www.bero.org/terms.html
Bero, have to correct you. We will include a carefully selected snapshot in the final release as well, GCC 3.0 is several months away. And we use don't use the -fnew-abi, because it is only partially implemented and not even close to finalized (likewise with libstdc++ v3).
1) realplayer doesn't work with glibc2.2, install the compat libraries and run with:l ib/RealPlayer7 /usr/i386-glibc21-linux/lib/ld-linux.so.2 /usr/X11R6/bin/realplay
;)
LD_LIBRARY_PATH=/usr/i386-glibc21-linux/lib:/usr/
2) gcc still has some issues (eg: input.c from xmms as well as linux kernel), install kgcc, and feel free to use it.
still, I use it, I need every last bit of speed, and this is much better then rawhide was two weeks ago (and faster then redhat6.2). AND: enlightenment is back in... Hopefully this means the end of the "war" between rasterman and redhat
Here's how to configure & build a stock RedHat kernel. This won't work when you upgrade to a new kernel, but at least you can look at all the options as they are configured.
/usr/src/linux/configs
/usr/src/linux, run
Look in
You'll see several files, names something like
kernel-2.2.15-i386-BOOT.config kernel-2.2.15-i586.config
kernel-2.2.15-i386-smp.config kernel-2.2.15-i686-smp.config
kernel-2.2.15-i386.config kernel-2.2.15-i686.config
kernel-2.2.15-i586-smp.config
Decide which one you want. I'm using
kernel-2.2.15-i386.config on my laptop and
kernel-2.2.15-i686-smp.config on my desktop.
You that you have a file, in
# make xconfig
or
# make menuconfig
Depending on X or Text mode. Look for an option like "Load Alternative Config File". Type/Paste in the name of the file you picked. Save & Exit.
# make dep; make clean; make; make modules; make bzlilo; make modules_install
There's Fontastic, though not all the fonts come with license information, so they may not actually be free. Quite a collection though.
--
OK, sorry ... now that I re-read my flame I must conclude that it was my mad mood speaking.
About three months ago, I installed Debian on my home system and I'm seriously contemplating installing it on my machine at work.
Slackware => Redhat => Debian. Seems like a natural progression, but maybe that's just me.
--
Information wants to be beer, or something like that.
It's Linux 7.0 that's out. See, all my favorite commercial apps say they require "Linux 6.2" to run, so therefore this latest version must be Linux 7.0. And we all know the commercial programs must be right because they can afford to sell the products. If this GNOME thing was any good, they would sell that too.
BTW, what's this "kernel" thing people keep talking about?
(hey mods, it's a joke)
--
Friends don't let friends misuse the subjunctive.
Caldera's Linux 2.4 Technology Preview includes:
This is not to be confused with Caldera's confusing versioning scheme in which 2.2, 2.3 and 2.4 all were based on Linux kernel 2.2.x. Maybe Caldera will jump up to 7.0 when the real 2.4.0-honest-to-God comes out in October 200x, and RedHat, Mandrake, Slackware, and SuSE all come out with 8.0.
Remember, crackers always want us running the latest stuff.
The contest of being to first to announce a distro has a beta out. Pissing contest for geeks. Have to love it. I do wonder, though, how much wasted bandwidth goes to ftp lurkers waiting to pounce at the first sign of something beta.
Bryan R.
Bryan R.
The price of freedom is eternal vigilance, or $12.50 as seen on eBay.....
what are the problems with 6.1? I've been using 6.1 for over 6 months (since shortly after it came out) without encountering anything serious (other than the bind vulnerability). Mind you, I've replaced the kernel and modified several other things.
Bill - aka taniwha
--
Leave others their otherness. -- Aratak
It's little things like that that can really irk your support base... the pointy hairs might not notice, but we do.
---
At least their competitors bothered to upgrade before their release
--
--
We have fought the AC's, and they have won.
It does seem that people who are long-term Linux users don't use RedHat anymore, maybe because it has been geared towards the "newbie", but at the end of the day surely Linux is Linux, and you can set up any distribution how you like given a bit of time.
.. I did, however, want programs to compile wihout having to search for dozens of libraries.. This is probably because I'm not "good" at installing the other distros, but RedHat has been the only one to compile nearly every program I throw at it without complaining.
True, but I've migrated back to RedHat (for at least the time being).. I'm by no means an expert, but when I recently built a few node Beowulf cluster for a test at my work, I didn't have time nor did I need to tweak each daemon running (most were shut off, uninstalled or not even installed)
Daniel
I can't disagree with you - you're not raining on any parade. I specifically said that the only reason I got this certification is because my employer wanted me to and paid for it.
Probably the same inbred clueless moderator that marked it as over rated.
I'm not really a linux person, but I don't get the big deal about distributions. Aren't they all using the same kernel, the same desktop, the same compilers and, really, the same everything?
Once you've got around the install procedure, what's the difference in, say, Red Hat and Debian?
Isn't Linux just Linux?
The small, independant retailer I work for decided to stock some Linux Distros once. We know have an official "Out of Date Linux Distros" shelf. It has, Redhat 6.1, YellowDog Linux Champion Server 1.1, and Mandrake 7.0 on it right now.
-fp
o GCC 2.96
How's this? gcc.gnu.org says:
GCC 2.95.2 is the current release.
And the snapshots have been 2.95.3-somedate, not 2.96. I know you guys own Cygnus which is a major player in gcc development, but what's going on?
sorry: 'rpm -Va' no longer works (and it was quite handy too)
A beta version of Red Hat - ie it is neither red nor a hat.
:)
But then the final versions weren't red hats either.... i'm confuseddddddd
at least windos has dos
No true -
Global Knowledge is their training partner and they have centers all over the place so travel should be minimal. They administer the tests as well.
And to defend their price of $700 for thest, it's a whole day thing and it's NOT computer based multiple choice like the Sylvan exams. It's instructor led hands on "I broke this machine please fix it" type of test.
--
This release, however, makes it even harder to uninstall gnome. A variant of SGI's fam (file access monitor), recently Freed, is run instead of regular init by the patched Red Hat kernel. It watches for changes to any of the gnome files, and if you attempt to remove one (via any method), it sends SIGCANTREMOVEGNOME to the process in question, which causes it to be terminated, and the binary associated with it to be removed and zeroed on disk.
This major new Innovation [TM] brought to you by Red Hat [TM][R] makes for a safer, friendlier [TM] Computing Experience [TM].
In the next version, we plan to expand this feature to also monitor X and GNOME configuration files, to ensure that not only can GNOME not be removed, but it can't be disabled by rogue systems administrators or hackers either.
SEC disclaimer: FORWARD-LOOKING STATEMENTS: This release makes forward-looking statements, which is surely a mistake; at the rate our stock price is falling, this release might not even make it out the door before we're bought out by SGI in a stock swap valued at seven dollars and thirty-one cents.
Well, I've been using Linux for four years now, and I still use Red Hat - on my servers and on my desktops.
.tgz's of Slackware are just non-standardized enough, and that's why no software maker will claim it works on Slack.
I started on Slack in 1996. Painful. But I loved it. Today I know and understand linux, and I'm looking at being more productive. Sure you can use cp and mv and find -name, but that gets tedious and redundant. Nothing beats the ease of point-and-click. I recently installed Slack 7.0. Downloaded the ISO. Still had to make those root/boot disks. Sorry to say, but Bootable CD's aren't just for newbies.
The RPM is (IMO) the best package manager out there. Upgrades are easy, new software installs are easy. Don't get me wrong, I love compiling software as much as the other dude, but that's not productive for _me_. Give me a binary RPM so I can _use_ the stuff. The
I never really saw any show stoppers with RH 6.1 but the couple of things I remember were that if you selected to install KDE workstation you still got Gnome at startup and if you selected 'Use Graphical Login' you still got the text login. Both easy to fix if you know what and where to edit but still significant problems in the eye's of people who are trying Linux for the first time.
As an 'Internet Solutions Provider', we've been running servers and developing under RedHat for years now. And it's a great, stable, mature distro. Yes, it's got more newbie oriented and yes RedHat have made a lot of money, but it's still a damn reliable, stable server envrionment and a perfectly adequate Linux development environment. All this is going to happen anyway, you can't tout something to the entire world without expecting people to actually want to use it. And you can't expect everyone to have a degree in computer science just to be able to use a computer. RedHat have done a great job with Linux and have helped raise it's profile immensely - it's relations with Oracle, Dell, IBM etc. show this. I like SuSE, Debian and Caldera too .. and Corel's alright for a turn-key desktop. Yes there are too many distributions and I do wish these companies would stop jumping on bandwagons by releasing, yet another linux distro - how about doing somethign useful, like writing some decent applications guys? Knocking this distribution and that desktop environment is not constructive for the development of Linux. Let's stop wasting our collective breaths and continue to promote it (in whatever form) and produce some more applications.
i hope things will be compiled for optimisation with a pentium, like mandrake is.
---
You have a 905B; the same kernel module runs both. Check out the options in networking in 'make menuconfig'; I think the help info tells you that.
EOT
millenium isnt expected for another 24 months
Uhm....it's due out this fall. I'm actually holding a copy of the Gold Final in my hands right now....
-Julius X
-Julius X
remove "-whatkindofspamdoyoutakemefor-" from email to send
Looking in the iso directory:
pinstripe-en-i386-cd1.iso
pinstripe-en-i386-cd2.iso
Are they finally breaking down and needing 2 CD's?
Give a man a match, you keep him warm for an evening.
Light him on fire, he's warm for the rest of his life
The "Larabie fonts" that is included with Caldera are free although their quality is not the highest.
Hmmm, werent we bashing MS for doing just this recently?
Later...
KangarooBox - We make IT simple!
I haven't installed it yet, but it looks as thought the Logical Volume Manager tools still aren't packaged with the distro. This concerns me. This is among several concerns I have about RedHat's future directions. I've always liked redhat (since the Mother's Day release back in the day) and especially have appreciated their attempt to balance the new and fancy with stability and security.
But recently they've been failing on both fronts. Suse seems to be taking the lead on new features (with their support of X drivers, and shipping LVM and reiserfs), and Redhat has slipped on the security front. Redhat took two weeks (two weeks!) to issue patches the the last round of security problems affecting the 2.2.14 kernel. Not the 24-hour turnaround I've come to expect.
I suspect the distro will be good in other respects, though.
Uhm, actually, as a Debian user, I'm pretty much used to this situation.
Except of course that we don't even have KDE 1.x yet... (c:
(of course, I still *use* Debian...)p.--Cycon
Your Brain + EEG + LEGO Robots = Brainstorms
More importantly, the RSA patent expires in a scant 20 days! Perhaps they're holding back public release until then?? Please?!
Bzzt. WinME has gone gold is due out 2nd week of september, 6 weeks from now. I don't really take issue with any of your points (other than, perhaps, the fact that their software has revved three times in the last twelve months, which will cause retailers to become super-pissed. Look at the shelf life of your average game--there's no sign of THOSE coming off shelves anytime soon) but that glaring inaccuracy jumped out at me.
What part of "shall not be infringed" is so hard to understand?
When I recently tried a Rawhide package, I noticed it was packaged in RPM 4 format, so I assume RH7 will use RPM 4 as well. :-(.
These packages cannot be handled with RPM 3 or any other tools. Luckily RawHide contains an RPM for RPM 4, in you guessed it RPM4 format
Apparently Red Hat felt it was imperative to have a new incompatible format for RPMs. What I do not understand however is why they did not did not change to a more open format, so can use more generally available tools to inspect them. Why not make a tar or cpio archive containing a cpio of the binaries, a subdir with post (un)install scripts, and an XML document with meta data?
It's really frustrating not to be able to get to that one little patch in an SRPM because you don't have the latest, greatest RPM tool at hand!
The version number looks like a marketing trick to me...
:)
If you take a look at what have been changed from RH 6.2 -> 7.0 - you'll see that its not much...
So my guess will be that it will take you from 1 day to 1 week to learn what has been changed and study the changes...
I'm sure that no one will disqualify you because you have the RHCE for 6.2 while they'll use 7.0
Hetz (Heunique)
I was pretty sure that RSA wasn't going to be fully patent free until September 20th 2000. At least, that's the date I remember Scheiner giving in Applied Cryptography for the patent expiration on RSA....
-Ted
I don't use any commercial apps on Linux, but this brings up a good point -- if it works with 6.2, will it work in 7.0 without recompilation ?
How about year/month of release?
example:
MyDistribution 2003/6
Although informative, It has the disadvantage of stating how old is a distribution relative to others (bad marketing?)
Well, this is great news for the community since like it or not, public perception of Linux comes from what RedHat are doing more than any other organisation - hence this'll be seen as Linux 7.0, which sounds better to the newbie than Linux 2.4.0-test3 :)
It does seem that people who are long-term Linux users don't use RedHat anymore, maybe because it has been geared towards the "newbie", but at the end of the day surely Linux is Linux, and you can set up any distribution how you like given a bit of time.
Still Linux does need something aimed at helping newer users overcome the initial "fear factor" of running Linux. Whether you like it or not, by doing so they're doing everyone a favour in the long run. So although I don't use it, I wish them all the best and hope this release goes well for them.
So as an example its version should be 2000.07.31.10.59.9999? There needs to be something to say, "Oh your running RH-7.0, you need to update package Foo and package Bar to get feature Baz in package Qux to work.", while what you recomend would be a bit hard to figure out what breaks and what does not.
Those RedHat boxes with the CD's and manuals and fancy color boxes probably cost more like about $10/each to package and put on the shelves. It's far more than a quarter. Even if the retailers can ship them back... they lose some money hiring a clerk to pull them off the shelve and ship them back. Then on top of that if RedHat is buying them back, they lose money by packaging worthless product.
Well, according to the dates that the KDE team posted, KDE 2.0 will be out the door before RH 7.0 will be released as gold.
Take a look at the releases of KDE beta's and you'll notice that they were released exactly as planned (with few days more for packaging - but I'm sure this is not a problem for Redhat).
Hetz (Heunique)
Darn, you're right. Forgot to carry the one or something :)
I predict 15 red hat vulnerabilities will be posted on securityfocus within 48 hours. at least the script kiddies will be kept busy scanning ip addresses for boxes running the beta distribution and wont bother with trying to crack my freebsd box.
I've got the RedHat 6.2 Professional (more like $170) and I'm smiling. When 7.2 comes around I'll be real interested again. The bugs squashed out by the free downloads, betas, CheapBytes, etc. make the boxed sets a real bargain.
Bah! Each time the version number of glibc is increased by 0.0.1, RedHat grabs the new version and uses it to bounce up its version number by 1.0. Thanks but no thanks RedHat, I prefer the stability and thoroughness of Debian and Slackware.
RedHat's basic OS strategy seems to be to release a .0 with lots of new stuff and improvements, but with it inevitably comes lots of bugs. For example 6.0 had 2.2 kernel, libc6, etc. the first distribution to do that. But it was terrible, lots of problems and bugs that I have seen on many 6.0 systems, like the mysterious "Shutting down X font server [FAILED]" and "nfsd: terminating on signal 9" messages every time to halt/reboot. The version of GNOME it came with was also really unstable.
.1 release. I was much happier with 6.1 when I quickly installed it. It worked much better but I didn't appreciate the unmaintained/undocumented text mode installer, or the fact it didn't install a kernel with kernel module loader.
.2 releases, but I presume they fix more problems, making them the most stable.
Then RedHat fixes most of these problems in a
I don't know about the
So imaging what a beta of an unstable product will be... 2.4.0-test4pre2, gcc-3.0pre5, etc.
I would stick with 6.2 unless you're really brave.
# debian/rules
It would be great if the installation routine could create a .config file in /usr/src/linux that would match the current installation and hardware! I can't build a new kernel because I can't figure out what network card I have (/proc/pci says one thing, conf.modules says something completely different, I can't find the chip on the motherboard, and nothing I've tried works anyway). However, the installation itself knows what hardware I have, but if I try to build another kernel, I have to manually figure it all out. There is no reason for this.
The installation routine should generate a .config based on the hardware it has detected and the options the user chose during the installation. In other words, I should be able to build the kernel from /usr/src/linux without specifying any options, and it should work!
--
And the men who hold high places must be the ones who start
To mold a new reality... closer to the heart
Fonts are copyrighted as computer programs. The glyph shapes themselves are uncopyrightable (the longest English word that doesn't repeat a letter).
<O
( \
XGNOME vs. KDE: the game!
Will I retire or break 10K?
Like it says (at the risk of being redundant):
;)
If you can't find it without me telling you where it is, then you shouldn't be running a Beta Red Hat 7.0
Do a /usr/src/linux/Documentation/oops-tracing.txt /proc filesystem then tried to boot that kernel.
$ grep Aug
and thats pretty much the closest you can get to a BSOD dump. Of course, good luck getting the kernel to panic. The only time my kernel panicked was when I forgot to compile in
Lars -
RedHat stock is at $18, down from a high of $150 only 6 months ago. And here is a nice quote from their most recent quarterly report:
"We have incurred operating losses in five of our previous six fiscal years, including our most recent fiscal year ended February 29, 2000. We expect to incur significant losses for the foreseeable future, as we substantially increase our sales and marketing, research and development and administrative expenses. In addition, we are investing considerable resources in our web initiative and to expand our professional services offerings. As a result, we cannot be certain when or if we will achieve sustained profitability. Failure to become and remain profitable may adversely affect the market price of our common stock and our ability to raise capital and continue operations."
Don't get me wrong. I would love to see RedHat survive as a viable, publicly held, independent company. But unless they figure out some way to make some money, they are toast, version 7.0 notwithstanding.
Pardon me for sayin' so, but if you're using a Beta version of an OS for "mission-critical servers" then you're smokin' better crack than I am. Either that or I deserve your job more than you do. :o)
sure it sounds like flamebait, but I'm right!
Please moderate up!
Stephen Molitor steve_molitor@yahoo.com
Fair enough. Thank you for the clarification.
Bryan R.
Bryan R.
The price of freedom is eternal vigilance, or $12.50 as seen on eBay.....
Unfortunately selling an OS in the bargain bin is probably not going to work very well. I've never seen it be successful, at least not the bargain bins at Compusa and software etc.
It's fine to sell say a game in the bargain bin, but for an OS or a business application people want the most recent.
why? Well because the most recent is an upgrade that fixes problems and is just overall better. A key being interoperability with other apps, etc.
Hmm, this wasn't offtopic. The troll everybody was responding to said "and noone likes Windows 2000"
The root for Apache docs is now /var/www/.
Will there ever be a mta other than sendmail? I'd like qmail included.
Run NMAP on your default install of a RH 6.1 box. BTW, there is a nice remote exploit for the lpd setup (I can't remember if it is a buffer overflow or just a misconfiguration). Checkout SecurityFocus.com for a look at the problems w/6.1.
Well, close...Substitute Rob Malda for ./.
Just looked this up myself. In case anybody is too lazy, Kwisatz Haderach seems to mean "Shortening of the Way".
How long will it take until they offically release the stable 7.0? Is there any word directly from RedHat? If not, how long does it usually take for it to hit the shelves and mirrors. Do they base their releases purely on development or is marketing and business the dominating factor? This all may have already been discussed, but unfortunately I don't have time to read the 300+ posts.
thanks all,
Josh
It is nonetheless not at all obvious that this winds up causing an actual problem.
After all, if a new version comes out every 6 months, that means that CompUSA and BestBuy have the opportunity to have regular displays that say: New! Improved! Buy now!
I would certainly agree that this results in there being some obsolete RHAT boxes out there that may become virtually unsalable. That does not forcibly represent a problem; computer stores have already needed to be able to cope with "best before" dates, and dealing with products that have to head to the Bargain Bin.
Thus, for Red Hat Linux releases to exercise the "Bargain Bin" does not forcibly represent a problem for retail marketing.
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
Looking at the features, I dont see why this would be a 7.0 release. The only real major upgrade is XFree86... I think they should release this as 6.3, and when Gnome2, KDE2, Kernel2.4, etc is out, and stable, then make it a 7.0 release.
-Brandon
XFree86 4.0.1
Latest Beta KDE (3!)
MySQL Now Included
Latest Postgres
Looks like some fun stuff. Intesting that they wouldn't include a beta of the kernel but of KDE. Guess RedHat knows what will and will not be done by the time 7 ships.
Bryan R.
Bryan R.
The price of freedom is eternal vigilance, or $12.50 as seen on eBay.....
Here's the solution - sell Debian!
Disclaimer - I love Debian and use it myself
Moderate this UP!
"Anyone that has ever gotten an idea based on any of my work and done something better with it-good for you."--J.Carmack
And for those of us who are developers:
gcc 2.96!
Finally, Red Hat adopts a recent version of the compiler. And I believe the standard library v3 was recently rolled into that version of gcc, so we ought to have a good deal better C++ support.
Hmmm, I would have, but I guess there is enough info in the SuSE 7.0 thread now...
--
"I have a good idea why it's hard to verify programs. They're usually wrong." --Manuel Blum, FOCS 94
do we really need a new version right now? Everyone was expecting 7.0 to be based on *stable* 2.4 kernel and include *stable* KDE2...
Nevertheless, RedHat should be aplauded and encouraged for offering the beta before releasing new version to the public.
-----
if you can point me to a place that has good and free TT fonts that we could include, do.
The attractive (IMHO) Knuthian Computer Modern fonts (of TeX fame/imfamy) are available as TT. cf. several links here.
red_crayon
"Never bullshit a bullshitter" All That Jazz
"Document roots for Apache and anonymous FTP are removed from /home so it may be automounted. "
/home? I liked them in /home.
What the heck does that mean, exactly? Does anyone have any idea where the document roots will be, if they are not in
Bero, where are you?
Got HTML? Want LaTeX? Try html2latex
Is the newer LILO included?
"Never bullshit a bullshitter" All That Jazz
Does this mean that RH7.0 will be a final snapshot from rawhide, and not a upgraded 7.0beta ? In a few weeks when the bug reports starts ticking in, will rawhide be more stable than 7.0beta, or is rawhide always the bleeding edge unstable redhat where we can crashtest all the new stuff ?
RFC1925
Let's see, most comp-usa's and other retailers that are nervous about selling linux to begin with are going to be stuck with shelves full of 6.2 releases when the 7.0 release comes out ov beta in 30-60 days... Man, if I was a retailer I would really think twice about stocking RedHat on my shelves. First it's not selling as fast as the other (OK Win isn't selling either but 98 is still a current release... millenium isnt expected for another 24 months, and noone likes 2000) so here's this upstart that makes me eat 20 copies of their software every 3 months. Example : I start with 6.0 - 6.1 comes out then 6.2 and now 7.0 beta means 7.0 final is soon. this is all within the past 12 months... As a store manager, I would have to make a decision to not carry redhat on my shelves as it is too "unstable"
I fear that RedHat will drive the penguin out of the retail market faster than any MS generated FUD could .
Do not look at laser with remaining good eye.
About twenty minutes after the beta directories were opened up on the mirrors, the first of the ERRATA files were transmitted to the mirrors for downloading...
FNORD!
All the world's an analog stage, and digital circuits play only bit parts.
I mean from the base install. When you start shifting things around a lot, you're getting more and more into the Linux of it and less and less the distribution itself. That said, I still love RedHat, it just isn't MY distribution, and I stated why. I do like RedHat, so chill out man. Personally, I like Slack, and yeah, there was already a flame post calling me a newbie, yadda yadda. I run Debian too, and I'm considering working on the package manager project for slack. It's just not MY dist, that's all man, calm down, put down the gun.
Eh...
The oldest box I have here is Red Hat 4.2. That's 1996 :) Don't feel like moving to another distro though, maybe because I haven't tried Debian yet ;)
But as far as downloading is concerned; a RH mirror on the same cable net is a big plus :)
Cya,
bBob
--
--
*sig*
I noticed in school that certain CDroms would just not mount without being forced. It was a pain honestly for me.
Code softly but carry a big magnet.
Picture things in 2 years, we're going to have Redhat Version 14, Slackware Version 15.1, and SuSE 42.
They're going to have to stop the insanity eventually! :)
Who's the black private dick, who's a sex machine for all the chicks?
I make it a point to always buy the newest version of Red Hat, just to support my fav company, but occasionally, I have to wait for the store I get it from to get more in, because they say they sell Red Hat's stuff very quickly. To quote the guy at the cash register, "Yeah, I may wanna try it, people seem to be buying it a lot these days." Sure it could sit up and take up shelf space, but I see a lot of places selling it rather easily. Don't even ask me how long the local Media Play managed to keep their hands on 12 copies of Corel Office 2K for Linux....ahem gone in a week....
--Nuintari
slashdot : where an opinion can be wrong.
You're missing the point Einstein. The point is, there are some idiots out there who flame a distribution without even trying it.
I'm running reiserfs with journaling on 2.2.13. That works fine (so fine that I've moved everything except root,home,archive partitions on my machine over to it). That said, reiserfs with journaling on 2.4.0test does NOT read them (i.e. refuses to mount).
This is a problem that I have, and is probably one that THEY know of, and is a good reason not to include reiserfs as part of the basic install.
Including the reiserfs patch (as part of an upgraded kernel source archive), and providing ext2-to-reiser utils (if and when they are written) would help things a good deal.
p.s. I haven't bothered to check/contact the reiserfs mailing list over this. This is not an excuse for me not having the problem 'fixed' -- 2.2.13 works fine for me. However it is a valid excuse for not having reiserfs in -their- kernel at this point.
p.p.s patience. I'd personally like to see LVM first, and reiserfs to wait in the wings until it is virtually (i.e. at least appears) designed for LVM.
John
John_Chalisque
Maybe, but all of Red Hat's code names have double meanings. For example:
;) will play off of.
6.1 was called "Cartman", a cartoon character
6.2 Beta was "Piglet", a cartoon character, and also a charcter from Monty Python's Holy Grail
6.2 was "Zoot", also a character from the Holy Grail, and a type of suit.
so 7.0 beta is "Pinstripe", also a type of suit, but also has some other meaning that 7.0 (or 7.0 beta 2
Isnt that the name given to Paul Atreideis by the 'Nuns' in Herbert's Dune? It meant he was the 'ultimate spirit/being' or some such IIRC.
(1) There's an apt-get mechanism that you can set up to do automated updates (think, security patches) of your system software. Redhat is working on this, too, but Debian has been there for a long time.
(2) They don't ship alpha quality software! I sincerely hope that RedHat has bought some QA with their IPO money, because despite having a reputation for being easy to install, RedHat upgrades always strike me as a severe nightmare.
(Hey, maybe I'll try a *beta* release of a "x.0" version of RedHat! That sounds so exciting! Uh, on second thought....)
Yay! yay! more blood!
C is for Cookie.
and The 7,0 offers again a true filling horn at new features has got me wanting to switch distro's immediately :)
~ppppppppö
Some of my not so close friends always frown upon RedHat, they even say it's the win9x of Linux.
Since I am no hardcore linux user I wonder what the basic difference is between say Debian and Redhat (Debian is what the above mentioned people prefer).
Can someone clued enlight me on the basic differences?
The last dist I hardcored used (as only OS installed on my PC) was Slackware 0.99.14 on my old 386 many years back.
English is not my first language, so cut me some slack -: Om du kan lasa det har sa kan du Svenska
Will there ever be a mta other than sendmail? I'd like qmail included. qmail isn't open-source, so I'd doubt that it will show up in redhat core. postfix or exim probably have a better chance of making it, but I don't work with Red Hat. Sumner
rage, rage against the dying of the light
what about gnome 1.2?
GNOME 1.2 is included.
But then again; I also can't understand why people buy Microsoft beta's and participate in the testing. MS is afaik the only company which can test a beta and make money out of it as well.
Do you even know what debian do? Yeah, I'm sure that they've just got tons of spare money to throw around.
I dont see why this would be a 7.0 release. The only real major upgrade is XFree86...
...
...
Let's see now, major XFree86 release so we can get more game ports, version upgrade so we can call WindowsMe 20th Century technology, better SMP so we can go head to head with other servers and serve up those web pages
Sounds like a big one to me!
Face it, most people play games and want clean installs that work well. The rest is nice chrome from their viewpoints, although better man pages might be nice to have
Will in Seattle
What about E 16.4, will Redhat bother to update that?
Enlightement 0.16.4 is included, but is no longer the default wm - the default wm is now sawfish.
Actually, the major portion of an RPM is a cpio containing the package files. The rest of it is things like install/remove scripts and package dependency information. You can always rpm2cpio some.rpm | cpio -t to get a list of the files.
Check out their website and their ftp site for the ISO image.
I noticed that rawhide has finally gone to the 2.4 kernel, and I just naturally assumed 7.0 would be 2.4 as well - but no, they are shipping the legacy kernel - yep, looks like 6.3 to me....
Looks like Caldera has leapfrogged them - Caldera's beta is shipping with 2.4-test.
If the beta is anything like the latest Rawhide Releases I have been seeing, I wont be upgrading to 7.0 any time soon.
/etc, so rc.d no longer exists, and its /etc/rc.3 or something of that nature (I lost one of my good boxes to that). So I'd have to redo all of my rpms with the new layout, and build one set for RedHat 6.x and one set for 7.0.
So far, one major change has broken any and all RPMS I have made for things like BIND and sendmail, etc. They changed the layout of
Well, so much for me having MageNet Linux Server 2.0 (ftp://ftp.magenet.com/pub) out anytime soon and having it work on anything but RedHat 6.1/6.2 boxes.
Sometimes 'progress' forces us two steps back, and this is one time it does. Why cant RedHat just leave well enough alone? Its the same thing Microsoft does. Why fix what isn't broken?
Brielle
Looks good. At this stage caution does make sense, guess we'll just have to wait.
What happened to libsafe? There was an article on it on RedHat's site, how it was going in to the next version.
Also, any plans for including analog for going through httpd logs? Very usefull.
Can you explain what`s new and what`s the difference between personal and professional edition, for us who cant read German.
KDE The Real Desktop
What the hell you talking about? qmail is open sourced...
If you browse the web, one of the problem is that in X you can't find a font called Verdana. So what to do? Just find the more similar font and map it to Verdana. The same for Arial and so on.
...for what I do, which is take 1.6 million http hits a day.
Yes, the gnome was a little weak, but not unreasonable. But hey, I sill get the nfs termination messages in RH62.
I think RH6 was the first to include support for Compaq's raid controllers - that stuff is great.
Really, Red Hat did a magnificent job with 6.0 as compared to 5.0. There were lots of problems with glibc under 5.0 that really got under my fingernails.
The problems with 6.0 were cosmetic. The problems with 5.0 were structural.
I wondered what would happen to my 6.x cerfification when 7.0 is release and I just got this back from RedHat..
Your certification will remain current. When 7.0 is released we'll make an update addendum to your student kit available through Certification Central.
Cheap UK and US VPS
That's just wonderful...
I just got the RHCE certification (didn't really care about it but my company insisted on paying for it, so who am i to argue?). Since the certification is specifically for RH6.2, and that it will expire at the end of the RH7.x serie (that's what the instructor said anyway, but nobody is really sure) - at the rate RH is going that should be in a year or so?
As I said, I am glad my company paid for this. Considering how much it cost ($700 just for the test), and how soon it becomes obsolete, I would NEVER have paid for it.
Nine times out of ten MS betas are far more stable than release versions. I'm quite convinced a vital step in the MS development process is "beta test to ensure optimum bug saturation - add bugs as necessary to taste". I think the point that was being made is that it isn't necessary to HIDE stuff; put up a link, let the morons who decide to download it and kill their systems die, it's their own problem.
---
Tim Wilde
Gimme 42 daemons!
Does the Xfree 4.0.1 in RH 7.0b come with it's own free TT fonts? (Freetype IIRC)
Or do I still have to link to (or copyover) the ttf's from my Win partition?
At least Patrick made it public why he bounced up from 3.9 to 7.0: in order to take away some of the confusion about "Why are you still running Linux 4.0? Man! 7.0 is out already!".
... as it should! I prefer Slackware and Debian stability to RedHat Beta 6.0, 6.1 and Alpha 6.2 which include the newest and most unstable of all releases.
But I am sure that it won;t be long until Slackware is lagging behind again
>"Document roots for Apache and anonymous FTP are removed from /home so it may be automounted. "
/home directory being a default automount point (meaning you access other people's remote home directory though /home). They use /export/home for the actual location of local home directories. Redhat used to place local things in /home, making it more difficult to use in a heterogenous environment.
/home, you can use it as an automount directory without RPM being upset when you upgrade Apache or FTP.
What the heck does that mean, exactly?
Sun started (I think) the practice of the
By taking everything out of
"It's overkill, of course. But you can never have too much overkill." - Anonymous Slashdot Coward
Will someone here port glDuke to Linux? http://vapps.emuforce.com/glduke/
Not really. Distribution is only allowed in as the original tarball. See the website.
--
47% of all statistics are made up on the spot.
Why does there need to the start of beta? Should not all distributions be continuously in beta? That is, the distribution should not be static but should be under continuous upgrade as upgrades to individual components/packages are released. Then the 'released' versions would become a snapshot of the state of the build.
Oh, yes. Suggesting that people who can't browse an FTP site (or get links mailed to them on the announce list) probably shouldn't watch their system being torn into shreds by a beta distribution is going to ruin Linux's chances in the real world.
So that's the reason my grandparents got Win2k betas?
Announcing...
h at/beta/pinstripe/ d hat/beta/pinstripe/
a t/beta/pinstripe/ h at/beta/pinstripe/
t a/pinstripe/ e ta/pinstripe/
/ pinstripe/ a /pinstripe/
r edhat.com/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
n stripe
/ redhat/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
/ beta/pinstripe/
a /pinstripe/ t /beta/pinstripe/
i pe/ r ipe/
i nstripe/
i nstripe/ p instripe/
/ redhat/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
i nstripe/
h at/beta/pinstripe/
/usr/man is now /usr/share/man
/usr/doc is now /usr/share/doc
/usr/info is now /usr/share/info
/home so it may be automounted.
Red Hat Linux "Pinstripe"
a Beta release
Red Hat. Inc. presents a beta release of Red Hat Linux for your
hacking pleasure. First, the regular drill:
This is a beta release of Red Hat Linux. It is not intended for
mission critical applications. It's not even intended for
non-mission critical applications. Important data should not be
entrusted to Pinstripe, as it may eat it and make loud belching
noises.
Significant changes have been made since the last version of Red Hat
Linux. We need your help to find and report bugs. Search for
existing bug reports for problems you find by using bugzilla at:
http://bugzilla.redhat.com/bugzilla/
Attach patches if you're motivated!
This beta includes so much cutting edge software, the binary packages
come on two iso images. The installation program now handles reading
packages from multiple CDs.
* Where can I get this release?
Pinstripe can be downloaded from our public FTP site at:
ftp://ftp.redhat.com/pub/redhat/beta/pinstripe
With the support of volunteers ftp site administrators, Pinstripe is
available from several mirrors. The following have complete copies of
Pinstripe, please use a mirror close to you:
North Carolina, USA:
ftp://metalab.unc.edu/pub/Linux/distributions/red
http://metalab.unc.edu/pub/Linux/distributions/re
California, USA:
ftp://ftp.sourceforge.net/pub/mirrors/redhat/redh
http://ftp.sourceforge.net/pub/mirrors/redhat/red
California, USA:
ftp://ftp.kernel.org/pub/mirrors/redhat/redhat/be
http://www.kernel.org/pub/mirrors/redhat/redhat/b
Connecticut, USA:
ftp://ftp.uselinux.org/pub/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
Indiana, USA:
ftp://csociety-ftp.ecn.purdue.edu/pub/redhat/beta
http://csociety-ftp.ecn.purdue.edu/pub/redhat/bet
Michigan, USA:
ftp://mrhankey.bizserve.com/pub/linux/redhat/ftp.
New York, USA:
ftp://ftp.ee.cornell.edu/pub/linux/redhat/beta/pi
Pennsylvania, USA:
ftp://carroll.cac.psu.edu/pub/linux/distributions
Pennsylvania, USA:
ftp://cronus.res.cmu.edu/pub/linux/ftp.redhat.com
Tennessee, USA:
ftp://sunsite.utk.edu/pub/linux/redhat/redhat/bet
http://sunsite.utk.edu/ftp/pub/linux/redhat/redha
Australia:
ftp://mirror.aarnet.edu.au/pub/redhat/beta/pinstr
http://mirror.aarnet.edu.au/pub/redhat/beta/pinst
Germany:
ftp://ftp.gmd.de/mirrors/redhat.com/redhat/beta/p
Germany:
ftp://ftp.uni-bayreuth.de/pub/linux/redhat/beta/p
http://ftp.uni-bayreuth.de/pub/linux/redhat/beta/
Norway:
(ISO images only)
ftp://carroll.cac.psu.edu/pub/linux/distributions
Peru:
ftp://sajino.terra.com.pe/pub/linux/redhat/beta/p
Japan:
ftp://ftp.kddlabs.co.jp/Linux/packages/RedHat/red
* What's new in this beta?
General system improvements:
o FHS compliant packaging of files
See http://www.pathname.com/fhs/ for more information
o Document roots for Apache and anonymous FTP are removed from
o Packages with services are automatically restarted on live
upgrades
o Expanded LDAP integration
o Expanded Kerberos integration
Core system components:
o glibc 2.1.91
o XFree86 4.0.1, XFree86 4.0.1 runtime environment
o XFree86 3.3.6 X servers included for maximum hardware compatibility
o GNOME 1.2
o kernel 2.2.16
o GCC 2.96
Expanded hardware support:
o Basic USB support (mouse and keyboards)
o Expanded hardware accelerated 3-D support
System service changes:
o inetd replaced by xinetd
o BSD lpr replaced by LPRng
A sampling of package upgrades:
o GIMP 1.1.24
o Perl 5.6.0
o Tcl/Tk 8.3.1
A sampling of Package additions:
o SDL, smpeg
o SANE
o gphoto
o MySQL
o AbiWord
o dia
o ispell has been replaced by aspell
o XEmacs
Next generation development library previews included:
o pango: Unicode font rendering
See http://www.pango.org/
o Inti: C++ foundation libraries including GTK+ GUI toolkit classes
See http://sources.redhat.com/inti/
Enjoy!
The OS Development Team
Red Hat, Inc.
This message is provided under the terms outlined at http://www.bero.org/terms.html
Here's what's new about RH 7.0:
perl 5.60
php 4.01 - speed boost over version 3
mysql - now open source, no longer just in power tools
XFree86 4.01 - speed boost over version 3
enterprise kernel - raw filesystems and other performance patches
kde 1.91 - beta for 2.0, includes new browser
kde office 1.91
And what's missing:
sendmail 8.11 - crypto smtp
kernel 2.4test5ac - decent smp performance
tux 1.0 - very fast RedHat kernel web server
apache 2.0pre4
bind 9.0 - major rewrite
staroffice - now it's open source
LVM
reiserfs
Sendmail and staroffice aren't beta and should have gone into this release, the rest are probably too bleeding edge. Anyone think of anything I've missed?
Personal is aimed at the desktop-market, so maybe it will be preconfigured not to run all services under the sun by default and make beginners a bit less vulnerable.
With the support of volunteers ftp site administrators, Pinstripe is available from several mirrors. The following have complete copies of Pinstripe, please use a mirror close to you:
North Carolina, USA:r ipe/ s tripe/
ftp://metalab. unc.edu/pub/Linux/distributions/redhat/beta/pinst
http://metala b.unc.edu/pub/Linux/distributions/redhat/beta/pin
California, USA:p e/ r ipe/
ftp://ftp.sourc eforge.net/pub/mirrors/redhat/redhat/beta/pinstri
http://ftp.sou rceforge.net/pub/mirrors/redhat/redhat/beta/pinst
California, USA: /pub/mirrors/redhat/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
ftp://ftp.kernel.org
http://www.kernel.o rg/pub/mirrors/redhat/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
Connecticut, USA: /beta/pinstripe/
ftp://ftp.uselinux.org/pub/redhat
Indiana, USA: .purdue.edu/pub/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
ftp://csociety-ftp.ecn
http://csociety-ftp.e cn.purdue.edu/pub/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
Michigan, USA: ftp://mrhankey.bizserve.com/pub/linux/redhat/ftp.r edhat.com/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
New York, USA: ftp://ftp.ee.cornell.edu/p ub/linux/redhat/beta/pinstripe
Pennsylvania, USA: ftp ://carroll.cac.psu.edu/pub/linux/distributions/red hat/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
Pennsylvania, USA: ftp://cronus.res. cmu.edu/pub/linux/ftp.redhat.com/beta/pinstripe/
Tennessee, USA: ftp://sunsite.utk.edu /pub/linux/redhat/redhat/beta/pinstripe/ /
http://sunsite.u tk.edu/ftp/pub/linux/redhat/redhat/beta/pinstripe
Australia: ftp://mirror.aarnet.edu.au/pu b/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
http://mirror.aarnet.edu.au/ pub/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
Germany: ftp://ftp.gmd.de/mirrors /redhat.com/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
Germany: .de/pub/linux/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
ftp://ftp.uni-bayreuth.d e/pub/linux/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
http://ftp.uni-bayreuth
Norway: (ISO images only) ftp ://carroll.cac.psu.edu/pub/linux/distributions/red hat/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
Peru: ftp://sajino.terra.com.p e/pub/linux/redhat/beta/pinstripe/
Japan: ftp://ftp.kddl abs.co.jp/Linux/packages/RedHat/redhat/beta/pinstr ipe/
Well, this is great news for the community since like it or not, public perception of Linux comes from what RedHat are doing more than any other organisation - hence this'll be seen as Linux 7.0, which sounds better to the newbie than Linux 2.4.0-test3 :)
It does seem that people who are long-term Linux users don't use RedHat anymore, maybe because it has been geared towards the "newbie", but at the end of the day surely Linux is Linux, and you can set up any distribution how you like given a bit of time.
Still Linux does need something aimed at helping newer users overcome the initial "fear factor" of running Linux. Whether you like it or not, by doing so they're doing everyone a favour in the long run. So although I don't use it, I wish them all the best and hope this release goes well for them.
-- In the future, everyone will code Perl for 15 minutes. --
Caldera announced the Linux Technology Preview last week with similar things thrown in. I've tried it and it's pretty solid. Get the ISO, or it's "free" if you buy it from the store (with a mail-in coupon).
This I see as a nice thing:
/usr/man is now /usr/share/man
/usr/doc is now /usr/share/doc
/usr/info is now /usr/share/info
=== Cut ===
General system improvements:
o FHS compliant packaging of files
See http://www.pathname.com/fhs/ for more information
=== Cut ===
What about the rest? Ex. KDE - where does that get installed?
Read this article for more info about what I'm talking about.
Wow, you have shown me how little I can care about a direct personal insult. It's almost like the sound of one hand clapping. Some people meditate on it for hours, and yet strangely, I don't give a fuck. Interesting, huh?
Eh...
Wow, you are so intelligent, erudite and clever I'm amazed you lower yourself to our level. I find myself enhanced by the very presence of your posts here on Slashdot and am naturally swayed to believe everything you say purely due to you incredible qualifications, no doube gained at a particularly young age.
;)
I'm guessing from the quality of your post that you are also fantastically good looking, witty, urbane and generally perfect.
Keep up the good work, we all know that there are very few highly educated Slashdot users around and we need reminding every now and then as to that which we should aspire to.
troc
Troc's dubious podcast and blog: http://www.trocnet.net
Slack and Debian are my 2 main ones. Of course, I am a total newbie since I have used Linux for several years now, as the main OS of my computer rather than NetBSD, and SunOS (on their respective pieces of equipment of course). I can program in several languages and I'm eventually going to have a PhD. I also am finishing college in a CS program in only 3 years, and I could have done it in 2 except that I started out as a dual major and lost interest in taking both. But then, I'm a total newbie, so I must just be talking out my ass.
Eh...