Slashdot Mirror
AOL Builds New IE-Based Browser
jfruhlinger writes "According to News.com.com.com, America Online is preparing to release a free AOL-branded browser that is 'based on Microsoft's Internet Explorer technology.' The browser will be available to users who don't have AOL as their ISP. I admit that I find this development baffling -- not only does AOL already own a browser, but why on earth would a non-AOL user want to use an AOL-branded version of IE?"
Okay, I can't.
AOL is for dumb users. IE is for dumb users. This is a perfect match.
(This will probably get me modded as flamebait, but in the old days of Slashdot, it wouldn't.)
Microsoft last year granted AOL a seven-year royalty-free license to use IE technology in its products. The license was one of many concessions that Microsoft offered AOL as part of a $750 million settlement in an antitrust lawsuit filed by Netscape in January 2002.
However, one source familiar with the new software said the Microsoft settlement and IE license did not play a factor in AOL's decision to develop its own browser.
Yeah, right...
Evil A + Evil B = More evil!
They are scared of google. If you can find your email and web searches easily, why do you need AOL's portal? You don't.
Google is going to release a browser that is just AOL for free. Pretty content filling the screen all over the place making the daily news, email, messaging free and easy for everybody.
AOL and microsoft-- they both know this. This is their answer.
God help us all.
Its IE OPTIMIZED!
Why dont they advance on Netsrape?
NT
If I recall AOL as a Settlement from Microsoft got the right to use IE in their program or even as a browser like this for free for like 7 years. thus the use of IE here. why spend money developing your own browser when you can use someone elses for free and just put a little front end on it?
AOL OS?
though there wasnt much detail in the article, I suspect it is simply going to be ie with an aol 'skin'. I suspect they dont have access to ie source code....
*user clicks close button*
[POPUP:] Thank you for being an AOL Browser user! I'm sorry you have decided to stop using it. I'm going to go ahead and leave it open for a few more minutes, for FREE.
*shows [OK] button only*
ermmm...
click here
Anyone who's still locked into AOL and hasn't left yet must obviously be very trusting of their brand. Not only that, but an AOL-specific version for their customers means easier troubleshooting. Don't forget that MS has abandoned IE upgrades for the older generations of Windows installations; hopefully AOL might release its own security packs later?
Get off my launchpad!
It's open source!
Someone had to say it....
----
Don't they know which way the wind is blowing? Why use a browser engine that is being actively neglected by its parent? Puzzling only begins to describe this decision by AOL.
CUZ TEH INTERNET IS SO MUCH DIF3RENT WHEN UR VEIWNG IT WIT AOL!!1! OMG LOL
I think it's rather simple.. they want to be synonymous with "The Web" (known to us as a collection of other things) to the average home user. I know plenty of folk who think AOL *IS* the web.. it can't hurt their business.
Now, as to who would want an AOL branded IE, I know I wouldn't, but I imagine they will introduce some value-add to make it interesting to the typical non-technical user.
NOW I CAN AUTOMATICALLY POST IN ALL CAPS!
but the damn slashdot filter seems to know I'm using AOL.
Alright, so AOL is the bane of the internet. AOL users really aren't the most knowledgable users on the internet either. So pairing up AOL users with Internet Explorer (known for its holes and exploits) will just make the worm and virus problem worse. I mean, with all the popups with IE and AOL users used to pretty flashing content through AOL...means a lot of infected machines.
"We are the music makers, and we are the dreamers of dreams" -- Willy Wonka
I'd use IE branded butt wipe, AOL for that matter, too.
No Nyarlathotep, No Chaos
Know Nyarlathotep, Know Chaos
Perhaps it'll be a good browser or perhaps lack some of the security holes? And people who just switched away from AOL might want it.
Here comes AOL version 14!
I have used at school (forced) and it really sucks. It is pretty slow at parsing (IE up to 3X faster). Still, Firefox is the best
do AOL owns Netscape or what?
AOL making a browser based on IE, it's like Ferrari choosing Kia engines for their cars...
I admit that I find this development baffling -- not only does AOL already own a browser, but why on earth would a non-AOL user want to use an AOL-branded version of IE?
It's a kind of extreme sport. Why surf safe and comfy when you can fear JPEGs, juggle a dozen windows and risk getting beaten as a lamer for AOL branding. Same as with bungee jumping - some people just can't get WHY, but don't diss it unless you've tried it yourself.
AOL CDs....Now with more crap !
... doot doot doot !!!
...of course is will AOL simply reskin the existing IE or will they actually write their own and address security issues on their own?
Until that day arrives, Micro$oft continues to dominate the browser market and owns 90% of it. Hence, AOL, like any other commercial company, will back the de facto standard. Since 90% of the market is Internet Explorer, most web page designers will build their pages to be compatible with Internet Explorer (IE). AOL has an economic motivation to use IE technology as the basis of the new AOL browser.
Similar reasoning applies for office applications. Most programmers prefer to write office applications for Windows instead of MacOS because Windows dominates the market.
Apple missed the boat ... er ... luxury superliner on that "one".
Swiss Cheese wraped in crap! What will they think of next......
"TV, a medium as it is neither rare nor well done." Ernie Kovacs
You should read There must be a pony in here somewhere (reviewed by me on Slashdot) to find out AOL's real strategy. Netscape was not bought out for its software technologies.
Netscape was bought out so that the marketing department called up Microsoft and told Microsoft they wanted an AOL icon on each and every desktop with newly-shipped Windows. For like 2 or 3 years Microsoft did exactly that, which brought AOL who knows how many customers that paid for the service. Distributing Netscape-based browser to the AOL subscribers would have no financial benefits for AOL whatsoever.
First I want to say that I hate AOL... Im just trying to figure this out.
But I would think they are *trying* for the best of both worlds...
AOL has better content controll from years of being "family friendly", however they have built their browser into a portal platform. Besides the sheer quantity of suck that AOL brings, one of their worst problems is that its not that easy to just type in a address and go, thats where IE comes in.
I think their stand alone browser might appeal to end users looking for content control without having to install the AOL software on their computer and getting AOL's portal services.
The browser will probably be available to AOL users to provide them more ease of use, while allowing them to still moderate what their children see through the browser.
Again.. I hate AOL, its the devil, but this is the spin I see AOL trying to put on it.
Fire in the hands of the village idiot is no tool, but a weapon of mass destruction
AOL must want a browser with all of the latest security holes, without the work.
"(...) but why on earth would a non-AOL user want to use an AOL-branded version of IE?"
:)
I believe this is called "masochism".
The problem with Slashdot memes is that YOU INSENSITIVE CLOD!
from Bush and Co.
While AOL may own Netscape, they probably found that a lot of sites out there were still IE specific and they couldn't afford the support costs for angry users who couldn't visit them. I'd probably do the same thing if I were running that project.
(Score:-1, Wrong)
I thought it was news.com.com.org.com.com
"why on earth would a non-AOL user want to use an AOL-branded version of IE?"
It's a tech support warning marker.
User: My system is slow and unresponsive and it keeps asking me if I a bride from Soviet Russia
Tech: Uh, ok sir. What Operating System, web browser/version,
User: I've got Microsoft Windows ME with Internet Explorer from AOL.. [click... dial tone] Hello?
Michalangelo Progr
This is like a marriage of evils. I guess AOL is going for something outside of the subscriber market, and they want to use the bug ridden Internet Explorer to accomplish this.
I think this is probable the most hideous scheme cooked up by this company.
This right before Firefox goes 1.0??? I thought AOL still had some ties to Netscape and Mozilla?
They did sell off Netscape Enterprise Edition to someone recently as well I believe.
Perhaps AOL Time Warner is selling off what they consider dead weight even though the siblings of Netscape will probably succeed where Netscape failed.
"A great democracy must be progressive or it will soon cease to be a great democracy." --Theodore Roosevelt
AOL sticks with IE in a deal with the devil! AOL is evil.
AOL buys Nullsoft. Definitely good!
AOL axes Gnutella, Justin leaves for greener pastures. AOL, clearly evil.
AOL uses wxWindows in AOL Communicator. AOL is obviously good!
AOL releases a branded version of IE. AOL, definitely evil.
Look, AOL is a big fucking company. They are going to do lots of good and evil things, because there are lots of people making decisions at different levels of the company. Do they have a coherent browser strategy? Not really. Have they tromped on the corpse of Netscape? Definitely.
There's finally a good browser based on Gecko (Firefox) and they've basically abandoned the Netscape browser. But AOL is just dealing with the reality of who their user base is and what they expect (the trailing edge of the Internet revolution, if you will - these people think IE is great, and will think a better IE is even better). And for all I know there may still be deals in place keeping them working with MS on the browser front - for a long time they were locked into that deal to get pre-installed AOL with Windows. Also, I wouldn't be shocked to see an AOL-branded or Netscape-branded version of Firefox come down the pipe 4 or 5 months from now too (post 1.0, of course).
As for the rest of us, let's just enjoy the cool shit that AOL occasionally produces, and continue to ignore the rest of the crap that will invariably come out of them.
That's easy to explain. First they tried something logical. Buy netscape. Open up codebase. Attract zillions of developers. Use enhanched codebase for own brand. Whatever.
It didn't work out as they expected. So now, they must think: we tried something that made a lot of sense and it didn't work. Maybe if we try out something that doesn't make any sense it will work. Simple and logical.
Among the reasons I dumped AOL was that unholy combination of IE and AOL insinuating themselves into the registry. I am sure AOL retains some real marketing geniuses who know some reason why this is a good move but it is beyond me entirely.
SLASHDOT: news for people who can't concentrate on work or have no life at all and got tired of yelling back at the TV.
This won't necessarily force AOL users to upgrade - I know plenty who use AOL 6 or earlier! But it will be a significant force that Microsoft can use to get more people to give them money.
I don't know why AOL is building on IE, but I can see many good reasons why Microsoft would want them to. There are a lot of AOL users out there, and that's a lot of revenue Microsoft could gain.
I don't think it's a coincidence that this came out so soon after the deadline for appealing the antitrust settlement passed. If I'm right in believing that the new AOL will only run on XP, then it's possible the antitrust lawyers for the hold-out States would have had ammunition to attack (although probably not destroy) the settlement.
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
That was a poor attempt to disguise your FP.
--fetch daddy's blue fright wig, i must be handsome when i release my rage
Then why is every antitrust settlement against Microsoft involves "concessions" that only result in an increase in Microsoft's monopoly position?
Was not one of Microsoft "concessions" in the governments case to donate hardware and Microsoft's software to schools!!!! This is a page out Apple's marketing plan. Microsofties must be high fiveing each other after these "concessions" are accepted.
I've had a really bad experience trying to cancel AOL some years ago.
I don't know whether the person on the phone accidentally gave me the wrong number or if they were trying to throw a hint at me. I called their customer service center and asked to cancel the account. She fought tooth and nail to get me not to cancel (of course) and finally gave me a phone number to call in order to cancel. Okay, but there was one problem when I called.
"To talk live to a hot, horny girl, press 1."
I have no idea whether she gave me the wrong number (I read it back about three times to confirm) or she was hinting to me to "go fuck myself" because I wanted to cancel.
Many people will assume that the reason for this IE-based browser is to have a AOL-branded property for better compatibility with Microsofts non-standards. The real reason -- and the reason I'm posting anonymously -- has to do with certain insane conflicts of interests higher up within the company. Namely: big investments in MSFT stock, and various instruments with large MSFT weighting.
Especialy given the security conserns around internet explorer. In fact, wouldn't they be worried about liability?
Oh, that's right. Computer software dosn't need to actualy 'work', or 'not leave you vulnerable to hackers' or anything fancy like that...
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
And, if you actually manage to close it, it puts your pops up messages periodically asking if you'd like to reopen it...
(Anonymously to protect the shame of having once been an AOL user oh so long ago...)
...they don't do ANYTHING not in their best interests.
they already own a browser
Yes, but Mozilla/Netscape doesn't given them (I suspect) a boatload of cash from a company that wants marketshare, marketshare, marketshare. AOL desperately needs cash- ever since the merger, they've been hemorrhaging money because the index finger doesn't know what the middle finger is doing- and neither even knows about the thumb.
Or, it could be as simple as "AOL customizations to Mozilla/Netscape take X hours and cost Y dollars, MS is willing to do it all for free".
Needless to say, I'm sure MS thinks they're getting something out of the deal too.
Please help metamoderate.
A friend's mother recently bought a computer (which it was up to me to get working), and the thing came infested with AOL. Not only was there AOL links everywhere, and AIM running at startup, but the system manufacturer had set every instance of I.E. to an AOL branded Netscape browser. Going to program files -> Internet Explorer revealed, you guessed it, a app to sign up for AOL. The regular address bar in windows had been replaced by an AOL bar, which also fed everything through the AOLified Netscape (the normal address bar had been turned off by default and, once on, was shoved almost entirely off the side of the window).
It was a mess, quite frankly. Welcome to the future.
The ______ Agenda
AOL put a lot of money into working on Mozilla and didn't pull any corporate shenanigans a la Sun's debacle with OpenOffice. Where would Mozilla be today had AOL/Netscape not pull millions of dollars of R&D money into building it up? Probably nowhere, or just now becoming remotely useful.
OSS fans need to adopt a bit of political realism here. Corporate entities are amoral, and that means that they will side with those who best serve their owners' interests. It is thus in the interest of OSS users to actively encourage them to see OSS like Mozilla, OpenOffice and the Linux kernel as being in their interests to support.
AOL has given a lot, and I can't think of them actually taking anything. Does anyone seriously expect the average AOL user to jump over to Firefox? It's hard to believe that people as smart as many OSS users are so detatched from the public that they don't see how incompetent most AOL users are. AOL knows that, most of us should too.
The people who are hooked on AOL are not a significant enough block anymore to be the pivotal base to win over. If AOL is smart, they'll capitalize on their investment into Mozilla by making the Mac version of AOL software use Gecko. That's more than enough users to make a dent in the market. AOL, last I heard, had two million Mac users. That'd be over twice the number of people that downloaded Firefox 1.0PR.
In the end, people should be amazed that AOL has given so much to OSS communities, without playing battered wife to the Evil Empire like Sun is doing now after their settlement.
Click here or a puppy gets stomped!
Maybe because they want people to be able to view all the non standards compliant banking, an e-commerce sites that only work with IE?
Maybe because they don't want to use a technology that gets updated and re-polished all the time like Mozilla.
Maybe they don't want to completely re-engineer their sortware or use open-source code so that others might hack their proprietary crapola?
Often in Error, Never in Doubt.
I'm sorry... Did you miss something?
Sure.. I'm sure that they could still very well be working on a GBrowser, but they could just as well be not.
What is going to happen when Microsoft stops shipping IE as a stand-alone product? Will the AOL-IE browser take its place?
"Destroy science and religion. Science would re-emerge exactly the same; but not religion." - Penn Jillette, paraphrased
"Microsoft's Internet Explorer technology"
It is an unusual use of the word "technology."
Someone is getting paid.
--Web Grafitti
Anyone who is both willing and able to replace his browser isn't going to be interested in the AOL brand; that's notoriously for stupid grannies. In the windows world, only power users fiddle about with changing basic software like that, and power users have heard that there are modern browsers, like the new Netscape. What could AOL offer to make up for the shame of having their logo on your screen? Why, a skin for IE, of course! It is to laugh.
Then there's the question of why they use IE instead of Netscape. Either is free to them for the near future at least, neither is going to cause them big problems. I wonder if it was to take advantage of the fact that IEs dlls get loaded during bootup? Or maybe there is some quid pro quo expected from MS? Why would MS care?
This sounds like something that the insiders at MS might know about. Where are those Halloween document sources when you need them?
See what I've been reading.
I don't consider AOL buying a company I like "good."
This means AOL is still 83.3% evil.
Ironically, the word ironically is often used incorrectly.
Never underestimate the power of stupidity.
Does everything include nothing?
Does AOHELL proprietary browser allow malware installation?
Does AOHELL e-mail allows spam and worms through?
Maybe AOHELL is sufficiently "shielded" to not suffer from those scourges...
General Motors has just announced a new car based on Ford's "Edsel Technology"(TM).
Amazing. AOL has a major problem: their customers must go through a desktop and a browser to get to them, and both the desktop and browser are controlled by their major competitor. Now they are incorporating their competitor's browser in their own system? How do these executives get hired anyway?
That would mean hell would be full of icebergs and they'd need lots of heavy coats down there....
Microsoft last year granted AOL a seven-year royalty-free license to use IE technology in its products. The license was one of many concessions that Microsoft offered AOL as part of a $750 million settlement in an antitrust lawsuit filed by Netscape in January 2002.
Why not screw the company which screwed you?
Also makes me wonder if they will get people hooked on this browser and switch over to Mozilla later on.
Get your Unix fortune now!
Why what better way is there to control the desktop than through IE... MWHAHHAHAHAAAA
Hmm, what should I do, use IE which develops so many new holes that it should be called The Titanic or use something like Mozilla Firefox which has few holes that are patched when needed by a notification when you start it up.
"So easy to pwn, no wonder it's #1!"
Take a moment to reflect on the target audience of AOL. Just reflect; you know what they're like. They're not really stupid, but they're just not exactly hacker types.
...
Now think about what happens in that person's brain when they see an AOL icon in the corner of the browser window.
"I'm using AOL!"
Now imagine what happens inside the person's brain when AOL tries to sell them the AOL service.
"I'm already using AOL! Why would I pay for it?"
It's rare that you're presented with a knob whose only two positions are Make History and Flee Your Glorious Destiny.
1. They are not too popular in their main business(internet access) 2. They buy netscape and screw it up.From being the best it goes to worst. 3. They buy Winamp(Nullsoft) and screw it completely.The worst version of winamp came after AOL bought it(v3 i think).
What is it?? Do these guys hate profits or they tryin to see how much they can mess things up! . Weird.
Now they wanna release a browser for people who already hate them.They've completely lost it and have no clue to where they've headed.
Lord of the Binges.
If I had imagined a Beowulf cluster of those last night I would have gotten more sleep.
vicious, untreated political sewage...niche entertainment for the spiritually unattractive...worshipless pap
Didn't Microsoft claim that Windows was so tightly integrated into Internet Explorer that you couldn't get rid of Windows without breaking Explorer? Didn't they "demonstrate" this in front of Congress?
How could AOL pull off such an engineering feat?
Wait, was it the other way around?
Remember that (depsite all the effort put into it) even Firefox is still heaver on RAM, CPU, disk space etc (especially given that on modern windows, IE is always installed and taking up disk and large parts of it reside in RAM at all times because of its use by components like Explorer)
Also remember that the target market for stuff like this probobly doesnt have the latest and greatest hardware. Therefore, mozilla/firefox will not have the same performence as IE on these machines.
And the users will notice that "the new AOL feels slower than the old AOL".
Also, another big thing to remember is that there is a HUGE collection of web content (both external and on the AOL network itself) within the AOL/Time Warner empire. A chunk of that content makes money for AOL/TW in various ways (ads, cross-promotion etc etc etc). Part of the problem is that they need to check all of this content under gecko to see that it works. And remember, if a page (either an AOL/TW page or something else) doesnt look exactly the same in "the new AOL" as it did in "the old AOL", AOL users are going to blame "the new AOL" (instead of the page itself)
Why on earth would a non-AOL user want to use an AOL-branded version of IE?
Similiar question:
What is the square root of pi?
Yep yep. Am I evil for thinking that this may be beneficial to me as an IT consultant? I figure that I tell clients that AOL is crap and it's their problem their money if they continue to use it. (AOL's autofix thing for network connections, by the way, has broken the connections of two of my clients' computers and costs them a fortune for me to come out there and delete AOL's autoconfig'ed settings. Stupid, stupid stuff.) I know this is all horribly off topic but whatever.
I've translated the article using the AOL user translator:
"ACORDNG 2 NEWSCOMCOMCOM11!11!! WTF M3RICA ONLIEN IS PRAPARNG 2 R3LAAES A FRE AOL-BRAND3D BROWSAR TAHT IS BAESD ON MICROSOFTS INTARNAT 3XPLORER TACHNOLOGY!!1!! DA BROWSER WIL B AVALEABLE 2 USARS WHO DONT HAEV AOL AS THERE ISP11111!!! LOL I ADMIT TAHT I FIND THIS DEV3LOPM3NT BAFLNG - NOT ONLY DOAS AOL ALREADY OWN A BROWSER BUT Y ON EARTH WUD A NON-AOL US3R WANT 2 USE AN AOL-BRAND3D VARSION OF EI?!!?? OMG LOL"
They do make it as hard as possible to cancel. Not only do they make you dial a special cancellations number, which is not published, and barely staffed, they also put the poor saps that work that particular line in a very tough spot - they are supposed to talk you out of cancelling, and if they cancel too many accounts in a day they will be fired. They get bonuses for NOT cancelling - even though they're answering a line that is for cancellations only, and one where the simple fact that the customer has the number to dial indicates they've already waded through a lot of shit to get there, so they're pretty determined.
I doubt that giving you porn numbers is official policy, but having seen the incredibly disrespectful ways that AOL reps are required to treat customers that want to quit, I wouldn't really be surprised.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Friends don't let friends enable ecmascript.
but why on earth would a non-AOL user want to use an AOL-branded version of IE?"
B/c there are still plenty of clueless users that AOL does not yet monopolize, and ironically they won't have a clue that the browser is just IE with AOL logos on it and an AOL homepage.
Flying is easy, just throw yourself at the ground and miss. -Douglas Adams
How many windows apps use IE as a browser control?
An assload, that's how many. There are at least 3 alternabrowsers based on IE, I doubt that any of them have more than two developers. Most every windows based RSS aggregator i've used uses the IE control.
Why is this the case?
I don't know first hand, but I hear its because its an easy thing to do. I've heard from a few people that mozilla is a pain to embed. Its a shame, too.
While Working at Time Warner Cable we had to switch from Lotus Notes to AOL Mail when we merged. Ha Ha. - I remember it like yesterday. Their crappy software conflicted with the MS Networking in a few crappy Win 95 computers that caused them to stop talking to the network. During our few calls to "corporate tech support" we were offered "Long Distance" plans during the calls.
Their new plan to use IE technology when they own Netscape is perfectly logical when viewed in the context of previous "management" exposure.
So AOL's plans seem to be buy something at it's highest cost (like Netscape) - turn it into crap - cut losses by laying people off - watch stock value plummet - fire management - quit with huge severance package.
"Ooh! Ooh! I know! Lets take this broken browser and break it even more! Then lets distribute it as part of our software package!"
"Why, Bob, that's be best damn idea I've heard this year! How would you like to be a vice president?"
Drop me a line at:
Key ID: 0x54D1D809
*presses 1*
----
Running 'Nix is like owning a Lightsaber. It's "a more elegant weapon for a more civilized time."
Well, I usually tell them that I'm leaving the country.
That works like a charm everytime, and they just can't argue against that now can they?
Ofcourse, I had a bad experience once when the guy wanted to know *why* I was leaving the country.
Ehmmm.
That sounds just like the kind of shit RealPlayer used to pull.
;)
From what little of it I have seen recently it has calmed down a little, but it used to get everywhere.
Perhaps the coder in charge of screen real estate got a new job at AOL
liqbase
Wow that sounds horrible. I dont think I've ever seen a computer come default that poorly. Was this from from no-name company or was it someone big like HP or Dell? I'm curious to know so that next time I'm asked for purchasing recommendations, I can add another item to my "Avoid these companies at all costs" list. :)
Joseph?
Funny story, I had heard stories of a similar nature before I tried cancelling my account. What did I do ? I called mastercard and told them flat out to stop payments on it. It's a helluva lot simpler and the people on the phone at mastercard can speak english and put up no argument..
Might be worth keeping in mind if you run into this situation again in the future.
John_Allen_Mohammad,
posting anonymously because Mr. Malda bitchslapped my account. *shrug*
The worst of both worlds.
Why an AOL IE browser? Behind the scenes, AOL and Microsoft probably have an agreement on Digital Rights Management. The monopoly lives and grows.
Stupid users + insecure browser = why don't they just GIVE their computers away?
Talk about a bunch of zombie machines waiting to happen.
Question everything
You've cancelled AOL more than once?
You've got a virus!
AOL built ... read : plus the bugs and security holes introduced by AOL !
and on the top of that : bloated with all the popups and spyware endorsed by AOL.
Because not everybody is computer literate enough to know that AOL sucks. Granny aint going to care what some punk tells her if AOL is telling her they can make her internet simpler. I find it distasteful that people on here can't understand that the internet does not make sense to everybody, and that some people need assistance with it.
Buy Steampunk Clothing Online!
New optimised browser for AOL: Now catch bugs up to 10 times faster! Get OWNED by goatse.vbs.exe.badshit faster and harder than before! oh well, ya gotta cull the herd somehow, job security,etc. ***tries to convince self...***
Down With Slashdot BETA!!! I've been around the corner and seen the oliphant; you can only abuse me from your perspecti
remember the settlement that "allowed" aol to use IE technology because their purchased child netscape was cheated out of the browser war? this is it.
aol will start distributing tons more cds that auto-aol-brand your ie. just wait.
User: My system is slow and unresponsive and it keeps asking me if I a bride from Soviet Russia
Tech: Unplug your cable modem and plug it back in...
Web hosting that doesn't suck!Dreamhost
I haven't read the book, but that sounds wrong. The MSFT/AOL deal you refer to was in place for several years before AOL purchased Netscape. Even if this were not the case, you don't pay $4 billion ($10 billion, by the time the deal closed) for a company in order to get a deal with another company that will place an icon representing your service in their product so that there is a possibility that a user of their product will decide to click on your icon and then decide to subscribe to your service. Especially when that other company already has its own service (MSN) that directly competes with yours and has its own icon featured just as prominently.
"They do make it as hard as possible to cancel. Not only do they make you dial a special cancellations number, which is not published, and barely staffed, they also put the poor saps that work that particular line in a very tough spot - they are supposed to talk you out of cancelling, and if they cancel too many accounts in a day they will be fired. They get bonuses for NOT cancelling - even though they're answering a line that is for cancellations only, and one where the simple fact that the customer has the number to dial indicates they've already waded through a lot of shit to get there, so they're pretty determined."
I actually used this to my advantage. During a really bad few work months, I was forced to give up my regular ISP, and those free AOL CD's started looking pretty good. I signed up, intending to cancel after the free trial. Lo and behold, at the end of the trial period, I received a bill for a month's service. I called up the customer service droid to complain loudly, and was offered apologies and another month of free service, which I accepted. The next month, another bill came, and I repeated the cycle. This ended up going on for well over half a year. Of course, I never actually USED AOL. I just established the connection, then fired up my regular utilities. End result: seven months' free internet with a loss to the Forces of Satan of some $170.00 or so. Fairly played, I think.
They thought that their ciustomers wern't in enought pain all ready?
:P
I smell a conspiracy, maybe its a favor getting returned for the AOL link on every desktop
GPLv2: I want my rights, I want my phone call! DRM: What use is a phone call, if you are unable to speak?
AOL, being in the "content" business, wants everybody to use a DRM-friendly browser.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
"I'm taking your mother and wife to Rio."
MS is competing with AOL with MSN. Using IE is simply giving bullets to your enemy.
evil is as evil does
This is not flamebait...it's the truth...the IE technology is a security nightmare...aol shuld thint about this harder cuz all those AOLers out the are getting seriusly screwed because of this...for clueless people they should make things as secure as possible **Cogh Gecko Cogh** not just screw them even worse...everyone that i know who uses aol or ie has some crap in there computer like adware and spyware and all that other good shit u know...i cant even do anything about it cuz it keeps coming back...I know they dont care about there customers but they are knowingly screwing there users by the things they do...it's sad really.
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so fuckinmg drunk dright now oh and i have a fgit brd onm my bed .,.. haahh alsashdot losers!
hwos gonna ge tlaid tonight?!1 not y0h muawhgaha.-
"Think of the Internet as a Highway." There it is again. Some clueless fool talking about the "Information Superhighway." They don't know didley about the net. It's nothing like a superhighway. That's a rotten metaphor. Suppose the metaphor ran in the other direction. Suppose the highways were like the net. . . A highway hundreds of lanes wide. Most with pitfalls for potholes. Privately operated bridges and overpasses. No highway patrol. A couple of rent-a-cops on bicycles with broken whistles. 500 member vigilante posses with nuclear weapons. A minimum of 237 on ramps at every intersection. No signs. Wanna get to Ensenada? Holler out the window at a passing truck to ask directions. Ad hoc traffic laws. Some lanes would vote to make use by a single-occupant- vehicle a capital offense on Monday through Friday between 7:00 and 9:00. Other lanes would just shoot you without a trial for talking on a car phone. AOL would be a giant diesel-smoking bus with hundreds of ebola victims on board throwing dead wombats and rotten cabbage at the other cars, most of which have been assembled at home from kits. Some are built around 2.5 horsepower lawnmower engines with a top speed of nine miles an hour. Others burn nitrogylcerin and idle at 120. No license plates. World War II bomber nose art instead. Terrifying paintings of huge teeth or vampire eagles. Bumper mounted machine guns. Flip somebody the bird on this highway and get a white phosphorus grenade up your tailpipe. Flatbed trucks cruise around with anti-aircraft missile batteries to shoot down the traffic helicopter. Little kids on tricycles with squirtguns filled with hydrochloric acid switch lanes without warning. NO OFFRAMPS. None. Now that's the way to run an Interstate Highway system.
I'm not anti-social, I'm anti-idiot.
"To talk live to a hot, horny girl, press 1."
What did she say?
Indecision is the key to flexibility.
Ok, AOL big wigs are obviously smoking crack. Not only are they releasing a browser that most tech magazines and even the federal government tell you to avoid using, but who is this aimed at? Those people running the IE-free version of windows?
Why the hell wouldn't they base this on Mozilla or Firefox?
That would be like goodyear releasing a new tire based on the old firestones from a few years back that the government MADE them recall because they were exploding.
Way to go AOL.
dumbasses.
"That, sir, is none of your business. Now, cancel my service. If I get another bill from you, I will file a chargeback with my credit card company and tell them to automatically deny any charges from you in the future and report you for fraud."
i am a soviet space shuttle
I can understand this move. they have the royalty free license and from what i understand from a contact of mine this is not a shell for IE like Avante or MyIE2 this is a full browser. Also, alot of sites out their were developed for IE and I guess AOL wanted to keep that. one thing i can guarantee for certain is that Microsoft knew about this before AOL did it and i think Microsoft may be encouraging it. They dont want to develop anymore standalone releases for Win 9.x/ME/2000 and AOL just cant keep using the same engine in their new releases of the AOL software so I think this is the base of future AOL releases. Only time will tell though. i have seen the beta in action and it looks pretty nice. Im still waiting for Apple to port Safari tho :)
yeah, it bugs me when they only have an 'OK' button...they so often miss the 'GO STICK YOUR HEAD DOWN THE TOILET, YOU SMELLY PIECE OF CRAP' button.
That's nothing new. Earthlink has a cancellations department that they stick all their newbies in (talk about trial by fire, eh), but at least they don't make you dial a special number to get to it.
Hahahaha. First post. Eat it, fuckers.
Wth our high tech cutting edge technology, our new Nigerian browser will read your brain waves (i.e thoughts) and take you to the best website. We know whats on your mind. Its Pr0n.
Send us your money and we will provide you with a FREE copy of this top secret software. Your computer is safe with us after you install our software. No?
Once I wanted to try out AOL, just to use the "50 hours of free internet". Well, besides that it didn't work for some reason (can't recall exactly what it was), I made a bad mistake: I used some fake name, address etc. to activate the account.
Problems began when I had to explain to a women on the hotline that there is a city called "Phobos Lab" in Germany (that was the name of the city I supplied, which really is the name of a Doom level).
solutions I have seen used is calling and telling the credit card company that all further charges from AOL are unauthorized.
that will get them to stop it in a farking hurry.
a friend of mine used to use a prepay mastercard. he simply stopped filling it and let AOL try and charge a defunct card.
Prepaid Credit Cards are wonderful tool to fight against scumbag companies like AOL.
Hey AOL...looks like your engineering team has finally perfected that blend of ice cream and crack with PCP sprinkles. WTF are they thinking? Why expend the resources?
Derek Greene
Woohoo! Possibly the gayest ISP has made one of their gayest decisions better!
When you need great justice, take off every zig.
When they ask why you're leaving the country, tell 'em, "To get away from AOL!"
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
you think it costs them $170 to give you internet? hahahahahahaha
>that they don't see how incompetent most AOL users >are. AOL knows that, most of us should too.
>AOL, last I heard, had two million Mac users
Mac users on AOL:
clueless people with money who'll pay double what they should because of the cool factor.
Thank you for explaining it to the world.
zeke
What you described is the customer retention dept. of both the cellular telephone service and DSL internet service company I worked for previously. I think most corporate service companies behave in genereral way.
Kinda ironic that in July 2003 AOL made a $2million donation to the Mozilla Foundation, and now their releasing an IE-based browser. Why not base it on either Firefox or the Gecko rendering engine?
"With Microsoft, you get Windows. With Linux, you get the full house" - unknown
"you think it costs them $170 to give you internet? hahahahahahaha"
No. That's what it would have cost ME.
ftp.mozilla.org = 64.12.168.243
[arin info]
OrgName: America Online, Inc.
OrgID: AMERIC-158
Address: 10600 Infantry Ridge Road
City: Manassas
StateProv: VA
PostalCode: 20109
Country: US
NetRange: 64.12.0.0 - 64.12.255.255
CIDR: 64.12.0.0/16
NetName: AOL-MTC
NetHandle: NET-64-12-0-0-1
Parent: NET-64-0-0-0-0
NetType: Direct Assignment
NameServer: DNS-01.NS.AOL.COM
NameServer: DNS-02.NS.AOL.COM
Comment:
RegDate: 1999-12-13
Updated: 1999-12-16
"With Microsoft, you get Windows. With Linux, you get the full house" - unknown
I suppose that could happen. Couldn't it?
Is it fascism yet?
If they wont cancel AOL, politely inform your credit card company to cancel it.
That will get their attention for sure.
http://saveie6.com/
I'd like to see if they're going to rewrite URLs on sites like Amazon and others and claim commission on the sales, using affiliate schemes.
Cant think of any other reason they'd want an insecure browser.
What have you lost in OOo that you have in Mozilla? Who has taken something from you?
Get a grip
Author, Shell Scripting : Expert Re
testing out my trending skills
A decade ago I signed up for AOL using my credit card. The next day I cancelled. That didn't stop them from charging me $19.95 a month for the next three months! After the third time visa was getting suspicious of *ME*!
Don't blame me, I didn't vote for either of them!
...Microsoft Contract
Actually, I think they need more computer contact.
Cloud and Tree - not just an immature webcomic, but a VISION.
I called to cancel a free trial account (needed phone access, and while they wanted to have a 15 minute conversation about WHY I was cancelling, I wasn't harassed to not cancel. This was in June.
paintball
What could be better? Someone that doesn't know what they are doing... Using a browser that doesn't know how to protect the user. There is a god; He just doesn't like stupid people :^)
My wife doesn't listen to me either...
I expected having a problem cancelling my account about 6 years ago, so I sent out a massive email to about 200 users. Despite the numerous replay-to-alls and the bitching, I didn't get reported once... though my friend who I put on the list got reported. After 48 hours of TOSes, I called to cancel... it was easy because they didn't have broadband access to try to sell you then.
fuck that was pointless.
Hm. So now we have two very unsafe browsers on the market. I guess it will be a while before we see less worms and viruses on the 'net.
-- Cheers!
Does anyone know if the minibrowser in WinAmp (an AOL product basically) and the minibrowser in Real Player are IE based, or just what browser scheme these minibrowsers are based on?
The difference between
I just checked the comments to see if there was anything positive about this. Cool new feature; AOL isn't evil; anything.
Nope. Not a thing. That's the best part of this article!
Why the crap would anyone want this?
I once tried to cancel with them, and they told me I could cancel anytime automatically directly on the web, by using the free realplayer software. All I had to do was go to real.com and download it.
There are going to be so many flames and jokes
that my computer will melt, and I'll laugh myself
to death
"Actually Evil A^2 + Evil B^2 = (Evil A - Evil B) x (Evil A + Evil B)"
Actually Evil A^2 - Evil B^2 = (Evil A - Evil B) x (Evil A + Evil B).
And you call yourself an Oregon State University graduate? For Shame!
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Comment removed based on user account deletion
Why should I vote in a presidential election? I don't live in a swing state, in fact it's so unswing that the majority of non-voters would have to register and all vote for the same guy to make a difference. That's not going to happen. So my vote will either go to the canidate who's allready won the state, in which case it's a waste of time to cast it. Or, my vote will go for another canidate, and be lost after he loses my state - again just a waste of time for me.
Do the licenses of Mozilla and Netscape allow AOL to use developments in Mozilla for proprietary software? I'm not too clear on the specifics of how open source developments in Mozilla are migrated over to proprietary distributions of Netscape, if they actually are.
But if AOL has licensed Internet Explorer from Microsoft, then perhaps the deal includes the sharing of proprietary code both ways. If Mozilla code can become proprietary for AOL under the project's licensing scheme, then they could possibly pass it on to Microsoft. Microsoft could end up using developments for Mozilla for Internet Explorer to deal with all its current security issues under a closed source license. That could be the whole reason for this deal.
This is a major reason why people all over the world are asking "Why would AOL do a stupid thing like that?"
Tech Public Policy stuff
It reminded me of a scene in Rambo 2 where that evil army guy says something like "We can reprogram his computer files" in a defensive remark about making Rambo disappear in vietnam.
Mind you, it was 1985 and most people thought pressing a button on a keyboard was programming.
The best scene was when he took that machine gun into the computer tent and fired like 5000 rounds, one handed, in a rage before going to make the bad guy poop his pants.
this is really mind-boggling, how is it that now that mozilla firefox has proven it's a viable platform the people who created the mozilla foundation choose ie over ns/ff???
All the torrents you could want.
No company would get away with something like this in Europe.
they are supposed to talk you out of cancelling, and if they cancel too many accounts in a day they will be fired. They get bonuses for NOT cancelling - even though they're answering a line that is for cancellations only
Well then, why don't we put the number on here? Random people could phone up and pretend to be convinced not to cancel... everyone wins!
Michael
"Goodness me, how unlike the FBI to abuse the trust of the American public." -- The Onion
AOL users are a significant chunk of internet users, and these internet users add to the Internet Explorer marketshare by choosing IE as their browser. In return for giving Microsoft this browser marketshare, they get their AOL icon on the Windows desktop.
If Microsoft takes it away, AOL can, literally overnight, make Netscape the dominant web browser.
AOL could have built their technology into Mozilla base and completely pushed MS out of the browser market...but the "big media" suits aren't into that type of competition... until, of course, MS DRM taxes them all!!
nifty concept me thinks...NOT! I wonder how many village idiots will actually install this thing over Mozilla....
A custom install of IE lets whoever do all sorts of stuff to your operating system. Sure, any install routine can do anything to your system, but once it's there, it's got all sorts of control over your computer via ActiveX. Here's an example... you're using your AOL-Customized IE, and decide to visit earlink.com. Hmmm... all of the word "the" on the page are replaced with "the stinkin'". Or, the page is otherwise mysteriously broken. This would be similar to where MSN's pages purposely appeared crappy when the user agent string from a browser contained the word "opera".
Sure, they could make their own browser do this sort of thing, but IE is so much easier.
"Would it kill you to put down the toilet seat?" -- Maya Angelou
Just stop paying, they cancel you quick enough once you stop sending them money.. And if they dont, well what do you care? its not costing you anything.
http://spamdecoy.net - free throwaway anonymous email - avoid spam!
They just work together, no changing of settings or anything.
Of course the ebay toolbar doesn't work with Opera, as it's a IE toolbar extension.
Oh, wait....
WARNING: Smartphones have side effects--most of them undocumented.
I san see it now. A massive outbreak of viruses. The AOL helplines flooded. It might go something like this: AOL Tech Support: "Hello, AOL customer support. Please state your problem." Paniced Customer: "My computer just turned itself off!" AOL: "I'm sorry. but thats not technicly possible" PC: "It did! Now it's turning back on again!" AOL:"Does the screen say anything?" PC: "Yes! It does!" AOL: "What does it say?" PC: "Use... Mozilla... You... Retard." AOL: "Does it say anything else?" PC: "Yes. It says: Reformatting... Harddrive... for... Linux... Install..."
& it seems like it's easier to get out of John Wayne Gacy's house alive after smoking pot than cancel a AOL account.
nt
My dad is a real character and loves to mess with people on the telephone. More on that in a minute. The family has had an AOL account for seven years now, and the last three years no one has used it much. Dad has broadband, and my sisters have moved out and gotten their own Internet access, though they still use the e-mail and IM accounts. However, he's remained an AOL subscriber because they simply will not let him cancel.
First off, they make it very difficult to find the phone number to unsubscribe. They want you to talk to a rep in an AOL chatroom so you can watch the AOL software suddenly barf all manner of whizbang new features on your screen. Like Athena springing from the forehead of Zeus, improved Instant Messaging Capabilities suddenly emerge from the dark recesses of AOL 9.0. How cool is that? say the hard sell salespeople. You decide to keep it for a few months to explore all the new features AOL has to offer. It's optimized now, you know.
However, we have the secret digits that will put us in contact with a real live person. That's because I put up with thirty minutes of annoying AOL popups (A/S/L? A/S/L? A/S/L?) and intentionally poorly-designed navigation to find it. That was nine months ago. Whenever my dad calls to cancel, they give him a ten minute sales pitch, then offer him a few months for free. Since my sisters don't want to go through the hassle of registering for free e-mail and Instant Messager accounts, he consents. When AOL decides to bill his credit card six weeks later, we go through the same elaborate dance.
But not this time. My dad decided to cancel for good. He called the secret number and talked to a customer service representative, whom I'll call Jennifer. Mostly because I don't remember her real name, but also because I like the name Jennifer. It reminds me of Larry Appleton's girlfriend on Perfect Strangers, and she was one classy dame. Ahh, Jennifer, mon amor! Je veux baiser votre main! Um, I digress. Anyway, Customer Service Rep Jennifer spent ten minutes trying to convince him that AOL was Better! Than! Ever!!! If he stayed on, Snoop Dogg and Jerry Stiller would come party with him. He could put them on his Buddy List, which he could now access on his cell phone.
My dad remained calm and told them that he did not own a computer anymore.
They informed him that that wasn't a problem,: they'd give him a computer.
Okay... That's when my dad rolled out the big guns. He didn't need a computer, he explained, because he'd gotten rid of the old one for religious reasons. He was sick of decadent, sinful "English" society and was moving to farm country to live with the Amish. Yea, verily he would have no electricity for their Internet-ready computer, or cell phone IM's, or anything like that. He wanted to ride a buggy, not surf AOL 9.0 Optimized.
Jennifer was nonplussed, since nobody resisted the siren call of free service and Snoop Doggy Dogg. She put Dad on hold while she got her manager to set him straight. My dad reiterated that he wanted to cancel, he had no computer and did not want one, he was moving to farm country to live with the Amish. Would Snoop help churn butter, would Jerry Stiller help raise a barn? Nay, he thought not. Eventually the manager gave in and agreed to cancel the account.
However, he asked, since Dad was so religious, perhaps America Online could offer him a Great Deal on a church website?
Heathen! Thou art truly clueless, and will surely burn in hell. Click.
--All your stolen base are belong to Rickey Henderson
Clippy: I see you are using your computer. Would you like to:
- IM a thirteen year old girl to chat about Justin Timberlake?
- Use the AOL photo archive to find JPEGs of Justin Timberlake?
- TYPE IN ALL CAPITAL LETTERS?
- mis-spllee evryethign baldy
- Auto-insert the phrase OMG LOL ROTFLMAO =)
- Shoot yourself in the head because you are so goddamned stupid
--All your stolen base are belong to Rickey Henderson
This is hilarious, if I hadn't already posted in this thread I'd give you a funny mod for sure. Funny thing is, I'm pretty sure I heard the same story, only from 'Jennifer.' Or at least one or two very similar stories.
=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-
Friends don't let friends enable ecmascript.
Hello,
I'm glad to see someone caught the reference to Harry Turtledove's WorldWar alternate history series.
Yes I've read the series. Yes, it's quite annoying a lot of the time. Dr. Turtledove seems to just crank the prose out on auto-pilot. I eventually just speed read it. The first book of the series is the best.
I think the best Turtledove alt history book is 'The Guns of the South'.
I hope the new browser from AOL will not be called Netscape 8.0. What an irony for Netscape to be based on IE rendering engine...
American OnLine + Microsoft Network = MOAN?
That's the only reason I can think of, that Mozilla is simply too secure, and with IE for AOL, spyware from AOL can be installed on the end user. I'm not saying they're doing that, there could also be business, contractual reasons for doing this. The problem is that AOL really has something great going with Mozilla, and as an ISP you would think being able to offer a superior, more secure experience would be a paramount selling point. That's why this doesn't make any sense, either the suits don't get it, that security is so important (and they own the secure browser), or maybe they have a stake in having the freedom to monitor their user's machines at a deep level. After going through one security nightmare after another with IE (on my work machine, at home I use Suse/firefox), I just had to stop using it, or use it only with the security settings on "high", which then makes it almost useless (except for testing). The only reason I use it at all is to check to see that my websites look OK in it.