Slashdot Mirror
10 Ads The US Won't See
prostoalex writes "Some ads made by world's leading advertising agencies for well-known brands will never be seen in the United States. The Gucci G-Spot turned out to be too risque, video for Drug-Free America was deemed too disgusting, Internet's favorite Honda "Cog" commercial won't air due to the high prices for a 2-minute spot, and Japanese commercials with American actors have contracts preventing the companies to run the same ads in the US. AdAge provides a link to the pictures and video (Windows Media .ASF format, alas) of the 10 best unaired commercials." I can get the ASFs working under VLC.
don't welcome any new ads. The only good ad is the blocked/skipped ad.
No ads is good ads.
I was under the impression that the Honda "Cog" commercial wasn't released in the US was because the car which was being advertised was a UK-only model! Anyway, I've seen it, and it's very impressive if you can stand the low-quality file from the Honda site.
Like eagles on pogo-sticks! -- Glottis
NOT safe for work...
Hand-rolled cigars (MPG)
I'm more interested in the ads that won't be shown in other countries because they are too "racy", "religiously offensive", etc. It's always fascinating to see how another culture rules out elements that we think are normal. The other way around is not so surprising, since we all watch the TV here all the time, and we know what shows and what doesn't on our own tv's.
Ultimately, I must agree that the "best" commercial is no commercial at all.
stuff |
Do a search on kazaa for banned commercials. It's too bad they are banned from tv because most are hilarious.
----
Squirrel
Even though it's not a real commercial (used to be on AdCritic back when it was good), I loved the Dodge Aries K-Class car commercial. It was a hilarious spoof of car commercials...
98 horsepower... standard.
map light... standard.
etc.
If you had nuts on your chin, would they be chin nuts?
... But what about the Nibble Nobby's Nuts ads in Australia?
If at first you don't succeed, so much for skydiving.
Production costs: $1.2 million
2 minutes of network airtime: $2 million
Mention on Slashdot: Priceless.
Sick of seeing the same old ads on TV? Seems like every hockey game I see involves 5 minutes of ads, 3 minutes of which are repeats! Well I've got the solution!
All advertising must be done live. No pre-taped commercials, ever. Even if it's the same script read by the same person there will be some difference. Now if a company spends a mil or two on a commercial it'll really mean something.
Of course it'll never happen, but if it did I'd be alot happier with advertising.
Jonah Hex
Horror & SciFi Erotic Nudes
Something tells me the second ad, "Gucci's G Spot," will be the one primarily responsible for the site's eventual Slashdotting.
The coolest voice ever.
*useful product.
*credit goes to some person on fark a while ago.
For every annoying gentoo user, are three even more annoying anti-gentoo crybabies. Take Yosh from #Gimp for example.
Why not break up a block of late-night "paid programming," and broadcast some of the more enticing ads within that time so TiVo can pick them up separately.
Stick a line on the Now Showing screen labelled "Check out the ads THEY don't want you to see!" or something like that.
If the ads are compelling enough to straddle the advertisement/entertainment line, people will watch. I watched those BMW commercials that ran in the same slot a while back-- didn't make me run out and buy one, but they were entertaining.
~Philly
Just why exactly would I want to watch even more ads?
Some ads made by world's leading advertising agencies for well-known brands will never be seen in the United States.
So basically, the good ads aren't broadcast, and I have to Tivo-triple-fast-forward all the ones I *do* get on TV because they're such a tripe.
Here's a suggestion for TV networks : instead of trying to sue DVR manufacturers because it lets customers skip your crap, why don't you replace the crap with good ads (and no, I'm not talking about Budweiser or Taco Bell ads)? Of course, you may have to leave good taste behind once in a while, but I bet good ads would being better brand recognition with less airtime, meaning less ads for viewers overall and less DVR zapping.
"A door is what a dog is perpetually on the wrong side of" - Ogden Nash
After watching the Simpsons and the 10 minutes of commercial I get from that and coming to slashdot to waste some time geeking out and seeing an ad for "OSDN personals" (WTF, by the way...) I just got the feeling that I wasn't watching nearly enough commercials.
The drug ad wasn't a Drug-Free America ad, it was for a New Zealand anti-drug campaign.
Don't think of it as your freedoms slipping away, think of it as complying with the Patriot Act.
Have you seen those little announcements around? I went to a credit union and saw one, you can't open an account unless you swear allegiance or some muck.
Think what a fine commercial you could make around that!
A feeling of having made the same mistake before: Deja Foobar
It seems like UK ads have a different kind of humour to them than US ones (especially taking #4 as an example).
There's a brand of crisps (US=potato chips?) in the UK. They got a very famous footballer, Gary Lineker, to do the ads for them. The ads were basically taking the piss out of him. The US company who owned the brand were absolutely against doing that as in the US it wouldn't be done. Suprisingly it worked a treat in the UK.
Microsoft Windows...stability guarenteed or your money back!
As long as there is a Second Amendment, there will always be a First Amendment.
Speaking of ads, my roommatte pointed out something funny about my TiVo:
I got the tivo partly to skip ads, now I never have to watch them during the shows I record (thank GOD for the 30-sec backdoor)
However, every week a new add will show up on the tivo main screen and I always watch those. He asked me why, if I hate ads so much, I watch the longer-form ads just because tivo wants me to see them.
thats some Zen shit i tell ya....
Who in his right mind would want to see them?
That drug commercial had to have been inspired by the movie Bad Taste. An oldie but goodie from New Zealand directed by Peter "lord of the Ring" Jackson.
Check this out (link)
in a Martini commercial is another you will not see in US, Britain or Australia. Quote from the article:
In one of the commercials, Paltrow is seen rising apparently naked from a hotel bed shared by an equally unclothed male.
"Pausing to put on only a shirt, she tiptoes downstairs, hoists herself over the bar and prepares Martinis on the rocks for herself and her bedmate."...But what distinguishes Paltrow from previous faces of the company is her very public, healthy living image.
"She particularly asked that the advert was not shown in Britain or the US because people in those countries are much more aware that she doesn't drink," a source at Martini & Rossi's headquarters in Turin said.
don't welcome any new ads. The only good ad is the blocked/skipped ad.
Yeah, but I hate to break it to you: you're not the majority. How many non-football fans watch the SuperBowl each year because of the commericials? A lot. That's because it's the one time of the year that you can be guaranteed that advertisers are honestly trying to catch your attention. So much of the other advertisements are bland and uninteresting. They're just not trying.
I think as technologies like TiVo start to take off there is going to be more and more pressure placed on adverising companies to come up with innovative ads that people won't mind sitting through. The real pickle for these companies is constantly coming up with new ads that are entertaining and push the limits and still not offensive to the majority of the American public. When I was younger I often wondered why ads suck so much. Surely there are tons of witty people who could write clever ads! Why aren't they being given the chance? Well, as I grew older I started to realize that a lot of humor is actually borderline offensive to a lot of people. Or they're simply too slow to 'get' the joke. Humor is, of course, the cheapest way to construct an interesting commerical. Other ways include novel imagery but this takes more talent and, arguably, more money.
Anyhow, I'm thinking that in the next 5 years we're going to see an improvement in the quality of advertisements to the point that they start to become entertainment in their own right. If companies do not do this, their ads are simply going to get blocked/skipped by an increasingly dissatisfied viewing public.
GMD
watch this
I saw a woman get kicked out of shopping mall once for breast-feeding her baby. I was sat close by with my wife and we didn't even notice. She was just sat quietly next to her stroller feeding her kid.
With that kind of brute insensitivity to the naked body you really expect the U.S. to show ads that just might disgust an audience that thinks breast feeding in public is perverted?
Honda's "Cog" ad is a direct homage to The Way Things Go, a 30 minute film of an amazing kinetic art installation (here's a video clip.)
You have to see this at least once in your life -- it's the most amazing "Rube Goldberg" contraption you'll ever see.
In a totalitarian system, you aren't allowed to talk back to the government; in the capitalist system you can't talk back to the sponsor.
--
Simon
Dear advertising execs:
If you're going to put ads on the air, make them good and funny. And I don't mean ha-ha-shut-up funny, I mean really funny, maybe even piss-my-pants funny (but only the first ten times). I still won't buy your product, but you could at least entertain me.
With much contempt,
bersl2
Thanks - I liked the Christmas play, the drug abuse adv and the Honda in particular. Just what the Doctor ordered for a Monday :-)
...is just about the most intelligence-insulting thing I've ever seen. I mean, really... the truth of the matter is that the majority of widely used drugs don't cause considerable brain damage, or at least brain damage on the level that is wreaked by say, alcohol abuse.
I think it should be banned for sheer stupidity rather than for any sort of inappropriateness.
Avi Player works; but since that site uses mms links, I had to paste the *asf urls to the command line.
Ultimately, I must agree that the "best" commercial is no commercial at all.
TV Programming has come to the point where the shows themselves are simply vehicles for product placement.
Look at all the coca-cola and ford positioning in the American Idol show for example of extreme product
placement.
I'd rather see a good well-done commercial than another half hour of typical drek television any
time. The expense per unit time of the commerical
is hundreds of times more than the show, especially
if the show is animated or syndicated.
Then again, I'd rather watch a Seinfeld rerun than a new episode of that stupid P. Hilton moron any time.
Won't see this in the U.S., been trying to find a download of it since coming back from Australia but no luck. Goes something like this...
Beautiful woman is sitting at a restaurant table. The waiter delivers her drink and says "take your top off for a chance to win $10000!"
Woman: "You're joking!"
Waiter: "No, really!"
Woman: "Take my top off, that's all I need for a shot at $10000?"
Waiter: "That's right."
Woman has her already-skimpy top off in a flash. Cut back to the Waiter with a stunned expression.
"I meant the top off your Diet Coke..."
Here is the entire archive
How about this---
John Smith's wildly popular U.K. beer spots by TBWA star well-known comedian Peter Kay as an overweight, useless parent who uses a sausage and a beer glass to illustrate the facts of life. Only a U.K. marketer would endorse such a loser as a brand spokesman
Umm, hello?
Dell Dude anyone?
Does anyone know where one can find a copy of this commercial from a few years back, or even remember what the commercial was for? It was something about getting money back or whatnot, Bonus was the big word:
Knock-knock
Who's there?
A BONUS!
Hello? Bonus? Speaking.
-my other sig is your mom
I'm from Australia, and the one thing that's extremely noticeable about US advertising is the huge numbers of drug commercials. Here in Australia, advertising perscription drugs is banned (though drug companies try to subvert the ban by funding ads that say something like "consult your doctor about treating disease X" without mentioning the drug they're pushing).
Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from a rigged demo
--Andy Finkel (J. Klass?)
That's the whole point of a credit union, isn't it? To have some kind of arbitrary rule to decide who can open an account. Of course, most use employment or geographic locations. I don't see why a credit union requiring allegiance to the U.S. or whatever is so bad.
I'm not an expert, but from what I understand there are very clean ways of extracting energy from coal these days. It has a bad reputation embedded in many people's eyes from the past, though, so it's not always a politicians' first choice from a public relations perspective.
Whether these cleaner methods for burning it make it more affordable and "better", I couldn't say. I guess it depends on the situation.
This is more of a moral venue. Slashdot must be straying.
-=- Many seek good nights and lose good days.
Mplayer works good as well. Try 1.0pre3 since the previous one I had audio but no video. It can even stream them as well if you run mplayer mms://<url>
>First it was an attack on those evil amendment thingies. Now this. I feel our freedoms slipping away.
/sarcasm/
>Don't think of it as your freedoms slipping away, think of it as complying with the Patriot Act.
Thats right no ad in the history of the united states of america has been banned before January 2001 when Bush got in office.
It's nice to see Slashdot doing their part to ensure America still won't see these ads. Ah... I love the smell of slashdotting in the morning....
Although they are fake, we cannot discount the highly suggestive Puma ads. Hubba Hubba!
When modding "Informative", please make sure it both has a source and IS actually informative.
The ads in U.S actually pertain to the content of the shows even if they suck. For example, I watch an NBA game, I expect commercials about sneakers and Yao Ming selling laptops etc etc.
If you have been to some other countries, their TV broadcasts are just completely off subject. Showing a rerun of Cartoons, then viagra commercial. Maybe some music karoke hour show, followed by insurance commercial about death and terrorism. It's that bad. Sport broadcasting always have lingerie and some fat chocolate commercials. It's unbelievable.
Internet's favorite Honda "Cog" commercial won't air due to the high prices for a 2-minute spot.
I often see the same annoying 30 second ad 6 times in a 30 minute show, sometimes twice in a single break.
A single 2 minute ad once during the show would be a lot more effective than the same ad 6 times, and since it's less total time, it would probably be cheaper too.
Jason
ProfQuotes
one for the poms...
Any truth to the story I've heard about a new Becks beer ad ? tagline (supposedly) goes
you don't need to be Posh to swallow Becks
Lots of businesses seem to find the recent terror-reactionist laws useful. Recently, Orbitz.com refused to refund some money to me from a cancelled plane trip, citing the Patriot Act or some such rubbish. How convenient for them.
Yes. Exactly that. To "take the piss" is to mock, usually with a mixture of caricature and ironic commentary. That's not from a dictionary - that's just how I (as an accredited piss-taker) would describe it.
"It is the prerogative of fools (or noobs) to utter truths that no one else will speak."
My grandmother got married a month before she graduated from highschool and had to keep it a secret or they would hav expelled her because she might corrupt the other girls. Whatever. To this day we segregate girls who get pregnant in highschool like they had some sort of communicable disease. And we still get our panties in a twist because the someone might want to marry someone who has the same genetals as them.
The USA is incredably sexually screwed up.
Boobies never hurt anyone. - Sherry Glaser.
New ?!
In Soviet America the banks rob you!
I hear and read so many people bagging on television advertisements: too many, too long, poor quality, what's the deal with tampon ads during sport, etc.
I have a radical solution to television advertising. It has worked for me for almost 18 months now - and I think you know what's coming next...
Throw out your television.
Yeah, yeah - I get flamed by people irl about this too. The lady at the cigarette counter at my local supermarket told me just last night that for someone to lack a television in this modern day was "just tragic!"
I see less shit ads though...
"It is the prerogative of fools (or noobs) to utter truths that no one else will speak."
Just to mention. The Honda ad was done in a "single" shot. The camera never cut away. It just took 606 tries at that single shot before every bearing, wheel, wiper blade, and drop of oil was perfectly aligned to yield one of the most complex ads ever filmed.
Here is an article explaining it:
The Daily Telegraph
British adverts are also fairly conservative. Continental European ads onthe other hand are comparatively racy.
Government of the people, by corporate executives, for corporate profits.
I saw this Dutch ad on the Internet a couple years ago. Apparently it's an ad for English classes. That's not the only reason it would never been shown in the US though.
Quicktime Video
Back in the day, this commercial aired a couple of times on TV before being pulled. It claimed that if Kennedy had only been in a VW Bug...and you would see the car floating down the stream. I would love to find a copy of this again.
Valley Pools & Spas in Andover, Minn., might be regretting its choice of the pitchman featured in its television commercials. Sitting in a hot tub in the TV spot is Todd Bouman of the Minnesota Vikings. The young quarterback now is caught up in an investigation regarding an alleged sexual assault that took place in a hot tub. Two women reported that they were assaulted at the Vikings' "Arctic Blast," a three-day charity event organized by the football team in February. Authorities haven't said that Bouman is a suspect, but he has been the only player named as a possible witness. Bouman's attorney, when informed about the commercial by a reporter from the Star-Tribune, was surprised. "I don't know, frankly, what I can say. Bad timing, I guess?" Former Viking Mike Morris also appears in the hot tub commercial with Bouman.
more info: http://www.startribune.com/stories/464/3720454.htm l
You can also download the videos with mmsclient. It works like wget -- you just give it the mms:// url. You can get it here. That site has an XMMS plugin, too, but I haven't tried it.
Japanese ads that will never air in the US (works in Xine).
All data is speech. All speech is Free.
I think that Honda, and the ad agency, is lying.
Rob Steiner, agency producer for Wieden & Kennedy, says that not only were practical effects more attuned to the tagline of the commercial, but CG would not have done the job visually, either. "You couldn't create that type of tension with CG," he says.
However, computers did come into play in the editing phase. Indeed, what looks to be one continuous shot is actually two, seamlessly stitched together by Flame operator Barnsley of The Mill in London.
"Our reason for shooting it in two 60-second pieces was damage limitation, really," explains Steiner. "We knew everything physically worked." But the contraption simply wouldn't fit down the length of a single wall at the Paris studio, so half was built and filmed on one side and half on the other.
With the intent of making the spot look like one continuous take, lighting and shadows in the studio had to look smooth over the full two minutes. Still, "due to constant movement, we couldn't even give [Barnsley] a good lighting reference," says Steiner.
This was covered on slashdot before, and it took 606 takes to get it. They had to cheat one of the transitions with cgi because they didn't have a room long enough to do it all in one shot.
mock him and thereby make him look stupid to anyone watching (including him and you if there's nobody else.). Common usage in Britain and Ireland.
Ireland also has "taking the mickey out of him", which is much the same thing - the phrase comes from you notionally "reducing the efficiacy of his penis" by embarrassing him. Island nations (Britain, Ireland, Japan, etc.) tend to run societies like that.
This is very bizarre.
Wearing pants should always be optional.
Apparently, Rebok put an ad on the tv that used a very disgusting fake company name during a recent Superbowl. The guy at this site was sure it was intentional, so he rang them up ...
Felcher and SonsI don't know if this actually happened, I'm an Australian, don't watch Superbowl.
The Internet's nature is peer to peer - 20050301_cs_profs.pdf
"Ads will HAVE to become better very soon"
Apparently you missed some of the finer points of this bit here. Why make better commercials when you can redefine the medium to require viewing of commercials? Think "Disney DVD."
We already have the "broadcast bit" in our flavor of ATSC now, what's to stop some new standard including a "no channel surfing bit?" It would allow broadcasters to charge even more to advertisers, which they would then argue would enable more/better shows. Why wouldn't Congress let this happen?
You can use VLC to save these MMS streams as AVI files. From within VLC, go to File > Open Network, select HTTP/FTP/MMS from the radio button list, and paste the MMS link in the Media Resource Locator field. Then check the Advanced Output checkbox and click on the Settings button at right. In the next dialog, choose output to File, browse to a location on your HD, and choose AVI as your encapsulation method. (I couldn't get anything other than AVI to properly capture and play the audio stream.) Hit the OK buttons to exit both dialog boxes, and after a short pause VLC's playhead should begin moving. VLC won't show the movie as it's being captured, so just let it go until the playhead jumps back to the left-most "begin" position. Then you can check the location you saved the file to and open it with VLC to check that you got it all.
The audio sync isn't perfect, but it's better than not being able to capture them at all. If someone figures out how to improve the audio sync, please let us all know. Anyway, hope this helps!
the mms URLS, then load them in gmplayer.
Works great!
#gmplayer mms://windowsmedia.dvlabs.com/adcritic/mrkippling
#gmplayer mms://windowsmedia.dvlabs.com/adcritic/carenz-sku
#gmplayer mms://windowsmedia.dvlabs.com/adcritic/johnsmiths
#gmplayer mms://windowsmedia.dvlabs.com/adcritic/sylvania-r
#gmplayer mms://windowsmedia.dvlabs.com/adcritic/honda-cog.
(Note remove any extra spaces in the text above if you want to just cut and paste.)
anyone seen the North Dakota TV Ad? Have you listened to the jingle? Doesn't it sound familiar? Like...a 70's coca cola ad?
Although the idea itself was a bit novel, and hadn't been done before that I could remember, here is where it falls over
"take your top off for a chance to win $10000!"
Most people, obviously including this girl, would take that statement as referring to their "clothing" top. She was silly enough to take it literally - which is the lameness in the ad.
OTOH, if he had given her the drink and said "take the top off for a chance to win $100000!", it would have worked better because the "top" became ambiguous. Still, it then becomes insulting to either that beautiful woman specifically, implying the dumb "beautiful" woman stereotype (she was brunette, if she was blonde there would have been a huge outcry), or all woman in general, as it implies they all would be silly enough abandon their dignity in a restaurant for money (and only $10 000 - I'd suggest for most people the "abandon dignity" threshold is $1 000 000).
Now, I don't think I'm a prude, but there are two things in TV ads that I find offensive, as a (male) child of the 70s, brought up in the post feminist era :
The Internet's nature is peer to peer - 20050301_cs_profs.pdf
Religion is the main cause of atheism.
Por supuesto, todavia esta vivo
With a picture of a large vacuum cleaner it said "Nothing Sucks Like An Electrolux"
Google references claim that the company tried the ad campaign in the US, but I never saw it. I snapped a quick photo at the time, but my shoebox collection of photos is not sorted in calendar order, so sorry.
For anyone interested in celebrities going abroad to sell products and make big cash, check out the excellent www.japander.com. Not only is it an interesting site, but it's a heck of a URL.
It was only recent that the U.S. laws changed to allow prescription drug makers to say what the drug is used for in television commercials. (They're required to list the various possible side-effects if they do so.) Previously, they could mention the name of the drug all they wanted, but that was about it. I still remember being bombarded with "Ask your doctor about Rogaine" without having the slightest clue what it was.
I don't believe for a second that the "Cog" commercial is for real. Everything about it just reeks of CG. Why? Well, I can't put my finger to it. It's too clean. Surfaces seem odd. The lighting seems unnatural. It just doesn't jive for me. Two shots? I think it's a bald-faced lie.
I recently was sent an mpeg of an ad for a Toyota Corolla (4mb or so, by email, oh the shame). It was actually pretty good, and if it wasn't so big I probably would have forwarded it on too.
It got me thinking... what a win for Toyota! They are paying nothing for the air time, and rather than me nipping off to the toilet or something while the ad break was on, it had my undivided attention for a minute or however long it ran for.
Is this the future of advertising?
An example of this is that Target (a US chain store like Wal-mart, K-mart, big-w depending on where you are) has typical t week sales in some departments such as baby items or clothing. Targets logo is a red and white circle that looks like a target (see target.com).
In Australia they run an ad for their baby stuff sales that starts out with an animated sperm that is made from their logo with a tail and it finds a egg also from their logo while the voice over talks about 20% off. I can't see that comercial ever being show in most of the US. They also have one for their bra sales that involves many sets of their logos.
I find it interesting that it took the Aussie (Murdock who started Fox) to bring some of the slightly racey concepts to US tv's.
The movies work fine in xine, too. I had to launch it from the command-line rather than the browser because of the weird protocol (what *is* mms, anyway?)
Here are the commands you want, to save you digging around the page:
xine mms://windowsmedia.dvlabs.com/adcritic/mrkippling- birth.asf- babies.asfl l_gore.asfo aches.asf a sf
xine mms://windowsmedia.dvlabs.com/adcritic/johnsmiths
xine mms://windowsmedia.dvlabs.com/adcritic/carenz-sku
xine mms://windowsmedia.dvlabs.com/adcritic/sylvania-r
and of course
xine mms://windowsmedia.dvlabs.com/adcritic/honda-cog.
Remove the spaces Slashcode's put in the URLs, of course.
(And there's only one P in "Mr. Kipling"...)
GROGGS: alive and well and living in
Sadly, that sort of thing is all too common. It varies by state, though-- for example, it's explicitly legal in Florida.
IANAL.
GROGGS: alive and well and living in
This wasn't on television, and may hurt some religious sensibilities, but I thought this Christmas ad for Ann Summers was very very clever. Possibly NSFW, depending on where you work.
...look no farther than how American ads portray men and fathers. You mentioned role reversals, but the issue warrants more of a mention than that. Men and fathers are portrayed as helpless idiots, inferior parents and "humorously" subjected to violence.
There's the add where the woman takes pictures of items so her brainless husband can find the items in the store, the Dodge minivan ad with the caption "gets more work done than most husbands", the candy bar ad where a squirrel chomps on a guys nuts, the (insurance?) ad where the guy doesn't care that he's spilled hot coffee on his crotch, and worst of all, the Progressive Insurance ad where a vindictive woman tortures her ex with a voodoo doll site - including taking a pair of wire cutters to his testicles.
If women in this country were subjected to as much humiliation, or female genital mutilation was treated as a joke in a commercial, there would be blood in the streets and NOW would be storming these advertizing agencies with tanks.
"Just tell her parents that you were getting stoned" as the toddler gets into the pool. I want to make a new version that says "Just tell her parents you were reading the bible" or "Just tell her parents you were jacking off" or "Just tell her parents you were talking on the phone" .... You get the idea.
Miller Time's Evil Beaver. Hands down the funniest thing I've ever seen on TV, period. I remember catching it once or twice before it was pulled from US Airwaves, though I believe it was actually nominated for an award in the UK.
If you can find this clip anywhere, you're in luck. So far, I haven't been able to, and I'd love to archive it to show my friends (who never have any idea what I'm talking about).
The longer I'm a member of the Human Race, the more I believe Apocalypse is a valid solution.
This Dutch ad starring Bill Clinton (thanks to graphics manipulation) is absolutely perfect in execution :
The Ad
Unfortunately, despite members of the White House having seen it and liking it (supposedly including Mr. Clinton), it was still deemed too sensitive as it was close to elections.
The ad was subsequently retracted from Dutch T.V.
For the curious, the end-slogan "Even Apeldoorn bellen" (if you can read it) is something of a catch-phrase in Dutch language as these types of ads (for an insurance company) have been running for years with the same style of humor.
Ads index page - links on the left, click the eyes-icons in the bottom to view the ads - personal recommendations: 'Egel' and 'Pianist'
I don't like the looks of war, racism, sexism,
& the like.
But - Hey! - ignoring them won't make them
go away.
Standing up & calling for change, when
I see them can & has... in some cases.
absolutely love the 2 minute honda ads myself, it's a shame the US wont get to see them in their full glory...
Software Freedom Day!.
Ok, lets just call 'em "banned for now", because we all know that about once each year, one of the big TV networks roll all these commercials up into a 1 hour TV show special in which they proceed to show us these commercials.
... but the ultimate irony is that they've just con'ed you into watching a WHOLE HOUR of commercials, most of which I'm sure they are compensated for.
These specials are usually dubbed with cutsie names, such as "the world's funniest commercials", or "boobs, too hot for TV"
Market droids -- start your engines, spin up your beanie propellors -- godspeed.
Skiers and Riders -- http://www.snowjournal.com
I believe that the nut holding your keyboard is malfunctioning.
Do not meddle in the affairs of geeks for they are subtle and quick to anger
It's not that breast feeding is perceived as "perverted" per se; Americans are just loathe to witness a baby suckling, and in so doing realize that our foreplay methods betray us as being sexually attracted to our moms.
If I could make this sig kill you, I would.
...check out asfrecorder...
Download them with asfrecorder, then watch them with mplayer. Makes streaming ASF files play nice.
http://www.narnarnar.com
George Bush's Alternative Fuels
Saddam's Adventure Tours of Iraq
O J Simpson's Golf Academy
Bill Clinton's Cigar Emporium
Osama Bin Laden's Weapons Wholesale
Microsofts Totally Secure Software Sale
RIAA Free Downloads
DVD Jon's Handmade Number Plates
but the most anticipated for 2004 is.....
SCO's Closing Down Sale
Linux: Worth suing everone for!
Two words: Fischli & Weiss.
'Nuff said. Look it up if you don't know.
But OK, I can't resist, so:
I remember when the thing came out and there was the point that they "cheated" once or twice. I believe the "cheating" was less about physics than about photography - maybe the speakers?
In any case I hope Peter and David were paid well for this, 'cause if not then it's a rip-off of the highest order.
Not that they'd find that a bad thing necessarily... we artists are usually tickled pink to be plagiarized by Big Capital, and it certainly doesn't hurt our prices.
Since I live in both the "traditional" (painting) art world and the "new media" (computer/network/etc) world, I always find it amusing how people in the latter tend to be more ignorant of the former than the other way around. Even though there is always a lot of osmotic exchange of ideas between the two.
This Like That - fun with words!
Okay - so now I concerned. I'm concerned by two things. The first is that somewhere in the world, people pay a TV tax - like for real? Are you having me on? The second (after a moment's thought) is my ignorance in thinking that television would be all free and available everywhere (we've only had Pay TV here for less than ten years, before that it was just the same 4 or 5 free channels the whole country over)
"It is the prerogative of fools (or noobs) to utter truths that no one else will speak."
To this day we segregate girls who get pregnant in highschool like they had some sort of communicable disease.
Stupidity can spread like a plague. Unwed highschool-age mothers are flagrantly displaying their stupidity. I wouldn't want a teenage crack addict spending time with my kids either.
And we still get our panties in a twist because the someone might want to marry someone who has the same genetals as them.
It's not possible. You can't marry someone of the same gender anymore than you can murder a dead man. The meaning of the word prevents it from happening.
The USA is incredably sexually screwed up.
Yes. Because somewhere along the line, people stopped saying "That is wrong", everything is acceptable and you're a bigot if you don't go along with it.
LK
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
Blah Blah Blah (*)(*) Blah Blah Blah ( * ) ( * ) BLAH!
In case you were replying to my post, I did NOT mean that evil things would go away by looking away. I meant offending things might not be as offending is someone looks the other direction.
I originally meant that if the "Shitnuggets blaa blaa yadda yadda" post looks like offending, there is no need to see it, by looking away.
That was my point. Current US President is still stupid, no matter how far away I look, I know...
-Is the meaning of life vanity, or is vanity the meaning of life?
I'm curious as to why BBC programs shown on PBS are not censored? I see nude pictures of women on Rod and Dellboy's wall all the time. They also get away with saying "shit". And "feck" (Father Ted) is pretty racy I guess as well.
We have a live tonight type show in Australia called "The Panel" it's done by the same people behind the movies "The Dish" and "The Castle". It consists of a group of 5 or so people sitting around a desk talking about current events.
One of the female hosts recently had her first child, and one night after coming back from an ad break, she was sitting in her usual spot breast feeding her baby.
Quite possibly the first time on live national television.
Isn't watching Ads on TV like going to an Art Museum to smell paint?
I'm a 2000 man.
Looks like the red ad for ESPN I was served on that page has a typo in one of the frames...
Ironic, on a site dedicated to advertising.
HINT: isn't that an odd age range?
garethw
... or betray that women like their breasts sucked.
is Russian Ark a 90 minute unbroken take through some famous Russian museum. And it has actors delivering lines. Imagine if some actor around the 85 minute mark flubs a line or looks at the camera.
"I still won't buy your product, but you could at least entertain me."
And THAT's the point of Advertising. Persuasion doesn't end with the first encounter. It mutates. Long before you've forgotten the ad, you would've probably told at least 2 of your friends about it. Consequently, one of your friends might be in the market for the product the ad was selling. He might be drawn to the ad and/or visit a store to inquire about the product.
Advertising works, even if it means going through a middleman like yourself to get the message to the intended audience. If Advertising doesn't work, the industry would've been deep-sixed a long time ago. And you'd be seeing less of it today.
I'd happily abandon my dignity for ten bucks.
But there are some funny ones that I like..
Rolling Rock commercial where the guy gets married, has an austrailian animal tv show type voice in the background, and he opens the bottle of beer with his wedding ring.
Pretty much any of the Budweiser commercials on the radio.. (tribute to the taco-salad maker guy, etc) I think they have done a couple tv ads like this but im not too sure, ive only caught the end of it.
Sierra Mist commercial (Superbowl commercial) where the monkey in a zoo catapults over the wall to the polar bears or whatever it was.
You could probably take.. 10,000 commercials and find only like 50 that were good though, and thats the problem.
That's because you have less free speech. Like when you try and call the Prince gay in a newspaper. To a US point of view those restrictions are abhorrent.
Tim
Omnia vestra castrorum habetur nobis.
When I was in Taiwan there was a German company selling heaters there and the add company they hired put Hitler on the sides of busses and billboards announcing this Heater from this company would Win the War on the Cold Front!
It didn't take long for the German company to find out and fire the add company, but that is an add you won't see in America (and sure as heck not in Germany).
The meaning of words change.
In common parlance, not in legal usage. On numerous occasions the US Supreme Court has had to contemplate the "Original Intent" of many words and phrases as they make their decisions.
Marriage is now equated in many peoples mind with a "license" to fuck someone, and get various financial breaks from the government, banks, and insurance companies, etc.
You seem to not understand. Actuarial data shows that male-female married couples cause cause less loss for insurance companies, so guess what...They get better rates. Marriage (as it currently exists) is a stabilizing force in society, the government has to spend less money in housing and rehabilitating prisoners when society is stable. So why not give a break to the people who keep costs down? Married couples have children, they invest in the future of those children, they generate business for banks. Why not try to convince them to come to YOUR bank instead of the competition?
LK
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
Its amazing to read who people think are responsible for bad ad's. Its always the ad companies fault. I would for an Ad company (global, multinational, yada yada) and while we may be responsible for some bad ads, there are always 2 facts that prevent the making of brilliant, intelligent and funny ad's. Money and Clients. If the client doesn't screw you down on cost, they appear both during the shooting (and suggest their non-creative ideas) and then at post production (and again suggest their non-creative, fucked up ideas) which you try to argue with, but of course seeing they are paying for it, you have to sit there and watch your masterpiece being turned to shit. Until the day that clients hand over the cash and shutup, bad ads are always going to exist.
Its a fact of life. Clients want to be creative and will ignore the advice of a 15yr creative veteran with 40 different global awards and push their fucked up changes. It sucks, but thats the job. Don't like it, then quit. There's always an endless supply of 18yr old creative wannabe's with award school certs wanting to get in. (and if your a really penny punching Ad agency, their free as in beer)
Freudian bullshit. It amazes me that people still say such nonsense, many years after Freud's pseudoscientific crap has been completely disproved.
Here are a couple of good places to start: 1 2.
"Politicians and diapers must be changed often, and for the same reason."
The solution to advertising is education. Educate the consumer about how ads work, about sources of info not from a biased ad or salesman. I don't know about you, but I've had, in the past, three different (English) teachers devote time and resources to projects based on the former of my suggestions.
Also, I think that word of mouth is more complex than you suggest. But I'm too lazy right now to think of a good example. Meh...
According to another article at AdAge.com (the same periodical as the main story comes from):
CINCINNATI (AdAge.com) -- Recent internal research by Procter & Gamble Co. indicates that consumers who fast-forward through ads with digital personal video recorders such as TiVo still recall those ads at roughly the same rates as people who see them at normal speed in real time.
Source: March 17, 2003
Can't link/copy the whole article, because they charge a few $$ for it.
Why pay a million dollars for 30 seconds when you could just get your ad Slashdotted for free?
As with most people who try to justify their subjective opinions, your arguments have very little objective substance.
? opt ion=article&news_id=75), so even if you are right about it being stabalizing, you still have not shown any evidence to suggest homosexual couples are different.
"Actuarial data shows that male-female married couples cause cause less loss for insurance companies, so guess what...They get better rates. "
While it's true that married couples get better rates and may even cause less loss, I'm not sure how this applies to your argument against homosexuality. I don't suppose you have evidence to suggest that male-male or female-female unions cause more loss, do you? All you've shown is that married couples cause less loss than single individuals.
"Marriage (as it currently exists) is a stabilizing force in society"
"stabalizing force" is a rather subjective phrase, don't you think? Stabalizing by whose standards? I mean, divorce rates have generally hung around the same amount (between 40 and 50 percent). Doesn't seem that stabalizing to me. Besides, a recent article published by the University of Washington suggests that homosexual couples have a similar rate of relationship dissolution compared to heterosexual divorce rates (
http://web.psych.washington.edu/news/index.php
Of course, what you really meant to say was that it was destabalizing for you since you don't like seeing men in love with other men, right?
"the government has to spend less money in housing and rehabilitating prisoners when society is stable."
That statement is a no brainer, but again I ask to see your evidence that homosexual couples somehow cause more instability. The most frequent instability I can think of are the crimes commited against them by bigots, but I hardly think it's fair to blame homosexuals for that.
"Married couples have children,..."
Homosexuals can adopt children...
I've only seen that ad once, and it was in a cinema. I've never seen it come on TV, and I even told a few people about it, but I've never seen it come round, or heard back that it has ever been on TV. Clearly it got/gets very few slots, or hasn't been fully released yet (some humourous ad campaigns are run in cinemas first to gauge reaction).
Where did you see it?
mogorific carpentry experiments
Too risque for American TV, the Trojan Games ads have run in the UK.
Anyone wanna actually try that?
Vote for new mod!!! Score:-2,Imbecile
Stupidity can spread like a plague. Unwed highschool-age mothers are flagrantly displaying their stupidity. I wouldn't want a teenage crack addict spending time with my kids either.
... somewhe
SCORE: +3 STUPID +2 IGNORANT.
If you smoke crack, whether you're in highschool or not, it's a bad thing. I'm not saying getting pregnant in high school is good, but I am saying that I wouldn't mind my (hypothetical) 6 year old daughter hanging around a 28 year old responsible pregnant woman. Your logic is aweful.
People get pregnant. It happens. Pregnacny is a beautiful thing. My fiancee and I have a kid on the way (she's 4ish months pregnant). We're both 22, and it seems to be the thing to think that 22 is young to be having a kid. But, we love each other, and we love the kid (already, even before birth).
But, to compare this to crack is... just irresponsible at best, and damaging at worst. Pregnancy is a wonderful thing that has it's place and time. Crack has neither: it destroys lives and relationships. To be facing the pregnancy question a little early, and compare it to crack... are you suggesting that there's a proper time in one's life to smoke crack? That you'd let your kids hang out with crack addicts, as long as they're 30 and married? The longer I type, the less of a point I see in your arguement, and the more pissed off at you I am.
Telling your kids that pregnant people in high school are bad, and you shouldn't hang around them, is a terrible thing to do. Often, girls in this situation need love, appreciation, and support. To cut them off because they're diseased is just wrong on every human level I know of.
It's not possible. You can't marry someone of the same gender anymore than you can murder a dead man. The meaning of the word prevents it from happening.
From the American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, 4th ed.:
MARRIAGE - NOUN: 1a. The legal union of a man and woman as husband and wife. b. The state of being married; wedlock. c. A common-law marriage. d. A union between two persons having the customary but usually not the legal force of marriage: a same-sex marriage.
Look, the arguement is "marriage is blah, special, a sacrement, this, that, the other thing". Fine. Whatever. Call that marriage, and call equal protection for couples under the law "civil union".
The arguement stands like thus:
Conservative Preacher: "Gay marriage would ruin the specialness of marriage"
Gays: "Fine, whatever, don't call it marriage. In the mean time, we have a loving, monomogous relationship, and your laws are costing us a lot of money that we wouldn't have to otherwise pay if we were like you".
Conservative Preacher: "Marriage is defined as being between a man and a woman."
Gays: "Dude. Don't call it marriage if it makes you feel better. Whatever. But, whatever the civil, protected by US law equivilancy is, we'd like to have that".
Conservative Preacher: "Same sexed couples cannot have children on their own, therefore they should not have be entitled to the protections of marriage."
Gays: "How does the ability of two people to have children relate to their home loan interest rate? To their need to pay more taxes? To their need for more expensive health insurance (no children should mean less expensive health insurance)?"
Whatever. Every arguement I've heard against gay marriage goes back to the definition of marriage, which is defined in an anti-gay religious sense. However, somehow this has been extended to the law, and it's just stupid. There are 2 parts to a union-between-two-people. One is the part that the church, god, and your parents will recognize. The other is the one that the IRS, blue cross/blue shield, and Century21 will recognize. All that most gay people want is the 2nd part, and they're even willing to not call it marriage, opting for calling it what it really is, a "civil" (or having to do with the law) "union" (partnership of two people).
sig?
Thank you, sir, for having something insightful and well thought out to say. I appreciate your comment, and am putting you on my "friends" list, unlike the parent poster, who is already on my "foe" list (see other comment in this thread).
I appreciate your words.
~Will
sig?
Lots'o bad guys won't tell if you're out of line until afterwards and then you're hurting. Think society like a big bully which for most of time acts predictably, lays the rules for others and goes '..or else I'll smack ya'.
You're free to do anything, just beware the bully. Stay out of it's sight, distract it and you'll be fine. Only stupid ones get bruised.
Preserve old classics: copy your collection onto all hard drives.
The reason is that Americans still regard the BBC as the ultimate broadcasting organisation, and if it is OK for the BBC to broadcast, it must be OK to screen it to a US audience. In fact, if it has been shown on the BBC, that means that it is of such outstandingly good quality, that all Americans should be strapped to their favourite reclining chair in front of the TV and made to watch it.
Of course, UK audiences would rather watch "Friends".....
Donte Alistair Anderson Roberts - hi son!
Karma: Chameleon
"Married couples have children,..."
Homosexuals can adopt children...
I'm married, and my wife and I have no intention of having children. We're now entering the stage of life where it's too late to have kids, so I doubt we'll ever reproduce. Sorry, LK, but "Married couples have children,..." is no argument. Try "Many married couples have children" and avoid pigeon-holing us heteros as much as you love pigeon-holing non-heteros.
"Marriage" means a joining, as does "wedding". It's usually applied to man-woman matrimonial ceremoneis, but not exclusively.
Ceci n'est pas un sig.
In the land of the free press most of the free press (bar CNN) wont accept advertising thats unpatriotic or critical of corporate greed. They use bogus excuses about it being too discursive and issue orientated - crap like that.
Fact is corporate America gets its butt kissed by the press it gives advertising money to; not surprising but certainly hypocritical.
And the press doesnt want to piss off an unelected thug like Bush, well OK, elected by the Supreme Court if not the people.
... but play one here in /. ....
I have not seen the ad.
Needless to say most of the polite audience here has no idea what we are talking about (Becks? Posh? Pom?).
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
It's morning here, and as I started reading "people upset because they won't get commercials" I figured I had gotten it all wrong and so I read it again.
And again.
Now, I know I'm gonna get stomped down for being a communist or something, but if I were you, I'd be quite happy not to get flooded by any more mindless brainwash designed to turn us all into happy Consumers than we already are!
We do not need commercials to tell us what we need.
I'm pretty sure I've seen a short version of the 'cog' ad, probably a 30 second version. Not sure if its just the tail end of the full ad or another smart edit. This removes the 'cant afford 120s ad slot' excuse.
Of course, maybe its not a US model car....
Marriage is now equated in many peoples mind with a "license" to fuck someone
Remember, a wife isn't a special case in a rape suit. Not that that's a problem, except the definition of ``rape'' in California basically covers any sexual act a woman regrets and can prove.
Overall, I think there's something wrong with this country...I just can't quite put my finger on it.
-- The world is watching America, and America is watching TV.
"Only a U.K. marketer would endorse such a loser as a brand spokesman -- and let him explain sex explicitly to a 4-year-old"
Nice comment from the journalist on the Ad site. I would prefer to see it as the British having a self deprecating sense of humour and that we don't rely on seeing perfect looking people to boost our own self worth if we buy the product.
That 10th entry on the AdAge site... the one about American actors... and they do very specifically state American actors.
Now, take a look at the picture chosen to illustrate the point. Mr James Bond himself, the dashingly handsome (git) Pierce Brosnan. I'm sure the last time I looked, he was Irish.
Sheila Broflovski: Just remember what the MPAA says: Horrific, deplorable violence is okay, as long as people don't say any naughty words!
Here you go... appears to be an official site for their ads, and it's got the "Honda" one:
http://www.the118118experience.com/
It's available at http://www.thenumber118118.com/flash/video/hondaad .mpg
"The invisible and the non-existent look very much alike." -- Delos B. McKown
The US dept of human services and health is currently delaying the screening of some important pro-breastfeeding ads due to sensitivities raised by the formula industry! While the US continues to contravene the World Health Organisation code by allowing formula ads in the first place! In virtually *no* other country in the world is infant formula allowed to be advertised due to the demonstrable and well documented risks associated with its promotion. The AAP was strongly in favour of the ads, but after a few private reports from some well heeled interests they seem to have changed their stance! Why bitch about missing a few items of trash when some gernuinely useful content is being canned? See bfnews.blogspot.com/ for more.
1.) we're getting married. 2.) we love each other 3.) it's society that says having a child out of wedlock is bad, not my morals.
My morals are sound. I know where I stand, I stand beside my fiancee all the way. I would have preferred we'd been married before she got pregnant, but honestly, I'm thrilled to death now anyway.
I have no moral qualms. All of my morals agree with each other, it's people like my parent poster's comments that make me think "this is one of those people who claim to love everyone and yet despise anyone who doesn't fit into his worldview".
sig?
How do we get more commercials banned here? AFAICT, the higher a firm is on the list of "top advertising agencies", the worse their stuff is. Can we get the Top 20's entire output on the bad list? Pleeeeze?
:-/ )
(BTW my grandfather was in advertising, and I'm not against *all* ad.s, just the ludicrous / insulting / insane / repellent / inscrutable or otherwise counterproductive ones. IOW 90% of modern advertising.
"To this day we segregate girls who get pregnant in highschool"
Ostracized, yes. Discriminated against probably. But Segregated? I'd like to see some evidence of a junior high/ high school in the US that actually segragates pregnant teens.
There was a time historically where kids were segragated in US schools for a number of reasons, but I'm not sure that "segragation" happens anymore. The only example I can think of is people who are moderately to severely mentally retarded, and even then there are significant laws in place to protect these students.
jeff
or for another funny clip about a K car - check out this reliant racing against a toyota supra - crowd reaction is funny (its zipped, so have to save 1st)
If you replace all words 'nigger' in Blazing Saddles with beeps, the movie would sound like a bird concerto. On the other hand, if you replace it with 'person of african-american origin', it would probably run an hour longer.
I could likely get a new cable channel funded by just mentioning that was my slogan. Really, the male genetalia is an evolutionary afterthought ... just look at it ... or don't.
When a woman flashes the kitty in public it's sexy. If a man tries the same thing it's disturbing and will likely be laughed at.
This message brought to you by the Homophobic-Men-For-More-Naked-Women-on-TV Society.
you're all figments of my deranged imagination
It should be more like 5E+50 (that's a 5 followed by 50 zeros -- near enough to a zillion that we ought to just say "let's mod this up to a zillion"...)
This space intentionally left (almost) blank.
I have a 2 months old son. A couple of weeks ago, the little fellow got really hungry while we were at the mall. So, we sat down and she covered herself with a light blanket (she's really shy) and started breastfeeding him. Still, a bit of her breast showed (didn't want to smother the baby).
An elderly couple walked by, looked at her and stopped, shock in their eyes. Then the woman started berating my wife for her "indecendy".
I went ballistic. Really. I stood up and shouted at her. Her husband tried to intervene, and I started screaming profanity at him until they escaped in fear. I'd never felt such a rush in my life. It was magnificent.
My wife was mad at me for two days for "making a scene".
I'm not sure what my point is. I guess I just needed to share. Thanks.
also used this name in the movie - look at the piano being played during Big Gay Al's USO Show number.
"Time is an abstract concept devised by carbon-based lifeforms to monitor their ongoing decay." - Thundercleese
... and the shopping mall owners can be sued for it. Your local La Leche League - a breastfeeding information organization - can provide you with information to help combat the practice of stigmatizing breastfeeding.
Sean
I don't think homosexuality needs to be rewarded with tax breaks. After all, homosexual marriages do not contribute to the population (and thus to the economy). So I think fags and lezzies should be able to get married, but they should still pay the same taxes and have separate medical insurance. And god forbid allowing them to adopt children. We don't need any more kids with screwed up psychology here.
It sounds interesting (especially the magnet-for-uranium bit). Could you perhaps recommend a source for this?
They're thinking of opening up a coal burning plant or two for various reasons roughly where I am, so I'm interested to find out more about it.
After all, homosexual marriages do not contribute to the population (and thus to the economy)
An interesting stance. I have a young daughter. My girlfriend (we're not married) gave up work towards the end of her pregnancy to look after her.
Since that time, four years ago, she's been contributing less to the economy in terms of taxes, work done, etc than she would have been had she not given up work. (She has had part time jobs, but nothing like a full-time career)
She wants to go back to work once our daughter is in full-time education, but that's not going to happen for at least another year, possibly more. meanwhile, our daughter won't be contributing to the economy for another 12 years at least.
On the other hand, gay and lesbian couples, as you so insightfully point out, can't ahve children naturally, and have an extremely hard time adopting. That leaves both members free to work, contribute to the economy and pay lots of taxes.
So, if your reasons are purely economic, you really ought to be in favour of same-sex marriages.
It's official. Most of you are morons.
([P]rerecorded video tapes rented from Blockbuster) [don't] have an established usage pattern (fast-forwarding through commercials) that conflicts with the behavior of the DVDs.
Really? So how many people don't fast-forward through the FBI warning and the trailers on US VHS tapes? I think the issue here is that the DVD Video restrictions are annoying, but not annoying enough to be a medium-killer the way Circuit City's DIVX license-managed DVD format was.
...when you're writing a game...tweak the difficulty of "Easy" to something [your mother] can cope with. -- onion2k
Often, girls in this situation need love, appreciation, and support. To cut them off because they're diseased is just wrong on every human level I know of.
Except on the level of a parent who wants to protect his children from stupidity. Sure, girls who find themselves pregnant at 16 need love and support, but not at the expense of my child.
Call that marriage, and call equal protection for couples under the law "civil union".
I have no problem with that, as long as no one is forced to treat it the same as a marriage. People have the right to give next of kin status to whomever they choose. Same sex partners should have the right to inherit property or make medical decisions. This is not a problem, it's only fair; But it is not a marriage.
Whatever. Every arguement I've heard against gay marriage goes back to the definition of marriage, which is defined in an anti-gay religious sense. However, somehow this has been extended to the law, and it's just stupid.
Most of our laws have their roots in Judeo/Christian/Islamic morality. We can't steal, we can't murder, and we can't bear false witness without facing the criminal justice. In some places your can't screw your neighbor's wife without facing civil justice.
Have fun defining the world in your ever-so-righteous view of right and wrong, but please, do the rest of the world a favor, and don't talk to my kids.
God forbid someone tries to expose your future children to ethics and morality. Well, I'm sure there will be all kinds of unwed teenage mothers that you can get your kids to keep company with.
The longer I sit here and think and type and preview this comment, the more sure I am that I hope to never meet you in life, nor that you introduce yourself or your belief system to my kids.
There are millions of people just like me. Anyone of them will be just as good.
And Fuck You for comparing my unwed fiancee's "problem" of pregnancy to smoking crack.
Is your fiance' out of high school? Did she drop out of high school because of her pregnancy? Is her pregnancy going to ruin her life, in the way that becoming a crack addict would?
Quite bitching. You know what I was talking about.
If you had said that to my face, I'd have flattened you.
I don't doubt that you might have tried, but the question lies with whether or not you'd have been successful. I'm too old for fist fights.
LK
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
While it's true that married couples get better rates and may even cause less loss, I'm not sure how this applies to your argument against homosexuality.
I'm not arguing against homosexuality. I'm pointing out why heterosexuals get certain benefits.
I mean, divorce rates have generally hung around the same amount (between 40 and 50 percent). Doesn't seem that stabalizing to me.
That's a misleading figure. 70-80% of first time marriages last. The people who are married multiple times are the ones who skew the statistics. Larry King and Richard Pryor have been been divorced enough times that it would take over 20 successful marriages to make for a 50% success rate.
Of course, what you really meant to say was that it was destabalizing for you since you don't like seeing men in love with other men, right?
I have no problem with people loving whomever they choose. I just have a problem with one small group pressuring the rest of society into altering one of its most fundamental institutions in the name of diversity.
LK
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
the only joy greater than agitating a nerd to the point where he provides you with "research" (aka links 2 and 3 from a google search), is causing him to do so when you're not even being serious
If I could make this sig kill you, I would.
Actually no. As I understand it, in the UK you can be guilty of slander (or libel) even if what you say is factually true, but the telling of it causes injury to someone.
In the US that isn't possible. As long as you can show you have a reasonable reason to believe that what you're saying is true, you're covered.
Don't talk rubbish. To prove slander or libel you have to prove two things: that the statement in question is both untrue and damaging to one's reputation.
If I say that someone is a liar and a cheat, then I am not committing slander if they have been shown to be a liar and a cheat. So, I can can safely call the sprinter Ben Johnson a liar and a cheat because he did indeed lie and cheat. He could try to sue me for either slander (if the allegation is spoken) or libel (if it is written) but as it can be proven that he did lie and cheat he'd get laughed out of court.
Next time, perhaps you should engage your brain before you suggest that accurate reporting of the facts can be considered actionable.
"Accept that some days you are the pigeon, and some days you are the statue." - David Brent, Wernham Hogg
Paying taxes NOW is on the micro-scale of things. Making babies who will pay taxes when you become a burden for the economy (that is, when you retire and burn through most of your savings) is more significant.
Let's be honest here. I'm more interested in your implied meaning. It's called reading between the lines. You had no real reason to post that argument except to imply that homosexual couplings would cost more to insurance companies or just be more "destabalizing." So far, you have yet to show any evidence to support either of those claims. Most of what you have said has been personal opinion so far.
"That's a misleading figure. 70-80% of first time marriages last."
http://www.divorcereform.org/rates.html
from that site:
"The National Center for Health Statistics recently released a report which found that 43
percent of FIRST MARRIAGES end in separation or divorce within 15 years. The study is based on
the National Survey of Family Growth, a nationally representative sample of women age 15 to
44 in 1995."
Now, unless you have other evidence to support your claims, my argument still stands.
"I just have a problem with one small group pressuring the rest of society into altering one of its most fundamental institutions in the name of diversity."
I just have a problem with one group thinking it's ok to deny equal rights to another (even a minority) based on speculation and personal opinion with very little hard evidence.
Again, you're using subjective opinions to make your point. "fundamental institution" to whom? Not everyone sees marriage the same way you do. In reality, most people who have this argument are talking about the religious definition vs. the basic civil union. Most people in support of homosexuals are talking about the civil union because that's the only legal version that comes with benefits. They could care less about the religious aspects.
You had no real reason to post that argument except to imply that homosexual couplings would cost more to insurance companies or just be more "destabalizing." So far, you have yet to show any evidence to support either of those claims. Most of what you have said has been personal opinion so far.
How about this?
Here's a quote CONCLUSION: In a major Canadian centre, life expectancy at age 20 years for gay and bisexual men is 8 to 20 years less than for all men. If the same pattern of mortality were to continue, we estimate that nearly half of gay and bisexual men currently aged 20 years will not reach their 65th birthday.
I concede that this study only focuses on men from one geographic region.
In fact, in some areas it may be worse, this documentary shows this.
LK
"Hi. This is my friend, Jack Shit, and you don't know him." - Lord Kano
1. Your argument is only true for male couples. Any 2-bit lesbian can scrounge up the cash for a sperm shake from the sperm bank.
:)
2. When babies start being grown in labs, non-identical genetic "cloning" will allow gay males to reproduce.
3. Allowing affluent gays to adopt would help our economy be more productive by ensuring that unwanted children got the care they needed to become productive members of society -- not the prisoners, drug addicts, and mental health patients that the poor heterosexuals keep popping out at alarming rates.
The fact is, it's not government's job to push children on people for tax purposes. There should be no marriage penalty OR benefit. There should be no child penalty OR benefit. But then... it's crap like this that makes me favor a national sales tax and eliminating marriage as a civil matter altogether.
-l
(single, full-time father)
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It appears you didn't read the follow up in the same journal which specifically comments on people trying to draw the same conclusions you are from their article..
You would see a few interesting quotes:
"Under even the most liberal assumptions, gay and bisexual men in this urban centre were experiencing a life expectancy similar to that experienced by men in Canada in the year 1871. In contrast, if we were to repeat this analysis today the life expectancy of gay and bisexual men would be greatly improved. Deaths from HIV infection have declined dramatically in this population since 1996. As we have previously reported there has been a threefold decrease in mortality in Vancouver as well as in other parts of British Columbia."
and conveniently enough considering your previous arguments, this:
"Death is a product of the way a person lives and what physical and environmental hazards he or she faces everyday. It cannot be attributed solely to their sexual orientation or any other ethnic or social factor. If estimates of an individual gay and bisexual man's risk of death is truly needed for legal or other purposes, then people making these estimates should use the same actuarial tables that are used for all other males in that population. Gay and bisexual men are included in the construction of official population-based tables and therefore these tables for all males are the appropriate ones to be used."
If you want a popular source, read John McPhee's Rising From The Plains, a book about Wyoming and John Love, a USGS geologist. As McPhee and Love were touring parts of Wyoming, Love pointed out areas of discolored coal and identified them as uranium concentrations. As dry as the topic sounds, McPhee does an excellent job of making it an engrossing read.
Thanks for the pointers. I'll go and check it out.
It is well acted, edited, and the acted responses come out "cool and casual"!
When the (quite beautiful) woman realizes her error; she just raises her eyebrows!
Remember, it is NOT set in USA!
.
(David Bowman, EVA near HUGE Monolithic Win-PC in orbit around Jupiter) "My God - its full of Malware!"