Slashdot Mirror
Armed Dolphins Released Into Gulf of Mexico
An anonymous reader writes "The Guardian is reporting on what may be the weirdest Hurricane Katrina story yet. Military trained dolphins may have been released into the wild by the Hurricane's devastation." From the article: "Experts who have studied the U.S. navy's cetacean training exercises claim the 36 mammals could be carrying 'toxic dart' guns. Divers and surfers risk attack, they claim, from a species considered to be among the planet's smartest. The U.S. navy admits it has been training dolphins for military purposes, but has refused to confirm that any are missing. Dolphins have been trained in attack-and-kill missions since the Cold War. The U.S. Atlantic bottlenose dolphins have apparently been taught to shoot terrorists attacking military vessels. Their coastal compound was breached during the storm, sweeping them out to sea. But those who have studied the controversial use of dolphins in the U.S. defence programme claim it is vital they are caught quickly."
What could be the porpoise of arming these creatures?
Before we starting carping on the ineptitude of our navy, I think we should more carefully exsalmon the situation - they may not be solely at fault. Perhaps Katrina is just a red herring here, and these killer dolphins have been floundering around for months. Maybe some deranged fool let them loose just for the halibut. Whoever is responsible should have their head on a pike.
We just send out the robot sharks to killed the armed dolphins. Then we send out the exploding whales to take out the robot sharks.
I, for one, welcome our new dolphin overlords.
All I asked for are some frickin' sharks with frickin' laser beams on their heads!!
Thanks for all the fish!
blah blah laser
blah blah welcome new overlords
blah blah cluster of these
blah blah blah blah
Frickaseein' wabbits
I am a leaf on the wind
Best first post ever.
So long and thanks for all the toxic darts..
Holy crap flipper just killed my entire family.
On a serious note I say the answer is to just buy a bunch of six packs of beer, drink em and then toss the can rings into the ocean. TV has told me this will kill all manner of marine life. TV is seldom innacurate.
What about the sharks with lasers on their heads? Were they at different facilities?
--- -- - -
Give me LIBERTY, or give me a check.
Doesn't the Navy have some sort of tracking system for their dolphins...? I'd assume so at least.
In 1972/2005 a crack commando unit was sent to prison by a military court/accidentally released into the wild for a crime they didn't commit/by a hurricane.
These men/dolphins promptly escaped from a maximum security stockade/maximum security pool to the Los Angeles/Texas underground.
Today, still wanted by the government, they survive as soldiers of fortune. If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them, maybe you can hire the A-Team.
Warning - will work for mackerel.
I am a leaf on the wind
RUN FOR YOUR LIVES! Someone, find a shark to save me!
I don't get it.
In other news today, Dr. Evil has issued a reward for the return of his precious aquatic minions
This sounds like a plot right out of a B sci-fi action movie; the kind where you go, "nah, that can't happen".
Table-ized A.I.
Simpsons already did it.
- You know, I have one simple request. And that is to have sharks with frickin' laser beams attached to their heads! Now evidently my cycloptic colleague informs me that that cannot be done. Ah, would you remind me what I pay you people for, honestly? Throw me a bone here! What do we have? ...Right.
- Dolphins.
-
- They're US Navy dolphins.
- Do they have frickin' dart guns attached to their heads?
- Absolutely.
- Oh well, that's a start.
Wouldn't dolphins with toxic darts be natural enemies of sharks with laser beams? Our only hope would seem to be if they fight and mutually destroy one another. If they should band together... may god help us all...
"But I trust in the people's capacity for reflection, rage and rebellion." -Oscar Olivera
Which is the most stupid ?
The more Slashdot posts articles with such poor premise, especially the these pseudo-science tin-hat articles, the less I read Slashdot.
And every military aircraft that flies 'could be' carrying nuclear weapons.
But they arent.
Will the dolphins come back from active duty with Great Barrier Reef Syndrome and attempt suicide by swimming into plastic beer can holders?
In the communication, Skippy confirmed that he and the other dolphins were indeed armed, declared himself and his compatriots "freedom fighters" for an organization called the "Cetacean Liberation Front" or "CTF", and demanded that all other wrongfully imprisoned cetaceans be released immediately, or the group would initiate hostilities against surfers, SCUBA divers, and windsurfers.
The following is a transcript of this communication:
At this point, the administration still has issued no official statement concerning this situation.
____
~ |rip/\/\aster /\/\onkey
The article says they could be dangerous "if equipped with special harnesses carrying toxic darts." There is nothing to indicate that there is any evidence that they were armed. Think about it: with a Category 5 hurricane coming their way with days of warning they are going to leave them armed?
Someone is fear mongering.
... for April Fools jokes?
Flipper! Flipper!
He'll Dart you Faster than lightning
No Dolphin you see
Has more bloodlust than he
Thank the Navy! Navy!
For this stupendous new blunder
stalking there under...
under the sea!
Performing sanity checks on your own beliefs is vital in avoiding poisoned koolaid.
and thanks for all the guns.
Don't Crease the Weasel!
how the heck dolphins knows who is a terrorist? and if they are trained since the cold war, they are trained to kill comunists... now...how the heck dolphins knows who is a communist?
I agree they have too much money but this story is a complete and total load of crap.
"...and yet, I blame society" Duke - Repo Man
I heard about 6 other dolphins from the area that got free and they found all 6 hanging out as close as they could get to their former pen.
just because your a schizophrenic doesn't mean people arn't really out to get you
But those who have studied the controversial use of dolphins in the U.S. defence programme claim it is vital they are caught quickly.
I think they fear the notion of these dolphins training other dolphins to attack humans.
Buy Steampunk Clothing Online!
"Experts who have studied the U.S. navy's cetacean training exercises claim the 36 mammals could be carrying 'toxic dart' guns."
Right, because the dolphins would be equipped, locked and loaded when held (i.e., not engaged in training exercises) in "their coastal compound."
Oh wait, I forgot to put on my tin foil hat.
There we go... Egads!!! I must now cancel my scuba trip in the Gulf!
Ahem...trained to shoot terrorists?! Is part of their plan to break our collective will coordinated attacks on Sea World and the nation's beaches?
"Sir, Officer Toodles noticed that you were wearing an especially bulky overcoat this July..."
Are you trying to tell me that these dolphins are sitting around in their tanks with 'toxic dart' guns attached to them AT ALL TIMES? Do they shoot these darts from their asses? I can believe that maybe there are trained dolphins, and maybe they escaped, but that they can shoot unsuspecting divers with toxic dart guns?
Please. What a craptastic, misleading headline for Slashdot. I don't comment much here on Slashdot but in the name of all that is holy, who posts this crap?
At least it's not a dupe, yet.
There's something about them. They make you institutionalized. At first you hate them. Then you learn to live with them. And before you know it, you find yourself depending on them.
"And you should've seen the one that got away!"
Table-ized A.I.
I for one welco... Never mind.
I don't think the dolphins are equipped with their arms while living in the holding tanks. Such weapons, if they still exist, would be typically strapped on at the beginning of a patrol.
I smell some fear-mongering here
from the article:
"Usually dolphins were controlled via signals transmitted through a neck harness. 'The question is, were these dolphins made secure before Katrina struck?' said Sheridan."
Is this to imply that these dolphins aren't relying on their friendly master's familiar scent or unique vocal pattern?? Their friendly master might not be friendly at all, and just a computer operated by a human, and any human at that!
I must find these dolphins.
"Conn, sonar! We have an unidentified contact, bearing three-five-niner, range unknown!"
"What the hell? That sounds really weird... I never heard anything that quiet, but yet surely, there's something th---"
"DARTS IN THE WATER! Incoming darts!"
Next day:
An American Sub Sunk During Routine Exercises
The DoD still hasn't released any detailes about the incident, although they have confirmed that a Seawolf class submarine took a hit from an unknown weapon during a routince training exercise in the northern part of the Atlantic. It is speculated that the submarine was wrongly identified as a terrorist vessel by a squadron of the Dolphin Anti-Terrorist Task force. The Departament of Defense refused to comment.
This is a sig. It is appended to the end of comments I post.
Meanwhile, I think these dolphins will head for the nearest node in the global grid system, gather a bunch of other dolphins together and plan the downfall of our corrupt leaders. It's a joke...
Mongrel News all the news that fits and froths
Dolphins will soon rule the world.
:)
Oh well, I guess there are worse ways to go. At least we won't be ruled by catfish. They are some ugly motherfuckers.
The price is always right if someone else is paying.
Huh. How'd they do that?
I hope they didn't do it in the same way the Russian army taught dogs to drop satchel charges under German tanks. You see, they used Russian tanks to train them. So when they got into battle with the Germans, what did the dogs do when given live, armed satchel charges? Delivered them right under Russian tanks, of course. That plan was rather quickly abandoned.
The US Army hasn't faired much better; they armed bats with incendiary devices- the plan was that, release from a plane over Japan, they'd find refuged in building overhangs and whanot. They were kept calm by refridgeration. So during one of the trial runs (incidentally, the first trial run with live ammo), some genius decides they need a picture of the bats. It's pitch dark, so the photographer uses a flash. Which not only wakes up the bats, but startles them as well...
...and as they say, "hilarity ensued."
Please help metamoderate.
I was watching a show on this the other day. Apparently the dolphins are trained as if it is a game. When they kill for real they are traumatized by it and become useless to the navy at that point. Unfortunately they have no better means of dealing with underwater demolitions teams than tricking fun-loving creatures into becoming murderers.
"I'm not impatient. I just hate waiting." - My Dad
General Lance Lord, we need you!
General "Ohhh, so now you like our dolphin jamming satellites!"
It was Gil. He was feeling Blue, because he found his wife perched with his walleyed neighbor. But the wife was such a sucker. It turned out that the neighbor was more of a minnow rather than a bass.
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
What's next? Crack-addled dolphins?
And this is better than dolphins with mines strapped to their heads?
LongTail SSH Brute Force analysis tool is here!
Articles like this weren't poluting the front page. Honestly, if it's a slow news day, it's a slow news day.
What, no sea bass with lasers ?
It's a perfectly valid opinion shared my many people, and if you disagree, that's no reason to mark it flamebait.
HOW did this get marked informative, when at best, you are funny (though not really). Just out of curiosity, would you know who that A.C. is that it running around and knocking one editor and trying to replace him with you?
I prefer the "u" in honour as it seems to be missing these days.
It's like when the dolphins exile humans to the sea in the Simpsons when their king dolphin escapes from SeaWorld.
This calls for one thing...
We gotta start setting up more beach volleyball nets.
I hate to say I told you so, but...
"It may be the oddest tale to emerge from the aftermath of Hurricane Katrina. Armed dolphins, trained by the US military to shoot terrorists and pinpoint spies underwater, may be missing in the Gulf of Mexico."
hmm, lotta "mays" there... Let's see who it is making the claims...
Experts who have studied the US navy's cetacean training exercises claim the 36 mammals could be carrying 'toxic dart' guns. Divers and surfers risk attack, they claim, from a species considered to be among the planet's smartest.
"Experts"? What "experts"? Who says they are? What makes them an "expert"? What are their qualifications? And this isn't something they know, they're just "claiming" it's possible. Oh, OK, it's on the internet, it must be true...
The US Atlantic bottlenose dolphins have apparently been taught to shoot terrorists attacking military vessels. Their coastal compound was breached during the storm, sweeping them out to sea. But those who have studied the controversial use of dolphins in the US defence programme claim it is vital they are caught quickly.
"Apparently" - more conjecture. The compound was breached and they were swept to sea, the article claims, yet without any corroboration yet. So they *know* this? Or they are just stating it as a fact that you, the gullible reader, wants to believe, wants to trust in? Hey, it makes for a great story, right?!?
"Leo Sheridan, 72, a respected accident investigator who has worked for government and industry, said he had received intelligence from sources close to the US government's marine fisheries service confirming dolphins had escaped."
Oh, I'm sorry! "Leo" said so, and he worked for the gov't in some nebulous capacity, so you *know* you can trust him, right!?! And, even if he's not "experts", well, he is an "expert", right? And we aren't really concerned with that sort of thing - what's it called - um, "accuracy" - here in this story are we? Anyway, we have to know that Leo is right and just and honest, especially since he has "sources", and we all know that anonymous sources are unimpeachable, a la the NYT, a paragon of reporting honesty and non-bias. Just like the Guardian is, apparently...
"'My concern is that they have learnt to shoot at divers in wetsuits who have simulated terrorists in exercises. If divers or windsurfers are mistaken for a spy or suicide bomber and if equipped with special harnesses carrying toxic darts, they could fire,' he said."
What a great guy Leo is! He is "concerned" - that is, he doesn't know this to be true, it just worries him. What a wonderful person, to be worrying about all those folks he doesn't know who might possibly - if the story is true, and if a dolphin has a harness on (yet another unconfirmed, conjectural supposition) and if that dolphin thinks this stranger to Leo is a terrorist then the dolphin might put said stranger to sleep and they might not be found for hours and might die. OMG! It's almost certain!!!
Let's hope the dolphins were made secure before the storm, because we don't have a clue if they were or not, just like we don't have a clue even if they are out there, just like we don't have a clue if they are that they might be wearing harnesses with supposed toxic darts that, just like we don't have a clue they might even use against some innocent! But man, what a hell of a military bashing story this is! w00t!
"The mystery surfaced when a separate group of dolphins was washed from a commercial oceanarium on the Mississippi coast during Katrina. Eight were found with the navy's help, but the dolphins were not returned until US navy scientists had examined them."
Oh, those nasty nasty military guys! You know they are always up to some bad, bad purpose! Be very careful if you ever see one! They carry guns, some of them! Yeesh!
Well, if the Navy Dolphins have been released, there can be only one solution... There is ony one team that can bring them back.
...
We must release the Navy Seals
(Sorry, had to be said)
Good security is based upon reality and common sense. Common sense is a function of having common knowledge.
This is the most brilliant thing you've ever seen here?
Resisting my immediate Pythonesque urge to say "No, it isn't." and start an argument (the long course), I thought about that.
I guess that might make Slashdot the antithesis of the US Air Force then. Their slogan is "aim high". Slashdots might be "aim low and keep sinking" (as far as particularly sharp witticisms go).
Obviously, this post just proves the point. My IronyDetector(TM) is in overload mode.
Anyway, I don't seal what the big flapper is about this cod-forsakenly-bad humour. This isn't the funniest bit since Noah's shark. And we keep hoping it dolphin ish up soon. Further posts could make folks crabby. You'd have to be a strange manta want more. It's an eel impulse, I tell you. Perch the thought!
(Okay, that was a poor copy of the original few, who used up most of the good seafood...)
-- Mal: "Well they tell you: never hit a man with a closed fist. But it is, on occasion, hilarious."
So basically, some marine biologist read "Ender's Game," and wrote a really good budget proposal....
"Ladies and gentlemen, my killbot features Lotus Notes and a machine gun. It is the finest available."
First the plauge carrying mice disappear, and now dolphins with dart guns might have gotten loose. Maybe we are the third smartest species and they're just building up their arsenal....
What does this button do...
Ok, who the hell has been playing with the moderation? How is that +5, informative?
This article has some of the worst moderation ever - of course, many people are avoiding it, but that's no excuse.
...the dolphins are trained to kill insturgeons.
(sorry!)
"A week in the lab saves an hour in the library"
Lucky for the Koreans that specs for their new combat robots don't require operation underwater - the US have that. Rule Dolphtainia! Dolphtania rules the waves!
A few summers back I was in San Francisco taking a boat tour of the bay and as our boat was passing some naval facility (SPAWARS?), the guide mentioned that facility was training dolphins. Someone then asked why the hell the navy would spend a great deal of money to train dolphins? The guide informed us that the dolphins were trained to swim around US Naval Vessels and if a scuba diver came within a certain proximity of the boat the dolphines would ram the diver in the ribs and neck and force him/her to surface whereupon they would then be shot. I dont know how this dude knows but it certainly provides for a great mental picture of flipper beating the shit out of the most suprised saboteur ever.
Open source is the difference between trust and anti-trust
...dolphins arm you.
--Friends don't let friends do frames.
Missing info from the article: The dolphins are wearing a necklace that hold their guns. These guns are fired by brain waves, at the dolphin's will. The device is powered by cold fusion, wich have been developed in secrecy by the US Navy for more than 5 years now. Saying so, the dolphins are extremelly valuable as the necklace power may be endless. Also it is confirmed that some retired KGB agents that were living in New Orleans are already in possession of the cold fusions plans and in their way to mother soviet russia and China. We are all doomed.
Bring on the "friggin' lasers" jokes.
-David
...that even if this program exists, that the 'toxic dart' guns are permanently attached to the dolphins or that someone left them attached during the hurricane?
I would like to be the first to say welcome to our bottle-nosed overlords!!
Waiting for you by the bridge
Is it april 1st already?
The U.S. Atlantic bottlenose dolphins have apparently been taught to shoot terrorists attacking military vessels.
Ahem. . . isn't a key part of the definition of the term "terrorist" that they attack civilian targets?
Or have we officially redefined the term to include anyone who attacks an American anything under any circumstances, ever?
Pull the old lasers on the head schtic, but man, this is actually kinda scarry.
I mean really, no moral tirade about fuzzy, well squeeky cute animals etc.
But the question I have is how LONG will they go uncaptured, I mean is this something we need to worry about for a year or two ?
And better yet who has the fire button ? Flipper himself ?
I had no luck with the sea bass...
There have been stories about the marine mammal program before, and regular fights with animal rights groups. It is no longer classified though, so anyone can go find out plenty of information at the project's official website. You can also check out their FAQ. It pretty clearly states that dolphins and sea lions are only used for marking and tagging, and that they are not used offensively since they can't really distinguish friendly forces and foes. It seems some people still refuse to give up on speculation however.
Anyway, I seriously doubt that dolphins are being used with poison darts, since the Navy seems to prefer using sea lions now (They don't need storage pools, work better in tight areas like harbors and piers, and tolerate more varying temperatures). And even if there *were* poison dart weilding dolphins, why on earth would they be left armed while at a training facility during a storm?
It's worse than that! They are under cover!
in that vein of course the only way to deal with dolphins with dart guns IS of course sharks with frickin' lasers
I forgot what that stood for! Come to think of it, when do you capture the flag in counter-strike? I think you've been playing CS a little too little.
I have freaks! I did something right...
It's just like my crazy neighbor always said "one day the government will have sharks fighting for them, ... yah!"
"with lazer-beams... yah!"
"that shoot from their eyes!..... yah!"
Am no fek Buddhist, but this is enlightenment.
Hundreds of Tuna Fishermen have been killed from unknown toxins..
Now THATS dolphin safe tuna.
The road between democracy and tyranny is paved with secrecy in the name of security.
Somebody heard them say
"So long and thanks for all the fish"
I welcome our new dolphin overloards, until we get hungry and eat them or they strangle themselves on 6pack can fasteners.
All Hail King Snorky
F7 doesn't work, ignore spelling and grammar
I for one welcome our bored readers
Like my mother always said, "It's all fun and games until the government-trained killer aquatic mammals wind up in the hands of your country's enemies."
(Man, that was pretty prescient of her ...)
So long, and thanks for screwing up AvantSlash (again) with your CSS ...
S
Reminds me of "The Incredible Mr. Limpet" (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0058230/)
Really though, this could be interesting...
Is that you John Wayne? Is this me?
Shop as usual. And avoid panic buying.
I don't know what's funnier, the EEEEEEEEeeEEEEeee eeeEEE or the fact that you have a +5 Informative. Mods eating tuna?
Saskboy's blog is good. 9 out of 10 dentists agree.
I haven't read anyone writing in this thread one word about how sick this actually is.
HELLO!
Let's summarize here, so humans are born into this universe and found other species in their proximity...and SOMEHOW between being born and now found ethical justifications to train another species with no vote of it's own to KILL other beings for the very purposes of the human beings themselves??!!!!
If i had a huge alarm right now with a _BIG RED FLASHING LIGHT_...i would certainly turn it on _RIGHT NOW_ !!!
I know in WWII dogs were trained to carry explosives and sneak under tanks to detonate themselves under the tanks, to my opinion that's pretty much the same kind of thing as the above, so i know this isn't new, but that's _NOT_ the point, i just cannot fathom what this must say about human kind or at the very least about the people who justify this or cooporate with this.
Suppose every race/species in the universe had a story and that story would start with being born into this universe, then humans would have at some point _NOT ONLY_ have a chapter of the fase they killed eachother(or other races), they'd _NOT ONLY_ have a chapter where they killed other species, they'd also have a chapter where they trained other species to kill "for them".
This seems to me so much like a host race training a slave species to kill for them, while the slave species has no voice in this neither might it not know what it's doing, which the host species uses/exploits to it's very own advantage.
If we not radically self-reflect here, be it on thinking, ideology, conduct, ethics etc etc, then there is no telling what chapter will be next.
We're here in this(universe) with other species...to me this feels like breaking some highly critical cosmic law.
Something you just _DO NOT DO_ !
(Maybe one could compare it to advancing to another higher level of misconduct....as if the levels of the status quo weren't already bad enough.)
While humans could have taken responsibility...it looks like it's going exactly the other way.
I think we could praise ourselves extremely blissfully lucky if things turn out well with us after all, i'm not saying it would not turn out positively, but that point seems just so far away when reading something like this.
Oh slashdot... the endless puns and stories about mine hunting and not one person has questioned the validity of this anonymous submitter's story.
There are so many things wrong with this...
Why were they kept "armed"? (surely they don't live day to day with "snout-guns" attached)
Why were they not evacuated alongside all their other important assets?
I can go on and on...but I'd rather address the issue at hand.
First we have an urban legend about hotel room key-cards and now this steaming pile of unverified stupidity... With an audience in the millions you'd think the slashdot editors would take their jobs more seriously.
Slightly OT : How many Al Queda suicide divers have you heard about? Is there any reason to believe that a dolphin would be able to neutralize a boat carrying armed terrorists? Where the fuck are our human units when/if such a bizarre situation arises?
Won't somebody PLEASE think of the tuna??
I'm reminded of Grant Morrison's WE3 comic book trilogy.
Logan Smith
I don't know, but they can't be worse than the people they hire to work at airports currently. I mean, dolphins are supposed to be intelligent.
Doesn't it make you feel good to know that our freedoms are protected by politicans, lawyers and journalists.
and I was taught that the unloaded guns are the most dangerous ones.
----- If communism is a system where the government owns business, what do you call a system where business owns govern
to "neutralize" them by dropping their "payloads" on them.
One way or the other the idiot Yanks are gonna get us all killed one day.
I, for one, welcome our new dolphin overlords
"The cetacean commandos have escaped!"
"Quick... send in the Korean combat robots!
I'm Erwin Schrodinger and I approve of this message, and I do not approve of this message!
The US Navy refers to its dolphin units as "Marine Mammal Systems", and documents the purpose of each unit. Individual units are trained for mine hunting, force protection, and object recovery.
Assuming that these dolphins are not part of a separate program, presumably the loose mammals are part of Marine Mammal System Mark VI. Note that the Navy Marine Mammal Program FAQ includes the following item:
Does the Navy train its dolphins for offensive warfare, including attacks on ships and human swimmers or divers?
No. The Navy does not now train, nor has it ever trained, its marine mammals to harm or injure humans in any fashion or to carry weapons to destroy ships. A popular movie in 1973 ("The Day of the Dolphin") and a number of charges and claims by animal rights organizations have resulted in theories and sometimes actual beliefs that Navy dolphins are assigned attack missions. This is absolutely false. Since dolphins cannot discern the difference between enemy and friendly vessels, or enemy and friendly divers and swimmers, it would not be wise to give that kind of decision authority to an animal. The animals are trained to detect, locate, and mark all mines or all swimmers in an area of interest or concern, and are not trained to distinguish between what we would refer to as good or bad. That decision is always left to humans.
I find trace references to the fact that the former anti-swimmer system (the Shallow Water Intruder Detection System) was supplanted by something new involving dolphins. In the old system, a sea lion would swim up to an unknown frogman with an open-jawed clamp attached to a line attached to its nose, ram into the frogman, and then signal the handler -- the frogman would essentially become "handcuffed" to the line, easy to reel in.
Any program relying on (nontrivial) preemptive multithreading will be buggy.
it was a show on the discovery channel showing off how u.s. was training dolphins for military purposes, attaching daggers to there heads and letting the dolphins go do there job. But they released it wouldnt work very good because after the years(i think it was years) it took to train the dolphin to hunt people the dolphin wasnt reusable. After the dolphin saw the damaged it cause with the blood and the pain it would swim off and would never do it again. on a side note: OH CRAP WE BETTER GET THOSE DOLPHINS OUT THE OCEAN AND BACK INTO THERE TANKS OR ELSE THEY COULD BE FREE.
I am so writing a script for this right now!
Defender of Microsoft and Communism!!!
And discover the following:
Does the Navy train its dolphins for offensive warfare, including attacks on ships and human swimmers or divers?
No. The Navy does not now train, nor has it ever trained, its marine mammals to harm or injure humans in any fashion or to carry weapons to destroy ships. A popular movie in 1973 ("The Day of the Dolphin") and a number of charges and claims by animal rights organizations have resulted in theories and sometimes actual beliefs that Navy dolphins are assigned attack missions. This is absolutely false. Since dolphins cannot discern the difference between enemy and friendly vessels, or enemy and friendly divers and swimmers, it would not be wise to give that kind of decision authority to an animal. The animals are trained to detect, locate, and mark all mines or all swimmers in an area of interest or concern, and are not trained to distinguish between what we would refer to as good or bad. That decision is always left to humans.
Does the Navy ask the dolphins and sea lions to do dangerous things?
The dolphins locate and mark the location of sea mines which are designed to be set off by large ships, not aquatic animals. In the swimmer detection program, dolphins and sea lions move so quickly and with such accuracy that human swimmers in dark or murky waters are located and marked before they know what has happened. Once the marking has been completed, the animals are removed from the area before mines are disarmed or swimmers are apprehended by trained security forces. Marine mammals are actually in more danger from sharks, and wild marine mammals are put in much more danger by people who feed them (which is why it is illegal).
Why have there been so many rumors about the NMMP over the years?
Several decades of classification of the program's true missions of mine-hunting and swimmer defense, led to media speculation and animal activist charges of dolphins used as offensive weapons, speculation and charges that could not be countered with facts due to that classification. Additionally, fantasy is often times more interesting than reality. With declassification of the missions of the program in the early 1990s, the Navy has repeatedly and openly discussed those missions, but rumors are not easily forgotten, and there are those who continue to actively promote them.
In response to charges that the program abused the animals, the presidentially appointed Marine Mammal Commission investigated the program in 1988 and 1990. The Commission reported that the allegations were not only false, but that the Navy's care of its marine mammals was "exemplary."
Then, of course, we'd realize this guy was a kook, and that Slashdot is recycling stories that Art Bell wouldn't cover. Certainly makes you think twice about the journalistic integrity of the Guardian, though.
HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
Hey, they treat the dolphins as bad as they treat people!
When a true genius appears, you can know him by this sign: that all the dunces are in a confederacy against him.
So long and thanks for all the fish? Yeah, now they're armed... They'll want ALL the fish now.
Release the mad penguin!
Slashdot: Don't fear the penguins. Fear the friggin' dolphins!
Noise Is Music Podcast.
Haha, so true.
Sig!
Who's eating this chicken?
A viral marketing scheme for the SciFi Channel's next big Saturday Night Epic. What with the dolphin special effects budget, though, they might not be able to hire Bruce "The Chin" Campbell. Perhaps they can get Austin Jordan, the amazing actor from "Mansquito." Or not...
Seriously, though, did anyone bother to check out Leo Sheridan? This investigator is noteworthy for his declaring that any dead dolphins, whether on a Mediterranean beach, in San Diego, or the Gulf of Mexico, were killed to cover up the existence of a secret government program. In one case he even claimed the dolphins were deserters and were killed by explosive collars.
Might I suggest that perhaps he needs to purchase a few of these fine items to protect himself: http://www.lessemf.com/personal.html
Note: 'Day of the Dolphin,' (1974) starring George C. Scott, is not a documentary.
It seems unlikely that anyone would train dolphins with live ammo.
I welcome our new Dolphin overlods.
by TheSpoom (715771) Uncaring Linux user here. I have nothing to add to this but please continue. *munches popcorn*
Scuba divers killed by rouge dolphin with dart gun story at eleven. :P
Coward? Coward! Thems fighten words!!
Hmm... somebody is having trouble keeping their various cute and lovable kid's show characters separate...
For the record
Don't mean to troll, I'm just sayin'
Remember the opposable thumbs scare from five years ago?
Shouldn't poison dart tipped dolphins be under Hardware Hacking with the other case mods?
Dolphins are mammals, not fish. If you're going to monkey around with species-related puns, at least stick to the same class of vertebrates. This has been the giant elephant in the room throughout this thread.
You know what they say; an armed society is a polite society. Have you heard of a single dolphin-on-dolphin crime using a toxic dartgun that occurred when both dolphin were armed?
I didn't think so.
Since this was announced now, I am guessing the scurry to find them using the safety methods (said with some sarcasm here) has come up with nothing.
Now if someone gets hit, it won't be 'oh yes, were are sorry, we let us killer dolphins into the wild' but, you were swimming there, when we told you there were killer dolphins.
I can also see the denied purchase request for 20 tracking beacons hurridly being found and burned.
In other news, an elite squardron of fencing swordfish and navy seals (like, real seals) were also missing.
To confirm you're not a script,
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I for one welcome the Killer Dolphin overlords!
Pzzaaappt!! What was that sting like feelin.... Thud!
-ItsME
"Those who have studied the controversial use of dolphins in the U.S. defence programme claim it is vital they are caught quickly
Or what?
They're gonna go back to the sea, tell their brethren about what worthless abusive slobs we are, teach them some new tool-using concepts, and launch a revolution? Absurd, yes, but if we're still training animals to do our military dirty work these days, with exotic weapons no less -- and most of our military actions are motivated by unfathomable political stupidity and testosterone-poisoning -- we've all richly earned such an obtuse end.
I say more power to 'em, goddamit. Next time you see me rowing out and dumping bags full of rubber-handled tools (easy to grip w/teeth), supplies, and beer into the ocean, you'll know what I'm up to.
J
I think not...(*poof*)
I'm rolling.
.. before sending in a "What is so f****** funny about this? It is dangerous!" post.
...is whether the Navy fed them or let them hunt for food. If they fed them every day, their likelihood of surviving in the Gulf diminishes rapidly. If, on the other hand, they were taught to hunt for food, they could potentially pose a hazard. We don't have to worry too much about fishermen getting poked, as all of the water around there is now contaminated and shouldn't be used for fishing anyway.
Slashdot's first reaction to VMware
Top Secret pictures of the Navy Dolphins http://www.planetunreal.com/images.asp?/images/scr eens/uc_083105_2.jpg
Looks scary
The Guardian story is full of unnamed third party references. "received intelligence from sources close to the US government's marine fisheries service."
Leo Sheridan did not even say where the dolphins were trained.
The only thing new in this world is the history that you don't know.[Harry Truman]
The U.S. Atlantic bottlenose dolphins have apparently been taught to shoot terrorists attacking military vessels.
Sorry, but someone attacking a military target is combatant, saboteur if you like. The point of terrorism is to spread fear among general population in order to achieve certain goal.
A military vessel is a fair target in a conflict. Making an attempt on servicemen of your country doesn't imply that the foe is a terrorist, no matter how you hate it. That's what soldiers have been doing for millenia now.
Lisp is the Tengwar of programming languages.
So long and thanks for all the fish!
Insert Sig Here
Actually, the worst thing a dolphin could likely do would be to kill you by stoving your chest in or fracturing your skull or ribs. You'd likely then either die from your injuries or drown.
;-)
The dolphin's nose is extremely hard, and (IIRC) is its primary weapon. Dolphins have been known to fight off even larger sharks, and in any confrontation with a human they could easily dive out of reach and stage repeated charges, charging at you from below (which really doesn't bear thinking about) - remember, they can get up enough speed to lift their entire bodies may metres clear out of the water (up to 21mph), and that's leaving aside the bone-crushing amount of force they could generate simply by slapping you with their tail. They also tend to hunt in packs, and are intelligent enough to tactically herd and corral their prey first to make killing them easier.
So don't tell me a wimpy little out-of-his-depth naked ape thrashing around on the surface would be anything but fishfood to a highly-trained troop of 4-metre long 650kg sleek grey killing machines that can take out a great white shark...
As Terry Pratchett so presciently pointed out, never trust an animal that smiles all the time. It's up to something...
Everything in moderation, including moderation itself
In Soviet Atlantis dolphins release YOU!
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
Don't count on it.
Best Slashdot Co
For once in his life he could have been useful.
-G
Number Two: Sea Bass.
Dr. Evil: [pause] Right.
Number Two: They're mutated sea bass.
Dr. Evil: Are they ill tempered?
Number Two: Absolutely.
Dr. Evil: Oh well, that's a start.
Thank you, I'll be here all day...
Content Management System: A pretentious way of saying "text editor."
Here is a story about how they distracted a lady and emptied her purse.
Hey,
I saw these guys knocking over a Walmart during the looting! They were cleaning out the Sardine supply.
When Fascism comes to America, it will call itself Anti-Fascism, and tell you to give up your guns.
'Oh, shit, says humanity'
Simple. Moderation rule number 1: If you disagree, mod down. If you can't think of a good reason for the public, mod at random. If you can't think of a good reason but you don't want people to know, mod -1(Overrated).
I get modded down for speaking my mind all the time. It's really not surprising anymore.
Willy is back, trained, and pissed.
In God we trust, all others require data.
We can only hope, being the smartest mammals on the planet, that they can tell the good guys from the bad guys.
I found it interesting with all of the "science" about how smart dolphins are to find that they're also quite capable of evil. I mean, dolphin lovers like to talk about how smart and how "humane" they are and if we would be more like them we'd all live in this utopia. I thought this was an interesting take until I saw the Discovery Channel show about how young male dolphins gang up and kidnap and rape female dolphins.
How could this possibly be flamebait? Did the person who mod this down actually read the Guardian article? Or are they modding it flamebait because I think the slashdot story moderators are acting like a bunch of 9th graders? How hard is it to do a Google search for the people mentioned in the article? Is Leo Sheridan, a respected dolphin researcher and accident investigator, a real person?
"You'll get nothing, and you'll like it!"
A bunch of dolphins, all with puncture wounds on thier necks in the exact same place, consistent with a small explosive detonation. That sure sounds fishy to me. Considering that the military has been working with dolphins for quite some time now... Whether his information regarding that has any merit at all, the military does acknowledge training dolphins... I can't think of any other explanation other than an aborted U.S. military project.
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
The last few weeks have been hellish. My house in New Orleans flooded out, my TV was stolen by looters, my food and water by the mayor's thugs, and now there's a bunch of dolphins in my living room making me type for them. If there are any search geniuses out there, please help me find the current whereabouts of Flipper, as the lasers on their heads are starting to get unnerving. They promised to fry me if I can't find their god ... er ... Flipper.
Please help.
WTF! Happened to "Thanks for all the fish?"
I am Bennett Haselton! I am Bennett Haselton!
Even years after his plee, the government hasn't hit the proverbial nail on the head yet.
I only came here to do two things; kick some ass, and drink some beer...looks like we're almost out of beer.
I know the military can be stupid sometimes, but surely not stupid enough to have their trained killer dolphins armed up during an incoming major hurricane?
Since no one would ever attack under the cover of hurricane?
It's not like the place is deserted from the evacuation, or that the military personnel is busy running around with sandbags and with crossing-guard duty, or anything.
If you're willing to strap poisoned darts on dolphins, and train them to kill. You're probably willing to do it in any weather. Hell, it's not like they'd only train the killer-dart dolphin attack squad to work on perfect sunny days.
You can't take the sky from me...
That would be as stupid as handing Haliburton a no-compete contract to rebuild New Orleans, after the over-priced, under-performing fiascos they've been involved with in Iraq. Oh. they did.
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
"If communism is a system where the government owns business, what do you call a system where business owns govern"
You're referring to fascism , "the merger of state and corporate power" (according to Mussolini, its first biggest booster).
"Corporate" doesn't mean what you think it means in this context.
Wikipedia gives a good history of corporatism.
"Under Fascism in Italy, business owners, employees, trades-people, professionals, and other economic classes were organized into 22 guilds, or associations, known as "corporations" according to their industries, and these groups were given representation in a legislative body known as the Camera dei Fasci e delle Corporazioni."
So you see, "the merger of state and corporate power" doesn't just mean businesses. Today such a system might include corporations such as the AFL/CIO and other labor unions. Yes, they are corporations, too.
And business never "owned" government under Fascism. Fascism is primarily about putting the state above the individual, indeed above everything, include businesses.
Doctrine of Fascism
"The corporate State considers that private enterprise in the sphere of production is the most effective and usefu [sic] [typo-should be: useful] instrument in the interest of the nation. In view of the fact that private organisation of production is a function of national concern, the organiser of the enterprise is responsible to the State for the direction given to production.
State intervention in economic production arises only when private initiative is lacking or insufficient, or when the political interests of the State are involved. This intervention may take the form of control, assistance or direct management. (pp. 135-136) "
Benito Mussolini, 1935, Fascism: Doctrine and Institutions, Rome: 'Ardita' Publishers.
Dude, I've just finished reading that and the linked list from it. (twice)
You have just blown my mind and scared the hell out of me.
You know, if only a couple of things in that list of 14 characteristics, I'd not worry. But, when I am seeing all of them around us daily... just creepy, very creepy
----- If communism is a system where the government owns business, what do you call a system where business owns govern
Perhaps the Dolphins were just defending their fish supply from the other dolphins who were trying to loot it.
Randy.Flood@RHCE2B.COM
It's real simple, when these critters run out of darts, they'll return for more; That's when they'll get recaptured. Of course, if any of these things wonder into a "Liquor and Ammo" store in the "Big Easy"; Well, I'd hate to think what would happen if these critters got drunk AND reloaded all at the same time. Just how intelligent are these killers?
(insert scuba tank noise here) (Glancing to the rear at ghostly image appearing quicky, through the scuba mask): "What the.....NO, Flipper! NO Flipper! CEASE FIRE! CEASE FIRE!"
I for one, welcome our new Dolphin Overloards. Squee squee, masters.
When are you guys gonna realize that The Guardian is just a fancy tabloid like all the rest of the junk out there. They are one of the worst at spreading completely baseless stories with nothing but conspiratual CRAP. *sigh* But hey... that does make for some really funny stories!!! And it sure does take all kinds.
Jho
Sorry man... the Internet pooped on me.
...why don't just use altready poisonous or dangerous fishes?
"came on, bite that ass!
No, no! That one!
NO! Bad do^H^H piranha! "
Just remember that the list was made by someone who wanted to prove that America was fascist, and set out to find points of commonality, however tenuous. As evidenced by conspiracy theories, you can draw connections between anything if you try hard enough.
Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
I guess what made the article stand out is the multitude of events.
(for the record, I know almost nothing of fascism, and my sig is an honest question to 'hopefully' lead me to enlightenment. I had never even thought fascism could be the answer. Its a sign of my ignorance in this area that I hope to eliminate)
Some things that make me worry (and ring with the article linked).
- detaining POW's after the conflict has ended
- detaining anybody without charges or trial
- having the FBI look for 'criminal obsenity'
- DNA database
- preemptive strikes
- science being replaced with religion in the classroom
- ever-growing military spending (who is *really* going to invade us?)
- constant fear-mongering of the terrorist boogeyman instead of preparing for common disasters
- DMCA
- USA PATRIOT act
- rampant corruption
- constant degredation of the courts with the term "judicial activism"
Before reading that article, I saw these things as just wacked. As for conspiracies, I really don't think the government is organised enough or has people smart enough to pull em off (based on my observations). However, sometimes people get caught-up in a course of events that leads them to places they never expected to go (Nazi Germany is the best example of this). Another commonality that I'll throw out. I'm willing to bet that all of the guys leading their countries into fascism probably thought they were doing the best thing for their people (seems most also had the *consent* of the populace too, from some quick googling). I really hope we aren't going this way but, everytime I turn on the news, things look a little bit worse.
Show me there's nothing to worry about, and I'll shut up.
And before anybody tries to cast me as some wacko liberal, I should make clear, I was a registered Republican until Bush beat McCain in the primaries. I was so disgusted that I switched to the Libertarian party. I also served in the US Army as an Airborne Combat Engineer (for the lay person, this means jumping out of a C-130 aircraft from 800ft with 80lbs of explosives in your rucksack).
----- If communism is a system where the government owns business, what do you call a system where business owns govern
Yes, and in the US, it's patriotic to consume, to keep "the economy" going. Are you comfortable with how proud Mussolini would be with our corporatist government?
He would probably be unhappy with how business don't seem to serve society/state enough. Remember that their purpose isn't to serve the owners ultimately. It's to serve the state, according to Mussolini, at least. He would no doubt exercise what he thought was the state's option to directly administer many industries. All in the "pubic's interest", of course. Interestingly, many on the left would make the same complaint about business and offer the same "solution".
Even though we don't have many labor corporations, just unions (which work differently), it's "the merger of state and corporate power". It's certainly not "of, by and for the people".
All unions except informal ones are genuine corporations. They have bylaws and charters and all those things that go along with being a corporation.
And while we don't have a separate legislative body for all those corporations that way fascist Italy did, we do have lobbyists in Washington exercising influence. That includes business corporations, but also all those other corporations, like the NEA, AARP, Sierra Club, etc.
According to one researcher at the facility the dolphins escaped from, the last one out did a complicated triple back-flip while whistling "The Star Spangled Banner" which he correctly understood to mean, "So long, thanks for all the fish."
This sig is false.
This is the first time I've heard anyone make fascism look attractive.
Maybe I need to break out of my idiot savant mode and study some political science.
----- If communism is a system where the government owns business, what do you call a system where business owns govern
This is the first time I've heard anyone make fascism look attractive.
Maybe I need to break out of my idiot savant mode and study some political science.
It's not surprising that fascism might look attractive. Dictators don't just come to power with zero support. There have to be enough people to believe in and be attracted to the philosophy. It has to look good for people to accept it. Hitler and Mussolini had plenty of popular support.
What's interesting is how time and again this idea of placing society always before the individual ends with dictatorship. We have our intuitions about how the state can be used to create a utopian society, and these intuitions turn out to be mostly wrong in practice.
What's interesting is how time and again this idea of placing society always before the individual ends with dictatorship. We have our intuitions about how the state can be used to create a utopian society, and these intuitions turn out to be mostly wrong in practice.
That's why I think the real answer is to use the state to put individual needs above the society instead. But what you end up doing that way is each house, neighborhood, city, county, and state being allowed to form their own armies and control local comerce. You might not have to compete- but you do have to provide a useful product if you're going to survive. And becoming rich would be impossible.
SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.
This is for all the SeaWorld tricks, bitch.
I agree with a lot of your thoughts. I started off (in my youth?) as more of a conspiracy theorist, but as time has moved on its become clear that almost any organization large enough (government or business) to be accused of conspiracy theories of any threat are also too disorganized at an individual level to pull them off. Instead it seems to always be well intentioned people whose actions, collectively, lead to an unfortunate and unthought-of end...
The real question is whether that end is unpredictable given the steps along the way. If it is predictable, can it be identified and exposed significantly enough and early enough to change course? One would hope that the United States has this capability through its ideals of free speech, open forums and a free press. But sometimes even those get eaten away at...
Come play Moral Decay!
Dah Nah NAH, Daa NAA Naa Naa Naa
How exactly are the darts fired? Do the dolphins pull the trigger with their fins?
and i gotta say it: where are the sharks with laser beams attached to their heads?
There's no doubt that corporate control of government, if left unchecked, will lead to no good. But it will be something different from fascism. Closer to mercantilism (the British war *for* drugs is humorous in hindsight). Despite the whinings of some attention-whores, America is a *long* way from the totalitarianism implied by fascism.
It also helps to remember that we had a far more corporately-corrupt govenment 100 or so years ago, and we recovered from that. The seventeenth amendment
was a significant structural change, but it did fix the problem for many decased (and was a *much* better idea than the sixteenth or eighteenth amendments!).
Socialism: a lie told by totalitarians and believed by fools.
Hrmm... Maybe they left for another purpose...
Hmmm... this makes me nervous.. I'm going to be at a convention at the Sheraton Sand Key in FL (just outside of Tampa) next week and plan on getting some waverunning in. Hopefully I wont be dodging projectiles from marine life.
;-)
I think they should take the dolphins and put them into the floodwaters of NOLA. Maybe they could do a better job than their police department there!
Libertas in infinitum
Hmmm, sounds a lot like Objectivism.
I read alot of Ayn Rand in my younger days (probably what lead me to being a libertarian). And the ideas seem to follow this line. Everyone acting in their own interests create the result of a better life for all. You are only responsible to yourself.
The problem with this is that some things (national intersate system) can be too big for any individual to do, and possibly extremely difficult to organize a collection of people to do. Another problem is there may not be sufficient motivation to ensure the poor are educated.
The plus side is when a disaster like Hurricane Katrina comes by, you don't have people relying on an agency like FEMA, people are prepared themselves.
($20 inflatable boat plus $80 of canned food and bottled water could keep someone going for over a month in a flood zone)
I think what we need is for people to have spirit of objectivism/libertarianism in that they strive to be self reliant and independent while maintaining a society that ensures that everyone is able to start adulthood with a minimum level of preparation and that there is some kind of safety net to prevent productive people from falling. Of course, there is no way to establish a government like this because, peoples attitudes are personal options (for now anyway).
One thing that would greatly help would be to reduce the number of corporations, and make it very difficult to form one. Also, make it easier to start a business. Limiting the liability of decision makers is dangerous. In a sole-proprietership, or a partnership, people are liable for their decisions. This encourages greater responsibility (a good thing in my mind).
----- If communism is a system where the government owns business, what do you call a system where business owns govern
Hmmm, sounds a lot like Objectivism.
The difference between distributism and objectivism is this: There's no room for selfishness in a distributist system. Because each artisan in each town has a *right* to the customers they know, as well as a right to ask the town council to levee tariffs to protect that right, markets in a distributist system are naturally limited.
The problem with this is that some things (national intersate system) can be too big for any individual to do, and possibly extremely difficult to organize a collection of people to do.
Under a distributist system, such large organizations become completely unneccessary. There's no need to move large amounts of goods or armament around the country- there are local producers to provide those needs. There's no need to move money around the nation or even have a combined national currency; each town would print it's own, and be responsible for their own welfare. Distributists were the only lefties to resist the Social Security system- they knew it was neccessary under capitalism, but they said that it was immoral in the extreme for it to be neccessary at all.
The plus side is when a disaster like Hurricane Katrina comes by, you don't have people relying on an agency like FEMA, people are prepared themselves. ($20 inflatable boat plus $80 of canned food and bottled water could keep someone going for over a month in a flood zone)
It's actually even better than that- within WALKING distance of the edge of the flood zone is a guy who makes the rubber rafts in his basement. And another one who's running a wood burning still to create clean water (he normally manfactures booze). And a third farmer selling the produce of his fields- or giving it away because he knows people who are in need.
I think what we need is for people to have spirit of objectivism/libertarianism in that they strive to be self reliant and independent while maintaining a society that ensures that everyone is able to start adulthood with a minimum level of preparation and that there is some kind of safety net to prevent productive people from falling. Of course, there is no way to establish a government like this because, peoples attitudes are personal options (for now anyway).
True enough- though a smart demagogue could take advantage of the three main facts that are now converging to make distributism possible in the United States: 1. The end of cheap energy. 2. The lack of central government services. 3. The fact that distributism is Roman Catholic and that Roman Catholics have a 25% plurality in the United States now- a voting block 62 million strong.
I think the key to taking advantage of that last is explaining it both in terms of economic science and in terms of Church Teaching- you'd still lose the Traditionalists on one side and the anti-Catholics on the other, but in a three way race you'd probably still come out ahead.
SJW: a person who perceives an injustice, and while correcting it, commits a greater injustice.