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Microsoft's Tips for Buying an MP3 Player
An Anonymous Reader writes "In another extension of Microsoft's 'Plays for Sure' campaign, the company has launched a web page with six tips to help consumers purchase the 'correct' MP3 Player for them. Among the insights of the article hard drive-based players suck and a stopwatch is a useful feature to have on your player. Unsurprisingly, the iPod meets none of Microsoft's criteria. A humorous commentary is available, of course." From the article: "6. Don't get locked into one online store. Have you ever been on the hunt for a particular song? Some obscure indie rock tune or rare jazz performance you heard on the radio? You might have to shop at more than one store before you find the song you're looking for."
They didn't say microdrive players suck, but the page IS about flash players. About the display thing, I wholeheartedly agree, I think people assume any ipod is "teh coolness", but I'd rather buy a flash player with a display and fm tuner for the same price as an ipod shuffle, I think apple manages to confuse a decent amount of people, and the apple fanatics, well, they'll buy anything apple.
I heard she's the new CEO for MS's new consumer guide division.
Rock that crushes, Paper & Scissors that don't matter.
and just why is this under the apple section?
I went to the site, and it doesn't look as bad as the leetspeek one, so I skimmed through it.
It's nice to see there isn't any obvious bias in the information, and it's pretty straight forward - I can fathom why they'd want to make a page like this, but it wouldn't stop anyone from purchasing that ever-so hip iPod/mini/shuffle/gumstick. However, what irks the hell out of me is the amount of songs that fit on the player is given using music in their proprietary format, wma @ 64kbps. Given that, it is a good way to suck in the novices (are there any left in the world?) and make them look for players that support WMA and such.
Harbl my harbl? Harbl.
Remember children, all generalizations are wrong.
...are all the hype nowadays ; as Microsoft don't make their own, they have to be present another way ; by making their software more compatible with it, by having their own shop, by having some hardware vendor selling one tailored after their specifications...
Anyway, they could not stand 100% against theiPod as it already gained the public acceptance as "teh coolest".
Trolling using another account since 2005.
The correct MP3 Player, can play Ogg Files.
Make sure your MP3 player has a radio, phone, alarm clock, slide rule, enviroment guage, laser pointer, pepper spray, self-inflating raft, nail gun, and the ability to play WMA and only WMA.
I know about Linux PDAs and such but is there a Linux-based mp3 player. It seems like a great idea since you wouldn't have to pay fees on the OS. Plus Linux is pretty customizable. Open the player up so people can write plugins and new features. Why hasn't anyone thought of this?
The best education consists in immunizing people against systematic attempts at education. - Paul Feyerabend
few with fm radio
how come mp3 players with fm radio are so hard to find?
doesn't it occur to manufacturers/ consumers how much functionality is added with so little effort by adding fm radio?
i have an iriver IFP-180T solely on the basis of it having an fm radio
how much does the fm radio circuitry add to the cost of an mp3 player? 50 cents?
will someone please enlighten me then how come fm radio is so hard to find in mp3 players?
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
that means there will be patents on things like the rock n'roll beat?
I can now stop time, but the effect is only temporary
The Neuros is a brick when compared to the iPod, and that's the only reason it never sold that well. Had it had its current feature list and been the same size as an iPod it would have done much better, even with its limited marketing budget.
Sure, the iPod's looks carry it a ways, but it's the size of the thing, and its smootheness (which makes for better pocket-ability than any of its last gen competition) that have made it so popular. Most consumers care far more about how big a DAP is than about its format support or even battery life...
Unsurprisingly, the iPod meets none of Microsoft's criteria.
Is that so? Up until recently, I seem to recall every iPod sold having a display.
So i can figure out how long the fucker takes to crash. No wait. :-)
Approximate figures based on CD-quality WMA (64 Kbps)
i don't mean to saw that no other player can meet my needs as well as an ipod, but since the ipod does it perfectly "as-is", there's no reason to look elsewhere.
the ipod is a success partly, yet, because of the "fadishness" of it. but you should also open yourself to the possibility that people are buying the ipod in droves because they actually find them better for their needs compared to other players. the recent estimates on the halo effect wouldn't be nearly as positive if the ipod were merely a fad. it seems people are examining macintoshes closer because they appreciate the functionality and elegance of the ipod and they believe that the ipod's fit-and-finish is indicative of apple products as a whole (which is largely true).
Not the iPod Shuffle.
It's the only player I can think of without a display.... and it's very popular.
"Things are more moderner than before- bigger, and yet smaller- it's computers-- San Dimas High School football RULES!"
i'm not sure he'll pull through....
Why do people think this is directly targetting the ipod?
Hard-disk based player != ipod
And do MS really believe WMA is CD quality at 64kbps?
According to that page:
* Approximate figures based on CD-quality WMA (64 Kbps)
"Nine times out of ten, starting a fire is not the best way to solve the problem." - my wife
MS is on crack.
so, what's exactly the use of an mp3 player, if I mainly use it as a portable radio? I can get one for under 2£... I understand that the more feature, the better, but they're just an add-oin, not something on which would heavily influence my choice...
Every player up to the Shuffle was a hard drive based player. Thus the only iPod that could not meet the criteria (and still be flash based) is the Shuffle.
TSI
From the article:
"*Approximate figures based on CD-quality WMA (64 Kbps)"
Am I the only one who don't think 64kbps WMA is "CD quality", or is it because the quality of todays recordings on CDs are quite a lot worse than they used to be, of could I just be insane?
Make me doubt one fact, and I'll start doubting all facts...
When did ANYONE with a clue listen to Microsoft? "Linux costs you more money", "Linux has more security problems" and "IE doesn't have any security holes which we can't fix and do the second we know about them if you have a fucking time machine!" seems to be all they can say lately.
I'm sick of Bill and his lies, who gives a fuck if he says Longhorn will stop teenage pregnancy, cure world hunger and get every geek laid within a week of buying it. He talks so much crap now (and so do most people who have spin doctors sitting up their ass all day) that we may as well go listen to the talking clock for a bit and at least get some truth even if it's useless 10 seconds later.
I like muppets.
Point #4 says, "Let a professional make your next playlist. Having an FM radio lets you put your player on autopilot as you mountain bike, cycle, or rollerblade." Just buy a radio player, then! Avoids Windows, too.
I don't want to read
Simply put, flash memory players have no moving parts, meaning that you can take them jogging and your music won't skip.
Does anyone have a problem with there ipod skipping while they jog? I know the possiblity is there, but lets get real.
Some players have a built-in voice recorder, FM recorder, or stopwatch
I think Kmart is selling those FM headphones for 5 bucks, all those kids sure want that FM. That's what all the cool people have nowadays.
using a player with Windows Media Audio (WMA) support as well as MP3 support gives you the most music per megabyte
Too bad WMA sounds bad.. You will have cheap headphones on so it wont matter. The rest of the world that likes sound quality and compatility will go with higher bit rate mp3
If you need help from microsoft before you getting an Mp3 Player, I would suggest not getting an Mp3 player.
Thank you Slashdot for the luagh, now if you can only find a Microsoft guide on how to submit stories to Slashdot. I think it would be
1)Find the dumbest thing on the Microsoft Website
2)Submit to slashdot
3) Repeat
mnewberg.com
"6. Don't get locked into one online store. Have you ever been on the hunt for a particular song? Some obscure indie rock tune or rare jazz performance you heard on the radio? You might have to shop at more than one store before you find the song you're looking for." What an outrage. MS must think we are all morons. When was an online store (Apples they are obviously reffering to) a bad thing? $1 songs and free ones everyday. All sorted nice and neat and there for you to have without HAVEING to goto the store. In the case you do hear an obscure song you like, you have options. 1. Record song and convert it to MP3. 2. Rip song off CD bought at local music store and put on music device. I hope they see me giveing them the finger, becuase im doing it as hard as I can!
...from the good folks that brought you the hilarious
Parents Primer to Computer Slang.
Now you and your family can be l33t together.
W
-------------------
This is my SIG. There are many like it, but this one is mine.
Some obscure indie rock tune or rare jazz performance you heard on the radio? You might have to shop at more than one store before you find the song you're looking for.
Rare jazz performance? Sure, I often want stuff like that, but why would I buy it off of an online digital music store? Nearly every store supplies its songs in a mediocre 128kbps-ish format, generally sub-par to the equivalent LAME encoded 128kbps VBR MP3. Why would I want jazz, with all its high-hats and dynamic range, in an uber-low quality format? Britney Spears' new single, sure.. but jazz??
And don't say AllOfMp3.com (who have changed CC processor to someone else)..
I like the CARS take on it:
CARS is good stuff!
If they only knew.
I'm an experienced shopper already. Audiogalaxy, Kazaa, Limewire, Bittorrent, I didn't really like that Direct Connect stuff, e-donkey, bearshare, IRC was too much effort, google, KDX, Napster (before it sucked), iTunes... the list just goes on!
P.S. In case you hadn't noticed: I didn't RTFA
[Fuck Beta]
o0t!
Let me think - I could listen to grainy L.A.-style radio, commercial-saturated lite-rock and the two-laughing-assholes-in-the-morning "wacky" radio show, or alternatively I could never, ever do that again. I'd be willing to pay more for an MP3 player that doesn't allow that crap into my ears.
If you're the kind of person who'd install ad-block software, why would you listen to the radio?
Mike Hoye
Wouldn't this be better suited in the Hardware section? I fail to see how this is Apple other than Microsoft saying not to buy an iPod.
Four roommates. No microwave. You do the math.
but why?
what is it about fm radio that doesn't appeal to you?
to me it's a free jokebox, it has no downside
in all honesty, respectfully, i can't understand you not being impressed by fm radio
i run and listen to mp3s, then at some point i get bored with my choices, and yearn for something random and fresh: voila, radio, different channels, different tastes
why is it that, if you are correct, people are hellbent on listening to nothing but that from their own collection?
isn't that incredibly asocial and self-important and stuffy?: "i know all there is to know about my musical tastes and my tastes will never change on a moments notice and yearn to hear something new and fresh"
i don't think that my mp3 collection, as large as it is, adequately describes all of my musical interests or whims or desires to find something new and different
are people really that incredibly inward and unexperimentive about their music choices?
i honestly can't believe that
and if you are correct, well then that's sad to me
are people really that cloistered and stuffy?
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
There are a couple of things they missed, like the fact that flash-based players are often smaller than hard-disk based players.
;)
I don't like their song stats (using 64kbps WMA only), but the truth is that most people have crappy headphones and won't notice a difference anyway.
What I do think is misleading is the bit about "not getting locked into an online store". They're suggesting that if you buy the wrong player, you'll be stuck with a single source of music, which is simply not true. It's the other way around. Stores that use DRM will lock you into buying players that support the same type of DRM. (You can always make a DRM-free copy the hard way, but this is beyond most people.) It's also worth noting that Microsoft's website doesn't say whether or not any of the players they recommend support MP3.
As an aside, has anyone seen an MP3 player (flash or not) that can be programmed to record radio programs at a specified time? I think that a time-shifting function would be a great feature for people who listen to NPR, talk radio, or the late-night lunatic fringe. Of course, it would also need an AM tuner. (And yes, I've seen the Radio Shark, but it's not portable!)
"The newly born animals are then whisked off for a quick run through a giant baking oven." --heard on Food Network
You must be one of those people that loathes popularity to the point of delusion. Sure, iPod are somewhat trendy. That doesn't negate it's worth as a purely function MP3 player and you're a moron for suggesting so.
Go ahead and stick to your "way-cooler" cassette tapes, indie-boy.
"Go with whatever locks you into Windows Media Audio".
Some obscure indie rock tune or rare jazz performance you heard on the radio
as if that even gets on the radio.
1. My player should have good audio quality
2. My player should be easy to use. No, scratch that, it should be _a pleasure_ to use.
3. My player should not look like an ass, should not weigh a ton, should exude quality. After all, I'm paying mad coin for it.
Myself, I don't give a rat's ass about FM. There's nothing but commercials on there anyway. I don't give a rat's ass about online stores either, because that's not where I buy music. Three things specified above are pretty much all I care about. And yeah, I'm gonna buy me an iPod when Apple releases the new generation with imporved battery life (another important thing).
The ipod does have a supply so that is one of six, not zero of six. The carelessness of posters...
* Approximate figures based on CD-quality WMA (64 Kbps) I call BS... 64 Kbps isn't even close to CD quality. Even with a top notch encoder such as LAME, 128 is the bare minimum for something you can consider CD-quality.
Game! - Where the stick is mightier than the sword!
and yes, you are right, there are ads
but do you watch tv?
you don't understand the concept of changing the channel?
to me, i can't program my tastes, i need to go out on a whim and listen to something i never heard before
i can't understand someone who can preprogram their listening pleasure without an element of newness in it
to me, all of the downsides you mentioned are vastly outweighed by a spirit of "give me something new and different"
i guess some people are just inward and stuffy than me
that's sad to me
intellectual property law is philosophically incoherent. it is your moral duty to ignore it or sabotage it
Be sure to get that FM receiver option so you can listen to higher-quality music when you get tired of your 64 Kbps WMA collection.
# cat
Damn, my RAM is full of llamas.
I have a MZ-NH700 Sony Hi-MD player and believe that this format offers a wealth of features over all flash/drive based memory players. I just wish Sony would hurry up and offer first generation Hi-MD users a firmware upgrade so that these devices will support the MP3 format.
As if any of Microsoft's time estimates have been correct.
Case in point: try copying a file to another place on any Windows PC.
For another fine guide of theirs, check out the Parent's primer to l33t sp34k. Seems to be on par.
I have seen the Neuros and the iPod side-by-side. The player itself is of reasonable size, but it is a flash player, and only capable of holding 256mb of music. Attaching the "backpack" enables it to hold a lot more music on the hard disk, but it essentially makes it a brick.
I would have to argue that the better user interface definately goes to the iPod. The Neuros' interface is cluttered and confusing, at best. The 5 preset buttons on the side may be useful for some purposes, yet, I find that they just take up space.
The extra features on the Neuros include FM recieving and transmission, and a feature called "hi-si", which essentially records part of a radio stream for comparison to a DB when synced to a computer. Sure, these features have that "hey, that's kewl!" value, but it only lasts for a day, one week tops. Ask yourself: are you REALLY going to _use_ these features?
FM transmission is really just an ad-hoc solution for getting it to play through car speakers. In most circumstances, I find that a cheap tape adapter actually sounds better. FM reception is gradually turning into a gimmick in digital audio players. We are turning to digital audio for a reason: you will not find many radio stations that do not play absolute crap most of the time.
The iPod is an example of a device that does one thing and does it well: play digital audio through an easy to use interface in a stylish device. Devices like the Neuros do a lot of things, but it generally feels slapped together and half-assed.
- Get a player with a hard disk, probably at least 20Gb. That way you can carry your entire music collection with you and you have enough choice to make sure you can find the right music for your mood.
- Make sure you can use MP3 or Ogg files, with no loss on the player. Anything that doesn't contain one of these is a nonstarter.
- Buy CD and rip them to MP3s for your player. Make sure this is easy with your chosen player. That way you maintain control of you property and have the flexibility to deal with new formats, backups, etc.
- Batteries have to last at least 5 hours, preferably 10 - otherwise they are a bind to use.
- Work out how long it would take to find a song amongst 3000 others. It should be less than 10 seconds - you want the music to dominate, not the user interface.
- Don't pay for stuff you don't need
Ipods aren't as good as many people make them out to be, they have a definite fashion element to them. However they are closer to where most people are with their needs (shuffle excepted) than the competitors. As far as the next generation?The United States of America: We do what we must because we can.
You are too stupid to live.
Some obscure indie rock tune or rare jazz performance you heard on the radio?
Funnily, this is the kind of music that you're most likely to find available as unrestricted mp3s, which will obviously work in any music player you like.
Irritable, left-wing and possibly humorous bumper stickers and t-shirts
Quite right. Twenty minutes to copy a 17-meg file won't hold a candle to some of Windows' estimates.
Bears don't normally eat things that talk and move backwards.
i think the stopwatch is a great feature to have
I'm certain it would be for some joggers. Say, how's GNOME* coming along?
*I kid, I kid!
* don't get locked into a non open and free standard
* don't get locked into a single OS
* don't get locked into DRM
You know, in a way I tend to agree with MS here, in the sense that I always thought moving parts are a bad thing for mobile entertainment devices. Idealy, if it is possible, I'd like my MP3 player to be fully solid state tech. Less power consumption, more rugged, and perhaps higher data density.
Of course, when the price factors in he equation, HD starts to look much more attractive...
Sigged!
Because the playlists of most radio stations in most markets are very limited and boring.
Until about a month ago, I was absolutely sure that I had a more diverse music collection on my iPod than the super repetitive, boring FM playlists in this market.
Now there's a new public radio station in this market with a diverse playlist. For the first time in ten years I'm hearing music on the radio that I have never heard of. It challenges me and I love it, but I'm almost completely sure my iPod is still more diverse, thanks to internet radio stations and other online sources.
4. Let a professional make your next playlist.
They are referring to radio stations. I hope this was indeed the case that professionals could make the playlists! However, most radio stations have deals with the record companies: play this song so and so many times and get so and so much money. Radio has basically been reduced to yet another form of advertising, where the advertised products are the songs themselves (so that you would buy the CD).
Of course there is still hope but do not rely on radio stations being manned by "professionals" who will do their utmost to provide you with a pleasurable playlist.
But I agree with them in the point that a flash memory player is much better for an active person. It will not skip, ever. And you don't have to be too careful with it.
Also, I'd rather get something from e.g. Iriver and put my own songs there than to use an online store be the player flash memory based or hard disk based.
And they forgot to mention to not lock yourself with proprietary formats such as WMA or anything which has DRM...
neuros sucks and your link doesn't even work loser
... for less than $200.
Archos Gmini
You would want Britney Spears' new single?
No shit. The Archos product lines have always pwned the iPod.
With the Gmini 400 (drool), it continues to do so.
Don't you mean "Cars are good things"?
... and then they built the supercollider.
how come walkmans with fm radio are so hard to find?
doesn't it occur to manufacturers/ consumers how much functionality is added with so little effort by adding fm radio?
how much does the fm radio circuitry add to the cost of a walkman? 50 cents?
will someone please enlighten me then how come fm radio is so hard to find in walkmans?
Not since Marie-Antoinette played milkmaid has looking simple and honest been so fake and complicated.
Finally, someone who doesn't yell about the iPod having the 'superior iTunes'. Personally I find the software that comes with some of the other mp3 playres much better. iRiver doesn't need any, and Creative (Zen Micro) just pretty much let's you drag and drop onto the player.
... and please, don't put it in your mouth (subtle reference to the chewing gum size shuffle, and not a total gay apple reference.
Everyone knows that only windows users are gay.
"Flash memory is skip-free and durable" --- non flash memory(HDD's) ARE BAD BAD BAD?!?
"For the active person, a flash memory player has distinct advantages... (list: Display, FM Radio, Choice of Colors, Stop Watch, Voice Recorder, FM Recorder, Free Arm Band)" --- Only flash memory players have these essential features such as the important Stop Watch to check your heart beat after your huge rock out session listening to your FLASH MP3 player
Average is dumb
You should know no to post a no-ip.com site on /., its been slashdotted already. go here instead: http://www.neurosaudio.com/
Anyone who is capable of getting themselves made President should on no account be allowed to do the job. - HHGTTG
Hmm, if you fall for Apple marketing, OK, but then other HDD players are long past being an initial draft.
But I must agree, MiniDisc as hardware is just rocksolid.
I have a Rio Carbon. I love it.
o .html one for about eighty dollars, or build one found in the premier issue of MAKE http://makezine.com/
Before I answer your 5 criteria, I will say that it holds 5 Gigs, which is more than I ever will need (about 1800 songs at 128 kbit). Now:
1. It connects to the PC, and when synced, you can play music off of it through the simpl USB 2.0 connecter. (No bulky base station required) from which you can do anything wirelessly. As to easy access, while it takes about 2 seconds to write a song on USB 1.1, or less than a second with USB 2.0 (I only use 128kb) it takes VERY little time to load a song
2. having a CD player built into the base station would be costly and inefficient. The software that came with my rio allows you, if you wish, to rip music directly from a CD into the player (Unlike the ipod, although someone might tell me if this is possible to do with a mac to an ipod. It is not possible with a PC)
3. They do build car stereos with RCA inputs.
4.I agree with you here, and won't point out the obvious economic solutions...
5. For wireless headset, you can buy http://www.bigfrogmountain.com/soltronixsolarradi
Off topic: I also want to say that buying an MP3 player with a built in FM radio seems kind of pointless, unless it has a built in recorder that can upload to my PC. I could then edit out static/advertisements, etc. but I doubt any portable MP3 players on the market are capable of this.
Don't you mean.. BIZZARO!
Basic conclusion? Determine your size needs. This is based on A. How long do you listen it in one go. B. What is your tolerance for repeats. C. How often do you chance your songs. If you use it 4 hours per day, can't stand to hear the same song more then once in a week and never replace your songlist you are going to need more space then someone who likes to listen to the same album over and over again. HD's also can be damaged more easily by extreme rough use. Not by carrying them with you in your pocket while running but if you throw your stuff around the hd might not survive. For most people there will be no problems.
So don't be tempted by "extras". Extras are easy. Making a damned good solid mp3 player is not.
As for the whole wma nonsense. My hearing is pretty bad but on the whole
MMO Quests are like orgasms:
You may solo them, I prefer them in a group.
Woah there! Put down the Kool-Aid, pal. You're still clinging to your Newton, aren't you?
Repeat after me: "Apple is a mindless, soulless corporation that would be just as evil as Microsoft if they had the marketshare. They do not care about me or what I do, so long as I don't 'steal' their intellectual property or post leaked pictures of their new products to the web."
Then again, I just got rid of my IIgs last year...
i personally find portability as one of the highest priorities when deciding on an mp3 player. just like the same reason I chose the IBM X31 as my laptop, I like devices I'm carrying around to be light and easy to use.
Weighing a ton or won't fit nicely in my pocket is not a valid excuse for having tons of features.
HD Trailers
http://www.mirrordot.org/stories/4d12acb0722715b19 eb0a3491221d3ab/index.html Mirrordot mirror of the /.ed page
Unfortunately I cannot find this funny yet as the humorous commentary has been slashdotted.
It's amusing to see how an article specifically about flash based MP3 players can be construed as "anti Apple" simpyly because it neglects to mention the iPod, even though the iPod is HDD based and as such completely irrelevant to the article... it's like complaining that an article on F1 racing doesn't mention your favourite Indycar legend...
This actually isn't bad advice. I was very surprised not to see something like: "Make sure your MP3 player supports Microsoft's latest DRM to make sure artists get paid for their hard work." or something similar...
But, here are some additional things to consider:
1) Upgradeable firmware - OH SO IMPORTANT... bugs will be found and fixed, and new codecs will be developed.
2) OGG, OGG, OGG...
3) Battery life
4) User Interface - try them all out before you buy to make sure you can deal with it. I have two i-rivers, on 395 and one newer 512MB (can't remember the number)... the 395 has a strange UI that I still can't get used to... Jog right to scroll down and jog down to cancel... eek..
Personally, I love both of my i-River players.. the line-input recording is a great feature, too..
That's the MS way - "How can we force/decieve people into using this?".
Now, if MS wants to really do us a favor, they'd go for : Worksforsure or better : "Writesforsure" to ensure maximum compatibility betwen office suites ( MS Office, StarOffice, KOffice, whatever...)
2. Make sure you're getting all the goodies.
accesories for the ipod are avilable to make it do almost anything. In addition, you can put linux on your iPod and get even more features for free!
3. You'll want a display. ... yet they suggest getting a flash based unit with not much memory... anyway, iPod's certainly have a display (sans the shuffle).
This is interesting because they say the reason is you have so many songs
4. Let a professional make your next playlist.
Meaning, get one with a radio. The whole point of an mp3 player is so you dont have to listen to the crappy radio.
5. Pick the right size for you.
The iPod is bigger than all the ones they suggest, so it certainly exceeds their recomendation.
or else!
From the webpage:
128Mb = 60 Songs.
256Mb = 100 Songs.
is vendor lock in only good when microsoft utilizes it in OS & Office apps???
Politics is Treachery, Religion is Brainwashing
It's just a matter of finding the right crack-head after the fences are closed. $20 iPods, $50 notebooks... not free market, but liberated.
It just gets more far fetched all the time, doesn't it folks?
OMG Apple is teh expensive. Other players are waayyy cheaper!
- Really, how can I find a player that's comparable and cheaper?
It's easy! Step one: Find a crack-head...
The irony is that the Play for Sure system does NOT mean that the songs download from Play for Sure sellers will work in Play for Sure players. Play for Sure is pure marketing BS. Check out this informative article from Freedom to Tinker.
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
....everybody seems to be defending their mp3 player I though I should defend mine. Personally I have a Sony Network Walkman NW-MS70D which I think is great. It's small, light, good battery time and great storage. Right now I have about eight different play lists, all about the length on a normal cd (and I could probablly have at least a couple more). Given; the quality is lower than what you could get with an iPod, but I only use it when I?m moving around so quality isn't the biggest issue. When I want to listen to Jazz I do it in the comforts of my own home.
Anyway, you should probably consider your need and budget before buying an mp3 player (wow really? Oh my yes). I have friends with iPods and whatnots that doesn't really use them that much. If your going to buy an expensive player make sure your going to use it first, and that you're not just buying one to have one.
In this completely unbiased article with absolutely no underlying agenda or ulterior motive whatsoever, the Redmond Beast makes a humanitarian effort to warn you about certain pitfalls that dot the path of buying a portable digital music player, so that you don't wind up with a music device without a built-in stopwatch, which, of course, would be a fate worse than death. Here, with brief summaries of Microsoft's explanations, are the six tips that could save you from inadvertently spending all eternity in Flash Hell:
1. Understand the basics, i.e. flash players are inherently better than hard-drive players because they don't skip unless you throw them at the water just right.
2. Make sure you're getting all the goodies, i.e. you just won't be happy unless your player can record FM radio and includes, for some reason, a stopwatch.
3. You'll want a display, i.e. there's no nobler way to die than by trying to change songs with a three-line, teensy-button human interface while jogging and being struck down by a Dodge Stratus.
4. Let a professional make your next playlist, i.e. why listen to your own music when you can listen to nonstop commercials and obnoxious local DJs on FM radio? And record them digitally, so you can share that great beer jingle with your friends and loved ones?
5. Pick the right size for you, i.e. Windows Media is great, and we just wanted to harp on that for a minute. Have we mentioned that Windows Media is great?
6. Don't get locked into one online store; it is, however, just fine to get locked into one proprietary data format and DRM scheme-- as long as it's ours.
Interestingly enough, before it was refined into the Six Commandments you see above, an earlier draft version of the list was considerably terser. AtAT operatives have secured a copy, and it seems to imply that Microsoft might have had some sort of unstated underlying objective in mind when it put these tips together, although we're having a tough time seeing just what it might have been. Maybe you can help:
1. Don't buy an iPod, iPod mini, or iPod photo.
2. Don't buy an iPod shuffle.
3. Don't buy an iPod shuffle.
4. Don't buy an iPod shuffle.
5. Pick the right size for you (as long as you don't buy an iPod shuffle).
6. Don't buy an iPod of any kind whatsoever.
We know the hidden message is there, lurking just beneath the surface. Maybe these three additional tips found in another draft unearthed by faithful viewer DT will shed some light on the subject:
1. Make sure your flash player isn't white. You don't want to get it all dirty now, do you?
2. If your flash player has a fruit on it, you might get poisoned by insecticide.
3. Always listen to Uncle Bill; he knows what's best for you.
Hmmmm. Nope, it's still a mystery. Impenetrable. Guess we'll never know.
Say, is that the smell of fear wafting over here from the Pacific Northwest?...
What I want should have been on the market some time ago. Small like a CD player but takes DVD media. Small to largish screen would be nice, enough to scroll though 10 selections at a time.
Ipod is nice, but it's spendy and it's battery life is very limited.
Digital media players are cool and great for jogging but not everyone has the ability to play them. Media cost is high.
DVD-R MP3 can be played on most DVD players. It's an established technology already in use everywhere. The cost for the media is sub $1/disc or sub $5.00 for DL. Storage 4.7gig to 8.5gig DL. While it does require access to a DVD-R drive, those are priced under $100.
There is no sanctuary. There is no sanctuary. SHUT UP! There is no shut up. There is no shut up.
And then came Emacs... ok mabie your right.
even though, as much as I can understand, you can still add unDRMed MP3s to the IPod
My new blog
Hey buddy, you trying to start a holy war? What is it with you Kottke addicts?
It's not offtopic, dumbass. It's orthogonal.
Microsoft is making a mess of "Plays For Sure," its effort to provide an umbrella brand for non-Apple music players and download sites. "It makes the marketing for Microsoft Bob look masterful," he said. Which is not to say that he thinks marketing is the only issue. "They're taking a bunch of online sites that aren't that good, a bunch of products that aren't very good, and putting a logo on them. Every nickel they spend on this is a wasted nickel."
For a split second I thought about Baghdad Bob, but then, here's what his reference to Microsoft Bob means:
You may have heard jokes about some old failed Microsoft product called "Bob" or seen that big yellow smily face wearing nerdy glasses, and wondered "what the heck was that all about?".
Well, in early 1995 Microsoft released a software program called "Bob" designed to replace the desktop of Windows 3.1 and 95 with an interface designed mainly for novice users.
Microsoft held a big advertising campaign and loaded up stores with copies of Bob expecting huge sales. It totally flopped.
Found that at: Toastytech
Which makes me wonder, was Baghdad Bob named after Microsoft Bob after all?
Microsoft says 64kb/s WMA is CD quality.
What does that makes 128kb/s? Or 192kb/s? Sooperdooperaudiophonicbeyondcompare quality?
The only thing that is CD quality is...a CD. And while 128kb/s AAC is fine (and somewhat better than MP3 and WMA), it isn't even close to CD quality.
64kb/s? That isn't even FM radio quality. I'm not talking Clear Channel 99.something playing the top five hits over and over FM. I'm talking real FM quality (i.e. WGMS in Washington DC, or hundreds of PBS/NPR stations across the U.S.). Heck, I've not heard a WMA that I would compare to CD, and I'm not talking expensive stereos; I'm talking about listening on a stock car stereos.
I realize this is a silly rant, and there are people who listen who really can't tell the difference. But lets stop pretending on audio quality. It reminds of the 60's when every amplifier manufacturer was claming the most ridiculous power outputs until the government stepped in and made them stop.
You were mistaken. Which is odd, since memory shouldn't be a problem for you
Here's the google cache, in case the site get's slashdotted.
6. Don't get locked into one online store. Have you ever been on the hunt for a particular song? Some obscure indie rock tune or rare jazz performance you heard on the radio? You might have to shop at more than one store before you find the song you're looking for.
Do the different "stores" actually have significantly different content, other than artificial differentiation (like Apple Records hating Apple Computer)? Should they? I mean, there's no significant overhead for online stores to carry every track out there.
In practice, online DRM-protected music distribution will tend to become a "natural monopoly" like operating system software. You'd have your choice of half a dozen Clear Channel Radio equivalents all with he same content and all tied together behind the scenes to Microsoft. Choice would become the choice of buying your copy of Windows XP from CompUSA or MicroCenter.
Meanwhile, the "obscure indie bands and rare jazz performances" can be found without DRM on a CD from the band's own website or Amazon. I buy individual tracks from iTMS, but when I go to buy an album I pay a bit more and wait a bit longer to get a "clean" version.
I've bought more CDs in the past couple of months, since I got my iPod, than I've bought in the past couple of years before it. This makes me wonder about the industry. I sometimes wonder if they're not pushing DRM-protected music so hard they're trying to hurt CD sales...
Make sure your flash player isn't white. You don't want to get it all dirty now, do you?
(from one of the linked articles)
It's not offtopic, dumbass. It's orthogonal.
This statement makes the assumption that people that don't listen to the radio don't have other means of hearing new music.
One of the reasons I took my old walkman fishing and camping was the fact that it had a radio. It was nice being able to listen to tapes and it was nice to catch weather reports. Radios are very useful things at times and it's shocking to me that it's no longer fashionable to put them into portable media players.
There is no sanctuary. There is no sanctuary. SHUT UP! There is no shut up. There is no shut up.
Microsoft....... please die.
http://www.playsforsure.com/KeywordSearchResults.a spx?searchtype=keyword&show=1&keyword=ipod
:)
he he he he he
Arash
Arash Partow's Philosophy: Be a person who knows what they don't know, and not a person who doesn't know.
An IPod plus Radio Shark answers my needs.
- I can record CarTalk, PrairieHome, and Al Franken and listen to it when ever i want. A FM tuner buys me nothing.
I'm always suspicious about Microsoft motives - and I can't see any justification for MS to come over so pro-solid-state players. Sure solid state will likely prove more reliable (and probably requires less power) - but this is surely horses-for-courses?
I looked into getting an "MP3 solution" because I want to take my whole music collection with me in my car... 60GB would suffice - and if there was a _neat_ way to power the device from the car battery I wouldn't care if it wasn't truly portable. I was, however, under whelmed by what I could find... I can find expensive 20Gb players which require lots of wires to get them to work through the amp/speakers built into my car. Even the IPod (which is easily on of the better options) doesn't come with a simple cigarette-lighter cradle and built-in FM transmitter - at least not in the UK. I realise there are those who have devised home-brew solutions - but, to be honest, I don't have the motivation to put this together from scratch. I can hardly believe that manufacturers are crowding the "portable" player market while completely ignoring in-car entertainment.
Call me stupid, but I thought that the store using closed & DRMed formats were the ones doing the locking in, not the player that didn't support the locked format.
After all, had they used a open format, I would be able use it on any fscking device wouldn't I?
Not Buzzword 2.0 compliant. Please speak english.
And do MS really believe WMA is CD quality at 64kbps?
According to that page:
* Approximate figures based on CD-quality WMA (64 Kbps)
Going with the "they're secretly dissing the iPod Shuffle" line of logic here, (and not knowing much about the quality of the different codecs.) They probably used 64KBps in the chart since it'll make the (MS approved) PlayForSure players look like they hold more songs than the Shuffle.
Apple's advertising and materials boasts the Shuffle holds 120 or 240 songs respectively for the 512MB and 1GB models. Whereas a PlayForSure player holds 250 and 500+ songs for the respective memory capacities. Wow! Twice as many songs!
Hopefully averagegullibleconsumer won't look too closely and notice that Apple's claims are based on 128Kbps (AAC), MS' on 64Kbps (WMA.)
And if we take the MS critique further, note they also give Hours of play in the chart, 16 or 30+ hours, compare that to Apple's paltry 12 hour claim. (shh! don't tell anyone that one is music duration and the other is battery life!)
-gko
I own an iPod mini (that my wife absorbed as an appendage) and I returned my iPod Shuffle because I found it disappointing. I own tons of tracks from the iTMS, and while I think the store interface for iTunes is currenlty the best, eventually one of the other stores will rise to the challenge. For a long time you could argue that iTMS had the better selection, but the combined selection of the other stores is just as good (if not better) and I can use any player I like. I have my eye on a non-Apple player now and the current task of freeing my iTMS purchases of their digital shackles is a pain. Yes, there will be digital shackles on my other online purchases as well, but will it be as painful since they are in a format that every other player on the market uses? I'll probably still find a way to unlock those new tracks if for no other reason than to "stick it to the man (TM)", but it probably won't be with any sense of urgency.
I know Apple runs the iTMS purely to sell iPods, but currently it is that business model that has me looking at alternatives.
The battery type. Many of the existing MP3 players use proprietary accumulators. It becomes a problem once you have to replace them, which you certainly will, as there is a limited number of times you can recharge them.
That's why, for me, a very important information is whether an MP3 player uses normal AA or AAA batteries. If it does, it's a winner, because I know I will always be able to find *cheap* Li-ion replacements for my gadget.
Sigged!
Microsoft is a corporation. They are going to place articles on their site that is favorable to them and hurtful to their competition. Why would we expect anything different from any other corporation?
I thought that the store using closed & DRMed formats were the ones doing the locking in, not the player that didn't support the locked format.
No, it's the music publishers and record labels that do the locking-in. The stores just do their bidding.
"Over 500 songs" for 1GB (the number Microsoft is claimng) is 2MB per song. That equates to 500 4 minute songs at 64Kbps total bitrate.
Microsoft could be using songs from video games such as Dance Dance Revolution, Beatmania IIDX, and In The Groove. Those are typically cut to 1:30 to 2:10 and would take up 2MB. (period)
Theres an hyperlink to M$ PlayforSure.com music business lobby.
You can search for "iPod", but you won't get what you were expecting...
Is this legal in the US? They're using the well-known trademarked name to divert people to something else...
Sometimes you want to play just that exact song, sometimes you want to listen through some new albums, sometimes you just want to listen to *anything*. The iPod works for me because it does all of those things and it does them well. I also find that iTunes helps with this because of stuff like Smart Playlists - you just can't do that kind of stuff in the file system without massive lag as it creates the internal database within the device, on battery time instead of as you go on your PC.
The other day I tried looking for a specific song on a friend's Zen, and it took freaking forever to scroll through everything. I'm sure it does the other scenarios, but without being good at all three, it's just painful. A music player device whose major point is a large capacity should never suck at navigating. I've had a flash player, a CD player and a mini disc, and I never used those, because they couldn't cope with navigating.
Extra features are hard to decide on. You don't really *know* if you'll make use of FM radio, voice recording, calendars, to-do's, notes or the bundled partridges in pear trees. I have all five Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy books in my iPod's notes section and I enjoy playing the breakout clone, but that wasn't even a primary factor when I chose my device, it's just something I decided to like afterwards after having tried it out.
why did Microsoft release these tips so late? this would have helped before Apple released thier product...
Some people believe 1-1=3 and for the sake of being politically correct, we should respect their differences
Expecting an ad to be accurate is like expecting a fart to smell like perfume.
There are several ironies that one cannot help poke fun at:
A professional what? Playlists are bought and sold. There's about as much 'professional insight' in radio playlists as there is in coming up will silly ways of walking.
How about "don't get locked into one OS/Office Suite/browser vendor"? Just couldn't resist that one.
Also, people should remember that this ad came from a corporation. Corporations are by definition non-living entities which have the capacity to act as if they were living beings. In other words, they enjoy many of the same rights and benefits as living, breathing human beings (more, in fact), but have no internal moral code to speak of, since they're not people. Without an internal moral code, they could be accurately thought of as severely mentally ill.
So, you could interview any severely mentally ill individual and get information just as good/delusional as you get from Microsoft:
Maybe
I love how MS airbrushed Apple out of the portable music world. The whole line about online music stores that misses out the biggest, iTunes, is hilarious really. The fact that MS won't acknowledge their main competitor's existence (let alone superiority in some cases) suggests to me that they're probably going to release a music player themselves soon.
There are 2 types of people in the world, those who find that stupid binary joke funny, and those who don't.
From the article: "6. Don't get locked into one online store. Have you ever been on the hunt for a particular song? Some obscure indie rock tune or rare jazz performance you heard on the radio? You might have to shop at more than one store before you find the song you're looking for."
Ok. I call bullstuff. Show me **ONE** radio station anymore that even aspymptotically approaches indie rock songs or rare jazz performances.
Lame.
"Lawyers are for sucks."
- Doug McKenzie
Poor little you, yes it does need an OS.
Do you think those menus and song list, and reaction of the player to the button play being pressed is the inherent result of the look of your device (anything that has a triangle on it will make anything its stuck on "play"). Dude, your microwave has an OS, it's not Windows or Linux but it is an OS.
i would encourage anyone who has a daily commute or spends time driving for business to crank the radio over to AM and scan some channels for talk. i've found myself over the last few months when traveling for business (after getting off those damn tin-can jets), listening to more and more talk radio. The crazy right-wingers, the wacko liberals and all the other junk in between and learned a lot. Seriously, found a new show (new to me anyway) Handle on the Law, some guy who's last name is Handle (sp?) that takes calls on legal matters, large and small. Very, very interesting and tons of info i don't normally even think about. Also, it'll do everyone good to listen to right/left wingers in the same day - it'll open your eyes to some real wackiness and some real truths.
:)
:)
Parent is right on; ditch that crappy, re-played and re-played nonsense and give some talk a shot - it will make you think (sometimes not very kind thoughts, but hey, it happens).
If all else fails, scan the FM dial for a well-funded NPR station - the less-well-funded ones cannot afford to carry 'good stuff' 24/7 so they revert to lesser programming, but give it a spin anyway - you will learn something.
FM radio does not suck globally.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
the only thing this article didn't have was a pretty woman drinking coffee.
It should be noted that while AAC is "open", it is patent encumbered. If you want to write a software AAC encoder or player, you need to pay Dolby. Although there are open source decoders, their legal status is unclear. Of course, you also need to pay Microsoft for WMA, bit it is a little cheaper. The same applies to Fraunhofer for MP3 if I believe, although I can't find pricing information right now. Unfortunately, the most free and open format lacks market penetration.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I have never purchased an FM radio for under $50 that actually was able to pick up 1/2 the stations in town.
Last thing I need is another crappy FM tuner.
WRONG!
They do have 1 legit point: the iPod/iTunes combo is the worst for lock-in.
So, I'd like to find a player that supports MP3, WMA, and AAC (OGG would be nice too). Is there such a thing? I realize that this would not include the apple drm.
Fortunately, anything with video (ie. MP4) will support AAC. Since Nokia has now signed on with MS, I guess future Nokia phones will meet this criteria. Speaking of which, if I get a symbian phone with music capabilities, I can add stuff like Ogg myself. I wonder if music phones are any good for sound quality.
So you can enjoy the Blue Screen of Death!
You can match logos. When you see it on a device and on an online store you know the two will work together with a no hassle. It just works!
Plus, they didn't capitalize each word of It Just Works (tm) or add the trademark symbol.
Take the ABX challenge.
EAC to rip.
LAME 3.90.3 --alt preset standard
or --alt preset extreme
to encode.
99% of the population (regardless of equipment) can not tell the difference between these MP3s and source.
Do a blind test with your ABX program of choice.
Post your results.
WRONG!
iPod mini uses a HD.
I have to aggree with Microsoft on this. Players that conform to the MS suggestion list are more flexible. I like having FM tuner in my 1GB Flash based player. And if I ever do decide to buy music online I will not be looking at iTunes for it I like to have many choices in where I go. Ok so the stop watch thing is a bit of a strech but..
What mp3 player n00b is going to read this? Microsoft's site is huge. If it's not on the front page, it's likely that no one will read it. I hardly think it's a treat to the iPod.
Took me all of about 45 seconds to find a 512mb MP3 player for less than $100 ($85 in fact). Free shipping too. Also USB flash drive and voice recorder.
BUSLink 512MB MP3 Player w/ Flash Drive & Voice Recorder
I rather like the shuffle because I excercise daily. The IPod or IPod mini is too big and bulky. The Shuffle is perfect and because it plays in random mode it is great that no song will be repeated too quickly.
Here is how I use the shuffle. Load up the device with songs for your mood. Then excercise, but that might take 45 minutes or an hour and a half. Repeat for six or seven times. At the end of the week reload with new songs.
If you don't like the shuffle, well the shuffle is not for you. It is for me for people who literally count the grams that they have to carry when they are out and about.
"You can't make a race horse of a pig"
"No," said Samuel, "but you can make very fast pig"
that's what i'm talking about. NOONE is getting 500 songs on a 1gb flash player. even us normal nonaudiophiles aren't going to encode at 64kbps--
The Wolfkin
I was recently given an o-k MP3 player - Sandisk 256 meg - for an early birthday present, and I've found I like the radio almost more than the stored music. Listening to the radio while running around doing chores is great - and I can listen to my favorite station in the car without mom changing the station. :)
I can see how some people wouldn't want one, though. I really enjoy having one, though.
Most consumers care far more about name recognition and how "cool" a DAP is than how big it is. That's proven in the marketplace.
"Many portable music players can do more than just play music. Some players have a built-in voice recorder, FM recorder, or stopwatch. And some come with extra accessories like high-quality headphones, a belt clip, or an armband. Because most of these features are included at no additional cost, make sure the device you choose is filled with these fun extras."
That's free as in sky giving me a 'free' satellite dish so long as I pay then £100 for the next ten years.
They don't even make many watches with stop-watch timers and calculators built in any more, so why would anyone want an mp3 player with one.
"3. You'll want a display.
When you have hundreds of songs on your player, you really need an easy way to select your music by artist, album, or genre. This is critical if you want to find that one song or artist you really want to hear. A display also comes in handy when you're looking for your favorite radio station."
I'm sorry, but do they make MP3 players that play songs you don't want to hear?
"Having an FM radio lets you put your player on autopilot as you mountain bike, cycle, or rollerblade. "
So does random and statistics based playlists. What's more, it will only play the songs you want to hear, and without advertising or payola.
"6. Don't get locked into one online store."
Well there's an easy answer to that one...
thank God the internet isn't a human right.
and the sequel, too.
"Radio is *not* the only way to hear no things, and is my experience, the *worst* way to hear anything new and fresh."
That's the case, but for times of extreme emergency. And event like 9/11 will go unheard by an MP3 player, but if you can tune in to ANY FM station, they'll cover the BIG stories of the day, and in some cases could alert you to incoming threats. Heaven knows Clear Channel would jump at the chance to scare Americans.
Saskboy's blog is good. 9 out of 10 dentists agree.
...and ofcourse, try to stay away from devices with an embedded iAnus port, for no other reason than they smell bad.
.. but I recall an article, where in the Redmond campus only employees, who used MS mp3-wma players, were the ones directly involved with the product. Everyone else who bothered to spend some bucks on the portable player, went for an iPod.
The base Shuffle player holds 512 MB of music in a proprietary format.
Oh, the "proprietary format" boogyman.
The iTunes Music Store sells DRMed music, the iPod supports that music on the go.
BUT THE iPOD PLAYS MP3s JUST FINE.
You can't take the sky from me...
Well I don't really listen to singles that much. I listen to music by albums which fits nicely in my lifestyle (hour long commutes to Uni). For playback on the PC I use foobar2000, but overall just dragging songs on my P.C. to my Zen without having to worry about wether they are in the music library just makes it easier.
I don't use the FM Radio, or even the calender features, but I do use some of the subtler things like Album of the Day, easy Removable disk, and the ability to charge from any USB2 cable rather than a proprietary cable. A personal music player is a very personal thing and not everyone suits an iPod.
Oh did I mention that the Zen Micro fits perfectly in a mint tin?
"Some obscure indie rock tune or rare jazz performance you heard on the radio? You might have to shop at more than one store before you find the song you're looking for." well, go to Roadrunner on 43rd and Nicollet. http://www.landspeedrecords.com/
MP3, not whatever proprietary DRM format they are pushing in their online store.
My take:
If the mp3-player doesn't work with regular usb mass storage device drivers it probably sucks. If I have to install your closed source program to use the mp3-player I will not buy it.
I don't want a display. I can hear what music I am listening to thank you, I don't need a display to tell me that. A display is a sign of bad usuability and design. A mp3-player with a display will most certainly have lots of crappy features noone needs, whereas a player without must have a better design to Just Work.
I don't want fancy features, equalizer options etc. No FM-radio, no weird repeat options, just a play/pause/stop-button, volume control and perhaps a change song button. (see above).
Build one and I will buy it.
why did you buy a MP3 player in the first place?
No application needs an operating system. No matter what the problem.
It's programmers that need operating systems.
Just hauling some bits out of a fat file system, parsing them, shoving the name of song out to an LCD and the body of the song through a decoding algorithm is something a skilled programmer could do without an OS. If you are selling a gazillion players, and save $0.10 on each one by not having to buy and feed and OS, you've paid the cost differential between a lowly code grinder and a studly systems programmer.
But it's a tough market out there. If you don't want to compete on price alone, and you've done all you can with plastic molding, at some point you're going to start piling on software features. And at some point even the studliest of systems programmers is going to get overwhelmed with details.
Not that I'd ever buy a music player that needs an operating system, but that won't stop them from trying to sell me one.
Post may contain irony: discontinue use if experiencing mood swings, nausea or elevated blood pressure.
I find the most useful feature of an mp3/radio combo is the ability to record from the radio. You can use that for time-shifting actual programs, or for getting free music in the rare case that the stuff the RIAA has paid the radio station to promote is actually worth listening to.
... but you dish it out like if you were the ultimate authority about the matter.
2.- The goodies.
I used to carry an FM radio, a voice recorder for business meetings and one old MP3 player.
By being "gullible" (how much patronizing can you get?) I managed to reduce my need of different devices fomr 3 to 1, which is far much comfortable, by getting a player with all the fucntionalities.
3. Display
The jury is still out there in regards of the lack of display as a feature. You make it appear like it is all done and dusted, which is patently disingineous. I have never used the shuffle mode, for classical music fans the shuffle mode is a completely nonsensical thing (for the gullible as surely you would put it if you were a classical music fan), people attached to their albums (of any genre) will be horrified to serve their beloved albums in a order chosen by their player.
It may be useful for some, but to try to sell a clear downgrading as a feature is the most shameless PR stunt Apple is attempting. They are selling something crippled compared to the competition but they are not straightforward about it. we are adult enough to be told that they went that way in order to offer a more affordable player. They should teel us so and stop the nonsense about randomizing your life and al other claptrap. I hope this one comes to bite them in the ass.
4. Radio.
Look, if radio where you live sucks is not anybody's fault. The almost complete industry of music players rightly understands that radio is a valuable addition, specially if you can record using the capabilties of your player. In many places radio is a great way of entertainment that provides different alternatives to your music collection. Apple is pretty much the only one that stubbonly refuses to recognize this trend, which is practically a standard. That is their problem but that does not mean that just because Apple is doing it they are right.
5. Size.
This comment is absoultely preposterous.
256MB is 4 CDs, which for many people may be more than enough. As long as the price is fair (many players with this memory or less are insanely cheap) who do you think you are to say if this does not fit the needs of somebody else?. More gratuitious patronizing.
6.- Store lock in.
Although MS has no moral high ground regarding this one they are correct, one should look for the player that offers the widest choice possible if you want to buy music on line. The more shops the better, to marry oneself to one shop for all your music consumption is completely silly.
In my opinion the action people should thake is to avoid shops in their current form until they sort out all the interoperability problems amongst themselves once the people ignore them. But that is not happening, so people should exercise caution.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
You should for one moment pause and think that radio may be much better in other places where people may benefit from a music player with radio reception capabilities.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
6. Don't get locked into one file sharing program. Have you ever been on the hunt for a particular song? Some obscure indie rock tune or rare jazz performance you heard on the radio? You might have to search on more than one network before you find the song you're looking for."
***
1 is stating the obvious Batman, thanks for pointing it out.
2 is subjective. But you would know that if you had passing knowledge about user interface design. So mooth point.
3, again is subjective, which means, yet again, it is irrlevant.
Suggestion: do not go into marketing, you are a company buster waiting to be left lose in the wild.
IANAL but write like a drunk one.
I don't know.... I can see the validity to the argument that the Shuffle lowers the bar for "Apple quality" - since it's just a "me too" flash player for people who only shop for "cheap".
On the other hand, it went along with the Mac Mini, which is another experiment by Apple to cater to the lower end of the market - and most people consider the Mac Mini a stunning success.
I'd never buy a Shuffle, but by the same token, I'd also never buy an iPod Mini. They seem like "all style, no substance" to me. You pay close to the price of a player that can store 4x as much music or more, and you get the exact same thing except in a little bit smaller, colored casing? But nonetheless, it was a huge success.
Sometimes, you can't just go by the "feature set for the $" to determine what will be a "hit". It may determine what the "technophiles" among us buy, but the general public has other motivations. I've talked to a number of iPod Mini customers, and generally - they don't do lots of MP3 downloading. They jusy buy a few things here and there off iTunes and rip the CDs they already own - so 5GB is plenty of space for 'em.
Umm no. He said that using something that uses AA batteries is bad. There are thousands of products that use other kinds of batteries.
is the one feature they left out. Making an MP3 (or even better, Vorbis) player that has hard-wired flash memory is for the BIRDS. The days of a disposable player are ovar! You had your marketing chance at first, and if you blew it, you blew it; take it like a man.
I also prefer AA/AAA's to proprietary batteries. Which is why I bought the Rio Sport (S-35). It's an older player, and it's very "no frills", but it takes AAA's and has a card slot.
Jetaudio's products would be good if they'd just include a card slot. Many of JA's players handle Vorbis, and are small enough to take on the treadmill or track.
Creative is a lost cause.
MP3 doesn't compress "classical" music very well, and if I was using any kind of player while sitting in front of a computer, I'd be using a portable DVD player and a blank-video AC3 audio stream (60+ hours per disk of 160kbps AC3 stereo audio, yo!). If you're sitting in front of a computer and using a player, get yourself a portable DVD player and make a AC3 audio stream, and never look back. It's very easy to do using Besweet and Tmpgenc DVD Author, and you can designate "chapters" at each song for easy fast forwarding.
A personal music player is a very personal thing and not everyone suits an iPod. Bingo. It's so nice hearing this for once and not something insulting involving the words hippies, cult, cool and hip. Everyone's different. It's all good.
You don't have to need to listen to singles all that often to see why it's good to be able to find any given song quickly. It's one of those features that just must be right if you're going to make a music player device - imagine a phone where entering the digit 5 is hard. That wouldn't make a lot of sense.
When I use my iPod on commutes, I occasionally use shuffle (for the insane OMG FANBOY people who need this spelled out: no, not because I'm an Apple fan, but because I've been using shuffle since I first started using Winamp lots of years ago) but mostly I use Smart Playlists that change every time I sync them - songs without rating and so on (I rate them as I listen). Even knowing why the cable is proprietary and why they can't change it (it's a long story; I once wrote a comment on it) it's a valid point.
I carry my mp3 player with me to work and back and use it for listening to mp3s about 99% of the time. However, when I am driving, I listen to NPR on the car's stereo. On at least 4 occassions (I've only had it for 2 months), I have used the FM radio on my mp3 player to allow me to leave the car during a "driveway moment", so I could listen to the rest of the story on NPR without having to sit in the parked car for another few minutes. Although that is the only reason I ever use the FM function on my player, there are millions of people who like the radio and I think they would probably get a lot more use out of that than I do.
The truth doesn't care what I think.
The iPod supports a number of popular formats, including MP3 and WAV, but not WMA (they would have had to pay licensing fees to Microsoft). Just because Apple did not support Microsoft's format, many people are insisting that its vendor lock-in. There is nothing preventing another music download service to open up tomorrow and offer MP3's or AAC's for sale (some already do), that will be compatible with the iPod.
Then is the question of motives. It has been shown that Apple makes nearly no profit off the iTMS anyway, as its probably true that the entire effort was aimed at selling more iPods. What reason do they have to lock-in users anyway? It would actually be to Apple's benefit if other music services aimed to sell music for the iPod.
The whole idea of Apple trying to force iPod users to use the iTMS is totally untrue. Why, then, would they even allow iPod users to rip from CD's or import audio files that they already had?
There is nothing stopping a competent, intelligent person like yourself from replacing the rechargable battery inside the Shuffle. How hard could it be?
:-D No hard feelings.
Assuming that everything is built for the ages, there's no reason not to assume that you can't replace the battery.
Buying and disposing of replaceable batteries is much worse 'for the ages'. Buying and disposing of replacable rechargables isn't much better. Maybe you could refurbish your own rechargable batteries by replacing or restoring the tired cells (but you might have to dispose of some chemicals unless you can reionize that too)!
If you don't, you're really just committing to the disposable culture.
Where does your argument begin and end? What should or shouldn't be recycled rather than repaired or replaced?
Read Heinlein's 1953 Revolt in 2100, now more than ever.
Microsoft is just trying to spread the misinformation by making consumers think that iPod only works with iTunes, which is untrue.
If you don't know what AltaVista is (was), get off my lawn.
I think Microsoft is offering some good advice. And best of all, it applies not just to MP3 players, but to all computer hardware you might be considering. For example, I am in the market for a new desktop.
1. Understand the basics.
OK.
2. Make sure you're getting all the goodies.
Like iLife?
3. You'll want a display.
Wait, are you saying I should get an iMac?
4. Let a professional make your next playlist.
Well, Apple does seem willing to sell and support most of the hardware and software I'll need.
5. Pick the right size for you.
Capacity Number of songs Hours of play
128 MB 60 4
256 MB 100 8
512 MB 250 16
1 gigabyte Over 500 30+
Cuz no one will ever need more than 1 gigabyte.
6. Don't get locked into one online store.
Because consumers deserve multiple choices and open standards.
A slashdotter at the gym??
WTF?
Thank you. This reminds me of the second mouse button thing. Which is better: a crappy UI that requires a tiny three line display, or an elegant UI that doesn't need a screen at all? Music is very popular with the blind. An MP3 that doesn't require a screen is what these folks (a tiny market, to be sure) have been waiting for. Too bad iTunes isn't compatible with any screen readers!
I paid the going retail price for a Windows screen reader and got a free Unix computer!
It meats 2) Goodies (Games, notes, scheduling, contacts) 3) Display, 4) Playlists (iTunes generates playlists based on YOUR needs) and 5) Size. So the iPod matches 4 of 6. 4 is greater than 0.
Well, in response to the article, I think it makes sense in this case to buy...a Pocket PC:
1) The basics - my PPC uses (64 MB) SD and (512 MB) CF memory to hold a lot of 256 kbps MP3 files. I can take it jogging, in the NYC subway, and at work, and attach it to my belt with a nice hard plastic clamshell to protect my Dell Axim.
2) All the goodies - you mean you have FM radio and included speakers? I can have GPS, games, and develop MY OWN PROGRAMS for my music player. Oh, and voice recorder, notes ability, and Office sync. And this other thing called WiFi. Woohoo!
3) My display is more intuitive than yours! And I can view web pages on mine...
4) I can access and stream online (ad-free) radio stations using a free player with the little wiFi available...or pay for an FM-enabled CF upgrade.
5) Pick the right size, eh? And upgrade at a whim...using my mix of 32, 64, 256, and 512 MB CF and SD cards, I can fit a iPod shuffle's worth and then some...oh, and would you believe WMP on the PPC actually has this "shuffle" feature. STOP THE PRESSES!
6) Online store...whatever. I can use iTunes to "buy" songs if I wish or get them free through various promos (Paypal, Pepsi, etc.) and burn them from to a CD. Then, using Musicmatch, burn them to hi-quality MP3s and copy to my PPC. DRM...oh that! Oh, and I can play WMAs on my PPC...can you do that on your iPod?
And the funny thing is these PPCs when there's a Slickdeal, can be cheaper than the 20GB iPod and much more useful as an all-in-one device. Which is why I canceled my order for an iPod shuffle...twice, because I couldn't live with myself if I bought that rip-off. Anyway, with computers so ubiquitous today, how often do you really use the full 12+ hours of music on YOUR device without "plugging in"?
And what else is cool...I wear my Axim in a sexy silver clamshell and turn more heads than an iPod because it is...different. They ask, "You mean...that's a computer? Cool!" Otherwise, "Oh, another iPod - that's SO 2004!"
This sig donated to Pater. Long live
people use bose headphones to listen to 64K WMA. Better than yours I bet.
There is a spark in every single flame bait point.
The player and jukebox software combo should support music formats of AAC with Freeplay DRM. After all the iTMS gets exclusive deals for those hard to find songs you might be wanting occasionally.
- Tjp
I am in wallow with my inner money grubbing capitalistic pig. ... Oink!
I'm going to repeat something that got lost in the mindless drivel many of you posted. I posted this but I don't think many of you bothered to read it, even though it was the second post 3rd post in this thread. "Um, I guess I wasn't clear, I was talking about ipod shuffles. I thought that was clear, maybe not though. I like the microdrive ipods, my sis has one, I wanted one before. The microdrive ipods have one thing above all other microdrive mp3 players, the interface, that's something I've said so many times, but anyways, I was talking about ipod shuffles, where you can't even see what you're scrolling through."
well, there were three reasons why I bough iRiver 20G jukebox - instead of an iPod :
1) No locking down to ONE SITE
2) Tone of features - which Apple does not offer: Mainly, fm tuner, voice recording (It's pretty amazing I can still listen to some cool jokes my friends made on me while visiting home sometimes back), recording from any other device directly to mp3, and reading directions on road with a text reader
(and also, pretty damn good audio, photo viewer - which may not be unique, but is at par)
3) Every Tom, Dick or Harry is carrying a 'cool' looking ipod (this one works for me - I never wanted to part of that crowd)
I never use the screen on my iPod. I run it in shuffle mode all the time. If I didn't already have a 20G model, I'd have seriously considered the shuffle.
Nobody will ever need more than 64Kbps.
Which would make manufacturing a global market MP3 player difficult. The iPod has a global market.
The title of the article is "Get 6 tips for buying an MP3 player with flash memory." The windows media devices page mentions a number of hard drive based solutions. But it's way more fun to ignorantly bash Microsoft! Woo hoo!
There was nothing unreasonable about the 6 tips. Active people don't want music that skips when they run. Extra features such as an fm tuner can be a nice addition. A screen is nice for searching around for the song you want to hear at the moment (Life isn't always random). It's always nice to have options for more than 1 place to get legal music online. etc. If it wasn't for the Apple zealots and the rabidly anti-Microsoft crowd, this wouldn't even be news.
Vote for Pedro
If you have ever studied the methods used by MP3 and AAC you would understand that while reproduction of the signal is not perfect it generally is close enough for MOST music at 128k-192k. At that rate most people not listening through a hifi, i.e. small ear-bud headphones will not tell the difference. That is why if you have a hifi buy a CD it is that simple.
and it didn't cost you anything to rip off Chris Rock's schtick from "Bigger And Blacker"
You want to have something that is fun, lightweight, and flexible. And FM radio is a key feature that many players offer at no extra cost, even for less than $100.
I didn't know that an FM Radio is such a key feature in an MP3 player. I must've been crazy for buying an iPod so I didn't have to listen to annoying DJ banter, commercials and music that sucks.
The whole criticism was that 64kbp/s lossy music compression is not CD quality despite what Gates & Balmer & Co claim.
If you have to qualify and say "Sound just like CD if you are listening through ear buds that aren't that good". I guess that lacks the marketing pizazz of outright lies.
I speak for all of us audiophiles when I say this.
Shut up.
Deja Vu
n. 1. The sensation that you've read this very article before.
eMusic is an online music store compatible with the iPod. So there.
One of my favorite shows on talk radio (got an fm talk station here, also mostly right wing, but not entirely) is also done by a lawyer. However he no longer practices (though he mentioned he still pays bar dues or whatever so he's probably still allowed) and has some other lawyer do the free leagle segment once a week.
Can't remember if he's got his own seperate site, but is the radio stations page on him.
If you're in the greater St. Louis area you might listen in. The rest of the stations weekday lineup is pretty much repitious political crap, but his show is pretty good.
Mycroft
https://signup.leagueoflegends.com/?ref=4c3ed6600b6ea
So you're saying that if Apple made a music player that looked and acted like the WMA compatible players, Apple would still be the market leader? Thank you sir, for your strong belief in Apple! We need more consumers like you!
It's mandatory to wash your hands before returning to the land of Dairy Queen.
That's all well and good, but any true "audiophile" would surely agree that compressing a song into lossy MP3 format does far more to destroy the nuances of the original work than "imperfect rendering of the square wave" due to use of single-ended, capacitor-coupled output.
Realistically, the differences in audio quality between an iPod Shuffle and a comparable flash player from, say, Creative, aren't enough to matter for users using earbud headphones of the quality included with any of these units.
The complaints about a Shuffle "lowering the bar" for Apple quality weren't really referring to quality of audio output anyway. They're talking more about stooping to the level of presenting a product that has no display screen whatsoever, has very limited storage space for music, and no extra "PDA type" capabilities to enhance its value.
Again, I don't personally think it was necessarily a bad move on Apple's part at all. I'm just playing "devil's advocate" here a bit... But let me at least put it this way. It's unlike the Apple I usually think of to release rather "stripped down" products that are aimed at the "mass market". (In fact, one might say the iPod Shuffle is sort of like Hasselblad releasing a disposable point-and-shoot camera for sale at major chain stores.)
No, what the parent said is true. Apple HAS done nothing to prevent users from getting their music from other sources.
Apple HAS done things to stop other sources from using Apple's DRM, or their own.
Real's perfectly free to sell un-DRM'd mp3s. In fact, they'd gain me as a very loyal customer if they did.
Endless arguments over trivial contradictions in books written by ignorant savages to explain thunder in the dark.
looks like modded by some iPod carrying apple whore!
How to buy an iPod Shuffle
1.) Replace Earbuds with significantly better headphones (more or less... everything else).
2.) Deal with Apple's AAC codec. Sure its "the devil", but its actually a documented and superior standard. (http://www.apple.com/mpeg4/aac/)
3.) Throw out your playlists, throw out your worries about what's going to be played next. PDA type functionality, a display, and solitare aren't going to be missed. That's why we have Gameboys and PDAs.
4.) Enjoy.
Deja Vu
n. 1. The sensation that you've read this very article before.
The shuffle's defining characteristic is not the shuffling on the unit itself. It's the way iTunes shuffles songs onto the drive.
Most flash players require a lot of manual tuning to get the song balance you want. iTunes uses your ratings and playcounts to intelligently select a new set of music every time you plug in the unit. That means you just plug the shuffle in and go. If you plug the shuffle in before the 240 song capacity of the shuffle wraps around, the shuffling its doing is equivalent to shuffling from your whole library.
Since 240 songs is about eight hours of music, most people will never notice that the shuffle has a limited capacity. Very few flash players do that, even though it's a fairly simple feature to implement in the management software.
Vinyl, or if one must, CD. Any compressed music format takes a hit in sound quality relative to the CD sound.
PC Magazine, April 12, 2005
Whoah, it's like, from the FUTURE!!!!
any true "audiophile" would surely agree that compressing a song into lossy MP3 format does far more to destroy the nuances of the original work than "imperfect rendering of the square wave" due to use of single-ended, capacitor-coupled output.
I call bullshit. Sure, any true audiophile believes that hunk of crap, but that doesn't make it true! Of course these formats are lossy, but the whole freaking point is that the losses are carefully selected to fool the human ear.
I challenge anyone to do a double-blind listening test (A-B-C where C is a random selection of A or B, A and B aren't known until after the test) on several songs, several times. Tally up your guesses and compare with the truth. Are you significantly better than random guessing? For any decent codec and bitrate, I assert that 99.999% of people don't beat the codec. The vast majority of audiophiles have never taken such a test, and therefore are living a lie!!
I don't know.... I can see the validity to the argument that the Shuffle lowers the bar for "Apple quality" - since it's just a "me too" flash player for people who only shop for "cheap".
I already had a full-size iPod and decided I wanted the Shuffle for its portability. I now use my regular iPod at work or plugged into a Bose SoundDock at home, but I carry the shuffle in my pocket just about every single day, as well as at the gym. Why? Because the shuffle is so small I don't even notice I have it. So, it's not just for "me too" people who only shop for "cheap".
"First you gotta do the truffle shuffle."
Actually, I haven't taken out the time to do your proposed double-blind test, but I *have* compared songs played from my original CD and from a resulting MP3 ripped from it, several times, back and forth. I'm quite certain the MP3 versions sound considerably worse in some cases.
Much depends on the type of music and the bitrate chosen though. (What's your definition of a "decent codec and bitrate" BTW? Personally, I've found I have to encode my MP3s at 192 bits before I consider them acceptably close to "CD quality". But I find the vast majority of MP3s in people's collections are only 128 bit. At 128-bits, such things as cymbal crashes sound "dull" compared to the original music, and sometimes the vocals even sound a bit "harsh" or "metallic" in nature.)
Nonethless, the DEFAULT setting for most MP3 encoders in software apps is 128-bits. Sometimes, I see a default of 160-bits, which is more sensible... But never have I seen them use 192-bit or higher as a default setting.
(And before people start telling me about variable bit-rate encoding being the "key" or whatever, understand that VBR breaks compatiblity with many devices, so I never considered it a real viable option. I've owned at least 2 or 3 set-top DVD players with supposed MP3 music capability that choked on VBR encoded MP3s.)
That's all well and good, but any true "audiophile" would surely agree that compressing a song into lossy MP3 format
So use lossless AAC or WAV, duh. iPods support both.
stooping to the level of presenting a product that has no display screen whatsoever
Then don't buy one.
It's unlike the Apple I usually think of to release rather "stripped down" products that are aimed at the "mass market".
"Mass market" means "cheap". Trying to compete with Dell on throwing cheap boxes together is like Walgreens trying to take on Wal-Mart. And frequently going for selling fewer but higher margin units can be much more profitable than throwing out cheap units just to gain marketshare. I was looking at a gaming magazine (PC Gamer? sorry no link) that showed that Nintendo makes more money than Sony with the release of a new console system, because although Sony sells more systems and games, Nintendo makes more money because they don't take a large loss on the hardware. Case in point: other than Dell or Apple, what other players have shown signifigant, consistant profits over the last few years?
Flac can be transcoded to any format you like without incuring loss.
Flac-> formatX will be as good as formatX can be.
MP3-> formatX will not be as good as formatX can be.
An APX MP3, while most likely perfect sounding to you, is a lossy format and does not contain all the data of the original track. Transcoding this into another lossy format only makes matters worse.
If I'm using a set-top player, though, I'm at home. The place where all the original CDs sit on the shelf, and contain all that lovely crisp sound quality, just waiting to be placed in my NAD dedicated CD player.
Lossy compression is for fitting lots of music on my iPod Mini, and for that purpose, using the headphones that came with it, outside where there is plenty of background noise, 128kb AAC does the job. It also copes with LAME --alt-preset-standard VBR encodes for anything that _does_ manage to fall apart on the lower bitrate, too.
"I Know You Are But What Am I?"