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Nintendo Revolution Details Emerge
Pyrohazard writes "Nintendo has posted some details on the Revolution to their official site, finally giving us some insight into what the console will be like. From the site: 'It will be about the thickness of three standard DVD cases and only slightly longer.' This makes it the smallest Nintendo console yet! It will also be able to stand up, similar to the PS2, and the Xbox 360. It will be backwards compatible, and it will also play '12cm optical disks in the same self-loading media drive'. It also states that it will have a very quick start-up time, and be very quiet. It finishes by stating 'Get ready for the Nintendo Revolution in 2006!'" C|Net has an article up arguing that Nintendo is making an error in missing the 2005 Holiday season.
It also states that it will have a very quick start-up time, and be very quiet.
Aiming to capture the market for game-playing wabbit hunters.
http://onefed.com/media/NintendoON.wmv
I guess the big N are counting on this console once again appealing to hardcore gameplayers, especially since you can't watch DVDs on this.
Are they making an error ?, possibly but depsite selling less consoles than sony and about the same as MS, the gamecube was supposedly very profitable. THe margins were supposedly higher and nintendo reckoned that the gamecube was never sold at a loss despite its low price.
In short Nintendo don't neccesarily have to shift more consoles than Sony and MS to stay in the console game.
I'd argue that Nintendo might be better served waiting until *after* the Christmas season. There's been several "OMG I must have!" Christmas toys that nobody can find, everybody's going onto Ebay and bidding hundreds of dollars for.
Then there's the games/items that come out in say, January, and do well. This strategy has served Blizzard very well with their "ship when its done". In some ways, Summer is actually a better launch date (kids getting out of school) and using that as a steady segway into greater sales.
Of course, this is just my opinion - I could be wrong.
52 Weeks, 52 Religions with John Hummel
Link worked just fine in my firefox...?
"This is Zombo Com, and welcome to you who have come to Zombo Com" - www.zombo.com
Water cooling doesn't mean the xbox360 is faster. It could be designed crappy, with bad airflow. Hell, if the revolution is that small, it wouldnt need water cooling. Also, the water cooling could've been added to make the xb360 sound that much powerfull, a marketing ploy, which if true, you've fallen for.
Check out this fan made video. It's really well done.
mirror 1
mirror 2
Article about video
It's apparently to be based on the same IBN PPC970 processors as the Xbox 360, as well as a custom graphics chip from ATI.
So I'm thinking the two consoles could be very similar indeed...
Gamers Europe - Gaming News. Reviews.
I do agree with the cnet artical that nintendo are going to miss a major sale period here if it is not out till 2006 but they may as of yet pull it forward .
,Which is a very good thing as we don't need another loud large monster console.
.Though let me put my pundit hat on , besides the normal conectivity ala the GBA and the gamecube i suspect the reveloution may have the ability to download the data from the cards and allow you to play GBA or DS games on the big screen using the DS as a wireless controler (with the touch pad screen perhaps still working as normal ) and perhaps multi player DS games can be played with Reveloution controlers for some titles which dont have a touch screen (unless nintendo take a leaf out of the dreamcasts book and include a screen on the controler , albeit with touch pad functionality. ;) so dont cite me on it.
Looks like they are taking a leaf out of the mac minis book with the form factor
Its wonderfull they have confrimed backwards compatability which will be very important in giving them a good start with a cataloug of games though they may be missing out here if they don't include some form of DVD playback.
I have argued a few times that its not the features that sell a console but the games , but all things being equal otherwise the features can make or break the sale.
I am awaiting news of the conectivity with the DS , this is pure idle speculation
That is pure idle speculation though
The only things certain in war are Propaganda and Death. You can never be sure which is which though
I think it could be a smart move. Think of it. The XBox and the PS3 will be going all out to steal each others' thunder, and the consumer market for consoles will be split. If Nintendo can handle staying out of the spotlight for a little while, and then show up the next year with a console superior to the other two and good lineup of games, all the attention will be focused on them. As it is, you could argue it's too early for a second XBox and a third Playstation. Nintendo's timing could be perfect.
"Finnally", "dosnt"... Considering your spelling qualities, I'm surprised you haven't had an article published sooner.
/. comment!
Oh, and my first
And wouldn't it be funny if it got modded down as Redundant?
It's interesting that all 3 console manufacturers chose IBM PPC processors this time around. It means that game developers programming in assembly language will only have to learn one. Too bad there aren't many left who do. (A fact of life when the bottlenecks move to memory/art/game-logic).
Because the GameCube used PPC, it looks like Nintendo will be the only one with an (relatively) easy backwards compatability story. The PS2 could perhaps be emulated since it was only a 300Mhz MIPS processor, but I pity the person that has to write the emulator for the pipelining stages on the VUs. Microsoft has not said whether they'll be backwards compatible, but I predict the answer is no.
Didn't Nintendo's president say in a press conference just a few months ago that the Revolution will actually have some feature that is "Revolutionary" that no one has seen before and will change console gaming forever? I remember a slashdot article about it but I cannot find a link to the specific "story" I'm thinking about.
:)
Perhaps something about the controller?
Or perhaps some obscure feature that we'll hafta wait longer to see?
I was hoping to see something about that in this article but I guess I will hafta wait longer... If anyone has a link to what I think I'm talking about, I'd appreciate it.
"This is Zombo Com, and welcome to you who have come to Zombo Com" - www.zombo.com
Has anyone who has read the C|Net article considered the source of this statement: "Sony has not said when it will release its next-generation console, tentatively named PS3, although industry watchers generally expect it to hit stores sometime next year." Who are these industry watchers, anyway? Yes, this seems to be the buzz that's about the net, but let's be fair minded here and assume that products can launch when they're not expected to, or not at all, and have in the past (think Duke Nukem Forever, and other vainglorious examples of vaporware in various technological fields).
The Crimson Dragon
"(Update 05/13/05) I have had a couple of readers that commented on Microsoft stating that the Xbox 360 was "water cooled." While this might be technically true, it carries a very heavy marketing spin in order to glom onto an enthusiast technology. To be succinct, the Xbox 360 is not water cooled in the way we, meaning just about every computer hardware enthusiast on the planet, tend to think of water cooling. The Xbox 360 motherboard we were shown did have a CPU heatsink in place that utilized a heatpipe. Yes, a heatpipe does have liquid in it and some H2O as well, but is usually primarily ammonia. In a heatpipe, the liquid at the "hot" end vaporizes, and is moved to the "cold" end of the heatpipe by a pressure differential and convection. Once the heat is transferred to the fins in the cold end, the substance condenses and the process repeats. The CPU cooler we saw on the Xbox 360 processor looked very much like this CPU cooler seen at Plycon except the Xbox 360 cooler was taller than wider and only utilized one copper heatpipe tube."
Link -> http://www.hardocp.com/articleprint.html?article_i d=768
Given the size of this beast it may well be that there is practically no air gap inside the box. This would enable Nintendo to use the whole surface area of the box as a heatsink.
If this is designed correctly you could make convection currents work for you and turn the whole room into your air space.
Aside from that it does sound like the big N is going for user experience inplace of raw power. Lets assume that it is a small cute box that will provide maybe twice the performance of the current GameCube (unlike the order of magnitude promised by the xbox 360 and PS3), can be sold at rock bottom prices, say $150, on launch day and acts as a centeral hub for mad multiplayer DS parties.
I'd say thats a winner.
There's not going to be an MTV special since The Revolution won't be televised. (rimshot)
It is good to maintain backward compatibility, Nintendo will have an easier time getting people that own a GameCube to buy their new console - just as Sony had an easier time getting people who owned the Playstation to buy the Playstation 2. This will give them an easier time with launching this new system.
Not only that, but as the new console generation pops up starting this Christmas, people will take into account which system has the most enjoyable games - if Xbox 360 doesn't have a solid number of good games at release time and isn't able to play Xbox games, they may find people holding back to get a Playstation 3s or Revolutions because of the already present game catalog.
I'm rooting for Nintendo, they've had some extremely fun games on the GameCube with a massively higher ratio of good games to bad when put alongside the Xbox or Playstation 2. The Mario sports games have all been excellent and enjoyable, rather than a pretty simulation of the sport like the EA and Sega sports titles carried by the competition.
I'm sick of following my dreams - I'm just going to ask them where they're going and hook up with them later.
if I wanted a big, loud games machine I'd use a PC.
OTOH, water cooling is a relatively expensive option. If, as in the previous XBox, Microsoft sells XBox360 below cost, that's another $5 or $10 per unit (times millions) it'll cost them for something of questionable marketing value.
he he he he he he h--(stabbed in stomach by an annoyed Link's sword)-- GAAAHHHH!!!
(four-note song plays) You received the double-barreled rifle! Now you can blast rabbits and Hyrule soldiers through their ears.
You can hold down the "B" button for continuous firing.
If any of the big 3 does actually get into the shops this year, it will be a miracle, but even if they do rush some samples out the door in order to win the marketing race, they certainly won't have the volume to fulfill the Christmas season demand in all territories, let alone a decent games line-up.
All the new machines will arrive in British shops mid 2006, at high prices, and a round of price cuts will happen in the lead-up to Christmas, when games start appearing in volume.
2005's Christmas console race is already decided. The PSP will be in the shops with a lot of games. Any next-gen machine won't have the manufacturing volume or the games line-up to compete.
A pizza of radius z and thickness a has a volume of pi z z a
The Revolution will not be televised.
It's too soon for a new console. The games run fine on the old ones. If it's able to offer some mindblowing new content along with the intro, Nintendo is smart to wait for the 'compelling need' to drive it's sales through the roof.
There's also the aesthetic angle. Cultural preferences are rapidly moving toward Nintendos form factor and will be peaking in 18 months, not 6.
The GB/GBC/GBA/DS are handhelds, not consoles. They don't count.
Back when the PS2 was in development, I think DVD players were still $150 and up; so the appeal of having DVD playability was a definite value-add to the game console; it was like subracting $150 off the price of the PS2, because it could serve double duty.
However, nowadays DVD is so common that CompUSA is selling DVD players for $15.
So, why would I care about DVD functionality? To save $15 off the game console? Woot.
Now, if it had something else, like PVR to DVD-R functionality, that would be a value-add worth considering, but basic DVD playing... nah.
You don't have a DVD drive already? Their 40$ you cheap basterd, my dvd player was cheaper than the xbox dvd remote. Everyone has a dvd player, and nobody bought a xbox to play dvd movies. Nobody. I heard japanesse people bought the ps2 as a dvd player because it was cheaper at the time, but it wont be this time. The reason some developers didnt like the cartridge format is because n64 carts were like 8mb, and a cd is 700. Square likes cutscenes, which wouldn't fit on a cart. The Revolution uses 12cm discs, and theyre blu-ray discs if I recall. They will have equal, or near equal (possibly higher?) capacity then the xbox (still uses standard DVD's) and who knows for the PS3. Also, 99.99% of games dont use the full DVD disc anyway, so the gamecubes smaller (2GB?) discs weren't much of an issue. As I said before, the Revolution uses 12cm disks, with a higher capacity. Think before you post.
On the one hand it seems silly not to include it
If your video game console and your movie player are in the same box, and you want to play a game, then you have to sit on your @$$ and wait until an older sibling finishes watching a 12-hour Meg Ryan marathon. There's a reason why Nintendo has consistently priced the GameCube $50 lower than the PS2 or Xbox.
-1 (Evil proprietary format)
I wonder if the real "innovation" we are going to see with the Revolution has to do with the business side, namely that this box will be better focused in its purpose than Xbox360 or PS3. Perhaps in addition to being small, it will be significantly cheaper than the other boxes. I think if you look at where alot of game systems go (with the exception of Slashdot users and gadget freaks), they are not hooked up to the main TV in a house but to some secondary TV in a kids playroom, den, etc. Some of the media hub features discussed for these boxes are really overkill and not worth paying for if you just want a really good game system. I'll let my DVR evolve into a media hub and let the game system do what it does best, play games.
My Halo box usually just gets used as a crappy dvd player.
So do you play Halo 17 on that box?
Its modded troll presumably because you don't know what your talking about. The "revolutionary" features are yet unnannounced, says Nintendo. Being smaller and having better graphics is not the revolution. (Hell, the pres of Nintendo even said, the better graphics are becoming moot anyway, as games get closer and closer to photorealism theres eventually a limit you hit, i.e. graphics is not the wave of the future)
...will the Revolution be Live? --no wait, XBox took that...
You can hold down the "B" button for continuous firing.
...is pretty clueless. Microsoft are the only console manufacturer rushing to get a machine out this year, as they see it as the only way to steal any market share from Sony. Sony and Nintendo are quite happy to keep pushing the five systems that they have on the market at present, and have no pressing need to rush out new systems to respond to Microsoft's stopgap.
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You write: I guess the big N are counting on this console once again appealing to hardcore gameplayers, especially since you can't watch DVDs on this.
It's a classic error. DVD playing takes nothing away from game playing and so a hardcore gameplayer could care less that a console does or does not play DVD's .
I'm unconvinced that 2005 launch will benefit MS as much as they think. This holiday season will already be mighty competive with PSP and Nintendo DS. Both handhelds will have a good selection of decent games by Nov 2005, and it will be the first holiday season for the PSP. Atop that, Sony will likely sell the PSP without the "Value Pack" option, which may bring down the price of the console to $199. Plus Grand Theft Auto and Grand Turismo (amoung others) will be out by then.
The Xbox 360 will also have to compete with people's willingness to wait for the PS3 and Nintendo Revolution. This may or may not be a factor depending on what Sony and Nintendo can deliver next week at E3. Remember, an early lauch didn't help Sega much with the Dreamcast (or the Saturn, which they forcefully lauched a few months early in the US to get a headstart on the PS).
If you also consider that the Xbox's life span was relatively very short compared to other consoles (launch 18 months after the PS2, and lauches ~12 months before the PS3). Many consumers that are not hardcore gamers, esp ones that have bought an XB in the last year or two, may feel perturbed that their recent purchase is already obsolete. To compound that, MS (as well as Sony/Nintendo) have to compete with other hot gadgets like the iPod that weren't around during previous console lauches that may appeal more to their core market(young-male adults) than gaming consoles.
But if [the fake "Nintendo On" VR-toaster console] were real, who would NOT buy one?
The same people who didn't buy Nintendo's last VR game system.
Yes, because the absense of water cooling in the Gamecube meant the XBox was faster, too.
In all actuality, there is every indication to show that the Gamecube is for the most part every bit as powerful as the XBox, with the only real advantage the XBox has over the Gamecube is more memory, and arguably the hard drive (though since it's largely underutilized the fact that it isn't standard in the XBox 360 should speak for itself).
Anyway, when we start talking PowerPC instead of x86, the whole rules on heat and power as well as size totally change. It's entirely possible that the Revolution and Xbox could be more alike than unalike. Though with Revolution having Gamecube compatibility and the Xbox 360 not having much of anything, the XBox 360 could be more powerful and it would still have an uphill battle.
A large backlog of games to play can make or break a system. Anyone who doubts this needs to compare PSP and DS sales figures. (For those who haven't been watching, the DS is killing the PSP globally.)
"Everything you know is wrong. (And stupid.)"
Moderation Totals: Wrong=2, Stupid=3, Total=5.
This information has been floating around the gaming sites for a few days now, but oh well. The really interesting stuff about what makes the Revolution a "revolution" has yet to be revealed however.
There's some interesting, but not ground breaking stuff that has been confirmed, like wireless controllers, DS connectivity, 802.11 internet connection, and free online gameplay, but the really interesting stuff is still just speculation. For what it's worth, my guess is that the "revolution" part of the console will be that the controllers have built in gyros. I've been playing WarioWare: Twisted since it hit the streets in Japan, and let me tell you what anyone who has played that title can tell confirm: twisting is the future. There's a great part of WW:T where you get to play the original Super Mario Brothers game by turning the Game Boy to the side to move forward while the world spins around under your feet. It's how the game was meant to be played!! I suppose the Nintendo critics will call a motion sensor a gimmick, but I really believe it has the ability to put some fire under the industry's feet.
Of course, there's a lot of other speculation that I'm not too sure about. Broken Saints claims that the Revolution will somehow display real 3-D on your TV screen, I guess using special glasses or something. That sounds unlikely to me. I've also heard that the Revolution will have a DS like touch screen controller or one that is somehow reprogrammable by the game, but I don't want to think about the ergonomics of that all. Pressure sensitive buttons does sound like a good idea, and I wouldn't be surprised at all to hear that.
One interesting thing about Nintendo versus Microsoft is the different things that people focus on in their announcements. With the Xbox 360, everyone is talking about the 3.whatever GHz PPC chip. With the Revolution, everyone is talking about possible changes to the way games are traditionally played. It just goes to show the Microsoft is still more interested in the technology side of things, and Nintendo is more interested in the "innovation" (or, if you believe the detractors, "gimmickry") side.
...is that they treat games as art, rather than cheap entertainment. There's a huge amount of overlap, to be sure, but the difference in emphasis makes all the difference. It could be argued -- probably correctly -- that the masses want cheap entertainment and not art, but still, if Nintendo could cultivate a sort of elite Apple-esque image, rather than their current childish Disney-esque one, that'd work well for them, I think...
They've been saying how they realized that the look of the console matters. Hopefully this means they've grasped the larger concept that *image matters*, perhaps as much as everything else put together (they can have the best games out there, but if it's seen as an uncool thing to own, people won't own it*). However, from the rather narrow stuff I've heard from them (only talking about making it look physically better, nothing about the larger picture of *why* it needs to look physically better), I'm sadly doubtful...
* people suck
Work is punishment for failing to procrastinate effectively.
I wonder if they might not make the case itself a heatsink for the CPU and GPU. There are lots of computer PSUs that are like this, they have a finned design to help dissipate heat.
The Brittish gaming market is nearly irrelevant. What difference does it make if the 360 doesn't debut their until 06?
So Nintendo is making a big mistake not releasing their console this year, and Sony don't get mentioned even though their console is slated for 2006 too?
True Sony have made noises about releasing the PS3 this year, but they did exactly the same thing to spoil the Dreamcast's launch. And even though they were about a year after the DC, Sony still had crappy release titles.
As I mentioned briefly on the N-Scene mailing group... I'll expand more here.
I really don't think this is video of the "Revolution" system at all, I think this is very likely the special "joystick" that was mentioned briefly a month or so back.
Watch the video closely, the video clearly presents this system as a 3-D proximity controller. They always show it on the floor in the middle of the room, and that it is sensitive to someone approaching it.
Also, I don't think this is specifically a Revolution controller either. Notice that it shows in one segment, output supported for TV and some other type of screened device, then in the next segment it shows that it takes input from the GameCube and a "?" device of about the right dimensions of the Revolution concept art that has been floating around.
Also there have been complaints that I have seen about the Mario art at the end, that it either looks like Luigi, or is bad art. Oddly enough, this is the common design for Mario on most PC and Mac based games. I'm not sure what that means, but there is a precedent for Nintendo to illustrate Mario like that.
No, this video is very much in line with something Nintendo would generate and potentially show at a press event, and the fact that it appeared on the net last week is either a testament that Nintendo is attempting to execute a buzz kill on it's competitors announcements... or a very serious security breach has happened within Nintendo.
Personally, what I would like to see is the end of the video, and I'm hoping we get to see it next week.
I think you will find that despite the smaller form factor with the Nintendo Revolution, it will probably still be on par with the PS3 and Xbox 360 given the extra time they will have in producing it. I will be amazed if even the PS3 is as large as the Xbox 360. Additionally, I beleive that the addition of multiple numbers of CPUs, all running at different Mgz clouds the overall power of the system, and makes a systems speed difference very negligable. I think this holiday season is the least of Nintendo's concerns. Nintendo has already stated that they are going after Sony as the top dog in the race. Stepping onto the market later is actually a good move and I think the Xbox 360 is coming to the market way too early. We have seen this happen with the Sega Saturn and the Sega Dreamcast. I also am strangely getting the notion that Microsoft is aiming its targets at Nintendo, and Nintendo is aiming theirs at Sony. And Sony is just content to be at the top. Why not try to challenge Sony? In the end, it is very possible there will be 2 leaders this time around, Sony and Nintendo.
See my comments above under "You guys are misunderstanding the video"
Nintendo seem to be doing very well for themselves in the 'pathetic' third place. They're certainly turning a profit on the GameCube, unlike Microsoft for example, and have the best first-party games on any system, bar none.
There's no need to have a games library as large as, for example, the PS2's - how many of that system's games are really worth buying? There are plenty of simply excellent games available for the GameCube, and so long as Nintendo keep it up, I'll gladly buy their next system.
And tomorrow the stock exchange will be the human race
Given the size of this beast it may well be that there is practically no air gap inside the box. This would enable Nintendo to use the whole surface area of the box as a heatsink.
So, you can play Mario Karts 2 while cooking your breakfast on it?
Information wants to be anthropomorphized.
Are all these new console companies goin round in circles, one is called 360, the other is revolution, what next?! a console called elipse!
The 20GB hard drive is standard with the Xbox 360.
I'm sure everyone's already seen this impressive video (widely regarded as an elaborate hoax). It makes a good point: With their vast storage and processing abilities and constantly improving compatibility, Nintendo has only it's lack of development in interface that keeps it from seeking the holy grail of virtual reality.
"Never let your sense of morals prevent you from doing what's right." -Isaac Asimov
Can I have your sister's telephone number ?
The slim PS2s are smaller. But it never said it was the smallest console ever, just the smallest Nintendo console ever.
Nintendo has always been one of the most secretive companies in the game industry. They are releasing these "features" only to combat Microsoft recent announcements. And to some degree it works, people are talking about it.
The interesting features will probably be announced at their pre-e3 conference, Tuesday. Although, at this point, it is still unclear how much they will talk about the "innovative" aspects of their next console.
per dolorem ad astra
If you're having so much fun with those GC games, why do you care if they're in 3rd or not? I don't have to play what everyone else says is the best to enjoy it. If mainstream systems stay in the top sales wise, who cares?
Both the Xbox 360 and now Revolution are making a big deal about "you can use it vertically or horizontally!" wow! big deal. Is that really a selling point? Does anyone really care about that? Why are they both making that a selling point?
http://www.popularculturegaming.com -- my blog about the culture of videogame players
except there are now good games for nintendo since NES was discontinued
...For the beast had been reborn with its strength renewed, and the followers of Mammon cowered in horror.
Did you ask anything that hadn't been brought up?
Are you the first to point out the obvious facts?
Do we care that you don't care?
And yes, boot time DOES matter to some, me, for example. Go play your xbox sportgame console and salivate over MTV's ads.
Between my PS2 and my CG, when I want to play 5 minutes before I go out or whatnot, the PS2 isn't even worth tunring on. The load times for most games are enormous.
.. God of War got it right, but in general, there is WAY too much load time in PS2 games.
.. select, confirm, dismiss dialog. I just want game.
Things should always load in the background
But it seems like years ago that I played the game Metroid Prime, and it was absolutely incredible in terms of pre-emptive loading.
It still bugs the shit out of me that most games make you prompt 2 or 3 times to write to a flash card
Sony and MS are still exploring whether the games console is the best way to introduce the executive-wet-dream they like to call 'converage'. One device, for everything you need. One vendor. Total market share across horizontal markets such as TV, movies, music and games. I like the fact that Nintendo doesn't give a god damn what their machines do except let you play fun games non-stop.
"Old man yells at systemd"
It's apparently to be based on the same IBN PPC970 processors as the Xbox 360, as well as a custom graphics chip from ATI.
First.. Xbox 360 is most certainly not based on PowerPC 970
Second.. There's been absolutely no credible rumors about the specifications of Broadway (Revolution's processor)
Third.. Of all the Power PC-processors out there, 970 is one of the least suitable for a game console.
- Henrik
- when the Shadows descend -
Did anyone really expect the Revolution to run on anything else? I wonder what kind of power a modern cartridge has.
It also states that it will have a very quick start-up time, and be very quiet.
... because it wasn't and it didn't.
Are they insinuating that the Cube was loud and had long start up times?
Pointless statements make baby Jesus cry.
We have secretly replaced these Slashdot mods' sense of humor with a rusty nail. Let's see if they notice!!
You have to click on the procede to nintendo.com link and then click on the link in the /. summary to bypass the no-flash warning.
per dolorem ad astra
There are quite a few mini-itx cases designed this way, where the case acts as a giant heatsink.
Another unexpected side benefit to this is that, if there's absolutely zero free space inside, and, it has to be exactly zero, there won't be space to put an internal modchip. An external modchip is going to be a pretty big turnoff for some people. Of course, this is more then a little unlikely, but, hey, it's possible, considering the formfactor.
I've said it before, and I'll say it again. Winning the console wars isn't neccessarily about market share. Nintendo is turning/turned a profit on the Gamecube, which means they're not about to sink.
if I wanted a big, loud games machine I'd use a PC
:-)
I agree with you, ie. small and quiet is essential in the target environment, but I feel very strongly that there is also another issue that is being completely ignored so far: standard hifi form factors.
If the console manufacturers actually believed their own words about entertainment convergence, they'd be making consoles that fit sensibly into hifi racks, sandwiched tidily between A/V amps, tuners, DVD players, etc.
And since hifi systems come in full-width, midi, and micro sizes, the consoles should offer different enclosure styles too (hey, it's just plastic, the cheapest part of the whole unit), as well as a more portable version for taking along to your friends'. There hasn't been a console yet that hasn't looked like an ugly carbuncle hanging off the side of an otherwise decently styled entertainment system.
Sadly the console manufacturers seem to think that it's their divine right to make whacky and sexily styled enclosures at the expense of the commonsense and practicality needed for physical integration with other entertainment equipment. I doubt that this will change any time soon, as none of the Big Three are noted for listening to customer requirements.
Maybe we need some console rehousing specialists to help the annoyed hifi enthusiasts among us!
"The question of whether machines can think is no more interesting than [] whether submarines can swim" - Dijkstra
The Revolution will have voice recognition, gyroscopic controllers, pressure sensitive grips, and free internet play.
= 0).
This info comes from a very believable source (see some of his posts here http://ps3.ipbhost.com/index.php?showtopic=482&st
It's doubtful that the Revolution will be more powerful than the Xbox 360 (from what specs I've seen, it's going to have 3 CPU's running all @ 3.2 Ghz).
Any idea what all that is going to cost you yet though? We're at the point now in console video games were I really don't see much advance in graphics. Even if the Revolution is less powerful than the 360, I probably won't be able to tell the difference, and if the 360 ends up costing $700, then what's the point? I certainly wouldn't pay twice the price to get 25% more polygons/sec out of the machine.
Frankly, I think the current generation of systems is plenty powerful enough to graphically do basically anything that I'd ever want to see in a game. I'll probably just sit back and enjoy my Gamecube and Dreamcast games while everyone else is chasing more and more polygons.
-"One machine can do the work of fifty ordinary men. No machine can do the work of one extraordinary man." -EH
that Nintendo partnered with IGN.
The landscape for Nintendo information is going to get very strange. First you worry that IGN and GameSpy will be too positive about Nintendo. Then you think that Gamespot and C|Net are going to get vindictive.
Why couldn't Nintendo buy everyone off like Sony and Microsoft do?
I've been moving my controller to make mario Jump higher since the NES...
Oh you mean now it'll actually do some good? Awesome
This video has been making the rounds, it's a confirmed fake made by a college graphic artists, he hid "HIRE ME" and his email address inside the video on a few frames.
Word on the street is that their "watercooling" setup is nothing more than a set of heatpipes - an increasingly pedestrian method of cooling in the PC world. I've actually seen mid-range Dell systems with heatpipe coolers & no marketing hype.
That's the biggest problem with taking console marketing at face value - they tend to blow small technical details out of proportion to make the whole device sound more impressive. A recent example is the current generation of consoles; they were refered to as 128-bit units by marketing when all of them actually ran on 32-bit processors because they had a vector unit or some video-processor with a wide pipe.
my sig's at the bottom of the page.
I read that as nintendo explaining the gentoo emerge process *rolls eyes*
Europe is a bigger market than North America and Japan put together.
The following figures will be total sales as of the end of 2003 (Jan 13, 2004, for PS2).
North America
PlayStation 2 - 29.26 million
Xbox - 8.6 million
GameCube - 7.46 million
Game Boy Advance - 23.78 million
Japan / Asia
PlayStation 2 - 16.18 million
Xbox - 1.4 million (~425,000 Japan alone)
GameCube - 3.37 million
Game Boy Advance - 12.66 million
Europe / PAL
PlayStation 2 - 24.56 million
Xbox - 3.7 million
GameCube - 3.11 million (~3 million Europe alone)
Game Boy Advance - 12.98 million
Worldwide
PlayStation 2 - 70 million
Xbox - 13.7 million
GameCube - 13.94 million
Game Boy Advance - 49.42 million
GBA sales include Original + SP.
Why would I be xenophobic when most euro-weenies are as clueless as your are?
Whle skimming your post I first thought you were suggesting they should use a summer launch date, citing the segway as an example of success.
That would be a pretty funny argument, and I think it's about as valid as any other for missing the holidays when launching a gaming console.
It's sad that we follow corporate holidays so well as consumers- but we do. Almost all parents buy their kids big presents in December, then don't buy much for a while after. Big 'N' is silly to skip the holiday season.
I find it interesting how successful the xbox is.
I don't buy PC's with windows anymore, and generally regard MS as making poor software, but the only console I'd buy at this point is the xbox.
2 cents, nothing more...
Nintendo Revolution -
1. More powerful system and better graphics.
2. HD support even though I only know a few people who even have HD TV's yet.
3. Gone wireless (Even though they already have the best wireless controllers)
4. Wireless connectivity between devices (Nintendo DS, A new wireless GBA perhaps)
5. Small form factor. (You cannot tell me that the new 'slim' version of the PS2 wasn't the coolest thing since sliced bread. It is better period.)
6. More Storage (using DVDs will increase the amount of storage for textures etc for games considerably and is also alot cheaper to produce)
7. Online Gaming (Perhaps Nintendo's only real mistake with Gamecube was underestimating the advantages of online gameplay. The online service remains free.)
8. Backward Compatibility (I can still buy games from Nintendo this fall, enjoy them, and not have to worry about them becoming obsolete and unusable next year. This allows me to wait longer for the console and protects my investment of games.)
9. More exciting things to be announced at E3.
Xbox 360 -
1. More powerful system and better graphics.
2. HD support even though I only know a few people who even have HD TV's yet.
3. Gone wireless. (Controllers are pretty much the same)
4. Wireless connectivity between devices. (Windows PC or Windows Media Center PC)
5. Smaller form factor but still large.
6. Hard Drive (Handy to have, though not used too often).
7. A "ring of light" around the power button.
8. Online gaming (Enhanced version of Xbox live. Paid online service required)
9. Changable Faceplates (Just like cellphones, you can change the 'face' of the console with new hip styles)
Sony PS3 -
1. More powerful system and better graphics.
2. Will probably support Blu Ray although I still do not know what advantages that has or understand what it provides you)
3. Cell Processors (Still don't know what they do exactly, except they can be teamed in a grid somehow which is good for scientific calculations or running Seti @ home, how that helps games has yet to be seen).
4. Id bet money they go wireless too. Their controllers haven't changed in a long time.
5. Online Gaming (Same free online gaming model.)
6. PSP connectivity.
7. Form Factor (either a smaller slimmer form factor or I would not rule out that it might look like a DVD player from Sony)
8. Remains to be seen at E3.
There's will be no Smash Brothers for XBOX 360 and PS3.
Nintendo hasn't told anyone about the Revolution yet, aside from a few tiny tidbits (release date, size, etc). None of these are "the Revolution". Nintendo's big revolution as of right now is a very, very tightly held secret.
A few reasons -- Both MS and Sony have long held cherished traditions of ripping their competition off. Plus, every single 3rd party who has seen the Revolution has had pretty much the same thing to say about it -- this is going to be BIG. Industry changing big.
And, I think ultimately, they're going to wait until E3 or TGS to unveil it, and it's going to be a huge amazing "Woahgod" that will get every gamer that sees it salivating, just like last year's E3 presentation.
I bought a PS2 for DVD...
"Love is like a trampoline, first it's like "SWEET!!" then it's like *BLAMM!*"
Just heard this from over at the teamxbox forums (ironically)
"Each player will actually have two controllers, one for each hand. They will each have a joystick or d-pad, a regular shoulder button, and a pressure sensitive trigger, kinda like the gamecube. But he said the real kicker is that they also have laser readers of some sort in the top of the controller, above the triggers that can tell where you are pointing. So for instance if you were playing a FPS, you'd point it up and you'd look up, move it right and you'd look right."
Water cooling doesn't mean the xbox360 is faster. It could be designed crappy, with bad airflow.
Well, we can assume that both boxes are based on the same technology and both use the technology in a similarily efficient way. In that case, the amount of generated heat is proportional to the avialable processing power. This means that if the XBOX360 generated more heat, it has more power. As simple as that.
Hell, if the revolution is that small, it wouldnt need water cooling
Small = less space for convection, less space for conventional heat removal. Means that a more efficient method of heat removal is required to removed that same amount of heat.
With these consoles coming out with HD support, fast multi-core CPU's (PPC), I'm wondering if Intel and AMD are worried that they might loose market shared to the consoles especially if they supported web, IM and email through optional keyboards/mice.
Will Apple receive a 3+ Ghz multicore processor soon from Apple?
Will this lead to more games being ported to the Mac "first"?
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
Doh! That should be "soon from IBM".
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
The processor's that these consoles are using are not similar to the G5s that Apple uses. They are simplified, and as a desktop processor they would perform terribly. And the games will be written to the console specific specs, not the CPU, so this won't affect Apple's games.
Who cares about first party games? How about if Sony pictures made films that only played on Sony DVD players? Nintendo should be respected as a game developer, but what is the point in clinging to a proprietary platform? I say let game developers make games, and let console developers make consoles.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nintendo_On
...Also, I didn't know Buggalo could fly.
The earlier versions of Dreamcast uses heat pipe for the processor even thought the SH4 processor was very low power.
It says fan mockup but it looks pretty professional.. If this is real the new Nintendo it looks interesting
p e=wmv Video
http://www.gametrailers.com/player.php?id=5779&ty
ff 7 was a crappy fmv game that could have been done on the n64 with better gfx and none of the bs videos.
... battle would load very quickly too without the 10 sec "intro" to each battle.
and you wouldn't have the enormous load times
Science : Proprietary , Knowledge : Open Source
I know it's confusing for you to understand that Amsterdam isn't actually in Britain, but please try to bear with me...
You are mixing up sales figures with market size. The European market isn't as saturated.
Here are the ACTUAL market size figures, according to the United Nations population divison
Population of North America: 314 million
Population of Japan: 127 million
Population of Europe: 727 million
314+127 is less than 727
A pizza of radius z and thickness a has a volume of pi z z a
"A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming, is not worth knowing" - Alan Perlis
IMO, if it has a physics chip (and I think this is quite possible), it will deliver some stunning gaming, enough to make it the console to beat.
"A language that doesn't affect the way you think about programming, is not worth knowing" - Alan Perlis
Actually, Nintendo is just very clever about hiding the load times. In Luigi's Mansion, there was a load time involved when you opened a door (similar to Biohazard, but without the lame graphics). Metroid Prime just enhanced this by starting sooner. You shoot a door to open it, so it knows where it should be loading stuff. As you're walking toward the door, the game is loading the room. You'll notice that sometimes those doors don't open very quickly; sometimes I get to the door before it opens. The door doesn't open till the next room is loaded.
Passive or pre-emptive loading has been a long time in coming. I recall reading in Next-Gen about a game called One that utilized that stuff on the PS1, and Turok had some huge levels (which was part of the reason for the fog). Generally, if your game doesn't pre load, its because they were either rushing to release on time or it was some junky one-off to help make studio ends meet.
The flash card deal is a bit strange. I really liked the was F-Zero handled it (most of the time). Three bars that actually filled up and moved on quickly, catering to the theme of speed present in the whole game. Grand Tourismo 3 has this wierd progress bar that is basically only ever empty or full.
I Browse at +4 Flamebait
Open Source Sysadmin
I'm alarmed by the prospect of the Revolution using DVD discs. Why this fear? I'm afraid that its limited storage space will limit game designers.
Right now you might be thinking, "Are you insane? DVD-9 discs can store 9 gigs of data! What do you mean, limited?" Well, here's what I mean.
As most people probably know, both the Xbox and the PS2 use DVD discs. They both support DVD-5 and DVD-9. The support for DVD-9 indicates something; some games are too big to fit on one DVD-5 disc. This can be conclusively proven by looking at some recent games, like Xenosaga Episode II (see the bottom of the page, "Lasting Appeal"), which use multiple discs. At smallest size, these games are unable to fit on a single DVD-5 disc. At largest, they're too big to fit on a single DVD-9.
That's a lot of data.
I recently read in an article (probably in Game Informer, though I can't find it at the moment) that many recent games, including Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater, only barely miss filling a DVD-9.
That this is on the PS2. A current-gen system.
I think that says something.
What I'm getting at here is that games are getting bigger and bigger. There's no way around it. As our technology improves and our systems become capable of bigger and better graphics, we must supply more and more data in order to make said graphics.
If a PS2, whose capabilities are far eclipsed by the next-gen systems, almost requires multiple discs, how will those next-gen systems fit all their data in the same space? Better graphics require more data: bigger textures, more polygons, more custom shaders, etc. So how will it all fit?
And bear in mind that this isn't even taking into account the data needed for the actual game. A lot of code and other data is needed for the actual game. Furthermore, the Revolution is supposed to be, as Nintendo says, "revolutionary". How much extra code will it take to do cool things with these "revolutionary" features? A lot, I imagine.
This poses a problem. Where will all that data go? It has to go somewhere. Sure, wonders can be worked with compression, and yes, Nintendo has somehow managed to shove DVD-5 games from other systems into the 1.8 gigs offered by its proprietary format, but there is a limit to how small things can get. Furthermore, too much compression will result in decreased performance, which is a bad thing.
This is definitely a big problem. Sony got around it by flinging enormous Blu-Ray discs into its next-gen system, aided somewhat by the fact that it partially owns that standard. For Nintendo or Microsoft to use Blu-Ray would require licensing the technology, and you can be sure Sony would charge them up the wazoo for both the drives and the discs.
That's a problem.
The way I see it, both Microsoft and Nintendo are in trouble if they use normal DVD drives on their next-gen systems. Nintendo possibly more so, depending on the "revolutionary" aspects of their device, but this doesn't change the fact that they're both rather screwed.
For Microsoft, it looks like it's already too late; the Xbox 360 specs declare that it has a "12x dual-layer DVD-ROM". There is still some hope left for Nintendo, though, as they've only announced support for "12cm optical disks", which could be nearly anything.
Here's to hoping that Nintendo chooses something better than DVD-9.
I own itburns.net. What should I put there?
Do I have a PC at home? No.
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
If Nintendo can come up w/ some way to top 4 Swords, then it's all good.
I'm not too concerned about consoles or whatnot, but the idea that the Revolution can play GameCube games really appeals to me. This will save me space and money.
[o]_O
Good for you, the latest news from Nintendo themselves said that their unit will use standard DVDs so that you can watch movies as well.
Karma: It's all a bunch of tree-huggin' hippy crap!
A DVD is 12cm in diameter. The article clearly stated that the Revolution would use a 12cm diameter disc.
... to be honest I wouldn't be surprised if the XBox360 is the Saturn or Dreamcast (hmm, both of those were next generation consoles released around a year earlier than the consoles that eventually killed them in the market), although any gaming HDTV owner will have to get one. At least it doesn't look ugly this time around.
As it is coming out in 2006, I expect that it will either be a Bluray variant, or a HD-DVD variant. I'm hoping it will be a HD-DVD variant. Why? Because I can buy a Revolution for the fun multiplayer games and Nintendo franchise games, and get a free HD-DVD player, and then I can buy a PS3 for the more serious action games, and get a free Bluray player! Either that, or it will be a standard DVD-a-like to cut costs.
The XBox360 is the loser here, everyone has a DVD player already. Maybe if it supported DVD Audio, and the console was silent to boot
I own itburns.net. What should I put there?
Just because it has water cooling, it doesn't mean it NEEDS water cooling. "It's water cooled, it must be faster!" is akin to saying "That car has a spoiler, it must be faster!". Most cars you see on the road with a spoiler rarely, if ever, benefit from it. This could be the case with the XBox360 and water cooling. It could be a marketing ploy, or it could just be to have something quieter than fans. There are reasons to use water cooling over other forms that have nothing to do with the amount of heat generated.
Also, small, with an intelligent design, could mean "the whole case is a heat sync".
At this point, the only reasonable assumptions that can be made from knowing that the XBox360 has water cooling is that it's cooling solution will probably cost more, and weigh more.
Not saying the XBox360 WON'T be more powerful than the Revolution. Just saying that water cooling, or lack thereof, isn't really a good indicator, or an indicator at all.
Dark Nexus
"Sanity is calming, but madness is more interesting."
Well maybe before saying something like "...are the days of the X86 platform numbered?..." you do a little research, because XBox was the only console that is/was x86 based, others have been MIPS, RISC, MC68000, Super-H 3, Super-H 4, ARM, etc.
They only real difference between PowerPC processors and x86 is the amount of registers they have. PowerPC has quite a superior Single Instruction Multiple Data (SIMD) instruction set, where x86 processors have a rather limited amount SSE and MMX.
market share of consoles compared to computers is a rather benign comparison! they are two totally different markets, aimed at totally different people. I very much doubt AMD and Intel are even remotely worried.
Apple will be delivering a Dual Core PowerMac next year, maybe multi-core a year after, but like I said previously, they are pretty much two different technologies.
and I very very much doubt it will lead to more games being ported to make "first" due to the measly "5%" market share, where is the economic sense in that??
If you want to play games, get a console; for everything else, get a computer, PC or Mac..
/. is good for you.
Doing DS multiplayer parties would be mad, indeed, but maybe not in the sense you seem to presume.
A World in a Grain of Sand / Heaven in a Wild Flower,
Infinity in the Palm of your Hand / And Eternity in an Hour.
From Gamespot
Nintendo's next-gen console will also be around an inch tall; will support GameCube and DVD discs.
Professor Karmadillo Songs of Science
Analogies don't equal equalities, they are merely somewhat analogous.
You do have to hand it to Nintendo...Of the current generation of consoles, they and Sega are the only ones that managed to get more than one exclusive title on Game Rankings' top ten list. Not only that, but they've managed to do that two generations in a row...And, like Sega, they did it with exclusive titles no less. Though that will probably change sometime in the future when Capcom ports Resident Evil 4 to some other console whenever their contract with Nintendo is up.
I was under the impression that the Gamecube had sold around 18m consoles, mostly all at a profit, whereas the XBox had sold around 20m consoles, mostly all at a large loss. That 2m difference is hardly "pathetic third spot" when you consider the PS2 has sold 80m consoles.
4 306&page=1
Worldwide Hardware Sales (End of 2004)
PlayStation 2 - 81.39 million
Xbox - 19.9 million
GameCube - 18.03 million
Game Boy Advance - 65.74 million
Nintendo DS - 2.84 million (6m April 2005)
Sony PSP - 0.51 million
N-Gage - 1.3 million
PSone - 101.73 million
http://forum.pcvsconsole.com/viewthread.php?tid=1
If Nintendo have to change something, it is to reverse the decline: NES: 60m, SNES: 50m, N64: 33m, GC: 18m
(they'll probably sell a couple more million GC this year - maybe Nintendo should reduce the size a bit and cut the cost a bit more)
As the machines are more advanced, including emulation "software" is feasible (in the non-backwards days, you had to duplicate hardware, which was pricey. Often the old processor was used as the sound processor on the new system so you could maintain it. With modern systems, an emulator should be feasible, especially with Nintendo using a newer PPC chip, it should be pretty straight-forward.
:)
"Back in the day" when people hooked systems up through the RF modulator (other than as proof of concept, did anyone REALLY use the AV jacks on the NES or even the SNES when stereo televisions were rare)? Nintendo avoided it as front runner because they wanted to repackage and sell the games on the hand helds or as "All Stars" packs, but it was also infeasible.
Now with the devices sported Component Video or DVI jacks, the sets are becoming input limited. For good quality, nobody hooks their modern systems up via RF hookups, and lots of televisions only have one or two component hookups, asking people to give them both up for Nintendo is unreasonable, given that they don't play DVDs (meaning you need a component input for the DVD player).
I've loved all my Nintendo systems, and played them much more than anything but my Genesis, but I've been so busy that I rarely use my Gamecube despite having lots of games that I love. However, with backwards compatibility, I'll probably pick one up within the first 6 months or so, even though otherwise I might pass. Hell, if all it does is let me stop routing Stereo cables around and send it via digital audio, it'll be worth it to simplify wiring.
Alex
Let's be fair here, Microsoft didn't turn a profit, but then they never intended or expected to. Entering the videogaming industry as a console manufacturer is a huge, huge step, and a long-term one at that. The Xbox was basically establishing themselves, getting their foot in the door, becoming recognised as a participant in what was going to be a two-horse race. That was step one. Xbox 360 is step two, when they start making money out of their brand.
qntm.org
Good point, there have been good games for Nintendo now that NES is out of the way.
The Farewell Tour II
Because it increases the odds I'll actually buy it. If they all come out around the same time, I'll buy the cheapest one first, and then wait to see which of the other two I just have to have. Honestly, I'll be buying a PS2 when the 360 and the PS3 come out, because a) the bugs have been worked out in them finally (I think) and 2.5) The handful of great games I want to play on the PS2 (mostly RPGS) will finally be cheap enough I'll buy them.
ok.. so heads you lose tails I win. right?
"When the N64 came out, companies like Square could not release their games on the N64 due to cartridge format."
As pointed out numerous times already, FFVII used all that space for FMV. They very easily could have made that game for the N64. They chose not to. Back in those days, textures were around 4k. Even 8 - 16 megs is a lot of k's. The music was all midi. The characters were simply polygonal, most using goraud shading instead of textures. Etc. There would probably have been a few comporimises, but FFVII could have made it into an N64 cartridge.
"In reality, their proprietary format drives up cost for developers to use on their system. "
True for the N64, negligible for the GameCube. The reason the proprietary format for the N64 was expensive was because cartridges are just plain expensive. Optical media, nah. Make the disc a little smaller, change the format a bit. That wasn't anything but a minor change to the production facility. If it did cost more for the developers, it's doubtful it was by much. It was CERTAINLY nowhere near the difference between producing a CD and producing a catridge.
"And since Nintendo is continually losing market share to the XBox..."
Ugh. I hate getting into this argument. Are we talking world or USA here? The GameCube might be number 3 in the USA, but it's also killing the XBOX quite soundly in Japan. You may be thinking "so?" but imagine what the executives at Nintendo are thinking. Money's money. Even at 3rd place, Nintendo themselves produce AAA titles. Nintendo is going to react to their profit margins, not their market share. If Nintendo were to turn into Sony, would they really make more money? Sell systems at a loss? Produce cookie cutter games? Do nothing to ensure the market doesn't collapse like it did in Atari's age?
"I think Nintendo should really re-eveluate their stance on media drives."
The media drive isn't going to make the difference. It's the games. If Nintendo wants to give Sony hell, they'll need broader 3rd party support. At this point, the media won't make a difference. (assuming it has reasonable storage, anyway.) They need good hardware. They need good marketing. And they need killer apps at launch to get a few million into people's homes. From there, more developers will come out of the woodwork.
That is: IF they want to do that. The downside here is that store shelves get flooded with games. The problem is that Nintendo makes a killing on its first party titles. Less shelf space means less attention to their own products. Don't get me wrong, either way they make money, but they create a huge mess in their wakes.
"Derp de derp."
Most home PCs now are the $500 complete systems sold by companies like Dell, Gateway, eMachines, etc. used primarily to browse the internet and do email. Most of these people are not really interested in games past Solitiare and games.yahoo.com. I suppose it may be true that most high end PC's are bought for games though.
how is the small size of the console going to contribute to the revolutionary aspects of the console? maybe it will be a detriment actually.
Well those activities do not, as you say require a powerful computer. Suffice to say, those user would not have any incentive to "upgrade" in the future. Having no reason to upgrade would mean that you would see a decline in X86 "marketshare".
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
But I thought IBN was the exclusive CPU supplier to Magnetbox!!!
Check out my foes list to see who is so retarded that they can't use the signature line!!!
For years, Sega always had to be FIRST FIRST FIRST FIRST when releasing anything, and they always had to hit the holiday system. Sega CD, Sega Saturn, Sega Dreamcast. First, first, first, first first. Now they don't make consoles anymore.
Being able to hit the holidays is utterly unimportant for the vast majority of console releases. It's much more important to have a library of games available when the 4th quarter hits, and to build up a buzz among the hardcore gamers that should trickle into mainstream interest.
Basically, releasing a console before it's "ready" is always a bad idea.
i meant to say no good games
...For the beast had been reborn with its strength renewed, and the followers of Mammon cowered in horror.
Come on, the parent has very valid points. Game systems are also nicer than PCs in the respect that you don't have to worry about configuring games or worry about how it's going to perform or whatnot. People really dig that.
You know, much of the space in current console games is eaten up by the video cinematics and other extra things. Since the next gen consoles will be more powerful, they could realtime render the cinematics, reducing the amount of space required. More powerful compression for textures and music and the like could also be used because of their increased CPU power. A problem, but not incredibly so.
The Gamecube uses a format right now that only holds a bit less than 50% of what a normal DVD does. It doesn't seem too bad off for it.
Heck, they could just fit games on multiple DVDs like they've been doing for years for games with many prerendered cutscenes like Final Fantasy.
I for one don't mind their Disney status in videogames, as long as they are capable of pumping out Aladdin, The Lion King, Toy Story or The Incredibles. yes, i know the last few are from a close third party, like Nintendo had Rare...
I don't feel like it...
Christ, you do realize that when you buy a new console, you don't have to destroy the older one, right?
Muhammad, you do realize that when you play an old console, especially one with moving optical drives and fans, it eventually destroys itself, right?
And what about launch titles? A backward-compatible Revolution would appeal to people who skipped the Cube, even if the Revo launch titles aren't sliced bread, because they still have the Cube's greatest hits.
If you want to play games, get a console; for everything else, get a computer, PC or Mac..
What if I want to play games from independent studios that are too small to be noticed by console game publishers, or even make games myself?
Now Star Fox 64... with that much voice acting, how did it manage to stay under a Gig? Nintendo has some of the best compression methods around. If I remember correctly, the voice acting from SF64 was done using an algorithm similar to MP3.
Mobile phones and other voice-tuned audio communication systems usually encode the voice with CELP (code excited linear prediction) rather than transform codecs such as MP3. Go to the Speex site to hear samples of how good voiceovers can sound even after lossy compression to 10 kbit/s.
the voice files were too big due to the extra languages
Which voice codec did you use? Some generic ADPCM or MP3 codec, or a specifically voice-tuned codec such as Speex?
The entire thing was textures. Gigabytes and gigabytes of compressed textures.
You could have gone the path of .the .product and generated a lot of the game's textures procedurally.
I'm sure Nintendo is verry worried that the group of people in the world who can't spell "no" thinks they suck.
Now go back to watching MS propoganda on MTV.
and look where they got, pretty much the #2 position. The Xbox has been a pretty big success. Seriously. Microsoft just up and decided to pop into the gaming market and bumped Nintendo into third place, really. As much as I personally dislike the Xbox, I have to admit it's been a success.
Nintendo really just needs to attract more big name brands to their console again.
Gabriel Ricard
Third.. Of all the Power PC-processors out there, 970 is one of the least suitable for a game console.
"That settles it. Order a batch of 500,000 PPC 970s for the X-Boxes."
-Microsoft X-Box 360 Lead Engineer
All they need now is to put really big fans on the fins.
Oh, wait...
Hey, you need to go back even further. Pre-emptive loading showed up on the PSX before the GCN was even released. Check out Soul Reaver. Unless you had the ancient, plastic-railed PSX and/or a cruddy disk, it was pretty much seamless.
First posting isn't trolling. It's...first posting.
Oh these topics are great for bringing out the cult-like fanboys.
Stuff on Macs vs. PCs is great for it too.
Why do people take it as an attack if you choose a different console then them. I mean for chrissakes... I'd rather have my choice of 3 or more consoles, then have to pick a winner. different people like different things.. but they don't like other people to like different things.
Hell if you want to like the xbox, or osx, or the psp... why give a fuck if someone else doesn't? I actually MISS the days of more choice for computers and consoles... it was always neat trying to figure out the workings of a new system.
Grow up fanboys... it's not all about you.
If I can't smoke and swear I'm fucked.
but you see, nintendo themselves also stated that the revolution may turn off much third party support, as it will not be easy to port games too, what with the whole being revolutionary thing
final stance : Go team Nintendo.
Nintendo has been at this a long time... realize that unlike Sony & Microsoft they will make a profit off the console!! from day 1!!! [Rember MS burned almost a billion $$ on the first Xbox as an "acceptable" market entry stratagy!!] Also, partners of IBM and ATI mean they'll be using laptop quality parts rather than "hacks" like everybody else.
The only thing I see is that Nintendo needs somebody else to partner with... going it alone for them just won't cut it. frankly, Nintendo + Apple would be interesting... If devices could "play" together you'd have a really cool idea on your hand. Mostly, Apple needs Mac gaming to come back ...Nintendo fits their "personallity" perfectly. Things like both make cool designed toys.. like minimacs & ipods versus GAmeCube & Gameboy..
I could have put my barbed penis in and out of your anus, which if true, would make you a raging homosexual.
To confirm you're not a script, please piss in my ear.
There's a fourth wildcard: Samsung.
:)
I have long expected Samsung to jump in with MS for the Xbox program if not buy out MS's share. The MTV special was LOADED with Samsung ads. The two companies are apparently already living together.
Why? Microsoft wants to beat PS3 and Samsung just wants Sony dead. Worse for Sony, Samsung is on a tear and actually has the products to do it, in vertical markets both dominated by Sony and in markets Sony can't touch. What crumbs Samsung leaves behind, LG is happy to grab. Sony is under huge pressure they simply have not felt in years.
For MS, Samsung brings the manufacturing skills that would come in handy for making consoles.
Right now, making Sony miserable is Samsung job #1 and if they can throw a few billion at videogames and give Sony a massive headache, they'll do it. In a flash.
So I speculate they will either go in with MS as coproducers on Xbox360 or the third Xbox will be made by Samsung and powered by MS.
If it happens, I was scoop credit.
Sig for hire.
Don't forget, the reason N stayed with ROM carts for so long (and still has for the handhelds) is that Nintendo OWNS the ROM factories. They make the things for themselves and for third-parties and pocketed huge profits from making game carts.
They could have jumped to optical with the N64 but they had too much money invested in ROM factories. Jumping to optical would have been a huge writeoff. It's only the handhelds that have mitigated the issue.
Now they've gone optical but again it's their own format that they alone make. Anyone who wants to do a GC game is stuck dealing with Nintendo for manufacture and Nintendo can set the prices and keep the profits. That's probably more important to Nintendo than preventing piracy. They do not want to support a format that anyone else can make.
Contrast with Sony and MS where the two companies reserve the right to approve the games but the third-parties can have the discs made anywhere and it's really just a common DVD anyway. Cheap and easy to make.
It may not SOUND like a big deal but these kinds of things can matter a lot to developers when there is only X amount of profit to be made on each game. If it looks like a chunk of that will get sucked out just having the special discs made, well, you tell me where you're gonna focus on making games.
Sig for hire.
I'm not sure if I'm alone in this but I always thought of my GC as something a little bit different. I use my XBox for 'serious' games and PC Ports because I own a Mac, and to be honest £100 for an XBox seemed a lot more attractive than £1500 for a decent games machine.
I bought my GC for party games and genuine original content. I loved Monkey Ball, Doshin, Pikmin and Double Dash. The GC proved without a doubt that there was more to modern gaming than how many polygons you can process per second and how accurate your AI and physics engines are. I think thats what made it better for adults. When I was a kid I wanted more realism and violence, now I want more fun and originality.
This is why I'm excited by the Revolution as there will be something in there that is not obvious by the hardware specs, that will make it a worthwhile purchase - fun games.
Scared of flying, pointy things snce 1979!
Soul Reaver? That was a great Dreamcast title first! It only showed up on PS2 later. If only Sega would come back with their own console again. :(
The Revolution uses DVD media, not BluRay. Only the PS3 will be using BluRay media.
"They could have jumped to optical with the N64 but they had too much money invested in ROM factories."
Uh.. That and it would raised the cost of the system, made gaming more frustrating, and the games would have been far easier to pirate.
"Derp de derp."
is it my fault that you sleep before you read your /.?
...For the beast had been reborn with its strength renewed, and the followers of Mammon cowered in horror.
Soul Reaver was on the PSX. Soul Reaver 2 was slated for the DC but cancelled. The release of Soul Reaver on the PSX was several months before the DC release.
Too bad Apple has already teamed up with Sony. Maybe not in Sony's console market, but in the HD market. I can't recall the specifics all together, but if you watch the MacWorld keynote speach from Steve Jobs some Sony exec comes out and they make some deal about how they are working together on some HD standard.
But to me it wouldn't make sense to make any kind of deal with Nintendo when you have ties to Sony.
?! Knights of the Round on you. *tears off on golden chocobo* thats about 250 hours of my life your insulting!
Brain(s): 0.0% user, 1.3% system, 0.1% nice, 98.6% idle
Yah, the pre emptive loading in the PSX Soul Reaver game was so good you could run down a hallway and fall off the map because the next section/room decided it want loaded yet(mainly a problem getting to the first boss fight).
Well I've wrestled with reality for thirty five years doctor, and I'm happy to say I finally won out over it.
Actually, Mr. Coward, it is required. I am typing in English.
Deja Vu
n. 1. The sensation that you've read this very article before.
BTW. Your comment is completely off-topic. There is no need to be a fucking grammar nazi.
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
well i'm glad you enjoyed it..
i didn't.
that about sums it up.
Science : Proprietary , Knowledge : Open Source
I never had that problem, except when I was using a burned disk in an ancient, "have to run me upside-down" PSX series 1001.
Get back to work.
This was with a pressed comercial disk and my PSX had not yet neded to be on it's side to play properly yet. I think my PSX was a 3rd generation. I bought it new when FF7 came out (yah that was the killer app for me).
Well I've wrestled with reality for thirty five years doctor, and I'm happy to say I finally won out over it.
that you. finally someone set it strait. nintendo has done so poorly this last generation.
are you completely retarded? Nintendo has done THE worst at calling the market. They have gone from a superpower to the weakest name in 5 years. The last thing Nintendo called well was N64. They pushed the boundries of power....that is all the "market" wants. haha, Nintendo+Apple? thats the last thing they should do. hey! lets make a dying name team up with a limited computer company!
the question isnt whether people actually play DVD's on the system....it is giving them the option of playing it. I (the consumer) will chose to buy the system with more features then the one without. Now, to set the facts straight. "Revolution" will not be using either of the next generation DVD's. oh, and XBox360 will. So Nintendo is actually the loser here. Do you know the difference between the two formats? the new generation holds 10x what a normal DVD does. That has major impact on game play. Microsoft will be using HD-DVD, and Sony will be using Bluray. Nintendo however chose to use DVD format. why? why wouldnt you use the best technology available. That is the reason the N64 was so sucessful. Didnt they learn anything from the Gamecube failure? sleek design, plays dvds, online gaming. sounds like the sales pitch for PS2. so whats new? what do you have to offer the NEXT generation?
The XBox360 uses a standard DVD drive, not a HD-DVD drive. HD-DVD can hold up to 45GB in its latest 3-layer incarnation, which is 5 times what a DVD can hold. Bluray can hold 54GB in its current incarnation - 6 DVDs worth.
Nintendo have only said that their drive is a 12cm optical drive, and that it supports DVD video playback and gamecube discs. For all we know it could be bluray, hd-dvd or some kind of holographic disc. Nintendo have been quite coy about the drive details, as well as the controller details.
Gamecube was hardly a failure, it just wasn't as big as it could have been - the reason for this is more likely due to poor marketing than hardware deficiencies.
Have you checked out the Revolution pictures? It is the best looking of the three consoles.
I think that both Sony and Nintendo will play up the compatibility aspect this christmas for their existing consoles whilst hyping their 2006 consoles, in order to dent early adopter sales of the XBox360 if it is released on time.
ok, wow. I had that all wrong. This changes a lot. xbox is goin to be hurt by that. I mean, what are they improving on then? PS3 should be a big hit. And I would love to see Nintendo to go back to their roots, and give us something exciting. The gamecube was a failure; it wasnt exciting.