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Ten Reasons to Buy Windows Vista
pennconservative writes "Michael Desmond, writing for PCWorld.com, gives us ten reasons to buy the next version of Microsoft Windows. Some of his reasons sound compelling, and it definitely sounds like Microsoft has found yet another way to ensure market dominance for a few more years. Desmond also gives a few reasons not to buy Vista, but the most compelling of those is the hardware required to run it. Since Vista will likely ship on every new computer anyone buys, I don't see that being a major roadblock."
The article points out that they actually give you two options for the desktop. If your computer can't handle the new, fancy look, you can simply use the Windows Classic look. That way users without the high-end hardware can still run it.
FreePA
DRM. Why would you pay for your own shackles?
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
what feature will I get that I don't already have in Mac OS X 10.4?
I skimmed the list rapidly and I'm already using the equivalents to at least half of them, probably more (I wrote "skimmed"). Some of the features I have even used for several years...
I have a really elegant proof for Fermat's last theorem. If this sig was only a bit longer...
This assumes that every new computer will be decked out enough to be able to run it.
Every new computer that carries the "Designed for Windows Vista" sticker must meet minimum system requirements.
Those are 10 reasons to buy vista IF you are currently running XP. As a Linux user who has always the option to open a maconlinux OSX window, the only reason would be the collaborative environment. All the other reasons were available to me on linux osx or both, since at least two years ago. Heh, the two way firewall :)
---- MISSING MISCELLANEOUS DATA SEGMENT --- [sigdash] trolololol
According to Microsoft, the requirements for Vista are almost as low of Windows XP, you just can't have all the pretty effects and such.
I was reading about Vista last night and it's including features like a revamped sleep mode which is a cross between standby and hibernation. They have have SmartFetch or whatever it's called so it knows what applications you typically use and at what times so it'll preload them into memory making it seem snappier.
All in all, it sounds like Vista will be a pretty good release (at least, in my opinion).
They will if they want to have a "Made for Windows Vista" logo on the outside, which would be all major PC manufacturers. Trust me, most OEMs are already well aware of the Microsoft Logo requirements for Vista. If it's going to ship on your PC (and by ship I don't mean your brother's girlfriend's ex-boyfriend's PC company down the street) it will probably be logo'd. If it has that logo, it will run Vista just fine.
After paying for 3.1, 95, 98, 98SE, ME, 2000, XP I'm really starting to abandon cynicism and derision in favor of good old practical thriftiness. I just can't afford Windows anymore.
Idiot.
Good luck MSFT - you've got a hell of a challenge ahead of you.
The age of the compelling application is mostly over because existing hardware (even systems several years old, and thus dirt cheap) fulfill almost all of the average person's computing needs. I'd wager that 90% (or more) of average household computer usage is spent in two applications: email and internet browser. (the other 10% is word processing, accounting/taxes, etc.)
And no, gamers aren't "average" computer users. They're always looking for state-of-the-art.
Seriously -- other than as a new game platform, why would the average person buy a new computer? Mom & Pop don't understand/care about new video production, DVD ripping, file sharing, etc. They just want to occasionally look something up on the net, buy something off eBay, or get a photo of the grandkids. If they already have a system (and market saturation ##'s suggest that they do) convincing them to shell out a grand for a new box that doesn't offer them anything more than the old one is going to be a tough sell.
Will they get XP if their system does not meet the requirements? Surely Dell will sell a low-end machine that might not have the hardware to run Vista? Or worse yet, they sell a machine that meets the minimal requirements, and performs like a dog. I wouldn't think that they'd want that perception, right?
DT
Is this thing on? Hello?
that support out of this box all this
1. Security : Something like Linux or OpenBSD
2. Internet Explorer 7 : FireFox 1.5.x is good enough
3. Righteous eye candy : Something like OS X
4. Desktop search : Google Desktop or bagel
5. Better updates : apt-get or yum
6. More media : Something DRM free
7. Parental controls : non root user?
8. Better backups : rsync
9. Peer-to-peer collaboration : wiki?
10. Quick setup : live CD to harddisk
It could also be called, "10 reasons for buying Mac OS X Tiger"....
Monstar L
I actually read though the list, and other than the last three options. (backups, install times, live shared docs) the other 7 were options I've been using for years on Macs.
Granted, not that I'm not happy that Windows is catching up, but I thought it was funny that to me at least, the only new features were the last three listed. All of which sounded very interesting.
Cupertino, start your copiers!
So the top reason to buy Vista is "you have to".
--
make install -not war
I read this yesterday and to be honest I am disappointed. The only thing that I really care about is security. Everything else matters very little (to me anyway). I will give Vista a run when it comes out as I have a PC that should be capable of running it (runs the betas fine anyway) then I will make my final opinion. I am seriously considering a switch to another platform though.
Compatibility with more games. Other than WoW, what popular MMORPG runs on Mac OS X?
Get a console to play games!Compatibility with more peripherals sold at retail stores.
Possibly, but I'm unaware of any peripheral I need/want that is incompatible with OSX.Compatibility with web sites that are made exclusively for Microsoft Internet Explorer technology and for which there are no close substitutes.
Any suggestions of what sites those may be? Even as a Windows/PC user, running Firefox exclusively, I never came across any site worth my time that required Internet Explorer.Will they get XP if their system does not meet the requirements? Surely Dell will sell a low-end machine that might not have the hardware to run Vista?
Depends on whether Microsoft raises the system-builder license price for Windows XP once Windows Vista is released. Depends further on how many web sites with no close substitutes, such as the web site for the only provider of a given product or service in town or the provider of a service for which you have a long-term commitment, plan to require Windows Vista and its rumored support for Trusted HTTP.
Because you can.
No wait, thats not right.....
Do not try to read the dupe, thats impossible. Instead, only try to realize the truth
What truth?
There is no dupe
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Improvements to IE and Windows media player? I don't use them now, why would I be interested in an improved version to sit idle?
1. What's good for Microsoft is good for the US economy.
2. Because they have a million tricks up their sleeve to obselete your old software.
3. You're too stupid to use linux.
4. Your new hardware has been sabotaged for any "pirated" software like linux.
5. Because we get kickbacks from Ballmer if you do.
6. As an american, you are culturally programmed to want new toys and to believe what marketing firms tell you.
7. Because it will be secure. *snicker*cough**snort*LOL... damn, I can't keep a straight face.
8. Because we at Microsoft have been busy trying to convince you that cool tricks are only possible on Vista, and considering our other OSs are steaming shitpiles, you just might believe it.
9. Because WE SAY SO.
10. If you haven't bought Vista yet, then the terrorists have already won...
Is there any way to mod this story 'troll'?
Actually there is.
Seems like I've had 8/10 of those for over a year with my Mac. Way to "innovate". As long as you have to buy a whole new computer to run this OS, why not buy a whole new computer and try a better OS than the one you have now. One that has been out for almost a year (10.4). One that isn't a "1.0" like Vista will be.
If you really like MS though, why not wait for Windows Vista "98" when they iron out the kinks. (OS X had 'em too early on).
Comment forecast: Bits of genius surrounded by a sea of mediocrity.
In other words, they're (apparently) taking away the current theming engine used in XP. And (ugly default theme aside) that's an improvement, how?
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
I don't think M$ would think twice about imposing this to their users if asked by the government, industry consortiums, etc. I think this is the number 1 reason not to use Windows, at least for people who think their privacy and constitutional rights are important. An example is the request from UK's gov to have their own backdoor to the system: http://yro.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=06/02/15/13 1222
Get a console to play games!
Which non-Blizzard real-time sim is well-supported on Mac OS X? Or do you claim that all non-Blizzard RTS games are poorly engineered? Which console supports independent gaming?
I'm unaware of any peripheral I need/want that is incompatible with OSX.
For one thing, the peripherals that switchers may already own. For another, the peripherals that people receive as gifts, either to individuals from family members or to non-profit organizations from charitable donors.
I can't think of any major IE-only sites at the moment; I'll let others respond.
1. new firewall almost as good as ZoneAlarm
2. new IE almost as good as Firefox
3. new eye-candy almost as good as OS X
4. new desktop search almost as good as Google Desktop
5. new update program almost as good as Mac Software Update
6. new media programs almost as good as iLife
7. new parental controls almost as good as proper parenting
8. new backups almost as good as things not breaking in the first place
9. new P2P almost as good as turning off your firewall
10. new quick install almost as good as all the other planned features that don't actually exist yet
So, instead of a wide open door with a 'PLEASE ROB ME!!!" sign taped to it, they've half closed the door and put up a sign that says "ALL OTHER THINGS BEING EQUAL, I WOULD PREFER THAT YOU NOT STEAL ALL MY BELONGINGS, IF THAT'S OK WITH YOU."
When your starting from the gutter, the "next level" is only the curb.
Lawrence Person (lawrencepersonh@gmailh.com (remove all "h"s to mail)
http://www.lawrenceperson.com/
The registry thing definitely needs a backup solution (or something that can be rolled back). For everything else, given the current sizes of disks, I predict a revival of tape backup technologies. Travan tapes can get to 400GB a pop, so they seem a reasonable solution.
Well, considering there are more and more new computers being shipped with Linux, and how far away Vista's release is, maybe this isn't 100% accurate.
If you are young enough that you can not afford a copy of windows (and you are reading slashdot taking you out the impoverished demographic) then you are not old enough to have bought windows 3.1.
Even if you're a downsized IT worker who has had to switch jobs to food service?
they could start by disabling by default LM hashes... I'm not sure who in MS thought it was a good idea to leave a old security hole open because it was being used for reverse compatibility, usually you close security holes.
Since when has this country used intellectual elite as a pejorative term?
No matter how many new PCs ship with Vista, there is going to be 3 to 5 years before it dominates the market because that's the approximate time it will take for the existing installed base of PCs to be renewed. Can MS wait that long? Can apps writers? Can the media companies?
There are many more than 10 reasons to NOT BUY ANYTHING from Microsoft.
Developers: We can use your help.
Compared to the XP fisher-price look?
Just be grateful, OK.
"I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
I've been playing with some of the new features in Vista, and the entire product is dquarely aimed at businesses. We currently run a mix of XP SP1 and SP2 at work with a few stray 2000 and NT 4 machines. XP was a huge improvement over 2000 from an IT management standpoint, but it still needs fixing.
The biggest shift will be the whole "least privilege" thing that's been standard on Mac OS X and Linux for quite a while. For our users that do require some rights on their machines, spyware cleanup and slowdowns and virus infections are the worst things to fix. If they can't get on there in the first place, then life is better.
One of my favorites is the new provisioning model. Setup is done by deploying a custom disk image that is actually easy to make and maintain, unlike previous versions' Sysprep and such.
That said, it's not a compelling upgrade just for on-the-surface features. I still prefer Mac OS to the Windows user interface any day. Plus, the huge system requirements pretty much kill any of the eye candy for most of our users. We'll be buying it strictly for the improved manageability.
I remember when Microsoft's competitors got a lot of flack for just trailing MS. The times have changed. Most of the listed new features in Vista are MS playing catch-up with the competition:
1. Packet filtering capabilities, per-use administrator rights -- from Linux.
2. Tabs in IE -- from Firefox
3. Eye candy/transparency -- Mac OS X
4. Non-awful search system -- everyone was ahead of MS here
5. Better update system -- still no systemwide yum or apt, but the most abysmal thing about maintaining a Windows box was keeping it up to day, and IE was a piss-poor tool to do so with. See Linux.
6. Looks like MS is bundling the equivalent of rhythmbox/iTunes and gqview into Windows.
7. Parental filtering options -- Okay, I'm not aware of anyone else that bundles this in, so this may be new.
8. Better backups -- Linux's amanda.
9. Peer-to-peer collaboration -- I don't yet know enough about what this actually translates to to be able to comment on it.
10. (apparently a wishlist item, not a real feature?)
Any program relying on (nontrivial) preemptive multithreading will be buggy.
Don't be too sure. As the article points out in the last lines:
The simple fact is we don't know, so to say that it won't is BS, especially since Microsoft HAS been making a lot of noise - they want their own iTunes-style franchise. (I know, another case of Windows Mac Envy)
Compatibility with more games.
This may be an argument for XP, but it's not one for Vista. The only game I've heard of so far that will be Vista-only is the next version of Halo and that's strictly for political reasons.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
Oh great, there goes the RIAA and MPAA into meltdown.
First of all new computers will come with it. And then it is quite likely that some applications will require Vista. Hasn't Halo 2 been anounced to be Vista only (even though I can't think of any feature Vista might have that would make it a better target than XP)? That will pull some of the gamers over. And the next version of Office?
1. Security, security, security: Good! Something we can all agree on. This is a great reason to upgrade!
.. This isn't a great reason. I can run IE7 on XP, or I can run Firefox - which is what IE is to be modeled after. Not a reason to upgrade.
.. gets a welcome update that turns the once-bloated player into an effective MP3 library I think it's spelled 'WMA DRM' not MP3. None the less, media is readily available for XP, OSX, and Linux. This is not a valid reason to upgrade.
2. Internet Explorer 7: IE gets a much-needed, Firefox-inspired makeover
3. Righteous eye candy: This could be a good improvement for those who want a showpiece. Your eye candy is hidden when running applications, and I don't see this as a sole reason in and of itself to upgrade.
4. Desktop search: Yeah, this is a very handy feature. See Google Desktop, Beagle etc. This is not a reason to upgrade.
5. Better updates: WinXP home's update service will be provided for 2 years after Vista has been released. WinXP Pro has approximately 5 years. This is a good reason to upgrade when your existing OS isn't supported.
6. More media:
7. Parental controls: From a technical standpoint, allowing you to block games by their rating could be good. The caveat to this is that parental controls should be done at a parental level NOT through technology. Good reason for certain parents to upgrade. Not a parent? Move along, nothing to see here.
8. Better backups: Working as a tech I found system restore to be only somewhat useful and really hidden. Average Joe user will still not know how to use it or be afraid to use it. Savvy users may employ other technologies to backup information such as Ghost. Products exist so you can store your backups in another location, if your HDD dies, this feature won't help. Not a reason to upgrade
9. Peer-to-peer collaboration: Sounds like P2P, I have it and don't use it. Either way, this technology already exists on WinXP. No upgrade required.
10. Quick setup: Beta code alert: Quick setup vaporware. Not a reason unless it is actually released.
In conclusion, Vista will be a great security update. Most other features are already available for XP and are just now being integrated into the OS - could this lead to more anti-trust lawsuits? (IE and MediaPlayer are historical examples)
Proof by very large bribes. QED.
That may or may not be completely true. In the days when XP first came out, we saw boxes with that "Designed for Windows XP" sticker on them, and most of them were grossly underpowered. Just because you can run XP on a minimum of 256MB of RAM doesn't mean you should. PC manufacturers regularly shipped "bargain" PCs configured this way and they ran like crap. Then again, maybe the PC manufacturers will have learned from previous mistakes and are going to ship PCs that are actually going to run the OS to spec, instead of just being able to boot it.
Nam et ipsa scientia potestas est - Sir Francis Bacon
FTFA: "...Today, desktops routinely ship with 300GB or 400GB hard drives..."
I know HD's are getting bigger and what not, but most computer systems I see advertised are shipped with 40gb drives, but I don't recall any on the market with that much capacity, so is this a typo?
1. you do it because we say so
2. so your lousy software still runs
3. because you are an idiot
4. herding instinct
5. because you need a new mouse
6. so you can play dis new game
7. it's bitchen
8. you want to be like the guy next door with all the viruses
9. because you simply don't know any better
10. can't spell mackintosh
10) Upgrade hell....a new motherboard counts as a "new computer" and thus requires a new Windows license.
9) If you don't have a computer capable of running it to it's full potential...why bother?
8) DRM embedded into the OS. Less control for the user.
7) Viruses
6) Worms
5) Spyware
4) Vista will feature ads.
3) It's still Windows, so it'll still look like something made by Playskool.
2) You're going to have to relearn everything anyway, particularly the Office interface which will be radically different with the new release....might as well switch to something new anyway
1) Gates is evil. What more do you need?
Here's what to be excited about: 1. Security, security, security
Is Ballmer writing his own ad copy now?
Dangit, I said "ugly default theme aside!"
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Compatibility with more games. Other than WoW, what popular MMORPG runs on Mac OS X?
Compatibility with more vertical-market apps such as the one used by your employer.
Compatibility with more peripherals sold at retail stores.
Compatibility with web sites that are made exclusively for Microsoft Internet Explorer technology and for which there are no close substitutes.
But for the next 3-4 years, you'll get all of those things with Windows XP. So what motivation is there to "upgrade" to Windows Vista? If you wanted the 10 features listed in the article, you could get Mac OS X now. If you want the things you mentioned above, stick with the Windows box you have now and don't waste money on the upgrade.
From an old ars technica article, 15 vids (30-45 mins each) with MS programmers talking about and showing the system:6 /1/22/2614
http://arstechnica.com/journals/microsoft.ars/200
the thing I like most about Vista (or what i've heard about Vista) is the new per-app volume control.
Sigs are bad for your health
Let's look at the reasons more closely, shall we?
1. Bi-directional Firewall. Full disk encryption. Security.
Anyone reading PCWorld should not be simply relying on Windows XP SP2's firewall. They should have already installed something like ZoneAlarm or Kerio - which are bidirectional firewalls. There goes that reason out. As for the full disk encryption: wait until a user forgets their password. There goes all their files. Apart from that, I expect to see a full list of exploits for Vista the first week its out.
2. IE7
Firefox. Does everything IE7 does, and then some. And what self-respecting person uses IE exclusively, except to check for compatibility when doing webdesign. There goes that reason.
3. Eye Candy
Although looks do play a role, it shouldn't be the defining factor for any heavy computer user (PCWorld crowd again). Plus, with the uxtheme.dll hack and custom themes, WinXP looks pretty damn good already. Plus, did you see the specs required to even run that eye candy? There goes all the regular computer crowd too.
4. Desktop Search
Current users (can) already have Google Desktop. It's very nice for Vista to incorporate these things, but I don't see it as a compelling reason for current XP users to switch. Especially with the compatibility issues that these users will face.
5. Non-IE dependant Update system
Already in XP, innit?
6. Better Windows Media Player
With XP, one can already run Quintessential Player, Winamp, Foobar... Media Player Classic, VLC, etc. Again, not a compelling reason for me to switch. Plus, I doubt that the new WMP will be able to let me switch dub streams, or select fonts for my anime subs. Features already supported by its competitiors. Again - no reason for me to switch.
7. Parental Controls
Finally, a potentially compelling reason. If I was a parent. And if I wasn't so very much against webfiltering. And if my kid weren't able to root my box in 30 seconds flat.
8. Better Backups
We're talking about a home desktop program here. I do backups, but I'm content with what I have. Namely, Nero. Nero lets me choose what to backup. I could see the use of this in a server environment; but not with a desktop environment where what you need to backup changes location every week.
9. P2P Collaboration
I prefer chalkboards. If I need to share files, I can do that already. If I need to share desktops, I use VNC.
10. Shorter install time
Yes, because a shorter install time (for something that's done once in an OS' lifetime) is truly a compelling reason to switch.
Now I'm glad that the author gave us these reasons. Because if this is the best he can come up with, I really see no reason to switch. Other than the fact that they're going to purposefully break apps to not work in XP (Halo2). And the reasons not to go with Vista? The author considers the fact that they didn't implement some new apparently confusing ideas (virtual folders) as being a reason not to go for it. Logically, that makes little sense; but such statements makes me wonder if the author is a payed worker by MS.
And what about the whole DRM issues and OPM ordeal? How MS Vista will refuse to play some high-resolution videos on your computer if it doesn't like your monitor, or if you don't have a certain (as of yet unreleased) video card. Or program compatibility with pre-Vista software, since this OS was written from scratch? What about those, truly compelling reasons?
To be honest, I can see alot of the ideas as being good for complete computer noobs. Those that don't patch their computers, don't install firewalls, and use IE exclusively. For them, there are some good reasons. After all, they'll never do anything that will hit DRM restrictions (unless they implement DRM for wordprocessors... Actually, that was implemented in Word 2003 wasn't it... I spoke too fast). But the grandpas and grandmas and the computer illiterates, are these the audience of PCWorld?
I'm really dissapointed at the lack of substance of the article. If anything, this was a "suck up to MS" article.
Who is in a hurry to upgrade their OS?
To pay more money, and go through the pain of a reinstall, there must be a killer feature. I use Win2k and I still don't see a feature I am missing.
My productivity/entertainment/leisure all comes from application features, not OS features. The OS is merely an enabler and I don't see any reason to upgrade yet.
Maybe on my next computer but even there with the levelling off on HW, my 2GHz Barton core with ATI 9700 Pro is still going strong and my Nforce (first version) with superb onboard sound and DD encoding still hasn't been topped. Zero reason to upgrade anything right now. The curve has definitely flattened.
Exactly. Reading the feature list if Vista is like thinking "Great! Bubba's going to use a bit more grease this time...
"I've got more toys than Teruhisa Kitahara."
that's an improvement, how?
:P
Compared to the XP fisher-price look?
Just be grateful, OK.
XP has a classic theme, too.. In fact, I always switch to that on any PC I use that has XP on it.
I am grateful.... for the Linux community
No, but it will be an argument for Vista soon enough. Halo is the first, but eventually more and more games will demand Vista to run properly, or at all.Just like with XP and 98.
This may be an argument for XP, but it's not one for Vista.
Sure, but the GP was asking about Vista vs OSX, not Vista vs XP.
$x='S24;r)>63/* h@<5+oZ)32"5cz';$me='phroggy'x$];
$x=~y+ -xz+\0-Tx+;print$_^chop$me for split'',$x;
So, you are saying that the main reason for buying Vista is compatibility with a proprietary but otherwise outdated standard.
Well, I'd say those are excellent reasons not to buy Vista, then: while running Windows for compatibility reasons may be be expedient in the short term, we have to pay for it dearly in the long term.
In fact, people have a simple choice: don't upgrade. Windows XP will keep running for many years to come, and in a few years, hopefully, your "compatibility" reasons will have disappeared, as even more apps are available for other platforms.
Unless you've been living under a rock for the past few months, you probably know that the latest version of Windows--called Vista--is due to hit store shelves later this year (in time for the holidays, Microsoft tells us).
I confess that having been a Linux/OS.X user for years I knew nothing of the exact release date of Vista and had no plans on rectifying this. If that means I should be living under a rock, dibs on that large and jagged lump of granite, sandstone and basalt are sooooo 90s and marble is just plain gauche.
Only to idiots, are orders laws.
-- Henning von Tresckow
But for the next 3-4 years, you'll get all of those things with Windows XP.
If you from Mac OS X to Windows, you have to buy a PC, and if you buy a PC in 2007 through 2009, Windows Vista is what you're going to get.
Parental controls - I honestly don't know if OS X has anything like this
It does.
Why upgrade when you have a robust, secure, beautiful OS in Linux available at an unbeatable price (free)?
Give Linux a try and you will never be disapointed!!
Linux Help
for all things on Linux
Why does everyone keep comparing Vista to MacOSX? I mean sure, OSX had most (if not all) of these features first, but the one and only reason a large portion of the market will upgrade to Vista is DX10, everything else is just gravy. And yes, the title is misleading, it should probably be "Ten reasons to upgrade from Windows XP to Vista".
rooooar
There = A location
That is not always true, exempli gratia:
There is always a grammatical error in any statement that points out a flaw in grammar. There is also a flaw in grammar in every signature which is written to show others proper grammar. There is something ironic about this.
Stupidity is like nuclear power, it can be used for good or evil. And you don't want to get any on you.
I tried to - and these bugs annoy me:
* zip files: the build in stuff does not work, double clicking on a zip file creates a new window of
a process that hangs. you need to kill it using task manager. 7zip&co to the rescue.
* "security" implemented badly: everytime anything gets executed you get a prior popup where you need
to allow that. for example when I want to run the control panel, I get that popup first. or clicking
on anythign within the control panel. even worse are the details: they tell me that a dll is about
to be run as program. which dll? which application triggered that? of course that information is
missing. and of course, vista does not remember my choice. next time I run the same application, I
get the same popup. stupid.
* slow as hell, sometimes. also sometimes astonishing fast. a very different mix, it takes time to get
used to it. he slow parts of course are annoying, and the faster parts don't cancel out that effect.
* looks like mac os X. sure, some people like it, I prefer kde. and all the parts on mac os X look and
feel that I hate are now also implemented in vista. great.
* auto-run still active: autorun for cds was a bad idea. the sony/drm/rootkit story should have told them
at last. but they didn't learn it enough, so now you get a popup whether or not to run some autorun
(or some other software). kde has the same popups, they are a bad idea like almost every popup.
animeate some icon if you want or something, but don't move some software in the front.
* graphics don't work well - yet. the nvidia driver shipped with it doesn't work well, the result has
strange graphic effects that noone wanted (I tried only WoW, but I guess other apps will have them too).
nvidia has a driver for vista 32bit! but it doesn't install - finds no supported hardware. crap.
* sound problems? the driver works fine, the test tool works fine, but applications like WoW stay silent.
maybe the vista audio api broke and is no longer compatible?
* doesn't shut down. the start menu has a button that looks like it will shut down and turn of the
machine, and I was impressed how fast it is. but it does not do that, vista only suspends to disk.
* and of course for everyone (including me) to judge a product by a beta 2 version. oops, it is not beta2,
it is only community technlogy preview with buils 5270 - guess microsofts own QA department knows well
that while some parts have already the "beta 2" label, it could be called at best "alpha 2" if you take
the (missing) usability into account.
1) Hey its the latest OS from microsoft.
2) What do you mean dell doesn't ship xp anymore?
3) Fask, and m$ aint gotta release a patch for w32.gohide.and.pray?
4) Welcome to Office Live. btw your company uses us. change your operating system. come back.
5) BD/HD - DVDs. min requirements : Atleast 64-bit Arch. 5 GHz, 2 Gb Ram. Vista. Your Soul.
6) Dept. of Homeland Security Ordinence.
okay six reasons....
All the reasons listed there are totally unimportant to me (as well as the hardware requirements). The only reason for me to consider upgrading/switching is if the software I use doesn't support XP anymore.
Soon, some version of direct x (maybe 10?) will be vista only. Then games will come out needing that version. The game would have run on xp, but xp won't have that version of direct x.
The idea that Microsoft would ditch its own OS for Mac OS X came to me from Michael Desmond of PCWorld.com, whose writings convinced me that the process had already begun.
I was amused, but after mulling over various coincidences, I'm convinced he may be right. This would be the most phenomenal turnabout in the history of desktop computing.
Desmond made 10 observations: Microsoft's Vista is all about Mac OS X: Security, a Modern Browser, Eye Candy, Desktop Search, Better Updates, More Media, Parental Controls, Backup, Collaboration, and More.
Though these points aren't a slam-dunk for Desmond's thesis, other observations fully support it. The theory explains several odd occurrences, including Ballmer's freak-out and an insane defense over monopolistic practices. Like, who cares?
DRM.
I suspect a rather large bunch of unsuspecting users will hit a pretty hard wall once they realize they cant just d/l and use whatever software they like. With DRM pirating is pretty hard, compared to today it will be insanely hard to pirate an application that puts antipiracy rootkits in a DRM partition. For 98% of all the home users i know this will be an enormous reason not to get Vista.
The upside is that cheaper/free applications will have a blast. Once people mostly uses free software the step onto some other system is so much smaller. Either that or a whole bunch of software companies will have to lower their prices to a much lower price.
HTTP/1.1 400
Right at the bottom (links stripped):
Hot Products at Yahoo! Shopping:
Apple iBook G4 Laptop Computer
Windows XP
Mac OS
"You'll get nothing, and you'll like it!"
Vista isn't even out yet and so many people are already cloning that 'Righteous eye candy' with KDE. /.ers, but I'd need more compelling reasons than the ones listed. Especially for the price.
I'm not as against Microsoft as some
P.S. Yes, I know I don't have to use Aero Glass, but I'm just mentioning it because it's one of the reasons listed.
All these great things that I've already had on my Mac for a year or more - and I get viruses and spyware and bad karma, to boot! Yeeehaw!
Frog blast the vent core.
Hadn't heard about this. May be interesting.
Sure you have. It's called iChat in OS X. Again available for years. Don't be surprised if they add video conferencing capabilities to it with the first upgrade, something tthat is also currently available for the OS X.
To be honest with you, I overlooked that. Also I kind of meant the general mis-spellings one might usually see, such as "There always doing the same thing every day" (as opposed to "they're" in context).
space is pretty cool.
But, I don't see MS marketing Vista as an X-box replacement you can run on your old peripherals.
That's because you don't watch a lot of TV. I see plenty of commercials talking about "the world of applications and devices that run on Windows" on the cable news channels. The commercials for current Windows do play up compatibility with legacy products, but this may begin to end with the Windows Vista operating system, as its driver signing rules (especially on x86-64) exclude users from using older hardware whose manufacturer doesn't make a signed x86-64 driver available and, furthermore, exclude electronics hobbyists from making their home-built hardware compatible with Windows.
Some reasons I didn't feel that strong:
- Eye candy -- I always get the feeling they're desperate when picking that.
- IE 7 -- for anyone who has heard about Firefox or Opera, it's not a notable reason.
- Desktop search -- too many (good, too) alternatives already.
- Windows Media Player getting a decent media library -- too many (good, too) alternatives already.
There are more unlisted examples of these things too, and Windows Vista looks in many aspects just add on tools that have awesome free alternatives going for them already. With this mini-analysis, I suppose the OS will be compelling for novice users, and more advanced users may be trapped with it due to future Vista products that can't be emulated well yet in alternative operating systems. At least that's why I'm on XP now. It's not really better than competitors, far from it, but I have things I need to do that doesn't come or work for Linux.
Beware: In C++, your friends can see your privates!
[Various scenes of people being mock sexually assulted.]
Voiceover: "Being violeted doesn't feel good, does it?"
[Pictures of Windows Vista]
Voiceover: "That's why Windows Vista is built with security in mind."
[Pictures of Steve Balmer]
Voiceover: "Buy Windows Vista, or Steve Balmer will violate you."
When you ask a fan why do they support one team instead of the other, they don't really have a good answer, but you can bet that is something personal, like they come from my home town, or my father supported this team etc.
Any reasons to buy Vista in today's market of choices would be something personal like this. In earlier years past, it would have been there is no other choice.
1) Easier to live in non-administrator mode, I'm still gonna login as admin so who cares
2) IE7..I can get a beta of it already who cares
3) Eye candy..neat for like 10 minutes but who cares
4) Desktop search. If I wanted that I'd already have it from google, who cares
5) Better updater, the XP tray app is just fine who cares
6) Windows Media 10, I'm sure it'll be downloadable for XP who cares
7) Parental controls, I don't have kids who cares
8) Better system restore, sounds good but I backup my important docs with Nero so who cares
9) Collaboration tools, sounds neat but I doubt its worth it
10) Install time speedup, not switching from XP takes me *0* minutes, so who cares
What did you eat today? http://www.atetoday.com/
Yes, most games aren't for OS X.
Yes, a lot of proprietary company software isn't Mac compatible.
No, almost all peripherals work with Macs without having to install anything, even if they say they don't work.
Not really. Those web sites are becoming much less common.
Stupidity is like nuclear power, it can be used for good or evil. And you don't want to get any on you.
Will it do this out of the box? Or will they cram it down your throat with another 'forced paid upgrade' ala xp pro ?
I have mod points and I am not afraid to use them.
DVDDecrypter, DVDShrink, Quicken.
There are some dvd rip&burn apps for the Mac, but noe that I have tried come close to these two Windows apps. Quicken for the Mac is a waste of good disk space. And neither GnuCash nor Moneydance come close to offerring the full feature set of Quicken for Windows.
I have migrated and consolidated all of my Windows/Linux/Mac stuff onto a new iMac. The aforementioned 3 apps, keep me from shutting off the Windows machine.
"I'd rather be a lightning rod than a seismometer." -Ken Kesey
As an owner of both macs and linux/windows pcs, I'll buy vista because I can get rid of half my hardware and run everything on one hardware platform... bios > efi, or so I hope.
What I understand from your answer is that Vista is (or might be) the right choice for technology consumers. Nothing wrong with that, but I'll stick with Linux. I don't fancy myself a consumer.
P.S.: IE 6 works under my Linux, I assume it works as well on Mac OS X / x86, or will do so shortly.
Unfortunately, if you plan on ever buying a prebuilt computer ever again, you probably don't have that choice. Microsoft's monopolistic practices have made it virtually impossible to buy a desktop or laptop computer from a major retailer without also paying for a preinstalled copy of Windows. In those few instances that you are offered the option, the computer without Windows doesn't cost any less--you're still paying for a copy, you're just not getting it.
Most of those bargain systems ran okay once you turned off all the UI improvements and brought it down to something that more closely resembles Win2K. And often times a simple RAM upgrade would give you enough room to start turning things back on.
As a side note, alot of people that that purchase $400 w/monitor machines were either new computer users that would use the system to learn what to actually buy the next time around, or they were replacing an old 300Mhz/32MB Win9x/ME box.
Honestly XP with the classic look is only marginally slower, if at all, than ME and I'd much rather see someone running XP for the sake of better network security and thread management(i.e. crash mitigation) if nothing else.
My God! It's full of eval()'s.
1. They wear out.
2. Network effect.
> I use Win2k and I still don't see a feature I am missing.
Me too, but once Vista is released I expect we'll be missing new patches and service packs.
Get thee glass eyes, and, like a scurvy politician, seem to see things thou dost not.--King Lear
From TFA: Over the years, one of the key reasons to upgrade versions of Windows has been the free stuff Gates and Company toss into the new OS
While I'll agree that they like to "toss" things into their OS, I don't see what is so compelling about the free things they are "tossing" in. If Windows was a tossed salad it would probably be a boring iceberg salad with a whole ton of ranch dressing sprayed all over it.
"Vista takes security to the next level. There are literally too many changes to list here, from the bidirectional software firewall .."
.."
.. SuDO ?
.. tabbed pages"
..
.."
.."
.."
..
..
A software firewall isn't really a firewall more an emulation of one that runs as a system process one that can be hijacked by the next virus/worm.
And one that wasn't 'bidirectional' was never a real firewall in the first place> That you have now to tout such as innovative is ludicrous.
"to Windows Services Hardening, which prevents obscure background processes from being hijacked and changing your system
When you say 'takes security to the next level' you do mean Windows security, don't you ?
"Perhaps most crucial (and least sexy) is the long-overdue User Account Protection,"
Err
"Internet Explorer
Yawn
"new antiphishing features
How about a system that is immune to phishing, not that would be really innovative.
"IE7 on Vista will run in what Microsoft calls "protected mode""
You mean like Firefox running as a user proccess under Linux or Safari under OS X.
"The new OS tightly integrates instant desktop search
The old embed, engulf, make impossible to remove and devour switcheroo.
"And now key components, such as the Windows Defender antispyware module
How about building a system that didn't get hijecked by spyware just by browsing a web site. Not that would really be innovative, for Microsoft that is.
"You can also restrict each account's access by time of day or day of the week."
More innovation?
What's left, translucent windows that goes wavey when you move them. That I should live in such times
Fudwatcher
davecb5620@gmail.com
Windows 2000 - the all-business operating system for the new millenium.
You know, it's plainly obvious that windows development is a complete train wreck, and I was wondering who there was for the Evil Empire to turn to. At first glance, it appears that they've killed all of their possible saviors (and paid a pittance to the bankruptcy trustees of Be, Inc.)
When Copland cratered, Apple was able to buy NeXT. When DOS was proving too much of dead end even for the Empire, MS turned to Dave Cutler from DEC and ended up with a severely damaged VMS that they renamed "Windows NT". Vista is six years late already, and had to abandon the work in progress and rollback to the windows server 2003 code base.
Can they continue after Vista? Should they keep throwing good money after bad? Or, should they swallow their pride (if they ever had any) and buy a license for a modern, working operating system from Apple for probably a tenth of the money they've wasted on the Longhorn disaster?
If Apple can move to Intel, can Microsoft make a similarly daring move? Are they willing to pay Apple tens of billions in royalties on the OS, and make their money on the apps?
If this actually happens, I'll have to drastically revise my opinion of BG and the monkey boy. It would be one of the best things that could possibly happen for the computer industry overall, though.
-jcr
The only title of honor that a tyrant can grant is "Enemy of the State."
1. Security, security, security
.. we are still waiting. Can we cut the shit and focus on a more secure browser instead of glitz and tabs?
/s
This has never be a paramount feature of Windows V.anything. In fact, it's been anything but the 3 s's. We are still waiting for the IE fix as well as the grandiose top priority on security.
2. Internet Explorer 7: IE gets a much-needed, Firefox-inspired makeover
See #1
3. Righteous eye candy:
See #2.. Could we get something to nip that little spyware problem please? Enough with the froof.
4. Desktop search:
hot tip: [START] -> right click -> explore -> F3 (above the #4 key). if your 1eet, dir
5. Better updates:
Can we get that XP patch first? Maybe if you weren't dicking with the eye-candy, we could have this before 2007.
6. More media:
Ok, this looks like a good fix. Oh, wait.. no mention of fixing it I guess. How long has this been a problem?
7-10.. add your own
Join the Slashcott! Feb 10 thru Feb 17!
Ooooh! I can think about a lot of people on the 'net who I'd personally like to offer that feature. And conveniently, their zombie bots, er, I mean, computers, are already running Windows. They'll just need to upgrade.
Village idiot in some extremely smart villages.
That happens when you're an OS-upgrade lemming. I've had 3.1 (bundled with a PC), 95 (ditto), 98 (ditto), and XP (um, obtained when I built a PC). I just never saw any reason to upgrade my working and works-with-all-programs Windows versions on those computers.
/. "don't mod me down, I'm really a Linux user" disclaimer}
{insert idiotic
Hail Eris, full of mischief...
E pluribus sanguinem
Most of those bargain systems ran okay once you turned off all the UI improvements and brought it down to something that more closely resembles Win2K
While this is true, it goes back to my comment about the difference between running the OS to spec and just booting it. Run of the mill bargain basement shoppers aren't going to know how to turn off the UI enhancements, and therefore will be stuck with a computer that is too slow. They also won't know enough about the system in most cases to undertake a RAM upgrade either.
Having said that, it is my own understanding that there will be a great deal more UI enhancements in Vista than any other OS to date. This will mean an even greater slowdown for the poor user buying the $400 machine. The smart thing for Microsoft to do about this would be to make the OS a bit more intuitve about hardware contstraints. It would be great for the average home user not to have to know how to turn off UI enhancements because the OS does it for them. Windows XP does this, but not as well as it should.
Nam et ipsa scientia potestas est - Sir Francis Bacon
From TFA: Heck, it took me almost five minutes to find the Run command, which used to show up right in the Start menu.
I think this illustrates the differences between the Windows and Linux worlds. With the next version of Windows, they don't want you to be running commands or going into a command prompt. With the next version of KDE (at least in the mockups) it's been shown there will be a text entry area for directly entering commands integrated into the K menu. It's already been done in SuSE (and possibly others I'm not aware of)
This just goes to show that Microsoft thinks all of their users are idiots, and Linux developers want their users (even the newbies) to be more adept at using their OS.
"how far along is WINE? Will it run all of MS-office? What are its limitations?"
It's a pretty odd question to ask in a thread where we are discussing Darwine. People will run Mac-native Office if they really need to.
--
Internet Explorer (n): Another bug -- that is, a feature that can't be turned off -- in Windows.
Against:
I can use third part applications to emulate these features (and if I used windows, I would have them already setup). It's not worth $150 (europe) to me every 3/4 years. Serious point: wtf is MS bundling DVD writing/photo organisation software in their OS? They've already sold the OS before release - it's not like they have any commerical x86 OS competition: why are they so actively taking away profits from smaller software firms? It is not necessary AT ALL. It's not like IE7 is the killer app that's going to force people to upgrade or anything.
For:
The knowledge that MS does and will continue to give a bucketload of cash to charity: I don't mind stealing from the rich to give to the poor, I just hope it continues to give - the company has enough money to make a serious difference in the world - it's in a very unique / lucky position - the richest company in the history of makind (probably). Use the money for good!!!
"You know you don't act like a scientist, you're more like a game show host." Dana Barret
The real test of software comes when millions of people are using it. One of the benefits of the open source model is continuous improvement and immediate feedback; although, I suppose it might be possible to make other software work this way (such as windows updates). We won't know for sure how good/bad or useful it is until the complaints start rolling in. I personally would wait for service pack one or two. It will almost certainly be better.
Compatibility with more games. Other than WoW, what popular MMORPG runs on Mac OS X?
Shadowbane
Planeshift
First Star Online
A Tale in the Desert
Clan Lord
EverQuest (not 2)
Unless you're a real junkie for City of Heroes or EQ2, no need for Windows.
Compatibility with more peripherals sold at retail stores.
What? You mean like external hard drives (both USB2 and Firewire), USB input devices, video cameras, single-shot cameras, USB or network printers, HDCP-input HDTV's, DVI and/or VGA monitors (with monitor spanning), audio signal processors, etc.?
Yeah, not only will all of that stuff work on OS X, (and usually without need of a special driver), but often times they will work BETTER than on a PC. Try again.
Information wants to be anthropomorphized.
Seriously. Not that I plan on ever buying Vista, but if I do, I will run it in classic mode just as I do XP. I have a high-end graphics card that could easily run "Aero Glass," but why the hell would I want to use it to render OS effects? When the card is under load, it uses a lot of power, generates a lot of heat, and makes a lot of noise (the fan spins up). I accept these things when I play games, I don't want them when I'm at the desktop.
And I don't know about WP5.1, but I still use WordPerfect 6.1 for Windows, and it is indeed fast on modern hardware. No current word processor offers me an incentive to upgrade.
Give a man fire, and you warm him for the night. Set a man on fire, and you warm him for the rest of his life.
Well, the timing you can't argue with – but the features it's advertising strike me as familiar. "Eye-catching graphics" are already available for other systems, in the form of eg. the X compositing engine and not to mention Enlightenment. Bundled applications I can't help but laugh at, especially considering that most Linux distributions have more than Notepad, Paint, and Media Player – hell, almost all of them come with a free office suite, which Microsoft users usually have to pay several hundred dollars for!
As for more-rigorous security, well, there's the first place I think the article's going wrong. Just by virtue of the fact that the word "more" is in there, you can easily see why so many people suspect Microsoft intentionally cripples the system to force upgrades. Viruses, spyware, and worms galore – and yet I have yet to see that on any Linux distribution I've used. And besides, I refuse to consider anything secure that's anything less than OpenBSD.
Again, it's "improving". Which infers that the security was, well, not very good before. And again, I still won't consider even Linux to be secure when compared with OpenBSD. As for the "spyware library updates," I don't think that they would even be necessary if Microsoft didn't make it so easy to get loaded with spyware in the first place.
/etc, /home, and /var.
Backup software is another thing worth mentioning on Linux. While it's not directly related to the article text here, it's worth mentioning one particularly understated feature of UNIX systems – how easy it is to back them up. Whereas with a Microsoft box you have settings scattered all over the hard disk, I can typically back up all my Linux boxes and even transfer the configuration to another system just by tar'ing up three basic directories –
OK, let's get on to the next paragraph. Continuing!
Now, what really puzzles me here is how Internet Explorer is
Creative misinterpretation is your friend.
I already have all this in Mac OS X, I have no reason to use or buy Vista over OS X. Microsoft are clearly playing catchup with things like security, an improved browser (everyone has Tabbed browsing and Google search bars already, IE7 is already yesterday's news), and search - Microsoft are acting like Mac OS X 10.4 never happened, because they're so arrogant. Oh well, everyone will still buy Vista anyway unless Apple do some huge Mac advertising campaign that'll kick Microsoft's ass!
I will not buy Windows Vista or get any hardware that bears it. Just because I can afford not to.
1. Linux, linux, linux.
2. Firefox. Konqueror.
3. Couldn't care less
4. See #3
5. Linux
6. See #4
7. See above
8. Shell script does it
9. I was wrong, I could care less.
10. ??? I can install Slackware in under 10 minutes, and have been doing so for the past 4-5 years. Is this really a selling point? If so I truly feel sorry for Microsoft.
So excuse me if I don't buy it.
I hadn't known there were so many idiots in the world until I started using the Internet -Stanislaw Lem
really? they're going to ship Vista on Macs and Linux boxen then? did M$ sneak a bill through the Congress that requires every new computer anyone buys to include Vista? I for one will be very happy to never own a copy of Vista--i've already got all the 'righteous eye candy' that I need, and all of the other 'features' that were listed...OS X, the future, today!
If you from Mac OS X to Windows, you have to buy a PC
Not really, no.
If you buy an iMac or MacBook today, or just about any Mac later this year, then you don't. Vista is expected to run just fine on the Intel-based Macs.
Information wants to be anthropomorphized.
That's intereting......I run XP on a celeron 433Mhz at work with 512MB RAM and a crappy intel video adapter built on to the motherboard. It sounds to me like it runs circles around your newish computer. Either you're a troll or a novice computer user. Apparently you can't be bothered to set any preferences for your applications (or is this something that you think you should only have to do in Linux)? Word and Outlook are customizable and scriptable via VBA, far more than most applications written for either *NIX-like or Windows platforms (Apple has got AppleScript, but it's a mixed bag). Go find a clue before opening your mouth next time.
This article does not include monty-pythonish foot, am I missing something?
Every single last one of these features is redundant and lame, seriously.
AMEN! Isn't that the whole point? Bargain basement PCs don't come with a $600 graphics card installed.
I may not know much about Vista, but based on previous performance by Microshaft, I really don't have to.
Prophesy: Vista will come out, will be plagued by hardware and software incompatibility issues (sound familiar?), will suck eggs for about a year, and will finally be widely accepted. Blah, blah, blah ad nauseam.
Nam et ipsa scientia potestas est - Sir Francis Bacon
Long ago there used to be an old DEC tool that first appeared in RT-11 called: pip. It stood for "Peripheral Interchange Program". What did it do? It copied data from one device to the next. If you had data sitting on a CDC-80 (80MB fixed disk) connected to an Emulex disk controller and wanted to copy your data to an RX08 8" floppy disk, that was the tool to use. The closest tool in 'NIX would be: dd. Nobody complained about pip being bundled with the operating system. Nobody thought it was "feature creep" - because copying data about turned out to be pretty useful.
Does Aero come even close in utility for a user?
The reviewer didn't mention InfoCards and the Identity Metasystem. No wonder, since they are still works in progress. Still, InfoCards and the Metasystem will be a compelling reason to upgrade to Vista.
............... kris
InfoCards are built into IE7 and run on top of the new Identity Metasystem. InfoCards are metadata representing identity data such as username, password, VISA card number, age, etc., that are converted into tokens protected by private keys. These tokens will be passed to Metasystem servers on the Internet running the Security Token Service via Web service protocols standardized by OASIS and supported by Sun and IBM. These Metasystem servers running STS will process the token, validate the key with a public key, and allow user access to their remote resources.
The Metasystem itself is a major advance in identity technology because it layers itself on top of existing identity infrastructure rather than replacing it. In other words, it doesn't require web site administrators to rip out their existing directories and databases; they just deploy a running instance of the Metasystem and an STS server that talks to their local identity store and they can talk to InfoCards.
The end result is no more passwords, no more phishing, and users get to control their own identity information. Enterprise users will love it, IT administrators will love it, and it's just one more reason why I want to upgrade to Vista. I for one am sick of remembering ten million passwords and being phished and if InfoCards and the Metasystem can save my butt I'll be first in line at Fry's.
"I thought I could organize freedom. How Scandinavian of me."
shouldn't that be Meet the *new* boss, same as the *old* boss
i mean, that's the lyric
Supplies!
From what I've seen so far, it looks as if Vista will automatically go to Aero Basic if the hardware isn't up to snuff for the full DX10 accelerated Aero Glass. And, also from what I've seen, the Aero Basic should be about as processor intensive as XP's Luna.
If we consider that since the dawn of XP, even cheap boxes have upgraded to at least DX9 integrated *cringe* graphics, 256MB RAM and a processor that hovers around 2Ghz; a new commodity grade computer should be able to handle your basic www, e-mail and productivity applications with an interface that resembles XP with WindowBlinds. Albeit, some pagefile thrashing may be in order.
We just need to convince manufacturers to put a sticker on the machine saying "You didn't spend enough to play games on this POS, now go back to checking your email like a good grandma."
As for users that try to put this on a previous generation of commodity box. They're probably seven shades of outtaluck.
My God! It's full of eval()'s.
It seems to me there is a downward trend with MS in every area, marketing, innovation, product design, and security. I think that it has reached a very noticeable level to even those who are die-hard MS fans. Maybe it was the marketing by hype practice that put MS on an inescapable treadmill of eroded credibility. It seems harder these days for tech writers to stick their necks out and jump on the MS bandwagon to fully hype the new products. That was a pretty wimpy review of Vista, and I expected more hype from the writer, otherwise why cover a beta that keeps loosing features just to meet a release date.
/.ers, they are the followers and not the leaders of the "top ten reasons to buy an OS". Of course, in shear volume of sales they beat all other OSs hands down and they are truly the top dog of the desktop computer market. Why, then does MS seem to have to make such an effort to try and steal the "innovation" credit when so many know the truth is far down another road?
;-)
While not seeming to overcome fear of innovating a new OS, MS asks us all to live in their imaginary world and believe that they are the innovators of all things new to desktop computing. This may be the way to go if MS were better at the art of illusion, but they are not that good at it. While David Copperfield can make a live crowd believe he just made an elephant disappear before their eyes, MS can't convince PC prospects that they are not following Mac and Linux in the desktop innovations Vista claims to offer, maybe, at some future date.
Clearly, from the posts here by savvy
Perhaps being on top so long breeds fear of innovating. It may be safer to wait and watch others do the innovating, fumble around at a knock-off and proclaim you have just innovated a whole new set of features that everyone needs, right now. It seems to work to a degree, but is that also failing to keep the giant of desktop OSs on top, as more markets slip away from MS.
I switched from MS Win to Mac and Linux over the last few years. First by getting comfortable with Mac OSX at work and a couple of years ago I discovered Linspire. I still love the Mac, especially for graphics work, but I never got use to seeing MS products for the Mac, like MS Office and IE. So, Firefox and Open Office have been my primary browser and office suit for a while. I tend to rely more on Linux as my primary desktop OS now and have cut all but a couple of old ties to third party Windows software, that I rarely boot into XP to use. One of those is Swish, a light weight flash movie developer package. I tried to get Swish running in Crossover Office, but no go there.
These days, I don't consider myself to be a MS product user to any noticeable degree, and I need not wonder why. MS has performed so poorly as at the corporate level, like a bully loosing his grip on the desktop playground, doing desperate things in response to the slightest threat from any new kid (or those already not cowering in the corner like Mac). I thought I switched primarily for security reasons, and would have said that if surveyed at the time, but now I think it goes further. As MS continues to disappoint me almost daily with their attitude towards their users and others in the market, I realize that this is the real driving force behind my switching from MS products.
So, with regards to Vista, I don't see any thing for me in this OS shell game MS seems to be playing. In fact I think it may be the worst direction MS has ever taken their marketing in. MS seems to be resorting to carny trickery to milk money out of anyone they can. I wonder if this is the big downward spiral of the software giant that has been predicted for several years. It certainly is interesting to watch...
Sorry for the long reply on this one
I lost my sig...
Well, you don't need to use Windows Update anymore after you switch to a different OS, but if that's a problem holding you back, I'm worried...
'Yes, firefox is indeed greater than women. Can women block pops up for you? No. Can Firefox show you naked women? Yes.'
10. System freezes. 9. New bugs same as the old bugs. 8. USB2 only works half as fast as Firewire in real world tests. 7. 165,000 viruses knocking on my internet door. 6. The Registry. 5. The Registry. 4. What do you mean my $1,500 2-year-old computer doesn't have enough power? 3. Hey, you said my old software would run with this. 2. Bill's wallet keeps get fatter and mine keeps getting thinner. and the number one reason not to buy Windows Vista: 1. I'm tired of paying a lot of money just to get half of last years OS X features!
Compatibility with web sites that are made exclusively for Microsoft Internet Explorer technology and for which there are no close substitutes.
;)
And which sites would that be (that people would care about)?
I have an offshore account, with a major bank. They used to only accept Netscape Communicator 4.72 and IE 5/6 as browsers (they'd check User-Agent: w/ JS, and not let you login if you don't match).
They kept on changing the system (HTML, JS, removed all JAVA stuff), and I've been using FireFox (with user-agent extension) for a year.
I've mailed them once telling them that systems works perfectly fine with Firefox.
Then I realized I don't use User-Agent extension at all and I am still able to login into banking system.
Moral of the story - things are changing. If major bank modifies its banking system so that it works with Firefox, I think it says something.
Either they care about users, or they have hired a switched on geek, aware of standards
Micrrosoft has taken a rather narrow view with their Vista. Problems facing computers today do not relate to "yet another UI attempt" and there are already much more interesting UI advances from other companies (try multi-point touch display f'rinstance.) MS needs to address stability, security and performance. Stability of its own applications would be a start. Security to remove or control its own mistakes in design compromises. And performance in terms of delivering a near real-time experience to the user. Isn't it interesting that the only machines that never need to reboot (in my household) are the TiVo (Linux) and the house file- and print-server (also Linux) but my Tablet PC can't go a full day without something coughing up a fur ball. And my Windows Media PC needs constant attention to drive fragmentation and a level of technical "intervention" that would be completely outrageous to a TiVo user. It's also interesting to note non-English speaking visitors tend to end up on the Mac for browsing or checking their email. They also tend to use the TiVo (which involves learning how to switch away from the Media PC, which is usually sitting there with a list of movies and a browser window open to a Google page) but they know how to use TiVo ... even the remote is immediately easier and more familiar.
If they built a stable, secure OS that ran smoothly, I think the customer base would increase. As long as we get upgrades to Windows for Workgroups, like NT, XP and Vista, it's just more of the same.
I run Windows 2000 on my Athlon 2400s I am a lot less than impressed by this list.
1. Security - Nice, but we have not any real problems, probably because we use Mozilla browsers and e-mail.
2. Internet Explorer 7 - I have used IE only for websites that won't load in Moz. Makes no difference to me.
3. Righteous eye candy - I am over the age of 12.
4. Desktop search - Google and its free.
5. Better updates - Win 2K is no longer being updated. Besides, I never let any progrm load stuff on my system that I do not know about.
6. More media - Might be interesting if did that sort of thing, which I don't.
7. Parental controls - My yougest is 18 now. He is on his own.
8. Better backups - So what? The old one sucked so badly, I just bought some 80GB drives and put them in USB 2 enclosures. Problem solved.
9. Peer-to-peer collaboration - I don't work in a multi-national conglomerate. I run a very small business -- 2 people, my wife's business is even smaller. We don't need it.
10. Quick setup - And if I don't buy it, it will take even less time to install.
Over all, I see no reason to shell out the big bucks for a new Micro$oft product. It does not solve any of my problems and it costs money. Besides, I would be concerned about the inadequacy of my hardware that is only a couple of years old. I don't want to shell out even more bucks for hardware.
Summary, no economic reason to spend money.
In the land of the blind, the one-eyed man is king.
Security, Security, Security
...need... eye candy.
...just use Google and Yahoo like you do normally anyway since they're already here and better.
yeah, they're so good at this. The world's richest man wants to 'protect' you from people who will give him more money for the opportunity to sell you junk that you don't need, using commercials on your desktop, or 'jump-outs' in your application.
Plus since we're talking security here, what makes you think that you're going to get any from the guys who bend over backwards to put ordinary people in Chinese concentration-camp prisons. You can be assured that anything from Redmond is going to have plenty of backdoors for the Gitmo Gomers to read and monitor everything that you do on your PC. And Linux won't have this.
Internet Explorer 7: IE gets a much-needed, Firefox-inspired makeover...
So use just FireFox. 'nuff said.
Righteous eye candy...
Do like Steve Jobs and just drop some acid if you
Desktop search:
Better updates:
one word...sourceforge....next?
More media
more embedded DRM, you mean.
Parental controls
we are already grown-up, and we don't need any more excuses for library restrictions on web access. Like prohibiting 17-year-olds from getting information on effective birth control, just cause 'Jesus or Allah says no'.
Better backups
the application programmer's responsibility, not the OS.
Peer-to-peer collaboration
they seem to want to make that quite illegal if I recall correctly.
So how much money or honey did they give this guy for writing such a transparent puff-piece about an operation system that doesn't even exist yet?
It's true, compatibility with legacy applications can be a problem. Some Application Service Providers build windows-centric web apps. A Macintosh-only shop I know had to install Virtual PC so they could do payroll with a service that they could access online. With Macintosh/unix you can always do what you need to make a profit, but your solution just might exclude the less capable windows machines. Heh.
On a similar note, what compatibility will you get that you don't already have in XP as far as games go? Lots of games are still designed to run on Windows 98 and most run on Windows 2000. It's a small percentage that run only on XP and most of those are from Microsoft. Are the game companies going to switch to Vista only en masse? If not, why upgrade, especially considering how hard Microsft worked to put such limits on the system under the presumption that you're a criminal even if you paid for your copy?
IE only sites... yeah they're still out there but the use of altnerative browsers is on the rise. You know what a lot of people do when faced with an IE only site when they're not using IE? Simply don't go there again. Oh, sure, if it's important enough they fire up IE, but if it's not they just go elsewhere. And few users of FF/Opera/whatever don't know that IE is less secure than their browser of choice, so they're suspicious when faced with a site that requires IE anyway. "Oh, you need IE so you can give me all that spyware, huh? Fuck you!" is one phrase I heard a friend say just three days ago.
Hardware and apps are always a problem for users of other OSes, but with regard to the latter Wine has come a long way... and then there's Crossover and cedega. When I used Crossover more than a year ago it could already run tons of Windows apps. How long do you think it'll be before Windows apps that can't be run on Crossover & cedega are in the minority?
Ah, I see that one of the latest crop of mods struck while I was typing. The modding here has gone to Hell in a handbasket lately. Too bad, dude.
I dream of a better world... one in which chickens can cross roads without their motives being questioned.
What? You mean like external hard drives (both USB2 and Firewire), USB input devices, video cameras, single-shot cameras, USB or network printers, HDCP-input HDTV's, DVI and/or VGA monitors (with monitor spanning), audio signal processors, etc.?
How about the video camera, USB or network printer, or flatbed scanner that was donated to you or to your organization? Does Mac OS X have more drivers for gift hardware than Windows does?
The main reason to buy it is so that Michael Desmond gets his check from Microsoft for writing the review.
Every one of his ten reasons to buy is a feature that OS X has had for at least a year.....if not longer. As a matter of fact when Vista is released to the masses I imagine most features will look like copies of present OS X software. Microsoft is not really known for creativity and by Bills own words they take whatever has already been done and try to make it better.
Unless they require a password for ALL software installs their security is going to fail in a big way. My prediction.....their security will actually be an inroad for infecting the computer.
Does Aero come even close in utility for a user?
I went back and re-read the paragraph on eyecandy, and I can't make much case for it. A live preview of minimized programs is nice (it's one of the few visual effects I like in OS X), but I fail to see why that would require 3D hardware.
Aero is being developed for the sake of adding a new feature to Windows. Most new computers will run it, and most people won't bother turning it off. I suppose that's Microsoft's standard for innovation.
Give a man fire, and you warm him for the night. Set a man on fire, and you warm him for the rest of his life.
...so what reasons do I have to buy Vista?
On a similar note, what compatibility will you get that you don't already have in XP as far as games go?
TERdON's comparison was not with Windows XP but with Mac OS X 10.4.
If not, why upgrade
Because hardware wears out, and new hardware comes with the new operating system pre-loaded.
You know what a lot of people do when faced with an IE only site when they're not using IE? Simply don't go there again.
Unless it's, say, their university's online gradebook. If you can't view your grades or sign up for courses in Firefox or Opera or Safari, then you have to use IE. Or do you claim that they would transfer to a different university over this issue?
Hardware and apps are always a problem for users of other OSes, but with regard to the latter Wine has come a long way
And with regard to the former? My Microtek USB flatbed scanner, which SANE still lists as unsupported, is keeping my PC on Windows.
How long do you think it'll be before Windows apps that can't be run on Crossover & cedega are in the minority?
It doesn't necessarily work that way, as the Windows API is a moving target. Specifically, Windows Vista introduces a whole set of APIs that Wine doesn't know about.
... Tiger, already has all of the "breakthrough" features that Vista is supposed to have. Oh, and has already delivered. Let's wait to see what Apple has when Vista finally ships.
please excuse my apathy
I think you miss the point. Vista's new default theme requires a rather stout CPU + GPU combo to operate well. Its "Classic" theme is probably one of WinXP's themes. (I wouldn't be surprised if they offered both WinXP default themes.)
I don't think anyone was claiming that WinXP's "classic" theme was supposed to be much faster than its default "Windowx Xbox Wannabe" theme.
--Joe
Program Intellivision!
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Not running everyone as admin does NOT constitute security. In fact, I would have no reason to switch from my *nix systems for this security. Gonna have to try harder then that.
2. IE 7
I've gone of the "upgrade" list of IE 7 quite closely to find... nothing new. Everything they "add" is already in another major browser. As for that anti-phishing feature, as a student in IUs Applied Cryptography:Phishing course, I can tell you it's worthless. Because it relies on a file on disc, probably built into IE, this can be easily circumvented by malware. Sorry, I don't trust IE at all, just from the track record. Need a better reason? It's still built into the OS. Not... smart... at... all...
3. Eye Candy
Granted, I only have a Windows box for my gaming pleasures, but still it is stupid to require a high-end system for the desktop. Most users will not be playing games on it, so most won't automatically have the hardware to run this. What I'd like to know is if it comes on by default? I'll bet it does, which means that it'll run very slow before users realize to turn it off. Plus, why is this necessary? I realize I'm a little bit of a purist, and prefer a command line, but even when I use a desktop, this seems like overkill. Has anyone ever desired to see what's on a window without actually opening the window? Does it really save that much time?
4. Desktop Search
Ok, again this is a good thing to have, and one of my main beefs with Windows is the slow search feature (hard to find the virii on friend's coimputers). Now, my *nix box is damn quick thanks to how they do searches. I wonder if Microsoft has gone to that model. Also, will it search hidden and system files by default? Something it *needs* to do, and doesn't by default.
5. Better Updates
Nice to see them getting away from using IE for everything, but again, this is a feature in Mac OS, and *nix already. Not exactly a reason to "upgrade".
6. Media
Ok, I'll give 'em more media is gonna be a selling point for the average user. Good smart marketing *clap*. But my question is this. Are these going to be strand alone programs? Or Microsoft's usual anti-monopoly move, and built into the OS. If built in, as the DVD Maker sound like, why? All this is is a new way to add vulnerabilities. I think as little as possible should be "OS", and the rest offered as downloads that don't have root permissions in the OS.
7. Parental Controls
Now, this argument is personal, but hear me out. I don't like cencorship, and I think that a better parenting method is to teach kids how to use the computer correctly and trust them not to be going against your will. Locking it while you're at work, kinda petty. Some parents might agree with this, and I'm not a parent, but I definately don't like this practice or some of the stuff AOL is doing. I also think this could be a fun attack vector. Imagine blocking file downloads for the update client? Or locking out the admin account, then un-priviledged virii can have all day to scan the hard drive for information.
8. Backups
They tout the fact that the backup client is upgraded for the first time in years? Not a selling point.
9. Peer to Peer
I am willing to place $1000 on the fact that within a year of Vista going public, this feature is exploited in at least 5 virii. More than that, it will be used by Phishers to get people to join false workgroups, and steal information. Perhaps a SEPERATE program would be a better idea here? Something that doesn't come on, right out of the box?
10. Quick Setup
If it comes with this, awesome. No OS has quick setup right now, and even *nix is plauged by bloat (FC4 takes over an hour, 6.5 GB). However, I don't believe this number, "15 minutes". Is that like Windows 95 will run on 4 MB RAM? (For the record, it DOES, just barely... the mouse lags). Perhaps on a high end system.
But, this article is not about getting other OS users to switch, it's about getting XP users to upgrade
Want to find other gamers to play board and role playing game
I was intrigued to see that system restore is being "tweaked" to make it even more useful.
Really, has anyone EVER used this thing and EVER found it useful?
I've turned it off and never used it. HOWEVER, I found where they hid the Backup program on the XP Home CD and I use that each week! Glad to hear it seems like it will be installed as default.
Eye candy and an mp3 player
let me get my cheque book
There are places where the networks are not touching,and there are places where they are-Boeing's Lori Gunter
Jumping Jesus man. OS X has had better drivers for all that stuff than windows for a long time. Most of the time you can just plug it in without installing anything.
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Im not saying that Microsoft engineers can't do it right, i mean that there are usually things that end priorizing things that goes against security (drivers in ring 0, internet explorer integrated, needing to be admin to run games, the past is full of examples). Will that kind of things happen again? Dont want to bet that much being already very good alternative options.
1) Help microsoft pay for ongoing anti-trust legal battles
2) help those who have stock in MS to see a growth in their stock value
3) Help homeland security worm its way into your personal affairs, thru windows back doors.
4) help those who have stock in MS to see a growth in their stock value
5) help suppress open source software.
6) help those who have stock in MS to see a growth in their stock value
7) help the economy by requiring more people to be hired to handle windows IT issues.
8) help those who have stock in MS to see a growth in their stock value
9) help MS to buy out and shut down better products.
10 help those who have stock in MS to see a growth in their stock value.
I said HONEST..... I didn't say anything about Ethical.
There was a time when investing in stock was based upon believing in a company's products and services.
Today that doesn't matter, so long as you have a positive return (do a google for "trillion dollar bet" for the extreamly unethical side of this.
Gift hardware? What on earth are you talking about?
Like most other folks here, I hadn't heard of "Windows Collaboration" before
The "P2P" is peer-to-peer in the original sense of the word, as Microsoft's IPC and printing mechanism is peer-to-peer -- you don't need to specially designate servers. This is not a "P2P filesharing" application in the vein of Gnutella.
It looks like it might be basically NetMeeting (kinda like vnc with an emphasis on multiple-user simultaneous use) but with the ability to text chat and offer files to other people connected. I could see it being quite handy, but I don't think that there's anything that you can't do with an IM application or IRC plus vnc. It might be somewhat more convenient to bundle the above.
If Microsoft wants to make real, technical improvements that would help their market, I've got a great one -- provide a version-control system for Office apps. Let people merge their changes. It's incredibly annoying to have long documents that multiple people cannot work on at once. This is no problem if we're working on a text document or HTML document or LaTeX document or whatever, but you can't work simultaneously on a document in office. Grr.
Any program relying on (nontrivial) preemptive multithreading will be buggy.
Where the hell is "stability"? With all the new toys they added to Vista I sure as hell hope it's at least stable when it comes out.
Can I answer??
I'll tell your Grandpa that he doesn't need to buy software for his kid, that's what synaptic is for!
And if you actually meant "games", then OK.
If games is the issue, then get an XBOX360 for games, and an actual machine (the cheapest one) for web/mail .
It's much less expensive, because you don't need a 3d card, or a Pentium VVIVIIVVV or two gigs of memory for actual work, and the XBOX 360 , a playstation 3 when there is one, or even a playstation 2 are much better designed for games at home than a mswindows machine bought at walmart and administered by your nephew.
Security, security, security
What about my Linux partition?
For the first time, Microsoft is building high-end graphics effects into Windows.
What was the deal with the XP look then? And is there a medium choice if I don't want the crappy Classic look but also don't want to need dual 7800s in SLI? Hell, they've got quad SLI now, is that what I'll need to run F.E.A.R.?
Windows Vista boasts a much-improved backup program that should help users avoid wholesale digital meltdowns.
You mean Knoppix?
Parental controls
Haha, you're kidding, right? MS couldn't stop releasing of their own source-code and CD-keys before XP came out, and they are still plagued by security problems, so what makes you think that a kid with above-room temperature IQ couldn't get around this? Actual parenting is the solution. My school has priveleges and download locks, DeepFreeze, and N2H2, and you know what we do in class? Get through the filter, go Download.com, download the Unreal Tournament demo installer, install it, and play for an hour.
Desktop search
How hard is it to put things in folder? C'mon people. If you are really lazy or forgetful, Google desktop will be better the same way that Google search is still better than MSN. Is this for the people that dump EVERYTHING on to their desktop? Could it include a bomb to kill them off?
Better updates
Unless the updates themselves are better, I don't care. When I can download a Service Pack and have it NOT ASSRAPE MY SYSTEM then I will be happy. A service pack should not add 8 minutes to the start-up time, like it did with mine (reinstalled XP with included SP2, no more problems than usual)
Peer-to-peer collaboration
Bittorent? Doens't Ubuntu come with that already? Or is this a new security hole? Or is this like the same Handouts/Dropbox feature already in operation at my school?
Quick setup
Dream on, kid.
The 'Net is a waste of time, and that's exactly what's right about it. - William Gibson
Gift hardware? What on earth are you talking about?
In the case of individuals, birthday and Christmas presents from relatives who can't tell Ralink from Realtek. In the case of non-profit organizations, donations in kind intended as a tax writeoff.
Because the app writers will force you to.
:)
It's that plain and simple. Companies writing applications for Windows will enjoy the new DRM features. Not to mention that everyone will HAVE to buy the new DRMed version or their system will refuse to run the DRMed apps they have at the same time as the non-DRMed.
So companies will jump onto the DRM bandwagon for the simple reason that you can't pirate their stuff anymore. Well... let's just assume you can't, just for the sake of not starting an argument about whether it's vaporware again or not.
They'll THINK it does prevent pirating. And that's what matters.
Joe Shmoe Average will not know how to circumvent it, so he'll buy all the new shiny apps. And new apps will not work on "legacy" (read: current) systems. Especially game companies will jump onto it like blowflys swarm a piece of turd.
So no matter what "wonderful" features the new piece of tur... software from Redmond offers, people will buy it for the simple reason that their new apps will not run on anything else.
We used to have a Bill of Rights. Now, with the rights gone, all we have left is the bill.
The real reason not to buy Windows Vista is that Microsoft has a history of abusing its customers. This version will be secure?
Remember that Windows XP had many problems, besides being extremely vulnerable, until Service Pack 2. I suggest everyone wait until Vista SP2 to evaluate Vista. That would save a lot of time.
Remember the last Microsoft encryption scheme, that is built into Windows XP? No? If you have never heard of EFS, I can tell you why. Many, many people lost all their files because of the bugginess and poor documentation of EFS. EFS doesn't work at all on stand alone computers, unless you think that not being able to have a valid backup is "working". (If you argue with this, you will be arguing with Microsoft technical support, who has verified this more than once. On stand alone computers, EFS encryption is tied to the SID of the OS installation. If you change stand alone computers, you cannot decrypt your files.)
Will you trust your files to encryption by a company whose last version was buggy and poorly documented and lost customer files? (Try TrueCrypt instead.)
Remember that Windows NT, Windows 2000, Windows XP, and Windows Vista are ALL the same operating system, but just new versions. Microsoft renames their products and takes advantage of people with little technical knowledge, who think that they are buying a new product.
Remember that Bill Gates is the Dr. Death of software. HE decides when Microsoft's software is no longer usable, not the customers.
When someone abuses you, never forget. Try not to be involved with habitual abusers.
--
Before, Saddam got Iraq oil profits & paid part to kill Iraqis. Now a few Americans share Iraq oil profits, & U.S. citizens pay to kill Iraqis. Improvement?
About Wine/Vista: For starters, it'll be years before Vista becomes necessary for even a strong percent of games. In that time, a WINE for XP is fine, as long as it runs most software/games. And in three years, when Vista is semi-needed to play a decent number of popular games, I bet some progress on the WINE for Vista front will have been made.
WTF! I still haven't seen a list reasons why I should dump my Windows 2000 Pro + SP4 + Security Roll Up for buggycrappy Windows XP SP2 ?!? Features my ass! Am I missing something here... (honestly?)
www.tribalnetworks.org - helping tribal people around the world to own their own means of high-tech communications
I grew up in a family that used AOL, and I had to endure parental controls for most of my life. Since I love computers so much, it was perhaps one of the most frustrating aspects of my life, and it was extremely shameful and demoralizing because it sent me a message that my parents didn't trust or respect me. During those years I despised them because there was no personal or human aspect to our relationship--only control.
Having third party software that does this is one thing, but building these features into the operating system is something entirely different, and I find it abhorrent. I feel really sorry for kids growing up now that are going to have to fight Vista in the home.
This means consoles have just about no indie / freeware scene. You'll never see a freeware gem like Cave Story on a console (Macs have a fair number of indie games available for them, but the selection still pales in comparison to what is available for Windows PCs).
PC games tend to be far more customizable than console games. Keyboard + mouse is also still the best method for controlling first person shooters.
Flamebait/Troll mod
F***ed-up previous post, sorry. Flamebait/Troll mod option should really not be offered to everybody. How the hell does parent qualify as a flamebait??? There really are a *lot* complete systems out there with half-assed on-board graphic cards!
The sensible choice in XP is to use the horrid new themes. They look awful, but they are improved in usability. If you look closely, you will see that the "start" button is much easier to click, as is the "close" button in maximized windows, and the minimized window buttons, because there is no dead zone between the buttons and the edge of the monitor, effective making the button way bigger, and much easier to click when you do those tasks with a mouse (fitt's law, says so, at least).
I have an XP machine at my new job, and I miss gnome a lot, but the classic windows theme wouldn't make it any better.
I didn't see anything on that list that Mac OS X or your favorite Linux distro doesn't already have. I looked, point by point, and could think of a comparable feature on either Mac OS X or Linux or, usually, both. That's what I wish Windows users would understand, particularly home users. Microsoft, despite their dominance of the OS market, sells, by far, the least advanced operating system of the big three. Linux gets features as soon as someone contributes code, which happens all the time. And, if you're impatient like me, you can install Debian testing/unstable and always have the latest features as they come down the pike.
Let's review:
Security Every Linux distro I know of forces you to make a non-privileged user account. There are plenty of features built into GNOME and KDE now that let you do a graphical 'sudo' to do administrative tasks. On the Mac, this is the default. They have their own graphical 'sudo', which works incredibly well. And, aside from the occasional exploit, neither OS has the same kind of inherent security problems that Windows does. IE 7 One word: Firefox. OK, two: Safari. Both great browsers that already offer all the same featuers. Righteous Eye Candy The GNOME and KDE themes have improved dramatically over the past few years and they look pretty good. Maybe not "Aero Glass" good, but then again they don't require an outrageous graphics card to use. Mac OS X has Aqua. Very pretty indeed, and far less distracting than Aero Glass. Desktop Search On Linux, locate. On the Mac, Spotlight. And developers can write Spotlight importers that give those apps better control over how their files are indexed. Windows has nothing like this. Oh, and if you are using Windows, use Google Desktop Search. It works well. I like it. Better updates On Linux, set up a cron job to do an apt-get update && apt-get upgrade every now-and-then and you're set. On Mac OS X, Software Update already updates every piece of software Apple sells with about one or two clicks. And, it runs automatically. Done. More Media iTunes, QuickTime. And with Flip4Mac, you can play un-DRMed WMV files right in QuickTime. On Linux, there are too many media players to name. No, they won't work with Windows Media, usually, but there's definitely no lack of MP3 library apps. Parental Controls Now here, I don't know about Linux, but I'd find it hard to believe there isn't some way a person couldn't use PAM to control when and where his/her kids use the computer. On the Mac, parental controls are already built in, system-wide. Better Backups Sure, it costs $99/year, butGranted, Linux still has to do some catching up in terms of user-friendliness, but like all UNIX, all the pieces are there if you know how to assemble them. There are more and more graphical tools appearing everyday to put those pieces together for you. Mac OS X already has just about every feature the article describes and they're planning a new release about the same time as Vista appears.
And Microsoft would do well to drop certain features. The Windows Registry, I think, is one of the worst-conceived ideas ever. If Microsof
If it's not one thing it's your mother.
Reasons people will buy vista: 1. Because it will come with all computers after release 2. Microsoft WILL make XP obsolete, example, Halo 2 for PC has been announces and will only run on Windows Vista 3. Most windows users either only know about windows, dont know how to use anything ither than windows, dont know how to get anything else.... they dont sell powerbooks at walmart 4. We are the only ones that actually KNOW about the imbedded DRM, the standard mom & dad have no clue what it is, or what it does, so naturally Microsoft isnt about to tell them about it. 5. America doesnt care about anything other than what TV tells us, with few exeptions It is the job of guys like the one who wrote this article to bring the issue of DRM to light, because the average user doesn't read comments on slashdot, the people in the media need to let these people know what they are getting themselves into, rather than talking about features that dont really matter, because that is who can reach them and give them the info that really does matter. about security, vista does take a step in the right direction, even it does fall behind other OSes in this respect, they are finally taking security into account in design, rather that giving it out after release in updates. As an administrator of a windows/linux network, i am happy to see this, as it has been long needed. Is it really that terrible to steal from the best? I mean, this is Microsoft's specialty isnt it?
Microsoft may boast better security but the fact is, until it's been put under the microscope and examined by the experts, it's just marketting hype. Microsoft must be stupid if they think that hackers are going to post exploits on the beta releases. They're going to wait until the official release when it's on everyone's machines. If Microsoft really wanted to improve security, they would allow their code to be audited and tested by the experts. Just as the RIAA grades its own progress on piracy, Microsoft grades its own progress on security.
TFA's author says IE7 is a compelling reason to go to Vista - but won't it be available for other flavours of Windows?
Take a look at iTunes and Safari again, both have parental controls already. If you don't mind the command line, OS X has backup tools. #10 (quick install) doesn't really exist yet.
So yeah, pretty much everything in Vista is already in OS X, except for the rumored collaboration tools.
GCHQ Quantum Insert installed. If only our tongues were made of glass, how much more careful we would be when we speak
iTunes, GarageBand, Final Cut, iDVD. Etc. Apple's been shipping this stuff for years. MSFT's just talking about what they hope to release, and talk is cheap.
The last three could never be made and released by Microsoft as part of Windows... never. Plus you've got to remember that these may ship with your Mac but they aren't aren't 'part of' OSX. And when it comes to iTunes, well MS has had DRM'd music since Windows Media Player 7 (...or was it eight). Ever heard of WMA?
Hell, even as far as "Music management / photo management / drm / desktop search " goes they all were in Windows XP - just not noticeably. Music could be managed with Media Player, photos don't really need management - but they could be sorted, filed and viewed with XP out of the box and desktop search is in there (you just have to turn that indexing service - that everyone told you to close - back on).
DRM? Well XP is DRM'd! They hold the patent on a DRM'd OS and no one but MSFT has the desire to make a DRM'd OS.
God, I'm defending Windows.
Get your Unix fortune now!
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And which sites would that be (that people would care about)?
My bank (and, as far as I know, most banks). Plus, my friend's company (a windows shop) controls their servers through some IE-only deal--don't know the details, but he's frustrated that he can't use Firefox.
Ride the skies
(reply to grandparent)
Compatibility with more games. Other than WoW, what popular MMORPG runs on Mac OS X?
Puzzle Pirates, Everquest, Second Life, Lineage, probably others. Puzzle Pirates and WOW are enough for me.
Other kinds of games are sorely lacking, but MMORPG's are basically covered.
Compatibility with more vertical-market apps such as the one used by your employer.
You shot who in the what now? A: any custom applications that a business requires its employees to use should be on a remote browser anyway B: your employer does not get to decide what OS you use for your home computer, unless they buy it for you C: most of that stuff is super-light and trivial to run under emulation. If not A, B, if not B, C.
Compatibility with more peripherals sold at retail stores.
Very true, and quite annoying. However, you'd be surprised how much runs under OSX without additional software. Things like all mice, keyboards, most cameras, all hard drives, etc. Scanners and wireless network components will bite you if you aren't looking, but it isn't too hard to look. There is usually quite a bit out there which is compatible anyway.
This used to be much worse, but with my recent foray back into OSX I've found everything I've needed without many problems. The switch to BSD has been kind to Apple hardware.
Compatibility with web sites that are made exclusively for Microsoft Internet Explorer technology and for which there are no close substitutes.
You're kidding, right? I haven't come across a site like this in years. Even my stock broker's site is cross-browser, cross-platform. The last I.E. only site I came across was an internal bug database that was getting junked for a myriad of reasons. Nobody following good coding practices anymore requires I.E. on Windows. The reasons range from general buggyness, to security problems with Active X, to needing to run from Win2k backend servers. And that there are a lot of technologies out there which are faster to work with, cheaper to develop and implement, and all of which happen to be cross-browser.
The ______ Agenda
can only be an improvement. As I've said before, I turn off the Themes service on any computer I possess. A service to handle themes? Overkill! Then they locked it to only work with signed themes... http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=uxthemes+patc h
Since Vista will likely ship on every new computer anyone buys...
Um, apple, anyone?
1) You can't avoid it because the hardware you'd like to buy happens to be pre-loaded with it, and the company will not dare to displease big Bill.
2) Because the content providers are so caught up in their own paranoid customer hating trip that they prefer to give full control to Mr Bill rather than authorize an open source compatible player for their content.
3) Because Vista is fully compatible with buying Outsourced products at WallMart, eating Genemodified food, wearing overpriced Nike shoes while watching spectator sports that have strictly no relationship with you but give you a fake feeling of "bellonging".
a lot) Because counting up to 10 is actually hard work.
I'm late to the party with this comment, but...
Is it just me or have nearly all the "cool bundled apps" and visual eye-cady already been done quite well by KDE and OSX?
How can those factors be "reasons to upgrade"? There really is only ONE reason to use VISTA. That is most people are afraid of change. So if they are going to be forced to change, then they are going the "safest" route and staying with MS. OSX will always have better eye candy, and frankly the screen shots I have seen only look impressive if your used to the ugly interfaces MS generally provides.
I am sure this launch will be a big splash to most of the ignorant IT world and home computing world. But I'll be perfectly happy splitting time using KDE and OSX. What I am really worried about is VMWARE, with the huge system requirements a virtual machine may have some trouble with this latest incarnation of super bloatware.
-MS2k
"Run of the mill bargain basement shoppers aren't going to know how to turn off the UI enhancements, and therefore will be stuck with a computer that is too slow. They also won't know enough about the system in most cases to undertake a RAM upgrade either." This is the dumbest thing I've ever heard. So you are assuming because someone cannot afford a top of the line PC that they are also stupid? I have seen alot of computer illiterate people walk into a computer store and let the salesman sell them anything. Having more knowledge about PC's is what will allow you to buy a less powerful PC because you will know what you need for what you are going to do with it and also, you will not be 'conned' into the useless upgrades that the salesman might recommend.
Don't you hate how they make you call it classic? "Clunky" would have been a better choice. The real marketing genius however was to make the new theme hideous, thus ensuring accolades when the damn thing gets replaced.
Those are my principles. If you don't like them I have others. -Groucho Marx
Is if my house has empty frames in the walls.
> Vista is expected to run just fine on the Intel-based Macs.
Microsoft and Apple have both said that they're not going to make any effort to allow Vista to run on the intel macs. As it stands right now, Vista assumes that EFI has a lot more features than Apple's EFI has. So someone is either going to have to rewrite Vista to not need these features (ha), or they'll have to rewrite Apple's EFI implementation to support these features (also ha). In other words, this isn't going to happen.
My other car is first.
I don't know about "a long time". Windows XP has pretty good support for that stuff, and dates back to October 2001. At that point, OSX 10.0 was only a few months old.
I have never come across a peripheral I couldn't use under OS X, and I've dealt with some pretty weird and wonderful stuff.
Even stuff that needs serial to USB adapters and the like - a bit more annoying, but they still work.
There are many criticisms of OS X to be made, but driver issues is not one of them!
Let's see. IE 7 will be more like Firefox and Vista will be more like OS X and Linux. So much for original thinking.
Safe sleep has been out on mac for months, and believe it or not it's something in the OS, so not just the new macbooks, but ANY mac can do it with the one time input of a few shell commands to unlock it, NEXT!
VLC FOR MAC IS DYING! IF YOU DEVELOP, PLEASE SAVE IT!!
There *are* a couple omissions though. ATI's highest-end TV capture card, for instance, doesn't have anything but Windows drivers.
I keep on hearing this, generally from US based people. I really can't understand it at all. I'm based in the UK, and I know for a fact that most if not all major bank websites work fine with Firefox.
1. Security, security, security: Windows XP Service Pack 2 patched a lot of holes, but Vista takes security to the next level.
One of the beta's for Vista already had a security patch issued. So yeah. Okay. They're ahead already!
There are literally too many changes to list here,
We would have to use a bunch of security lingo that you would not understand.
from the bidirectional software firewall that monitors inbound and outbound traffic to Windows Services Hardening, which prevents obscure background processes from being hijacked and changing your system.
Obscure processes will have to be signed by Microsoft. If this signing is forged somehow or there's a hole, yeah, goodbye Windows Services Hardening.
There's also full-disk encryption, which prevents thieves from accessing your data, even if they steal the PC out from under your nose.
JOE USER DOESN'T USE A PASSWORD WHEN HE BOOTS UP HIS COMPUTER. See a problem?
Perhaps most crucial (and least sexy) is the long-overdue User Account Protection, which invokes administrator privileges as needed, such as during driver updates or software installations. UAP makes it much more convenient for users to operate Vista with limited rights (meaning the system won't let them do certain things, like load software, without clearance from an administrator). This in turn limits the ability of malware to hose your system.
Okay, after laughing at the "and least sexy" comment for a bit and forgetting about the fact that Unix has been doing something similar for years with things like sudo, su, etc, let's take this apart:
This will have no bennefit for home users. Guess who has the root account? The owner of the machine! This is the same thing with OS X. A home user, when installing an application, has been trained to enter in the admin password when they want to install something. So if weatherbug prompts them, they'll do it. Once a program has admin access, of course it can do all sorts of things, rendering this UAP protection moot. The game is over.
Try again Microsoft...
In the case of individuals, birthday and Christmas presents from relatives who can't tell Ralink from Realtek.
If the exact make and model of a given item is so important that the slightest mistake means you might as well not bother, why are you asking someone else who can't realistically be expected to understand this to buy it for you?
Comment removed based on user account deletion
There are still jerkoffs who will run a check on your user agent and ban you if you don't use the "top 3 browsers' on the internet. Enabling safari's debug menu alllows you to change user agent to "MSIE 6.0" and bam, those scripts are spoofed into thinking you're using IE, and let you right on in.
VLC FOR MAC IS DYING! IF YOU DEVELOP, PLEASE SAVE IT!!
or some third party hacker will simply make an install cd and/or patch system not unlike "windows xp EUE" and this wont be an issue relating to apple or M$
VLC FOR MAC IS DYING! IF YOU DEVELOP, PLEASE SAVE IT!!
I'm currently running Ubuntu with Xgl + compiz in an old laptop (Pentium 4 2Ghz, Geforce 420 Go) and it's incredible snappy and with lots of cool effects. When I go back to old X I just can't believe how bad X performance was, you have to see it. I see this as the proof that you don't need a 512Mb 7800 GT to run Aeroglass.
I'd bet that the high-end hardware need has to do more with .NET than anything else.
The reason Windows is the only platform of choice on new desktops is not because of Microsoft, its the software and hardware manufacturers.
Bill knows it suits them to only support one hardware platform and one OS for most of their hardware, cos it makes it cheaper for them. As long as the software and hardware companies play ball with Bill, we are stuck with windows on new PCs for the forceable future.
--Imagine every Thursday shoes exploded if you tied them the usual way. This happens to us all the time with computers.
It's essentially a 64-bit Windows XP skin with a few added security features. Whoop-dee-fricken-doo.
Remember, open source is free as in speech, not free as in bear.
Drag your user folder into blank CDR icon or external USB/Firewire drive. Done.
I don't think Microsoft is offering anything near to a full system restore backup with thiers either.
"Enjoy what you're doing! If it becomes drudgery, you're doing it wrong!" - Jim Butterfield
2. Internet explorer - Don't use,
3. 'eye candy' - I want my OS to run the applications that I need to use. NOT look pretty. These are things I turn off anyway. (I mean geez, the default XP skin looked like a Fisher-Price toy.)
4. Desktop search - I know where my files are. Most times it would take me longer to get a query started than to just go to the folder.
5. Better updates. - "We shipped a broken product but we're going to make it easier to get it fixed now." yep...
6. More media - A lot of people make better media editors/players that microsoft.
7. Parental controls - Right, because most parents who need this kind of help don't already rely on their kids for computer support.
I still run Windows 98SE on at least half the machines in my office. Microsoft discontinues support? Big whoop. I use BigFix + AVG + Firefox + Eudora. I bypass the vast majority of crapware that is responsible for most of the security updates in the first place. I run 99.99% of all popular applications on a decade-old operating system and every time Microsoft threatens to obsolete a platform tier, I laugh. You should too. Vista is accounts payable candy for big corporations. The vast majority of advantages you might get with this OS can be gained alternatively by not being a n00b when it comes to safe computing practices.
Just say no, to software mafia: Microsoft, Symantec, Quicken, et. al.
... I wish these features would make it into Vista.
.exe self-extractors. Software should come in a standard package format like MSI or be denied installation.
1. I'd like to update all my software in one place - even third-party applications.
2. I'd like hardware drivers to be present at such a place - even third party drivers. You know that cheap TV-tuner I bought? I'd like those drivers to be available there too. Before I buy new hardware I would like to be able to see if the drivers are available.
3. I'd like to adjust the deadzone of all my analogue input devices, including my Logitech joystick and my XBOX 360 controller for PC. It should be part of the calibration-process.
4. I'd like games to adhere to a common standard so that I don't have to reconfigure my joypad for every new game I buy.
5. I wish headsets would work better out of the box. For some reason using a microphone is always preceeded by an hour of troubleshooting.
6. I'd like chess to be one of the bundled games.
7. I'd like improved Bluetooth support. Support should be built-in for headsets, mice, joypads, keyboards joysticks and speakers. Without any need for third-party drivers.
8. I'd like the Device Manager to get its' own icon in the Control Panel.
9. I'd like to subscribe to NHL-games and watch them on my laptop/tablet on my way to work.
10. I'd like a search tool similar to Beagle with open APIs so third-party developers could define how data from their applications should be processed.
11. Just say no to
Damnit! That's eleven! If one has to go you can leave out chess.
1. Security, security, security: New holes, new holes, new holes.
2. Internet Explorer 7: GetFirefox.
3. Righteous eye candy: Ooohhh shiny...
4. Desktop search: Learn to organize.
5. Better updates: Why update? Because it was broken in the first place!
6. More media: More DRM!
7. Parental controls: Real parents don't need an OS to babysit their kids.
8. Better backups: Already have that.
9. Peer-to-peer collaboration: ???
10. Quick setup: Why am I running setup more than once anyways?
In short, 10 compelling reasons why you don't need to upgrade to Vista.
Does it strike anybody else as odd that all the features (maybe minus the eyecandy, although probably not) are not actual parts of the OS, but applications that should be completely separate from the OS. Doesn't microsoft have enough monopoly troubles without tieing more crap into the OS?
Anthropic principle: We see the universe the way it is because if it were different we would not be here to see it.
Remember: The minimum requirements for XP were 64MB of RAM.
Just because it meets the requirements, doesn't mean it will actually be usable.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
My girlfriend's university's electronic enrollment system is incompatible with Firefox (not sure about KHTML-based browsers). Since she takes about an hour there by public transports, not being able to enroll online is a pain. She was NOT happy when she found out, and we sent a complaint there, to no avail.
So let me ask (because I don't really know) what would happen if you have to install a version of MacOS released before SATA (so w/o drivers) on a machine with a SATA HDD?
You won't be able to install at all. The installer knows what machine you're installing on and if it's supported.
Or more accurately...
COH is supported on Linux via Cedega.
http://cedegawiki.sweetleafstudios.com/wiki/City_
This space unintentionally left blank.
I can hardly wait....
1. Lack of updated (signed) hardware drivers fo Vista.
2. Expensive software updates for those versions that don't run on Vista.
3. The search and expense for alternatives programs and hardware that will never be ported to Vista.
4. "Better Virus support.?" So, MS expects to still have viruses?
5. A boatload of lousy Windows programs that will (unfortunately) still run on Vista.
6. New and improved licensing schemes, activation, and shiny new rate plans.
7. Microsoft Access Vista (and the PHBs who will say it should replace your relational DB)
8. A new round of "Well business X is sending us Vista documents, so we need to upgrade too."
9. New technology, new training, new TA ("Hey, dude, where do I find Run on the menu?")
10. New Technology new Servers.
And Number 11...
Microsoft generated FUD on Windows XP and earlier technology.
"Enjoy what you're doing! If it becomes drudgery, you're doing it wrong!" - Jim Butterfield
Just have a look at my hacked up version to get an idea of how clean and easy a desktop can be.
Here's how it looks by defaulte b2006min0vj.jpg
http://img76.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenief
Here's how it looks when you start expanding thingse b20064nh.jpg
http://img76.imageshack.us/my.php?image=screenief
Everyone bashes MS for being monolithic, but look at how little Active Desktop caught on. AD let's you customize your desktop more than any desktop I've ever seen and a lot more simply. Sure right out of the bok it's not the easiest thing ever, but with a couple of MS wizards and Clippy I'm sure it wouldn't be a stretch for a mildly interested user like Joe Sixpack to play around with.
Timeless Rogue Star - Defile Convention - Transcend Time, Life, the Universe, and Everything.
The "Average Joe" comments are getting long in the tooth now.
For instance, I remember just a few months ago when the Sony Rootkit fiasco was just becoming known. Here at Slashdot and other sites people were doing the "Nothing will come of this. Sony will do what they want and others will follow them because Average Joe User doesn't care about this and blah blah blah". Well, we all know what happened with THAT don't we? Unholy hell broke loose and EVERYONE...including the "Average Joe's" were up-in-arms about this to the point that Sony had to recall all the infected CD's.
It's about time we stop trying to sell the consumer short. The buying public is becoming more savvy. If this DRM thing that is suppose to be coming out for Vista finally hits, I would expect there to be major backlash.
Only time will tell.
"Leo Fender was in a 'state of grace' when he designed the Stratocaster." -- Paul Reed Smith
Do you think I wanna have to go buy an nVidia 7800 GT (I *eventually* plan on getting one) just to be able to run Windows and play games like Battlefield 2 on low graphics (which my machine handles fine with its builtin ATI Radeon 200 Xpress). And whereas currently you easilly use a single 7800 GT and put all graphics on high, if you run Vista, running high graphics would mean using dual 7800 GTs in SLI, which would mean I'd have to buy an SLI mobo (my current board has PCI-X, just not in SLI) and a new power supply to provide all that newly added requirement for extra juice... so from the sounds of that alone, no thanks, I'll stick with XP for now...
So I agree with this guy below,
Tho as an avid OS X user, I do have to say that #7 and #8 are not found on my computer.
I MUST point out something I feel most computer users don't get about macs:
Mac OS X Tiger, with all it's whistles and bells (and a few more added for good measure) runs absolutely great on my DUAL 450 MHz G4 COMPUTER. Don't ask me how old this computer is. If I hadn't recieved this comp. as a present, I'd still be using my old Single Proc. 400 MHz G4.
So I use it for FTP (and SFTP/SSH), web server (apache, PHP etc.), audio streaming (via web), DVD burning, photoshop (intensively) and all that great stuff, all on my (by PC standards) ancient computer. With the newest OS. All those Dashboard, Exposé, and additional plugs (like multiple desktops, with transitions like 'cubing' for fun) all work.
I'll be DAMNED if I'm ever going to fall for the "Buy a WHOLE new computer every 2 years" B.S., i think that's really stupid. I had a hard drive *start* to act flaky a few years ago, and replaced it. I've NEVER reinstalled the OS from reformatting in 4 or 5 years. If your OS needs the brand-spankin' newest most hardcore processor and graphics card, that it's obviously REALLY BADLY MADE.
(obviously this holds for Linux too, but linux is definitely not for most people. For me, OSX is plenty Linux/Unix. i use the command line often, and install from source occasioanlly, but don't *have* to use command line all the time) I've noticed that every time a new version of OS X came out, it was *faster* that the last, not way way slower, as Vista sounds like it will be.
It's like the difference between getting the newest Honda or Nissan, vs. buying a new BMW or Benz. Pay a bit more, get a lot more that'll last for a longer time.
quote:
by Yahweh Doesn't Exist (906833) on Saturday February 18, @09:41AM (#14750091)
1. new firewall almost as good as ZoneAlarm
2. new IE almost as good as Firefox
3. new eye-candy almost as good as OS X
4. new desktop search almost as good as Google Desktop
5. new update program almost as good as Mac Software Update
6. new media programs almost as good as iLife
XX -> 7. new parental controls almost as good as proper parenting
XX -> 8. new backups almost as good as things not breaking in the first place
9. new P2P almost as good as turning off your firewall
10. new quick install almost as good as all the other planned features that don't actually exist yet
PS. I wonder if quick install is actually anything new. Also, unfortunately any mac user knows that Firefox was a great port of Safari (with a few nice added features). I was really hoping Vista would have something COOL about it, but it's all just catching up with Apple again.
A live preview of minimized programs is nice (it's one of the few visual effects I like in OS X), but I fail to see why that would require 3D hardware.
After all these years, I decided this weekend to start coding a game. It's just a simple sprite-based puzzle/twitch sort of game, and I only needed 2D operations (like bit-BLT), but it turns out the best way to do 2D operations on new hardware is to use OpenGL. Strange, but true. Apparently, the card manufacturers don't bother adding basic 2D operations; everything is geared to 3D.
So, it makes sense they want a 3D-accelerated card for simple operations like their rip-off of Enlightenment's "picture of the running app" minimization.
Also, it allows them to help push new PC sales, which helps make the PC industry richer. Microsoft makes most of its money from Dell and HP and the like, in OEM sales of MS-Windows and MS-Office. If the PC manufacturers don't make money, they are less likely to allow Microsoft to push them into exclusionary deals.
Microsoft is to software what Budweiser is to beer.
And to think it only took you 7 releases to figure it out. If the rest of Micro$oft's customers are as willing to waste their money, their future is very bright.
an ill wind that blows no good
You finally get all the features every other operating system had from the fricken beginning!
I was thinking much the same. For example, when I read this...
...I thought most usability research had pretty much thrown out this sort of visual jiggery-pokery some time ago now, having discovered that since monitors are basically flat, 2D surfaces, trying to project things in funky 3D or to impose layers through transparency just disorientates users. It's always possible that Microsoft have come up with a new and qualitatively different approach to that of the research labs at other big software places like Sun or IBM, of course, but I'm betting heavily on "gimmick" until I see any evidence to the contrary.
It seems to me that the vast majority of the 10 "reasons to buy" have already been more than adequately addressed on Windows platforms by third party software, some of which will presumably still be necessary since it sounds like MS isn't going to include any anti-virus software unless you pay for it. On other platforms, it either was never an issue, or is likewise addressed by third party add-ons. Putting it into the OS may or may not be an advantage relative to starting with nothing, but relative to where we are, who cares?
Of the remainder, if they're genuinely getting serious about security, that's great, but on the flip-side, we all know about the Trusted Computing rubbish, DRM, and all that jazz. On top of that, we have the recent stories about national governments wanting backdoors and entering talks with Microsoft to ensure they get them. If a government cracker can break my system, so can a script kiddie with the right friends, and that's game over for Microsoft's security drive. It's not secure if it has deliberate backdoors!
The more I read about Vista, the less I care, and I'm someone who (at present) does run XP both at home and at work, and uses some OSS for practical rather than philosophical reasons. I've been looking seriously at shifting to an alternative platform for a while, and with all the security and DRM badness going around lately, the obvious commercial alternative -- Apple -- is pretty much ruled out of the game by its own actions. This could be the best thing to happen to open source software since forever.
If you disagree, post your argument. (-1, Overrated) isn't your personal censorship tool for views you don't like.
Remember that Bill Gates is the Dr. Death of software. HE decides when Microsoft's software is no longer usable, not the customers.
I decided their software wasn't usable a long time ago. Bill Gates didn't have to tell me that.
Microsoft is to software what Budweiser is to beer.
Executive Summary: The only sure thing is that it will cost you a lot of $$$ per seat, and that seat has to be an EXPENSIVE seat as well. Forget using you one year old Dell box. You'll need to buy anti-virus/Trojan software. It still won't give you any more than you can get installing SUSE 10.0 or SimplyMEPIS-3.4.3 on your old Dell box, and either of them will cost you less than $100. and much less if you burn your own ISO.
...The new OS tightly integrates instant desktop search,
... the free stuff Gates and Company toss into the new OS, and Vista is no exception.
...screen out objectionable content ... restrict each account's access by time of day or day of the week...
;-) Only time will time.
1. Security, security, security:... but Vista takes security to the next level.
Echos of Ballmer. And what level of security can that be when one of the negatives is that Vista won't be shipping with anti-virus? Linux still doesn't require antivirus software, even though antivirus software houses have done their best to create the illusion that Linux needs their products.
User Account Protection, which invokes administrator privileges as needed,
A feature of Linux since the beginning.
2. Internet Explorer 7:
A FireFox wannabe. Everything IE7 is 'going' to have is already in FireFox, and FireFox will add features and patches much faster than Microsoft service IE7.
But Vista users get an important extra level of protection: IE7 on Vista will run in what Microsoft calls "protected mode"--a limited-rights mode that prevents third-party code from reaching your system. It's about darn time.
So Microsoft is going to try chroot. Nice, but a little late.
3. Righteous eye candy:
Expensive eye candy, considering the hardware you need to buy to see that candy. Are there enough games and gamers to give Microsoft a return? Such eye candy won't be necessary for SOHO/Enterprise business. Maybe Microsoft is trying for the Hollywood movie production firms?
And is it me, or is Microsoft's VISTA just another way to eat up CPU cycles from the new expensive hardware that it needs to run on? Will the spreadsheets or databases run any faster?
4.
Wow! Can you say "locate" folks? It does everything VISTA's search function is supposed to do and it can be done from a commandline or from a gui interface. It has been in Linux almost from the beginning. If Linux developers had Microsoft's patent propensity they could lock M$ out of the search game.
5. Better updates: Vista does away with using Internet Explorer to access Windows Update, instead utilizing a new application to handle the chore of keeping your system patched and up-to-date.
Microsoft saw Synaptic running apt-get and said "Wow!". Now they are copying it.
6.
Free? There's NOTHING free in Windows products that the consumer doesn't pay for several times over.
7. Parental controls:
Copying Linux again? In Linux you can give each child their own account, and when they can access it. And, control which websites they have access to and when they can access them. I don't need an expensive OS that will further restrict what I can do with my own computer to do that.
8. Better Backups
Anything would beat using IE to drag files to your CD icon, but excellent backup software like K3B has been in Linux for several years.
9. Peer-to-peer collaboration:
Will that work as well with "cracker-to-cracker" collaboration?
10. Quick setup:... slash setup times from about an hour to as little as 15 minutes...
Microsoft's "setup time" has NEVER been as low as an hour unless it was partially setup by the vendor. Those that purchase XP separately can count on setup times that will stretch to four hours, IF they have drivers for all their hardware. They can also count on several reboots.
Running with Linux for over 20 years!
Like many have already pointed out, the list is merely listing things that are offered for free (Nix) / as part of other OSs (Mac). Even XP can have most of those features w/ the right third party apps. Backup? Parental Controls? IE 7? aargh! FFS who cares - and anyone who does will have already found a perfecly usable solution by now. E.g. anyone who is technically proficient and values their data already has some kinda backup routine / system that works for them, even if it is as simple as periodically copying your data directories lock stock and barrel onto another machine or medium. Eye candy is moot, you use your OS to do things, NOT for eye candy. If you want eye candy, you watch a movie, or look at some visual art, or play the latest 3D game. Seriously who really cares about how good their office application looks as long as it works and doesn't make you sick just looking at it. As for security and multimedia, coming from M$, I'll believe it when I see it. Bidirectional firewall... er... you mean like all those nice FREE 3rd party firewalls? Or that nice 'iptables' thingy that comes by default with Nix? oh. Multimedia? You mean DRM? AAARGH DOS, Windows 95, 98, 2000, XP. Note the trend: needs faster computers to run, all do fundamentally the same thing, but we're forced to upgrade when the software we want to use stops being supported by the legacy OSs. Oh yeah, and the cr@ppy security and networking 'features' that were built into the OS in the first place. Not to mention the good old "640k is enough of everybody" saga that led to years of fun with EMS, XMS, conventional memory et al and windows 95 putting the window dressing over the fact that the problem still existed until 2000. Maybe I'm a cynic, but I can't wait till I'm confident enough to port everything I do over to 'nix, and keep windows strictly for those one or two killer apps + games. Now if only Nix would fix them damned driver issues... hehehe
10 reasons to buy Windows Vista? I am WAY ahead of you, already bought it, and the features are great. When exactly? Oh... got the new iMac a month ago.
Reason #11, and I'm not kidding, is because it's such a bloated piece of crap that PC World will sell a TON of magazines. Vista will be new, different, confusing, poorly working, and LOTS of articles will need to be written to re-educate the masses on how to use Windows Vista and how to "tweak" it. If I was selling Windows magazines, I would be praying for Vista.
First of all, not knowing how to do something has absolutely nothing to do with stupidity. I never claimed anyone who didn't know how to tweak a UI was stupid. In fact, it's people who take advantage of novices or call them stupid that give those of us in computer related fields the reputation of being arrogant pricks.
I have seen alot of computer illiterate people walk into a computer store and let the salesman sell them anything.
Yes, and let's assume that this is the norm also shall we? Not everyone goes into a computer store to buy their first PC. Many people buy them at low prices because they saw a Dell or Gateway ad that claims a "Powerful, Entry-Level PC" for $400. In either instance, the price they paid doesn't have anything to do with the fact that first time PC users aren't likely to know how to tune a low-end PC so that it can run a graphics-intensive UI without slowing to an absolute crawl.
Besides, just because you like to go out and waste a few hundred bucks on a POS doesn't mean everyone else will. I myself would rather spend a few hundred more and get something that will do what I want without having to tweak the UI so much it looks like Windows 3.1.
Nam et ipsa scientia potestas est - Sir Francis Bacon
2. I like freedom
3. I like freedom
4. I like freedom
5. I like freedom
6. I like freedom
7. I like freedom
8. I like freedom
9. I like freedom
10. I like freedom
Hence, I use a few different variations of Linux on my boxes. No MS. No Apple. Just open-source and freedom. I don't give a shit that I can't play the newest games. I don't give a shit that I can't run the latest and greatest commercial apps. I don't give a shit that I can't use every cheap off-the-shelf piece of hardware. I don't give a shit that I don't belong to a an elitist club with a superior GUI. I value freedom over all. Am I an idealist? You bet.
Meh.
You win. This is the best answer I have seen yet.
Meh.
Somehow Linux is able to give high security without preventing it's users from doing anything but stare in stupor at the shiny bells and whistles.
I'm a musician and electronics tinkerer, and I'm wondering how this will impact playing with DSP/MIDI homebrew hardware/software, as well as the choice in vendors for commercial digital music processing/creation/control hardware and software.
There are two levels of driver signing under Windows Vista: signing by the author ($500 per year to VeriSlime) and signing by Microsoft Windows Hardware Quality Labs (I'm guessing roughly $1000 to $2000 per driver revision). If you see a "Designed for Windows" logo on the box, then the vendor is already paying for WHQL testing. Microsoft may be shooting itself in the foot with homebrewers, sending them to GNU/Linux or *BSD or the like.
I don't know why anyone would "upgrade" from Win 2K it's compatible with (90% ?)of XP apps, supports games that use direct x 9,and is relatively stable. It suffers from the usual Windows mediocre security, but that can rectified with the free zone alarm firewall, + the free avg anti-virus, + the free adaware and the free spybot search and destroy. Having a light interface it even is "teh snappy" on an old school Athlon 700 machine I found at a thrift store for 7 bucks. It also isn't encumbered with activation and DRM.
:) Even recent games render OK on the geforce 5200 fx upgrade card.
Would I rather use OS X on the desktop and Linux or BSD on a server? Yes of course, but I do think Win 2K pro was the best version of Windows Microsoft ever issued if one is forced to use Windows for games or work.
Vista I predict will be a resource hog and a DRM hell in exchange for transparent windows that won't be as classy as OS X. Who needs it the current games I can play on Windows suit me fine, Need for Speed Porsche Unleashed rulz.
Tired of all the isms, don't exploit people as an employer, or a government, mmmmK?
I don't find it very intelligent to choose a OS platform based on the availability of one game.
Tell that to anybody who bought an original Game Boy just to play Tetris, a Nintendo DS just to play Nintendogs, or a PSP just to play GTA. But you're right in one way: the people who bought a PSP to play Lumines are screwed.
.....Just because you can run XP on a minimum of 256MB of RAM doesn't mean you should.....
XP run just fine on 256M and likely so will Vista. Just don't try to run any of the Applications you bought the computer for in the first place.
What will Vista bring to the art of computing, that OSX has not had for about a year now already? OSX 10.4 runs faster on our old G4 laptop than the OS 10.2 it came with. With MS, the new OS software generally runs slower on the same hardware or misses out on most of the improvements. One big pain with Windows has always been the difficulty of upgrading from an old to a new computer. When I bought a new G5 iMac for my wife for Christmas, getting all her stuff and settings from the old G4 to the new one was almost automatic. Boot the old one in disk mode, connect them with a cable (firewire) and click the mouse to automatically transfer all data, internet settings, account passwords, preferences and applications and all their settings and more to the new G5. I wonder if Vista will make it easy to upgrade from an older machine to that shiny new one.
If Vista users are no longer running as administrators (a good thing) how many of their current apps will cease functioning? If users have to re-purchase or upgrade much of, or most of their software, that will be a big disincentive to upgrade to a new computer or upgrade to the new OS on the old one.
All theory is gray
I swear on Howard The Duck that a significant portion of new pc purchases these days are because of malware infestations. Computers these days are fast, but not fast enough to browse the web while being ravaged by all the malware a typical user will pick up after a year or so of web browsing (or in some cases minutes of web browsing).
And here's the kicker-- typical users don't even know what they are dealing with. Many new pc purchases will come from those that believe their malware-slowed computers have simply become "obsolete." Now Vista will give them yet another reason to buy a nice, new, shiny and fast computer to replace their old, aging and slow 3.2ghz Pentium D.
Or, Howard willing, they'll buy a Mac.
...unfortunately no one can be told what The Mat^H^H^HGoatse is...they must experience it for themselves...
"If you want the things you mentioned above, stick with the Windows box you have now and don't waste money on the upgrade."
Or I can get both by getting Vista. It's also a LOT less $$$ than getting a new mac and replacements for all the apps I need.
If I Google "ten reasons to buy the next version of Microsoft Windows" will it give me similar results as Googleing "French military victories"?
Would I rather use OS X on the desktop and Linux or BSD on a server? Yes of course, but I do think Win 2K pro was the best version of Windows Microsoft ever issued if one is forced to use Windows for games or work
K ernel/default.aspx
r nel.mspx
Do you really not understand technology, or just pretending you don't?
WindowsXP has a massive scale of compatibilty, security, application stability and even tons of kernel enhancements over Win2k. People that see WindowsXP as Win2k with prettier graphics must also see a porshe as just a VW Bug with prettier paint.
Add in SP2 that forks off after the Windows 2003 server security and optimizations. (remmeber the reports that when Windows 2003 was first released it was faster on the desktop than XP? Well that code was pushed into WindowsXP in SP2.)
WindowsXP is not only safer, more compatible, has a ton more features, a more robust kernel, but is actually faster than Windows2K, even with the 'pretty' themes turned on. Average tests in our labs show XP consistently 10% faster than Win2k.
Here are some 'real' tech points, and these are just the changes in XP prior to SP2.
http://msdn.microsoft.com/msdnmag/issues/01/12/XP
Here is the MS version of some of the same topics:
http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/driver/kernel/xp_ke
Happy reading and please for the love of God people stop believing that Win2k is A) Faster or B) more solid than XP. Both are false and just lead users to staying with an older OS and avoid XP when they could be benefiting from it.
Take Care,
TheNetAvenger
Maybe so. I know for a fact that First Citizens bank doesn't, though.
Ride the skies
Any suggestions of what sites those may be? Even as a Windows/PC user, running Firefox exclusively, I never came across any site worth my time that required Internet Explorer.
Filefactory.com (one of those short-term file-sharing websites)
Not only does that bletcherous abortion require IE, it makes you download a 3rd party client.
Didn't say it was a particularly GOOD site, but it is one example that requires IE.
> Er...yes. Applescript is a legacy Mac feature and has nothing to do with the Unix shell. It can't even pipe text.
e ference/Manpages/man1/osascript.1.html
5 .html
Manual Page for osascript(1)
http://developer.apple.com/documentation/Darwin/R
Saying "[Applescript] can't even pipe text" as an argument is like saying "bash can't even manipulate the GUI controls!"
Anyhow, osascript can take scripts from std-in just like perl can.
Further, applescript can use the output of other shell scripts just like the backtick operator. http://developer.apple.com/technotes/tn2002/tn206
Finally, you used to have to kludge the shell to pipe text into an osascript, I don't know if this is still necessary (here's the proof of concept):
#!/bin/bash
#copy fd 0 (stdin) into a different fd...
osascript 10<&0 <<EOF
set linefeed to ASCII character 10
set u to "/dev/fd/10"
set p to POSIX file u
open for access p
copy result to stdin
set u to "/dev/fd/1"
set p to POSIX file u
open for access p with write permission
copy result to stdout
read stdin before linefeed as text
copy result to linebuf
set lp to POSIX file linebuf
tell app "Finder"
get comment of (lp as file)
copy result to file_comment
end tell
write (file_comment & linefeed ) to stdout
EOF
Read Heinlein's 1953 Revolt in 2100, now more than ever.
Perhaps most crucial (and least sexy) is the long-overdue User Account Protection, which invokes administrator privileges as needed, such as during driver updates or software installations. UAP makes it much more convenient for users to operate Vista with limited rights (meaning the system won't let them do certain things, like load software, without clearance from an administrator). This in turn limits the ability of malware to hose your system.
You could do this already in XP but hopefully it works properly and is the compulsory default. Even going so far as to not allow 'admin' logins without changing a deeply nested option would be good so the stupid nubs who would still insist on loging in as admin would atleast find it a bit harder to hose their system.
For those who can't RTFA: ...
1) Less broken security than XP
2) Don't need that annoying 10 minute wait downloading Firefox to get a tabbed browser
3) Eye candy (if you buy a new high-end video card)
4) Don't need that annoying 5 minute wait downloading Google Desktop to get a search that finds stuff
5) Does security updates exactly the same way as XP does... er
6) Don't need that annoying 10 minute wait downloading a useable media player and image organizer
7) New parental controls mean it will take your kids as long as 18 seconds to get to porn.
8) Built-in back-up software now easier for your mom to ignore.
9) Collaboration software the OS team found in the Office team's dumpster one night
10)Something that wasn't in the beta the reviewer saw, but MS said was positively, definitely going to be in there.
Whoopee. Now for the negatives:
1) You have to give Microsoft money
2) Less broken security than XP, but still broken.
3) Your PC is too slow to run it.
4) They've moved everything on the menus about at random again.
5) Windows Mail is Outlook Express with grep ran over the source code. Hey, I think renaming it is a positive, in a few years I won't have tpo explain that the bloody thing is not Outlook.
~~~~~ BigLig2? You mean there's another one of me?
What sort of world does this guy live in? 300 or 400 GB hard drives, standard? I've yet to see a popular desktop computer, that isn't a server or a gaming machine, with more than 100 GB... It's possible to get 300 and 400 GB hard drives, certainly, but excepting the more extreme computer applications (i.e. games, server apps, design apps), this space is rarely necessary.
games journalism blog
dont know bout xp, but the i cant kill a process indicates extreme newby in windows2000
(right click my computer, manage, services...)
You say you want a revolution, talk to Nintendo.
There is the Right way: OS X
The Wrong Way: Vista
and The Max Power's Way [The Wrong way, but Faster!]: Windows XP
Slow Down Cowboy! It's been 1 hour, 47 minutes since you last successfully posted a comment
Only Windows 1.0....Steve Balmer REALLY pushed the solitaire in his commercial.
Hey, It was the 80's, and I was drunk, OK.
Won't do THAT again...
Slow Down Cowboy! It's been 1 hour, 47 minutes since you last successfully posted a comment
Give Linux a try and you will never be disapointed!!
Well, I'm disappointed with linux almost daily, but I still keep using it. Of course, its irritations are nowhere near as bad as WindowsXP, which seems to have been designed specifically to irritate the power user.
Retired from software... maybe. Sort of.
Do you have anything other than Microsoft's own FUD to back this up? We all know how reliable their Linux benchmarks are and what an incentive they have to get us to "upgrade."
Tired of all the isms, don't exploit people as an employer, or a government, mmmmK?
...obviously written under the influence of at least two of them....
Hahaha... yeah. Well, color me unimpressed.
.NET 1.1 can talk XMPP and has messaging APIs.
They extend the presence concepts (Jaber, XMPP, Google Talk, everybody's doin it) and notification APIs (what, on top of UPnP, right?). Never mind that you need to have apps that support it.
Basically, Office.
Oh, and Office on other OSs (2000/XP) will support the same workflow features.
So, what's so great about this? It's not like you can't bundle a simple API with your API to talk the talk. UPnP was available in XP Gold.
Big. Fucking. Deal.
THIS THING CAN TURN ON A DIME, MACROSSZERO STYLE ALSO FUCK BETA, ~NYORON
Is so you can talk about Windows without accidentally referring to features from the outdated 5 years+ old XP that were removed in Vista...
-- Provided that auditing is turned on and you're logging the minimum of: process execution / fork system calls, opens, closes and process exits.
Have a cron job that runs daily and mines the audit data for file access that happens after execs of programs (on a per program basis). Have it analyze at least N execs and find all the common file open-for-reads that happen consistently in that process or any child. (You need to log closes/exit so you know the scope of a process and when to stop looking for file opens that might belong to a process you're interested in... speeds up log processing).
Once the cron job has culled enough data, it would create a "prefetch profile" listing the files that are common, and stat them to find how big they all are. If there are a lot of small files, it'll check to see if the blocks of each file are roughly in the same area of the disk. If not, unlink and copy in place to try to coerce them into the same allocation group.
Finally, it would create a small script or config file in a directory somewhere, one for each monitored program, listing the files in sorted order by their block positions on the disk. This file would be read by a system service that runs before login and occaisonally wakes up and reads those files, thus forcing them into the buffer cache. It would decide which file groups to read first based on the amount of time each parent exec process ran during the log interval examined (100% of the time, 50% of the time). A certain weight would be given to programs that are started repeatedly (since they may incur many disk IOs [page in AND page out] better to do it upfront).
The file service would constantly run, reading files aggresively when the IO load is otherwise low (sort of like the minimum and maximum transfer rates of the softraid kernel threads), but throttling back when in IO contention. It would wake up after short intervals, find the most "important" program it hasn't loaded files for that isn't already running, and work that file list. Then go to sleep for a time that keeps the average IO rate below the max threshold.
A side effect of this might be that the page flush kernel threads need not run so frequently since this program will put page-out pressure on old pages.
And the service would go to sleep for a long time when IO counters indicate less than a certain threshold of page-ins since the last time it ran (and collected said statistics)... this indicates that it can no longer improve any program's startup time.
Wow. This is intense. I wonder if the optimizer in OSX is anything like this, or the RedHat prefetch service.
THIS THING CAN TURN ON A DIME, MACROSSZERO STYLE ALSO FUCK BETA, ~NYORON
My bosses have been buying computers like they were going to stop being made for the last year. (I did too--to avoid being locked in to VISTA-TPM slavery). The Big Boss hasn't trusted MS in years. In fact, after my new box was set up and my files transferred I was allowed to install Linux on the old box! Who really believes that "Trusted Computing" is really for the benefit of users users or even owners, instead of being for MS, it's ilk and and whichever of their business partners they "lease" access to? VISTA-TPM "owners" will just be suckers whose computers will be controlled by distant third parties. Believe what you want to believe, though.
If you want your life to be different, live it differently.
So lemme get this straight. You say that Mac browser's suck. So that means:
;) Make sure you brush your teeth.
Konqueror sucks (which Safari originated from)
Firefox/Camino/Mozilla/Netscape suck
Opera sucks
Wow... that's quite a load of FUD you're spitting out there
The ONLY browser that I will agree with you on is IE for Mac which MS abandoned quite some time ago. All the others I listed are pretty much identical to their Windows or Linux counterparts and are quite nice.
Compatibility with web sites that are made exclusively for Microsoft Internet Explorer technology and for which there are no close substitutes.
Ha. I just logged into my MSDN account with Firefox to download an ISO, and the tree widget that lets you choose which applications/OSes/etc. you want to download now works. It used to function only with MSIE. Even **MICROSOFT** is ditching their proprietary extensions.
Larry
1.) Security. Yeah... XP showed us how great MS is at that. But forgetting XP, 'security' doesn't mean much until it's out and circulating, and people start trying to use that 'security'.
.\shortcut\folder\file. Oh. And backslashes. MS, aren't your programmers screaming at you for having to type things like: "\\\\blah\\folder\\blah"?
2.) IE 7: Seven eh? Wonderful, I'll breeze right past six, being a five users. If it's Firefox-inspired, is it finally detached enough from the OS to be useful? Tabs are nice, yes, but Firefox and others beat you to it MS. And add some shortcut keys for Heavens sake! One of the things I love about FF is that it can be controlled without a mouse. Productively.
3.) Eye candy. Processor hog, maybe, but I dig computers that look good. As long as it's smooth. Lose the smoothness, and you lose the eye candy.
4.) Desktop search: He complains about the XP search, I do hate that thing. Now we've all got a better reason to store all our documents inside that pretty "My Documents" folder. Forget organization. (I'm guilty of this too...)
5.) Better updates: IE and Windows Update separated? Praise God if this is true. I've installed XP on computers only to have Windows Update crash, fresh out of the box. That, and the upgrades themselves often crash.
6.) More media: A good thing, but this guy loses points: "one of the key reasons to upgrade versions of Windows has been the free stuff Gates and Company toss into the new OS" Very interesting, given the price tag with three digits to the left of that decimal point. Wow, free stuff I pay for!
7.) Parental controls: Reminds me of the little HAL-control installed on Discovery. Worked well.
8.) Better backups: A good thing, whoops, more lost points: "Today, desktops routinely ship with 300GB or 400GB hard drives." Oh yes. Let's make replicas of all our files on our harddisk? Then the entire disk gets lost in some accident, and... well. I've been brought laptops that were "acting bad", whose problem was they'd filled the harddisk up with copies of itself...
9.) P2P collaboration: I can collaborate, joy, but can we share files? (Yup, this OS will sell...)
10.) Quick setup: A good thing, whoops, this guy just seems to shoot himself in the foot: "will slash setup times from about an hour to as little as 15 minutes." An hour, eh? If that's XP you're talking about, it's not an hour. There's install, which takes at least an hour, then patching, patching, and my God, more patching. Then you have to install real software, given that Windows computers come with none themselves.
There's just one thing I want. (Well, maybe not quite) Symbolic links, like what Linux and Macs have. I'd kill for symbolic links. And no, 'shitcuts' do not count. If I use a shortcut to a directory, I can't say:
Don't get me wrong here though: It could be a huge improvement over XP and family. Unless it's disasterous, I plan to get it myself. (Dual-booting with Linux, and OS X, if possible...)
What was wrong with the NTBackup supplied with XP (developed by Veritas, wouldn't you know)?
* Easy to pick exactly what you want to back up
* Easy to add pattens or folders to always exclude, with a sensible default list.
* Volume shadow support
* Schedule it to run anytime.
Why... it didn't support burning to DVD?
It doesn't take anyone who has the sense to make backups more than minute to see you can drag that file into a DVD burning application.
THIS THING CAN TURN ON A DIME, MACROSSZERO STYLE ALSO FUCK BETA, ~NYORON
I never saw the point in moving from Win2000 to XP (I won't call this an 'upgrade', because it sure as shit isn't), and there's nothing whatsoever compelling in Vista that would make me even consider throwing my Win2000 away. Granted, I generally only use my Windows partitions for games, but then - so do most 'power' Windows users. Those that aren't power users are content with email, browsing, playing music, maybe watching an occasional video - and you can do each and every one of those things on Win98, much less any newer version of Windows. You certainly don't need anything beyond Win2000 for any of this.
The only people I see actually going out and spending cash on Vista are those buying a new stock computer, pre-made from someplace like Dell - because they'll need a new computer just to boot the fucking OS. The average Joe and Jane User already have machines which far exceed the specs required for their usage, machines that they're used to and have configured 'just so'. Not to mention the headache of moving all of their data, a real chore for Joe and the Missus.
There aren't any more 'must have' apps for Windows that convince people to upgrade before the life of their machine expires. We already have everything that 99% of us need, and what the other 1% thinks none of us gives two shits about. As for the win/machine combo upgrade, most people are going to say "been there, did that far too many times, fuck if I'm going to do it again anytime in the near future", and move on - without Vista making so much as a blip on their radar.
Max
My god carries a hammer. Your god died nailed to a tree. Any questions?
You know, you don't actually have to write "TheNetAvenger" at the bottom of the post, it says it riiiiiight up the top just underneath the subject line, for everyone to see.
The bounty for finding a critical bug in Windows seems to be about $10,000. Microsoft never gets new technology right, the first time. Vista won't cost $10,000 a seat. How can you possibly fail to make a decent income off the bounties alone, for the remainder of your working life?
It's a small world and it smells funny; I'd buy another if it wasn't for the money; Take back what I paid (SoM)
Big cons are glanced over here. IE is probably the most used feature on most peoples' computers. From surfing for fun to surfing for business, I'd say most users spend most of their time in their Web browser (or maybe a document editor). Especially with 'web applications' being so popular.
Local network connectivity? Is this going back to Windows 98 days where despite being on the same network, with the proper settings, you still can't use file/printer sharing with the computer you can easily ping? Isn't this a big thing for home users (broadband) and more importantly corporate users (files, printers, workgroup, shared workspace, groupware, and of course the Internet).
these two things should be the first to be made rock-solid. They're well into beta testing, with it being over a year (let alone alpha testing internally before). These would be the first thing I would perfect, especially considering the huge dependency on it.
Yet this guy just runs over it, as if they were minor bugs, like an interface quirk or debugging message. Already a few paragraphs in he discredits himself by paying no attention to the biggest glaring errors. Talk about being PAID to be positive about the article.
Now one more issue.
Greeeeaaaaat. Just what we need- another interface look. Get with the program. The interface should by consistent. 100%. Turn off rendering shadows and transparencies. Turn off anything 3D. Make it a 2D bitmap for all I care. But keep it looking the same. Replace the 3D bar with a static image, and then don't need the rendering features. Look is the same, but it's not as crisp. This is just another way to tell users to look for the little green start button and them to go "you mean the blue one" because they were dumb enough to feel the need to change it.
-M
when you see the word 'Linux', drink!
Makeover?? Rip-off! Anyone tried IE7? That shit is just a pure imitation of Firefox. It looks like Firefox, but it acts as a 38 ton truck.
You just got troll'd!
Then you maybe can explain to me... how Compaq could sell a PC with a Windows XP logo WITHOUT any display adapter ?
As far as I know a PC will not boot without some kind of display adapter and Windows can not run without a display adapter.
The Designed for Windows logo is as worthless as Windows itself.
Have you btw. tried to install XP on a SATA only PC ? "No harddrive found, setup can not continue.", this was a XP-logo'ed machine too...
--
Tis sig. is not a sig...
If for no other reason, I'll refuse to buy Treacherous hardware just to deprive them of the ability to point to me as one of their "satisified customers." This fuck-job by the media cartel is just going to get worse and worse until we finally all stop buying their SHIT, and for me it ends now!
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
>1. Security, security, security: Windows XP Service Pack 2 patched a lot of holes
I've had no virus/spyware problems on Win2003 or Win2000.
>2. Internet Explorer 7: IE gets a much-needed, Firefox-inspired makeover
How does this affect Mozilla users?
>3. Righteous eye candy: For the first time, Microsoft is building high-end graphics effects into Windows.
Pointless.
>4. Desktop search: Microsoft has been getting its lunch handed to it by Google and Yahoo on the desktop,
>but Vista could change all that.
Not if I keep using Google.
>5. Better updates: Vista does away with using Internet Explorer to access Windows Update
I don't use Windows Update.
>6. More media
Media is the biggest canard ever in the software industry. If you do anything based on the word "media" then you have a lot to learn.
>7. Parental controls
Don't care.
>8. Better backups
Again, don't care. I don't rely on M$ to store my data.
>9. Peer-to-peer collaboration
Huh? Most of my friends don't even use my keyboard. What does collaboration have to do with Windows?
>10. Quick setup...will slash setup times from about an hour to as little as 15 minutes.
Most Windows installs are designed to run for months. If setup time matters, then by definition your install doesn't.
I would actually be interested in improvements in Windows Vista. For what it's worth.
There are several excellent reasons for even "Average Joes" to upgrade from 98 and XP. I _thought_ the article was going to highlight improvements like Kernel upgrades, Network Stack and IPv6, and Memory Management with the fluff stuff but was sorely disappointed.
;)
I was pretty ambivalent about up upgrading until I watched these interviews. Of course, given the source I take what they say with a grain of salt. On the other hand, these guys are the coders and not the businessmen, so I think I'm more willing to listen to them when they say they're onto something cool.
Dang it, there I go trusting something M$ has to say...another marketing victim
This crap happens all the time. It happened in NT4. It happened in 2000. It happens in XP.
When I'm root on a *nix system, about the only thing that will tell me to suck it is a hardware problem. (For instance and HD read error. Sometimes you can't even kill the service reliably.)
"Access Denied" is something I should NEVER see when running as an admin.
BTW. Apple ripped off the task bar from Microsoft
OS X is the direct descendant of NeXTSTEP. Notice the same Dock in the screenshots? Sorry to burst your bubble, but the Windows Taskbar is a ripoff of the NeXTSTEP Dock. Even the Recycler was ripped off (the Recycle Bin). Thanks for playing and please drive through.
AFAIK that wasn't the case about 18 months ago. Either that or they were checking the OS string returned, and decided they didn't like that.
The description in this article of the peer-to-peer collaboration seem very similar to what ICQ was doing with their "corporate version" before AOL bought them dismantled the product....
Everyone keeps hating on Microsoft for including all this (God Forbid) DRM in Vista. Guess what.
... all the way to the monitor. Recently, ATI got caught with their pants down claiming that
OSX nor Linux are ever going to have a chance of playing Blu-ray or HD-DVD in their current forms.
The only way that would ever happen is if they were loaded up with drm and the hardware was locked down. I
guess a lot of people don't realize that their beige box 'puters that they install their brand new copy
of Vista on aren't even going to play HD-DVD in its highest resolution. You think Microsoft LIKES putting
DRM in their OS? What do they have to gain if the studios didn't require it to play their content (I mean
it must be their content since we can no longer do with it as we please).
Anyway, back to my small rant. In order to be certified to play HD-DVD or Blu-ray there must be a complete
trusted path
they were selling a card that had HDCP support. I guess someone forgot to tell them they can only sell
THOSE cards to OEMs that were certified.
Now a lot of people will say: "Well just don't buy Vista or HD-DVDs". Sorry folks, a LOT of people myself
included WANT to be able to play HD-DVD on their home theater systems. So, some will say: "Just buy a
standalone player". Again, I don't want to. I like all the things an HTPC gives me. So, bottom line, since
the STUDIOS require the DRM, I don't see why everyone is busting Microsoft's chops.
-- http://anonet.org -- The internet the way it was meant to be. Check it out, you may be surprised.
Msft is coming out with seven different versions. My guess is that the standard version, the version that ships to most home PCs, will prove inadequate within a few months.
Fortunately, msft will provide an upgrade version for $149.
" Ten Reasons to Buy Windows Vista"
But I still haven't seen a real reason to actually buy windows yet... I mean, as opposed to, well, y'know...
You need a FREE iPod Nano
microsoft should target their OS at a broader audience. if i were them, i'd dump the current code and start from scratch like OS X, with Unix foundation and everything. i'm sure they've got the cash to develop this, if apple was able to... thanks.
There's not actually a deadzone at the edge of the monitor for the classic theme either. The graphic for the button doesn't extend to the edge of the screen, but if you actually click up there you click the button.
This is exactly why I've always said that we should promote Free Software for its ethics rather than any particular feature that it happens to have at a particular moment. The technical advantages (such as security) that products like Firefox might have over other products will always come and go, but the ethics of Free Software will only cease to matter when if all software eventually guarantees users' freedom.
Ethics, shmethics. Although that's a good reason, a better (and more simple) one is this: use Free Software because everything else is hostile to you . This is getting (much) worse because of Treacherous Computing and Digital Restrictions Enforcement, but this reason existed even way back when Stallman was trying to get his printer to do what he wanted (instead of what the manufacturer wanted).
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Yes, that's basically what ethics means to me. By hurting others in our society, we hurt ourselves because we have to live in that society too. So it's much the same as being hostile or selfish. But, as always, finding a simple, catchy way to communicate the issues is the difficulty.
"Besides, just because you like to go out and waste a few hundred bucks on a POS doesn't mean everyone else will. I myself would rather spend a few hundred more and get something that will do what I want without having to tweak the UI so much it looks like Windows 3.1." I never said anyone LIKED to go out and spend a few hundred bucks on a POS. Some of us don't have a few hundred extra to spend on more. So we learn to get by with what we can afford. By the way, I wasn't calling novices stupid. That is just how I interpreted your previous comment. I may have misread what you were trying to say. All I'm saying is that for people like me who really don't have alot of money spend but still want a PC will take what they can get and learn to make it work as efficiently as possible.
Could someone PLEASE explain to me why everyone is annoyingly comparing Windows to Mac and other OS? Windows is updating WINDOWS, it's not updating MAC. You people are impossible to please. "It's not like Mac!" Hmm, maybe because it's Windows? And if Windows didn't try to start to "compete" with other OS, you'd all start a topic saying, "Eh! Microsoft still doesn't know anything! What are they waiting for!?" Just because Mac has had 'better security' since...ever...doesn't mean Windows can't attempt to have it either. If you like your mac, good. Stay with it. And for the people who like Windows, I'm sure they are happy that their company is upgrading.
I understand your concern, but I believe that it is misplaced. All libraries have porn filters for children's machines. But that's quite different from being unable to find information on breast cancer because the local bible thumpers forced the local library to deny any access to a website that has the word 'breast' on it. I've even seen library filters deny me access to Safeway grocery ads because chicken breasts were on sale there.
I typed 'horse pictures' into Google and got pictures of horses. Search engine companies are very sensitive to having children access accidently hard-core porn images when doing innocent searches. This is a concern between the porn industry and the search engine companies. They have to come to an arrangement that prevents this kind of thing from happening. It's very bad for their businesses. Having children innocently and accidently come across porn images will become rare in the near future. It is much less common now than it was five years ago.
But that will happen without over-restrictive filters on websites on public-access computers.
never heard of it before, but a quick google search starts settnig off alarms immediately
"
System Requirements:
* Windows XP with Service Pack 1 installed or Windows 2000 with Service Pack 3 installed, or newer, or Mac OS X 10.3 or newer.
* A connection to the Internet.
* 512 megabytes of RAM is recommended.
* Lots of spare time.
"
Not exactly a small footprint, which goes against the grain of being simple and innovative. The increase in computing power isn't an excuse to add bloatware to a desktop. I think that's one of the reasons Macs have done as well as they have (even if only a minor one), they don't leave widgets that'll painfully slow things down for the user. I don't know about you, but I think a lot of users like to crank all the settings up, which can lead to sloppy performance if there is bloat left around. For consumer software, it doesn't matter which product has more features if the core of the product is sluggish and gets in the way of getting something done.
Timeless Rogue Star - Defile Convention - Transcend Time, Life, the Universe, and Everything.
Looking at it from a Linux perspective, this is the area that Microsoft seems to be furthest behind to me (with the software on XP). The last time that I looked there were at least three "Windows Update" versions - "Windows Update" (which seems to be called "Microsoft Update" these days), "Office Update", and MBSA.
Even if these were consolidated into one I can't see the third-party suppliers letting Microsoft manage their updates the way that equivalent Linux suppliers let the Linux distributions do.
For example, Realplayer and MS Media Player don't exactly "play well together" - I can't see Real agreeing to be included in some MS equivalent of Yast or apt-get. The equivalent Linux media players need the distributions and the distributions need the software - it's a beneficial relationship that doesn't exist in the Microsoft world. Windows XP thinks that it can do everything (there was an interview a while back with someone from Microsoft claiming I think that "everyone talks about iLife but no-one talks about Scanners and Cameras Wizard") but it sometimes doesn't seem to recognise that sometimes other people can do a better job than you and if it's selling your OS - that's still good for you.
We've got 3rd-party applications as the standard for many things on Windows, how about a 3rd-party package manager? With a trustworthy name behind it it could make sense. It would have to be free at the point of use, though...
What about people that currently run older machines?... how well does it operate on an Athalon 750 with 512 of ram, and a 32m Nvidia Ge-Force 2 GTS? Really!...... i'd like to know! because my budget isn't looking too good for upgrades for a while.
Do you have anything other than Microsoft's own FUD to back this up? We all know how reliable their Linux benchmarks are and what an incentive they have to get us to "upgrade."
I do; however, shouldn't you rethink this a bit? It is their OS, and their kernel technologies, who do you think would know them better than MS? Why would MS even put time into 'changing' what was in Win2K if it wasn't to improve it?
Secondly, the facts Microsoft present, like "Larger Device Drivers and System Space" are facts that any geek can check to see works in XP and will fail in Win2k as there is limited space.
As for the non-Microsoft FUD, the first link I posted was from a MS site, however the article was written by Mark Russinovich and David Solomon, and Mark is of SysInternals, a company that has been both assistive and quick to point out truths of flaws in NT over the years. You can find their site at:
http://www.sysinternals.com/
So unless they were just being paid to say what MS wanted them to say and risk their credibility with items that could easily be proven wrong if they were wrong, then ya, all I have is MS FUD.
If you don't believe the links I posted, go freaking test it yourself, try to break XP and prove to the world that MS has been lying about XP for 5 years and no one else but you were smart enough to find it. Prove that the Registry Limits are the same as Win2k, pick anything.
There are also a lot of other system changes that are only casually mentioned or skipped in these articles. For example, did you know that in WindowsXP if an application makes a very bad call, instead of just shutting down the offending application as Win2k would do to protect the OS, XP will try to figure out what the application was trying to do, and fix the call and pass back the correct information, address, etc in real-time, so the application doesn't fail and the user never even notices. All for compatibility to correct mistakes of 3rd party programmers that were idiots to keep the 'software' running as expected. That is enough of change in the OS between Win2k and XP to warrant the upgrade alone, let alone the performance, stability, and other improvements.
Does anyone here even think anymore, or does the Microsoft name invoke a knee-jerk reaction and bring out the 'idealistic anti-MS ignorance'?
You know, you don't actually have to write "TheNetAvenger" at the bottom of the post, it says it riiiiiight up the top just underneath the subject line, for everyone to see.
:)
No I didn't notice that, oh my God... (just funning with ya)
Actually, it is a habit so that your name doesn't get forgotten. (i.e. business communication, sign, repeat, sign, etc.)
And although not intended in this instance, it looks like it worked, I bet you won't forget it.
TheNetAvenger *Smile*
The Fedora Project is making great strides with SElinux, but as you note, the browser (and e-mail client) are tough cases, because they can launch other apps (OOo, media players, plugins) with different security requirements from the browser. Handling these transitions in a flexible but secure way is challenging. But with the progress being made now, a solution will almost certainly be shipped in the Vista timeframe. The expectation is that Linux desktop releases that appear in late 2006 (FC6?) -- around the same time as Vista -- will use SElinux to sandbox desktop applications.
Compatibility with more games. Other than WoW, what popular MMORPG runs on Mac OS X?
There's that Second Life one, but most others are Mac-only.
Compatibility with more vertical-market apps such as the one used by your employer.
My employer actively discourages staff taking work home. But I'm in a financial company, so that's not surprising. I can run Office though, which is the most I'd ever need for work at home.
Is this really an issue? Do companies buy licences for custom vertical-market apps for employees' home computers?
Compatibility with more peripherals sold at retail stores.
Such as? Just about anything USB or Firewire will be fine, internal hard drives are fine, most RAM is fine. What peripherals are you talking about here?
Compatibility with web sites that are made exclusively for Microsoft Internet Explorer technology and for which there are no close substitutes.
That's not a feature! It's a bug.
Websites made with IE "technology" are made with IE "proprietary extensions that either step well outside the standards or work differently to the standards." That is not something people should trumpet as a feature.
My employer actively discourages staff taking work home.
That's because you work in an industry where most employees are rich enough to own real estate close to an office. Many people who work in IT aren't that lucky and must telecommute.
Do companies buy licences for custom vertical-market apps for employees' home computers?
Yes, some publishers of proprietary computer programs make site licenses available that cover telecommuting.
Just about anything USB or Firewire will be fine ... What peripherals are you talking about here?
USB devices that aren't HIDs (keyboard/mouse/joystick) or mass storage devices, such as USB flatbed scanners and other specialized input and output devices. There are a lot of scanner makers that still refuse to make Mac image acquisition drivers and refuse to share wire-level specs with the community to make SANE drivers, which means that the total cost of switching from Windows XP to Mac OS X includes re-buying peripherals. I may stop complaining if and when Microtek helps the SANE people write a driver for my paid-for Microtek Scanmaker 4850 scanner.
[Compatibility with your university's IE-only web site is] not a feature! It's a bug.
Would you want to transfer to another university just because your university's online courseware, introduced after you enrolled, turned out to use IE proprietary extensions, and the IT department was unreceptive to spending time and money on adding equivalent Safari or Camino proprietary extensions? Then the total cost of switching to Mac OS X would include moving to a different university, and if not all of your credits transfer, which is likely the case for incoming seniors, you have to re-buy your education.
Thanks for not pouncing on me for drawing a blank there.
Generally speaking, I've found that like Microsoft Windows, it is often best just to plug (say) a given USB device in and see if it works. For example, I have these pretty cheap dual-analog controllers. They're fine if you just plug them in, but you're pretty much screwed if you try to use the company's outdated, buggy drivers, which in addition to being really weird and crashing your system on SP2, do not allow you to calibrate the joysticks at all. Seriously.
These same pads work fine on a Mac, too. For that matter, I think all USB input devices are pretty much using the same standard these days, with the exception of tablets. Printers are basically plug-and-play, since I'm pretty sure the print system is based on CUPS and Gimp-Print. Basically, if it prints on Linux, it prints on Mac, except without all of the horrible, gut-wrenching pains.
As for like, random PCI card, that's a bit of a minefield. I'm not sure if x pci card can just be plugged into a Mac, since I've only been using them for about a year and I've never owned a PowerMac besides, and they've changed standards no less than twice in the last year - first to PCI-X and now to PCI-Express.
You put forth that users must either choose between user-friendly with "bloat", or lean and mean but user-hostile. This, however, is not the case.
I will surely upgrade to vista when it is released. coz it rocks,i think it is going to have a good 64 bit support. Check this too: http://www.extremetech.com/article2/0,1697,1931917 ,00.asp
http://www.alieneyes.uni.cc/