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Limited-Use DVD Technology
ps_inkling writes: "Two companies are creating different techniques to make DVD discs unusable after a set period of time. SpectraDisc has a patent on a limited-play DVD technology; FlexPlay is currently developing limited play DVD technology. The SpectraDisc technique is to coat the DVD with a film, then wrap the DVD in an anaerobic package.
The idea is to sell these 'play-once' DVD movies at a substantial discount to regular DVDs as a way to compete with pay-per-view or movie ticket outlets."
This sounds just like DIVX from circuit City will noone learn?
Let Microsoft know, whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship
A technology flops, and companies try to resurrect it nonetheless. Don't they remember Circuit City's Divx fiasco?
"It take 9 months to bear a child, no matter how many women you assign to the job."
Do theny never learn? Sure, now they do not require you to connect ot the Big Brother, Co. to view it, but who will want this anyway? And how would they handle liability, if it does not play??
<^>_<(ô ô)>_<^>
"creating more waste faster than ever imagined"
I don't get it.
Just screws other people, not me ;)
I have all my movies in DivX format on my harddisk (easier to browse anyway)
Great, so I'll spend what, half price on these compared to regular discs, and have to throw it out afterwards. And what if I want to atch the extras? after the coating's gone,t he menu probably won't work again? Yea, I didn't read the article, but chances are they probably don't go into this. Why don't companies learn from what other stupid companies did? If I buy something from a store, I want to have it in the future, no stupid one watch crap. I can go to the stupid video rental place and rent a movie and watch it several times (in 5 days), probably for the same price or even cheaper, and I don't have to worry about burning disc coatings in my player.
Let them research a new technology that costs millions, to create a manufacturing process to sell disks that costs billions, and to make disks that due to their physical composition, will almost cause the industry to LOSE money?
:)
I, for one, am looking forward to this
So, now we see why they were so keen to eliminate DVD copying software. If only they hadn't made DVD copying a complete and utter technical impossibility.
Will this technology fade once DVD-R comes into the mainstream?
0x0D 0x0A
And it failed miserably. My uncle's got a DivX player that's near-useless. He should've got one that also played regular DVDs - but hey, he was an early adopter. I don't think limited-use discs or other media makes sense. People want to *own* the movies and music they buy. Otherwise, everyone would listen to the radio all the time, or get pay-per-view movies on their cable or satellite. But hey - what do I know? I'm just an American Consumer - I vote with my dollar. And my dollar won't be buying a use-once disc. Unless you can rip it to DivX;-).
Wouldn't that make Nitrogen gas illegal under the DMCA as a circumvention?
My handle breaks slashcode, what does your handle do?
You'd think that after the failure of Cirtuit city's DIVX that they've learnt that consumers aren't interested in limited play DVDs.
Besides, neither of these systems would seem to cause any trouble for DiVX:) for those who what to get around the time out problem
I can't particularly see this taking off for a number of reasons. 1. How long will it be before the DVD's are cracked (if it is a software time limit) 2. When DVDR's become (very) cheaply available, won't people buy them, copy them for a substantial discount like people did with PSone CD's. However, someone thinks it will work and save money, so someone else will find a way around it and abuse the system.
i SWEAR i've heard of this.. like a year ago.
qouting my good friend Eric Wilson here....
"For every technology, there is an equal and opposite hacker technology"
simply put, someone will hack this and we'll see either easy copies of this, or some way to play the orginals for as long as desired
Lawyers, MBA's, RIAA? A jedi fears not these things!
Once is all I need to copy it :)
The next thing you know, they'll be trying to sell us eat-once popcorn to go with our play-once dvd
---
Oregon
Was the "play once" or "rip once".
These pretzels are making me thirsty.
LOL! That'll work. rm -rf *stupid*companies* like Circuit City and Macrovision.
The biggest trick the devil pulled was letting lawyers become politicians so they can write the laws.
How about DVDs that disintegrate after a period of time? Maybe after subjected to the heat of a DVD player or something. Then you have no waste. Like those packing peanuts made of starch. They disolve in water so you don't have to worry about styrofoam waste from packing material anymore.
No todo lo que es oro brilla
I'm not a hardcore environmentalist, but isn't that a little irresponsible? Not only that, it's a stupid idea with limited appeal. (Cool! I can get a dvd for 4.99 that I can only watch once? Sign me up!).
Blah.
I can't wait to see these schmucks fold, and hopefully after losing significant amounts of personal investments.
Imagine the uses for it.
In the every box of cheerios you get a copy of the Powerrangers movie that you can play 3 times before you have to buy another box.
This would enable cheap short life DvD's to be given away to people. Perhaps a movie mag could put on it all the new previews they had at such a small cost. As much as i dont like the idea there are many uses for this technology.
Also I could see some of those online places that will let you rent DvD's over the net use such a thing. They send it out and you get to watch it twice or three times and they save money buy not having to worry about postage. I kinda hope this works and kinda don't due to it could become the standard and evuantally you wont be able to buy movies anymore but be forced to rent them.
So the point of my comment is this. Any technology when used can be either good or bad. This has the future of both. I imagine both uses would get used out of it.
-THIS SPACE FOR RENT!
This kind of technology I doubt will compete with pay-per-view. The main idea of pay-per-view (ppv), is that you do not have to even move off your couch to order it. With Satalite, you can hit a few buttons on a remote. With Cable, you have to make a call, that that is also pretty easy.
So I have to run to the store, buy something that will cost what.. $2 (I would hope), bring it back, pop it in.. watch.. remove. Place coffee on.
This is certainly not convenience. I could see, maybe ordering them online, have them shipped to your house, then watch.. but again, you dont have it when you wanted it (when you ordered). PPV allows you to watch it RIGHT then. But you have to look at the side of these DVDs, if you are allowed to rewind, and pause, that would be great, it would have that advantage over PPV.
Should be interesting to see if this idea actually works.
Its not what it is, its something else.
OK, This is IT!
:-/
If I hear one more "didn't they try this with DIVX", or "I thought Circuit City...", etc., I'll inflict harm upon someone in this lab I'm currently sitting in! Inflicting harm is kinda like DIVX, isn't it, but instead of "play once and it's done" it's "punch once and they're done"?
Sorry, too much caffeine today
If you celebrate Xmas, befriend me (538
Read the patent if you like.
Nothing new here. Consumers rejected DivX, and this is no different for them. Will they be smart enough to reject it this time around?
Anyone remember Divix? Basically the same kinda thing..... and it failed horribly. Circuit City lost several Million dollars over the deal when they had to shut down the service. The principle was... buy a $5 disc and you could watch it for like 3 days. After that you have to "renew" the rental through your divix capable dvd player for a fee, buy the movie through the player, or toss it.
The point is... why deal with this when people can just go to a blockbuster and rent it for 5 days for the same price??
Flop... that's what I say!
If I just wanted to watch a movie once, I'd rent it from my local Blockbuster or similar video store. Those places carry DVDs now.
But if I buy a product, I damn well want to use it more than once! (Well, a data-carrying product, anyway. Food is a different story...)
I'm sure they could have tried to make VHS tapes, audio cassettes, and so on, that would only play once. Nobody was fool enough to try it until now.
I predict this thing will crash and burn at least as badly as DivX did.
Kai MacTane: Web developer for hire in San Francisco
How does this compete with pay-per-view?
The main selling point of pay-per-view is
not price, but convenience/live broadcasts.
You will have to go, and buy this only to
turn around, and throw it away. This isn't
just incovenient it is wasteful, and doesn't
even touch the live performance aspect of
pay-per-view. Money would be better spent
on working out a broadband streaming solution.
--wyn
which just happens to be how many times you need to play it to make a copy.
Who cares. There's a reason Divx died.
Didn't they already try this and it met with little . . . er . . . no success?
-Joe
The difference between Circuit City's fiasco and this is that divx required a special player which dialed an 800 number to see if you're eligible to play the disk. That part wasn't so horrible. The bad part is that CC wasn't making any money with it so they dropped it and screwed all the people who had paid extra for the specialized players.
;)
These new ideas are entirely different.. they rely on the disc itself to limit how many times you can play it. I, for one, wouldn't mind paying $1-2 for a DVD which allows me to watch a movie a couple times until the coating on the disk makes it unreadable. You only have to read it once to rip it.
Do you even know anything about perl? -- AC Replying to Tom Christiansen post.
Apparently Pay-Per-View is more popular than I thought it was, for it to have competition. However I don't see much of a future for either limited-use medium. Divx didn't fare that well, and you'd think that would serve as a lesson, unless their research suggests that the general populace shied away due to Big Brother concerns than a lack of enthusiasm in the "delivery method."
In any case, I fail to see how this will improve on both Pay-Per-View and rental. Only a limited amount of material is available to PPV (usually the stuff that's been in the video rental places for a while), and I doubt that any who would make a trek to a rental store, most of which would have the full permanent version DVDs for rent, would really mind a return trip, especially if the temp DVDs just have the movie and not any special features. (After all, would the studios be likely to put special features on a temp DVD?)
"What's so random about flipping a coin? Ever heard of the I Ching?"
Just play them in a vacuum!
The biggest trick the devil pulled was letting lawyers become politicians so they can write the laws.
So if you put those discs in a vacuum, you'd be able to store them almost indefinately? It's fairly easy to make a box for these discs and pump all the air out of it.
;-) or record them to DVD-R once the discs are cheaper.
Alternatively, there's probably a way to chemically treat the "special coating" so that it doesn't oxidize.
Of course, you could also just rip the DVD's to your hard drive and convert them to DivX
Hard drives are still the only commonly available technology that doesn't require you to have big piles of stuff (discs, tapes) around.
Cryptnotic
My other first post is car post.
With Pay-Per-View:
Advantages over rental:
- Don't have to leave the house.
- Don't have to pay late fees.
With Cool-New-Useless-Technology
- Still have to leave the house.
- Get a cool new plethora of coasters.
With Movie Theater:
Advantages over rental:
- Big screen Big Sound
- Popcorn requires less effort and tastes better
With Cool-New-Useless Technology:
- Same Screen Same Sound
- Popcorn inevitably gets burnt in the Microwave.
And this is supposed to compete??? WTF?
Karma: Non-Heinous
For $4.99 you get not only a DVD, but a tasty snack!
THAT'S what they should have done with all those AOL CD's....
By the way, people are stupid. That'll never work.
I don't see how this offers any real bonus to existing ways of movie rental. Pay per view allows me to rent movies from the comfort of my own smelly couch, and video/DVD rentals allow for several days worth of viewing (along with fast forward/rewind) I think this is a case of good technology with no real use. Also, if it is the removal of oxygen that maintains the DVD, maybe some airtight food storage sealers would actually have some use after all.
This, if implemented, would be a great reason to legalize DVD backup solutions. Right now, the DVD is virtually not wearing out. But if it does, the consumer can argue all kinds of standard consumer protection arguments in favor of his right to watch the DVD *as the content is licensed*, like once, but to use the content when he is ready. It will be tough defense for the DVD people because there will be very legitimate reason to back it up.
Ahh yes, another piece of junk for us to accumulate. I think I'll shelve the used discs on my bookcase, next to the handbook on "How to reduce clutter".
Wouldn't it be nice for a change if our culture moved away from selling to people as much junk as they can buy? Disposable diapers, disposable cameras, disposable cellphones, etc. I find that many people lead just as disposable lives, unfortunately -- with the quality of life getting emptier as people get richer.
Yes, yes, I know that all marketing is about making people want something they didn't know they needed before. Just because we're accustomed to it doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. I look forward to the day when we can overcome our material desires, the need to one-up our neighbors, and express our achievement through spending money.
Maybe science, freedom of information, and education will get us there someday. I hope.
person a: "Hey can you rewind? I missed what that guy said"
:|
person b: "too late, it's been wiped..."
Also, what would happen if you paused the DVD - would it still degrade?
I'm sorry, but I think it's a bad idea. In addition, what about all these wasted/junk DVD disks? Plastic Bags are enough of a problem, what about millions of junked DVDs?
/me shakes head
-- Dan
click on User#179946 Info, and it says you are "1", not "1/137", and has no knowledge of your posts...
The only time I've ever seen something stupider than this was when my dog ate his shit right after dinner.
visit the hwky website for a lyrical genius infusion.
Even with AOL's heroic efforts I was greatly concerned about the amount of coasters in the world... My friends, we may be safe after all.
Not only does God definitely play dice, but He sometimes confuses us by throwing them where they can't be seen. -Hawking
I'm assuming that this "film coating" is the same tech we heard about a while back that causes the DVD disc to corrode into uselessness shortly after the film is exposed to reader light ...
... digitally identical playback, every time, unlike VHS, which corroded and is useless after a few years.
Is anyone else worried that this film might "rub off" onto your DVD tray, and get onto one of your other discs afterward? I'd certainly be pissed to discover that the rental DVD I purchased destroyed the discs I already own... I don't think there's a conspiracy here, but I don't think this film is a good thing, either.
To be honest, if I want to rent a DVD, I go to blockbuster, or Hollywood Video if there's one near by. It's cheap, it's pretty painless, and there's no risk of the disc destroying my setup
One thing that is VERY nice about DVD rentals is that you can watch the movie one year or eight years after the video store acquired it, and -- provided the disc is readable -- you get the same experience
~Aaron.
student of animation and the fine arts
... on Mission Impossible. Jim sticks in those shiny discs in and it self destructs after it plays once...
"Backups are for wimps. Real men upload their data to an FTP site and have everyone else mirror it." -- Linus Torvalds
The issue NOT addressed is. How much waste will "Limited-life" DVD's generate in our landfills?
We're becoming ever more the "great throwaway" society.
getting shat on even more...
Wow, I should not post when knackered.
At a time when cities are striving for a 50 or 75 percent reduction in waste going to landfills it is downright disgusting to be engineering throw-away technology. We have enough AOL CDs occupying our landfills. We don't need DVDs there too, especially when the consumer doesn't even want limited-use tech.
I bet within 5 years there is a special "waste tax" on every unit manufacturered (sorta like tax on soda cans) because we know the items will end up in the landfill.
Just be sure you don't leave it in your drive for a few days ... it will probably rot and drip slime all over :-)
...
That brings up the possibility that you could use the discs in an air free enviroment. It would be pretty easy to do, methinks. Set an aquarium upside and displace the air with a noble gas that is lighter than air (helium, hydrogen, whatever). Only open and store the DVD in that oxygen free enviroment and you should have any problems.
Of course it is late and I could be way wrong
-Jim
Now it will only cost me $3.50 to rip it and make a DivX ;) movie instead of either shelling out $20 or waiting for it to come out on Usenet/FastTrack/IRC/etc.
I, for one, completely and full-heartedly endorse this product.
If the disk is rendered unreadable by a reaction involving oxegen, all that is needed to keep the DVD's from going bad is to store them in an oxygen free environment. After you open the packaging, watch the DVD, then place it in an airtight package with some yeast and water (the activated yeast will consume the oxygen in the container) and the disk should still be playable at a later time providing the new packaging is airtight, and you consume all the oxygen.
Of course the other obvious way to get around this is to rip the contents and burn your own.
Comments should be like skirts. Short enough to keep your attention, but long enough to cover the subject
I did start using Netflix though, and I'm quite happy with the service. Blockbuster is a good 15 minutes from my place, so the mailbox makes a lot more sense.
www.lonseidman.com
"But if I buy a product, I damn well want to use it more than once! (Well, a data-carrying product, anyway. Food is a different story...)"'
How about toilet paper?
First off, I just wonder how they're going to make this all enviro-safe, considering that they're talking about a disposable commodity. With all the films and coatings, you have to hope these things can be recycled.
Second, it just doesn't strike me that a disc couldn't simply be 'fixed'. *spritz spritz*, a few blasts of a nice clear heat-resistant coating and you've got a sealed item that'd still fit in the tolerances of a DVD drive. I bet it only takes a few days, if these things actually make it to market, before someone discovers what can of stuff to buy to make instant-preservations.
My own pointless vanity vintage computing page
Y'know, for all the shortcomings of Divx (special players, mounting costs, VHS-Beta-style format war, deceptive advertising, being unable to share discs, etc), it had one thing over both of these harebrained schemes.
Replayability.
You could purchase additional viewing windows, and you would be a sent a bill by HQ each month. Pay-per-view DVDS - it's as dumb as it sounds, especially since many of the discs had no special features, were pan-n-scan, and basically had no redeeming qualities whatsoever. At least you could replay your own discs.
These dumbshit ideas... 3 days, and they're in the trash, never to be viewed again. The wrapping and case/sleeve also go in the trash. FlexPlay presents a claim that 100 million DVDs can fit into a 10m^3 block. It's still additional waste, of landfill space, of packaging, and of the resources and energy that went into producing a DVD that craps itself after 3 days. It's not as if you can return the flick for someone else to enjoy - the disc is WASTED. Perfect for the disposable society, but I thought we were trying to move away from that?
As for the "save the environment by driving your car less" claim attached to this... build cleaner cars before looking for excuses to keep the current ones.
Someday, you're going to die. Get over it.
normally I'm not a environment type of guy but the same thought occured to me when divx came out as now. theres going to be a huge amount of waste from this. is it really neccesary to make a big landfill of non-useable discs just so Blockbuster can compete with PPV?
sigh. my brain hurts from corporate stupidity.
I bet atleast 50% of the first 100 posts to this thread will be dumbasses; "Dont you remember DIVX?"
Why, YES I DID, THANKS! I didnt need to be reminded more than once.
Proof that people are more interested in posting the obvious for karma, than reading what has already been said.
Anyone who considers arithmetical methods of producing random numbers is, of course, in a state of sin.-John von Neumann
If this happens movie manufacturors won't be able to turn the profit they enjoy off of normal DVD's. Where would you pick them up besides Wal-Mart? Blockbuster sure as hell isn't going to carry something that competes with itself. Neither are all of the smaller video stores that we have around my hometown.
I'm not sure if there are any official numbers attesting to this, but the few people I know of that actually spend money on pay-per-view (and I do mean "few," since it tends to cost more than a 3- or 5-day VHS rental) videotape the PPV broadcast.
All I can see this doing is either removing the middleman between the movie company and the "unauthorized" copiers or flopping on its face when these kinds of people run into copy protection.
They'll last untill some rocket-scientist figures out that some bizzare combination of fishoil and hairspray will neutralize the selfdestruct mechanism....which will take place 4.36 days after they get to market.
But really...who cares. Between broadband, DivX;-), the dropping costs of DVD writer/rewriters and the media, hardware DivX;-) cards (I know one or two have been announced) and the social acceptance of Napster....The MPAA is in the process of shitting itself.
Well at least until they get enough senators in their back pocket to pass that SSSCA shit.
virtros
Worst. Sig. Ever.
An introduction of this technology will almost certainly increase DVD piracy, as people will see an opportunity to get a full movie cheap. FlexPlay, at least, claims their discs will work in all DVD drives, including DVD-ROMs. The market for DVD burners, currently technophile and media professional toys, may witness a small upsurge in demand, and ripping tools will become popular as the damn-copyright set notes the obvious ways around the time limit - make copies of the discs.
There's no way this can come to any good. Abort mission.
Someday, you're going to die. Get over it.
you buy them at a substantially reduced price, and can only watch them a set number of times... sounds to me like video rental. and in video rental, you only have to produce the media once. it can be rented out as often as you want. sounds to me like they're trying to compete with a strong industry by introducing an inferior product! ah well...
To me this would cause more piracy. If I rented a disc and knew it was going to expire the first thing I'd do is copy it. Once copied I'd know it couldn't expire so I'd give the original to the kids and put the backup into my own collection.
I do the same thing with CD's now. I make a copy which I use, keep a copy on the hdd, and put the original into a safe spot. I've done the same thing with DVD's from time to time but not as much as the cases for DVD's seem to work better in my experience.
At what price learning? At what cost wisdom? The price is a man's peace of mind, and the cost is his life.
Hardly. Why go down to the video store and "buy" a limited use dvd when you can just order a pay-per-view movie without getting yer fat ass off the couch?
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Hurray, after disposable cell phones, we now have disposable dvd's with built-in self-destruction!!!
I wonder how far our civilisation can innovate. (as far as it's willing to recycle maybe?)
Those disks should be heavily taxed to pay the recycling too (or collect the usaged disks to re-build the Twin Towers?)
The Netflix marketing stategy where you have x number of DVDs out does a better job of keeping the lemmings in line.
you can use them to bomb small countrys...
;-)
Not quite as effective as most bombs, but the millitary could get 'em for free, hell maybe even get money for cleaning up...
hmmmmm well i am against this myself i mean come on just one use... i want to use forever... and for all you bitching about popcorn and other food your all wrong... i DO want my food to be reusable... i payed for it and it breaks when i use it... sounds like pure bs to me... so if anyone wants to join me in suing the hell out of kraft foods then you cn find my email branded to the goatse.cx dudes ass...
-coward out
ps/btw/pps... "this is not a troll"/"this is not a flame"/"oh and uhhh....any other karma whoreing i can do"
A play once dvd priced at $5.88 or just a buck would severely break a store. Customers wont know the difference from the play once dvd's or the standard dvds. They will see that cheap price for say, Fast and the furious and nab it before someone else does. Then when they get home the kids will spark up the dvd player while mom is in the kitchen cooking. Mom calls the kids for dinner and the kids stop the dvd player and have dinner. The family retires back to the living room and starts the dvd from the beginning only to find mom is not going to see any of it because the dvd has alredy burned off it's boot sector.
You will turn up with upset customers, fast.
I work at a walmart in the nortwest houston area. I can vouch for the fact that customers are not very quick at understanding things much less take the time to read anything. All they see is a Price, and an object they want. A while back we were stocking Jarassic part 3 in dvd. One full screen, one wide screen. Most customers dont have a clue there a difference and have a problem with the wide screen letter box format. Most of them come back and ask about full screen. They didnt see a little sliver of text at the bottom of the dvd that said wide screen.
Customers arent very bright when they come in stores. They will plow through water on the floor, spilled legos, anything. They never see signs higher than 6 foot, (never can find the 2 signs in the store both with 3 ft letters saying restrooms).
Customers seem to check their brains at the door and dont understand what Out of stock means and ask, "well, what does that mean?" Out of stock means out of stock, there is not a magic hat we can pull a 19 inch tv out of and if you ask me again Im going to scream!
These things are going to be bad stuff. Just think, they might write games to these discs. Then we will have a war on our hands.
DRACO-
Consider yourself blessed if you are sneezed on by a dragon and only get wet, it could have been a fireball.
You know, not simply to be controversial, but I don't understand the big problem a lot of people here seem to have with this idea. People are comparing this to DivX (evil). This is *not* DivX, not even close. DivX required special hardware. DivX required that the user give over their credit card info and hook the player up to a phone line. DivX required the user to live with the fact that someone, somewhere, was recording everything they watched on their DivX player. This is not DivX.
What this is, however, is a pretty revolutionary idea for the world of video rental and I'm suprised more people aren't seeing this. This, if successful, has the full potential to completely change the way people rent movies. Suddenly, with this technology, any retail outlet has the full fredom of becoming a video-rental store, without any of the additional overhead involved of tracking discs, late returns, lost/damaged media, collection agencies, etc. Instead, any convenience store owner can go down to Costco and pick up a box of movies, rip open the top, and set the box on the counter next to the cheap lighters, beef jerky, and plastic roses. Consider that. How do you think this is going to affect rental chains like Blockbuster if every grocery store stocks the latest movie releases in the impulse-buy section of checkout lines, between the tabloids and the candy bars? It won't completely kill video rental stores, to be sure, because there still needs to be a place to non new-release movies, but it will take a chunk of their pie.
Additionally, this promises to change the whole distribution method for existing video rental stores. Previously, when a new movie was about to be released, discs and vhs tapes would go on the market to rental outlets for an extreme price of like $80 a pop, and this is how the publishers would make a good chunk of money off of the rental market. Only after the rental outlets have had a chance to get the latest-greatest movies, would they go on the market to the general consumer at a more normal price. This technology allows publishers to do away with that step, and release new movies to rental and consumer markets simultaneously. Of course, how many people are going to go to a video rental store to rent the latest and greatest when they can get it in the checkout line of "Safeway" remains to be seen. But the argument remains that, on the distribution side for movie rentals, this technology would simplify things immensly.
Some people point out that with this technology, you could by the disc, take it home, and rip it to make a copy. Sure, but couldn't you do that already with rental discs from a video store? Nothing has changed there. There are no new copyprotection mechanisms introduced with this tech. All the same all circumventable copy protection techniques still apply. If you want to pirate, you still have just as many options as you had before. In fact, this tech gives you a new one cause, unlike with traditional rental media, shop owerns aren't going to be so paranoid about people shoplifing movies.
The one significant concern that I've heard and I completely agree with is the environmental issue. Yes, this further advances the disposable society by giving us one more thing to clog our landfills with. Is it a huge issue? I don't think so. We throw more material away when we toss out an empty full sized bag of doritos. However, there is a certain "save gas/polution cause people don't have to take it back to the store" factor.. tho I'm not sure how much I'd trust the little environmentalist's report on how significant a savings that would be.
Anyways, I could go on but this is long enough. In short, this isn't the next frontier of evil in the media universe. It might even be useful.
This just can't compete with pay-per-view.. I'm sorry.. The reason that people get pay-per-view is to record it. I don't know anyone that pays the $8 or whatever a ppv movie is that doesn't record it.
No one is going to buy a proprietary dvd that they can only play a few times when they can ppv the movie and record it and watch it infinate times.
Its a status thing.. people like to physically own a movie whether they bought it or copied it off ppv is irrelevant, the very idea that they can stockpile cassettes and then watch any movie they've already seen on a whim is appealing to people.
Inevitably this will be compared to the failed divx producted produced by circit city a few years back. (Neglecting the stupid proprietary player you had to buy) The main reason that divx failed, was not because of a consumor lack of interest, but instead because of the lack of industry support. The industry did not want to get behind a product that could be re-activated. It was their view that this product was just like a full version of the film. They realized full well (for once) that they were putting a product out there that would be cracked. With cracked divx floating around, everyone could have cheap movies. Who wouldn't want a $3.99 movie title.
:-)
The reason Limited-Use DVD's might succeed is this: if the companies involved can actually get these stupid things to distruct then the industry will back them. These companies work to make money by taking advantage of the consumer, and with little risk of the consumer pulling one over on the industry, the product is viable for them.
Also if this technology works it can be deployed immediately, there is no modifications that need to happen to your exsisting dvd players.
And for those that don't get out much, go to your local Blockbuster, notice anything? Way more dvd's now then ever before, why? More players, and this is the technology that the industry wants us to use.
I'm just happy I got my dvd player that plays all regions and allows me to turn off copy protection (to vhs).
Up against the cold hard consumer says no wall, motherfsckers!
Christ. Yeah, we're all going to really embrace this new and wonderful technology. Because they're going to do it 'right', unlike DIVX!
Wait, you mean, the reason DIVX didn't catch on was *because* of the limited use bit?
Oh crap! DON'T TELL THE STOCKHOLDERS!
Yeah, that is just what I want. A DVD that biodegrades from the heat inside my player.
Tech support: What seems to be the problem?
Me: Well, there is this sticky goo in my DVD player. I can't watch any movies.
Tech support: That is normal, sir. The new single-use DVDs biodegrade in your player, making the player usable only a single time.
What I don't understand, is why theyre spending MORE making a DVD, but selling the crippled product for much LESS than the regular DVD's?
Shouldn't they pass costs to customers correctly? These limited play DVD 's should cost MORE than than the regular DVD's because they cost more to make!
Unless it is something like a CDRW that reads the disk and then has a laser erase it, I doubt that this can be good for the player. The laser needs to stay clean, and coatings that get melted off will probably produce some kind of waste. Perhaps that won't be a solid, but I don't want to be inhaling any strange fumes from my DVD drive.
Then again, maybe someone was inhaling some fumes from their DVD drive and thought it was a good idea.
It looks like inverted programming to me :)
You finally get technology that you can save data to for 5 years at least (CD media) without having to worry about data loss, and they decide you should be able to render the data useless on that tecnology.
Instead of getting something that works out the door and then improving it, like us programmers, they cripple what's already out and expect to make money off it. I hope this technology won't get off the ground. At least the average consumer is getting smarter every year.
"Wireless : LAN
The United States, a disposable nation. We build our lives around the convenience of Dixie cups, Saran Wrap, dime store paper plates, a Ziploc bags.
Now, disposable movies. Like we needed one more thing for the landfill?
CSS encryption + these two companies = more AOL cds
Waste products.
As Nancy Reagan was once said, "Just Say No!" :)
Exactly. For those of us with the kit to copy this is great, but we are not the target.
;-)
Blockbuster want these more than life itself. They can finally forget about dealing with returns - and always have inventory as they don't have to play the averages game. Just order a stack of disks and send them out.
It IS wasteful, not only do we have 20 CDs falling out of every computer mag we buy - we'll have a DVD to bin every time we 'hire' a movie.
This has to be weighed against the real waste of returning to the shop with the watched tape, all the time and effort involved in dealing with the returns process etc... Its still a bigger waste, but probably not by much.
The masses (and I dont mean that in a condescending manner) will love this.
"you mean I don't have to go back to the shop with the disk!! bingo!"
This technology is actually coming on line slower than I expected. Give the consumer what he wants. He wants movies to watch once, cheaply, when he wants it, with minimal hassle. This is a better option currently than movie on demand over a bit of wire.
Another benefit is that Blockbuser after Blockbuser will close as people get used to ordering films like pizzas. I can run to three video shops while holding my breath from my front door - bet thats down to 1 within a year of this hitting the street.
Maybe they'll fill those empty shops with coffee shops!
"Flexplay is also studying the development of a biodegradable DVD."
My dvd is over-heating....NOOOOO!!!!
Flames!!!! ack!!!
The best comparison to this technology is renting a DVD from your local Blockbuster. While I am not a big fan of Blockbuster, per se, I see absolutely *NO* advantages of this technology over renting at Blockbuster.
At Blockbuster, I walk in, give my $4, and walk home with any movie on DVD. I can watch this movie any number of times in a certain time period. With these discs, I walk into Blockbuster, put down my $4, and walk out with a movie on DVD that I can watch any number of times in a certain amount of time.
Why, then, would anyone get one of these?
Well, I suppose you do not have to return these new movies, but is that a big enough incentive?
If you charge $3.99 for one of these movies, I assume that Blockbuster is going to walk away with $2 per disk. That is a 100% return. On the other hand, if Blockbuster buys a new DVD for $20 and rents it 15 times at $4/rent, that is Blockbuster walking away with a 300% return on the investment.
On top of that, Blockbuster still has the movie! They can continue to rent it out, or sell it as a previewed move for $10, making even more.
No, this makes no sense for consumers or for the rental people.
- (c) 2018 Hank Zimmerman
Furthermore, with Flexplay, there is no need to hook up a telephone line to your player, no need to provide credit card information to anyone and selection is not limited to a small set of stores and titles.
That's cause... there aren't any stores or titles, as of yet.
ok, my choices are:
and how much garbage does this generate?? if a disc can be used once, i assume it is then garbage? AOL discs would have nothing on the pile of coasters this dungheaded idea would generate!!
This disc is a great idea pity they are selling it to consumers. I belive that the buyer for this technology would be the ARMY. Imagine them being able to communicate with something and than having the data destroyed AUTOMATICALLY.
;)
they can put this in AWACS or P10 planes (remeber the incident with CHINA?) and if they get into a nasty situation just pop out the disc and watch all the programs they spy with disappear (yeah I know you would not be able to use this to record data)
Unless they extend this coating onto CDR for military to use and if they get into trouble they just expose the data to sunlight
Gives a new meaning to "this message will self distruct in 5 seconds"
that she has limited use in an aerobic package...
;-)
What I think'd be cool is a DVD you can buy and play in any DVD player, as many times as you like. And it's pricing would be similar to the same movie on VHS except with more goodies included on the disc.
Oh, wait...
--
Linux: Because rebooting is for adding new hardware.
Evening news:
:)
Today an undeground nail polish producer was arrested for making illegal substance to protect limited-play discs from limiting the play. Ever since limited play discs were adopted by movie studios all legal make-up companies stopped manufacturing of clear nail polish, as a thin layer of it, applied to the surface of the disc, prevents it from expiring. Last week authorities confiscated 20 gallon clean nail polish liquid from illegal alien, trying to smuggle it in through Mexican border, and today an undeground lab got busted.
In Entertainment news: Britney Spears new video release "My Smashing Songs" on limited play dvds have to be unlocked first by bathing th disc in diet pepsi. Dr. Pepper claims it can also be washed in diet Dr. Pepper, though quality of playback is not guaranteed...
p.s. as usual -- everything above is made up
Hyperom.com
what if this single use technology gets implemented fFor software and games?
.. (although if pirating is lessened, the software theoretically becomes cheaper, and thus it becomes easier to track who gets multiple backup copies)
this makes it extremely difficult to pirate a piece of software, because you can only read it once. meaning you can only install on one system. so unless you buy a disc just exactly with the intent of burning/ripping a copy, you effectively become unable to pirate.
it's not infallible, and in fFact might have major conceptual holes with how the CD-ROM drive actually reads the data. and heaven help you if you actually need a backup copy
Yeah, yeah, that $7 is for the Cindy Crawford vehicle Fair Game, but maybe good DVD's will drop in price like that, and at least you didn't pay to see it in the theatre.
-sk
Seems every time I rent a DVD from Blockbuster, it's scratched into uselessness because farking morons have abused it previously. If they just *sold* you these self-degrading discs in sealed packages, you wouldn't have the scratch problems, AND you wouldn't have to return it.
The only certainty is entropy.
According to their website, these DVDs are just coated a strange way and become unreadable after 24-48 hours. ;-)-ing it ?
So, how will it differ from the typical VHS rental situation (besides the fact one can bin the DVD instead of returning it after) ?
How will it prevent me from DivX
Trolling using another account since 2005.
this might be an interesting model fFor new music to be mass distributed fFreely to potential listeners.
.. why would you buy it after that?)
like this: a new band starts, plays some show, and throws a hundred fFree CDs into the audience, distributed them on the street before and after the show, maybe get local music-stores to put up a small giveaway-display. consumers pick them up, and listen 2 or 3 times. just long enough fFor the music to get catchy in the consumer's head. then they march out and buy the whole CD fFor 15 bucks.
the trick would just be fFor the band to get the message out: "These will work a couple times. hope you like it. if you do, maybe you'll want to buy a fFull CD" a bit verbose and complicated to be spewing out to a drunken mob at a concert. but if the idea sticks, it could be worth it.
personally, i could dig this idea. i never buy a CD fFrom a band i've never heard. but once i've heard them i tend to like them. so this would be a terrific way to hear new music and get fFreely exposed to a band, then decide whether i like em or not.
(of course, the give-away model is entirely impractical fFor DVDs. usually one viewing of a movie is enough
I don't know about anybody else, but when I signed up for the "Future" and this digital revolution, it was partly so that all non-physical art; literature, music and film, would be publicly accessible, for free, from a discreet and tastefully designed computer consul. --Preferably on a spacious and graceful starship.
The entire Star Trek universe was/is a weird Freudian hallucination wherein all the races are rarified aspects of our current selves.
This idea of taking something purely digital, something which is reproducible with no threat of waste or effort, and tying it to a wasteful, laborious and greedy method of storage and distribution is so bloody Ferengi, it makes me retch.
The flowers of humanity are not shared openly, but dangled like carrots in an infantile effort to 'get something'. How ugly and foolish!
We're a bunch of silly hobbits, squabbling over Bilbo's estate gifts, getting the name tags lost and digging holes in his basement.
Hooray for us.
I can't wait to start ripping off the media giants and distributing their crap for free to anybody who asks. Too bad most of it is unwatchable. --Though I suppose it'll make stealing it less time consuming in that I won't actually have to view any of it. . .
-Fantastic Lad
I return approximately 25% of my video store rentals on time. Despite being exactly their target demographic, I don't want to buy more plastic crap to throw away.
Why not work towards using DVDRW in stores? I haven't heard of DVDRW existing yet (maybe it does, I don't follow the news) but bear with me.
Use Case
1. Customer steps into store, picks "The Matrix" off the shelf.
2. Customer walks to counter. Pays money. Hands over the disc they rented last time (maybe yesterday, maybe six months ago)
3. Shop gives customer another DVDRW pre-loaded with "The Matrix", which they burnt a few days before when their cache was low. If customer had picked something obscure, they might need to wait a few minutes for a copy to be made up on the spot from a store master - ordering ahead will avoid this.
4. Customer leaves, views movie, returns disc to store when they want either another rental, or the deposit they paid for the disc back.
Piracy concerns
Sure, it means potentially lots of copies of media floating about, but that's what we have now with video libraries - except the video store pays up front for it. People can still duplicate VHS tapes at home etc. so there's no new piracy introduced.
People still need to bring their "DVD Rental Barn" disc back to rent another movie - or they pay extra deposit on a new disc - ie. not economical if deposit > price of a blank.
Security
Movie distibutors issue special "one rental shop only" master copies of their DVD movies, in some encrypted format. These master copies can be decrypted and duplicated by software that uses a CD Key (Half-Life, Quake3 etc) type of system to identify the video store. The CD-Key is linked server-side with the unique "one rental shop only" algorithm/seed issued to the rental store.
If EITHER the shop's master copies get ripped off physically or duplicated electronically, or if the software/CD-Key is duplicated, then decryption/duplication won't happen because the server-side check will fail.
If the "store master copy" encryption is cracked, then the store's library becomes pirateable. See reason why this doesn't matter above.
If both the "store master copy" entire library AND the CD-Key/software are stolen, the store claims on their insurance policy, then gets a re-issue of its entire catalogue. It is in the interests of a video store not to give media away - and video store employees to keep their jobs.
Privacy concerns
Customer data is not included in the information sent to the authentication server - it sits outside the duplication box altogether, preferably - and stays in the store. Of course, places like Blockbuster might want to offer discounts (laugh!) for opt-in profile tracking, etc. Wary consumers can cash in their old disc for a refunded deposit and sign up for a new one every time, if they're that way inclined, but I don't know anyone who does this with rental libraries now... perhaps priests who rent a bit of pr0n? but I digress.
What's in it for the Movie Industry
Perfect market statistics through the server-client authentication mechanism.
Lower overheads for disc manufacture.
Mega bucks because they can indirectly charge consumers, through billing rental stores based on volume per DVD - right now, they get nothing when you rent "Life of Brian" because the copy was paid for a decade ago by the video store.
How could it happen?
Once the technology is available to make DVDRW cost-effective, it could be piloted in existing stores. If it seems to work, it could expand from there, with perhaps a gradual (five year) shift to the new model, at a pace consumers drive themselves.
It doesn't even require commitment from all the major corporations at once - only for one to trial it, then another, and another, until they all get the idea.
Remember - I'm not trying to fix piracy, only late video rental return fines. This idea is licenced under the "take it, change it, do what you want and become a billionaire" boiling_point_ public licence.
"If you create user accounts, by default, they will have an account type of Administrator with no password." KB Q293834
Yes, it's great for rental, yes, it's bad for waste. But, would it be possible to combine this with some form of read-write system?
Instead of Blockbuster charging X for these, how bout charging X+50 cents, or whatever, with the rest being a deposit akin to glass Coke bottles? When the DVD is degraded, the consumer has two choices: make a coaster, or return it for credit in the amount of the deposit. The Disc goes back then to be re-encoded. I know that kinda kills the fire-and-forget portion of this, but inventory of returns and such still isn't required here. They just need a big box and someplace to stamp a little credit sheet.
"You're never ready, just less unprepared."
So, wouldn't this be similar to a use-once laserdisc? or VHS tape? Seeing as how you can watch it once, what happens to the goodies you typicially get on a DVD? (commentaries, deleted scenes, et al) And c'mon, i just got 2 decent movies last night (spaceballs, guilty by suspicion) for $5/ea(!) at wal-mart... C'mon, they're gonna have to sell these things off at $.50/ea for people to buy them...
It sounds like the air-based system could be easily defeated w/ a can of spray-on lacquer to coat the disc. Does that voilate any laws?? I mean, give me a break if their technology is flawed and inferior, they deserve to lose.
The biggest trick the devil pulled was letting lawyers become politicians so they can write the laws.
I used to work for a Giant Eagle Video Department store. After doing a little research and having a discussion with my manager, it became evident that a large percentage of profits comes from late fees. Even more so with DVD's, because stores do not have to buy special rental edition DVDs like they do for VHS (Rental Copy VHS ~ $80 - $100, not assuming bulk discounts, the only difference between this VHS release and one you buy from BestBuy or Circuit City is that the Rental Copy's are available at least several weeks before Customer Copy's; DVD's are released to the store and consumer at the same time and cost only~$15 - $30). Thus stores, can tack on higher late fees for DVDs (despite the fact that they pay much less for them than VHS) under the guise that DVD is the better and rarer medium.
So in short, if stores eliiminate the means for receiving late fees from customers, they are effectively killing a good portion of their profits. This idea may work for Mail-Order rentals, but I have not really seen their popularity take off as much as initially expected (anyone have specific numbers to prove/disprove this?)
After you graduate you have one bad product to push before your diploma incinerates.
I can see this, I start a movie, then I get a phone call from a friend or family member so I stop the disk, maybe go out to dinner with some friends. A few hours latter when I go to restart the disk it's destroyed. If it truely is play ONCE then they can't expect it to last more then a few hours...
Oh and I won't even start on the hassle of returning a damaged DVD where the package was cracked and air snuck in.
Now if it lasted a few days, like a rental does, then it might be worth the convinence of not having to return it, and it would be great to never have to go back to blockbuster again with a disc the previous renter had managed to scratch beyond usefullness. But truthfully I will go one renting and buying standard DVDs, and if like some people have mentioned they take that option away... then I'll just start using wares copies, not because I am cheap and don't want to pay... but because they offer what I want.
iRepairIT - iPhone, Mac, & PC Repair
But, why throw discs away, when you can re-use them around your house?
Just remember: "He who furnishes his mind will live like a king. He who furnishes his house will have trouble moving."
Sad but true.
Just thinking about potential uses... if the coating can be applied in a fashion that the coating only erodes AFTER being hit by the read laser... corporations or other groups such as Amnesty Int. could issue all offices with a stack of DVD's - on each DVD put large (say 16MB) random data files (ideally generated from a true random source such as background radio noise or leaky diodes) then each time something really confidential needs sending use the correct disk and file - the act of reading the file will cause to be zapped... the only part of the disk that needs to be permanent is the directory structure.
Is it just me or is this idea of woro (write once read once) abit Mission Impossibleish -- this DVD will self destruct in 1 day...
--- Users are like bacteria -> Each one causing a thousand tiny crises until the host finally gives up and dies.
Here's an idea. How about if the government starts printing money that disintegrates in a few days, so we can use it to buy self-destructing DVDs. But no, only criminals pull crap like that.
A few more consumption-encouraging ideas for our innovative captains of industry:
- Beer that goes flat in 2 minutes.
- Cigarettes that go out after 3 drags.
- Condoms that leak on the third spurt.
And if any recording business mogul out there is looking for a car whose brakes fail the third time it's driven, I will be MORE than happy to sell you one. Please! In fact you can take it for 3 free test drives, and hey the radio works!
If this new read-once tech comes out into the mainstream, a few chemically-minded entrepreneurs will crank out read-once neutralizers to prevent decay of these discs. Looking at the basement Xtacy labs springing up everywhere (in BC, Canada at the least) assures me that if a bypass is found, it will become available en masse.
I think the assumption of the system's infallibility is inaccurate, as evidenced by the history of such schemes, ie. DivX et al. The only difference is that this is a physical copy prevention.
For every DRM there is an equal, opposite and excellent crack
No packaging is perfect so these DVDs must have a limited shelf life. Each will need a "best before" label and the stock will need rotating just like as supermarket.
When did the medja companies start to hate their customers?
I have a Friend who is collecting AOL cd's. He's going to shingle his Dog's doghouse with them (and at the rate we're giving them to him, maybe his house too).
For more ideas, I wholehartedly recommend this Google Search.
Creating a self destruct DVD? What a nice way to:
All in the name of economic development. Things like this doesn't create value, instead it subtracts value. The sole purpose of such an idiotic idea is just to move money from one place to another, i.e., to the pockets of the already wealthy.
All they need do is to push to outlaw permanent storage mediums.
Sounds ridiculous?
All they have to do is the following. . .
This whole new scheme of destructo-disks just seems like a subtle and clever way to encourage the market in the direction similar to something described above.
Sound foolish? Ask yourself this: Do you think for an instant that any major corporation wouldn't immediately implement such a scheme if they thought they could get away with it? And then ask: Are people not getting dumb and pliable enough to not only decline fighting such a system, but to actually support the oh so 'reasonable' arguments the P.R. officers would use to promote it?
Read some of the silly regurgitations you see on Slashdot if you don't believe.
Ah well. This is why we call it the 'good' fight. We may be destined to lose, but that's not what matters, is it now?
-Fantastic Lad
I want to know, in what reality, is this a good idea? I'm all for finding things that are expensive and having good ways to make them cheaper, but this isn't it. DVD's are far from outrageous. Most people are accumstomed to $20 for a movie, even from VHS, so $20 for a dvd isn't unreasonable, yet a company every year or so, comes up with a great new technology to make dvd's "better".
Personally, I'll keep renting video's from Blockbuster for a few dollars a week and if the movie is worth watching more than once, I'll go to Fry's or Best Buy and buy it for $20 or less. The only way this technology would survive, is if it was significantly less than simply renting. That would mean a "play once" dvd would be $1-2. Otherwise, theres no insentive to change from the habit of just going to rent it.
It has two sides
..anything goes.
In the States these disposable devices seem very popular. Is it that you really don't mind about transforming your country into a giant junkyard??
Assuming that it is a thin coating over a otherwise normal dvd; you can use one of those $30 DVD/CD/Game-Doctors that are used to repair scratches on discs and remove the coating.
For anyone that doesn't know what those are; a DvdDoctor sands the surface of a disc.
Wrong. Late fees, which frequently cost more than the original rental, are a major revenue stream for Blockbuster and other movie rental companies. They don't have any incentive to back this sort of technology.
There is another point about this, by having to return stuff to the shop I'll bet they get a reasonable number of additional rentals from impulse decisions while returning itemsf.. At least for those who do it during opening hours.
On the other hand, if returns stop they can reduce staff counts, this may seve them more money than they loose..
But they still have ways to get additional revenue streams to partially replace these. How about an environmental charge, similar to a deposit on glass bottles (common here in Europe). You pay extra 'up front' for the disk, but if you bring it back this gets refunded (CD's etc have a very small recyclable content/value, but since when have people in the entertainment biz. let the facts get in the way of profit?). This way they get extra money from the lazy and drag you back into the shop too..
Meybe I ought to patent this as a business model?
"Oops, I always forget the purpose of competition is to divide people into winners and losers." - Hobbes
I wonder if that film they are talking about will ruin players as it outgasses?
An engineer who ran for Congress. http://herbrobinson.us
That's it i'm sealing the windows, borrowing my 79 year old grandmothers oxygen tank, and filling the room with helium.
Would a room filled with helium improve the efficiency of my speakers? The lesser mass per volume would allow the speakers to push the air easier and quicker. I suppose this would lead to my sub being able to produce higher frequencies.
Only down-sides to this would be that helium doesn't conduct sound as well as the higher density air does, and the frequencies that my speakers can produce would change which would throw off the balance between them.
OK... I gotta know. What's with all your fs showing up as fF?
:)
So how long before we get a sealed unit DVD player. Sound viable to me. Build in a 100 disk storage carousel, a loading system which doesn't expose the disk to air - it only has to open the wrapping on the disk - and away you go. Would you use an inert gas in the carousel/player or would you evacuate it ? Sounds like the geek water conversation of the future 'I use a 100 capacity argon carousel' disdainful look 'really ? I use an evacuated player for higher laser read performance and self locking, low pressure helium storage cases'. What would be better ? Vacuum ? Or do you need gas to cool the equipment ? Does the laser oxidise the new coating on the DVD ? What happens if you want to replay the part that you just saw ? If you need gas for cooling, which would be best ? Helium ? Argon ? Neon ? Nitrogen ? Xenon ? If you used vacuum could you drop the laser power ? Would it mean better focussing ? Higher data density ?
They're essentially saying here that by eliminating return trips (which will never happen, but that's another point), they save gas.
But what they're totally ignoring is the cost to produce, and re-stock these things. Say you're Joe Videostoreowner, and you've got 1,000 DVDs in stock for rental. FlexPlay gives you a huge amount of cash to move to these things. Now you're not in the rental business, where you hold a fixed stock and the money rolls in, you're in the sales business -- which has an advantage in that if "Night Eyes 9" sits on the shelf forever, once someone rents it you don't have to re-stcok it.
You're now in the retail business-- every movie that goes out never comes back, so you have to re-order stock constantly, it has to get shipped to you, then you have to unpack it and stock it. Anyone who's seen a Hollywood when the week's new movies come in knows what a mess this is... and with FlexPlay, it'd be even worse.
From the video store's viewpoint, unless they're masochistic and want to run a traditional retail operation, there's no reason they'd even consider this.
So yay, death to FlexPlay
-- q
...and its a play forever DVD.
What would happen if you are watching your
see-once DVD and you have a powerfailiure? -
Your wife/husband/son/doughter/boss/grandparents call
and say their car broke down and need help,
etc. etc. Would you get a new watch-once movie or
is that movie void?
On the other hand, if its even cheaper. Then the
ripping ppl can buy even more movies and rip
and put on the internet for download.
Third thing, with the building of digital
broadcasting systems for TV. The PPV systems
will be supperior and with no waste of natural
resouces. Like the plastic trash etc. wich would
come out of use-once-dvd:s.
Bottomline, this is an utterly stupid idea.
L
- To understand recursion, we must first understand recursion -
I'm a little disappointed to not see more concern about the huge environmental problem this implies. I have enough guilt about all those damn AOL CDs - at least my CD writer's now burnproof.
Does anyone know if there's anything recyclable in these cheap convenient plastic discs?
This is not a sig
How 'bout a copy of Battlefield Earth that self-destructed before you watched it. I'd pay some bucks for that ...
[Insert pithy quote here]
Think about all the trash/litter this would create!
What if I make a mistake and play a chapter at the middle of the Disc. Is that chapter lost then?
Annyway, I really think this would accelerate piracy even more. Buy the "play once disc", copy it, and then throw it in the trash.
...but all kinds of other stores might think about selling see-once discs. For them it makes sense, they just have to sell the DVDs like everything else, and not worry about having to set up a return desk with someone checking IDs and making sure that the discs are returned one time, or at all.
So your local supermarket or gas station could start to make profit off video "renting" without the need to invest money in it first.
but it dosen't sound like anything a good buffing kit could't take off. sorta refreshing, get away from all those firmware hacks and region code cracks, market the machine as a cd/dvd cleaner :)
Are they or are they not concerned with piracy?
buy the dvd cheap cause it will only play for a few hours. Then proceed to watch it then rip it or rip then watch as many times as you want. If they are tying to slow the pay-per-view industry its gonna have to cost something like 4 bucks a disk. This to a pirate is most likely going to be well worth it. Once our pirate friend makes his rip he can then distrubute it via p2p and friends for free.
I'm sure people will buy these no-return-rental [tm] DVDs and make their first play a rip, then play back from DivX as often as they like. Since it will run on a normal standalone DVD player, there is nothing else the supplier can do to ensure it only gets played once. Anything that someone says can be played once, will always have people flocking to prove otherwise, just like Oracle saying that their database system was unbreakable, people tried hard to prove them wrong. The manuafacturer of these DVDs will be able to use the "surprisingly" (well, for the industry people anyway) high sales to prove that people like this way of doing things, and will eventually loose out because they're charging rental prices and putting people off buying the full versions which they actually make money off.
Follow me
If you really wanted you could have the soundtrack in ogg vorbis. All you need is a tool capable of getting the timing right when interleaving the audio and video. There was a 3 step procedure at some point that actually seperated the video output and the raw ac3 stream (which is capable of 5.1) As I recall you could then use another program to combine said ac3 track and a DivX stream. It could very well have been a bit of professional level software and the abillity to manipulate ac3 was needed for that reason.
Anyways other than synching issues there is no technical reason why a DivX can't use the same audio, the same subtitles probably even the same menus as 'real' DVD other than the cost in time and effort to obtain these features.
https://www.gnu.org/philosophy/free-sw.html
There has to be some better use for this technology. Instead of looking at the rental space, maybe they should concentrate their efforts on using them as promotional materials or something else which can be given away for free to the end user.
At least it's slightly better than DivX in that with DivX, you needed to purchase a special multihundred dollar player. DVD players are of course readily becoming a dime a dozen now.
Stupid fuckers will never learn. We need some ovens to gas these marketing execs.
you can guarentee the one use would be Smartripper->Dvd-R in most cases.Wouldnt the coating potentially damage some players though.
Man, far more than the usual number of knee-jerk reactions, this time :-)
:-) Have you ever subscribed to MSDN? You end up throwing out dozens of CD's a month (or a DVD or two a month now). And I've certainly created many times more coasters than the number of movies I've watched in my life.
:-). They spent a lot of time coming up with that policy. So I end up paying late fees on top of the not-so-cheap rental. I personally find returns horribly inconvenient. And the rental companies no doubt find them extra labour to process.
:-) There'd also be something symbolic in becoming one with a movie you really liked, and even one that sucked and deserves no better fate than being eaten :-)
First of all, didn't Divx require you to buy a special Divx player? That's a big difference, investing in a new technology that *only* supports limited use.
Second, regarding the waste factor: have you ever been to McDonald's? Or any fast food place? The amount of trash one gets is huge as compared to a single disc. (And the disc seems to start biodegrading anyway, the minute you open it
I'm not saying more waste is good, just that in perspective, this isn't a huge factor.
This needs to be compared to rentals, not purchase. I've spent more money on Blockbuster's annoying but smart (for them) return policy; midnight the next day. It lulls you into a sense that if you don't get around to it tonight, you can watch it tomorrow, and return it before midnight; tomorrow night comes, you watch the movie, and are too tired to return it (I always
The rental places could also have a better rate at movie availability. I would guess that they could predict the total number of rentals more easily than the daily rates. So they stock up, and you can be assurred the movie will be in. In fact, the day the movie is released, you stand a *greater* chance of being able to get it. That's when people most want it, too. That kind of works out well.
The main disadvantages I see are 1) storage space required in the store will be greater; 2) there will be less older run movies available, since they don't stick around. If this takes off, six months after release, it may be very hard to get a copy of a movie. And, as mentioned, there will be some waste, although that can be played off a bit against gas, pollution, and labour in handling returns.
I wonder if they could make them taste like chocoloate or nachos? $2 or $4 for a rental, that would be a nice tasty snack afterwards would be very cool, and avoid the waste problem, too (well, at least modify the waste problem to an organic one
-dale
Love many, trust a few, do harm to none.
Late fees account for a decent percentage of Blockbusters profits currently, a search at Fortune.com may turn up the exact figure, I couldn't find it although I remember the article from late last year. Numbers are in the $Billions on return fees alone
However, the Shops themselves account for a much bigger slab of the operating costs. In surveys a majority of people who DONT hire movies cited the shops as OFF PUTTING because they felt intimidated by snotty staff sneering at their 'lame' movie choices. Ordering a disc through your TV opens up this VAST market to Blockbuster.
The only alternative would be to hire decent staff - which costs even more money. Blockbuster is about PROFITS not TURNOVER and would happily reduce its overall turnover to increase the profit margin.
Back of an envelope calculations would guess at each hire being anything from 20 to 200% more profitable from a business park unit than a shop - even if your sending them out within the hour on the back of a motorbike - these things are light - one courier could deliver a serious number of discs in a day.
Forward looking Blockbuster sees this - they can cope with losing the late fees. And the other posters suggestion of a 'green returnable deposit' is highly likely aswell.
YES CANCER.
plastic softening coatings, and organic volatiles, oxidising agents, and some clown decidies mercury would be perfect play once agent, hey a bit of benzine as well. and Phillips - it would not be a cd anyway.
I'll be lining up a class action on day one, and have one in the pregnacy ward of a hospital - and if a birth defect happens - sue sue sue.
Or my dog likes the smell of the wrapper and chews them.
new product, new law suits.
Just video it while you're watching it.
The idea is to sell these 'play-once' DVD movies at a substantial discount
'Play Once'? More like 'Rip-Once'.
The next day, Joe goes to his supermarket. There's a bank of vending machines by the entrance: $1 for a can of Coke, $1 for a can of Pepsi, and $0.99 for the "Harry Potter" movie he took his kids to see a few months earlier (and spent $21 in the process). "Hmm... for less than the cost of a Coke, I could be a hero tonight and bring home Harry Potter." They watch it that night, but the kids want to see it again, and again, and ultimately he's bought the $0.99 version five times before he gets around to buying the replayable version for $20. He's paid AOL-TW $25 for a DVD that only costs $20.
Multiply that extra $5 by the 30 million AOL subscribers (a person willing to pay AOL 12 times a year will have no problem buying Harry Potter six times) alone and AOL can spend $150 million on acquisitions or campaign contributions without having to scratch (let alone dent) its budget.
If it works, next year it will cost $2.50. I remember the day the gumballs inexplicably rocketed from a penny apiece to a dime apiece; the day I showed up at the drugstore with my penny collection.
Why not just supply the DVD with some coarse sandpaper and instructions to "deface after use"?
You fool! You've given cheese to a lactose intolerant volcano god! Do you know what that means?
I guess will have to call upon the chemical engineers to reverse engineer the chemical layer.
Then we can get the formula and recipe on how to make the chemical to remove this chemical layer or at least to deactivate it from doing any harm. Another way is to get some car bodyshop fine polishing compound, and get your electric drill out with the circular sander/disk and squirt some compound on the DVD and polish the layer off. The layer should only be a few microns thick. Wala! I can read the disk now.
There is only two ways I can think of on how the chemical layer is activated: 1) by the oxygen level once the disk is exposed to the atmosphere which triggers a certain chemical decay rate, 2) by the heat of the laser reading the disk whereby the chemical layer degrades at a certain rate for a certain amount of heat per time.
In both cases, this technology depends on a certain decay rate of the chemical layer so that the optical quality becomes more opaque and hence prevents the laser from focusing on the disk. Two types of chemical properties to make the disk opaque that I can think of: 1) a chemical that has an oxidizing agent that leaves a residue on the disk (similiar to oxidizing aluminum but could be de-oxidized with current chemicals), 2) a chemical that has acidic properties which slowly etch into the plastic casing of the DVD and either reacts with the air or heat. To defeat this, probably need to remove with an acid neutralizer but as soon as the disk is opened to minimize damage.
So give it time, someone will be able to defeat it! To me this form of protection is low tech since no decryption is needed, just some chemicals or a little muscle, and a polishing sander.
Surely this is an obvious replacement for Windows product activation? Just sell XP on a CD which will survive long enough for you to install it once...
It only takes half an hour or so to transfer the data to your HD and remove the CSS protection. The actual encoding takes hours, but by then you've got the data anyway, and you can take the disc out.
I'm 100% opposed to this idea, because not only is it another useless technology invented purely for the rapage of the consumer, but it removes the idea of having an archive. You can still rent old movies. If you buy these 'several-use-only' discs, watch them and then decide a few years later that you want to wacth it again, you need to locate a new copy.
It's a fine idea for a nation which doesn't actually CARE what it's watching, and allows Hollywood to churn out mindless action films one after another, but I don't think encouraging the production of films you'll only want to watch one is a good thing.
np: Godflesh - Nail
- Chris
I accidentaly press stop?
;-)
My house eletric power goes down? (California?)
I press eject?
I roll over the remote control and press every button?
An emergency happens and I need to stop, turn off everything and get out?
Clumsy, take notes. I smell lawsuits.
Buy a Nintendo DS Lite
Hey, I thought Divix was really a good idea except it required a special machine and invasion of my privacy (via that phone line connection). A limited use dvd for rental purposes is not a bad idea, if the cost of the thing is the same as actually going into Blockbuster and renting a movie.
I just hope the shelf life of these things is good enough. If the dvd expires before I get to view it I'd be really pissed.
As for garbage, well the dump is already full of all the free AOL cd's I get in the mail every week!
(At least the floppy disks they used to send got re-used).
1) ripping and DeCSSing it
2) silvering the top if it's single layer once the coating wears off
?
I don't see how this would work
I mean, what about the menu part on the DVD? If you looked at it once, surely that would mean thatr it would now be erased, correct? Or what if the disc skips then tries to come back to its original location, but finds that its been erased?
And, if this method were possible, you could still rip the video from the disck, convert it to DivX, and then play it off your hard disk.
------------------
http://www.utgib.tk
Clearly, these people have never heard of video/dvd rental...
Here's the link:
http://www.flexplay.com/flexplayq&a.htm
Here's one Q/A:
==========
Q: How does the quality compare? Are any features missing in Flexplay discs compared to regular DVDs?
A Flexplay disc is a DVD. Video quality will be the same as from a regular DVD. Anything possible on a DVD will be possible on a Flexplay disc.
==========
Sounds like a pirate's dream. Now instead of having a record of all the DVDs he's rented that the cops can come back to later, he just forks over $5 cash a pop, takes the full DVD home to his PC, rips the 0s & 1s, and is selling untraceable bootlegs before the "consumer edition" is in Wal-Mart. Dead presidents don't talk.
Anyhow, interesting idea.
It's all 0s and 1s. Or it's not.
What is the point. Blockbuster video here I come.
Insanity is just a state of mind.
This is the _exact_ reason divx failed.
1) Movies are released on these limited use DVDs.
2) DeCSS based software shows up on international websites which copies DVDs with a single click of the mouse (patent pending).
3) Movie studios declare such sites as sponsoring "corporate terrorism" and insist that the US gov't do something.
These methods are doomed to failure because of the existence of DVD decryption technology and cheap recordable DVD media. If I can get a blank DVD for $1 and rent a movie for $4 then I can make a copy for $5, which is much less than the $15-$20 you usually get charged. Adam Smith's invisible hand deals these companies a swift slap of reality.
Remember, You are unique...just like everyone else.
How long will it be before someone produces a varnish like coating to apply to play-once DVDs so the surface does not deteriorate?
You will be wrong. How many people have broadband as opposed to 56k dialup? How many people have TiVo's? The people who have those things make up a very small slice of the population. Movie rental stores will be doing fine in 5 years time.
The only alternative would be to hire decent staff - which costs even more money. Blockbuster is about PROFITS not TURNOVER and would happily reduce its overall turnover to increase the profit margin.
:)
If they really cared about their employees, they wouldn't subject them to Nazi-eque hair follicle drug testing that will detect drugs used anywhere within the last 3 months.
(I avoid Godwin's law because this is my first post to the thread.
I read an article in the paper this week that pointed out that Warner Bros Studio is irritating many other studios with their pricing strategy. WB wants regular DVD's to become impulse items like magazines and priced accordingly. They are already pricing new titles at $15US and many at $10US. If WB keeps up this strategy, it'll be pretty hard to sell a one-view DVD for $2US when many full DVD's are only running $5-7US.
The Glass is Too Big: My Take on Things
Studios race to choke DVD copying
Several rental stores around here do this already with VHS and DVD. If you rent a 5 day title and bring it back the next day, they credit you something like $1-2.
The Glass is Too Big: My Take on Things
It IS wasteful, not only do we have 20 CDs falling out of every computer mag we buy - we'll have a DVD to bin every time we 'hire' a movie.
It would make more sense to have a reusable media with this kind of application...
First we had crackers and hackers, now here comes a new breed. Shelaqers! (Ones that coat the DVDs with a fluid to prevent destruction.)
Chika Chik-ah... do-e ow ow.
With that in mind, I'm quite amazed they just haven't totally run with this business concept of selling things that cease to work after x number of tries in the name of software and digital content copyright. Other industries should take note; let's not just stop at music and movies. We could make GIF and JPG images non-viewable after 10 views or so (the porn industry could make a killing!) We could make DVD players which stop playing and explode/disintegrate after 100 movies (I think some of those are availabe now). We could make furniture that you could only sit on a few dozen times (the "ultra-leather" could just dissolve or something). How about about cars that cease to run after 30,000 miles, probably right when you are in the middle of your road trip to Fairbanks, AK. We could make *kids* that cease to function after 12-18 months, because hey, babies are cute and no one wants to deal with your little brats anyways when they turn two years of age.
Somehow, I fear the notion of "what's good for one industry is good for everyone else" is going to get taken to extremes. The software industry applies limited use technology (i.e. software evaluations, etc.) in a reasonably responsible manner (not all applications, but most). You evaluate the software for free, and if it doesn't suck, then you actually buy or license it; it doesnt cease to install on your machine after so many tries. Software is abstract code that continually faces revision; licensing it seems like a logical idea. A copy of The Matrix is not going to change 5 years from now; why would you want to pay for a subscription or limited use fee? The business model that worked so well with software is not going to work with couches, cars, kids, or even "non-variable" digital content such as movies and music. The only way businesses will understand this is the hard way, of course; view-once DVD technology is clearly no exception. . .
supposed to dissolve/dissapate WHILE IT IS
IN YOUR DVD PLAYER.
Now, of course they've done test after test
to make sure that this has no long-term
consequences on your DVD player... right?
Of course they have. Otherwise, you'd end up
with a DVD player of shorter life-span and
then you'd... have... to... buy... a... new...
one...
Oh, wait --- that doesn't work...
but if the coating is the only thing that degrades the dvd, can't you either polish off the coating with a GameDoctor(tm) or some nice auto plastic polish, or even better just determine what environmental triger causes the coating to decay and prevent that? If they were smart it would be something destroyed/made opaque with the dvd laser, but then i'd just polish it off, and use it again.
Great, 25 bucks is way too much to pay for DVDs.
It's a good thing the NFL doesn't use these for replays, or the Patriots would never have won the Super Bowl.
The MPAA and the Writers Guild of America filed suit today against FlexPlay. They claim that FlexPlay's patent for "limited play" DVD's is invalid.
A statement from the MPAA was released: "Thanks to the heroic efforts of modern and historic screen writers there have already been a number of movies created that no person would be willing to watch more than once. Why Lorne Michaels and half the cast of SNL are single-handedly responsible for creating a wide array of 'bet you can watch it even once' films. FlexPlay's failure to site these obvious cases of 'prior art' will quite quickly and effectively render their patent unenforceable."
In other entertainment news, SNL, MTV, and Nickelodeon networks have teamed up to offer a new collection of "limited intelligence" movies to be released direct to DVD.
--- I wish I could hear the soundtrack to my life. That way I'd know when to duck.
If they are just coating normal DVDs with material, then it is actually more expensive for the manufacturers to produce these "Divx2" discs.
Even assuming that normal DVDs are extremely cheap to produce, and that a $3-$4 Divx2 disc is still profitable, what kind of volume would they need to actually turn a profit? How many times do they think someone is going to buy one of these discs? I would say on average, a person who is going to buy one would buy it at most once (maybe twice) before just buying the regular DVD (that's assuming that the regular DVD exists). Further assuming that not everyone who buys the DVD is going to buy the Divx2 disc, it seems that they are dealing with a rather small volume, which again, reduces their profit due to manufacturing costs.
Furthermore, they probably wouldn't include all the special features on a Divx2 disc that they would on a DVD disc, because most special features are designed for re-watchability (director/actor comments audio track, deleted scenes, etc).
All in all, I wonder if this makes good business sense from the manufacturers' and the studios' perspective.
"Every man is a mob, a chain gang of idiots." - Jonathan Nolan, Memento Mori
There's already too much crap in landfills, let us email greenpeace and the government to take action about this kind of stupid ideas (ideas on how to make even more one-time-use physical goods such as DVDs)
haven't these people heard of divx? and look at what a roaring success that was as a business model.
--- C00l
Yea, I know. But I like to eat with my movies. I didnt put this whole theater in my basement to miss out on the egg rolls. I want the full experience.
Damn. Gonna get modded for that i know. Im used to being able to edit my posts... Disregard the previous post. It has been recinded.
Blockbuster doesn't want to deal with returns? Not hardly. Blockbuster loves late fees. It comprises about 20 - 25% of their revenue.
If FlexPay is to have any chance at this market, they would need to start selling permanent DVD's in addition to their disposable DVD's. The reason for this is to give the consumer the option of buying first the FlexPay disc, then later if they like that movie, the option to buy the permanent disc at a slightly cheaper cost. Instead of buying a $20 DVD at BestBuy, the consumer buys a $5 FlexPay DVD. Then if they like the DVD, they can go online to FlexPays website and buy the permanent one for $15. They still end up with a permanent disc for $20. But if they movie sucks they just saved $15.
That was a big objection from retailers -- they wanted the punters to come back for returns so they'd have to come inside the store again. And also one of the reasons consumers weren't impressed -- they sure as heck WERE going back, so what was the point?
Infuriate left and right
OK, I can see that consumers don't generate enough garbage as it is. We need to break a record and everyone should be adding atleast 10 tons of waste to our landfills every year.
Oh yeah, they might say the DVD's can be recycled, but so can aluminum cans. And how many of you recycle cans? SURVEY SAYS... less than 10%.
Yeah, disposable DVD's. Great idea. We are always thinking ahead.
This leaves out the few million people who watch movies on their standalone DVD players.
I can already do that with my laptop that has S-Video out and is actually smaller than most set-top DVD players. But for the rest of consumers, why can't a set-top DVD player maker make its codec system extensible so that users can compile codecs such as xvid (which grew out of the OpenDivX code), put them on CD-ROM, and load them into the player's flash memory?
I don't think DivX supports Dolby Digital 5.1 sound yet
Most casual movie watchers have only stereo anyway.
Will I retire or break 10K?
Sure... take it home, copy it, don't have to worry about returning the media.
IF they make these "disposable" disks, it would be as bad as the millions upon millions of AOL freebies that occupy the nation's dumps. It may be convenient to not have to drive it back to the video store, but think about all that plastic.
When exactly did the world go crazy?
Russia proves to be the most capitalistic country by selling tickets to space while america destroys the idea of ownership with limited use movies?
Wouldn't a fee have to be added to each of these disks, similar to the fee we pay on any item that becomes toxic waste, batteries as an example have a fee added on tho their price to cover the disposal. If the movie industry replaces the current DVDs with this technology, I feel sure that they will see a severe drop in revenue.
They should remove the 82.000 passenger cars and light trucks. Period.
On the other hand: They are creating yet another throw-away product. Did the study also measure the pollution and waste created through the unusable DVDs? I guess not.
What does this study prove? Basically that you can justify almost everything in a *scientific* study.
lies, damn lies, statistics
I feel so sig.
Maybe when they try to patent the method this may come up as "prior art".
No, the patent will most likely be on the specific material used or the application to DVD or both.
Will I retire or break 10K?
Yippie! I'm buying a DVD writer! Now if only the writable media was as cheap as CD-R....
-ted
Not crying 'repeat story', just a mention that we first got wind of this back in 2000: Self-Destructing DVDs: Son of DIVX
It requires polycarbonate to make CDs and DVDs. Polycarbonate that's generally not recyclable or biodegradable. If the disc self-destructs, it's landfill fodder- which means they're going to be choking up the world with nigh worthless plastic discs, using precious resources (the plastic, the materials to make the disc, etc.). All of this to make that precious pay per view they've been seeking all these years realistic and to do away with rentals (Realize that the media companies view rental companies as the enemy (except Viacom- they own one of the largest rental companies out there...) because they don't control the situation themselves. Rather than fostering their own rental company as Viacom did, they'd do this instead...)
I guess they have to have that object less in, "greed destroys all..."
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the State of Texas
If they make it cheaper than Blockbuster, I'll end up paying less before converting it to DivX :)
For this to be worthwhile for them they must have good copy protection. However, copy protection is an impossibility.
The goal of copy protection is to create something that copies perfectly to a display device but fails to copy to a recording device. Simply creating a recording device that more perfectly emulates the display device and the signal is copyable.
Copy protection screws things up. That is how macrovision works. They screw up the signal coming out of the vcr so that recording devices with certain circuits will not record a good picture, then they lobby congress to make it illegal to produce a vcr without those circuits. (We pay the congress to work for Macrovision, what kind of a scam is that?)
DVDs don't have copy protection. If you copy an encrypted DVD you still have all the data that was on the original. Region codes and encryption (encryption is maybe too strong a word for what they do) do nothing except for make you life difficult when you are trying to read the DVD. Region codes mean that in order to watch movies you purchased you may have to buy up to seven DVD players (or 1 code-free DVD player) although it is likely that most of your movies will be from your home region.
Coding Blog
I almost never rent movies when I return them. Usually returning them is a job performed when I'm making a trip elsewhere. Of the two closest video stores to my house, one has a drop box in the parking lot (you don't even have to get out of the car) and one has a slot in the front of the building (you don't even have to go in).
I think this combination of errands routine is pretty common, and cuts into the claims of fewer trips. Also, both stores are within walking distance from my house, meaning even special trips to/from can be done on foot. Probably also common in many urban areas.
if Flexplay discs constituted 10% of all rentals, the technology would save 50 million gallons of gasoline, eliminate 111,000 metric tons of carbon emissions, 700 tons of hydrocarbons, and 1,000 tons of nitrogen oxides every year.
Fortunately, the manufacture of the plastic disks will only require 400 million pounds of crude oil to be manufactured into disks, releasion only 700 tons of hydrocarbons, and just under a 1000 tons of Nitrogen Oxides each year.
It would also eliminate 35% of the rental company businesses and employees, thus boosting the countries economy.
What do you want to bet they haven't addressed all the issues this coating is goign to have, like coating the inside of your player's optics?
Sounds like all the people involved with Divx are dodging the unemployment line. We didn't fall for it then, why should we now?
"Blockbuster want these more than life itself. They can finally forget about dealing with returns - and always have inventory as they don't have to play the averages game. Just order a stack of disks and send them out."
Actually, they don't want that- they have to "stock" it with the videos to begin with (Which is the same level of effort as restocking DVDs from the rental returns. Now VHS tapes on the other hand...). This would a bad PR thing for them- and they've other plans that would work out as well or better. Can't say anything more than that (covered by my NDA w/my employer)- if things pan out the way I'm hoping they will, you're about to see several changes in things as they're done.
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the State of Texas
For the most part I only buy a DVD for the extras, I can usually remember the plot of a good movie, but what I love is to be able to enjoy the film in diff. ways. Sure there are times I want to see the movie again and agian (cough Boondock Saints cough) but I mostly buy DVDs for the extras. This technology does nothing for the DVD extra enthusiast, so I say GOOD DAY to it.
Hello Kettle,
You, my friend are as black as pitch.
With love, Pot.
Yes, that is a problem. But this destructo-disc idea isn't an answer to the problem- it brings on the same issues as the problem you mention and puts a bunch of junk in a landfill. This technology is more akin to somebody saying, "what if we did this," without pondering all the consequences of the process and doing it all the same. Now, you bring up a way of dealing with things that's rather interesting... Too bad they aren't doing this and can't get there from here- or can they? :-)
I am not merely a "consumer" or a "taxpayer". I am a Citizen of the State of Texas
Luckily, google has this cache.
An interesting quote from that site:
"The environmental impact of Flexplay discs will be negligible. 100 million DVDs can fit into a cube just 10 meters (about 30 feet) on each side. Thus, the impact on local landfills will be minimal. "
lesse... 100 million discs is about one per US family. Say every family 'rents' an average of 30 of these things a year, that gives us a rectangle full of discs that's 5 stories high, 90 feet wide and 60 feet deep! What a fabulous idea! We take this medium that can last, if properly cared for, longer than the life expectency of the average person who uses it, and we build some kick-ass obsolesence into it... I hope they do this with music CDs and books, too. Maybe some kind of fading ink that gives you say, two weeks to read a book after you remove its airtight covering, then the words just dissolve away, and in the trash it goes! the_consumer loves our disposable society...
"If you're thinking what I'm thinking, you're right." -
Is it me, or is that a waste of plastic? I mean, buy something in a plastic case, made of plastic and some chemicals, watch one time and then garbage it... I think this is STUPID.
CS majors, we are the geeks that run it all. Without us things die.
As a technology inclined DVD renter, ripping everything I buy with the excellent all-in-one program package, GKnot, I have run into one big problem. Alot of the DVDs I rent from my local independant video rental store (When you rent a video from Blockbuster and it says "This film has been edited to fit your screen", it should also read "This film has been edited to fit our mormon ideologies".)are scratched beyond belief! My pathetic PC DVD-ROM and PS2 DVD player have to skip entire chapters to get past some of the bigger scratches. This plays hell with ripping DVDs, because I have yet to find an EAC for DVDs. I think this new technology will not only save me a buck or two but also allow me those pristine, skip-free rips of all of my favorite movies! ;-) codec endowed DVD players. Then I can burn all of my DivX for anyone and not have to worry about the troublesome conversion from DivX->VCD or SVCD which always seems to run into problems.
Having a video card with TV-out and a couple of cords from radio shack later, I can play any of the movies I have ripped in full screen glory! The only thing we really need to take DVD pirating to the average consumer is DivX
I will vehemently support any method of getting me pristine copies of first-run DVDs for less!
Adam
Not sure yet if this is bad or good. Right now I am leaning on the bad side, but I can see some positives.
If they make the cheap (and they better be cheap) limited use discs avaliable in a timely manner compared to the full copies, it would be a nice way to preview media intended for long term ownership. I don't mind paying $20 for a DVD containing worthy content, if I can know its worth.
Problem with this is I fear a price hike on the non limited media as an incentive to keep people buying the limited ones. Long term this is the better outcome for them.
Entertainment media is not the whole story though.
What about other media? Software and data in general worries me more. Imagine your limted use OS installation media! !?! Or your class materials distributed for one time installation with per machine node locked license key!
So in general, my concern is that people will have less ability to purchase large quantities of data for long term use. Or that some types of data are only published for short term use. Right now they have little choice. Either actually put it on long term media or don't offer it. This tech changes that.
Blogging because I can...
The Forum has been resistant to significant changes due to consumer confusion and cost issues. Until then, none of the companies can say they are developing a DVD product. They can only say they are developing additional technology that they will submit to the DVD Forum for consideration.
For example, you'll notice that blank DVD+RW cannot legally display the DVD Logo, as the DVD Forum declined to integrate it in to the DVD spec. They control this the same way Phillips controls the CD format.
* As is generally the case, my opinions do not reflect those of my employer.
I think that this isn't useful to traditional rental outlets, this is for stores who can't be bothered with ID, returns and all the other hassle that goes with video rental..
A coin operated vending machine could be very interesting..
Jason
DIVX (not DivX...) was slightly different; per another posting the danger of the DIVX format was the massive database that Digital Video eXpress could use to track your viewing habits.
Although this is a slightly better format in this regard, it has the same problems inherent in other read-once media.
For example, self-destructing floppys -- sounds like a good idea? It's been tried, in fact I remember picking up a floppy at my local Heath/Zenith dealer back in the early 80's that could only be read once.
There are plenty of times I rent movies and don't get to watch them in the first viewing. So the media certainly can't self-destruct after first playback. So what is an acceptable time before you lose the rights to watch the rest of your movie?
I don't think I want RIAA determining when I can watch a movie. I'm perfectly happy paying my late fees to have the option to watch a rental when it fits my schedule.
Consumers will be wary of this because they don't recognize that the publisher of the media still owns the movie even after they have it in their home.
Eric Sarjeant
eric[@]sarjeant.com
if all they're doing is adding a film that can change when exposed to air... there are ways to remove films. Even if it scratches the DVD, there are ways to remove scratches as well.
One time use by way of adding a film? I wonder if Tilex(tm) will be selling a special 'hack' for these disks. (:
As this disc is undoing itself, what sort of damage might it be doing to your player? How can either company protect themselves from claims that there dissolving discs permanently damaged my DVD player?
would this be cheaper than RENTING a movie and watching it as much as you want (for ~3days)? Man, the only way this could succeed is if the disks were 4.00 each (as rentals are ~4.25 for new releases)
I SURVIVED THE GREAT SLASHDOT BLACKOUT OF 2002!
--Mike--
Just look at all that wasted whitespace in your post.
--
E_NOSIG
I like to preview a DVD before shelling out for it too, but how is this preferable to renting a DVD and returning it? I'm no eco-nazi or anything, but don't we have enough disposable crap without this?
This seems wrong to me. Would you rather create mass amounts of waste and further destroy the environment just to avoid a trip to the local video rental store? On one hand we're trying to create cleaner fuel and protect the ozone, and on the other hand we seem to be trying as hard as we can to make bigger landfills. This "use it, throw it away, and forget about it" attitude seems quite fucked up to me.
First, every here wants to compare this to CC's lackluster Divx discs. Actually, if this was anything like Divx at all it might be a halfway decent idea. What people don't remember about Divx was the fact that you held onto the discs and if you decided you wanted to watch the movies again, all you had to do was pay another "rental" charge. So, in essence, you could start a collection of movies that you could rent on demand without having to run to the video store. In other words, people kept these discs.
This new format, on the other hand, does nothing but creates waste. Not only is it more garbage for the landfills...guess what guys? This stuff doesn't biodegrade very well. And when it does, the foil inside is a toxin. Whoever pushes this technology should really wise up to this fact and provide DVD/CD disposal facilities at stores that sell these discs. Better yet, why not come up with a method to recoat/surface these discs and give people the option to sell the discs back for a fraction of the cost so they can be recoated and repackaged? Sounds like a deal to me.
Wise men say, "Forgiveness is divine, but never pay full price for late pizza."
Would cleaning a DVD with Vodka be a violation of the DMCA? :*)
Absolutely!
Joe Torre - X - HardwareEngineer @ Amiga Inc & ZapMedia Amiga, AmigaDE, BeOS, Linuxz, QNX, Rebol, Windoze, ZME: So
simply throw away all the plastic, etc. that is required to make a DVD. Think about all the wasted material that would be caused by such a thing! Trully, I wonder how many FREE 1000000 hrs. AOL CD's are lying in my local landfill... We don't need to double that number with DVD's.
Now if someone overthrew George Dubya that actually cared about the environment then some sort of forced recycling system would fix all this... =\
The real reason the MPAA are so excited about this format is that it will give them the ability to STOP circulation of some DVDs. This kind of read-once system means that the media corps can control public appetite for a movie. Disney wised up to this marketing technique years ago by intentionally shutting down the sale of several older titles to conveniently reissue them several years later. When they do so, people go out and buy them in droves, thinking "Ahh, I liked Snow White as a kid, and my kids haven't seen it yet! I'm so lucky they re-released it so I can buy it for the cost of a new release!".
If this system takes off, you can expect to lose the ability to rent a lot of older titles... at least temporarily. Then, periodically, titles that are cheap enough and popular enough will get reissued, and others that would cost too much for the benefit (i.e. movies where the amount of the sale that goes directly to the studio is lower) will never be seen again.
Also, if a new copy protection or region coding "enhancement" scheme becomes available that would be backward compatible with the majority of the DVD players out there, the studios can start issuing _all_ read-once DVDs with the new scheme. That way they can force the new technology on consumers much more quickly. And if the new scheme is cracked, they can incorporate a fix just as fast as they are able to change the master being used by manufacturing. Of course, those few who have older players that won't work with the new scheme will need to "upgrade", resulting in a new royalty to the studios.
If this sounds too nefarious to be possible, go find out more about the copy protection that these same studios are trying to incorporate into CDs, or find out about the "region coding enhancement" that is on some newer DVDs. Now imagine a world where these read-once DVDs are firmly entrenched in the market, and try to imagine the studios NOT using their advantage in the supply chain to force a newer, better protection scheme on consumers. Yeah, I thought so.
The studios have noticed that drug dealers don't sell kits to help you make your own drugs whenever you want. They sell drugs directly, and customers keep coming back. Which way do you think the dealers would make more money?
D
something tells me that either that the free market theory is shot or that there is no free-market that actually drives costs down based on supply-demand and the cost of production. rather, the cost seems to be associated with how much the consumer can use it. shit man, i knew i shoulda charged $1000000 for the last anvil i sold. the consumer will be using it forever!!!
I think people will dislike this because they will realize that they are getting screwed, price-wise.
People don't have a problem renting something for $5. Or buying it for $25. But if they get the same product they would have rented (and returned), or purchased and kept, and then are forced to throw it away, I think they'll be dissatisfied.
They'll realize- "hey! this is the same disc i bought for $25. those things can be made cheaply enough for me to THROW IT AWAY, so why do DVDs cost $25? Especially since it probably costs MORE to make a dvd that expires than a regular one!"
And, yes, I know that the costs are not limited to the cost of the DVD pressing. But I still would feel really odd throwing away a DVD.
It seems like, if they just dropped their prices on all DVDs (and CDs for that matter) to the 9.99 range, they'd make just as much money as now, on more sales. The lower price would, I think, discourage piracy.
You could also, though this would be annoying, have the 9.99 dvds just have the movie, while the "deluxe edition" had all the extras. Some studios do this already, to an extent.
Of course, all these arguements have been made before, but the idea of a disposable media really pounds them home more, and might even strike a chord with the mainstream consumer.
The limited-play DVD format is a compelling alternative to video rental as it presents indisputable advantages to consumers, content providers, retail stores, distributors and disc manufacturers. For the consumer, a limited-play disc at the same price as a rental offers a quantum leap in convenience and flexibility of use.
In reading through this press release there is no actual mention of what these consumer benefits are. We have a patent on something new and we can make a lot of money doing it, therefore it must be good for consumers!
This is just freaking crazy!
Pooty tweet
Would it be a copyright violation to collect all the dead disks, Polish them (like a semiconductor plant planar tool) and re-coat them? You could sell recycled plastic.
The truth shall set you free!
troll....
Not only is is DivX 'like' it is also years too late. With the prices of DVD dropping(Ex. $15.99 - $19.99 at Best Buy) this technology would have to be less than $3.00 per movie. The chain rental places(Hollywood Video, Blockbuster) already have that price range sown up. Lets hope commonsense prevails here and consumers have gotten wiser since DivX.
I was going to post this comment about 8 hours ago, but I couldn't log on to /. for some reason. Anywho, I don't think that anyone has mentioned that besides alll the consumer rejection, and comparisons to DIVX, that the amount of garbage this would produce is enormous. Personally, I hope environmental groups loby hard against this kind of thing.
Perhaps you could keep the disc from becoming useless by coating it again with something that would keep the disc from oxidizing. Of course you'd have to make it very thin and make sure it didn't affect the optics... dunno if it would be possible.
:) I can see cans of spray lacquer being pulled from store shelves because they're "circumvention devices!"
But would it violate the DMCA?
-- "Those who cast the votes decide nothing. Those who count the votes decide everything." -Joseph Stalin
Something feels wrong about taking a perfectly new, unscratched CD that could last for decades if looked after and binning it because of course its contents (AOL) are useless.
I don't know...it makes a pretty good support for a coffee cup, and in a pinch they can shim table or desk legs when the floor is uneven. Gee, maybe I should write a book...1001 uses for an AOL CD...I can just see the indignant "cease and desist" letters now...
You're using her as bait, Master!
these 'play-once' DVD movies
Yup, "play once" right to my DVD burner!
Isn't anyone worried about all the waste that this kind of technology will produce? I don't know about you but this really bothers me. Not only are they subverting our rights to purchase a product and expect it to work for a long period of time, but they are creating waste that doesn't need to be. America is already the biggest producer of garbage, and this will only make matters worse. I love computers and technology but I know that they aresome of the most toxic things that are produced out there and thowing them away is a bad idea for the environment. Plese stop this madness
If I bought a Divx disc at the store, at least there was some opportunity to permanently purchase the disc. In this situation, I buy a disc, and it becomes useless. If I happen to really like the movie, then I have to go and buy it again.
With the advent of Ebay I can't fathom why any of these companies are even bothering. I can go to Amazon and order a brand new DVD, or perhaps even pick up an early used edition at Ebay. If I don't like it, then I just put it out on ebay and offload it to somebody else.
This sig has been temporarily disconnected or is no longer in service
Since these DVDs are read-once. What if, instead of watching it, you ripped it to hard drive? Then play the movie thru a software player that supports file playing. Hmmmmmmmm.
Oh no, what a mother f*cking stupid idea. No i'm taking no prisoners on this one. The people who came up with this have too much time and no brian. They are stupid gimps. Probably footballer/jocks. Why? ok WHY!?? in the fu*king name of all that is HOLY? would these stupid gimps want to do this?!? I mean, for crist sake, the CSS HAS BEEN CRACKED YOU IDIOTS. No amount of painting with stupid paint will stop people copying your stupid bits of rip-off plastic onto their computers. DO YOU UNDERSTAND? This is going right to the top of the dumb ideas hall of fame, because i have no time for time wasters who manage to get millions in funding from stupid managers who have no _clue_ how stupid the product is.
This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.
So, when you rip these DVDs to convert them to AVIs or DivX files... you have to get it right on the first try! You open the package, pop in the DVD, fire up DeCSS and make a copy of the DVD on the first play. Toss the DVD in the trash and continue to watch the movie again and again after you convert it to a viewable format.
...until some company develops some kind of spray that will stabilize these cheesy DVD's.
I wonder if an aerosol based product could be in violation of the DMCA?
According to my memory and this BBC article I just found...
The 1997 agreement was signed by the Clinton administration, European Union member states and Japan, but the White House says Mr Bush does not support it and is calling for a cabinet review of climate change policy.
I read somewhere that calling for a policy review right now is like calling for a review of fire-safety while your house is burning down.
...this ought to go over like a lead zeppelin.
If this is not how they do it, then I would be completely and utterly wrong. If anyone has more details, kindly post them.
Geek used to be a four letter word. Now it's a six-figure one.
...is because I want to watch them again -- maybe 10 or 20 years from now. Obviously impossible with a time-bombed disk that by design degrades with age. No way in hell will I ever buy such DVDs.
If I want to watch a movie only during the next few weeks or months (before it self-destructs), I might as well go back to the bloody theatre, spend the same money, and have a better viewing experience.
~REZ~ #43301. Who'd fake being me anyway?
$3 to rent a one use DVD, a couple bucks to buy a blank DVD-R, under $400 for my DVD burner... My movie collection is about to get much larger...
[Replying to my own comment so as to not have to reply to people individually]
While kiosks and everything sound nice, remember that we almost already have those. I can buy DVDs right now and a ton of places, at least in the U.S, and I am willing to guess most industrialized nations.
So your local kiosk, currently selling DVDs for anywhere from $10-$30 (at a 100% mark-up) is going to use *the exact same business plan*, but instead sell the same product for $4?
To use the example of a typical movie ($25 on DVD), that means that the kiosk is going to have to sell six times as many movies on the new format ($12 profit on the original vs. $2 profit on the new discs) to make the same amount of money.
I just do not see that happening.
One of the problems of releasing this new format is that DVDs were intorduced and priced with "home movie libraries" in mind. Studios realized they could make a lot more money on these movies pricing them were they are affordable ($10-$25) and getting people to buy them (instead of selling one copy to a rental place, even at high prices).
Economically, this will be a failure.
- (c) 2018 Hank Zimmerman
How, exactly, does it degrade? Does it release a "harmless" gas? Does it flake off? Become discolored? What exactly happens inside the player when you try to play an expired disk?
Such a protected disk does not comply with the DVD specification, therefore there's no way to know whether it's compatible with every DVD player.
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
i still can not figure out why these people would waste their time on this technology, when you could just rent the movie, go out and by the blank DVD-R, and burn a copy, for a cost that is greatly cheaper then buying the real DVD in the store.
Lemme just rewind and watch that aga...ACK! Eject button by mistake! No!
::sob::
-Barkeep, a draft of your most hazardous brew, for the world is slowly stepping into focus, and I don't like what I see.
If its got an anerobic layer that evaportes after playing then play it underwater or in an oxygen starved enviroment...my toilet should suffice for this
PPV on digital cable is 3.95.. Which I think is cheaper than Blockbuster.
Set the Tivo to record it, and TVO automaticall knows its PPV, marks it as Don't delete till I tell it to..
Then I can watch the PPV movie any time I want to.. (never real time, they only start every 30 minutes).
If I like the movie? Then I archive it to tape in the middle of the night..
-Jason R
Why is it that so many people are suckers for things like planned obsolescence and other methods of turning durrable goods into perrishable ones? When will there be enough examples to disuade the greedy. Reference DIVX and the US automobile industry vrs Honda, proffits up by 60% in this reccsion year over last year.
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
Maybe I'm the only one actually thinking about consumption here, but this is a wasteful set of products. Lets make a nasty disc that doesn't decompose, but instead just becomes useless and it MEANT to be thrown away. ;)
This is just silly! And why is it so hard to rent DVDs? I never have trouble with the concept myself...it seems pretty easy to me
The thing is that these things - however limited in their use - will cause two things:
people buying more Pr0n online etc.. cuz they can just watch it and throw it away before they get caught with it by their friends, wives, whatever...
also pr0n discs will be the most overused ones... watched and watched until not a single frame can be seen on it any longer.
.
I know you can find them cheaper if you don't go to Blockbuster. A local rental place here has a 5 DVDs for 5 days at $10. That's $2 per disc and 5 days of copying time. Plus, their selection is 3 times as big as Blockbuster. Look around, and I'm sure you'll find a better deal. Along with the $2.95 DVD-R singles over at meritline.com, and you have a total cost of DVD of $5, very reasonable.
Every codec has a rate control which adjusts the quantization step size to control the bitrate at the cost of quality.
Yes, an early copy control scheme would rate control movies to exactly the size of a read only disk making them difficult to copy to a RW one which is smaller.
In reality the computationally expensive part of encoding is motion vector determination (10-100x of decode). Requantitizing is simple (2x decode).
The quality before requantitizing may be better but the after quality is still so good most non-professionals will have trouble telling the difference. Even in extreme cases it will probably only be noticeable on a few rapidly changing scenes. Assuming of course one has a non-broken non-brain-dead encoder.
-- Rick
(AP) - Microsoft Exec's have filed a lawsuit against... All of Mankind.
... and also that we were brought to court by the Federal government for employing monopolistic practices against everyone .."
For remembering all of the failure of Microsoft. BIll Gates saw quoted saying "
Oh wait... it already happened.
make Linux, not Microsoft. sin(beast) = -0.809016994374947424102293417182819
.....for this.
If all you can get is temporary DVD's - e-bay is forced out of the DVD business
Another Wild-Eyed CANADIAN.
IMHO is what really killed DivX. Considering how many buisneses crash within the first year. The buisness dies and what does the consumer have? A very expensive paperweight. J. Q. Public was at least smart enought to realize this.
make Linux, not Microsoft. sin(beast) = -0.809016994374947424102293417182819
as if we didn't have enough problems with these thieves and intellectual property cry-babies, now we have to contend with massive amounts of material waste? Three cheers for capitalism (hip hip... uuugh).
AntiChristX
Daring to remain below 5 karma indefinitely
"Will this technology fade..."
;)
I think that's kind of the idea
This from the people that named copy-prevention "copy-protection," and who declared those who copy to be pirates? A fool move not already having a name such as one-way rentals, or something similar that would accentuate the positive features.
The act of throwing these discs after they have become useless is like dumping a soda can in the lake. Personaly, I won't even think contributing to this act of destruction.
Receiving unsolicited AOL cds and now dvds in "tin cans" at my home makes me feel so bad already for our environment. What are these idiots thinking really? Is there any limit to human stupidity acting in the reason of benefits and ROI? Are these people who designed this stuff conscious that there children won't be able to walk in a land without garbage?
Are we going to get a new color of recycling bin specifically designed to recycle these dvds and aol's ones? Companies like AOL MacDonald's and maybe now Blockbuster should be all liable and fined for the pile of garbage their customers are dropping all over.
I'll go back and read Zodiac from Neil Stephenson...
PPA, the (eco) girl next door.
-- I feel better now. Thanks for asking.
You should read:
1/25/2000 - SpectraDisc Corporation, a Spectra Science subsidiary, develops a prototype limited play CD/DVD technology
It says the following:
"Once the disc is removed from its packaging, the disc can be played in any conventional player
for the prescribed amount of time."
In another press release, it talks about how the coating is tamper proof. Eitherway, it is difficult to remove a micro-meter scale layer from a delicate surface... Honestly, just buy the "full version" of the movie if you don't like this idea... Make it flop like DivX by boycotting... Either that or just rip it! : )
This gives me all the more reason to want to break their copy protection and rip my own permanent copy.
You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
excited about this? ... Wait, no I'm not.
The same stupid thinking that destroyed DivX could now make .DivX incredibly popular.
Albuquerque PC
If DVDs start selling for less than CDs, that says a lot about the recording industry, doesn't it?
Considering that most of the crap, err, movies suck anyway, maybe the movie companies should just save their money and not even bother. Besides, most half decent movies show up on pay-per-view for an extremely long time before they go to DVD or VHS. Hey! why not just start copying VHS tapes again! Or copy it when it gets played on your hacked cable box!
Face it guys. You are wasting money on a worthless battle.
I agree. remember that stunt they pulled by changing the time due back to noon the next day instead of midnight? sure you get 12 extra hours, but how many people can remember to take their movie back by noon, especially when they've been use to bringing it back at midnight for years and years. And how many people will really wake up at 9 or 10 in the morning to watch it one last time before it has to go back at noon? Blockbuster knew what they were doing. Not on only do people forget to bring their movies back by noon, alot of people are at work then, some are just waking up or still asleep. Now they have all these people for some reason or another who couldn't get their movies back by noon, and now have late fees where they normally would not.
---- "Excuse me. Where's the children's gun section?"
but I am probably more of a waste of space in person, too.
--
E_NOSIG
We are already paying for plastic bottles as an incentive to recycle. IMHO, view-once DVDs are not even a bit different. We'll just have to add those 10c per disk, and your xMart will add one more recycling machine: "glass", "plastic", "cans", "DVD" :-)
Ok, this will probably be ignored by EVERYONE. But has anyone thought about what this will do to the enviroment? Toss away media that will get tossed away a lot if it becomes popular. Am I the only one who thinks this is a bad idea enviromentaly?
[Just Shut Up and Do What I say]
does this remind anyone of Divx (the original one)?
From reading the link in the article, the protection seems to be just under the reflective layer. The redox reaction would occure between the reflective layer and the coating which is between the reflective layer and the polycarbonate plastic. (right where the phthalocyanine layer is in a cd-r)
The coating seems to oxidized from the laser shining on it. It may be pulling oxygen from air or it may be in the coating it self. In a normal dvd, the lacquer coating and the label would slow or stop the flow of oxygen to the coating. The double polycarbonate sides of a double sided disc would not allow any oxygen to get into the middle.
So if the oxygen was not provided from the coating it self, I would have to conclude that they can only make single sided discs and would not use a lacquer coating to protect the disc. Why protect a short life disc anyhow?
Do other people who actually spent the time to read the articles agree?
Are they planning to do anything to recycle these discs? I'm not an environmental nut, but I don't like the idea of entertainment designed to become garbage after its used, especially when there are alternatives.
Looks like June 6 of last year.l
http://www.forbes.com/2001/06/06/0606topblock.htm
Late fees--or what Blockbuster calls its "extended-view policy"--have accounted for 19% of the company's revenue in the past.
DivX was seen as an "add on" to DVD, thus all exisiting DivX players play regular DVDs as well, so your uncle's player is, in fact, not useless.
Circuit City never made/sold a "DivX ONLY" player...
Be honest, we're talking about something the sizee of a CD-Rom, when we all drive SUVs and eat LeMenu dinners on full-size plate packages for one stinkin' meal. This place is absolutely craqwling with junk for merchandising purposes.
This won't help, but the packaging around food items is the real crime these days. I'm not for the little disks, but to get a snack these days you have to dig through a pound of crap.
The yogurt was tasty, but the cup is eternal.
And the reason is becase rental stores make MUCH more money on late fees than they do on the price of the rental in the first place.
This is why they never care if your late with videos, as every day is just more dollars for them.
This would remove all late fee costs.
If a DVD costs them $15 and they rent it for $10 but its $5 per day if late, that can add up quick.
With the new format its a one time $10 charge and no more.
In addition they can buy a DVD for a set price and rent it out multiple times.
If it costs $15 and you rent it for $10, after you rent the disc out 200 or so times thats quite alot of money, and Then you get to add on late fees.
With the read once discs your limited to the markup value one time.
So spending $15 on a disc and making at least $2000, if not double that due to late fees, is no longer attractive then maybe this will happen.
But wait, its not..
Does anyone see a frightening similarity between this "DEVELOPMENT" and ASP's? If you want to buy the movie for life you will need to pay your licensing fees every year at which point they send you a new DVD to replace the one that "self-destructs". Only what will they do to all of the people that already own current "lifelong" movies? What happens when you steal cable? Or what happens when the gun you own becomes illegal? Grandfather that DVD.
because you've already been modded down
T Money
World Domination with a plastic spoon since 1984
Being an ex-Divx employee, I first want to shed some TRUTH on the Divx player and company.
1) Divx players played ALL DVD-V discs.
2) Divx discs support all video and audio formats (widescreen, 5.1, DTS, etc). We even developed a player that played High-Def movies. We did a 20 minute proto-type with the movie Ants.
3) The concept was ahead of it's time. Ask any studio exec. with they would like to have something better than CSS to protect their assets.
If the disposable disc was priced and marketed right, then this would be a cool useful idea. However, like Divx, I am sure that neither will happen. Also, the tech community which tends to be early adopters, also tend to throw the baby out with the bath water when evaluating new twist on current technology. If there are any potential downfalls, that is enough to damn the entire concept.
I've got movies on demand. 24 hours a day.
Cost a few bucks, can rewind with my cable remote and don't even have to get up.
HBO has shows and movies [Sopranos, Band of Brothers etc] for a flat monthly rate, and there is a channel [#1] that I can 'play' and rewind movies just like HBO OnDemand.
Pretty cool huh? Digital Audio out [Fiber] on the cable box lets me enjoys DTS [when available] and the picture is pretty awsome.
The only thing: Can't zoom. Doesn't play MP3's like my DVD player... but it has USB and FireWire ports.
What will those be used for? Videoconference anyone?
Get your Unix fortune now!