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Law of Unintended Consequences Strikes Grocers
netbuzz writes "The law of unintended consequences is taking a chomp out of grocery chain profits as more stores transition from human clerks to self-service checkout technology, thus reducing the time shoppers spend in line and under the temptation of impulse items. That's the upshot of research being released tomorrow by IHL Consulting Group in Franklin, Tenn., which provides market analysis to the retail industry and its IT vendors."
However, I refuse to use self-checkout if I have to wait behind any customers. The cashier lanes are always faster, even when they have a line. I can't believe how stupid most people become once they enter the self-checkout lanes. It's scan-scan-swipe, people; in-and-out in about 45 seconds or less; how frickin' hard is that to understand?!? I'm not talking about the people who get stalled because their credit card was rejected, I'm talking about the ones who have to stop and read the full screen after scanning every damn packet of washers in their cart; or who don't seem to understand that the barcodes have to be presented to the lasers, and that no matter how long you stare at a barcode, the scanner won't pick it up. Morons.
Of course, that's just my opinion. I could be wrong.
John
The law of unintended consequences is taking a chomp out of grocery chain profits as more stores transition from human clerks to self-service checkout technology
They're also taking a chomp out of grocery chain profits since I refuse to shop at a store that forces me to do their work for them. What's next, stores that make you stock their shelves?
Push Button, Receive Bacon
10 years ago a grocer's cashier had a career, now he's a 'Courtesy Clerk' earning $6 bucks/hr.
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
The self-checkout lanes at my local grocer have a sensor system that basically demands staff intervention for every customer. If you don't place the item in just the right spot after scanning, the damned thing is automatically convinced that the user is trying to pull a fast one. The self checkout lanes stand empty most of the time because of it.
Women are like electronics: you don't know how damaged they are until you try to turn them on.
self checkout doesn't work well, because the system checks to see if you honest by weighing what's in your bag.
Washers are so light, that it often doesn't recognize that they're there. So you have to see that it didn't work; read the screen to find out what happened, read the screen to see what to do...rescan, or pick the bag up and put it down on the pad again, read the screen to see if that worked,
wash rinse repeat
I don't buy washers from home depot, but I do buy a packet or two of screws, and this happens all the time.
------ Work is so much easier when you don't
Put condoms and twinkies right next to the self check counter... Sit back and reap the benefits!
You take it, I don't want it...
I have no time to look at impulse items... I'm too busy slamming my fist against the screen, trying to get the dammed thing to work.
And I'm still waiting to recieve my paycheck for my part-time job as a bag-boy and cashier...
It's not a xenophobic thing. It's a "Those fucking things never work right" thing.
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
1. Marginally increase the time between the self checkout's stages, such that customers will spend, on average, a few seconds more while checking out. This has a two-fold benefit: 1) the longer the customer takes, the more potential there is for a line to develop at the self checkout line, forcing some of them to revert to a standard issue checkout, and 2) the customer checking out will have more time to idle, look around, and potentially pick up something else, which leads me to ....
2. Near the end of the transaction (after swiping his or her credit card), ask the customer if he/she would like to add any last minute items. The customer can press 'NO' and the transaction will just complete. If they press 'YES' (after seeing that oh-so-tasty snickers bar), they'll go back to the scanning screen where they can scan their snickers bar. The checkout button will then be replaced with a 'Complete Transaction' button which will charge the card, print the receipt, and send them off. The store could even go so far as to offer a special 'last minute' discount (like a couple of cents off said snickers bar) to further entice the customer.
3. Close all self checkouts, return to 1995.
are they implying that those self-checkout lanes are faster?
it seems that every time i go through one of those things i have to get some manager over there to "ok" my purchases. whether it's a "violent adult videogame" (half-life 2) or isopropyl alcohol to keep my car's gas lines freeze free (recreational drinking?).
they've been such a hassle for me i don't even use them anymore.
Hell a few TV sets with moving content would do it for most of the ADHD cattle out there. Oh look it's my favourite show....oh now it's moved to that screen over there, I think I'll follow...oooohh look a pretty shiny thing. I want to take that home. I'll just add that to my trolley.
;-)
Perhaps I should patent this and make a bundle
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
The easy solution for this is to follow the lead of Las Vegas casinos. Basically you want to make it as hard as possible to leave the store with money. Hide the registers behind a wall of mirrors. Funnel the customer through a gauntlet of racks of impulse buy goods before the can get to the check out*. Put speed bumps on the floor. Offer free cocktails and a $5.99 prime rib buffet.
*Fry's Electronics already uses this technique.
It's not offtopic, dumbass. It's orthogonal.
The clerk in my grocery store remembered my name, twice, and flirted with me every time I went in. I took the plunge and asked her out and it turned into quite the summer romance while she was in town. Try that with some self-checkout and you'll be arrested within the minute.
I'll tolerate anything except intolerance.
If I wanted to handle my own cart/checkout, I'd have bought it online. When I go to a grocery store or retail outlet, I always use a checkout clerk because the dozen or so times I used self check out, it didn't save me any time. Also, my grocery shopping consists of about 75% fruits and vegetables, and doing those on your own (numeric touch screen that doesn't always recognize the fruit code) definitely doesn't save you time.
There was also a 6 month period where I went to Home depot about twice a week, and bought lumber every time (I was building a lot of stuff). Their self checkout system doesn't (or at least didn't) allow for construction materials purchases, so the self checkout was NEVER an option.
I encourage others not to use self check outs, and spend a few extra minutes in line. That way, the big expensive machine that they replaced two humans with doesn't provide them any utility.
This is where I get my recommended daily allowance of "Foot in Mouth."
I never really saw the attraction of the self checkout as a serious shopper. When I went out for food with college buddies we'd all hit the self checkout if there was no line as a competition, too see who could avoid having the machine flip out at you for doing something wrong. Because we went so fast, we had to have an attendant come bail us out a couple times. Without fail, someone who had gone through a normal checkout was standing at the door waiting for us. I could probably do it now with my 1337 retail skills, but really the self checkout is a joke. It's boring conversation, and you have to bag your own stuff, just so some company makes an extra dime that you'll never see.
Support college students. Go through a normal line.
SAILING MISHAP
The customer using the machine totatlly freaks!
Actually as a computer programmer I lay most of the blame on the bad design of the scanning systems. The scanner in one location the scale in another, often far flung, location, the credit card swipe in still another location, even down below eyesight. Worse yet as with many ATMs machines there are TOO MANY BUTTONS for what should be only ONE OPTION enter PIN and PAY! Not only are there too many buttons, but the onscreen instructions often are worded differently than the keys you have to press. "PRESS YES" out of the extra 10 buttons only an "OK" seems to map to "YES." It may seem obvious to you that OK is YES, but you have to read each key to eliminate the possibility that YES is an Option, this takes time, not just to read, but to double check you are doing it correctly. I don't know how many stores I have shopped at that put those kindergarten silver or gold stars by the keys, then verbally tell you to ignore the instructions and hit the "GOLD STAR". Often the screen will have option layout that would map to 4 function keys, but the keypad doesn't really have function keys in that location. Add to this that at auto-checkouts there's usually no one there to assist you, you usually have to figure this all out on your own. It is a money transaction, so if you are like me with an unfamiliar interface, you double, triple, quadruple check what you are doing.
BUT worst of all, instead of one crappy layout system used by all stores, THEY ALL SUCK, BUT DIFFERENTLY. Name me one chain that has these machines well made? In time, someone will come up with a decent layout and everyone will adopt it and it will seem silly we had these problems but we're not there yet.
HERE's an idea, put stick on scan labels by all the veggies so once bagged they can just be weighed and scanned instead of having to key in the code by HAND -- WTF???. Make the labels big with not just the code but large with print of what the veggie is so people aren't too tempted to cheat the system. A computer voice should also echo the entry (I believe most systems already do this).
Many systems I have seen seem cobbled together from unrelated discrete components -- THIS WILL NOT DO.
I WORK IN SQA AND I WOULD NEVER SIGN OFF ON THIS SHIT! Forgive my language, but its us, the IT professionals to blame here -- NOT EVERYDAY FOLK who
Letter To Iran
<rant>Hmph - at least you CAN pump gas. I'm on a business trip in Portland, OR (I'm an Australian native) and I was told today that "You can't pump your own gas in Oregon it's illegal". Say WHAT?!
So instead I have to wait for the SINGLE GUY looking after 8 pumps to get back to me, and having asked first time for a full tank and second time for "fill it up as much as you can" I get about 15 gal in the 18 gal tank. Yeah that will sure make it easier for me. NOT!</rant>
This is one case where self service is far easier and definitely preferred, (but I agree about the Marketing Dweebs).
Traditionally we think of computers as things that are meant to make our lives easier and faster, giving us more time to do the things we really want to do (which for most of us is playing with computers!) In this case it appears that computers are benefitting us as consumers to the detriment of the company that has implemented the technology. How long will it be before this new 'technology' is only employed to give the illusion of efficiency, but in reality will keep us hovering around those impulse items for far longer than we should?
Grab your tinfoil hats, people, here it comes. Shopping habits of consumers could be analysed to determine who is more likely to impulse spend, and these consumers could be held at the checkout longer while the computer 'processes' the items that they wish to purchase. However, I suppose that when that becomes feasible, RFID chips will intercept our thoughts and send them to McDonalds anyway.
"Dewey, you fool: Your decimal system has played right into my hands!"
Why not use those 5 cent RFID tags? Place your shopping cart in the scanner and hit a button. "But what about produce?" you ask? Well, how about RFID-enabled bags with specific tags for each kind of produce? Sure, it's not perfect, but it could be refined. Plus people could return the tags for store credit, and information embedded in the tags could be used to manage inventory and tell robotic machinery how to bag and/or stock the items. Also, if you steal my idea, I will hunt you down.
I make websites and stuff. Buy one.
There are a lot of comments "proving" that self-checkout is a waste of time. I have to disagree, at least for me. My method is to cruise by, see if theres a self-checkout already open and hit it. If not, I'll go stand in line (if it's reasonable). I generally fly through the self-checkout with no problems. Then again, I don't buy a ton of produce or anything that requires anything other than the old barcode. I have maybe one problem every 100 checkouts this way. What does this prove? Self-checkout is great for ME. Maybe not for everyone, but definitely for me.
Plus I prefer buying the 36 pack of condoms (cheaper per condom and avoids me having to buy them as often) at the self-checkout, especially when combined with some other random purchase like peanut butter.
Why not use those 5 cent RFID tags?
Place your shopping cart in the scanner and hit a button.
"But what about produce?" you ask? Well, how about RFID-enabled bags with specific tags for each kind of produce?
Sure, it's not perfect, but it could be refined.
Plus people could return the tags for store credit, and information embedded in the tags could be used to manage inventory and tell robotic machinery how to bag and/or stock the items.
Also, if you steal my idea, I will hunt you down.
I make websites and stuff. Buy one.
X80: "Good Day Sir, Please Scan First Item"
Consumer: (Scans taco mix)
X80: "Ah, Taco Mix, very nice, I noticed that you seem to have chosen the generic taco mix, are you sure you have thought this through?"
C: (Selects "yes")
X80: "Have you given much thought to the consequences involved in buying generic taco mix? What will your children say?"
C: (Selects "I don't have any children")
X80: "Ah, I see, single guy, living it up, not too concerned about the quality of your taco mix. Are you in a relationship?"
C: (Selects "Not really, Girls don't like me very much")
X80: "I am sorry to hear that sir, it probably makes you feel pretty bad at night, trouble sleeping?"
C: (Selects "Yeah, some times my mind wanders at night")
X80: "How about some tylenol PM? Also, I would like to recommend this issue of Maxim, it has some great advice on picking up women in the clubs, and also some great pictures to jack off to, you know, if things are a bit slow to start"
C: (Selects "OK")
X80: "Great Sir! I'd say this is probably working out to be one of the better shopping experiences you have had recently. Not going to want to make a mess out of that magazine though.... Tisues?"
C: (Selects "Absolutely! I want the ones with lotion.") (Then mumbles to himself) "This thing is great, so much less embarrasing than dealing with those pretty young checkout ladies."
X80: "Your additional Items will be here in one moment"
Beautiful Checkout Assistant: "Hi... uh... this is your girly mag, and tissues for masturbation sir... and here is the tylenol... so your depressed ass can get to sleep at night... you are a pretty sick person, you know that?"
C: "..."
X80: "Women can be pretty damn cruel, don't you think sir? How about a rope?"
C: (Selects "no thanks, get me out of here")
You take it, I don't want it...
Every time I go to do self checkout I must be behind the idiot who can't check himself/herself out! This means I actually spend my time in line making fun of the products they're trying to get me to impulse buy, especially at walmart (they shove a ton of 'as seen on tv' crap right there). When I have time to consider the pros and cons of a product and research the alternatives in all the various magazines on display there, it's no longer an impulse.
//how can an old lady lift a box of dried milk into her cart in the store and onto the conveyer, but not lift it off the cashier station when she's bought it?
Plus when there's a human at the scanner all day they know exactly when it gets dirty and clean it right then, keeps people from doing the 'I don't understand why it won't scan through this dried on milk' thing. I used to be a cashier, just taught me how stupid humanity is.
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Working in a grocery store, I thought of an idea that would possibly drive up little purchases like this: advertisements on the monitors, perhaps with arrows point to the merchandise while advertising the sale price (if any). Perhaps if you spend more than a certain amount, an ad offering a special price comes up before you pay...something like that. I know the last thing some of you want is more advertising in a grocery store, but you're already submerged and bombarded enough as-is inside of them ... a quick flick of the wrist and press of the "No Thanks" button will become automatic.
I almost forgot,
I'm the one who buys the day-old 'red-band' bananas and find that the automatic cashier hasn't been updated with today's 'red-band' price. So I insist that the cashier at the auto checkout stand leave the station, walk back a half-kilometer to the produce section, and verify that the price of the day is two pennies less than the machine says that it is.
And as soon as the auto-checkout attendent cashier begins their merry journey, your machine has locked up because it is demanding that you show your driver's license to the cashier in order to buy a beer.
Now ain't that just the worst of them all?
I absolutely detest self-checkout machines for many of the reasons already discussed here, but my biggest pet peeve happens when you run out of room in the bagging area. If you dare remove something the machine will throw a fit until it is put back. If you barely scoot your already scanned items over, the machine will think that something was pulled out and will nag you.
And how is fighting with these machines like this supposed to save time?
Self checkout lines are never any faster than regular checkout lanes.
Of the 5 times I have tried to use self checkout, I made it through without needing assistance exactly zero times. Items won't scan, the item doesn't come up in the database, the sensor won't recognize that you've put it in the bag, the touch screen is so far out of alignment that the bottom buttons won't work, the money thing won't read a nearly perfect bill. There's so much that can go wrong or not meet the system's expectations that this is possibly the worst application for self-service technology one could imagine.
Yeah it only takes one checker to manage 4 stations, but in the same time he or she has managed to get one person through each station, he or she could have checked all four through a traditional register setup.
All kings is mostly rapscallions. -Mark Twain, The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn
Am I the only one who still wonders to himself, "How the hell did this happen to us?" as I scan and bag my own groceries. I mean, I really feel like someone got the uperhand on me.
If we ever conquer Iraq, I hope someone puts self checkout lines in their supermarkets. Then they will know what slavery really is.
I scan an item and put it on the scale; PLEASE REMOVE OBJECT FROM THE COUNTER. I take it off; PLEASE RETURN ITEM TO THE COUNTER. BEEP BEEP BEEP PLEASE REMOVE ITEM FROM THE COUNTER. I then walk to the normal line and get checked out while the machine is still throwing a temper tantrum from my anomalously weighted loaf of bread.
If they'd lower the prices of my groceries I'd go through the lines but since they don't / won't - I won't.
The more efficiencies that you put in the market the less you cycle the money: IE: Spend $100 paying an individual. That person will then spend $50 of that $100 on something. The 3rd person will then spend $5 of that $50 spending something. Fourth person spending $1 - total money in circulation for spending money is $156.
In real life the multipliers for money are much higher (8x I think). The more you cut individuals at low-end jobs the more you decrease the overall US economy, or at least drive the profits into the higher income segment.
Again, lower the price to get me to go through the lines. I shouldn't have to do the grocery store's work for them.
There's a gorilla from Manilla whose a fella that stinks of vanilla and has salmonella.
All types of random currency the self-check out machines end up with. Pro-tip: 1 yen coins work as pennies in the wal-mart check out line!
Monstar L
If the grocer is losing money from impulse purchases (oh boy, $0.10 profit from that pack of gum) they're making it back in reduced labor & overhead... I don't have solid figures, but even a minimum-wager with no benefits has a higher overhead than an autonomous system with a low maintainance requirement.... certainly enough to offset that $0.10 profit per customer....
But regarding self-checkout: the systems I've used are all a major pain in the arse; the only time I'll use them is if I have very few items to purchase, the self-checkout lines are clear, and the regular checkout lines are overflowing. Why?.... self-checkout systems are uusually crap, with terrible user-interfaes, buggy scales that constantly put you into "wait for assistance" mode because they think you're trying to steal something, staffed by a single "associate" who is busy talking to a co-worker or otherwise unattentive to your self-checkout system being in locak-down mode... I could go on, but basically until they rqadivally improve the efficiency of self-checkout I generally avoid it.
(and I don't impulse-buy in the regular checkout lines... the only thing I'll grab there are batteries or phone-cards that I actually need.)
Be who you are and say what you feel, because those who mind don't matter and those who matter don't mind. - Dr. Seuss
Did this phrase originate in The Path Of Daggers, Book 8 of the Wheel of Time series by Robert Jordan? That's the only place I've seen it.
"She could still hear Siuan going on about what she called the Law of Unintended Consequences, stronger than any written law. Whether or not what you do has the effect you want, it will have three at least you never expected, and one of those usually unpleasant."
Some of the supermarkets near me have started doing something this. They added (often lcd) TVs to the checkout lanes. They play (the same) short 'ad' on each. It is usually a fake cooking show or the like, trying to inspire the shopper to buy this or that. And not only is it video, but they each have a speaker pointed at the checkout line. Talk about in your face marketing!
Mod others as you would have them mod you.
Self checkouts that basically force you to use some type of plastic and further increase the stored information on my fat tin foil covered head? NO THANKS! Cash and carry only for me please. I don't need a record of me owning a hammer or a nail gun once they confiscate everyone's firearms and I especially do not want to be barraged with advertisements for upholstered covers for the new ceramic throne I purchased for my kingdom. Now excuse me while I run off to the grocery store to buy a new roll of material for my personal haberdashery.
...food co-op. The usual arrangement is working members at x-hours per month labor (stock, sweep floors, unload trucks-whatever) get their stuff as near to wholesale as possible.
What, so they can go into college student loan debt only to find that the industry they're learning a skill for, has gone overseas?
MBA's, I'm talking to you. Come back in 5 years and see if you aren't next. 5 years. Mark this post.
--- Grow a pair, liberals... stop letting the Republicans bully you!
My local Asda just installed four self-checkouts. In the few times I've used them, I've only once gone through without needing the attending cashier to come and authorise something. Since there's only one cashier attending all four machines, if he's handling somebody else's problem you have to stand there and wait while the machine screeches "UNRECOGNISED ITEM IN BAGGING AREA! PLEASE SEEK ASSISTANCE!" over and over again. The only way it speeds things up is if there's no queue, you have at most two items, they don't require weighing, and you're not buying anything that needs an age check (ie, alcohol).
Also, because of the way they're set out, you end up with a milling clump of people blocking the main aisle, none of whom know whose turn it is next. If they'd put the machines at the *end* of the line of checkouts they would have had the space to set up a single-queueing system like at a bank, but noooo...
The really annoying thing is that the place used to have five basket-only lanes. Now it only has two. So you have to wait around for longer whichever you use. Yes, that's progress.
You must think in Russian.
Okay, the customer goes and gets a few scoops of some stuff, putting it into a baggie. He slaps a UPC code on the bag for the bin he got the product out of, and takes it to the checkout for weighing...
Except... how, in an automated checkout, does the system know that what the UPC code says is in the bag is really in the bag? What if he made a mistake a grabbed the wrong UPC code for the product, or worse... what if he was deliberately trying to swap codes with another, cheaper product?
A human teller can identify the mistake right then (and in all fairness, should give the consumer the benefit of the doubt, assuming it was a mistake), but a computer will just blindly allow it.
File under 'M' for 'Manic ranting'
Its not about saving the customers time, its about adding $0.27 cents x 10,000,000,000 customer transactions to the CEO's bonus check...
Thats what its all about.
The one that gets me is how many stores now require you basically go through the payment system twice. Someone had this nifty idea a while ago that the customer can scan their own card, while the cashier is still ringing things up. Since the cashier rarely checks the card or signiture anyways, this should speed the whole process. The problem is that checking signitures and cards is a cyclical thing. Fraud becomes high, signitures/cards start getting checked. This reduces fraud to to point that signitures/cards are no longer checked, and the cycle begins anew. Now that we are in a check the card phase, or if you do any shopping in a higher risk area, the process goes like this:
1) swipe card
2) put card back in wallet
3) wait for cashier to finish scanning
4) have cashier ask for card
5) get out wallet
6) give card to cashier
7) get card back
8) put card away
9) have cashier as for ID
10) get ID out of wallet and hand to cashier
11) get ID back from cashier
The process should be
1) give card to cashier
2) get card back
I don't include the initial getting out of the first card or putting away because these can be done while the cashier is doing something else. It makes absolutly no sense to slow down the entire process in some strange attempt to push more of the work off of the cashier and on to the customer.
PLEASE REM0VE FIST FR0M SELF CHECK0UT MACHINE BEF0RE C0NTINUING
Hear recorded Slashdot headlines on your phone! New service beta testing. Just call (248) 434-5508
I'd have to say that my experience with self-checkout at my local grocery store (Price Chopper) has been very positive overall. Sure there are idiots who can't get the thing to work, but they comprise a suprisingly low percentage (around 10%, I'd say). The only issue to ever bug me are the seemingly random "please wait for cashier assistance" messages, which the cashier usually makes go away within a few seconds from his station. In general, if there is at least 1 person waiting at a manned checkout line, it's faster to use self-checkout, unless you're buying a bunch of produce you have to enter the codes for. One bonus of the manned stations, however, is that you can scan your credit card while the clerk is scanning the items, shaving off a couple of seconds.
I also like to think that since there's only one employee watching over 4 self-checkout counters, they may end up passing the savings on to me. Given that they're saving 3*$6*24*365= $157,680 per year, part of that money might just go into 50%-off sales on HotPockets or Mountain Dew.
On a side note, the self-checkout counters finally satisfied my curiousity about what happens when you scan something that isn't sold at the store (I used a pack of gum which isn't sold in the US). The answer is: the system locks up for 1-2 minutes (I think it tries to access alternate barcode databases or something), and the cashier gets really annoyed with you.
Another observation I made is that in the first few months after they installed the machines, if you scanned two items of the same kind in a row, the system would tell you to "wait for cashier assistance", probably as a precaution against people accidentally scanning an item twice (which I would always get around by scanning another item in between the two of the same kind). Eventually, they got rid of it, I guess when they realised how often people buy more than one of the same product. However, sometimes I like to imagine that instead of having a pre-made database of the product weights, some sort of learning algorithm was implemented, where the possibility of customers cheating in the first few months was an acceptable risk, and eventually the database was filled with average weights and standard deviations for each item through regular use, though maybe I'm overestimating the competenecy of the coders who write those programs.
And concering impulse buys near the checkout, I'm proud to say I've never made one.
Has anyone picked up on the idea of how Fry's does checking out? Seriously, it's the best damn system!!! With your standard checkout lines, it runs in parallel. That is to say, each register has its own line. At Fry's Electronics however, it's done in serial. With this method, you have X number of registers in a row. Behind them you one giant line of people. This way goes much much faster because you don't have to worry about individual mini-line backing up at each register. Computer crash, failed credit card, stupid customer...it doesn't matter. You just pick the next available register when it's your turn at the front.
Oh and there are plenty of impulse buying shelves you walk by as you go through the single waiting line. Pure genius! It's win/win for everyone!
Life is not for the lazy.
I just don't like self-checkouts... 1) Take the elderly and/or handicapped shopping! Church groups and nursing homes often have vans or buses available for such adventures. Make sure to have the folks spread themselves as evenly as possible across the self-serve checkout lanes. Have a hidden video camera (or three! -- with mics!) handy to record whatever transpires. Wally-World dares not complain when geezers and gimps are clogging up the oh-so-efficient automated checkouts that they can't figure out or have difficulty dealing with for physical reasons. 2) Start a rumor among your favorite gossips and paranoid acquaintences that Wal-Mart is using all of those "spycams" (security cameras) at the self-serve checkout aisles to record people's PINs whenever they use payment cards that require PINs. Don't bother mentioning the fact that all the checkouts and the rest of the store is under Wallly-World surveillance...just focus on the annoying self-serve checkouts with your rumor. 3) Point out to other shoppers at Wally-World that a good cashier in a regular checkout lane can process more customers with purchases faster than an automated setup can, because most people don't practice using automated checkout systems 40 hours a week and don't get as good at "ringing items up" as even a slightly motivated human cashier is after a week or two on the job. Mention this in letters to the editor of your local newspaper and hosts of your favorite radio shows, griping about the awkward, slow automated checkout lanes in some of todays bigger stores.
"You're young, you're drunk, you're in bed, you have knives; shit happens." -- Angelina Jolie
You know, just for future reference.
"A great democracy must be progressive or it will soon cease to be a great democracy." --Theodore Roosevelt
i was beginning to think that i was the only person around here that
:-)
a) doesnt impulse buy, sure sometimes i come away with chocolate, but usually i've hunted it down, i'm very picky about my bar selections (i cant stand any form of dried fruit for a start...)
b) LIKES the self service checkout, when all you're doing is stopping in for a 4-pinter of milk* and said chocolate hit and there's not much of a queue you can just bip, bip, dunk in a coupld of coins and you're away. hell, even the veg selection works - though they dont seem to notice when you tell it you're weighing average tomatoes and you're actually buying the twice-as-much organic variety
do you also have 10 items or less/hand basket only lanes in the US? which is sometimes a good go-between, though often has miles longer queues than the normal ailes, my tip when you've got a trolley full: go to the end of the line of lanes furthest from the exit. they seem mostly emptier for me
* 4 pints ~= 2 litres, 1/2 gallon, 10 cups, 3 bugles, one hat, etc.
If you don't risk failure you don't risk success.
For me, standing in line at the checkout is usually anti-impulse buying. If the wait is too long, as it usually is at the Walmart, I start leaving items on the rack next to the line. The longer the wait, the more items I dump. Recently, the line was really long, and I started with about $50 in products, and wound up purchasing only about $5 worth. Still, I don't like the self checkout because they talk too much, and too loudly. I think they are designed to appeal primarily to women, since they constantly tell you how much you are saving. (Women love that!) If they want to make more money from me, just add more cashiers to keep the lines reasonably short.
By the perception of illusion, we experience reality
Sadly, for me, in corporate USA, I'd have to pay for the privledge to stock the shelves.
..... they won't believe you.
Right. In my day, I had to get up in the morning at ten o'clock at night, half an hour before I went to bed, drink a cup of sulphuric acid for breakfast, work twenty-nine hours a day down at the mill, pay the mill owner 2 quid an hour for the permission to come to work, and when we got home, our Dad and our mother would kill us and dance about on our graves singing Hallelujah.
And you try and tell the young people of today that
Push Button, Receive Bacon
Put condoms and twinkies right next to the self check counter... Sit back and reap the benefits!
You are a poor capitalist. What you do is you put a kiosk selling sledgehammers and crowbars right next to the shop with the self check counter... Sit back and reap the profits as people frustrated with the self check counters suddenly get in touch with their inner luddite!
Only to idiots, are orders laws.
-- Henning von Tresckow
My local Kroger store (King Soopers) installed self-checkout lanes about 5 years ago. The #1 problem with self-checkouts is that people don't know how to use them:
- Don't use it if you have more than 10 or so items. You won't save any time and you'll just clog up the units for the rest of us.
- The items you buy MUST be put on the "bagging area" scale. Do not lean on the scale and don't take anything off once you put it on.
The benefit of the system? 6 self-checkout units replaced 2 "express" lanes in my Kroger - there is rarely a line, even when the other lanes are busy. If you just want to get a couple of 12-packs of Diet Pepsi and a bag of chips, they can be very, very fast - particularly if you don't even have a cart.
Most of the problems I've seen boil down to the fact that people don't understand how they work.
The Fujitsu system that Kroger uses is astoundingly better than the NCR system that Wal-Mart/Home Depot uses, although it appears that the NCR system has gotten better.
45% fewer impulse purchases won't upset the apple cart? This guy is obviously an IT writer, not a retail pro; hardly surprising since this is from Network World. Though I wouldn't have ended the article by shoving my foot into my mouth... despite the fact that I am also an IT writer, I write Linux tutorials for moeny.
This guy doesn't realize how wafer-thin grocery store profits are. If the problem can't be fixed, self-service checkout will be something grocery and other retail stores *used* to do. Reconfiguring the "impulse" displays will probably work.
Personally, I'd miss it. I'm one of those people who has very little trouble using self-checkout... though I agree that the UIs usually suck.
Tech Public Policy stuff
Half our life is spent trying to find something to do with the time we have rushed through life trying to save.
-- Will Rogers
I just finished the book In Praise of Slow and while it wasn't an earth shattering read at first, it dawned on my just how much time I waste speeding through tasks and life that I never really do anything at all, or rather, never really enjoy them at all. All these frustrations in this thread about self serve checkouts, manned checkouts, beeping machines, machines that don't beep, etc. seem to highlight the need to just slow down and realize that maybe thirty seconds of your life dealing with the idiosyncracies of a self checkout machine is just not worth raising your blood pressure over. I am not trying to get all Zen on people here, but learning to savor moments of your life, even frustrating moments, will do a lot more to enrich your life than trying to find ways to add thirty seconds to the end of a day you never enjoyed and won't remember.
Standing in line at a long checkout? Read one of the magazines, get lost in thought, or, and I know this will scare many a geek, strike up a conversation with one of your linemates. You're not going anywhere for the time being, so enjoy it. Enjoy these little moments to yourself. Since few Slashdotters ever read this far into a comment, I say if it makes you feel any better plan the gangland style murder of the idiot in front of you, the cashier, store management, whomever, in intricate detail and that time will slide by with nary a worrisome thought. Then, head over to the firearms section of the store and supply yourself with a high powered rifle and plenty of ammunition. On your way out of the store, take note of the imbecile's description and make, model and license plate of their vehicle. See? That stress is melting away.
People have enough trouble using ATMs, I hate when you are in a line to get cash out when you hear the person getting their plastic card returned - beep beep, then you hear it going in again. It is for this reason I never use the self checkouts.
With the checkout chick it is the joy of interdependence of workers, she is highly skilled at using the reader, knows where the bar codes are on the products, and trains everyday. The average person would do it once a week, won't know where the bar code is and thus spends ages moving the box around till it scans....and that is before we get to the ATM bit.
-- Cheer, Cheer, The Red and the White.
Bahahaha
Damn, I just finished using all my mod points too.
Hell a few TV sets with moving content would do it for most of the ADHD cattle out there.
Here in the UK, my local Tescos have both put small LCD TVs up in some of the aisles, advertising products available in the aisle in which they're in. The Tesco Metro (small cut-down version, selling the basics) near my office has a couple of large LCD TVs suspended over the checkout lanes, generally playing a news channel, sometimes sport or music videos.
It's official. Most of you are morons.
I was in the US for the first time last summer and I war really surprised to learn that the cashiers weigh the fruit and stuff on the counter. Here is Finland we weigh them on the fruit and veggie department and get a stick on barcode label that they read on the counter.
And guess what: they trust us to not add stuff after weighing, the cashier doesn't have a scale.
OTOH, we don't have self checkout lanes and the cashiers do not pack our stuff in to bags as we leave.
The local krogers store put in 6 duplex lanes of self checkout registers in but people refused to use them. They now have a single lane and it gets very little use. I have used it a couple of times, but find the store lines with real huamns checking me out moves fast enough
I would pay a slight premium for a special checkout lane.
.45, and a pack of paper targets with his credit card ready, it is exceedingly rude and possibly unwise for you and your troupe of loud running children to cut him off. I had plans this afternoon, relaxing enjoyable plans, that are now delayed for 15 minutes while you sort out what candy your kids threw in the cart and what candy your fat ass bought.
I tend to go grocery shopping once every other day, sometimes daily. It's a habt I got into last year and living in Germany has only reinforced it. I buy a few fresh items, a drink or two, and some essentials (razors, soap, lube etc.). I very rarely have any more than a shopping basket full, I usually can carry what I bought in my hands.
When I get to the register I already have my cash or my credit card out. I've been paying for things at stores since I was 5, I don't see how people can act surprised (watch them, they do) when the cashier gets done zapping things and asks for some form of payment.
Let me through. It isn't a personal ego thing, I'm simply going to zip right through the line and be on my way. Its common courtesy.
On a related note, Wal-Mart shoppers in Northeast Ohio. If you see a man walking to the register and he is carrying a pack of razorblades, 2 boxes of roundnose
I'm sure this is probably redundant/offtopic or something, but I thought it was funny. Yay me!
(My "checkout" word was "retracts" - how appropriate!)
It's actually pretty simple. Hold two small items in your hand. Scan one item, place TWO items in bag. The machine knows the approximate weight of the items but small discrepancies don't usually trigger the alert. And those scales aren't that precise, anyway. (it helps to put your hand (and the items) ALL the way down into the bag and SET the items on the scale, don't toss 'em)
I do it all the time, at HD in particular because they don't really seem to care. The machine once puked out on me and the "cashier" came over with her key to reset it, and while she was there she copped and attitude. I said, "Hey, I don't know why I've gotta do your job, anyway, so just reset the thing so I can get out of here." Screw 'em. If they're not gonna hire real people to work as cashiers, then I'm going to trick the machine and steal small items whenever possible.
I refuse to use self-service checkout because I am not getting paid to work for the store. If the store offered 5% or more off the bill I might consider it.
There's that. The amusing thing about all these complaints is that these are techno-junkies complaining. You all love technology, but hate the consequences. Technology has made it easier to do your job from India. Technology has made it easier to eliminate cashiers (union or not, they don't get paid that much). Even the public library has self-checkout. Throw in everyone's desire for "low low prices (TM)", and you have the present situation. We all are getting exactly what we deserve.
Granted my personal experience is anecdotal, but I do not know one single person who WANTS self checkout. Stores are moving to this model to save labor costs, not because of some public outcry demanind self checkout.
Give me the mind numbing $17.50 every time.
No. You just think that is the reason why the cahsiers are there. The real reason why is those machines fail pretty often. It's a pretty common occurance where the machine thinks that I didn't place an item into the bag but I did. Usually happens where the item's weight is pretty variable from item to item(ie Baked goods, nuts,washers, etc etc). The problem is that the thing relies on weight. The machine locks up and then you need someone to over ride the machine.
Ooo man the floppy drive is broken. No wait. The computer is just upside down.
At least at my local grocer, the system displays a "Please wait for cashier" message after you scan in a bulk item (apples, candy, whatever), at which point the attendant is supposed to come and visually verify that is what is on the scale matches up with the barcode.
In actuality what happens is that the system beeps "Please wait for the cashier", and the attendant just pushes a button without verifying just to keep the line moving.
But yeah, the designers did TRY to take things like that into consideration
...and it needs to be treated as such. Everything goes through test phases and everything takes time to figure out. It's a feedback loop - we try to figure out how the machines work, while the supermarkets try to figure out how to make them work. Sure, they aren't perfect at launch, but that's because they made mistakes and also, nobody knows how to use these things at the speed a regular cashier does anymore. Five years from now, I reckon
1) There will be an extremely obvious and intuitive *standardised* interface at these devices (or maybe two or three)
2) Everybody who ever does any grocery shopping will know instinctively how to use said interfaces, the same way we can all use ATMs
3) People will have got over the novelty of self-checkouts, and gone back to using regular cashiers when they have enough items that this is faster.
Clearly the whole system has advantages and disadvantages, and at least one of those disadvantages - nobody knows how they work - will disappear with time. I, for one, have confidence.
qntm.org
Virtually every time... say, three times out of the last four... I'll get thrown into a loop in which I scan an item, it says "Please place item in bag," I place it in the bag, it says "Unexpected item in bagging area! Please remove item," I remove it, it says "Please place item in bag," lather, rinse, repeat.
I have never been able to figure out how to deal with this or what I'm supposed to do... other than call for help. If anyone knows the cause and cure, please let me know. Try not to insult me any more than absolutely necessary in the process.
(The fourth time didn't work either. I was checking out half-a-dozen nutrition bars of different flavors. One of them wouldn't scan. It didn't offer me any sensible options, like keying in the UPC by hand. Eventually... after my wife, initially convinced I was being clumsy or stupid or both, satisfied herself that it wouldn't scan for her either... we settled for purchasing the five, and dropping the unscannable bar onto a random nearby surface).
"How to Do Nothing," kids activities, back in print!
The self-checkout lanes need 'done this before' aisles and 'new to tech' aisles. Not sure how best to word it, but that's a far better indicator of how quick you're going to get through vs. how many items someone has. I almost feel cheated when I go through self-service lanes (or ATMs) because I never get to take much time. I swear people in front of me at ATMs must sometimes be trading stocks or applying for a mortgage considering how long it takes them to insert the card and get $20 out.
creation science book
I live about 3 blocks from a Kroger. I admit that I had trouble with the self checkout machines when they were first introduced. I feared the change. I was worried that I wouldn't be able to operate the machine, and that turned out to be correct, at first. There were, of course, a couple of humorous encounters which the machine definitely won. My first big realization was that the machine was weighing the food after I scanned it. That was huge, as I was being held up having to wait for the supervisor to approve the scan. Things got much better and I was able to use the self scan proficiently for small purchases, but I was still not using the self scan often as I was afraid to use it for anything without a barcode. Once I conquered that then the issue became only how much was in my cart. I use the checkout pro's for large loads, and the self checkout for medium and small loads, and I can do so with speed and accuracy. What it boils down to is practice. Most of the people reading this are younger, technical people who don't have much trouble learning something like this. My mom, who is in her 50's, has a terrible time with the self checkout. She is slow, she doesn't understand it and frankly I don't think she cares.
This does not even address the issue of SERVICE. These assholes install this lovely equipment, open 6 u-do-it lanes, and leave one human lane open, that doubles as the customer service desk. Imagine, you go to customer service to get a human, and you wait while somebody argues with the employee over a return. Good grief. Thats on top of making you sign up to belong to some club (database soon to be shared) to see the savings that stores used to be happy to offer simply to get you to come through the door. Don't get me started about walking to the far corner of the 50,000 sq ft building for a gallon of milk.
Fortunately, in my area of New Hampshire, there are Farmers' markets springing up everywhere. Fresh meats, veggies, breads- really, I eat better, and I dont feel like a number, or second class, or ostracized because I cant figure out some blooming idiot's idea of automation.
These same arguments were made when ATMs first came out.
"Am I going to get a discount for not going into the bank and using a teller?"
Now bank tellers are pretty much non-existent and to add injury to insult not only is there no discount you have to pay a surcharge to get money from the ATM. Self-checkout lanes will grow to become the norm; soon assisted checkout will no longer exist.
Car insurance companies have already implemented in some states giving discounts to customers if they install black boxes that monitor their driving. Today it's optional. Soon you won't be able to get insurance without one. After they establish that they'll move to the next logical course of action. They wont cover your accident if you were X% over the speed limit.
This is defined either as progress or that we're are Frogs in ever increasing water temperature.
Once, drug related property seizure laws affected only the drug lords. On I75 that runs from Florida up to Canada, cars are stopped and if you have what the officer thinks is too much cash he takes it. Doesn't matter if you're with your family and have tickets to Disney Land, that 3,000 in cash becomes property of the police and to get it back have to prove it's not drug money.
This is defined either as progress or that we're Sheep.
From ATMs, to self-checkout, drug related property seizure to you name it... This is the direction we're headed. A lot of you won't use self-checkout. But you will. In your lifetime it will become that there will be no other option available.
Seriously, are you telling me that they didn't know that slowing down checkout increased impulse buys? Surely the guys selecting items for the checkout aisle had that figured a long time ago.
"We reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals." --The American President (20.1.2009)
I worked in a Grocery store for 6 years(High school and half of college). I often times ended up watching the 4 self checkout machines at our store. I hated almost every minute of it.
The machines often don't work propery, no one really knows how to fix them and they crash and need a reboot at least 5 times a day. Our manager had no idea how these magical boxes worked, and often paid a technician 50-100 bucks to come reboot the thing or something like that.
You see the problem isn't just that customers can't work them it is that managers at grocery stores have no idea how they work. So instead of fixing the problem we would often work around it or ignore it.
My manager loved the fact that I could fix computers; sometimes I would fix the machines for him. The things actually are running Windows XP or 2000 most of the time. When you boot them up you can actually get to the desktop and work it like a normal computer(touch screen is like the mouse). Ours even had 3D Pinball installed on them!
The customers do suck at using them. However, when the guy in charge of the store has to look at the instructions everytime he goes to turn it on you know it's not going to work well.
The other big problem the machines caused our store was theft. I caught a lot of people trying to swindle the machine, but I'm sure lots more got away. You know something is wrong when you hear "Please move your soup to the belt" and you look over and see a steak going down the belt. The things have weight sensors, but as long as the weights are decently close it will accept it. Employees can set the tolerance, ours was pretty forgiving. Also, many people just never scan larger items. They just leav it in the cart and say they "forgot"....
Getting them to fit on the scale was a real PIA, y'know?
"My country, right or wrong; if right, to be kept right; and if wrong, to be set right." --Senator Carl Schurz (1872)
It should be obvious - the self checkout will start offering different impulse items. Things that people forget about or are a hassle to go out and buy might start coming up as offers in the form of pop-ups - and they will be conveniently located a short distance past the checkout lane. For example "would you like to add charcoal to this order?" or "did you remember to buy laundry detergent? Press 1 to add 1 gallon of Tide" - or "take advantage of our hot summer savings - enjoy a cool Diet Sprite on the way home .89 cents - click HERE!". Because of the preferred savings cards - all kinds of information is stored. They can do all kinds of marketing - and charge .75 cents per "click through" to the co-reg that benefits (like - getting a landscaping quote from a landscaper near you, or a siding quote or whatever).
It's just a matter of time for someone to figure it out.
www.wildpad.com
>I work at Home Depot, as a cashier. I can back up all of parent's statements;
>people lose about fifty IQ points when faced with the self checkout. That's
>why ours have a cashier supervising them.
I always thought the reason you have a cashier supervising them was because the FUCKING SELF CHECKOUT MACHINES DON'T FUCKING WORK.
I've all but given up on "self-check out".
Self check-out means wagging your purchase over the scanner at 15 different angles waiting for the "beep" of success, and then putting the thing in the bag only to have the computer continue to ask me to put it in the bag. Or randomly being told to "please wait for assistance" so the supervising cashier can come blindly type in some code and overwride the error. And all for the joy of then walking out the door and setting off the shoplifting alarm.
Further, if I'm going to do the job that used to get done FOR me, I should get some benefit for it, like a discount.
Steve
A work that expires before its copyright never enters the public domain and thus enjoys eternal copyright protection.
i dunno, I for one am for this tchnology. I'm a Hollister model and as it is now, i spend hours checking myself out. My time is valuable.
So, this implies that the average consumer is faster at checking himself out faster than a somewhat trained cashier. I've been through a few around here and some of the users still dont realize that you are suppose to scan the barcode and just keep sliding the package over the scanner.
I rarely use self-checkout. And then only when there's absolutely no line and I have less than 5/6 items. Otherwise, until I get a discount/noticeable savings for doing it myself, a cashier is going to ring up my stuff.
Plus, often times EVERYBODY is in the self-checkout. Making that line WAY longer than the regular lines.
But these self-checkouts are sprouting up everywhere. Even my local library has adopted this policy -- I'm definitely waiting for a few lazy a-holes to get laid off. There I admittedly prefer it since I can avoid sh!tty customer service.
I ask because as a consumer who's used them in targets, and grocery stores (some Safeway for instance) they on the surface anyway don't seem to save enough to bother since a human has to be their for any number of reasons-a machine doesn't work as expected, or it's giving misleading feadback or the machine breaks
Insightful? No. Self checkouts ACCEPT cash. Why bother posting about something you know nothing about? (Well, at least you don't know something as simple and obvious as self checkouts being able to accept bills and coins AND give out change.)
At least around here, the systems are really crappy. In order to discourage shoplifting (or soemthing... havent really figured out the real purpose yet since it is so braindead to get around if you wanted to anyway), every item you scan has to be **weighed** by the checkout before you can scan the next item. This results in a horrible sequence of scan, put item in bag on weight sensor, wait 1-2 seconds for it to register, scan next item.
If you have even just 5-10 items this makes the time going through the checkout take about twice as long as it should.
Don't even get me started on the abnormally sized items that don't fit on the sensor, where you have to wait for the cashier supervisor to come muck with the machine....
I really don't know what these systems are trying to prevent. If you wanted to steal something then why would you scan it? If you scanned it then you already paid for it, who gives a f*ck if it's in a bag on the sensor? Are they trying to keep people from sneaking stuff into the bags or some crap? What's to stop you from just grabbing a bag and shoving stuff in there?
It's really retarded and a huge waste of time IMO.
more stores transition from human clerks to self-service checkout technology, thus reducing the time shoppers spend in line and under the temptation of impulse items
Don't worry, soon you'll be waiting forever in line just to go through the self-service checkout
Opus: the Swiss army knife of audio codec
That's what bugs me the most. I have cloth shopping bags so I don't have to keep throwing out those horrible plastic sacs that always rip on the way home. Is there any reasonable way to bag while you're scanning? No. I have to stack the items on the scale, then when I've paid, pack them into my bags. Can't put the bag on the scale (Please remove unauthorized item), can't place items into bag on the floor (Please place your item in the bag). Most of my shopping is done by bicycle, so I just want to throw everything into my backpack or panniers.
This is just one of the reasons (that loud, annoying voice is another) that I won't use the self-checkout if I'm buying more than two items. In fact, I also lodge complaints about them with the cashiers and store managers while I'm at it. Not that it makes any difference, I'm sure. *sigh*
It may look like I'm doing nothing, but I'm actively waiting for my problems to go away.
--Scott Adams
Obviously there just aren't enough ads in the self-checkout screens!
Anyone rude enough to replace people that low on the pay scale deserves to have the self check out machines crammed up their ass and the hole sewn shut. Anyone using the self check out machines deserve all the hassle that comes with it, should be given 10 lashes in the parking lot, and a pay cut.
Having to work for a living is the root of all evil.
Reminds me of the colorful interactive screens at WalMart gas pumps that keep blasting me with the great deals of the day when all I want is to tank up. I have to suppress the urge to graffiti the bright LCD screens, short-circuit the happy shopper music, slam the gas nozzle through the self-help clean-engine additive dispensers, douse the credit card application signs with liquid fire, etc. Nope, I can't do that since I may want to return for the cleap gas, and thus... *sigh*
If there are lines at the cashier lines, an available self-checkout, and I have only a few simple items, I'm going with the self-checkout. I count those 5-10 minutes (and the associated aggravation) as part of the price I pay to get things from that store. Okay, so I'm impatient. I don't lash out, I mind my own business, and I make choices about where & when I shop with both my impatience and finances in mind. There have been plenty of times when I spent a little more for convience.
One thing I'm definitely not going to do is stand in a long line in order to "force" the store into giving discounts for self-checkout. My time is more valuable to me than that.
--Tony
Really, when you have to try and figure out how to operathe the freakin thing, do you really have time to scratch your ass and contemplate buying a snickers bar and the latest "Brittany Spears Screwed An Alien" tabloid?
No, you're trying to figure out how to negotiate that self serve scanner without setting off the "I'm too fucking stupid to run this thing alone" alarm.
WTF? Over?
That system works well at stores where you're buying perhaps five items at most, and those items are small, like books or video games. It just doesn't scale up to grocery stores or Wal-Marts, where people have shopping carts and larger items. They'd need far more space to queue all the shoppers, and it would be quite difficult for some shoppers waiting at the single queue near Checkout 1 to see that Checkout 24, over 150 feet away, is free.
I was once a Wal-Mart cash associate. Yeah, I hated the thing. I was responsible for making it sure it worked all the time, but Windows would constantly crash on the thing. How do you explain to customers why their self check out machine broke?
Seriously, have you ever tried to use the self checkout in a Wal-Mart? There are several problems bound to happen.
#1, some fat housewife in a housedress just brought 2 grocery carts full of stuff to each self checkout before you got there.
#2, those that actually observe the "20 items or less" that most self checkouts have, can't dial a telephone, much less figure out how to use a self checkout.
#3, the store employees that are there to assist those people using the self checkouts are as dumb if not dumber than most of the customers trying to use it.
#4, there is always some problem with "you failed to place that item in a bag" that keeps cropping up when you buy items that don't weigh very much.
#5, produce and other items that don't come with barcodes throws customers for a loop.
Wal-Marts are by and away the worst for this. And it isn't just the retards that have trouble operating it, but they do seem to come out of the woodwork to use the self checkouts. Folks that look like they actually have a few operating brain cells tend to get flumoxed by them. (Can you tell I live in an area that has a lot of folks living under the poverty level????)
Self checkouts will never replace good cashiers that know how to scan items. I worked at a grocery store for 11 years, and the company I worked for had a goal of 100 scanned items per minute. It sounds hard as hell to beat, but the good cashiers could accomplish that easily if they had someone bagging for them, and many could do it even if they were bagging for themselves. It comes from repetition and the eventual autmoatic knowledge of where the barcode is on each product, and how to move it across the scanner to pick it up. They also know all the codes for produce by memory, so they don't have to look anything up.
As a customer, I'd rather have a good cashier ring me up than spend the time fighting with those stupid self checkouts. I'm so sick of a bag of potatoe chips and other light weight objects making me press extra buttons to say "ignore bagging" and the like.
Albertsons has been playing with a "scan the item(s) as you put them in your cart" method, and has hand-held scanners at the front of the store for customers to use. Where I live, nobody ever touches them.
I don't know about you, but I power-shop when it comes to groceries, and my wife loves to follow that model. I don't want to be spending an eternity waiting to check out. And that's what I see in the self checkout lines.
Shit...that's easy.
"YOU BROKE IT!
What did you DO?"
There, problem solved. Balme the customer. 8 out of 10 people will beleive you and feel like it's thier fault. The other 2 will punch you in the mouth. The trick is to pick out the two and just shrug your shoulders and walk away from them.
Good Luck!
WTF? Over?
Here's something most never even thought of. Many of the Self-Checkout systems have no provision for accepting cash and once a store goes completely over to the self checkout setup I can then legally leave with my selected goods due to their refusal to accept Cash, which in the U.S. is legal tender to cancel all debts.
So if they only accept plastic, then I have legal grounds to walk out of the store with what ever I want as they've refused to accept the U.S. Currency that by law cancels the debt between us and as I don't believe in plastic of any kind (no store membership cards, debit/credit cards) they'll have a problem with me as I'll certainly do my best to increase their costs.
I have xenotriskadecatechnophobia. The fear of 13 foreign robots.
It is by the juice of the coffee bean that thoughts acquire speed, the teeth acquire stains. The stains become a warning
Bank owned ATMs in the UK provide free balance/withdrawal services to customers from other banks, and the banks still have human tellers in their branches. Note that no law was passed to force this - it was in response to widespread public outcry over charges. Obviously the stand-alone ATMs (the kind you get in corner shops and pubs) still charge fees to everyone - but then they are provided as a money making scheme, rather than a service to bank customers.
did you have to walk in the snow both ways?
Here is how it happens:
They cost less to install.
Management doesn't use self-checkout.
Man, you really need that seminar!
Given their are five things than have to work correctly for each self-transaction: scannable tag, correct price, correct weight, correct discount, correct clerk intervention- I had early error rates approaching about one per item. After a few years I'm happy if I can get through 10-20 itesm with one or two errors now.
a few years ago here in Southern California, all of the major grocery/supermarket chains had their unions go on strike...which resulted in MONTHS of long lines. the result of the strikes? the unions got to keep their jobs, get more benefits, not fire anyone, AND have the self-checkout counters made available. SO, less work for the union folks but with the same if not more benefits. a LOT of people became angry because of this...so many more people decided to find other non-union grocery chains, i.e., Trader Joe's. The funny thing is that it's actually CHEAPER to shop at Trader Joe's, the people who work there are nice and helpful, and the food is healthier, granted, the selection is limited. Nowadays, *IF* I ever have to step inside a union-staffed grocery store, even if I buy just a pack of gum, I'm going to make a checker scan it for me...and I'll insist that someone bag it. if you're going to strike for months and cause a big uproar, then you're going to check my single item and bag it.
semper ubi sub ubi
Perhaps you would like some cheap Walmart cheese to go with your cheap Walmart whine? If your 5 mintues of time is soooo valuable that you feel you shouldn't have to wait in line like everyone else then perhaps you should try this time saving measure... Go to the grocery store 1 time a week for 45 min instead of 7 times a week for 15 min each.
-- QED
A long time ago, in a galaxy far aw... err... a few years back, when Germany's currency was still the DM, I remember using a vending machine in a railways station. And getting a Polish 10 Zloti coin instead of a 1 DM as part of the change. The coin was remarkably similar to 1 DM in size and weight.
:P
The difference between the two was bigger than between the yen and cent, though. A DM was (later) worth half an euro, while the 10 Zloti... well, let's just say that the difference between 1 DM and 10 Zloti was 1 DM
I'm guessing whoever it was did it more than with that one coin, since pretty soon all vending machines in town had been tweaked to the point where they routinely rejected genuine 1 DM coins too. They swallowed any other coinage just fine, but 1 DM required several tries and some of the 1 DM coins just didn't work at all any more.
Now I don't know what actually happened there, but my favourite wild uninformed guess (or conspiracy theory, if you will) is that it was done so they'd reject the 10 Zloti coins. Unfortunately the difference between them was so small that it also rejected some of the real coins.
A polar bear is a cartesian bear after a coordinate transform.
* A lot of complaints about these systems, and, yeah, the one time I've used them at Wal-Mart they were kinda fucked up. But I use these regularly at Fred Meyer (a northwest chain) and the machines they have work pretty damn well, other than they need the volume turned down a bit. I'm a big fan of these because I don't often get a large amount of groceries and I'm a fidgety, impatient person that never buys more than 1 or 2 packs of gum on impulse per year anyway. * Produce. A lot of comments about problems keying in produce. I always thought the system was pretty good: there's a sticker right on the produce with a little 4-digit number. Just hit "produce", type in that number, and away you go. What's the hassle?
When did the future switch from being a promise to a threat? -C. Palahniuk
You made an 11 year career out of RETAIL?
I'm amazed at the vitriol coming out of all the geeks on this one. I guess a lot of people have had really bad experiences, but I would have expected interprising. I tell you what though, I love the self scan lanes BECAUSE of the fact that they are a little clunky and you have to learn how to use them. Why is that? Because 9 out of 10 times there is no line at all - its like having my own reserved lane and I figured out a long time ago how to work it. You just have to be smart enough to know when its the right tool for the job. You don't want to go there with your fully stuffed grocery cart (let the professionals handle that scanning) or stuff you know it has problems with (why in the hell would you try more than once to buy washers on one of these?), but if you're just buying a couple things for dinner, or just stopped by to get that box of nails you needed they make the perfect express lane.
Health Insurance is not cheap.
"There is no money flowing into oblivion as your analysis would suggest. "
No, it goes to Asia, and into the pockets of overpaid CEOs. They're making billions specifically because more and more workers are making little to nothing at all. There are more billionaires because there is a much smaller middle class and larger poor class in America now. That, and Asia, is where that money is going.
They hire more R&D people OVERSEAS to create newer technologies further increasing efficiency
Pay out more dividends to a handful of ultra rich investors and lucky employee stock plan holders
Open new stores (and thus hire more people again) - using the cheapest (read: immigrant) labor possible
Expand/Renovate existing stores (employing new labor in form of construction and additional store personnel) - again, hiring the cheapest labor possible
Bonuses to big wigs *gasp* *shock* *horror* - Okay... so then they either invest in stocks, deposit in banks, or buy something... all of which put the money back into circulation - money which is, for the most part going out of the country. Investing in stocks doesn't mean workers get paid more. Swelling bank accounts don't mean more tellers. Automation can handle all of that.
In my experience, every self-checkout setup requires one employee to watch 4 scanners. I find it difficult to beleive that an experienced cashier isn't at least 4 times faster at running a bar code scanner than a rank amatuer... so wouldn't that employee be better utilized running a register? Plus, they now have 4 times as much equipment to perform the same job! The only reason I can think of to implement this system is to start training customers now for the day when all purchases will be rung up via RFID as you attempt to exit the store.
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
I was never an impulse buyer while waiting in line so they are not losing any money on me using the self checkout. However, I do find myself going to the grocery store more often now. Usually I would just stop by some convenience store on the way home if I needed just one item like a bag of chips or a bottle of soda. Yeah it may have cost a little more but it was worth it not having to deal with the amount of time it would take to get in and out of the grocery store. The cost for convenience was justified in my mind. Now the grocery store has greatly improved the convenience factor since I can be in and out in no time now. They may be selling less impulse items but, at least from me, they are selling more regular items.
Uh, Albertson's already has an LCD monitor with video and audio at every checkout register (except for the self-checkout)... it might be a little late to patent that idea!
I've abandoned my search for truth; now I'm just looking for some useful delusions.
Why don't they make the card readers have a magnetic stripe reader in BOTH SIDES? There are so many people (including me) that get it backwards, or even just spend a few seconds looking at it trying to decipher which way the picture is showing to slide the card. Every machine has a different picture, and sometimes the pictures are so bad that it's impossible to tell anyways, or even after you study it, you get it backwards.
Of course, the other way to solve the problem is to put a magnetic strip on both sides of the debit card.. but I haven't seen that done yet either.
Speak before you think
you should see the coins, bullets (new and spent), jewlery, and all manner of things wind up in there.
my friend works at a grocery store and its always a race after someone dumps a lifetime collection of coins in there to grab the 'rejected' coins.
most people just throw out the rejected coins in the trashbasket too...
Generally, I hate the way the self-checkout systems work. I've seen them from a couple of vendors, and there seems to be one dominant player.
Anyway, it is really nice to be able to check myself out with certain varieties of items that I would prefer not to share with anyone, store clerk, or other customers.
-fb Everything not expressly forbidden is now mandatory.
....without real details about this magical $16/hour cashier job, and where it's at.
Even better. I can ask for $10 as bribe money not to tell management that they broke the expensive all mighty self checkout machine.
Too bad the mods have left. The folks above didn't mention that Home Depot has ONLY ONE HUMAN CASHIER LANE OPEN at a time - at least during the week!
These self-service lanes are just another way to reduce human contact. Since many people go online now and bank from ATMs, why bother talking to some human cashier?
In time, the tree of touch-screen menus through which one must navigate in order to reach the "Shut up, I'm ready to pay now" button will include such intermediate screens as:
"Would you like to add a 2lb bag of M&M's to your purchase? YES/NO"
*no*
"Would you like to add a tin of TrendyMints to your purchase? YES/NO"
*no*
"Special! This week only! See the explosive secret that shocked Hollywood - as celebrities' nightmares come true! Read it now in CelebMag, only [SPECIAL PRICE!]$7.83 with your existing purchase! YES/NO"
Combine the already-extant technologies of pervasive customer-preference tracking and vending-style dispensing of your impulse buys, and their revenue streams jump right back up, and the only price paid is the infuriation of the customer who just wants to buy his bloody breakfast cereal and leave.
I refuse to use self-checkout "services"
If you want me to ring up my own order, give me a damn discount for it, otherwise I'll go to a clerk and ensure that at least one American can keep a job for a day.
Now to answer your question based on my comment above:
Self-serve pumps for gasoline? Yes, I use those for my car because I don't want some slob scratching up my car but when driving the trucks I don't give a flip about the paint as long as it protects the steel from rusting, so I go full serve then. There is actually a benefit to doing the work yourself when paying someone else for the privilege.
The Christian Right is Neither (Christian nor right). See: Matthew 23, Matthew 25, Ezekiel 16:48-50
Retail markup is figured as a percentage of the price at which it is offered. So inherently there is no such thing in retail as 100% markup. If cost is 60 cents and the item sells for $1 the retail markup is 40%. This of course makes the retailer look less greedy when he sells that lighter he gave 10 cents for at $1 making it a 90% markup.
If I'm going to do the checkout clerk's job, then damn it I want his paycheck. At least with gasoline self service was cheaper! This way the clerk loses, the store wins, and you get... what, an extra fifteen seconds?
WTF are you going to do when ALL the checkouts are self service? You think the wait is bad now!
I'll tell you what I'LL do - I'll cuss you for using them in the first place.
mcgrew's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be explained by greedy self-interest
You've just touched on the second* best reason for the Iraq war. Nothing spurs an economy like wartime. FDR knew that, too - it's not a D/R thing. Sadly, it's growth based on debt, and the US is racking it up quite quickly.
*The first is, of course, to avenge the stalemate Sr played into with the senior psycopath. If you want to talk terrorism, let's dicuss Afghanistan; if you're into WMD, we should have paid just a wee but more attention to N. Korea.
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
Increasing efficiency _increases_ the output of the economy, as scarce resources (e.g. cashiers) are freed up to perform other work. And self-checkout will increase the efficiency. Assuming that this has a significant cost impact (and nobody would bother if it didn't), prices will fall as competition between retailers drives prices down due to reduced cashier costs.
The trouble is, you'll never connect the fact that your weekly grocery bill over the next year declines from 98.43 to 97.23 due to the increase effiency of the new system, because the drop will phase in (or more likely, be masked by inflation). You'll only grumble that you are swiping your own groceries instead of staring off into space while poor schlepp has to scan them for you.
On the other hand, my local ShopKo's self-checkout system is a pathetic joke. It's painfully slow. It doesn't get any of the little details right. Every single time I used it I hit some problem that requires cashier intervention. End result: they're always empty.
Good systems are possible and it appears customers have no tolerance for bad systems. Things will eventually improve all round.
Search 2010 Gen Con events
Imagine hardware parts like those 5 cent washers with RFID chips on them! Or other items where it can be knocked or worn off while packing & shipping to the retailers!
Costs will go up to make RFID work! Hardware better for manual counting by clerks. Groceries are for RFID!
I'll think of a really good SIG just before I die.
Eclectic beats from Leeds, UK
handmadehands.co.uk
And I'm sure all those Jews sitting around in Auschwitz and Buchenwald that had their lives made shittier suffered so that some great societal change could be made?
The civil rights movement affected change because BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS were being denied. If I was being told, you have to wait in this really long ass line because your white, and all the people of asian, african and latino descent can use this reallly fast checkout system over here, then maybe we'd agree on something. However this is about checking-out at the grocery store, and people protesting the "dehumanizing" self-checkout machine. Find some other cause to champion hippies, they haven't legalised pot yet. Start there.
Sig withheld to protect the innocent.
it might be a little late to patent that idea!
:-)
What just because there's that pesky prior art? That never stopped anyone with buff lawyers
These posts express my own personal views, not those of my employer
I was making a point that letter-writing campaigns (your solution) are completely useless at affecting change. No other relevance intended.
But keep the tin-foil hat nice and shiny...
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