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Copy-protected CD Tops U.S. Charts
Joey Patterson writes "CNET is reporting that Velvet Revolver's new album, 'Contraband', which is protected with SunnComm's anti-copying technology, has topped the U.S. album charts. The SunnComm and BMG execs quoted in the article say that they're pleased with the apparent consumer acceptance of the anti-piracy technology, but they have been hearing questions about how people can get the copy-blocked songs from the CD onto an iPod."
the music swapping types are bound to find a way around this one, im sure
It's quite probably just a case where not many people have discovered that they've been screwed-over just yet...
The anger will come soon...
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
Funny, I thought I saw this on BitTorrent already.....
It's either on the beat or off the beat, it's that easy.
I moderate therefore I rule!
--
... is that in their attempts to create a CD that fits their aims, the record companies have tried many methods of corrupting the CD format, and then they have tested these by making secret releases into localized markets, sometimes of hundreds of thousands of CDs. Everyday people have then bought these sub-standard CDs, and have been unknowingly testing the record company's new CD protection schemes for them.
For instance, an early release made under Midbar's Cactus format in Germany reportedly had a 4% return rate. These were from people who found that these CDs didn't work on their normal CD players -- let alone in their computers. 4% is a huge return rate when you consider that many people might have found a problem with one CD player but not another, and who might have thought it was the player that was at fault rather than the CD.
Undeterred by these experiences of upsetting their customers, the record companies have continued to develop these formats and test them on an unsuspecting public, either unlabelled or with small or misleading labels. Along the way, problems with these CDs have been found on DVD players, car audio systems, older CD players, PlayStation machines, computers, laptops and several other types of devices.
To add injury to insult, several of these so-called 'copy-protection' formats actually interfere with the error-correction mechanism of the disk. This mechanism is designed to take care of scratches on the disk -- your CD player can fill in over a small number of scratches on the disk because the error correction codes tell it how to. The manufacturers found that by corrupting the error correction codes, they could make a CD that computers would reject, but that normal CD players would still manage to play. The cost of this, of course, is that your CDs are less resistant to scratches (and Philips have confirmed this). This is not too much inconvenience for the manufacturer -- but what about for you?
They seem to have confused acceptance with ignorance.
This is only for owners of the new CD. All others will be sodomized by a big helicopter
Step 1. Go Here
Step 2. Connect to the newsgroup of your choice.
Step 3. Download the music for the CD that you own.
Since you can't do this via legal means you clearly will have to do it via this somewhat legel method.
Considering a few days ago a friend suggest velvet revolver to me, sending me 3-4 songs from their new album to me over DC++, needless to say, I didn't like them very much and propmptly deleted the music files (within 24 hours i assure you!)
Excuse me, I don't mean to impose, but I am the ocean
I've never heard of this "chart topping" band.
I guess I'm getting old.
simple. have a home audio system with a fiber audio out, and have a nice sound card with fiber in, and make MP3s over it. Won't get the static or line noise of the copper, although I'm sure your dog can tell the different between this method and a direct CDA rip....
--
Here comes the brigade of people complaning that they should have used the generic "Portable MP3 player" rather than "iPod"...
"If we let things terrify us, life will not be worth living."
- Seneca
Yeah, to really prove how much people prefer copy-protected CDs they should sell two versions, one with and one without and then they can show the world that people prefer the ease of just buying multiple copies.
RTFA. There is a sticker on the CD that its copy protected.
Obviously a lot of people have bought this album, and no doubt a lot of people will want to transfer songs to an iPod or other player and will find out the hard way that they can't. This will get the public's attention on the issue of copy protected CDs. I suspect that most people will not buy another one, having been burned once before. If these prove to be unpopular enough in the long run, they will probably not be sold anymore. Hopefully, there will be a future story about a band's album having very disappointing sales due to copy protection.
I wasn't able to rip it on my OSX box, but it ripped just fine on my linux box. Maybe it's because it's a different drive, but it works just fine.
I should put it up on bittorrent just to spite them, fuckers.
Isn't this the same company who sued a Princeton student after he figured out that pressing the shift key defeated their copyright 'protection'?
Besides, it's probably F9 or something this time.
Go to iTunes music store.
Buy album.
Put on iPod.
On a less pithy note, would it be that hard for EMI to make an agreement with Apple such that, if you have the CD in the drive, you can buy the iTunes version for free? Or you could always package the album with a certificate code that can be used to buy the album for free on iTunes. Both of those seem like relatively easy solutions.
And, finally, on an inquisitive note, does this software also install on OS X? Or is this a Windows only gimping?
Philip Sandifer's academic website
so basically, if you can listen to it, it will be on p2p, get used to that RIAA!!!
On another note, I didn't know that Velvet Revolver is made of alumni from Stone Temple Pilots and Guns N' Roses. I guess it does pay to RTFA :P
iTunes Music Store
AC comments get piped to
I use a Mac and purchased the album. No problem encoding to AAC with iTunes or transferring to an ipod. Wouldn't have even known it was copy protected without this posting.
about as noticable as the explicit lyrics stickers i bet
This is becoming normal to me. Anything associated with the RIAA is officially defective. Is this the Suncomm software that could be bypassed by pressing shift (or turning of autorun)?
I've yet to find a CD I couldn't rip and put on my MP3 player, and the day I find one is the day I keep returning them as defective until the store runs out of stock. The music Nazis won't ruin my completely legal fun!
Presently here, but not there.
I was going to say 'boycott', but it appears to already be too late for that.
If you want the songs on your computer, download them from iTunes (or other legal service of choice), use hymn (or semi-legal equivalent of choice), and then listen or convert as you please. Or, use Bittorrent. Or DC. Or Shareaza. Or ____. Amazing how inventive the discerning music consumer/pirate can be. :P
Well, what do you know, the copy protection didn't stop the pirates... and it was released 7 days pre retail. RELEASE DATE: 2004-06-08 RIP DATE: 2004-06-01
Hell, I'll go buy this one. These guys make good music. Plain and simple. Go pimp your 'the people want copy protection' somewhere else. People want decent music. This band delivers.
Uh, buy it on iTunes for $9.99?
i figure people will still buy it, until they realize exactly what it means..
As in earlier tests by BMG and SunnComm, the copy protection on the Velvet Revolver disc can be simply disabled by pushing the "Shift" key on a computer while the CD is loading, which blocks the SunnComm software from being installed. The companies say they have long been aware of the work-around but that they were not trying to create an unhackable protection.
,etc).
If the point is to make people unable to rip the music and you allow a backdoor 'knowingly' then why even bother in the first place?
"We are actively working with Apple to provide a long-term solution to this issue," a posting on SunnComm's Web site reads. "We encourage you to provide feedback to Apple, requesting they implement a solution that will enable the iPod to support other secure music formats."
Dear Apple,
Please support the latest copy-protection scheme from my favourite recording label, BMG and their current subsidiary, SunComm. Also, please compile in support for the different methods for every single other copy protection scheme espoused by every other label on every other album at Best Buy.
Also, please be prepared to update these codecs as the record labels see fit or the iPod and iTunes may no longer be compatible in an effort to keep ahead of nefarious CD pirates.
Also, please CC: this message to anybody else you know that makes CD player apps (Nullsoft, Microsoft, Roxio, Sony, etc, etc
Finally, please forget about that old 'Redbook' standard for CDs. That is old and should be cast off upon a pile of 8-Tracks, Divx discs, and CSS.
Thanks for your time.
Love, Tom
I regularly import protected CDs made by Avex and others in Japan. I don't know what the heck they're protecting them with, but my CDRW doesn't even SEE the protection much less have problems ripping the tracks.
I can copy them to my MP3 player without any difficulty, so they can count the CD as "protected" for their sales stats if they so desire, but they're deluding themselves if they think it's stopping playback-shifting.
N.
"Nothing strengthens authority so much as silence." - Charles de Gaulle
I'm sure there's a joke in there somewhere.
Karma: -2147483648 (Mostly affected by integer overflow)
The entire album is on the following newsgroups:
b inaries.sounds.mp3.2000s. complete_cd
alt.binaries.sounds.mp3.heavy-metal. sounds.mp3.rock.full-albump 3.secular
alt.binaries.mp3
alt.binaries.sounds.mp3
alt.
alt.binaries.sounds.mp3
alt.binaries.sounds.mp3.full_albums
alt.binaries
alt.binaries.sounds.m
alt.binaries.sounds.lossless (in APE format)
alt.binaries.sounds.aac (in AAC format)
And, why I have no idea:
alt.binaries.sounds.mp3.french
I've not yet found a single CD which has been copy protected that cannot be bypassed easily. I wish they'd just learn that these systems which try trickery on the laser head (so that head bounces around the disc if you try to do a consecutive read) is simple to get past.
The last one I had that required "cracking" (although it hardly warrants the term) was bypassed using the sticky bit of a post-it note (I won't say exactly where it was stuck for fear that I'll have the legal eagles coming down on me, as it were).
I find it more of an inconvenience than a reason not to buy a particular artists CDs (although I've never heard of these chart-toppers).
The CD medium, as it stands now, just cannot support the kind of copy protection they want to put in place, simply because they have to cater for "dumb" machines, such as the typical CD player. It would be more frugal if they just didn't bother.
Contraband..... pretty apt name considering the copy protection on the CD.
READY.
PRINT ""+-0
You can't make up the fact that the album in #1 right now, but is the recording industry saying "if people did not accept the copy protection then the sales would be lower"? Did it ever occur to them that maybe it is just a really good album and that the people buying it are people who don't steal music anyways?
From what I understand, most people who used to buy CDs from before Mp3s were popular STILL DO. Sales are up aren't they? I personally never used to buy CDs. I would just listen to the radio. Mp3s are convienient because they are commercial free and I can play DJ, but if they didn't exist I would be listening to the radio and not buying albums. Most people I speak to feel the same way.
http://brandonbloom.name
For a windows system you just need to disable the auto-start for your CD player. I then converted the music files to .WAVs and use that to 'copy' the CD.
If people really want to use it on an ipod, why dont they just get it off iTMS? If youre using an ipod, you are a lot more likely to use music mostly in a digital format.
It's probably what i'll end up doing.
Personally, i think this is sort of a shitty thing to have happen, but its not totally unreasonable. Its available in a different format and it not damaging to consumer's computers. If you don't like it, dont buy it, but i dont think this is on the level of some of the worse things the industry has done or considered doing.
Avex use Cactus. This has the bonus of that the player application dosen't seem to support double-byte characters, so if I can't read a kanji I can just check the romaji in the DVD-ROM part. My DVD player usually can't play track 01, but my PS2 and optical-in fix that...
The CD isn't really protected in any way.
According to the article, it has anti-copying software (read: spyware) that installs automatically using Windows Autoplay if you insert the CD into your Windows PC, but the CD isn't otherwise protected.
So if you have Autoplay turned off, or use Linux or a Mac, or simply hold down Shift while you insert the CD, you can rip the files fine. This workaround has been known since last October, when the SunnComm copy "protection" system was first introduced.
Use a Mac to rip it, or buy it from iTunes.
On one hand, I'm pissed that I had to jump through hoops to get the CD on my PC.
On the other hand, it's a damn good album.
Quite a dilemma....
Anyway, it's got DRM'd WMA files, but those didn't really interest me much. WMA's not a bad codec, but the Mac version sucks, and I need the files to work well on my PC and Mac.
I've transferred my entire CD collection to mp3 with Exact Audio Copy. Approximately 200 CDs nearly all of which are collecting dust in my basement, the rest are in my car. I don't even have a CD player connected to my stereo, well actually I do - the CD drive in the computer thats connected to the stereo. Anyhow, this Velvet Revolver CD is one I've been thinking about buying but if I can't turn it into mp3 files then I really doubt I want to bother with it. I'm guessing though that the software I use for that, Exact Audio Copy (and LAME), probably wouldn't have a problem. Does anybody know for sure?
Is the sticker like the parental advisory sticker, and part of the artwork, or is it stuck over the packaging?
If it's the former, then it's an incredibly tiny label/a.
As in earlier tests by BMG and SunnComm, the copy protection on the Velvet Revolver disc can be simply disabled by pushing the "Shift" key on a computer while the CD is loading, which blocks the SunnComm software from being installed. The companies say they have long been aware of the work-around but that they were not trying to create an unhackable protection.
Of should be off. Didn't see that when I checked for spelling. oopsie
Presently here, but not there.
It's therefore a bit premature for record labels to celebrate mainstream "acceptance" of these horrid anti-copying devices, when the mainstream still doesn't give a hoot as they don't know / don't care / know specifically what that entails or how it infringes on their rights.
Mp3's are generally still a college level / nerd / for-the-privalaged medium with expensive doo-hickey devices to play them - Ipod costs $250 - $300 for crying out loud! - you can buy a CD-Player for $10 at Walmart, Target, or Radio Shack.
Copy protection is the kind of thing that will be slaughtered once MP3's become more actual mainstream. Then let's see about such "acceptance". The whole point of MP3s is the flawless and svelte transfer from one medium to another, without the junk of big goofy disks to carry around. The magic word is "transfer". We have the right to transfer and convert the content to any medium we wish. Once people become aware of the possibility of such freedom, they're really going to get as pissy as the rest of us and to hell with "mainstream acceptance".
Actually, who cares!
Pros: the sticker's big, shiny, and eye-catching.
Cons: it's in the tiniest type I've ever seen.
I had it three days before they started recording it.
I recall quite distinctly, when riding along with a friend a couple of weekends ago, he playing this particular CD on his in-dash MP3 player from a cd he'd burned with MP3's that he had downloaded. He also told me, that at the time, the CD was as yet unreleased.
Oh well, that's some effective prevention they have there.
To me, Velvet Revolver is what's wrong with the music industry today. Let me see, what were two popular bands of the past? GnR and STP. I wonder... let's throw ex-members of those bands together, record a bunch of their crap and shove it down people's throats. Genius!
Okay, I'm completely boggled now . . . what exactly are they're trying to accomplish?
like was said earlier, just plug your stereo into your pc's line in, and record a wav file.. convert to mp3. or get the voice recorder attachment for ipod, butcher it so it is no longer a microphone but a line in, and away you go... (based on the assumption you can record long enough.. have never used it)
As in earlier tests by BMG and SunnComm, the copy protection on the Velvet Revolver disc can be simply disabled by pushing the "Shift" key on a computer while the CD is loading, which blocks the SunnComm software from being installed. The companies say they have long been aware of the work-around but that they were not trying to create an unhackable protection.
(From the CNet article)
The shift key is now "hacking". There we go, folks.
So then what the hell is the point of copy-protecting CD-ripping when you can just get the whole thing off bittorrent.... because someone else loaded it from iTunes and re-encoded it back onto the internet??!?!?!?!?!?!
What the heck is the point of the copy protection system anyway, considering this fact?
I guess the moral of this story is, if you can come up with some fancy crypto security technology you can sell it to companies with too much money and too many PHBs. Even if it doesn't really solve the big issue, it will let them sleep well at night.
I'm pretty sure I'd suck as a saleman.
READY.
PRINT ""+-0
Does the protection stop linux machines or is it not saftware? In Canada we do not have access to iTunes (becasue we are legally allowed to share music and old Jobs doesent think it is worth the effort) Even though we can share music in Canada I would buy it off the music store. If only it worked with Linux.
Geek Code Version 3.0 GSS d? s++
I thought this kind of copy protection screwed up Macs? Wasn't there a case where several people had to take their iMacs back to the shop because Natalie Imbruglia's White Lillies Island completely disabled the drive? God, just imagine having that trash stuck in your computer permanently...
Exactly.
I purchased this album at the store. I asked the girl behind the counter if I could bring the CD back if it didn't play in my car. She said I could.
I bought it, it played in my car, and Grip had no problems archiving it for me. Dunno what the copy protection is, but it works GREAT!!!
Linux - Because Mommy taught me to Share.
I bought the CD and immediately ripped the CD to MP3 without any problems (for my personal use in my MP3 player). I didn't even know it was copy-protected until I read this thread. I guess SunnComm's copy-protection is doing a bang-up job.
Exact Audio Copy with LAME works like a charm!
Is a copyprotected CD still a CD?
Tried that.. didn't work. I could've eventually found some workaround, but at that point, it seemed easier to just copy the files over. (Of course, given the dismal state of SMB in OS X, I'm lucky it didn't turn into a bigger hassle.)
;)
I praise my Mac in one post and take a jab at OS X in another... I'm gonna piss off damn near everyone, aren't I?
Who would want to copy that crap anyway?
Don't buy the CD from the store, but go straight to the iTunes-MusicStore the album is there. (As you might probably know: Now you can listen to it on your iPod or burn a CD or listen to it on all your five computers.) http://phobos.apple.com/WebObjects/MZStore.woa/wa/ viewAlbum?playlistId=14131660
Oh and yes, it's also available in the european stores.
I've used CDs in the past that iTunes for Mac OS X (then 4.0) crashed while ripping. I restarted to Mac OS 9 and was able to rip them without difficulty.
So just to be fair, iTunes being unable to rip a CD doesn't necessarily mean the CD is too badly "protected" (i.e. corrupted) to rip. There has been and may still be a crasher somewhere in the bowels of iTunes MP3 encoder.
That said, yeah, it's probably the copy protection.
cdparanioa. I've encountered a couple copy-protected CDs that didn't even know what hit them. God I love that program, It's saved a couple of my CDs before the originals completely deteriorated from use.
"It has always been this way and it won't change, god bless the fucked up USA" The Briefs
In Russia.. The CD Copywrites you! .. You insens.. clod.. I don't own a CD player you... etc.. :)
That doesn't answer the question; how many people actually read that sticker or have any idea what it means?
Well, I have bought quite a few CDs that I knew were copy protected. But then I knew what to expect. I come from Australia, where copy controlled CDs are labelled as such. This hadn`t been a problem until recently. I`d managed to turn all those CDs into MP3s (for my own use, thank you very much), and the CDs had played in all my devices.
I decided to go to Japan. I took a spindle of CDs/DVDs with me. The new laptop I got doesn`t play any of the copy controlled CDs I brought with me. Thanks guys. No, really thanks.
By the way, for anyone who might be travelling abroad, keep in mind how difficult it is to get a DVD player that supports your region when you don`t speak the language. I`ll be watching them on my laptop for quite some time.
Refuse to make a statement in your sig!
I guess the Disc Velvet Revolver disc I bought last week at Circuit city is defective, I stuck it into my crappy Compaq, opened Zlurp and ripped it, then I used whatever crappy burning software Compaq puts on the computers they sell at Wal-Mart, and it works fine. The bad thing is that I had already ripped to MP3 it with Music match the day I bought it (as I usually do) and didn't bother to listen to the files. Well the Zlurp ripped files burned fine and I just finished listening to the disc on the CD player on my home audio system, I used the Music Match files and they played fine as MP3's on the stereo in my truck. Now I know, Wal-Mart bought Compaq Celeron computers are really uber-haxor boxen, custom engineered to circumvent DRM software.
If you don't care about the deliberate corruption of the well established CD standard. That's your choice.
But, if you really like the music/the band but hate the protection, then you should buy two copies. Buy one and return one. The music company will realise something wrong if the customers can boast the return rate somehow to double-digit.
Is the name of the album: "Contraband."
First, turns out that the copy protection was lame (shift-key anyone?). So one reason for the lack of consumer backlash (if not just ignorance) might be that people figured that out...
On the other hand, what's dangerous is that the music industry might see this as the precedent to boost sales with copy protection. I mean, piracy (according to them) is hurting their buissiness, right? So it's logical from their point of view that a copy protected cd generates more sales and sales is the measure for the charts. This sets a bad precedent...
From a cursory read of the article it looks like the "copy protection" is a win32 application. If so it would look like copy protection won't matter if you use linux or have autoplay disabled in windows for that matter.
Honestly, I could care less if a cd is copy protected, as long as there is a format I can play in winamp/xmms and on my cali.
Oderint dum metuant
You can hold shift while inserting/loading the CD. Yes it bypassed the EULA splash screen. Yes you can play it, but it plays like broken MP3's. Skips and skips, just like broken records. You can rip 'em into the format of your choice on Windows, unfortunately, without getting the "digital key" the rips are unlistenable. Try it on Mac or Linux!!!!!
If this CD is copy protected then I would assume that it won't have the Phillips CD logo stamped on the disk and or jewel case liner. (since it would not technically qualify as a red book spec CD) Furthermore, I would have to agree with some of the /. crowd that most of the customers buying this CD are oblivious to the fact that it is copy protected.
"I bow to no man" - Riddick
So by messing with the scratch protection algorithms in most CD players, it makes the CD less durable.
Doesn't this increase the consumer's need to rip it immediately?
Linux - Because Mommy taught me to Share.
The SunnComm and BMG execs quoted in the article say that they're pleased with the apparent consumer acceptance of the anti-piracy technology, [...]
Yeah, and right after its discovery, people used to pump their bodies full of penicillin in toothpaste and whatnot, before they found out that exactly that f*cked up their bodies. Bet the distributing companies in those times claimed the same "apparent consumer acceptance"...
They'll get you!!!
yep more consolidation
Sony now own BMG, great news for the consumer egh ?
Click Audio CD when you insert the disc.
Start Audio Juicer
Click Start Rip
???
Profit!
SmashTech - No smashing of tech involved
If RIAA, SunnComm and BMG found out that Macs can easily bypass their "security" feature, they might "try" to make this protection scheme to work on the Mac. Maybe they don't care too much about Macs and Mac users, because there are only a "handfull" of them compared to the Windows-mongers. "Dear Apple, please keep your installed base lower than 5% so RIAA and record companies would leave us alone. Let them chase after Windows users. Thank You."
Have you taken this up with DIMIA? Its illegal for a company to discriminate aginst your culture if your an Aussie.
Timing how long until I can get the mp3's
iTunes AAC (mpeg 4)
- burn it unlimited times to unlimited CD's
- back it up to HD, to CD, to DVD, to floppy, if you must
- copy it to unlimited iPod's
- copy it to unlimited PCs, play it on up to 5 simultaneously
- stream it to up to 5 machines from one Mac or PC
- hook it wirelessly with lossless audio via optical connectors to your home stereo with Airport Express
Copy-Protected Optical Media
- play it in only one place, once at a time
- scratch it once, lose it forever
- repeat after me: it is not a CD if it is not Redbook
So which one are you going to buy?
The next pasture is always greener
I find it funny reading all these outraged posts about how the disc is not valid red book, etc, etc.
The protection on this disc is very light, and will really only catch the casual user. If you know what you're doing, it's very easy to bypass.
I find this protection a breath of fresh air. It is almost as if the publisher is saying "Here. If you know enough to bypass this, presumably you understand copyright law and won't swap files." No scheme will stop a dedicated cracker, so they offer one that doesn't even try. In fact, the publishers even acknowledge it isn't a very secure scheme. Yes, their trust is probably naive, but that's their problem not mine.
See this article for a description of MediaMax.
SunnComm rips off the record companies by selling them a copy protection scheme that doesn't actually work.
The record gets passed around on all the file sharing networks and usenet newsgroups.
This free advertising results in increased sales, driving the record to number 1.
The pointy-haired bosses at the record company believe that the increased sales prove that the copy protection scheme is working and issue congratulatory press release.
But I did hold down the shift key when I put the CD in. Then I ripped it, packed away the original, and proceeded to play it from my home entertainment system of choice, my computer.
Do I share it? Hell no. I'm a huge fan of Scott Weiland and would never do that to him. The CD was worth $14 to me and then some, but I did think twice about buying it after reading the notice on the cover. I seriously thought about downloading it out of spite.
If I would have unknowingly had their software installed on my computer that blocked a function, I'd be just as pissed at them as I am at people who write viruses.
This is just another "legal" virus like Gator, Real Player, Comet Cursor...
If tyranny and oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. - James Madison
Copy protection my ass... if you can hear it you can copy it... They think that by putting some really nifty copy protection on a CD makes it impervious to copying is absurd at best... Analog rips work rather well and you'll still get the 128kbps @ 44khz quality. Granted this is by far the slowest form of copying, it still works. I did this back in the day with cassette tapes. Oddly enough, they sounded on par with the original copy.
I'm not sure if this has been posted, nor am I sure if I'm breaking any laws by posting it. If I am, I'm sorry, and before the mods delete this post, its wrong to install stuff on computers without asking, its just common sense.
1. Insert the CD and let the software run if you haven't already.
2. Remove the CD and restart your computer without the CD installed.
3. Enter the Device Manager (Right-click on My Computer-> Properties-> Hardware Tab-> Device Manager.
4. From the View menu, select Devices by Connection, then select Show Hidden Devices.
5. Scroll down and find the device called "SbcpHid", right-click and DISABLE it.
6. Close Device Manager, Windows should ask you to reboot, say Yes.
This will disable the protection, allowing you to listen to the CD using Windows Media Player, you can even rip the songs to MP3 for backup without the garble.
400 Person LAN for Charity: Zion LAN 2005
What difference does that make? There's a sticker on my parents' VCR that says "long play" and another that says "Nicam Stereo" but neither of them has a clue what either of those things mean.
Just because people have bought something that doesn't mean that they have fully understood every aspect of what they've bought. Just as my parents don't appreciate the full functionality of their VCR most CD purchasers don't appreciate the restrictions attached to these copy-protected "CD"s*.
(* Technically these copy-protected discs aren't CDs, because they don't meet the red book standards, hence my use of quotation marks.)
"Accept that some days you are the pigeon, and some days you are the statue." - David Brent, Wernham Hogg
but they have been hearing questions about how people can get the copy-blocked songs from the CD onto an iPod.
You have to pay extra for the privilege of using the music you've already bought once.
I guess the FBI's new anti-piracy logo failed to terrify people into submission, as was hoped by record companies...
CDs that use other systems that deliberately malform certain pieces of data, on the other hand, violate the Red Book spec and should not be called CDs.
How stupid do you think people are?!? IT COMES OUT ANALOG IN THE END. It will hit a speaker eventually. Therefore we can capture it! Video is the same deal; TVs are not digital.. yet.
SPDIF out from my CD player -> SPDIF in to my computer. Press "Record" on my computer, press "Play" on my CD player. Clean and cut up in a basic sound editor. Duh?!?
Sure it's not perfect, but it just points out how stupid the recording industry is. Spending millions on researching and licencing copy protection technology that in the end _can never work_. No wonder they claim piracy is causing them to lose money, they're pissing it away on this bullshit.
Am I alone here?! Maybe I'm the idiot.
The new Beastie Boys album is also copy protected.
0 04 -06-13/2004-06-19/0
http://www.securityfocus.com/archive/1/366191/2
I saw their video on MuchMusic (like MTV in Canada) and really liked it. I had planned to go plunk down my bux to get it, but now that I see it's copy protected, I think I'll pass. Can't see myself giving money to people who don't appreciate having me as a customer.
Hmmmm, the sticker is missing from the copy I downloaded from usenet. Try again SunnComm and BMG.
The brigade, in this case, is incorrect. Some varieties of the Corrupt Discs contain restrictions-managed .wma files that the owner can copy to a limited number of WMA players. Almost every modern pocket music player can play WMA, but Apple's iPod player can't.
Let's just make the **IA happy and say I was making a personal backup copy. The disk seems to have two sessions, a data and an audio. The audio session seems to be unreadable if you just put the CD into a Windows box and expect to be able to rip audio. Windows just seems to ignore the audio session. I suspect that the TOC has been screwed up.
My work around was quite simple. First turn off auto run because it will pop up an EULA when you put the CD in to install the Suncomm crap. I got an image of the CD fine with Alcohol. I then burned it with CloneCD. When I put the copy into the CD-ROM drive, iTunes picked it up as an audio CD. I can only assume that CloneCD wrote the TOC correctly.
As far as Linux goes, I only tried K3b and it could get a good image from the CD.
Record companies can and will and have bought back their own discs in order to boost ratings. Then a flock of lambs will come and see what's #1 and buy it, regardless of what it is.
If it doesn't offend, it's mellowed out trash which goes in from one ear and out from another, it's OK to buy. Talk about "easy listening" on a grand scale!
and this had a huge "COPY PROTECTION" sticker on it I can imagine some people purchasing it just to see how easy it is to get around.
I bought the new Beastie Boys record earlier this week and only at home noticed the transparent sticker, with white text on white background stating that it is a copy protected disk (it did not claim to be a CD but it was sold in the CD section).
Then I put it in my computer, ripped it and encoded it succesfully for use in my portable mp3 player. So much for your copy protection.
BTW, it's a brilliant record. Get it if you're into hip hop.
Antti S. Brax - Old school - http://www.iki.fi/asb/
... The RIAA have bought a law banning keyboards with a shift key.
You make the mistake of thinking you can educate the fundamental stupidity out of people. You can't.
I might be mistaken, but aren't the now ubiquitous 80 minute CDs contrary to the redbook standard? After all, my first generation Discman does have problems with 74+ minute CDs.
English is easier said than done.
10 Buy a copy from a major chain
20 Open it
30 Return it
40 Goto 10
For people who don't speak Babelfish:
.wav file.
.wav, run it though a program for audio compression, maybe MKW audio compreesion toolkit. Then, distribute it to as many of your friends as possible.
Get a cable which you can plug into your CD (Note: "real Compact Discs" don't ever have DRM) playing device of choice. It should have a male port on both ends. Plug one into your microphone port, the other into your CD player. Open a device (for example, sound recorder) and click record. Hit "Play" a half second later so you don't cut off anything. After the song finishes, stop the recording, clip off parts from the beginning and end, and save as a
With your
MKW = http://www.etree.org/mkw.html
Mod "Overrated" instead of replying "I disagree with you," you coward.
RTFA. There is a sticker on the CD that its copy protected.
Does the label bother to mention that it isn't actually a CD, or are they merely relying on consumer ignorance, such as that you display in your post in calling it such?
Are the stores stocking it in their normal manner for CDs, instead of in a seperate section as they should? Not doing so could well be considered consumer fraud by the retailers, it might not be out of line to drop a line to sundry Attorney's General if such is the case.
KFG
I bought the album, afer all I am all for supporting Scott Whiland's drug habit, but I also noticed that GRIP for linux ripped it without a second thought...so much for copy protection.
;)
Also worth noting is that my co-worker (who also bought it) put the CD in his windows box and refused the DRM in the auto-run program, and it completely hosed his profile simply can't log in anoymore.
I thought they were trying to screw the people who were pirating the software, not those who actually bought it!
proxy
I sure hope the MediaMax protection racket works under WINE.
;)
Otherwise Linux is still playing catchup.
If tyranny and oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy. - James Madison
Someone mod this up. lol
whoa, look at the sale they have going on this week for the velvet revolver album...it practically rivales the price of iTunes. I'll post the url http://www.packetnews.com/search.php?kw=velvet+rev olver
Another recent album, Beastie Boys - To the 5 Boroughs was released by EMI thats copy controlled. Upon further research, I found that it used Cactus Data Shield 200. Not only did it use a second session to block direct playback of the .wav files (You need to play back mp3s through their built in player) but they introduce errors into the .wav actual files to make it extremely difficult for me to rip (Even in EAC) without pauses or cracks. I hear that those lucky enough to have drives like Plextors have less trouble, but I think this is going a little too far. How am I supposed to get it in my iPod now? I'm in Canada, so no dice, and this issue may not apply in the States.
Anyone who would actually pay for this shit deserves to. Frontline had a great episode focusing on the music industry with quite a bit about the construction of this band.
Ya, folks have been able to rip this CD in OS X. Pop it in, load up iTunes, click import, done. :)
;) )
But hey, could always buy this album online from the ITMS (and, possibly, sprinkle a bit of PlayFair on your download
"Things are more moderner than before- bigger, and yet smaller- it's computers-- San Dimas High School football RULES!"
Well, the fact that it did well on the charts has more to do with Slash and Duff McKagan together again, sans Axl Rose. As far as ripping, it works fine on a mac... no problems whatsoever. Oh! And the album is also available at the iTunes music store, so you have the option of buying it cheaper and not having to rip it anyway.
Maybe the CD was just really, really good. :)
probably people are buying it just so they can have the joy of bypassing the security lock-out. Clever marketing, boys.
"Reality is that which, when you stop believing in it, doesn't go away." -- Philip K. Dick
The music is actually good. Whoah, crazy thought, I know.
Next, they'll be claiming that the sales is actually due to the copy protection. My first instinct when reading this story was to download it and see if I liked it.
Since it's selling, it must be worth buying. Hence more people download it, like it a lot, and buy it! Wow... what a concept.
Oh, and the copy 'protection' doesn't work. Broken via any number of simple means no doubt, but the simple truth is, there are no less than FIVE torrents for the full albumn right now on my favorite tracker site.
Hehe.. funny.
Meanwhile, I've taken this whole issue a bit less seriously, especially when the there are more pressing issues to worry about going in the world today. Nobody is being killed for copyright violations (yet?).
You remind me of Jack Valenti when I saw him on CSPAN. He would argue against piracy in one sentence, the next he's pitching new movies. Argue, pitch, smile. Argue, pitch, smile.
Well apparently, some do, because there are iPod issues, no?
Oh yeah, Stone Temple Pilots, right. They're great.
I saw Stone Temple Pilots this weekend. I liked them better the first time around...when they were called Pearl Jam - David Spade
Don't forget the smile. Now go pick up your RIAA "Slashdot +5" bonus check and astroturf another story for fun and profit. Who mods this crap insightful?
I bought another "copy controlled" album, Beastie Boys' latest. I didn't notice the copy control sticker in the store as it was clear with white text. The album cover is white.
Backside of the album cover has information that album might not play on a car CD-player.
I was pissed as I felt cheated. The copy control didn't prevent making uncontrolled copy of the album nor did it prevent making mp3's or flac files of the songs.
I don't know if the easyness of copy control circumvention was just because I use linux and not windows or mac, but I seems that this shite is there just to piss off the consumer.
Radio Shack... You've got questions, we've been put on hold by the sprint pcs operator.
(sprint sure got a good deal out of that. I swear the RS people spend most of their time trying to fix Sprint's mess)
..is one person to play/record each song at a good sample rate. rename the files and ID3v1/ID3v2 tags, and you're set.
you can still get good quality, and the copy protection basically becomes a non-factor since all you're are doing is recording the output and not the protection scheme itself
that is, unless they've found a way to prevent a person from playing on one piece of software/recording on another utilizing the same soundcard, on the same machine. have they?
- The truth is a virus. -
how people can get the copy-blocked songs from the CD onto an iPod
Uh -
1. Don't run Windoze?
2. Hold down a shift key?
But there's another twist: that people are willing to pay for music even when they know they can steal it; also, that the claims by the RIAA that Napster was ruining their business was exactly the garbage we long thought it to be.
Not that the RIAA will see it that way of course. They're so dumbed by their own paranoid greed they'll consider this a great success.
My wife bought a copy protected CD and wanted to copy it to MD but the MD recorder refused. Under Windows if you played it you got some crufty 48Khz WMA file, never the full 16 bit PCM. On my Mac however, I was able to rip the disc to iTunes as straight WAV and then burn her an unprotected version of the CD. She then used this to record her MD. I have yet to see a disc that the Mac can't copy.
"I have the attention span of a strobe lit goldfish, please get to the point quickly!"
why would anyone want to buy, let alone pirate a Velevet Revolver CD? Truly they are the shittest, most over produced, revenant rock group in existence today. The only thing worse I could imagine is yet another Motley Crue reunion (shudder).
Making the moon less necessary since 1998.
streaming to a digital virtual audio device and ripping that to whatever format you choose (for example using Virtual Audio Cable for Windows).
If I want to copy it, *nothing* is going to stop me.
The Album is available at a close to CD Quality of 320 kbps on undernet. Searching for Velvet Revolder Contraband throws numerous results. for the curious.. try #mp3passion on eu.undernet.org
fifteen jugglers, five believers
plug it into a tape deck or other cd player and make a copy that way cant you
back in the day we didnt have no old school
Just use Audio Catalyst (older SW) and rip any CDs as per normal unprotected wav files.
Then open the wavs in CoolEdit and do any editing/sorting of wav data and delete any raw data/noise content (usually the multimedia or PC player.exe content).
Then save your files and convert to preferred compressed format.
and the first thing I did when I saw it was copy protected was burn a copy without the protections. (I didn't know it was protected until I got it in the mail.)
Took two minutes with RecordNOW DX to make a pristine copy.
Amazon reviews can be insightful, but like guidebooks, they really are just a guide. It's pleasing to see (I wasn't aware of this new measure) that the most helpful review for this album discusses the pitfalls of this protection and ways to help circumnavigate it. Spread the word through whatever means possible.
I'm aware of all the copy protection on DVDs and I don't care. I've never ripped any of them, have no plans to, and still buy them. If there's previews I just do something else while they play like watch TV.
If the general population cared about backing up their stuff there would be an issue. But as it is, the general population doesn't care. It was quite a while before I ripped my music CDs.
Most people have just learned to take care of their stuff. How many people back up their video games, vhs tapes, computer games, dvds, etc? They just keep them in protective cases and don't mistreat them.
Backups are simply not an issue for the mass market.
Ben
Work Safe Porn
That's funny, I'm listening to the full album right now. Downloaded via IRC.
So, what do you want them to do (aside from not using copy protection, obviously)? Include a multi-page pamphlet explaining all the reasons not to buy the CD? Have the salesman deliver a lecture with Q&A session on the exact implications of the sticker to every customer who picks it up? Give them a written exam to make sure they know how the Redbook spec and fair use laws work so they can be given permission to buy it? At some point the customer has to make decision to buy the CD or not of his own free will, and slashbots attempting to dissuade him from doing so by any means necessary or declaring unilaterally that no one in their right mind would buy the CD is no more correct or helpful than the RIAA hoping he doesn't notice the sticker.
does it run on Linux? :P
Pavlov. Does this name ring a bell?
I listened to GnR before it was cool. I knew STP when it was Shirley Temple's Pussy... And I'm STILL not buying this godamn CD. Won't be downloading it. Won't be listening to it on the radio.
And if that isn't enough, I don't plan on voting for bush or bush light either.
And I'm damn near tempted to burn all my cash... Run my truck into the river... Sledge my *gasp* computer!
Do ya get it? Are you payin attention? Are ya fuckin catchin on or is your head still up their ass?
>what exactly are they're trying to accomplish?
This is just another shot across the bow. Ideally Joe and Jane consumer should be thinking thusly, "They sued all those people! Our CDs now have protection! Uninstall that damn eMule right now!"
All the record companies have to do is get x amount of sympathy going and the P2P gravy train will go further underground. As Joe and Jane opt-out (perhaps they don't want to get sued or perhaps they're sick of 'subsidizing' those who don't pay by dealing with DRM) out of P2P there goes another node and a strict lesson to their kids, "I better not find any P2P software on there." And then this meme travels to the water cooler, "You believe this? I gotta use this stupid Sunncomm player because of all the thieves out there!"
Then the average P2P enthusiast isn't seen as a harmless overzealous yet poor music fan, but as a criminal who is making your life hard. They then hate them and blame them for the reactions of the RIAA. Heck, they may even buy DRM on purpose so they don't get "stolen goods" on their computer or as a 'moral' action.
In other words they want you to understand that they're serious about copy protection infringement and want you to feel bad about it. Once you sympathize with them, they win.
I'll let the reader decide whether its best to let them win or not.
Hah! Thats nothing, I had it three days before they started to write it... ;)
"They looked deep into my soul and assigned me a number based on the order in which I joined"
The new Beastie Boys disk loudly proclaims that it has copy protection features. When I picked it up I was kind of concerned, and very supprised that such a digital friendly group was putting their stuff out with the protection. I stuck it in my laptop, said no to the 'install our crap' window and proceeded to play the disc in Winamp just fine. Then I ripped it just fine. Great, no prob. Then I got in my ride and tried to listen to the CD. THE DAMN CD WON'T PLAY IN MY 99 VW GOLF. WTF!? The stock damn CD player. WTF, WTF, WTF!? I have never had to deal with the stupid shit DRM inflicts us with. My iPod never impeded my enjoyment of the music. What a crock of crap. So I'm now ripping the tracks to WAV format and I'll be burning the DRM stripped WAV files to a disc to listen to in the car. (when I don't have the iPod hooked up.) Once again.... DRM is fine when it doesn't affect the quality of the music and it doesn't impede the customer trying to legally listen to the music. They have failed again.
Copy protection sucks, but this is one problem iPod user's will not have :-). Got my mod point - now let's just see if the system takes it back if I post anon.
In true civil desobedience fashion, the proper way to make decision makers understand that they are wasting their time is to:
1- purchase the CD
2- Optional: rip & copy it
3- return it and get a refund because it doesn't play on your equipment.
(2) is optional. The proper and law-abiding way is to not rip that CD.
If the return rate goes to around 10% or so I think the message will be pretty clear.
I didn't try this particular album but I have bought some other CD's protected by SunnComm (for example, "No Roots" by Faithless) and I had no problems ripping them for my iBook + iTunes + iPod combo. In fact, in my carreer of a compulsive music shopper I have never encountered a CD that I could not rip (yes, like all of us, I heard the horror story about Celine Dion, but I also heard about crop circles and Yeti). Sometimes the ripping is just abnormally slow (2x and even less), but that's all. Maybe the copy protection is acceptable... because it doesn't work?
The last copy protected album I came across was made rippable by coloring a swath of the outer tracks with a whiteboard pen. If you find the last track gets affected, then eject the CD and erase little bits of the inner edge of the ink until you can get the last track, but not have the stupid data track show up.
Of course, this only works on the extra useless type of "protection" that arrives in the form of a data track.
Google answer summary of wealth distribution in the US
and a nice Pie chart distribution of wealth
I have a little over 1200 CDs, they made enough they wont get another dime.
The way the recording industry as a whole has handled things over the last few years... convinced me music wasn't that important.
F*** EM!!!!
What really SHITS me is that the parent comment is plagiarised word for word from here:
http://cfdr.eu.org/issues/cd/
without attribution to the original author (who incidentally is 'Jim Peters'), then modded up to be 'Interesting'.
Perhaps there should be a PLAGIARISED moderation section, with a link to the original article.
Whenever the topic of Music and CDs the natural progression of the discussion eventually leads to a few posts of fair use, yet this poster has not used 'fair use' with the copying of the text (almost ironic).
This is NOT the best sig in the world, but this IS a tribute to the best sig in the world.
That was the name of my friends band from the late 80's they played punk-rawk
Huaah
..........FULL STOP.
I bought this album and wanted to copy the tracks to my personal archive. I placed the CD into my drive, a little box appeared, I think asking me if I wanted to install the player so I could listen to it, which I just cancelled. I opened up MusicMatch and clicked record, 10 minutes later and it was done. I have had the same experience with about 20 to 30 copy protected CDs, using different protection systems, but I have not yet failed to rip any of them at the first attempt. Is it the software that it tries to load (which I always cancel) that prevents you from accessing the audio tracks?
As I understand it, the "copy protection" is a program which is secretly installed when inserting the CD in a PC's CD-ROM drive. Isn't this some sort of troyan horse or virus? DMCA or not, I don't think this is legal.Z After the program installs, do any non protected CD's still work in a computer? If not then they are restricting our rights to play our _own_ audio recordings on CD!
Slashdot social media options: AIM, ICQ, Yahoo, Jabber and Mobile Text. Why no MySpace?
Well it would appear that the CD has copy protection on it but it can still be ripped normally. This seems to offer the best of both worlds as the record companies are happy (CD is copy protected) and the consumer is happy (CD can be ripped to different formats) Looks to me like everyones happy ;)
Sky subscribers are morons. They pay to be advertised at !
Pirate his music. That man is a drug fiend. You will be doing him a favour. Have you seen Velvet Revolver's new video "Slither"? He looks like Skeletor in this newest video, he has lost alot of weight from his drug habit.
See, it works! They couldn't copy the sticker.
... is that I can't use them. I have a Marantz dv4200 DVD player, that I also use for playing CDs. This is no problem with ordinary cds, but the copy prot. cd I have from EMI won't play. Ripping the disc was no problem and the copy works fine. My question to the music industry is: What have You accomplished by this?
1. Create a product that can't be used legally by some people
2. These people stop bying Your product
3. Blame low sales on piracy
4. ???
5. Profit!!!
Since you're only asking for the price of the CD, they will almost certainly not show up... hiring a lawyer would cost at least ten times more, and they'd be likely to lose anyway. So you'll win by default. And it'll piss them off.
(I'm assuming you're in the US, but most other countries probably have a similar setup for small claims.)
'Nuff said.
"Acceptance?"
How can the consumers accept something they most likely did'nt know about - or were oblivious too.
In consumer zombie land - they dont care about anything than getting the latest fix - regardless of what the future will bring because of it.
"CD"
Last time I checked - a music CD not following the REDBOOK format is not a music CD. Meaning you should be able to play the audio tracks on any CD Device regardless of it being in your car, on your computer or anywhere. It may look like a cd, smell like a cd and taste like a cd.. but its not a CD.
// instant - "I for one welcome our new Decaff Coffee-Flavoured-Coffee Overlords"
This strongly suggests that the "protection" exists solely to undermine legitimate personal use. There is no possible anti-piracy use for preventing only half (?) of your users from format-shifting. They know as well as we do that there will be the same amount of internet piracy of the album whether it has this protection or not.
THEREFORE, it's time to entertain theories as to what their real motive is. The two that spring to mind are:
Ultimately they're clawing for all the mindshare they can get, because they only really exist as long as you believe in them.
It's tragic. Laugh.
Anyone else find it ironic that the title of the album is "Contraband"?
I decided long ago that I would never pay for another album from a major label. I've never even heard of most of today's "chart topping" bands. I listen to indie music and swap CDs with my friends. When I do buy a CD -- which I actually do on occasion -- it involves handing a wad of bills to the artist. I seldom listen to the radio, and when I do it's classic rock. Since I only recognize copyright for 14 years (or 28 if the artist formally requests an extension, which of course none of them do anymore) I can freely download my favorite oldies from gnutella. And if anyone tries to stop me, I'll just shoot 'em in the face. Pretty simple, really...
I believe there is a fair degree of truth to the old maxim "5% of the worlds population owns 95% of the wealth". You and I and the others here are not likely to be in that 5%. Sure, big companies have shareholders, but the vast amount of shares are often privately held by a board of directors who control the company. The other shares are released onto the market to plump up the coffers, but without risking loss of control of the company if this is at all possible. The power belongs to the companies, not the people. Your governments are bankrolled by these companies, and the governments write laws to suit these financial giants. We exist only as a demographic to be sold to.
All those moments will be lost in time, like tears in rain.
well, if i was going to pay for it, i'd take the Copy-Protected Optical Media and bypass the copy protection - half price with free postage from any of the nice websites i know. it's lossless music i can do what i want with and a physical product that lasts and has $ value. no i'm not trolling, but i don't think that was +4 insightful. not for me and i'm sure plenty of others anyway.
This is my Sig, this is my Gun. One is for Slashdot and one is for Fun.
The simple answer is that you shouldn't copy material - it's against the law. Manufactures like me have to make a living, for heaven's sake.
I stole this
...if you buy it, it's copy protected. jesus.
no wait.. it actually should say that, because that's all it is. i haven't seen the exact message, but if it's not clear & honest these companies should be taken to court for lying to people. this is the kind of thing that really gets on my tits. there has to be a law that covers this in most 1st world countries?!
This is my Sig, this is my Gun. One is for Slashdot and one is for Fun.
I've bought the copy controlled "Fly or Die" by the N.E.R.D (Virgin/EMI) and wanted to rip it for my iPod. The same track failed to rip at exactly the same location on two different locations, trying both cdda2wav and cdparanoia on OpenBSD.
This is the very first time I wasn't successful ripping a copy controlled CD - saddly, the "industry" seems to improve.
Thanks Virgin Record, EMI and the N.E.R.D.
It can't be copy protected *that* well if I was able to download it all from SuprNova the other week.
OK, so this copy-protection tech does not wipe away the rendundancy, scratch-protection data from the CD. That's good.
I am still happy that I listen to classical music. Somehow these copyprotection schemes don't seem to be coming to the classical world.
Sigged!
"But more than just copy-protection: as The-Bus (138060) demonstrates by copying the entire CD EULA, BMG will also slip in DRM keys "personalized" .... "
Surely, the whole claim behind these EULAs is that you can change the terms AFTER the sale, if the contract gives you the option of returning the product for a full refund.
The refund is suposed to make it comparable to a sale.
This BMG contract says "if you don't agree, don't play it" not "if you don't agree return it for a full refund".
So they're not even putting a pretence of making this legal.
so where is the torrent?
after a brief search look at this : Velvet_Revolver-Contraband-2004-RNS regards
downloaded and deleted. Pure crap, buy a hammer and hit your testicles with it, it has to be more enjoyable
thinking about it, as legal as you wanan get there's really NO way to copy protect a freakin' sound. RIAA and whoever else want's to win this battle needs to find new methods of securing their copyrights. frankly, i'll do what i want with MY property despite what anyone says. and if that means putting a microphone up next to a speaker i'll do it. really, how can you stop someone from recording a sound?
fact: microsoft > linux
all i do is rip the tracks off the CD and add them to my jukebox (kde's juk). if i want to copy the cd, i just copy the ripped tracks onto a cd, no hassle.
i can put tracks on my netmd this way too
To copy the CD, all you have to do is friggin' press shift??!? Are they serious? Why should I be worried about this? Am I missing something? Is this really, really that lame?
The article is light on details as to exactly WHAT this CD is. Just a standard music CD with a data track with software that loads upon Window$ reading of autorun.inf?
I guess another, more serious question to ask is: If I press shift and copy the files, have I violated the DMCA? Just wonderin'
Buses stop at a bus station
Trains stop at a train station
On my desk there's a workstation....
If I can hear it, I can copy it. Going analog (mind the 'og'...) does not kill you, on decent equipment.
I'm with you on this. I don't have any copies of CDs and I'm boycotting anything with DRM on it but I'm wondering if there's an easy way to check (without trying to copy the CD) whether or not it's DRM'd? If I don't see the CD Audio logo on the disc then I'm suspicious but I'm not sure I can count on that. Anyone know of an easy way to know for sure?
---
We spoke for about a half an hour. I don't recall a thing we said. - Colorblind James Experience
No, the sheeple will contentedly line up to have their pockets raped, provided they can instantly have the latest 30 seconds of digital clipping noise and shiny video. If they had spines, the RIAA wouldn't have succeeded with screwing everyone to the tune of $10-12 profit (or more) on every CD they paid a whopping $1.25 to manufacture and package.
If getting ripped off for an 80% profit margin wasn't enough to wake the sheeple up, why would you think they'll raise a stink about DRM?
Most of them are even uneducated enough to think it's a problem with their "old" CD player, and will spend even more money fixing a "problem" that never was.
I do not fail; I succeed at finding out what does not work.
My wife wanted it, and at the time play.com were selling the Canadian (non crippled) import, so I bought that as I refuse to pay for substandard goods. However, this should show that 99% of the general public couldn't give a flying filesystem check about copy protection.
When I am king, you will be first against the wall.
I suppose that if it does become an issue they'll just address it with something like a good old fashioned shrinkwrap license on the CD -- "by opening this CD you are giving us permisssion to install whatever the hell we want on to your computer."
Oh, well...in the meantime, is there anybody in Utah with some free time on their hands and a desire to be a test case? :)
* * *
It is a dada story -- it has no moral.
Next you'll be telling us that it isn't wrong to treat your customers as criminals/the enemy... Oh... right, nevermind :)
Seriously, what you said may sound paranoid, but it's also the most logical, simple explanation. What they want is for people to buy the album and related albums as many times as possible. Mixed CDs? No! You buy Greatest Hits albums. Et cetera...
Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken - Tyler Durden
Let me check...yep, the Velvet Revolver CD Contraband is available on the iTunes music store. The greedy bastards just want you to buy the same music twice. Once on CD, once digitally. Doesn't that fly right in the face of fair use?
I hate sigs.
I know this post may get lost in the shuffle, but I just checked with a few sources online and low-and-behold there is the entire album in MP3 waiting to be downloaded by anyone and everyone that knows where to find it.
So much for copy-protected CD's. Why do they even waste their time with this non-sense? Instead of trying to figure out how to fool the copiers...why not turn the entire buisness model upside down and encourage downloading the album and then making the money back from live shows?
You know 60 years or so ago artists made their money from live shows or live broadcasts on the radio. They can do this again.
I could go on and on about this. People may argue about how the guy sitting in his bedroom making music and recording and pouring his heart out into making a CD is being ripped-off if people just download it. Well, that guy sitting there probably has a passion for music and would be making music anyway...and giving it to the community afterwards is much like Open Source programming. How many programmers from around the world slave over code to make something that they're not getting a dime from? I feel that music in the future can somehow learn from Open Source. How exactly, I don't know yet.
"Music is everybody's possession. It's only publishers who think that people own it." - John Lennon.
Has severe penalties for willfully misleading.
I hope they applied for an excemption.
Fact: It is NOT a 'CD'
Fact: It is a defective product - does not meet CD standards.
Fact: Don't know what stickers they use to qualify the product in different countries.
To burnt consumers, register a formal complaint.
If it silently runs/launches a program, interferes with normal computer operation, the company could possibly be be had for virus/cybercrime offences.
also if you don't let the program install then you never agreed to the EULA
I think we owe it to the record companies for empowering us with these technological marvels. Screw the artist who produced the music, he should get royalty/credit only once (for my original purchase). The record execs are the ones who created this new performance and they need to get paid too.
BTW, this comment applies to the recent self-destructable DVDs too. Keep up the good work [RM][IP]AA groups.
Nice one! :)
I watched a PBS special on the recording industry a few weeks ago. Velvet Revolver's record release buildup was extensivly covered. Industry executives pwere predicting like a 90% chance for a breakout album. Presales alone indicated the same.
"God fights on the side with the best artillery." - Napoleon, Marshal of France - speaking truth to power
Someone made it incredibly easy for you to do this, too.
Yeah, right.
So, you're telling me that if I BUY a music CD, it'll install software on my PC that could potentially be spyware, trojan or other crap? And it might do this if I just stick it into my CD drive via autorun?
Wow. You just made me want to download it from the Internet even more...
If I buy a CD then it is reasonable use to copy it to my iPod. If I can't, I will sue.
Device manager-->View hidden devices-->sort by connection-->SbcpHid-->Properties-->Driver-->Stop.
Now you may RIP as you please, just in case ye fergot to hold the shift key before.
HAD
On a whim I bought the album on itunes (i'm a big GN'R fan and kinda like STP)...
... who can it be now, knocking on my door.. it's RIAA don't make a sound....
I wonder if russian ripping service allofmp3 has this album... dammit not yet contraband search returns
"Men at Work - Contraband - The Best Of Men At Work "
I liked the single on VR contraband (slither) but the rest of the album sounds a little half arse... there's one decent ballad on there that's kinda like a country'ed up "sweet child o mine" *Shrug*
but i digress...
e.
Build Your Own PVR/HTPC news, reviews, &
I dont think people accepted it as they prolly didnt know about it until they bought it. then were like "oh shit, wtf is this? oh well, I bought it and brought it home"
oh and not to mention, cd sales dont count returns IIRC.
Security Focus has a posting about the 5 Boroughs CD installing some copy protection software if you put the CD in a Windows or Mac system. There's much griping on a Beastie Boys message board, but few details. A Google search indicates that this is not the case in US and UK, though someone picked one up in Manahattan that's copy protected. Since this album just came out a couple of days ago, it'll be interesting to hear how this pans out.
which apparently tries to install copy-protection software on your computer when inserted (Win and Mac obviously). Hell, while they're at it, why not install Gator or Bonzi Buddy?
Free Tibet, my ass...
What is music when you despise all sound?
What is the answer to this problem? Don't buy Contraband by Velvet Revolver. For that matter, don't buy CDs from any of the big labels. Boycott is a consumer's only recourse. If we let them get away with this, then we give up our fair use and personal property rights forever, and accept the RIAA et al's pay for play model. Kids, stop feeding the hand that bites you!
How ya like dat?
I bought this cd (Velvet Revolver) a couple days ago. The first thing I did when I got inside my house is threw it in my computer CD player and ripped it to mp3's (using GRIP on Slackware 9.something).
No problems here. Infact i'm listening to one of the mp3's right now.
1 2 1 2 THE NAKEN CREW
I first read about this yesterday. I bought the CD last week and didn't notice the DRM label reportedly on the wrapper. I would have bought it anyway.
Autoplay is always disabled on my WinXP box, because for me, having it enabled is actually an inconvenience. I had no problem ripping them to WMA(done initially out of habit)and then to MP3(switched to this for use under FreeBSD).
Although this "protection" didn't keep me from using the CD in this way, most Joe and Jane Users will not have this disabled. So, this protection might keep them from ripping. The main P2P users are kids, and most of them will eventually know how to circumvent it whether it be by disabling autorun or pressing the shift key.
Later
-Slashdot Junky
.
Landfill Mining Co.
Managing the (Un)natural Resources of Tomorrow
You lazy sods.
Ironically enough, I was reading this /. article this morning at home before going to work and was thinking about how I hadn't had any issues ripping any of my CDs. It wasn't until I got to work that I found out that one of my own CDs is copy protected.
The CD is Goatwhore's "Funeral Dirge for the Rotting Sun." I'm going to see them tonight and decided I wanted to listen to their music some while at work, and lo and behold Windows Media Player won't recognize it. In fact, when I inserted the CD a box came up telling me that I "Some files need to be updated before you can play this CD," so it appears to be a SunComm style copy protection. (I'm not sure if it is Suncomm's software though.) The funny thing is, I've already ripped the CD. The first thing I do when I buy any CD is rip it to mp3 so that I don't have to go digging for the CD while at home and so I can transfer it to my personal mp3 player. There is, however, a notification on the back of the album art that it is a copy protected CD. Also, like some other CDs mentioned in other posts there is no CD Audio logo on the album cover or the CD itself. (It is, however, stamped on the inside of the jewel case.) However, that does not necessarily mean anything either. A quick look at my most recent CD purchase (Auf der Maur's self titled album) and it appears to be a standard CD, but the CD Audio logo is nowhere to be found.
Anyway, if it were any band other than Goatwhore, I would immediately take the CD back. Unfortunately, in this case that goes against my beliefs in supporting local bands. Hell, I work with a family member of the band and I know one of the sound engineers who worked on the CD.
...Maybe I can use those connections to educate the band that some people may not buy their CD due to the copy protection...
If Murphy's Law can go wrong, it will.
Had I know the CD was copy-protected though, I wouldnt have even bought it on iTunes. Just renforced why I buy Indie now
"Slashdot, where telling the truth is overrated but lying is insightful."
I have been reading through the modded up posts here and I have yet to see one that mentions the fact that shit "protection" scheme does not work with a Linux based OS; and isn't that what /. is all about? I bought this album ($9.99 and Best Buy) and decided to read the cover fully before I broke the seal on the package when I got it home. After reading some very fine print (someone's definition of "prominently" is very messed up) I learned that the disc uses the MediaMax "protection" system. I then did a quick search to determine if this would affect me as a Debian user. I learned that this "protection" system would only really affect Windows machines, and then if they only have auto-run enabled, so I opened the package and proceeded to rip it with Grip and encode to Ogg -q5. I also had no problems copying the disc with cdrdao for use in my car. I honestly don't see the problem here. If the anti-copy mechanism doesn't work there is no need to get in a huff about it. Just go on your merry way and let the record companies think this system is all that and a bag of chips. It doesn't affect anyone with half a brain.
As a side note, this album is really quite good. At first listen it is rather bland - not bad but not great. After listening to it some more, though, the music starts to shine and album shows how good these musicians really are.
Slash is the man.
ummm yeah, i got this off the internet in 5 minutes. looks like the drm works really well. i'm probably going to buy it anyway because it doesn't suck.
I don't know what the hell these people are talking about, but I bought this album the day it came out and immediately ripped it with Musicmatch onto my Nomad Zen as a 320kbs MP3...
Keep Austin Weird!
I ripped the CD using iTunes on my mac into 160 KBPS Mp3 files, which I then burned to a CD containing the collected works of Guns N Roses and Stone Temple Pilots (the bands who's members make up Velvet Revolver) and have been listening to the backup in my car for over a week. I saw the copy protection thing on the sleeve, but iTunes didn't offer any resistance to importing the files.
using Grip.... no problems at all.
-Cnik
"but they have been hearing questions about how people can get the copy-blocked songs from the CD onto an iPod"
Actually, it costs a lot less than $1.25 to press and package a commercial audio CD, but you are right, the outdated, inefficient, and corrupt marketing schemes used by distributors is to blame for the high price of media.
Although, don't forget that the big five distributors were CONVICTED during the Napster case of price fixing in a federal court. I got my $13 check, did you get yours?
[RIAA] says its concern is artists. That's true, in just the sense that a cattle rancher is concerned about its cattle.
There's no issue.
If you can't rip YOUR cd to YOUR ipod just download it.
It was available on a couple P2Ps a few days before it hit the shelves.
Distributors sell more cds, that is really cool for them, but now, they use the P2P argument to cut costs: "Selling cds is no more profitable", I don't think so, these companies laid off a lot of people, and only after that, they have found a new mean to recover money?? That sounds really strange, why not having done so at the beginning? Because it was only a matter of time, P2P was just a mean to increase profitability by cutting jobs and pushing non profitable artists out of the market. And so, what now? Diversity in music is disappearing, and is only distributed through P2P networks... So you can be sued because you want to hear something that does not belong to the charts. Moreover, these protections are only jokes, whenever you can hear at the tracks, you can rip those. I will sustain those companies when they sell blank cds to prevent piracy.
Buy it, rip it, RETURN IT!
When they get a significant return rate, they will get the point.
It is not a CD. You thought it was, but it does not play right.
Hit them in the wallet, that they notice.
/.ers can crash web sites,
can WE make a difference in this fight?
Your homework for this weekend, buy, rip, return.
Well fuck, you might as well keep them then. As long as you have broken the law, deleting them won't absolve you from any wrongdoing then, right?
So if I play a friend's CD in my computer, I have broken the law? The songs load up in memory, so I have a copy of them. Even if it is only for the length of the song (longer than 30 seconds).
Funny how slippery these ignorant slopes are getting.
My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.
All the songs from Velvet Revolvers album Contraband were avaliable in P2P-ville at high quality variable bit rates before it was released to the public. Many CD's find their way onto the P2P networks day's, weeks or a couple of months before they're officialy released to the public.
SunnComm execs spotted buying 1 million copies of "Velvet Revolver" CD.
The record companies report sales by the amount shipped to distributors and will also send thousands and thousands of "spam" and promo copies and count those as sales.
"Corporate rock still sucks. What are you gonna do about it?"
Ive had the mp3's now for at least 2 weeks.
You bougth something, expecting it to be a standard CD. (reasonable, given that the copy-protection is typically poorly marked, and the CDs stacked up on racks intermixed with the non-CDs) That is, you gave away money, reasonably expecting to get a CD for it that would play in any machine capable of playing CDs.
;-)
Well, in point of fact, these new Velvet Revolver CD's *ARE* standard CD's. They conform to the Blue Book Standard for hybrid CD Audio/Data discs. They'll play in any CD player, even that MP3-CD player.
The only copy protection here is a data track with some software and an autorun. Install the software, it fucks with your CD drivers when you try to rip. That's it. Hold SHIFT to bypass, or disable the autorun, or when the screen comes up that says "An upgrade is required", hit Cancel. Yes, you can actually *cancel* the installation on this sucker.
So as far as the record exec thinking that people approve of CD Protection mechanisms, maybe he means that people approve of easily disabled protection mechanisms.
- Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day, but set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.
Even if it wasn't, when they factor in that one lawyer is less expensive than the hundreds of returns that people could demand refunds for should they set this precedent, they would easily favor showing up.
Mathematics is made of 50 percent formulas, 50 percent proofs, and 50 percent imagination.
I got the CD and I was really dissapointed. Scott Weiland, who I really liked in STP, just does not fit in. Plus, the music sounds a bit too 80s pop metal for me. For a band like this they really needed a stronger singer. I know that I just bitched about the 80s pop sound, but Sebastian Bach (former Skid Row, a band I never really liked) would have been alot better - he has a strong voice and an amazing range.
I just saw that one in a.b.s.mp3.2000s
By "copy protected" do they mean that if my copies come in contact with the CD it won't catch some nasty STD (or CDTD)?
Yeesh, what'll they think up next.
Whenever you read this sig someone's refrigerator light turns on.
Velvet Revolver's CD was available on the net weeks before it was released.
So called pirates still get their music. While those who actually buy it will be unable to put it on their MP3 players. Why would any one buy it?!
If the music is readily available via p2p, and if those who actually buy it get screwed, then what's the point of DRM?!
I'm serious, can someone explain this to me?!
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
I'm sure i'm not the first to say "I've got a copy without a label :)
See Sig! See Sig Zig! Zig Sig Zig!!!!!
Way back when the powers that be in the recording industry tried to put copy protection on VHS tapes. I was able to make copies of the so call "copy protected tapes." What copy protection is to me is just a minor annoyance and nothing more. Even with this so called "copy protected" CD's, you can still copy them with a program called "Total Recorder" which will record anything played thru your sound card. The URL is http://www.highcriteria.com. If that doesn't work you can use your stereo CD player with patch cords to the AUX input to your sound card and then use the above program to record it. Where there is a will there is a way. George
I thought the same. What a prick.
I've seen a couple of posts here about buying the CD to "support the artist".
What an insult to humanity...these guys don't need your support, and there are literally billions of people in the world that truly need a little slice of your CD/Benevolent_Art_Supporter budget.
Feel better about yourself for kicking a few bucks to people who wipe there asses with hundred dollar bills. Just try not to think about the real world while you do it.
Since you're using a purely audio CD player, the CD will work on it. Even fairly basic compact stereo systems have digital output.
Hmm, got this and several other files sittin on my hard drive.
00-velvet_revolver-contraband-2004-rns.nfo
your belvoed copy protection fuckin SUCKS, your shit is all over the internet before it even hit the street.
FREEDOM - 1, RIAA FACISM - 0
Next!
Funny thing these copy protected CD's - they don't play on my DJ setup. Which means that I can't play them, despite the fact that the clubs I spin in all pay their ASCAP and BMI fees to allow me to do so. Usually these are mainstream records that I'd want to play because the crowd likes them (my own tastes are indie label and rarely DRM protected).
But the real loser, as usual, is the artist - their music isn't being played in the club so no public performance royalty, and their CD is returned so no points or mechanicals. (If you buy lots of records, stores are fairly cool about believing you when you need to make a return.) So the artist makess no money and loses out on a promotional opportunity to boot (i.e. "Hey DJ, what was that song you just played...?")
What ever happened to the "The customer is always right" attitude? It's curiously absent in today's world. Instead, record and movie execs would prefer to try to use technology to beat the consumer. You need the mp3s for you iPod? Download them--they're a dollar each. Scratch your original CD? Buy another. I've spent a fortune on CDs--but I won't pay for this. That CD is crackable--trust me. I've heard the cracked version, and it's as clear as day. Of course, I deleted it as soon as I heard it. ;)
People who like to rock are rebellious by nature. They don't like being forced into a corner. What these guys need to do is hire some psychologists.
Contracts 101. If the CD doesn't play in a device it should, you have the right to rescind the contract i.e., a right to a refund. Where did YOU get YOUR law degree?
-truth
I had a steady B+ in my AI class until I failed the Turing test...
If companies want to trash up their CDs with all sorts of worthless gack, more power to them. Because the DRM trend is the best thing that ever happened to my music collection. When I found out that the artist-screwing, mediocrity-championing, price-fixing cockroaches in the mainstream music biz were now proposing to charge me the same thing for a less useful product I made a simple decision: I would not support them any more. Now I buy legacy content used and new content from indies - true indies, not major label shills. And my music collection has never been more interesting.
There's a genius guitar player who charges me a flat subscription rate. A couple dozen times a year a CD shows up in the mail - hand-decorated, with hand-crafted packaging, frequently a one-off live recording, the only one in the world. I pay less than $5 on average per CD.
The other night I went to Bitpass' Mperia.com and started browsing the downloadable music, some available as low as $.25 per track. A couple of hours and about $14 later I had well over thirty new songs on my hard drive with no restrictions whatsoever.
I buy more things at concerts by local artists. I buy more from CD Baby. I get a fair amount of content totally free and legal off the internet... and often end up supporting an independently produced artist with a CD purchase on the strength of what they gave away freely.
And it all has two things in common. It's less expensive and more interesting than what I'm likely to find on the shelves at Walmart or Sam Goody. I would estimate my music budget dollars are nearly twice as effective with this strategy as they were when I mainly bought new major-label-produced content.
Now, I'm rather a stickler about it, but there's no reason you would have to be; if you wanted to replace 20 or 50 or 90% of your purchases but still buy your favorite artists or whatever - nothing to stop you. The point is - just because some mainstream junk with DRM is topping the charts doesn't mean they're winning. We all oughta know by now that chart-toppers or not, the music industry is not doing well financially. Me, I registered my feelings on DRM with all the major labels years ago. They didn't listen so I took my dollar away. I don't want to stop them doing what they're doing - that's freedom of speech, as messed up of an example as it is - artists has the right to sell out their freedom of speech for a terrible record deal, publisher has the right to hawk their overpriced content purchases gacked up with DRM. Every artist has the right to produce and sell their stuff exactly how they want and I have the right to choose.
So choose!
It Is the Nature of Information to Transgress Artificial Boundaries
The copy protection works so well that it is impossible to find MP3, let alone loseless versions of this album online.
Jooleem. Get Addicted.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Sony Music ships Music CDs with a low tech copy protection which will prevent such CD to play on Computer, DVD players, Car MP3 players.
.. now CD is ready to be played/ripped/tickled.
They mix a data track on music CD and remember it doesn't have any autorun program, data track confuses smart devices like PC and DVD/MP3 players but generic CD players simply ignore the data track and play music just fine.
A low tech trick can enable such CDs to play on computer etc.
Take a black marker (Non Permanent) and mask the outer most track by drawing a smooch circle on the CD and voila
-AC
Comment removed based on user account deletion
"The SunnComm and BMG execs quoted in the article say that they're pleased with the apparent consumer acceptance of the anti-piracy technology, but they have been hearing questions about how people can get the copy-blocked songs from the CD onto an iPod."
This should tell them that the people buying the CDs probably don't realize what it is that they are buying and are going to be pissed when they find out.
The race isn't always to the swift... but that's the way to bet!
And it just gets tougher-- we don't even *know* who voted for the DMCA if I remember correctly. The vote was done in some sort of "name not recorded" procedure, so there's no way to know which ones are the idiots/beholden to industry and which ones stood up for our rights.
The purpose behind DRM confused me. There is no doubt that Velvet Revolver's music was readily available on the net for free before the CD was even released. Thus, any so-called pirate was able to get it with no problem.
There is also no doubt, as seen above, that the DRM was easily circumvented.
There is also no doubt, that those who legitimately bought the CD and respect the digital millennium copyright act, are screwed. They are unable to convert their newly bought CD to a different format, even though doing so is perfectly legal under the fair use laws of the US.
Considering there is no doubt as to the utter failure of DRM, as shown above, I was perplexed at why it exists. I had trouble finding the answer as I was looking at it logically. The answer to my question is that there is no logical basis for DRM as it is necessarily true that DRM fails stops so-called pirates and screws legitimate buyers.
So what's the answer? I've determined that when confronted by a problem, it is felt by most people that doing something is necessarily better than doing nothing. This is seen as true even when the result of that something is worse than if nothing was done in the first place. Even when that happens, when doing something exacerbates the problem, people will say in defense of their screw up, "Hey, at least I did something!"
This psychological mindset is at play in relation to DRM. The morons in charge of the music industry see so-called piracy as a problem. They can either do something or do nothing. Even though DRM causes more problems, i.e., screwing over legitimate buyers while not putting any dent in so called piracy, they continue doing that something because they feel that doing nothing would somehow be worse. And that's despite all the evidence that clearly shows that DRM is actually worse.
This is why I think DRM will eventually fail. Over time those in power will see the futility of their "something" and do something else to solve any problems associated with so called piracy.
If someone says he and his monkey have nothing to hide, they almost certainly do.
CD player with digital output, soundcard with digital input, some kind of basic (open source?) wave editor. For the CDs that even your TDK VeloCD drive can't rip (not very many).
I play *all* my CDs on my computer. Can't be bothered finding the disc I want to play out of the 800 or so I have.. so far, I've ripped them all no problem. Had to resort to the above method for two or so. Just burnt copies after I ripped them incase I had to do it again at some point. How amusing! The only CDs I make copies of are the "copy controlled" ones...
Don't let the bastards grind you down...
The RIAA 'buys' the song a place at the top of the chart, so it would be pretty easy to maniuplate which CD rises to the top, and choose a market that would have fewer people that would realize its copy protected.
Instant verification of their 'success' for marketing purposes to help usher in more copy restricted media..
---- Booth was a patriot ----
I have not purchased a CD in many years. When the RIAA can stop being greedy I will return to buying music. Why are CD's still $10+? I can go to walmart and buy a DVD for $5.50. Movies cost much more to make than a CD. Lower the price of CD's and I will come back to CD's. As for online music, those cost too much too. Why should I pay $15.00 for 15 songs, the CD costs less, and with a cd I have a hard copy. Make the per song price cheap and make good music and people will download lots of music. Why priate music if you can get it cheap? As for copy protection of the songs, it is more of a pain to paying customers than pirates. So forget the copy protection in songs.
At the risk of prosecution, I've already ripped and copied the Velvet Revolver CD I bought last week. For what it's worth, really, really good CD.
ont-day alk-tay about usenet-bay
There is someone somewhere that will have no problem converting from analog to digital and then publish on P2P.
Have you noticed those MP3 files that sound worst than a radio tape recording?
Well, if you are not deaf.
L+G
The $999 HD-Tivo is already out, and it's very useful.
The revolution may have to wait a while.
i am a huge gnr and also stp fan. i went to the concert here in kansas city and i liked it so much that i bought the cd last week... i am listening to it on my computer here at work after running it thru grip and streaming it from home... what kind of copy protection was on the cd? i haven't noticed any problems yet?
This friend of mine got Velvet Revolver songs off p2p networks a week ago. If the protected CDs are not worth buying because they won't play, there's always the net...
"Creativity is allowing ones self to make mistakes. Art is knowing which ones to keep" - Scott Adams
I copied it, maybe the copy protection is just for people who don't know much about computers....
So if I play a friend's CD in my computer, I have broken the law? The songs load up in memory,
That depends on how you play it. If you play it like normal people, the cdrom is actually producing an analog audio output that goes direct to the sound card and out to the speakers (unless you are using a digital output, yada yada). In this case, you haven't loaded a copy into memory.
Not that it matters, its perfectly legal* (in the US) for you to make a copy of your friends CD's, the RIAA gets a payoff^H^H^H^H^H^Hcut of audio cassette and CDR sales so they will leave you alone.
* As far as I'm aware, there it isn't required that you actually buy a cassette or audio CDR to get this protection.
is it against the dcma if you have autoplay disabled before this cd came out?
http://www.backstab.net
8. Tubgirls on Film
I just downloaded 3 songs from the new velvet revolver CD...I guess the record execs don't have WinMX!!
That was kind of the point
Record companies can now laud that they've created a new unbreakable copy program and everyone else who doesn't autorun their cds can copy freely. The point is that the music companies can pat themselves on the back for being so clever and show how their new copy protected cds are doing well, and the rest of us cheap bastards can ignore it all together
The sad part is there was probably a great deal of money and research put into this 'solution'
Oh well whatever they can do to tell themselves they are saving the music industry. I just wish they'd pour that money into producing good music. After all, there has been no evidence that P2P programs and music copying are even hurting record sales. Everywhere, except on and aruond college campases, music sales are as strong as ever.
I think the problem people are seeing is that file sharing seems to kill the one hit wonder bands of the world. Like a song, download some tracks. If they have nothing else good, store their one song on Simon's Sexy Summmer Mix 83.
Personally, if I want to support an artist I enjoy, I go see them in concert. That's where the artist (not the record company) gets their money. And i'm sure every bad (short of metallica because lars hates everyone) would prefer you to pay $30 on their concert t-shirts, then $20 on their cds.
The Neo-Bohemian Techno-Socialist
Maybe the CD is actually good and thats why people bought it?
*ponder*
who would of thought, good music = sales
Even with the new CD protection, it is still trivial to copy the contents of CDs.
One simply needs to connect the "analog" output of their CD player to a recording device (PC w/soundcard) and the protection can be circumvented.
As long as we are allowed to hear the music, it will always be copied.
There is no way of preventing music piracy short of bolting headphones to peoples heads!
They probably just want to prove how much they suffer from illegal P2P distribution and CD copying. They will try to claim, that it wouldn't be number one, if it wasn't protected.
That's why I have been using my Macs more than my Windows machines.
:)
Luckily I have access to numerous Windows machines so that I can experiment with all this so called Copy Protected CD's. Well, I could just reinstall Windows, but it'd be a lot more fun to install the copy protection scheme on computers of people that always giving me a hard time here at work. Teach them a lesson for Pirating Musics without sharing them with me!
/. their telephone lines with complaints, and they'll start seeing things differently.
"It's the height of ridiculousness to say for those 9 lines you get hundreds of millions."
If it's the same scheme that I'm thinking of, it was one of the first "Copy Protection" schemes.
The manufacturers purposefully damage the disk data. They rely on anti-skip technology in CD players to compensate for it, while a ripping program will go bit-for-bit and record the damaged data.
Of course, this perversion means that the margin of error that let the anti-skip technology do its job is now gone.
I read some source code patches once for CDparanoia which would let it work around this crap.
I thought consumers were supposed to be hating the RIAA and revolting against copy-protection measures! How can this CD top the charts when it's "not really a CD?"
Oh, that's because only the geek niche on Slashdot gets up in arms about things like this, not the rest of society. Don't you remember, nobody will buy the iPod Mini?
They were pissed off when the story broke, and said they would sue him, but backed off.
You may not be able to rip the song to an ipod, but you can by the song off of itunes for 9.99 and then put it on your ipod.
Music thieves of the world - Grow Up! Haven't any of you prison lawyers had a job yet. Here's a thought, go work for someone who will pay you with MP3 music files. Not a pretty world you would want to live in would you. Here's another thought, so many of the super rich are rich because so many of the super lazy just want to play video games. Learn how the rich get rich before you complain about anything and I don't mean all that prison talk about how you're the victim being repressed. They should rename this site to 'Slashdot Prison Talk'. Here's the first discussion - Help, I need a prison lawyer, my mothers making me look for a job! Ghost Atom
Or just use itunes on windows. It works.
What is a "US Album Chart"? Am I supposed to care about this "Chart"?
Am I paying more for this CD because of royalities payments for the copy protection?... or
Am I paying less because of the reduced functionality
Incidentally, I love the spin that SunComm put on this:I see this as an attempt to strong-arm Apple into using stronger DRM supplied by the record labels, instead of Apple's own FairPlay DRM.
"The SunnComm and BMG execs quoted in the article say that they're pleased with the apparent consumer acceptance of the anti-piracy technology."
Tin foil time:
The anti-piracy feature is not copy protection. It's failed, half-hearted copy protection, and they already know that. The real anti-piracy feature is in ripping these CDs despite the supposed protection, meaning you've circumvented it (despite the fact it works as well as a square car tire), and now you're in deep kimchee with the DMCA for both having copied copyrighted stuff AND breaking the protection scheme.
"I may be synthetic, but I'm not stupid." -- Bishop 341-B
Everywhere, except on and aruond college campases [sic], music sales are as strong as ever.
This brings up an interesting point for the RIAA. Isn't their target demographic for the vast majority of artists who are featured on labels part of the RIAA the lucrative 18-25 year olds? So you can talk about how music sales aren't down across all demographics, or how there really isn't any link to the increase of P2P programs to the decrease of music sales overall, but the one group that the RIAA really cares about is the one that shows the correlation the RIAA has been stating for quite some time.
DOnt many say to return it if you dont agree?
I'd love to try it out. Seriously.
For those with access to WMP9, you can download the whole album from Wal-Mart's music download store for $9.44 or individual tracks for $.88. I don't know if it's on iTunes yet. By the way, don't criticize this as another boy-band or Britney thing. Velvet Revolver is made up of some former members of Guns 'N Roses and the former lead singer of Stone Temple Pilots, etc. That is why this album is so popular.
We may experience some slight turbulence and then...explode. -Capt. Mal Reynolds
I did buy the CD online at BestBuy.com last week. Although I didn't notice the DRM warning, I wasn't looking for it. It must have been on the wrapper, because it is not on the jewel case or cardstock sleeve.
-Slashdot Junky
.
Landfill Mining Co.
Managing the (Un)natural Resources of Tomorrow
I just used CDex and ripped the thing with out any problems what so ever and put it an WinMX. I would to the record company coming after me, since the album is the only thing I'm sharing at the moment. What are they goign to do, arrest me for sharing music I OWN? haha. By the way, dont bother buying the album, it aint that good. They way my mind works, if it was a decent album, I would not be sharing it on WinMX, I'm just pissed i wasted my money ONCE AGAIN on a shitty album. No wonder that is the only album I have purchased in like 3 years.
Yes, you get to hear the guitar of Slash without the stink of Axel Rose messing everything up.
"Music is everybody's possession. It's only publishers who think that people own it." - John Lennon.
I ripped it fine and got it on my Ipod with windac
How come these Rich-O-Meters are always in Pounds and compare to either worldwide or the UK? How about a US one? Or, better, one that will let you pick your country?
"A great democracy must be progressive or it will soon cease to be a great democracy." --Theodore Roosevelt
I just ripped a copy of the CD at 256 K bits/second with no problem at all. Now I will just take it back to the store and tell them it wouldn't play in my CD player and would like a refund. :) I love this copy protection stuff, it gives me a valid reason to return a CD that I just ripped.... Thanks RIAA...
My guess is because the actual bands would have a lot more power to command the money. Plus it doesn't work anywhere near as nice for the one hit wonders, and it probably means a whole lot less money overall. Maybe they can make some money back with live shows, but why would they want to give up the money from the CDs? The stupid thing about this is that the copy protection probably does almost nothing to stop the pirate, and just annoys the person who has legitimate use (like copying to mp3 player, or playing in other equipment).
I bought the Velvet Revolver album, and as soon as I got home, I ripped it to my hard drive and made 2 copies. The original stays at home, one copy stays in my truck, and one copy went to my office. I noticed the data track when I ripped the CD to my hard drive, and figured I wouldn't have a problem since my OS of choice is Linux (slackware to be exact). All went without a problem, both copied CD's play just fine, and the mp3's on my hard drive are also just fine. It seems that copy protection is aimed or developed on and more M$ and Mac OS's. Linux didn't seem to worry that extra data track. :-P
- Pretty blue screens with white writting!
- Advertisments that open even without having to browse the web!
- Friends warning you that you are sending them viruses!
- Friendly error messages that hide their boring, repetitive message!
- Get helpful advice on moving on to your next overly priced video game, because that one your playing is just... old.
- And more!!!
Buy now and you can even spend the day trying to install those updates. You don't need them, however, this is the most secure and stable operating system in the world.You may need to purchase more RAM and a new CPU to keep up with rapidly increasing demands of todays software.
Why do people still feed money to the RIAA? You're enabling their sue-happy ways!
-Rich
This is true, but the fact is the horse is out of the barn...the cat is out of the bag...the RIAA and it's companines are trying to hang on to their strangle-hold of music. But their days are numbered. The more they tighten their grip, the more slips through their fingers.
They either change to fit the times, or they die. It's as simple as that.
Next step in preventing copying is not to sell CD's anymore...don't put them out there, no one can copy them! They'll have special listening booths where you go and pay $20 to listen to the CD one time...and of course they'll be glass boothes for monitoring and you'll be searched like at the airport for any recording device. You pay your money, go in, listen for 72 minutes and then leave.
There, no copying, and the RIAA still rakes in the cash! Sound crazy? This is actually one of their ideas!
"Music is everybody's possession. It's only publishers who think that people own it." - John Lennon.
One of many. Since their copy protection doesn't work, I guess they'll have to fall back on the DMCA and suing people incautious enough to not host their music overseas.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
First off, you're about the 5,000th person to mention that.
Second, everyone who read the article knows how trivial it is to defeat the copy protection, and that the company that put it out knows it too.
Slashdot gets worse every day... Pipedot: News for nerds, without the corporate slant
(Score:5, Insightful?)
I'm sorry but there is no such a thing as "law-abiding way" of "true civil desobedience," it's an oxymoron. And no, your advise has absolutely nothing to do with civil desobedience, especially not true civil desobedience. Real civil desobedience is a "refusal to obey civil laws in an effort to induce change in governmental policy or legislation, characterized by the use of passive resistance or other nonviolent means." (The American Heritage Dictionary of the English Language, 4th Ed.) True civil desobedience is braking the law and going to jail to demonstrate that the law is not fair. Not only it has nothing to do with your proposal but is of course impossible to do in any "law-abiding way," a priori. Returning a CD is hardly civil desobedience. Going to jail and letting people wear "Free HuguesT!" would be. I believe it to be a very important difference.
Sincerely,
Pan Tarhei Hosé, PhD.
"Homo sum et cogito ergo odi profanum vulgus et libido."
I cannot recall the exact text of the ad but it's message was clear:
The fourth most precious commodity, after food, clothing, and shelter, is this:
A person's attention.
I remember the picture used in the ad. It was a guy off in the distance looking at (I think it was) a small yellow ball on the 'floor' in the foreground of the ad.
I basically gave up on commercial TV because, basically its overal content disgusts me--it's so superficial. About all I can stomach is the TV news on regular TV nowadays....
The 'last' straw was when marketers installed advertising in public bathroms! Can't a person have a little privacy and quiet time when they are 'answering the call of nature'?
http://www.ftc.gov/opa/2002/06/3tenors.htm
- 30 -cd-settlement_x.htm
Here's the one (the MAP case) that you are talking about that was settled. It was a class action by 39 states attorneys general and the record companies settled. I love the quote in the article saying the price of CDs should go down to $5 after the settlement...ha.
http://www.usatoday.com/life/music/news/2002-09
Oh, and that case started from a ruling by the FTC that the record companies had indeed been price fixing and the record companies got off with very little fine and promising to stop the MAP pricing program for 7 years. They didn't stop and 39 states sued.
[RIAA] says its concern is artists. That's true, in just the sense that a cattle rancher is concerned about its cattle.
Yes...I know the link points to the admin hearing (which goes to the full commision). The commision reports of the FTC are all PDFs and nobody clicks on a PDF in slashdot...feh.
I figured that slashdotters would be intelligent and diligent enough to do there own digging if they wanted more information, but apprently not. (at least for old geoffy up there...nice email response there buddy).
Sad...
[RIAA] says its concern is artists. That's true, in just the sense that a cattle rancher is concerned about its cattle.
Many people still wrongly expect them to capable of being ripped to an iPod, hence the controversy.
"But a CD's purpose is to be used in a CD player."
And these CDs do play in CD players, unless there is something wrong with the CD player. In which case the fault is not with the CD so you can't demand a refund.
It should also be noted that these CDs do contain stickers saying "This CD is protected against unauthorized duplication. It is designed to play on standard playback devices and an appropriately configured computer (see system requirements on back). If you have questions or concerns visit www.sunncomm.com/support/bmg". So if your CD player is not a "standard playback device" or "appropriately configured computer" meeting their system requirements, you have no basis to complain.
"I mean playing as a normal CD does, in a CD player, which is what some of these DRM'ed CD do not. "
If by "some of these DRM'ed CD" you mean "early attempts at Digital Rights Management that met with failure and thus have been replaced by new technologies such as SunnComm's MediaMax which is used in the Velvet Revolver CD". But that has no real relevance to the topic at hand, does it? Of course since we know you must have RTFA before posting, you already knew that.
Besides, I believe those protected CDs contained warnings that they could not be played on CD-ROMs, so the argument that their purpose is to be played in any CD player again does not apply.
"If the customer did not have sufficient notice as the non-compliance..."
So a sticker on the front of the CD does not count as sufficient notice? What do you want them to do, glue a big neon sign to the case?
Mathematics is made of 50 percent formulas, 50 percent proofs, and 50 percent imagination.
This is a classic security tactic byu using the average users ignorace as the tool. The label implies that the copy protected content will not be playable with out the software. That is a lie. The Software attempts to install immediately upon inserting the CD. If the Software is aborted it ejects the CD. Whatever you do do not install the software. The Copy protection will only work if you install the software. Once you install the software - U R Screwed. On a Windows based PC hold down the SHIFT key when you insert the CD - this will bybass the autorun feature. Then you can utilize the CD just like any other non-copy protected CD - RIP it to MP3 and download the contents to your MP3 Player of choice. For more detailed inforemation: http://www.cs.princeton.edu/~jhalderm/cd3/