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What is 'IT'?
From "Service Call," a short story by Philip K. Dick:
The young man flushed, swallowed noisily, tried to grin, and then hurried on huskily, "Sir, I'm the repairman you asked for; I'm here to fix your swibble."
The facetious retort that came to Courtland's mind was one that later on he wished he had used. "Maybe," he wished he had said, "I don't want my swibble fixed. Maybe I like my swibble the way it is." But he didn't say that. Instead, he blinked, pulled the door in slightly, and said, "My what?"
"Yes, sir," the young man persisted. "The record of your swibble installation came to us as a matter of course. Usually we make an automatic adjustment inquiry, but your call preceded that -- so I'm here with complete service equipment. Now, as to the nature of your particular complaint..." Furiously, the young man pawed through the sheaf of papers on his clipboard. "Well, there's no point in looking for that; you can tell me orally. As you probably know, sir, we're not officially part of the vending corporation ... we have what is called an insurance-type coverage that comes into existence automatically, when your purchase is made. Of course, you can cancel the arrangement with us." Feebly, he tried a joke. "I have heard there're a couple of competitors in the service business."
Stern morality replaced humor. Pulling his lank body upright, he finished, "But let me say that we've been in the swibble repair business ever since old R.J. Wright introduced the first A-driven experimental model."
For a time, Courtland said nothing. Phantasmagoria swirled through his head: random quasi-technological thoughts, reflex evaluations and notations of no importance. So swibbles broke down, did they? Big-time business operations ... send out a repairman as soon as the deal is closed. Monopoly tactics ... squeeze out the competition before they have a chance. Kickback to the parent company, probably. Interwoven books.
[...]
A swibble. What the hell was a swibble? And he was on the in, industrially speaking. He read U.S. News, the Wall Street Journal. If there was a swibble he would have heard about it -- unless a swibble was some pip-squeak gadget for the home. Maybe that was it.
You can find this story in The Collected Stories of Philip K. Dick, Volume 4: The Minority Report.
Thoughtfully, he added, "In fact I'd say the real war was a war over swibbles. I mean, it was the last war. It was the war between the people who wanted swibbles and those who didn't." Complacently, he finished, "Needless to say, we won."
Didn't anyone else think: he took two small boxes in. he made people very exited. he does transport stuff. it's clean, and safe (hence can't move too fast) so maybe he walk from one box to the next without spending time in-between. A transporter so to speak. But then even I think I'm insane.
I think to make a reasonable guess, we should set up some stipulations as to what this IT must accomplish to make sense in light of the information we do have.
Let's assume that these people who have commented on IT are at least as intelligent as we are, so they would tend to think of the same problems that we would in regards to how well this will work. The information in the origional article is only of value if we can assume that it's well thought through and realistic.
So, we have been told that this will be revolutionary, that it will sell for about $2,000, it will change the world more than the internet, that it will make this guy richer than Bill Gates in 5 years, and that you can put them together easily.
From these facts, we can infer the following:
1) It's simple. If you can put it together quickly and it's under $2,000 it can't be very complex, and it can't incorporate any super high-technology, you can't make monopole magnets and room-temp superconducting for under $2,000.
2) It would be used by a LARGE number of people. In order for it to have more impact on society than the internet, hundreds of millions of people all over the world will have to use this on a daily basis.
3) It's easy to mass-produce and has a fair profit margin. If this guy's going to become richer than Bill Gates in 5 years, this thing has to be easy to make at quite a bit less than $2,000, and it has to have mass-market appeal.
4) It would have to produce a complete revolution, a change in the way we think about one or more important aspects of society. Our daily lives would have to change in a meaningful and significant way.
If we apply these rules to some of the different guesses so far, I think most of them fall flat. A personal flying machine would be difficult to learn how to safely use, and would be useless in a huge city like LA where there would be hundreds of thousands of people flying in a limited space. This contradicts rule 2.
Same goes for a hover vehicle or super-bike.
Also, people, particularly Americans, love their cars. We want cup holders, cruise control, 50 disk CD changers, air conditioning, luggage room, and the whole family in the back seat. We won't give that up for a personal flying machine, a single-seat hovercraft, or a super bike. So those all break rules 2,3, and 4.
If anyone disagrees with these rules, or would like to add other stipulations for IT, let's make a good set and apply it to our guesses.
That's what i was looking for. I'm thinking dirty, dangerous currency. 'Reading' device requiring infrastructure.
To figure this out, we have to look at the acronym.
IT.
I could stand for Invisible, Infrared, Intergalactic, Interoffice, Internet, Incredible, Industrial, Illiterate, Immediate, Inverted, etc.
T could stand for Traffic, Turkey, Tampon, Turbine, Trip, Telethon, Turtle, Trampoline, Thermometer, etc.
So, by powers of deduction, I predict that we are either on the verge of using Intergalactic Trampolines for super-fast space travel, or Invisible Tampons (Bezos' laugh was probably more of a suprised yelp when it was demonstrated on him).
I can also see excellent reasons why people might not be allowed to use either of these items.
I really hate signatures, but go to my website.
Well, it's nice to know that the upcoming Star Wars movie won't be the only huge letdown next year... ;)
DO NOT LEAVE IT IS NOT REAL
NDA is a powerful thing. Bind the wolves by law and they won't be able to bite you. Right?
Due to repeated reports on
They have a bunch of severe problems:
1. control
I suppose it's a lot harder to fly a vehicle than to drive one. Especially if it's light, and there's going to be hundreds of them flying around above and between city buildings. More so in bad weather.
It would be quite a system that could automatically overcome this.
2. Power
It takes extreme amounts of energy to fight the gravitation. This could be solved by slider-like, foldable wings. Take-off and landing should be vertical to reduce ground area requirements. Once airborne, you should be able to slide.with the wings opened and engine(s) turned horizontal.
I think, therefore thoughts exist. Ego is just an impression.
Remember the developments not long ago that showed that superconducting coils were found to serve as a gravity shield?
oh yeah, this will revolutionize cities..
"Honey, I'm taking the Mecha out to shopping"
"Daaaaaad! I wanna borrow the Mecha for my date tonight!"
Riiight.. if that's what it is, then the only ppl that will have a use for it is the army.
-since when did 'MTV' stand for Real World Television instead of MUSIC television?
That will allow the third world to cheaply and easily generate power, clean water, etc.
Maybe California can use some to get more electricity.
I'm thinking it replaces currency. requiring reading devices and gov. cooperation with infrastructure.
Personal Transport (hover/copter/sterling-driven/bike/scooter/wheelch air/backpack) has no chance of generating $60 billion in 5 years at $2k a pop. In order for it to make that much money, pretty much everybody in America needs to buy one. In order for that to happen, it needs to be a 100% replacement for a car, because most people will not spend two grand on a second vehicle in addition to their car.
Cars protect from the elements (rain, cold, etc); they provide some protection in accidents (metal frame, air bags, seat belts, etc); they allow you to carry passengers and luggage; they can travel at high speeds (as in >30 MPH) over long distances; they are hard for a non-expert theif to steal.
Given that criteria, a personal craft that can not take you from L.A. to Vegas at 70 MPH, be driven comfortably through Detroit in January, and crash into a garbage truck head-on without killing you... will never replace cars, and therefore will be nothing more than a toy for yuppies and the "Earth First" crowd.
Teleporter - The problem I have always had with sci-fi transport devices is that they don't actually move you. They disintigrate you and then replicate you. Most of us would rather not be destroyed and simultaniously replaced with a copy that has our memories. Also, it can't be done with current knowledge.
Power generation - I could see that becoming a popular option. A lot of home-owners, including me, would have gone solar a long time ago if it was cheap enough. However, nobody can make $60 billion in the home appliance market. The margins are simply not high enough, and if they were you would face stiff competition within a year or two. Also, most urban dwellers live in apartments, where power and utility costs are usually hidden in their rent payments.
Waste Disposal / Water Delivery / etc. faces the same problems as the generator theories.
It seems to me that for "IT" to live up to the hype, it must be something that none of us have thought of, or ever thought we would want. After all, nobody thought we would want to do our computing with a mouse-driven GUI before the XEROX engineers thought of it, and nobody thought they could sell one until Jobs visited PARC labs... but now it is hard to imagine selling any sort of client software without it.
Information wants to be anthropomorphized.
Sounds more like a subway to me.
That would explain why cities would have to be redesigned around it.
You can get those at my corner store! Chocolate covered mint chip or chocolate chip ice cream, in a cookie sandwich. Good for you and tasty too (kind of).
sulli
RTFJ.
If some CalTech physicist came up with viable fuel cells, do you think Exxon would finance his research & marketing? If someone from CERN produced a useful & net-positive fusion reactor, do you think the various power companies, with their existing plants and related revenues, would be willing to change course and throw their resources behind this research.
Or here's one -- if some kids came up with a robust, scalable, powerful operating system in their spare time, do you think Microsoft would adopt it, or would they do everything they can to neutralize it?
Sad to say, I think this happens all the time...
DO NOT LEAVE IT IS NOT REAL
Who is John Galt?
:( )
(of course, I finally get to read this long after the discussion has died down.
I think the net would be used for organizing these things automatically into trains for more efficient transportation (like telecars), and advanced route planning with traffic controls.
"Train" is the keyword... Or why else would he "assembled two Gingers - or ITs - in 10 minutes" for demonstration?
I have some theories. #1. IT is a new voting machine that shocks the shit out of old farts when they screw up voting. #2. IT is a new keyboard that shocks the shit out of me when im browsing the web at work, when I should be working. #3. IT is the # of patents I will be filing for after reading all your cool ideas in this thread.
...Kamen records record sales first year and decides to IPO early. E*Trade idiots, with their new found Yahoo spoils bloat up the company's valuation, raising the stock price far higher than it should ever be. IT, Inc's employees, brought on with low base salaries but tons of stock options get fat and lazy, driving down year 2 sales. Wall St runs screaming, investors follow, and Kamen spends Y2K in his sister's basement celebrating the new year with bathtub gin. Timing is everything.
---- Just another spud server.
Interesting, I always thought that good looking women were a "real man's screw" :)
Thanks for the info. The waste of including one with every single product still annoys me though. I suppose there is a definite advantage to the torque provided from the driver design and the depth of the insertion location.
If that's all it is, the overhype is incredible, but considering the participants....
Maybe it's a robot you can send to do tasks for you - pick up groceries, the kids, etc. Maybe you can ride it too.
Helicopters sound too dangerous. Plus what about inclement weather?
---If you can't trust a nerd, who can you trust?
Its a matter transporter, like a 3-d fax machine; thats' why he needed to set up two of them (sender and receiver) they were preassembled and only needed to have the stands and wires hooked up.
-- www.globaltics.net
Political discussion for a new world
IT's a BOFH?
-since when did 'MTV' stand for Real World Television instead of MUSIC television?
But... I LIKE my mother-in-law...
NOW I SAID IT!!! EEEEAAAAA
It's not revolutionary enough to impress Bezos and Jobs.
It doesn't have GPS
It doesn't have the ability to communicate with other TurboScooters
It doesn't have a palm device for information gathering and realy
It does have a tracking module, to allow for caravans and auto navigation
It doesn't have the physical hooks to allow daisychaining of scooters together.
Geek dating!
GPL Deconstructed
The George Foreman grill has already been invented.
Isn't that from Dave Barry's computer book (I forget the name)?
I nominate Michael Palin. He obviously can deliver the line well. The proof is in the beginning of every episode of Monty Python's Flying Circus.
-----
"The only difference between me and a madman is that I'm not mad." - Salvador Dali (1904-1989)
(Or, if slashdot has a problem w/ that url, here:E =US%2F91%2F10%2FUS05971091__.tif&PAGE=4&USER_HTML= %253CA%2BHREF%253D%2Forder%253Fpn%3DUS05971091__+T ARGET%3D_top%253EOrderPatent%253C%2FA%253E&SCALE=0 .35
http://www.delphion.com/fcgi-bin/any2html?FILENAM
)
why not use unix? Your friends do.
They arrange a meeting with all these high profile billionaires, and let the media in onit, keep it secret, and then you say it is NOT hype? It is the very essence of hype.
Sig:
Navy nuke sub lifestyle?
I doubt it... why would Bezos wonder if it will be legal to use it? My guess is a personal hovercraft type device...
I think the spirit of Bezos' comment was that it would require some shifting of current regulations. A motorized personal transport device sold in quantity would necessitate a rethinking of the design behind our public spaces and access ways. So, while not explicitly illegal, a device like this would probably not work too well with our existing sidewalk and road system and would probably require new laws to legitimize it's use.
"The world is a construct of forceful imagination. Those who don't know walk around in the reailties of those who do"
Maybe it is a hovercraft.. But have you ever seen one in person? They're _very_ LOUD. How would he get around that?
Your hovercraft is loud because it's full of eels.
And they're shrieking.
It's It
What is it
It's it
What is it
Faith No More - Epic. I thought they answered the question a LONG TIME AGO?
The ultimate network admin tool needs HELP!
Whatever IT may be...IT is sure to be cool. So IT will sell.
It is indeed a clean personal hovercraft type vehicle. I'd love to see how the implemented the "breaks" on it.
IM Joking! They sometimes are useful! wait no there not..
If it's a personal VTOL aircraft of somekind - hovercreaft or helicopter - it ain't revolutionary: www.solotrek.com HADAM!
Why do people assume it's a simple device just because it was easily assembled from parts that came in a few boxes? Nothing was said about the parts themselves, just that they assmbled easily.
A PC assembles easily, but I sure as heck can't come up with one in my workshop from a pile of sand, a tube of epoxy, and a couple blocks of aluminum and copper...
I found this comment further down in a Wired article( http://www.wirednews.com/wired/archive/8.09/kamen
meico
Right now the lead article in ...". It's not talking about this swibble.
http://www.informationweek.com/
is "IT Execs Meet
It's "Dave Barry in Cyberspace." But I still don't remember if that virus description is from it. It sounds quite familiar, though.
here's the patent for what possibly could be IT submitted in december. illustrations start on page 45. http://www.delphion.com/fcgi-bin/any2html?FILENAME =WO%2F01%2F50%2FWO00075001A1.tif&PAGE=45&SCALE=0.3 5&MODE=fstv
On the bright side, turbine jets have a reliability rate an order of magnitude better than reciprocating internal combustion engines- there isn't much _to_ fail. Flameouts can happen if you slam on high power suddenly resulting in a turbine stall- remember this design would be optimised for a lower rate of speed in the first place, I think it would be not that hard to eliminate the risk of a turbine stall within such a limited operating range. Unlike a 747 turbine, a portable heli turbine would not _have_ to go from 0 to 700 mph, and would not have to have the capability to dump that much fuel in that you could stall the turbines (early 747 engines suffered from a behavior that when you pushed the throttles forward firmly, you got a huge bang and a turbine stall- they had to bring up the engine speed more smoothly with throttle interlocks to avoid this, because of the huge difference in fuel flow and thrust between low and high power)
I think the idea with IT (sticking with my original guess on its identity) must be, "Limit maneuverability to 'stable and gentle' and increase the engine's reliability until it's waaaay beyond the average reliability of, say, car engines/TIRES/brakes/steering linkages etc".
It'd be a hard _sell_, but the actual engineering problem is nowhere near as hard. It's not that much of a problem to produce a jet turbine that is orders of magnitude more reliable than, say, a car. The very light duty requirements and materials such as titanium would only make this easier.
However, it's probably wishful thinking. It's funny how a lot of my adolescent fantasies involved teleporters... Hrm. That was probably TMI.
--Fesh
--Fesh
Kill -9 'em all, let root@localhost sort 'em out.
The Applicant is listed as DEKA Products Limited Parnership, and the Inventor is Dean L Kamen, matches the story. Illustrations start on page 45 http://www.delphion.com/fcgi-bin/any2html?FILENAME =WO%2F01%2F50%2FWO00075001A1.tif&PAGE=45&SCALE=0.3 5
looking at the comments of other readers, several other web pages, and the patents:
- it must have to do with transportation. it will be a _compelling_ alternative to cars (e.g. NO scooters or rollerblades - they exist today and people are not using them). the word compelling is significant here. there are tons of smart car alternatives already, none of them successful on a large scale. and it must have a higher sex appeal than cars.
- a new energy source/motor technology is involved. the patents and some articles hint at that. also, the remarks that big old companies (the oil industry?) will be trying to prevent the tech.
- cities will have to be redesigned.
- the inventor is an 'avid aviator who commutes via helicopter'.
it must be a personal helicopter/flying machine. something you strap to your back and fly to work. this is possible (and actually pretty simple) with current technology, provided you have a new super-efficient energy source/motor. take your super motor, add GPS and a bunch of computers so people can't crash into things, and voila!
the only thing that doesn't quite fit is that it can be transported in some cardboard boxes.
I propose that it is a walker, such that you strap one to each leg/foot and it helps you walk taking very big steps. They communicate using infrared to time their steps. As each foot comes to the ground the device compresses and then explodes out, pushing you forward. You could with a small amount of energy (yours and the machine's) move at 20 m.p.h. taking 10 to 20' steps as you go.
Kamen doesn't predict the future, he produces the future! If "Ginger" is only half the quality of his previous devices, then "IT" is gonna be HUGE!!!
The reason that cars congest cities is not that everyone lives in the city and drives, it's that everyone lives a half-hour commute from the city and drives in. And as the towns a half-hour out become crowded and overbuilt and old, we build bigger, badder freeways to establish new towns farther away that are still a half-hour commute away, resulting in more congestion, more buildup, more freeways, more miles driven, etc.
So, as long as this trend continues, it will all be about speed. You need to keep going faster to keep moving farther away from the problems (crime, pollution, poor schools, lower property values) of those living closer in. It's no accident (ahem) that the 55 mph limit was lifted in the US, as people try to live farther away from central cities, but still want to get there in the same time. Same thing for road rage, "tier 1 suburbs" decaying, sprawl, etc.
So, until something reverses this trend, say, light industries built in autonomous small towns, accompanied by small-scale power plants and made possible by information technology and shattered corporations (all of this is starting to happen, BTW), a clean personal transport won't matter.
Unless, of course, you're suggesting these things can "dock" in bigger vehicles that go 100mph (trains?), and/or have rollbars and harnesses.
All that said, I'd love to own one, if it's what you describe, which it pretty much has to be.
"You can't get something for nothing." - my grandfather, on the stock market and Reaganomics.
It appears to be based off of the same technologies used in DEKA's smart wheelchair that can climb stairs, etc. Just a commercialization of it. http://www.delphion.com/fcgi-bin/any2html?FILENAME =WO%2F01%2F50%2FWO00075001A1.tif&PAGE=1&SCALE=0.35
I think you are right on...
Another definition for "ginger" is "pep". Pep means energy. Ginger is an alternative to the internal combustion engine, as others have speculated; or some sort of efficient energy storage solution. It's first manifestation will be in some personal transportation device. Bob Metcalfe, 3com founder, says: "Now, if I invented metal, and came out with the first spoon, which would be the big invention, the spoon or metal? This is the current complication in solving the IT mystery." This is a great clue. The invention is the engine/storage unit (the metal) and its first manifestation is the scooter (the spoon). So, yes, it is a scooter, but that is less important than some of the technology in the scooter. That is the real breaktrhough. The comments about refitting campuses, etc, are in regard to the scooter specifically, but aren't necessarily relevant to the important underlying technology (the engine). When the prototype was shown to Bezos, et al., it was done in a room. A small, contained room would not be sufficient to show off the true power and flexibility of a new transportation device. It would, however, be acceptable to show off a new power generator/storer that might use a scooter to demonstrate. Peter Bray peter@webridge.com
There is a possibility that time travel would require a time machine at both the departure and destination places, so that we would only be able to do time travel to times that are later than the date of discovery.
Everyone thinks it's a personal transportation device but that doesn't fit with the article. Mainly, there are two products of like kind one that will be sold to consumers for about $2000. And the other which seems to be more expensive but would cause people to build entire cities around them.
Why build a city around a bicycle??
Save Pangaea!! Stop Continental Drift!!
It seems very likely to be a form of transportation, but the scooter idea doesn't fit a couple of the mentioned hints.
1) Allowing people to use it would be an issue.
2) Redesigning cities would be very likely.
3) It would definitely be revolutionary (and I don't care how fricking cool a scooter gets, it probably isn't going to be world revolutionary.)
4) It would threaten the billion-dollar old-line automotive industry (again, I don't think scooters could ever pose a strong threat.)
A jetpack just seems more deserving of the hype they're trying to raise. Plus, it's about damn time someone gets it done!
Badgers? Badgers! We don't need no stinkin' Badgers!
The personal helicopter theory fits too well. Even the comment about IT being a hovering device. I believe IT will be something similar to this: http://news.bbc.co.uk/hi/english/sci/tech/newsid_8 93000/893200.stm
Only, Kamen's version will use an environmentally friendly power source. Perhaps a compressed air engine, or a version of the Stirling engine he is so fond of.
The device is a type of personal transportation scooter, but it's not as simple as the patent describes. There are two key parts that are purposely left out of the patent application, but it doesn't matter because the patent covers the invention anyway. The "scooter" uses a BALL for movement, and is powered by two small motors that work in tandem to rotate the ball any direction. Like the iBot, a computer keeps the ball rolling so that the scooter can't fall down once it's turned on. The second part of this device is that it HOPS like a pogo-stick. The user stands on a platform several feet above the ball, with compressible pistons and springs between the ball and the platform. The hopping motion allows the device to go up and down stairs, over rough ground, or over just about any small obstacle. (Notice that one of the traits of the device described in the patent is that it has a detector to keep the user from hitting his or her head on an overhead obstacle. This is because the user is quite a large distance above the pavement, so this is an issue.) The third part of the invention is that the computer also controls the piston to keep the level of the platform uniform. So while the device is hopping, the user stays level above the ground, or moves very little. The revolutionary part of this is that ir FEELS AMAZING to ride. It feels like it's hovering, like a snowboard on a steep slope in deep powder. It can easily jump up and down stairs. Perhaps it can even leap off a ten-foot drop because the piston will compress to absorb the shock of the landing. The hopping motion conserves energy as well. I think the feeling of riding it is so great that everyone will have to have one, and when everyone has one, then everyone will demand that cities be redesigned to make it the standard mode of transportation. I believe my description above is possible using current technology and matches to all the clues given in the article. I'm very curious to see if anyone else can find a flaw in my description.
I hacked into DEKA last night and got the scoop on Ginger. It's basically a pogo stick with some self stabilizing actuators. It's going to make the razor scooter obsolete.
Having looked at al lthe drawings up on http://www.thesmokinggun.com and reading everyone's description who's seen it, the novel thing about this has to be a gyroscope based stabilization system for a variety of scooters...The drawings of the "scooters" looks very unstable, and his application mentions a devide which is unstable when not powered... As for "Ginger", I think he may be referring to Ginger Rodgers (as in with Fred Aistaire)...Maybe this thing just glides around like her smooth dancing?? The only thing still nagging me was Bob "ethernet" Metcalfe's quote : "Now, if I invented metal, and came out with the first spoon, which would be the big invention, the spoon or metal? This is the current complication in solving the IT mystery".....very odd, hints at a whole new technology... Fascinating!
http://www.arcosanti.org is a experimental planned community an hour north of Pheonix Arizona. Architecture and urban planning students visit it from all over the world to consider Paoli Soleri's concepts. I propose to consider planning a community near Arcosanti that those same visitors can visit called Gingerville, inhabited by Gingerians and financed by Ginger-bread men. If cities can be architected around this invention, and if it's going to be bigger than the PC or the net, then I propose to stop wondering EXACTLY what Ginger is and start working up plans for a small scale town that operates, from it's inception, by incorporating Ginger into its design plans. My first Gingerville meeting will be on Tuesday, Jan. 16 at 10 am at the Denny's on 7th ST., just south of Dunlap in Pheonix, AZ. The updates on this will be reported to my forum at http://network54.com/forum/96622 Remember-- the main goal right now is to PLAN for WHATEVER Ginger is rather than trying to figure out WHAT it is. We will "suspend our disbelief" that it will change the world and go ALONG with that! Why? For fun! And MAYBE we'll get AHEAD of the curve, too! Rick Potvin.
Yes, it probably is a transportation device, requring cities and campuses to install some kind of track, providing power and/or guidance.
Wallace J. Lee
lots of things can be taken appart, and stuck into cardboard boxes and duffle bags, and then put back together with a screwdriver - probly most things in my house could...and I'm not talking chairs here...computers come to mind here...
Also, I think IT has to be something so new - so out of the box, that nobody would ever think of it, untill it is commonplace (think personal computers, internet). now dont get me wrong, I'm not saying I think it's a computer or Internet-2, or some such BS, but, it is on that level of revolutionary-ness.
The "billion-dollar old-line companies" are more then likely Oil and car companies (what else COULD they be?) so transportation DOES fit well, howerver, I dont find any of these ideas very plauseable (howerver, I hope the transporter is what it is ;)
The opinions in this post are ficticious. Any similarity to actual opinions, real or imagined, is purely coincidental.
Not sure how to read this. How could a scooter/car/whatever be fun? Perhaps the mention of a hover device awhile ago (they've been available for years) could look 'fun' when activated.
The invention could be fun if it suddenly stood up when turned on! Imagine that it is a one or two wheeled scooter that was laying down on the floor and when turned on the handlebars or whatever suddenly rised up as the wheels spinned to stabilize the darned thing!?!
"sweet dreams are made of this..."
This link is to a picture created originally by Syd Mead, who's a well known/respected futurist and industrial designer.
He's the same artist that brought us the designs for movies like Blade Runner, Tron, the original Star Trek movie, and 2010.
here's the link: http://www.notrobot.com/ginger
This link is to a picture created originally by Syd Mead,
who's a well known/respected futurist and industrial designer.
He's the same artist that brought us the designs for movies like
Blade Runner, Tron, the original Star Trek movie, and 2010.
here's the link: http://www.notrobot.com/ginger
This becomes even more interesting when you learn that Kamen is the founder of "FIRST". And what do we find under "Sponsors"? "The following organizations and individuals are Foundation Sponsors of FIRST: ...
DaimlerChrysler Corporation Fund
Delphi Automotive Systems
General Motors Corporation ...
Motorola, Inc."
Anybody still thinks he's gonna bring the motor industry down?
"Once again, the powers of the herb open up the mind"
Other articles about Kamen have reported that his company has developed a small prototype Stirling-cycle electrical generator. Since Stirling engines can use efficient multi-fuel external combustion. A practical Stirling generator would be light weight, efficient, and clean. He could use his own generator to power his device.
2. Abilities. The article say that the "IT" will run afoul of some existing laws and that cities will need to be modified to work well with "IT". Do you think that it will be able to fly? Or traverse water? I think that if it could fly it would negate the 'safer' argument, but if I could commute across the Hudson River with it... Maybe we'll need to add landing pads to our balcony.
Kamen is basically a control systems expert. He is also a helicopter pilot (a hobby). His iBot wheelchair is smart enough to climb stairs, balance on two wheels, and even run on a sandy beach. He and his team have shown themselves to be capable of almost arbitrarily increasing the safety and reliability of vehicles they create by using sensor integration and complex control processors.
Automating a flying machine is much simpler than a ground vehicle. Full autopilots for aircraft have been around for years. Kamen has demonstrated several times with several products that he take an existing product and make it smaller, smarter, safer, more user friendly, and efficient. If IT really is a vehicle of some sort, then you can bet that it will be safe and as idiot-proof as is humanly possible.
IV
"These laws they're passing won't even compile anymore, let alone execute." - anon
http://www.indetech.com/
The site is called "Independence Technology" or could that be short for IT? Remember that Johnson and Johnson is going to be selling the iBot for DEKA.
"sweet dreams are made of this..."
I've been trying to put this story together in my mind all day; I mean, this could be the Big Thing, right? This could be the one where I end up with a really good job. And so there's been this cheesy, Sat-morn electro tune flitting through my Personal Soundtrack(tm). And every now and then I hear, flitting through the acoustics, some barely recognizable, far-off lyrics: "Jane, his wife!", "Daughter Judy", and "His boy, Elroy." You have no idea how helpful this could be. The only thing missing from this story has been some sort of monolith.
It appear Dean's been doing some really high tech R&D mentioned at http://www.hsterm.com VERY interesting I might add. -JR
Let's face it, everything we know about IT is entirely speculative. I've heard some speeches Dean has given as founder of the organization FIRST (For Inspiration and Recognition of Science and Technology, http://www.usfirst.org). Every year, when describing that organization's robotic's competion, he speaks entirely in enigmas until the final unveiling of the rules. There is no value even attempting to speculate on the nature of It, but that is not my primary point. I've been looking for a long time to link the world of Dean Kamen and FIRST with that of Slashdot, Linux, and the OSS Movement, so naturally, I am delighted to see him pop up in an article. I suggest every teenage slashdotter to look into the FIRST Robotics competition....if you're interested, and you should be (what slashdotter doesn't love an engineering challenge?), look into starting a team at your high school. So that's my two cents. -Zuchinis
-Zuchinis
Uhhh, slashcode DOES add spaces in the markup - at least in the main story. It's annoying, but I've learned to check each URL after previewing and saving because slashcode tends to mangle it.
I disavow any knowledge of any person posting under my nmae.
Has anyone elver postd undre your nmae?
My personal wish is for IT to be efficient energy transmission. I'd laugh when an energy receiver is turned on and I think "What does it do? It doesn't move... or light up..." It would replace a dirty and dangerous thing, upset billion-dollar companies, change the world, require changes in cities.... And paranoid safety-freaks (or corp.-owned politicians) might try to prevent people from using it...
But I doubt it is.
The inventor's history, the clues, and some reason can allow us to infer a few things.
1. It's fairly simple. Less than a car, more than a bicycle. Don't get me wrong, this range is open to some pretty complex things.
2. It hasn't been tried before or thought of for this application. (Scooters anyone? Little personal cars? All done before. All failed with consumers.)
3. It's less dangerous than the alternative. (If it replaces cars, it's LESS dangerous. Flying, especially with rotating blades, may be considered MORE dangerous.)
4. It's attraction will be usefullness and function, not simple "coolness" factors. Not a solution in search of a problem. (How else do you acheive the required income he predicts?)
5. Revolutionary could mean "e-mail" revolutionary, not necessarily "cure for cancer" or "teleportation" or "unified theory" revolutionary.
6. No revolutionary components (on the smallest scale). Likely it will have circuits never put together before and sections never built before, but he didn't invent a new transister or actuator. (Nothing based on completely new components goes for $2000 with a profit.)
7. It's likely mechanical, or fundimentally mechanical.
A few questions still remain:
1. Why are college campuses specifically mentioned for retro-fitting?
2. If it's not mechanical, what other technologies is he knowledgable enough of?
3. Why might people not be allowed to use it? The revolutionary and utopian aspects that are praised make me wonder.
4. What does "architect cities around it" mean?
5. How will it change a person's way of thinking? About what?
6. I assume the meeting was indoors and in an office or workplace. This and the duffel bag clue tell me it is less than half the size of a car. Maybe 1/4 the size or less. Assumptions that it will be replacing cars or commercial aircraft are made suspect...
7. Are metro and pro paired in a client/server fashion or cheap/expensive?
8. Why *so* secretive. This is worse than transmeta!
9. Does the word "transmeta" make anyone here lose faith in the word "revolutionary"?
Especially you, Dougie and Fee. I would have expected that code mongers like yourselves should have deciphered this overhyped,but still viable and truly world impacting invention by now. With the information available at your fingertips, and your superiour intellects, I expected full disclosure at this site, one of your favorites. Now, I'm stuck with my own, nebbishy speculations. Help me you guys... what, definitively is 'IT'?
'Elvis Presley had nothing to do with excellence,just myth.' Marlon Brando
They received a fair bit of press in the middle of last year, following an AP report that they would propel the wearer to speeds of up to 25 mph using a mechanism similar to footwear-mounted pogo sticks with internal combustion engines (!).
Some selected articles on this invention can be found at: http://popularmechanics.com/perl/tw_display.pl?id= 306
http://abcnews.go.com/sections/world/DailyNews/rus sia_boots000707.html
Wow. That is totally awesome.
.:.
:tedd
For those horrible knights of nee, or whatever they are calling themselves these days.
There are two problems with this:
1) There wouldn't be much point in the amount of secrecy this has demanded if it was as simple as stringing together his current patents and articles to form some composite invention. Since it's assumed he doesn't want people to find out about it, it's going to be a bigger leap than that.
2) More importantly, in the Wired article, he talked about using a briefcase-sized Stirling engine to power a cell phone. Do you know how big it (or an array of them) would have to be to move my 150lb carcass?
Why don't I believe you?
Or why should I?
Looks like someone cracked.
"Dean's two-wheel balancing device is really cool," said Dr. Wise Young, director of the W. M. Keck Center for Collaborative Neuroscience at Rutgers University. "It zooms around like lightning just by standing on it and leaning forward or backwards. The battery is the platform. Using it is totally intuitive. It will require reorganization of sidewalks because there will be people zooming all over cities with it."
Read the complete article.
"sweet dreams are made of this..."
it is so obvious - because he needs someone to sell the device (amazon) and someone who programms the OS (apple), innit?
As you can see, the 'Pro' provides more protection from the elements.
Also found a photo of a 'Metro' being pushed back to the lab after a mechanical failure:
LOL! suck on this Asimov?
"Kill 'em all and let Root sort 'em out"
was at www.whatisitreally.com
I've been following this since the begining and I still can't decide what it is. I'm inclined to think it's not a motor vehicle and more of a power generating system. There are some real interesting threads supporting this at www.WhatCouldGingerBe.com
If you travel to the year 802,701, don't forget to say hi to the Precious Moments people who call themselves Eloi.
Like Tetris? Like drugs? Ever try combining them?
Will I retire or break 10K?
If they won't say what it is, then it is just a big joke. It sounds like the promise of cold fusion a few years back. I will just plan on buying an electric/hydraulic car if a few years and let the rest take care of itself.
Romanes eunt domus? People called Romanes, they go the 'ouse? It says Romans go home. No it doesn't. What's Latin fo
That takes care of the legal questions, the architectural retro-fitting, the gotta-have-it factor, and the might-require-new-regulations.
What'choo think, people?
You're making a simple but understandable mistake. This is not science, this is technology. Science is the search for truth by formulating theories and comparing them to evidence; the success of a theory is the degree to which it approximates truth, and as such requires peer review. Technology is the process of creating useful devices (both physical and information-based); the success of a piece of technology is the degree to which it is employed (or arguably the degree to which it improves some process), and as such does not require peer review.
-spc
But that's just me.
Every time a guy gets a threesome, somewhere in heaven an angel gets his wings. --Cary Tennis
One editor who saw the proposal went as far as to speculate -- jokingly (perhaps) -- that IT was a type of personal hovering craft.
Coooooooooooooooooooooooooool. If that's what it is then that is pretty damn neat!
But, if you read the article carefully, you'll see it mentions the Stirling engine, *then* talks about a hush-hush project that Kleiner Perkins is investing in. It implies that this is not, in fact, IT.
Damn, I need to track down my college friend who went off to work for Dean doing the US FIRST thing. Maybe he knows...
"According to the inventor of "Ginger," Dean Kamen, his device will be an alternative to products that "are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities."
Hmm, Porn, spam, and chainmail are frustrating to me, dirty, expensive when they slow down my network, and dangerous if you're a user caught with these things on my network... So, maybe IT replaces that stuff?
Seriously though, I remember an article a few years ago with someone testing out designs for personal aircraft and hovercraft to replace cars. The designs were smaller than automobiles and used the same amount of fuel from what I remember. The automakers would poop themselves if this was the case and the oil industry would kill it with cash payouts to politians if it used less or different fuel sources than autos.
Pretty thought provoking even if it is just a hoax.
"When people are being beaten with a stick, they are not much happier if it is called 'the People's Stick'." -Bakunin
IMHO, it would appear to be some sort of flying vehicle that runs on an unconventional power source (IE, not Oil products [hmm... Karma?]). The car companies would oppose it, the gas companies would oppose it, even cities would oppose it due to the hazards flying vehicles could pose in the hands of general consumers.
It sounds like it is highly portable: "In a private meeting with Bezos, Jobs and Doerr, Kamen assembled two Gingers -- or ITs -- in 10 minutes, using a screwdriver and hex wrenches from components that fit into a couple of large duffel bags and some cardboard boxes. ".
I don't think it's a hovercraft as that would not really conjure up the notions such as these: "Kemper says the invention will "sweep over the world and change lives, cities, and ways of thinking."", "Jobs is quoted as saying: "...If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen." ".
A flying craft, however, would require design consideration for buildings (entrances on many levels, less overhangs to bang your head on, etc) where a hovercraft could be suited for ordinary streets (really, what modifications to a city would you need for a hovercraft? how could it benifit significantly from any changes?)
Of course I could be totally wrong about this... But based on the information provided in the article it sounds like a fair bet.
We know it's a transportation device, since robotic dogs already exist. Teleportation might be possible someday, but there's no way he's made this kind of step in quantum mechanics, so it's not that. Electric cars and fuel-cell cars are already well-known, though I suppose he might have some alternate transportation method, but I think that "this might change the way cities are designed" points to a Wired article I saw a few years ago about the hovercar. The one I read about had four small turbine engines and VTOL; it got something like 300 miles to a tank of gas (or a few other possible fuel types) and sounded pretty impressive, possibly revolutionary. Initial price was supposed to be $1mil, but it was expected to come down. Does this sound possible?
yeah but how many of these would be able to be built for under $2000 from the contents of a couple of duffle bags?
I changed my mind. Here is what IT is:
IT
The assembled with a hex wrench gave it away.
Dancin Santa
My bet says it's some sort of super-clean, super-cool transportation. And since it was "turned on", it has something electrical.
I think you're right. At least on the transportation part. Hopefully it does turn out to be super clean and super cool.
But what kind of transportation is it? Assembled from parts carried in two large duffel bags? Sounds like personal transportation rather than a large multiperson vehicle. Is it some sort of kickass, Internet-guided scooter?
And what does IT stand for? I---- Transport?
--
IT is obviously some sort of new-millennium blow-up doll. They might have thought that was Bezos laughing, but who knows what it really was (other than his wife)? Whether it is legal or not? Sounds like a drug or sex to me, seeing how we're a nation of prudes. 2k seems awfully expensive compared to your average $15 air-inflated model however.
Arthropoid, the Right Clam for the Job
"IT is an Individual Transport device utilizing a rotating electro magnetic field for propulsion. The rotational device is magnetic bearing mounted, thus producing minimal drag. External mag strips may be required; however, it may be done without changing design."
______________________________
Eric Krout
If you celebrate Xmas, befriend me (538
I'm beginning to agree that IT is some mode of personal transportation(like those scooter things, but better). Given the inventors' previous experience with such machinery(the wheelchair) and all the comments in the article this seems like the most logical conlusion. Relieve traffic congestion downtown with a scooter like device? It would have to be alot better than that though. Up here in Canada, it would get mighty cold riding one of them things to work.
-----
"People who bite the hand that feeds them usually lick the boot that kicks them"
Higher Logics: where programming meets science.
The off-road wheel chair discussed in the article is very real, and very cool. Imagine being a parapalegic and being able to reach the top shelf in a grocery eisle - with perfect balance on two wheels. Then you can bomb on home, climb the stairs to your room, lift the chair again to get on your bed, then hop off. I'm not too familiar with his work other than this, but if IT is as useful of a device, but for the entire population, IT will make loads of cash and probably be pretty cool. From the article (especially the end) it looks to be some type of transportation device. If they are talking about redesigning cities for IT though, I'd imagine IT would have to have some sort of resistance to weather trouble, so it wouldn't be as simple as the hover boards in Back to the Future II :) - interesting how many bttf references in this thread btw.
Hah!
You want it all, but you can't have it.
It's in your face, but you can't grab it!
We're going down, in a spiral to the ground
Yep, it fits on so many levels:
1) Is it legal? This would have to be treated as an personal vehicle, but not necessary a aircraft, so you would need additional laws for "driver's" licenses, vehicle registration, speed/ceiling limits, safe flying zones, and so on and so on.
2) Retrofitting cities. You would need a completely different infrastructure to support these; hangars/landing pads, traffic paths or throughways marked. This is assuming, of course, that this vehicle is gas-powered; we might need a whole new power/fuel distribution system to keep this things of the air.
3) Dirty, noisy, etc. As one other poster said, "that's either cars or dogs". And we already have electronic dogs.
4) Mega corp interference. Personal helicopters are going to make this guy RICH because I want one!
5) Building them with a screwdriver/hex wrench/carry it in. It this guy can build a wheelchair that climbs stairs (which would need a very high power-to-mass ratio to haul someone's ass up stairs), then I bet he could apply that kind of power-to-mass ratio to a personal chopper. Building it simply and quickly means it probably is a sturdy pre-fab; not unlike the new scooters/mopeds that are/were the rage.
"Don't mind me cutting myself on Occam's Razor"
here is CNN's story on the 'intelligent wheelchair' Johnson & Johnson's
given $50e7 to support development of.
The future cometh.
for the love of Life!
Rion L. Snow
Well unless this is the world's largest and greatest prank, it can't be something as simple as a scooter, seeing as people with real credibility like Steve Jobs, and others with significantly less credibility, like Jeff Bezos, are touting that it is as important an invention as the PC.
Also, according to the acticle, the model will sell for under $2000, which makes it much less expensive then a car. Remember too that it was tested inside a room (I believe) which decreases the chance that it's any kind of helicopter.
Cold fusion in a duffle bag? Some totally off the wall totally green power source that runs off of CO or CO2 or dirt? Becoming the only distributer of power in the world would easily make 60 billion in the first few years.
Cities would plan around distributing the power, entire industries would fail overnight. The success of this think would be the only thing that held the markets in check from totally bombing and destroying the economy. Most of the statements made fit some sort of renewable, green, power source with near limitless (H20?) fuel.
The most suspect part of the article is the fact that he gets to keep 85% of the company! People this big don't invest in small (+5mil) chunks. I was involved in a (failed) startup, and learned quickly that if you don't ask for 10mil +, they are not even going to return your phone calls. So what is the company/product valued at? Since all of those names will want part of they payout, they'll all be putting money in. Five, ten, fifteen million a percent?
So either in the next couple of days all of these people will be issuing denials that they are associated and that they never made such comments, OR, this is the biggest thing since they forgot to patent sliced bread
Here are some other stories about IT if you're interested in doing some more investigating:
/ index.html
p od_id=8
http://www.salon.com/books/wire/2001/01/09/ginger
http://www.inside.com/jcs/Story?article_id=20218&
--
RumorsDaily
Happy Fun Ball! now all we have to do is get a couple of wise-ass kids to taunt their happy-fun-balls and it will be the end of civilization as we know it... horos
You're *all* IT!
http://www.delphion.com/details?pn=US05971091__
That patent would seem to suggest you're on the right track . . .
It's the 2002 Subaru Impreza WRX!!!
Hey.. Perhaps that's what IT is!
You're right it would. In fact, it fits better than anything of the other ideas I've seen. Buuuuuut, a jet pack is pushing it methinks... :-)
-----
"People who bite the hand that feeds them usually lick the boot that kicks them"
Higher Logics: where programming meets science.
ooh ahh now beam me up SCotty
Gee, the story seems much more like it's derived straight from Brazil.
- passion
It's an invention, not a scientific discovery. It's like building a better combustion engine, not warp drive. It doesn't have to be peer reviewed.
-----
"People who bite the hand that feeds them usually lick the boot that kicks them"
Higher Logics: where programming meets science.
ni!
-- This post (c) 2003, Knights who say Ni, LTD.
A possiblity could be that this guy has managed to build a hamilton engine. From what the article hints toward, IT could be a better energy source.
Hamilton's engine was supposedly shown to him by aliens. While I don't support this idea I do believe that this machine would work. It basically works on magnetic repulsion and harnassing that to rotation energy along a special angular line. While the idea is sheer genious I don't believe it is other worldly. I think Hamelton felt it necessary to use some other source to make his idea more credible since he is not a scientist.
Anyhow, maybe IT is a usable form of Hamiltonian mechanics. Check out "The granite man and the butterfly" (book) for more detalis on this stuff. Also look around for the Hamilton engine and the isotopic line of motion. It is fun stuff to play with and contrary to most articles it does fit into todays physics... just think it out.
-Bob
I am the penguin that codes in the night.
I believe the solution is obvious. We have all the info that we need:
It made a grown man laugh when constructed
It will change how citites will be architected, [reduces human] impact on the environment
Alternative to "dirty, expensive products," discplaces old companies
There is a controversial/eccentric element to IT, but IT is no doubt meritorious
After three hours of thought, I understood what the invention is:
A new type of toilet/trashcan that converts biological waste into energy and/or decomposes it into, say, water vapor. It will alleviate the need for the existing sewage/water supply/energy infrastructure and get rid of the old companies which have been supplying city dwellers with utility for years. This is why Kamen Kamper is afraid these companies will find out about his invention! You must agree with me then... Stanislav Rost (prSPAMgrssor@S.P.A.M.cs.bS/P/A/M/u.edu)
He also made an appearance in a story here on Slashdot awhile ago about his cool wheel chair.
Unless this is a huge PR stunt for something silly, this could be an amazing invention (this guy has the history for it). Personally, I think it might be something like a power source or simple personal transportation device. My guess is that whatever it is it will be enviromentally friendly, simple, and elegant. Anyway, that's my 2 bits.
Hexy - a strategy game for iPhone/iPod Touch
I'm getting my knickers in a twist over this one - I really want to know more about IT.
--
--
Democracy is the art of saying "nice doggy" while subtly reaching for a large stone.
If this is the case, then short all of your hypothetical stock in IT.
The technology is there to make personal helicopter-like hovercrafts for about the same price as cars. It'll never happen, and any pilot will tell you why. Adding a third dimension adds about a factor of 100x in complexity. Most people will never be willing to learn to fly, especially for their daily commute.
I also don't think that an incredibly smart autopilot (which I also think is possible) would solve problems: You can't build highways as easily in the sky, even if you're being controlled by a computer.
Still, it's probably the most likely suggestion I've heard so far. Interesting...
"People who do stupid things with hazardous materials often die." -- Jim Davidson on alt.folklore.urban
I was thinking I remembered the name "Ginger" when the comment above reminded me of the Gary Larson "Far Side" cartoon, in which a human is scolding a dog about going into the trash, and the dog only hears "Ginger...blah...blah..blah."
m
One interesting aside is that a cursory web search reveals that this cartoon has launched an entire genre of research, ranging from papers on Far Side semiotics at:
http://www.mtsu.edu/~dlavery/farside.htm
to a class project on writing a finite state machine to translate text into Ginger-speak.
Failing that, a personal hovercraft wouldn't be all that far away from the FAA's current SATS (Small Aircraft Transportation System) effort, which reads a lot like "An aircraft in every garage." Here's a paper on training issues associated with this system, which is supposed to fly in lower minimums than present IFR traffic, with pilots who know less about flying than at present. If that doesn't scare you, check out the rest of the proposed features:
http://www.academy.jccbi.gov/iats/session5b3.ht
Deka Research home of Kamen's research company appears to be slashdotted. The Google-rama cached copy tells us little (here)
;(
Maybe we'll all get lucky and IT wont be bullshit and marketing - maybe it will be something wonderfull - something beyond consumer crap and markatroid drivel... God knows we need something to clear out the underbrush... these are some very serious statments (vauge but lofty).. my only worry is that Jeff "One Click IP $WHORE$" Bezos has anything to do with IT
Maybe IT is a patent for air -- and the 'design changes' required to accomidate IT simply have to do with metering all of our useage
>have a big, broad impact not only on social >institutions
Like rush-hour traffic, teenage mating rituals, and car worship?
>but some billion-dollar old-line companies.
Like Ford, GMC, Dodge, Honda, Volkswagen?
> profoundly affect our environment and the way
> people live worldwide.
NO MORE ROADS! And if we need to go overland, we can just use that off-road wheelchair! Oh, we are assuming this vehicle is cleaner than a car.
"Don't mind me cutting myself on Occam's Razor"
- 6,092,249 - Constant pressure seating system
- 6,062,600 - Anti-tipping mechanism
- 6,062,023 - Cnatilevered crankshaft stirling cycle machine
- 5,975,225 - Transportation vehicles with stability enhancement ising CG modification
- 5,971,091 - Transportation vehicles and methods
- 5,794,730 - Indication system for vehicles
- 5,791,425 - Control loop for transportation vehicles
- 5,701,965 - Human transporter
- 5,522,568 - Position stick with automatic trim control
Hope this helps someone figure it out...This is not a Fugazi
Asuuming it's not just a load of overblown hype...
It's most likely some kind of personal transport, given the background and the hints in the story. There's definitely a hint that it's some kind of free movement device, so it doesn't need an infrastructure, so no train track needed. It's got to be something stable, so some kind of motorised scooter or rollerblades are not going to sweep all before it as they would be difficult to keep balanced, especially with even just a little luggage.
Now, people seem to be keen on the flying machine part, but I have a few major reservations. First, safety: ignoring design issues about keeping the thing stable, what about issues like fuel tank protection, noise levels, pilot qualification (I suppose that comes under the "possibly illegal"clause), etc? Next, power itself: is there really any engines efficient enough to sustain flight compared to current personal transport like a scooter - 100mpg at 30mph? Finally, power source: batteries are too heavy, so perhaps IT would use biomass fuel?
Now, for a bit of sci-fi speculation. If it really used something like cold fusion, water engines, anti-grav, etc, why design a whole new mode of transport? Surely it would be better and more profitable to licence the design for retrofit into existing vehicles by existing manufacturers? Would there be at least some leaking of information of the viability of this technology?
My conclusion, given the pricepoint: some form of foldable/collapsable motorised (perhaps biomass?) one or two-person motorbike scooter-type thing with weather protection. However, BMW or Mercedes had something similar to this 10 years ago with conventional power and a rigid roll-bar and auto-deploying stabilisers, and of course 15 years ago Clive Sinclair lost his fortune and his credibility when he came out with the C5...
Fits inside a duffel bag and a couple cardboard boxes (I'd guess moving boxes)
Can be assembled quickly with hex wrenches and a screwdriver...
That makes me think of a pair of rollerblades, or one of those scooter thingies!
2 models, the metro and the pro; Just those naming conventions make me think of rollerblades or scooters, too, with the metro being an economical version, and the pro with additional bells and whistles...
And the invention will "profoundly affect our environment and the way people live worldwide. It will be an alternative to products that are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities."
It sounds like he's describing something both economical and ecological, as an alternative to... cars? Buses?
I'm thinking... electrical scooters or rollerblades, that can be chained together, like links!
Say, something like a shopping cart sized device, allowing one to sit or stand, with safe and clean electrical power, allowing one to move at, say, 10mph for 25 or 35 miles?
Able to link and chain, to create caravans...
It'll confound people because it isn't quite a car, nor a sidewalk friendly device...
And it'll be definitely fun!
Also, it could have an additional contact strip, to draw power, inductively, from embedded power strips!
Geek dating!
GPL Deconstructed
My guess is that they're patenting the whole Information Technology field, by 2002 they'll own all geeks.
Saying that, and looking at our clues as to what 'IT' is, my best guess is IT is some sort of cheap new transportation.
What else do these folks know of that changed the way citys are designed, effected the envrionment, and required new legislation? The car of course! By extension, this must be just like the car, only different.
I'll be the first in line to order my Geo IT Metro.
The Internet is generally stupid
IT is very cool, but there is definitely a bit of extra hype. Someone had a link to a pic of one which I can't find now. johnson and johnson has helped fund the R&D. And since this requires FDA approval the development is more like a drug than a bicycle or the like and so development is very expensive. I saw him demo this on the a PBS show. It's very cool. They had to turn away volunteer testers because they had so many people that wanted to use IT. It can go up curbs and stairs. It's got a complex gyro system so that IT can balance on 2 wheels (~10" Diameter). It allows a quad or para -plegic to essentially stand up. That would allow them to be eye-to-eye with someone else standing. First trial users were so overwhelmed by the freedom that they were crying with joy. IT is very big for anyone confinned to a conventional wheelchair. Look for it soon. It won't be cheap though. The idea is that owning IT actually saves money because you don't have to modify your living space as you would for a conventional wheelchair. - Good stuff
http://tinyurl.com/3t236
Jobs told Kamen the invention would be as significant as the PC, the proposal says.
If Steve Jobs says this, he just might be on to something. But how many things have been trumpeted as "PC replacements" in the past, oh, ten years?
Jobs didn't say it would replace PC's, he said it is "as significant as the PC." Big diff...
"And like that
We can only guess at what this genius is cooking up - but, he is definately a man who could do it. We'll just have to wait and see what IT is. Maybe we could get the Chinese to help us out a bit? I wonder if DEKA is hiring engineers?
I like mine better.
"I'll take the red pill. No! Blue! AAAaaaahhhhhhhhh"
- Monty Python meets the Matrix
For some reason this makes me think of the product in the movie strange days. I know IT isn't any type of VR... but who knows
Here's a bio page for Mr. Kamen. He's got a few patents over on the IBM Patent Server, starting in 1975 and going to the present, mainly for medical devices. You can find more stuff by running a quick Google search.
http://unxmaal.com
Yeah, I read up on his wheelchair; it makes me think it'll be an electrical scooter/cart.
What would be neat is if it had GPS and maps, maybe via built in Palm type device.
Also, the ability to daisy chain and form caravans (and thus the statement about planning cities around it, campuses, etc)
Especially if it could track painted guides, as well as allow for clean electrical power, as well as communicating with each other, and maybe even running off an inductive power source!
Geek dating!
GPL Deconstructed
when our Electronics professor came into our class for the first time, he told us to do an assignment:
A writeup about "What is IT?".
We all did.
He read them all.
Then he proceeded to design our course for that semester. (Infact, that was what previous semester was all about)
Incidently, IT is what appears in the name of our multi-year course, and still if you ask most of the students - they say "IT is Computers+Electronics+Communications."
(Mind adding +Management of it all, bozos! to that).
A quick search at the USPTO for DEKA and Kamen yields some 39 patents. Broadly, the categories are:
If this is any indication of what IT is, my bet is on the transport (see patents 5,701,965 5,971,091 and 5,975,225). I can't see selling that many Catamenial collectors (patent 6,168,609).
Anybody want a peanut?
Maybe he thinks Bill Gates is gonna go broke. THEN Kamen would be worth more than Gates. And "IT" is a record of how Gates has been squandering his billions on expensive hookers and endangered African animals he hunts for sport, and can't keep going at that rate for 5 more years.
Or maybe ITs just a personal helicopter...
a cook book
That Kamen has a habit of doing everything he says. The more ridiculous it is, the more likely he is to do it, do it well and make a great deal of money at it. The price range being talked about here makes it seem like his stirlings have been renamed.
Those would indeed change the world. They would also be faced with an onslaught of opposition from the established companies in this area. People would plan cities around it.
If Kamen has really done it then I doubt that any of this is exageration.
It's a remote control for nuclear missles. Now before you dismiss me, look at the facts:
IT is not a medical invention.
-- Mmm hmm!
In a private meeting with Bezos, Jobs and Doerr, Kamen assembled two Gingers -- or ITs -- in 10 minutes, using a screwdriver and hex wrenches from components that fit into a couple of large duffel bags and some cardboard boxes.
--Yep. Remote control.
The invention has a fun element to it, because once a Ginger was turned on, Bezos started laughing his "loud, honking laugh".
--Blowing up IRAQ is fun!
There are possibly two Ginger models, named Metro and Pro -- and the Metro may possibly cost less than $2,000
--Well yeah enough equipment to scramble your radio waves so the Pentagon has no clue..
Bezos is quoted as saying that IT "...is a product so revolutionary, you'll have no problem selling it. The question is, are people going to be allowed to use it?"
--Good question. Will they let people have their own nukes?
Jobs is quoted as saying: "...If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen."
--Yeah, because who is stupid enough to be in the place where the remote control _ISN'T_ at? The person who controls the remote wouldn't blow themselves up!
Kemper says the invention will "sweep over the world and change lives, cities, and ways of thinking."
--Blowing shit up does that.
The "core technology and its implementations" will, according to Kamen, "have a big, broad impact not only on social institutions but some billion-dollar old-line companies." And the invention will "profoundly affect our environment and the way people live worldwide. It will be an alternative to products that are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities."
-- Yes, you can quickly annihalate huge cities with your new IT(TM) Remote Control!
IT will be a mass-market consumer product "likely to run afoul of existing regulations and or inspire new ones," according to Kemper. The invention will also likely require "meeting with city planners, regulators, legislators, large commercial companies and university presidents about how cities, companies and campuses can be retro-fitted for Ginger."
--We will become a fragmented society and wage wars on eachother! The end is near, my friends!
The signs are there. You now know the truth!
Now before you freak out, if you send me your credit card number and authorize a $200 charge I will send you my new book entitled "How To Survive a Nuclear Blast." There are only 500 copies left, so get yours today!
--
Whatever you do, DON'T CLICK HERE!
I can't stand this! I have to know what it is! Is this driving anyone else totally insane? Normally I can just research what IT is through Google, or even Everything2 for that matter. But now, IT, is driving me crazy and I don't even know what IT is. DAMN!
I saw this wheelchair demoed on a TV profile of Kamen some months ago... it's amazing... it can basically stand-up on two small wheels, and using gyros and a CPU, can dynamically balance itself, even if someone shoves it as hard as they can...
So, some sort of personal transportation device that doesn't quite belong on the road, or on the sidewalk is my gut feeling...
Of course if you can balance on two wheels, why not one? A powered, dynamically balanced, untippable unicycle would account for the laughter at the secret demos!
Hell, if that's not what IT is, it should be!
Reminds me of that "Where the hell are the flying cars?" ad.
Why do I need a sig? I never post.
The invention itself is as interesting as the inventor. Kamen -- "a true eccentric, cantankerous and opinionated, a great character," according to the proposal -- dropped out of college in his 20s, then invented the first drug infusion pump; he later created the first portable insulin pump and dialysis machine.
Of course he knows what he's doing he dropped out of college.
Last heard Kamen was working on perfecting the Stirling engine (an engine that runs on almost any source of heat). Seen an article somewhere a few months ago saying he had solved some long standing problems and that it was going to provide a clean cheap source of energy to the third world. Maybe a Stirling engine powered car? doesn't really seem revolutionary enough though....
Didn't log in the first time I posted this. A 1999 article by Bob Metcalfe. Check out the opening line:
INVENTOR DEAN KAMEN insists his IBOT is not a wheelchair. Nobody pushes you around in an IBOT. You wear it, like Kamen wears his helicopters.
One important clue no one is commenting on is this: The article doesn't say any of the observers "used" it, only that they observed it. If I were Bezos or Jobs, and it were a TRANSPORTATION device, I'd have wanted to jump on and try it. However, they only watched it and laughed..... This tells me it is not a transporter, but rather does something which makes a driver or user unnecessary. Course, I haven't a clue what that might be.
DAILY ROTATION
Individual
---
- Revolutionary (Jeff Bezos): (ie it goes round and round.)
- John Doerr is by no means stupid, but he does fund lots of stuff. He helped Netscape startup, for example...
- 'an alternative to products that "are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities"'
I'm currently theorising that this is transportationally related: In my mind at least this fits all these criteria - and I can certainly sketch in vague conceptual forms technologies that could influence city design.Heinlein Shipstones anyone?
... and today's pet project has
>>According to the inventor of "Ginger," Dean Kamen, his device will be an alternative to products that "are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities." What does that describe besides prostitutes?
It's going to be an alternative to "dirty, expensive, and sometimes dangerous" products? He has to be talking about cars. And I can't think of anything else that would need refitting a city to deal with IT. The auto industry is still a huge thing. If he had a simple, cheap, safe, and fun replacement for the car, I can see that growing to $60 billion in less then ten years.
Here's an article about a personal flying machine that is close to the size they mention in the article. The article is talking about NASA and Silicon Valley, but I imagine others would be working on the same idea.
Other than personal hoverscooter, this is the only thing I've seen that makes sense.
RogueMod +2 Interesting
Boss of nothin. Big deal.
Son, go get daddy's hard plastic eyes.
Expanding a vast wasteland since 1996.
Monty Python's Flying Circus!
He who knows not, and knows he knows not is a wise man
Yes! A herring!
We shall do no such thing.
Oh, please?
Cut down a tree with a herring? IT can't be done! (The Knights of Ni recoil in horror)
Oh! Don't say that word.
What word?
I cannot tell! Suffice to say is one of the words the Knights of Ni cannot hear!
How can we not say the word, if you don't tell us what IT is?
(cringing) AGHHH! You said IT again!
What, "is"?
No ... not "is"! Wouldn't get very far in life not saying "is."
My liege, it's Sir Robin!
Sir Robin!
My liege! IT's good to see you ...
Now he's said the word!
Surely you've not given up your quest for the Holy Grail?
He is sneaking away and buggering off ...
Shut up! ... No no no! Far from IT!
He said the word again!
I was looking for IT ...
AAAGHH!!!
Ah, here, here in this forest.
No, IT is far from this place.
Oh!! Stop saying the word! The word! The word we cannot hear!
Oh, stop IT!
You said IT again!
Hey, I said IT! I said IT! Oh! I said IT again! And there again! That's three ITs! Ohhh!
PJRC: Electronic Projects, 8051 Microcontroller Tools
Patent 5971091 with DEKA and Kamen's name on it seems to address a unicycle/scooter type device . . . haven't had a chance to look it over
It's their new hot product: chicken wings. Except it comes with dipping sauce.
This will revolutionize the entire world!
--
Whatever you do, DON'T CLICK HERE!
Yeah, but that doesn't make it funny.
Boss of nothin. Big deal.
Son, go get daddy's hard plastic eyes.
Expanding a vast wasteland since 1996.
1,000 bucks says that's what it is. And the information in the article seems to support this theory, like having the zoning laws changed, it being kind of humorous, etc.
Beware! That stuff can really mess you up! I knew a guy who started taking it every once in a while, usually after he exercised or exerted himself. Pretty soon he was quaffing whole bottles of the stuff, uncut, morning noon and night. Stay away from this one, folks.
---
If it's really that revolutionary, maybe it's not anything you would just think of. Maybe it's not something from a si-fi movie or something like cold-fusion that has been posted about on slashdot before. It's strange that everyone keeps trying to fit it into their little world of ideas, when it could just as easily not fit into that world.
Please help! I'm stuck inside my virtual reality headset!
As you all know, Marketing has long known that we geeks are technologies Pavolvian Dogs. They've used publications like Popular Science and Byte to whip us into a frenzy about their "latest, greatest" thing. Now, as many of us have long suspected, it appears that the Internet has been compromised as well. For many years, we have used the Internet to calmly and rationally discuss what's new in technology. However, I think this article makes it clear that the hype-free days are now officially over.
I propose the following steps be immediately taken:
- Begin carrying random magazines wherever you go, and make it a point to be seen enthusiastically reading one by a Marketing Wonk. Perhaps spreading disinformation about our information sources will help stem the tide.
- Encrypt all emails that contain the subject lines "Dude, you've got to check this out", "Schweeeet!", and "OMG, when's payday!". Also encrypt all emails with the subject line "D00D, FR33 PR0N N WAR3Z H3R3!", just to keep them guessing.
- Try to keep the geek-drool traffic to a minimum, at least until one of us can invent another totally new information medium that only we can understand.
And for God's sake, don't tell anyone you don't trust about Indrema!
Or its an electric broom.
Don't you mean Ockham's Razor?
Ockham's razor, also called "law of economy" or "law of parsimony", is a principle stated by William of Ockham, that entities are not to be multiplied beyond necessity (non sunt multiplicanda entia praeter necessitatem). This principle was, in fact, invoked before Ockham by Durand de Saint-Pourcain, a French Dominican theologian and philosopher of dubious orthodoxy, who used it to explain that abstraction is the apprehension of some real entity. Galileo did something similar by defending the simplest hypothesis of the heavens, and other later scientists stated similar simplifying laws and principles. It is called "Ockham's razor" because he mentioned the principle so frequently and employed it so sharply. For instance, he used it
Encyclopadia Britannica, Inc., 1994
I don't want to judge anyone's lifestyle choices, but isn't this an awful lot of fuss to make over an ordinary disembodied hand? Oh, no, maybe I'm thinking of THING.
Yeah, I read up on his wheelchair; it makes me think it'll be an electrical scooter/cart.
I doubt it... why would Bezos wonder if it will be legal to use it? My guess is a personal hovercraft type device...
"And like that
I wouldn't be surprised if Ginger is some variant of Kamen's wheelchair, designed to be fast, light and compact.
You missed the joke. Before Diet Coke, there was Coca-Cola Classic, and before it was classic it was...well, it was it. "Coke is it". That was the slogan. That was the jingle.
Which, by the by, had the unintended effect of prompting my then 4-year-old sister to beg my mother to run to the store and buy her some "Cokeisit".
I'm too young to remember what coke was before it was it, but my parents remember trying to by the world a coke. Not sure this was a round of coke, or a single coke with a few billion straws, but either way it was a rather laudy proposition.
Even if it's bullshit, it's cool sounding bullshit and a mecha follows better from his stair-climbing wheelchair then a personal hovercraft.
Though the garbage-powered generator is the only other thing that fits the criteria.
Boss of nothin. Big deal.
Son, go get daddy's hard plastic eyes.
Expanding a vast wasteland since 1996.
Argh! I just said IT!
(I think IT's a new form of electric shrubbery. That's why cities and campuses will have to be redesigned. And that's why Bezos laughed when he turned it on. An electric shrubbery is a very silly thing!)
IT?
Holy crap, I'm majoring in IT and no one knows what IT even is?
I should REALLY have just gone into primary education. I could learn to make things out of popsicle sticks and learn to teach kindergarten math.
IT. Bah.
Angry IT woman in big clompy boots. And talking lint!.
a motorized seat on wheels thing that can handle sidewalk curbs and stairs without disturbing the rider and go 25 mph on straightaways. Also folds up into a briefcase size package that is airplane carry-on sized.
Isn't it obvious?
So IT must be a time travel device right?
The articles clearly indicate that it's a transportation device. The speculation is that the civil structures would have to be changed because currently everything is designed around cars : Roads, parking lots, etc. The mentions towards old economy forces obviously implicates the car manufacturers and the gigantic economic partners of those car companies.
Jobs is quoted as saying: "...If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen."
Cities are currently entirely engineered around cars and the need to get those cars around. If it weren't for cars our social structure would be quite a bit different.
Kemper says the invention will "sweep over the world and change lives, cities, and ways of thinking."
Implication there is hovering, flying, etc. Sweeping over seems to be a hint of something that don't ride on the ground.
Easily theorised though: have an existing product with low cost of manufacture, and sell for a huge markup, just like Microsoft do.
Especially if it's a device (rather than software) you could license it to others to manufacture and sell.....
... and today's pet project has
Hoverbikes, perhaps?
Ha! I kill me!
By then, the electricity bill for riding to work will be more than a days pay, at least in California.
If IT is any of the following:
Wireless Anything
Bluetooth Anything
Embedded Anything
eCommerce Anything
XML Anything
Convergence Anything
I will personally start the greatest jihad this planet has ever seen - enough is enough with the markatroid stunts.
Based on the MSNBC facts, IT does not exist. I assume some of the facts must be wrong, but that means it won't be very revolutionary then will it?
The story must be frought with misquotes, hype, and just a plain draw to decieve the media. Hell if Tom Green can say two words and get international attention anyone can make the media piss on themselves.
What rolls down stairs,
Alone or in pairs,
Rolls over your neighbor's dog?
What's great for a snack,
And fits on your back,
It's Log..Log..Log!!
It's Lo-og, Lo-og
It's big, it's heavy, it's wood!
It's Lo-og, Lo-og, it's better than bad, it's good!!!
Everyone want's a Log
You're gonna love it Log
Come on and get your Log
Everyone needs a Log
Log, from Blamo!
Or maybe I'm just in a credulous mood, or maybe it's too cool for me to care.
I am of course too lazy to look it up, but the bipedal walker thing is way too cool. This thing would make bipedal robots much more likely.
Of course, until they learn to design one that can get back up off the ground, you won't be putting many bike messengers out of work =)
Boss of nothin. Big deal.
Son, go get daddy's hard plastic eyes.
Expanding a vast wasteland since 1996.
Of course, according to this post, which is only a few down for me, if you search for "dean kamen" on google you get tons of pages. So which one of you is right?
Checking.... The other guy is.
"I'd like to live in theory, because everything works in theory, in theory." - Can't remember who said this.
According to the inventor of "Ginger," Dean Kamen, his device will be an alternative to products that "are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities."
---
Sounds like a replacement for the automobile -- which is what most people are speculating. I have to wonder if it might be some sort of personal flying device. That would definitely result in several of the legal barries that Kemper hints at in the original article. Of course, that seems pretty fantastical.
A hovercraft or something similar is probably what IT is. But two important questions needs to be answered. 1. Power Source. The article mentions the current product that "IT" will overtake as being dirty. So what kind of clean, safe and small type of power source could fit into and adequately power a personal craft of this type? 2. Abilities. The article say that the "IT" will run afoul of some existing laws and that cities will need to be modified to work well with "IT". Do you think that it will be able to fly? Or traverse water? I think that if it could fly it would negate the 'safer' argument, but if I could commute across the Hudson River with it... Maybe we'll need to add landing pads to our balcony.
e x p e c t d e l a y . c o m
They never do tell you what it is.
And the brethren went away edified.
I thought this article was about the clown (Stephen King's novel/movie?) :).
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
The by-line for the MSNBC one says:
By PJ Mark
INSIDE.COM
"IT" is getting a bunch of people to endorse a non-existant idea so they can get a book deal...
Who's to say someone didn't just put together a bogus press release and leak it to someone at one of the news pages that 'broke the story'? It wouldn't exactly be the first time that a news site (or paper, for that matter) failed to check its sources before posting such information -- it's usually easier to get the story out first and worry about the retraction later. The few articles that are out there reference practically identical information, so it likely came from the same source. And all of the information on the inventor and writer would have been quite easy to come by... Doesn't this story sound just a little _too_ news worthy? If I wanted to get a web magazine to bite on a hoax, this is exactly the kind of teaser I would come up with. Or perhaps I'm just trying to pretend it's just a load of BS so I don't have to wonder what it is for the next couple of years! Jocephus --- Listen to your bullshit detector!
It's ZERO-click ordering! But seriously, Kamen's VC says "he had been sure that he wouldn't see the development of anything in his lifetime as important as the World Wide Web -- until he saw IT". Now at first I thought, "Come on, no one GETS a thing like web in just one sales meeting". But later while I was making chile I thought "Hey Jobs understood the PARC research right away. He understood the Pixar technology right away. He even recognized the genius of the Apple II while it was still a board full of handwraps." So then I thought "Ok, I'll forget that he's paying Bezos his Time-Man-Of-The-Year tax. I'll forget that iCubes crack (pfpfpf ha). I'll even forget how insanely great Nexts were supposed to be, and I'll step into the reality distortion field one last time and I'll believe it when Jobs says something is really cool." And then I thought, "Ok that's enough crack for tonight. Time to finish the chile."
IT means Information Technology (aka, Internet)
...but our company's slogan is "Big IT."
Well, uh, the bigger the better, I guess...
--
BACKNEXTFINISHCANCEL
its one of those 3d/solid printer things. There were some articles on slashdot about them a while ago. That would clearly explain all the legal issues around the device.
Thoughts on tech, Software Engineering, and stuff
Ever seen The Rocketeer?
All the hints are there in the article. It is obviously a personal transportation device that:
replaces cars
is fun & appealing
will require/allow city infrastructure changes
is easy to use
would require new laws/regulations
make existing competitors (probably automakers) panic
The article's hints are just to blatant too be anything but some sort of personal autonomous flight pack.
Of course IT could just be the latest version of VIP
IV
"These laws they're passing won't even compile anymore, let alone execute." - anon
My bet says it's some sort of super-clean, super-cool transportation. And since it was "turned on", it has something electrical
If you invented a super-cool transportation device, why would you be demo-ing it to Jeff Bezos and Steve Jobs?
Mmmm.. Donuts
I rollerblade; around a *lot* of places, rollerblades are banned, restricted, or prohibited.
Hovercraft is just a little too... sci-fi for my tastes.
Electric go-karts with GPS and auto-navigation and caravan-ing, seems a smarter and cooler idea, myself.
Geek dating!
GPL Deconstructed
a jetpack is fucking dangerous!!! read the article again.
Sorry, no quote, but as I remember, IT was the giant pulsating brain that commanded the citizens of Camazotz in Madeleine L'Engle's A Wrinkle In Time. IT apparently had the ability to dominate humans' minds by forcing repetitive thinking. If this IT is supposed to be an allusion, I am scared.
a bunch of vaporware overinflated hype. show me something tangible and then well see whats up.
.com was IT? look whats up now. hype hype hype...
remember when
NEWS: cloning, genome, privacy, surveillance, and more!
NEWS: cloning, genome, privacy, surveillance, and more!
IT probably stands for Individual Transport.
It will be an alternative to the car. Thus the reference to the 'billion dollar old line companies' and 'social institutions' - in America, and in many places around the world, the car is a powerful social symbol.
The model named 'Metro' fits with a metropolitan-based transportation device.
Kamen has most recently worked on the 'active' wheelchair, which 'transports' an 'individual'. It would be natural that his mind is still focused on 'individual transport'.
Screwdrivers and hexwrenches indicate a mostly mechanical device, although I wouldn't preclude some pretty smart electronics. His active wheelchair can beat a human in a shoving match and stay balanced, no mean feat.
Anyway, I would bet on IT being some adaptation of the active wheelchair technology. Some sort of powered scooter you strap to your legs? Motorized shoes? Power roller-blades?
IT is in the movie Bicentennial Man. IT is One...
I still think given the guys age and the seeming lack of knowledge of current pop culture, that it is named after Ginger Rogers because it has legs.
They could call it the Personal Pollution Free Circular Thrust Motion Mobile.
The Clausius statement of the second law of thermodynamics: It is impossible to construct a device which when operating in a cycle, will produce no effect other than the transfer of heat from a low temperature reservoir to a high temperature reservoir without external aid (work being done on IT).
Corollary: It is impossible not to assemble a team (of software 'professionals') which when operating in a cycle (of software release or anything else), will produce no effect other than the transfer of software from a 'Bug-less, microscopic memory imprint' state to a 'Buggy Bloatware' state , consuming work (lots of IT) in the process.
Now you know what IT is.
Electrical Engineering is BORING.
Another article about it on Salon is here.
e r/ index.html
http://www.salon.com/books/wire/2001/01/09/ging
Coke is it.
It must be the solution to keep a site running after being slashdotted. Of course everyone wants it.
Haaayeellll no.
http://www.indetech.com/productfunction.html
Plenty of info to quell the hype at www.indetech.com
-Dr. Ion
Im not a flamebait!!! im +5 Funny!
I'd like to see anyone build a car with a turbine engine from the contents of two duffel bags in a matter of minutes. I'd say it's some sort of transport device but very low-tech, big springs on shoes!- -------- ---
-----------------------------------------
-------------------------------------------------
No sig. today thank you.
ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!
Moderators, *please* do your little "+1 Funny" magic on this one!!!!
"Don't mind me cutting myself on Occam's Razor"
For $2000?
Don't most of us on Slashdot work in IT already?
General Relativity: Space-time tells matter where to go; Matter tells space-time what shape to be.
Really, no joke.
A mechanicaly operated (pedaled) sealed system personal dirigible, with a mechanical gas pump.
Cost efficient, fun, difficult to regulate, cheap to mass produce once the design is right, and requiring serious changes to archetecture to take advantage of them.
I'd buy one, wouldn't you?
-- Crutcher --
#include <disclaimer.h>
-- Crutcher --
#include <disclaimer.h>
But if you do a Google search on "ginger dean kamen", you get nothing. Not even any wack rumors. Deja doesn't turn up anything either.
So, it's got me curious, which is a pretty good PR trick if nothing else.
--Seen
"I used to be a dilettante. Then I thought I'd try something else for a while."
For those too lazy to see the above link: Page two says:
He might run into problems with the Stirling engine, too. The development of a marketable Stirling device has eluded the brightest engineering minds since Robert Stirling, a Scottish minister, patented the first version in 1816. The basic principle of Stirling's external combustion engine is simple: A chamber is filled with a gas that expands as it is heated by a small heat source, such as a propane flame, and contracts when cooled. The process operates a piston and drives the engine. The advantage? Cheap, local fuels can be used to run the engines, and Kamen has adapted his model to produce electricity instead of mechanical power.
But producing the thing is a more complex matter. While many have tried to use Stirlings to power drive shafts for vehicles, they have proved too expensive to manufacture on a mass scale, and they're not always efficient enough. One low tech problem is designing seals that guard against waste as the heat is transferred into a form that does useful work.
Deka's version heats a chamber containing helium, under pressure, and Kamen says it can run on gasoline, propane, fuel oil, diesel, alcohol, or even solar power - with one-fifth the emissions of a gas stove. Deka's engineers think they'll succeed where others have failed because they've ironed out all the kinks. "We looked at the history of the Stirling - all the money and time and expertise poured into it - and identified a half-dozen key goofs that previous teams had made," says project leader Chris Langenfeld. "Seventy percent of it was a materials challenge. We had to track down the right composites to use as seals."
Kamen hopes that his family of Stirlings, five years in development, will soon bring portable electricity to nations without a reliable power grid - or any grid at all. He envisions briefcase-sized Stirlings powering cell phones and cell towers, as well as purifying water. He aims to have them on the market in the next two years, and is currently working on the marketing issues - like how developing nations will be able to afford bulk purchases of the engines, which are projected to cost $1,500 apiece.
I think our friend Ross C. Bracket may have what IT is... a stirling engine powered scooter(?)?
A quick metal frame, a couple small electric engines, and lightweight batteries. Judging by his work, probably a relatively good gyro-balancing system. Throw in economics of scale, and you could do it for $2000.
"Don't mind me cutting myself on Occam's Razor"
It;s some new kind of peltier based air conditioner
___ alwaysBETA.com - Hey, you've got nothing better to do.
it is really a combination of three ideas that have been around for a long time.
the first is of course the stirling engine that is hardly a secret. it produces a very steady and stable source of power using a variety of energy sources. but as an engine for producing movement it just isn't very effective.
the third is a collapsable platform with two counter-rotating blades to generate thrust. changing the angles of the blades can move the platform in a variety of directions. but it requires a tremendous amount of speed and power to generate enough thrust to lift the platform and an occupant.
the second (what links the two) is a rotary hydrolic motor like the ones used on large-scale chainsaws (ten foot blades attached to what look like coffee cans that can cut down an eight foot diameter tree in a few seconds). other than the smallest bit of friction between fluid and hose there is virtually no loss of energy.
the stirling engine operates a hydrolic pump that pumps hydrolic fluid through a rotor that turns a driveshaft with several thousand pound-feet of torque. through a gearing system this is changes into several thousand rpm at a sufficiently strong torque to spin the fan blades.
for now the mechanics that steer and operate the craft are rudimentary, but it is likely that some of the systems from the ibot will be used to ensure that the craft remains level in flight even if the rider leans over unexpectedly.
the total unit weights about 80 pounds and folds up rather nicely. basically what it boils down to is you could go out to lunch, pour the rest of your martini in the tank and then fly back to the office straight as the crow flies.
frankly I don't understand why he doesn't just stick a hydrolic engine on four wheels, toss the stirling engine under the back seat and have a car that can outpower a diesel truck but cost less than most macintosh comptuers.
- anon
When Kamen was testing his Ibot wheelchair he took it from the bottom of a Paris Metro station to the restaurant level of the Eiffel Tower - up the stairs.
The man is a genius.
-- "The reward of suffering is experience." - Aeschylus
Something just like IT
Dancin Santa
Going on the assumption that the name 'Ginger' is significant somehow, I did a Google search for the word Ginger and other words like 'transportation' and 'Mythology' and 'flight'.
The most intriguing match I found was to the character 'Ginger' in Chicken Run.
A quote from the review "<I>...partly thanks to Ginger, who believes that he'll be able to teach her and the rest of the chickens to fly</I>".
Could this be an invention that will help us 'learn to fly'??
I think everyone is on the right track about this new technology being a form of transportation. Especially considering this guy's history.
Remember, this invention is going to be drastic enough to change our entire notion of how cities should be organized. If it isn't transportation, then it's a new method for delivering utilities.
There's many people saying that this is merely a new type of engine. Think about that for a minute, though. If it were merely a new engine, we could continue using cars (privately-owned, personalized transport) just as we do today -- no change required.
I'm thinking that, somehow, IT is a new paradigm and not merely a new technology. Anything more than that, and I have no idea... but it's something for all of you to mull over.
"Never argue with an idiot. Their drag you down to their level, and then beat you with experience." --Anonymous
Rumor has it that IT requires excessive ammounts of Dihydrogen Monoxide.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
Ok, so it replaces the car.
Think, how fast can you run...
-----Original Message-----
m l
From: Jim Bowery [mailto:jabowery@ricochet.net]
Sent: Saturday, December 30, 2000 3:57 PM
To: Ray Calkins
Subject: Bruce Calkins?
Ray,
I don't know if you are related to Bruce Calkins:
http://www.moller.com/about/staff/#calkins
but if you are, do you happen to know if the Moller people have checked out the stuff being done at the University of Houston with their "vortex thruster" approach to the Coanda effect?
http://www.ifdt.uh.edu/vtc/vortexthruster/main.ht
"Our initial conservative estimates indicate that a thruster with a 1 sq. m. chamber area can generate 4 tons of thrust with 17 times less energy than a conventional jet."
Seastead this.
from http://www.intriguing.com/mp/scripts/mp-holy.txt
... not "is"!
...
... You wouldn't get far not saying "Is"!
...
...
... he was giving up,
... er ... no ... I ... er ... I ... er ... I certainly wasn't giving up ... I was actually looking for the grail ... er thing ... in this forest.
... it lies beyond this forest.
...
...
... I've said it ...
... We've said it ... We're all saying it.
**SNIP**
ARTHUR
Cut down a tree with a herring? It can't be done!
OTHER KNIGHTS (they all recoil in horror)
Oh!
TALL KNIGHT
Don't say that word.
ARTHUR
What word?
TALL KNIGHT
I cannot tell you. Suffice to say is one of the words the Knights of Ni! cannot hear!
ARTHUR
How can we not say the word, if you don't tell us what it is?
TALL KNIGHT (cringing in fear)
You said it again!
ARTHUR
What, "is"?
TALL KNIGHT (dismissively)
No, no
OTHER KNIGHTS
Not "is"! Not "is"!
Suddenly singing is heard from deep in the forest.
SIR ROBIN'S SINGERS
Bravely good Sir Robin was not at all afraid
To have his eyeballs skewered
TALL KNIGHT (irritated)
"Is" is all right
BEDEVERE
My liege, it's Sir Robin!
TALL KNIGHT (covering his ears)
You've said the word again!
SIR ROBIN and his SINGERS appear in the clearing. The SINGERS are going on
cheerfully as usual and ROBIN walks in front of them, continually embarrassed at their presence.
SINGERS
... and his kidneys burnt and his nipples skewered off
ROBIN holds his hand up for silence.
ARTHUR
Sir Robin!
He shakes his hand warmly.
ROBIN
My liege! It's good to have found you again
TALL KNIGHT
Now he's said the word!
ARTHUR
Where are you going good Sir Robin?
ROBIN'S SINGERS (starting up again)
He was going home
He was throwing in the sponge.
ROBIN (to SINGERS)
Shut up! No
ARTHUR
No
TALL KNIGHT
Stop saying the word!
OTHER KNIGHTS
Stop saying the word! The word we cannot hear! The word
ARTHUR (losing his patience with the fearful KNIGHTS OF "NI")
Oh, stop it!
Terrific confusion amongst the KNIGHTS OF "NI", they roll on the ground covering their ears. The TALL KNIGHT remains standing trying to controlhis MEN.
OTHER KNIGHTS
They're all saying the word
TALL KNIGHT
Stop saying it. AAAArghh!
OTHER KNIGHTS
You've said it! Aaaaarghhh!
ARTHUR beckons to BEDEVERE and ROBIN and they pick their way through the helpless KNIGHTS OF "NI" and away into the forest.
**SNIP**
Okay, IT will revolutionise society, require cities to be retro-fitted, may breach existing regulations, and the inventor is a helicopter nut.
My guess? IT is a personal aviation device (eg. helicopter or jetpack) which is manportable, easy to use, safe, reliable and has a useful range.
The car won't be obsolete overnight; we'll still use the car for cargo (shopping etc). But that'll be about it.
--
Andrew Oakley - www.aoakley.com
And they got their demand with the new president: SHRUB! ;)
It's alternative to a common product which is expensive, dirty, and dangerous, especially for city dwellers (sounds like a car to me). He has a history in electric wheelchairs.
He's reinvented the Sinclair C5!
Fuck IT. I don't give a shIT what IT is.
it fits its description. I think he played R2D2's Leia scene to snare the techie types.
Maybe it's one of those evil telescreens from George Orwell's chilling tale of '1984'. Given it's around 17 years overdue, it could happen. Furthermore, the MSNBC article says that "If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen" . Also it states that it isn't a question of whether people are going to buy it, but a question of whether it will be legal. It makes you wonder...
Someone ever tries to kill you, you try to kill them right back!
I read about this thing a few years ago. After seeing all the comotion here, I went back and dug up the URL. Here it is: http://www.solotrek.com If this isn't it, I'll be it's something similar.
(this is prolly going to look like flamebait, but i swear i wasn't trolling)
if jobs and bezos love IT, then IT must be a method of selling at a loss and then making up for it with quantity!
you too can have your very own DotCom (tm) to sell everything that you think everybody needs but is too lazy to buy it at a real store. here's a testimonial from Bob, started using IT to his advantage:
"A couple months ago, I started using IT to sell groceries on the internet. I figured 'Why would anybody trust the people at their local mom n' pop store when they could send their credit cards to me?' So I was talking to IT Venture Capital Services, and their rep was great! They gave me $10,000,000 just for walking in the door! And then when I told him I had a business idea that involved the internet, He gave me another 10,000,000! IT is the best thing that ever happened to the economy!
oh wait... tech stocks are down...
"I hope I don't make a mistake and manage to remain a virgin." - Britney Spears
From the article:Why the secrecy? Kamen fears, as he states in a letter to Kemper that is included in the proposal, that "huge corporations" might catch wind of the invention and "use their massive resources to erect obstacles against us or, worse, simply appropriate the technology by assigning hundreds of engineers to catch up to us, and thousands of employees to produce it in their plants." What really strikes me strange about this quote from the article is his advisory board. Anyone recall 'Pirates of Silicon Valley' (or something like that) a historical fiction based upon all the IP thievery that was going on in the early days? Jobs stealing from Xerox, Gates from Jobs and Bezos from all of us, etc. If all those guys have a reputation as IP cronies, scavengers, jackyls and thieves would you trust them on your advisory board?Come on. Something is truly strange afoot here. The inclusion of Bezos and Jobs is akin to the wolves watching the chicken coop. The whole quote implies that Kamen is aware of this as a potential problem yet still he makes the assumption that these guys won't rob him blind the very second they have a chance. I dunno. Seems to me like the most brilliant minds often lack the common sense required to make it in the real world. I hope this doesn't bite him on the ass.
Prospecting Stinks. Stop Wasting Time on Cold Calling.
I can't believe nobody's yet flashed on the obvious technology that fits every mentioned qualification.
And Steve Jobs' interest is hardly without precedent.
reboots@random
P.S.: I'm well aware that these are two of the most overused links on SlashDot. Sue me!
IT's a Witch! Burn her! Burn her!
if I remember correctly, IT was some sort of clown/arachnid hybrid.
---
"You just stranded one of the world's greatest leaders in San Dimas!"
Bob Fucking Costas. Does anyone else hate that motherfucker?
A wheeled vehicle, but with automatic
self-balancing and self-braking functions. Also
with a generic capability to latch on to other
sources of mobility, including special (probably
tracked) vehicles built for the purpose, or
horizontal or vertical conveyor belts, possibly
with a kind of slingshot action to push then
release the vehicles at higher speeds, where they
will remain stable due to electronic and
gyroscopic controls.
May have autonomous capability, so units could
be public (like the experiment with bicycles in
Amsterdam), and could be thus "borrowed" or
perhaps rented when needed and then
automatically would shunt themselves around
the city in anticipation of predicted needs.
They would initially be useful without
infrastructure, but later as infrastructure
(conveyor belts, or conveyor-bot moving vehicles
onto which these personal vehicles could latch)
became more widespread, these personal vehicles
would become more useful. City governments
would invest in huge fleets of them to
alleviate traffic and pollution problems, but
individuals would also buy them for personal use.
(Metro versus Pro, although an individual could
presumably purchase either).
The wheels have to be fairly large (over 8",
say) to allow smooth navigation over obstacles.
The vehicle will also be able to jump when
necessary, absorb bumps with an electronically
controlled damping system, and may be able to
hook together with other units to form a train.
It may have a kind of micro radar to detect and
quickly respond to obstacles such as curbs.
With its low price, the Metro will not have
the ability to recover energy during braking and
downhill... well, maybe with a flywheel. But the
Pro may have this ability.
Note that Bezos et al did not necessarily see
these things doing all their tricks. They did
see at least one of them "turned on." It would
be possible to demo vehicles such as this without
having the full infrastruture in place: one unit
could, in motion, catch up to and latch on to
another unit, which could then demonstrate the
slingshot action of transferring speed to the
first unit. A key technology in all of this is
the same kind of sensing and balancing that goes
on in Kamen's wheelchair replacement, but applied
in a different domain, the domain of coordinating
and connecting two moving entities (vehicle and
vehicle, or vehicle and conveyer belt).
In a time of impending energy crunch (you ain't
seen nothin yet) a more efficient transportation
tool will really take off.
I think this is it. You could build cities around
it. Cities will be retrofitted for it. It will
affect people in cities especially. It will sweep
over the world.
It won't replace cars. Weather will be an
issue. But many cities in the world have way,
way more motorcycles than we ever see in most
of the cities most of us live in, and this will
be a cleaner, cheaper, replacement for those, in
those places where weather doesn't make it
impractical. It will be interesting to see if
it can balance and travel on ice.
On one score, though, all the ideas I've seen
including this idea (I would say my idea, but it
contains parts stolen from many of the ideas of
others here) fail the test: I don't think these
ideas are bigger than the Internet. But maybe
John Doerr thinks so.
Other ideas:
Maglev: nice idea, but takes a lot of juice.
Probably impractical.
Hover: also nice, but a bit extravagent. Keep
in mind, whatever this is, if it is too over-
the-top, there will be some stigma that will
hold back its acceptance. I think these gues
are smart enough to understand that. They
did allude to a bit of a question about whether
people would be allowed to use it, but that fits
for some wheeled vehicles as well as a hover
vehicle.
Toilet: Nah. Not as big as the Internet.
Personal power station: doesn't fit with some
of the hints that are out there.
Wireless internet: Maybe, if by that we mean
ad hoc wireless networks where everyone makes
their own bandwidth available for others to
share when it's not being used, with a
resulting high bandwith network especially in
cities... But there is no tie-in with a dirty
product, in this case, unless it is obliquely
with the fact that telecommuting makes cars
less useful.
You see it. You eat it. You sleep it. You dream it. You live around _IT_!
On Tue Jan 9 23:13:29, Tritium wrote:
> This is part of one of Kamen's patents, and may be IT.
I think you're right. I think IT is a new type of "scooter", that uses dynamic-balancing tecnology that Kamen developed in the iBot. The iBot could balance fairly stably on only two wheels, even with a full load - you could push it or pull it, and it would compensate to remain balanced.
I think IT is a scooter that uses a similar system, but extended to allow it to do the same while moving. Leaning forwards would force the scooter to shuffle forwards to maintain equilibrium, but since you're standing on it it'll keep moving forwards. The further you lean forwards, the faster it'll go. Straighten up and it'll stop. Lean backwards and it'll move backwards. Since it only balances on two wheels, it would indeed look amusing - people would find it hard to believe that it wouldn't fall over, or at least be incredibly unstable. I don't know what the other two wheels (on each side) are for (in the image Tritium pointd to), but I'd guess they provide a way to smoothly scale even large obstructions, such as kerbs or flights of steps.
It would need some form of motive power, and I'd guess at an electric motor.
Reading the patent description whose number is on Tritium's image backs this up:
It fits all the clues:
- not a medical invention
- possible quick assembly from constituent modules, using only scredriver and hex wrench
- disassembled, fits in a large duffel-bag
- fun element - something which looks so absurdly unstable would make me laugh, especially when I realised it worked. I laughed when I first saw the iBot standing up, too.
- Less than $2,000 - should be relatively cheap to mass-produce.
- Two models - makes sense. You even get different models of those damn push-scooters now...
- "a product so revolutionary, you'll have no problem selling it". Who hasn't wanted a skateboard/scooter/rollerblades that could climb stairs? Or not tip you over when you hit a crack in the pavement? Or safely navigate cobbles? I know I have, a thousand times.
- "The question is, are people going to be allowed to use it?". Having people zipping around on pedestrian walkways on motorised scooters will give safety groups the jitters. OTOH, it looks too small and flimsy to compete with cars on the road.
- "If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen". It's a city-planner's dream - electrically-powered, no pollution, quiet, clean, fast, safe (if you're going to crash, just jump off), you name it. It dumps all over cycle-paths. Perhaps "Ginger-paths" next?
- "will sweep over the world and change lives, cities, and ways of thinking". Hyperbole, sure, but it could replace bikes/skateboards/rollerblades entirely, and have a good crack at cars for short in-town journeys.
- "The core technology and its implementations will... have a big, broad impact not only on social institutions but some billion-dollar old-line companies". Yah, like petrol companies, car companies, oil companies. Cheap, efficient electrically-powered, safe mass-transit devices? The petrol/car co's must be having a coronary at the mere thought.
- "will profoundly affect our environment and the way people live worldwide". See points about cheap, clean transport, earlier.
- "It will be an alternative to products that are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities". IE, cars, bikes, the tube, buses, trains.
- "IT will be a mass-market consumer product". At under $2,000, I'd want one.
- "likely to run afoul of existing regulations and or inspire new ones... will also likely require meeting with city planners, regulators, legislators, large commercial companies and university presidents about how cities, companies and campuses can be retro-fitted for Ginger". See point earlier about how it couldn't safely mix with pedestrians or cars, but would probably need a cycle-path-type idea.
If there's anything I've missed, please let me know. This sounds about the coolest hting I've heard of in years, and I'm dying for 2002 to come around so I can find out if I was right or notAny thoughts?
-- Hi, I'm a
... It was a large, white box, with no lights or switches or ports that I could recognize.
"Ah, so it's totally wireless", I said, but that only widened his already freakishly big smile. "Just open it", he said.
Easier said than done. He managed to shut the box so tight that at some point I seriously considered hacking the damn thing with an ax. And just as I turned my head to ask him if I could go and take my trusty axe from the trunk of my car (don't ask), the box, as if hearing my thoughts, opened.
From it rolled (or should I say, bounced), black, rubber balls, about the size of tennis balls, but apparently heavier. The box didn't seem to contain anything else. "I still don't understand what it does", I said, "Well, if you want, you can cut one of the balls open" he replied, and handed me a small knife.
I cut the ball in two, and it seemed to be made of solid rubber. I cut each of the pieces into smaller pieces, but they still looked as homogenious as the halves themselves. I cut them into smaller and smaller pieces, but they still looked like rubber. "Is it nano-tech or something?" I asked with dispair. "Alright, I should probably tell you, since you don't seem to figure it out yourself" he said in a somewhat annoyed tone - "It's rubber".
"What?! Rubber?! Is this the invention that's supposed to be bigger than the PC? A box filled with rubber balls? What the hell are people supposed to do with this thing?"
"Nothing."
"So it was a scam! I knew it! But why? Is it the money? Or is it simply for the pleasure of fooling the whole world?"
"Well, you see, I've invented so many things in my life -- useful things, important things, things that've changed people's lives. And yet, did I have a couple of billions of dollars to spare? Did anyone even know who Dean Kamen is?
And then I noticed those computer and Internet companies. They rarely invented anything important. Not only their inventions didn't save people's lives -- sometimes they didn't even make money. So what was their secret? Why so many people were excited about them?
Hype. They made so much hype and yet delivered so little -- it was really amazing.
And then it hit me: inventing is hard. Thinking of an idea that'll change mankind forever and then developing that idea into something useful takes a lot of time and effort, and even if you invent something that changes the world, you'll be most likely to be forgotten. Hype, on the other hand, is easy to make, especially if I could convince some well known figures from the computer industry such as Jobs or Bezos that they could get publicity and even money from that kind of stunt.
So I made the box you see before you, and filled it with rubber balls, so it will be heavy enough. I called it 'IT' after 'Information Technology' - one of the many buzzwords that were invented at that time."
"So it was fame, then?"
"No. Not only that, anyway.
It made me angry that these companies will be remembered as the agents of innovation and progress, while in reality, the main thing they did is to generate hype and do stupid publicity stunts. I hope that this will help people realize how silly and unproductive this whole thing is."
(whoa, i hope i didn't make too much of a fool of myself with this comment)
Here is an article on inside.com as well. PR stunt? Good one if it is.
8 &p od_id=8
http://www.inside.com/jcs/Story?article_id=2021
> Don't you mean Ockham's Razor
No, I mean "Occam's Razor". Quoting from your source:
"also spelled OCCAM'S RAZOR"
That's good enough for me.
> is a principle stated by William of Ockham,
> that entities are not to be multiplied beyond
> necessity (non sunt multiplicanda entia praeter
> necessitatem).
The same source gives this as the definitive definition:
"Plurality should not be posited without necessity."
To me, today, Occam's Razor is generally quoted as, "The simplest or most obvious answer is generally the correct one".
The reason it's my sig is simple: I overlook the obvious. I never see the simple answer. And thus, I end up wasting a lot of time, effort, and probably health "cutting myself" on "Occam's Razor".
Though I think I will/might switch my sig to this one:
"Reality cures optimism" - DoomHaven, unless someone has prior art on it. Of course, the inverse works just great for someone who is continuously cheery, and thus diametrically opposed, to me.
That is nifty sig.
"Don't mind me cutting myself on Occam's Razor"
From the article:
According to the proposal, another investor, Credit Suisse First Boston, expects Kamen's invention to make more money in its first year than any start-up in history, predicting Kamen will be worth more in five years than Bill Gates.
Bill Gates has more than US$60 billion to his name. That means this company would go from $0 to >$60 billion in five years? My first reaction is that this is complete horseshit, but if Credit Suisse First Boston, an arm of a major Swiss bank, is behind it, it must certainly carry some weight.
But think about the sheer logistics behind rocketing to more than $60 billion in corporate worth in only five years... it absolutely boggles the mind!
Jobs told Kamen the invention would be as significant as the PC, the proposal says.
If Steve Jobs says this, he just might be on to something. But how many things have been trumpeted as "PC replacements" in the past, oh, ten years?
--
Maybe it's new way to do market research. Buy a news network and put out a bogus story on a mysterious product and then ask the masses what they hope IT is!
On the other hand maybe it really is the omnipotent, omniscient, artificially super-intelligent, mind-reading, sensory input inducing (for awesome VR games!), cheap, environmentally friendly, runs on blacklightpower hydrinos, high-temperature superconducting, instantaneous transportation and communication device, with a built-in simulated oral sex attachment, that I really really wanted for Christmas but didn't get.
If IT only runs on Windows I think I might consider dual booting.
let's pretend that IT is some sort of personal hovercraft/helicopter/magnetic/spaceship that is super fuel efficient.
Destroying the existing car/gas empires (while initially disruptive) can only be good for us (economically and otherwise) in the long run. Whole new industries, whole new infrastructure.
Lets crank up a whole 'nother round of start-up businesses!
-C
Just a guess, but I think IT is a personal two-wheeled version of the iBot. Here's his most recent patent application: PERSONAL MOBILITY VEHICLES AND METHODS You have to look internationally for patent information, folks. Transmeta had published patent applications on-line fully detailing all of their inventions 9 months before the news 'broke' on slashdot, etc.
The "Stirling engine" is just too silly and I'm going to throw it out. However, the meaning of IT post sounds plausable. The USPTO patenet listings seems to have some clues. I picked "human transporter" as the most viable entire-product listed. Then there's the Ginger post about what Ginger could mean. An editor (in the linked story) called it a "personal hovering craft". All this seems to jive (and go back and read that patent!). "Metro" and "Pro" seem like good names for transportation devices or some sort.
There's too much mention about "irregular surfaces" and "stairs" and what not, and the thought of people suspended below helicopter blades frightens me so much that I'm going to wager that it is NOT a helicopter. But I believe it is a personal (one-person) hovercraft type device (no doubt, with a novel approach) that has controls like a scooter [or motorcycle] (which allow for leaning), plus a joystick control and a height adjustment control.
The thought of thousands of people with this would jive with what was said about city regulations. With all the current craze over the scooter fad, yeah, I could see people buying them in droves at the right price, and it sounds far more entertaining than the stock of a previous employeer that I have sitting around doing nothing.
Summary: It's a one person transportation device that does not rely on standard locomotion (which makes it cool) such as a motor driven wheel to move you from point A to B. (Of course, I wonder how good the brakes are!)
Anyone ever play the game Paranoia by West End Games? Did you ever get the R&D Catalog that had novel inventions such as the "papercut chainsaw" and the "I scream cone"? Well, if so, you'll remember IT. What is IT? You mean, you don't have IT? I WANT IT! PLEASE! Tell me where I can get IT! All your enemies already have IT! [In this case, IT was a handheld computer device that could wipe out any enemy as reliably as any other R&D device in Paranoia. Which is to say, rarely.] Anyone care to join me in some More Treasonous Songs About Food Vats?
As far as I know from IPR people talks at my former company, it doesn't mean anything that you don't find anything in the patent database, for there is a quite long period of time (I thing is something like 2 years) between you submit the patent, and it is publicly accessible. During that period, your rights on it apply exactly the same, but the patent is just not "searchable". The idea is protecting exactly the same kind of thing the IT guys are trying to protect. In brief, don't trust too much on patent search.
Easy? Power is a problem as usual but batteries are slowly improving. In 5 years time they may be good enough.
For those of you who are interested in a serious possibility, try looking at this document, which may well indicate one of the effects that "IT" exploits. DANGER! - the contents of this document may cause a severe mental blockage in the mind of any self-respecting, dyed-in-the-wool, conventional physics researcher http://www.egroups.com/files/electroaerodynamics13 /DoE+Advanced+EM+Working+Group+/Beprpp2.pdf
What are the chances that the people responsible for IT hire Linus, have a blank website with no tpyos, and finally name the product after a Robert Louis Stevenson character?
If you receive IT in an text email, don't worry, you're ok. If the email is HTML, delete immediately, then run a virus scan of your entire system. DO NOT under any circumstance run an IT.exe, or other attachment, delete (or better yet shread) immediately. If IT should arrive in a package, fill a bathtub (or other suitabale container) full of water, then place package and entire contents totally submerged in the water for a full 24 hours before removing. If properly handled IT is not dangerous.
"Open code, in other words, can be a check on state power." -Lawrence Lessig
I'm thinking of how you'd connect Jobs and Bezos to a transportation device, and it occurs to me: Amazon will want to sell them, and Jobs will want to put computers in them. Because... Imagine this: You go to your web site, select your destinations in the city (work, store, cheese shop, etc.). You get into the cool little pod, it whisks you away to your destination. Along the way, you browse the web, send/receive email, etc. It's a personal and configurable subway system. That would be cool. :)
--
Swampfox
Real Hacker (tm) Wanna-be
Swampfox
Real Hacker (tm) Wanna-be
Deals
Its a marketting campaign.
No really,
there's nothing of substance there, if there was, they'd patent them and make them.
You'd be reading the patent submissions, not the PR.
This is PR, its not a leak, its a marketing 'teaser' campaign.
Why a teaser campaign if there was anything of substance? If it really was going to be huge you would have no teaser campaign.
It needs hard selling so its nothing you would want or need.
http://www.indetech.com/ is Johnson and Johnson web site on his previous invention a 4WD wheelchair.
This story might also be interesting to you:
http://www.msnbc.com/news/285231.asp
If you search on Kamen, you get stuff from his own websites or from press releases quoted on news sites,
e.g.
http://www.usfirst.org/dean.html
From this site, Dean founded 'First' in New Hampshire, and works/founded
Deka Research and development corp whose web site doesn't work.
So it sounds like a marketting build up to sell a mainstream 4WD wheelchair as fun vehicle you would
want to play with.
It took some thinking, but I've figured out what IT is... IT is the newest piece of immensely overhype and excessively shrouded bit if techno hype to be produced since Transmeta's cryptic web page first went up!
And people are having such a hard time figuring out what IT is...
:)
If I could only live my life with my threshold at 4...
Here IT is again.
Dancin Santa
The Spanish Prisoner was a David Mamet film staring Campbell Scott and Steve Martin. The premise was that a scientist invents a unnamed formulat that will control the world's economy for the next 3 years.
It's all top secret, nobody gets to see it. and the viewer never finds out what it is or what it does. I don't want to give away the movie
But I think that Jobs and Bezos are trying to lure in Gates with IT. They will attempt to control the world's economy to drive Gates crazy. :>) Then again, Gates probably IS driving a good chunk of the world's economy himself.
Sounds like a game of tag gone horribly awry...
Jeez... the cold-fusion flap was when I was at university, and I'm not even thirty. Ten or eleven years ago would be more like it...
Because if he demoed it to anyone prominent in the transportation industry, they'd probably steal the idea and build it themselves?
--
Obfuscated e-mail addresses won't stop sadistic 12-year-old ACs.
Win dain a lotica, en vai tu ri silota
Wasn't there mention in that recent Wired article about an engine he was working on?
-- This sentence is false.
An illustration I saw a LOOONNNGGG time ago depicted a group of people standing around wearing what looked like powered unicycles. The vehicles consited of a cowling with a clear windscreen, armrests inside with controls at your hands. A single column down your back to a footrest with the wheel below it.
You probably remember them. A group of people, supposedly looking at a monitor whose face is not visible, oohing and aahing about what they were supposedly seeing. I'm as impressed by IT as I was by those stupid IBM commercials. IT is vapor until its function and nature are revealed, no matter who supposedly oohs and aahs over it. Cactus Critter no sig; it's better that way
Dontcha think the people using it in the future would've already come back to tell us what IT is?
A patent search on IBM's patent server for ( (Kamen Dean) (INVENTOR,ASSIGNEE)) does not show anything too interesting in recent patents. The "Catamenial Collector" is humorously confusing...it appears to be...almost...a sex toy. Everything else he has patented recently seems to be boring and mostly medical...
But for $2000? Wholesale? A decent road bicycle can run well over $2000.
the only things that would impress me are:
Faster Than Light Travel
Teleportation.
Time Travel
Anything else would not deserve so much hype. Remember the hype around Transmeta, and now we know Crusoe is (almost) just vaporware.
because one of anything is never enough
we've been racking our brains at work with different theories. A personal consumer device that replaces something expensive, frustrating, and dangerous that requires city infrastructure changes can only be a transportation device. What kind is another question, teleportation would be awesome, a hover Razor scooter more believable, but for it to be less dangerous it must be somewhat automated. Either way, IT is the ultimate riddle =)
according to this discussion and the article above, my guess would be a form of transportation sort of like a personal train car, operated electrically by a grounding strip. Kinf of like the way bumper cars are operated with the big metal mesh on the ceiling thats electrically charged. These things are probably light enough that most anyone can lift them, or also have a self-propelled method for short distances.
The advantages of such a machine are obvious. less pollution, probably a reduction in accidents, etc. The disadvantage is you have to fight a multi-billion dollar car industryt who's not going to let something like this happen. As cool as this technology might be, who's gonna take GM, Chrysler, and other auto-manufacturers on when they already have a strong political hold in washington?
I'm sure some of my little buddies out there will get the reference in under three hours. . . .
(sorry, couldn't resist. . . . at least there are no www.goatse.cx references. . . .except that one. . . .)
with Dean Kamen? Please?
Woot w00t w007.
1. The Hooksett Banner Archives, April 22, 1999
April 22, 1999. This week's stories: (click on the headline to jump to story) Pembroke Academy boys recycle clutter and junk into nitrogen-powered...
URL: www.neighborhoodpub.com/banarchive042299.html - bytes
from THIS Altavista query?
Three men in a small room with hex wrenches, a couple of duffel bags, and a guy with a big "honking" laugh.
Considering that and the known critical mass of each of these men's egos, I'm thinking's its a new, efficient way to masterbate.
Quickly assembled using simple tools and with no reports of maiming or bloodloss? I guess Ikea won't be selling them, then.
--
I would be a paid subscriber if Taco and Hemos weren't such cunts
After reading the article I have to agree. It is definetly transportation, but I don't think it's a car / scooter or something like that. I rather would guess something that allows you to "fly".
Why? Because he seems to be an avid flyer that alone is a good point, plus a scooter wouldn't do you any good in africa or in the outback (just to name two), so maybe he figured out a way how to produce a cheap, reliable helicopter?
If you want to e-mail me, use my PGP Key.
Perhaps IT isn't "it", but "I" "T"? Everyone seems to think it's transportation oriented, so perhaps it stands for "Individual Transport"... Sheesh, ever notice how many times you use that word?
For most small companies, people live in fear of what will happen when the "geek" jumps ship. All those uncompensated weekend hours re-writing the vb code for the database... what now? www.ridiculopathy.com
if you're going to post the lyrics to a Laika song, you should at least give them credit.
It is money.
---
"You just stranded one of the world's greatest leaders in San Dimas!"
Bob Fucking Costas. Does anyone else hate that motherfucker?
Crazy, just as I thought IT would stand for Individual Transport, I read that someone posted they thought it stood for the same thing 3 hours ago. Anyways, my thoughts are that it is some kind of back to the future hoverboard or flying device. I could only come up with the idea that this "personal vehicle" would ride on magnets or some kind of propulsion device related to magnets and electricity (like some of the thrill rides use now, I think Superman The Ride uses it). http://www.fasteddie.com
http://www.fasteddie.com
you know, for kids!
// "Can't clowns and pirates just -try- to get along?"
Pretty damned amorphous, that's for sure!
Eatin' teenagers and all that! Ba-DUM cha!
--hongpong.com
fucking retards.
I bet it's cold fusion. He just whipped his bell jar, a strip of palidium, and some heavy water out of his duffle bag and voila!! Electricity!
Now, if only the utilities don't silence him before he makes it public... ;)
Waltz, nymph, for quick jigs vex Bud.
A quick look at the first claim of the patent reveals:
Sounds like motorized pogo sticks to me. I just can't believe anyone could make $60 billion on motorized pogo sticks.
What do you mean they cut the power? How can they cut the power, man? They're animals!
i'm sure IT will be bundled in the first release of Whistler
It is a replacement for cars 'dirty, sometimes dangerous' Inexpensive transportation think of where the goverments are when it comes to the regulation of personal flying machines...
Magnetic Levitation Rails built into the ground? Are you crazy??? Not only would it destroy every computer in ever city, I would also result in mass amounts of badness in the form of metallic items being attracted to the ground.
Sorry to spoil the game, but I think this guy is chortling mightily with his buds and knockin' back a Zima at the O'Reilley's Bar right now, thinkin' about what a bunch of suckers we all are.
--hongpong.com
Actually, no.
This patent refers to the all-terrain wheelchair that is Kamen's most recent invention. See Fig. 4.
J.J.
http://www.inside.com/jcs/Story?article_id=20218&p od_id=8
A portable, personal jetpack can fit into every one of the clues on the website mentioned above.
Wanna hear my theory? I think it's some sort of personal flying device, perhaps using some sort of antigravity or magnetic repulsion. Here is my evidence.
From the MSNBC article;
IT is not a medical invention.
The invention has a fun element to it, because once a Ginger was turned on, Bezos started laughing his "loud, honking laugh".
-What could be more fun than flying?
Bezos is quoted as saying that IT "...is a product so revolutionary, you'll have no problem selling it. The question is, are people going to be allowed to use it?"
-People may not be allowed to use it? This suggests that it will break existing rules. There are many rules about airspace in cities, for instance. Also, pay attention to this, scooter fans; revolutionary. An electric scooter would not be revolutionary
Jobs is quoted as saying: "...If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen."
-If you could fly, architecture would have to take advantage of that. Roofs would suddenly be parking lots. Balconies would be landing pads.
The "core technology and its implementations" will, according to Kamen, "have a big, broad impact not only on social institutions but some billion-dollar old-line companies."
-Billion dollar old line companies? Like car companies?
And the invention will "profoundly affect our environment and the way people live worldwide. It will be an alternative to products that are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities."
-Once again, what else is dirty, expensive and dangerous except the auto?
Here are my final two points. The inventor is an avid aviator, and he drives a helecopter to work. And finally, the code name, 'Ginger' evokes Ginger Rogers, the girl who could 'dance on air.'
Don't you wish you could dance on air too?
Building on his experience with wheelchairs the inventor decided his next invention would be a mass market transportation device. A levitating scooter might be able to hit his price point of $2,000. The scooter would be powered by magnetic levitation rails in the ground. This explains why Jobs is quoted as saying: 'If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen.'
All I know is that this better benefit consumers; otherwise we really shouldn't care, as it would not affect our lives. PS We are not talking about Information Technologists. We are talking about some top secret projeect. To avoid confusion let's refer "IT" as Ginger please.
http://www.indetech.com/productfunction.html
IT could have a fun aspect, parts would fit in a duffelbag, etc, etc. Shop and compare!
The article says that IT is an invention which will change the world. Like cold-fusion?
There is a certain order scientists follow when releasing a new discovery. The idea must be given peer review before anyone should believe a word about it.
A couple of scientists came out about 15-20 years ago I believe, saying they had acieved cold-fusion. They were given their 15 minutes, interviewed by reporters, etc. The problem was that their 'method' for achieving it was bogus. When time came to present it, and have others duplicate it, no-one could.
Until they say what IT is, and IT can be duplicated by someone other than the 'inventor', it's not news, it's hype.
IT: (n. eye- tee). 1. A state of having recently graduated from college with a liberal-arts degree and realizing that all your electrical engineering friends are making bank. 2. A catchall term for 40-something HR reps from conglomerates making any number of x (x.) products, none of which have to do with computers. Term explicitly, or implicitly, indicates an incomprehension for technology related substances. 3. (n.)Dodging term for one who works at a failing .com "Harry, where do you work?", "Oh, I'm in IT."
IT(n.):syn. Synergy, Value-Add, (phr.)Thinking outside the box. (side: box (n.) is not implicitly labeled). or, any other number of terms upper-management throws around without any clue of definition.
IT(n.):ant. Work-ethic, Skilled Labor, e.g. "I work for a company that's been around longer than 3 years."
FluX
After 16 years, MTV has finally completed its deevolution into the shiny things network
"It is seldom that liberty of any kind is lost all at once." -David Hume
As I posted at MSNBC:
I would tend to agree with this perspective.
It might be super energy efficient, or super quiet, or just plain made out of attractive, trendy, and translucent plastics.
Jobs's participation in this would tend to enforce this impression; Jobs is more of a personality and a motivator than any real visionary.
In addition, creating top-secret hype and innuendo a year before any kind of announcement leads me to think that the technology and application will be as revolutionary as a translucent all-in-one computer running MacOS.
On Tue Jan 9 21:27:56, Al Capone wrote:
> Is nothing more than a some cheesy overhyped skooter or
> rolling device thats electric or pedal power. YUCK!!
> Check the man's lineup of other inventions. Then ask
> your self could it really be anything else?
IT's made out of people! eww.
I'm dead. No, really. Ok fine, you got me, I'm a newt.
Just because of that "dirty, dangerous, and frustrating, esp. for people in cities" comment you shouldn't assume that it's a form of transportation. What if it's a space heater?
Suffice to say; the one word we knights of ni cannon hear!
Given:
.. I guess that Ginger is a compact personal flying machine meant
to replace cars.
- the inventor's history of transpo-oriented patents like Stirling engines and off-road wheelchairs,
-that the inventor is an avid aviator who commutes via a helicopter,
- the talk of running afoul of regulations and of re-architecting cities
- Ginger will "have a big, broad impact not only on social institutions but some billion-dollar old-line companies" [quotation here]
- it is a mass-market alternative to a "dirty, expensive, dangerous" item
-Lloyd
Actually describes fully the invention made ..
in contrast to a lot of other patents .. .
I'm still trying to figure out what people mean by 'social skills' here.
I beleive "IT" is an acronym for "Independance Technology". I suspect what this will turn out to be is a hopped up super mobile wheelchair for both physically challenged and non-physically challenged folks to use. The trick would be to get folks used to the idea of wheelchairs as a acceptable mode of transportation for average folks to use. I beleive the is information on this at the Johnson and Johnson website, but forgot the URL....
IT's BULLSH... you figure out the rest
I'm a good cook. I'm a fantastic eater. - Steven Brust
You said it again! AAAH! I said it! I said it! OOOOH! I said it again! AAAH! That's three "it"s...
Regards,
-scott
Regards,
-scott
There seems to be a general consensus that IT is some kind of personal or portable transportation device (Individual Transportation?) based on the fact that Kamen is pretty much centric on creating things to help people get around. Sifting through the article gives us a lot of clues that may be read various ways but here's my take on them:
In a private meeting with Bezos, Jobs and Doerr, Kamen assembled two Gingers -- or ITs -- in 10 minutes, using a screwdriver and hex wrenches from components that fit into a couple of large duffel bags and some cardboard boxes.
Clearly indicates something portable and can be easily put together quickly with a minumum of tools. Remember Little Netty (I think that was the name) of the helicopter in one of the James Bond movies? She came in a few duffle bags and was assembled in a few minutes. So I can imagine a personal transportation device that can be driven to work, disassembled into a duffle bag and stored under your cubicle until 5:00pm. No parking hassles.
The invention has a fun element to it, because once a Ginger was turned on, Bezos started laughing his "loud, honking laugh".
Not sure how to read this. How could a scooter/car/whatever be fun? Perhaps the mention of a hover device awhile ago (they've been available for years) could look 'fun' when activated.
There are possibly two Ginger models, named Metro and Pro -- and the Metro may possibly cost less than $2,000.
Again going on the transportation idea, a Metro model (Metro for Metropolois? City) vs Pro for long distance trips?
Bezos is quoted as saying that IT "...is a product so revolutionary, you'll have no problem selling it. The question is, are people going to be allowed to use it?"
Currently, you have to be licensed to drive and in most areas, licensed to operate any kind of motor vehicle. Hmmm...
Jobs is quoted as saying: "...If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen."
This currently happens with bicycles. They create new bike paths or alter roadways to accomodate cyclists. Could happen with a motor device that doesn't operate at high speeds like a car.
according to Kamen, "have a big, broad impact not only on social institutions but some billion-dollar old-line companies."
Big shot at the big three (well, they were the big three motor companies). So a device to put all gas-combustion companies to shame?
"profoundly affect our environment and the way people live worldwide. It will be an alternative to products that are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities."
They keep pushing the city angle, which we know is the key issue with gridlock. Cars are indeed dirty, expensive and sometimes dangerous (but then so is the average Windows program)
IT will be a mass-market consumer product "likely to run afoul of existing regulations and or inspire new ones," according to Kemper. The invention will also likely require "meeting with city planners, regulators, legislators, large commercial companies and university presidents about how cities, companies and campuses can be retro-fitted for Ginger."
Again, just screams of dealing with a new transportation device. Look at how campuses have accomodated cyclists converting old walkways into bicycle paths. Now they might have to deal with this!
Kamen fears, as he states in a letter to Kemper that is included in the proposal, that "huge corporations" might catch wind of the invention and "use their massive resources to erect obstacles against us...
This would be typical of big car companies to work heavy handed agains the little guy. Remember the Tucker? A revolutionary car in every aspect, but was shut down by the big three before the first production run. I know, any company can use tactics like this, but it is typical of large companies when their primary bread-winner is at risk.
Sure, this response is transportation centric but I do feel, based on Kamen's past inventions (there are quite a few, including a wheel-chair that can climb stairs) that this is a natural next step for him. As for Jobs and Bezos, these guys just live for this type of innovative technology so it's only natural for them to be involved.
liB
IT is a bunch of bullshit!!!
Anyone who went to the national FIRST competition last year saw Dean demonstrate the wheelchair he/DEKA created. I actually have a picture of the thing, but I'm at school right now and can't post it. The wheelchair is designed to make a disabled person feel completely independent and reduce the feeling of inferiority that might come from having to sit in a wheelchair while someone stands over you. The chair has a gyroscope for stability. This means it can switch positions from a normal two wheels on either side, to a one wheel on top of the other position. This makes the person in the wheelchair at the same height as a non-disabled person so that they can look eye to eye. It can actually walk like this, balanced on one wheel. While Dean showed it off, he sat in it the entire time. The thing is designed to work in various terrains, including sand. Another feature Dean showed is one's ability to climb stairs with the device. Using the railing on a set of stairs, one can easily pull themselves up the stairs, while the wheels circle around to climb the stairs. Dean Kamen's done some pretty cool stuff with robotics.
Sheepdot: Open Source good, Closed Source baaaaaaad!
Damn IT
so it can be assembled with a screwdriver and some hex wrenches... ;)
so it'll replace something dirty inefficient and dangerous (the people?)
so it fits in a couple large dufflebags and some cardboard boxes.
but he says they'll have to talk to city planners. so it needs an infrastructure...
they say they'll design cities -around- IT... they say they'll have to talk to regulators and university persidents about retrofitting for IT
well it can't hover or fly, imho... if it hovered, it wouldn't need an infrastructure unless it's like those magnetic trains.
if it flew... well can you imagine the liability lawsuits? plus, again - no infrastructure needed, unless they want to pad the ground for impact
my guess: magneto-repulsive hovering rollerblades/skateboard/scooter-stye thing.
cardboard boxes: large hover inducing... plates.
dufflebag: implements to assemble... device.
demo: Kamen hovering on device from plate 1 to plate 2
funny though, it was all a big secret from the press till they showed the computer geeks...
// "Can't clowns and pirates just -try- to get along?"
...flamebait me if you want, but personally, I think that story sucked... stop trying to use big words to sound smart... "Phantasmagoria"? Who says that?
I've got about as much eye-hand coordination as Christopher Reeve. thelung187
Alan Watts wrote a book about this year and years ago: This is it
Bah. None of you are thinking big enough. I say IT stands for Instantaneous Transport That's obviously why he needed to build 2 of them - one to transmit, and one to receive.
OK, so I know I'm dreaming, but I want personal teleportation...
-Cyclopatra
"We can't all, and some of us don't." -- Eeyore
"We can't all, and some of us don't." -- Eeyore
- IT is not a medical invention.
- In a private meeting with Bezos, Jobs and Doerr, Kamen assembled two Gingers -- or ITs -- in 10 minutes, using a screwdriver and hex wrenches from components that fit into a couple of large duffel bags and some cardboard boxes.
- The invention has a fun element to it, because once a Ginger was turned on, Bezos started laughing his "loud, honking laugh".
- There are possibly two Ginger models, named Metro and Pro -- and the Metro may possibly cost less than $2,000.
- Bezos is quoted as saying that IT "...is a product so revolutionary, you'll have no problem selling it. The question is, are people going to be allowed to use it?"
- Jobs is quoted as saying: "...If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen."
- Kemper says the invention will "sweep over the world and change lives, cities, and ways of thinking."
- The "core technology and its implementations" will, according to Kamen, "have a big, broad impact not only on social institutions but some billion-dollar old-line companies." And the invention will "profoundly affect our environment and the way people live worldwide. It will be an alternative to products that are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities."
- IT will be a mass-market consumer product "likely to run afoul of existing regulations and or inspire new ones," according to Kemper. The invention will also likely require "meeting with city planners, regulators, legislators, large commercial companies and university presidents about how cities, companies and campuses can be retro-fitted for Ginger."
Okay, now consider this:The invention itself is as interesting as the inventor. Kamen -- "a true eccentric, cantankerous and opinionated, a great character," according to the proposal -- dropped out of college in his 20s, then invented the first drug infusion pump; he later created the first portable insulin pump and dialysis machine.
I am totally blown away as to what it is, but it seems like this guy just might know what he's doing...
--
When the device was turned on, behind closed doors, laughter can be heard:
Assuming this device was actally DEMONSTRATED IN USE in a room...It's probably not using fan blades (personal helicopter) or ducted fans (personal skirted hovercraft)...The thrust required to lift a person displaces a LOT of air...And that means NOISE!
(And not too smart to fire up in anything other than LARGE space....But the dimensions of the meeting space are not mentioned.)
The Metro model I imagine an alternative-energy Scooter with some kind of stablization gyro...Think of an untippable Zzap electric scooter. The Metro would provide low speed city transportation for metro commuters.
Think of a two wheeled iMac that your Mom could ride.
(Considering that you could fit 4 in every space a standard car would take up...In traffic and parking...One would need to redefine those parameters)
The Pro model would be a higher-speed seated/enclosed two-wheeled untippable vehicle.
The latter brings along the same liabilities as a conventional motorcycle on freeway traffic.
But the former...The Metro...In the version I presuppose...Could be VERY popular in cities. Especially in California. And even MORE especially in San Francisco.
Dang. I submitted this question Ask Slashdot style under science, hoping it would get serious attention, seeing as how Dean Kamen has brought a lot of good to this world through scientific advances.
My personal hope is that the Stirling engine discussed on page 2 of this Wired article is approaching commercial viability. Cheap portable power generation using virtually any kind of fuel? Sounds awesome and of great potential beneifet to humanity. Anyone close to the project have any inside info? Anyone familiar with this technology want to further explain its coolness?
Look, I've read Sladek, I know what IT is, it's an evil robot sent to paint pictures and kill people.. Sure, they're going to think at first that it's nothing, and is in fact something good for humanity.. but then they'll find out and try to elect it vice-president... I KNOW THESE THINGS.
---
"Music is music, but anarchy is stupid." -- Eli Armen-Van Horn
Peter Gabriel / The Lamb Lies Down on Broadway / 1974
Second soul, and second one off the sinking ship, is Sekem: Energy, Power. Light. -WSB
Clearly it is transportation.
It probably comes out of his wheelchair research.
And it made Jobs laugh.
Gyroscopically stabilized pogo stick.
Or maybe a stabilized unicycle.
Though that's not as funny.
The closer you are to the code, the happier you are. - Ancient Geek Proverb
IT is tis reaaly mean clown who eats little kids, so watch IT!
I can do pirouettes off my roof in a 25 hundred pound helicopter.
and
His personal retreat on North Dumpling Island off the Connecticut coast often does not hear the whirr of his helicopter blades more than twice a year. But he could tell you exactly how everything on that helicopter works. He was instrumental in the redesign of the rotor hub, which is where the rotor blades connect to the engine shaft.
Seastead this.
Clearly this is a La-z-boy e-cliner WITHOUT the 6 month Web TV subscription.
These twin-engine personal helo designs worry me a little. What happens if you get a one-engine flameout? Uncontrollable yaw rate, uncontrollable roll rate, rapid loss of altitude, or maybe all three simultaneously?It's possible -- with proper training and constant practice -- to autorotate if you're not too high up to start with and there's enough room to land safely, but I'd worry about weekend pilots trying this.
"How many light bulbs does it take to change a person?" --BMcC-->
If you receive an "IT", get rid of it immediately WITHOUT using it. It is the most dangerous thingy yet.
It will rewrite your hard drive. Not only that, but it will scramble any disks that are even close to your computer (20' range at 72 degrees Fahrenheit).
It recalibrates your refrigerator's coolness setting so all your ice cream melts and your milk curdles. It will demagnetize the strips on all your credit cards, reprogram your ATM access code, screw up the tracking on your VCR, and use subspace field harmonics to scratch any CD's you try to play.
It will program your phone autodial to call only your mother-in-law's number.
It will hide your car keys when you are late for work and interfere with your car radio so that you hear 1940's hits and static while stuck in traffic.
It will give you nightmares about circus midgets.
It will replace your shampoo with Nair and your Nair with Rogaine, all while changing all active verbs to passive tense and incorporating undetectable misspellings which grossly change the interpretation of key sentences.
It will infest your armpits with fleas of a thousands camels.
It will rewrite your back-up files, leave the toilet seat up and leave the hair dryer plugged in dangerously close to a full bath tub.
It wantonly removes the forbidden tags from your mattresses and pillows, and refills your skim milk with whole.
It is insidious and subtle. It is dangerous and terrifying to behold.
It is also a rather interesting shade of mauve. It will cause the universe to implode at the speed of light with a giant sucking sound, and bother those with sensitive eardrums.
These are just a few signs. Be afraid. Be very afraid.
PLEASE FORWARD THIS INFORMATION TO EVERYONE YOU KNOW!!!! Or "IT" will track you down via public transportation. And won't you be sorry then.
+1 Still lots of assholes
+2 still too many assholes
+3 1 person makes a good joke, then everyone copies it, at this level there are not many comments to be had
+4 This particular moderation level is inhabited to quite a large extent by habitual offtopic posters. These particular creatures do however have a great skill. They present their offtopic piece with such authority they get modded up
+5 One would think that this level would represent the cream of slashdot commentary. Suffice to say that on occasion it does, but all to often now, moderators +5 something that is *mildly* amusing or just slightly less than idiotic
GiraffeSville, a place anyone can call home
In September, Wired reported that Kamen was working on the "Stirling engine... an affordable, portable machine that will run a water purifier/power generator that could zap contaminated H20 with a UV laser to make it safe for drinking." http://www.wirednews.com/wired/archive/8.09/kamen_ pr.html
Sometimes I worry that I'll develop Alzheimer's disease, but no one will notice.
It's called a hyperlink:
the article mentioned above
Of course it is slashdotted anyway.
All kings is mostly rapscallions. -Mark Twain, The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn
I say it's a backpack helicopter- twin fans or something. The reason Bezos cracked up would be this: here's a guy hovering in a helicopter suit, _indoors_. I'd have laughed too :) also, that would be one screaming hell of a demo for the convenience and containedness of the vehicle, if you demoed hovering it in a _room_ safely without it being wildly daring and dangerous. Suppose they had these guys like Bezos in a room and _flew_ the thing in through a door? Very impressive demo that would be. The idea is, this is a vehicle so manageable that it's not unthinkable to give it to plain old commuters, so they can commute through 3D space instead of sitting idling in traffic...
Why else would he assemble 2? It's probably an early version of a mechanical shoe that can propel you forward
David...david....dave? Dave? hello?
I know, let's ask Slick Willie. He's one of them thar roads schollars and I hear that he's and expert in word definitions.
. Quit playing Monopoly with Bill. Switch to one of many non-Microsoft products today.
Now, what if one plane is at a higher altitude than the other. What happens with the change of potential energy as an object goes from one plane to the other?
--
IT is the book version of the Blair Witch Project - how difficult can that be?
According to the Salon article:
http://www.dekaresearch.com/
...is the inventor's homepage.
o/~ Join us now and share the software
imagine a Beowulf cluster of THEM.
"Tant qu'on nage dans l'incoherence..."
Not confused enough? http://translate.google.com/translate?u=www.slashdot.jp&hl=en&ie=UTF8&sl=ja&tl=en
Hmm. Based on this article, Electronics Boutique should start accepting pre-orders any minute now...
--jwriney
Yes I know, it's too perfect. Let's look at the facts:
It can be assembeled with screwdrivers and hex wrenches in less than 10 minutes.
It's supplies come in a large duffel bag.
When turned on, Bezos gave his "huge, honking laugh"
I think all of you know what I am talking about. The man has come up with some sort of NT Bong (New Technology) that can smoke itself. Maybe it uses a spacesuit-helmet type setup to give the full effect.
Now go, ponder the possibilities!
OK, just a theory, but one that meets the criteria specified. IT could be a device allowing instantaneous movement from one location to another. Whether by teleportation or whatever, IT requires a device on both ends, and there is a version which will be installed in most homes to accomodate a person, and one for business to accomodate transport/shipping.
This satisfies all the criteria as follows:
1) IT is not a medical invention.
Obviosly.
2) In a private meeting with Bezos, Jobs and Doerr, Kamen assembled two Gingers -- or ITs -- in 10 minutes, using a screwdriver and hex wrenches from components that fit into a couple of large duffel bags and some cardboard boxes.
"IT" would only have to be big enough to form a "doorway" or maybe two for demonstration.
3) The invention has a fun element to it, because once a Ginger was turned on, Bezos started laughing his "loud, honking laugh".
IT could be used in humorous ways, waving from across the room, etc.
4) There are possibly two Ginger models, named Metro and Pro -- and the Metro may possibly cost less than $2,000.
Once again, one for shipment of goods, one for each and every home.
5) Bezos is quoted as saying that IT "...is a product so revolutionary, you'll have no problem selling it. The question is, are people going to be allowed to use it?"
I can REALLY see legislation coming into place because this constitutes a threat to national security.
6) Jobs is quoted as saying: "...If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen."
Two words: No streets.
7) Kemper says the invention will "sweep over the world and change lives, cities, and ways of thinking."
Yup, it would sure do that... An 8 hour day at the office would be just that... an 8 hour day.
8) The "core technology and its implementations" will, according to Kamen, "have a big, broad impact not only on social institutions but some billion-dollar old-line companies." And the invention will "profoundly affect our environment and the way people live worldwide. It will be an alternative to products that are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities."
OK, we have automotive, trucking, and air-line industries... and replacement of all cars in the house for only $2000 would SURELY be a less dirty, less expensive, less dangerous solution, that would especially help those in high traffic areas. And who here hasn't been frustrated while driving?
9) IT will be a mass-market consumer product "likely to run afoul of existing regulations and or inspire new ones," according to Kemper. The invention will also likely require "meeting with city planners, regulators, legislators, large commercial companies and university presidents about how cities, companies and campuses can be retro-fitted for Ginger."
OK, this one, well you would have to put up legislation to limit what this can do to continue to control international travelfor a variety of reasons from drug trafficing to terrorism.
Anyway, those are just thoughts that make sense to me as one possibility of IT.
Actually, there already exists a revolutionary transportation device that threatens to render existing infrastructure obsolete. It is over 100 years old, is the most efficient type of transportation know to man, requires no electricity or fossil fuels, and can be assembled easily with common tools from standard parts. Its a bicycle. Recent advances in CAD and laminar flow have led to vehicles that exceed 85 mph (see http://www.e2000.net/#PersonalSummary) when operated by non-athletes. Of course, these vehicles are not mass-produced because of a lack of consumer interest. They are still tens of thousands of dollars less than high performance Olympic track bikes OR electric cars and hybrid vehicles (most of which actually can't go over 85 mph). What is wrong with the public? People see pedals and are afraid they will be forced to do some work. 60% of Americans are overweight and 30% are obese. Its time to put away the car keys.
Bezos and Jobs have found a way to get "One-Click shopping" everywhere!
I can't wait until they "Retro-fit my house" with "One-Click Coffemakers" and "One-Click Alarm Clocks". Just think about it!! "One-Click Car Starters", "One-Click Dishwashers"...
--The space between my ears was intentionally left blank--
I think IT is a robotic transportation device -- but not for people. For a cost of less than $2000, it would be very difficult to make a product that can be assembled in 10 minutes and is also safe, clean, and competitive with a car. Many of the trips that people make are to pick-up and deliver THINGS that could instead be handled by a small automated robotic vehicle, perhaps even one that flys. IT wouldn't need to accommodate hundreds of pounds or the safety requirements of people. This also fits with all of the details mentioned in the article about problems with existing regulations, and retrofitting cities, companies and campuses for IT. IT could bring instant gratification to e-commerce and would transform or replace a million things like Mail, UPS, Fedex, pizza/food delivery, and video rental. Think Kozmo for everything and more. Hordes of robots zipping around the streets, sidewalks, or even the sky would certainly be revolutionary!
Sometimes when you read ACC, you come across a description of some all powerful complex device with a spooky name. But if you think about it and try to draw it you'll see a theromocouple or a rheostat.
"What's going to happen to me Dave?"
"Something wonderful."
Ka-Booom
Jobs is quoted as saying: ...If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen
This makes me believe that its definately some sort of transportation device..
Its the hoverboard from Back to the Future II... remember that??? I think IT is a mode of transportation, as his last invention was the iBot, and he doesn't want big companies getting hold from it.. remember back in the movie the hoverboard Marty took was a barbie-like one that had a big ol' Mattel sticker over it??? ------- There comes a time in life when you must take a piss in the sink. -Peter Ovaskly, Second Poem
What would be neat is if it had GPS and maps, maybe via built in Palm type device.
This thing could be a electric cinder block and you already want to connect a Palm to it?
Won't be long before some kid announces the first port of Linux to IT... Lint, maybe.
I'm personally hoping for some type of personal teleporter. Good way to thin out the population too... "This thing is BETA, people."
Dual, because that is the most sensible configuration for a personal hover unit- one at each shoulder. Ducted, to help contain noise, improve safety, and because the fanjet operates on the principle of surrounding the bypass fan with a cowling to increase its efficiency.
We are talking about twin micro high-bypass jet engines of some variety- bear in mind that the high-bypass means the jet exhaust is only the center of the blast, and the vanes turn a much larger fan which produces most of the thrust through suction and its own exhaust. This muffles the jet whine and produces huge amounts of thrust- hundreds of thousands of pounds at very high efficiency for 747s, and those fans are not all that much bigger than a tall man.
Fans for jets are designed to take bird impacts directly in the blades at close to the speed of sound- this personal version could get away with _much_ lighter construction. The lighter the construction, the less weight it has to lift and the less thrust, noise and general air violence it has to generate- also, jets are optimised to fly at very high speeds. There is no reason to believe a high-bypass jet could not be designed to operate in the hovering position- if you wonder about the hot jet exhaust consider this- turboprop engines are also jet engines turning propellers, and many modern turboprop engines have the jet section (which produces the power) firing backwards. Air comes in the back, turns around, and goes out the front after powering the props! If that is possible, so is having the jet exhaust going through a _muffler_ after powering the fans. And again, these engines could be tiny tiny tiny if they only have to lift betwen 50 and 150 pounds _each_, at a very specific airflow (hovering). The whole design would be altered throughout to optimise for the very different conditions- for instance, 747 engine fans have to take brutal impacts, but these little fans could be far, far lighter.
Consider some other clues- Slashdot has run an article on a potential new method of making _titanium_ almost as cheaply as aluminum. Who is using titanium in mass production now? Steve Jobs. Who is said to know all about this IT thing? Steve Jobs...
I am almost certain that this dual fan personal heli-backpack thing is made mostly out of titanium. It might be a tenth- a fiftieth! of the weight of the old jet backbacks and those proof-of-concept things in which the vehicle is half again as heavy as the passenger. High-bypass jet engines can be outrageously light- even _without_ heavy use of titanium you'd be surprised how light turbine engines are compared with reciprocating engines. Turbines can be designed to run at the ultimate peak efficient RPM for their operation- and with this design, the fans too can be designed to also run at peak efficiency. Then instead of adding so much thrust that you can go 'kapwing' up into the sky, you just cut back on the engines more and more until the peak output is just enough to lift you easily- and the engines are about the size of big Maglite flashlights...
Mark my words. I bet this is what it is. What the heck else could it be? A unicycle? Please.
According to Kemper's proposal, IT will change the world, and is so extraordinary that it has drawn the attention of technology visionaries Jeff Bezos and Steve Jobs Hmmm. Not exactly the first two names that come to mind these days when the phrase "technology visionary" is uttered. Maybe Jobs. After all, he was so visionary he was able to release a crippled G3 with a builtin monitor, USB-only interfacing, and no floppy drive, and revive an otherwise dying company. For his next amazing masterpiece, he'll replace your orderly, comfortable, but buggy GUI with one that never crashes, but makes much less sense visually.
I do not have a signature
FINALLY! This will be the biggest, most successful product to drain the pocketbooks of nerds since the Internet!
-gerbik
http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:www.yourneigh borhoodnews.com/banarchive042299.html+dean+kamen+g inger&hl=en
Sig:
Navy nuke sub lifestyle?
2 in fact: one for each foot.
Add a hand-held controller and we're off to the races.
Funny how easy it was to guess.
Here's a Pic and info of the IBOT. Add some contempary chips, and it's easy to imagine.
Jetsons cars that fold into a briefcase! Inspiration from cartoons! No more traffic, and it fits most of the statements in that article.
a beowulf cluster of IT?
...a way to get loadsamoney off venture capitalists, then run!
I'll believe it when I can walk into a shop and walk out with one.
Hacker: A criminal who breaks into computer systems
"Information wants to be paid"
When you guys finally get to see IT, you will pee your pants, I swear. IT is better than Slashdot, better than nudie anime, better than Britney Spears waiting at home in bed for you and your laptop (and I speak from experience on that last one, really). If you think Napster changed the world, wait till you see IT
All kings is mostly rapscallions. -Mark Twain, The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn
'Cause IT's only knock and know-all, but I like it...
--
Never hit your grandmother with a shovel, for it leaves a bad impression on her mind...
According to the inventor of "Ginger," Dean Kamen, his device will be an alternative to products that "are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities."
Also from the MSNBC Article:
The "core technology and its implementations" will, according to Kamen, "have a big, broad impact not only on social institutions but some billion-dollar old-line companies." And the invention will "profoundly affect our environment and the way people live worldwide. It will be an alternative to products that are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities."
Anything that revolutionary would have to be transportation of some kind. The "billion dollar" companies are car and oil companys (and possibly power companies".
yet..
--------------------------------
and it's gay,too.
I got IT: it's teletransportation.
you must see it for yourself
I was waiting for someone to say this. Two Dr.Suess references have been floating in my head since reading this: "moss-covered, three-handled, family grudunza" and "a thneed's a fine something that everyone needs!"
:-)
I hope that IT is less imaginary or at least less destructive
"You can't get something for nothing." - my grandfather, on the stock market and Reaganomics.
IT got my wife pregnant; ITs not my child... i hate IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1
I haven't stopped wondering all morning ever since I saw the article. Check out the statement "will people be allowed to use it?" in the MSNBC article. Doesn't this sound kind of odd? It's got to be something that can be very very useful while it can also be used illegally - and the legal usefulness of it has to outweigh the potential hazards. Besides the obvoius idea that it might be a new way for transportation - something like a hovercraft, could it be something as wild as a teleportation device?
IT got my wife pregnant; ITs not my child... i hate IT!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
> if jobs and bezos love IT, then IT must be a method
:)
> of selling at a los and then making up for it with
> quantity!
LOL... I'm selling these boxes for a $1 loss each,
but it's ok... I'm going to be able to sell
20 million of them!
If I owe you $400... I've got a problem.
If I owe you $4,000,000.... You've got a problem!
Friends don't let friends buy Compaq's. (Dell/Gateway... same same) You want a good computer? Build it yourself.
Like any dot-com entrepanuer (sp?) these days, it's mostly a bunch of hype. At best it's like an ATM. Not revolutionary, but maybe somewhat useful. I like to dream about hoverboards, levitating backpacks, and women as much as the next guy, but let's face it. I don't think IT is going to be any of those.
because I read about Information Technology everyday. Boy, such a fuss ...
Java is the blue pill
Choose the red pill
&& ...Marko
-- &&
We're living thru an energy crisis most people think it's avoidable. The way is being paved for IT. Keep your eyes open, were being railroaded towards IT's ultimate acceptance.
If this is the case, then they've already been beat to the punch. The price is a little steep, you could probably cobble together a unit yourself for $400 or so, hardest part being the gears/transmission.
..don't panic
...the wrong trousers, Grommit!
It's an MC! A matter compiler straight outa the Diamond Age. I want one too.
Always working to get that square peg in to the round whole
IT makes The STUFF!!!
And get ripped off!? Check out what happened to the guy who invented the Tucker automobile, or the guy that has taken years getting money out of the car industry for intermittent windshield wipers?
No way would I take a show any type of transportation device to the auto manufacturers.
I also think it's some sort of personal hovercraft. Especially with the Ginger reference. It would have to be more radical than a scooter device to make those earning projections. I saw this guy's wheel chair that can climb stairs and rise up on two wheels (and remain stable!) so one could reach items on the top shelf at the grocery store. The man is a genius!
Flying cars...I want my flying car!
$2k for a car? only if it IS a Metro (the Geo/chevy kind)
Lowmag.net
I'm surprised this article has the humorus foot icon. I was hoping for an 'ask slashdot' to focus people on the task of figuring out what IT could be. From the clues offered in the articles I would have to assume that IT offers a better way to get from point A to B. My guess is that the man has engineered a replacement for the internal combustion engine. Maybe he has figured out a way to fit a hydrogen powered turbine under the hood of a car. Whatever IT is, I want one now!
http://www.huskiebrigade.com/insight/dean_98.htm
http://www.thefutureschannel.com/kamen_conversatio n.htm
And yes, it could well be a transportation device...
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free the mallocs!
OK, I look up Dean Kamen--someone I've never heard of--on Google, and find pages and pages of links to things about him. Try that with anyone else, (i.e. someone really famous) and you'll get a bunch of dead links, misleading links, barely peripherally related links, and the like. Nothing nearly as impressive or _targetted_ as a certain Mr. Kamen.
That sets my spidey-sense a-tingling.
But lest I be accused of being too much of a curmudgeon (which brings one to ask--is it possible to be too much of a good thing?), let's assume that IT is real, and IT's what it promises to be.
How about a personal servant? I'm not talking about a solar powered lawn mower, but a _real_ personal servant, the sort that Matt Ruff wrote about. (go look him up--one of the best damned authors alive today!) Could that be IT?
Oh, no--I have it.
Cold Fusion. For real this time.
Unfortunately, it STILL won't be a revolution.
"People who do stupid things with hazardous materials often die." -- Jim Davidson on alt.folklore.urban
A number of posts have suggested that it is potentially some form of transportation system which reduces pollution and traffic - based on various theories as to how the technology works. If you accept the premise that this product will hit the $60B threshold within 5 years then there has to be limited or non-existent barriers to its adoption or perhaps significant cost savings if implemented. My rationale behind this is that the sheer investment in dollars and the time necessary to develop the infrastructure for a new transportation project is tremendous - it might require well in excess of 5 years to complete the projects and deploy it. Consider the steps involved: gather the parties mentioned, i.e., city, state, universities, etc., approve a proposal submitted by this group, award the development contracts and implement the contracts - which presumably require infrastructure development, read construction and then full commerical deployment. Therefore, I am proposing it has to be something which completely leapfrogs the current infrastructure or leverages off of it with minimial modification. Otherwise, (i) the VC's would not embrace it so wholeheartedly after seeing the issues with adoption of other new technologies (read: Internet) and (ii) it could never scale up so quickly. I think it argues for something much simpler to install - such as a clean energy output device - perhaps fuel cells running off of the existing energy distribution system (natural gas or retrofitting natural gas delivery system for new fuel) for the home which produces H20 as its end product - kills two birds with one stone and totally wipes out or supports existing complicated and expensive ecnomic structures, i.e. power generation and delivery and water treatment and delivery. Alternatively, if it is a transportation device it must not require the infrastructures alluded to in some other posts. Either way, interesting stuff. Let's hope this is not "cold fusion" revisited.
Personal Helicopter
Personal helicopters are somewhat available today (Kamen uses one himself) so there's no real need to retro-fit a city or campus to accomodate one. Besides, I think humans have enough trouble navigating 2D space, let alone 3D space. And besides making leaps of technological advances in propulsion systems to support such a device, I sure wouldn't have a warm gushy feeling in my tummy that my neighbor could slice and dice me with his "transportation device". Gives a whole new meaning to road rage.
Modified iBOT (wheelchair)
Based on the fact that the first point in one of the articles says it is not a medical device, I think we can safeley rule out a wheelchair or wheelchair like device for getting around. Besides, I can't see the masses accepting this as an alternative to get to work in.
Personal Jetpack
I can't see a device like this sweeping the planet, even if it is cheap. It's hard enough to convince a business exec to strap on a helmet to ride a bike to work let alone a jetpack. Again we have the 3D space navigation problem and again, there's no retro-fitting needed for a device like this so I don't see it meshing with the info that's out there.
Scooter
Nothing fun here. These things are just as dangerous as current travel methods and I can't see anyone laughing if one of these (motorized or electronicized) was turned on. Also, these exist all over the place in non-motorized form and I don't see any city, campus or facility leaping to retro-fit their world.
Which leads to..
Hover Device
This is my choice for what I think it could be. Why? Simple. Imagine a simple device that would be personal and compact. No real big change in how cities operate but you could alter sidewalks to accept these much like walking paths are now altered to accept bikes and humans. Getting to work would be just like walking, except you wouldn't be walking but sitting down and navigating. The execution could be simple through the use of Kamens previous patents. He has a device to adjust trim via a joystick device. So what's easier to use than that? Tilt forward to move forward, left to move left, right to move right. Trim is automatically adjusted to the terrain (and you're only a few inches/feet off the ground so it's not a lot of adjustment). The device could be assembled quickly from a compact set of bags, no argument there (see images below on how compact it would be). It certainly would be fun because its just like riding bumper cars at the fair (hopefully without the bumper aspect though). I sure would laugh seeing one fired up as it lifts off the ground. Are people going to be allowed to use it? This is an interesting controversy. Why can't they use it? Licensing? A bike/car/helicopter would certainly need some kind of licensing if it follows the rules of the road. A hover device wouldn't since it really is just an alternate to walking and thus is executed on the streets and takes up no less space than a human being. The restricted use might be imposed at an age level. Not available for people under 16 much like mopeds are now. An alternate to [cars] especially for people in cities. Well, I can tell you that I would jump at the chance to save the $15/day parking if I could get to work using such a device and I'm sure others would agree. If that's all you use your car for, why not? It certainly wouldn't put automakers out of business but it would affect them greatly. Imagine you still have a car but only use it 2 or 3 times a month for large hauls or long trips. Otherwise you get around with your IT. Maintenance, oil and gas costs would be reduced. The life of the car would be extended and automakers would see less people buying cars less frequently.
I've included a sketch here of what it might look like and how it would be constructed (this is really rough but you should get the idea).
liB
IT is a way for Amazon to be profitable and for Apple to have more than 5% of the market again.
:)
Obviously this would require something huge and innovative that would seem impossible today.
Another guess...
IT is a copy protection scheme for audio and video that cannot be broken
=== The price of freedom is eternal vigilance
quantam computer!!! You put the pieces together like legos then fill it up with water and of course the "special" fluids for the computations. IT uses a 9 volt battery for power. And IT doesn't do windows since IT is extremely fast and Windows OS is really too slow to be reliable.
Save Pangaea!! Stop Continental Drift!!
>>products that "are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities." you left out the obvious option....it could be robotic prostitutes....sorry couldnt resist.
"...your future, make it a reality, all you have to do is fight for me"
If you read the article carefully certain things are apparent:
I'm reminded of "Steel Beach" by John Varley. In his lunar society the "mail" could be used to send packages very quickly and automatically - including people - through tubes.
Hence the semi-autonomous gopher robot. You can put things in it, including people, and control it by telling it what to do and it figuring out how to do it. You could order your groceries on the internet from your pc and tell it to go pick them up. You could put your kids in it and send them to soccer practice (and keep them from using it for the wrong things). You could put your drunk friend in one and send him home that way. Or you could hop in one yourself, use the onboard controller to tell it your destination, and it takes you there.
Of course, it seems like such a device would make a great target for stupid shitheads: teens, lousy drivers, mean people, etc. Lesson #1 of the internet: anonymity breeds bad manners. Furthermore, any device can become frustrating in the right context. For instance bikes are great for getting around, but even they can cause traffic jams in places like Bejing. Even the pedestrian traffic in many places like NYC is too much.
cryptchrome
---If you can't trust a nerd, who can you trust?
Either Kamen has found a way to reverse the
gravity or he's invented a way to transfer
matter through some kind of portals between
two places.
Jari
Finally, boy scouts all over the world can finally be provided with a left-handed smoke shifter.
-----
"The only difference between me and a madman is that I'm not mad." - Salvador Dali (1904-1989)
-red hot chilli peppers
---
-
ping -f 255.255.255.255 # if only
Given the clues, and the speculation here on /. - I believe I know what IT is. Bear with me - I haven't read all the posts here (not enough time!!!), but two different paths have emerged which both point at what this thing is:
IT is a bicycle.
IT uses a very advanced Stirling engine for propulsion.
Nothing else seems to fit all of the clues. A small, foldable (and easily assembled) bicycle seems to be the only device that would ellicit a laugh from someone, being that bikes are fun to ride.
A Stirling engine is the only type of device that would make old big industries nervous (lower fuel consumption, and coupled with a bicycle, it would make auto makers tremble too). Some have said that such a Stirling engine couldn't be made, but I beg to differ - there have been numerous studies done to build Stirling engine powered automobiles, but all had the flaw of slow startup times that was thought would deter consumers (the best, done by Ford (?) took 10-15 seconds from "turn the key" to "go", back in the 1960's I believe - yeah, that takes too long for me - not!). But on a bicycle, one could pedal for that long until the thing was going, then let the engine take over (plus, that would reduce the load on the engine during startup, keeping it from stalling, and limiting, or eliminating, the need for a transmission).
Remember - "Ginger" means lightweight, quick-on-the-feet, so to speak. Such a device would have all that. The core technology of the advanced Stirling engine would have a ton of other uses, as well.
Such bicycles, if used by enough people, would cause need for city planning - look at any large city where the residents use a ton of normal bicycles, and you will see what I mean. Plus you would need the infrastructure for refueling, in some manner.
That is my guess. If any of you have ever seen Kamen's iBot wheelchair (this thing is truely amazing - it affords such a level of mobility to those who need it, that the term "wheelchair" doesn't really describe it - think "mobility chair", that comes close), you know this guy knows his stuff, and isn't a crackpot.
I guess we'll know how close I was come next year...
Worldcom - Generation Duh!
Reason is the Path to God - Anon
This is consistent with his patents and the description provided. It's not a medical device, the price and size are about right, and if it takes off, it would change the use of streets and sidewalks. It would have many of the same legal problems as skateboards, rollerblades, and scooters. It also has a major product liability problem, but if he's attempted FDA approval on a wheelchair, he may be able to deal with that.
That is the one word the Knights who say Ni cannot stand! Ni! Ni! Ni!
Stupid Cheap Guitars
3 Questions... All joking aside, couldn't this guy get in some legal trouble for calling this invention "IT"? Also, after reading the book (I would say watching the movie, but the book is way better) will anyone actually want anything to do with "IT"? And finally, is "IT" hacakable so we can run Linux on it?
~Ken
Everyone has thrown their $0.02 in saying IT is a transportation device citing reasoning of changing a cities infastructure, pissing off major companies, making something safer/easier/cleaner. Transportation is not the only thing that this could be.
I'm thinking a new system of delivering power. Power lines are terribly dangerous and annoying. The power companies would be really pissed if we found a usable alternative.
New residential and commerical communications system - see above. Or, maybe it is a better way of
So, it doesn't necessarily *have* to be a mode of transportation, unless you are going to consider transportation of utilities or data in the same game.
what ever. i guess we will see in '02.
sarcasm { I can't wait. }
Y'all read it here first.
IT is an antigrav device, using Podhoretz's (sp) work in Russia on spinning GHz freq disks of superconducting cermets.
I think the discussion around a personal transport that flies/hovers is accurate, but the motive power is going to be something far far different from turbofans or rotors.
Dig it. The world is about to get even stranger.
8)
gigantino.tv - Heavy but weighs nothing.
(First obvious reply gets a cookie)
Sorry, slight tyypo on the gentleman's name... :(
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free the mallocs!
Read page two of the above link, it really seems to fit in...a tion/declaration.html
http://www.nara.gov/exhall/charters/declar
http://www.nara.gov/exhall/charters/declaration/d
http://www.nara.gov/exhall/char
Well, as far as PR stunts go, I doubt this is one. It's not Dean's style in the least. And before you ask, yes, I have met him although I do not know him personally. In fact I saw him last Saturday. Above all things Dean isn't really all that interested in making money anymore. He's more interested in changing the world (witness what he's done for FIRST). R Deka Research, Dean's company, is a completely R&D firm. They do contracts for some companies but I believe most of that's just to pay the bills. The real work is the stuff that Dean directs them to do. The iBot was one thing that Dean directed Deka to work on that was not something a company asked Deka to research. The more important projects Deka does (ie. those started by Dean) are usually too risky for any corporation to want to develop. In all honesty I almost expect Dean to reveal what this new invention is at either FIRST's Kickoff (January) or National Championship (April) next year. As to what it is, my guess is that's it's a Stirling Engine that actually works. They're pretty cool and can burn almost any fuel. Is this as big as they say it is? Knowing Dean, I would bet on it. Matt Leese
IT is a hoax.
If we were closer to April Fools Day, this would smell drastically like a hoax. Despite the date, it still sorta does. We'll see how this plays out over the long run.
Nathan Mates
An illustration of what IT is.
I suppose a bit of incredulity and cynicism is to be expected of virtually anything posted to this forum, but nevertheless my looking into this shows that this invention may very well be, if not revolutionary, then a profound change in how we get ourselves around.
Kamen has busied himself with personal transportation devices, and has two patents (5971091 & 5975225) with regard to such devices that balance themselves on 2-4 wheels and move a load (with or without people) over irregular terrain. Now this in and of itself would be just an interesting invention, but reference to the Sept. 2000 Wired article cited here previously would show that Kamen's also worked on the Sterling engine. Here I posit that the name he gives his invention, Ginger, is actually a part of an anagram, shown here:
A STERLING ENGINE = GINGER ISNT A LIE
IF Mr. Kamen has perfected the Sterling engine to a maximum of efficiency and minimum of pollution and incorporated it into his patented personal transportation devices he will have created an easy way for anyone to locomote themselves around their neighborhoods, work site, or campus. It would be a fun, interesting way to travel. In short, this conclusion meets all of the suggestions provided for in the articles on the book deal, coordinates with one of Kamen's main areas of study and invention, and has some speculative evidence to prove itself. I haven't seen a better explanation yet.
The only tool you've got against psychosis is experience.
Also since the invention was described as replacing something "dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating" it mean that it would replace a human assistant.
Also this kind of thing wouldn't be that far out since Honda recently demo'd their walking robot and Kamen demo'd his iBot. Also text-to-speech (http://www.lucent.com/speech/) and speech-to-text (http://www.lhsl.com/) software already exists. The hard part would be gluing the stuff together so that the robot would be easy to use and useful.
It would be revolutionary, fun, possibly cause legal concerns (what?!? have robots walking around?) and cities might have to be designed around them to give them a separate lane to travel from point A to point B.
"sweet dreams are made of this..."
When the I-Bot was in top-secret tests, before it was announced, the project code name was "Fred", which we didn't understand (yes, I have inside knowledge about the I-Bot, but I have no idea what IT is). Now, it is obvious that it stood for Fred Astaire, because of the nimbleness it gave wheelchair bound people, and maybe a pun because it can climb stairs. Ginger, therefore, stands for Ginger Rogers. Maybe the ducted fan helicopter/jetpack does make sense, because then Rogers could also be a pun on Buck Rogers.
-- stream of did I lock the front door consciousness
I'd originally guessed a personal transport system like a sophisticated scooter myself. I agree with your conclusion. That is, assuming this isn't all an elaborate hoax, like that episode of the Simpsons, where a corporation planted an "angel skeleton" and fired up Springfield into a religious fervor. That is, until it was stolen and then reappeared at the shopping mall opening.
Gamingmuseum.com: Give your 3D accelerator a rest.
The scooter design idea has some possibilities, but what would make it special or revolutionary? Perhaps the man has solved the mechanical difficulties associated with flywheel energy storage -- high density flywheels, better vacuum seals, easy to manufacture and reliable magnelev bearings, and so on. It meets the hints: * The Inside article says the "core technology and its implementations" will impact big corporations and be the alternative to dirty, sometimes dangerous, and frustrating technology -- like, say, the internal combustion engine? * It would come in different sizes * People would own more than one * multiple uses, from transportation in many forms (car or scooter) to UPS backup * rebuild cities around it -- you'd need "recharge" stations all over the place * it is primarily a mechanical system, the inventor's forte * Provides the gyroscopic stability for the scooter design the patent searchers have seen * might provoke regulatory problems (an efficient flywheel requires high density: can you say depleted uranium? Even lead is toxic & regulated these nanny-state days.) * The introductory product, such as a scooter, is amusing and captures the imagination, but the energy storage and delivery system itself is the long term money maker as it is adapted for other purposes. Just another $0.02
Excuse my error.
The GINGER anagram is not exact.
But as another poster noted, ginger means light on one's feet, so there could be a relationship there.
The only tool you've got against psychosis is experience.
It's got to be something stable, so some kind of motorised scooter or rollerblades are not going to sweep all before it as they would be difficult to keep balanced, especially with even just a little luggage.
So you fit it with the dynamic balance system from teh iBot wheelchair... no problemo.
"it" is a hoax illustrating how stupid we all are. Imagine if it were a bicycle, that'd fit the clues. And we already have IT !
- IT is not a medical invention.
- In a private meeting with Bezos, Jobs and Doerr, Kamen assembled two Gingers -- or ITs -- in 10 minutes, using a screwdriver and hex wrenches from components that fit into a couple of large duffel bags and some cardboard boxes.
- The invention has a fun element to it, because once a Ginger was turned on, Bezos started laughing his "loud, honking laugh".
- There are possibly two Ginger models, named Metro and Pro -- and the Metro may possibly cost less than $2,000. Bezos is quoted as saying that IT "...is a product so revolutionary, you'll have no problem selling it. The question is, are people going to be allowed to use it?"
- Jobs is quoted as saying: "...If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen."
- Kemper says the invention will "sweep over the world and change lives, cities, and ways of thinking."
- The "core technology and its implementations" will, according to Kamen, "have a big, broad impact not only on social institutions but some billion-dollar old-line companies." And the invention will "profoundly affect our environment and the way people live worldwide. It will be an alternative to products that are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities."
- IT will be a mass-market consumer product "likely to run afoul of existing regulations and or inspire new ones,"
- according to Kemper. The invention will also likely require "meeting with city planners, regulators, legislators, large commercial companies and university presidents about how cities, companies and campuses can be retro-fitted for Ginger."
** It's a ROBOTIC PROSTITUTE!! ** oh happy day!It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?
Let's see - this is probably some sort of cheap, economical transport device that will help lower demand for gasoline.
How long before the oil companies, car companies, etc have this guy whacked? Newer and better modes of transportation have been introduced before, but they always seem to fade away, except for some bad examples currently being looked into to make the car companies look as if they actually care about the environment.
I'm betting it's something like this:
ABC News Item
bullshIT
our wonderful public transportation systems!! they're the cause of massive frustration in almost any city around - especially for commuters. ;) that would also necessitate literal 'building cities around' the invention...but i've no idea why it would make Bezos laugh. other than because he's a dork.
Could use the same technology (gyro stabilized), but keep in mind the IBOT will be over $20,000, whereas one version of IT is supposed to be under $2000. It's also going to be "mass-marketed" which generally doesn't happen for devices designed to assist the disabled, like the IBOT.
However, the clues point to IT being a personal transport device of some sort.
-CausticPuppy "Of all the people I know, you're certainly one of them." -Somebody I don't know
Yeah man, you've got it. They don't need any vc. Just set up a pre-orders site - I'll be the first one there to order!
gadgetophile.com
It would be easy if this thing used Microsoft stock certificates for fuel...
The only other possibility is that it is a bottomless coffee mug. :-)
"I drank WHAT?!?!" --Socrates
There is no gravity...the earth just sucks.
- IT is not a medical invention.
- In a private meeting with Bezos, Jobs and Doerr, Kamen assembled two Gingers -- or ITs -- in 10 minutes, using a screwdriver and hex wrenches from components that fit into a couple of large duffel bags and some cardboard boxes.
- The invention has a fun element to it, because once a Ginger was turned on, Bezos started laughing his "loud, honking laugh".
- There are possibly two Ginger models, named Metro and Pro -- and the Metro may possibly cost less than $2,000. Bezos is quoted as saying that IT "...is a product so revolutionary, you'll have no problem selling it. The question is, are people going to be allowed to use it?"
- Jobs is quoted as saying: "...If enough people see the machine you won't have to convince them to architect cities around it. It'll just happen."
- Kemper says the invention will "sweep over the world and change lives, cities, and ways of thinking."
- The "core technology and its implementations" will, according to Kamen, "have a big, broad impact not only on social institutions but some billion-dollar old-line companies." And the invention will "profoundly affect our environment and the way people live worldwide. It will be an alternative to products that are dirty, expensive, sometimes dangerous and often frustrating, especially for people in the cities."
- IT will be a mass-market consumer product "likely to run afoul of existing regulations and or inspire new ones,"
- according to Kemper. The invention will also likely require "meeting with city planners, regulators, legislators, large commercial companies and university presidents about how cities, companies and campuses can be retro-fitted for Ginger."
** It's a ROBOTIC PROSTITUTE!! ** oh happy day!It's 10 PM. Do you know if you're un-American?
This was the great promise of the new revolution - that we could work from home and home could be a suburb and we could still quickly contact our urban friends.
Well, IT will force cities to reevaluate their design because parking spaces now may have to go verticle.
IT will run afoul of FAA regulations.
IT runs afoul of billion dollar companies - GM and Oil companies is my guess.
And so forth.
Personalized levitation maneuvering system.
like some else said - it'll be the size of rollerblades.
it'll get up to 60 miles an hour.
it'll keep you from falling over, even in abrupt stops.
it'll cover ANY terrain - stairs, etc.
-k
Dean Kamen is the son of Jack Kamen, the EC horror comic book artist. Now I'll have to go back and check out my back issues of _Weird Science_ to see if there any clues... Offical Jack Kamen EC bio at: http://www.gemstonepub.com/eccomics/articles/bios/ bio_kamen.html