Slashdot Mirror
The Saga of Katie.com
digitalcaffeine writes "The gist of the story is that Katie Tarbox became a victim of an online sexual predator when she was 13. She wrote a book about it in 2000 and Penguin Putnam made the title of the book 'Katie.Com', which unfortunately was a domain name owned by Katie Jones since 1996. Now Tarbox's lawyer is demanding that Jones turn over the domain name.
Penguin refuses to apologize, saying that it would be a violation of their free speech to re-title the book and that Jones never trademarked katie.com, so they can do what they want with the words."
If it weren't so stupid, it would be funny. These people need a severe beating with a clue stick.
Website gang-raped by thousands of Slashdotters. Film at 11...
It's not also a violation of the domain owner's free speech rights to have to "re-title" her domain?
There's something ironic about her lawyers fighting to have the Katie.com domain so that she can promote her book about Internet predators.
without ever googling for the domain name they used? Unbelievably clueless.
Why doesn't the real (slim?) Katie make katie.com a convienient mirror of, say, goatse. Then the people will complain to Penguin and they'll be forced to do something. Like change the title. It's her right to decide the content of her page, right? So I think she'd even be in the clear :-)
:)
Of course ligit visitors might think Katie is a weirdo, but hey. It's better than having Katie.tv_fm_info_dumbtld
My other car is first.
FSF should sue Penguin and get Tux's name back.
--
I thought trademark was a right guaranteed with or without going through the trademark process. After her first "sale" (visit from an outsider), she would have held a trademark on her site.
The Political Programmer
the fact that the sex.com ruling made web names property. I would think that with that precedent, and judges love those, that the owner of the site can not be forced to turn it over. She was there first.
Atomic batteries to power! Turbines to speed!
Cheers,
Erick
http://www.busyweather.com/
I sent a letter to Penguin yesterday letting them know that I disapprove of their actions in this matter.
It's conceivable, but unlikely, that if enough people write or call they will change their tactics.
I assume that dealing with a large publisher is like dealing with government; I expect that they ignore email complaints but are more likely to respond to letters or phone calls.
While a person's name may not be unique, katie.com is a unique identification. Penguin has (by ignorance) directly acted against the interests of the person who had katie.com. Freedom of speach does not mean there are not consequences for what you say. A lack of copy right does not change the uniqueness of the identification. This has law $uit writen in the biggest letters I have ever seen.
In a place beyond time and space, in a land far better than this, look for me there...
Well it looks like someone in the publishing department should have done their homework before approving the title.
Hrrm... I usually just sign my name.
Maybe Penguin should have thought about that before releasing the book? Dumbasses. On the plus side, I've decided to becoming a budding author. My debut book is scheduled to be released on April 1 2005, and its name will be "cia.gov".
Gee, or do you suppose they could have just gone to the website www.katie.com. Why on earth would they need to google it? Or were you just trying to use a cool term?
My beliefs do not require that you agree with them.
Why on earth didn't they look it up first?
And since it was clearly meant to be a generic name for the book title, why are they demanding rights to the website? I mean, no one's going to go to "katie.com", they understand that it's simply a symbolic book title.
Failed! You fucker.
I notice that you currently own the name "slashdot.org". Our research shows you never trademarked this name. Last week, I applied for a trademark on the terms "slashdot", "slashdot.org" and "slashdot.com" and these have been granted. Therefore I require you to hand over your domain immediately, or face legal proceedings.
Yours Sincerely,
I.P. Freely
1. Write a book called Amazon.com about ancient warrior women that are stalked online.
2. Take control of said domain name then sell it back.
3. Profit
Unlike the plans of the underpants gnomes and SCO, this one may actually be crazy enough to work.
When Argumentum ad Hominem falls short, try Argumentum ad Matrem
867-5309
... how is Darl McBride involved? I mean come on, doesn't he *really* own the trademark to penguins?
Proudly supporting the Libertarian Party.
Katie Jones can assert her copyright of the works and the name at any time. Just because someone else doesn't do their due diligence and wraps their business up in a name does not mean the original owner has to cough it up. A little advice for Katie Tarbox's lawyer(s): even IF you get the name awarded, it will be tied up in court for a long time, probably longer than the value you have attached to it will last if not immediately established, and secondly, any decent judge will force you to pay through the nose to compensate the original owner. Good luck. You should make her a seven figure offer if it is so important to your business model.
[RIAA] says its concern is artists. That's true, in just the sense that a cattle rancher is concerned about its cattle.
This could set a frightening precedent.
Anyone know why the lawyers are going after Katie Jones rather than the register or something? All Katie Jones did was send someone money to register a domain name. The idiotic publisher fogot to check and see if it was taken before naming the book? Huh?
Katie Jones hasn't broken any laws, so I would guess that the lawyers are just trying to bully her. All this publicity will certainly take the wind out of the corrupt sails.
My post doesn't make sense because this story makes no sense. This is just crazy!
[FromTheMorning]
Katie might have a good story to tell but we need to make sure her book sinks like a stone. Is there a legal defense fund? How do we contribute?
I am very easy to get along with, but I don't have time to waste being nice to people who are being stupid. -Theo
It seems that the Katie.com people don't like the web traffic and messages from users who assume Katie.com is the abused Katie. Apparently the lawyer suggested if this was a problem for Katie.com, they could donate the domain to penguin. This is not a hijacking. And not the black-and-white victimization the write-up implies.
My book Google.com is going to be a bestseller!
Seems to me like the katie.com publisher and probably Tarbox screwed up in not checking domain registration before printing. They've gotta suck up their own mistake, and not hassle Jones about donating the name back.
Chances are that we'll solve this whole dillema by reducing her server to a smoldering pile of rubble anyways....
Although it's holding up well so far...
But Katie J is also being stupid with her whole "I can't use my domain blah blah blah" crap. How can she not mention her baby on her page because people are coming there? The whole point to the web is that it is PUBLIC and people will come and go. So people are reading, now she has to take everything down? Stupid.
LordBodak's journal.
What Katie needs is a good pro bono lawyer to go after Penguin for the suffering she's received. Tell the lawyer to "make a name for himself," and let slip the dogs of war.
Publicity would then ensue, which in this case would be highly negative for Penguin...and that's bad for sales. They'd shut up and snap to a salute with a cookie when their bottom line is threatened by a legit challenge.
In other words: stick it to the man!
RTFA. Penguin is a multinational corporation and Katie Jones is from the UK.
Penguin should retitle to Katie.org, Katie.net, Katie.golf.... whatever's free ;-)
1) Name book after existing, small time website
2) Create small copywrite-related controversy over said site
3) Get small site url posted on Slashdot.
4) Reduce small website to smouldering ruin
5) Offer to accept smouldering ruin as "donation."
If you had RTFA, you'd know Katie Jones is from the UK. Care to restate?
As a UK citizen, she should just go to the police with the threatening legal letters, and raise a charge of harrassment against Penguin Publishing. Point out that Penguin Publishing published her e-mail address everywhere in order to get a lot of people to harrass her. I'm sure that there is a lot of stuff she can do under UK law to stop this illegal baiting.
... it would be nice to see a lawyer with a heart for a start ... I'm not holding my breath though.
Penguin are clearly in the wrong here. I will just choose to not buy any book published by Penguin, it is the least I can do.
I hope that a lawyer sees this and decides to help this person out
What are the mods smoking today? That's funny, if it's anything at all.
It's not her real number, it's from a freaking song!
:)
feh. stuff.
Feeling that her message hasn't been driven home enough she proves how horrible it is to be victimised (albeit in a very different way) by victimising another innocent girl due to her online activities....
Please send your complaints to Katiet.com, which is the web site of the Penguin book that is causing all this fuss.
If the author gets flooded with mail about her predatory behavior, something might happen.
The autor's address is katie@katiet.com
Penguin couldn't care less.
"Live Free or Die." Don't like it? Then keep out of the USA
Apparently she is getting LOTS of hits. LOTS.
1) Sell advertising space on the web site.
2) Sell advertising space for penguin's competitiors.
3) Put a picture of someting unplesant (but not illegal) on the web site. That should annoy Penguin.
4) Sell the web address. Let Penguin try to stop here. Just make sure to sell it to someone else with lots of lawyers.
I know that libraries are a huge source of revenue for book publishers. I personally will try to recommend that the library I work for does not purchase any copies of the book or any future books by Tarbox. Perhaps a letter writing campaign from area libraries condemning the actions of the publisher and threatening to not buy books from the publisher because of its actions may be in order.
"What use is power to the Keeps of Balance?" -Disnt of Nightmare LpMud
To answer some questions that I've received today, firstly as far as I know the rather aggressive lawyer who contacted me yesterday is not part of Penguin Puttnam but is working with Katie Tarbox on future projects and trying to gain control of my domain name for these projects. She informed me that things would 'only get worse' for me from here if I didn't do something about it - i.e. give it to them.
Finally, a point about this domain name. When this book launched I had no choice but to take down the content I previously had published on the front page because of the traffic coming to the site and having no choice but to remove it if I didn't want my professional and personal reputation damaged by it. I still use it, although I don't link from the front page of course, and one day I sincerely hope I'll be able to move my content back up where it belongs.
Cheers,
Erick
http://www.busyweather.com/
American thinking spreads to other countries. Film at 11. :)
The surprise isn't how often we make bad choices; the surprise is how seldom they defeat us.
I would suggest a boycott of Penguin books (including all subsidiaries) for its lack of tact in this matter.
They are behaving like M$, the world-dominating monopoly that we all know to be "compassionate" corporate citizens of the world.
This is a several-year-old book.. like the summary says, it came out in 2000. I read it a couple years ago, and I noticed that it said her actual website was "katiet.com", despite the title, which I thought was odd.
Now suddenly over 4 years later they're making an issue of it? Makes no sense, unless something is getting left out of the story. Lawyers suck.
Quidquid latine dictum sit, altum sonatur.
You have a rather broad definition of "random, uninteresting American." If you had bothered to do even a modicum of research, you would find that Katie Jones (owner of katie.com) lives in London, and Pearson Group (which seems to own the Penguin Putnam group) is based in London.
You clearly dislike it when Americans assume everything is about them, but is it fair to complain when you also assume everything is about Americans?
Let's Slashdot the piss outta her to show her our support!
wait, looks like you already got to it.
Ok, carry on, then.
Yours Sincerely,
IPFreely
There is nothing so silly as other peoples traditions, and nothing so sacred as our own.
#1 Why is katie.com such a great name. I suggest the name katie911 would have made more sense.
#2 According to article, There was a tv show about a love relationship between a 40 year old and a 13 year old? wtf?
#3 Why doesn't Katie Couric sue over Katie.com since her name was stolen too. She's more popular than this girl.
As the article states, the publisher knew someone else owned katie.com
The arrogant bastards just didn't care.
"Live Free or Die." Don't like it? Then keep out of the USA
While I think that this is probably a hairy legal situation, one that can't possibly be hammered out here on Slashdot to a decent resolution, I do have to side with Katie T.
/. gasp) and not a single one of them has been able to own an ISP account name for more than three or four months before getting deluged by online predators. They are not doing anything more, typically, than simply owning a female-sounding ID. This is fairly indicative of the experience most women have with the Internet.
The ordeal she went through at the hands of a net stalker is not something that ought to be taken lightly, nor something that ought to be brushed aside as an aberration of the Internet. This kind of stalking happens much more often that most Internet aficianados are willing to admit.
I have many female friends (collective
Add to this that websites designed to provide a "safe place" for stalked women are themselves frequently overrun with trolls.
Katie T. suffered a whole hell of a lot to come to a place where she could write her book. That the title of the book was the same as a website is mere lucky coincidence. Now, the 'owner' of the website who has done nothing more with the website than put up pictures of her 'art' and certainly done nothing in the way of promoting her website nor attempting to expand it any way, is trying to take away Katie T's right to the name.
It was Katie T. who put in the time and effort to put katie.com on the map. The least the 'owner' could do would be to offer the domain for sale to the rightful owner.
But look at all the publicity they're getting for the book.
It's just marketing through the US judicial system.
Does anybody know why its so common for victims of childhood sexual abuse to become abusers, either sexual or otherwise, later on in life?
I'm not going to try it from work though... If it exists, I doubt its work-friendly.
I sent the following email to...
katie@katiet.com
online@penguinputnam.com
I just read about what's happening over the katie.com domain name, and I wanted to encourage you to not try to steal someone's domain name away from them. While I appreciate your cause of keeping children safe on the Internet, please don't use the Internet to victimize someone else in a different way.
Your publisher made a bad mistake. Because of it, I can't in good conscience recommend your book and will probably take steps to avoid your publisher's books in the future.
~~~
http://parryaftab.blogspot.com/
Let 'er rip, kids!
I'd be a Libertarian, if they weren't all a bunch of tax-dodging professional whiners. - Berke Breathed
if you would like to let penguin know what you think of their strongarm tactics, you might find the following information useful:
c o.ukn guin.co.uk
Penguin Books Ltd, Pearson Customer Operations
Edinburgh Gate, Harlow, Essex, CM20 2JE
Fax: 0870 850 1115
www.penguin.co.uk
customer.service@penguin.co.uk
orders@penguin.
export@penguin.co.uk
internationalsales@pe
Penguin Group (USA)
375 Hudson Street, New York, NY 10014
www.penguinputnam.com
Penguin Group (Australia)
250 Camberwell Road, Camberwell, VIC 3124
Australia
Tel: 61-3-9871-2400
Fax: 61-3-9870-6086
www.penguin.com.au
Penguin Group (Canada)
10 Alcorn Ave., Suite 300, Toronto, Ontario, M4V 3B2 Canada
Tel: (416) 925-2249
Fax: (416) 925-0068
www.penguin.ca
Penguin India
11 Community Centre, Panchsheel Park, New Delhi 110 017, India
Tel: 91-11-2649-4401
Fax: 91-11-2649-4402
www.penguinbooksindia.com
Penguin Ireland
25 St Stephen's Green, Dublin 2, Ireland
Tel: 00-353-1-661-7695
Fax: 00-353-1-661-7696
Email: info@penguin.ie
www.penguin.ie
Penguin Group (New Zealand)
Private Bag 102-902, North Shore Mail Centre, Auckland 1310
Albany, Auckland, New Zealand
Tel: 64-9-415-4700
Fax: 64-9-415-4703
www.penguin.co.nz
Penguin South Africa
24 Sturdee Avenue, Rosebank, 2169, South Africa
Tel: 27-11-327-3550
Fax: 27-11-327-6574
A pizza of radius z and thickness a has a volume of pi z z a
Right on the money. How stupid are the Penguin sales and marketing folks to release a book with a domain name as the title, when they did not even own it. The one they own katieT.com should have been the title. It is almost like they had a disconnect between marketing and the art department. (Someone in the art department said "KatieT? It has to be Katie.")
Even the creators of Friends were smart enough to register www.hahanotsomuch.com before it was used as a joke URL in the TV show two seasons ago.
Penguin is trying to make Katie pay for their stupidity.
Have you Meta Moderated t
Do these amazons get stalked by assassins using claws? Are the amazons able to summon shining warrior spirits to use as tanks? Do they have heat-seaking arrows?
People with their own domain name are leeching potential profits off corporations, thereby destroying the economy!
One of the lessons of history is that nothing is often a good thing to do and always a clever thing to say. - Will Duran
...Katie Tarbox became a victim of an online sexual predator when she was 13 ...
Seems to me the only scumbag predator here is Katie Tarbox - maybe Jones should write a book about this asshole.
Katie should redirect katie.com to tubgirl for a while. I bet that will get Penguin off her back in a hurry.
Any technology which is distinguishable from magic is not sufficiently advanced.
Couldn't Katie Jones sue Katie Tarbox for libeling her as a sexual assault victim?
This article brings up an interesting discussion. The article asserts that since she didn't trademark her domain name and that is the reason that the lawyers feel that they can take it from her.
Can the average person trademark domain names relatively inexpensively?
As the owener of my own domain name (and I am sure may of you slashdotters have one). How do individual owners (ie NOT businesses) protect their domain name from litigation such as this? And how much would something like this cost?
"Tempt not a desperate man" - Willy S.
looks like you've been slashdotted....
1) OK, then... phone numbers are not trademarked. If I use my next door neighbor's phone number as the title of a book I should be OK, right? Probably up until I get sued for the cost of him changing his phone number and all associated costs. Imagine all the crank calls he'd receive at 3 am. This is why books and media started using 555 numbers.
2) I hate victim mentality that equates their suffering with entitlement. If you were a victim of something (esp. as a child), suddenly people are supposed to donate stuff to you, like domain names?!? ("Think of the Children!" the cynical demand heard everywhere...) Sure, it's a stretch to attribute the publishers' and lawyer's desires and expectations to their client, but she has the power to tell them "No! Not in my name, Asshole!"
katie.com was there long before the book was even a gleam in a publisher's eye, so Penguin Putnam can go suck it. I hope they get their ass sued off.
They say the first thing to go is your penis. Well, it's either that or your brain. I forget which...
And now her katie.com problem is solved. Nobody can access it.
The Sig, the sig
Generally one would name the book with a title that has something to do with the book itself. So, why Katie.com? Does the appending of .com make one think of sexual predators? I mean, at one time, dumbasses thought appending .com would make your business successful, but that's another story.
I don't see why they couldn't just name the book and propped up a website, independently. Then the book could reference the website as a resource.
I'm glad that Katie Jones took the high road. If I were her, there'd be some of the nastiest porno I could find sitting on katie.com right now.
But am I the only one who finds these "I survived" $$$$ book-tour, public therapy cash-ins slightly distasteful?
This is unbelievable. What's wrong with our legal system these days?
before this, I have never heard of katie.com before, now every geek as heard of it and some (probably just a few) will go get her book. so as PR, she has already acomplished her goal.
they say "any press is good press"
Neither Penguin or Katie T. have made any offer to Katie Jones for the domain katie.com. In fact, Katie T's lawyers informed Katie Jones that things would 'only get worse' for her from here if she didn't do something about it - i.e. give it to them. Add to that, Katie T is planning on releasing a whole new line of educational materials for schools this fall. Still no offer to actually buy the domain name.
I'm just wondering what merited putting this story on the front page, when nothing has changed with it in 4 years. To illustrate, see the following chronology of events..
2000 > Katie.com published.
2000 > Penguin and Katie's Lawyer say give us the name.
2000 > The real Katie says no.
2001 > Penguin and Katie's Lawyer say give us the name.
2001 > The real Katie says no.
2002 > Penguin and Katie's Lawyer say give us the name.
2002 > The real Katie says no.
2003 > Penguin and Katie's Lawyer say give us the name.
2003 > The real Katie says no.
2004 > Penguin and Katie's Lawyer say give us the name.
2004 > The real Katie says no.
Penguin and Katie's Lawyer continue using the name Katie.com when they have absolutely no claim to it. Who's dumbass fault is that? If I was the real Katie, I'd put up Google ads, popups, popunders, Gator, and whatever the hell else I could and at least make some money off of the traffic. The point is its her domain. Is now, and was four years ago, and was 8 years ago when she registered it. It is clearly HER DOMAIN. No news here.. move on..
http://www.haxwell.org
The lawyer was wrong, there is someone out there would would pay top dollar for Katie.com, especially with all the publicity...
Porn peddlers!
to a porn site, I'm sure the internet porn industry would love to get their hands on katie.com
her blog.. http://www.katie.com/babyblog/
the Federally Uncontrolled Corporate Kabal -- or FUCK for short. Your e-mail is being monitored. If you dare to say or even THINK anything that might cause a $0.0000001 loss in profit, you will be publicly executed, the next eight generations of your family will be enslaved, your house will be auctioned on ebay, and your family name dragged through the mud. Have a nice day, and ya'll come back now, Y'heah?
From the "unpleasant lawyer's (Parry Aftab)" website:
>>She can be reached via e-mail at
>>parry@aftab.com and for time sensitive issues
>>or for media on a deadline, at 201-463-8663
>>(her U.S. cell phone).
So pedophilia and stupid IP legal junk all wrapped into one. Its the best of the internet.
Yet another example of what's wrong on the Internet. Someone should set up a fund for Katie Jones so that she can hire an attorney and have her attorney send the other Katie cease and desist letters...
First off, Katie the book writer should have checked it out and secured the website before being published. /.
Second, Katie the website owner should cash in and sell ad space, I'm sure she'll be getting a lot of hits now that the story is on
---
Those who can, do
Those who can't, teach
Those who don't know how, supervise
(Sigh.) Obviously not, indeed. It's rather worse: the lawyer for KatieT contacted the owner of Katie.com, and suggested that Ms. Jones simply donate the name to them to solve her problems. Quoth Ms. Jones,
She also mentions that she has turned down substantial offers for the domain in the past, which makes the suggestion of the donation mindbogglingly obtuse. Methinks she needs to hire an aggressive pirhana of a lawyer... oh, and that you should RTFineA before burbling in the future. =|//Information does not want to be free; it wants to breed.
penguin.com--that would be a good title for a book about business uses of Linux, wouldn't it?
This only helps a little, but if everyone does this it'll have "some" effect.
Go to Amazon.com, look up the book, find the negative reviews, and click "Was this review helpful to you: Yes"
"Science flies us to the moon. Religion flies us into buildings." - Victor Stenger
where are the google ads on katie.com ?
The lawyer who is trying to take Katie.com from the rightful owner is pretty rediculous. The owner of Katie.com has even stated that the lawyer has made semi threatening phone calls to her that things will "only get worse". There happens to be a link on Katie.com to the laywer's weblog, which happens to have a link to her personal page which has contact info. Let her know what you think of the situation:
parry@aftab.com
201-463-8663 (her U.S. cell phone)
This kind of lawyer bullshit really has to stop.
In FACT it says: The lawyer "tried to convince me that I should donate the domain name to them,"
That's a little different.
"Who are in control, they are not in control of anything - they don't even control themselves!" - Glen Beck
The first thing that Katy J. should do is renew katie.com for 8 more years (it currently expires in Aug. 1996). That will show that she means business in protecting her domain. If Penguin books wants to come back in 10 years, let them. Otherwise, they can pay up or buzz off.
how utterly irresponsible of penguin.
this is a case of a marketing dept gone haywire.
i certainly hope ms. jones (owner of katie.com) doesn't give in and further, i really hope that there's an attorney out there who will step up and defend her property.
this is no different than a company advertising their new business at 123 main st. and you happen to live at 123 main st.
Is it 5:30 yet?
Anyone want to bet that if I wrote a story about sexual abuse and published it under a title that happened to include Penguin's lawyers phone numbers or e-mail addresses, I'd get instantly sued?
The bullshit about trademarks is just an attempt to confuse the issue.
I thought you couldn't trademark a title of a book or song.....?
Personally I feel this is simply corporate terrorism. I hope she doesn't hand over the domain to them. It's hers and she had it for years before the book was published. Apparently they knew it was in use since they have that disclaimer in the book stating that katie.com wasn't associated with them.
What makes it all especially ironic of course is that the book itself is about the abuse of the Internet to disrupt an innocent person's life. In the situation of Katie.com, however, it is increasingly the case that the abused has become the abuser.
I think this sums it up nicely. I wish her luck in fighting this!!
Has Comcast disconnected your Internet account? Same here. You can read about it at http://comcastissue.blogspot.com
Remind me again, why she can't move this shit to another domain?
Write Penguin:
Penguin Group (USA) Inc.
Public Relations Department
375 Hudson Street
New York, NY 10014
Call their toll-free number: (800) 631-8571.
Go to Amazon.com and write a negative review of the book, citing the domain name problem.
Years ago, Katie T was victimized by sexual predator, and is now publishing a book about it... years later, Katie J is vitimized by by Katie T's free speech predator, and will she will be coming out with a book in 2008...
ana10gA1
OK, everyone seems a little confused about this - like, why now when the book was published in 2000?
For those that don't RTFA:
- In 2000, this book came out, and Katie Jones asked Dutton (subsidiary of Penguin) to change the title, as she had the domain name and they were hijacking it; as a result of the book title, KJ was receiving emails both detailing peoples abuse at the hands of paedophiles, as well as abusive emails from paedophiles themselves. See here and here. KJ took loads of stuff (including pictures of herself and family) off the site as a result - and Penguin ignored the request. I can't find the original slashdot article, although I'm sure there must have been one.
- Now, four years later, Jones gets a nasty letter, and this slashdot story is posted. This is caused by KT doing some thing about teaching kids about online safety (whether for money or altruism I don't know) - and them calling it Katie.com. Source.
- It seems the lawyer, one Parry Aftab, has a website.
There's a good summary (almost as good as this one) here, and suprisingly, on CNN.
katie j should simply host pr0n on her site and see what happens or with all that extra traffic, put up some banner ads.
My big question...what does this mean for the average person with their own domain? Can an individual trademark his/her own site to defend against this sort of thing? I don't need to be harassed by some person/organization with the same last name as me who wants my vacation photos moved.
//Information does not want to be free; it wants to breed.
They're surely sending countless visitors to katie.com, and wasting her bandwidth.
Sue them back for this, in addition to the mental stress caused by dealing with the situation. Show how the "victim" is now making you a victim, and I'm sure this would all go away rather quickly.
I shall title my next book Google.Com! I think I've got something here.
...I belive my response would be "Go to Hell". If I were human."
If I were Katie Jones, I'd setup Google AdWords on my front page, and perhaps a sponsored link to the katie.com book on Amazon, and use the proceeds to power a legal fund.
www.katiethebook.com doesn't seem to resolve. Quick somebody grab it before her lawyer figures it out.
/^([Ss]ame [Bb]at (time, |channel.)){2}$/
If you haven't read the Register article, you should still head over to the Amazon.com page for the book and make sure you vote up the comments telling this story and why not to buy the book & vote down the others. http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0452 282535/qid=1091544986/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/104-735100 1-1544757?v=glance&s=books
While being molested is a horrible horrible thing, using it for your own personal greed and to hurt others is horrible as well.
Gag order.
The government could not get whitehouse.com from the pr0n sellers, Katie J should not have to give in to Penguin. Katie J should sell to Whitehouse.com. That would fix Penguin's wagon! They avoided girl.com, well they can still be advertising a pr0n site. After the sale, tell the good folks at the American Family Association that Penguin is pushing a pr0n site, those smut dealers should not be selling text books to out children.
That makes it look like the ever-popular "My book got published and I can afford a lawyer, give me the domain name I want" approach. I hope Katie Jones finds good counsel to put Ms. Tarbox in her place.
Direct from Katie.com:
To answer some questions that I've received today, firstly as far as I know the rather aggressive lawyer who contacted me yesterday is not part of Penguin Puttnam but is working with Katie Tarbox on future projects and trying to gain control of my domain name for these projects. She informed me that things would 'only get worse' for me from here if I didn't do something about it - i.e. give it to them.
The "only get worse" part is enough to qualify it as a demand in my book.
I haven't ever solicited selling this site - infact I've turned down many offers, some very high, because I WANTED TO KEEP IT!
Good for her.
the domain was registered in 1996, well before the book was written and released. The book was originally to be titled "girl.com" but that turned out to be a porn site, so they changed it to "katie.com" instead.
All in all, it was a stupid move on the publisher's part, and they are just pulling the normal corporate move of not acknowledging any responsibility and hoping their legal threats can win it for them.
Personally, if I owned a domain like that, I'd use it as an opportunity to be a really big pain in the ass, but that's just me. I think the domain owner has all rights to be as much of a pest as she wants, and quite obviously she has all legal rights to the domain.
if you really wanted to get pedantic, you could argue that since the sex.com case (somewhat) established domains as "property", that the book title infringes upon her property. there has to be an ambulance chaser out there somewhere willing to pick that standard up and run with it...
EOM
I agree. Hit em where it hurts. And let them know why you are not buying thier products. Who are their subsidiaries?
That's just legal BS, what it really means is: 'STFU and hand over the $%^%&* domain you %&@$%^@!!!'...
I'd love to trademark any of the many domains I have, but they cost $335 per class (if I'm reading the site correctly)! So unless you're planning on using the trademark for business purposes, who the hell's going to shell out that kind of coin for a trademark for a personal website domainname?
Trolls lurk everywhere. Mod them down.
Apparently the book got renamed at the last minute because girl.com (the original name) was a porn site. The solution for Katie Jones as owner (and sole publisher of content) of katie.com seems obvious to me!
If the problem remains unresolved (and the domain unusable for the original purpose) maybe selling katie.com to a porn company would be a good way to get both some remuneration for the trouble and some one-upmanship at Penguin and Katie Tarbox. I'm guessing that domain might be hot property by now. Dealing with a "niche" porn company (I'll leave that to y'alls imagination) might be even more profitable, and a lot better still at raising bloodpressure at PP. CT
At this point the best hope for justice is a publicity backlash. Penguin is already well on their way to getting more negative publicity than they can stomach over this screw-up.
We should all write (preferably in dead-tree form) to Penguin, and to their corporate masters, Pearson.
Be polite but be firm. Ask specific questions and ask specifically for a reply (this will keep the letter alive and consuming resources in the bureaucracy much longer). Make it clear that this arrogant action, if uncorrected, will negatively affect your purchases and recommendations in the future.
Penguin:
Penguin Group (USA) Inc.
375 Hudson Street
New York, NY 10014
Pearson:
Pearson Headquarters
3 Burlington Gardens
London W1X 1LE, United Kingdom
Phone: +44-20-7411-2000
Fax: +44-20-7411-2390
Or, if you're in the US and just feel like ranting, try Penguin Customer Service: (800) 631-8571
This Like That - fun with words!
Her (the lawyer's) blog: http://parryaftab.blogspot.com/
I suggest making it an internet meme on the scale to shame savekaryn.com. She runs a chat thing, somebody here has to know her. Set up a donation site to collectively, temporarily buy her domain. Get somebody like Stile to be the webmaster, somebody who is used to having a whole lotta people mad at him/her. Once the appropriate sum has been reached (say, the amount of money she'd need to take a year off, sounds like she needs it), turn it over to Slashdotters - the trollers, the goatse boosters, the sick child who pulls the wings off flies in each of us - to collectively create the website you absolutely would not want to go to. Popups, grossly NSFW images, midi renditions of "Eye of the Tiger" that won't shut off. Ought to clear the matter up in about a year. Then give it back.
It Is the Nature of Information to Transgress Artificial Boundaries
Comment removed based on user account deletion
No, as Microsoft isn't in the gay porn business, or even the movie business in general it wouldn't dilute their trademark. You can have the same name in different fields.
Never confuse volume with power.
According to the article, Tarbox's lawyer "tried to convince" her to donate the domain name, and then informed her that if she doesn't, things "will only get worse." While this sounds like Penguin is bullying her, these also could be taken out of context from a much more civilized conversation. Penguin/Tarbox understand that Jones has been put in a bad situation (and yes they would like the website), so they are telling Jones that they are going to continue promoting the Katie.com brand regardless of whether or not they own the site. They have no interest in paying to acquire the site, and are perfectly willing to leave the situation be (as they have for the last four years), but if Jones wants all this to end, all she has to do is hand over the site. The article gives the impression that there were some strong-armed bullying tactics used (especially with that worse quote), but its entirely possibly given what was quoted that that isn't the case.
It even sounds like Penguin's involvement in all this stopped once the book was retitled and published in 2000. The main issue now stems from the fact that Tarbox wants to parlay her fame as an author into something more of a motivational speaker/victim's advocate type of career, all under the Katie.com brand. Regardless, Penguin made a big mistake about all this, and now it sounds like Tarbox is forced to pester Jones since she wants to push her agenda. I wonder if Jones and Tarbox can't team up and go after Penguin for creating this whole mess in the first place.
Jones vs. Tarbox. That sounds sorta familiar, for some reason...
The only thing I hate more than hypocrites are people who hate hypocrites.
--J
This, my friends, shows the complete warping and distortion of character that is becoming a celebrity. A girl is violated, writes a book about it (hopefully her intent was only to inform and alert, NOT to get famous), and now that the book and her story has become so popular she feels it's time to capitalize on it more. So she starts going after the owner of Katie.com with lawyers? Does anyone see anything totally wrong with this?
I don't know, maybe Tarbox got some bad legal advice or something, but this just seems too fucked up. The publisher messes up, doesn't do any investigating, this "other Katie" gets all these fucked up emails regarding pedophelia all day, and now Tarbox's lawyer is playing hardball to get the domain names? Sick...
--
Is it me, or did it just get fatter in here?
haha. redirect to girl.com for a few weeks. that'll get 'em to change quick enough.
I wrote a letter to Susan Peterson Kennedy, the president of Penguin USA saying I thought it was bad publicity for them to harass the established owner of the domain name and that they should make right. Pointed out most of the other things said here, like they couldn't have been so stupid as not to know the name was already taken, etc.
Katie T's lawyer has a blog, http://parryaftab.blogspot.com, which gives you a somewhat positive impression of her (Parry Aftab) - she's mainly involved with Internet safety and privacy issues.
This appears to be a squabble between two good guys (gals), as happens from time to time.
and one stalking victim to another.
Nice to see that KatieT's bad experiences left her with so much empathy for others. Seems like she got what she deserved a priori. It is truly a mysterious universe.
That's why you should, instead, visit:
;-)
http://parryaftab.blogspot.com/
and waste a little bit of the blood-sucking lawyers b/w instead
Is it just my observation, or are there way too many stupid people in the world?
We need a TLD analogous to 555-
They could go so far as to accuse Penguin of extortion, "hand over your domain or it will only get worse" : "pay us more or we break more fingers". Of course, the RIAA is doing the same thing and getting away with it: "pay us $3000 because we have 'proof' 'you' did something or we will sue you for $XXX000 and you know we will win if you can even afford to go to court."
Tm
Support TBI Research: http://www.raisinhope.org
Check out this link. This guy had to stop referring to an old software company he was involved with in order to not get sued. You might recognize the name of the old company.
How did Shakespeare put it? "Who steals my purse, steals trash. But he that filches my good name takes that which enriches him not, and leaves me poor indeed."
If the domain registry shows she has held the site since 1996; her lawyer would have to be a complete idiot for here to lose.
There was some guy who had the gateway.com domain long before Gateway 2000 had a presence on the internet. I think in 1995, Gateway approach this guy and offered him $15k for the domain. They said that was their offer because it would cost about $15k to hire lawyers to get it from him. At the time, Gateway was using gw2k.com and they still used 2000 as part of their name. One newgroup poster dubbed them Buttmunch 2000, a name I still prefer to this day.
Wansu, th' chinese sailor
Hi, my name is like katie I wrote like a book called katie.com. I've been like a spoiled bitch since I was a fetus. I think like just because I was dumb enough to like pick a book title like that, and get raped, that I should be entitled to the domain katie.com.
irc.enterthegame.com #linux
I'm getting strange visions of pedofiles running around with the body part that was playing in the box tarred and feathered.
Opps! They're all out. Apples and oranges might be a good analogy here. Altho logic and lawyers do seem to do the Oil and Water trick quite well. {set cliche mode /OFF}
Calling the book katie.co.uk? The publisher is British, she's British, and judging by the current state of the above website, the owner would probably be more willing to give it up.
Instead, they suggest that the domain name should be given to them as a "donation." I generally donate money to causes that are essentially "poor." I don't see any poor people on Kate T.'s side of the fence.
Did anyone here read the book? One thing that jumped out at me was the way she talked about living in a very wealthy area (New Canaan, CT). For example, her swim team didn't have to do fundraisers because they were just given the money for travel, etc. Now there's a domain name she happens to want, and she seems to expect that it should also just be given to her. It does seem like Katie T. has a strong sense of entitlement.
I wrote to Pearson's president expressing my
displeasure at their sister company's behaviour.
I didn't even get a form letter in response.
-- Programming with boost is like building a house with lego. It's a cool but I wouldn't want to live in it
Anyone else go to the site and read the exerpts from the book? Sounds more like she's a victim of a snobby, shallow, superficial society.
- Kevin
The less confident you are, the more serious you have to act.
What's really been disgusting is that Penguin has refused to acknowledge Katie Jones since 2000, when the book was first published, and the massive traffic began swamping Katie.com. They created a massive slashdot effect on purpose, against someone who had no connection with the book, and now have clearly decided to complete what they started, and take over the domain for themselves. Pretty ugly preceedent if they succeed - misappropriate someone's trademark, slashdot somebody for a few years, then file suit to take over the domain.
Big corporation with millions of dollars, against a small businesswoman with limited resources. I say a legal defense fund is in order here, if it ever goes to trial (and of course, WHERE would it go to trial - the US, or the UK?)
Here is where you can find out the names of the executives of Penguin USA. I figure with the power of slashdot, we can discover how to contact them with our disapproval.
I emailed the author, and got this reply: I appreciate your thoughts and understand them completely. It is not posted on my web site, but this issue is between Katie Jones and Penguin Putnam. They own the name Katie.com as a published book and decided to call it that. I can do nothing in my power to change it. I would suggest if you would like your voice to be heard and a chance that something is done about it, direct your sympathy to Penguin Putnam. For the record I have never harassed Katie Jones for her site. Best, Katie Tarbox Whether that is true or not, I have no idea, but in the interest of fairness, her reply should be noted, I think. I have to admit, my (limited) knowledge of publishing seems to indicate the actual author has very little juice here.
John Kenneth Fisher
Table of malContents
The girl was abused, but the main thing people hear about is some stupid domain name squabble..
Great learning experience.. And what lesson is this to teach?
"Kill all the lawyers first".. was sound advice it seems..
---- Booth was a patriot ----
- the free world and all; you know that. Dog eat dog is what it's all about, the right of the strongest and all that. If you find something and like it, you take it, and if nobody is able to resist you, you get to keep it and call it 'your right'.
After all, its the land of 'democracy', 'opportunity' and 'freedom':
democracy: make up the rules as you go along.
opportunity: steal and run if you get the chance
freedom: if you aren't caught it wasn't wrong.
- if you don't like it, change it. You're the people.
Am I the only one who thinks this is the biggest non-case ever? Do we even waste the court's time over such dribble?
ChozSun
ChozSun.com
Not sure if anyone came up with this yet (and I don't have time to go through all the posts), but why not simply put the original (girl.com) title onto the books guerrilla-style? Everyone in their respective towns and cities should get some labels, print 'Girl.com' go down to their local mega-bookstore and then slap it right on the cover while no one is watching. Might even do good to slap a small disclaimer on the inside of the book (over the publication info) stating that the defacement is in no way endorsed by Katie Jones or something else along those lines.
Odds are that the books will have to be returned to Penguin as 'damaged'. If it starts costing Penguin real money to replace the corrected title, then they may give in and rename to something other than 'Katie.com'.
unbelievable. some companies deserve to die. I'm certainly not buying another Penguin book after reading that.
MORTAR COMBAT!
Hasn't anybody started collecting money to hire lawyers and fight this?
C'mon now! That's a fake name! How about Katie gzipBox or Katie rarball?
Best Buy can have you arrested
is to make sure nobody can use the domain by /.ing it.
As a victim of a somewhat similar, absurd situation, I'm appalled. Who expected to have to trademark domain names like "Katie.com"? When the problem was pointed out. Penguin should have apologized, put up a web site, and asked the Katie.com owner to put a one-line disclaimer and link to it. They should have then done the same for her. Problem solved.
Instead, some jackass lawyers decide to screw up someone's life. If someone knows a good lawyer (jackass or not) who'll help the Katie.com website owner kick Penguin's butt, please let her know.
Amazon .com was sued by the owners of the Amazon Book Store, a woman-themed store that had been in existence long before the online company, for stealing their name. I think they got paid off.
"As God is my witness, I thought turkeys could fly." A. Carlson
She can be reached via e-mail at parry@aftab.com and for time sensitive issues or for media on a deadline, at 201-463-8663 (her U.S. cell phone).
From the "unpleasant lawyer's (Parry Aftab)" website:
>>She can be reached via e-mail at
>>parry@aftab.com and for time sensitive issues
>>or for media on a deadline, at 201-463-8663
>>(her U.S. cell phone).
To: parry@aftab.com
Subject: Hi
Dear Katie T and Parry A,
I think it is horrible what you have done to Katie Jones (katie.com)
You should stop all further litigation and change the title of your book and new product line.
If you or Pengiun had the insight to check girl.com before publishing it as the title why couldn't Katie.com have been checked? No one is at fault for this but you, and now because it isn't your site you want her just to 'donate' the domain name. She has had this personal site since 1996, we are in 2004, which makes her the owner of the domain for 8 years.
If you want to see how this has ruined your readers go to Amazon.com and look up the reviews of the book.
http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/customer-reviews/ 0452282535/ref=cm_cr_dp_2_1/102-3064588-7620110?%5 Fencoding=UTF8&me=ATVPDKIKX0DER
Almost every single review is negative because of your actions against the domain owner of katie.com
I hope you end this and change your titles.
-Matt
And it seems that the lawyer never read the book (or she would think twice before harrassing KatieJ) and, if she gave legal counsel to KatieT, she never really cared about the case - only the good $$$ she could make from it.
i'd be really tempted, but it might show an attempt to damage the reputation of penguin. you and i know this is wrong, bad and Just Plain Dumb, but you can never predict which way a court will see it...
My brand of revenge is a little different. To embarrass the HELL out of Penguin, I'd make Katie.com a porn site.
Unlike a new mother of 2(?) and small business owner, I think microsoft can come up with a few bucks to have justice enforced.
That's the whole point of Katie T's jag. She was molested and is an author now. She's not a little guy anymore. She's achived pseudo-celebrity!
And just who by the way meets a person they know only from the internet, for the first time, in a hotel room that person is staying in? Come on. That's just retarded.
This makes the "abused" Katie look like a fraud and a liar, how does that "help the childeren"?
She puts herself right in the corner with Michael Jackson sueers, Monica Lewinsky and Rebecca Loos.
All these "reliable" people.
"/Dread"
I appreciate your thoughts and understand them completely. It is not posted on my web site, but this issue is between Katie Jones and Penguin Putnam. They own the name Katie.com as a published book and decided to call it that. I can do nothing in my power to change it. I would suggest if you would like your voice to be heard and a chance that something is done about it, direct your sympathy to Penguin Putnam. For the record I have never harassed Katie Jones for her site.
Best, Katie Tarbox
I sure don't envy her. I don't want to put words in her mouth, but what she doesn't say makes it sound a lot like she isn't altogether pleased with the way Penguin Putnam has been dealing with things. Actually, it sounds to me like she didn't ask for this and is tired of it.
I keep forgetting my place. Jesus is for losers. Why do I still play to the crowd?
It just seems insane for the publisher and author to take a hard line on a case like this. They can't win. No matter how it turns out, even if they won in court...highly doubtful...they get dirty. They're already dirty and now it's public dirty laundry waving in the breeze. The abused figures out how to turn a horrible incident into big $$$$ fear mongering on Jerry Springer and in turn becomes the abuser. What a f'ing PR disaster and now the media's got ahold of it.
Even Blake Stowell from SCO couldn't spin that into anything positive. It's so heavy-handed and brazen, you'd think they were doing it deliberately.
Penguin's upper management is either on some serious medication or they need to be. Take away the crack pipe and get them into detox.
That's our life, the big wheel of shit. - The Fat Man, Blue Tango Salvage
Hmm... Interesting little portrayal the author of the book offers there. Isn't it _her_ lawyer that's asking Katie Jones to offer the domain name for free to her?
I'm not a nerd. I'm a geek. Nerds make more money.
It's boilerplate. Anyone sending email to about this here get's the same response.
My guess is she's probably sipping mint julips under the cottonwoods enjoying here $$$$ from the book and doesn't give a rats ass about being part of a legal predator's actions.
I guess she doesn't care because it's "not her" getting screwed this time.
just title the book katiet.com or kat_t.com or any other play on katie tar...or heck they should have called tarbaby.com given the mess they are creating....
KatieT: Big bad internet hurt me! I deserve to be able to wine about it under the name katie.com
KatieJ: I'm sorry you got hurt. I am trying to make a difference in how internet chat rooms work. But katie.com is not your's, please consider telling your story with the name katieT.com which is your domain.
KatieT: Your involved in internet chat rooms?! They hurt me! The Internet should pay--you should give me katie.com because I got hurt and I deserve the domain name!
KatieJ: I'm not the Internet, I am just an young mother that does not want to be pushed aside. I can understand you wanting the person that hurt you to pay, but I'm also not Frank (a.k.a. "Mark"). Taking away what I consider to be my own online identity (my domain name) is not going to make Frank pay but rather will just increase the amount of injustice in the world.
KatieT: No! I WANT! Give me or things will only get worse! See all the book covers at the bottom of katieT.com! I'm going to make sure the whole world knows that I deserve to have katie.com!
KatieJ: Again, I ask that you do not steamro...
KatieT: GIVE! MINE! I WANT! GIVE! MINE! I WANT! You do not matter to me! When I'm done, the "Community Service" section of my website will explain to other victums of the Internet how to take the domain names that they want. Then the Internet will really pay for what it did to me.
KatieJ: But I do help wit...
KatieT: No! I do not care what you have to say! I WANT! I WANT! I WANT! *YOU* deserve nothing and *I* deserve everything! katie.com will be *MINE* because the big bad Internet hurt me!!
... was nice enough to post this on her website:
She can be reached via e-mail at parry@aftab.com and for time sensitive issues or for media on a deadline, at 201-463-8663 (her U.S. cell phone).
So give her a call.. Tell her what you think!
I do not want to make any money out of this situation, other than to recover my losses.
She really needs to sue for some ungodly sum ($100 million) for defamation of character (after all, she never flirted with older men on the Internet) and get an injunction against the book. Make them slap stickers on the cover.
Best Buy can have you arrested
She should move her own web site and e-mail to katie.katie.com. Then she can exploit the original domain name. While she probably won't want to run a pr0n site, I suggest she have katie.com and www.katie.com point to something which will make her some cash. And throw the luser e-mails away. She's probably got enough regular spam coming to katie.com anyhow that the domain change will help a little.
--
"Open source is good." - Steve Jobs
"Open source is evil." - Microsoft
Link to "the lawyer"'s blog. Maybe we can fill in those 0 comment entries.
http://parryaftab.blogspot.com/
Capital suggestion! I sent Ms. Aftab - an exceedingly, ah, well-nourished individual [http://www.aftab.com/images/parry2.jpg] - the following post... >
I recently read a story about your book and the problems it has been causing with the legal owner of Katie.com, Katie Jones.
I was appalled to read about how your lawyers, or penquin's lawyers acting on your behalf, are trying to steamroll Mrs. Jones into "donating" her property. Instead of bullying her into giving up her rightfully owned domain name, might I suggest politely offering her a nice sum in exchange? Any reasonable person would see that as being the decent thing to do.
It disgusts me that you were the victim of an online predator, and now it also disgusts me that you have become a different type of online predator.
I strongly urge you and your publishing company to either deal with Mrs. Jones in a respectable manner, or leave her alone altogether. I also urge you to put pressure on your publisher to stop this despicable behavior.
Sincerely,
(my name here)
"With sufficient thrust, pigs fly just fine." -- RFC 1925
This is a perfect example of the dangers resulting from corporations now being treated as entities which enjoy first amendment protections (I believe it was during Reagan's presidency that this change happened).
Think about this for a second - a huge media corporation with publishing facilities in cities all around the world and teams of lawyers - arguing that their free speech is being violated by one person's individual website. Do you really think it's in the spirit of the first amendment that these two entities should be perfectly equal in the eyes of the law?
I have written Katie Tarbox and encouraged her to do the right thing by publicly denouncing the attempt to extort someone out of their legitimately owned property. I have some hope that she is still capable of human feeling and moral thought. You, however, would appear to be a lost cause. I'm not sure which is more sickening: your thuggish bullying of an innocent woman, or your pious self-justification that it's "for the children". You are a disgrace to your profession, madam.
there's never anything wrong with making a web-log go away.
Tarbox is described in her bio as having dealt with an "internet predator".
Now she and her lawyers are after this other Katie over a domain name.
Who's the internet predator now?
"People" using "unnecessary" quotes should be "shot".
Going to www.aftab.com on the other hand, could maybe cap its bandwidth limits if it's on some webhosting server.
Not everybody run a webserver on their own computer, you know...
It's its. They're their, there. You're your. Who's whose? A looser loser, though those two too threw through the trough.
Has anyone noticed the falling stars? LOL Go slashdot!! Before today the book had fairly decent ratings (4 or 5 out of five stars). Since this morning the reviews have fallen down to 2 and a half stars LOL. Is it possible to take it down to zero stars?? I'd like to find out So I think that leaves us with Lawers--0 We the people--more than you can count I'm loving this LOL!!!
She should resell copies of the book on the site.
That would really piss them off and would provide a ton of cash to pay lawyers to ward off Penguin.
IANAL, but it would seem that there's absolutely no protection against what Penguin did at all. They might as well have used her address or phone number.
No, what this case involves is out-and-out extortion. It has nothing to do with Capitalism or they would have offered to buy the domain. Their lawyer is using threats in an attempt to steal it. Taking someone's property without paying for it is stealing.
This is on the order of someone building a house at 63045 North 63045 Street, and then Channel 63,045 starts up and decides they want the property you live on for the address to their studios, so they tell you to sign over the deed to them for free.
They had no right to this name, she had it first, and it is legitimately her name. This is a clear and obvious attempt at reverse cybersquatting, and nothing less. Don't smear Capitalism over something it is not.
The lessons of history teach us - if they teach us anything - that nobody learns the lessons that history teaches us.
They're talking about trademark registration, not domain registration.
-molo
Using your sig line to advertise for friends is lame.
She probably won't take this to court from her own statements on the matter, so a nice evil PR campaign might work really well. Especially since she shouldn't face any of the "cybersquatter" rules that get domains turned over - after all, she 1) registered it practically in the stone age (1996, before Katie T. was molested or whatever), and 2) did so in good faith, using it for a personal site before it became useless as such.
Penguin clearly hasn't acted in good faith, I see no reason why she should. Goatse it is!
-Looking for a job as a materials chemist or multivariat
They made a book about a sexualy harassed person and as a reasult they try to screw over the rightfull owner of Katie.com?
Don't fight for your country, if your country does not fight for you.
There was a point where she was going to name her on-line (fear based I'm sure) education program katie.com. The publisher of her book wasn't involved with this. However the lawyer she is/was working with was. He has his own lame blog, like every other self-important ass in the universe. Now her program has been renamed something in the .org space.
As much as the ill-concieved and inconsiderately titled book has been a significant burden on Mrs. Katie Jones (Who runs a web-based small business with a chatroom no less) it's about Katie Tarbox demanding someone else's property be donated to her new commercial venture.
There's a reason she didn't call the book girl.com. And it's the obvious one. She didn't call it KatieT.com, which is the domain she now uses. But Katie.com. The property she neither owned nor could afford. So she greatly diminished the value and utility to the owner. Her lack of empathy for others, particularly after what she's been through is telling. I've no doubt that rather than lie, a person such as herself would just re-imagine the truth to be whatever is most convienent for the moment they are in.
In the interest of fairness Ms. Tarbox should, in the following printings of her book, retitle them, and include an apology to Mrs. Katie Jones. She wants people to learn from and have empathy for her. It's only reasonable that she learn from her own mistakes, and be considerate of others.
The Russians have won. They have made the world a cesspool of distrust, greed, fear and hate.
Yeah. Go to your local bookstores and rip random pages from katie.com.
A young mother uses her own name to promote a web site of pictures of her baby and someone else wants the to take away the domain name. What does this sound like? Oh yeah! veronica.org where a father uses his toddler's name to promote pictures of his baby and Archie Comics needed to "protect" their trademark! Funny thing, now some 5 years later when veronica.org is not about a baby but now redirects to "SamsDirect" it seems like Archie Comics no longer cares about protecting their trademark. It is funny how quickly these bullies (Archive Comics/KatieT) will stop when the domain name owner is not an easy target.
Because having a publishing company that hires a lawyer to try to get a domain name is equivalent to holding down a small child and jamming an erect penis into its undeveloped vagina.
Real fucking noble of you.
[ Inspired by this brilliant post ]
"Penguin refuses to apologize, saying that it would be a violation of their free speech to re-title the book..."
Treat others as you would want them to treat you.
What if Katie Jones (katie.com) did this (with some help...)
1. Write a book about Linux. Title it, um... 'penguin.com'
2. Launch a campaign to persuade Penguin publishing to donate control of their penguin.com domain. Of course... in aid of millions of citizens abused for several years by a convicted monopoly. Many of these citizens are finding comfort in the things described in 'penguin.com'
3. Keep praising our right to free speech.
4. Work hard promoting 'penguin.com': a CD jacket, translations to various languages, lecture tours, bookstore appearances...
5. Oh, I almost forgot... by all means, register 'penguin.com' as a trademark.
What if?
Not if you're named Katie! Seriously, I wouldn't want a site out there using my first name as a support group, or porn provider specializing in small penar or dutch beastiality.
1) Amazon.co.uk does not seem to have been affected by the comments that appear on Amazon.com
2) When Rockstar Games published GTA III They made dam shure that they owned www.pogothemonkey.com
Wouldn't it be nice if schools got all the money they wanted and the army had to hold jumble sales for guns
At first I thought this had to be an article about sting operations and breaking up international porn rings. I mean, is that the perfect vice-squad pseudonym or what? Like "Katie Honeypot."
I think I'll just start calling her "Katie Botox," (half-assed anagram) or maybe "Katie Buttocks." Boy, her playground days must have been a drag!
LOL... Just checked Amazon.com...
:)
There ARE now 5 or 6 "negative reviews", with 30 to 40 "USEFUL" votes for some of them!
Interestingly the only TWO "positive reviews" now have approx 140 to 150 "NOT USEFUL" votes each!
The "Spotlight reviews" (The ones you see first) are calculated on a daily basis, it will be interesting to see the outcome of this particular "Slashdotting"
Maybe we should all rip the covers off a few high dollar Peguin books at a few Bookstores - maybe leave a little note - hit em in the pocketbooks...
She could probably even sue for emotional damages because of the content she got thrown into her inbox: personal tales of people's abuse.
/they/ would suffer emotionaly from reading all that and the millions will flow from Penguin to katie.com!
I doubt she actualy lost any sleep over it, but all it takes is to convince a jury that
I normaly hate this kind of suit, but this call for payback.
How about either giving the book highly negative reviews on amazon, or in the review, state the situation clearly for all possible buyers of the book. Most people would be appalled at Penguin's bullying tactics and be happy to boycott the book. Sales would slump miserably (at least through amazon) and the publisher might actually get a clue that they should change the title.
katie.com clear case for every sane person, which points out lawyers aren't wery sane (at least 50%, which go on such cases)
Katie Jones maybe does not have the money to fight them back, but any sane judge should make the right decision and send those Penguin lawyers home empty handed (or even better make them pay for the misery Katie Johnes has gone through), if they make this a case.
Things in a rear mirror might be behind you
Since she lives in the U.K. she might be able to sue the parent company there as this might constitute defamation or libel there and it would be serious damages if so. Only problem is they don't allow people to sue on contingency in the U.K.
The lessons of history teach us - if they teach us anything - that nobody learns the lessons that history teaches us.
From Parry Aftab's website:
She can be reached via e-mail at parry@aftab.com and for time sensitive issues or for media on a deadline, at 201-463-8663 (her U.S. cell phone).
There ought to be a slashdot spinoff, maybe called slashcott, so when BS like this crops up the corps involved can get buried in notes from people threatending to boycott 'em.
Date: Thu, 05 Aug 2004 11:23:50 -0400
From: Chris Knight <merlin@ghostwheel.com>
To: online@penguinputnam.com
Subject: In response to katie.com
To whom it may concern,
I make this promise today: As long as Penguin Group is engaged in their
disgraceful attempt to strong-arm katie.com from its rightful owner I will
refuse to purchase any book published by them, or any of their subsidiaries.
Should Penguin Group succeed in stealing katie.com from Katie Jones I will
continue to avoid your books, I will teach my children to do so as well, and I
will spread the story to all my friends.
We live in a capitalistic society, and profit seems to be the only thing
people understand anymore. Therefore, I am casting my vote with the dollars
you will not receive while engaged in such actions.
-Chris
-- This sig is only a test. If this were a real sig it would say something witty. --
"Katie Tarbox" anagrams to "Rob, take taxi".
Fate, I tells ya.
San Diego Padres, 100 Park Blvd, San Diego CA 92101
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by
Write a parody of this whole thing and use the title Penguin.com.
Katie T. claims to have no power over what Penguin Putnam does, but she certainly should. Penguin and her apparently predatory lawyer, by their actions, are damaging her reputation. That alone should give her some legal basis for getting Penguin to change the name of the book and stop harrassing Katie J. Katie T. needs a new lawyer.
Of course, it could be that as long as the checks keep rolling in she just doesn't care. In which case she deserves whatever damage her reputation incurs.
As every decent person does I am sorry for what happened to Katherine Tarbox. However, this does not releve her of any of the personal responsability as a moral human being to stop what has/is happening to Katie Jones.
If she has any sence of morality she personally will stop this and make amends.
Really, I know what I'm doing...Ohhhh, look at the shiny buttons!
I'm gonna get myself stalker online then write a book titled 'microsoft.com' in remembrance of my soft small childlike heart that was crashed, er, broken online. I bet I can win it.
Dustin - A different story...
>>I appreciate your thoughts and understand them >>completely. It is >>not posted on my web site, but this issue is >>between Katie Jones and >>Penguin Putnam. They own the name Katie.com >>as a published book and >>decided to call it that. I can do nothing in >>my power to change it. I >>would suggest if you would like your voice to >>be heard and a chance that >>something is done about it, direct your >>sympathy to Penguin Putnam. For >>the record I have never harassed Katie Jones >>for her site. >>Best, Katie Tarbox the article said Katie's lawyer, not her publisher's lawyer... what's with that?
http://www.aftab.com/
The part I like best is where she compares herself to an elephant. At least she has a healthy body image...
http://www.aftab.com/about_parry_aftab.htm
From http://www.aftab.com/
"Parry Aftab is one of the leading experts, worldwide, on cybercrime, Internet privacy and cyber-abuse issues."
A gather this means she's an expert on
committing cybercrime?
San Diego Padres, 100 Park Blvd, San Diego CA 92101
It is pitch black. You are likely to be eaten by
Pedophiles DO look at family-photo-album sites.
Protect yours with a password.
Not permanently, however, it would cause penguin some problems if people rang up and complained about not being able to get to the web site, and Katie Jones wouldn't have to pay for bandwidth.
The Internet's nature is peer to peer - 20050301_cs_profs.pdf
I feel as you do - the book is hers. She is responsible. Hence I sent her the following letter:
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
What happened to Katie T has no effect on the legitimacy of her actions. It is simply irrelevant.
Nicotine free Amish .sig.
If they can't sell books, they can't pay lawyers. Lets let them know how we feel, Dave Barry Style!
b out/contact.htm
Direct mail and orders to:
Penguin Group (USA) Inc.
405 Murray Hill Parkway
East Rutherford, NJ 07073
(800) 788-6262 (Individual Consumer Sales)
(800) 526-0275 (Reseller Sales)
(800) 631-8571 (Reseller Customer Service)
International numbers here: http://www.penguinputnam.com/static/packages/us/a
"I threw up my hands in disgust and wondered if it had been such a good idea to have eaten my hands in the first place."
If I falsely tell people you got mugged, are they going to hold it against you?
Should it be any different for sexual assault victims?
Dont't be an ass.
Abolish Copyright. Restore Freedom.
You could argue that Katie of the web site established a narrow trademark the first time she announced her URL. Narrow in that it applies to a web site publishing whatever it was she was publishing.
You can also argue that the book author has a trademark to the term "katie.com" for use as a book title.
1996 comes before 2000.
Also, phone #s CAN be trademarked under limited circumstances. Not the NUMBER, but letter-abbreviations. For example, after a fight, Sprint successfully registered "1-800-PIN-DROP." The term is NOT "merely descriptive," yet it is identified with their long-distance service. However, 1-800-DIET-NOW would not be trademarkable by a weight-loss products firm, nor by a candidate running for the Japanese legislative body.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
go to http://bugmenot.com/ for an Amazon registration ID and Password if you need it to log-in to vote.
Too valuable, even with what Tarbox has done to diminish its value.
Instead register KatieTarboxIsAStupidBitch.com and rip her a new one there. No need to bet a great domain name....
K Tarbox: "It's Mine! It's Mine! It's Mine! It's Mine! It's Mine!"
/kicks K Jones in the shins...
"Creativity is allowing ones self to make mistakes. Art is knowing which ones to keep" - Scott Adams
Well, if there is one site worthy of a hefty slashdotting (Penguins would I'm sure stand up to the assult!) is would be http://www.aftab.com/ the author of said snotty letter demanding the site be handed over. Nice, seeing as she specialises in protecting people online....
Rikster
Remember folks, we need a mirror of katiet.com incase it gets slashdotted
$ wget --mirror katiet.com
Someone else already posted the author's reply in this thread. She has nothing to do with this dispute. This is all Penguin Punham vs. Katie Jones.
I don't like the idea of punishing the author just because her publishers are evil. There are better ways.
That was just over the line. Yes, the Penguin side of the issue is doing their best to bring their personal totalitarian dystopia to the Internet. Fine, call them on it. You can even disagree with Katie T.'s actions in this whole affair, no problem.
But let's not stoop to insinuating that a thirteen year old being raped was somehow her fault. And what sort of retardity possessed that mods that made this funny ?!? Goddamnit guys, let's at least try to be somewhat respectful here.
--LordPixie
This is not anywhere close to Funny.
Know where to stop, buddy.
3.243F6A8885A308D313
It seems that Ms. Katie J registered the site in good faith for her own use in 1996. Regardless of any legal (mis)construction, she should have sole rights to the name on DNS and the actual web site.
There should be no discussion except condemnation of Penguin for trying to usurp the URL. There should also be condemnation of Katie Targrass for not stopping her publisher from doing this.
Any legal construction that eventually grants Penguin the right to the URL is morally wrong and we should protest. We could be next.
I'm voting with my feet and am certainly NOT going to buy that book, and any other Penguin book for that matter.
You people do understand that juries have to agree to this kind of nonsense before these evil bloodsucking lawyers can "win" a case, right? You do realize that juries arbitrarily pick settlement amounts out of their collective asses, right? And that if jury settlements come from the vacuuming bowels of a jury's intestines, appeals court settlements are from somewhere in the Oort cloud?
It's so easy to rip into the lawyers. Somebody came to *THEM* and said, "We want to sue this chick over her domain." The lawyer's JOB is to (a) determine if there's a chance in hell that this case can win and (b) find a way to win it.
It's not a lawyer just leaped out of his $5 million mansion and descended upon Katie Jones with a fistful of paperwork. You sound like typical conservative hacks, all irate over trial lawyers winning personal injury lawsuits, when the JURY is really responsible.
As a friend of Katie Jones and the guy who hosts the katie.com domain...... Wow, you Slashdotters are an amazing bunch. No other site that has carried the story has generated a response as big the one from Slashdot. I thought my server had died earlier today, the amount of traffic it recieved was so large, and all from Slashdot. Thank you for taking an interest in this issue.
Apparently the book got renamed at the last minute because girl.com (the original name) was a porn site. The solution for Katie Jones as owner (and sole publisher of content) of katie.com seems obvious to me!
I had about the same idea, turn katie.com into a porn site, one of those "Just 18" sites, or the like, and, of course, call all of the models on the sign up page, "Katie". Get some basic content, pics, movie clips etc. and then use the book's fame against it. Might even be worth it to have a bunch of fiction posted on the site as well. Hell, go for the spike, and have lolita type fiction, and advertise this fact on the front page. If nothing else, the amout of controversy this will create will draw a ton of people to the site, just to see what it is all about. Once the site gets really popular, sell it to one of the bigger porn companies, and get out in style.
But then, I am vindictive that way.
Necessity is the mother of invention.
Laziness is the father.
Given that Katie.com is owned by an individual whom lives in the United Kingdom and Penguin are a multi-national (i.e. are likely to have offices in the UK), I wonder what the relevent UK laws state. I wonder if Katie Jones could bring a claim to the UK courts if she wanted.
Yes - but not pr0n. Put up some Google Adwords, or sponsored links to Amazon. That would help cover the costs of the commandeered bandwidth. She must get a nice bit of traffic looking for information about the other Katie, why not use it? The good things about Adwords is that Google would choose the links, so she would have a good defense if accused of using the domain to profit from "Penguin's" trademark.
Oh, and while we're at it, don't forget to rate the reviews on Amazon if you found them helpful....
David Shanks
Address correspondence to his office, or better yet, send an additional CC: to him.
Together, we will drive the rats from the tundra.
It is unfair to make someone who has had the site give up the name because the book came out. Tarbox does not have the right to force someone to give up their domain because of a book... however the site owner can't complain about the title as it is not copyrighted. This is going to be an interesting case to follow and see what happens in the end.
Mr Nissan registered the site http://www.nissan.com/ for his computer business. Nissan Motors came along later, and put up enough of a legal struggle, that Mr. Nissan had to change his website, so that it cannot be used for commerical purposes, namely, Mr. Nissan's computer shop. The whole story is here --> http://www.ncchelp.org/The_Story/the_story.htm/
I found the "Any" key.
It sucks if you own something like katie.com to go thru this, but sheesh, squeeze the lemons, lady, and:
a) put Google AdWords on the site, with some abuse content. You'll make a mint.
or
b) put a porn site at katie.com. See how fast Penguin Books will stop promoting it. (I do not recommend this, I do not support/agree with/recommend porn, but this would be an effective way of dealing with a pushy publisher.
Just think of all that free publicity and traffic ... someone could make a lot of money with this domain.
That's why libel often involves sexual issues. It doesn't matter that you might not stigmatize a sexual assault victim -- it only matters that a significant enough segment of the public -- legitamtely or not -- stigmatizes a sexual assault victim. From a strictly pragmatic perspective, it's advantageous to marry someone who has not been a sexual assault victim, since there will be fewer psychological problems in the bedroom (plus smaller chance of sexually transmitted disease).
BRILLIANT IDEA, Smithers.
--- Eat my sig.
Trademarks do not need to be registered, but it helps. For quick reference, try this : http://www.uspto.gov/web/offices/tac/doc/basic/reg ister.htm
Oh, come, come, come. Without a monster or two, it's hardly a quest... merely a gaggle of friends wandering about. - Owl
Read the details RD, it IS Katie's lawyer doing this, the lawyer is NOT affiliated with Penguin. Look the fat bitch up, she is one huge, ugly, fat, lawyer from hell, fuck her, and fuck Katie T.
You are correct, there are better ways, but you can't kill everyone that deserves it.
If the problem remains unresolved
I think its time for google searches to "Penguin Publishing" to go to a site discussing what penguin publishing has done here. As well as boycotts, etc...
Apparently Kate Tarbox, that bitch, believes in an eye for an eye, and is doing just that to someone else now (abusing and hurrasing someone via the internet).
KATE TARBOX! STOP THE ONLINE ABUSE!
Bravo.
Provided that there's a jury.
Fox Announcer Voice
/Fox Announcer Voice
When publishing companies attack! Next, after Swaping wives at 9:00, 8:00 Centeral Time...
I also just noticed that the domains penguinsucks.com and boycottpenguin.com are available for registration. Perhaps someone could host online protests there as well.
Um, it's too bad no one cares about anyone involved in these proceedings. I'm sure the book was terrible and the website even worse.
Would they have been? Remember the Tommy Tutone song "867-5309 Jenny"? Lots of people had that phone number, but noone got sued over it.
I mod down all the "free iPod"-sig losers.
Erm... Linux users might not appreciate the defamation of the term "Penguin", as far as google is concerned.
----geppy -
http://www.newsforge.com/article.pl?sid=04/07/28/1 513218
David Shanks
CEO, Penguin-Putnam, Inc.
david.shanks@us.penguingroup.com
Why should we give the book poor reviews because of a dispute with the publisher? This has nothing to do with the quality of the text.
From Parry Aftab's [lawyer] blog:
Katie's dream to create a safe haven for these kids is a wonderful idea. We think it's so wonderful that we are going to help her build it.
If anyone wants to help, let us know. You can drop by wiredsafety.org and volunteer. Let them know you want to help build Katie's program.
This seems to be what they want to do with katie.com. Her blog links to http://katiesplace.org/, which says her "safe haven" will be launched within a year.
It seems that on Katie T's lawyers web blog
that they already are planning another website called katiesplace.com,and Katie T already has katiet.com, if this is true then why are they still trying to take away the domain of katie.com
http://parryaftab.blogspot.com/
You can neither trademark nor copyright book titles. Books commonly come out with identical or nearly-identical titles. For example there is no legal conflict involved in Heinlein not being the only author to title a book Glory Road. And if you look at, for instance, the New York or London Review of Books you'll see books commonly coming out on current and historical subjects with titles completely or nearly identical - again, no legal action ensues. Some of these books come out on Penguin, so they know the law here.
To the extent that you can trademark anything, trademark is based in common law and derives from first use in commerce - and only applies to its use in commerce within the catagory of goods or services it's in (IANAL but I used to be the bureaucrat in charge of trademarks for a mid-sized state). So if you could trademark "katie.com" for the sale of books and publications (and you most certainly can't, unless it's the publisher's imprint rather than a book title), and you argue that the katie.com Web site is in that category, by common law right of first use kitie.com wins and you're up the creek without a paddle.
You also can't take a term already in use in an area and make it your trademark in that area - so you can't just start taking book titles or Web site addresses that aren't yours (and probably aren't trademarkable in themselves) and filing trademarks for books or publication services or whatever based on your appropriating them for your own publishers imprint - you can't call a publishing house "King James Bible" and then demand that all the bible publishers retitle their output.
What arses! The lawyer making these threats should be disbarred.
"with their freedom lost all virtue lose" - Milton
This has probably been discussed, but what the heck.
It's clear that the domain is Katie Jones' property. It's also clear that it was a real slimy tactic usurping her domain name on the book title. It's a lot like having the phone number 867-5309....
Looking at 'it is what it is,' has she thought about leasing the domain name for a cut of the sales revenue? The book's title will not change, and it's in print. As long as she owns the domain, she will be harassed, and if she structured the contract correctly, she could at least profit off of their sleazy idea.
"Who are you?" "No one of consequence." "I must know." "Get used to disappointment."
... calculated about this, so burn karma, burn!After reading the provided excerpt from the book titled "Katie.com", it reveals something about this young woman that doesn't portray her in a good light. As a matter of fact, she seems to be hilighting the fact that the chat with a pedophile began when she was 13 but seems to de-emphasize the fact that the actual 'molestation' occurred when she was 17. Still a minor but she was not a kid and it wasn't molestation and perhaps not even rape - Had the jerk met her somewhat superficial standards at the time (had been in his 20's, had been generally kind and paced things a bit slower) she likely wouldn't have accused him of molestation.
Combine that with her attitude toward this lawyer led barnstoming over the domain that the publisher used for a book title (which has nothing to do with the events portrayed in the book) and the general lack of care for what is being done on her behalf... I don't envision this young lady a victim of anything at all except her own actions and superficial views of the world.
Mod me troll, if you must, I can't help it.
I have an idea. Why doesn't she write a book about her experience about corporate preditors screwing a young mother out of her domain name? I even have a good title for it.... Penguin.com
Ladies and gentlemen of the supposed jury, Katie's attorney would certainly want you to believe that his client registered "katie.com" eight years ago. And they make a good case. Hell, I almost felt pity myself!
But ladies and gentlemen of this supposed jury, I have one final thing I want you to consider: This is Chewbacca. Chewbacca is a Wookiee from the planet Kashyyyk, but Chewbacca lives on the planet Endor. Now, think about that. That does not make sense! Why would a Wookiee - an eight foot tall Wookiee - want to live on Endor with a bunch of two foot tall Ewoks? That does not make sense!
But more important, you have to ask yourself, what does this have to do with this case? Nothing. Ladies and gentlemen, it has nothing to do with this case! It does not make sense!
Look at me, I'm a lawyer defending a major publishing company, and I'm talkin' about Chewbacca. Does that make sense? Ladies and gentlemen, I am not making any sense. None of this makes sense!
And so you have to remember, when you're in that jury room deliberating and conjugating the Emancipation Proclamation... does it make sense? No! Ladies and gentlemen of this supposed jury, it does not make sense.
If Chewbacca lives on Endor, you must acquit! The defense rests.
I know a few, including one who works for a very prestigous IP firm on the west coast. Only one problem. Katie (of Katie.com) is in London, while Katie T (of the book) is in America. That makes this case a bit hard to prosecute, and the potential outcome (and revenue) in doubt.
-------------------------------------------------
katie.cnn d d
katie.com.cn
katie.net.cn
katie.org.c
katie.fr
katie.it
katie.am
katie.tv
katie.m
katie.fm
katie.to
katie.sr
katie.la
katie.t
Grab 'em while they're hot!
--- Yx3 = Delilah ---
In the contract selling the name to a porn company, they could include a clause indemnifying her and making the company liable for any loss as a result of a suit by Penguin.
Thus, if the sells the name to reputable or financially sound company, she could pretty much protect herself from any potential personal liability.
Katie Tarbox and the editor at Penguin Putnam should have done a quick domain search before they named the book.
[-- Trust the Monkey --]
"It seems that the Katie.com people don't like the web traffic and messages from users who assume Katie.com is the abused Katie. Apparently the lawyer suggested if this was a problem for Katie.com, they could donate the domain to penguin. This is not a hijacking. And not the black-and-white victimization the write-up implies."
Text included to beat the lameness filters, but you're still a 'tard.
This is nothing more than, "You have something we want, therefore you need to give it to us."
The trademark/domain issues only create confusion. It seems Katie T's lawyers are hoping to capitalize on that confusion.
...is of course that Katie Tarbox isn't abusing anyone online. Could you just imagine the irony?
Remember YMMV!
Ciao
Randy
Sorry, but I just can't bring myself to post her phone number.
:X XXX
TARBOX, KATIE **
(KT6079)
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
NEW CANAAN, CT 06840-5024
US
Phone: XXX XXX XXXX
Domain Name: KATIET.COM
Administrative Contact , Technical Contact
TARBOX, KATIE **
(KT6079)
agidore26@aol.com
XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX
NEW CANAAN, CT 06840-5024
US
Phone: XXX XXX XXXX
Record expires on 22-Oct-2010
Record created on 22-Oct-1999
Database last updated on 29-Jun-2004
KT6079
TARBOX, KATIE **
(KT6079)
agidore26@aol.com
NEW CANAAN, CT 06840-5024
US
Phone: XXX XXX XXXX
Oh, come, come, come. Without a monster or two, it's hardly a quest... merely a gaggle of friends wandering about. - Owl
She could check with the Faroe Islands to see if tarbox.fo is available then redirect to that. (Strangely there doesn't seem to be a .fu TLD.)
One line blog. I hear that they're called Twitters now.
I think a nice big picture of "hello.jpg" on the main page would put to rest any desire on the part of Penguin books or Katie T. to have anything to do with that website. Just my opinion of course :)
Now, THAT is one penguin I wouldn't mind seeing steamrolled.
First: Katie Jones, you REALLY ought to take revenge, not for revenge's sake, but to show corporate america that running rampant or roughshod over the world is NOT going to be tolerated. Here's what to do: Sell/license Katie.com to a porn company, such as Hustler. That would be approro, since the shyster lawyer and Penging are trying to hustle/horn you into "donating the name". To hell with them, just for that. Now... Don't forget to register you problem with the UN/WIPO, as well as ICANN, and the EFFF, as well as the ACLU. Try to contact Groklaw, and see if they'll help you out. It would be interesting to see if they'll accord ALL citizens of the WORLD the same basic protections we in the US are supposedly/purportedly granted by law or nature or divination.
Katie Tarbox, being of reasonable intelligence, could have named her book "Katie T.com: Portrait of an On-line Victim", or something to that effect. It is very likely the thought crossed her mind that there HAS to be a real katie.com out there. Couldn't she have checked?
He scheister/shyster lawyer IS of ABOVE REASONABLE intelligence (anyone taking a line of work that generates umpteen numbers of dollars really is not dumb by a longshot), yet like (whether or not the lawyer is or is not is up to the audience to determine) a DIPSH*T refuses to defuse the situation, namely by at least republishing future copies of the material with new covers, renaming the touring events, and the related publications as "Katie T.com". The book need not have followed the URL convention/naming format, but since katiet.com is Tarbox's site, WHY, WHY, the hell was the book not correspondingly named? "Katiet.com: Portrait of an Internet Victim" is not hard to deal with.
I'll TELL you why: Greed. Unadulterated, insatiable corporate GREED. Of course, Tarbox stands to silently acquire immense wealth if she remains silent and lets her shyster lawyer roll all over Jones. This is BS. This is an example of what the current cadge/cabal administration would allow to happen to ordinary citizens (especially of of non-US residency) when corporate america wants to save a buck, take a buck, or co-opt the lawfully-acquired properties of others.
Now, as for Penguin: I'LL NEVER AGAIN buy another penguin-published or advertised title or imprint EVER, EVER, again. Not, at least, until you HONORABLY, ethically, morally, and convincingly resolve this issue: RETITLE THE BOOK, and pull ALL store shelf copies (and re-cover the books), REGARDLESS OF YOUR COST! You incurred it, you FIX it.
I will also as widely as possible disseminate the word as widely as possible.
David Syes
Previously: "Linux... Toward the Sunrise..." Now: "Linux... Toward the-- No, now, part of Every Sunrise"
I knew I remembered seeing something about this on here before:
How Dangerous is Online Chat for Kids?
------
Objects in Mirror are Losing!
Although I'll probably be lost in the torrent of comments on this one, I would just like to turn people's attention to a startlingly similar case; gateway.com.
For those that don't know, Alan Clegg once owned the domain "gateway.com"... since around 1994 or thereabouts. All of a sudden in 2000, Gateway 2000 decided that they liked this Internet thing after all and wanted to have the domain. So did they offer to buy said domain??? Hell no... they sued Alan for the domain. (a URL that details a bit of this is http://www.cybermad.com/culture/odd/odd.html)
Now, to this day I don't know exactly what happened to this lawsuit... I didn't keep up with it much, but of course gateway.com now goes to the large corporation.
Funnily enough, one of the really amusing (horrible) things that happened during the lawsuit was that Gateway 2000 removed the definition of "gateway" from their online dictionary, it being a piece of networking equipment which is where Alan got the name from.
If you're out there, Alan... I still wonder occasionally what happened. I even wrote an opinion piece of my own website about it... you can still search and find information about it on Google.
I feel for Katie Jones... and to be honest I hope she wins the lawsuit. Sounds to me like she's fighting the other Katie... not necessarily Penguin. I, for one however will not be buying this book under any circumstances. It would just fund the lawsuit.
Because it's the author's lawyer that is harassing the domain owner.
Now that's what I call a sticky situation!
Since katie.com is taken, why not just rename the book and make a new website on the name? I suggest spiffy new melding of Katie's first and last names "Katie Tarbox" www.katiesbox.com anyone? Yes I'm obvious. Sorry, I'm a writer
I emailed Katie Tarbox a nice email explaining that the bullying tactics were hurting her cause.
This was her reply:
I appreciate your thoughts and understand them completely. It is not posted on my web site, but this issue is between Katie Jones and Penguin Putnam. They own the name Katie.com as a published book and decided to call it that. I can do nothing in my power to change it. I would suggest if you would like your voice to be heard and a chance that something is done about it, direct your sympathy to Penguin Putnam. For the record I have never harassed Katie Jones for her site.
Best, Katie Tarbox
She claims to have nothing to do with it. I don't know, but the reply was nice and enough for me to leave her alone.
Sierra Tango Foxtrot Uniform
From CNN "In early publicity, Tarbox's autobiographical account was promoted as Girl.com, but the book finally appeared under a different name. The Web site at www.girl.com features hardcore porn." :D
Oops, should have read further... this looks like an autoresponse. Figures...
Sierra Tango Foxtrot Uniform
If you can afford a lawyer, you can afford to at least offer to buy the domain name. What is up with this "i'll see you in court!" knee jerk reflex?
#!/usr/bin/english
Except for ethics and freedom, you're right.
Nostalgia isn't what it used to be.
Hey Bill, fork over that domain name...
If you read:n guin_ka tie_hijack/
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/08/04/pe
they already mentioned that she would not be allowed to sell the domain name now since "it is now intricately linked with the book and media machine surrounding the other Katie".
I can tell you one thing any money I was ever going to spend on a book published by Penguin would now go to support the owner of katie.com
If you actually read the first posting on Katie.com you'll see this:
"To answer some questions that I've received today, firstly as far as I know the rather aggressive lawyer who contacted me yesterday is not part of Penguin Puttnam but is working with Katie Tarbox on future projects and trying to gain control of my domain name for these projects. She informed me that things would 'only get worse' for me from here if I didn't do something about it - i.e. give it to them."
It would seem that the real fight is with Katie Tarbox's lawyer, Parry Aftab. She can be reached here: http://parryaftab.blogspot.com/
turn katie.com into a porn site, one of those "Just 18" sites
And you could make the 8 half faded, so it almost looks like a 3
It's gonna be called KatieT.com, and it's gonna be about a dirty, naughty little girl who goes into #Lolita_Chat and seduces older men into meeting her for sex.
Then I'm gonna sue that fucking bitch to teach her a lesson in manners.
....except to WB and Paramount and whatever else big corporation wants to kill off their fan base for some reason.
Both companies above have waged war against their fans regarding websites.
In the case of WB, hundreds of fans had their fansites before Harry Potter was a galleon gleam in their coffers. That still didn't stop WB from sending cease and desist letters to teenie boppers the second they bought the rights for the films.
Just one more example of how corporations have more rights these days than citizens.
why dont the bloggers get together and help katie.com out and do a google bomb? ;)
Ever-popular? Which other book authors have done this? I must not keep up too well.
"Who are in control, they are not in control of anything - they don't even control themselves!" - Glen Beck
If the legal system worked she wouldn't need to be stressed - she shouldn't need to hire a lawyer, she should just spend 10 minutes with free legal counsel and then sit back and watch these people fail because they have no legal standing what-so-ever. What happens next? Does the rapist demand the name because he fucked someone called "Katie"? Or does she get jail? In this legal system anything could happen if you have a good lawyer.
This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.
the bloggers should do a google bomb :D
Get a competing publishing company to sell their books at the site. Thus the more successful Penquin is at driving "their" traffic to the site, the more money a competitor makes!
Heck, the books could still all be "appropriate", as in topical self-help, etc., targeting young girls.
Then tack on a fashion/clothing/makeup storefront too!
... I plan to write about the Linux IP wars - the lawsuits, the issues, the politics, you name it. I'm going to title it "Sco.com".
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnIn quiry.asp?userid=9c4iVli9ho&isbn=0452282535&it m=1
make sure you write bad reviews here too. don't limit them to amazon.
Sooo.. They write a book about getting exploited online, then use that book to exploit someone else online. Sorry, no.
There is a photo of the rapacious "cyberlawyer" on this page of her blog. Underneath the thumbnail it says "View full size". I declined to do so because my monitor is only 1024x768.
But Katie Jones got their first. Its hers. The book should be retitled with an apology inserted into the first few pages of future printings.
Man if this is settled correctly it'll be a big jump for internet copyright protection. But other then that it just pisses me off!
You do realize, of course, that posting Penguin's email addresses on a popular website such as Slashdot is CRAZY! Lots of spam spiders crawl Slashdot all the time, and they are likely to get spa...
oh. Right. -J
I was told that I could listen to the radio at a reasonable volume from nine to eleven...
Maybe we should give'em a clue?
the victim becomes the abuser, in the name of shameless profiteering. very, very sad.
if katie t. disapproved of penguin's actions, she should say so. her complete silence on the matter speaks volumes about her and her intentions.
Managing cybercrime, privacy and cyber-abuse risks.. She's kidding...right? Parry Aftab, The Angel of the Internet (Angel of steal your domain from you maybe)
Her name is Perry Aftab. Do what you will.
Turns out that the administrative contact information for KATIET.COM is bogus, at least the email portion.
Administrative Contact, Technical Contact:
TARBOX, KATIE (KT6079) agidore26@aol.com
745 CARTER ST
NEW CANAAN, CT 06840-5024
US
203 966 1828
I tried to send an email to that address to ask if she would post her side of the story on her site somewhere and had it bounce back. Now I don't know how nsi deals with this sort of thing, but in the past, i've had registrars breath fire down my neck b/c I had old, outdated information in my whois records.
I'm currently submitting a service request with nsi but I'm not sure if this is the right channel to for this. Anyone else have any other contact information for submitting bogus whois information to nsi?
I agree. However there is a three day approval period for B&N reviews. I submitted mine, but I doubt it will be accepted.
Fucking-A, I'll do it...anonymously
TARBOX, KATIE (KATIET-DOM)
745 CARTER ST
NEW CANAAN, CT 06840-5024
US
Domain Name: KATIET.COM
Administrative Contact, Technical Contact:
TARBOX, KATIE (KT6079) agidore26@aol.com
745 CARTER ST
NEW CANAAN, CT 06840-5024
US
203 966 1828
Record expires on 22-Oct-2010.
Record created on 22-Oct-1999.
See Taubman sucks for a domain name dispute that was heavily documented. Hank Mishkoff fights off Taubman over an issue over "The Shops at Willow Bend". Has lots of good stuff on "safe distance", Lanham Act, Trademarks, etc.
He wins in the end but it's quite the battle.
Several musical and movie talents have done this, used courts to attempt to take control of domain names. Some like Juliaroberts.com (IIRC) were exploitive, but I've read of others who were just ordinary people who unfortunately happened to share a name with a whiney self-absorbed star.
Katie Jones should find a way to profit from all the free publicity her web site is receiving.
Why not just put up a porn site and start charging admission to the book readers that are trying to gain access?
I wonder how Penguin would react to that!.
That's a stock reply, I got it too.
It's also bullshit, as it's NOT PP pursuing this, it's Kathleen T. and her lawyer.
feh. stuff.
we're your 51st state, now, aren't we?
I called the Customer Service number and the lady had no idea what I was talking about. So I asked to speak with their lawyers and this is the info she gave me: Aurora LaZeglia (212) 366-2387. I'm not sure of her position, but she's a lawyer with Penguin. Call her and tell her how you disapprove of their tactics.
In an ironic twist, girl.com now appears to be parked: they could probably have it for free through WIPO :-).
I encourage you to email what you think to Tarbox
katie@katiet.com
and her Penguin Putnam mafia
customer.service@penguin.co.uk
(too bad I couldn't find any customer service email in u$a)
Why don't you also post a review that this self-promoting piece of crap deserves at Amazon.com book review
Don't forget to give feedback here as well.
It's sad that Tarbox's early exploitation defined her career so early. She might be exploiting herself with books and websites about her violation, but it's more likely that she's now become a completely willing victim of lawyers and publishers who pimp her out as a tiny cottage industry. At least the centrality of Penguin Putnam, and their arborcide products, in this sleazy story shows that the Internet is at worst an innocent bystander in this travesty.
--
make install -not war
Do what you will.
Would it be legal for Katie Jones to turn her site into a parody site? She could pretend to be the Katie from the book and "confess" that the whole story is just a hoax, or maybe place a false advertisement describing the book as a "How-To" story written by a 41-year-old man who lured a 13-year-old girl to his hotel room using an online chat site.... Given that Penguin has retained a top-rated constitutional lawyer to defend their misuse of the domain name and have millions of dollars to spend on questionable tactics to get Katie Jones to abandon the domain, I don't think there's any point in keeping the moral high ground in this case.
Penguin probably monitors the web and book sites and will quickly write up some of its own reviews. They'll probably also enlist others to rate the reviews. Many publishers do this, in order to promote their wares or to balance negative reviews. If Penguin is savvy, it will also seek out blogs and post responses. Dairy Queen is doing this in response to the Moolatte/mulatto debate.
-- SYS 64738 --
Thanks to everyone who's voiced their support on this issue. I'm a bit overwhelmed by the volume of responses and the server is a bit overwhelmed by the traffic :)
I have to confess I'm not overly optimistic that Katie Tarbox will ever accept responsibility for what she's putting me through or attempt to make amends in any way.
I do hope, however, that public opinion will encourage the author and co. to back off and stop using what doesn't belong to them.
the domain "katie.com" was not registered (emphasis mine)
not to lend credibility to the lawsuit or it's legitimacy but people who want personal pages that are not for commercial use should be using the .us TLD (if you live in the USA or your respective country TLD). .com is for commercial entities.
Now using this same arguement, the publisher should not be trying to register or suing for the use of a domain that does not represent a commercial entity either. That is what "sub-domains" are for, ie: they should simple put it at katie.publisher-domain.com or www.publisher-domain.com/katie/
There is no reason for a book, movie, song or other published media getting to have it's own domain... it eats up space, confuses people, and basically turns the internet into a dirty database. What happens when someone wants to start a company named Katie?
Of course this crosses into the question of whether companies get to have the same name, not a problem... companies come and go, they make money and lose money they file and settle and dispute lawsuits around the rights of the company to use namespaces and have been doing so since the beginning of commerce... we have an established tradition here and a structured system in place to deal with it that everyone understands going into it. You want your company to get famous with a branded name... you'll have to fight for it, if you lose you can pick a new name and try your luck with that one, if your business is any good it will succeed despite the name.
A fool throws a stone into a well and a thousand sages can not remove it.
A better example would be Air Canada's failed attempt to force the owners of zip.com to give up their domain name when Air Canada introduced the Zip brand of economy airfare as a spin-off of the main-line airline business. It was yet another case of a company choosing a name and advertising it without checking first to see if the web address was available. Air Canada eventually gave up and stopped advertising zip.com (good thing, as the web site was redirecting people to the competition at WestJet) and registered 4321zip.com instead.
Umm, money (or the lack thereof in this case)? How would Katie Jones defend herself when the other Katie desides to sue her for libel? Even if KJ had tons of money she would still lose since it would, in fact, be libel. And it is MUCH easier to win a case of libel in the UK than in the US AFAIK.
Good Morning Parry,
It has come to my attention that your website, aftab.com, is the same name as a book that I am considering publishing. I would like for your free (consider it a donation) legal advice on how to resolve this issue. I would assume your belief is that the book title should take precedence over the website. As an example of this being your representation in the case Vs Katie Jones (http://www.katie.com). In this situation AFTAB stands for All For The American Bastards. It is about freedom, liberty, justice, doing what's RIGHT and standing up for what you believe in. There are many American bastards in history, some well known, some not so well known. This book aims to bring those bastards to the spotlight and make sure that everyone knows their names and why they are in the spotlight. I am concerned however that your recent negative publicity with katie.com. I am afraid that this will hurt the sales of my book. Could you please change the content on aftab.com to state that you are in no way affiliated with, have ANY ties, or share any views with All For American Bastards until this can be resolved at a later date? Your kind donation to our cause is greatly appreciated.
Sincerely,
Jack McCormick
An American Bastard who is simply making a request and voicing his freedom of speech.
P.S. How do you sleep at night? You may laugh at this, but if you do then I truly do feel pity for you. You are defined by your actions. Do the right thing, and only you know what that is.
Legal Disclaimer:
This email is intended to be educational in nature. It is about freedom of speech, justice, American bastards, and slashdotters (American and otherwise bastards). This document is not legally binding in any way, nor is this disclaimer for that matter. blah blah blah.
All you /.ers should take exception to this misuse of your favorite flightless bird.
Following katie.com's example, if I were Robert Spector and HarperBusiness (Harper Collins?) I'd go after Amazon.com. Wopieeeweeeeee!
"When it rains, it pours." --Morton's Salt
*********
Rob, we never tried to take katie.com, Katie Jones is doing all of this for publicity. We were always using katiesplace.org. I am also not Katie's lawyer or anyone's lawyer and Jone's knows that.
I donate 90% of my time to running a charity that protects people online. But replying only feeds Jone's hidden agenda here.
For that reason, I request that you not share this without my advance permission.
-----Original Message----- From: Rob Miles [mailto:rmiles@theskepticalreview.com] Sent: Thursday, August 05, 2004 2:42 PM To: parry@aftab.com Subject: Katie Jones and katie.com
Please stop your campaign to force Katie Jones to give up HER domain, katie.com. Even since the book by the came out, she has dealt with unwanted and unwarranted attention. Maybe this all started as a mistake or an oversight, but to plan to release additional material under that same name (as reported by Ms. Jones on 7/30/04) is certainly mean-spirited at this point.
As of 7/27/04 your site lists a new venture with Katie Tarbox named katiesplace.org. If this means that you have in fact given up on trying to force Ms. Jones to give up her rightful domain, then I apologize for the above and offer you my deepest appreciation.
***********
For the record, I consider any email sent to me to be my own property, regardless of any request or disclaimer saying otherwise.
I hope the EFF (of which I'm a member) gets on this case pronto...
I don't know if what you are saying is true, but assuming for the moment that it is. I think you MAY have a point. Certainly I don't think a 13 year old (well not most 13 year olds) are capable of making adult like decisions and ought to be treated that way by the law. OTOH 17 year old girls are a way different bunch. Many of them are sexually active and are engaged in other adult activities. This doesn't make molestation by a 40 year old man correct, espcially if he raped her (in the non-stautory sense). OTOH, if she would have been 18 then it all would have been legal?? That just doesn't make sense to me. And she bears some responsibility for this as well, as she was certainly old enough that she SHOULD have known better (at 17).
----- Question authority, but not ours. Hate the man, but we're not him.
we need pictures of both Katies, side by side. hottest one wins the domain.
i have seen katie TARBOX at her site already, so i think katie jones has a substantial head start.
From my extensive knowledge of publishing (10 years in the book trade), if an author has a bestseller, as Ms Tarbox does apparently she can get just about anything she wants. (Thus the decline in quality of most bestselling novelists as they get the power to tell their editors to shove it.) Pretty much like an A-list movie star.
All joking aside, the publisher should put aside their money for legal fees in this case, and just pay the domain owner whatever she wants. Yeah, she may have turned down several "high offers," but I assure you that none of them had the deep pockets of Penguin. Give the girl a nice advance, as well as a few points of the royalties if you want this domain THAT bad.
Hell, I totally agree with you.
;)
If these people are going to be asses and demand you turn over your domain beause they aren't creative enough to come up with a new name, you're going to get free advertising. With this comes value, and if you look, you'll find that SOMEONE will be interested in that traffic. I do like your idea, though
-matt
"I note with interest that your book was originally going to be titled "girl.com" and yet it was changed before publication to my domain name. Was this because girl.com is a pornography site? This shows, to me, an awareness on your part that naming the book after a domain name was significant. It's a shame you didn't consider the significance your actions would have to me."
One of my school's plays was called girl.com too! - it was something about a girl band making it big. A group of us looked it up one day and they changed it.. pitty, we really should have kept it to ourselves until after the first night!
The point is, they probably took one look at girl.com and thought "porn, lots of money, bad reputation", then took one look at katie.com and thought "single owner, small fry, we have more lawyers". What i dont understand is what legal standpoint Penguin has? how could a lawyer even take up the case? They must have something? It makes no sense if they dont!
This comment does not represent the views or opinions of the user.
Having done that, she shouldn't threaten Penguin or ask them for anything...but on their own Penguin would probably figure out how much the problem was worth to them, and offer her a nice large check for her domain site.
"Two million dollars? Well...I guess I could let katie.com go....if you double that offer!"
Just go to the local courthouse and file a lawsuit against the book maker and the author for harassment and whatever else fits the bill.
Steve's Computer Service, Hobbs, NM
"KatiesPlace.org the new joint project of Katie Tarbox, Parry and WiredSafety"
Looks like Parry had a business interest in getting katie.com. Looks like they've given up.
God I'm tired of this.. Katie T is nothing but a greedy selfimportant bitch.
She was NOT raped. She did go and meet a sleezy guy who turned out to be a lot older than she expected... But she did this when she was 17.. not 13 as all the press material implies. Additionally, she wasn't raped at all... Her mom and coach walked in on them while they were kissing and feeling each other up.
He was eventually charged with crossing state lines with the intention of having sex with a minor.. he was also charged with some bogus CDA seducing a minor over the internet charge. The CDA was overturned later that year.
The only victim here is katie.com
If the problem remains unresolved (and the domain unusable for the original purpose) maybe selling katie.com to a porn company would be a good way to get both some remuneration for the trouble and some one-upmanship at Penguin and Katie Tarbox. I'm guessing that domain might be hot property by now.
...now, if only someone would make a book or a movie out of one of MY domains :/
Precisely,
Between a) "Give us your domain now!" and b) "We'll give you $xx,xxx for your domain" I think I'd tend to be more receptive to party B.
I'll leave the Profit! jokes to you. And for once they'd be applicable!
-matt
Email and work extension for Helena Kennedy, Penguin UKs head of legal can be found here I have a lot of respect for her - since Penguin UK stood up to David Irving - so I don't know how much she's responsible for this. A bit of polite pressure could do some good.
And an RSS feed.
Everyone restart your browser at the top of the hour ;-)
One man's -1 Flamebait is another man's +5 Funny.
Although all her PR crap makes it sound like she was 13.. She wasn't.. they started talking when she was 13.. Met to shack up when she was 17.. But never got as far as the consentual sex (which would have been legal in Texas and her home state), because people walked in on them... Since then she's produced this victim story to save her image.
The weirdo DID get convicted.. for crossing state lines to have sex with a minor. The conviction was only possible because the age of consent in his home state (california) is 18. Had he lived in Florida no crime would have been comitted.
I don't know where you get the idea that ANYONE is "silencing criticism" here in the US. There seems to be plenty of criticising going on here. So I don't know where this whole McCarthy bit comes from, it just makes you sound silly.
----- Question authority, but not ours. Hate the man, but we're not him.
KatieT (at the age of 17) got caught kissing a man she'd been talking to over the internet for almost 4 years by her coach and mom. No sex happened. These are undisputed facts.
::shrugs::
KatieT's melodrama and the ruin she made of some weirdo's life are another matter entirely.
Perhaps Katie Jones can sue for being made out to be a whiny self important bitch.
If you're going to write a book about internet victimization and possibly how to protect yourself, wouldn't Step 1 include not publishing your personal information? A quick whois on the book author's website reveals:
.
Registrant:
TARBOX, KATIE (KATIET-DOM)
XXX XXXXXX ST
NEW CANAAN, CT XXXX-XXXX
US
Domain Name: KATIET.COM
Administrative Contact, Technical Contact:
TARBOX, KATIE (KT6079) XXXXXXXX@aol.com
XXX XXXXX ST
NEW CANAAN, CT XXXXX-XXXX
US
XXX XXX XXXX
Record expires on 22-Oct-2010.
Record created on 22-Oct-1999.
Database last updated on 5-Aug-2004 15:15:55 EDT.
Yeah, I XXXed out some of the information there, including her street address, phone number and AOL email address.
Anyhow, yeah, its sad this chick got abused. Yeah, its also great she's spoken out about it, good for her in writing the book. Shame on her though for this legal bullshit. She should take control of this situation and get all the pressue off the owner of katie.com
Not only was she 17 at the time they met but they didn't have sex. They had started making out.. kissing and feeling.. and her coach walked in on them.
Frankly I think the whole victim thing is just a covert to protect her 'honor' and a lame attempt to cash in on the fear of internet predators.
The weirdo was prosicuted.. Under the CDA (which was later tossed as unconstutional) and for crossing state lines to have sex with a minor for which he was convicted (well that was his intention!)
I have written letters both to katiet and the lawyer mentioned on katie.com. Here are the responces:
From ktarbox261@aol.com
I appreciate your thoughts and understand them completely. It is
not posted on my web site, but this issue is between Katie Jones and
Penguin Putnam. They own the name Katie.com as a published book and
decided to call it that. I can do nothing in my power to change it. I
would suggest if you would like your voice to be heard and a chance that
something is done about it, direct your sympathy to Penguin Putnam. For
the record I have never harassed Katie Jones for her site.
Best, Katie Tarbox
from Parry Aftab parry@aftab.com
am not anyone's lawyer and no legal actions are being taken. I protect people online, as an unpaid volunteer. No one wants to "take" katie.com. Jones is doing this for the publicity, and unfortunately, it's working. L
Sorry that you and so many others have been mislead.
Parry
You have to be pretty naive to believe anyone is really who they are on the Internet that you haven't met before. Even MORE naive to meet someone you've never met for the first time at a motel. Common sense, some people lack it.
just fine. No lag at all. Must have a great host.
I guess she doesn't care because it's "not her" getting screwed this time.
Even though what she is doing is wrong I still think this kind of comment is completely inappropriate...
Book titles can't be coyprighted and are pretty hard to trademark.
.com names that goes against her. However, I don't know how it applies in the USA.
It's pretty hard to get a trademark on a common name like "Katie" and the USPTO made a specific ruling several years ago that adding ".com" to a generic term did not turn it into a unique coined term that could be made into a broad trademark.
Trademarks have to be specific. You can trademark your name, but only in a specific field of business that you are acting in. Two people can own the same trademark in two different fields. Delta Airlines and Delta Hotels, for
example. Penguin books and Penguin computing.
Now normally, KJ has one big leg up. The normal test for trademark infringement is "is the public being confused?" And they clearly are. But there was that very specific ruling from the US trademark office about
Book titles are a special case. Two people can use the very same book title! My father wrote a novel "Act of God" and there are several novels by that name, all legit.
Unfortunately, the push on Penguin to "do the right thing" doesn't seem to be working.
Has it been over a year since you last donated to the Electronic Frontier Foundation
No, just redirect to goat.cx, the mirror of goatse.cx! Then everyone who goes there can be scarred for life... That'll teach 'em.
i think she has a shot in courts regardless of trademark laws.
imagine i write a book called '10 downing street' which is about a brothel set at 10 downing street. tony blair does not own the trademark of downing street but i bet the court would recognize he has some rights over the place. and for sure i could not clame blair should move out and let me move in.
Dev elpizw tipota, dev phoboumai tipota eimai lephteros http://euclidian.org
Trademark or copyright? It is copyright protection, I don't get a trademark on Badbunny Productions just because I use it do I?
She says in her response that it's out of her control and that it's not posted on her web site, my only question is "Why not?"
If she doesn't agree with what Penguin's lawyers (or her own) are doing on her behalf but doesn't have the power to stop them she at least should have the power to make her view of the situation clear.
fencepost
just a little off
I've gotten the impression that selling, attempting to sell, or even expressing anything other than "The domain is not for sale" in response to an offer would have the potential to seriously hurt any legal case or WIPO case she might be involved in.
On the other hand, if she wanted to she *might* be able to get away with running her own porn site at that address - as long as she owned it, she'd probably be fine. Of course her lawyer might have a different take on it, she might have no interest in or be opposed to running a porn site, and the fact that she's in the UK might have an effect (what are UK porn laws like?).
fencepost
just a little off
is ktarbox261@aol.com, according to the paypal button on the katiet.com site. Perhaps we all should drop her an email there and let her know what we think about the situation...
'You see, there is a difference between a joke, blaming the victim and saying the victim might have prevented the crime (you lock your doors don't you?). The parent in a joke, so LEAVE OUR BLACK HUMOR alone. I don't blame victims and don't know enough about the particular crime to speak about the last one.
I'm well aware that it was a joke. And make no mistake, I'm a huge fan of the dark humor myself. But this one was quite malicious and in extremely poor taste. It quite simply crossed the line and went too far.
By all means, keep up the off-color commentary. But you still need to know when your joke becomes inappropriate.
--LordPixie
Together we can take the slashdot effect to her cell phone!
---
At this time, there are 256 reviews at Amazon. Let's bring it up to 65536!
- Grab a really raunchy hardcore barely-18 video box back cover image off the 'net, and photoshop Katie Tarbox's name into the credits. For bonus points, add her lawyer's name and lawyer's picture.
- Post a link to it on Slashdot when finished.
- PROFIT!
Just think, this could become the next Goat.cx man, Tubgirl, or Rusty's Wife type of image, fame-wise anyway...Honestly, that's the best Idea I've heard yet.
She should sell it to a porn site about a midget named katie.... That does all SORTS of wild things.
That's just scary.
300 1 star reviews down to less than 1 hundred now
Why not contact the lawyer. I emailed here, but haven't gotten any response yet.
She claims to be a lawyer fighting for people's privacy and against abuse on the Internet. Yet she invades Katie Jones' privacy and sends her abusive letters. Great.
Is to put a revolting porn picture on the site to force the publisher to distance themselves.
Hi Guys,
I was following this story earlier on today and was happy with how the reviews were going. Last checked it was at 209 Reviews and 2 stars overall.
NOW ALL THE REVIEWS ARE GONE. It's back down to 84 Reviews 4 stars overall!
What's going on! Is Amazon removing those reviews!?!
PENQUIN'S EVIL PLAN
1. Take advantage of a young girl who's been taken advantaged of.
2. Take advantage of a young girl (katie.com) who hasn't been taken advantage of.
3. Take advantage of the public.
4. Have a posting on Slashdot.org
5. Sit back and enjoy the funny postings on slashdot.org.
Penquin's plan to take over the world is working!
1) It is the name of the book and can be used to promote the book.
2) It is the URL easiest to type in a webbrowser.
Nothing else matters to Penguin
My advice to the original owner of katie.com is to have registrar lock enabled and make sure their domain fees are paid up for the next few years or so so 'dirty tricks' aren't used to steal the domain away from her like what happened in the (in)famous sex.com case....
You get a trademark automatically, and it receives protection without registration. What registration buys you is the assumption that the mark is valid in court. Without registration the other side can challenge the mark and make you prove that you own it, used it in commerce, etc.
On that note, if anyone wants to email the lawyer directly, KatieJ publishes the name and address on her "How can I help" page.
The address for Parry Aftab (her lawyer) is parry@aftab.com.
Ironically, Parry Aftab describes herself as "one of the leading experts worldwide on cyber-crime, Internet privacy and cyber-abuse issues.
This lawyer is ironically the founder and president of an online safety organization called wiredsafety.org which helps victims of harassment.
I've personally contacted the EFF (www.eff.org) and chillingeffects.org. I suggest others do so as well. Let's help Katie Jones!
My confidence in Amazon.com reader reviews has evaporated!
I clicked on the link to see what had happened with the reviews, and average * rating had gone to nearly 2 stars, with nearly 300 reviews.
This was due to the slashdot effect on amazon.
(Not that I am sure the slashdot effect is fair either)
However, as I was clicking for the next pages on reviews of this book, I noticed the number of reviews were steadily decreasing.
It went from 287 to 100+ to 87 to 85 to 80 just right now.
The average star rating is now nearly 4 stars.
Someone is removing the reviews.
Who is doing this? Amazon? the author? possibly the publisher?
$ whois katiethebook.com
.com and .net domains can now be registered with many different competing registrars. Go to http://www.internic.net for detailed information.
Whois Server Version 1.3
Domain names in the
No match for "KATIETHEBOOK.COM".
Amazon.com has removed all 300+ reviews that were put up yesterday and today!!!
If a book is copyrightten, regardless of trademarking the title, the title is copywritten along with the content therein.
Not true.
Copyright applies to the content but NOT the title, which can be reused (unless trademarked).
If I understand this correctly, it can be reused even in the same genre.
Witness _Bladerunner_ -the science fiction movie made from the book _Do Androids Dream of Electric Sheep_. The novel and had no relation whatsoever to the science fiction novel by Alan E. Nourse titled _Bladerunner_. (Electric Sheep and the B. movie didn't even have any relation to running blades, unlike the original Nourse novel which was used banned surgical procedures and the infrastructure necessary to get scalpels into illegal surgeon's hands as an illustration of potential flaws in eugenics law schemes.)
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
How does it get from 238 reviews average 2 stars down to 80 reviews, average 3 and 1/2 stars.
I wonder if penguin made amazon remove the reviews...
No kidding.
.de and .com domains, registered them. Few years later, I got contacted by an obscure company that also carries the same name. They sell building material and claimed that my homepage - offering IT services as a freelancer - infringed their trademark on building material.
.com domain, but they only paid my legal expenses and I made no financial gain from it (too bad).
Here in Germany I HAVE registered my first name as a trademark for IT services.
Story behind it: I have a rare German first name and when I discovered that noone owned my name's
It was a shaky case, but still, I had a computer science degree to focus on and didn't really want to engage in a legal battle. I settled with the company's owner and we later agreed to give them the
After that experience four years ago, I had my name listed as a trademark for IT services at the German trademark registry. It will be valid for the next six years.
While the link in the parent post is getting a lot of moderation done, there are pleny more at Amazon.com that people need to write reviews for, and mod up:
US: Amazon.com, Amazon.com
CA: Amazon.ca, Amazon.ca, Amazon.ca, Amazon.ca
UK: Amazon.co.uk, Amazon.co.uk, Amazon.co.uk, Amazon.co.uk, Amazon.co.uk, Amazon.co.uk, Amazon.co.uk
I havent read the book, but that never stops someone from making a comment.
I feel bad for Ms Tarbox'x ordeal, but, she is now victimizing another young woman. I'm betting that her "brand" will eventually win, I hope it doesnt. I would also hope that Ms Tarbox is doing everything for purely altruistic reasons and not profiting from any of this. Karma can be a bish
It is better to be the hammer than the anvil.
Al Roker did a special report featuring Katie last week, and also interviewed the head moron from Perverted Justice.
Hi all,
3 .html)
I've read the article and I think I can add a couple of things that haven't been added yet.
Knowing the publishing world as I do (I've got two books out, and plenty of friends who are authors), it seems to me that what may have happened on Penguin Putnam's side was that just before publication it was discovered that the original title linked to a XXX site. Books usually have to go into production a couple of months before release, and if it was close enough to the publication date, somebody in a rush may have figured that "katie.com" was innocuous enough and may not even have been in use. In that case, it is an honest mistake. As far as intellectual property goes, there actually isn't a violation on either side - unless the book directly mirrors the website or vice versa, neither can really complain on that end.
(It's rather like naming a character "Elric" in a story. Anybody can do it, but if the character is an albino from an island named Melnibone, that's when you get sued by Michael Moorcock. To cut a long story short, you can't copyright a name.)
As far as what Ms. Tarbox's lawyer is asking, it's intimidation, plain and simple. I very much doubt that Penguin is involved, though (partly because if they really wanted the domain name, they would go after it directly - they aren't a monopoly, and they don't need to use proxies).
The reason it's intimidation being used is that there really isn't anything Ms. Tarbox's lawyer can actually do to take the domain name away from Katie Jones. In order to dispute the name, the lawyer would have to take the dispute to the World Intellectual Property Organization (WIPO), and than she would have to prove that Kate Jones registered the domain in bad faith (essentially, that she specifically registered the name so that she could sell it to Penguin after the book was published). However, since the domain name was registered before the book was retitled (and years before, in fact) the case would be extremely difficult to prove.
(I'm not a lawyer, but I covered this in an article I wrote back in 2001 that is located at http://www.tophosts.com/articles/print.shtml?1000
I really do sympathize with Ms. Jones, and I hope that public opinion will effect a change that will get Ms. Tarbox's lawyer off her case. It really is sad when intimidation like this is used.
Robert B. Marks
Author, Demonsbane in Diablo Archive
Interestingly, one of the points making it difficult to enforce a common law trademark (and I presume this also applies to service marks) is that it is difficult for a potential infringer to determine, in the absense of registration, that the mark is already in use.
This is NOT an issue for second-level domain name (such as katie.com) as trademark. Domain names are all registered in a tirvial-to-check central database.
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
And here is a link to Pary's mug shot.
Yikes.
You can't handle the truth.
Ms. Tarbox seems to be taking the "I was a victim once so I *must* be percieved as the victim now." approach.
that was a fucking good post.
just need some kind of anthem behind it, aseven I wanted to kick some tarbox ass, after that.
I think we may have caused the Amazon book review function to crash... (or maybe they've started censoring!)
oh Jennie...errr Katie...
-----
He was charged with the federal crime of crossing state lines for get it on with a minor.. and the CDA (which was overturned as all slashdotters know)..
... cept he was from California where the age of consent is 18. (that law is setup so if it's legal source and dest state then it's okay)
He went to jail for 18months and has been barred from continuing his job selling securities.
The federal crossing-state-lines-to-get-it-on-with-a-minor charge wouldn't have even held
Based on the wild shift in rating (from 1.5 or 2 to 3.5) and the reduction in total reviews, it seems like Amazon has deleted some of the Slashdot-inspired reviews.
Well I did, and here is what I found. Tell this ugly, sniveling little apathetic moron what you think.
TARBOX, KATIE **
(KT6079)
745 CARTER ST
NEW CANAAN, CT 06840-5024
US
Phone: 203 966 1828
Amazon is pulling all the one-star reviews. :(
There were over 200 this morning.. now there are about 80.
You filled Dr. Hathaway's house with popcorn, but all you're doing to Penguin is writing a complaint letter?
:-)
Man, you used to be cool!
go look. used to be more than 200, now there are only 80 or so. all the ones i looked at were 4 or 5-star ones.
i'm vaguely disgusted, but not surprised
I went to the Amzon.com page for this book about an hour ago to chime in on the books marketing strategy.
Just as I expected HUNDREDS of posts dated today were coming in from Slashdot members giving the book a "one star" review, and for the most part, airing legitimate concerens with the marketing and books publisher. Some of these reviews were well written and not just angry flames toward the publisher (so many negative reviews were writeen that the books overall rating went down to 2 stars).
I just went back a few minutes ago and saw that Amazon has DELETED all the posts from the past few days (the newest review, a positive one, is dated August 2, 2004).
I'm not sure how to feel about this...part of me says: "Maybe the way Amazon is looking at it is: These comments are about the publisher, not the book itself, so we are going to delete them.", but ANOTHER part of me says "I smell a rat here, I bet that Penguin is pressuring Amazon to censor reviews to protect their allmighty bottom line".
Either way....this is going to be messy.
So Penguin was unwilling to promote girl.com as the title of the book because girl.com is a pr0n site, right?
So if Katie Jones wants Penguin to leave her alone, maybe she should just post some pr0n.
Or, better yet, tell Penguin that unless they buy the site from her for $$$, she'll sell it for same $$$ to a pr0n company.
"It sure was strange to see something on Usenet about me that didn't involve Klingon gang rape." -- Wil Wheaton
For infringing on my rights as author and publisher of the book "165.193.128.72".
Sounds like that little bitch got what she deserved.
Too bad she lived.
Mind you I have not read the book..
nor will I.. but..
Seems to me based on the definition of rape:
http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=rape
So Katie T is attempting to rape Katie J..
I guess she doesn't care because it's "not her" getting screwed this time.
Even though what she is doing is wrong I still think this kind of comment is completely inappropriate...
Well that's you.
Personally I don't see how being raped or whatever (and it was most likely her own fault to begin with) gives her the right to make other people's lives miserable. Victim my ass.
Does anyone know how to get a story like this posted somewhere non-geekly like Salon or another news site. That way there'd be no chance of deletion or censorship. Amazon only has a review section for the book, so perhaps they think it's the wrong venue for diatribes against the bullying tactics of the publisher. The right place to make this information known just needs to be found.
According to NSI Whois:
TARBOX, KATIE **
(KT6079)
agidore26@aol.com
745 CARTER ST
NEW CANAAN, CT 06840-5024
US
Phone: 203 966 1828
I was thinking one might be able to create a shill business named 'katieT.com', trademark the name, then use their own logic against them with the katiet.com domain. That is of course unless they've already trademarked 'katieT.com'.
Does it bother anyone else that amazon.com has removed the unfavorable comments on the book left by people today? I know who wont be getting my money in the future.
If you'd take 10 seconds to read ANYTHING, you'd realize the site is not typically a blog, but the main content was replaced with an MT blog because it is lower bandwidth.
Lack of due diligence. Not to mention giving the publisher a *huge* PR black eye.
DNA is a Turing machine. You, however, being dynamic and emergent, are not.
I wonder about this. I admittedly didn't read all 900 comments (so this could be redundant), but could Peguin be held criminally responsible for a DDOS attack? They had to know full well publishing a book with a domain name as the title would result in tremendous traffic to the site. Indeed, the publicity would render the site useless for its intended purpose. And even if you can't prove malicious intent, you should be able to get gross negligence. It would only be negligence, if not for the fact that they changed the title based on the site content of girl.com, meaning they knew full well what would happen, which is gross negligence at the minimum, and decent proof of intent. I wonder if the UK equivilant of a general prosecutor would be willing to step up and file criminal charges against Penguin for a Denial if Service. Just a thought, and IANAL, so I could be way off base.
WWJD?
JWRTFM!
I sent a mail asking that she clarify the boiler-plate response slightly, since it left some things ambiguous. I've just got this reply (fast response!):
==
Paul,
Thank you for your letter. Parry Aftab is not my lawyer and that is something that is not vague. Penguin and I have also worked very hard and I think this will come to end by the morning. I will say that much.
Best, Katie Tarbox
==
It appears that Katie Tarbox is represented by the Lordly & Dame talent agency. I wonder what they think about recent exploits of Katie Tarbox and her lawyer?
I'd like to see somebody try to steal my domain name. I know damned well my lawyer can beat up their lawyer.
Let the big guys then fight each other over it.
My guess is she's probably sipping mint julips under the cottonwoods enjoying here $$$$ from the book and doesn't give a rats ass about being part of a legal predator's actions.
At least you labeled it as a guess. It is, of course, nothing more than that. In the absence of any reason to assume that Katie Tarbox has acted maliciously, such comments are, to say the least, less than constructive. (They are, to say the most, potentially libelous, but IANAL.)
So how about we tell Barnes and Noble, Amazon, Borders et al that they can stop selling this book, or we stop buying lots of nice pricey tech books?
It would be sweet, passive way to get a little cash while still keeping the moral high ground.
I am billdar, and I approve this message.
The aggressive lawyer, Parry Aftab, appears to be the executive director of an organization called wiredsafety.org.
They have a whole section on filing internet abuse (html form, most likely to a formmail program). One form of reportable abuse is Identity Theft, how ironic would it be if they got a lot of reports of the identity theft as it relates to the katie.com high-jacking?
Lawyer's Cell: 201-463-8663
The lawyer is the one who is harrassing the site owner. Give her a call or two.
What else can I say.
Both Katies are being made victims (how ironic) by the lawyers, who are acting like stereotypes rather than human beings. Katie2.com may be the story of an innocent girl being victimised by lawyers over the Internet.
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Penguin says that Katie Jones never trademarked "katie.com". Is it too late for her to do so now? If not, how much would it cost? (With all the publicity, I suspect the fees wouldn't be a problem.)
I remember going through and seeing a ton of negative reviews; now they seem to be all gone.
What happened?
Take a look at http://www.katiet.com/guestbook/ It has what looks like guesbook entries for the past few years, and people have been saying what a lot of us are saying to her now for years. Hopeless cause?
KatieT's lawyer, Parry Aftab, is certainly not lacking in ego - there is a section on her website where she revels in the title "Angel of the Internet":
For the amount of time and personal sacrifice Parry has devoted to making sure that everyone, especially children, can learn to use the Internet safely, privately and responsibly, Parry is often called the "Angel of the Internet." (emphasis added)
She is obviously aware of the problems they are causing, as referenced in her blog entry titled Katie Tarbox and Katie.com (the book, not the site) - Monday, July 26, 2004.
One can only gues that KatieT is making as much of this opportunity as she can - after all, she is unlikely to publish any other books of significance making basic editing mistakes on the front page of her website:
As an advocate and expert in this field, I realize that the dangers that lye on the Internet will continue to exist unless we as a collective make the effort to prevent those dangers. (emphasis added)
Shame on KatieT for harrassing the rightful domain owner - I hope she realises that it will undermine what she hopes to achieve in the long term.
Sara
Designer, Gamer, Macgrrl in an XP World
Apparently slashdot's campaign has been noticed and dealt with. No new negative reviews are making it up.
Despite the notices that she's sending out claiming *shocked just shocked* ignorance in all of this, if Katie Tarbox tells her laywers and Putnam to cease and desist in the attempt the steal the domain name, they have to do it, at least in the case of the lawyer. So she maintains some responsiblity in all of this. The past crimes against her do not let her off the hook for her unethical behavior now, nor that of her lawyers.
Thanks, Parry, for reminding me why I dislike lawyers so much. You're really keeping up your profession's reputation.
Life is hard, and the world is cruel
In the case of BladeRunner, Ridley Scott paid for the rigts to use Nourse's title.
u nnern ner-faq/
See, for eample:
http://www.wordiq.com/definition/Blade_R
or
http://www.faqs.org/faqs/movies/bladeru
Marvel has teamed up with the now-infamous Parry Aftab to create a superhero themed website fighting cyber abuse. Marvel needs to hear from the public about Aftab's grab for Katie.com.
http://www.internetsuperheroes.org/index.html
Life is hard, and the world is cruel
The justice in that is beyond reproach. (-:
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Got time? Spend some of it coding or testing
Isn't Amazon's pulling of the reviews potential grounds for a consumer misinformation suit. I mean as long as everyone is suing how about a class action against Amazon for intentionally misleading potential customers?
If they pulled them here, where else have they done the same?
It sounds like a very unfortunate situation. In particular, the Register article says that Penguin (the book publisher) knew that katie.com was registered by someone else. In this case, they likely should have given the book a different name. Perhaps they could have registered a new domain and set up a Web site related to the book. Basically, it was probably not a good idea to name the book for a Web domain that they had not registered. It might even be a good idea for the book to be rereleased with a new name (plus an explanation.) For Katie T, it would not hurt to try and de-emphasize if possible the use of the "Katie.com" name for TV shows, etc. related to her story. Does Penguin (the publisher) have any right to take the domain from Katie Jones? This would probably be true only if katie.com was a trademark of theirs. There have been cases where someone registers a domain without realizing that it is a trademark. In this case it sounds like Katie Jones came along first. However, it is a different situation where someone registers a domain and then later someone else tries to establish the name of the domain as a trademark. There is a very good chance that Katie Jones (not Katie T) is entitled to the katie.com domain and the name of the katie.com story should ideally be changed (although that could be difficult.)
Katie's book is read by peadophiles. No question. Some because they get a sick pleasure out of it, others because they want to seek help but are too messed up. Probably other reasons too.
When the book was published, www.katie.com featured pictures of Katie Jones' children and details of where Katie Jones worked.
Just how hard would it be for one of Katie T's peadophile readers to get close to Katie J's children with that information? Caring about child safety online? Don't make me laugh.
I just knew it.
I got EXACTLY the same reply, word-for-word. And my email she was replying to was not neeeaaar as polite as yours! I doubt she's even reaing them. Probably using an auto-responder.
Instead of just symbolic gestures of support, we need a united Slashdot vigilante internet justice effort. Anybody willing to code such a program/webpage?
Nonono, a gay porn site. like hotmale .com.
An especially annoying one.
Just because you care.
Even better, someone who has read the book should just post the ending. BTW, how does it end?
If Katie T really has anything to do with this fiasco? My money says that the publisher is the ass-hat with the big stick, and they're acting "in the best interest of their client." Never mind that those same actions parrallel the lining of the publisher's pockets.
Howdy.
In alt.activism.children the only person whose taste buds are dead enough
to permit him to perform oral sex on Mike Echols, alexplore, writes:
> When the conversation was with 13-year-old Katherine Tarbox of
> New Canaan, Conn., the subject was piano playing, one of young
> Katie's passions.
You know, we all heard this touching tale when Parry Aftab was flogging
the book to death. It's 100% Sex Abuse Agenda embellished tripe.
> Katie, who was staying with her mother, Andrea, and her teammates
> in the same hotel as Kufrovich, went to his room at about 9:30
> p.m. Her worried mother squeezed the details from one of Katie's
> friend, and rushed to Kufrovich's room with police - but not
> before the pedophile had a chance to kiss and fondle her.
In reality, when the police entered the room, both Katie and her network
acquaintance said "nothing had happened." The guy was allowed to leave
with no charges being filed.
Later, after being programmed to think of herself as a victim, she filed a
complaint, and decided to become a media darling, write a book, meet Parry
Aftab, and function as the poster child for Internet luring.
Hey, why turn down a lucrative career opportunity, right?
They also managed to get the FBI involved, and charge her "predator" with
a couple of those vague new "intending to" and "traveling for the purpose
of" laws. He got 18 months.
To make matters worse, Katie titled her sob story "Katie.com." Well, the
20 year old owner of www.katie.com, who lives in London, was less than
amused when she started getting millions of hits from the Child Sex
Hysterics.
And so it goes.
She has a friggin AUTORESPONDER answering now. Your emails are probably going right into the bin.
I've seen this reply pasted a few times now:
"I appreciate your thoughts and understand them completely. It is not posted on my web site, but this issue is between Katie Jones and Penguin Putnam. They own the name Katie.com as a published book and decided to call it that. I can do nothing in my power to change it. I would suggest if you would like your voice to be heard and a chance that something is done about it, direct your sympathy to Penguin Putnam. For the record I have never harassed Katie Jones for her site.
Best, Katie Tarbox "
It's identical everywhere.
Can we say, autoresponder?
Why would she comment on this anyway? You know how emails can be used in pending litigations.
BTW, how does it end?
Katie swallows.
Please apply this patch to the above:
Katie, Katie who can I turn to
We want you to give us something you want to hold on to
I know you think we're like the others before
- Who saw your info in the WHOIS database
+ Who choose who's 'WHOIS' they got to ignore
Innocent people shouldn't be forced to pay for inferior software development.
--"Code Complete" Microsoft Press
Katie.com, as a sole proprietorship, should sue this hijacker for usage of a trademark. In the U.S., at least, using a trademark in business use makes it a de facto trademark, and so Katie.com probably has a valid counter-claim and could conceivably claim a percentage of the royalties (I'd start with all of them, and negotiate from there) of the book, TV program, and curricula.
Many attorneys in the U.S. work on a contingency basis, but if possible, sue in the UK on the grounds that that is where your business is based. Simultaneously, find an attorney in the US in the county that Penguin Books and/or Katie X is located in, as they will try to change the venue of your suit to throw you off and make it hard for you to sue them from overseas. Sue for the entire amount.
You've done a good job standing up to these clowns. Hit them back, hard.
MOD PARENT UP!!
What's wrong with using http://members.webs.net/pages/k/a/t/katy/index.htm for a book title? :-)
I think that this is censorship. Or Penguin books pulled their strings and forced amazon to take negative comments down.
(Spaces added by me; the site's running off my dialup connection, and i'm just being conservative.)
Does this give me the right to sue for timgarrison.com, considering that IS my real name? Who cares if the book was titled the same as someone else's domain name. What about all these books that use "eBay" or "Google" in their titles? I really doubt many of the automotive repair manuals that you see on the market have gotten permission from the automotive manufacturers to use their brand in the title of the manual. I'm sure the major ones did, such as Chiltons and Haynes, but there's many others out there. Taking this a step further, what if I write a book called "PHP: A step-by-step guide to web development", is Rasmus Lerdorf going to sue me because I'm using the name of his project in my book title? This world is nothing but a vicious cycle of careless lawsuits.
Okay, then. To start with:h tml?id=0452282535 or better yet, use the Search function on that site http://us.penguingroup.com/Search/QuickSearchFrame ?id=katie%21com
Penguin UK (returns a "Sorry...")
http://us.penguingroup.com/Book/BookFrame/0,,,00.
Penguin Putnam (USA) search...
http://www.aftab.com
http://ParryAftab.blogspot.com/;
http://www.KatieT.com noting the various translations of the book that have all used the same (incorrect) URL/name;
http://www.KatiesPlace.org/pages/1/index.htm;
http://www.wiredsafety.org/
Looking at space, radio, science and computing from a 'down-under' amateur enthusiast perspective.
F#ck em. They can trademark katie.com. However, she keeps the domain for prior art and should trademark www.katie.com then sue their ass if they come out with a sequel.
-- Why can't we moderate posts "incoherent"?
I'M sorry I didn't understand
To the chat room aspects of katie.com - a sort of backhanded way extra jab at a site that bears nominal similarity to what lured Katie T. into her situation. Wouldn't that be something if intent to cause damages besides sheer stupidity were behind this?
who is to say what one can and cannot sell? at least here in the us nobody can stop me from selling something that i own (and isn't against the law to sell/possess...)
... and the book should sill be property of the author...
from above, i'd say make a spoof site and claim it's a hoax, if they want to try to get you for it in the uk, change dns and hosting providers to the US, there are plenty of cheap ones, many with unlimited bandwidth for the site - or dns redirect to girl.com, and frame it with a 'katie.com striked out book cover with that title written in...) the possibilities are endless, and if the publisher says they're being defamed, they aren't the book is
if i'm presuming facts, please correct me
fortunately for katie.com the whole issue is much more public nowdays...and the rules for internet presence are slightly more sane toward "first come" status.
It seems to me that a domain name has to be unique, that it would stand up to a trademark infringement. In naming a company the first thing you must do is prove that in the place of operation there is no one using a name already as thier DBA. But there can be multiple unrelated businesses in different counties/states using the same name. (i.e. China Town or Tom's Market) However on the internet there is no localization when it comes to a FQDN which means that they are infringing upon the rights of the owner.
As for interesting forms of revenge, the easiest would be to setup a paid membership site to learn more on how to protect children and the like; charge $25+ per year and use that money to pay for the traffic. If the book is driving traffic to a site that is then making her some money, good for her.
Just my 2 cents.
Nope, girl.com is right now just a domain parker
No sig for the moment.
This sounds like the legal definition of a denial of service attack (the law doesn't specify the algorithm for causing a DOS). IMO, Penguin has been engagin in felony computer fraud.
An engineer who ran for Congress. http://herbrobinson.us
A better example: Nissan.com
As the website says now, it was forced to remove all commercial contents. It was owned by Uzi Nissan in relation to his local computer business since the early days of the internet.
Nissan Motors didn't get it, but the guy lost use of his domain. It's a pity that the detail of the case were removed from the site. The guy even showed a copy of a receipt fro the 70's he issued using the Nissan name to Datsun (former name of Nissan).
The katie.com case is not exactly the same. The name was chosen deliberately to refer to a domain name without assessing the damage it would do to the domain name owner (such as having to pay for dealing with the traffic and pay for the bandwidth). It's not that they happen to have the same trademark (which is allowed for different businesses). In this case the author of the book deliberately chose this title without checking about the domain name, and without considering the impact of chosing to use the existing domain name' or perhaps worse: choosing to ignore the consequences. I think in this case they should pay katie.com to compensate for the trouble.
From her (the lawyer's) site: Parry Aftab, Esq., The Privacy Lawyer(TM) ... managing cybercrime, privacy and cyber-abuse risks
What a crock of excrement!
Global warming is neither science, nor politics. It is a religion.
She also has a blog: http://theprivacylawyer.blogspot.com/
Global warming is neither science, nor politics. It is a religion.
The publisher response about Katie Jones not registering katie.com as a trademark only claims that this means she cannot force them to stop using the name. Not that they can stop her using that name.
But even if they are legally allowed to use the name as the title of a book, it doesn't mean that they are not liable for the damages caused by this, even if it wasn't used maliciously. IMO heir neglegance in failing to predict and avoid the consequenes of mass producing books with references to an existing personal domain is enough to make them liable. It's not that they discovered that the name they used happened to also be someone's domain name. It was published AS A DOMAIN NAME, thus they had the responsibility to check in advance if they can use it and to consider the impact of using the name.
Should we all trademark our names now?
;-) )
Isn't the the registration of my name at birth in the proper name registry enough for legaly using it for identification?
Is it possible to register my domain name as a trademark for the purpose of "personal network presence"? How much would it cost? Where would I register? I believe that the domain name registry for the popular tld's are operated in the US, so I would have to register in the US, and also in any other country that might be associated to me (such as: where I live, Where I am a citizen, where I do business, where I host my domain, where I host my email, DNS, etc.)
Perhaps resellers of domain name registry services should bundle in (at least as a "paid for" extra option) the registration of the domain as a "personal id trademark". I wonder how much it would cost. (Would namecheap.com have to rename to nameexpensive.com
Perhaps a more sensible deal would be insurance that would pay for legal defense in case of trademark claims on a personal id.
Or perhaps there should be a legal mechanism for people to trademark their names for personal identification that is separate from the commercial trademarking system. People do have different needs, and people do share the same name. So there should be a mechanism that would allow people to protect the use of their personal name for identification without preventing others using the same name (i.e., protecting an individual from personal name being taken away - in this case Katie Jones has the right to use the name Katie, had the right to register the domain name katie.com that was available as a means to identify herself in the internet, and should be able to be protected by law from others trying to deny her this right to use her name, or from others abusing her network-presence-id).
Perhaps somebody should write a book and call it katiet.com?
5 of 1014 people found the following review helpful:
:)
The **GUY**, March 1, 2004
A Kid's Review
;
WOW, what's next?, a new Britney Spears Album
As someone who has known several real life authors, it's far more likely she sipped A mint juliep she purchased with her royalties and is now back at a day job. It's less "$$$$" than "$/1000000"
Bad management trumps ideology - Show the world you want better leadership. http://www.timefornewmanagement.com
It should be noted that the Penguin Group is a Pearson (www.pearson.com) company. Pearson also owns a few other companies you may have heard of :
Partnership with O'Reilly for Safari
- safari.oreilly.com
- safari.informit.com
Financial Times (ft.com)
Pearson Education (pearsoned.com)
- Addison-Wesley
- Allyn & Bacon
- Benjamin Cummings
- Prentice Hall
- Cisco Press
- Adobe Press
- New Riders
- Peachpit Press
- Que Publishing
- Sams Publishing
- InformIT
- CourseCompass
- Many others
Domains belong to those that register them let this money grubbing lawyer and girl pay for it or just go register something else
http://www.npcgaming.com Dedicated Gaming Servers
Their email address is customer.service@penguin.co.uk.
I was just thinking myself that a quick way of forcing the issue would be for KatieJ to change the homepage to a statement that Penguin is an online predator, with an email link, perhaps, to the unpleasant lawyer (and Penguin contacts, I suppose).
When I was a kid, we only had one Darth.
I have actually written to Amazon with my account information so they know how much it's going to cost them explaining that I will not purchase ANYTHING from them until they remove this book from their site or the situation with the owner of Katie.com is fully resolved to the satisfaction of the domain owner. This whole situation makes me sick and I will not purchase any new books from Penguin Puttnam in the future. If I HAVE to read it it will be purchased used. I would urge others to vote with their wallets as well and let Amazon and others who sell this book (thereby lining the pockets of Penguin Puttnam) that doing so is going to cost them. Let's see where this goes. - el foobar dude
Generally, that is the case; chances are that Penguin bought all rights out from under Tarbox for a song - chances are she has no actual control over the property.
When I'm at the bookstore I usually have multiple titles I'm trying to choose from. Now I won't have so many. Much easier. I'll just refuse to buy any book from this publisher.
It is more productive to voice thoughtful opinions (reply) than to judge (moderate) others.
You are thinking about the mikerowesoft.com case, where Mike Rowe responed to Microsoft's $11 offer and then they came down hard on him. That doesn't apply here, since katie.com was registered LONG before the book was published, so squatting is out of the question.
The press release is at http://www.penguinputnam.com/static/packages/us/ab out/press/press76.pdf.
Not sure if this whois link will work or not, but agirlslifeonline.com was just registered yesterday to Katie Tarbox. Probably a smart idea.
http://www.katie.com/
/ ab out/press/press76.pdf
http://www.penguinputnam.com/static/packages/us
''Trena Keating, Editor-in-chief of Plume, said, "We have made every effort to
clarify the fact that Plume's book, Katie.com, and the website, Katie.com, are
not in any way associated with one another..."''
Except, until now, rename.
After hearing about this issue this morning, I reviewed the book poorly on Amazon.com, wrote to Katie T and her lawyer, and then wrote to Penguin. Literally 5 minutes after I wrote to Penguin, I learned that the case has been resolved, as Penguin just announced they are re-naming the book. I'd like to think it was my email that pushed them over the edge... ;-)
More details at http://www.katie.com
Way to take action, everybody!
Paul
> in the us nobody can stop me from selling something that i own
Unless there is a court-ordered injunction.
from http://www.katietarbox.com/ "Welcome to www.katietarbox.com ! This site is currently under construction Please come back again later You may contact the owner of this domain name here if you wish to make an offer to purchase this name: This parking page is a free complimentary service provided by Active-Domain Co. & Active Venture Pte Ltd: Domain registration service by Active-Domain.com : Buy domain name, register domain name, and domain transfer from $8.50. Webhosting service by Active-Venture.com for single or multiple domain hosting and website hosting at affordable price."
It sounds like both Katies are pawns against a ruthless corporate bully (is that redundant?).
According to www.katie.com Penguin have relented.
So when they publish something really good you might have to relent too. Out of fairness, you understand.
It's like when a pair of cops walk up and 'asks permission' to search you. They really are asking permission, but they do it in a way that presumes compliance. The fact that you have the constitunal right to say 'no' doesen't come into play if you say "yeah, go ahead".
Free Software: Like love, it grows best when given away.
Penguin knows this.
The practical problem is that copyright law is enforced by the victim taking the violator to court. They are using harassment, itself probably a crime, to intimidate a person without deep pockets. It's like trespassing or squatting, if someone uses your property long enough, it becomes their property. They have done the equivalent of publishing a map misidentifying her property as a publicly accessable racetrack. When people get there, they might notice that it isn't, but not until they have driven all over her pansies ruined her lawn.
I propose we do our due diligance and visit their websites, see what they have to say about it. Visit all their sites as many times as necessary to make sure they know we've done our homework. Here's a few:
Penguin Group USA
Penguin Group
Penguin UK Readers Group
If you find any nice high res images, recommend them in your reply.
Katie is in Europe, so is Penguin. It is in other places, too, but this is probably of interest. Notice in particular that in Europe, Big Guys aren't allowed to use trademark law to intimidate Little Guys. Other forms of harassment are probably illegal, too. and 3 lefts never make a right.
Even so, expressing a willingness to sell if she could get a good enough price might still work against her - particularly considering that most cases probably *are* squatting cases, so the folks deciding may have an immediate reaction.
Basically while offering to sell *shouldn't* hurt any case she's involved in that doesn't mean that it *won't* hurt her.
fencepost
just a little off
All the more amusing, since her husband had originally registered the domain for her as a gift. Maybe she can trade up for a new car.
A post a day keeps productivity at bay.
one is a book title. one is a domain name. i think we can all tell the difference.
Question
http://www.ironfroggy.com/
If this is true - sharing the info can ruin the book sales much worse than just "poor language, 1 star" reviews. People are after a hot story, and "17, kissed a bit" is absolutely not so hot as "13, raped" story. Share this on Amazon?
From the press release on katiet.com: ...I never believed that I had any right to the name Katie.com as a website but simply viewed it to be the name of my book. That being said, I never wanted anyone to experience unwanted emails or traffic on the Internet. As someone who has been abused, I would certainly not wish to cause anybody pain. Therefore, I sincerely apologize to Katie Jones for any suffering she may have endured.
On the contrary. You DO get trademark through use. Registering a trademark still requires you to use it to get protection. You get copyright production by just publishing.