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What Makes a Good IM Client?
thesaint05 asks: "So I was sitting here at my job where and IM is a pretty integral part of communicating intra-office. However, I have 3 different clients installed, and each has a different user base. Within the office we have an SIP server and use Windows Messenger. The Google Talk client is for colleagues and friends on the cutting edge, and AIM is used by pretty much everybody else (including a bunch of clients). So, after holding 3 different conversations simultaneously on all 3 clients (Windows Messenger with a colleague, AIM with my girlfriend, and Google Talk with a friend at a different tech company) I got to wondering, what are the strengths and weaknesses of all of these clients? Which do you use and why? If you could combine features from all of the IM clients out there, what would they be?"
I was asked this question a few days ago, my response was that there is a little something from every network that I would like to combine for use into one standard.
MSN - Ability to change your nick. Ability to accept or decline others from adding you to their buddy lists.
AIM - Ability to set auto-reply messages. Direct connect for quicker file transfers.
Yahoo! - Ability to send messages to people that are offline that they will receive next time they sign on. Ability to go invisible.
There's stuff I'm missing, no doubt, and I didn't cover every protocol out there, but those are the major things for me.
I'm not sure of all of the Jabber specifications, but I know there's things in there that specify encryption stuff, among a number of other nice things.
Right now, I think strong encryption (like with the gaim-encryption plugin) between client to client (not client to server) is one big thing that all of the major players need to address.
A community-oriented lyrics site
This was just an excuse to use the words "my girlfriend" in a Slashdot story.
don't be concerned about things like these, just be thankful you have a girlfriend!
If you could combine features from all of the IM clients out there, what would they be?
;)
Adium?
I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate.
and be done with it all. Googletalk is just Jabber which works with GAIM. Windows/MSN messenger and AIM work, as do Yahoo and ICQ.
See Subject line.
GAIM is an Open Source program, and therefore is completely free. Trillian has a free and Pro versions, but the free version is still quite capable.
Support for all of those seperate networks eliminating the need for multiple clients.
They do exist (although I'm not sure about the SIP support).
Simplicity.
Trillian for Windows, gaim on Linux. Next question?
I can explanate how to administrate your network. You must configurate and segmentate it, so it can computate.
You could try using gaim?
trillian
http://www.ceruleanstudios.com/
The author of the question is the one that uses all three IM clients. Shouldn't he be telling us the strengths and weaknesses of those clients?
You'll just need to break up with your girlfriend and cut ties with that other guy, and everything should work OK. Let me know if you have problems.
MSN is a resource hog, GoogleTalk lacks quite a few "standard" features, and the newer AIM gets, the worse more bloated it gets.
I don't have to worry about which is better.
Trillian suppports them all.
With Trillian I can have my MSN, yahoo, AIM, and google names all up (and ICQ if I wanted to).
We seldom regret saying too little but often regret saying too much.
Sounds like you're looking for Trillian with the Jabber plugin (and some instructions) to be able to connect to all three.
Anyway, I abandoned having more than one IM client installed a while ago. ICQ, for example, has always taken up gobs of RAM, and was one of the main reasons I wanted to consolidate a few years ago. I used to use Gaim, which is a good open source client that can connect to most networks (including Jabber, so it'll work with Google Talk). For whatever reason though, it kept crashing on me whenever I'd send a file, so now I'm using Trillian (Pro), which has worked very well for me. (Much better than the 1.x version I tried several years ago, if anyone hasn't tried it in a while.)
As for the networks themselves, I have contacts on the major four (ICQ, AIM, MSN, Yahoo) and really, the features of each aren't that different when they're all in the same client; it's all mostly small things. ICQ doesn't have the thing that shows when you're typing, for example. But for me, if they can do text chat well and can send files, they're fine for my usage.
It's better to vote for what you want and not get it than to vote for what you don't want and get it.
- E. Debs
That's pretty beneficial, and as far as I know that's the reason we use it at Dell, at least for internal IM needs.
Bryan "BJ" Hoffpauir
I actually haven't seen this in an IM client, but it would be cool. Tie in to a networking system like LinkedIn or build in the capacity so that if you choose, you can browse and create connections through your friends list.
Helping with organizational effectiveness is our job.
Try Trillian
Personally I just stick with GAIM because all my other friends are on AIM. It's also compatible with a host of other protocols (which I don't really use). And it's free. I like free.
Any IM client/server system I use must be able to connect with a SIP server like Asterisk, so that I get automatic phone presence information and phone control in my IM client. Jive Messenger has this, so far, and so does Microsoft Office Communicator (though I'm not sure if that actually works with Asterisk - I doubt it ;)
If you don't know where you are going, you will wind up somewhere else.
I never heard the Eliza Chat Bot called "girlfriend" before.
I use Yahoo! IM simply because a large number of my friends and contacts are on Yahoo!. That seems to be the #1 reason people go with an IM client. I also like the fact that I can log on as invisible- as I don't like it when people use IM to keep track of where I am.
aside from the encryption, icq had all of these and more in 1997
1. Timestamps, because I may start a chat with someone and then leave the window open. If they add something as an afterthought an hour later I'll be able to distinguish that from the older conversation.
2. Logging to a text or HTML file, because I use chatting/conference rooms during meeting to capture ideas. It's wonderful get this all into a file and then post an URL to it for the meetings attendees.
3. Plugins to support various other IM protocols. This allows the client to be extensible to anything new that comes along.
All these can be found in GAIM.
http://gaim.sourceforge.net/
Because of my really fast box, I can play all the games on the IM client! Exactly what I need in an _Instant Messaging_ client!
"Women are just like ninjas; They lie even when it is more convenient to tell the truth." ~ Unknown
IRC is the ultimate IM protocol. Although at least Messenger does support multi-user conversations, IRC has always been the king of the hill of multi-user chat. Brilliant for in-office use.
And of those three you mentioned, I only know local users for Messenger (not taking into consideration that nearly all of them use MSN Messenger, not Windows Messenger). So that makes AIM and Google Talk pretty useless - no users, no chat program.
Since this is Slashdot, answering this question is mighty easy. A good IM program has to be open source. Then, it is automatically the greatest invention known to man kind.
like trillian, except with a pretty UI :)
and growl makes it easy to read IM's without actually switching apps.
Gotta love OSX.
What Makes a Good IM Client? One that does what you want it to.
Get your own free personal location tracker
The advantages of ICQ (over AIM) with the default clients are:
1. Offline messages. Extremely handy for a lot of things.
2. Stored History. Unbelievably useful when trying to find something someone mentioned to you 6 months ago. Grepping through the licq history has been a livesaver for me. AIM clients can of course implement it too, but a lot of them don't for some bizarre reason, or they require you to manually tell it where to store files.
I read the internet for the articles.
As a great big dweeb, pasting multimedia into the chat window and having it come across nicely is rad. It is one of my favorite methods for conveyance of stolen music, and funny/apropos pornographic images.
No chat client does that perfectly. Hello is great for pictures. iChat & GAIM & AOLIM are good if you're both running the right client and have the right network topology, which is rare.
Maybe the Skype client gets it right. Dunno. Never used it.
There are no trails. There are no trees out here.
I think this one is a pretty nice client: www.miranda-im.org ...
Cool thing: all major protocolls are supported via plugins AND you can set it up to use gnupg! Not a common feature in the big programs
just get http://bitlbee.org/ (with irssi on a screen, yeah!).
or miranda..
Which do you use and why? If you could combine features from all of the IM clients out there, what would they be?
Seems like a question asked after a whole afternoon of pondering with a belly full of lunch. Seriously, if you have 3 IM clients going...I don't know what to tell you but good luck with the job.
The one thing i'd like to add from all clients is a userbase. ;) The multi-im clients come close to this functionality and as far as I'm concerned it is the only important feature they need to share. Text messaging everyone I know without inconveniencing them by asking them to switch to a network of their choice is ultimately the point of im. Open interfaces for enhanced features like games, picture and file sharing would also be nice but there is little reward for each of the hosts of these services if they can't guarantee commercial advertising.
If you could combine features from all of the IM clients out there, what would they be?
Trillian. It has MSN, Yahoo, AIM, ICQ, and irc clients, along with encryption you can use for anyone else who uses Trillian over AIM and ICQ. That's really the best part (besides the fact it's much nicer than the AIM, ICQ, MSN and Yahoo clients combined and free for the basic version).
The quantity of girls who'll get naked on their webcam for free.
Thanks and try the fish!
GAIM I use it on my linux box because it rocks all the different instant messengers and so I can be connected to all my AOL, Yahoo and MSN at once. You cant use a webcam or do voice and I've not experimented with file sending features. MSN I use on my Windows box. Ability to change names is good. Most people in Europe and Asia are on MSN. Yahoo More people in Africa and Middle East rock yahoo. Has a music feature. Doesnt eat up that much RAM if you care about that type of thing. AIM Most Americans use AOL. The preference setup is not user friendly. File transfers well, even when MSN and Yahoo fail because of firewalls.
Personally, I use Kopete under Linux, but I recommend Miranda IM to every Windows user out there. Miranda has a plethora of plugins for everything from IM protocols to a very useful boss key, including message encryption and voice support.
-- Estoy feliz, feliz de que no sea cierto.
What makes a good IM client?
What makes a good *insert type of software here*?
Answer:
Ease of use, low learning curve for basic operations, intuitiveness, "it just works," nothing that gets in the way, customizable, safe and bug-free, etc. etc.
As for IM-specific:
Supports all options of the network I am on, e.g. 3-way conversations/rooms, type-styles, etc.
Supports common options like send, ignore, copy-text, etc. very efficiently
Protects as much as possible against known flaws in the IM networking protocols, i.e. graceful failure and if possible, recovery.
Multi-protocol.
Local ignore list.
Local spam protection.
Local security options like administrator-enforced logging, etc.
Support command-line commands like "/msg" or "/pm" for those of us who like to stay on the keyboard.
Knowledge is how to play a game, intelligence is how to win, wisdom is knowing what game to play.
Perhaps this is nitpicking too much, but is Google Talk really "the cutting edge"? I can understand maybe the author is talking about having "the latest product", but that definitely doesn't equal the cutting edge. As far as I can tell, Google Talk doesn't make any major advancements in technology whatsoever, in fact not even its GUI is very original. It looks alot like Apple's iChat. I think it's one thing to have the latest product, but that certainly doesn't mean you have the best product. Bad products come out all the time, and the people who grab them up shouldn't be considered cutting edge.
Indeed. Adium is by far the best IM client I have ever used. Very slick and clean interface. Very solid protocol support thanks to its GAIM core. Developers who are very active on the project. The only thing left I wish for is MSN webcam support ;)
I've got Gaim (gaim.sourceforge.net/).
t _messengers
Includes basic (text only, if you use things like voice, video and sending files often, it is not for you) support for AIM, MSN and a whole bunch of others. There is a way to make it work for Google Talk via their Jabber client, but I can't tell you first hand how well that works.
As for features, I like the tabs the most. You would be having your three conversations as three tabs in one window, with color coded notification if they are typing or have posted something new. All chats can be logged, so you can easily go back and see what was said. There is also a built in spell checker that I haven't yet bothered to get working. Finally (that I can think of now), if you've got folks with multiple accounts you can have them on your buddy list as only one name, cutting down on clutter.
As a big plus, a new version (if I did my math right from their announcement) should be coming out pretty soon, for which they promise many great things on the website...
If you don't like Gaim, might be something on here? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comparison_of_instan
A good client will handle multiple protocols.
A good client has a beautiful, well thought out interface (including the prefs)
A good client does not have games.
A good client does not have a stock ticker.
A good client does not have a giant SUBMIT button (Everybody knows enter/return sends).
A good client will let you organize/arrange your contact list to suit your needs (Sorry iChat -- yes, even in Tiger)
A good client is extendable.
A good client has a no-brains-needed logging feature.
A good client plays well with others (Growl, baby)
A good client has tabs (Nobody wants a dozen chat windows).
A good client will not try to reinvent the wheel (Why does control+Z minimize the chat window in Gaim?)
A good client will let me effortlessly send files (uhhhh....)
I'm thoroughly sold on Adium, but since I'm stuck on Windows at work, I use Gaim there, because it is the simplest. Trillian is extremely overrated. AIM is absolute adware garbage.
On the Mac side, only iChat lets me transfer files without issue (official AIM might, but I won't install it to find out).
Proteus and Fire are nice, but Adium is *nicer.* I won't fault anybody for trying the others, but I think it's worth anybody's time to give Adium a day or two to win them over.
Slashdot: 24 hours behind every other site or your money back!
It's lightweight, sleek and easy to use. No bloat, no nag and no fee.
Miranda supports ICQ, AIM, MSN, Yahoo!, Jabber, Gadu-gadu and IRC.
Oh, and it's published under the GPL.
http://www.miranda-im.org/
If you want to juggle several accounts and not worry about firewalls, go to Meebo, which does Gmail, Jabber, AIM, ICQ and MSN in a browser window.
(Celui que tient la peur de devinir nuage)
Did you make it out of that 3-way alive?
You didn't acidentally send an IMissive about your girlfriend's nipples to your client, I hope.
Hmmm... that might have made for some interesting extra-business activity. A 3-way, becomes a THREE-WAY.
If Nalgene water bottles are outlawed, only outlaws will have Nalgene water bottles.
It has plugins for almost every IM protocol out there including Jabber. Might have trouble integrating Google Talk with that, but I'm sure it's in the works. And you can have secure IM sessions via AIM, which is a big plus for me. You can get the Pro version of the software from your favorite bit torrent sites.
I think the poster is asking what makes a good IM client, not which IM client we happen to prefer. Related questions to be sure, but not the same.
Contrary to folk wisdom, IM clients can be specialized, they're not all trying to outdo each other at the same tasks. So it's important to ask yourself what you're looking for. Fun & features? Try Yahoo's 'IMvironments' (or whatever silly thing it's called), sharing pictures? 'Hello' has some picture oriented, well-designed UI affordances in their chat client.
Personally, I look for the following things in a client:
- Simplicity (I want to think about IMs as little as possible)
- Universal compatibility (I don't want to run more than 1 client, I don't want to ask my friends to get xyz client in order to talk to me)
- Configurability
- No ads
I haven't tried every available client, but Gaim fits the bill for me. It's small, simple, highly configurable and speaks pretty much every lingo out there. It's not strong in its file-transfer capabilities and its ability to send pictures, but those features are not as important to me.
Plus, it's open source.
Hubbah
Regnessem This is an Japanese GAIM-type software ... It runs on Windows and you have to use plugins. Lots of cool features ... one of which is you're able to know if someone clicks on your name and opens a chat interface.
PS Notice anything interesting about the name?
1. Any IM client that isn't secure could one day prove to be a huge problem for a company or a userbase. Fortunately, there hasn't been widespread IM viruses, but who knows?
2. The ability to VoIP, change nicknames, block certain types of users, send images, create smilies and a variety of other features are always fun to have. But they can't be intrusive. I hate MSN's interface, way too many useless gadgets that try to be cool. On the other hand, Google Talk is very clean but Jabber isn't the most feature-full system.
3. I don't want to see ads when IMing. I don't want to get popups from using software, and I don't need daily news. Google Talk is awesome for this, as is Trillian and Adium.
I've always loathed real-time chat, including IRC and instant messaging. I'd rather people just e-mailed me in general, since then I can respond whenever I feel like or just ignore it. The moment I was hired at my current programming job though, I was required to set up a work specific AIM account from day one. The owners were overseas in Spain, and it turned out that AIM was their primary means of communication between Spain and the U.S. I've slacked a bit in the three years after that as far as my general loathing of it, but I still have yet to ever use instant messaging at home. The thing that's always scary to me is the sheer number of confidentail business conversations that have taken place over unencrypted AIM over the years. We've tried getting people to use GAIM with the encryption plug-in, but that's generally only used by the technical people and not the business people.
Can anyone tell me first hand, who is running or has creatd a software business, are there risks that you will write some code that some silly company owns the patent to, and thus get sued? I mean, has anyone run into a situation where they started a company, then turned out some "process" they wrote turned out to be patented? The whole intellectuial rights deal seems screwed up to me.... thanks
And for those who want to use these IM clients but can't from work, there's always Meebo. Pick on AJAX all you want, but I can IM on MSN, Yahoo, Google, and AIM through port 80.
i've heard there is a windows program that does the same,. i'm sure someone here will telly you, but i like gaim when i ever do use IM as it handles msn/im together. i should imagine google talk might be included in the next version of it or at some version in the future as they seem to be quite friendly towards OSS.
oh and the worst aspect of any instant messenger is if it pops up and steals your windows focus and you end up typing half a url into a message window or whatever. best feature is integrated email delivery notification for me. would be nice to have that for gmail as well as aol/hotmail.
What about IRC? Don't geeks use IRC anymore? Besides, X-chat will probably have video and voice before any decent AIM or Windows Messenger clients for linux do.
It's a hand twinkler, you dumbass! And I got a bag of whoopass for you!
Duh. Most IM clients are inflexible and generally kludgy compared to the power of customisable IRC clients like X-Chat.
to be Kopete, for KDE.
http://kopete.kde.org/
It's fast, easy to use, very elegant. It suffer from the same problem most KDE apps have, far too many options, but once you get it setup the way you like it, its fantastic.
Video for Yahoo chat, as well. Jabber, MSN, ICQ, AIM, Google Talk, Yahoo, others that I haven't even heard of.
It's really nice; but only for Linux right now.
WhiteWolf666 an exBush supporter. All you new-school,compassionate,save the children Republicans can rot in hell
Because it's on my iBook, which has become my primary desktop machine, and because it's what all of my friends who IM use.
As for work. I hunt down and hurt people who IM on my network. Although I do think setting up a secure jabber server might be worthwhile at some point.
Cypherpunks: Civil Liberty Through Complex Mathematics. Those who live by the sword die by the arrow.
yes, it isn't a consumer grade service, it is a service you have inside the corporate firewall. It was 5 years ahead of the competition 6 years ago and they haven't done much to it since, but on the plus side you can integrate it with Notes applications so every time a name appears anywhere on a form in a Notes database (expenses form, discussion database, document library etc.) it grows a little green icon you can click on to chat with the relevant person. Buddy list does not belong in a little window all by itself, IM awareness should be spread over all applications, anywhere there is a name I want to click to chat or mail, or VOIP or screenshare or webcam etc.
End-to-end encryption is a killer feature. After all, do you really believe the large networks will NOT keep a log of your conversations if they can?
Psi, the jabber client implements the PGP/GnuPG encryption for Jabber. Awesome stuff.
Just to clarify, the AIM protocol does allow you to go invisible. There's a little eye-ball looking thing at the top of your buddy list in the AIM client. Click it, and the eye closes. Voila! You are invisible. In GAIM, the same can be done under GAIM. Tools->Away->Invisible.
Going to have to say Trillian = bloat + not completely free... and slow to develop. (And for my own irritation... skins so mottled that you have to re-learn how to use the app with each new skin or design your own) Gaim = slim + completely free... as in beer... as in open source and speedily developed... except for -just- recently as they are trying to get to 2.0 and add all the features and new code from the google summer of code team that was working on GAIM. Not to mention you have three flavors of security... gaim-encryption.. best one out there... gaim-e which I don't have any experience with.. and Off-The-Record encryption.. which is kinda like that little kid that lived down the block and spray painted his bike black so he could be cool like you... but is ok encryption and what AdiumX for OS X is stuck with thanks to no native GTK for OS X (but not for long! http://developer.imendio.com/wiki/Gtk_Mac_OS_X). Anyway.. Gaim is a bit more ugly, for sure.. but if you're practical and admire utility and inginuity... GAIM is the way to go. http://gaim.sf.net/ However, if yer mr. money buckets and like having to add stuff like a Jabber PLUG IN in order to use the jabber protocol and like lots of confusion because theres no UI guidelines when people make skins and you're not too concerned with the fact that AOL/Time-Warner actually sells a product to capture text sent over their instant messaging networks, and sells them to corporations... or that about three lines of PERL will do the same thing for another 'tech savvy' guy that sits three cubes down from you... well obviously security/privacy isn't anything important to you.
I have to say that for an IM protocol/client there are many features that make it 'good' the only problem with your question these features are not what cause widespread acceptance. The only thing that causes widespread acceptance is 'all my friends are on it'.
Go Screen!
windows: miranda im. tiny footprint, native controls, and you can make it look as basic or as advanced as you want
linux: kopete. the latest version supports video (and maybe audio), global identities, and the ability to see people's status on icq who haven't authorized you (for some reason kopete and miranda are the only two clients I know of that do this)
gaim, I find, is far too basic. but some people like that in a client. and I have no idea why everyone suggests it for a windows client when miranda is there. aside from the fact that the last time I checked, miranda had bad support for the AIM protocol.
as for what makes a good IM client, well, I'm only not getting into the "merge contacts" function. having only one entry on the list that combines a friend on gtalk, msn and icq is great. and the ability to copy that contact (kopete) to another group for even more management.
group support, obviously. and sub-groups. informative/customizable tooltips. avatar support in the list itself. the ability to rename a contact.
these features and what I pointed out above are what makes an IM client good to me
I find automatic logging of conversations an indispensable feature of any IM client.
A good protocol is useless if the people you are trying to keep in touch with aren't using it. I use AIM solely because that's what all of my friends use. Chat_Client_X might be better but if the people I need to keep in contact with aren't using it, what's the point?
-everphilski-
I used to use trillian, but it doesn't support the MSN's custom smileys feature. So now I have to use MSN messenger just to display (and send) the smileys.
things already said:
additional requirements:
Until a couple of years ago, ICQ was the only IM used here in Brazil.
Since then, MSN catched and became the one to rule them all.
And no one I know uses ICQ for real anymore...
Although it's a M$ product, I must praise it a little here.
It has a very intuitive interface, but above all, its animated emoticons, its cool winks and its easy of use of add-ons such as webcams, microphones and even handwriting add a *LOT* to its FUN FACTOR.
I must admit I still miss the offline messages and the invisibility mode, but the "fun potential" of MSN is so higher that I am willing to spend more time having laughable conversations in it than during the old ICQ times...
Well, just my 2 cents.
If I clone myself, can I call it a thread?
If a girl winks to us, can I call it a race condition?
I've used almost every IM network and a lot of the clients that exist out there (except Yahoo since I don't know anyone with that). I have found that most of it comes down to what others have. I use universal clients like GAIM on Linux, Trillian on Windows, and Fire on my Mac because that way I can connect to all of them at once. To be honest there are subtle differences between most. Thinks like setting your name differently is so insignificant it doesn't bother me.
The one thing worth mentioning is what Google did. G Talk is an attempt to compete and only that. They used Jabber so they didn't even implement anything of their own really. They just tied in people's google accounts that already had and setup some servers and called it another IM network.
The reality is the IM market is a joke because of a lack of standards. Its been overlooked for quite awhile cause people seem to preoccupied but think about it this way. We have a standard for viewing static messages (email) and we have a standard for view pages of information meant for everyone. So why is there not a standard for sending real time messages? Why do we have so many companies implementing their own way of doing things? Wouldn't it make sense to have an agreed upon protocol that could be implement by everyone like a P2P network does?
IM is an area in computers where humans failed.
Trillian Pro can do that -- including SIP messaging with Live Communications Server -- with the (very alpha) SIP plugin for Trillian located here.
That's probably going to be the "best" integration of the technologies.
Don't think that a small group of dedicated individuals can't change the world. It's the only thing that ever has.
I use Gaim to connect to the AOL IM servers, and I've found it surpasses the traditional AOL AIM client by far, as well as alternatives such as Trillian (bloated and graphically immense.)
The Gaim interface can be customized down to being nothing but a window with a list of user names (customizable names can be introduced for your list), and has optional buttons on the bottom of the user list for quick action. Bottom buttons can be graphics, textual, or removed entirely. This is a user list interface at its best.
The user list spawns a traditional 1-on-1 chat window with a remote client, and supports tabs allowing switching between conversations easy, as well as noting other conversation changes without needing to reference another window.
Gaim is portable, and runs on Linux, Mac, and Windows.
Gaim is modular. I have quite a few nice little plugins that do interesting tricks. For example, if I'm too busy to respond to someones IM (this is rare), there is a plugin to set your idle time. Sure it may be a little cheap, but it allows me to avoid talking to someone if I'm deep in writing code without making them feel like I'm just ignoring them if they see I've been idle for say, 20 minutes or so.
I also find Gaim's logging system efficient. The AOL IM client tends to save all logs in HTML format, including all the color tags and formatting. This seems to me to be a waste in hdd space (granted it's small, it's still annoying.) Gaim saves only the textual information, and provides a nice interface to viewing and searching logs based on the user you're searching for and the date of the conversation.
Being a developer myself I think it would be beneficial if there were some sort of drawing utility on the client, similar to a traditional chat window but with graphical point-and-draw type interface. A feature such as this would help in discussing new ideas for programs between developers, or perhaps go as far as drawing driving directions for friends.
Of course if we're talking "chat rooms" where the communication line is more than 1-to-1, IRC is always the best :) In that case I would recommend X-Chat.
Overwhelmingly, what makes a good IM client is whether your community uses it. Network effects dictate that the more people you have using a client, the more useful it is. This property is subordinate to its functionality.
http://www.meebo.com/
If you're company uses IBM Sametime internally you'd do well to checkout NotesBuddy. Easy download:
http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/tech/notesbuddy
It is by far the best IM client I've used. Useful chat history retention, group chats, palettes for animated gifs you can drop in a conversation. I use gTalk, AIM (used to use gAIM), and used to use ICQ, SameTime v3, Trillian. NotesBuddy is still my favorite client.
in addition to AIM and Jabber. How? They explain it right there:u gh-jabber
:-)
http://allforces.com/2005/05/06/ichat-to-msn-thro
A lot of friends told me about Adium. But hey, I love software integration and iChat integrates with Mail and AddressBook in a way Adium won't be able to. Both (Adium and iChat) have pros and cons, but it's nice to know you can use iChat for -all- IM protocols
Animoog.org
Because it's the only one you aren't using to snork off during work ;)
-Rick
"Most people in the U.S. wouldn't know they live in a tyrannical state if it walked up and grabbed their junk." - MyFirs
Trillian.. One client, multiple protocols - even Google Talk which is just Jabber.. Even handles Skype IM.
"Straddling the sword of technology..."
For my needs, the Remote Desktop feature of MSN Messenger is extremely useful. I haven't seen that from the other big players.
I'm also looking forward to the PC-to-phone calling, and the folder sharing feature.
For instance, AIM is not the only IM that can send files (directly). Also, you mention encryption.. while I do not use either yahoo or msn, i can tell you that AIM has had the ability to use digital certificates to initiate RSA-2048 -> SSL encryption for years. (I use www.thawte.com's free e-mail certificate for both this and my e-mail.)
Anyhoo.. just a couple of corrections.
PS. GAIM has an encryption plugin... but it does not interpolate with AIM's encryption scheme. Why is this? Because of this, gaim encryption only works with other gaim users, instead of the entire aim community..
/dev/random
I think we're mixing client and protocol. A good client for me fully supports as many protocols as I need, and provides little nicities like Gaim's buddy pounces, and plugins.
A good protocol is Japper, which is really an arbitrary XML routing protocol that can be easily extended to manage more features and links up otherwise divergent networks
You can set up AIM to allow file access to a group of users, and then they can browse and upload/download files to a shared folder. Even through a firewall. I've used this at work. When I had to go to China, I was able to retrieve a file from my PC at work using AIM. I've also used it to grab files from home. I like the open-source clients, but the AOL proxy servers add some great value to their proprietary client.
Bitlbee is an irc gateway to all the messenger clients. This means that I can communicate with my MSN contacts over (what appears to me to be) irc.
This means I can run screen+irssi+bitlbee on my home server, and will never disconnect from any of my msn,aim,irc,etc and will be able to rejoin my clients from wherever in the world I am (very important for a laptop user like myself).
It organized all of my streams of communication into one single, easy, clean interface (irssi, really, but still) and allows me to manage my time much more efficiently then before. (not to mention the benefits of never logging off, so people can send you messages and you can pick them up without having to be "on line" at that moment.
I'm looking forward to naming my firstborn after it.
I embraced IM early on when ICQ came out. However, it seems I'm part of the "old generation" that scorns those over-fancy windows and basically unused "webcam" features...
I was very partial to jabber two years ago. I really liked not being stuck to a single vendor/server whilst being able to communicate with my friends on other servers, the choice of IM clients, the gateways (transports) to other protocols, possibility to change your nick, be connected multiple times, etc...
Jabber combined the best of all worlds and added on top of that.
However, some time later I had to give in and throw in the towel. I changed servers a handful of times, thus losing all my contacts each time, because each server was unreliable. The transports were even more unreliable.
True enough, the base features work perfectly, but I didn't switch to Jabber for just "the base features".
Progress on the infrastructure isn't. How long has it been since Jabberd2 has been in the works and remains unstable? Could someone please point me out to an up-to-date and stable ICQ transport?
I've toyed with setting up my own server, but getting jabberd running correctly with the right transports remains a non-trivial task.
So I'd love to say "Use Jabber", but I'd have to add "if you can".
That said, Psi remains my all-time favorite IM application. It's lightweight (in a QT environment, otherwise add up the memory used by QT), and has a simple, cute, and very comfortable interface.
Misleading titles? Inflammatory blurbs? Keep in mind that Slashdot is a tabloid.
I enjoy the ability to see conversation history in the chat area. It seems like an obvious feature. For the most part, I use GAIM though.
"Strangers have the best candy" -Me
A few years ago, an IM client called Trepia was released (it was even featured on Slashdot). You could enter your geographical location, and it would display people in a "Buddy List" of sorts based upon how close to you they were. It was a neat way of finding local people to chat with.
It seemed to have a lot of promise, then one day it wouldn't connect to the server, and trepia.com got redirected to its author's homepage. Now the domain's been bought up by a squatter.
What ever happened to Trepia, does anyone know?
... that's the killer feature for any IM application. This is the perfect emoticon for subtly picturing my boss when talking to colleagues.
Since I mostly use Linux whenever given a choice (in other words, any time I can connect to my machine at home and/or drag my laptop around), I tend to prefer open-source programs like Gaim, which seems to support logging in on more than one screenname or network at the same time. Although I will admit, the only network I've used so far is AOL's, mostly because I've been using their instant messenger for years...
Honestly, though, I rarely use instant messenger much. I can't stand it. Whenever I want to talk to someone they're offline, and whenever someone wants to talk to me I'm busy. In fact, despite what some people say, I find e-mail to be a much faster medium for communication – whereas Gaim is almost never running on my machine, mostly because I usually don't leave it running, I almost always have Gmail open as one of the five different sites I've configured to all come up whenever I start my browser. (Isn't tabbed homepages great?)
Creative misinterpretation is your friend.
I've been using Game for a while. Previously i used some icq clone... But now so many stupid people use MSN, so now i should too :|
:|
I like to be able to chat using text in my IM clients and not a whole lot more. I think file sharing could be implemented via a simple call to the email client, either manualy, or placed with-in the client. I guess for that, it might help to have a common interface to email functions? Is there even a standard for that?
I remember on the Amiga, AREX could be used for accessing parts of applications... that is, each application had an AREX interface. Is there anything standard proposed for posix Apps that would see such functionality... Such a feature would surely create a massive reuse of code.
I guess i like my IMs to be simple is what I'm trying to say... not that the AREX stuff is all that simple, but it certain would make the implementation of components that accross different applications easier. Why use an IM client to send a file when we've also go the protocols and libraries implemented else where to do that?
Giving IE users a taste of their own medicine since 2005 - http://pods.-is-a-geek.net/
people say its bloated, but i do actually use the majority of the built in features. for something i spend so much time using i dont mind a bit of bloat when it has so many useful things built in :)
- handwriting thing is genuinely useful in some situations (e.g. drawing usb/other plugs for noobs so they know what you mean). also great fun for wasting time at work/sending a personalised insult.
- easy access to remote assistance for my mum is a total godsend when i have my tech support hat on
- very clean easy to use UI (ignore the stupid skins etc)
- easy access to loads of multiplayer games, again for wasting time
- webcam/voice have come in occasionally useful and work well
just a shame about the ads, tho i suspect there's something to remove them.
can't really complain about any of that when its a free service, but it'd be nice to be able to shop around for the cell messaging service.
i've tried others but i always miss something.
So we've got 10 points for "my girlfriend," a smooth 7 points for "intra-office," 12 for the "friends on the cutting edge" combo and 20 for the obvious I've-been-living-in-a-cave question.
49 points total, not bad at all for a Wednesday afternoon!
For my PC i use Miranda - http://www.miranda-im.org/
:)
For my Mac i use Adiumx - http://www.adiumx.com/
Both cover the 3 networks i'm registered with (plus more), ICQ / Jabber (via GoogleTalk) / MSN. But i don't use anything bar the chat and file sending functionality. If i want to voice chat to somebody, i use my cell phone. Or if i'm really feeling lazy, then Skype...
The common goodness with these two, they're super simple, and they just work. I use the base install for both, that's the minimum amount of functionality. You can extend both with plugins, but who really needs all that bloat. AdiumX has tabbed chatting (that can group chats at a protocol level), and growl support, which is very pretty
I've tried a bunch of other clients, but they all come with too many bells and whistles. As mentioned, all i want to do is chat. That's it. And thats what IM is about, instant messaging. If you need any other functionality, like voice or whatever, then use the phone or send an email...
Join the Digital TV discussion @ http://forums.dvbowners.com
security and privacy are by far the most important to me... although this responsibility isn't really totally up to the "client" but the package as a whole.
I farted
In the 2 countrys I've lived in (Canada and Guatemala) pretty much everyone uses MSN or Yahoo, yet almost all the Americans I've met use AIM. Im wondering if this is part of aol being "the interweb" in the states, or cause people in other countrys dont like aol cause it has america in its name...
Also, in response to the first post, AIM and MSN both have the ability to go invisible and MSN has the ability to direct file transfer.
I think the main strengths that the two biggest networks (aol/msn) have is that AOL is the internet to a ton of people, and MSN comes bundled with windows.
Chances are any disscution on Slashdot will degrade into a flamewar about ID/Christianity within 14 posts.
MSN for winks and nudges, of course!
I've used Trillian for a while now and every once and again it seems to lose messages that I send or that are sent to me (even from within our reliable intranet, and will all protocols!). Very, very annoying, and this issue has been reported on their forums for some years now, and still no fix! Their tech support guys there seem pretty arrogant, and just won't recognize that this is an issue, even if the whole world is reporting it. Screw them!
ALL traffic should be encrypted by default. It should be invisible to the average user, but configurable for those who are interested.
--Rob
Towards the Singularity.
Miranda is one app that keeps me on Windows... and it keeps reminding my why all other clients suck. Every now or then I'll try GAIM, but I actually prefer CenterICQ....
Miranda is small, modular, has simple & coherent interface (looks like a native application, not some sort of freakish eXXXTreeeme-Teeenage-Mega-Skinzz-application), protocols galore, etc.
Belief is the currency of delusion.
Sure, you can use Gaim or Trillian to connect to multiple networks but why not use the proper protocol - Jabber - and let the server do the work for you? Just pick a jabber server with MSN, ICQ, AIM and Yahoo transports. Then it doesn't matter which client you use, as long as it supports jabber you're fine.
I would choose Psi http://psi-im.org/psi.affinix.com/ if you work in Windows or KDE and Gajim http://www.gajim.org/index.php?lang=en for Gnome.
Plus, you can install all sorts of nifty tools on the Jabber server: email checking, receive RSS feeds, control your jukebox...
- you could change your nick anytime :)
- I still remember my ICQ number
"Freiheit ist immer auch die Freiheit des Andersdenkenden" - Rosa Luxemburg, 1871 - 1919
Trillian does all of these things, and much more. Instead of just saying things it SHOULD NOT do, how about moving those things into prefs or optional plugins, via a rich api for plugins.
I think Trillian is by far the best I've seen. I bought the pay version (like $25) because I loved the free version. The pay version is even better, with the best logging/activity history I've seen.
"Ain't I a stinka..." - Bugs
Jabber has a number of the right ideas and is an excellent choice for an enterprise instant messaging system. Install Jabber at work with gateways to AIM, Yahoo, MSN, etc.
If your jabber server is aggregating your access to networks, then you only need a simplier, lighterwight jabber client on your desktop, or mobile device.
Jabber has a standard for multi-party chat rooms and it can be used across systems. There is a lot going on with regards to SIP integration for signalling, GoogleTalk is a good example.
Jabber also has a community process for enhancements to the protocol. There are several JEPs covering signalling.
Many of the clients mentioned, GAIM, Trillian, iChat, GoogleTalk, Adium are already Jabber clients.
Useful features:
I expect the chat program to tackle at the very least windows, mac and linux.
Way too many IM's are bloated to the point where the system is appreciably slow.
We all need to send a zip, or gif at some point. Though I find the 'user pictures' cute, I think they add significant bloat.
This is critical. If you can't keep someone off your contacts, IM spam ensues.
A list of who is online & offline.
Low bandwith usually results low latency, when the connection is slow.
I'd like to be able to have a voice conversation, with text IM's.
I'd also like to be able to add a video stream.
Way too many clients lock their network, and so we have this huge network fragmentation. I don't mind if my friends want their own clients which have the nice bubbly windows and 'user photos', I just don't want to *have* to run them myself.
If someone want to play a game via their IM, then go right ahead.
I'm not sure how often I would use this, but it would be very useful when I do need to use it.
http://www.qnext.com/
Here are the reasons it's is as good as it gets
It is like having a private jukebox with music that you actually like and where all the files come from trusted sources. You determine who has permission to access your shared music and you can set the quality level of the music stream. Music is either encoded the first time you play the song or can be streamed in its original format.
Imagine creating a private P2P network with ten friends that share music together. Each friend has one thousand songs on their computer and this means that you now have potentially ten thousand songs that you can listen to anytime.
pretty much the coolest thing.ever. too bad theres not many users. Found this website courtesy of StumbleUpon
"Could you put that in a memo entitled, SHIT I ALREADY KNOW!" - Sarge
Tabbed UI for IMing.
An automated message to people who IM you that says something like the following: "This is an automated message. The user you are trying to message has already reached the maximum number of IM conversations (X) they have said they can deal with simultaneously. Your message has not been delivered. Please try your message again later," where "X" is the max number of simultaneous IM conversations as specified by me in the IM client's settings.
Something that warns me when the person I'm IMing with is using some crappy generic client like Gaim or Trillian which is generally incapable of handling most things (file transfers, voice/video, etc) properly. Better yet, automatically let me know exactly what client software and version the other party is using so it's easier to rule out version mismatches when troubleshooting things like file transfer problems.
Moderator hint: a comment is neither "Flamebait" nor "Troll" if it is true.
My biggest gripe with all of the multi protocol clients (I'm looking at you libgaim) is the lack of support for proxing via HTTP. Not using the CONNECT method at the proxy (like anyone has it enabled). I'm stuck using the real Yahoo! client (yuck) because I haven't found one yet that handles the AIM/ICQ, Yahoo HTTP protocol.
We're supposed to see HTTP proxy support in Gaim 2.
The obscure we see eventually. The completely obvious, it seems, takes longer. - Edward R. Murrow
Microsoft uses their Meeting Server with the documented, open SIP or SIP over TLS protocol, right. But, according to their "extend and embrace" motto, they couldn't do different: to authenticate you use some undocumented variation of their NTLM protocol.
No, GAIM 2.0 won't support it. The other Linux IM Client that does SIP over TLS, minisip, doesn't support it - and doesn't plan to support.
In my job that is the solely reason I can't use Linux at my desktop.
Note: MSN does not do SIP over TLS either, it's Windows Messenger. Which doesn't even run under wine or crossover office.
Patola (Claudio Sampaio)
Unix System Administrator
Lot's of chicks to talk to!
There's no place like ~/
GoogleTalk in Gaim :
- for the messages, use jabber :
explained here, or in short :
Screen name : your gmail name (djsmiley2k)
Server : gmail.com
Password : (your gmail password)
Under Jabber option, Connect server : talk.google.com
- for the voice :
SIP isn't supported by Gaim, yet.
There was a fork experimenting with voice, Gaim-VV.
They did manage to get something interesting to work, and now they're working to port back their results into the main Gaim.
According to gaim's news, it'll be included in version 2.0.
Best part, one of the developper has been hired by google to make sure that gaim works with google talk's feature.
For your "IM window taking over the PC", it's a window manager problem.
Under Linux, it's just some settings to tweak
- KDE's control pannel "Desktop" - "Windows behaviour" - then play with "advanced" option (how much is it easy/hard to ask for focus) or "focus" (like "focus follows mouse", never get your focus stollen. Old school unix style)
Under Windows, well... the window manager just sucks. You must find another way.
- You may try Gaim - Tools - "Preferences" - "Plugins"
"notification icon" (message can stay minimized (and not focused) until you clic on icon, like on old icq98 client)
"message notification" (set different ways to alert about new message, like changing the title instead of asking for focus)
and optionnally you can install the "guifications" plugin (use "toaster" non-focused windows, like MSN. Effects on 3D games may vary. Doesn't show up when playing games on my old 3DFx Voodoo 5)
- There may be free tools (the "check against spyware before installing" kind) that can control the focusing behaviour of windows.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
It's the network.
I was surprised that almost noneone mentioned MIRANDA because it's a great IM.
:)
I started using it a couple days ago and IMHO is the best one i tried so far,
and when i say the best, this are the things that i find important
- It connects to MSN, ICQ, AIM, Jabber, Yahoo, IRC, etc (plugins)
- It's Open Source -> Free
- It has a pretty decent GUI
- I can use and see images from MSN contacts
- Very good file transfer
- IT ONLY USES 700K of RAM when minimized!!
- It has about 500 plug-ins to add great functions
- etc...
so there you have it, i think it's one of the best IM out there.
www.miranda-im.org
Control-Z is the UNIX suspend; since gaim is a gnome tool, and gnome is a set of tools initially developed for Linux, a UNIX like OS, guess what control-Z does?
The same thing it should for anyother x windows app, minimizes the window.
The ability to send messages to offline people, and have them read them when they log in. I really miss this from the ICQ days. Is this extra server intensive or something? It was very useful.
I guess the main thing would be: Build a core that has
:)
- one side to plug messenger network protocols with passing trough *all* functionality of all present and if possible all future networks
- another side where you can plug in functionality like on firefox.
- a third interface to the core for ui/theme support by translation from theme data to a set of widgets and functionality.
i guess most of this is already done. in
miranda
but a thing that is missing is probably the lightweight style that extensions on firefox have. it's jsut javascript with xml. so everybody can start pretty quick and add own stuff.
if this will become possible in miranda (i'm sorry but i don't know if it already is...), then why bother with other stuff because we already got the perfect messenger.
"Perfection by customizability trough community"<sup>TM</sup>.
P.S.: Why doesn't extrans work anymore??
Any sufficiently advanced intelligence is indistinguishable from stupidity.
...As I said, the SIP server is probably Microsoft Meeting Server, which implements the open SIP or SIP over TLS protocol with a nice little undocumented NTLM authentication scheme.
No plans for the two Linux SIP over TLS clients (GAIM 2.0 and minisip) to support this scheme. So, in this case, GAIM won't do any good for this guy's job: he'll still need Windows Messenger (not MSN, which also doesn't have SIP), which doesn't run under wine or crossover office.
Patola (Claudio Sampaio)
Unix System Administrator
Go gaim, i have stript down to the bone ... just to connect and talk .. no images no nothing that i dont need, oh just the basic emoticons.
The word is CUSTOMIZABLE for me.
RUPERT! I TOLD YOU TO WATCH THE BAGS! You were looking at the boys again, WEREN'T YOU.
Use an in-house Jabber server with several transports and connect to just one server (which in turn connects to several different services) with one client (there's several to pick from). Or switch to a Mac and use Adium. :-)
Hexy - a strategy game for iPhone/iPod Touch
I used Trillian for three years. Then I got my Mac and within three hours of using Adium I knew I'd never go back to Trillian. I'm a large fan of Trillian in the Windows world (paid for the Pro account even), but if you're comparing between IM clients I prefer Adium. It might be a bit of comparing Apples to (XP)oranges since they're two different platforms, but I think Adium tops out overall.
:)
In regard to logging- I have three years of Trillian logs, so I know and have used it profusely. I prefer Adium. It's a lot easier to search within logfiles, and it manages them a lot better. Granted, it's a matter of taste, of course. But let me tell you, the way Trillian logs is really not fun, since they don't have one standard log format. Over my three years of logging I ended up with like three different formats- first the barebones, then with a timestamp on it, then it changes the actual name of who I was conversing with once I switched to Pro and changed contact names (from HOTSEXYCHICA6969 to Jane Doe, for example). The result? It was a bitch to convert my three years of logs to Adium's (more strictly standarized, from what I've seen so far) format. I might not stay on Adium forever, and the fact that they keep their timestamps standard and always log the user's screen name (not your personalized name for them) will make it easier for me to switch in the future to another software package (or platform) if I see fit.
By the way- I coded some quick conversion code in Java in a few hours when I made the switch from Trillian to Adium. I'm not an amazing coder, but it transferred my variablely-formatted logfiles well enough. If you're also making the switch from Trillian to Adium, the code might be useful to you (depending on how you logged your conversations earlier). I plan on throwing it on my blog on Good-Tutorials.com in the next few days for anyone to grab, so you can check that out if you wish. You can also email me at goodness@ that site I mentioned and I can perhaps send it to you soonishlyer. Granted, it's probably not a hugely popular thing, but if it helps a few, what the heck.
Good-Tutorials
For me I want to have secure messaging. I installed gpg-agent and GPGME and Licq http://www.licq.org/ gets the GPG stuff done automatically for ICQ, AIM and MSN. There is also an SSL option for direct connections.. think it only works with ICQ and AIM though.
I use BitlBee in rcirc. All the protocols you mention, plus IRC, ICQ, Jabber and Yahoo, all from a unified interface within the comfort of Emacs. BitlBee also works with your IRC client of choice, of course.
With regard to the bigger picture, business requirements are more important than protocols.
The secret of success is honesty and fair dealing. If you can fake those, you've got it made. (Marx)
- Open Standard Protocols that aren't locked into any specific client or implementation or ISP, and include whatever features happen to be important to what I'm doing (e.g. encryption on messages, file transfers, integration with other applications so my outdoor thermometer can IM my PC weatherbot or whatever.) The big players here have been Jabber and IRC, and SIP is emerging because it's the market direction for VOIP protocols (and VOIP is really just a Presense Server plus a specific set of Media Connections, just as IM is) and because it supports Proxy servers so you can connect different SIP systems together in various ways and build cool interconnections between phones, PCs, and other widgets.
- User communities that include the people I want to talk to - Primarily this means "It reaches my coworkers, so I can have an IM conversation while I'm on a long phone call." For this, I'd prefer if the communities I care about used open standards, but it's more important that everybody's on the same presence server and there's some integration with the corporate phone/HR database so you can look up people easily. My current work IM environment has been Jabber-based, but we've just gotten some new system with Shiny Friendly Icons and Couch-Potato Non-technical-User documentation and no real information about it; perhaps if everybody switches to it it'll actually be useful.
They're fairly orthogonal goals (:-) Some people deal with this by using multiple-protocol-multiple-server Swiss-Army-Knife IM clients, but for the most part I'd rather not have IM from random people or my AOL-using mother-in-law, so if that means that I'm using one client on my work PC to talk to coworkers and another client on my home PC to talk to my toaster, that's ok.Bill Stewart
New Fast-Compression-only CPR http://preview.tinyurl.com/dy575ks
I think that in a day and age where many people use different protocols or applications, if you must talk to them all, get something that doesn't just do one.
I mostly switched programs when other people said "Oh man, try this, this rocks!" Or when everyone I knew and talked to were using it. One year everyone had ICQ. Then they stopped, mostly. Then they all had AIM. Then some had MSN, some had Yahoo. Now its a crapshoot, you never know what they'll have! So I gotta stay prepared.
True, you may lose some of the special features of each individual application. Maybe you lose voice chat, maybe you lose certain icons. But the convenience outweighs all that, imo. Why load up 3, 4, or more applications when you can just load up one.
If you go with a client like GAIM or Miranda, you also don't have to deal with ads, tickers, news, or any bloated feature that you could just care less about.
Miranda is my application of choice. Its windows based, and is very stable. And, like firefox, its greatly enhanced by a slew of extensions and plugins. I believe that's one of its greatest features.
You can add in extra smiley sets, extra protocols. Pretty much anything.
Its open source so you can muck around with it, if something's broke, and add to it yourself. And as its only based in windows and windows alone, its quite steady and stable (unlike gaim, which has had a tendency to crash, or atleast crash more often than miranda).
And Miranda works out of the box with everything out there, even Google/Jabber. No grabbing anything else. Its fairly often updated. And its got a small footprint. Its sleek, straightforward and has a nice interface.
http://miranda-im.org.nyud.net:8090/ [Miranda-IM.ORG]
clean, simple design
customized skins w/out ads, bots, or tickers
secure ID & transfer
easy file and voice transfers
speed of login & use
He who knows best knows how little he knows. - Thomas Jefferson
How about an IM application that leaves me the heck alone when I am trying to get some work done?!? Let the IM'ers crack THAT nut...
/.
IM is the leading cause of unproductivity among US workers. Yes, that's right folks, it has even supplanted posting on
--
Me? Oh, I am here in the name of science!
blah blah blah
Comment removed based on user account deletion
The worst aspect of AIM was the "focus stealing" aspect, also present in MSI Installer. NO program EVER should pop up a window and instantly put focus to it. Never, No. Flash it, but don't come up to the front.
Imagine you are talking dirty to your girlfriend in a long typing message, and then an unexpected IM from your grandma pops up, and it's too late, you hit enter. Your message of "....and I'm gonna lick your clit" ends up being sent to grandma.
Yeah, it's never happened to me(happened to someone on bash.org), but a good IM client wouldn't let you do that.
If they could combine all the propriety feature of each client into one client. I have tried a bunch of multi-clients like gaim, kopete and trillian but with just about all of them you cannot start a conference or use the msn "winks". If there is a client out there that "can do it all" I'd like to know about it..
Jimi Spier
www.jimispier.com - My tunes
- Real-time chat, like ICQ was (is?) able to do. Your words appear as you type each letter, not when you hit enter. I normally prefer IM-style chat, but sometimes I prefer to convey meaning that's only possible in real-time.
- Often, when IMing, I'll be typing something, but then my friend write something that I should respond immediately to. So I end up deleting (cutting) what I was typing, putting in a response, and then pasting my original sentence. Why not have the option of two input windows, either of which will send to the other user? I've wondered if a Gaim plugin would make this possible.
What Google will do next with Google Talk. "GTalk will log all your chats for you, and make them publically searchable! Never lose what you or one of your friends" (or your cheating girlfriend/wife) " said ever again!"
Trillian doesn't support Google talk yet, but I'm told that's coming. Until then, I have one friend on there. The rest of us have been using IM too long to get away from AOL, MSN, ICQ, IRC, etc. Trillian handles them all on my PC and on my Mac, I use Fire for the same functionality. Basically, a good chat client will let me IM with anyone on any service.
2 cents,
Queen B
HDGary secures my bank
ICQ is the best protocol in my opinion - but certainly only with another client.
Direct connections
offline messaging
e-mail an ICQ message to user (UIN@icq.org)
server routing for when direct connects fail
*per-buddy status* (always appear online to a couple of close friends, while mode goes away or busy for the rest of the world, or whatever you want to do)
changeable nick names (can be over-ridden by user if a buddy changes their name too often to keep track of)
talk from invisible mode
2. The client should be compatible on a numerous amount of operating systems, even capable of running on older "outdated" ones (i.e. Windows 95/98). With that being said, it should not take up too much processor overhead either. It should be able to run in the background without hurting the performance of important applications.
Unfortunately I do not have a suggestion for a specific client, because lately I am pathetic, have no friends and do not use any instant messaging software.
...then bitlbee is a great way to use your existing IRC client (mirc, irssi, xchat or whatever) to access jabber, google chat, msn, yahoo and oscar (aim/icq). It's not perfect, it will not allow you to send or receive files (yet), but if you're fed up with bloated GUI clients, and are allready using an IRC client, it may be the best choice. At least you'll have all your chatting in one client.
> Trillian is extremely overrated.
How about saying why?
I have used GAIM, Trillian Basic and Pro versions and found all were pretty good. In the end, I found GAIM to be a bit too 'clunky' and settled on Trillian Pro (of which I have been very happy with it's performance and stability).
Although the post referred to the client, not the service, I will respond to your post anyway. All of the features you like are already in one service, Jabber. Jabber is open-source, so you can configure an internal Jabber server for your company. I am my company's Jabber admin (among many other things) and it's great. I am auth'ing to AD (which means I don't need to keep a database of Jabber users) and the Jabber backend is MySQL (basically to keep track of rosters and such). You can run it on Linux or Windows and there are many many free clients to use with it.
Someone around here mentioned Google Talk. GT is Jabber.
You might be thinking, but Jabber is so different and no one uses it. Well, using Jabber's s2s module, you can have a gateway to an AIM server so your internal Jabber users can also talk to AIM users. Pretty slick. Of course, all of this depends on your company's firewall, but judging from the submitter's statements of using every service under the sun, it doesn't seem their firewall is too tight...
I would only use the one that is official by the organization.
Gaim is definitively the best for me. In addition version 2.0 will provide webcam support for MSN and Yahoo.
http://gaim.sourceforge.net/
www.secway.fr has Simp which is an easy to use encryption software product for MSN 7. I use it with a friend and it has advantages, but I wouldn't recommend it for everyone since it sometimes causes a few seconds delay in messages arriving.
Saskboy's blog is good. 9 out of 10 dentists agree.
Ugh....GAIM works with all the above mentioned and then some. I definitely prefer it to all others.
The issue begins not with the client, however, but which one will sneak out past the wall. EVERY IM Client should support usage using the accepted and open ports so they CAN be used behind the 'Wall. Too many times I am relagated to only being able to use AIM from the Web Based process (Works with Internet Explorer only apparently) rather than ICQ (won't work behind the wall), MS Messenger, or Yahoo.
How many Chat IM clients do I WANT loaded on my machine? NONE if they won't work behind the clients (and my only access to the outside world) 'Wall without having to jump through the hoops and barrels to maybe get it to work today.
You keep going until you die..."Me".
They're all much of a muchness; smilies and text is all I need. I use MSN/GAIM as everyone I know uses MSN exclusively but that's pretty much the norm in Europe. Just use whatever your group has standardised on.
The log formats are exactly the same across all the platforms within Trillian. I haven't examined the log formats of older versions of trillian, so perhaps in the past, but at least not since 3.x.
I agree, this sounds mostly like a mac vs. pc thing. Mac users typically love their proprietary software more than pc-equivalents, often, even if unreasonably.
"Ain't I a stinka..." - Bugs
No really, they do.
I'd like to see some way to integrate more with the IM. Ok, so I'm mostly on MSN now, but I've also recently used Gaim and Kopete. What I'd love my IM tool to do?
"easy things"
1. If IM is offline - auto send an email. Don't tell me, "your contact might not respond because they appear to be offline". Deliver it anyway goddammit. It should be like the mail service.
2. Alert Volume mixing. In windows, it seems to me that it uses whatever the "Wave" channel is set to. But I'd like to balance it against the music I'm listening to, or maybe I want to play a game, or maybe i want some alerts to be quiet - like yeah, I'm sitting at my computer right now, so that alert 1 can be nice and quiet, but alert 2, no, I want that DAMN LOUD!
"medium hard"
3. Share calendar tool. Meetings / events / to-do lists.
4. Extendible xml based event protocol. So anyone can come up with a new type of event. And support for each event could be as simple as a new plugin.
"harder"
5. Seeing as how they're my contacts, and theres things like ICQ's shared folders, how about an type manager interface for that? Photo sharing? music sharing? private blogs? anything else?
See - I see the IM as the key tool to achieve some degree of controlled data sharing within your select peer group, where peer groupings are relativily easy to manage. and if you can take that to the next level - how about data redundancy across your peer group. easier streaming of your own data to multiple locations. IM could make all of these tasks EASY for the end user.
If you're on OS X, you can use Adium (adiumx.org). It's pretty, functional, AND free! Based on GAIM.
I am aware of a business requirement of a friend where they use MSN day in and day out. I've asked questions and know exactly what MSN is missing for his usage.
However, everyone he "chat's" to is on MSN. So having too many different systems is a problem (the OP missed out Skype as that has IM capabilities which I use before calling somone on that).
I'd like to make money from writing my own client for this "specific business requirement", but haven't got a clue where to start. Just learning C# to try and get a starter, but may be heading up the wrong path. Any advice?
Nick
see http://cvs.sourceforge.net/viewcvs.py/gaim/gaim/sr c/protocols/oscar/adverts.c?view=markup
Gateways go a long way towards solving such problems. You can use your client and your better protocol with others who use it, while chatting with those on inferior networks via the gateway between the two.
Cyric Zndovzny at your service.
A filter that slaps you in the face if you start typing in IM-speak.
"u" for "you", "4" for "for", etc.
More than one instance of "lol" per minute
More than two exclamation points (possibly mixed with ones) in a row
Smileys on more than one quarter of your messages
And so on.
"A great democracy must be progressive or it will soon cease to be a great democracy." --Theodore Roosevelt
Everyone loves to hate gaim apparently but it works just fine, handles msn, ym, aim, jabber and a few others. It works in Windows and the *NIX.
Sure a year ago Gaim sucked ass [crashed a lot] but it has since been very reliable.
Tom
Someday, I'll have a real sig.
That's not what my logs show. Across my three years I have: nickname: message [time:stamp] nickname: message [time:stamp] Real Name: message That's what I mean by differing log files.
Good-Tutorials
I use iChat because I like the interface -- particularly the voice and video features. That pretty much limits me to talking with AIM- or other iChat-users.
However, this all works because most of my friends/colleagues fall into one of these two categories. Ultimately, I'll use whichever protocol they use, because, after all, I want to talk to them...
Trillian Pro.
Gaim 2.0 isn't out yet. Did he use a CVS version?
Also, did this guy connect over SIP or SIP over TLS?
Trillian is not a Linux application, so I don't know whether it provides SIP over TLS connection support.
Patola (Claudio Sampaio)
Unix System Administrator
Napoleon, don't be jeolous that I've been chatting online with anonymous cowards all day. Besides, we both know that I'm training to be a cage fighter.
It's a hand twinkler, you dumbass! And I got a bag of whoopass for you!
I use MSN (aMSN) because all my friends do. (It's the popular protocol here) Other than that I ditched Skype for Givmo today.
Adium with built-in hassle-free encryption, VOIP and H.323 Video Chat would pretty much have everything I can imagine. Including not looking like crap.
We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
Im on OSX and Im using AdiumX which allows me to keep all my buddies from Yahoo, AIM, MSN, and Googletalk in one list. If you want to do that on Windows or Linux use Gaim.
I like Fire. Thanks to a previous post, I'm downloading Adium right now. If you're on a Mac though, Fire is great.
except for chatting of course, working file transfer. Not "once in a blue moon" working file transfer. Not file transfer that hangs the client. Not file transfer that stops in the middle of a transfer. Not file transfer that is coming Real Soon Now.
DO YOU HEAR ME GAIM?
One of my favorite features of an IM client (which is present in both Google Talk and Adium) is the automatic grouping of multiple IMs from the same person. For example, if I type 5 lines before you type another, it only shows my name once with all 5 messages. I think it makes reading conversations much more pleasant :)
e w.jpg
Here's a screenshot of how Adium does it:
http://www.adiumx.com/screenshots.php?show=overvi
So just put it on a usb stick and take it with you.b le
http://gaim.sourceforge.net/win32/index.php#porta
Gaim, though it's not as full-featured as the original clients (short on special features) is a workhorse for all the REAL uses of these things. And, it both works in Windows, Linux, and maybe the Mac...
I think it's gaim.sourceforge.net; if not, it's on Google.
--- For a good time mail uce@ftc.gov
I doubt people remember them anymore, but their phones do.
Adium is an open source IM client licensed under the GPL and based on libgaim. If you're calling it proprietary because it's Mac-only, when we're comparing it to the Windows-only, closed source Trillian, that's a little... dubious.
Yahoo! Messenger can do offline messages too.
Ant(Dude) @ Quality Foraged Links (AQFL.net) & The Ant Farm (antfarm.ma.cx / antfarm.home.dhs.org).
Granted, I've always been a huge jabber advocate, but I honestly don't see why more people here don't recommend it. A lot of features that are cited in other posts that are foudn in the more popular protocols that make them unique from one another are already present in jabber: permissions, offline messages, various status options, logging (not really a protocol feature). The protocol is easy-as-pie XML, and the is open and standard so that the sky is the limit as to how clients can choose to interact with one another. I've always found the protocol to be very flexible, and there are a lot of tiny little features that make it a pleasure to use (subscription management, anonymous chatting, etc etc).
Adium makes a good IM client.
In other news, Mac OS X makes a good operating system.
Dude, Adium is released under GPL, and in no way proprietary. I'm sorry if I sound offensive, but I'm under the impression that you are attempting to compare two programs without knowing almost anything about one of them. And that's not very reasonable in my opinion.
At least the other guy claims that he used Trillian extensively...
- lightweight
- No memory leaks
- Open Source in C++
- File Transfer between users
- Skype-like Firewall navigation
- Buddy Icons
- Ability for individuals and corporations to run their own servers, and either connect them to a main network or keep them private
- high-quality video & audio chat
- Encryption
- Ability to change your nickname
- Free (as in beer)
- Ad-free
- ability to report bots/spammers and have the reports cross-referenced for duplicate reports of the same IP address
- Whiteboard
that should do it... anything I forgot?-jX
Don't you just love politics? It's like a comedy of errors.
There's only a couple of things, the ability to accept others when they add you to their list (MSN) and Direct Connect (AIM, Jabber) that are protocol dependent. Except for that, GAIM (and Trillian, for that matter) give you many many client side features lacking in the "official" clients, plus, you get to chat with people on all networks easily.
Now, here's the things I'd like added to a client like GAIM/Trillian:
That's a list of desirables.
The cesspool just got a check and balance.
Hmm.... sounds like the pre-AOL ICQ!
those were the days......... ^^
MSN - Ability to change your nick. Ability to accept or decline others from adding you to their buddy lists.
AIM - Ability to set auto-reply messages. Direct connect for quicker file transfers.
Yahoo! - Ability to send messages to people that are offline that they will receive next time they sign on. Ability to go invisible.
It still lacks a few critical things that force me to go back to using other clients occasionally. EG. Yahoo Messenger supports webcam video chat, and Adium doesn't.
Adium also doesn't seem to be inter-compatible with secure chat built into Trillian, which is a bummer when I want to chat with people using Trillian on a Windows machine.
But overall, yes - Adium is great!
Nothing is better than finger and talk. Ok, maybe finger and ytalk.
If you don't understand, then you haven't been using Unix long enough.
I use SIMP for Yahoo, and the number of times it crashes, fails to encrypt, or show unreadable messages makes it not quite ready for prime time. I am looking into the OTR plug-in for GAIM and the SecureIM plug in for Mirranda. I think I am leaning toward GAIM OTR plug-in given it's easier to install and confirgure. The biggest problem is getting not tech guys to install. Simp for Yahoo needs a patch and a seprately running program.
Easier than remembering exactly which of 23,893,542 permutations of RoodDoodxxx you had to pick as your nick because your first 23,893,541 choices were already taken?
I personally always had a lot fewer problems with random numbers. Maybe it's just me. :)
How about all the im networks get off their buts and allows communication between networks. I don't need to have a Yahoo account just to email Yahoo users. Or an Aol account to email
Aol users. I should be able to use my Yahoo Account/Client to talk to Aol, google, msn, etc users.
The only thing I want is for all the IM networks to have the ability to talk to users on other IM networks. This way can choose for ourselves which IM is the best for us rather than being forced to use third party clients which connects to every network and is crammed with features for every network/protocol.
This is supposedly what Google Talk is trying to achieve.
There is no god but Google and GTalk is the messenger of Google.
It's the people on the network that keep me signing on. My family uses Yahoo, a few friends use MSN, and a few use AIM. (In the past AIM was great because you could use it to talk to AOL users for free, but these days, I don't know any)
...Appearantly, the Veronicas of the world are a rather uncreative bunch.
If I want to talk to all of them, I have use all three clients. In my experience most people install IM clients for the same reason -- a friend says, "You should download [AIM/Y!M/MSN] and chat with me! My screenname is veronica696969". No one really cares how many custom smilies any given client supports -- they're mostly all Good Enough at their basic job -- rapid transport of small snippits of text.
On a completely unrelated note, the following AOL screennames are already taken:
veronica69
veronica6969
veronica696969
veronica69696969
Don't ask me why I know that.
The absolute most important feature of any IM client is to allow entire directories to be transferred, rather than only individual files. All Linux AIM clients only allow single files to be transferred at once. This is a major flaw in every non-official AIM client on Linux.
Tired of free ipod spam sigs? Opt ou
http://www.adiumx.com/ which includes:
Grouping of nicks under a single nick and holding for "pounces".
Transparent encryption.
Ability to reliably use the assigned nicks to refer to an intended user.
Make user icons available reliably.
Make client reliable and stable.
Last, but not least, make file transfers reliable across all protocols, which did requiring opening up ports for AIM transfers: 1026 and 1027.
Reasonably sure that last one is documented.
I have said this before when the subject of IM software comes up:
There is no such thing as good IM software. Everyone has a perfectly good, universal "instant message" protocol. It's called SMTP.
What's wrong with IM?
Well, to talk to everyone you might want to talk to, you need multiple sign-ons for each of the incompatible networks. And you have to configure either a universal client that's going to be borked periodically by official protocol updates, or you have to load five or six "official" clients on your computer.
Plus you have to be willing to trust each company whose IM software you want to use. Is their software secure? Are their servers? How much information is leaked out your PC when you use their protocol? Will they give you a date with an advertising bot?
No thanks.
E-mail is universal, not controlled by any single company and can easily be secured. What's not to love about that?
-- I wanna decide who lives and who dies - Crow T. Robot, MST3K
Gimme my Trillian. I have the Pro version too for the plugin capability. Match this with the Plantronics DSP-400 headset ($39 at Amazon) and you have a great voice chat system that works with Yahoo Audio Chat and a number of others.
"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master."
Windows Messenger with a colleague, AIM with my girlfriend, and Google Talk with a friend at a different tech company
Sounds like a good client for you would be no client, so you can get some work done.
I belive everyone should be assigned a unique 7 digit account number. Also on top of that I would like to see a three digit number prefix that would group my contacts in some sort of order (geograpic loacation perhaps?). I might even come up with country codes on top of that for even more organization. Also a standalone hardware device would be great. Maybe one that could be hung on a wall, placed on a desk, or even a wireless device that you could carry with you. Adding a 10 digit keypad to this device would be great, so you could press the the digits that corespond to the to the IM buddy that you are trying to reach. Heck, you might even want to throw on a speaker and a microphone on the device so you could verbally chat... damn I'd better find my patent applications
The IM of choice in Poland. Translates roughly as "yakkity-yak". Just about everyone that uses IM in here in Poland uses gadu-gadu, so you don't have much of a problem with what to choose as long as you're staying local. The protocol is closed, but it's been reverse engineered years ago, and its available as Kadu http://kadu.net/ for KDE and GnuGadu http://www.gadu.gnu.pl/ for Gnome, as well as EKG and EKG2, both of which run in terminals Screenshots: http://ekg2.org/screenshots.php Funny -- it's the only specifically local IM protocol included in Kopete.
Trillian includes all the best from every client... since it uses them all.
I know two other people have already said to try Notesbuddy, but I wanted to reinforce that. It supercharges Sametime.
this is perfect for people not travelling with their own computer or at work where you can't install a client
http://www15.meebo.com/
The other thing that you can determine from the typing message is if they are talking with other people.
If you see the typing message and then never get a response then they are talking with somone else.
I have friends that are commonly involved with multiple conversations at the same time and so I see that message often. Then I will get a message from them with no previous typing message at all. I assume that the typing message gets sent to the last person (windoe) that you were talking on, and not the current one.
It doesn't bother me hence I've not tried to find out if that is what it's really doing.
Why hasn't anyone mentioned Skype? Does Skype have no play in the IM market? They have an IM client too you know....
how do you get any work done...
Comment removed based on user account deletion
I use:
Yahoo, AIM, Jabber, MSN, GoogleTalk (broken Jabber).
I prefer Jabber because there's more clients for it, but none of my jabber servers are stable enough for me to just use jabber to get on all my accounts.
I really hate the state of IM today...
I'm using Kopete because while gaim supports more stuff, it's buggy about notifications (it won't stop telling me I have a message when I don't have one!).
If people didn't have to spend all their time fixing network issues maybe IM software would stop sucking. But until then, the proprietary adware wins out... Except maybe trillian, but they're Windows only; which I'm obviously not on.
All I wanna do on IM:
Talk. Send files. Maybe video chat.
It doesn't need to have "nudge." I don't need blocking, or hidden, or any of that. I can keep a local buddy list, at least that way I'm not limited to 200.
I'd really like to see everyone use googletalk, then I can use a better client!
- Offline messaging. If I have something to say to someone, I don't want to wait until they come online, THEN go look up what I was going to send, and send it if it's still relevant. Also, defaulting to e-mail as offline messaging (MSN) isn't good enough. I have friends who check their e-mail accounts MONTHLY. So it goes from "instant" messaging to "eventual, if it gets noticed" messaging.
- File transfer. I don't do massive transfers, but queueing should be possible without spawning a zillion windows. Also, it must work! Don't laugh, it's amazing how many just fail at file transfers!
- Clean interface. I want an IM client. I want to send and receive text messages. Other features like webcam chat are nice, but the basics should always be accessible. I've tried Trillian a few times, and while it seems technically capable, the last time I tried to use it, every last configuration option I tried was buried at the end of a maze of seemingly unrelated crap. I went back to official separate clients.
- IM is not: A web browser, a media explorer, a minigame client, a p2p client, an RSS reader, or anything else that can be shoehorned in to bloat it up and bolt fake hipness on. By "anything else," I mean MSN's "winks" and "nudges." Great, pointless disruptive flash animations that can be remotely triggered... and they even want us to pay for packs of them! WTF! Does anyone fall for this stuff?
- Customization: On the flipside, I love the customization of (the security deathtrap that is) MSN. A large library of default emotes, and the ability to define your own approximately desktop icon-sized animated PNG emotes that trigger when you type strings of your choosing. There have been some really creative uses of this, including synchronized ones that stich together to form one long one. (i.e. a 3-section emote that looks like a "sending virus..." progress bar)
It also lets you change a 96x96 avatar icon at any time, and manage a library of them. You can also get a small definable string to say something below your name on people's contact lists. With Windows Media Player (OH GOD, NO!), Winamp, with a 3rd party plugin, or probably others, you can automatically update this string to show what song you're listening to at the moment. It reverts to its last contents when you stop playing.
You can also change the color/background image of your main messenger window. You can change the background of a chat window, and offer to share the background pic with your chat counterpart.
Messenger still has a way to go before it has a long record of security, and that's to say the least, but it's got some great customization options. Totally unneeded, but they really add to the experience of using it more than you'd think. I'm kind of torn now, because I love the features of MSN messenger, I just wish they were on a (1st party) client I could trust!
adium, growl and quicksilver, that's what
word
could it be?
Just walking down the hall and talking to your coworker? Or using the phone?
:-(
Maybe I'm just getting old.
This is a subject dear to my heart because I'm Mac-based, but have a friend overseas who is PC-based.
* iChat: as you'd expect, this Mac-only client has the cleanest, most elegant interface by a wide mile. It interfaces for PC users with AIM, an app which is a pox from hell. But we use this quick messaging.
* Skype: a revelation when it arrived, delivering perfect cross platform audio.
* iNeen: horrendously bad name that matches a complex interface that requires a steep learning curve for newbies. It delivers cross platform voice and video, and has been fine when we want to do video, but was a bitch to set up - none of the instant simplicity and clarity of Skype or iChat.
I think an important feature of an IM client is the ability to take it with you. An all-bells-and-whistles version chained to a PC is pretty useless if you are in the middle of a conversation and need to move..cos really, the important feature of an IM client is the ability to have A CONVERSATION. Are they on AIM, ICQ, MSN, Yahoo??? Who gives a rats-ass...you have the conversation thru the medium that is convenient.Even though i work on a laptop, i am not about to carry that with me on the train or to a game. Even a PDA is more than i want to carry most of the time....actually...all of the time! My zaurus has been laying dormant in a draw for months. Anyway...needs to be mobile....and i have only seen 2 applications that run across a variety of phones that support multiple protocols... Oz Mobile IM http://www.oz.com/ & mobichat http://www.mobichat.com/. At $1 per day per protocol, Oz mobile IM is going to sting the wallet a little though.
If the cutting edge is less features than IM had 5 years ago, it's pretty damn edgy.
i hope this isn't me being stupid...but i've used several different clients on windows, linux and mac. mostly all can do file transfers. how about sending a folder, namely several files at once, sending one at a time is soooooo annoying and seems kind of stupid maybe its just me
I use IM for work and for personal reasons. This is what I think would make a good IM client:
.plan to post information like contact details if you wish)
* Message history (with timestamp, search, export)
* Tabbed IM windows (with shortcut key to cycle through them based on groups)
* Customizable sounds for every event (and option to toggle individual event sounds)
* Blinking taskbar notification for new messages
* Customizable auto-responders
* Offline messages (+ online message failure notification)
* File transfer capability (+ drag & drop functionality into the window)
* Status modes (Online, Offline, Busy, Idle, Not Available, Invisible)
* Users IDs are their e-mail addresses
* Aliases for yourself (for user search)
* Aliases for your contacts (to overwrite the display on your list)
* User groups to organize the user list (collapsable)
* Broadcast message to group
* Block users list (ignores all data from these users)
* Safe users list (allows unlimited message size, file transfers, does not check for message flooding)
* Permit/Do not permit your id to be added to a user's list
* Multiple user discussions (pseudo-chat rooms)
* Unintrusive pop-up alerts with message contents (So I don't have to switch windows to read short replies)
* Profiles (just a simple
* Contact lists and preferences stored server-side
* Operable on a LAN when WAN is unavailable (at least a core subset functionality, possibly with local server software)
* Guaranteed message synchronization (message order displayed in window is always the same for all users)
* Basic text formatting (color, bold, italicized, etc)
* "Contact is typing..." message
* Start on OS start, connect on network presence options
* Alerts for defined users signing on/signing off
Add-ons/Extras:
* Direct-Connection (real-time typing update, server-independent)
* Video/Audio chat
* Desktop sharing
* Mobile device interactivity
* Emoticons
* Customizable Skins
* Integration with Contact Databases such as Outlook
* Open API (to build bots and other creative ideas)
* Strong Encryption
* Networked application launching (for games)
I remember a now long dead contender from the ICQ heydays called Jabber that included text to speech in the client.
As I recall they included lots of uniformly annoying things as well that were a pain to disable, like loud cartoonish sound effects and "click click" noises to accompany keystrokes.
I though the text to speech feature would be handy. (And still could be.) In the end, though, I was never able to convince another human being to use it regularly. Most tried it for about a minute and ran off in search of a client that didn't go out of its way to irritate with a default install.
What I really miss from the old-school days is the *nix talk command. Yes I know people still use it, but I really find it striking how much contextual information can be carried in visually watching someone type characters out one by one and correcting their errors in real time. It really is different from the "compose and hit return" method most protocols use these days, and I find it really makes the interaction more like a conversation. Especially since you can both be typing and be reading things at the same time which is much like talking over each other.
I use Centericq (http://konst.org.ua/centericq/) which is runnin behind a screen on my home comp so it is accessible where ever there is a ssh connection.
am i the only one who wants ICQ's real-time chat to show up in other clients?? i remember we used to have this on *UNISYS ICONS* (called co-co)--the future was *then*... the past is now?
What, never heard of tar?
I think that the most important thing is probably sticking to standards. I wish that every client supported the exact same version of AIM Talk/Video and that every client worked with Google Talk perfectly. About the only thing that you can count on any of the clients out there, AIM, MSN, Yahoo, Google, Trillian, Gaim, iChat, Adium, Kopete, etc. is that they can all do text between the two. Often times a simple thing like file transfer doesn't work.
I'm most frequently using my PowerBook and the other day I found out that even though I used to be able to use my iSight to talk with iChat AV with other Windows AIM users but now with the new beta version of AIM this is no longer possible.
I rarely use Windows Messenger mostly because it's so Windows centric... and it seems to have more connection problems than the rest. I love the fact that pretty much everyone I know has an AIM screenname. I almost think that there really just isn't any room anymore for another IM client. Google Talk may have jumped into the game a little to late, but in order for it to catch up they are definitely going to have to add stuff like Video chat, etc. My 2 cents.--
Aaron Marks
Well, since you are simply referring to IM client, I would have to say that an almost perfect IM client already exists in GAIM. I have all my accounts logged in in one GAIM session, AIM, Yahoo!, MSN, and Google talk/Jabber. Works like a charm. As far as service is concerned, I believe that Google has the corner on it simply because they have the ability to both IM and make client to client calls.
Check out the Interactive Intelligence Client (people who work in big tech companies or call centers know what I'm talking about!)
Well if you've got the extra $$$$
-Evil Lord Drewcifer
Adium, a mutliple protocol instant messenger client for Mac OS X is an outstanding example. It is both simple and elegant in that it can be configured to stay completely out of your way and it takes advantage of the conventions provided by the "standard" user interface to deliver notifications rather than some cheesy, custom, in-your-face approach. The interface is very clean and consistent. It is obvious whoever is responsible for its interface understands typography and layout. When compared to many other clients, it seems to offer exactly what you need. Load up the most other clients and you are faced with a torrent of ads, and other useless features that clutter up the experience.
Join Tor today!
Just FYI, if you're not a GAIM user but like the videoconferencing etc features of your various IM's, keep a watch. The 2.x version of GAIM is supposed to re-merge the GAIM-VV (Voice+Video) forks so that it not only supposed multicliented goodness, but many of the media features as well.
I've been using Trillian since the 0.5x days and have continued till this day. I've used GAIM before, but Trillian works best. I don't see a need to upgrade to the Pro version for what I use it for, but I suggest looking at GAIM, Trillian Basic (free!), and Trillian Pro to see what fits you best.
Pluses (Some have already been listed above)
- Free version has a lot of great features
- Great for consolidating your IMs
- Pretty much all of the features that you would find in any of the standard standalone IM clients
- It allows you to use more than one screen name per network (i.e. two AIM accounts)
- Can do accounts/profiles for different users (i.e. family members with their individual IM account sets)
- Conversation logging with date and time stamps (good for ass saving or ass kicking)
- Available conversation encryption between another Trillian client/user
- Some keyboard shortcuts can be customized
- Quick configuration option finding
- IM network plugins (i.e. modular design)
- Hot update on plugins
- Easy connect, disconnect, away, here, etc. between one or all IM accounts
- XML Skinnable with complete UI customization
- Has an IRC client as well (what it started out as)
Minuses
- Difficulty with transferring files (I haven't gotten it to work, but I could be doing something wrong)
I am currently using the Basic version to connect a MSN, Yahoo, ICQ, and two AIM accounts. The logging feature is great and quite handy. I highly recommend you try it.
I use trillian for my regular chatting needs, and trillian as far as I know supports unicode as a whole (I chat with Japanese people on a regular basis). However, people using straight vanilla AIM and ICQ can't see the unicode characters. Other people using trillian that I am talking to over the AIM module can, as can MSN and Yahoo! users. But for me, unicode/multilanguage support is seriously a must-have.
Hello,
Sadly, CMGI closed Tribal Voice before giving PowWow an opportunity to take off. Of course, that could be said of many--if not all--of CMGI's acquisitions. But I digress... you had asked about PowWow.
A small PowWow server which an old version of the PowWow client was set up by former employees and is still available for use/download. Visit http://powwow.jazy.net/ for more details or to download a copy of the software.
Regards,
Aryeh Goretsky
Dexter is a good dog.
The Microsoft Office Communicator is by far the best choice for businesses. It is encrypted, can communicate with other business Live Communication Servers if so configured and still remain secure and encrypted, and for all those conversations you need to have with AIM, Yahoo, or MSN, you can still do it within MOC. The only downside is once you send a message to one of the external networks, it is no longer encrypted.
Another IM client noone mentioned is Skype. Skype has some obvious advantages:
So for now i'll keep using Trillian and Skype simultanious, well until someone writes a plugin for Trillian using the Skype API...
Anyway, ICQ contact lists are backed up on the server nowadays. Just use a modern client on the old computer (any ICQ release you can download right now, GAIM should also do the trick), and it will upload the list to the server.
The list will be downloaded on first login on the newer computer.
A good IM client is light-weight with a low CPU and memory footprint and isnt bloated. MSN is extremely bloated.
You can use a multi-protocol IM instead of 3 different clients. There are many multi-protocol IM clients such as Miranda IM, GAIM, etc.
Personally I use the Miranda IM client which is for Windows, it is highly customizable and supports plugins and very light-weight.
I like alot Jabber because it is an open-source protocol which makes it easy to make clients, bots, etc for it. Most jabber servers also supports SSL which is very nice.
A IM should do IM but now many clients have started doing other stupid stuff such as "customize your colors, background, picture, avatar, smileys", send vibes, play games, handwriting, etc etc etc full of useless bloat.
Check out Miranda at www.miranda-im.org. It has a very clean and customizable GUI and support for almost every protocol there is.
ICQ, as long as I can remember, has always had really stupid defaults (the typewriter sound, the inability to press Enter to send a message, the lack of color/font/other modifiers). Yes, you can change all of them, but why should you have to?
In addition, having server-based contact lists rather than client-based ones is really way better.
+++ATH0
I know it's not what you're looking for for an office-based setting, but if you're into gaming, you'll want to look at XFire. Does all kinds of spiffy things like allowing IM'ing from within games (without having to alt-tab), and then has a bunch of other random stuff like voice chat, one-click game joining to your friends, a sort of regulated p2p file system, and a screenshot upload system.
Really, though, the whole being able to chat inside a game without having to constantly alt-tab out makes it worthwhile in my book. The downside, I suppose, is that it's windows only.
That green slime had it coming.
I think ICQ used to be really great, but at a certain point some things happened...
- No idea who was designing the GUI at the time, but it started becoming more and more horrible. Everywhere you looked there were little animated icons running over your GUI or things flashing or weird sounds filling your room/office.
- They added craploads of features not many people really wanted. Later on a Light version was released.
- MSN offered a free e-mail address, and the step from e-mail to Messenger was a very short one to take. And of course, like has been said, most people find it easier to remember e-mail addresses than to remember a number sequence.
At work we run a jabber server on our internet gateway, with MSN, Yahoo, AIM, etc. transports installed. That way I can run Psi and be connected to all the IM services I might want to use (including Google Talk, which is jabber in the first place). It's very convenient in terms of not cluttering up my task tray, although I must say I think Psi could use some user-interface work.
Oh, and remote control of resource priorities would be nice too...
01. Text chat
02. History with plugin for search-system, like Beagle.
03. Built in spell-checking
04. File transfer
05. UPnP so most people won't have to touch their firewall.
06. Pen chat, i.e. a whiteboard
07. Voice chat
08. Video chat
09. A variety of implementations to choose from.
10. Voice to Text
11. Voice-History able to search both vocally and textually (sp? word?)
12. Encryption
I've been good all year!! Promise!
Why has no one mentioned Miranda? It's a great piece of software with which has support for lots of protocols. Check it out!
Agreed. Here's a ruleset: http://tpcmurray.blogspot.com/2005/07/rant-camera- template-chat-laughing.html
I'm wrong and so are you.
You lucky, lucky bastards! Proper little comp. sci professionals eh? You must have slipped 'em a few dollars eh? ... Oh, what I wouldn't give to be able to install an IM client. Sometimes I lay awake a night dreaming of being able to install an IM client!
Must be nice. We are so locked down here that there is no way they are going to let anything except NetMeeting (which has a horrid interface, no addressing etc.) be on the network.
This post brought to you by your friendly neighborhood MBA.
I tend to tell my friends that if they want to IM me, they'll have to use Windows Messenger or better yet, MSN. I have accounts with ICQ, Yahoo & AOL, but I don't like any of their clients. Once we can easily IM across services no matter what client we use, I will never look back. As a IT guy, I prefer MSN because of it's integrated remote control features. That alone allows me to troubleshoot friends and family's computers without having to do house calls.
At work, we use both the Exchange Instant Messenger, and are looking to roll out Live Communication Server, (which is pretty slick too!). I like the ability to do desktop sharing for training purposes as well. Of course all the IM clients pretty much allow for phone calls and video cams, but for me the real value is in the extra stuff, and like it or not, Microsoft has a HUGE lead here.
Just my $.02
1 - interest groups
:D
Type in a list of interests and find a group of people to talk to. In a way you can already do this with IRC, but you have to do the search yourself. What if you just want to randomly talk to people in a city? It seems like -everybody- is using instant messengers these days, but everybody still isn't as connected as we can be.
2 - complete feature support for all IM networks
Of course, with the syndication of various IM networks seeming fairly inevitable these days, IM clients must support multiple protocols, preferably modularly. The client should provide full audio/video/file transfer/embedded image support as well.
3 - security
Direct peer-to-peer secure communications. Need I say any more?
4 - customizable user interface and backend
Geeks use instant messengers. Geeks like scripting and modding. Geeks make instant messengers. Besides, what would any successor of IRC be without scripting?
"Miranda tries but has its own funky grey look. Why can't anyone just make a consistent IM multi-client that uses the standard windows look and feel?"
With the right settings, Miranda can have a standard Windows look and feel. It's the first thing I do when I do a new install of it. I have to argee, however, that Miranda's default appearance is funky, actually I'd go as far as to say it's downright terrible and off putting. I've had more than one person that I recommended it to uninstall because it was so ugly before I had a chance to tell them how to make it look better.
Personally, I'll continue to rely on Trillian. Encryption options, video, stability, and global attributes.:) I tried GAIM for a while, but spontaneous reconnects were driving me nuts, and there has always been an instability issue with it.
Why use an IM for communicating intra-office? An IP messenger can be used instead, as they do not tax the network as much as IMs do.
We use the open-source IPMSG for Windows
Turbo Note+ is also a good alternative.
I have a truly marvelous proof of the Riemann hypothesis which this sig is too short to contain...
I'm running Adium X 0.86 - which is the latest public release - but previous versions have, as I stated above, the feature(s) you're looking for, too.
Here's how you set it up.
Server side buddy lists for AIM were added quite a long time ago, but they haven't always been there.
Now that ICQ uses the same protocol, it does too, but AOL has basically killed ICQ off in favor of AIM. No marketing, a HORRENDOUS website that is impossible to navigate, and no real advantages over AIM now that they use a common protocol. Of who knows how many friends I know of that used to use ICQ, only a handful do now.
retrorocket.o not found, launch anyway?
At work we use ICQ groupware, a Beta which is several years old and is very unstable. However the reason we still use it is at this moment it is the only IM client I am aware of that 1) is free, 2) enables broadcasting to everyone on the LAN, and 3) indicates client status. Since we are an ISP, broadcasting is necessary whenever there are server changes/downtime/etc (or for broadcasting office-wide jokes on a Friday afternoon). If anyone knows of any other IMs which provide this, please post and let me know.
Of course when I am off the clock, the compatibility, free price, and clean look of GAIM is hard to beat.
Adium has OTR encryption and automatically logs the conversation into a searchable window.
The nicest, most featureful chat protocol I've ever used with Tribal Force's PowWow. Now there was a chat program worth using. Text chat person-to-person. Chat rooms for multi-person-to-person chats. Chat servers for multi-person chats. Voice chat. The best text-to-speech I've ever heard (and that was on Windows 3.11 and Windows 95B), even now. And a wonderful "group web surfing" feature where one person can control the web browser of all the people in the chat. And it was all done in a 5 MB install.
It's just too bad the protocol was kept so secret, and the marketing was so piss-poor. It was what NetMeeting, MSN/Windows Messenger always hoped to be (and never will be). None of the other chat clients I've used (MSN/Yahoo/AIM/gAIM/Kopete/Trillian/ICQ) compare to that one. The only thing missing, AFAIR, was video, but back then, web cams were still in the multi-hundred dollar range.
[sniff] Why do the good ones always die young?
I use Meebo.com for my messenger. It lets me log in to AIM, ICQ, Yahoo, Google Talk, Jabber, and MSN in a web-based, java-free session. It actually encrypts your passwords, unlike some.
Currently in Beta, if interested send a blank email to rsc@[removeThis]eyeball.com http://sipthat.com/archives/000406.html -Erik
When you combine these features, don't you essentially get the same functionality as e-mail? This leads me to believe that we might benefit from a system that supports both synchronous (such as instant messaging) and asynchronous (such as e-mail) communication. Do we really need two different applications for these two methods of communication?
Consider the main information that is transferred via an e-mail:
- Timestamp
- Sender
- Recipient(s)
- Subject
- Body (including text, images, other media formats, arbitrary files)
Now compare this with the main information that is transferred via an instant message:
- Timestamp
- Sender
- Recipient; however, on certain instant messaging systems, multiple recipients are permitted (for example, AIM allows you to create a chat room, and MSN messenger allows you to add additional contacts to an existing chat)
- Body; while this is usually just text, I don't see any reason why users should not be permitted to offer to send arbitrary files ("attachments") in-line (such as in MSN messenger) or images in-line (such as using when using direct connect in AIM)
To me, it seems like these lists of information are so similar that there doesn't really seem to be any reason why one application should not be able to deal with both types. There is actually an application created within IBM called NotesBuddy that claims to integrate e-mail and instant messaging (http://www.alphaworks.ibm.com/tech/notesbuddy/ [ibm.com]), but in reality, the integration isn't entirely seamless. The application also faces several usability problems (in my opinion).
I think part of the problem with the implementation of NotesBuddy may be that it tries to merge two existing services instead of providing a solution that is designed from the ground up. ICQ's implementation is perhaps more usable because the integration of synchronous and asynchronous communication is more transparent. However, I find its content limitations (just text) to be restrictive.
Then you should *REALLY* try to configure the window manager,
this way the effect will be not only with Gaim, but with all other applications.
For KDE, see preceeding post.
For Gnome, well I dont know gnome that much, but after some googling around,
i found the following :
To start preferences tools, either "Applications" -> "Desktop Preferences" or "Start Here" (Nautilius starts) -> "Preferences object"
You can then play with the "Window Focus tool" in the preference tools.
In linux you can have different mode for auto-focus :
- "a la windows" : whenever a new window is opened it'll automatically steal the focus (unless it is explictly a pop-under)
- my favorite : a window can give a focus to another one only if it is running. (i.e.: If an application is active, and you click "Help" -> "about" the new about box can get focus. But if some background task, like gaim, opens a window, this window will also be background).
- Old-skool Unix style : you must give focus manually. No pop-up will ever steal focus, (even if *you* opened the pop-up).
Then you have three ways to give focus :
- "Windows/Mac" style : You click to give focus.
- "Old-Skool Unix" style : whatever is under the mouse has focus.
- same as above, but windows come automatically to the top of the other windows.
"Sufficiently advanced satire is indistinguishable from reality." - [Tips: 1DrYakQDKCQ6y52z6QbnkxHXAocMZJE61o ]
I had tried it a few times and it didn't work. Anyway, my Windows-compiled version didn't have TLS on it yet.
Patola (Claudio Sampaio)
Unix System Administrator
http://www.download.com/Trillian/3000-2150-1004747 3.html?part=dl-trillian&subj=dl&tag=button
but if we could get everyone to use Gaim it would probably cut down on some of that crap people try to pass off as english
like foreign languages
or street names in european countries
better perhaps, would be a FORCED spell check, that made you acknowledge the changes.. People might craft their messages more carefully just so as not to have to perform the extra step of accepting the changes....
Spell checkers used to confirm every change.. now they do it as you type, no beep, no flash, with really bad end results sometimes.
every day http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Special:Random
Thats because ICQ uses the same protocol as AIM now
Bottles.
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