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This is IT?
Dave (picked at random) and 8000 other slashdot readers wrote in to tell us that they too had been overcome by the relentless hype machine that is IT, Ginger, Segway, whatever. Read about IT in your favorite hype-dispensing media outlet, each of which thinks that it has an exclusive on the story of IT. Flash diagram of IT. Time. NY Times. Reuters. And don't forget to watch the advertisement, errr, "demonstration" of IT on Good Morning Consumers tomorrow. Update: 12/03 13:37 GMT by T : Segway's webmaster John Grohol points out the segway website as well.
The southpark version was hilarious
"Well atleast its better than dealing with the airlines"
"Nothing has happened at the level of the pedestrian to improve transportation since we invented the sneaker..." Really. Firstly, once on wheels, can the driver be considered a "pedestrian?" Secondly, what about bicycles, scooters, and the like. I'm sure there is some incredible technology going on there, but the arrogance seems much more powerful.
It may be hyped but it could be a breakthrough. At any rate it is something that interests us as geeks. Stories about this broke on friday or maybe before and you have been getting thousands of submissions on the subject. It took you until tonight to actually post it. Hi, I don't know if you know tons of people think things are neat that you may not, but it is true. So if you get lots of posts on something then maybe it is worth posting.
Sadly, I'm disappointed. All the hype.. Oh well, I'm sure I'll buy one, why the hell not right?
What, me worry?
"It's not a war on drugs, it's a war on personal freedom. Keep that in mind at all times." Bill Hicks
Is anyone else sick and tired of 20 year old technology getting slapped together into some cheezy consumer product and being heralded as the cure for cancer? Is a gyrosco-ped supposed to make me go out and spend a ton of money on something that is functionally useless?
Maybe we haven't been telling people what we want loud enough, because they're getting worse at guessing. Come on market researchers, earn your money!
...when you could just add a third wheel to this rehashed Razor Scooter out in front and improve balance *without* $3000 of worthless technology? Sure, it'd look like a motorised tricycle, but it's about as useful as one anyway. It looks like the dot-com "hype-over-substance" marketing tactic has crossed over into transportation too.
Wasn't there a thing named IT in an episode of South Park? Mr. Garrison was pissed at airline companies and invented his own form of transportation involing a gyroscope and an anal probe.
*shrug*
What advantages does it bring that the bicycle doesn't? And what exactly will people do in winter? Sure they say that it works well on snow, but I don't feel like riding it when it's -40 degrees outside. I agree, it's a technological marvel but I don't see how it can help me in my day-to-day live. At a speed of 8 miles an hour, it's clearly not enough. I can walk faster than that.
The most important part of this is the "just think about stopping" part, the advanced system that mimics human movement.
While I predict this will be at BEST a fad, we can now finally take the core technology and start building robotic war mecha.
ZOMG I WOULD LOVE TO KNOW ABOUT YOUR FEELINGS ON MACINTOSH VERSUS WINDOWS, VI VERSUS EMACS, AND HOW YOU'RE NOT A DORK
What a load of hype. So the Segway has no engine or brakes, but it has motors. So, it uses gyros and the motors to maintain stability/locomotion (doing away with the throttle), and it uses a wrist control to go left/right. The motors must use regenerative braking to stop and recharge the batteries. Looks like the Segway is an imaginative, very high-tech, very expensive.... electric scooter.
Hmm... If the Segway is allowed on sidewalks, there would be instant competition in the form of conventional electric scooters. They wouldn't be anywhere near as cool, but they also wouldn't cost $3000 or more. And, they'd run longer since they would not need to expend juice to feed the gyros and microcontrollers.
Hey, if everybodys doing it, it must be cool. Kinda like smoking, drinking, screwing, etc...
Negative:
Another thing to make Americans more lazy. I mean come on if you cant bring yourself to walk the 25 feet between your living room and bathroom to take a leak, you should be shot. 7 deadly sins - sloth.
Positive:
Necessity breeds innovention. If your 500lbs boss cant seem to walk the distance between his/her limo and office then use Ginger!!!! Think of all the pain on his/her knee joints.
My sig (if i could remember my login): Je m'en fiche!
It just be super-revolutionary,but do we all really beleive Steve Job's comment that "cities will be built around it?" taking a looking at Time's 'scoop', i find that hardly possible.
Ok, it's a scooter, it goes slower than a moped, yet a little faster than walking. Big deal. Are we all willing to shell out that much cash to go slightly faster than walking? Don't even get me started on how it looks...it looks like the person is riding on an old fashioned push-mower.
I doubt this will revolutionize anything, all the gyro's and balance monitoring aside, it isn't that practical. It looks gay.
A search for IT will find about 410,000,000 results, most of which are about the lower case "it". Didn't they learn from the DIVX/DivX confusion?
And it was in part spoofing the original IT stories. It was a good episode, well worth watching. As far as I'm concerned, their comments about air travel were dead on ("Will people go through that just to get around?" "It's still better than dealing with the airlines" "Oh... Yeah... Yeah...")
I'm trying to teach myself to set people on fire with my mind... Is it hot in here?
It's not like they've discovered flight or built the first boat or the wheel. All they've done is engineered a nice electric scooter. Cool but it seems harly "earth shattering", perhaps "earth nudging."
This thing is alost a flying broom so I say we start the NQL, National Quiditch League.
Maryann was more of a babe, by far!
Wow, that Dean Kane guy sure has been busy since the young Superman series ended. Who would have though a handsome actor could also be such a brilliant scientist and inventor??
What that's you say? Dean KAMEN?
Oh.
Nevermind!
SlashSigTheorem: Humorous, Political, Critical, Constructive- If you have a
Although I'm sure that many /.ers are disappointed in IT, IT is a practical application of new technology. While it is not the pollution powered rocket ship that some had envisioned, it is a definite step forward.
I personally think that more efficient forms of transportation could be very important, especially considering the fact that we get the fuel for our cars from the middle east. While the war in Afghanistan is going well, it will not eliminate strife in the area, and oil prices could well rise. After the Middle East is largely under the control of the USA, oil companies will likely gain a monopoly on Middle Eastern oil, another event likely to drive up oil prices. I'd love to see the big oil companies lose a bunch of money encouraging this war, only to find out that everyone's moving around on little scooters and the Middle East oil isn't very valuable anymore.
These will never be successful as long as people are scared of 10 year olds.
Besides, many cities, counties and states do not allow vehicles of this description on sidewalks.
OK,
Can I drive this thing with crutches ??
Marcel
Free Web based FTP
I guess the rumors were true.
I for one am very disappointed. How is this more important than the internet? But what is?
they'll be a very efficient way of delivering AOL signup cd's door to door.
Soon, @home will be our victim, but right now, it's only Michael Jackson, Verizon, the Pentium 4 and Ain't it Cool News
tcd004
I can't wait to run one of these with my now useless 4000 lb piece of metal.
If this came out when scooters were still "in" it might have been some what cool, but I live in Wisconsin, and I am sure as hell not going to use this in winter. What is the point of this? I am sure its nice, but riding your bike would be easier. Also, many municipalities do now allow anykind of wheeled transportation on sidewalks (wheelchairs are allowed). I would not go down main street at 10 miles per hour on one of these with people pulling in and out. I doesn't even look that manuverable. I am sure what is left of the Silicon Valley techies that have jobs will get these, but no one else.
Why doesn't he bring out his stirling cycle engine that he is also hyping. That would have been alot more useful.
Welcome to the Entropy Bar, may I take your order?
I swear, I'm going to get sued when I'm crashed into by a corporate CEO who gets his $4000 suit ruined.
Even the sight of corporate monkeys riding around on these things on sidewalks will be hilarious.
Steve Jobs has seen it and he said it would change the world. Remember the last time he said that? He was introducing the iMac.
Does anybody else remember the South Park in which Mr. Garrison builds a device which goes at 300MPH and 150MPG? He does this because of the piss poor service at airlines. The government bans use of his device because otherwise the sagging airline industry will suffer.
Hey, it could happen.
The real strength of this, wasn't really focused on in the articles - it's easy to use.
.. let's see your fancy gyromajig work then. AHAR!
Obviously, having never ridden one, I can't say for sure, but it seems that all the gyros et al will lead to this being a very simple getabout.
Of course, being a mountain biker, if I see any of these on the bike paths, I will be throwing magnets at you
ahem
Why does everyone assume that "IT" is going to be the next great product that will solve everyones problems? Sure, this guy has made some great stuff in the past but that doesn't at all mean that "IT" will be great or useful. IT could be a useless piece of shit. It could be some product that looks great on the surface(e.g. Parking meters that were first made to ease parking and traffic problems and now are used to make cities tons of money and not help with traffic or anything else now) but turns out to be just another product destroyed by the human desire to make money. I hope it's great but why the hell fall into the hype just to be let down and upset about what IT really is later?
"Developed at a cost of more than $100 million"
EXCUSE ME??? I think the curve for IQ assesment has to be adjusted, VC's have just managed to proove that it should extend well into the negative realm.
And this is better than my decked-out 2.8-liter Audi A4 HOW?
Probably because they're $8000.
Coke was "It"?
br.
My brain hurts.
$0.02 (CDN)
Screwing is pretty cool, actually.
Anyone got a better idea what this is about?
No Engine?
Why do I suddenly feel like Homer?
"It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
Apparently, balance is attained with the help of sensors and logic boards and powerful electric motors. I think it'll be fun to watch an IT malfunction (perhaps as a result of a bug in the firmware) or run out of juice while someone is riding it. Will she fall forwards or backwards? In any case, I am sure it will be a very characteristic and, after a while, instantly recognizable motion. IT will be the high-tech version of the banana peel -- instant laugh for everybody who's watching at that fateful moment.
When I look at the hype surrounding this thing, it reminds me of Transmeta. Transmeta had some of the world's brightest computer geeks working on a s3kr1t pr0j3k+ that would change the world, and it turned out to be yet another x86 clone (whoo hoo.) Now there is another company with bright scientists working on a s3kr1t pr0j3k+ that would change the world, and it turns out to be a motorscooter. (whoo hoo.)
Moral of the story: Don't believe the hype.
..you gotta admit, it could solve some real problems in big cities. Kamen's genius lies not only in his engineering, but in his realistic viewpoint. He knows that, except for the early adopter crowd, people aren't going to want these. However, that won't matter. If you read the Time article, he tells you straight up that he's going to focus on postal carriers, police, etc. first. Once Ginger is proven in those capacities, people will want one. Also note that he's seeing it as a middle ground commute vehicle. I personally would've shelled out the money to be able to be in traffic with a Ginger instead of my pig of a car that takes so much space and had a payload of exactly 1 person. (And don't even get me started on car pooling; what a frickin waste of time!)
Please mod this post only if you think others should/n't read this. I have enough ego^H^H^Hkarma. Thanks!
wasnt this a south park episode. 511_The_Entity Yup it is from that episode, hehe, no really watch it.
Yes, I think Segway is cool. Of course, it's been so overhyped that unless it has the ability to teleport people across space it will feel like a disappointment.
This thing is not for rich suburban white guys who hang out on internet all day. Its for postmen and chinamen. Ever been to a crowded asian city? What a nightmare. The elites will definitaly prefer a Segway to other vehicles. The american consumer is probably the last market for this thing.
This thing is probably expensive and weighs a ton. Oooh, it stands up on its own, how have I lived without it! If you want an electric personal transportation device, TH!NK about one of these instead.
Make us fatter?
Yes -- 8 miles per hour replaces only a single mode of transportation that I am familiar with: walking. Not true -- elevators go O(10^1) mph, safest mode of transport too, unlike these death traps! (sp?)
I hate to complain, but this seems a little unnecessary doesn't it? My progenitors have spent millions upon millions of years evolving all these groovy body parts. More relevantly, I've evolved these nifty LEG things to which comes attach an even niftier FOOT. Not only that, but I have two of these wonderful appendages.
What does this mean? Well, in simple terms, if I want to go somewhere, I don't need to friggin trumped up little scooter because, thank's to these nifty legs... I can get in a car and drive.
What, You thought I would walk? Are you mad?
I am BelDion's
The NY Times article seemed just a tad tolerant of the hucksterism going on here. In addition to the cost of the vehicle, throw in maintenance costs, insurance costs, extra insurance for worker's comp payments when your postman goes down on this thing and the 3 mph that he loses when carrying a 50 lb bag of mail on his back because he "doesn't need" a truck and you got yourself a great big worthless fleet of hype machines on your hands. Someone has friends in high places to get the USPS to want to take these contraptions for a test spin.
---Technology will liberate us if it doesn't enslave us first.
1. Ok, I'm visualizing moving forward on my new scooter.
2. Hey, look at that -- this is pretty neat!
3. Ok, now I'm visualizing turning the corner...
4. Wow, it knows what I want!
5. Ok, let's go a little faster.
6. Cool.
7. Umm. That tree is coming towards us awful fast, visualizing not hitting it.
8. Hello, anyone there?
9. AAARRARAGGGHGHHHHHH!
10. Ok, visualizing getting out of the hospital bed...
We do need a revolution in transport. Something
like a low three wheeled bike with a mini petrol
motor, weighing about 30kg would do the trick.
Keep it simple will solve our transport problems.
This segway gimmick won't.
I must admit that I'm fairly disappointed by "IT". I was somehow hoping for giant war mecha or something of that type. I don't know...an electric scooter like this just lacks something...especially after all this hype. Reading through the posts here, I can see that most of you are in agreement with me. However, I really think we're missing the point. Steve Jobs could be right.
We Americans have never really been very much interested in public transportation. Trains, busses, subways...they all take second place to our cars. Our nice, inefficient, polluting cars. Now then, could you imagine if these things genuinely cought on? Imagine having our cities interconnected with high-speed railways, not highways. Imagine replacing all the roads in our cities with smaller pedestrian walkways, populated with people on Segways. Imagine how much less polution there would be, how much less noise would be generated, and how much less space would be wasted.
Yeah, I know...I'm still waiting for my flying cars and giant robots...but this could actually be useful technology.
yrs,
Ephemeriis
"Work is the curse of the drinking classes." -Oscar Wilde
Quick! Register www.segway.com :)
You say it is "just a scooter". That is like calling the automobile just a "horseless carriage." It's just the closest concept you have to fit. As far as hype, Kamen tried to downplay the "hype" none of which was advertisement, but statements "taken out of context" from the likes of Jobs and Metcalfe (you know the guy who said linux would "fade away"). Can't you see that a vehicle which uses Dynamic Stability to be driven as an extension of your own body movements is a great innovation? What the hell happened to Slashdot, where putting linux on the dreamcast is cool, just because it can be done, yet the Segway is "just a scooter." What the hell?
I think that this is a pretty cool invention, and this guy is the real thing. But I was extremely disapointed when he started commenting about how it was going to "change cities" and get rid of cars.
This assertion begs several questions (which are extremly relevent to someone living in, say, Austin, where I am):
1. How many people live close enough to work that they can afford the time to communte on a device that moves at walking speed? (no one I know)
2. How many people live in places where the weather is neither too warm or too cold to spend the time outside?
3. How many businesses have the infrastructure to handle storing and charging these things?
4. Is it really going to share the sidewalk with pedestrians? Where are they going to go now?
5. What about security? Riding around on a $3000 device that can't move faster than walking speed is a huge crime oppurtunity.
I really get disapointed when people who are smart in one are (ie fantastic engineering) think that they can easily solve all the problems (real or not) for the rest of us. The market of ideas, economics, and labor always decides what happens based on the aggregate effect of the millions of small decisions made by the individuals.
If his device really is good enought to get rid of cars, it won't be because he SAID so, it will be because he made something that has the same (or better) combination of convinience, speed, economy (both $$ and time), and security as the car. And, unfortunately, this cool device is not "IT".
Donut, glad "IT" doesn't make you DP and ski-pole to operate.
Yeah Time, it's called a fucking electric motor.
--------
get jiggy w/ ayn rand!
My street is 45mph, it only does 17mph. I only live 5 miles from work, but we dont have bike lanes or sidewalks for me to use it. Most of the people at work live 20+ miles, not doable. And my laptop bag is too heavy to carry that far.
Really, the only thing I could use it for is short trips to the store, but where would I carry my groceries?
Before I could use it daily, need the roads to have bike lanes, and I need to carry a payload.
While Dean Kamen's Segway scooter is an interesting technological achievement, I have two concerns:
1. Because using Segway is so unlike anything out there in terms of personal transportation devices, the reseller better really teach people how to use it correctly. I have visions of clueless Segway riders crashing into other pedestrians and larger vehicles because they're not used to how to stop this scooter.
2. The US$3,000.00 cost for the personal version is way too expensive, IMHO. Kamen should seriously talk with the one company that produce a Segway-like scooter at a reasonable cost: Honda. Using its motorcycle and electric vehicle expertise, Honda could build such a scooter for US$1,800.00 or less per scooter.
This thing looks big and clunky, it will never become popular.
Unless it can be carried around as a handbag and is light enough for grandma to carry it might accually be popular. Those razor scooters seem like a pain in the ass to carry around when your in the store. The same goes for bikes and rollerblades when you arent using them.
On the other hand, the same can be said for a car. Except that cars have parking spots and bikes have bike racks and that explains why they are more popular to use than any other type of mechanical transportation.
Steve Jobs reckoned this thing was going to change the world. Ladies and Gentlemen, I think we have been conned!!
It's heavier, cheaper and slower than a bicycle, not to mention 10 times more expensive. Why bother?
How is this any different than the motorized scooters that kids are using these days? Looks to me that scooters have the advantage of folding up and taking up less space. Now if they were powered by nuclear waste using thermonic devices that would be cool.
Go to www.segway.com and you'll get the standard IE "This page cannot be displayed" form with all sorts of helpful advice on why it can't.
Which is all well and good, except I am using Omniweb. Damn that freaked me out.
Let the conspiracy theories begin!
Laugh while you can, monkey boy!
This is yet another way for people to remove themselves from nature. Just another reason for people to get fat and lazy and ride a scooter around the shopping mall instead of use the tools god gave them that just so happen to be attached to their legs.
It's trendy, gauranteed to be over priced and basically useless. It steers itself, yeah great ok. Steering was so hard, it's about time someone put an end to all this steering nonsense. I mean actually having to turn the handle bars, god forbid. This is the greatest invention since power steering.
Gimme a break. How long before the sillicon valley yuppie is spotted at Yosemite park in their BMW SUV with a Ginger strapped to the back so they can ride through the park at 12 miles an hour to digest the sites faster so they can talk on their cell phones at the next stop and plug more data into their PDA before they shuffle off to their mobile office (BMW SUV) and cellular fax machine.
I'm sick to death of this crap. To all lazy people, get a mountain bike!!! Go hiking!! Do something with those patheticlly weak limbs attached to your flabby body.
Not just a scooter, but similar. with computer controls to slow down the boss and allow you to track them
I guess we'll just have to see it to "get it". From everything I see, there is a big cooness factor involved. And I gues it doesn't have an engine. which makes me say "HUH?!"
"It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
look here -> http://dailynews.yahoo.com/fc/Tech/Ginger/
I heard about "IT" back in april, apparently there are stories about it going back to 01/01 and even 1999 (I dunno how specific the 1999 stories are, however).
Not to mention that my gf mentioned the story to me THURSDAY
Slashdot; news for slow people, Stuff that's 2 years old...
All that engineering just to make 2 big wheels do what 4 smaller ones could without $100M of technology. All that technology just to do what the bike already does.
Yeah, Kamen is a genius.
I'll stick with my bike and use the money to upgrade to leather and heated seats in my new car.
What happens when the battery dies? I assume the thing can't keep you balanced properly without power!
Ok, here's my major question... If it is a self-balancing, high speed transportation device, what practical use does it have? The human body has an amazing ability to balance (I can ride a unicycle, I know this for a fact). In other words, it might be a technological marvel, (a bicicle that never falls down), but it's nothing mechanical that humans don't pretty much automatically do.
Moderation: Put your hand inside the puppet head!
Dean Kamen should really go for a patent on Methods of Influencing and Abusing the Media using Respected Businessmen and Venture Capitalists now that he knows the trade so well. He should have to pay for every keystroke, every packet transmitted, every second of mobile phone time, etc. that was wasted on hype...
I must admit, this is a pretty nifty application of existing technology (notice I didn't say "invention"), but I'm not really sure how anyone hopes this will ever be legal. On the streets of my home (New York City) a Segway rider wouldn't be allowed on the sidewalks, just like bicycles. And I don't care how stable it is - if a Segway rider got hit by a taxi going 40mph, he would still die.
New transportation mechanisms have always been met with huge hurdles to adoption. Most of them don't make it through the institutional barriers put up by the automobile manufacturers and oil companies. Even John Doerr and Steve Jobs (for all their arrogance) don't throw around the kind of influence it would take to "build cities around this invention". I can see only a few reasonable applications:
I'm sure it's useless, but I'll say it anyway - I hope the media learned its lesson this time!
More ways to not get off our fat-asses and walk.
-Russ
P.S. That would be me with a nice set of extra tires around the midside too.
Me
Now that's a scary picture
"It is a greater offense to steal men's labor, than their clothes"
Damn it, I was hoping for a child-eating clown
with all the processing power this has, it might actually be useful to have a beowulf cluster of these. it seems sufficiently redundant, so one could be doing something complex on one of the extra cpu's (article says it has 10, that seems excessive imho) assuming it isnt needed, as you commute to work or whatnot. and with dozens of them in future ginger-garages, hooking them up to crunch seti@home packets or something more useful may be a nice way to publicaly donate powerful hardware when not in use.
...with a Beowulf cluster of these? (yes, I had to ask)
The sidewalk issue is dicier. In order to ensure that Segways are permitted to move alongside pedestrians, Kamen's regulatory-affairs mavens will have to keep the machine from being classified either as a motor vehicle or as a scooter. At the federal level, the deal is done--though, for a while, the Occupational Safety and Health Administration wanted to classify the Segway as a "powered industrial truck." Technically, final sidewalk authority rests with state and local governments. Kamen is betting, however, that the decision will be made not by lawmakers but "de facto, by what becomes standard practice. If we have police and mail carriers riding on the sidewalks for a year, how is anyone in government going to say, 'It's O.K. for us but not O.K. for you'?"
I'm no gun freak, but they say it about carrying guns in public....
"First you gotta do the truffle shuffle."
until someone hacks it and puts linux on it? Seems like all geeks do nowadays :)
If the software of this were to be Linux or something Open Source, then /. would be all over the 'hype' bandwagon. But since it isn't it all must be an evil capitalist invention. /. people have to gasp get real jobs, perhaps you'd wished you'd invested in something besides crap.
Next year at this time ( or shortly after ) when VA is bankrupt and you
NO i... 2-LETTER PRONOWNS INSIDE THIS ARTICLE!
:-)
:-)
GET RELIEVED!!!
Among all the hype pouring at us from all
directions about this gadget, I am somewhat
relieved to see that the "technology" topic icon
on Slashdot hasn't yet morphed into a two-wheeled
something
Grrrrr.... With a sprained knee, a brace and a
pair of crutches I hope to get better before test
drive is available around.
Looks like everyone who is physically able to
drive a scooter (or even less able) will be able
to try soon and say if he likes or not. Don't
barf at now just because is not a flying
saucer that you expected out of the previous
mystery hype and you can't get hold of this
gadget
VKh
Nice toy, but hardly practical, and at 8mph you may as well get your ass in shape and ride a bicycle. I can double this silly thing's speed without breaking a sweat, and I'm hardly fit, by bicyclist standards (or anyone else's for that matter).
Sorry, Kamen, it may be a hoot to ride, but this thing isn't terribly well-suited for outdoor urban usage. Indoors is another story however...it would be a riot to zip about a mall or large store on "IT".
it's $3000 (the commercial version is $8000), it makes you look like a dork, and you can't buy one and won't be able to for quite some time... and we've been waiting a year for it to be announced...
These guys take after Microsoft too much.
Actually, I'm really surprised.
I would have expected a lot more acceptance from the other readers of Slashdot. Or maybe it is simply a case of the "Slashdot Syndrome". (that would be not reading the entire article before you post.)
This is amazing technology!
From the Time article:
"Lean forward, go forward; lean back, go back; turn by twisting your wrist. The experience is the same going uphill, downhill or across any kind of terrain--even ice. It is nothing like riding a bike or a motorcycle. Instead, in the words of Vern Loucks, the former chairman of Baxter International and a Segway board member, "it's like skiing without the snow."
I don't know how many of you have ever been snow skiing, but it is amazing! There is a reason it's so popular.
Also from the article:
"Cars are great for going long distances," Kamen says, "but it makes no sense at all for people in cities to use a 4,000-lb. piece of metal to haul their 150-lb. asses around town."
This is so true! We are so wasteful as a nation in this way. It makes absolutely no sense!
Again, from the article:
"...Dean Kamen...The 50-year-old son of a comic-book artist, he is a college dropout, a self-taught physicist and mechanical engineer with a handful of honorary doctorates, a multimillionaire who wears the same outfit for every occasion: blue jeans, a blue work shirt and a pair of Timberland boots." and "But if Kamen's personality is half Willy Wonka, the other half is closer to Thomas Edison. While he was still struggling in college, Kamen invented the first drug-infusion pump, which enabled doctors to deliver steady, reliable doses to patients. In the years that followed, he invented the first portable insulin pump, the first portable dialysis machine and an array of heart stents, one of which now resides inside Vice President Dick Cheney."
This guy is a hackers hacker! Give the guy a break. I'll be the first to say it (on Slashdot anyway) I think it's going to be a huge hit!
Co-founder and designer at Music Nearby: http://musicnearby.com
The flash presentation makes an interesting claim on the motors:
"Two of them drive each wheel independently. Fully redundant. If one fails, the other takes over."
I would like to see this.
Also claims to have 5 Gyro's that "operate by commitee, voting among themselves to eliminate errent readings"
Would this device work in Florida?
Stop saying that word! AAAGH! You said it again! AAAGH! Now I said it! I said it again! That's three its! AAAaaagh!
Do any of you actually live in a city? This is amazing.
An airbag, seatbelts and will require a helmet and special license to operate???
But, it's not just due to the need to be dry that I dismiss the "revolutionary" hype surrounding this toy -- it's the fact that people already arrange their lives around the automobile. In LA the average commute is 30 mins (which must be grossly skewed by people working from home, because it is nigh-impossible to go anywhere in LA in 30 minutes). People work in central areas but live in increasingly-remote housing areas. As a matter of fact, the fasest growing region in the country is the Inland Empire, a smog-filled, hot-as-hell snake pit (lovely place) east of LA. But the house prices are very low compared to the "beach cities". It's the automobile that makes this commute possible. So, tell me how many people are going to forgo an automobile, with it's creature comforts and potential for travelling a fast speeds, for an 8 mile-an-hour gyroscoping pogo-stick? You'd have to not merely redesign cities but reverse the suburbanization of America to make this a widely-used device. Too many people have invested the next 30 years of income into their home in the (hellish as they may be) suburbs.
And Alan would point out man solved the balance problem long before the gyroscope by adding another wheel. Low tech, but effective.
-- @rjamestaylor on Ello
Consumer versions are supposed to be $3000 USD, but still.... I live 2.5 miles from work, but Ginger supposedly has a top speed of 8mph... It would take me about 19 minutes to get to work. Taking the public transportation, it takes me around 20 - 25 minutes and I'm able to read along the way... I was really excited about ginger until I found out how slow it was...
Where's the market? All the people who can afford a $3000 scooter live in the suburbs and couldn't use it to commute to work, and all the people in the city can't afford it. (Obviously a generalization, but in terms of potential market it's on target)
At least it will make a good kids toy :-P
-- Michael Lee Martin
But this could actually mean the *end* of the razor scooter.
*BUDUM-CHING!*
The next Slashdot story will be ready soon, but subscribers can beat the rush and slashdot the links early!
In the U.K. years and years ago a chap called Clive Sinclair brought out a three wheeled electric car called the C5. The performance was similar to a bike when the electric motor was engaged but you often had to physically pedal it up steep inclines. It wasn`t awful but simply didn`t catch the public`s imagination. Better than walking, but not as good as a bike, and certainly not a replacement for a car.
Unless this invention turns out to be better than some existing form of transport it will probably fail. Generally the public give things like this short shrift.
As an owner of both a Zappy and a TurboScooter I can tell you that 8-12 mph is HORRIBLE. The TurboScooter goes about 21 mph (with me on it) and that is about right. No one wants to commute for 2.5 miles and have it take as long as the bus (or longer at 8mph). Especially since you typically need to have these sorts of batteries always charging (must have a charger at work). The idea that it is hard to tip over is interesting, but if it weighs 65lbs to do this, you are going to have trouble bringing it up stairs or in stores. One of the big problems with electric scooters is that they are not meant to be driven on sidewalks and they have a smaller profile than this thing. Personally, when walking on a sidewalk, there are many times when I step sideways to get past people or to pass people and something like this is way too wide to play nice with people. As far as the price goes, $3000 is going to be a hard sell to the general public. Even on my TurboScooter, which is way more practical for commuting than this device, cost less than half that and people stick their nose up at the price. It will have to be in the $500-$1000 range and the only way for it to get there is for mass production of these things to begin. Without the network effect for charging stations, new sidewalk laws, etc, I don't see these making any in roads into real life.
I love this type of technology, and I may even buy one myself, but I also by dual processor machines, ReplayTVs, and Plasma screens. I am certainly the exception.
BTW, when you run into someone with a 65lb Segway going 8 mph, it isn't going to be pretty.
"If I can see farther it is because I am surrounded by dwarves." -- Murray Gell-Mann
The remarkable funny--and eerie-- thing about the SP episode is that when the announcer ended talking about Mr. Garrison's invention, he said... "The most important thing to remember Tom, is the question that is on everyone's minds... What is IT, and when will I be able to buy one?"
From the Time article:
As Kamen sees it, all these issues will quickly fade if the question most people ask about the Segway is "How do I get one?"
El Karma: excelente(principalmente la suma de moderación hecha a los comentarios de los usuarios)
Electric Scooter $3000 or $600 Bike + $2400 Beer.
IT = 8MPH, Bike = 15MPH
IT = no excersize, Bike = 300+ Cal/hr
IT = No beer, Bike 2400 micro brew or 4800 Bud/MGD
IT = requires power, Bike = burn off beer gut (see above)
Ok, so IT looks nice and all. But I have one question, how does it deal with snow?
-- http://frobnosticate.com
Note that there's nothing exciting here on the powerplant front; you get a choice of NiCd or nickel-metal-hydride batteries. And it doesn't climb stairs; Kamen patented a stair-climbing version, but that's not what's being shown now.
Whether this will catch on remains to be seen. Powered scooters, rollerblades, and skateboards perform much the same role more cheaply.
Balancing with two cross-track wheels leads to some wierd situations. For one thing, to stop fast, you have to speed up to move the CG back, then decelerate. So it's probably a "lean back to slow down" thing, rather than one with a throttle-like control. Stopping distance may be a problem. And I look forward to seeing how Kamen handles wheel slip.
The business plan depends on some big delivery service buying the thing. But for that, you'd like something that can carry packages.
while that's pretty rude, IT lacks a couple of things. IT isn't as catchy as "goat sex", and IT is less gross to see some women spread open that way than it is to see a man spreading himself that far open.
/. reporting on old as fuck stories alrady did that.
I don't see it catching on personally.
Also, it didn't make me toss my lunch, either.
Seriously... it's an interesting piece of tech, but I'll take my bike anyday.
---If you can't trust a nerd, who can you trust?
I think all the people who are saying "electric scooter, big whoop. $3,000, yeah right" are slightly missing the point. Yeah, it's kind of wimpy for the price tag. Yeah, it's kind of expensive, and it's questionable who would want to use it.
But this is just the first model. It's more sort of a proof of concept--a demonstration that the scooter can work, and looks as neat as all get-out in motion. As time goes on, the performance will improve and the price will fall.
Look at the Palm (Pilot). The first model was, what, 128K? With no backlight, no infra-red, or anything? And how high was the price tag? And now the Visor Deluxe, which was at one time the wet dream of anybody who even looked at a Palm, is only $130 brand new.
Look at the DVD player. The original models were expensive enough, the first bunch of discs were glitchy enough, that a lot of people scoffed and made snide remarks. But the DVD went on to become the fastest-adopted new consumer technology ever.
So here we have a relatively slow, electric-powered self-stabilizing scooter, for $3,000. Are very many of us going to buy it? Do very many of us have the money to sink into that sort of gee-gaw? No and no. I know I'm not going to be spending three grand on something like that myself, either. Nor would I be likely to spend two grand, or even one grand.
But by the time it gets to about $500, sign me up.
Editor Emeritus and Senior Writer, TeleRead.org
Would't this describe a brick, that uses electricity?
From the time story "And it can carry the average rider for a full day, nonstop, on only five cents' worth of electricity."
"Pulling off this trick requires an unholy amount of computer power. In every Segway there are 10 microprocessors cranking out three PCs' worth of juice."
Now running THAT many CPUs on 5 cents worth of juice is nothing short of a miracle.. and it zips you around too? I mean my Inspiron takes up to 70 watts of power and uses between 3-7 killowatt hours of electricity per 'day' or around $1 worth of juice.
Every once in a while for the past couple of months, I'd come across some tiny blurb about "the much-hyped (IT|Ginger)". But these blurbs, which seemed to be few and far between, primarily dealt with the "hype" surrounding this thing. They would have been a sort of meta-hype, except that there weren't even enough of those articles to constitute anything more than a sort of collective raised eyebrow.
There wasn't even a concerted effort to be mysterious about it, as far as I can tell. Nobody was saying much, and nobody much cared when it did come up.
So now I'm supposed to believe that this scooter thing was made out to be the next Sliced Bread, that everyone was quivering in anticipation, and that rumours have been swirling for months about its mysterious nature? Bullshit, we've barely heard of it. This is a strange sort of revisionist history indeed.
Or maybe I just don't go to the same parties that Time reporters do.
At 3000 bucks american a pop, it seems that that owning one will be a way of saying, "Yeah, I'm both rich AND lazy!"
--Nuintari
slashdot : where an opinion can be wrong.
I find it hard to comprehend a machine that was developed with pita bread, pseudolamb "meat", cucumber sauce and Greek flair.
My little sad piece of the internet: www.mtndewd
This IT will be a huge success - electric powered novelty vehicles from strange inventors have a great track record
http://www.thehungersite.com
And how will this thing handle ice and snow?
Carl
Vote Libertarian
Since when are Americans into low power/ low emission transportation anyway? if there weren't gas stations where would we go to the bathroom??
ôó
Quite frankly, I'd prefer the version envisioned by Modern Humorist.
I mean, it looks cool and all, and I'd love to try one, but I can't see myself using one to get to work. My feet have been working so far, and this would probably be dangerous. I have visions of "Gingerites" constantly running into old people... The office I work in is next door to a casino, so there's no shortage of those around here.
So are you just supposed to leave this thing in the parking lot, or are you expected to keep in your cube at work? Or leave it in the bike rack and wonder why it disappeared while you were gone?
What gets me is the price - $3k for an electric scooter! Come on! For the same price you can get something that's a much nicer toy (the Kawasaki Ninja 250R has a retail price of $2,999, gets over 70mpg, does 0-60 in 5.5 seconds, and you won't look like a complete dork while riding one). Can you say 'Sinclair C5' all over again?
Being a bicyclist, I am partial to light, fast, cheap transportation. The Segway appears to be none of these. It is expensive, a brute-force solution to a non-problem IMHO. That's why I, at least, am underwhelmed.
Then again, I dislocated my shoulder last week on my bicycle while avoiding traffic. Maybe I can ride it again tomorrow, maybe not, but it has been quite painful and made it much harder to run errands around town (take the time to run an errand on a bike and double it; you've just arrived at the time to complete it, driving, if it's in downtown DC and you have to park). This device would make such injuries irrelevant. I'm sure it would be wonderful for elderly or infirm people who can't drive. So perhaps I am an "able-ist" in that I am biased to think about things as if I'll always be hale and healthy.
If the product is made affordable, it would be a lot nicer and less intrusive than a Lark or a Rascal for sure. But I don't see it as being quite as revolutionary as the car, simply because it does not radically increase carrying capacity, doesn't really offer commercially compelling advantages over a regular scooter, pair of feet, or a bicycle to balance out the cost... I don't see how this device would change the world for the average mope, but for some people it sounds like a godsend.
Attenuate your expectations, as this Dean Kamen seems to be telling us, and in context it is pretty neat. Not earth-shattering, but pretty neat, alright.
Remember that what's inside of you doesn't matter because nobody can see it.
Figure out how to overclock and create the jet skateboard that is needed.
The thing i want to know is, what do you do when you get to work? Unless you bring it into your cube, you cant do a thing. Someone could get take off with it.
What if these damn terrorists use IT? Who will patrol IT? If I use IT must I use the same signals as bike riders... I hate bike riders... They never obey the rules and cops never pull them over. Will townships have a demand for "no IT on the sidewalk" signs? um, IDEA! I am going to start making "IT is not a crime t-shirts" now... Wait for my new website in 10 min. or so! Your support wanted!
great! let's create even MORE overweight Americans. the only exercise many lazy Americans get is walking from work to train, work to car, walking in malls, etc...
now, even THAT pitiful regimen is threatened by this little scooter. a cool idea, but we have more pampering than we need in the USA...
Yeah, I was one of the faceless posters that spammed /. about the unveiling of IT tomorrow morning, and got my story axed like everyone else. As stated somewhere above, if this many people keep posting about it, then why the fuck wouldn't the news-mongers of Slashdot post it sooner? And why the hell does everyone want to immediately bash the damn thing? Are you really that pissed that it's been over-hyped? I haven't heard anything about it since the first of the year, and had actually forgotten about it until the SouthPark episode the other week.
/.'ers don't either). It worries me that if this does catch on, will we all become bigger fatasses if we stop walking everywhere? I think there's more implications than just changing the world of transportation (if it really does go that far)...
I for one would love to at least try one of these out--looks like it may be fun. The price is way to high for me, and probably for the rest of America for quite some time. On the other hand, I'd like to consider the fact that I don't get much exercise as is (and probably most
Sometimes I doubt your commitment to Sparkle Motion.
Bikes cost very little. They don't weigh very much. They're simple and most problems can be fixed without going to a shop. And if countries provide the intrastructure (as most do, the US being an excpetion), the bike fills the gap between walking and driving a car just fine. Of course it lacks the geek-factor though...
The problem I see with this is that cars provide something that public transportation does not. Americans are private people - I like my music, in my truck, without having to put up with cigarette smoke, Mr. Loudmouth hitting on the cutie in the next aisle, worrying about being robbed/stabbed/accosted, or the other little niceties we seem to beat each other with. Public transit also hasn't caught on since it seems that America cannot run an efficient mass-transit system. Trains are late, people crowd in and cause delays, etc. If I'm late, it's usually my own fault.
I'm not against an efficient, well-designed mass transit system - or an electric car that can provide the same 'seat of the pants' feeling as my truck or my motorcycle - but the facts of civilization in America may be a bigger hindrance to mass transit than any of the other items.
It's ugly. It looks like a push lawnmower.
It's unsafe. When you crash into something at 40 mph on one of these, you will sustain serious injuries. There are no seatbelts, because there are no seats. There is a picture of someone (Kamen?) riding the thing on drudgereport.com this evening. The rider is wearing a bicycle helmet. In terms of personal safety, that won't cut it.
There is no security. If I take my people-mover to work, leaving it in the parking lot, anyone can steal it.
No cargo room. Many car trips require the driver and passengers to bring something heavy along. I don't see how this will let you carry anything, even a shoulder bag, without disrupting the balance.
The faster you go, the more bugs you eat.
If I'm wrong about any of these, I will be very happy. We could use a new form of transport.
I am not a lawyer. Do not take my words as legal advice. If you need legal advice, consult an attorney.
This thing is a hacker's dream. It looks quite modern - microprocessors, firmware, etc. Not purely mechanical. The speed limit is set by the circuitry -- which means it is all hackable.
Imagine programming one of these things to spin you around, then accelerate to breakneck speed (perhaps literally) This could be quite fun!
Whoops, left out a "/" on that tag.
What Dean seems not to have realized is that although a segway would be useful in some cities, it won't be to any in America that I can think of. He intended it to replace the car for in-city commuting. But the problem with cars in-city is not from people residing within it - it's from all the people commuting to and from the city. The fact is, most people either live in the suburbs and commute all over the place by car, or in a few cases (New York especially) live in the city and commute by walking and public transportation. The segway is not in competition with the walker or the car, but the bike - a cheaper, faster, healthier, more flexible (try hauling a 60lb segway up stairs) and more environmentally responsible way of getting around. The segway might have some uses for certain industries and age groups, and it will probably go over better in Europe and especially Japan, but here in the states there's not much point to it.
---If you can't trust a nerd, who can you trust?
I have the explanation for how this gizmo works. As you lean in the direction you want to go, gravity acting on your body tries to pull you in that direction. The scooter, using its internal smarts, rolls that way without tipping over, maintaining balance, and thus you move off efficiently. It's the same propulsion system used in many perpetual motion machines. You can go as far and as fast as you want, powered by the acceleration of gravity.
(Please realise this is tongue-in-cheek. Though on a flat surface you can do alot with gravity and momentum -- that's why scooters work.)
-- We all have enough strength to endure the misfortunes of other people. La Rochefoucauld
Really. Firstly, once on wheels, can the driver be considered a "pedestrian?" Secondly, what about bicycles, scooters, and the like. I'm sure there is some incredible technology going on there, but the arrogance seems much more powerful.
pedestrian noun
A person traveling on foot; a walker.
"A mind is a terrible thing to taste."
I had my heart set on it being a twin-turbine personal helicopter :) funny thing is, I had this all worked out to the point where you could damned near build one, all on the basis that Steve Jobs et al wouldn't be fools enough to go ga-ga over a powered scooter.
I'll give 'em this much though: yes, designing cities without cars WILL eventually be necessary. Yes, that will be interesting and challenging and different. But I thought it had to be a lot more exciting, and pulled together loads of detail such as recent developments in titanium production, the capacity of (highly efficient) jet turbines to route their intake and exhaust in very counterintuitive ways, the geometry of a twin-ducted-fan standing platform and how this would be essentially stable and would require hard leaning to get it to move quickly- and even then, wind resistance on the high-mounted fans would mean that the machine would be trying to slow itself at all times, its CG located very low because a human would be standing on the base and their CG would be irrelevant, the orientation of the device would follow the centering effect of the human's weight delivered through the feet...
The only thing even vaguely like this would be the SoloTrek, and just think for a second of how much heavier _that_ monster is than a person- it's really just a mini helicopter, not even the balance issues would apply. As such, so much of its awful power and noise etc. is required simply to lift its own weight, and how much better it would be to use titanium and minimal, balance-oriented controls to make something so feather-light that it's barely heavier than a person, far more capable of urban use...
To top it all off, turbines are ideally suited for just _one_ speed, which is an ideal match for a heli-type device as it would be devoting pretty much every bit of its energy just to hovering, with no engines whatsoever for lateral motion- that would be strictly a matter of leaning in the desired direction like you were in a hang-glider. All this is just _waiting_ to be done, and Kamen has the resources to do it _and_ a background not only in aviation but in helicopters. It seemed so obvious.
Oh well...
You can get a really, really, nice bike for US$3000. And go faster then Segway, and be fitter for it.
You said:
Actually, if the Segway IT were allowed on sidewalks, there would be instant lawsuits, courtesy of conventional injury lawyers. Forget about skateboarders running into old ladies -- IT is gonna be great! "Call 1-800-ITHURTS!" :->
I don't see walking speeds being very useful, even to someone on their feet all day it would slow people down all that stopping leaning it up against a wall and then getting back on... What is wrong with a good pair of sneakers for one hundredth the cost?
But if this thing goes reasonably fast, can take hills and lasts all day then a lot of people will want them. I could see the post office buying a couple thousand of them.
...a Beowulf cluster of these things? Sheesh.
One of the hardest truths for any technologist to hear is that success or failure in business is rarely determined by the quality of the technology. Betamax was better than VHS; the Mac operating system is superior to Windows.
hahaha
It's also not clear where you are supposed to use these things. Using them in traffic seems more unsafe than a bicycle (since you are even less visible and have even less protection in front of you), but riding anything motorized at 15mph on the sidewalk seems both rude and dangerous. And these things are too slow for bicycle lanes.
A cynic might say that this is simply an attempt to boost sales of one of Kamen's other technologies: automatic insulin pumps, since obesity is the leading cause of diabetes.
Would you ride this to work instead of driving?
I am car-free[carfree.org]. I do not own a car and I use a bicycle to travel everywhere. I use a bicycle to buy groceries, visit friends, go to movies, get to work, etc. I am very aware of the attitudes of many Americans towards their cars. Americans do not like to give up their cars for even the shortest trips. If you suggest that a person ride a bicycle the short 5 miles to work they in general will not even consider this. It is outside the realm of possibility and imagination. The car manufactorers have done a great job of equation the following:
car = freedom = independance = success = identity
Unfortunately a person without a car is someone to pity. I would love to see everyone riding around on bikes or this new mobility device. Outside in the fresh air, exposed to the environment, enjoying themselves and being a little more environmentally responsible. (Why does it take over 100hp to get a single person to work and back every day?!)
I am not holding my breath. If people where that interested in traveling without cars why not use electric bikes?
If you already owned a car (and you probably do) why would you spend another $3000 to not drive your car and be given funny looks by friends and co-workers, secretly pitied, and thought a fool.
Unfortunately, having a car is an axiom for American life. For most American driving a car is a right dammit! (Or at least is should be) After all, without a car how would someone get around? There certainly aren't any other practical ways. Those guys riding bikes in the winter, rain and heat are just crazies. They only appear to be having a great time while everyone else is trapped and angry in their cars.
Share bicycle touring info worldwide: http://wheretocycle.com
I would be ashamed to admit IT.
"Everything you know is wrong. (And stupid.)"
Moderation Totals: Wrong=2, Stupid=3, Total=5.
At an average speed of 8 miles an hour, or three times walking pace, Mr. Kamen says the Segway can go 15 miles on a six- hour charge, for less than a dime's worth of electricity from a standard wall socket.
While I don't normally think of myself as a "rich suburban white guy" I supposed I am suburban, white, and fairly well paid. I tried to think of ways that I might actually use this because it seems so cool. However, with a 12 mile commute and a max speed of 8-15 miles an hour (couldn't quite figure that out) it's just not for me.
Maybe in time it will go faster, longer, etc.
That which does not kill me only makes me whinier
I can't believe some of you can't realize how this can effect travel.
There's no reason to drive 3000lbs of metal around on fuel that comes from the other side of the planet(for some, for the other's it's processed on the other side of the planet).
This thing is intended for cities. When I went to college, I had a transportation dillema. From the dorm room to the college classroom, it took 30 minutes to walk, 30 minutes to drive, 30 minutes to ride public transportation, 15 minutes to ride a bicycle, and maybe 10 to ride a motorcycle. This thing would do the job in ten, or less.
It's not large, so you can fit many in one place. You might be able to ride them inside buildings. It can go fast, or slow. It's safer than almost any other form of transportation, and can be enjoyed by a wider audience.
For long distances cars may be work better. Likewise for rainy days. However, city-dwellers experience the effects of both less, making this more useful.
On top of that, you can avoid short bits of bad terrain by hopping off and carrying it to your next bit of (roughly)flat surface.
If just 15% of people started using these for their 1-5 mile travels, you'd see traffic problems in major cities ease.
Many people who live in major cities don't even buy cars. I believe they'd enjoy this quite a bit. Plus, for people who only need to travel 1-5 miles for most things, this might be a better idea.
Or take the 3-person family. Mom and Dad don't drive 14-year-old junior everywhere. Mom and Dad only need one car, because on most days neither drive them to get to work. The car is for the larger grocery runs and trips to grandma's house.
So instead of paying out $30k-$60k for the vehicles, the family pays half to serve the same needs.
Look at suburbia! When I was in High School it was important to know someone who was 16 so that they could drive you around. I was in prison at home. Not any more. Now I could go wherever I needed.
And the need for busses(crowding our roads, carrying our children) will decrease. If the infrastructure is done right, the kids won't need those busses, and we replace bus drivers with a few cops on scooters patrolling the Segway-sidewalks.
A trip to the convenience store takes me 15 minutes. I go to my car and start it up, wait until i think the oil has risen into the engine and coated my precious engine walls, and I drive along the roads, which aren't always well-placed or direct. I find a place to park(if i'm lucky), lock my doors, and go in to get what I want. I leave to get back into my car, try to get out of the parking lot with traffic coming at 45-60 mph, and get on the road, weaving round a not-so-direct path back home. this one-mile-each-way drive would be 5-10 minutes on the segway, 15 in the car.
When the segway hits the sidewalks, we will realize that it is actually easier to go about most daily travels on it, rather than in a car.
rhadc
me: I don't know about you, but I can hardly do more than the simplest math in my head anymore. I blame it directly on my use of calculators. My handwriting is also terrible, since I barely ever write by hand.
[news for me, stuff that doesn't matter]
I don't think so. The Segway and scooter serve the same purpose, and get the job done with negligible difference in method and results from a users perspective. A carriage, on the other hand, lacks a mile-long list of features that a car has.
It's just the closest concept you have to fit.
Yes, and beyond technology, which is irrelevant from a users point of view, how is this any different from a scooter?
Can't you see that a vehicle which uses Dynamic Stability to be driven as an extension of your own body movements is a great innovation?
Yes, its an innovation, but is it an advancement or just a cool hack thats too costly to be commercially viable? Most seem to think the latter.
4segway.com
aboutsegway.com
allaboutsegway.com
buysegway.com
crashsegway.com
diesegway.com
esegway.com
ihatesegway.com
mysegway.com
segway-industries.com
segway1.com
segwaybiz.com
segwaycollection.com
Let the slashdotting being.
Take a eueropean veiwpoint for once and imagine everywhere is like downtown new york. The big deal about this device is it lets you move four times faster but it dosnt take up anymore space than your body normally would. Get rid of the cars and all the sudden you have tons of room and no more traffic and no more parking. This is like a solution to the "last mile" problem of subways. Subways work great for getting around to most places but you still have to do like half a miles worth of walking to get to a terminal then to get to where your going from the terminal you stop at in most cases. If you've never been to a city with foot traffic like new york the best way to think of it is that everyday you have to do the equivalent of traversing the mall to several stores. All that walking back and forth blah blah etc. etc.
I would think the only deterant to this thing will be how heavy it is for when you finally have to pick it up and use your feet and how long the batteries will last.
You have to wonder though if something like this became common how pathetic will we become physically. It's getting quite common that the only exercise a lot of people get is walking they do in their daily day to day stuff. What would happen if they loose even that? Better get your kids in the habit of doing exercise now it might become even more valuable of a habit than it already is.
Jartan
Lots of comments have been talking about this thing like it's some kind of Razor scooter with a motor on it. I think you're missing the point. For those who have never seen Kamen's wheelchair, it's amazing what a difference sophisticated control systems can make.
The gyros in Kamen's wheelchair are tied into a negative feedback control system that balances the vehicle. In the wheelchair's case, this means it can lift itself up on 2 wheels and drive around that way. You can even give a rider a push while the chair is up on two wheels without any danger of tipping them over. The control system responds just as a person would, by briefly backing up to regain equilibrium.
The Segway looks light enough and clean enough to be taken indoors and brought on mass transit. If it is practical to handle and easy to learn, this could become a regular part of some people's commute.
Don't dismiss a new technology / product before you have any real information about it. The personal computer could have been dismissed much more easily than this thing based on the devices that came before it, and the inability to forsee that seemingly minor changes could result in an entirely different use pattern for computers.
I look forward to the first in-person review we see on Slashdot.
How do you keed dry when it rains???
The world already has scooters, and they haven't revolutionized cities or society. They certainly aren't the most revolutionary invention since the computer, that's for sure ...
max
I was wondering about the learning curve, like I'm trying to keep my balance, and Segway is trying to keep my balance and we get into a violent feedback loop. Then I read Grove was rolling slowly along when Doerr ambled over and pushed him in the chest. When the Segway kept him from losing his balance, Grove emitted a distinctly un-Grove-like giggle.
Now I'm wondering if we can apply the technology to bicycles, windsurfers, skates, etc. Now that would be awesome: In-line skates that act like Segway.
This technology is ultra cool! It's like an ultra geeky razor scotter. However what's cooler about it is that it has the potential to lead to highly sensative vechicles for sporting/fun. It's like having Harry Potter broomstick kinda control. Imagine jet ski's and other vehicles being this responsive!
Ohhhh, too expensive now, but seriously fun,
Rob
If people where that interested in traveling without cars why not use electric bikes?
Here are some samples of the proper usage of Where and Were, and We're and Wear (a bonus):
Where are my keys?
We were going to the beach, but decided not to.
We're through being cool.
What are you going to wear to the dance?
"Would it kill you to put down the toilet seat?" -- Maya Angelou
You might be tempted to make fun of readers for being "overcome by the relentless hype machine that is IT" but don't forget for a second that it's outlets like Slashdot that helped feed the initial frenzy to begin with. Your snotty, so-very-blase, hipper-than-thou attitude is, in this context, totally hypocritical, and in my view is a symptom of the immaturity that is causing Slashdot to lose its relevance -- and fast!
I for one think the Segway is really cool. But that's probably because I wasn't one of the people theorizing it would have a GPS system, be a hovercar, run off of hydrogen, or possess a perpetual motion engine.
A major question is how heavy IT is (for lugging up and down steps and over bumps), and also how awkward IT is to store when not needed (at the office, say). The lawyers for businesses likely would have hissy fits about liability for injuries, so I can't see IT being allowed that quickly into most large office suites or complexes (or even factories), at least not without some non-trivial consideration of liability issues and rules of conduct.
Given the price, IT'd be a major target for theft. How will IT be secured outside while the owner is temporarily inside an office or store? How would a 7-11 manager react to a punk teenager wanting to scoot around in his cramped store on an IT? Suppose the scooter is an old lady or other disabled individual who can't get around without a wheelchair or (perhaps) a modified IT? Will the ADA (Americans with Disabilities Act) make it hard to refuse such an old lady her in-store scooting, even in an antique glass and china shop?
There are a number of such interesting, ancillary issues to consider, arising from the apparent possible "universality" of such devices.
A truly excellent pizza parlor is a delight unto the heavens. Treasure the sauce and the toppings!
They're mirroring (using apache) a page hosted with ISS. not a big deal.
they think electicity grows on trees
"Pulling off this trick requires an unholy amount of computer power. In every Segway there are 10 microprocessors cranking out three PCs' worth of juice. Also a cluster of aviation-grade gyros, an accelerometer, a bevy of sensors, two batteries and software so sophisticated it puts Microsoft to shame ."
Thank God for that! There's no way I would ever knowingly set foot in (or in this case on) any mode of transportation powered by Microsoft or Microsoft-esque software. I value my life too much for that kind of risk.
So when are we going to see the first Segway modding sites? Which leads me to my next question, how long will it take for Kamen to unleash the unholy wrath of the DMCA on said site? Seriously though, I doubt anyone will be able to figure this thing out for a long time (or would be willing to risk their safety to do so) and Kamen doesn't seem like a DMCA aficionado.
Why is it that the typical Slashdotter's comment is so negative?
To me, it's a cool invention. I want one. Will I spend $3,000 on one? Most likely not. But of course, that is just the introductory price.
Amazing magic tricks
On the surface, I would agree that:
>>How many people live close enough to work that they can afford the time to communte on a device that moves at walking speed? (no one I know)
But Segway may just be the missing piece to the puzzle of mass transit. How many people would take the train/subway/bus if they could use this gadget to get to the bus/train station, or to get to their job after they get off the bus or train? Without something like this, trains/buses just don't work for the masses.
And how noisy is it?
There's an excellent article here.
It's been posted here once already, but it's not being modded up fast enough.
For you slashdot moderators, here's what you've wanted to hear:
Yes, I'm sure it's just a matter of time before someone hacks the Segway to run LINUX. Hopefully it won't cause any traffic fatalities.
What I really want to see is a pool of hireable Segaways (like a Taxi) connected to a network, that autopilot themselves to your GPS-mobile-phone determined location. *THAT* will revolutionize city transportation.
I live in Montreal (Mount Royal.. MOUNTAIN) and it's very hilly with lots of steep sidewalks. Does this thing have the power to get me up a hill??
Besides, IT is much better for the environment than a gas powered bike, especially in the dense population of cities.
I think IT is going to be a hit for those of us who live in cities, don't want a car, but sometimes grumble about walking across town to do (insert activity here).
This certianly won't replace cars, but it might partially replace public transportation systems. Funny how that wasn't really mentioned in the Time article.
Remember last years claim that IT was "bigger than the Internet"? In retrospect, it very well may be, but so were the hula hoop and the Pet Rock, and the clip on tie...
-- @rjamestaylor on Ello
Yes, and beyond technology, which is irrelevant from a users point of view, how is this any different from a scooter?
Without having touched/ridden/experienced one, how can you judge one way or another? Nice how you can be so certain based on assumptions.
Nevertheless, I'm glad you've made your mind up, that's just one more on the market for others to use.
How many people do you know that can drive cars?
How many people do you know that have the skill to navigate motorized scooters through traffic? Much less, I'd assume
Now, how many people do you know that would want a transportation system on par in terms of speed, cost, and efficiency with bikes and motorized scooters, with the safety and ease of use of using cars? I think this is a large market, and is exactly what Kamen is going for.
--
Amongst the great quotes:
I live in NYC. In the 5 boroughs something like this would be great. Places like Hong Kong, downtown London, Chicago, small cities in Italy, any REAL city where people actually walk around, this would be great.
Places like LA, Phoenix, suburban Long Island where there are no pedestrians anyway would not be suitable for this.
The TIME article said that speeds of 3-4 times walking speed would be normal.
In NYC bike messengers already get around the city faster than cars. I see doctors and 60 year old women go through the Village on those Razor scooters. Parking spaces cost more to rent per month than whole houses do in other parts of the country. I go weeks without driving now and didn't own a car until I moved out of NYC temporarily for a few years. Cars in NYC are evil and most people avoid them. A reliable, speedy machine that takes up about the same space as a person would be very welcome.
As for price, Give it 5 or 10 years and it will be down around a few hundred dollars. In the expensive bike range. Not to mention the used market.
Of course by then GM or Ford will get into the market and we will have SUV Gingers that weigh 10 tons, run on gasoline and have ostrich skin leather heated bucket seats.
Should make pub crawling ALOT easier!
IT was already invented by Johnny Hart, author of the comic strip BC. The prior art is plainly visible in the upper right hand corner of this picture, has been available for quite some time, and appears regularly in newspapers and online.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
It's pretty difficult to ride a bike or a scooter whilest intoxicated. Driving a car is illegal and stupid. So how about riding a Segway drunk? It has balancing technology that allows it to not tip over. They need to do some testing. What I suggest is take someone to a local bar, get them wasted, and see what happens. I would gladly volunteer :)
I do think that this is a great invention and I think it has a lot of potential to take off in cities like Tokyo and such....
Can't wait to tear one of these apart and start on my first Battle Mech.
:-/
Of course, if my Battle Mech can't go faster than 8mph, I'm dead meat.
I guess I'll have to figure out how to water cool the processing units and OVERCLOCK!
Now... Where did I leave that brochure on energy weapons...
"Read about IT in your favorite hype-dispensing media outlet"
Yeah! Like Slashdot!
So you can run Linux on a Dreamcast who gives a shit. It doesn't solve any problems.
Like many have stated already, this seems to be for those who don't want the cost/responsibility/pollutoin of a car but don't want to actually expend enough energy to use a bicycle or walk.
However, a low-power, effective gyro assembly coupled with a recumbent bicycle would definately be something I would look into, at least for use in the warmer months. When you factor in that the price of a good recumbent is about $1200 USD, plus maybe $300 more for the accessories you want/need (safety, people!), you would still have $1500 left to add in a gyro assembly and match the price of the whoseewhatzit.
I've been on a few recumbants, and I can tell you, if you are reasonably healthy they can move you pretty damn quick. The biggest issue I and most other people have is getting used to the new "balancing vectors" so to speak that recumbents require. Plus, you can actually get a cargo hitch for those camping trips or cross-country adventures, which also addresses those concerns about not being able to bring groceries home on a scooter.
Also, can't wait until hooks an Xbox up to one of these, and makes a twirling, tightrope-walking Beowolf cluster of these, and yada yada yada...
Green-voting, republican-registered, socialist-libertarian.
I have a lot of respect for the research and development that has been done by Dean Kamen and his company. They've done wonderful work with dynamic control systems for FRED, the "wheelchair" that can climb stairs and I'm assuming that this uses some of the same technology. However, it seems absolutely rediculous to me to put this technology into essentially a small scooter that can't do anything better than a simpler scooter with a third wheel for maintaining stability. I haven't figured out why you would possibly want to take that third wheel out and replace it with a heavier, more complicated, more expensive, and likely less reliable system?! Anyone pick up on something I missed?
Learn to fly! www.beapilot.com
if it only had a place for my iPod -I might buy one of these scooters. It also needs a firewire port...maybe version 2.0??
I hope Kamen didn't intend to name this product *Segue*.
Because if he did, I hope his engineering and marketing acumen is better than his english.
by Piers Anthony none the less! I dont remember the name of the book, but it was one of his older pulp sci-fi novels. The main character, and just about everyone else, used an enclosed version to get around everywhere.
WhiteRabbit
5. What about security? Riding around on a $3000 device that can't move faster than walking speed is a huge crime oppurtunity.
(No, this isn't a socialist rant...)
The whole issue of theft, as well as much of the problem of lugging these heavy objects into buildings, disappears under something like the Yellow Bike paradigm. If people could pick them up where they need them, and drop them off at the destination, they wouldn't need to worry.
It wouldn't have been much use getting between my apartments and my recent jobs, but it would have helped a lot at the jobs. It especially would help for quick jaunts to Kinko's-equivalents, or running between government offices, or among centrally located clients. Not much help in the vast bastions of suburban sprawl, but a lot of good in the downtowns of large cities (well, those that have downtowns). And very useful at large datacenters (assuming that any of the companies that run them still exist by the time that these puppies hit the market).
It must run on Linux:
Also a cluster of aviation-grade gyros, an accelerometer, a bevy of sensors, two batteries and software so sophisticated it puts Microsoft to shame.
Nevermind, it could run on anything.
...how the Mac would revolutionize the PC industry, and the software writers would just start writing apps for the Mac platform?
I think it's going to take a couple generations of Segways to impact how cities are built, if then.
Sidewalks are already in place, and even if you don't want automobile traffic in your inner city area, you still have to have provisions for commercial traffic, like delivery vans and taxis.
I think the only thing that will result from the Segway, IF it's a huge success, is we'll see wider sidewalks in the future.
Guy goes and invents something, and gets griped at non-stop.
No wonder big companies don't try new ideas.
Its almost the 2002! I was promised flying cars. Where are the flying cars?
Another guy who floated through first year. ;)
And remember, only if you're a neutrino is mass almost an irrelevant quantity.
He also owns an island off the coast of Connecticut. He calls it North Dumpling, and he considers it a sovereign state. It has a flag, a navy, a currency (one bill has the value of pi) and a mutual nonaggression pact with the U.S., signed by Kamen and the first President Bush
I don't care what "IT" is, Kamen owns an island with a monetary denomination of pi!
--------
It's OK to be social, just don't tell anyone about it.
Initial implications for this device begin at the private sector. Imagine a mail carrier being able to strap on a pack and make a run in half as much time, going across sidewalks, dirt, grass, gravel, etc. Mail carriers at large corporations would be able to use this to get across larger buildings. Security guards could quickly and efficiently make their rounds, making it easier to put more rounds in a night. Park rangers could more easily get from point to point in a park. There are implications for airports, and any long walk areas that have the need for getting a certain percentage of people from point a to b quickly. Think about areas normally patrolled by officers on horseback or rollerblade or bicycle and just introduce segway/IT. Replace every oversized golfcart on a factory line that the management uses to shuffle from place to place inside.
For the public, there are schools/colleges where you might have classes on oposite ends of the campus, making it difficult to get books and then get to class on time making you carry a double load most of the day. For the infirm/elderly/disabled it would allow them to once again go for a "walk" in the park with their family/friends. It would allow people who are temporary disabled (casts, sprained ankles, etc.) to not need to slowly hobble everywhere they go. It will help the asthmatic who doesn't have the endurance to go on a hike with his friends to finally enjoy the outdoors like others. It would allow those already so damned lazy they can't walk two blocks to the store to not have to get in their car to go get something.
Notice any key theme in the above? Outdoors? Not just some punk ass kid (which we all were/are at some time) on a "scooter" bumping into you making you spill your latte, or noisily flying down the street on his gas powered scooter interrupting your nightly viewing of "Friends". Look at the design of this machine, large tires, self-balancing, automatic shutoff and speed control safety features, this is a standup ATV. Even if it has say only 30 minutes of battery life that's 4 miles at top speed (I'm assuming). Many people with asthma or cardio/pulminary problems can barely walk a block or two, imagine being able to say you went out for 4 miles. I could almost make it to work on a segway in the same amount of time as it takes me to drive through the traffic, as I'm sure many other people could. Training! Bah! Step on lean forward and go, easy as falling. Safety! Bah! Step off and the device stops dead. Redundancy in computing and drive mechanism means little chance of failure, catostrophic or otherwise. Price! Bah! $8,000 for the "industrial" version $3000 for the commercial version, early adoptors will easily pay. The early adoptors and an increase in chip speed/decrease in chip costs will drive the price down by half within the first year. By Christmas 2003 Korean companies will be selling knockoffs for $250 with fold up chasis and backpack straps. By 2004 they'll come in 15 different colorful shades and be as lame as the jellies, pagers, cell phones, and the backstreet boys.
Or the same people who drove the hype machine to it's heights can sit around an be dissapointed about how this won't change their miserable lives and bad mouth it and destroy yet another perfectly usable worthwhile product. How anyone could sit and bad mouth a man who educated himself, owns his own country (island), and works to do nothing but make the majority of peoples lives better, is just beyond me.
...before the first yuppoid asshole has a serious accident on one of these things because he was talking on his cell phone while riding it, and then tries to sue the manufacturer?
The next revolution in locomotion will be when personal transport leaves the ground. I consider any moves until then to be simple stepwise evolution.
I mean, the car was not even the "revolution" (if it was one) that the train was. When you compare Car to Horse drawn cart, You CAN NOT compare horse drawn cart to MODERN car. You have to compare it to the car at the outset.
evolutionary.
Back to the "IT", in it's current state it would need to be faster to appeal more. But if it is faster it gets massively dangerous. So it needs.. computer control? And computer control on other moving objects sending information to eachother? Ouch, that'll take a while.
We'll see where this goes.
Someone made a comment on a robot using this for locomotion. Now that Actually is pretty damned cool.
A senior design project gone bad and a liability underwriters nightmare all rolled into one.
I really get disapointed when yet another reactionery and empty post from a 14-year-old who cant spell counts as "insightfull" on Slahsdot -- definately stirs my grits.
moves at walking speed
Sigh. Read the article, putz.
Mod this clown down so at least other people reading at level 4 or 5 don't waste their time even reading this (not to mention getting sucked into a reply like poor me). Now, the dude who pointed out the fact that this is totally not for US market was onto something ...
One simple rule for its versus it's
Gotta love a vehicle that is balanced by gyros. I mean hey, If I am hungry, I can always just eat the balances for my vehicle and if they break, I can just get replacements from my favorite greek restaurant. Gyros Rock!!!
09 F9 11 02 9D 74 E3 5B D8 41 56 C5 63 56 88 C0 is the magic number.
It's a nice thought, but unfortunately it doesn't work. Many cities and universities have tried yellow-bike type programs (including Austin, where I used to live) and it ends up not working. Much like rental cars, people treat 'em like shit and use 'em like toilet paper. They don't own them, so there's no reason for them to take care of them. The hoard them, they steal them. It's generally not a big deal if all you're using is old crappy bikes, but something that's new - and $3000? Forget it.
---If you can't trust a nerd, who can you trust?
Slashdot commenters trash everything, unless its linux, and even then they trash it a bit too. Look at movie, music or any other kind of review. At least %80 of the comments are negative! I bet if the Time article said that this thing used linux, 80% of the people here would herald it as the greatest invention of all time.
HaveFun!
WhiteRabbit
No thanks. I'll stick to my diesel guzzling truck that gets 20MPG in the city, 27mpg on the highway, goes everywhere I've attempted to go (4x4), and I can use it for everything from driving to the movies to moving cross country.
Besides, it's a Ford venture... I'd rather not have the tires explode and fly into a ditch only to land on the roof and have that cave in on me.
To mpernis to skilo apo piso otan trexi
Why did God design us with two feet (or why is it that we were naturally selected to only need two feet)?
If you read all of the Time article, you'll understand that it works on the same principle as walking (aka controlled-falling). The difference between the users of FRED and the users of GINGER is presumed mobility. Users of FRED are less likely to have the motor controls required to maintain balance, so the system does it for them. The concept with Ginger is that you provide the information and the mechanics interpret the intention.
Course, this has simply been a regurgitation of the article for those of you too lazy to actually read. Cool flash picture, huh?
ALL HAIL BRAK!!!
Time to throw in my $.02. There is an American market for this: college students. Scoff you say? Well, I have a 10 minute walk from my dorm to my classrooms every day, and while I'm an avid biker, it isn't always practical to haul out my 25-lb. mountain bike to dart to and from class. This device could solve a lot of that, and save me lots of time every day.
The only potential problem is price, but that's what student loans are for. What's another $3,000 added to the $80,000 we'll be in debt already? *Sigh*
1) When it's rainy, windy, snowing, or othewise inclimate weather, this thing will not be used.
2) You can't pick up chicks with it.
3) There's no trunk to store even a gallon of milk. And you have to control it with two hands. If I'm going from here to there, it's for a reason. Most of the time, I'm going to takes something with me and/or bring something back.
Looks like these guys got carried away with a good idea and didn't take the time to translate their idea into a good product.
Software Wars
Who the fuck can't ride a scooter or drive a car? Is there some huge group of uncoordinated retards who cant operate a scooter or a car but can ride an IT? Is that the market for this piece of shit? It's some sort of scooter for the severely challenged?
How is IT as safe as a car? You're totally unprotected on an IT, just like on a scooter or a bike.
What a fucking joke. This has to be one of the biggest hoaxes ever.
Someone tell Steve Jobs I have an invention that will totally revolutionize the way we eat dinner. It involves a George Foreman Grill, a shredder, and a funnel. But I don't want to reveal any more because I'm filing hundreds of patent applications. Just tell Steve to make the check out to "cash."
- Have a picture
Of course, since DEKA's claim to fame is their contributions to medical technology and innovation, the bed you wind up in may well be "It"s uncle. Makes you hope the thing works better than you expect, doesn't it?
My own pointless vanity vintage computing page
8 miles an hour, while faster then I would walk, is too slow for me to use it to get to work. I want one that goes about 35 max. That would get me to work in the same amount of time as my car.
Gorkman
Ever fall off a bike by having it tip over? You can't make this thing tip over.
Free 3DO game system and Crystal Pepsi with every purchase!
Guys, this will be a great way to get from my couch to my bathroom and back. Where can I buy one?
As a side note, I can just see the hippies in California thinking they are so cool because they painted their 'Segway' neon-green with little flowers on it. Ooh, flower holder on the handlebar? You betcha.
...populating the background of sci-fi movies. that's all, though.
Before these are introduced to shop floors, there are several questions that need to be answered:
1) Stopping speed/distance.
If I'm on a Segway and Floyd is on a fork truck headed right at me, do I have enough time to brake or should I leap?
2) Rear view.
If it travels in reverse, it must have review mirrors. Otherwise, not only will you see accidents involving people going backwards, but also lots of people doing a reverse tail chase as they attempt to contort their body to look backward.
3) Load Capacity
Most often, when someone is traveling around the plant they are carrying something from one place to another. Golf carts, hand trucks, and bikes are used because they are quick, and they do not require the operator to carry the load. The Segway appears to require both hands to operate, so where does the load go? How much can it carry? Documents only, or can I throw on replacement parts for the job I'm about to do?
4) Visual/Audio Alerts
Some environments require that any wheeled device utilitize a light or siren when in use to alert those around that it is operating. How easily will the Segway accomodate other visual/audio alert devices that need to be piggy-backed onto the device?
It appears from the TIME article that Kamen is already talking to OSHA, which means he is moving in the right direction, but until these and other questions are answered publicly, I really doubt we will see floor managers adopt this device over a golf cart.
you've never been to/heard of china, taiwan, or japan, have you?
cock.
Do you really think they kept it secret this long, only to have it leaked before they wanted it unveiled? Check out this story over at Yahoo. The details are sketchy, but I think its clear that IT is bigger than a stupid scooter.
(Bias alert: I work with urban planners and transportation engineers, so my own viewpoint is likely skewed as hell, just in a different direction.)
Disruptive elements worth watching:
- Although it might be a macroeconomic edge for any urban area that adopts it, the Segway will really shine in fast-growing, high-density communities in developing nations. Other posts have mentioned it, but the point bears repeating: This is a no-brainer in the high-density cities of the developing world. No, it won't let farmers care for their fields faster and, no, it's not going to do a thing to eliminate the suburban-to-urban commute... but it will reduce infrastructure needs and congestion -- both of which are big-ticket drains on a city's economy.
- Assuming it gets the safety nod, planners and elected city officials are going to love this thing. The former group is pretty monolithic its desire to get people to make "mode changes" (translation: they want us out of the car and on the train/bus/Segway), and the latter are spending billions of dollars across the country to lure people back downtown because they believe density = lower overall cost of services = good. (And yes, luring people back downtown also equates to political power.) I don't know if Steve Jobs is right about cities naturally springing up around this technology, but it's a pretty short hop to think that some cities might dramatically restrict personal auto use in a downtown core if these caught on in a big way.
- The opportunity and use costs upset the existing paradigm. Getting around in a major U.S. city means you have your own car, you hoof it or you use some form of transit -- and, until now, the negatives of fixed-route transit or ridesharing (inflexible!) tended to balance against variable-route solutions such as cabs (pricey!), walking (slow!). The result: People, quite rationally, tend to prefer a personal vehicle for most trips. But now there's another option -- one that may have lower buy-in and use costs.
It will never take the place of cars completely or even mostly, but in cities like Chicago (which is experiencing a huge uptick in downtown residential development), this could be a way to dramatically reduce the number of cars on the street and increase the rate of residential urbanization.Honestly, I never thought a pro-auto, anti-transit guy like me would ever see anything like this.
"It was a summer's tale: Just a boy, his Linux, and a head full of dreams..."
for those who didn't read the story--It's engineless, and it's got some (supposedly) heavy duty computing power... Other than the obvious industrial uses, what about students? At UCSC, I find that the parking is impossible, the campus is often too wide to walk efficiently, and the buses are often worse than walking. People use bikes, but since the whole campus is built on a hill, it makes for interesting experiences for non-avid bikers. Aside from that, there is the constant rain and mud, which sprays up and covers your back/backpack.
For students carrying backpacks, this could be useful.
Also, business people going to work, that only live a few miles from where they work. They often drive because walking will make you sweat and the need to look professional/non-dishevelled at their workplace. For that matter, riding one of these things would clear up congestion a bit, and it is virtually unpolluting... I'd love to get one for my work, because 90% of the time, I'm driving around a big ass van to bring a mouse or keyboard to a computer lab that, if I had the leisure of not being on the clock I'd just walk to...
I think it's an interesting Idea, and I hope it is pulled off. I also hope the price comes down so us mere mortals can afford it... Hell, I was looking at an electronic bike for 1200 anyways, I might as well get this, and get more than 20 minutes of 15mph electricity.
The Segway seems like something out of a Heinlein novel; Kamen seems like a Heinlein character. And it seems like a nifty idea to me.
I have to park nearly a mile away from my first class, and I bet this'd be a heck of a fun way to get there.
On the other hand, it seems like he already did this better with the iBot. Check out those videos. Why stand when you can sit? Why lug your Segway up stairs when you could ride your iBot?
(Actually, I'm more in favor of PRT than anything else. It solves the problem of commuting AND getting around the city, plus it's Jetson-y cool to boot.)
He who refuses to do arithmetic is doomed to talk nonsense.
Have you ever tried to balance on a scooter? This thing is revolutionary, I tell you.
Do you really think this is about a scooter? Do you really think they kept it secret this long, only to have it leaked before they wanted it unveiled? Check out this story over at Yahoo. The details are sketchy, but I think its clear that IT is bigger than a stupid scooter.
Consider rollerblades. They can certainly do 12mph, and probably more. And a healthy person in reasonable shape can go 15 miles on rollerblades without too much trouble. (Although who can afford to spend more than an hour travelling 15 miles to work?)
Rollerblades are much lighter, cheaper, and they are legal on most city sidewalks which usually ban motorized devices.
So, unless you're really, really lazy, can you name one advantage of this scooter over rollerblades?
If I can be modded down for being a troll, can I be modded up for being an orc, or a balrog?
Impressive!
:-)
I think I'll go buy a bike, and stop by the Liquor Mart on the way home.
(a) it's too expensive, and
(b) it's too slow/carrying capacity is too low.
Don't y'all remember what's happened with virtually every product in history? They get cheaper, those that move get faster, and the dratted things get modified out of all recognition. Features that people want get added in somehow. I suspect that, if this thing survives, it'll soon have the facility to carry parcels, and it'll soon move faster. And, of course, it won't take long at all to drop in price.
I personally hope it does well, since the overuse of cars is responsible for too many accidents, too much pollution, and too much waste of scant resources. Hi-tech toys are all very fine and exciting, but we need to start acting a tad responsibly while we can (and while we can still have some shreds of credibility).
And don't forget to watch the advertisement, errr, "demonstration" of IT on Good Morning Consumers tomorrow.
...as if like Slashdot doesn't promote it's own parent company's products whenever they get the chance.
:)
What's that about?
Come on, be nice Mr. M.
Buy a small diesel powered vehicle, like a Volkswagon. INSANE fuel efficiency and pretty good performance.
A properly tuned diesel engine is better for the environment than a gasoline powered engine of the same power output.
I am appauled by how most people have reacted to this, both here and on other tech sites. It's amazing that you fools can rip on Kamen, especially after seeing all the other inventions he's done. The iBot is unbelievable.
.. Hello? Anyone home? When was the last time you saw a 35 year old cruising down the street in a metropolitan area on a fucking Razor scooter? The idea here is that these things are going to be efficient, enjoyable, and most of all, EASY to ride on. What the fuck do you think all the gyroscope technology Kamen has been working on for the past 10 years is all about? I'd guess 95% of the idiots here wouldn't even be able to begin to understand how the thing works, especially because they'd be too worried about how they could get l00nix to run on it.
Anyway, for all you imbeciles who keep saying "oh puhleze! How is this any better than my leet raz0r sk00t0r?"
Get your heads out of the sand, for Christs sake. Its not for suburban white kids running leet warez servers who never leave their houses, its for people who are pissed off with having to get in their car to drive a few blocks in the city traffic, for college kids who don't want to walk 5 miles every morning at 8AM to class, and, especially, for developing countires to embrace when they build up their transportation infrastructure.
--
Most comments seem to look at Segway from a consumer's point of view. Did anyone think about this from a business point of view? As the time article points out, the real winners here are companies like the Post Office, FedEx, Amazon, etc.
Think about running one of those big FedEx trucks in downtown San Francisco. Now, they can toss a Segway in the back of the truck, park once and hit 10 city blocks. What about large packages, you ask? What, you think they can't hook a basket to the front or even a trailer to the back? Sure, they'll have to work on the gyros to get it to balance under load, but that's not insurmountable.
Think about pulling stock in an Amazon warehouse. People use to use roller skates, now they can use a Segway.
This could be a big hit for consumers, but I think it will be even bigger for big business.
Gentoo Linux http://gentoo.org/
Well of course this is true NOW, (not many carriages out there with AC and a CD-Player, I admit) what about those early models? They were pretty much just carriages with motors. I think we should judge this idea in a year or five, really.
Laugh at stupidity: mod idiots +1 Funny.
Give me a milk create, two children's bike wheels, a broomstick, and a Futaba radio control kit and I'll show you IT's chief market competitor.
Thanks for saying it for me.
Or perhaps this could be a hi-tech walker? Imagine a gang of senior citizens on these...
that is called "brakes". Or did I just oversee
them somehow?
I'll get one if they use Huey Lewis and the News' "This is it" in the commercial.
Perhaps this 2nd machine has a Stirling Engine. Now when you arrive at your destination, you use your scooter to get the last block or two to your office and put it in the rack with everyone else's and go to work. No more rush hour, no more red lights. Why should the scooter be the whole story? I wouldn't want to ride this thing across town, either. Afterall, it's called a Segway. Kinda like a subway, but in segments.
Whatcha think? If you think it's stupid, come up with a better idea.
Work is for people who lack the imagination to play.
yeah the people that live in cities are very poor, just look at Boston's back bay nothing but poor people.
We have highways closed, chain controls, and a request to not travel if we don't have to. I would think twice before taking my Jeep out.
How would "Ginger" play here? Not at all?
right on.
The Segway is too slow for bike lanes.
Well, as far as I can see it, seems like it will end up similar to rollerblades or something similar on crowded sidewalks in urban America. Some people will use them, others won't. It will be a matter of either preference or cost. But as far as a real application, if they could make something like a train "run all day on 5c worth of electricity" now that could really change the world. Probably work out better than Mag-lev trains and it would make riding on a train almost dirt cheap since you could place the motor and brake mechanism on each car of the train. Now, do those motors have enough torque to make it up a fairly good San Francisco hill? (Lombard St anyone?)
I assure you that it does not look "gay". We design some of the nicest, most fashionable interiors, clothes, and devices you are likely to come across. We dress and undress the champions and heroes of this nation. Something as plain and silly as "IT" must have been designed by a heterosexual.
Class of '93, a project for Advanced Microprocessor something or other, a good friend and fellow engineering buddy and I came up with a goofy little project.
On no budget, and with little sense of what a pain it would be, we set out to design a "balancing robot" that would balance itself on a cylinder and, given the command, attempt to roll forward or back. Basically, an upside-down inverted pendulum.
It came really close to working... the batteries we used to way to heavy, but my cohort made a kickass mechanical gyro and we wire-wrapped our own 68hc11 computer to control the thing. It would balance for several seconds before the underpowered motor was overcome by the weight of the assembly. Like I said, not budget.
It was a lesson to be sure... and maybe prior art. Hmmmm. I think we got a B on it.
:)
to be completely correct, /. needs a 'hype' topic with the transmeta logo on it.
/. has moved on to the next hype.
/. lately.. so i think the next hype may be umm.. sex-box vs gametube?)
the story so far -- transmeta picks up linus, slashdot picks up transmeta. thousands of useless articles later transmeta is almost gone and
(granted, not much about IT has passed the portals of
Comment removed based on user account deletion
This is the most rediculous and stupid thing I've seen in a long time.
Congrats whatever company you are -- not only is the hype 10,000x greater than the reality, but its overpriced AND not very useful, too!
If failing were winning, then you are a big time winner!
If you've got bike lanes, and bikes cost one tenth as much, and you can carry much more stuff on a bicycle, and bicycles go faster, and bicycles give you exercise, and they still won't let you ride it inside the store, why not just use a bicycle?
Unless they do let you ride it inside the store. Then it would be cool.
Even Slashdot wants to hide some things
Looks like a good solution for a robot's propulsion system.
But, it's rather limited isn't it? I mean, I live in a town where 45 mins at a slow walk gets me cross town with no problem at all. If I go any father, I tend to go driving for hours.
Not to mention, I'l living here in Canada. When it snows, what am I going to do with it? That's the same reason I haven't bought a motorcycle.
Nice concept, but quite limited in it's appeal to less varried climats than what I live in.
Yeah., I'm with you! Getting dizzy enough so that I vomit as I eternally confine myself to a wheelchair sounds like a blast!
Maybe then I could get Kamen's stair climbing wheelchair invention and hack that too so that it'll purposely spin me around and dump me unceremoniously down the stairs it had just climbed. Think of the possibilities...
"I may not have morals, but I have standards."
I don't care how dynamic the thing is, drive it on the sidewalks around here and you will get yourself killed!
i would much rather like to see a spread out cunt. find a pic of that. btw, what do you think of volume of that anus is?
Hey man, NOTHING's bigger than SHT.
Ok, how many times have you been walking to the water cooler and some moron doesn't understand the whole keep-to-the right etiquitte of pedestrian walking and you have to studder step like 3 or 4 times. You drop than embarresed "sorry" remark with a smile and move on your way.
Now picture this with both of you doing 17mph. If that person's skull is hard enough, it's like running into a wall at 34mph! This thing goes to fast to be used indoors.
...at least according to CNet and Time magazine...
You can cut down a tree, burn it, make electricity.
But seriously... look at the physics behind it. Its the same argument with small cars vs SUVs.
ohhhh...i am ever so stupid
Progress has to happen in steps. Those of you environmentalists who want to minimize our dependence on petroleum products, think about this: how will we get there? It can't just happen overnight.
I'm willing to accept this as a great first step in cleaner transportation. No, this won't totally replace cars in all cities, especially cities where some people face a 20-mile commute or there are crappy sidewalks. No, it doesn't run on hydrogen. No, there's no stirling engine. No, there's no GPS system. If you were expecting one, you were misleading yourself. (Kamen's resume was available all year long; it wasn't hard to figure out, within reason, what he was up to.)
But this is a great step in the right direction. It can't all just happen at once. If we wait for a president to suddenly pass a law banning all gas-powered engines and mandating solar and wind power for everyone, that day will never, ever come. Realistically, change should happen in steps, not one massive bloody revolution that would unemploy millions of people and totally upend our economy as we know it.
And shame on Slashdot's "michael" for his condescending, geekier-than-thou post. I'd say I expect more from Slashdot, but his immaturity seems to be part of a general trend here.
Year One:
Something wicked this way comes...
Year Two:
It's called... mysteriously... IT... Ooooh!!!
Year Two and a Half:
Remember Gilligan's Island? It's now called GINGER. Ooooh! But does it REALLY have to do with the classic TV show? Or doesn't it? Wait to find out! Oooooh!
Year Three:
It's a "human moving device." Ooooh what could that mean? Ooooooh!
Year Three and a Month:
Europeans think it's a really good idea! So does Steve Jobs and Jeff Bezos! Ooooooooh!
Year Three and two Months:
Oooooooohh!!!
Year Three and three Months:
It's been cancelled.... no just kidding, it's still gonna come out! Tricked 'ya! What is it what is it what is it come on guess!! Ooooh!
Year Three and four Months:
The inventor of this also invented... the slinky!! Ooooh! Is it a slinky scooter? A slinky flying car? A slinky Jetsons-mobile? Is it George Jetson himself playing with a slinky AND Ginger? Ooooh!
The day it comes out:
Good Morning America!
It's a... well... it's a used Moped, to be perfectly honest.. autographed by Ginger from Gilligan's island, comes with an iPod, a gift card to amazon.com, and has a slinky logo on it. It costs $3000 and runs on double-A's that last 3 minutes... so..
....
Ooooooooohh!!!!!
The next comment I write will be ready soon, but subscribers can beat the rush and see it early!
Average walking speed, in real world traffic:
Pedestrian: 2.5 MPH
Bike: 5 MPH
Car: 20 MPH
Ginger: 5-12 MPH
If Ginger can average 8 MPH, its doing well against a car for urban applications, esp considering in many places parking itself can take minutes.
Also, look at total cost of driving a car: if this guy costs next to nothing to power, it will pay for itself after 1 year of 4 mile commuting.
So it could work. Of course you can get yourself a dang fine BIKE for thousands less, and its not much slower.
(The times are from fairly meticulous timings of myself in real world situations carrying real world loads. The car is probably the most variable, but was from my 4 mile commutes in an uncongested part of LA, with convenient parking at both ends. Now that I live in SF, with shitty parking, I don't touch the car).
Let's see... I enjoy the exposure to the elements and the consumption-of-time that I get from walking, but my ass just isn't fat enough. How can I rid myself of all that unnecessary muscle-toning exercise? I know! I'll buy a Segway!
Think of it.. Axel from twsited metal.
Hi.
I have to agree with the people who say that the US is maybe NOT the primary market for the Segway. I live in Shatoujiao, a small coastal town off the edge of Shenzhen, one of China's biggest economic centers outside of Shanghai. And when I arrived here a few weeks ago I was SHOCKED by the amount of scooter traffic.
The scooters here are basically like a souped up version of the razor, with small electric motor, and can get about 20mph or more.. Speed is controlled by handlebars and the scooters have a seat. (some of them two! one for the kids being taken to school!) And there is a typical motorcycle-like compartment on the lower back of the device to lock up things like groceries, etc.
Cost? RMB 800 (About USD 99.99)
While I see them, and they do look kinda silly, they make a lot of sense for this place, where the population is too great for car transport, and the slope of the mountains is too much for stress free biking. Walking is 'okay' but sometimes takes a while and it's really hot, a cool breeze on a scooter would sure help cool off.
Okay... That's one.
Another case in point: Discovery Bay, HK.
Discovery Bay is a community, mostly mixed, on an island in HK. They limit the number of cars that can be allowed on the island. Also, they limit the number of golf carts on the island. Everything else is pretty much built around walking/biking distance. I can see these things being perfectly suited to this kind of place as well, and I'm sure there are more communities like this around.
Both of the places I mentioned above are relatively pollution-free (in terms of car exhaust), especially when compared to nearby Shenzhen and HK.
Another place I can think of would be Boroccay, in the Phillipines, which currently has tons of motorcabs crisscrossing the place. It's kinda filthy, the motorcycles. I can see several beach resort-type places benefiting from the gyroscopic nature of Ginger, where they try to keep, more or less, natural walkways and paths instead of cementing or asphaulting things up and scarring the land.
So....
While I'm unconvinced about the American market, I would say the foreign and resort markets would benefit greatly from such a device, but the problem is, they've already found many solutions that are _MUCH CHEAPER_.
Why should I buy a Segway for $3000 when I can get something almost the same for $100? That's what I'd like to know.
(I'll probably buy one of these scooters to take back to the States... *grin*)
I don't think anyone could argue that the technology itself isn't cool. It's amazing, and hopefully with time it will be applied somewhere else.
The problem is, we were lead to believe that this would change things. But, really, technology aside, what is new about this in terms of function? At its core, it's simply a device that allows us to move around faster then walking with very little effort. We have those already; from motorized scooters to bicycles, which can be had for quite a bit cheaper. What makes this better? It's easier to use? Most people can handle a bicycle, or at the very least, one of those 'Lark' type electric transports they advertise on TV.
There's no doubt the intentions here are good; lets stop relying on giant polluting cars. The device should be applauded for it's breakthroughs in technology, but unless that technology ends up being translated into some other application, there's really nothing here that will change the world.
The Internet is generally stupid
Although I must admit that I was unaware of any hype, after reading some of the latest articles about the scooter, I'm pretty amused. Along with the standard slew of tech magazines, I am also an avid subscriber to Maxim, which did a piece on emerging technologies back in July. IT (or Ginger as it was originally named) was one of the technologies featured. The major points of the article were:
1. Dynamic Stabilization
2. Powered by hydrogen
3. Only emission is water
While it stands to be seen whether IT will include all of these items, I have to admit that the idea of a working and mass produced mode of personal transportation with these technologies does sound pretty exciting. It seems odd to me that none of the hype that I have read mentions hydrogen power at all.
Regarding the gyroscopes and self-balancing aspects, from arstechnica.com:
"Pulling off this trick requires an unholy amount of computer power. In every Segway there are 10 microprocessors cranking out three PCs' worth of juice."
10 CPUs? Hey, these things have a built-in beowulf cluster!
Maybe we can hack linux on these things, so when you're not riding around anywhere, it can run SETI@home in background mode.
*hide*
---
I'm not a real anonymous coward, I just play one on TV.
so much for the economy.
i know, i'll go sell mouse traps under the BMW brand for $380 each.
One thing I see people bitching about here is the fact that it will be impossible to lug about when you're not on them. But I think the whole point of this thing is the fact that you wouldn't get off of it. You're perfectly balanced all the time on what is effectively a zero-footprint transporation device. You wouldn't get off of it while standing in line, or while riding the morning train. In fact, since it does the equivalent of all the small body motions you do naturally to stay upright, you'd probably be less tired on one of these than you would be standing without it. The only problem I can see is stairs... I don't know about other places but here in California EVERYTHING is handicapped accessible, so I don't think that will be that much of an issue. This is brilliant technology, and I can't wait until the price point meets my budget.
Error: PANTS NOT FOUND. Press <F1> to continue.
There's enough money behind this thing that I should be able to get a serious settlement when I run this sucker infront of a car because thinking about stopping didn't work!
Who the fuck can't ride a scooter or drive a car?
What he's saying is who do you know that can do either WELL, and not add to the morons out there.
I don't know many that would fit in the Car catagory, and none that fit in the scooter catagory. Yet I know hunders of people that drives cars (only a couple that drive scooters from time to time).
I'm not a prophet or a stone-age man,
I'm just a mortal with potential of a super man.
Many of you equate the arrival of Linux as a true Windows killer to the day when Grandma can use it successfully. Same for Ginger as a true transportation alternative. I don't know too many Grandmas who'll be able to hike 60 lbs. up stairs and over obstacles ... Also, given the appalling lack of quality and reliability in most tech devices today, I shudder to think how badly made all the clones of Kamen's device will be.
:)
P.S. I'll buy one if you can put a lawn mower attachment on it
Never underestimate the laziness of man.
My work is 4 miles from the train station. Do I commute? No way, I instead drive 30 miles in my car. Why do I commute? Couldn't I take my bike on the train and then bike to work from the train station?
Sure. But I don't because that would mean, well, I need to bike 4 miles to work.
So am I a lazy ass? Sure. Is most of America, and for that matter the world, comprised of lazy fat-asses? You bet.
Now, ask my lazy ass if I would be willing to ride a device that I simply stood on, stabilized so that its much harder to fall of than a bike or scooter, to travel those 4 miles?
Yeah, I would. Kick in the price drops that will inevitably occur over time and the technological advancements to make this thing lighter and faster, and I think this thing could be as revolutionary as many are guessing.
This forum is so cynical and short-sighted it's shameful. This is an invention whose time has come. It's not perfect I'm sure, but it will improve and inspire others. Who is the market. I can give you just two examples from my own experience:
1. My 70 year old mother, who is still highly mobile but needs to do her shopping, visit friends, etc, and doesn't always wish to drive a car, but can't ride a bike.
2. Me, who has never driven a car, and feels unsafe on a bike, despite bike lanes in the city I live in.
Hail Mr Kamen! Thank you for vision, your genius!
The "15 times" is based on the fatality rate per 100 million vehicle miles traveled for motorcycles and passenger cars. The latest numbers can be found here. For 1999, motorcycles were 18 times as dangerous as passenger cars.
Mea navis aericumbens anguillis abundat
reading these articles makes me feel like I am not sweating in my loins and shuddering enough about this thing?
/.?)
What's the big deal? Another way to haul your lazy fat ass around. Yes, "bigger than the Internet" indeed.
(or should I be posting this to the Ginger-based version of
sic transit gloria mundi
So what happens when I want to move a piano?
Two objects of identical materials but differing masses, going the same speed over the same surface, will take the same distance to come to rest.
You need to think these things all the way through. To say that a heavier object, like a train, does not stop as fast is not the same as saying it cannot theoretically be made to stop as fast. Train rails are smooth for a reason - mimizing rolling friction allows them to use a smaller, more economical engine to move the huge load even though it greatly increases the stopping distance necessary (like trying to stop a car on ice). Roughen up the rails and they could stop faster, but they'd need a much bigger engine to pull the same weight to overcome the greater friction. Also, to maximize braking ability you'd probably want to put brakes on every wheel of every car (instead of just the engine), plus probably increase the depth of the rail and the wheel so sideways stresses wouldn't cause the cars to jump the tracks, and make all sorts of other very expensive changes in the design of trains.
Basically, trains take a long time to stop because they are not designed with the primary goal of stopping in as short a distance as possible. Also, with something as huge as a train, material failur e might be a concern - but that's a design issue, not a physics problem.
#DeleteChrome
I moved from downtown to Brighton, despite working near Copley Square. It was the perfect compromise between the suburbs (and nothing easy to get to) and closer downtown (where I'd have half the apartment in an aging Brownstone). I live 4.2 miles from work. Taking the public transportation (which I do daily) takes 35 minutes. At 12 mph, this would make it 20, AND I wouldn't be sitting on a crowded, smelly, car.
In Boston, you can't really locate a business too far from the train stations. With this, commuters from the suburbs could get around Boston really conveniently by taking the train into the city than using their Segway to get around inside the city.
This can work WITH suburbs, if people are creative.
Now, in South Florida, where I grew up, this would be useless. I was 20 miles from everything, and there was no mass transportation that was worthwhile. However, if some useful rails were put in (you IT over to your town station, then hop on the train somewhere at 180 mph, then IT to your destination, it could work).
The Segway seems great for those living in major cities (or Boston, which is a miniature major city) which have a useful public transportation system. Taking mass transit but driving to the train station seems silly.
This won't eliminate the car, but COULD go towards eliminate commuting in a car. There isn't a problem (traffic or environmental) with people using cars for hauling items (like groceries) or taking long trips. Its the commuters sitting in cars not moving in city traffic that are the problem.
Alex
I think this thing looks pretty awesome. But, if the 3k$ pricetag is a bit daunting you should look at the electric bikes by Electric Sierra Cycles. I've had one for a few months and love it. Here in Santa Cruz we've got a subsidy program set up by the local transportation beaureu that cuts about 500$ off of the list price. Ah, liberal towns.
I based my opinion on the articles, if I get my hands on the thing and I'm wrong, then I'm wrong and my opinions will change accordingly.
Uhhhh... I don't know about you, but I pay for more than just fuel. After you factor in insurance, maintenance, and other miscellaneous expenses, it costs much more than a single dollar for gas.
However, I do agree with you that "it" is not very well suited to trips across town. But then again, I don't think it's designed to do that.
BTW, a single dollar for gas? 30 miles across town and back (60 miles), approximately $1.29-1.49 per gallon, and say 30 miles to the gallon... at least $2.50 or so, wouldn't you say?
All well and good, except that the damn thing weighs 65 pounds. Carrying it on a bus is right out.
I don't see Segway hitting it big yet. What's needed is some time to miniaturize the components and bring down the price a bit.
Never attribute to malice that which can be adequately explained by stupidity.
Yes, heavier objects have more momentum.
They also have more friction stopping them, as the force of friction equals the force down (gravity * mass) times the coefficient of friction.
Since both the momentum and the stopping force are proportional to mass, it cancels out.
Of course, real rubber tires don't act quite like what you learned in high-school physics, but we'll leave that for another day.
If you're gonna flame somebody, try to get a bit of a clue first.
Sure, your average fat ass suburban housewife would never buy one, but a salaryman that rides his bike to the subway station in Tokyo every morning might. In fact, Tokyo has the perfect infrastructure for IT.. the sidewalks and pathways are already packed with bikes, and I can't see someone on a Segway being anymore dangerous then a kamikaze schoolgirl riding a bike, while talking on her cellphone. Also, Japan has a HUGE elderly population that are too infirm to ride bikes. Of course, I don't know if I'd feel comfortable seeing grandma ride down the road on one of these babies... Now, all they need to do is get the price down, and find an effective way to secure IT. (Bicycle theft is extremely common in Japan.) Oh, and make a pink, Hello Kitty version for the teenage girls.. get Ayumi Hamasaki to do a commercial for IT, and IT's sure to be a hit.
Come on people. You just here about this thing, and your already hounding IT. Just concede that your a little disappointed, but that it's still REALLY QUITE NIFTY.
Comments like "Uh, I'ma buy me one uh them motor-ceecles instead. Hyuk, hyuk", just prove your ignorance and your willingness to add to the problem of pollution.
I for one (on a measly college student wage, no less) will purchase one as soon as I can.
The main reasons that people don't commute on motorcyles and bikes are:
1 Too windy... messes up their hair and clothes.
2 Too wet and too cold when the weather is bad.
3 They don't like the idea of getting hit by cars.
This "IT" solves none of this... you're still riding around under the sky, cold and wet and totally vulnerable to getting hit by bigger things.
Still, of course I'd love to try one. It looks totally fun.
Your response has a few holes...
#1) If I could walk to the bus, and then to work from there, I would. The speed is a factor, it doesn't improve the range of where I can go without a car or just walking (and I'll bet it walks slower than I do!).
#4) Bikes manage because they can move quickly enough to avoid side street traffic and/or have a special lane (that they can ignore - after all, they're just like a car - except they can use the sidewalk and run lights at will!). Someing moving at walking speed better not try and use the bike lane, pissing bikers off, or bother any pedestrians - see #5.
#5) I think you rather missed the point of the question. It's not after you're DONE walking that's the issue - it's that you are ambling along on a $3000 device at a speed where most anyone can casuallly catch up to you and bop you on the head. Think "ITJacking" and you get the idea. Unless it comes with an electrified exoskeliton and anti-personel limpet mines (ala Car Wars), I would not be going out for many strolls on this thing.
All this is assuming everyone even has the right idea about what IT is. My guess is a really revolutionary toaster that automatically applies marmalade to anything put within! Now that would be IT for me.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I can get from place to place at roughly 20 MPH. Therefore, it would be useful in really densely-packed places -- homes and offices in skyscrapers (as opposed to packed but spread-out urban areas like San Jose). It's open, so it would only be useful where it's not likely to rain, snow, or be otherwise environmentally extreme on a regular basis. Strike Chicago, Seattle, San Francisco, New York, Minneapolis, Boston, DC and Detroit, to name a few.
You will look so stupid riding these, that you'll get even more shit than those idiots who rode razor scooters around back in the .com days.
It's worth $3k, and all I really need to do is kick you off at a stoplight and ride off. Far easier than carjacking; more like stealing a very, very expensive bike. If you have any cargo that you can't easily carry, forget about it.
Yeah. Revolutionary. A thing that makes sense in San Diego, LA, Miama, Dallas and Atlanta, and then only if you want to get, er, Ginger-jacked and contribute to various crack habits on a semiregular basis. Oh, and forget about impressing the ladies -- motorcycles are cool, scooters just call for a beating.
On the other hand, I drive a bright red 2000 Mustang convertible with leather interior and a kick-ass sound system. Yeah, I'm racing to ditch it and pick up one of these suckers.
Every year during my review, I just pray the words "slashdot.org" aren't mentioned.
This is so pathetic. Oh where have you gone Thomas Alva?... The thing weighs 65 pounds! Maybe after you get your hernia lifting it into the coffee shop you'll be able speed yourself to the hospital at 10 mph. Just incredible. Runs on the same sort of battery as a laptop computer & we now how reliable and longlasting they are... Kamen originally wanted to power it with a Stirling engine. *That* would have been something. As it is, this thing is just a very very bad joke.
wah, wah, ching chong chinky chang. cheechen dow chow hyueeyen. Wah, wah!!
I bet I could hack one of these things to make it go 50mph instead of 18mph!!
Comment removed based on user account deletion
you can all go fuck yourselfs
Let me put this in a context where this device could be useful (for me).
I walk to work right now because I live 5 blocks from where I work. When I was picking a place to live I wanted a place that:
1. Was not in a crummy area
2. Was walking or a short bike ride from work
3. Did not have to drive to work
Walking is okay, except in winter. Bike riding is okay too, except when I have to dress well for some reason, and I'm in a rush.
This thing solves the problem that: it does 3-4 times walking speed - it replaces the bike. It also can let me dress in work clothes and not arrive at work all sweaty and stuff. I could talk on the cell phone while riding the thing, or even check the time without worrying about falling off.
This device would widen the distance I can live from work without requiring me to get a car, use public transport or have to walk far. And you get to work less sweaty than on a bike.
Cool. I'd buy one.
But think about the people who will be affected by this. GREATLY affected by this. People who walk 8-5 as their job. People who live and work 10, 20, or 30 city blocks away. People who walk back and forth across warehouses, malls, and supermarkets all day. People who courier, deliver, or solicit donations door to door. This new invention allows them to go from stopped and interacting, to moving at a rapid speed with a mere thought and a quick motion.
This invention will fulfill everything that people on the inside have said about it. It will change the way we move in an urban environment. It is not just a 'scooter'; it cannot be replaced with a motorcycle. Try to pick up a Kawasaki and dodge people across city blocks (without causing panic or noise), turn into your office building, get on the elevator and stop at your cube. Sure it might be fun, but... ya know. Now pick up a motorized razor scooter and get across town quickly without smacking into someone, losing your balance, or getting it stolen (most /.ers haven't discovered that there is a digital keying system on the top).
There is a niche for this product and there is a massive one. You wont commute across suburbia with itm but it just might be the incentive you need to take public transportation (no more extra walking). Or maybe you were on the fence about walking for your commute. This will solve that problem. And finally might I say people can now use motorized transportation and talk on their cell phones without possibly hurting anyone but themselves.
This may not be your perfect solution to this inventor's puzzle, but for right now I feel it is the perfect solution.
------
I have not yet begun to procrastinate!
Good thing it doesn't detect shifts in balance to turn as well. Shifting your balance while driving down the sidewalk could have gotten messy.;) After all, you're driving around standing up, holding on to a pole. Can't be too comfortable.
and since it has been less than two years since I've had a seizure (I loose consciousness for a few minutes), I can't get a drivers license, nor am I allowed to ride a moped/scooter in my country (Denmark). Since IT (probably) wouldn't require a license, I would be allowed to ride that. Not that I'd be caught dead on one - I'd rather walk or ride a bike :-)
We do not live in the 21st century. We live in the 20 second century.
I hear a lot of skepticism arising from the fact that this thing won't climb stairs. Well, when was the last time you had to climb stairs in an office setting? Because of ADA, handicapped ramps are designed into most public spaces, which means that most urban spaces can be navigated by wheeled vehicles. (although I sort of feel sorry for the handicapped people who will suddenly have to share their ramp with gingerers)
/arcade design. Unfortunately, these things will have to become popular and widespread BEFORE people start changing archetecture, so it will be an interesting ride for the first few years. So to speak.
I would say the greatest hurdles facing this are range and social acceptance. 15 miles is a pretty sucky range, and I hope that a more potent fuel cell model is devised. If these things become acceptible to ride within malls and office buildings and on campuses, then they've got a shot. Hence the archetectural challenge of devising public spaces which accomodate a middle ground between car / strip design and pedestrian / mall
When Ford started to democratize the combustion engine, his intent was to bring people from the city back to rural settings, and in fact the automobile spurred suburban sprawl. I wonder if the intent of bringing people from the suburbs back to the city may be shanghai'd by some unforseen consequence of tripling human walking speed.
Or, it could just be a fad, like CBs and hula hoops.
Yes, there are. This is not actually news; stories about IT's true nature were available a week or so after the hype began. (I submitted, but apparently /. is none too interested in getting news out before its generally available.) Kamen is best known for his medical inventions: for example, he came up with the first wearable infusion pump, a Godsend to a certain type of diabetic who must have a steady influx of insulin to function well. In the earlier stories, IT was discussed as a mobility device for the handicapped, and although that's not the focus of the recent announcements its pretty clear that you could adjust the thing for a person with limited mobility by tweaking some of the control parameters.
The disabled, such as my 5-year-old son who suffers from Cerebral Palsy, are most often not retarded, but due to their limitations are indeed unable to operate a scooter or a car. IT may be just the thing for them. (And let me tell you, at $3000 it is priced very competitively with ordinary motorized wheelchairs.)
And the brethren went away edified.
Now I remember why I stopped reading forum in college.
Lessee. It looks like cool tech, initially overpriced. No one commenting here has actually ridden one, making just about every observation here f-ing useless. I have yet to see a negative comment from someone who has ridden one (not to say there won't be plenty) so maybe there's actually something there.
A lot of people thought the automobile was dumb, overpriced technology when it intro'd, but it seems to have done OK. They still make cars, right?
I think I'll reserve judgment (about Kamen, and IT) until I can ride one for myself, and see what the price tag finally settles around.
In the meantime, I think I'll refrain from stepping up on my big pedestal and announcing to the world why I'm so damn smart that I know a) more than the people who have actually seen/ridden one, and b) can predict the future as to how this will succeed, fail, cause people to exercise less, build new cities, is more useless than a bicycle or car, doesn't hover or use whiz-bang engine technology, run off my own recycled urine, or replace my spouse.
Sorry, just had to get that out. Please everyone continue now...
Ok, make that 12mph and at most 1/3 the time of walking, but all the rest should still hold up.
1. Doesn't go up stairs
Sixty pounds is too heavy for my mom to carry up a flight of stairs.
2. Not Hands Free
How do I hold my bags when I am using my hands to work this thing.
3. What happens when my stupid roommate forgets to charge his and runs out of juice on the street?
He's got to drag the damn thing around all day until he can charge it.
4. Can I Take it into a crowded bar?
If I can't it's no good to me.
Australian Post workers use a low-powered motorcycle to deliver most letters in suburban areas. It's a very clever way to get things done, possibly quicker than walking. It also means that the postie isn't required to hobble with the tonnes of parcels he's carrying.
On the other hand, of course, US$3000 (AU$6000) is a lot for a motorised scooter equivelant. It's just like the fold-up scooter really, nothing too exciting or revolutionary.
The commitee will drag out the process, trying to figure out if he's pregnent, dimpled etc.
We do not live in the 21st century. We live in the 20 second century.
Excuse me Dude, but 'chinamen' is not the preferred nomenclature.
This invention is described in detail in US Patent 6,302,230 (sorry, no direct link, use your favorite database).
The cynicism on this board sickens me. I think people are trying to exhibit their "coolness" by putting down this device before they even see a demo. But think about it and try to understand the vision.
,etc - ie, most of america - this thing will be intriguing. Why isn't granny rollerblading around the mall, instaed of using those motorized carts? Think about it. And the population is only gettin OLDER.
1. PEOPLE ARE LAZY. PERIOD. That's why people won't bike the 3 miles to the train station from home or work. The fact that you don't have to pedal this thing will make more difference then most of you realize. Obvously, you health nuts who are complaining about how people SHOULD walk or pedal 3 miles aren't in touch with most of humanity and its tendency to take the path of least effort.
I saw a funny scene where someone at the local shopping center went into a grocery store, came out, and then moved their car about 500 feet and reparked before going into the gym (the GYM, for crying out loud). That behavior tells me that laziness really reigns supreme and that's why this device has a future.
2. So if I don't want to pedal the 3 miles between the train station and home or work, why not use a motorized bike? IT is safer than a motorized bike or scooter. Obviously, the gyros, sensors, and software are doing SOMETHING to keep you from falling over. Can't say the same for a bike. My mom , in her 60's, would probably be comfortable riding one of these things, but she sure won't touch a motorized bike.
3. Also, this thing moves at manageable speeds and seems more agile than what you'd find at lower, comparable speeds on a bike.
For those of you who are 28, fit, and in good shape - sure, bike, rollerblade, etc . For those who are lead much more sedentary lifestyles, are afraid of falling
I think this thing as real potential. Is it a done deal? No. Does this thing provide a solution to a problem that is growing bigger and bigger as cities continue to expand and surburbia means that I no longer can walk to the "corner" video store? I'm certainly going to give this thing a chance.
I could've sworn I saw something like this in a Dr. Seuss book!?!
It's HERE from Sep last year.
Interesting stuff in light of this new scooter whatsit - anyone got photos of the robochair?
I'm envious of anyone who owns and pilots their own helicoptor(s!!) :)
No, I did not read the f***ing article!
Sorry, but I saw the patents in referral to IT and Ginger; the concept of a autobalancing wheelchair and a fuel efficient drive system almost immediately sounded like a scooter, or something similar, to me.
Another point. Is no one thinking: Segway, segueway? As in, this is going to introduce something new and different? This is a short term (though short may mean 20 years to Kamen) until whatever he's introducing because of Segway hits the market.
GPL Deconstructed
Wnat to know why this is a big deal? Because if it is a small, fast, cheap vehicle, it could be the next Honda Super Cub is a small, cheap scooter that has long been a popular mode of transportation in Europe and third world nations, where the people have little money for vehicles and fuel, or storage space. Honda has been selling the Super Cub for decades, and Super Cub sales worldwide have been a huge staple of Honda's income for a long time. The Super Cub was also an excellent advertising tool, as it made the association of cheap and reliable with Honda for hundreds of millions, if not billions, of people worldwide.
....
If "it" can handle travel on a crappy dirt road, and sells cheap, this thing has the potential to be huge in areas with electricity. It could make a company, and in the long-run, be a pretty big deal.
Of course, I personally think that Kamen works for Microsoft and is going to show off the new
Check out the lifter and JLN. Real live non-newtonian, reactionless drive
you can build out of an old monitor.
Think personal levitation. Yes, I have built one, and visited the company, and no it's not the ions. The future is very bright indeed, but only if people dig a little bit below the surface instead of posting crap from the likes of Time. I mean you people are supposed to be geeky right? When was the last time there was a science story on here that wasn't a press release? We are on the brink of the biggest revolution in all of human history. A revolution that will provide clean, limitless power to anyone who wants it. You can be sure
that the people who control power (literally) do NOT want to see this happen. This is the
main reason you wont see this in the media or in mainstream science. However, now it
appears that after years of supression and ridicule the tables are finally turning.
It's going to be an interesting ride.
Segway? Amway? Yessiree, Bob, I can see the pyramid scheme sale of these things a-coming! Wotta segue'!
A rework of traffic rules will be required. This is a "motor vehicle" in some states, but doesn't meet the requirements for one. It might come under the definition of "motorized bicycle" in California (electric, 1KW max), but you'll need to wear a helmet.
The real problem is that it's too fast to mix with heavy pedestrian traffic, but too slow to mix with motor vehicles. It self-balances, but doesn't do automatic collision avoidance.
I'd rather be in an area full of skateboarders than one full of Ginger riders. Skaters have good reflexes.
* We see IT in fight rings?
:)
* IT gets a spot in a Holywood movie?
* they teach an ape to use one?
* the black market of stolen Gingers forces Kamen to license the technology?
* people complain it's a city-street safety hazard?
* people complain it makes them lazy and we should all go back to walking? (I say it was ofcourse a mistake coming down from the trees in the first place)
* we get a weatherproof one?
* someone will model a battle-bot after IT?
really nice, but I'm not waiting at the edge of my seat to get one
You've proven my point. The opportunity to design a train that stops in a short distance (any distance, actually) cannot be exploited without consideration of it's mass.
...joke...
..opps....they stop, as long as their _mass_ is similar as well, otherwise, once again, mass dictates because it is a factor.
Mass _is_ a factor when trying to stop, as I pointed out and you confirmed.
I can stop it on the spot (without a redesign of the wheels, brakes or tracks), by running it into another locomotive, but only if they are of equal mass.
Now, tell me again that mass is not a factor here.
A locomotive made of paper and a locomotive made of iron do not have the same mass....right?
Regardless of the material, if two objects of unequal mass are run into each other, the one with higher mass will dictate over the forward motion of the other. Mass, again, is a factor in stopping. Saying that an object was not designed to stop quickly has little to do with it's mass as a factor. Or are you suggesting that the mass can be instantaneously reduced as a method of reducing momentum?
In that case, consider a bullet that penetrates an object by force of concussion, where it's mass is less than the steel or concrete or bone that it passes thru. Again, the bullet is not designed to stop, rather, it is designed to penetrate...but what happens when two bullets of similar design hit head on?
The only way I can see this thing working is if he takes a cue from Big Blue: Don't try to go it alone, license the patents to a slew of other companies. I'll bet Honda would pick it up in a heartbeat. Let them do the development needed to make it more practical and affordable, and let the combined advertising of a couple different manufacturers convince people they want it.
Hell, it's not too late to get a bunch of these things in time for the SLC Olympics.
Granted, when we walk we're falling forward in a controlled fashion, as Kamen states in the Time article, but we then lift ourselves back up and fall again to sustain the walk.
The batteries are for balancing -- five cents of electricity per day. Where does this beast get the energy to move a few hundred pounds at speeds up to 12 MPH and sustain it "all day"?
Can the technology scale? Why not build a roofed two-wheel rickshaw for two riders? Imagine commuting at 30 MPH through a city on a few small rechargable batteries. Make it bigger, give it a fluid reservoir for load balancing, and have a two-wheeled four seated family sedan that cruises the highways safely for pennies per lengthy trip.
I dunno, I will wait until the real world product is in the hands of some real world reviewers before I believe it to be the best thing since sliced bread. Right now I come down on the skeptical side of opinion.
Get off my virtual lawn, you damned virtual kids!
Some (not all) train lines in the UK and Europe have allowed bicycles for years, but because bikes are bulky not everyone uses this service. The IT could be a convenient replacement.
As another /. poster mentioned, we can expect this to drop down in price if it catches on, perhaps from industry/business purchases.
I for one am interested simply because unlike cars you are engaging with your surroundings. Most people in the US drive down to the local corner shop just to get a pack of cigarettes. It may sound stupid, but when you drive you miss out on all the little interesting details in life that you catch when you simply walk. Since distances between residences and commercial areas tend not to be walkable, this could be an interesting compromise.
I can't believe what I am hearing- this new machine is pure genius. It can carry you around for $0.05 of electricity a day!!! I can't understand all of the bashing I am hearing. My goodness, this man is a genius- why not add to this world instead of tearing down the ideas of others who truely want to improve the world???
1. How many people live close enough to work that they can afford the time to commute on a device that moves at walking speed?
IT goes 3 times walking speed (mentioned repeatedly in the articles). This is a key point, and is central to Kamel's plan to get people to use mass transportation to get to and from town, and use IT to get to and from the mass transportation. In his words, "turn a 30-minute walk into a 10-minute ride."
2. How many people live in places where the weather is neither too warm or too cold to spend the time outside?
Hardly anybody really. Come on, generations of New Yorkers have been trudging through freezing sleet and sweltering heat from the subway to the office. It's weather, we just deal with it.
3. How many businesses have the infrastructure to handle storing and charging these things?
All of them. Every company has had electrical outlets, and even a Dilbert-size cubicle has a corner to lean an IT. Bikes haven't created an insurmountable storage problem for employers, and ITs are smaller.
4. Is it really going to share the sidewalk with pedestrians? Where are they going to go now?
They'll stay right where they are. Pedestrians already share the sidewalk with joggers (and people who are just in a big hurry). IT riders won't go any faster than that, and possibly will smell better.
5. What about security? Riding around on a $3000 device that can't move faster than walking speed is a huge crime oppurtunity.
Good point, except that it goes 3 times walking speed. In certain places ITs might have to be locked up like bikes, but probably not nearly as often since, unlike bikes, ITs are rideable indoors. If I paid $3000 for one, I would sure as hell ride it into stores and park it between my knees in movie theaters.
Certainly IT won't get rid of cars. But Kamen isn't saying that it will. His goal is for IT to make cars unnecessary within urban centers by extending the distance people are willing to travel without them. Doesn't sound crackpot to me.
"Pulling off this trick requires an unholy amount of computer power. In every Segway there are 10 microprocessors cranking out three PCs' worth of juice" - linked Time article
Can you imgine a Beowulf Cluster of these things? maybe I can use them as a render farm.. how much ram did it have again?
Lets take a look at the the two real complaints -cost and weight- for a moment. Both will obviously come down drastically over the years.
Three things- electronics, gyroscopes, and the batteries make the Segway expensive. The electronics will be a tenth the price within a month of even a single Segway sisterboard making it to Taipie, no matter how poorly the Segway's sales might do. Barring any hereforeto unforeseen aviation boom, I imagine that the gyroscopes will probably only drop in price in proportion with the volume of Segways produced. The batteries should far slightly better (but not as good as the electronics), steadily, albeit slowly, dropping in price over time, a trend that will also take place whether or not Segway is successful.
As I see it, only one thing really adds significant weight to Segway, and that is the batteries. They mention both NiCd and NiMH batteries can be used. IANABE (battery expert?), but I would bet that they are using those older battery technologies because of their power-to-weight ratios, or perhaps even their power-to-volume ratios. Many other power solutions are available, each with drawbacks. Batteries where probably chosen for efficiency, simplicity, and safety concerns. Better battery tech, or fuel cells, or Stirling engines, or even gasoline engines (probably requiring some lightweight, high-velocity flywheels for energy storage) could potentially help reduce the current weight of the Segway. Heck, if these things do become popular in cities, run them right off of overhead wires, like bumper cars! Or maybe even through substreet power lines via inductance. No need for much of a battery at all then.
When Thales was asked what was difficult, he said, "To know one's self." And what was easy, "To advise another."
For some reason, I just envision a strangely-dressed fellow on one of these with a golf bag strapped to the handlebars......
Now, before you all moderate me down to -1 Troll, can someone explain to me:
-
-
Until I understand the "IT" better, I am inclined to believe that (as some other readers have pointed out) that the "IT" is something akin to Transmeta - all hype, no action.How does the IT store enough energy to ride around ? Its form factor seems to be much smaller than that of an electric scooter, yet it seems to offer better capabilities.
When I step on the IT, what prevents me from falling on my face ? I can think of one thing immediately: a big honking gyro spinning parallel to the ground. However, the torque produced by leaning on the control shaft seems to be quite large, too large for IT's modest-sized gyro to counteract.
>|<*:=
The real question is...
Is this analagous to the first Palm or the earlier Newton?
After all, Steve Jobs was supporting it...
Can't you see that a vehicle which uses Dynamic Stability to be driven as an extension of your own body movements is a great innovation?
What, you mean like... a bicycle? Or roller skates?
Hell, I drive my car via an extension of my own body movements. I call this miraculous technology "the steering wheel."
News for Nerds. Stuff that Matters? Like hell.
I don't see why IT should be any safer than a bicycle in similar traffic conditions. The only thing that might make it safer is if you permit it on sidewalks, but then, why not permit slow-moving bicycles on sidewalks as well?
I personally shouldn't buy one, as I would use it instead walking to work (and then I would have to start to think seriously about exercising [shudder])
But what about the elderly? They use walkers to get around and stay balanced. Although this has increased their mobility, it still limits them to how far they can go. There are electric carts, but they are usually big and unweildy.
With this segway there is a better alternative (hopefully with a setting of walking speed, I wouldn't like to be pushed aside by all those grannies). They can stay independend longer. Don't forget that the western population is aging. And the longer the elderly can be independend the better it'll be for sociaty.
Pure physics states that a bumblebee can't fly.
:)
Pure physics also claims that it is not possible for a wheeled vehicle to exceed 200mph from a standing start within a quarter mile.
Both claims are invalid.
I'd prompt you to consider that using pure physics to state that mass is not a factor in braking is risking defense of your debating skills with pretty thin paper
...a device that has been around for hundreds of millions of years, can support weights of up to several tonnes, is very energy-efficient, and lasts for decades. It's called a FOOT. And guess what! It's free! You're born with a set of them!
'He who has to break a thing to find out what it is, has left the path of wisdom.' -- Gandalf to Saruman
vikas
The little sensors "voting", this is for normal people. For CS people this is called Fuzzy Logic. I'd bet my arm that it use a fuzzy logic controller chip to compare and analyze the gyros position/data so it can feed the little electric motors with the appropriate action to take in *real time*. This is the key to IT , if its not being able to process all of the gyros info in RT then it worth nothing, luckily thats what fuzzy logic can do the best.
These kind of systems have been in use for more than a decade in Japan for controlling the speed of the subway as well as their elevators. Its so effective that they do not have handles or pole on wich to hang on when they take the subway, also, it is being said when you take the elevator you don't even have the slight indication that you are moving.. the fuzzy controllers adjust the speed so well that it eliminate the acceleration/deceleration effect thus eliminating the need of handle and the feeling of moving.
This is a stolen sig.
What is the funnel for? Why not just use a sieve?
That really fucking gauche man...funnel centric mofos have ruined the landscape.
To "beg a question" is where you assume in your argument what you're trying to claim or prove. You know, premises, conclusions, inference so forth. "Small scooters are the best mode of transport because of their diminuative size. The smaller the vehicle he better form of transport it is, hence this new scooter is very fancy-pants."
I used to move cases of beer with one of these things at the party store I worked at as a kid. Big deal, so it didn't have a built in gyroscope. That the Segway hardly justifies the $2,960 price difference.
This won't enjoy the huge success Betamax did in comparison.
I don't know what's more depressing: that you actually thought you were being insightful by posting this, or that our ever-vigilent moderators voted you up for it.
At the risk of responding to your knee-jerk, brainless dribblings with an actual answer instead of the back-handed slap upside the face that they so richly deserve, allow me to call your attention to:
- the elderly
- the handicapped
- people too young for a driver's license
- people who live in communities with noise-abatement laws
...and that's just off the top of my head, and not even speculating on possible uses in industrial applications. The question isn't whether people can drive a car or a scooter, although there are plenty who cannot for reasons having nothing to do with being "retards". The question is whether there are applications for which the Segway might be more appropriate than a car or a scooter.The problem with the Segway isn't that it lacks a market. The problem is that it's at least $2300 too expensive for most of them, and probably about twice as heavy as it should be.
How is IT as safe as a car? You're totally unprotected on an IT, just like on a scooter or a bike.
With a top speed of under 10mph, comparing a Segway's safety to a car is, well, about as stupid as the rest of your post. I suspect that its safety is about comparable to a bicycle, but the Segway has the advantage of not putting the rider in a hunched-over position -- jumping clear of an accident will be much easier.
In passing, let me just say that I am astounded and overwhelmed by your level of compassion and understanding for your fellow human beings. Here's hoping that you contract a degenerative neural disease, so you can taste some of the same.
News for Nerds. Stuff that Matters? Like hell.
Yes, I agree that Information Technology is a bunch of hype. Anybody remember MIS?
Ok, this is a bloody accident for me waiting to happen. Do you know how sweet it would be to get that thing up to 60mph or so?? If I ever get ahold of one, there's going to be some hot warranty voiding action.
Need Free Juniper/NetScreen Support? JuniperForum
Kamen wasn't thinking of Slashdot hackers. Good thing it can withstand 7 tons!
Just what America needs--one less way to exercise.
Wheelman was featured on Slashdot earlier this year. It seems a much cooler way of getting around.
I think this will go the way of the Sinclair C5... sad really....
Cheaper personal scooters are there and here too - as well as weird bikes.
You can order yours here!
i still dont understand why you have have to control this thing with your anal sphincter.
indierock / punkrock band photos and more... http://www.digitaldefection.net
Let's see...
front door --> driveway: scooter
driveway --> parking garage: car
parking garage --> office building: scooter
front door --> cubicle: scooter
cubicle --> upstairs coffee room. Awww fuck, you mean I have to walk?
IIS has some of the same error messages as IE, but either way it's pretty weird...
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
If I want an electric scooter, I'll get one for under $200 on Ebay. Computer-assisted balance isn't worth another $2800.
I guess this is one of the things you need to try. I also guess after the "announcement" we'll all be a bit smarter. But one thing is for sure, if it's anything like time.com suggests, I'll buy one. $3000, I don't care. I mean that's what I spend on a notebook, so why not on a transportation device? The big question for me is, how well does it handle bad ground.. like sand.. mud.. snow.
As for Dean, he's way cool. Money with the value of PI? COmmuting via helicopter? Can I visit? Please? Pretty please?
- Bartmoss
I have a father who is 78 years old and has one of those electric carts that you sit in if he has to do any walking more than about 50 feet. I think this could possilby be very usefule for someone in such a situation. You may think that this "Segway" looks big and clunky but have your ever seen or lifted an electric cart. They are much heavier and much bigger. On the subject of price I return to my comparison to the electrric carts... got to www.hoveround.com and chech out the over $6000 price tag for theur chair/cart. I can easily see my father rinding one of these and I can easily see him spending the money for one too. I think everyone just got a little excited by the hype of the brainless media and the "blue skying" corporate exec who got to preview "IT" "It" doesn't have to replace a car or a bike to make it a very useful tool.
Business is Business and Business must grow, Regardless of crummies in tummies you know... -Onceler
I mean really, it's like he's building a space probe or something. I suppose you wouldn't want to have the thing die and nock you over, though. But I suspect that as time passes some (a lot) of that redundancy is going to go away in the name of price.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
There are a lot of people who have trouble walking but they can stand. They will be able to use IT to get around. Use IT for short trips to the store and save on gas and car wear & tear. IT may reduce our dependence on oily arabia. IT is the missing link in public transportation. IT will get you to the bus/rail stops & back.
I want IT!
Seriously guys.. You nay-sayers have got it all wrong.
Think how revolutionary a device is that can get you to the train station or bus stop on as much energy as it takes to start your car in the morning.
Think how easy it would be to take a quick jaunt to the local corner store that is just a wee bit too far to walk (but hey that Gas Guzzling SUV parked in the driveway is great for that eh?).
This Kaman guy is thinking of the planet here, and I think you guys should too. Anything that saves our grandkids asses has gotta be a great thing. That's why that sticker price is so high.
Save the planet cos Mars looks like a real shitty place to have a family bar-b-q.
You are a fucking idiot.
How about extending this idea to involve hover technology?? That would solve the problem of going up and down stairs....
15 miles at 8mph--15 miles in about two hours. Add the six hour charge: eight hours. So, 15 miles in 8 hours.
That's 1.875 mph.
Average human walking pace is 3 mph, is it not?
How long until Adidas sues over the usage of the name of their prior art in the field of personal transportation?
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Who the fuck can't ride a scooter or drive a car? Is there some huge group of uncoordinated retards who cant operate a scooter or a car but can ride an IT?
Probably approaching 40% of the over sixty set, and 80% of the over seventy set. My grandmother springs immediately to mind.
Is that the market for this piece of shit? It's some sort of scooter for the severely challenged?
Well, I don't know if that's the intended market or not, but I do know that the aforementioned grandmother is getting one just as soon as I can slap the credit card down, assuming it really performs as the previews indicate.
I suspect I'm not unique in this sentiment.
Now for the final question: Does IT run Linux?
A Segway can be used as a car for certain short-run applications. Its safety comes from the fact that you don't have to put it out on the street where two-ton metal things are going to slam into you at 30+ miles an hour. Sure, you can fall off, you can bump into other things or people at 5 mph, but I'd rather take my unprotected body into a brick wall at 5 mph than go car-vs-car at 30 mph each.
Segway is safer than a car because walking is safer than a car. Cars have steel frames and safety features up the wazoo because speed kills--double the speed, quadruple the hurt. Segway is safe because it's slow.
--The basis of all love is respect
I expect this "scooter" will go the way of the sinclair mobile or any of the crappy inventions that guy has done in his career.
The slashdot audience seems fairly split in the middle about this one. Half of us seem to think that it'll certainly sell, the other half that it's just a (vastly overpriced) scooter.
Personally, I think it'll sell to many purely for the novelty value. I've always been fascinated by Kamen's previous self-balancing wheelchairs and the like. I'd love to own one... but probably not for $3000.
What I notice from the article is that Kamen appears to be understating his invention to start with. I'd probably guess it goes faster than 12mph, and although that would be impractical on inner-city pavements, I can think of quiet suburban roads where that would be a godsend. Also, if any decent number of people start buying one, I'd guess the price will drop well below $3k.
"...and what's more, it's running Linux!"
Taken from the US patents website.... so segway really IS a scooter =) http://128.175.106.144/gallery/realsegway.jpg
This invetion will go the way of the Sinclair horizontal bike.
It is awkward, expensive, makes you look like a dork, and isn't really more useful than something you already had.
Mind you, I'm never wrong about these things. When the CD-ROM was invented, I accurately predicted we would never hear from such a useless invention again. After all, it was more expensive than the PC you plug it in, and all of that for half a GB of read only data, while no one could have any conceivable use for read only data.
I also accurately predicted that Java would be just a fad. After all, who would need a slow interpreted platform independant language while only one platform would exist a few years on.
this time I'm right tho.
I still don't understand how this is supposed to supplant bikes. What college student, guy in India or China, etc, is going to spend money on this when he already has a bike. And for a hell of a lot less than $3000.
As far as I can see, it's designed to make you fall over when you hit the brakes. Either that or you just go ahead and plough into that old granny at 20mph anyway[1].
Copenhagen airport has push scooters, you see people whizzing up and down the the airport. Very weird.
[1] Grannies are 50 points you know.
Deleted
I don't mean to start a flamewar, but...
Chinaman is a racial slur like nigger, chink, gook etc. He should have used Asian or Chinese Man.
Humorless sig goes here.
In Copenhagen Denmark, we have a Yellow bike program called bycyklen (aka City bike).
The bike is rather unpleasant to ride for long distances, but can be used for small trips.
But there are idiots even in Denmark, so there are problems with people stealing them.
Read more here.
Welcome!
To the Sinclair C5 of the '00s.
I was just nodding in agreement with all the "it's only a scooter" comments when my mobile phone (cell phone to you Yanks!) rang, and I started to think about possible parallels in technology. When the first portable phones were available, they were basically a normal telephone handset connected to a big clunky battery. Their usefulness was pretty limited - after all, they were "just phones," expensive ones at that. Now my mobile fits in my pocket, the battery lasts several days even with heavy use, it cost next-to-nothing, and I would seriously struggle to live without it (as would many /.ers, I would think)
...) should be worthy of at least consideration.
;)
The Segway technology has the potential to evolve, as portable phone technology has. From the individual's point of view, it may not solve an existing problem, but from society's point of view, a possible solution to the myriad problems of urban traffic (congestion, pollution, acres of real estate devoted to parking space,
I'm not saying in it's present form it will change the world, but don't write off the whole concept out of hand.
And as the Time article pointed out, marketing of course is the key, not the technology itself. To eventually crack the consumer market, the Segway must be painted as an indispensable lifestyle addition, complete with an array of eye-candy after-market accessories.
'course I could be wrong, and there's a worldwide market for maybe 5 of these things
Hello,
You may or may not be aware that this 'personal electric vehicle' idea has been carried out before. It caused the loss of a great computer company in the UK (Sinclair , remember them, the Spectrum, QL etc). This was back in 1985
Sir Clive came up with an invention way ahead of its time, called the C5.
See here for details and pictures!
It was an outstanding failure, mainly due to safety concerns on busy roads. It caused the downfall of Sinclair and massive personal debts to Sir Clive (brilliant man)
Prepare to be underwhelmed. Strange how these things go in cycles.
IT is over 50 pounds heavier than a bike, ten times as expensive, 1000 times more likely to be stolen, slower than you can peddle, and (I assume) handles like sh$# in comparison; you will not be following the mountain bikers down any trails on this pile of techno trash ... yet it has received more hype than transmeta's "this site is not here yet" message ... The marketing blurbs are idiotic; "change the way cities are built" ... insane.
... Amsterdam'ers (new and old) who seek a mode of transportation between walking and driving, a will continue to ride their bikes that are faster, cheaper, and more maneuverable.
You will not be able to ride this toy on the street in New York, and it will be useless, annoying, and hopefully banned on the crowded sidewalks
I don't know why everyone keeps dismissing this thing. I live in Atlanta where the traffic and smog are terrible. I would love to ride my Bike to work -- better exercise, etc. But everyone drives here and I fear for my life( damn Atlanta drivers ). The reason people drive is because they are out of shape, physically incapable of riding a bicycle, or the weather discourages them. Segway solves some of this problem. The people who can't bike use Segway and those of us who can bike use the bike. As long as this thing gives more credibility to alternate forms of transportation, it will be doing us a big favor. Think of the energy and environmental concerns -- carrying a person around for a full day on $.5 of electricity.
We should start lobbying now for the government to start investigating how to convert some streets into IT and Bike paths. Cars are terrible -- expensive and harmful and deadly. If this helps change America's love affair with the car all the better.
New York would be great for these things. My main concern is whether it's remotely possible to take one on a subway train without seriously inconveniencing everyone else (not that New Yorkers are typically bothered by the idea of inconveniencing others). There are a few blind spots in the subway system which would become a lot more accessible if you could cover the ground between stations at 10 mph.
I've always like the idea of restricting cars and bicycles to the major avenues and providing adequate parking facilities at the outskirts of the densely occupied areas. Keeping them away from pedestrians would probably make both sides happier. Something like the Ginger would let you space things out further, assuming that it can mix with foot traffic better than a bicycle or scooter.
The problem I see with this.. from a marketing standpoint (technically it's truly cool)... is that it's aiming at the biker/scooter market. And they seem to want more exercise in their transport than this.
Most drivers I know have a few issues with this device:
1. I have to stand up for how long?
2. I have to ride without a heater/air conditioner?
3. How the heck do I carry groceries in it?
I think #3 will be solved fairly readily. #1 might be solved but it's a major form change and well.. #2 is a problem.
In effect, it doesn't fix most of the problems drivers have with the current solutions and doesn't seem to appeal to the bikers/scooters (who already like the current solutions).
I hope I'm wrong. I'd love to see cities make this move (especially cities designed around the idea), but I'm not holding my breath just yet.
Let me get this straight:
.com days.
;)
How many Americans are there?
280 Million.
How many sq miles of land do you have?
3.5 million.
How many sq miles per person?
80.
(rough stats from here) That's a lotta space for you and me. Hence the automobile.
Now, pick a nation that does not reside in Europe or North America, and is not so automobile-centred. That is where this will take off. Places where cars are a luxury item, population is high and land is at a premium. Most of the developing/developed world.
This thing will not be used by anybody in Europe or North America simply because of the uncool factor. You said it yourself :
You will look so stupid riding these, that you'll get even more shit than those idiots who rode razor scooters around back in the
Yes, yes, and guys that drive cars get laid, and guys that don't...don't.
In the Phillipines, cell-phones are used to txt-msg most of the time, rather than talk. Funny how not everything is used the way Americans use it. I mean, gosh, did you know that in parts of the world, people drive on the OTHER side of the road? <gasp!>
For $3000 a person can buy a used car here. I don't know about the rest of the world, but I imagine a used car is a whole lot more than $3000, making this Ginger at least a cost-efficient, people-friendly etc, alternative solution. Just try removing yourself from the suburban shopping mall long enough to see that maybe, "changing the world" doesn't start in the U.S. of A.
OTH, if you wanna look cool in your car, while staying Saudi Arabia's bitch, be my guest.
P.S. Do you have a mustache?
It's the technology. I don't think the "scooter" itself is supposed to revolutionize the world. Rather, I think the focus here should be more on the technology *in* the scooter. People need to be looking at the implications of what he has designed to make this thing 'tick'.
So wait for one that goes faster, clown-off.
Its not about look its about physic and matematic known as "automatic controls".
:) you'd fly away.
This is a "non minimum phase system" meaning that in order to achieve an action you first have to "push the other way".
Let me explain, you're standing on this thing and you want to go forward, well lean forward, the gyros will sense you're falling and start to power the engin so to regain balance. But how would you stop? if i am guessing correctly (and being an electronic engineer i guess so) the only way to stop effectively is acting in a non minimum phase what that si first you accellerate a bit, (for a few milliseconds but rather fast) this way you push the weight back and therefore allow for a very sharp stop by maintaining balance. This is something that would work MUCH better than having 3 wheels. the point is that with 2 wheels you can tilt the weight on top and use this to your advantage allowing (As i just roughly explained) for sharp starts and stops. immagine you're standing on your 3 wheel thing (which is no longer thna a skateboard. and you suddenly break the wheels the "good old way" what would it happen?
This kind of control theory has existed for decades and has indeed many cool results already (i have seen a DOUBLE inverted pendolum balanced just fine) this is just a smart application of it.
Jccq
They used $100 million on that?! And he already had the balancing wheel-chair. (I've seen that btw, and it's cool..).
But this? This will crash and burn. $3000 for a scooter? Think bike. And you'll even get exercise..
This is a toy for lazy rich guys. Nothing else.
Remember, there are no stupid questions. But there are a lot of inquisitive idiots.
Next question is "why would people want to stand while moving from place to place? Why not make a comfortable lightweight chair with this system?"
Mini kickboard, skateboard with a stick, bicycle as easy to hop on as a scooter and of course the first 2-wheeled transport that refuses to fall over without support.. It may be great but price has to be great deal less than what it is now. $100 is maybe too much.
Do you think it can be hacked to run linux?
--- even the safest course is fraught with peril
>on internet all day. Its for postmen and
>chinamen. Ever been to a crowded asian city?
>What a nightmare.
Hmm... is your logic correct Mr. rufusdufusdufusrufus....
Is the crowded Asian city caused by overpopulation
or by lagged of an electric scooter?
Ah ha..... perhaps we should nuke all those goddaxn chinamen after finished with Afghanstan,
we will save the world!!!
That should be good. Just lean forward to go forward. When the power runs out, just fall on your face.
Is anyone else looking forward to seeing that?
This sig made only from recycled ASCII
Have any of you considered that this device could
be very useful for people other than the perceived
market.
I am sure that this could, with minimal modification
become a welcome alternative to the traditional wheelchair.
It is not a scooter but a smart unicycle.
Lurking is an art. If you can read this then I have not yet mastered it.
hopefully i'll eventually see one of these too
Yes, the hype sucked. No, it's not Cochrane's warp drive.
But it is a new mode of transportation. It is a motorized, stand-on, auto-balancing, fly-by-wire, two-wheeled unicycle.
I use "two-wheeled unicycle", because the unicycle is the only single-axle vehicle that is familiar to everyone. (Or think of a non-bouncing pogo stick with wheels if you prefer.)
The single axle is the most significant distinguishing feature of this invention.
This is a very cool ride because it's a motorized unicycle that anyone can walk up to, stand on, and go zipping around. If it works well, that's gotta feel really amazing.
This is a very cool hack because you can't build a single axle vehicle that everyone can use without sensors, computing power, and software to do the balancing. $3,000 for this is pretty fscking cool. $200 in 7 years will be really significant.
This is also a novel UI. This is the first throttle/brake on a motorized vehicle that I've heard of that is coupled to corresponding body motion rather than being hand or foot actuated. One UI thing I question is that it sounds like you twist your wrist to turn. Since you lean forward or backward to throttle or brake, why don't you turn your body to turn (pivoting your torso and the handlebars with respect to the platform)?
On a more practical note, a single-axle vehicle can have advantages in size and maneuverability, and probably efficiency, over two-axle vehicles. Standing humans, after all, are single-axle and two-wheeled (horses are two-axle and four-wheeled), so this is the vehicle configuration that most closely matches our bodies.
It hasn't been practical before, because it requires cheap and reliable "AB" (Artificial Balance :-), which Kamen's team seems to have built. Once the required AB software and hardware are cheap and small (fist-sized and $5), this will be the most cost-effective single person vehicle.
It's not nearly as significant as the automobile or the bicycle/moped/motorcycle, but mankind's first practical single-axle vehicle is sure not a fscking scooter!
=LavaTrollUm... it sounds like the decoder glitched
This scooter thing is technologically a neat idea but it's too expensive. I think this tech should be scaled up and applied to say, fully enclosed electric assist bicycles and even fully enclosed electric motorbikes (then they would become and actually be able to compete with autos). If such bicycles and motorcars could stay less than 2 to 3x the price of their counterparts they'd have a chance.They'd also have to be considerably cheaper than the cheapest 4 wheel cars.
Even without heat, an enclosure w/windshield wiper and ventilation would add considerability to the value of what once will have been bicycles and motorcycles.This is especially so in big cities with _very_ expensive and scarce parking.
Of course, you'd also have to change the riding position from that of riding a horse to that of sitting in a chair, like cars and (mild/semi) recumbent bicycles to make the enclosure more pratical, more aerodynamic, and to make it _cool_.
Actually, this is where I see this thing headed; it has a considerably smaller footprint than a standard wheelchair, and I can imagine later models being able to handle escalators. The main problem is dealing with when somebody falls down.
I suppose it could be a solution for those with limited mobility, who now putt around in those motorised wheelchairs. Given that this company is also involved in stair-climbing wheelchairs, it might be what we see this thing doing most.
Still, I don't think this is insurmountable, it's just a question of surviving the "Version 1.0" phase.
You're right - US cities are built around the automobile. Large arterial highways carrying cars large distances at large speeds (well, that's the theory). Cities sprawl - everything feels BIG. It's very American.
Here in London, it's pretty pointless to own a car, unless you use it to get out of the city. The city is flat, space is at a premium, and walking is actually a viable option, if you've got the time. 3 million people endure the horrors of the London Underground (hot, smelly, crowded, frequently broken) every day, simply because there aren't any alternatives. Segway might just work here, since Londoners are typically businesspeople, and won't do that nasty physically active stuff, like riding bikes.
As an example, I walked to work once or twice during Tube strikes this year, and it took about an hour. If I could Segway it in 20 mins, this would be *faster* than the tube, and hugely more enjoyable. All I'd need is covered pathways to keep the rain off and I'd be set.
You could change the little engines and other stuff. It was right after he suffered that carrer ending neck injury from Wrestling.
Am I the only one imagining this?
Teenagers have taken every other walking-alternative and turned it into some sort of sport, be it competitive skateboarding, roller blading or freestyle biking..
if this thing suceeds, I wonder how long it'll take before we see one of these things on a halfpipe, and cluttering up ESPN so that real sports like Hockey cant be watched?
Also, I'd like to know how you are supposed to corner on this thing. Real scooters lean into the turn, so you can turn fast and hard without being thrown off. Turn on this thing too quickly and you'll be on your ass in the gutter, special tires or not.
Seriously though folks, Kamen's taken something which everyone who's ever been a kid knows how to ride - a normal scooter - and made it dynamically unstable by putting the wheels beside each other instead of in line. Now, in order to make this ridiculous idea usable you have to add a bunch of gyros, motors, logic boards etc. And so we can herald it as a major technical breakthrough. Whoop-de-doo.
But we should all be scared. Because some of America's Most Important People have invested money in this pile of toss. So they will do what it takes to get the thing sold. Beware American public services.
Uh, have you ever tried to balance on a Segway? This thing is marketing, I tell you.
If you were blocking sigs, you wouldn't have to read this.
Think about it, by maintaining the riders balance and transferring the riders balance corrections into forward motion might be how IT really works
I think this maybe much bigger than all these guys on slashdot seem to think. It's not simply a scooter. This Dean guy isn't that stupid is he?
So... It runs pacman?
Opinions stated are mine and do not reflect those of the Illuminati
I honestly see no need to reason to argue over the definition of terms such as pedestrian or innovation. Why must arrogant geeks always resort to this sort of stuff. Ehh. As if I don't work with enough of these guys.
...well... ya know...dumb. Moreover, when this guy was talking about pedestrians he was using the term fairly loosely.
/roller blades are a pain in the butt to get on and off, they make you look dumb, and they suck both up and down hills; razor scooters ust plain suck all over the place, motor scooters (vespas and whatnot) require gas and a place to park them, yada yada yada. And these are only some of the down falls.
;)
Personally, I laughed when I read this reply. I don't mean to be an ass or anything, but calling people "arrogant" for not giving a 'what what' to bikes and scooters is kind of
Considering that these things are capable of moving with no human balance, takes up practically zero space while being driven, can go very very slow (hold still at zero mph), and go in doors safely (unlike bikes, skooters, skates, skateboards, etc.), and use practically nothing for energy.... I think that's a fairly big innovation. And hell, I'm going to go out on a limb and say this innovation is probably about as big an innovation as the sneaker. This thing is to small vehicles what the sneaker was to the old wooden shoes that flatfoots had to wear back when they were trying to snag jack the ripper.
When the sneeker came along it was like "holy *hit, this is what shoes should really do." Now this little device has come out and taken just about everything bad out of small vehicle should do in an urban environment. If this thing could charge itself it would be perfect.
Perhaps it is because I live in SanFran... but this thing looks freek'n dope to me. Bikes are too big, clumsy (cars want to kill you, and suck up hills); skates
The only problems I see with this thing are a big price tag, perhaps weight (how heavy it this? I think it might be light, it is made out of AI) , and a need for a charge at the days end. Not to bad if you ask me. I want one. Sign me up. Need to pay off the Althon MP and the TiBook first
"Things are more moderner than before- bigger, and yet smaller- it's computers-- San Dimas High School football RULES!"
Youch, thhhhhat's why the "preview" button is there huh? Ehh it's 4am.
"Things are more moderner than before- bigger, and yet smaller- it's computers-- San Dimas High School football RULES!"
Well now we've done it. This device has removed the last form of any exersize most people get; walking.
Yes, it's a cool idea, but come on....replace WALKING?!?! What's next? The automatic chewing machine!
You... want... IT... but you can't have... IT.
Thank you Faith No More.
Let's hope.
Stop worrying about the risks of nuclear power and start worrying about the risks of not using nuclear power.
please let me know
'cause if it's not a scooter
you'd better just say so...
</huey lewis ripoff>
sorry, made me giggle... :)
Uhh, anyone around here work for Deka? They're long-commute distance from here, and seem like a cool place to work for. Must send an resume...
DO NOT LEAVE IT IS NOT REAL
I love computers. It's cool when they can do things like keep us balanced. But why not just put a simple wheel on the back? A three-wheeled device doesn't need 10 microprocessors and five gyroscopes.
"Most of the people at work live 20+ miles, not doable. And my laptop bag is too heavy to carry that far."
America -
the only country where a product which enables you to be lazier is shut down by the lazy.
your jesus is another mans xebu. chew on that hypocrites.
What about locations that get alot of snow or have bad weather? I'm not going to be riding around in sub-zero temperatures on ice covered roads that have several inches of snow on top with one of these things. It looks like a great invention, but it's not going to sweep the nation the way it stands now.
At least there's an intelligent key. Maybe it'll keep some dumb-ass from taking something like this seriously (and into traffic!)
- Sig this!
--
Nic
1. Riding along
2. See good looking girl
3. Keep looking at good looking girl
4. IT steers me into good looking girl
Interesting way of meeting someone. You can chat her up on the way to the hospital.
In other words, it's not a toy, and has the potential to cut significantly into America's road miles.
1. Riding along on IT
2. See good looking girl
3. Keep looking at good looking girl
4. IT steers you into good looking girl
Interesting way of meeting people. You can even chat her up on the way to the hospital
1) You can use it on a sidewalk (bikes in most states must share the roads with cars -- a scary prospect).
2) It has a much smaller footprint....so you can store more of them, or put one in your truck.
3) You can collide with others (pedistrians or others on IT), without causing damage (unlike a car or a biycle)
4) You can stop faster than a bike
5) You can't fall off of it (or at least it's much harder to fall off)
6) It takes less coordination than a bike
7) It takes less skill to ride than a bike
8) It has much better manuverability
and I'm sure it has other benefits.
"You have the option of insanity. I do not. And that makes me crazy!" - Brian to Angela, My So-Called Life
It was Steve Jobs' endorsement that made me think that It/Ginger would be no big deal. This is the man who in recent years has gotten all hyped up over the revolutionary impact of computers that look different but really are slower and do less.
I live in Canada. It can be extremely difficult to get around on foot during the winter, let alone in a car with four wheel drive. What the fuck am I going to do with a scooter? An "enclosed" scooter isn't going to do me any good if it can crash through 6 inches of snow and ice. And I am not talking about northern Canada, I am talking about major urban areas - we get snow, and a scooter throug hsnow is an unrealistic pipe dream.
- If This Peace Is Fictious, I Shall Destroy It
Ok I know a super motor scooter really isn't anything new, but the tech behind it is awesome.
.05$ a day! My comp uses more than that on/.! I just hope that this is put in hybrid cars, robots, etc so the next time I buy a truck it has double digit gas milage.
1)Auto balancing.
This IS big. Now some other company could use this technology and build something like oh say artifical legs, better wheel chairs, etc. And, suprisingly, there are people who have lost their ability to balance. Now (or soon) devices can be built to restor the function.
2) Low energy use.
3)Responds to human wants.
"Just imagine stopping" And it stops. This is the ultimate UI (yes better than KDE Aqua and Luna) That is my favorite part. I hope we can make more stuff that responds to what I want to do. Like the radios in HHTG.
Well In conclusion IT is nothing short of curious but the technology powering IT is very powerful and will make a dioffernce. The guy who made this was also the guy who made the filters in a portable dyallisis machine. So there is innovation here.
Secondsun
- My NoC can beat up you NoC
There is nothing wrong with being gay. It's getting caught where the trouble lies.
This seems like another one of those ideas...
IT seems to be of most use outdoors...
...it's not gently inserted into the anus, is it?
First off, what about going upand down hills? San Fransisco has alot of them, how long and how far will it go on that sort of terrain? Plus inagreement with other posts, what about the weather? Rain, Snow, etc... I really thought that this was going to be cool, I really thought that this would be bigger than the internet. Dean Kamen wants everyone to believe in science and support it, so that what, we can have a bunch of letdowns like this in the years to come from overgrown kids?
How's this thing with conservation of momentum?
Assuming it can break, heavy use of balanced torque should so it, It doesn't seem to have much of a wheel base. That time diagram reckons zero turning circle. How ? go - stop - turn- go - etc. Corners are definitely going to be fun. The center of gravity is so high in relation to the axl height - at least it can't jack knife !
Crashed my motorbike sounds so much better than fell off my ginger!!
I agree. Watching it in action on ABC, I didn't have a word for it, except it looked 21st Century and needs a new vocabulary. That may explain why they call it 'it'. It certainly isn't a scooter, it's not a bike, it's not skates, it's not a motorcycle. But just as when the automobile came out, it is way beyond what it looks like and will have social ramifications.
For whatever it is, I think everyone, or at least a lot of people will want one. I sure do. It looks fun, it looks practical, and it looks like something people will use 8 or 9 months a year in most parts of the country. It seems to be an extention of the persons body and is able to handle water in the street and it looks so sturdy I may want to test it in snow!
Whatever IT is IT is going to be something stupid....
It is just another exspensive thing, that the millions of people in poverty won't be able to buy, or learn how to use. Meanwhile it changes the market, and now they are stuck in poverty. Kind of like the computer.
The contributors to this forum are always too quick to judge. Pro or Con, Optimist or Pessimist, whatever happened to 'Wait and See' ?
For $600 i can go buy a very nice bike, save money on gas, not have to worry about parking spaces, go just as fast if not faster then it, AND loose weight. bike > IT.
While they say IT monitors your balance, it realy uses the FORCE. By using IT, you will develop your abilities to use the FORCE. IT will eventualy help us become a race of superbeings. Prety amazing IMO.
Once again, Slashdot users show themselves to be the trash of the geek world.
Dumbasses, heh.
Didn't we go through all this malarkey in the 1980s with the Sinclair C5? Sir Clive must be sniggering in his coffee - or tea - right now.
How on earth people could have been hyped into suggesting that this was "more important than the Internet" is beyond me. There's life beyond California: it rains - or worse - in some parts of the world.
And the suggestion that this will be useful for people to "haul their 150-pound asses around town" is surely optimistic: I hope they've designed these things to support the weight of the half-ton lard-arses the invention seems designed to promote.
Something grand like alternative fuel engines, home dialysis equipment or an autonomous exoskeleton?
It's a fucking scooter - we knew that already.
So I went to the web site for this poetry contest and had to close a pop up add for the damn mini camera which is showing up more and more.
I know there's a joke in there somewhere but it's Monday morning and I'm too tired to find it myself.
A goal is a dream with a deadline
The iMac candy color wave has thus long since passed the microcomputer world, and is now found in staplers and Foreman grills.
its pretty clear that you could adjust the thing for a person with limited mobility by tweaking some of the control parameters. It does make more sense in that role. It's gyroscopic system prevents falling -- this is a very big deal for many elderly people, who could operate an electric bicycle quite well but wouldn't survive a fall. And it would work much better than a bike on a crowded sidewalk. However, if it's controlled by shifting weight, would a cerebral palsy patient be able to control it well enough to stay on the sidewalk, let alone be safe in a crowd?
No - real l33t w1z4rdz fly the Firebolt.
We do not live in the 21st century. We live in the 20 second century.
I'll stick with my skates, at least I can do some grinds in them.
The url:c hnology/Inventor_To_Unveil_Tech_Marvel/*http://sla shdot.org/pollBooth.pl?qid=463&aid=-1
/. poll
http://srd.yahoo.com/Breaking_News/December/03/Te
It forces you to vote in a
Does it play ogg?
(everyone seems to ask this about anything remotely electrical posted on Slashdot).
I'd rather have a bowl of coco-pops.
Kamen just said "hopefully, eventualy $3000" so that means $8000 for quite a while.
When I finally got my license not that long ago, it was recognized that the vast majority of motorcycle accidents were caused by drunk driving. Almost all the rest could be contributed to driver error. Not the motorcycle driver's error but the error of those other drivers around him/her. Someone pulling out in front of you is the most common. Maybe it's because they didn't see you. Maybe it's because they thought you were farther away. I've had people stare me in the eye and pull out less than 15yds in front of me. Nice. If you ride a bike, you have to be one helluva defensive driver. So many riders I know aren't and they will probably wreck at some point. I was taught to be a defensive driver (and I taught myself to be offensive too :) ) from an early age so I have a leg up on the people who went through the system later and weren't taught that.
$ host www.segway.com
www.segway.com CNAME http://www.segway.com.edgesuite.net
http://www.segway.com.edgesuite.net does not exist, try again
www.segway.com is a CNAME to a URL! I wonder what idiot admin fucked that one up. And on their big day, too. It was working for me for an hour or two, but it just broke again...
Seems like IT would make a nice platform for a tele-operated robot.
Or, think of the stedi-cam shots that could be made for films.
I just wonder how it would handle running across a big wad of gum.
Actually, much of the technology that ended up in the Stegway was originally developed for use in a wheelchair.
Funny, how that works, no?
Regards,
Lee
I just saw it in action on Good Morning America and I am .. totally WOWED! This definitely is revolutionary...
/. geeks are going to hack this thing and:
I'm just wondering when
1) Install Linux
2) Remove the ugly looking vertical bar
- hey..use Bluetooth for the rotational control and have it sit in your pocket.
3) Add Voice Control
Oh baby..I can't wait!
_______________________________
"I'm not Conceited...I'm just a realist..."
with it's self-stabalizing capabilities, IT will offer it's owner precision targetting matched only by the army's most advanced weaponry.
yes, my friends, this is only the beginning. be on the lookout for our upcoming modules for the IT: a fusion-based motor (no more batteries!), armatures (here, let IT get the door!), night-vision enhancement, voice-recognition, heads-up display, vocal feedback, and everybody's favorite ... a direct neural link!
People will pass up steak once a week, for crap every day.
NOBODY IS INTERESTED IN YOUR PATHETIC WHINING!
Anyway, you did get the credit "8000 other slashdot readers"
Get over yourself fur feck's sake.
Pathetic.
On a more positive note, this is the US, it's a thing that moves, we're gonna race 'em. Speed, distance and endurance records will drive the technology forward.
If Kamen can build one for ~$5K, think of what $100K worth of Ginger would do. Oh, that's right, you've got no vision.
And she can't stand for any extended period of time without serious leaning (on cane or walker). If this thing responds to subtle shifts in body weight to determine where it's going, it's going to take her in one direction only. And I'm betting even at that she'd be tired before she got any real distance.
It's a toy, get over it.
7 November 2006: The day Americans realized corruption and incompetence weren't addressing 11 September 2001
If you ride a bike, you have to be one helluva defensive driver
Best piece of advice my instructor ever gave me: "Pretend nobody can see you, and ride accordingly."
Charles Gibson and Diane Sawyer got on them and zipped around for a few minutes.
It's fucking cool, OK?
So, all you naysayers out there asking questions like "how does this replace a bicycle?" or "how does it corner?" Maybe you should have waited to see!
First, these things look fucking MANUVERABLE. They turn on a dime. If you're stationary, and you turn the handlebars, you can do a stationary 360 if you want. Try THAT on a bike. While Dean Kamen was being interviewed, he was standing there idling, kind of casually rolling back and forth.
Several times, Kamen took his hands completely off the handlebars and continued along. The platform kept perfect balance and kept going straight.
Gibson picked it up faster than Sawyer, and Sawyer almost fell off hers once (she forgot what she was doing and panicked, I think, half-leaping from the platform as it rolled towards the crowd). But by the end of the first commercial break, they had both mastered it, and were zipping all around the plaza with speed and aplomb.
They put speed-limits on the newscasters' units, but Kamen's unit was fully unregulated and looked like it could really move fast. (Imagine the disaster if either of those newscasters had suffered an injury on live television on the very first demonstration!)
Some other demonstrators ran an obstacle course, including ramps, rocks, shallow steps (nothing like a staircase, but at least 2 inches high), and yes indeed, water. One of the demonstrators even did a stationary 360 while stopped on the middle of the ramp. It was freaky looking. He rotated around, became diagonal, then straightened out and the thing didn't budge.
Guys, this thing looks really cool. It is time for you to give this thing the props it deserves. If you still want to knock it, fine, but remember: the "hype" attached with this thing came from totally unrealistic expectations and wild speculation, fueled in part by Slashdot reader comments.
Something to keep your eye on...
-- null
I can see it. Wheelchairs with only two wheels. High speed mobile robots. Heck, you could even make smart casters for construction scaffolding that would adjust for wind load. That is truly cool.
But please, oh please, do tell me how on earth an electric scooter (admittedly, a very cool one) is bigger than the invention of the car, or the Internet, or sliced bread? Yes, yes, these will be phenominally useful in crowded Asian cities. Yes, paperboys and postal workers and meter maids and beat cops will have their lives changed for the better. SO??
I'm a big believer in electric vehicles. I'm designing my own right now, in fact. But try as I might, I cannot see the Segway as anything more than a fun gadget. I could use it at the mall, or maybe back in the manufacturing plant where I work instead of having to walk all the way back to the production areas. But it will not change my life, like the car, or the PC, or the Internet has. Won't happen.
If I worked close to home, I'd either bike or walk, not use a Segway. As it is, I'm a 25 minute highway commute away, something a Segway will never be able to do a damned thing about.
SUMMATION: Segway is cool. Segway is high tech, and demands mad props. Segway will NOT change the face of society. Segway is an electric scooter. Segway is an electric scooter. Segway is an electric scooter!
Mr. Ska
People call this hype? No way. The real hype came in the name of The Strokes' "Is This It", hit the European charts a couple of months back and the US ones some weeks later. Bleeding good band for being such a hype, though.
I have to say, I was pretty disappointed by this invention after all the hype. I mean, it's a neat toy, but as revolutionary as the PC? I think not. The PC gave people the ability to do things they could not do before (i.e., run complex computations, video games), increased the efficiency of things they already did (word processors, spreadsheet programs), and allowed them access to new information mediums (the 'Net). This, on the other hand, is just another way to get from point A to point B. I can't even begin to list all the ways we have to do that. This invention won't even begin to affect society the way the PC did.
That aside, so what if it's only a proof-of-concept? What's that going to get us in 5 years from now? Maybe it'll weigh only 15kg instead of 30. Perhaps the top speed will be raised. Longer battery life? Heavier load capbability? Integrated MP3 player? [ahem] Point is, it's an electric scooter based on some bitchin' technology. In 5 years, it will still be an electric scooter based on bitchin' technology, that is now better and has more features.
Pardon me if I fail to hop on the bandwagon.
Mr. Ska
The pathetic range of this vehicle will kill it; acc. to the maker, it gets 15 miles on a six-hour charge. Who the hell is going to pay 3 grand for that, when a small cheap car (think used Geo) can do better on range AND protect you from the elements, AND drive through slush and snow when it hits in the winter???
And then there's the modest weight; anybody who has had a bicycle in an urban area knows how easy it is to get your wheels ripped off; this thing is light enough to grab, toss in a truck and drive off while the owner is half-way through his/her double latte in the local Starbucks. (Doubt you'd ever see one pulling up to a McD window.)
Bottom line: it's a cute lab toy, not a real-world transportation option.
I'd have a personalized plate on my car, but "toxic bachelor" won't fit into 7 letters.
I used to own a Tomos moped. If I remember correctly, it had a $1200 USD pricetag and a top speed of 35mph. This little 'loser bike' is basically what Segway is up against when it comes to the consumer market.
I really like the Segway. When it's price and performance matches that of a garden variety moped, I will surely buy one. But for $3000 and a top speed of 15-17mph I'll have to pass. As the articles mention, Segway will get it's start as a pricey industrial appliance.
Hopefully a consumer version will be produced in the years ahead. It sure looks cooler than a gas-powered scooter!
He said he hoped to have it at $3000 for consumers in a year's time. It takes time economies of scale to kick in, particularly if there isn't already an established market for the particular device.
It took more than a decade for VCR's to drop from over $1000 to less than $100.
-----
Your Mustang makes you look like a jerk.
Jerk.
Mr. Ska
Yes, and beyond technology, which is irrelevant from a users point of view, how is this any different from a scooter?"
Only differences I can think of:
I can carry groceries home on my scooter.
I can sit on my scooter.
Oh, and I can go a reasonable distance in less than an hour.
If your $8000 Segway to a new reality in personal transportation can't keep up with joggers, that's just sad.
...maybe "Segway" can replace the "CowboyNeal" poll topic!
Mr. Ska
Since this IS the /. crowd, anyone pick one up today and got Linux running on it yet? :-) linuxonit.com/net/org seems to be available
I'm not sure how to say this, but -30 is way to F'ing cold to be ridding one of those things arround.
I don't think I will be able to give up my car for one of these. At least until global warming fixes our Minnesota climate.
And you would have an autoguided micro GPS system
which could control the Segway's path thru the city.
Plus get all that data/voice piped right into your heads up display as you coast thru town.
Dig the Beautiful South quote. Love that song.
-- Brian
The most rabid believers in American Exceptionalism are the exact same people whose policies are destroying it.
As a person that commutes by bike, one of the biggest problems I foresee with this device is where to ride it.
It's too fast for the sidewalk and not fast enough for the road.
If you ride on the sidewalk, you have to be very aware and extremely careful to not run into a pedestrian. It requirs more observation and forethought than many people are accustomed too.
Riding on the road puts you in danger of getting smashed by a car. I have runnin's on a weekly basis with this. Ask any bike messenger about this.
Bike lanes would be great, but if those existed we wouldn't need this device as much anyway.
Laugh at my ignorance while I learn Rails - a Real ne
It's about the communities, not the cities. People drive less than a mile to go to the grocery store, mall, etc. All these new developments are basically built that way, at least here in Maryland. With a Segway, I can ride to the grocery store.
As for a bike, I find it hard to
a) carry a lot of packages -- a self propelled machine like the Segway could probably carry a lot more.
b) SWEAT! How can I ride to work on a bicycle, in a suit, and not be covered in sweat when I arrive?
I think Segway will have a profound impact in places like NYC (where I grew up) and in small communities built around a town center.
I noticed they said something to the effect that it's a bigger deal than the invention of the internet. How dare they threaten Microsoft like that! Now they shall become part of the borg!
Dear Mr. Sims:
The name of the morning news program on which the Segway debuted is Good Morning America, not "Good Morning Consumers." I know that you try to bring a sense of irony with your silly Communist ramblings, but get off your goddamn high horse and write something objective for a change.
If you hate promoting (or, as you call it, "advertising") new products to prospective buyers, then stop publishing stories like this one.
How much did Dean Kamen pay you, Michael? Huh? Sell-out? Patsy? Speak up for yourself!
For more information, click here.
Don't get me started on office suites...it's kinda funny that stupid bloated Word 2000 will run on my computer and fucking OpenOffice requires double the hardware configuration...
Linux developers - get a clue!
Slashdot, the site where everything's made up and the points don't matter
The inventor thinks this thing can replace cars for transportation within the city, and even talks about banning cars from the downtown area. Is he nuts? How do you bring home the groceries on one of those things? How do you take the family someplace? What about when it's raining, snowing, or just freezing cold outside?
I see them only as useful in good weather when you have only one person who has to go somewhere and doesn't have to carry much.
1) Idea was a piece of shIT.
2) The price says "DamnIT".
3) What about the irregularities in the road/sidewalk? (I still don't know where you are supposed to ride/drive this thing). And it's hard enough trying to walk in NYC, I think the jarring from the road bumps will cause back problems from excessive use.
4) Do we really need a invention that can make people lazier and/or drive/walk like bigger assholes?!?!?
Waiting for the big mod down to -IT.
Causing Chaos Everywhere,
Nik J.
The strange world of a loner, in a populous city, drowning in society
Many people made predictions as to what "IT" was before yesterday's announcement. In fact, there is/was an entire website dedicated to the question. Interestingly, a poster with the pseudonym "Your Dad" seemed to be closest with "an electronic, gyroscope-stabilized G-spot locator." Not a g-spot locator, per se, but 2 out of 3 ain't bad! Nice guess, Your Dad.
--
https://www.eff.org/https-everywhere
*sigh*
At least give it a chance people. $3000 isn't that much money. I've got friends who spend nearly that much on mountain bikes who live in completely flat areas. A simple CD player cost that much when they first came out. VCR's cost considerably more than that at launch.
How many of us own/owned personal computers that cost that much money? Before we start casting stones at somebody else's ideas which many may find very useful, perhaps we should look at our own spending priorities.
"No, no, no. Don't tug on that. You never know what it might be attached to."
if www.segway.com doesn't work, try www.segway.com.edgesuite.net
Did you actulaly say "chinamen"?!?! Thanks for the racism, pal.
"People living in crowded urban areas" would have sufficed.
From Kamen's interview this morning, a six hour charge equals twelve to seventeen miles on level ground. The machine doesn't produce energy from thin air. :)
Get off my virtual lawn, you damned virtual kids!
In my day, we actually had to *walk* 5 miles up a hill to get to college
Read about IT in your favorite hype-dispensing media outlet
Huh? I *am* reading about it on my favorite hype-dispensing media outlet right now.
Oh, besides Slashdot...
Where are we going and why am I in this handbasket?
I saw the Good Morning America show and the quoted top speed was 12mph. The device can be locked down to a slower speed, like 8mph, for training or if the city didn't want anyone to speed on the sidewalks.
You know that someone's gonna hack this...
Hmmm...let's compare hoverboard vs. "IT":
Can ANYONE tell me why someone would buy IT instead of the hoverboard?
Make sure everyone's vote counts: Verified Voting
Theoretically, if the Segway takes off, there will be a greater demand for small vehicle traffic design. Bike lanes -- intended for usage for both bikes and Segways -- could be added to some of the major areas surrounding urban centers.
Designing a traffic infrastructure for both vehicles would encourage and benefit both.
Of course, I emphasize the word "Theoretically" in this assessment. Americans' love affair with the automobile runs too deep. It might not be efficient to drive our asses a few miles, but automobiles offer relative safety, protection from weather, cargo hauling and occasionally social status.
Christopher N Emmick
A good man, a better nerd.
Air-con sure, but where's the fucking cup holders? I can't wait to see the first fat yank riding one of these no-handed while eating a Big Mac. Or a pizza.
That was classic intercourse!
Ha! you got a retarded kid?
That rules. can I borrow him for a party? I want to play roll the retard down the stairs and my latest one died. I keep forgetting you have to feed the motherfuckers.
It may be true that it can deal with slow moving sidewalk traffic better than a bike, but is it worth $2500 more to do this? In order for the Segway to revolutionize travel within major cities, it is going to have to do some major cost cutting.
A bike is cheaper, lighter, and can go faster. It can also deal with mud, dirt, and grass a lot better. I don't think anyone will be taking the Segway offroading anytime soon. And if your bike does break, there are repair shops everywhere, and aren't that expensive compared to the repair costs for a state of the art, computerized, gyroscoped scooter.
The Segway is safer and smaller, but twice as heavy. Stairs are going to be a issue for it, as it is too heavy for some people to lug up (or down) a flight of stairs. I would also worry about security if I had one of these. It may not work without the keycard, but will that stop someone who doesn't know that from ripping it off? It looks flashy and expensive, and that just screams "Steal me". I think cost and weight have to be cut before it can be said to compete directly with bikes.
--I drive too fast to worry about cholesterol--
I was at the Good Morning America tapeing with a bunch of other Columbia Engineering students and I wasn't all that impressed. The performance was pretty good and it certainly wins on the "coolness" factor but In terms of practicality IT was majorly lacking. With a price tag of $3000 it makes quite an expensive toy and yet it isn't fast enough to replace a car.
Are you saying that everyone in a crowded urban area is Chinese?
She does this because, as a woman, she would not feel safe on a bus or a bike, and because she has an American's sense of entitlement to her vehicle, no matter how inefficient and inconvenient it happens to be.
I would buy a Segway tomorrow if I could, even at $3,000. Widescale adoption - even by urban dwellers alone - would
- Reverse urban decay by making cities more attractive places to live, not just work
- Allow more businesses and services to fit into smaller spaces by eliminating parking lots and wide streets, easing the sprawl of strip malls and housing tracks into some of our nation's best farmland
- Reduce environmental pollution and excessive use of fossil-fuels.
Unfortunately most Americans think like my best friend, not like me. However, radical change could occur if early adoption of the Segway forms a symbiotic relationship with an American push to reduce our dependence on foreign oil imports. Current events in the Middle East may be the best sales pitch the Segway has, especially for Americans to whom patriotism means more than environmentalism.I saw the Good Morning America demo, and I gotta say I was impressed! Nobody was running into things like I thought they would, but they were wearing helmets and had security people walking next to them. That tells me that they still think there's a risk of injury..
Now, it amplifies my movements -- I lean forward a little, and it moves for me. Let's say I'm not the most agile, dextrous person in the world: my movements are twitchy, I occasionally overcompensate and run into things, knocking them over and such.. How will this thing react to my klutziness? Will it make me even more accident-prone than I already am? Or will it smooth them out and make me look more agile? As I said before, nobody was running into stuff this morning (unless they *tried*!)
A slimmer and cooler Segway is already out and can be obtained at only $189.95. Take a look at this
Human Mower (HM)
IT is to a car as a car is to a _____
[ ] tele porter
[ ] jet skater
[ ] hydro wheeler
Yeah, since when has walking become out of fashion? Where I work people think it's some sort of disease! I mean, here in fatsville ( San Antonio, TX) it should go over very well!
Dean is quite a guy--drives a hummer to work on the days he doesn't take his helicopter. Seriously.
It's all going according to
I could imagine a great attachment: A small two wheel wagon coupled with a universal joint to the Ginger thing. Power solution -> extra batteries integrated into the wagon.
I'm surprised they did not already talk about something like this because the grocery trip scenario is an obvious one.
--- -- - -
Give me LIBERTY, or give me a check.
The pictures imply that you can ride the segway on the walkway, but I doubt that this will be allowed if this thing really kicks off and becomes a hazard for pedestrians. Industries maybe, but I can't imagine any age group that would have an advantage because of it. Young people would maybe use it for the fun of it, any other group would be better off with a bicycle or a car. This is definitely not true. Nobody will use it in a city where they don't dare to cycle (assuming usage on the walkway is not allowed as explained above). And where you can cycle (as in many small and middle sized German cities) without being afraid for your life, there the bicycle again has its advantages.
One more thing: You can park a (200 US$) bicycle basically everywhere without much fear of it being stolen, but a Segway for 3000 bucks?
twm
First: THAT IS IT?! 'k.
(so the title of the article is perfect, BTW)
Second thought:
Why not just re-invent the "kick-n-go"? Or make it battery operated or something.
You know those dangerous "razor-blade-scooters"?
And, those "motorized" scooter/skateboards?
That is what the KnG was; 3in wheels, a quick and dirty kick lever if you wanted speed, fairly wide track to stand on and (unless you did some of the stupid shit I did many, many moons ago) safer than most of the "20 year later ripoffs" you see today.
Looks, net, sounds like a good idea...but does not seem practicle or priced wisely.
Eh...then again, what do I know?
Have you read the moderator guidelines? Well, have you, PUNK? (and I want a Karma: Gnarly option)
...but it's better than dealing with the airlines.
---
I'm not an expert on his other inventions/innovations, but from what I've seen of his intellectual property myself and from what I've heard from other engineers/entrepreneurs, of whom i have a great deal of respect for, that I know inside and outside of the medical devices industry (his primary field) they're not either. I don't mean to dump on Kamen, but I would hardly say the potential of the Segway (IT) follows from his track record.
Actually truth be told I think his wheelchair-like device has the greatest potential if his design can be manufactured, produced, maintained, etc. properly.
This is a $6000 electric skateboard-- but for lazy middle-aged yo-yos. but wait, i thought skateboarding was illegal in most urban environments...
davejenkins.com |
Does anybody remember a Commodore 64 and Coleco game called "Quest for tires"? You had a cave-man riding a tire that looked very much like the Segway ... and the grin on the face of the caveman...
check it out: http://c64.users2.50megs.com/bc.htm
nuff said.
I think the segway is more photogenic than the transmeta, or the Y2K bug for that matter.
---If you can't trust a nerd, who can you trust?
Because its a total waste of time like it is.
Right now the Government spends a buttload of my tax dollars creating bicycle lanes on our county roads.
Bicycle lanes, which no one uses except for recreation on weekends by the militant spandex bike crowd... (who actually don't use the lanes, but instead prefer to still use the part meant for cars)
So lets see, it rains, it snows, its windy, its too cold, its too hot.... and who will use it then?
Of course we have Government agencies stepping up to the plate with out tax dollars to spend on this item where there is no valid use for it.
* Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
I just saw the demo of the Segway on Good Morning America just a few minutes ago, and I was impressed. I've heard about it a few months ago, but didn't really think too much about it. Then I saw a reporter describing the dynamics of it earlier today, and I was very sceptical. A machine that has gyroscopes built into it, so that it is impossible to fall off, redundant computer systems to back up each other, and has absolutely no engine. This sounds too good to be true. It sounds like it violates every known law of physics that I had studied for the past 4 years of college. Plus, what kind of energy system powers it? I'm sure it definitely can't violate the known laws of Entropy.
And then I saw it in action. And I was just like, "damn! I want one!"
And as for the $3000 consumer price tag, well.. how about waiting a few years, and buying it used? I'm in college, and my car is a second-hand used car, and runs great.
But anyways, it would be great if you could rent this kind of thing. Like in say, San Francisco or New York, where cars are impossible to get you anywhere. Some company can set up hundreds of rental points, where you can check in your Segway, or check it out. And where you'd rent it by the hour or by the day.
Yes, I'll still have my car. There is no way around that, but this thing is amazing. I can't wait until I get a chance to test-ride it myself.
It won't happen overnight, but yes, this thing will infiltrate the world over. The best places to market it are in the huge congested cities, such as San Francisco, New York, Hong Kong, Beijing, Taiwan, Shanghai, London, and any other packed metropolis. I live in Los Angeles, but notice how I excluded that city from the list of marketable places.
The Amazing Segway! Not sold in stores!
"Now I can walk through the park with my grandson again!" -Arthur, 65
Things are more like they are now than they ever were before.
...and also pointed out at the end that it would probably go over well in Japan and Europe - but not here. Did you even bother to read my post?
Frankly, that's only the beginning of segway's problems, and although you pointed out technologies will improve segway in the future, those technologies (i.e. lightweight electric motors and very energy dense electric power storage) will be applicable to a whole range of matters beyond segway, including a much better electric bike.
---If you can't trust a nerd, who can you trust?
"Get off dat lowride or i'll blast a cap in yo ass!!!"
I can't wait to watch some Jack Ass stunts with this hi-tech walker.
One of the first somewhat critical pieces from the media, now on the Boston.com homepage:
i ng er.html
http://digitalmass.boston.com/news/2001/12/03/g
JDL
There was a simmilar (true unicycle) device shown on the Hannover Fair in Spring by the Fachhochschule (FH / College of Applied Sciences) Bielefeld. Here's a mini-paper and here the press-release (in German / with photo).
Lars T.
To the guy who modded me down from perfect to terrible Karma - Apple haters still suck
Is there an official site set up for IT/Ginger/Segway? It'd sure be great to hear about it from the horse's mouth
This is awesome. It's small, you can't really hurt yourself on it it seems, and it won't fall over. Looks like the perfect mode of transportation for bar hopping if you ask me. All you have to do is slump forward and fiddle w/ your wrists to steer yourself around. If you fall off it, it stops. Giddy up.
link is realmedia surestream or something.
this is my sig.
YOU are fucking disgusting. No I'm not the original poster. But you are utterly fucking repulsive.
Hey if you want to be lazy and look like a dork the product for you already exists, and is about $2,500 cheaper. Get one of these babies, and the chicks will point and laugh just as if you were on a IT.
You still won't burn any calories in your 10 block trek to your office, and you'll be a menace to pedestrains. This piece of crap even weighs less than the other piece of crap! So it will be easier on your portly self lugging it over the bump in the evevator.
With the extra $2,500 you can buy lots of twinkies and ho-hos, and still have enough left to set up a 802.11b wireless network so you can use your laptop while on the head, you'll need it because of all the twinkies and ho-ho's.
How long before someone tries hacking it to run Linux?
I don't understand what is so great about this invention. The fact is, any able-bodied person who is willing to do only a moderate amount of exercise can achieve the necessary level of fitness needed to ride a bicycle faster than the maxiumum speed of this thing for several hours. A decent bicycle is
1) Faster.
2) Less expensive.
3) Does not suffer limitations inherent from batteries.
4) Does not cause pollution (the battery power does have to come from some power plant, you know).
4) Keeps you fit, as an added benefit.
Sure, cities would be nicer places if most people used these scooters... but the same would be true if people would stop being so lazy and ride a bike!
ye sof course.. and that used car will also cost you 60 bucks a month garage, 40 bucks a week gaz, 200 bucks a year repairs, 100 bucks a year insurance... and some in parking.
Damn! I live on the Moon! It'll just float away!
I GUESS I WON'T BUY ONE!
But most people don't live on the moon, and it might prove usefule to them...
What evidence do we have that the technology developed to create the Segway's handling and propulsion systems are related to motorcycle engines or even the Insight? It's pointless to speculate on the prospective pricing of other manufacturers of the same product when we don't know enough about the tech of the original.
As for the price, yes it is too high to be a viable option for the average civilian consumer, US or otherwise, at this point. I don't blame Kamen for that. New technology always comes out at a high price. If the Segway ends up picking up the government and major commercial contracts it is aiming for though it may just generate enough revenue to drive the price down more quickly than with comparable advances we have had in the past (pc, dvd etc.).
The main obstacle to a Segway revolution on our city streets will be at the municipal level though. There will be a catch 22 for a while where it won't be viable to invest in one, even if you could afford it, until local governments decide how they will be regulated. Yet local governments won't see the need to make policy without a consumer presence and demand. Once that hurdle is jumped then we'll see what the Segway can do for city congestion/pollution.
All in all it will be a while before we can truly judge the impact that the Segway will have, but I for one think it's worth the wait.
Most likely, when the battery runs low it will slow to a stop, and just maintain balance. Can't imagine the inventors forgetting that... Easy to fix in a firmware upgrade anyway if not.
Frankly, until we have sidewalk ramps everywhere, this damn thing is going to end up on the road competing with cars. Here in San Jose, less than 10% of residential sidewalks have handicap ramps. Frankly, I don't care for the idea of dodging people on these things on sidewalks anyway. If I need to be on the road, I want to be able to go the speed of traffic (25-35) or at least bicycle speed (15-25) if in a bike lane.
12.5 Mph as a top speed is too slow - make it 25-30 and it may have more utility and make it worth the price.
Speaking of price, at $3K I sure as hell won't be buying one for my child anytime soon. At $700 MAYBE. At $300, sure.
Hey, I just realized something...
Have you read that part where Andy Grove, 65, was pushed on the chest while standing on IT, and never fell off?
Well, Given this thing self balances you, and is virtually impossible to fall off of IT, then is opens up huge possibilities for Human Transporting Under Influence!
Now, you can be totally drunk and still manage to get home safe, provided you have a GPS too.
Let me stress this point: Sidewalks are for walkers. They are not for bicycles, or gingers, or pogo sticks. The only motorized vehicles I should see on the sidewalk are those used by the mobility disabled.
But more to the point, it is just purely offensive to put forth as some sort of miracle product a device that clearly can only significantly replace human-powered transit. Okay, so it reportedly has some sort of nifty, intuitive interface. There is absolutely nothing else significant about this invention.
It Is the Nature of Information to Transgress Artificial Boundaries
The best form of urban transportation truly is cheap. If you need to spend money to make it feel more "right", donate $4000 to a charity and begin using this technical marvell. All you need to do is put one foot in front of the other. Think forwards, and you'll move forwards, think stop and you'll stop. You can even go in reverse and turn on a dime!
I walk to and from work each workday. I walk to pickup my groceries, pick up my laundry, go grab dinner, etc. Just like the visionary at Segway, I have a car for trips to the airport and when I visit my friends who live in suburbia.
After looking over Segway's site and the information on the product, and after reading several comments here, I've had some thought, both serious and silly, and I thought I'd post a few of them.
;-)
1. What's the pounds-per-square-inch of force at the two points where the wheels meet the surface being traveled on? Is this enough to seriously injure feet/break bones when loaded with someone of average mass?
2. How does this thing handle on more slippery surfaces? The tires seem designed for dry surfaces where a smooth tire can expect reasonably good traction.
3. If I were to have a view from an overhead camera of an open squarish area with a bunch of salesrobots riding these around while trying to conduct business on their cellphones and reading their latest pager messages, would it be much like watching a science film about how molecules speed up and collide under heat/pressure?
4. Are these things classifiable as motor vehicles? Will they have to obey laws and precaustions such that pedestrians can be reasonably assured they won't be facing being impacted by the individuals like those mentioned in (3)?
5. I'm probably immune to this, as I have zero to no rhythm, but for those more active individuals that can actually move in time with music, how will the SegWay interpret body motion that isn't meant to convey directional commands to the unit itself?
6. How does it handle steep inclines/declines? Potholes? Different surfaces (hard/firm on one wheel, soft/sandy on another) - ie, a shoulder drop in a motor vehicle?
7. Will it have an emergency 'stop NOW' button to tell the processors "Halt horizontal movement and just balance, NOW"?
8. Are the electronics sections reasonably proof from the elements of weather?
9. Thanks to SUBWAY (tm), Jared lots a whole bunch of pounds. Thanks to SegWay, he can find them again.
>Get around town generating absolutely no >pollution
And that electricity is coming from where, fairies?
Uh, if you're in Boston, your electricity is probably coming from a 40-year-old natural-gas or coal-fired plant. You might well produce less pollution in some of the new SLEV Hondas than on an electric scooter.
That doesn't mean that mass has nothing to do with it. It just means that if you apply sufficent braking power(friction), you can stop anything. But a fully loaded train will need more braking power, or take longer to stop, than an unloaded one. Mass.
I won't buy one until it can send e-mail.
...the bicycle
Balance sensors:
IT: complex software and embeded circuitry used in conjunction with gyroscopes (5) to accomodate shifts in weight and terrain.
Bicycle: uses embed, neural networked balance sensors (2) of operator in conjunction with 2 plane-oriented gyroscopes (wheels, 2) to accomodate shifts in weight and terrain
Advantage: Bicycle. Extensive beta-testing and significant market penetration of biological control units predominate.
Power-train:
IT: battery operated motors, NiCd & NiMH. Regchargeable by plugging in any battery outlet. Good for approx. 6 hours.
Bicycle: uses operator biochemical force-actuators (legs, 2) for power-train. Rechargable at any lunch counter. Good for approx. 12 hours, or longer if reserves (fat) used.
Advantage: Bicycle: mean lifetime on force-actuators before requiring replacement is 75 years.
Motors:
IT: two which drive the vehicle independently. Emission free and fully redundant. If one fails, the other takes over.
Bicycle: two which drive the vehicle independently. Emission free and fully redundant. If one fails, the other takes over.
Advantage: Tie
CPU:
IT: pair of circuit boards ("sisterboards") sends commands to motor units based on input from sensors.
Bicycle: operator neural network ("left hemisphere" and "right hemisphere") sends commands to motor units based on input on sensors.
Advantage: Bicycle: operator neural networks includes threat detection, navagation ability and significant other software components.
Cost:
IT: who fscking knows?
Bicycle: less than IT
Advantage: Bicycle.
Winner: Bicycle.
To bad it wasn't the beer power car of the Simpson's fame. Oh well it a neat invention but i liked his auto-gyro slef stblizing walks up AND down stairs wheelchair. Forgot what it's called but i am guessing the IT is a scale down version of it. It's neat but i doubt i will be able to aford one or want one unless they shrink it in to the size of a skate board, which would be better then the design they have now which is to large and cumbersume to carry around the city, and to easy to steal. (come on it may have 64 bit crpyto but nothing beats a pair of bolt cutters and a pickup truck) But all in all when this guy brings it out for sale i'll check it out at the sharper image but untill then i'll stick to my skateboard and the many bruises i recieve in trying to skate through the urban jungle nyc.
Me and lunchbox here are going to kick your ass.
I hope Tony Hawk will teach me how to drive one of those...
Your fingers are right there, and I'm sure there are plenty of sharp objects about. Good enough for a joyride or two until decay sets in. People steal cars all the time and then just ditch them...
I agree with the other poster though - if they can't steal it, why not just break it? Either way, you loose.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
When I read this post, subconciously I saw Snow, Colorado, and read it as
Any vehicle is unsafe if you're a mormon
Before I get modded down for flame bait, ask someone who lives around the Zion Curtain to explain what a "Utah Roadblock" is. Two BMW's (Big Mormon Wagon's were around long before soccer moms and SUV's hit the mainstream... aka Suburbans, et al) Driving up the Canyons with cruise locked at a steady 64 mph side by side....
-- Life: Hate the Game... Love the cereal
...when you're going down a big-ass hill and the battery dies. 30MPH, gyros fail, end-over-end down the pavement. I wonder if Captain Ego has good product liability insurance and a team of lawyers. What a stupid freakin' invention. To have heard this guy pump him self over the course of the last 12 months, I would have expected something a bit more ground breaking and less...err...normal.
- It has inherent transverse stability.
- It has excellent turning capability. Two motorized wheels make the vehicle completely maneuverable. It has zero turning radius as it can rotate in place by counter-rotating the two wheels.
=LavaTroll(Imagine the disaster if either of those newscasters had suffered an injury on live television on the very first demonstration!) Imagine the ratings!!! 8-)
Throw a real engine into it, add some armor and weaponry, and you've pretty much got a mini-tank. Heck - slave a bunch of 'em together with an encrypted local IR/radio network, and you could have one man leading a "squad" of heavy weaponry units.
This could be the first glimpse at what heavy infantry might look like in the years to come.
"Great men are not always wise: neither do the aged understand judgement." Job 32:9
Just wondering...
just my blog and pix
My apologies to those of you out there that aren't american, you are not included in the subject.
Ok, so this is america, and Mr. Kamen thinks this is going to change cities. Last time I checked, people were still driving around in 3000 pound SUV's. Who wants to be riding on one of these IT things with one of those bearing down on you in a city? You can't drive it on the sidewalk, I can only assume this is meant for the roads.
Many other cities OUTSIDE of the US successfully have other modes of transportation. The only one I've been to, Amsterdam, has a HUGE population of bicycles. Shit. They even make a business out of pulling bikes out of the river and repairing and selling them, that's how many bikes they have. And if you own a car in amsterdam, it's half the size of your normal american car.
My point is that many other cities around the world have a base for human powered and small engine transportation methods. I can't think of any US cities that do.
I just hope this accelerates the day when people wise up and stop buying these shitty gas-guzzling SUV's. I drive a sentra. I don't want to get hit by your yuppie-mobile, it will hurt me a lot more than you, but you don't care, that's why you bought it.
Eventually gas prices will soar again, and I hope it will get so bad that people won't be able to fill their giant-tank trucks and such, and will be forced into something more realistic.
I live in London, and commute by Tube usually. I live ~5 mins walk from my local tube station and work approx the same distance from the station nearest to it, so I don't need one of these to get to or from the tube stations. I'd wager many, probably most, Londoners live and work sufficiently close to tube or surface rail not to need one for that either. Not to mention the lack of space on the average tube train: other commuters would soon get very fed up if even one or two people tried to bring their Segway on to a typically crowded rush-hour tube car.
So what about using it instead of the tube? Well, I live in Walthamstow, which is only tube zone three (of six) and I commute to Green Park in zone one. The distance by road from home to work is about ten miles, so pretty much the range of the device, and at a stated top speed of 12-17mph, I'm going to be lucky to complete my journey in much less than an hour, assuming I can weave my way through the congestion. Via tube door-to-door, when all goes well it takes no more than 35 minutes.
Of course, the tube doesn't always go well, and it's hot, crowded, dirty and expensive when it does, so on a nice summer's day maybe I'd prefer to Segway to work anyway, but most of the time London weather isn't nice enough to want to spend an hour each way in it. Maybe if I lived nearer to work it'd be different, but how many Londoners can afford to live in zones 1 or 2? (okay, the ones that could afford one of these things do!)
However, I was struck by the number of posters from North America who've said things like "this would be great for getting to the convenience store" (it wouldn't be for me or most British city-dwellers as my convenience stores are about two minutes walk away at the end of my street), and having an American girlfriend whose family live in a typical suburban area where everything is just too far to walk but just a short car ride away, I understand what they mean.
So, I don't think I'll be seeing one of these on the streets of Walthamstow any time soon, but maybe I will on the streets of Narragansett, RI, next time we visit.
My whole take on the device: It will be great for people who live fairly close to work. I think it will quickly become a "must have" for anyone who lives in a big city or lives close to work. You can ride it right up to your apartment, through the halls of your building to your office, etc. When you're done, it can be put in a closet.
Unfortunately, for the most of us, it's going to be an expensive toy. I can't ride it to work due to the limited range. If they could make the thing go 30-40 miles at full speed on a single charge, I'd be onboard. I could ride it to work, I could ride it around town during lunch, and I could ride it home afterwards (on sidewalks and bike paths, of course, not in traffic). Perhaps some better specs will be released soon.
But I have to ask, what's with Deka registering mystirlingscooter.com? Just trying to throw everyone off, or what? It was my understanding that the device itself wasn't going to be all that revolutionary, but rather the technology behind it. If this were powered by an efficient stirling engine, that would make sense. The technology that makes it device stand up is cool, but it's not going to change the world.
-Ryan, with the unoriginal sig
Compare the Segway with the Xootr eX3:
F LC XNX9GUESR2MN200J74S623X97C8RA&
http://shop.xootr.com/xootr/ex32.asp?shopperid=
power system: high-performance, proprietary 24V brushless DC motor with nickel metal hydride batteries
controls: variable speed throttle with regenerative braking action
weight: 19.8 lbs (9 kg) with standard battery pack
maximum speed: 17 mph (27 kph) (governed)
acceleration: 0-12 mph (20 kph) in 5 seconds
range: up to 12 miles (20km) with long-range battery pack;
6 miles (10km) with standard battery pack
hill climbing:
12 mph (20 kph) on 6% grade
8 mph (13 kph) on 9% grade
max hill grade 10%
braking: front lever-actuated friction brake, rear regenerative braking
charging: quick charger standard
maximum rider weight: 300 lbs (136 kg)
It seems better than the Segway in all regards except the balance and coolness factors, and price is less than $1000. Sure, the Segway is cooler, but if existing technology like the Xootr hasn't changed life in the cities, how will the Segway?
Everyone knows that damage is done to the soul by bad motion pictures. -Pope Pius XI
Dont you see? the innovation isnt the scooter, its the system inside that keeps it upright no matter how far you lean or what youre traveling over. Think of all the things this can be used for aside from a damn scooter...
-More stable wheelchairs, motorcycles, mopeds
-two-wheeled robots a 'la The Jetsons
-dont even get me started on the military possibilities
"Eagles may soar, but weasels dont get sucked into jet engines."
Your second concern, the weight, raises an interesting point that I may have missed in the articles I read: does IT perform better with a skinny passesenger -- rider? Itter? -- than a fat one?
All jokes about the average weight of target markets aside (i.e., average American @ 200 lbs vs. average person-from-anywhere-else @ 200 lbs [even though they probably use kilos or stone or something]), will IT go faster with a child onboard than it will with a full-grown man with a brief case and a laptop bag at the wheel? Or will IT govern its own speed to prevent hordes of yowling child bandits racing through downtowns with puffing bicycle cops in pursuit?
And for those people who say that Americans won't buy this thing, I'd like to make a suggestion. Does anyone know if Kamen has contacted college bookstores yet? Those things painted up in, say, BU's red-and-white would beat riding the stoopid "B" line through Allston anyday. Come to think of it, I bet the same is true for sprawling land-grant colleges as it is for schools in urban settings.
The only great things about this device is the form factor, and theft deterence.
I'm sure, however, that there will be services possible which make a stolen scooter useable for less than $3k. Further, rampant Ginger-Jackings will discourage consumption, and $3k untraceable transportation devices that can't outrun hoodlums in the dark of the night will lead to rampant Ginger-jackings.
Balance could be obtained by adding a 3rd shopping cart type wheel on the back, while still keeping a small platform...
Locomotion drive system could be achieved with a 2 or 4 piston driving crank shaft powered by each heel and toe.
Power assist is a nice option...
I hope the world promotes this as aggressively as it is apparently going to do so. But the evil that is unbounded self-servedness will unfortunately corrupt, unless many step forward to curtail evil.
I hear fairly poor comparisons with bicycles already but few of them mention some real questions I have: 1) how about steeper hills on this thing (30 degrees plus)? 2) Can you only carry a very light load on your back or be significantly off balance? (I don't know about YOUR amil carrier, but mine carries a pretty large, heavy bag) bicycles can have baskets adn panniers 3) bicycles have brakes which work very well how fast can this thin stop--the body position on a bicycle allwos faster stopping without end-o-ing that standing upright balanced on a scooter is would seem?
Until I get shown otherwise, I'll keep my curb-hopping, pot hole leveling, lighter, cheaper, basket-laden, workhorse mountain bike thank you.
You're fat as a hog, right? Whiny fatass.
'nuff said.
Schrodinger's cat is either dead or really pissed off...
About 30 pounds.
- Mike
Powered by Pocket XP no doubt....
heh
I have an idea for an alternate device. It's about the same size, you can travel at a speed slower than you can walk, or up to about the same max speed as IT. The benefits are that my device takes no electricity, it costs 1/30 the price, and it's available right now. Plus it's an HPV (Human-Powered Vehicle) so you get your exercise while using it. And it works on rough terrain, not just on smooth sidewalks. The only drawback is that it does take a month or two to learn how to use it, assuming you practice an hour or so after school/work every day.
It's called a unicycle.
Mod me as funny, but IMHO, IT is basically an electric unicycle (two wheels notwithstanding). They work in roughly the same way. Lean forward to go forward, lean back to go back. With practice, a unicycle can turn on a dime. And you can stay in (roughly) the same place on a unicycle by alternately pedalling forward and backward. My brother has one, and he can do everything on a unicycle that you could do on IT.
So it really comes down to cost versus learning curve. Which would you rather have - a device that takes a while to learn but costs ~$100.00, or an equivalent device that you can learn in five minutes but costs $3,000.00?
I guess the point I'm trying to make is that I think the market for IT is closer to the market of the unicycle than of any other transportation method. And considering how many unicycles we have on the street, I predict that IT isn't going to be the revolutionary, world-changing device that the creator thinks it is.
I post as Anonymous Coward because I'm even more paranoid than the rest of the slashdot crowd.
"Hey im the webmaster of segway.com, and I want you to link to my website so it crashes, so we can say 'the public's interest in this (sh)IT is overwhelming, our server even crashed from the lead'.
Come on guys, lets think about things before we jump on the HYPE-Bandwagon.
We're are ALL sick of this (sh)IT from months ago. We didnt care then, we dont care now.
*snore*
When I get where I'm going on one of these things, where do I park it? How do I keep it from being stolen?
If it's small enough to throw into the trunk of a car, that's exactly what thieves will do. Bicycles are nowhere near as expensive and get stolen all the time, even when they're chained down. $3000 a pop is a mighty tempting target.
That and its much more pedestrian friendly than bicycles... no need to get into the street and getting hit by a bus or idiot speeding down the roads.
My only questions are: Why all the redundancy? Sure, it'd be annoying if a motor failed, but are they expecting that to happen often? Eliminating the extra motors and cpus would bring the cost down considerably.
And the weight too..at 65 lbs, its no lightweight. I have to climb up stairs to my apartment (no handicap ramps here), which I will need to lug the thing up. Eliminating those extra motors will help take a few lbs off of it... perhaps an integrated backstrap for it would help too.
All in all, i'd buy one if it were cheaper.
-
Is anyone else sick and tired of 20 year old technology getting slapped together into some cheezy consumer product and being heralded as the cure for cancer?
The improved interface design IS revolutionary.
So is the improved "footrpint" - you could use this in a crowd.
Is a gyrosco-ped supposed to make me go out and spend a ton of money on something that is functionally useless?
Functionally useless? No. Like other vehicles, it's a foot-amplifier.
A "ton of money"? Depends on the denomination. How much would you pay for a good motorcycle? Now how much would you pay if you could use it on the sidewalk without getting busted? Now how much LESS would you pay if you couldn't use it at highway speed?
Like most new tech it will start with an early-adopter gee-whiz pay-off-the-development look-how-rich-I-am premium. Let's see whether they can make it affordable in a couple years.
Bantam Dominique roosters crow a four-note song. Once you've heard it as "Happy BIRTHday" you can't NOT hear it that way
he built it because nobody told him it couldn't be done.
Me lose brain? Uh, oh! (laughter) Why I laugh? -Homer Simpson
Just thought of something.... We know this may be a hackable device, and the speed limiter is comtrolled by a digital key. Therefore breaking the speed limit on this puppy would not only violate local regulations but the DMCA!
Convergence is beautiful, ain't it?
Green-voting, republican-registered, socialist-libertarian.
And what if you need to carry something? Like a briefcase, laptop computer, or worse yet groceries? What if it's raining?
And $3000? Please. This will be a California yuppie toy at best. You'll probably see a few on the boardwalk next to the beaches for those willing to spend $3000, that's about it.
I'm sure someone else has posted a link to the videos by now, but here it is again anyway. Pulling down the QuickTime version was a very fast download for me just a few minutes ago.
I give this thing 2 maybe weeks from start of public sale before the "extreme sports" assholes start successfully modding them to go faster at the expense of battery life, and maybe remove the handlebars, and become a public nuisance on city sidewalks just like the skate-rats are now. Expect cities to come up with entire new revenue streams as they pass Segway Speed Limit ordinances and it becomes possible to get pulled over and get a ticket on the sidewalk.
~Philly
problems:
1)you just increased the amount of area a person needs to travel, when compared to walking.
2)When walking, you can bumo into people with little to no effect, what happens when your doing it a 8 MPH?
3)what happpens when you run of someones toes? far mor likely to happen then steppin on someones toes.
4)If people can't be bother to look fo bikes and motorcucles, why would this be less likely to be hit?
5)what happens when you fall forward/backwards?
6)Is your employer going to pay for the electricity so you can charge it at work?
pluses:
1) the balancing technology can be put to many other devices.
2)will see them in cheesy sci-fi shows in about 5 years.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Just a thought, but sounds good to me, IMHO. Then again, I also wouldn't pay $3000 for something so small and slow. Does it even come with a helmet for that price? I'm sure there are a lot of people who will be hit by a car with these things. Also, what happens if you go through a puddle that's too deep? Is the thing waterproof, or will it short out and die, negating your $3K investment?
Just some thoughts.
today is spelling optional day.
What makes this thing any better than the kajillion or so electric scooters already out there that consumers are not buying in droves?
I'd be the perfect person for such a device, and I wouldn't shell out $300 bucks for it, much less $3000.
I'll grant you that the tech is kinda cool, in an abstract sort of way, but it can't even go up curbs for chrissakes. At least with a zap or similar scooter, you can pop a wheelie and ride up a curb.
It reminds me of the iridium phone- more of an expensive technical parlor trick than any kind of significant advance. There are already things out there that cost considerably less and have better performance, except in a few corner cases which I'm sure the Ginger Foamers will point out shortly.
Plus, I don't buy all the saftey claims- you can have all the gyros in the world, but if the wheels aren't getting any traction, you're going to wind up on your face with your nuts wrapped around the handlebar.
You have got to be joking, I refuse to believe that this is tha fammed IT, we all heard about. This is 5 magnitudes beyond stupid. I feel cheated and used by a huge corporate entity, someone look for a Microsoft logo on it.
Hopefully this is just a joke or something and the REAL IT will be out later. Kudos to the marketing team though.
But on a lighter side it is my FIRST POST! it must be an unintentional side effect of IT, I'm sure.
500 dollar reward for tip(s) leading to the arrest of the person(s) who stole my sig.
I know exactly why they flew Steve Jobs out to see the thing: they wanted advice on how to price it!
Kamen: Well, Steve, what do you think we should charge people for this thing. We were thinking that a pricve tag of about five hundred...
Steve: Wait, wait! Are you kidding me? No one will buy it for that price. They'll think they're not getting anything. You want people to think that this thing is the greatest product in the world. Charge them a premium, say, four thousand dollars, and the money will come pouring in.
I wonder if there will be Blizzak tires for IT for us in the great white north. Maybe a heater module, posi-trak, and a deicing system.
Hey, leave comments about my mother out of this!
If you are walking down a sidewalk and pestered by somebody on a Segway...
1. Stay in front of it to block it for a second or two.
2. Reach over the bars and yank out the key card.
3. Run like hell.
They will never catch you, because you are in good shape from walking and they are not. They will be stuck on the sidewalk with a $3000 push-cart. It's the perfect crime.
Information wants to be anthropomorphized.
Forget hype. I have no problem with deserved hype. see apple commercial with hammer.
I can go 15 miles or more on my bike, try that on this.
A can zip between cars on a bike.
this thing is more dangerous in a collision. If I get hit by a car on my bike, I go on top of the car, you get hit on this and you'll go under the car.
My bike is pratical on the street, this is not(too wide) that means you'll be on the sidewalk, with pedestrians, that means a) you'll be travelling the same speed as the walker, b)bigger foor print.c)laibility when you injure some one by running over their foot.
2 inch step? haha, geet the thing to go over a standard curb, or it immediatly become more of a hassle for the user.
I can not stress this enough, crowds. it is too big for crowds.
If he made it skate board shaped, it would be far more practical.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
As in, http://www.brooklynmachineworks.com/bikes/images/t mx_brick_drive.jpg (for the goat-fearing).
The LAST thing I need, or most any American does, for that matter, is something to make their ass bigger.
The dude is a Human Skunkworks. Don't let him out into public.
A chunk of the 3k is going to liability insurance.
The NY Times article references both Andy Grove and John Doerr's concerns that it will spark a feeding frenzy among the contingency fee lawyers.
Okay, so tell me again how that handle bar isn't going to smash my 'nads when I can't stop or wipe out?
Can you say 'class action lawsuit'?
They should call it the 'Bobbit'.
this is why i have gone out with girls i met on the bus. Or was it?
of course, i haven't met anyone serious from the bus (unless they were seriously crazy), but it seems that if you are in your own personal vehicle, you aren't really likely to talk to someone in/on theirs. Building community is an irrelevant argument.
OK, I have just one question...
I understand how the Segway uses force to balance. If you lean forward, it balances you out by accelerating forward. Nifty. Same goes for going backwards. If I am wrong on this, let me know, but I don't see how else the device can counteract leaning forces...
So, how does it compensate for leaning forward if it is already going at top speed? They say it is impossible to topple, but by leaning forward once the thing is moving at (constant) top speed, how would it not tilt forward until falling over? It could no longer speed up the base to keep up with the forward over-balance...
Same would go for going backwards once you were going backward at top speed and yet continued to lean back.
I am not saying that I would do this, or that with a bit of skill the thing can't be really safe (and *cool*), I just wonder about these "unfallible" claims?
JoeK
What Would Sutekh Do?
This thing seems designed to spill you on uneven pavement. It's true that twice walking speed is better than faster (more time to see the pot holes, less damage when you hit), but it sure isn't for anyone over 30. Even when younger falls tend to cause broken bones, and falls in traffic are much worse!
Bicycles have large wheels for several reasons, and one of them is so that small holes in the road don't cause you to spill. (You may need to work hard to keep you balance, but you have a chance.)
When Vespa's were popular, there was talk of banning them, and this was the reason. But this thing has even smaller wheels, so it will be more sensitive to pot holes than a Vespa even dreamed of being. It may not tip sideways, but if the wheel drops into a hole, it may buck quite badly. A large pot hole (one where the front wheel descended more than half way) would guarantee an instant halt to the machine, but not to the driver. And the axles looked quite exposed to mud. This can't be good, but I don't know how bad the maintenance would be. (That may not be a fundamental flaw, but the wheel size appears to be one.)
I think we've pushed this "anyone can grow up to be president" thing too far.
You can buy an electric scooter for under $300 that has a longer range and goes faster. It's smaller because you can fold it up. Its just as manueverable on city sidewalks(actually its better for sidewalks since its much more slender). And it's gonna be alot easier to fix since its just a damn battery and a motor, not 10 microchips and a gyroscope.
Plus you gotta worry about that thing getting stolen. Its pretty big so your probably not going to want to hall it up to your office or room, meaning now you gotta lock it up at the bicycle racks. However an electric scooter is much smaller and you can even get on an elevator with it.
Oh and did I mention that you'll look like the bigest fucking idiot on that thing. Good luck not getting your ass kicked. You'll be like one of those blow-up punching bags that you can't knock down.
-BlingBlings
-BlingBlings Flossin it
$5 / month hosted VPS on linux = awesome!
Can I just point out, as everyone complains about the $3K cost, that that cost is the *initial* cost? How often does a piece of high technology stay at its launch price for more than a few months? once these things go into volume production and the methods are refined, I'd bet we'll see a major price drop! And if not, just buy one from eBay. I'm sure they'll surface there within a couple of weeks of their launch.
"Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one " -Albert Einstein
IT is the perfect Slashdotty item. No substance, maximum hype with accompanying smoke and mirrors, and anybody can say any damnfool thing and no one can tell them they're wrong. I'm pleasantly amazed it hasn't croppe dup any more often than it has.
Bugger.
those links are mesmerizing even if difficult to make out.
How I wish I was a moderator today...while Rogerborg may have a point about disposal, no decent charger permits excessive overcharging. You can bet an expensive unit is going to spend the $3 required to prevent this.
1. Noone wants to stand up for a max distance of 17 miles. Trust me.. America (or the world) is just that lazy.. *maybe* a sit-down model would go better. That "mail carrier" stuff is crap. He's got a big pack, and would strain his back.
2. You can't transport stuff with it.. groceries, friends, whatever. (Hop on my back Billy, we'll ride to the store at 8mph on the sidewalk)
3. Most people are in a hurry to get to wherever they are going. I'll take my car at 35-55mph over a 8mph scooter anyday.
4. Safety!? Hello.. I'm going to run over the first jackass that rides in the street in front of my car at 8mph when there is no sidewalk.
5. Safety #2 - China, 10000 people on the sidewalk.. One idiot bumps you from behind.. you bump the person in front of you.. old ladies fall down..break hips..etc etc..
6. 17miles per charge.. 8mph.. No thanks.. I'll take "Bikes" for $300 Alex.
7. Regardless of the technology, it is still just a glorified Sharper Image electric scooter. Throw in a seat, hover ability, dome for safety, and 200mile, 55mph ability on 5cent electrical charges, and you've got a sell.
David Lettermans top 10 list for Ginger. (that whore) 1. Footprint is too large for crowded cities. I live in Tokyo and have been to LA and just about all large cities in America it is hard enough to pack enough people on the sidewalk as it is. 2. It is expensive. Never 3. It weighs 65 lbs. 4. What am I going to do with it at my destination. Use it to "walk" around Walmart. 5. 15 mile range, too short, what happens when I run out of battery power. I have to carry 65 pounds. 6. Try standing in one place for an hour. It sucks. Walking is way more fun. 7. Incliment weather. Walking keeps us warm. 8. Charge time. I want to go know but I can't because my IT isn't charged. 9. Reliability who is going to fix this technical piece of IT when it breaks. 10. Its gay.
But a standing platform that is simply 6 inches longer to accomodate a shopping cart wheel would still be highly tippable.
See, we lived in Montreal. We know all about snow.
You need clearance and wheels that won't follow a rut in a stroller, or you won't get very far. Some people have managed ski-type attachments for strollers.
So, yeah, such a thing, in its present form, would be pretty much useless there almost half the year. But that doesn't mean its worthless the other half, nor should people who don't live in such harsh climates be denied it's utility because it is of less value to you. What was that point about arrogance?
You could've hired me.
seems great for new yorkers commuting from upper west/east side down to wall st...manhattan is what, 7 or 8 miles long? you could do the r/t on one charge, or charge it up at work...cities will probably offer incentives so people will buy them, kind of like the transitcheck program in nyc...remember, the subway is like $50/month with metrocard, right? that's $600/year...so let's say the city offers you a $600 rebate, then you pay $2400 and recoup the cost in 4 years (plus you can use it to escape muggers in central park -- bonus!)...a 4 year loan on $2400 is around $50/month, which is what you would have paid for the subway anyway...hopefully it has a 5 year warranty!!
don't know if I'd try it in wintertime, though, your face might freeze off at 12.5 mph -- unless you wore ski goggles or something...but in summertime it would be great with the breeze you make as you cut up park ave at 12.5mph...
one question: how do you tell which is yours in the parking lot? not much room for personalization...maybe there's a business here...be the first to design custom segway wheelcovers, yes!!!
and what about a headlight for those late night starbucks runs??
recumbent tricycles solve the balancing issue at low speed.
The way the gyro works is by balancing you forwrd/backward... on a recumbent bike, your balance issues are side to side, and gyro's wouldn't help since there is no way to move the bike sideways with a motor.
Somehow, I like Mr. Garison's better
The Digital Sorceress
I think the problem a lot of /.ers have is that it is being compared to the car. The Segway won't replace anyone's car; it may, however replace the wheelchair, or if it becomes lighter, faster, and cheaper, the bike.
Slow down, cowboy! It has been 4 hours since you last posted. You must wait another few hours.
Well the point is not wheter to get killed or not.. the thing is the ever constant american falacy that at a 3000 dollar price this will revolutionize third world transportation. Yeah sure! It costs as much as a house for most third worldlers! And get real... ridding a bike is much more fun.. and dangerous of course.. but fun nevertheless. Concerened a about safety.. buy a gamecube and stay at home. why dontcha!?
3. What do you do when the weather gets cold? I have a 5 mile drive to work, and the temperature was a paltry -9*F (-23*C). You think I'm going to sit on an exposed seat and let the wind chill drop the temp to (aprox) -50*F (-46*C)? Guess again. I used to deliver newspapers on my bike in the morning, years ago. At least then I was exurting effort, thereby keeping myself warm. With the Segway, I have no such advantage.
Thanks, but no thanks.
Wow, that was fast! Apparently, this company has already introduced a product with reduced power consumption (and a pretty snazzy look, if you ask me)!
$5 / month hosted VPS on linux = awesome!
Why 2 wheels? Because 3 would be 'stable' and leaning would be a problem. With 2 wheels, leaning is what provides the lion share of the propulsion, with batteries running the balancing computer and stabiliser. With 3 wheels, the batteries would need to provide propulsion, making the effective range of the thing so small as to make the device pointless.
Sharper Image has been selling motorized scooters for some time now. They are junk toys for bored executives. This is different entirely.
Two side by side wheels require active stabilization, but allow the lean of the rider, the placement of the rider's center of gravity, to power movement. The 'controlled fall' and stabilization are the true breakthroughs here.
The REAL jabber has the user id: 13196
What you do today will cost you a day of your life
To me, that seems like the only real market. At $3K, it could pay itself off in decent time. Big plus for the lonely golfer or the "third man" who doesn't want to rent a cart by himself.
Other than that, this just ain't gonna sell in the US of A. We don't do carpools, public transportation, or bikepaths. Why change now?
So again, I think it's just golfers who will want to know whether or not this will fit nicely in the back of their 4WD, 16-cylinder Ford Excursion with the extra-wide chassis.
...and kings will shut their mouths because of him - Isa 52:15
I hope the testers have good health benefits. Ouch!
Seriously! With all of the built-in stabilizers and gyroscopes, it won't be any FUN! No self-respecting Skateboard punk will want it.
It'll be neat to see what this thing can do, on a half-pipe.
AND I bet it'll be only a couple weeks before someone overclocks it to 19 mph.
This will change our society!! Think of it... Low-riders, Stunt shows, drag races on souped-up Segways, Burnouts, stand-by shootings...
Comparing this to a bicycle is kind of like comparing a scalpel to a machete. Bicycles are cumbersome and dangerous in a city environment; the segway is designed to be nimble and safe. It's designed specifically to coexist with pedestrians.
I can't fucking stand it when people bike on the sidewalk.
This scooter runs on the same idea of balance control as the IPOD, Kamen's wheelchair. And frankly, it ISN'T just marketing: it's pretty neat. The balance software is actually BETTER than any human, because it can respond much faster. Hopefully one of the things they'll demo soon is the Segway sans-driver. While it's moving, they'll throw things at it, but it'll compensate instantly and remain upright and moving as normal. Gyroscopes are cool.
Did you ever think that they would outlaw smoking in US cities? Not in buildings, but on the sidewalks?? Well, they have.
Give the West Coast a chance.. L.A., with it's smog and fad-o-philia, just might pass an ordnance restricting emissions to such a ridiculous level that a Segway becomes a viable option for people running between opposite ends of town.. Especially since you can fit one of these things in your standing space on a bus or subway (granted, with a little ramp to off/load it.
For that matter, look at many European cities, especially those with 'old' cobble-stone sections where cars and motorcycles are not permitted..
And hell, if the price halves in a couple of years, I'll buy one just for the whiz-bang 'skiing without the snow' factor.
The REAL jabber has the user id: 13196
What you do today will cost you a day of your life
There's nothing amazing about skiing. I skied all the time when I was young (I lived kind of close to Siberia) and it's okay, kind of like riding a bike on Peabody enjoyment scale I just made up.
The vast majority of posts are slamming something that the poster has no clue about, surprise surprise.
Anyone who had watched the demo this morning on GMA would first have seen that the balance system in the machine is truly amazing, seeing the idiots hosting the show learn how to navigate these in seconds was shocking. They were doing no-hands and balancing on one foot within minutes while scooting around. They had a minimal obstacle course that included a small water trap that it zipped through no problem.
They were even purposefully crashing into each other by the end, although Dean did not look too pleased, it showed that basically, the Segway has better balance than us, thats the biggest danger. Dean's biggest fear was one of the hosts falling off of theirs and breaking a leg, each host had a spotter following them around, no spills were televised. If you trust it and hold on, you are not going to tip over.
The intuitiveness of navigation has too been seen to be understood. As others have posted, this is the first one thats been made public, the price, size,style, etc. will all mature in a rapid time frame if adoption takes place at even fractions of all the hype. Making a seated one should not be too difficult, alot more material, but if you lean in it and its attached to the wheel area, it'll work.
Dean Kamen is one of America's greatest modern day treasures and is so overlooked. Know anyone who has ever required dialysis, he changed their lives, know anyone with heart problems, maybe his stent has saved their life ala VP Cheney. Ever seen his wheelchair that climbs stairs?
In other words, take a look at it in motion, give a few seconds thought to that balance system and how revolutionary it is, the price will drop, it will get lighter and more styles will come.
Who knows, replace the wheels with some powerful gyroscopic inertial thrusters and you have a wicked flying scooter that keeps you from tipping over while in flight.
Sid
What? Are you kidding? Not drive, just because there is snow on the ground? How the hell am I supposed to get around for 4-5 months out of the year? (I live in Anchorage, AK) Not only do we drive on the snow and ice (with the help of studded or "siped" tires, such as the blizzak) we actually RACE on it. Oh, yeah. We race using motocycles too.
But in the car, you have shelter from the elements (and a heater too!), on the motorcycle (racing at least), you have exursion pushing the bike around (not to mention the heat of the engine between your knees). The Segway takes both of those benefits away.
It looks like a cool toy/tool, and it certainly has its uses, but I'm sure not going to be replacing my car any time soon.
Can't stand watching that show any more, but it's exactly what those guys would do after zipping through a crowd of Nuns or startled bystanders on the "Segway" and then cross the street to get away and fail trying to hop a curb.
Every new form of media has it's own Requirimento
Yah, that's all great but will it be the world shaking product its been hyped to be? Doubtful...People don't even bother to walk a few feet to go to a nearby convinience store never mind ride a scooter in less than perfect weather. How about carrying loads? I don't see people lining up to carry their shopping in backpacks so they can use this thing. What if you have young kids? How many moms would be willing to have their 6 yr old scoot around the city even if they are next to them? What about the liability issues when 2 people slam into each other at top speed for a combined speed of ~24mph?
Look at bikes, they don't take a whole lot of effort to get around most places but there is rarely a decent place to lock them up and you take your life in your own hands in the city. Carrying anything bigger than a rucksack requires getting in your car.
I see this, in it's present form, only being popular with techie types and the gung-ho altera crowd.
It is by the juice of the coffee bean that thoughts acquire speed, the teeth acquire stains. The stains become a warning
I agree with your comments, and I'd like to add that gas won't always be $1.00 a gallon. It's certain that SOMEDAY we'll use up a lot of our oil reserves, and it's somewhat likely that in the near term Saudi Arabia will be unstable.
...
It would be easy to combine the scooter with public transportation to replace a lot of automobile use in warmer cities. It even sounds like it does well on ice, so perhaps it might work in November in Minnesota (don't know about January though). Scoot to your light rail train, hang your palmprint locked scooter on the side, get off and go to the office. Check your scooter at planeside, use it at the airport
I could see renting the scooters around cities, as taxi alternatives. Car rental companies might want to look into this business. Or rent a scooter with your car rental for a small fee. That might be one way that a lot of the $3000 devices will see popular use -- as rentals.
The price will fall like a rock (what exactly is the cost here? silicon? ummmm look for $400 devices within a few years). There will be a place to attach a standard bag for carrying things. Eventually there will be trailers. Go to Europe, and tour your favorite town via scooter.
Best of all, I can scoot around when I'm 85 yo, even more demented than now, and can barely shuffle from spot to spot. Sounds good to me.
I won't buy one at $3000, but I'll definitely have on at $600! And before that I'll have rented one to get around on my business trips.
If these things really work as advertised, they will indeed succeed.
John Faughnan
jfaughnan@spamcop.net
I hadn't thought of that - Imagine how comical a collision between several of these would look!
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I needed some sour cream for my baked potatoe. Dinner was going to be ready very soon, and my kid's scooter was the quickest form of transportation available (out of bike and car alternatives), because it did not require disembarking and locking up.
When I got into the market, a security guard chased me down and asked me to get off... while chuckling. I was in no way speeding or endangering any shoppers, but I complied. As I walked my scooter to the far end of the supermarket, I got back on, once I saw a deserted aisle. As I scooted back towards the crowded area of the market, I was annoyed to see the same security guard from the front of the store there looking at me in an annoyed manner, and threatening to ask me to leave, if I persisted. He'd obvisously followed me throughout the store.
The first moral of the story, if you want to commit armed robbery somewhere, bribe someone to ride a scooter into the back of the store.
The second moral of the story is that society expects you, once you are no longer a teenybopper, to keep your fat ass in a car where it belongs.
I claim that I received weirdo looks from far and wide because I brought my scooter to the supermarket. Social coercion will similarly impact others to keep their fat ass in cars, rather than gingers. I hope not, but if security guards allow middle aged ladies in gingers, how will they fulfill their lifelong dreams of stopping teenagers on skateboards?
But if you were to turn the wheels on a bike or rollerblade by 90 degrees...
The REAL jabber has the user id: 13196
What you do today will cost you a day of your life
How about a paradigm shift in the way the American culture has been going for the past 200 years? How about a shift from the "me" attitude that is common in America today to become more socially aware, and aware of the impact on our environment and society that a single individual imposes. You mention McDonald's and their happy meal toys, and the garbage that they cause, that is the prototypical example of the me-now attitude that we are teaching our children. All growing up we are taught that we are special, and unique. What we have to realize is that EVERYONE is special and unique, and we have to respect others, even if it means the next generation. What we need now more than anything is a cultural revolution. To get away from quick fixes, and me now garbage. Instead of spending the money on "Happy meal" toys, why not emplore McDonalds to give that money to Cancer research, or building a great work of art? Where is the pride in craftsmanship in the world today? Why don't we build brick roads that can last for hundreds of years rather than quick asphalt solutions that pothole-up after the first hard rain? Money is not the problem, never really has been, it's the attitude of the here, now quick fixes that is the downfall of our society today. This rant can go on and on, but our pollution is a symbol of our polluted attitude toward our world.
One charge goes 15 miles and travels at a maximum of 12 mph? I ride my bicycle to and from work every day over a greater distance and faster speed. This guy is full of poo-poo.
All you need for an internal diabetic pump system is a bladder under the ass skin so that when the person feels weak and sits down, it squirts some glucose into their blood.
I am for the complete Trantorization of Earth.
When I was in high school, my buddies and I were out fishing in Long Island Sound. A storm freakin' roared up on us, and our motor just would not restart. The flounder we caught (the beer buzz) seemed pretty insignificant. We called the Coast Guard but they refused to get us. Something about only if it was life threatening. I guess our boat needed to be sinking before they would come get us.
The caretaker at North Dumpling came and got us and towed us into the island. He was there with his woman (oops, sorry dude, we messed up some nookie time) but he put us up at the caretaker's cottage.
The storm sunk my friend's boat, and the mega-monster Bertram that the caretaker towed us in was crashed up against the shore. Waves crashed over the stone jetty (it was like 8 feet above the normal water line) while my friend and I were trying to tie down his boat. A wave actually knocked my friend off the boat into the water.
The island was pretty cool though - had a mini-Stonehenge on it. Not sure if Kamen owned it then or not (don't seem to remember a wind turbine on it, but things were a bit hazy). We could have used a water-skimming Ginger to get back to shore after the storm.
..
I forget...are we at war with Eurasia or East Asia?
It seems to me that the computers could detect a beginner by the frequency and severity of balance corrections required and then do the speed limiting by itself.
...is about 2mph above the speed I average driving my car here in Seattle, home of some of the worst traffic in the country.
During the day, driving from downtown Seattle to downtown Redmond (~7 miles) will take you about 45 minutes. That's an average of about 9 mph.
Now I live in a rather rural part of North America, a place where sidewalks are not very busy. So I may have no clue what I'm talking about. But if sidewalks are as busy as they are portrayed in some movies, and now Kamen wants people to use this instead of walking on sidewalks? Now if you ask me, this has got to be pretty stupid, I mean there's already a crowd walking on sidewalks and every place else, now all we need is some dinky device to take up more space on the sidewalk, piss more people off, so we can have more ass kicking on the sidewalk. All I can say is, "WOW, what an invention."
(Doubt you'd ever see one pulling up to a McD window.)
That's a point in IT's favor, right?
_____
God is only experiencing itself -- Nisargadatta Maharaj
I didn't know that owning your own island and being (supposedly) self-educated automatically makes your product wonderful. How about just looking at the idea, ok?
Of course there will be niche uses for this, there are for almost any product. But you miss basic human nature, people prefer to sit than stand and people won't expose themselves to unpleasant weather if they can avoid it. Think grandma will feel comfortable bouncing around outdoors on 2 wheels when she could be sitting in her motorized chair with no chance of falling? Doubt it.
As for how safe it is, if the average person truly put safety ahead of convenience they wouldn't need laws telling them to wear a seatbelt. They just don't care.
It is by the juice of the coffee bean that thoughts acquire speed, the teeth acquire stains. The stains become a warning
As you say, is is an "IT," and therefore neither male nor female. This means there is only one sex, and therefore it is capable of ONLY homosexual activity.
... you are just about as gay as a leather pinata.
Realize that what's so special about this thing is that it has no controls of any sort, other than the handlebars. The device has only one function: Stay upright. That's it. If you lean forward a bit, the device will roll forward to prevent you from tipping. Lean backward and it goes backward. Now, that's not to say you can't knock the thing over, but the whole point of the device is to make it damn near impossible.
That said, it won't stop on a dime, I guarantee that. If you're booking along at 12 MPH, and granny walks in front of you, granny is gonna get plowed.
- Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day, but set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.
So he's why we're stuck with Cheney for the rest of his term? Thanks a lot!
I could see Segway having more of an immediate impact in densely populated, air polluted areas of the world... New Delhi India comes to mind... Although the Segway needs to be stripped down to it's least expensive components to make it an affordable option.. It probably won't work out too well for the general U.S. public due to urban sprawl (inter/intra office travel is a 50/50 possibility). Distance/Time is Segway's major pitfall while being good for the environment is it's upside.
I work within a couple of miles of my residence, so you'd think I'd like something like this (though not with a $3000 price tag). I don't. Maybe if you're the single person with a spare few grand, you're all set.
For those of us with families or those of us who want a place for a date to sit on Friday and Saturday night, this thing is a useless curiosity. It isn't like I could take the little Wokan to daycare on this thing. (A few miles in the opposite direction.)
"Hi, I was wondering if you'd like to have dinner with me Friday night."
"Sure."
"Great! Do you have a way of getting to the restaurant? I only have a one-person scooter."
Why is everyone so angry?
"Oh! Just another scooter!"
"Use a bike!"
Jesus...
despite what everyone says, this thing IS
Revolutionary!
It automatically ballances itself acording to your body's motion!!!
i mean WTF! that's f* king amazing! this thing that u see may not be THE big thing, but the technology inside it will allow in the near future for F* king amazing *smart* motorcicles/scooters/bikes/skateboards!
Imagine the hype scateboards from "Snow Crash" being made in 5 years! or imagine instead of shoes, wearing rollerblades and zooming everywhere (or not) and being automatically ballanced! this is some nice shit and just beacuse it looks like something your granny would use, it will allow for some amazing technological advances in things that havn'e changed (basically) in years (bikes, motorscycles etc etc)
Just to be picayune, you're misusing the term "to beg the question." Begging the question is implicitly assuming as one of your axioms the thing you are claiming to prove. It's better (and more descriptively) known as "circular reasoning."
What you mean to say is "invites the question" or "raises the point."
My work here is done.
Right, and we could also eliminate murder if people controled their passions and we could eliminate people falling off of ladders if they paid attention to what they were doing but those things aren't going to happen. People love technological solutions but avoid even looking at human behavior. People will continue to drink and ride and they'll continue to smoke.
You are such a dumbass. Read the article - you can put it in the space of a chair.
If you ever had anything interesting to say don't you think moderators would give you higher ratings than this?
Come up with a well thought out opinion for a change.
Dumbass.
I've seen a lot of comments about how practical this will be in cold climates, but what about hilly climates? I live in Pittsburgh, and I seriously doubt the electric motors in that thing will be strong enought to pull me up the hills in the city streets.
I applaud the technology but really...it's just another excuse not to exercise. The top speed is 12MPH and it's electric. I thought it was going to be some earth-shattering new power source or hydrogen-powered engine. It's just another fancy toy that will be popular for a while until people realize that it has the same problems as an electric-powered bicycle: you can't use it in the rain, you need to recharge it, you need to chain it up at your destination and if you're clumsy you'll run into people no matter what gyros are in the thing. I'll keep using my skateboard and mountain bike thanks.
You are essentially fulfilling comments made earlier - the only people that will benefit by this are lazy and don't want to walk. I understand it's trendy on /. to knock anything hyped, but really. REALLY. This is absolute crap. It's not going to completely change society. People who drive their car 3 blocks to get groceries still need the trunk to stuff their prepackaged food into. They aren't going to switch and stop burning fuel. Bikers won't dump their bikes which are certainly no more dangerous and give them great exercise(to say nothing of a very vibrant bike subculture). The only people that will buy it are rich yuppies that want to look trendy, or if they put the price point low, cardiac disease will jump 20%.
I don't doubt MS employees will look very trendy(=geeky) zipping around Redmond on their little racing-striped Gingers. But please. Changing the world?
DT
Look at the picture on the front page of "http://www.segway.com/consumer/home_flash.html". Seems fairly normal, yes? Well it is, until you consider that the Segway weighs 65 pounds. That leaves me wondering not only how the woman on the top of the stairs got hers up there, but how she plans on getting it back down. She must be pretty muscular.
Also, if I get drunk and ride my Segway around the town, I wonder if a cop would issue me a SUI. Do you think foot-patrol police in Los Angeles and London will ride these around? The ability to ride handless seems ideal for travelling forward while shooting at someone with a gun or beating them silly with a baton.
You'd let a 5 year old with CP ride one of these things? Are you nuts?
You also have 2 appendages called "legs" that tend to not get much use nowadays. There are also these things called "bikes" that don't require "outlets" or "quotation marks".
Buy stock in steel-toed shoes!
Ok,i think this has got to be one of the worst ideas in a very long time. I would bet you money that we will not be seeing anny of these things where i live.(Texas)
Also, i thought of a teribly ammusing idea. imigen this, your ziping around on your little sigway and the batterie dies or the gyros stop working. your going to fall flat on your face. (or back)
You'd have to PAY me a great deal of money to get me to use one...
who manufactures that?
...since we found pork in our pork & beans.
My trusty C5 has held up well, but has started to look a little dated. Now I can make the switch to a snazzy new platform, without looking dorky!
The big deal here is not the technology. (Even though "dynamic stability" has tons of other applications waiting to be discovered.) The big deal is not the speed, or the price, or the hype.
The big deal is "It is the first [vehicle] that doesn't isolate you from other pedestrians." Think about that... I'm sure Dean Kamen has.
For instance, just think about the potential to change the way we grow cities. (It's not certain to do so by any means, of course... that depends on substantial mass acceptance.) But if you consider the way cities looked before the automobile, and how they look today, it's easy to see the impact of the automobile.
This has the potential to have an impact of a similar magnitude. IT isn't going to take us back, but if it catches on it's going to take us somewhere else.
With reasonable men I will reason; with humane men I will plead; but to tyrants I will give no quarter. -- William Lloyd
I can see it now...some people complain and all but I can see important things comeing from all of this.
Most importantly...the fact that MPS(mechaps.com) can license the gryo setup for the mechs! Damn right!
See...I can see the bright side of any situation...though I can see little to no public use for "it" right now, though warehouse or workers in assembly plants could use them. Good for conjested cities but how good is it on inclines? I mean sure it can climb a hill but where I live...some hills are 10-11% gradient...and I don't live near moutains...but where the glaciers cut the great lakes.
Om, nomnomnom...
The Wheelman comes in 3 different flavors, sports an internal combustion engine and therefore packs a tad more oomph to climb steep slopes and the occasional scateboard-halpipe. :-)
And what sissy needs a handlebar anyway?
We suffer more in our imagination than in reality. - Seneca
From the website:
"Step on Segway HT, and your instinct will be to steady yourself, as you would on anything with two wheels."
So if your first instinct is to try and balance the thing, what's the first instinct of people around you, who have seen more than their fair share of people flying down the road on bikes, skateboards, and scooters, only to wipe out?
It seems to me that people would be scared to be on the sidewalk alongside one of these things, even if this fear is unfounded. Regardless, I have a feeling that, because of that fear, you'll see a few restrictions on this thing pretty fast, should it get popular.
The following was a post by Ben FrantzDale to a Mudd mailing list:
IT (aka Ginger, aka Segway) appears to be an automatic two-wheeled
unicycle, in that the fore and aft stability is attained through dynamic
stabilization. Having used a unicycle around Boston, Mudd and RPI, I
definately think it's a good mode of short to medium distance
transportation (i.e., a range of a mile or so).
The shareholder is always right.
I'm surprised noone has brought up the potential these things have for becoming a whole new sport. Or dozens of new sports, for that matter. How stable are they? Can I hang off the side, flying-dutchman style, and flail about with my mallet in a game of Segway polo?
I can imagine some sick variations on the general theme of a stabilized "scooter". You could make one that adjusts its angle while riding up and down a half-pipe. It lays out horizontal while in the air, and rotates back to vertical on reentry. It could even rotate the wheels independently of your body, so you couldn't land wrong.
Or take out the driving motors and slap some huge tires on it. It would make for one hell of a wild ride down the mountainside.
Duuuuude. Duuuuuuuuuuuude. The possibilities.... Tony Hawk Pro Skater and Jet Grind Radio don't look so ridiculously unrealistic any more. I had given up on downhill skateboarding due to repeated injuries, but now I'm taking another look at it.
Seriously dude, think about it. Dude. Duuude.
LAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAZER BEEEEAAMS!!!
if you could instantly incinerate people as they moved into your line of fire.....i'd buy one.
Think about it: The more people use IT, the less people will walk, ride a bike, etc. The already out of shape average American will become even more obese and get diabetes. Then they'll need to buy Kamen's insulin pump.
It's kind of sad. Who would be foolish enough to buy one of these when for a third or even sixth of the price you could get a decent road or hybrid bicylce. Even though IT uses a small amount of energy, you still need to charge the battery. That energy has to be produced somewhere, be it from a coal plant or some other source.
You could get a rad Italian road bike for $3000.
I don't know how else to put it, this is nothing majorly new (other then the balancing system), it is a scooter, and a ugly one with no cargo space at that. All this device might do is enable people to get fatter. And wait till someone gets injured when the balancing thing fails, can you say lawsuit.
Not to mention the fact that the website it totally hosed, what are they running on Winblows XP?
they'd be slick if you could turn them off. i have to cover them every time i want to sleep. sucks. also sucks that thing makes power LED on my midiman 2x2 midi interface pulse too... too many goddamn blinking lights.
[|]
And here's the thing in action
I read your thread, and as everyone else is pointing out it really is absolute drivel.
I live about 25 miles away from my work, not a bad deal because I take the local light rail in. Problem is the nearest stop is a little under a mile away. So, often times I drive my car there and park and ride. Switching to Segway for this would be awesome. Gas costs alone over the course of three years for my vehicle would overcome the expenses of buying a Segway.
Also, 3 nights a week I go to kung fu. The school is about a mile away from a different light rail stop - and for effiency and time sake i have to drive an additional 3 miles to go to a light rail stop past the traffic congestion so I can make it to kung fu on time. Now, I take my time hit in the morning when often times it will take me about 30 minutes to go 3 miles - that isn't good gas mileage. Having a segway would enable me to ride to the close light rail stop, take it to work, take the light rail after work to the stop near my kung fu school ride there and back, then back home. Easy, efficient, and very practical considering I never carry anything more than my laptop bag/backpack combo.
I know I'm not the only one who has transportation patterns similar; in fact 2 other people I work with are very excited about it for nearly the same reasons. The rest of your arguments (in this parent and your other) are just idiotic and irrational. Many people would like this. I'll probably be buying one when they come available - another perk is I don't have to leave my car at the light rail stop where it can be broken into or damaged.
Dacels Jewelers can't be trusted.
With a balence controled throttle.
But your not going to sell these things even at $1000. The deluxe can indeed go for as much as $3000 but there has to be a cheeper $500 model.
The biggest initial market I see for these things is collge students. So they will need a basket or wider base to help carry a book bag. In order to seed the market they will need to rent the scooters out on campus for something like $20 a week.
I don't think people will be commuting on these things. The best senerio I can imagine is that people purchase a use licence and use them temperarily. I'm in Portland Oregon and I avoid going downtown at all costs. City officials want people to use the bus. This could make it practical where you could just pick up a scoot when you get off at a stop. Then drop it off in a lot when you get where your going. Then pick up a different one when you leave and drop it off when you get back to your bus stop. You wouldn't have to worry about battery charge as you could move than likely get a couple bocks away to exchange your scoot for a charged one.
I can't imagine people getting on the bus with these things. Too bulky unless they make the busses standing room only. I wouldn't want to stand for 20 minutes on the bus going downtown.
The only question I have is how did this guy get so much hype over a stupid overpriced toy. Cities redesigned?! Unbelievable nonsense. I'm really shocked at how seriously this thing is being covered. I feel like it's all some kind of April fools joke. How do you buy this kind of advertising for such a piece of crap?
... when I was reading about how you "think forward" and forward you go, or "think backward" and you go backwards. That thing about stopping whenever you want too. I was convinced I already had a "ginger" but then I realized I was walking.
This thing could cost $200 if it was powered by a stairmaster type device/pistons, and had a 3rd wheel to keep it balanced.
The gyro in it wants to keep the Segway in the upright position. Lean the handle forward and it tries to move the wheels under it to upright it again. Allow the handle to straighten up again, the gyro is happy and it stops moving. Lean back and the gyro causes it to move the wheels backwards. That's why the only control is for turning, which the gyro won't handle.
What's the difference?
About $2,700
About 12 months
About 70 pounds
Ohh yeah, all of today's electric scooters have one wheel in front, and one in the back. This one has them side-by-side.
Sharper image has one called "X2" available on their website at www.sharperimage.com.
--- -- - -
Give me LIBERTY, or give me a check.
You hit it right on the head. Here are the top problems I see with IT:
1. Stairs. Especially in Europe, where I see a potential huge market because of the design of their cities, they have a lot of stairs.
2. Weather. A car is more than transport, it's a weather sheild. I don't want to ride in 110 degree Texas heat with no a/c. Besides, how could you get laid in it?
3.Security. How do you lock this thing up? Looks easy to steal.
4. Suspension. Is there any? The first good pothole may finish this thing off, or force the rider to visit the oral surgeon.
5. Safety & stupidity. We're dealing with people and something new that moves. Bad combination.
I see plenty of specialty and industrial applications as well as a home enthusiast market, but no one is going to redesign trillions of dollars of urban infrastructure for this thing.
I think this is a wonderful innovation, and the naysayers are just bitter. I can't think of an invention more useful for the times when I have to park my autogyro more than half a kilometer away from my Esperanto club meetings.
Damn scientists are disappointing me. No cold fusion, no hyperdrive, no nanotech weapons... and where's that cure for male pattern baldness???
If you control for smoking (a "lifestyle choice") your main risk is heart disease, not cancer.
Heart disease is also a lifestyle choice, the McDonald's lifestyle.
cpeterso
you are a bogronoupiescient asswipe.
The market can also be a vehicle for improving the environment. The buying and selling of "pollution credits" accomplishes exactly what you're asking for. It's a market-based mechanism that that automatically reduces the overall amount of pollution, while still allowing pollution to happen where it is most economically necessary.
That that is is that that that that is not is not.
Has anyone mentioned the words 'Sinclair C5' yet?
For the benefit of the Americans here who may not have heard of the C5, back in the 80's Sir Clive Sinclair invented the Sinclair C5 - A vehicle which had pretty much the same claims as the Segway. It'd revolutionise transportation, nothing would ever be the same, yadda yadda yadda yadda.
Result? The product became a laughing stock and it financially ruined Sinclair.
I think the same will happen with this useless Geektoy. Especially at $3000.
And forget any arguments about 'Steve Jobs' liked it. Of course he does! It's shiny!
I thought I skipped to an article on Linux by accident. But come on now lets talk about the MAJOR achievements.
It'd be a lot easier to buy a bicycle. Let's compare the two here:
Bike
$50-$2000 (Depending on what you want)
IT
$3000
Strike one...
Bike
Up to 30 mph (depending on gears, how fit you are, windspeed, etc)
IT
Approx 14 mph
Strike two...
Bike
Can carry as much as you want to push.
IT
Can carry, uh... it's going in reverse, now sideways, now forward.. Man, that center of gravity can be a bad thing too...
Strike three...
Face it, it's cheaper to buy a bike, you don't have to recharge it, can use it in any of the weather conditions IT can manuvere in, and you get the added benefit of getting off your huge, Quake 3000000 swollen, ass and working out on your way to work.
Just my 2.5 * 10^-1 cents
great, you hafta steer it and drive it with your balance? um, how the hell am I to drive it if I am wobling to begin with. most likely to be zig-zaging down the sidewalk or even into the street.
I think NOT, like every gizmo and contraption that has been invented to help mankind, we usually abuse it beyond its original performance specs. People will still be late to class, work and first dates.
It looks safeIts like any other vehicle, safety and common sense are required to use it. How many people will be decapitated and/or injured? Who knows. Anyone can drive a car on the sidewalk but few people do.
I hate being told what the next big thing is and that everyone needs one. I like my rollerblades and bicycle./P
Yeah baby thats what I'm talking about, More Power. Lets get our hands on some of that gyro tech and build something with a ducati engine in it!!!
The two limiting issues I see with this as a product are battery life/recharge time and how it handles curbs. Every day I drive 30 minutes, pay to park, board a ferry boat, ride the ferry for an hour, then walk 15 minutes to work from the boat. Could I use a Segway? If it made it easier to get around in Downtown Seattle, then yes, I could. The major difference between walking and riding is the way you deal with curbs. I have a very good friend who is in an electric wheelchair. He certainly gets around, but he has to travel a little further to find the places where there are curb cuts. I'm imagining that if I'm riding a Segway on the sidewalk (if I'm in the street I'd probably be run over), then I'm having to actively look for curb cuts and/or lift the Segwey over curbs. I'm really skeptical about how well that will work. Also, how long will it take to recharge? If it takes six hours (like some reports say), then that's probably too long to be useful in some cases. Also, if I run out of juice somewhere, what do I do? drag it? I guess I'm on the fence as to what I think of it. It seems like pretty cool technology that might fit into people's lives, but I'm not totally sure until I actually get a chance to use one and find out how well it handles curbs, stairs, bumps, etc and the power issue.
Avoid Missing Ball for High Score
which Microsoft isn't, unless you're talking about an environment for viruses.
Because it's a motorized vehicle with almost no footprint, because it uses sidewalks, and because it offers a non-locally-polluting, electric alternative means of transport that might actually appeal to some consumers. Batteries simply don't store enough energy to allow salable replacements for current automobiles, at least not without severely compromising functionality. But for close-range urban transport, electric bicycles and this scooter are a real alternative, at least when weather permits. (Interestingly, note the claims that the Kamen scooter functions on low-mu surfaces, something definitely not true of more conventional two-wheeled vehicles). Also unlike bicycles, this scooter should be able to mix with pedestrians on sidewalks with fewer problems, because of the footprint, the control interface for braking (less latency), and the seemingly better manuveurability.
As for the price, that will come down if volumes ramp. It'll be interesting to see if that happens.
This thing would be great for a downtown Segway-share program. It's well-enough secured so that you can't steal it, and cities would pay a great deal to ease downtown congestion. They can put Segway stations at bus terminals, and people can ride them from place to place on their downtown business.
I think these will replace "Larks" and "Little Rascals" for people who are just lazy and don't have a disability.
This was the subject of a long thread on rec.motorcycles last year IIRC. This is *not* from a motorcycle accident. The best opinion seems to be that this is the unfortunate individual who bit down on the blasting cap mentioned in the Darwin Awards.
The giveaway is that there are no skid mark abrasions. If you are in an accident (motorcycle, bike, even jogging) involving contact with pavement, you will see long series of parallel lines.
Another urban legend. MC accidents can get pretty ugly - the right protective gear makes a huge difference - but this ain't one.
Hank Murphy
1999 Triumph Tiger "Full Moon"
Dod#Ultra5
...when did tech people become such a bunch of negative finger-waggers. "Its just a scooter. I'll hit my head. It doesn't run Linux. Its slower than a car. Its not much better than walking. Its all hype. Waa waa waa." so it must not be cool.
Glad you all weren't around in the Altair days. "Its just a bunch of blinking lights. It doesn't do large batch jobs. What good is it? Who really needs a computer anyway? Whats all this hpe about computers? Waa waa waa."
Sorry if I'm rude but Bah! When did the industry become so full of (young) crumudgeons? You guys are no fun!
Was anyone else disappointed in finding out this was not a hoverboard?
Looking at the segway.com site, I see in the background of a few pictures a Segway vehicle made up as a backed chair. Perhaps that would be more suitable?
-- Maur.not.logged.in
Then they'd better look like
this.
Cool, the future is neigh!
My first CD changer cost $700. Now there about $100. Razor scooters came out at over $100, now you can get a cheap knock-off for $30. All you people complaining about the $3000 price tag need to get a clue: that's only the price for the early adopters. Prices will fall within a few years to half of the initial price; and cost for cheap clones will probably be under $1000 if they can figure out a way of getting around the patents. Just look at the thing; the cost to manufacture one of these can't be more than about $200, can it?
absolutely its hype.
Its applying a very cool concept into a very cool device.
But its a needlessly expensive solution to a problem more easily solved.... but maybe, just maybe, the solution needs to be cool in order to be adopted.
..regardless of affordability, mileage, etc. - this thing is going to do a lot more than just get you to work - it'll also get you either mugged, beat up or ridiculed!
It's about as sexy as a wheelchair, and it's sad that seemingly no effort or consideration was put in to how it looks. In fact, I'm still holding my sides in fear that I hurt something from the laughter that forced itself out of me when I saw this device. I am aware that aesthetics are subjective, but you're already doing yourself a disservice by tagging yourself as an individual who can't/won't walk/run/jog to your destination - do you really need to add any more humiliation to that?
Think about it, do you REALLY want to be the first one seen riding this thing in your neighborhood? If you do in my 'hood I promise you a Nelson-style 'HA HA' and finger point at the very least..
I would like to see their New York City version...with a machete, gas mask and chain big enough to stand up to jaws of life :)
I guess a lot of kids would steal these to build a battlebot.
Either the unit goes faster when you lean forwards, or you fall flat onto your face.
Could you install Linux on one of these things? What about making a Beowulf cluster of them? That would be SO COOL!!!
I am the hub of Jack's digital lifestyle.
First, I have to say, very cool. I saw the demo this morning and I can't wait to buy one.
Inevitably, people will hack these things as they do everything else. How would you trick your's out? Here's some ideas:
Is there something about your situation that makes a bike impractical, where a ginger is suitable?
Statistically speaking, the Scottish are the most obese race of people on earth.
Scotland, home of the deep-fried chocolate bar!
The C5 showed Clive Sinclair, director of MENSA (association of self-proclaimed genii) for what he was. The C5 was slow, unstable, difficult to steer and dangerous. Cruising along with one wheel in the gutter, exhaust fumes blowing through your hair, with the wheelnuts of some juggernaut spinning inches your ear is one reason these failed. Nasty plastic body, poor visibility and range - these were true dorkmobiles and deserved to fail.
The first generation of any new technology like this will be expensive for several reasons:
1) It gets them more money up front.
2) It limits the size of the user-base, thus simplifying support costs.
3) It allows the early models to be over-engineered while they are learning how they fail in real-world situations.
4) It restricts the buyers to being a more affluent and therefore theoretically more responsible group. You don't want the "punk ass kids" someone else refered to getting on them right away to start killing themselves and others before people have decided that they are safe.
Once they get into quantity production and they've dealt with all of the legal and perception issues, I would expect the "Mark-II" model to come down to ~$1,000US or so.
G.
For about as much, Joe Asian is probably going to spend $3000 on a motorcycle for getting him and his family around the city.
Having lived in Jakarta, I can recall too many times seeing a family of 5 riding a motorcycle.
(Pop + kid in front, mother riding side-saddle with two little ones in each arm)
"Communism is like having one [local] phone company " - Lenny Bruce
I was hoping for a speeder bike or a hoverboard, but all I got was this lousy human transporter from Segway.
walk...
ride...
skate...
run...
anything.
Seeing as how so many people are ridiculing this device already and saying how they wouldn't be caught dead on one, I thought that I would point out an interesting use that one person I know has already pointed out. Handicapped use. Strap a vertical seat on it and you could allow a great many handicapped persons to have vertical mobility in a 'very' compact unit. (compared to a typical wheel chair.)
If your bicycle weighs anywhere close to 80 lbs. your name is Steve Roberts. Any single-person bike you buy today will weigh no more than 30 lbs., and a reasonable commuting bike will come in at closer than 20. (Forget those carbon-fiber-framed Lance Armstrong specials---they're only useful to L. A. and his peers.)
The real benefits of a bicycle are fun and health. If you're of the mindset that likes bicycling, you'll gleefully take more time to go by bike. As you do so, you're getting more exercise than easily 90% of your fellow citizens, which translates into better health. 12 mph is an an average speed for an average cyclist, not a top speed.
You can buy a decent bicycle for under US$1000, and an excellent one for around US$2000, a good bit cheaper than the HT. Then you needn't spend anything for electricity, though your food bill will probably go up.
Overall, there's no comparison---bicycling is miles ahead of HTing.
I refuse to believe corporations are people until Texas executes one. -- desert rain on http://www.dailykos.com/user/
hehe, i agree with underpaidISPtech
blackmerlin
I don't know if you'll see this, AC, but here it goes anyway. You said:
You are most welcome. And thank you for having a healthy sense of humor. I am honestly a little surprised by the replies I got in which the author took (or maybe pretended to take) my comment much too seriously.
A long time ago I heard that the scooter wasn't the important thing, but instead it was the special engine (or something) used to power it. But this thing just uses batteries.
Had anyone else heard anything about that? Or was that just a big rumor at the time before people actually found out that yes, IT was pretty much a scooter?
George Costanza's bitchin' ride
Remember, this is the first version. As technology improves, it will get lighter, smaller and faster. Pretty soon it will be a pogo stick on skateboard wheels!
Truthfully, I'm excited. It's about time we started getting to the "Jetsons Age".
Actually, the Moon would probably be the one place this thing would be usefull. Nothing pushing off the ground to send you flipping all over, and you'd probably get pretty much the same mobility. Save a lot of wasted time and energy. Only problem would be getting stuck in the dust, but if it can handle snow, it would probably be ok. Anybody in the Chinese space agency want a good idea?
Like the name implies, is this just a money making venture to futher research into utilizing the gyroscopes to create bigger and better transport dohickeys?
Is it just a segue?
Later
Josh
Is it standard behavior around here to just shoot your mouth off without even reading about the topic in question?
Moderators and posters alike seem to be struck by idiocy here. Your job as a moderator isn't just to rate how much like the poster's writing, it's also to filter out totally inaccurate information. And there are a lot of high-rated posts on this topic that are totally incorrect.
I've seen people posting that this creature travels at 17mph. It's 12, according to the segway site.
I've seen people questioning the maximum range of 17 miles. The advertised effective range is 11 miles.
People complain about lack of cargo ability. They say there is a planned attachment that will pull 300 lbs of cargo.
The Time article says it is available now to corporations for around $8000, and will be available to the general public next year for $3000.
Shame on you morons who can write but can't read. Then again, you can't read this, either.
The one truly valid objection I have is that even at 12mph, it's still 3-4 times faster than most pedestrians. Most cities don't allow bicycles, which usually stick to around 12mph in the city, to ride on the sidewalk. So without good bike lanes everywhere, riding one of these around town could be difficult or dangerous.
I can't wait till some soccer mom wacks me with one of these at 12 mph and takes out my knee.
IT will be the easiest personal inqury lawsuit ever.
Well, it certainly is not something that should be dismissed easily. But there are a lot of more factors we should focus on. Price is mainly the big issue here. Looking back at what happened with automobiles in the beginning can prove useful for an analysis of this new invention. Surely we did build our cities in accordance to our medium of transportation. They key factor was price. It somehow was cheaper to the states to create roads for private vehicles than to properly design a railway system for state of the art, but expensive, trains. Maybe that's the reason why most famous mass transit subway systems date from way back in the middle of the first century. Hardly any new cities, that I know of course with my limited intellect and knowledge, consider a subway system in its early stages of urban development, since it is costly. Cities would surely be many more times better for pedestrians if timely effective and affordable mass transit could be installed in their infancies. Our cities would look so different than what they look like now, wouldn't they?
Still I'm obviously not being very insightful as I should be but it's a nice analogical exercise.
Another more unnerving factor is the free market and free competence issues. If this invention truly revolutionizes the way we live in the future, is it safe being a non opensurce development? I would definitely afraid to stake the advancement of my country on one company's whims and IC. Also with no competition, or "real" competition we would be looking at another automotive industry lock on consumers. Why we keep paying the same money or more for technology that has been around for decades and that is not really improving at the rate that it should, and has not given safety as well as economic improvement for consumers in the last 20 years, is a completely mystifying economical and social issue. Maybe we have failed as consumers to rightly demand of companies the adequate product that we deserve and expect of an informatized age industry. The same happens in the information technology market and in many others. That's a huge setback on the theory about cities being built around this device. Global warming and pollutions threats haven't substantially changed our automotive behaviors, if life risk isn't the correct market pusher then hardly gadget lust will.
If I had the 3000 dollars I would buy it of course, but myself I think 250 is more just. For 3000 I believe that most of us have already a fix of our own to strive for.
The first time someone clips a curb, or loses balance and falls into traffic the lawsuits and recalls will start flying. Seventeen miles per hour top speed? Ride a bicycle at 17 MPH and see how quickly you can stop. Now imagine you're riding a "Segway" and a car suddenly pulls out of a driveway. Better be wearing your MedicAlert bracelet!
Bicycle theft is a huge problem. These things will be easier to snatch and far more profitable for thieves. The diagram/pics show no obvious means for securing the thing to a bike rack, telephone pole, etc..
Hey, the /. crowd that knows Metcalfe's Law by heart is missing another simple square law in the comments so far: square footage.
Perhaps as many as 5% of downtown commuters today come by walking or biking, because they actually live in downtown apartments.
If this thing triples the radius outward from downtown that is "walkable", then it increases the number that can come without a car by NINE fold, no? That's a simplistic computation, but the LONG term effect will be to make more apartment buildings go up further away from downtown because you'll be able to "walk to work".
Oh, and the other "square footage" issue only a few have alluded to is that these will probably be allowed in public transit (in my Calgary hometown, bikes are only allowed on the trains, and only off-peak hours), thus increasing public transit usage, and will surely be allowed into your cubicle/office, (doubles as your coatrack), so the "stolen bike" issue will be reduced.
It'll certainly succeed in "medical need" and niche roles - my Dad who needs a hip replacement will get one for sure - he doesn't need a wheelchair but any walk over 200 yards is torture. And we'll see what else it does after that!
I dont know if anybody has posted this article yet, but it says that the next versions will have Sterling Engines in them. It also says that Segway can go up stairs.... Check it out:
h _s cooter_dc_3.html
http://dailynews.yahoo.com/h/nm/20011203/tc/tec
Today, the saddest people in the world are the ones who had high hopes for the geriatric scooter. Embarrassed jounalists and technology enthusiasts are in mourning.
Check out this page especially the last paragraph!
http://www.ginger-chat.com/story.html
Actually, trains do have brakes on every car. If they didn't, a high speed freight train would probably take 50 miles to stop instead of 7.
The reason I drive is because while a bike would be fine for the six cool yet sunny days of the year that I'm told is the quota for Chicago, it is just not practical between the potholes, road construction, crazy drivers, and the weather.
Speaking of weather, between the consecutive weeks of freezing temperature and the liberal use of salt on the roads, I doubt IT would last a single winter in Chicago.
Another consideration... the neighborhoods I have to drive through to get to and from work, I wouldn't want to be going through in the middle of the night in the exposed transport of a bicycle or IT.
I do not deploy Linux. Ever.
Hmmm.... Treehuggers...
:) Just make sure you aren't crossing the street on your Segway when my SUV is comming your way. :)
Remember the Yugo. Rememeber what a Surburban crashed into a Yogo looked like?
This might not be that bad.
please?
I'm laughing hard at that last comment. It does bring up a point though, and I quote:
Kamen's vehicle is a complex bundle of hardware and software that mimics the human body's ability to maintain its balance.
Isn't there a person on it? Why mimic human balance, unless the human is drunk? I guess that makes it perfect for college campuses after all.
The cool thing about the video on segway.com is not so much that the people look dorky, but that they look like how people in 1950 or 1960 would have imagined citizens in 2002 - cooking their food in microwave ovens and riding around on shiny electric scooter devices. If we have a little more rocketry and shiny clothes come into fashion then pulp sci-fi will be proven correct.
Everyone knows that damage is done to the soul by bad motion pictures. -Pope Pius XI
it's a great idea for use on a regular basis, but absolutely perfect for after the next WTC. my girlfriend had to walk back to brooklyn from midtown, and thousands of others did too since they shut down the subways and traffic on the bridges and tunnels. having one of these would have been great to get out of harm's way.
i'd pick one up tomorrow if i had the cash. if they had an installment plan like they do for cars, i probably would.
Care of WashingtonPost.com: Good action shots. Shows a cool water hazard demo as well. Here it is.
If the Segway is to become commonplace in our urban centers, planners and local lawmakers will have to deal with questions regarding kids, as obstacles, riders and hangers-on. IANAL, although most cities in which I've been allow skateboarding, as long as riders stay in control of the board, follow the flow of pedestrian traffic, and don't pull stunts (protective gear might be required also).
Laws which follow these lines could put to rest much of the inevitable safety debate, but what I really want to know is, can I take my kid along?
Or at least it will be after the first person is killed by some asshole riding at 17mph along a sidewalk
a person can run 14 - 25 mph.
It is a lot more comfortable when it rains, and it does 50 miles an hour.
Incorrect.
You're concept and equations are off. Remember that the total work done on a mass by a force is equal to its change in kinetic energy.
Kinetic energy of a mass can be determined by :
1/2*m*v^2
and work by the dot product of the force and displacement vectors or : Fnet * d * cos(theta)
using these two concepts you can solve for the distance required by a constant force to bring the mass to rest.
Of course you can use the frictional concept to determine the breaking force and plug that in too, but mass does NOT cancel out and two objects of two different masses will come to rest at different distances with the same breaking force.
Fnet * d * cos(theta)= 1/2 * m * v^2
A really cool fire hydrant or the offspring of a Razor and a fire hydrant, and the platform is just the right height so his poop won't hit the street. No more pooper scooper for me.
Speed: 12.5 mph (20kph)
Range: up to 17 miles (28k) on single charge
Turning Radius: zero
Payload:
Passenger- 250lbs (110kg)
Cargo- 75lbs (38kg)
Future offboard cargo module- 300lbs (135kg)
Platform Height: 8in (20cm)
Footprint: 19x25in (48*63.5cm)
Weight: 80lbs (36kg)
I've known several wheelchair-bound folks and one thing that bothers some of them is that they are always at a lower level than everyone who can walk. Hence, can't look eye-to-eye, reach cupbords, etc. I think that this could be rigged so that at least paraplegics (sp?) could use it. There is benefit to the fact that the footprint is about the same as a person.
...
Now if they could get it to do stairs
1. You won't be able to take it through the drive-thru at Jack In The Box.
2. Your kryptonite lock (the one you still have from when your bike was stolen) won't protect your $3000 Segway Human Transporter either.
3. They will make you buy liability insurance.
4. They will tax it and make you buy stickers, driver's licenses, and/or license tags.
5. They won't let you drive it on the sidewalk.
6. They won't let you drive it on the street either.
7. They will pass a law requiring the manufacturer to cripple the speed to 5 miles an hour and you will have to hot-wire the sucker to get the rated 12 mph out of it.
8. You won't be able to drink and scoot (not legally). Stuff that was legal to do while walking will be illegal while riding. Cops will search IT riders freely, vehicle occupants have far fewer Constitutional protections against unreasonable searches and seizures than do pedestrians.
9. They will make you wear a helmet.
10. The TV networks will cover Segway polo matches and they will be even more boring than TV golf.
11. You and I will be dead of old age before needed ancillary businesses like a) public parking and charging facilities and b) reasonably priced rentals at tourist attractions and hotels will exist.
Well Whooptie Dooo! What does it all mean Bazzle!
If it isn't broke, tinker with it till it is!
Give me a break. This is another case of PR gone rampant.
I love the speculation that the HT will somehow lead to urban redesign. Hah! We've been trying for years to get more bike-friendly infracture, largely to no avial. They throw us a bone every now and then--a bike rack here or there--but HT overpasses for busy intersections?!? Riiiiiiight.
...as you'd know if you were a pedestrian in NYC.
Also, bikes and cars cause tons of injuries, especially brain injuries, to passengers and pedestrians alike. Why? Well, their high speeds are one big reason.
Anyway, with the baby boomers set to hit their sixties and the hips and other joints starting to go, I can bet we'll see a lot of this IT sooner or later.
Ok, I was caught by the IT hype a little late probably. Friday.
Still, that was enough to keep my expectations high. What do I find? A piece of expensive useful-for-nothing toy. I'm not gonna dish out $8000 (or $3000) to move at such slow speed. Plus, if I ride this on the sidewalks, I'll probably earn the hate of every fellow citizen in the area. Oops, I'm sorry I just ran over your feet! Are you ok?
Probably, just another attempt to spark a recovery in the economy. Sure that's gonna get some investors interested. Haha!
Or maybe with the Segway's rider's face up against my car window.
look into it.
But if the situation in LA is anything like in Boston, Segway will make it possible to park further out, take the tube into the city, and tool around in the scooter. Rather than commuting closer to town, and footing it downtown.
Is there any purpose to this device, that is not served by other cheap motorized scooters and the built in sense of balance in our inner ears that don't require fancy microprocessors?
Let's face it, at $3000 USD, this thing is just too damn expensive for most (95%) of the people out there. My used MR2 only cost $3200 (4 years ago), and it's a lot faster than 12MPH.
If the obvious were a snake it would have enveloped you with it's limbless tube-like torso long ago.
The key word here is 'Electric'.
Imagine if you will, a tired lazy old hag that has nothing to do but waste away her useless life watching t.v. and eating pastries.
Now imagine a youthful, vivacious, whip of a teenager, just becoming aware of the world arround him and his role in it.
Exactly what the New Gestapo fears the most, unbridled, raw emotion. And power.
Their question, `how do we stop this?` their answer, remove the LEGS, the LIFEBLOOD of the youth of America. Promote laziness and new role models based on aged Bavarians and you have yourself the recipe for world domination.
Long day at school? Ride your lazy machine.
Long night on drugs? Ride your lazy machine.
Any reason at all? Ride your lazy machine.
And when Joe Hat launches the nukes and the EMP's ruin your ELECTRIC leg-crippling-mobiles you won't have the ability to run from Dr. Zurich and his blood guns( they have them, my friend saw one in Canada when he was a green beret) and you and your family will fall victim to one of the most obvious scams in history next to JFK.
I saw CNN's video. Obviously shot with a consumer camcorder, and I swear it was shot by a 7yo with ADHD that mistook his Ritalin for 12 Penguin mints.
GEEZ!!! The video was all over the place, focusing in and out... and somebody PLEASE hide the zoom button from that kid. I was getting dizzy from the fast, extreme (and fuzzy) close ups.
I do not deploy Linux. Ever.
Hmm...
IT costs $3,000.
So does an Apple Powerbook G4.
A car costs $20,000 and requires insurance.
IT could easily get me to the supermarket or the subway in a lot less time than it takes me now, and wouldn't aggravate my asthma as much as walking uphill in dry winter air.
So, why am I not supposed to think this is "affordable"?
Why do they need two of everything anyway? Ok, maybe two motors are acceptable to increase the reliability of the thing but two boards and two gyros? C'mon. These are highly reliable parts and adding two of everything will only increase the price and the weight.
Now maybe if they put out a value edition without all this useless crap and chopped, say 2500 off the price tag, I would get one. Not cause its particularily useful (it isn't) but its just so cool!
Well, not at that speed anyway. But each person has different needs, and anyone that tries to sell you a solution that fits all disabled people is selling you snake oil. Clearly IT would not be the best thing for absolutely everyone. Occupational therapists can teach some of the most severly disabled people enough to function in society; teaching how to use IT to those for whom it would be suitable is just the sort of thing they do.
And the brethren went away edified.
http://everythingisnt.com/2001_12_02_control_archi ve.html#7626223
You'll do what every other kid who has ever tried to balance and ride a hand-truck (or dolly, 'pendin on whar yer from) has experienced: Ker-BLAM!
$1,000,000,000 idea: How 'bout a self-propelled self-balancing hand truck based on this technology? It'll sure save my back on moving day.
Just show me how to hang my golf bag from the handle bars, and I would buy one in a second. It also needs a beer holder, but that's an easy modification.
tsia
Which means there's a good chance of getting people to buy them.
And Kamen isn't the only one that is convinced. Doerr (one of the main investors) hasn't exactly gotten where he is today by gambling.
Yeah, actually if you go look at the Segway website they really seem to be pushing a European image for their vision of this thing's integration into transportation (in the images they use). This thing might actually have a better chance in the UK and Europe.
It Is the Nature of Information to Transgress Artificial Boundaries
Segway makes it obvious what's starboard and what's port and
uses those categories intuitively, avoiding "left" and "right"
or any arbitrary conventions reminiscent of the control layout
in cars, or drive-on-the-left/right conventions.
the only green thing is the GUI display with the human face, and it
is to the right, not center, or starboard. The starboard/starboard
wingtip light is green.
the only red thing is the on/off switch, and it is to the left, or port.
The port side/port side wingtip light is red.
The yaw control is just like a rudder -- rudder controls yaw. Pushing on it pushes to the right and pushes Segway to the right, and pushes to NorthEast. Pulling on it pulls to the left and pulls Segway to the left, and pulls to SouthWest. This is just like East-West action of a rudder.
The rudder was historically (Viking times) mounted on the right, the starboard. In fact in Icelandic, "styrr-" "bord" "steer-" "side".
These ergonomic considerations go back a long way, yet here remain
consistent with both the inconography and bicycle handlebars metaphor
of steering the vehicle you are riding on/in.
This will generalize nicely to 3-space motion, for future personal
transport underwater, in the air, or in gridded space (imagine untethered elevators, allowed to move in and out of space).
Though this is redundant; a lot of people don't understand that this wasn't meant to travel from one town to another, or to replace the bike. I live in NYC and this would be a godsend.
Sure, riding a bike would be faster and cheaper, but ever try riding a bike through NYC, good luck. Sidewalks are too congested for a decent path and difficult to manuver through. Riding your bike on the streets... well, that's just asking to be hit. Plus, you HAVE to take apart your bike and chain it to an immovable structure whenever you decide to stop inside a building. Too much of a hassle.
Plus, wearing a suit, or for women, a skirt, on a bike is very uncomfortable and riding through water will cause the backwheel to kick up and splatter all that wholesome NYC water goodness all over your back. Besides, you have more control on these self-balancing segways with no hands than you do with both hands on a bike.
I wouldn't mind paying 3k for a consumer model. But for now, I can't wait to see my postal worker scooting up and down on the industrial segways, maybe ask for a testdrive. =)
You can't walk a mile to go do kung fu? What exactly is the point then?
7 November 2006: The day Americans realized corruption and incompetence weren't addressing 11 September 2001
add a fuel cell engine, armor plate it, add missle launchers,infrared and other sensors...
and point it at the tunnels. neat, uh?
And the surplus ones can be donated to the footless kids (if any left)of boratora.
According to the guy from Time Magazine that has been covering this for the past few months, it DOES go over 8" curbs without a problem. I heard him on the radio in Atlanta this morning.
has anyone made the comparison yet?
Yes, I do consider the technology involved (the auto-balancing system) revolutionary in every way. And I think I lot of people write Segway of as a fancy scooter.
Just that it *looks* like a scooter doesn't mean it works like one, or just that it's a transportation device doesn't mean it meant to replace existing ones.
When the microwave oven was introduced, it was expensive, yet it incorporate a new way of heating, one that we never thought possible b4 the microwave oven was introduced and yet so simple we understood the technology immediately.
The microwave oven looked like a traditional oven, and many people rejected it, said that it couldn't replace traditional ovens because it can't roast or broil. We made that comparison solely because of the way it looked. We didn't truely understand the way it'd enhance our every-day lives.
thankfully, the price eventually dropped, consumers adopted, and it changed our lives forever. When was the last time u made popcorn on the stove?
Not only did it changed the way we cook at home and the way we think of heating, it also changed the fast food industry and made them more efficient, it changed packaged food industry so much that there are now aisles of frozen and/or prepackaged food made solely for the microwave. Virtually every household has one now. This revolution took almost a decade.
Stop saying the Segway is too expensive, we all know it is. The PC cost $2000 when it was introduced, and how many of them do u have now? Forget about price, it'll fall without a doubt. Look a little further and think how it can change our lives in the not-so-immediate but forseeable future?
The microwave wasn't the "tablet-to-turkey-dinner" magic oven we envisioned in old SciFi novels. Likewise, even though the Segway isn't the Hoverboard, it might be the closest thing to it by means of how it'll change the way we live.
Would u accept it for what it is and nothing more? Would u allow it to change the way u live?
Hopefully we'll soon see mailmen and officers riding the Segway around our streets, where we can become acquintant to it.
Even if the Segway in its current incarnation doesn't turn out to change the world in the next few years, I can safely assume that the technology behind it will change the way we think about how vehicle operates.
Or maybe it'd go the way of magnetic levitated trains.
Lazy lazy lazy muvavuggaz. How is this useful? You need something like this to run errands, correct? Where will you put groceries? A breifcase? Anything? I guess you could use a bike messanger bag, but I'm also guessing that hanging a basket on this HT anywhere will throw it off balance. - This is IT? s#$t.
Simple, it's called time.
Getting off work at 5:15, a 30 minute train ride, and walking a mile to get there in under 15 minutes (excluding train delays which are often) so I can be there when class starts at 6 would be exceptionally difficult.
Traveling at an average speed of 8mph would drastically improve my chances of getting there on time.
Dacels Jewelers can't be trusted.
are not easily broken
Man buys IT, man stops walking, man becomes fat and unable to walk, man gets diabetes, man is forced to use his insulin invention, man no longer needs to walk, becomes one with the IT, and now is known as MANiT. MANiTs and humans fight for control and the saga goes on as Dean as MANiT supreme... A fantasy? I think not!
I don't understand the Slashdot community's response to this. It's better than a bike because it's powered; no work involved. It's better than both a bike and a scooter because you can ride it into the mall, you can keep it with you while you shop, you rarely have to find a parking spot and it doesn't make a lot of noise. Think about last time you were at an air show or an expo or something. Remember the golf carts? Yes. No more golf carts. There's a reason those people like golf carts more than bikes or scooters- you don't have to balance, you can stop and look around, you don't have to put your feet down to keep in your place and you can just leave it where it's at and go running without putting the kick stand down. Speaking of golf carts, when is the last time you went golfing? I'd sure like my golf bag to have wheels on it and balance itself and follow me around on my own IT. The potential is there.
I keep forgetting my place. Jesus is for losers. Why do I still play to the crowd?
If only people could afford them.
get me wrong, gyroscopes and no pollution rock in my book
No pollution?
No pollution from manufacturing? No pollution from the electric power plants you use to charge the battery? No pollution in disposing the batteries?
Sorry, once again hype outruns reality. This thing will generate pollution throughout it's life cycle. Admittedly far less than a car, but it will exist none the less.
works under IE 5.0 on NT 4.0
Can be found here. Doing a search for "What is IT?" on /.'s search engine doesn't exactly do anything (being as they don't care for words that are smaller than 4 chars).
"Oh yes,'' he said, ``they come and see me. They sit right here. They sit right where you're sitting.'' ... when is this then? When do they come?''
He was talking of the angels with the golden beards and green wings and Dr Scholl sandals.
``They eat nachos which they say they can't get where they come from. They do a lot of coke and are very wonderful about a whole range of things.''
``Do they?'' said Arthur. ``Are they? So, er
He gazed out at the Pacific as well. There were little sandpipers running along the margin of the shore which seemed to have this problem: they needed to find their food in the sand which a wave had just washed over, but they couldn't bear to get their feet wet. To deal with this problem they ran with an odd kind of movement as if they'd been constructed by somebody very clever in Switzerland.
Fenchurch was sitting on the sand, idly drawing patterns in it with her fingers.
``Weekends, mostly,'' said Wonko the Sane, ``on little scooters. They are great machines.'' He smiled."
- Douglas Adam "So long and thanks for all the fish"
I've always had a problem with handicap ramps. Whilst we depended upon stairs, we were pretty much safe from dalek invasion. Putting wheelchair ramps in all over the place leaves us wide open.
Fortunately I have a solution. If you bolt/weld a steel hemisphere about 3-4" radius in the middle of every wheelchair ramp, legitimate wheelchair users can pass easily whilst daleks will be completely thwarted.
Looks like it'll get Segway riders as well.
Should I post this as AC or not? Moderation will tell.
This sig made only from recycled ASCII
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Look! Futuristic truck!
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If a pedestrian leans forward, he puts out his feet to catch himself, and the result is walking. Similarly, if a Segway rider leans forward, the machine speeds up to catch him and keep him on balance.
If a rider leans forward while he's crusing at the Segway's speed limit, what happens? If the speed limit is absolute, the Segway of course isn't able to move forward any faster to catch him. IT is able only to control its own speed--not the orientation of its rider. Any suggestions?
It is only in the last couple of years that tethered robots like Sony's have been able to balance, stand up and take a step forward. Segway's control system does something even more difficult in my books.
I don't think that too many people can balance on a single axle never mind have a computer do it. From a robotics point of view, it is a very exciting technological leap.
I can see the benefits from everything from robotics to upright wheelchairs. The upright wheelchair allows level eye to eye contact, not the current looking down contact.
In robotics, one of the big problems is stopping multi-wheeled, multi-legged robots from falling over when on rough terrain. The six wheeled Martian rover comes to mind. Here is a 2 wheeled device that has the wheels on the same axis and it is pretty damn impressive on what it can do already.
My last point is that it seems that whenever the silent "majority" blasts a technology or enhancement as a waste of time or useless then it usually is quite successful. Two great technological enhancements come to mind that had the same initial negative response: the Internet and Linux.
This Small Times article says it all. To me, whether or not IT actually ends up getting used by the mainstream, the technology is amazing. A sidenote: have any of you watched the video footage of the wheelchair Kamen developed? My own preference would be for the $100M to have been sunk into getting the wheelchairs into the mainstream. People really NEED *that* technology.
You have never been to Paris have you? With mixed use 7 floor construction, you really can have everything in walking distance. Subways are there for the elderly and infirm.
Some early US suburbs, like Uptown New Orleans, got it right too. It's a little more spread out, but there is no need for a car. Work was concentrated Downtown and on the river. A system of trolleys used to get people there who could not walk. The neighborhoods themselves had all the basics of living, groceries, entertainment, libraries, parks and shopping in walking distance. Newer suburbs were built around this to take advantage of all the nice restaurants and what not. They were inconveinent to live in. As the core of the city is dying of crime and dismal public schools, the suburbs are being abandoned as well.
DMCA, Hollings, Palladium. What might have sounded like paranoia is now common sense.