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Best Buy Says Customers Not Always Right
linuxwrangler writes "Best Buy is one of the retailers that has now decided that the customer is not always right. Best Buy consultant Larry Selden has identified "demon customers" like those who file for a rebate then return the item. OK, I get that one (hey Best Buy: dump those customer-despised rebates and you won't have that problem...). Other categories like customers who only buy during sales are more interesting. Best Buy declined comment on how they are dealing with those customers. Some stores have actually "fired" customers. Welcome to the end result of all that customer information data mining."
Like always right to _choose_ not to purchase a service plan?
"Sanity is not statistical", George Orwell, "1984"
The last two paragraphs are a great example of putting in a worthless interview that has nothing to do with an article, solely to defend an undefendable topic.
If best buy is sick of people using rebates, then stop offering them. Rebates work by the majority of people not using them, while thinking they are buying it at a great price. If people are going to use rebates without actually buying the item, Best Buy is going to have to live with that. If they think they can get it both ways, they are wrong. It is just another example of horrible customer service and deception backfiring, and then the company having such a great monopoly that they can somehow blame it on the customers, the very people they rely on to make money. Just absurd.
Customers sometimes really can be a problem. But in most cases, it seems, it's just that the shop doesn't like customers at all.
You will always get scammers, like people who the article description described (send rebate, then return), as well as people who purchase extended service plans, then static zap their video card, hook it up to 110 AC, or otherwise kill it after a couple years, and get a much better card in replacement. At least with data mining, you can identify suspect customers instead of just going on the manager's whim.
I would have thought that many of the customers who only buy during sales would be buying a lot more products than if they bought on a semi-regular (non-sale) basis. Surely this means that the customers make up in bulk for the slightly lower profit margin due to sales? After all, the point of sales is to attract a higher product turnover at a lower profit margin, so what are they complaining about?
Disclaimer: The above comment was made while under the influence of too much coding and not enough sleep.
What on earth is wrong with waiting until a sale is on til you buy whatever it is that you have your heart set on?
If it is an urgent purchase that can't wait, then buy it then and there, but if you're happy to wait until whatever it is goes on sale due to it no longer being the newest and shiniest widget, what is wrong with that?
This is penalising people who are swimming against the tide of instant gratification that our credit driven society has pushed.
People have done this from time immemorial in raiding the new years and mid year sales at department stores they don't otherwise shop at
"And we have seen and do testify that the Father sent the Son to be the Savior of the World" 1 John 4:14
Normal costomers like my mom are alright. I mean she thinks, "oh, I need a TV" so she goes to BestBuy or Costco or whatever, finds one that looks pretty, and buys it. Big profits for the store.
If I need a TV, I wait a few weeks until I find a good deal on dealsea or FatWallet. Then I price match to someplace with massive coupon discounts, then I try to even pricematch the rebate. Then if they try to get me to pay for shipping I bitch about it and get that charge taken off. The stores make nothing.
If I was running a business, I wouldn't want people like me as customers. I would want people like my mom. It's just plain business sense.
Is a way for Best Buy to identify customers who are likely abusing the return policy in order to use the store as a free rental shop.
They can refuse a sale or refund to anyone for any reason (except race, sex, etc.) and are well within their rights to do so. They don't have the money like Walmart does to be able to absorb crap returns and BS like that.
What this will do is help to increase margin and somewhat prevent prices from rising to cover the cost of bad returns. Would you rather they let people get away with this or would you prefer to pay more for the products you buy to cover Best Buy's losses from abusive customers?
What about people that use pricematching and rebates together to get items for free.
How dare they pay Best Buy money in order to obtain products they seek to purchase.
In all seriousness, comments like these tell me I should be taking my business elsewhere. Not that I didn't already know ths, but it just reaffirms it. "Firing Customers" is quite possibly the dumbest thing I've heard today. And that's saying something. It goes against the whole idea behind a business; that is, to get customers and meet their needs while making a tidy profit. (Perhaps they believe their profit isn't quite tidy enough with people who use rebates and buy sale items.)
" Welcome to the end result of all that customer information data mining.""
You might want to sit down for this. No the customers aren't always right. It's a bit of marketing that companies spout like what gets satirized on those dispair posters. A company should aspire to high customer standards, but that doesn't make the customer "always right", and in fact to insure quality standards for everyone you have to let some customers go, because losing them is better overall.
Still, more power to Best Buy if they want to start discriminating against customers. I'm sure it's really going to make an impact on their bottom line.
Linux, you magnificent bastard, I read the fucking manual!
first off, i could live at best buy, i'm there atleast once a week just to look around, and check out the new releases in CDs and DVDs...but...they have the absolute worst customer serivce people ever...they're just not very smart at all, and not helpful...secondly, there's constantly long lines at their checkouts...sometimes i'll leave w/o buying something, just becuase i didn't want to wait in the long line...maybe they should worry about some of that stuff first..
...back to the issue...i guess this does worry my a little bit...seeing that they're tracking individual customers, and what they buy, and when they buy it (like only during sale periods)...the fact that i always use my best buy credit card, and my best buy rewards cards just gives them more of an opportunity to track me...i guess that's the last time i buy the "girls gone wild" dvd out of the "special interest" DVD section...jeez...
in any case, enough on that rant...
"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true." - Homer Simpson
What exactly does BestBuy consider it when they routinelyu advertise products they don't have in inventory, just to get you into the store?
What??? I always thought that the bank people are filling the ATMs with money... and now I read that this is customers duty... well, thanks anyway to the unknown people that put their money in the ATM so that I can get it out...
I had vowed to never go back, thanks to all the awful support in store, and online that I received.
Things like discounts not being applied, sale prices not showing up on the final invoice, etc.
I was dragged back in as they had a "great" Comcast deal. It would turn out to be a free cable modem, after rebate(s).
There were 3 rebates.
- $25 store credit
- $20 rebate from Linksys (for their modem)
- $60 rebate from Best Buy for buying the Linksys modem.
I used their kiosk, with their employee. I expected to wait the obligatory 6-8 weeks.
In very short order, the store credit showed up. Followed quickly by the Linksys rebate. 2 weeks later, the denial letter showed up from BB. They said I hadn't bought a Linksys modem. Interesting that they returned my orignal submission, and that receipt clearly showed the modem that they had on rebate.
When it arrived the rebate program had ended, so they screwed me out of $60.00. Another lesson in BB's incompetence.
I sold the store credit to somebody else. I wanted them to have to pony up that money for something, but it wouldn't be me.
Ergo, they're evil.
My mom says I'm cool.
"What we're trying to do is not eliminate those customers, but just diminish the number (...)" Anderson said
Puh! Being a customer, I still have a chance of survival then...
My case in point:
"This sign says 2 confections for 2 dollars!"
"It says 2 HERSHEY candies for 2 dollars."
"So?"
"Gobstoppers and popcorn don't count, and "almost" only counts in horse-shoes."
And then the customer will whine, and whine, and whine, and whine, and whine. My god, I've never heard so many adult-aged persons whine so much.
It's always something retarded they whine about too: they misunderstood the advertisement and want the deal anyway (yeah, right), or they know somone who used to work here and wants an employee discount, or they have a coupon ... that expired two years ago.
No, I don't need anger managment. I need a shotgun and some whiskey.
Home electronics resellers have a pretty spotty past - seems they expand exponentially, then raise their prices and reduce their service to customer-unfriendly levels, then they go bankrupt. It's a constant cycle caused by cutthroat competition and low margins.
Best Buy is just summiting the mountain and headed to the downhill side of the cycle. Profits are up. The problem is that i'm not going there anymore because the prices are pretty exorbitant. I'm sure others are getting the same impression.
They are following in the path of Crazy Eddie, The Wiz, Circuit City, and lots of smaller outfits.
HBI's Law: Frequency of calling others Nazis is directly correlated with the likelihood of the accuser being Communist.
I thought that was the whole thing behind making people either take the rebate or return it. Most rebates require an original UPC, and I assumed most retailers want something back that they can resell.
Or is that when the whole "fitness of goods" type thing comes in (spurious missing capicator anyone?).
You'd think a company like Best Buy would not allow an interview like this or have an upper level employee write a book about demon customers. They must have had to cut back on the corporate image team because of rebates. They shouldn't complain about rebates, the whole concept behind them is make the consumer think an item is cheaper than what it is being sold for, and hoping that you won't remember to send it in
1. Big Company assumes no matter what, people will come to store.
2. Big Company pisses off customers by getting way too aggressive with a very small minority of bad customers.
3. Big Company loses customers.
4. Big Company slashes prices more to bring people back, forgetting the price wasn't why people left.
5. Big Company loses more money, wonders why.
It's the SERVICE, stupid. It's why the Gateway store in my town always was best in its district... it was the only Gateway in such close proximity to a Best Buy. They couldn't help but look like geniuses in comparison to the untrained warrany-whores placed in the computer department at BB.
-=-This sig brought to you by The Cheat; and by Viewers Like You.-=-
...and I don't think I like to be bundled in with people attempting fraud. I'm not high maintenance but I can spot a deal. Either you're selling something or your not. Don't start trying to second-guess what I might buy next. Maybe I'm taking advantage of a cheap offer to find out how good your service is...
"Anyway it is sometimes the employes that don't feel like working."
True, however this in part is everyone's fault. From companies that pay bottom of the barrel wages, and have lousy support policies. To customers that demand bottom of the barrel prices, as well as are abusive to employees in general. If people really want what they claim they want? Then people's actions would reflect that.
It's funny how everyone is reacting so viciously to these remarks of unprofitable customers. However, what most of you fail to realize is that *all* businesses do this. Or at least the profitable ones. Here we go...
If one business like Best Buy is bringing in the same customers as say a competitor - Circuit City - they in theory would bring in the same amount of money. This is considering if everything is equal (no competitive advantages exist). How you kill your competitor is by selling to the most profitable customers.
This is done by big business against other big businesses - because customers can kill a biz as fast as it can create one.
If you are all so appalled at Best Buy - you should really be looking at retailers like Walmart - they are the king of this practice.
I run a small business, and sometimes I refuse to take on a client because I can tell they're going to be more trouble than they're worth. Why would I want to bother with someone who's going to constantly bitch about prices, try to wheel and deal me, and make me work twice as hard as the average customer? I don't need the money that bad.
It's probably the same thing for Best Buy. Why would they want to bother with people they know are going to take up their customer service reps' time, which costs money, and thereby result in no profit for Best Buy? There is no "right" to shop at Best Buy. There's probably a "we reserve the right to refuse service to any customer at any time" notice somewhere near the entrance to the store. Best Buy is simply choosing to exercise that right.
We don't have a state-run media we have a media-run state.
Unless you are one of these people (scammers), there is nothing to worry about here. This is actually a good thing; since Best Buy will lose less money this way, they get to pass the savings onto the legitimate customers. If you don't do anything wrong, there is no need to worry about the punishment.
This reminds me of a funny story.
I got a coupon in the mail for 10% off just about anything at Best Buy. I happened to need a fridge anyway so I just waited for the one I wanted to go one "sale" and then went in to use my coupon (still valid) and they tried to tell me I couldn't use it with "Any other promotion" and that the coupon would come off of the full retail price.
Bugger that I thought, and I escalated the matter up to the floor manager, and he said they couldn't do it.... I said okay ring it up for me here and if the coupon isn't supposed to work with a "sale" price than it won't deduct from the total. He starts to ring it up for me and then stalls for a second to say well even if it dos work I can't give it to you for that price (I just wanted to be certain he wasn't full of it that is why I wanted to see the computer reject it) The computer did not reject the coupon it applied it correctly just like I thought it would.
Then came the argument that if is wasn't allowed then the computer shouldn't allow it..... He said the margin was too low and they would make only 1-2% off of me so it wouldn't be worth it to them (I think about this and in my head say "He gets $9-12.00/hr if he's lucky why does he even care...). I rebutted his argument by saying that I would buy the 4 year "Performance Guarantee" which is $200.00 and almost all profit if he just rings it through with my coupon as well, he thinks about it and then I could see the greed ("I get to sell this PSP, that'll look good on my Up-sales record.") and boom 10 minutes later I was out the door...
The moral of the story is, that I know that everything there (except media and computer stuff) has a 30-day return policy.
I returned the worthless PSP the next day, and got my sale price.
Just like a con, except it was perfectly legal and in the end THEY made money off of me (granted as little as possible)
Yeah, the customer is so wrong he has to argue to give you his money.
There is evidence to prove both Democrats and Republicans are lying cocksuckers. Vote independently.
Gmail doesn't get installed into your browser when your not looking ;) Besides not every email actaully gets linked to adds.
If companies wan't to start ranking their customers then they should be prepared for a backlash, because as so many companies seem to forget, the buck stops here! :)
My suggestion is shopping clubs.
Get together a group of good consumers, mums on the school run is a prime recruiting ground. Organise until the number of participants is significant; and issue a membership card.
Then visit the shops.
Tell them that the group will promise to use a particular store for a particular type of shopping in exchange for a discount off all elements in store on production of the membership card. Organise an auction process for a type of shopping for an entire quarter and get the shops to bid against each other.
Providing the manager sees the take goes up for those stores in that quarter, everyone wins.
That way you can exercise the power of the mass market in the same way the shops use their marketing size to drive down supplier costs - the enticement of the large numbers with the threat of losing those numbers if they don't play ball.
In fact, since one thing Slashdot does have is size, that model would work well for Slashdot membership and computer goods...
Side 1 - people suck - have you ever read any of these "deal forums" (Fat Wallet and AT Hot Deals are two I read from time to time. Jesus fucking christ these people would walk a mile through the desert barefoot while eating salted peanuts for a fucking $10 rebate. Sometimes the "sequence of events" required to get these deals is more fucking work than just well, working and BUYING it for regular price, pricematch here, rebate there, obscure coupon code over there, print someone's reciept from some other store in some other state, and you might get a $79 item for $64 or something equally lame. I get a chuckle at the enormous lengths people will go to to save a couple bucks.
Side 2 - Best Buy sucks - reading this site is like a traffic accident complete with ripped off limbs, you can't stop looking but you know you should. The damn near criminal "support policies" they push and push and push on you, and the "piggyback" magazine subscriptions make me want to do things that would get me on the news. I'm currently getting bills from Entertainment Weekly because when checking out at BB a few months ago I let them "send me 4 free issues" just to get them to shut the FUCK up. Now they want me to pay for the stupid magazine like I give two drops of spit about EW (ew is right).
I don't know who to root for in this fight... Best Buy or the "demon customers" socking it to them. Goddamn I hate rebates, I go out of my way to avoid deals involving rebates because they just PISS ME OFF so bad.
Really I'm not ranting...
--- www.f-theocean.com
Not every one can go out and buy the best of the best, they just don't make enough money to do that AND pay their bills. Also some things are just not worth paying the full everyday retail price, for those things some people wait for the sales.
--
Registered .sig quotient : 1337
I see that Royal Bank of Canada sends wealthier customers to the head of the phone queue, while making ones with smaller accounts wait and wait. This is a classic example of abusing the facelessness of phone transactions, leveraging it to their advantage. Could you imagine customers putting up with this kind of stuff in a face-to-face setting? You walk into the bank, and they tell you to go to the "poor people" line? Or say you go into a department store, only to be told that you will have to let other customers cut in front of you, because they are buying more expensive items? That sounds almost like it should be illegal. But hey, what do you expect for a gigantic, faceless corporation?
BB wants the bar code to get a rebate. They won't accept returns without a bar code (only exchange). BB should complain about their employees not following their own policies. Btw, I fired them from being my retailers a long time ago.
Then I don't want them as a store.
I have no problems whatsoever with them using statistical records to catch abusers of the system, and as far as I'm concerned, returning the product after getting the rebate, for full price, is just fraud.
I really don't even have a problem with them keeping track of aggressive bargain hunters and finding ways to give them fewer deals. That said, though, the fewer deals I get, the less likely I am to shop at a store, and the less likely I am to recommend it to friends...and if the store ever tries to deny my a listed sale price, or just plain refuse to sell to me based on their records, I'll not only never shop at that store again, but I'll go out of my way to help ensure that my friends and family don't either. I also don't think I'm alone in that kind of sentiment. Stores needs to be careful. If they get a reputation for antagonizing their customers, they may find they lose more than they can afford to.
"If English was good enough for Jesus, it's good enough for everyone else."
Seriously, I don't know warped and selfish you'd have to be to believe that "being always right" is somehow a god given right when you're at the store, as the submitter seems to be implying.
Of course the customer is not always right.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
Then there's the clothing that's strategically pre-stained and the store hasn't noticed or doesn't care. Yeuk.
But Really, what's the deal with this? I mean, the refund/return scheme sucks for the retailers, but I am sick and tired of taking 15 min. to save $20 on a hard drive. Thank God for online shopping - the retailers will die if any activity comes of something like this report.
After working in retail myself, I can agree with the assertation that some customers are problematic in the return department. But this is extreme. The reason a retail outlet exists is to produce sales. Sales are made with good SALESMANSHIP. If you're an idiot, please do not apply for the computer department. If you hate videogames, don't work there. Simple - the reason most of these stores would ever lose money is crappy service.
Here's a thought - Instead of Demon Customers, let's save some money and deal with the "Demon" sales people - those working solely for the commission, those who sit and talk for 10-15 min at a time with other employees, even their friends at work, and those who are there cause no one else would hire them.
Who knew, I might spend more money at Best Buy if their service wasn't so bad that I walk into their stores for what I want from an ad, checkout, and run for my car instead of dealing with the Sales-whoreing, rude, half asleep lackeys they pay minimum wage to stock shelves.
Physics is nothing like religion. If it was, we'd have an easier time trying to raise money!
RTFA.
Some other guy from another retailer with a mere 21 stores in the same market is talking about 'firing customers'. The guy from best buy went out of his way to say that they won't give up on 'problem' customers.
C'mon people, follow the narrative.
Seriously: who actually tells those losers the truth?
Mike Hoye
"Puh! Being a customer, I still have a chance of survival then..."
Bowling for Customers: Coming to a theater near you.
I worked as a Tech at Blue&Yellow Hell a few years back, and I ended up quitting after getting into it with the weasly little sales manager over screwing over the customers with that ripoff service plan.
Hell, if you think the company is customer-hostile OVERTLY, you should see the kind of crap they tell the employees at those micky-mouse-micromanagement "Huddles" every morning before opening.
They complained about scammers that send in the rebate and then return the item. RTFA, not just the last few paragraphs. They didn't complain about people who bought products and sent the rebates in.
My wife used to work for Pier One. They had several people who would buy something and REGULARLY return it. Now it's 'used,' and they got $0 for it. Fair? Hardly. Companies should crack down on these scammers, or even sometimes outright crooks. It's costing THEM money, and it's costing us money.
I've been screwed out of enough rebates, especially on purchases from Best Buy, on a personal and professional basis that I'm glad that somebody is actually profiting from these marketing hijinks.
I don't have any sympathy for bad retailers who offer ridiculous deals to customers, with profit margins based on the fact that customers will not exercise options (eg, rebates) or will buy accessories to supplement the original sale.
:).... And *all* my problem customers left me, taking up the offer.
They deserve what they get.
On the other hand, I did run an ISP, so I know what it's like when you give a customer an unlimited account, based on a pool of bandwidth, only to discover they are a leech, and bring down the quality of service for all customers.
Still, they purchased the service legitimately, so I wasn't going to ban them...
So I sent them 3-month gift certificates from a competing ISP
My competitor wasn't too happy when he found out years later, but I was left with a pool of good customers, and those customers I didn't want respected me also, and often recommended me to their friends, many of whom weren't leeches.
Overall, I didn't abuse the customer rights, and I still managed to offer a premium service at a reasonable price. And at better profit margins than my competitors. Not once did I have to make excuses like fair-use policies do.
The moral of this tale? Treat your customers with respect and they'll respect you in return.
GrpA
Enjoy science fiction? "Turing Evolved" - AI, Mecha, Androids and rail-gun battles. What more could you want?
We once bought an appliance at BB then arranged for delivery. Never arrived, but we were charged on the credit card anyway. Very annoying working that out. :(
I stopped using best buy years ago when they stopped listening to their customers and refused to stick to their promises
-Tim Louden
Now, mailing in a rebate then returning an item is unethical on the customer's part (didn't think it was possible since most require original UPC).
However, it's been my experience that BB more often then occasionally won't have a rebate item on stock/shelves right when the store opens on the first day of the rebate sale. 3 cases where I've tried to get a rebate item (modem, HD, monitor) I'd get there and be the first few when the doors open only to find the item NOT on the shelf. Ask a salesperson and they'll say there's no more in stock. When questioned about the promotion, it's the usual B.S. "The item has been on sale for the past week, so we ran out".
I see rebate sales going out of popularity soon. I won't dare touch BB, and once great-for-quick-rebates-turnaounds OfficeMax has gone down the crapper recently for denying legitimate rebate submissions. The second "denied" rebate from OM, I really let the guy on the other end have it on the phone. (got approved after "resubmitting") Since that day, OM's made it on my shitlist along with BB. My sanity and karma isn't worth it. There's only so much crap people in general will take, and more will start to ignore them and not care as word-of-mouth spreads. Perhaps that's the goal of some retailers...
$cat
The Atwater Village Best Buy in LA hires a bunch of hot females, so as long as they continue to do so I will continue to shop there.
I expect to see frequent shopper cards like the supermarkets use to track their customers' purchases. Then, when the customer buys a new DVD player, send him coupons for $$$ off the usual first DVD purchases (Jurasic Park, The Matrix, LOtR). If he's a "good customer", he will pick-up a few other DVDs while in the store. A "demon customer" will only buy things on sale. No more coupons in the mail for him!
Please excuse my English. I am American.
I think people should read the articles they submit. Best Buy did NOT say they fired customers. Also, in my experience, Best Buy has been a better retailer than Wal Mart, Circuit City, Target and the like. I've received great service and pricing there and 100% satisfaction when I needed to return a dud digital camera.
How is a static fry of a video card "scamming?" Umm, the extended service plans are expensive because they cover so many things. If your company is unable to fulfill its contract then it is performing fraud. Plain and simple.
Unfortunately, Best Buy is the kind of company where there is intra-store (departments) and inter-store competition and actually fulfilling that expensive service plan costs the department money, so shady managers screw with customers when they're trying to 'get ahead.'
This business method is just disgusting and makes shopping at places like Best Buy something of a gamble.
This article shows you how unethical this company is. Its one thing to get rid of trouble customers and another to blame customers for actually buying on sale items and mailing in their rebates. If Best Buy doesn't like this then they can stop offering these deals.
Man, can consumer protection be any more impotent?
There's also the case of a guy I've heard of who bought a 300 GB firewire drive, replaced the IDE drive inside with a non-working 1 GB drive, then returning it, saying it didn't work.
- A
Push something (i.e. Capitalism) to the extreme and it becomes the opposite. Communism may have died in the USSR, but its alive and well at Best Buy.
I once had a Best Buy manager swearing under his breath because I refused to pay a "restocking fee" for a non-functioning MP3 player I was returning. Isn't it just as much a scam to stock defective merchandise and charge the customer to restock it? There's a happy ending, though- I called the Better Business Bureau, and Best Buy refunded the fee.
The price is WRONG Biatch!!!!
Everyone else is telling awful service tales, why not me?
I went to Best Buy to checkout a Lexmark All-In-One they had advertised for a wicked cheap after-rebate price. When I got to the printer section I found it it wasn't there. I asked an employee there if I could get some test pages printed, and he obliged, "Oh, sure thing..." After five minutes, I had zero test pages. He admitted to me this wasn't his section, he was just trying to get something copied (don't they have an office copier elsewhere?!)
I asked him if they had any Bluetooth mouse, and he replied, "Oh, yeah, just come over here." We got to the mouse section, he picked up a blue, corded Microsoft mouse - "The blue one, right?"
Bah.
SEARS dropped the "customer is always right" motto a long time ago and replaced it with "The customer isn't always right, but they are never wrong".
Lets face it, if you haven't worked retail then you simply don't know what hell is. Customers are often devoid of communication skills, arrogant, flat out dumb or in such a god damn hurry that they just don't care about anyone or anything else. We've become a consumer culture where everyone says "gimme!" with complete disregard. I'm not even gonna get into the number of thefts frauds etc. Just enter a Fry's Electronics some time and try to find an item on the shelf that doesn't have a return label already on it.
People suck most of the time, especially during the holidays. Sales or no sales everyone is pinching pennies and it's usually the rich pricks pinching them hardest and giving you a hard time for no reason other than to be a complete prick.
What I find ironic is that Xmas is the worst time for all of this. A time supposedly for giving, for your fellow man, love, compassion etc etc which when put into perspective is complete hypocrisy from what it really is. Greed, parking lot arguments, massive crowds, bad tempers, increased suicide rates, fraud. I could go on and on. The fact is, people suck whether they are shoppers or the assholes who own the store.
I'm no fan of Best Buy, I go only once in a rare while. But I don't see them as evil or wrong in this. You and I can decide not to patron them, they however have no fucking clue we are coming or what we'll do when we get there. As far as I am concerned they have the right to refuse service to anyone they like.
I go to BestBuy only to see first-hand what I want to buy from Amazon. Think about it. There's nothing at BestBuy that you can't get online. And with free super saver shipping, it makes it all the sweeter. No sales tax either. Amazon knows customer service, BestBuy doesn't. No rebates to worry about with Amazon. And it's usually in stock. If it's not, I can find it elsewhere online. I've had too many problems with BestBuy/CompUSA (WHY CAN'T THEY KEEP THEIR MERCHANDISE PROPERLY PRICED AND TAGGED!)/Staples/etc. but never with Amazon. BestBuy and others needs to pay attention to what's going on with Amazon and how they're eventually going to kill their sales.
Seriously though -- discriminating against customers is inherently wrong. It goes against the principles of the free market. This type of thing is no different than charging wealthy customers more, just because you can. Or turning low-income people away from stores, since they usually don't spend much.
From the article: Anderson said Best Buy was tightening its rebate policies in the case of customers who abuse the privilege, but declined to say what else his company was doing to discourage its most costly customers.
There is a simple way to stop mail in rebate fraud. Give the rebate when the sale is made and record it on the reciept. But computer stores will never do this because of how many people forget to mail in the rebate in time. I for one hate mail in rebates, and think it is deceptive for stores to list the price of a product as the price after the rebate (with the rebate listed in small unreadable font). On second thought, I wonder if what he really means is how to screw people from sending in the rebate, like forcing them to print out their own rebates from some website or shortening the time window.
Now while Circuit City is no better with the rebates, at least there they really try and help you with what you buy. I purchased a laptop from them, saw 2 weeks later it was $100 less at another store (on-sale), and went to get the price match. The manager gave me the money plus 10% of the differance with no problems. She told me she was happy I was a customer and looked forward to servicing my needs again. That was good service.
Rosco: "If brains were gunpowder, Enos couldn't blow his nose."
Best Buy's customer service has been in decline for a decade. A couple years back I bought a Geforce 3 card from them, only to find that the card in the box had been switched for some generic piece of junk. Took it back and of course they claimed I had to go through the manufacturer for a return. This went back and forth between them and the manufacturer until I had the manager at the store call the manufacturer himself.
After that, he agreed that it wasn't the manufacturer's fault and that the card could've been swapped out by one of their employees or a customer return and skrink wrapped back up, but they weren't going to do anything about it.
So I called my bank and disputed the charges. After reviewing the details, they sided with me and rejected Best Buy's charges.
It would've been possible for Best Buy to look up my 10+ years of sales/return history with them to see if I was trying to rip them off, but they just don't care. Worse, their attitude is that it's more cost effective to lose customers than pay for customer service. So I spend my $2k+ a year tech splurging at Circuit City instead.
There are lots of stores out there and heck, Best Buy doesn't even offer the best prices anymore, the internet does. But if I walk into a brick and morter store it's because I want service beyond what I'd get out of an internet sale. If I have a problem, I want to be able to talk face to face with a person that can, within reason, solve the issue.
But Best Buy doesn't offer that anymore. It'll be interesting to see if other stores follow their lead.
Here's a thought - Instead of Demon Customers, let's save some money and deal with the "Demon" sales people - those working solely for the commission, those who sit and talk for 10-15 min at a time with other employees, even their friends at work, and those who are there cause no one else would hire them.
I dunno if you mean retail in general, but Best Buy whores aren't commissioned.
Another saying was "Our job would be a lot easier if we didn't have any customers", but that's another matter entirely.
I had boughten T-Mobile phones with the Best Buy service plans. Why? Because I had no other way to insure my phone. I had used them in the past and they actually worked.
When Tmobile and best buy broke up, so did my PSP. Best Buy told me that I would get the cost of a new phone if I just went out and bought one (since no new activation = $$$$$$ for even the shitiest of phones). Yea, well when I tried to get them to actually pay up on that claim, they stiffed me. The BBB told me I was shit out of luck since 1-888-Best-Buy was not a member of the BBB. The store told me I was SOL since 1-888-Best-Buy is not a part of BestBuy nor is BestBuy.com
So yea - Ive gotten that.
The ultimate network admin tool needs HELP!
Honestly if someone takes the time to do a bit of research and sift through the ads in order to get free shit from promotional deals from companies like BestBuy that have horseshit customer service to begin with (anyone else remember the Native American dude arrested for trying to get his instant rebate on his pre-ordered NVidia card a while back?), then more power to 'em. Or maybe I'm just bitter because I've gotten screwed on so many of these rebate deals in the past.
"Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned for SEGA. ..."
They try to push those super surge protectors on you for like $50.
$50?!?! That thing better be able to stop the bolt of Zeus.
I happen to work at Rite Aid, and hear customers complain about *my* Single Check Rebates. They say how they hate all that paper work, and that the fact that we are showing that you can get say $3 back for such and such an item, but we can't do it at the register is misleading. But what no one seems to understand is that the rebates are actually manufacturer rebates. Rite Aid goes out AS A SERVICE TO THE CUSTOMER to find out what the manufacturer is offering as far as rebates are concerened. Rite Aid then places it in a little booklet, and advertises it on the item in question. Then, AS A SERVICE TO THE CUSTOMER, it takes care of most of the paper work. Instead of you the customer, filling out a form for each manufacturer to get 1 to three dollars here and there, you fill out one form FOR THE WHOLE MONTH, and Rite Aid cuts you A SINGLE CHECK for all the REBATES you are entitled to during that period. With rebates, the store in question is not trying to make the customer jump through hoops for an extra buck here and there. They are just trying to help you save a few bucks here and there that you might not other wise know about. I am sorry about the rant, but if you don't like rebates, tell the manufacturer. The local store really feels like its doing you a service and, like me, doesn't quite understand why the anger is directed towards them.
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Hippie Logger Jock
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The problem is that the current American population is a franchise generation. They prefer to eat at McDonald than Local Juicy Burgers, they prefer to shop at Big Supermarket Chain than local farmers market and BestBuy instead of Local Electronics. And to these people, "The Franchise is Always Right."
If the Franchise says rebates are to keep prices down, Americans say "OK." If the Franchise says buying on sale is bad, Americans say "OK." If the Franchise says giving us your name, address and phone number keeps the prices down, Americans say "OK." These days, the average customer doesn't question anything unless it appears in 60 minutes, and then only if the Franchises say individual thinking won't drive up the prices.
first of all, if youve never worked in retail, you have no real say in any of this. i happen to work at best buy, and ill tell you a few things. the customer is usually wrong. the majority of rebates are through the manufacturer, not best buy. if someone sends in a rebate and returns it, it was because copies of the UPC are acceptable, so theres really no way around that. im pretty sure thats like cheating the goverment too, thats a different issue though.
and to the people who complained about the service plan, no one is forcing you to buy it. it is the employee's job to mention it to you, if you can fix it, or have a "friend who can fix computers", good for you. have fun buying parts for your laptop. best buy doesnt actually make that much money off of a service plan in the long run. its only about 12% profit.
start complaining about the network cables you are buying, or the $35 usb cable that costs the store $1.08. stop whining about things you dont know about.
you offer to sell a gold bar for a dollar, don't get pissed at me when I show up with a dollar.
BB is deciding to sell thing at a price that hurts their bottom line, it's not the customers fault.
I'm not sure how you can return an item and get full price when the UPC is missing. Naturally, this problem is rooted in the fact that they don't wan't you to take the rebate. I suspect the percentage of people that actually send in for the rebate has been studly climbing and is reaching the point where it actually costs them money.
Of course, they can't stop, because a competitor will have a better deal.
Oh well, I generally don't shop at best buy, however I will be keeping an eye out for there spectacular deals.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
A customer appreciation bat.
Seriously, compared to CompUSA, they're downright saints. Still, if you don't like it, shop at a good honest local computer store (and if thier aren't any in you're area, you've probably got yourself to blame).
Hi! I make Firefox Plug-ins. Check 'em out @ https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/youtube-mp3-podcaster/
Remember, it's those customers who buy things on sale that make your bucks.
This sig no verb.
I got fired as a customer from Best Buys and sued them for unlawful dismisal.
"She's a West Texas girl, just like me" - G.W Bush Iraqis
Clerk: "Have you considered our extended warranty"?
Me: "Do you mean to tell me your products are so inferior that you can't guarantee them past 60-90 days? What the hell am I buying here"??? (Then I walk out)
Un-news
Most people don't really understand why this is so true. They get all caught up on the idea that some customers are actually wrong, or trouble makers, or whatever. But here's the skinny:
The losses you suffer from taking it in the rear for lousy customers is miniscule compared to what you lose when you treat normal customers with suspicion and disrespect in an effort to protect yourself.
Luckily, the company I work for gets this right. And we keep growing at a phenomenal rate, mostly through word of month. I am often amazed at what we do to keep the good word-of-mouth going.
Are there insatiable customers? Sure. Do your best to please them and move on. Let them enjoy the little world they've created for themeselves with their tempertantrums. Chances are all their friends and family find them annoying too. I remember one of our service people returning a nasty call and talking to the irate customer's wife. She said, in essense, "Oh, he's such a mean bastard. Don't listen to a word he says. I'll set him straight when he gets home." We had a good laugh.
Oh, and BestBuy's problem is that they've set up a dishonest business model that depends on misleading customers with sales and rebates. So now their whining that it's not working for them. If you have a honest business model then you rarely get angry at your customers.
Cheers.
I worked at a very small specialized retailer (running store) for about three years.
We had our normal "problem customers". People who would buy a pair of shoes and then bring them back after several long runs on the shoes and try to exchange them. People that would complain about our prices, and so on.
The fact that the owner of the store was there most times to make the final decision, what helped more than anything was having firm, clear-cut policies on things.
If you never took back shoes that had obviously been run in, then the person who was always trying to bring them back worn was going to have a problem. And, I admit, sometimes that meant calling the customer a liar, sometimes to their face.
The customer was always free to go elsewhere. There were even times when I would give directions to another store.
We would never refuse to sell someone a pair of shoes, and we would never treat a customer any differently than any other person off the street. If someone came in trying to return his tenth pair of shoes, I could objectively look at him (and the shoes) the same way as someone who was coming back for the first time to return something. Had the shoe been obviously worn outside? Would I feel comfortable selling this shoe *as new* to another customer? Would I feel comfortable buying this shoe myself, as new?
If the shoe passed those tests, I would take the shoes back, tenth pair coming back or first.
And I will add something on about the rebates - others posting are correct. If you have problems with rebates, *get rid of them*. No one likes them except the retailer, and if the retailer is having problems with them, then no one will be stopping them from getting rid of them.
Now, I also see a difference between a retailer rebate and a manufacturer's rebate. I dislike them both, but the retailer rebate is the worst.
SprintPCS, for example, is making a big deal about this new promotion for existing customers. If you have been a customer for over 18 months, you can get a new phone.
Fine print: SprintPCS will send you a rebate check for up to $150 if you buy the phone, even if you buy is straight from Sprint! So I give SprintPCS my money, and then I have to prove to them I gave them my money, and then 6-8 weeks later they will return *my* money to me?
Insane! Just give me the stupid phone up front!
- (c) 2018 Hank Zimmerman
Customer says Best Buy in the wrong, shops elsewhere...
I'm an Australian and I went on a trip to the US not so long ago for only a week on a business trip.
My first impressions of service in the US (other than the really fancy joints, and the customers on the business trip) was pretty appalling. People talk to you as if you, the customer, are a problem that has to go away.
Let's see... well apart from certain airline stewardess being a bit careless about which passengers they make fun of about on a flight, to the endless cancellations from hotel to hotel and at short notice.... to the rude replies when you ask a simple question:
"Excuse me, can you show me where the bathroom is?"
"Huh? YOU WANNA KNOW WHERE THE BATHROOM IS? WELL! IT'S STRAIGHT DOWN THADDAWAY!"
Oh yes... the image of the bored-out-of-her-mind angry waitress I saw in the movies actually existed!
Then some woman decided she'd check my ID for beer (I'm creeping up on 30 if you don't mind. But hey, nice to feel under 21 again), in a manner which made me feel like I did something wrong.
The taxi driver tried to rip me off, which reminded me of a similar experience I had in a third world country (Well the driver WAS from a third world country), but I'm not sure that this is the kind of experience vistors to the US should be getting. Made more sense to fork out for a limo.
I only tipped for good service (and believe me, it wasn't that often!).
I dunno, but maybe this talk down to the customer thing is just the way of life over there. Maybe you guys are all as tough as nuts and don't get easily offended - but the ordeals were a bit uneccessary. Everybody seems to be competing to be the alpha-male... for some reason.
Makes the RIAA spats against customers seem a little more realistic in my mind.
Oh yeah... and what the hell is it with you guys and Atkins anyway?
READY.
PRINT ""+-0
Screw yout competetor.
python paraphrase from the bookshop:
"You could go to my competitor down the street."
"They sent me here."
"Did They."
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Incompetence? Yeah, right. In the situation you described, it's more like fraud.
LOAD "SIG",8,1
Yes, like being a sucky store in the first place.
Someone needs to tell them how successful they already are in this area.
Rebates are a tax on laziness created by greedy, unethical corporations. I refuse to buy any product that has an advertised price that is based on a rebate. What a bunch of crap.
As far as Best Buy, it's to high tech what McDonald's is to cuisine. I've never met anyone in that store that couldn't be more intellectually-challenged by delivering pizza. The store is crap; the selection is crap; the layout is crap, and nobody in the place has a clue.
...to break stuff.
Wrong. That 99% statistic is a little out of whack, much like some of your reasoning. I.e.:
they misunderstood the advertisement and want the deal anyway (yeah, right)
Sorry, but this certainly can be, and is, a valid reason for customers to complain. Oftentimes, it's NOT the customer's fault for misunderstanding the ad. Rather, the blame lies squarely on the nimrods who designed the ad. Ads that cannot be fully understood after a cursory glance by at least 99% of the customer base DO NOT BELONG IN CIRCULATION. But they end up in there all the same.
Solution: word the fucking advertisements clearly. No legalese. Minimize exceptions, provisos, package deals, and all that shit. And, for fuck's sake, TEST the ad's wording out on a small group of consumers. Always.
True, ads are one of the hardest things to write well. The ad designers are, of course, trying to milk the customer base for all it's worth. Unfortunately this often causes them to resort to dishonesty.
In any case, I'm sorry that you, as the middleman, are confronted with "whiney" customers who just want to be treated with some small semblance of respect. A significant portion of these "whiners" were misled by shlocky advertising. The reaction from the average jaded popcorn boy does nothing to help the situation, either.
I work at Best Buy, and I can partially agree with the stance the company is taking. People don't realize that not only is the customer not always right, they're not always honest either. Every day at my store we get at least two instances of attempted "Rocks in a Box" returns (when a customer purchases a product, swaps the product out with something different or broken, and tries to return it). Other customers like to bring back products that they didn't buy at our store. We know because they're things that the company has either never sold, or haven't sold in years (like exercise equipment, Acer desktops, or clothing).
In terms of the service received, many of you probably have legitimate complaints (like that guy talking about 'smurf herds', when all the salesmen stand in a group and chat, and not acknowledge customers, which is something that happens every so often in the store I work at). But for every one customer who actually has a legitimate complaint, you get three who are complaining about problems they created themselves. The reason why that 'salesman' doesn't know anything about computers could be because he's an appliance salesman, and doesn't know anything about computers. The reason why that Tech (sorry, Agent) was rude to you could have been because there's a line 10 people deep at the Tech Bench (sorry again, Precinct) and you want him to come help you buy a TV. Maybe that Manager would give more a crap about what you say if you didn't smell like you've been rolling around in manure, or didn't act like a four year old with A.D.D. This is stuff that really happens, and what's worse, things like this are common, not extreme.
This is not an article about Best Buy practices. Its about how companies are coping with "Demon" customers. We have a "demon" customer that is slamming our tech support with questions unrelated to her service, but they will argue about the tie in and we need to keep our relationship. Its tough when people are trying to exploit your weaknessess. When the time it takes to patch the holes is time taken away from serving those who deserve it.
fire the customer is someting I have never heard of. The market was driven by supply and demand and in case of best buy if they fire the customer who keeps them in business then they might as well shutdown their store. FYI beggars can't be choosers. it funny how worst buy is whining because customers spending their money wisely.Honestly do they plan to dictate to the customers on how to spend their hard earned money?
High-rollers and steady customers always get preferential treatment at casinos. There are usually seperate lines for checkin, buffets, and shows for patrons they assume will be more profitable. In the meantime, we have to wait it out in long lines with the rest of the "poor people." So getting to the point, it is being done in a face-to-face setting.
"Those customers, they're smart, and they're costing us money." God that's frightening...truly a sign of the times.
The customer is not always right. There are customers who will find loopholes in a company's policy and exploit them, or who will take advantage of the courtesy's of a company. I work at GameStop, and we've had a couple of customers who routinely trade in games a day or two after their public release for cash. Now, we always suggest getting store credit, because the cash is going to be 20% less. But these same people always want the cash, and eventually we found out that they were trading in the same games at multiple stores. They were quite obviously stolen, so we cut them off. Customer always right? I think not.
So So tired of the Gestapo tactics of corporations these days. And even more fed up with odious consultants like Larry Selden, who are more than willing to screw the rest of the populace for a few bucks.
When do we get the privilege of forking over a $20 cover charge before entering Best Buy?
-Your local Neo-Luddite simpleton
Oh heeelllll no they are not. Skrew customer data mining! I have worked at two small buinessess and from personal experiance know how crabby a customer can be. We had bottled perfume at a shop. There were only TWO kinds of perfume and the lady INSISTED that she know the exact perfum smell. Well, a two dozen or so yanking out of a difficult case and she hadn't found it. She gave up, finally convinced we were right. Then she wanted a product that we sell & make in our store and a few others in the area. She swore up and down it was cheaper buy like $2-3 next door. At least she had the guts to come back afterward.
Then there are those who come and try on EVERYTHING then leave a huge mess for us to clean up and don't buy anything. Not that they didn't like the stuff we had. They were just bored. Spend two hours getting attention from us (not just for customer service) yada yada yada.
In the smaller buisness 70-80% of profit came from 40% of the same regular customers. Even 20% is a big chunk of change but that 2-5% of crappy customers were NOT worth it.
Is there anything better than clicking through Microsoft ads on Slashdot?
THere is this attitude, especially in the US/Canada, that the customer is ALWAYS correct, and that large stores are moneybags just to be exploited.
A store that offers rebates that cause them to lose money takes a risk. THat's a fact, finding ways to mitigate that risk is a good idea. Offering more sane deals is a better one.
Some customers ARE a pain in the ass, and not worth dealing with. Buying things to claim rebates and return the item afterwards for a full refund is , if not illegal, dishonest, and morally wrong. THe store didn't even have ot take it back in the first place, let alone give you a rebate.
Pat
Welcome to capitalism.
Signed,
The customer.
Call me a demon, I should sue for religious persecution.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
BAD. Just BAD. Ugh. My old boss used to say, "The customer isn't always right -- but they are always a customer."
My gosh -- talking about "demon customers" is just terribly bad PR. I've never shopped at a Best Buy, and after reading that, I don't think I ever will. I don't care if they think I'm the angel fucking Gabriel of a customer, if they're calling customers "demons" I don't want to deal with them.
It's one thing to scam the store out of money, for example buying sale items and returning for full price. It's another thing *entirely* to "take up too much of a salesperson's time." As defined by who? Some marketroid from Upper Management? I've often asked salespeople questions just because I was needed the information to make an informed purchasing decision, and eventually made an informed decision not to buy the product. Now, *I* don't think I was taking up too much of their time, but...
Or only buying at sales. Come on, think like a (skinflint) customer, especially if said customer isn't from the area and needs to drive a ways to get to your store -- gee, store X is holding a storewide sale again, I better check that out. You hold the sale, you deal with the skinflints. If the skinflints are a problem, hold fewer sales, don't just turn them away! You have to deal with the fact that not all of your customers are going to be consumerist sheep.
C'mon, people, the employees are there (or *should* be there) to help customers, and if they do a decent job the company should make money. If you need to resort to "firing" customers to make money, the customers may not be your problem.
Now, I'm afraid this will fail. The problem is that he doesn't realize that Angel customers are also demon customers, except with a soul. Now, it is true that they'll often help the Buffy customers stick it to the other demon customers, but that's because they're tormented by the past, and don't want to grab only the bargains anymore. But definitely, putting a bouncer before the store hellmouth isn't going to even slow down the demon customers. They'll make mince meat out of him. No, retailers should realize that they are really powerless, and let the professional slayer customers clean up the store.
From the article:
Best Buy executive vice president Philip Schoonover said the idea of "firing" some customers is one place where Best Buy disagrees with Selden. The company will try to find ways to make money-losing customers profitable, he said.
Thank you Mario! But our princess is in another castle!
Best Buy vs CompUSA.
" This reminds me of a funny story."
That statement is only half right.
heh
Actually, I believe we have entered an era where PSP arn't as bad of a deal as they used to. In the race to get items for the lowest price as possible, manufacturing is cutting back to the point where stuff doesn't last as long as it used to.
I bought a cheap DVD player recently, and I bought the 'extended warrenty' for 4 years. Cost me 9 bucks. The DVD playes cost me 50. So for 59 bucks, I am gaurenteed to to have a DVD player for 4 years. If this POS dvd player doesn't crap out at least once, I will be surprised.
I mean, buy super cheap, get the extended warentee for a few bucks, and then when it breaks, you gte a new one, which will i all likly hood be an upgrade from the one you bought, because that one won't be sold anymore.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Never give them your number, etc when making cash only purchases. One Best buy employee at Golf Rd. in Schaumburg told me i needed to give them the telephone number to purchase so i got out of line walked up to another cashier, and had him check me out. Look on the first cashiers face was priceless as i waved bye out the front door.
... I'm actually glad to see a store taking this stance. If they can match it by driving up the customer experience for "honest" customers then all the better.
The scam that is talked about in the text is nothing. I used to watch customers pick up stuff off the shelves then bring it to the checkout for a REFUND. Store policy was always something along the lines of the customer being right... so we'd give them the money.
It's about time stores started stepping up to using the data that they have and managing people who walk through their doors appropriately.
Of course, if there is no plus side to the new attitude then they should be damned to eternal hell!
I, for one, welcome our new retail overlords.
The problem is not necessarily with the company, but with society in general.
Who of us has not heard the phrase "the customer is always right". And I'm not just talking from a retailers point of view; I'm referring to parents, friends, newspapers, television, etc. What these sources fail to qualify is that this phrase has power only to the end of the customers desires. And this is what retail is supposed to be for; the customer knows what they want, and the retailer provides the product that meets the customers needs. Everybody wins! But society has bred a noticeable few retailers that care only about themselves, producing a noticeable number of customers who are "always right" on every topic, thus breeding a vicious cycle.
Retailers, stop trying to deceive your customers, you can trust them to buy your product if you give them what they need!
Customers, stop assuming that you you can get a deal just by demanding it, kicking and screaming. We all don't get a commission, and we all can't lower your price by X%!
Alternatively, do some research yourself. Go into the store knowing what you want to buy. Talk to the sales person, negotiate price, and if its going nowhere, leave. Don't walk in assuming you can get a 25% discount on whatever you like, especially when markups on most consumer electronics run below 10%!
GO to the DA, and tell them how youy where defrauded(you where), Also report them to the BBB.
They think it's bad casue they loose a little money, wait until you start taking up lawyer time.
The Kruger Dunning explains most post on
Best Buy or any retailer offer rebates in the hope that very few will actually claim them. Not to mention all those hassles of waiting period and post-mark dead lines etc. But, what intrigues me is how one can return an item after claiming for the rebate. Most rebates (AFAIK) need a original UPC code cut from the packaging. Returns cannot be made if items are not in their original packaging with their UPC codes. It is hard for me to believe that someone can actually return the items after claiming for rebate. Infact, retailers also gain from the fact that customers *cannot* return the items they brought through rebate offers. That should reduce their losses!
My best friend works at Best Buy right now, and his superiors basically all but say, "push the PRPs and sell enough that we're in the 'green' or get fired."
If they don't sell enough PRPs or do good enough business, even higher ups come to the store to bitch out the managers.
Brad Anderson, Best Buy's chief executive: "Those customers, they're smart, and they're costing us money."
We know where leadership by an anti-intellectual "strongman" who scapegoats minorities and likes boisterous rallies goes
A few years ago, Best Buy's customer non-service dicked me over for the last time. They made off with about $50 and 10+ hours of my time. Since then, I've vowed to be one of those "demon" customers. No, I don't have the patience to fill out rebates and return merchandise, hell I don't have patience to do rebates for any reason whatsoever.
But, I do make it a point to keep my eyes and ears out for pricing errors and the like which I can abuse the shit out of. I've got multiple accounts with bestbuy.com and anytime I find out about a severe price error, I make sure to rape them as hard as possible with it.
Since I've been at this, I've easily cost them 10x what they cost me - for example, the Claude Chabrol DVD box set which they sell for ~$70 - they originally mispriced at under $15, I ordered and received 4 of them. More recently, they meant to have a 30% off sale for certain dvds that are generally priced in the $20-$50 range. Instead they priced them all at under $9 for about 12 hours, including the $50 titles. I ordered about 12 of those. There are a few other similar cases of extreme pricing errors or single-use per "customer" coupons ($10 off any size order for example) that I've abused as best I could. The best thing about these pricing errors is that even if I can't return them for a full-price refund because the receipt reflects the price I paid, I can trade them or sell them on ebay and easily recover my "investment."
If Best Buy has pissed you off one time too many, join me in sticking it to them. We may be small as gnats compared to the behemoth that is bestbuy, but the more angry people who do their part, the more blood it loses and the more money we all will make.
PS, don't even get me started on their absolutely bullshit price-matching non-policy -- totally random, made-up-as-they go rules, even when the real "rules" are posted on a sign with 140pt type right above the smurf's head.
When information is power, privacy is freedom.
Maybe in the world of mindless retail, "the customer is always right" but this is absolutely NOT the case in other industries. As a developer and technology consultant, one of the most significant responsibilities I have is translating the customer's needs into something real and functional. In almost every case this involves at some point, me telling the customer what he wants may not be practical, economical, or even viable.
I vehemently believe that behind EVERY botched tech job, there was at least one greedy, obsequious player that was too afraid of telling the customer he is WRONG.
A few years back my company turned down a job for one of Stephen Spielburg's companies because what they wanted to do was ridiculous. We knew from the beginning that a bunch of detached executives had an idea for a net-based solution that would backfire on them, and we choose to not be the sacrificial lamb when the whole thing imploded. I lost some potential money in that deal, but I'm certain I would have been much worse off trying to patch the fatally flawed system they suggested we develop. Not a month goes by where I don't have to have one of these types of conversations with customers who want the earth, sun, moon and Jesus Christ piled on top of a rich creme filling that will rot in a few months time.
In the area of technology and application development, it's almost imperative for the customer to defer to the wisdom and superior working experience of the IT professional.
Back to the world of retail, how many of us have been in a store and saw some mindless consumer drool over a product that we knew was crap. Every day the goofballs in places like Best Buy have to nod and accommodate these people, even when, among the few employees that have a clue, are fully-aware the customer might as well toss their money down a drain.
Life is too short to go through that. I am so thankful I'm in a position where I have clients who respect the wisdom of my recommendations. If you're not there, you might want to strive to get there and not be a slave to the all the goofy, destructive, superficial mantras corporate america tries to brainwash consumers with.
if it's an expensive, hard to fix artifact, prone to breakage under normal usage or containing really small moving parts (laptops, PDAs, +500 and less than 1500 digital cameras/camcorders). do yourself a favor and get an extended warranty if you're known to be a klutz.
Also, the same goes for devices that are constantly updated with new models yearly or biannually (video cards are typical example). Make up some problem with the old one, be "forced" to get the new one as a replacement.
Never buy the warranty on things like: cellphones, pagers, really expensive cameras, console gaming systems, portable audio/video playback devices, and appliances that you don't move around much, etc. They are either not worth the extra cost, hardy enough as is, or easily RMAd for a replacement.
Well, this is typical demon customer behavior. I guess the worst customer is the informed customer. Sigh.
THIS THING CAN TURN ON A DIME, MACROSSZERO STYLE ALSO FUCK BETA, ~NYORON
Sounds good. Where do I sign up?
___
It's the end of my comment as I know it and I feel fine.
Statements like this one really proves that we are a sales culture dominated by snake oil salesmen and "yes" men/women. We'll agree with any decision the customer makes regardless of if it's really in their best interests or not because it makes us money. Sometimes, our modern commerce system is absolutely disgusting.
My experience, and probably the experience of anyone who's ever actually dealt with customers, is that they are usually ill-informed or partially informed because most customers don't actually take the time to do the necessary research that is needed in order to make a good buying decision. It is *our* duty as salespeople, consultants, etc to assist them in understanding and defining their needs. It is our duty to guide the customer into what is "right" based on their real needs and not perceptions.
Anthony Papillion
Advanced Data Concepts, Inc.
"Quality Custom Software and IT Services"
Thats the number of times I've been in a Best Buy. I've never made a purchase there. The sales people don't know their products. They will annoy you until you leave. The prices are within $5 of Circuit City.
Guess where I buy TV's and stereo equipment?
Professional Politicians are not the solution, they ARE the problem.
I've been spending my hard earned dollar at Best Buy for years, but no more. I (foolishly) purchased one of their "extended warranty" plans for an after-market car stereo.
I realize that what I've been through might be minor, but when I see crap about the customer not being right, it makes my blood boil. The reason is simple: companies like Best Buy take "the customer is always right? not anymore" to an extreme - where the customer becomes some kind of pinyata for them to beat on until all the coins drop from your pockets; where they try to make the customer feel like the bad guy for taking them up on sales, warranties, etc.
Here's a short version of the story:
Under this plan, I tried taking the stereo back because it wasn't functioning properly. A week and a half later, they called and said it was fixed. I took the time to reinstall it, only to find that not only wasn't it fixed, but that their fix had caused a new and unrelated problem with the unit. I took it back to the store, where they called a few days later saying it was fixed. The initials on the repair slip indicated it was the same tech, who said nothing was wrong with the unit. Not the problem I originally had it in for, or the new problem. The thing was fine according to this hack.
I took it back a third time being very specific that I did not want this same tech touching it. This time they wanted two pieces of wiring - the harness and the antenna adapter, which cost me about 30$. No problem. I brought all three items to the store, and they sent them all out. A few days later I got a call saying that the unit had been "junked" - they were going to just replace it.
Well, this unit isn't available any longer. No problem, I'll choose a comparable unit close to the price I paid originally. I also asked if they were going to replace, under the warranty, the two pieces of wiring they'd taken. Nope. This is where it starts to get ugly.
The CS rep I'm dealing with at the store has disappeared and returned, and decided on a model he believes is equivalent to what I had. It is priced at about 50$ less than what I paid and lacked several features of my old unit. If I wanted anything else, I would have to pay the difference from the price of this "comparable" unit. No, I can't just take a store credit and be done with it, thats not how it works, he tells me. "Well feature A doesn't seem to be on this model, I really liked that about my old model. Don't you think thats important?" I ask the CS rep. No, he tells me flatly. At this point, I'm getting pretty pissed. No!? WTF?
Back to the wiring stuff. They took the wiring from me, but they're not going to replace it. The CS rep says he'll call the repair people and have it sent to me - it'll be 7-10 days before I get it in the mail. I want to know why it wasn't already on its way, and how I'm supposed to install my "comparable" unit without it. Best Buy repair people knew they had junked the unit and that they weren't going to give me new wiring. The CS rep responds by saying he just called and it is being shipped. I try to explain to him that he's totally missing my point, but he can't hear me. They took something that they're not going to replace - therefore the items belong to ME. My property. Why don't I have them already? Why does it take you calling to get MY stuff back? Why won't you just give me new ones and be done with it?
At this point, he says something to the effect of "well, you're obviously not listening to me, so you can go talk to my supervisor on the other side of the store."
I had to walk away because the attitude this rep was copping was starting to cause a scene (which maybe isn't such a bad thing), but I was about to do something that would have prompted security to haul me off. At this point, a supervisor SHOULD have made him/herself available - this was all going on right in front of the service desk.
I was (am) royally pissed. The guy was a complete prick, didn't give a ri
There is very little future in being right when your boss is wrong.
I bought 2 160 Harddrives a while back and NEVER got my Rebate from them. I bought a 500 dollar IPod and they gave me shit when I took it in because it was acting up 2 months later. And I PAID for their warranty they make money off of. Now they want to punish people cause they are smart and only buy during sales? Lmfao, I would love to see a nation wide boycott that dropped their stock and sales to nothing.
I once worked in a department store in Australia. I sometimes performed the role of "door greeter", the person standing at the front door, the first point of contact for customers to ask directions etc. Part of this role was to immediately pick up the phone and contact security whenever one of a small number of "problem customers" walked into the store - known shoplifters, fradusters or problem customers who were rude or abusive towards staff.
...to which the manager replied "If you ever step foot in this store again, you will be asked to leave by our store security, or will be removed by the police if necessary."
On one occasion, such a person was in the store and started to argue and yell at the checkout staff, because she wanted prices from a sale that ended two weeks ago or something. When the manager arrived, this customer started to argue with him, and made one critical mistake:
Customer: "If you don't do what I want, I will never shop here again!"
Realising the error in her line of reasoning, the abusive customer simply turned around and left immediately.
I have NEVER found a store with such clueless employees. If they get screwed over, it's not the customers' fault IMO.
I purchased a DirecTV/Tivo system from BestBuy. I take it home and find out there's no card in the system. I can't make it work. The salesperson told me DirecTV would supply me with a card; DirecTV told me they wouldn't and I should get one from BestBuy. End result, I take the unit back to Best Buy and only then am I informed that they do have the cards, but they don't keep them in the boxes with the units. I tell them to piss off and I get a better deal doing business directly with DirecTV. I have NEVER found one thing in BestBuy that wasn't higher-priced than CompUSA, broken, incomplete or misleading. I'm glad this article came out, because for some perverse reason, Best Buy is on the way to CompUSA and I always stop there, but I'm now reminded that while I waste time poking my head in this store, I don't think I've ever gotten a better deal, or found less-clueless salespeople anywhere.
Can we all look forward to the time when these stores will be converted into Chuck-E-Cheeses? I could probably get superior tech support and an order of cheesy bread!
At the store, the clerks look up up the printer and then they tell him they wouldn't let him exchange it. The printer he had had been discontinued for years and there was no way Best Buy could have sold it to him. Basically they tell him tough luck.
Now in Best Buy's defense it looks like he's trying to scam the store, but my buddy asks them two questions. 1) If they can look up the printer, can they not look up if the box had been returned previously. 2) They can certainly look up his purchase history and see that he was a good customer.
After some reluctance and some heated words, they find out that the box had been returned 2 months before my buddy bought it. My buddy had bought thousands of dollars of appliances, electronics, movies, etc with almost no returns.
In my buddy's case they let him exchange the printer, but wouldn't had they not had the data and if he hadn't been so persistent.
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
In the UK, many stores have so many sales that you just know one is coming up soon. Even if its not an individual store, for some market areas you can be pretty sure there's a store somewhere close with a sale on at any given point in time. If not, then just wait a week.
There was some definition of "Sale". I think the items had to be at the higher price for a certain amount of time in at least one store in the country or something like that.
For some suppliers of UPVC windows, you may as well consider the list price to be double the real price, as they always have a sale on that evaluates to roughly 50% off, or "buy one get one free" or "buy front, get back free". When they come to their winter sale of "60%" you know thats actually quite good, as it equates to 20% off the normal price.
I've found that haggling is not so good nowadays. Maybe these people are running tighter profit margins compared with web stores. I wanted to buy a printer, and wanted the convenience of the local store for support, and was willing to go part way between their price and an online price - perhaps even throw the cable in for free (15 in the store, 0.58 online!) but they just told me to go away and buy online.
Here's something to do for those who live close to best buy (or other similar stores). Every week, when they send out their ads, they always have some free crap listed (after rebate, of course). Go in and buy as much of that as possible (or anything else you might want that you think has a negative margin on it). Repeat for a while and see if they get annoyed...
I've had staff members RECOMMEND that I do those things and take advantage of those annoying Best Buy "perks" that they are instructed to pitch at you.
Best Buy is totally aware that the customer would quickly think of ways of abusing the policy. But they already figured that would happen. They're banking on the gobs of people who are trying to be "decent", and Best Buy is just abusing that goodwill. Same thing with rebates. They assume (correctly) that most will forget about it, or not photocopy your UPC, then return the product.
The problem is that now, with the internet, these notions have spread far further than they projected. People do it out of spite, even if they end up wasting time and money doing these things.
So Best Buy could either demonize these customers who are acting just as they predicted we would, or adapt (maybe they could just provide better customer service?)
I guess customer profiling is the next best thing. It's like... you asked for it. Be prepared to fight for your right to abuse their policies... or get used to shopping with Amazon or Circuit City.
THIS THING CAN TURN ON A DIME, MACROSSZERO STYLE ALSO FUCK BETA, ~NYORON
Needless to say I got screwed,
The problem is that increasingly, you need to be an expert in every product that you buy and ask lots of questions and spend an inordinate amount of time.
A more serious example is with medical insurance companies: Ever heard of people being billed surgery because even though the surgeon was covered, the anaestesiologist or nurse was not? You have to fight for not being taken advantage of. Sadly, you need the energy even more when you are sick and weak. So, no rebate chasing for me. No complicated medical insurance either: I moved to a country where taxes cover it and make the process simple and stress free.
One place that does NOT give you hell: Microcenter. I shop there all the time. Generally, the return policy is 30 days. No stupid 15% restocking fee on the 500$ worth of stuff you just bought that doesn't work right. Their prices are sometimes a little higher (~3-5%) than on the web, but you can't beat the reassurance of being able to take something back if it doesn't work or won't fit or isn't the right part. (How many times have we all accidently picked up the wrong part off the shelf only to get it home and try to figure out why the damn thing won't fit right?)
I'm sure that Microcenter loses some money by doing this, but how much more do they make because their customers are loyal to them and vice-versa?
There is very little future in being right when your boss is wrong.
In a lot of ways I think Best Buy is a pain in the butt. Let's start with rebates.
But at the same time, anyone who says "the customer is always right" has never worked retail. Contrary to popular belief, at least 90 percent of the time the customer is full of shit. In the past, businesses only let them *think* they were right. Most businesses had to take that line, because they had a limited number of customers in a given location, and they wanted to make everyone happy. Thanks to an era of retailers on every street corner and nationwide sales via the internet, those days are over. I will admit that there are a lot of instances where businesses are very guilty of poor practices and poor customer support. But there are just as many instances, if not more, where the "customer" should be told to go shove his head up his ass and shuffle it on out the door.
Lets start with customers who regularly come in to a store, tie up a sales person asking endless questions, then go home and buy the item on the internet from a mailorder business. And before anyone fires up a reply saying "well then, the store should lower its prices", no brick-and-mortar retailer will ever be able to match the price of a mail-order only business, and you are being totally unrealistic (and very ignorant of business) expecting them to do so.
I want a new quote. One that won't spill. One that don't cost too much. Or come in a pill.
Just lie. Use a 555 number. You think the sales monkey cares? The only person who really cares will be the consultant they hired to prune their CRM databases.
THIS THING CAN TURN ON A DIME, MACROSSZERO STYLE ALSO FUCK BETA, ~NYORON
#1. To get people into the store so they might purchase other FULL PRICE items.
#2. To clear stock so you can put in different stuff.
Stores tie up a LOT of money in their merchandise. If it ain't selling at the price you've marked, then you ain't gettin' money. So you mark it down until it DOES sell.
I don't see anything wrong with shopping around to find the discontinued and going-out-of-style bargins that you're selling for less than you paid.
I've bought the replacement plan once - for my laptop, which was the floor model (I needed the laptop right then, else I would have bought it online). Sure enough, 1.5 years later the thing wouldn't turn on.
I will say that if you DO have the replacement plan, the service is pretty damned good should you need to take advantage of it - one week turnaround from dropping the thing off to it being shipped back and in my possession.
But, I figured the replacement plan for something that had already taken some abuse was worth the gamble. Most things I just self-insure - should it break, I can scrap it and buy a new one.
paintball
So, you're saying that these customer reps deliberately do what they can to piss off customers, even when they know the customers are not interested. And that we should just accept that some idiot gets paid to harass us as much as possible.
Why can't we just spend our money and get home to play with our toys, without being bothered by stupid sales people? And if the manager tells the sales people to behave like that, sure manager would be the one to complain to.
My old man was a cheapskate, but he grew up in Europe without a lot of money. I was with him one trip when he pulled up to the Texaco in his Jaguar and bought $1 worth of gas. (OK, that was 2 gallons in those days, but still...) That would keep him going until the Esso where he could use his Esso Credit Card. Oh, and he got a fantastic deal on the Jaguar...
I don't have that kind of brass, or I'd be the "you're fired" customer. If I go to Joe's Eats, I don't know what a burger costs til I walk in the door and read the menu, and I don't know how good it is until it arrives. If I was brassy, I could then reject it and walk out without paying , but it's so much simpler at the big franchises. Plus, sometimes (often) my wife and I will split a single meal; I feel imposing to do that in a small private business (lack of "brass"), but McDonald's couldn't care less if you order nothing but a small coffee and a cup of water.
People will agree that getting rebates on returned merchandise is theft, but I don't think BB will win customers by telling them not to take advantage of sales. I think they'll win more friends with a "let's get simple" approach. Also, here in Canada, eh?, you pay sales tax on the price before rebate - no rebate on taxes - 14% or more! Hmm... I wonder if they claim GST (VAT) back on that rebate? Rebates are a practice I tolerate because I have no choice - and usually take months for the cheque to arrive - and oh yeah, the bank will charge you a service fee to deposit - another 50-cent insult...
The rebate is a gimmick that (a) allows them to advertise a lower than true price - exaggerrated low price gets you in the door so the salesman can work his magic... - and (b) puts some limit on the quantity you buy (If like many box stores, the small retailer says "Their retail is lower than my wholesale!". The Grocery chains enforce limits with their "club" cards, but food is a whole different class of retail.
Those stupid warranty programs are a rip. When Sears first tried selling me one years ago for my fridge, my response was "are you suggesting you expect this product to fail??" When we bought coverage for our car tires from the dealer, and had to claim while away from home, it was almost as more trouble than it was worth. "Sorry, that warranty is through the dealer 1500 miles away, talk to them..." Had to buy a used tire as a spare and ask the dealer later for reimbursement of extra expense. Good thing they liked us...
BTW, notice that the world's biggest, most successful retailer is the one that offers NO gimmicks or sseasonal sales or other crap? Just "everyday, low prices". OK, so they're not always, but for all the (many) complaints thrown at Wal-Mart, the rarest are "I just bought it and then it went on sale", "I found it MUCH cheaper at another store", and "they tried to sell me an extended warranty".
Signed me up for Sports Illustrated on one visit and Entertainment Weekly on another, when I've always declined the (annoying) offer. Called SI and EW and was told that I'd signed up at Best Buy.... The service representative also told me that he gets several calls like that a day and it is not an isolated incident.
Bought my girlfriend a computer there and told the salesmen four times I had cable and didn't need MSN. Next month It appeared on my charge card. Called MSN and they said I signed up at Best Buy.... The service representative also told me that he gets several calls like that a day and it is not an isolated incident.
See a reoccurring theme here?
Called Best Buy customer service and was told that I'd have to call the individual companies to cancel the service (no sorry, no oops it was a mistake) and that there would be no harm - no foul.. I pointed out that had I not discovered it I could be out several hundred dollars. The prick had the balls to tell me it was my fault and he didn't really care if the sales people were signing me up because it was part of their job!
Needless to say I haven't been back to Best Buy in several months.
I've worked in retail (fast food to be more precise) during parts of high school and college and while most customers are congenial and fair, there are some individuals who need to be treated like children since they behave like them.
At the store I worked for, there were a handful of known 'customers' who would repeatedly scam; complaining they got the wrong product or that it took longer than it should have (pizza delivery). Now when the manager has checked the product before it left the store and the time the order was placed is printed on the delivery ticket (by the computer that the order was punched in on) we could tell when we did screw up and when we were being scammed.
After having the same customers pull the same scam 5+ times, I would have loved to have been able to tell them off but the managers would not do so because the scammers would invariably call the corporate office and corporate would not back the store managers up (corporate didn't have to deal with these people on a regular basis so it was easy for them to say "The customer is always right").
Frankly I found it infuriating and insulting that we continually had to prostrate ourselves to these idiots who thought they were clever because they could get away with a free pizza.
He probably should have just left the store after being shoved, and not gotten the Tube. I can't imagine why anyone would want to continue the transaction after something like that. Just go to another store.
Also, best buy isn't exactly cheap.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
Printer, free after 2 $30 rebates. Ink cartridges $30 each for B&W and MCY. USB cable not included with printer, $25.
"Sic Semper Tyrannosaurus Rex."
You can always return a Best Buy service plan for the pro-rated value of the plan.
paintball
I no longer shop at Best Buy, here's why:
... Finally the manager says something like "Well if it works fine here I can't give your money back" (I had already explained several times that I DON'T want my money back, just a replacement). After I got that through his thick skull he tells me that that can't happen either - again because it plays fine in there player. I get preached about how if they did that people would pirate things all the time. (I try to figure out why someone would pirate a DVD then bring it back for a copy of the same DVD.... hrm... maybe I'm missing something here).
One day I decide to buy Terminator 1 and 2 on DVD - I shop around a bit and Best Buy is about $5.00 cheaper than any where else around here, so I buy there.
I go home and watch them. When I get to T2, it won't play. Period. Just won't. Freezes wherever I jump to on the DVD. There are no scratches or anything in the DVD, it looks fine, but just won't play.
So I take it back & explain the situation. I have a reciept. Started out as one girl "helping" me. She completly ignores everything I tell her, e.g.: Me: "...The DVD itself looks fine, there are no scratches"... two min later: Her: "...Well sir there are no scratches, it must be your DVD player". grr. My DVD player is fine - I explain to her that I tried a FEW other DVDs after this oen and it works fine, including the T1 that I purchased and played the same day. I also explain that it works FINE in my PC DVD player which puzzled me a bit. She promptly pops the thing in a PC DVD player to test it - it of course plays just like I said it would - she looks to me and again says it's fine and must be my player.
Well this goes on for a while arguing with her - so I get a manager. The same exact process repeats itself.
Long story short: I never got a new copy at Best Buy; they WOULD NOT swap it no matter what - even with my reciept.
So I went to Media Play and paied the extra $5.00. It played perfectly. And I rest well knowing that for the extra five bucks I can alwyas return to Media Play without a hassle.
Customer walks into computer store I smile and ask how I can help them "I want this harddrive *mentions rebate*" *I like a good pleeb hand it to them thinking nothing of it ring it up and think well that was a nice 4 dollars to my commision* less then a week later *customer walks in with harddrive in hand* *wants to return for cash* rebate on side missing... mention this and the guy gets irate. 25 minutes a manager and the owner later the guy leaves with harddrive in hand swears he will never shop here again... good.
You have been sig'd
1) buy item without service plan
2) break item
3) buy item with service plan
4) after a couple years, replace the 'service plan' item with a new, top of the line model.
You can even intentionaly break the item after a couple of years, with the service plan, and upgrade to a newer model
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
Bestbuy used to be ok w/ pricematch. Not long ago, they change their pricematch policy.
Any items pricematched are not eligible for rebate. And the drones at the CS desk has been instructed to give all kind of excuse NOT pricematching.
Consumer only get smarter from time to time.
U guys should visit fatwallet, they are the master of pricematch.
I had a misfortune of buying a laptop from Bestbuy. It was a Celeron 2.4 GHz, and it turned out to be quite noisy: even when the computer was idle it would spin up the fan every now and then, and that was one noisy fan!
So the very next day I brought that computer back to them and said I want a refund. They asked if something is wrong, I said yes it is--too noisy. I was told the "technician" needs to look at it, the technician turned out to be a fat guy with a fake friendly smile and tons of computer "knowledge". He thoughtfully listened to the computer running, and said everything was fine. The store was really noisy, he couldn't hear anything, but of course he will say everything's fine. He then proceeded with explanations: laptops nowadays must come with fans and it's actually normal for them to be noisy, and without fans they would burst into flames instantly. I said I still want to return it and his response was there would be 15% restocking fee since the computer was not defective.
I guess he was right in his own way (that's his job anyway). Their policy states there will be a fee and that's it. They refused to believe the computer was defective, so there was nothing I could do.
What I did do though was I made a computer more defective. I got the firmware for its DVD drive, changed around bytes in it, reflashed the drive, and got the Windows DVD player to show gibberish. Funny thing was it still burned CDs and read data DVDs just fine.
After that they happily accepted back the notebook without any fees.
I know what I did is not exactly right, but they could have been more agreeable in the first place. I did bring the computer the very next day, did not open any CDs or anything, I sincerely felt I'm within my rights to ask for complete refund. Since they refused to play nice, I did not either.
Needless to say I did not get anything in Best Buy ever since, nor do I intend to. Instead I got a Centrino notebook which, if set to run at 700 MHz, will compile a Linux kernel and play a Divx movie without ever spinning up the fan. So much for flames.
For instance, post-up books offer deposit bonuses along these lines:
The thinking is that, at the standard 20-cent line, with its theoretical hold of 4.5% that the book should hold $112.50 thus netting it $12.50.
However, in a technique perfected and publicized by a guy in Montreal (since immortalized on the sportsbetting fora as "Claude the Fraud"; the fact that he and a mod of one of the major forums had a very messy breakup that ended with nude pictures of her getting posted only added to this tale's immor(t|)ality), you create multiple accounts and arbitrage between them, thus creating guaranteed profits and getting bonuses to boot.
This scam has, of course, tarred the run-of-the-mill bonus whores (who will play at any book, no matter how tenuous its finances or how bad the lines are) with the scammer brush. Books have been scaling back their bonus plans for the past couple of years (though with football season approaching, the bonus war will start up again). Of course, the bonus whores are uniformly stupid; the reduced juice a shop like Pinnacle gives is better than any bonus.
Related to this is the player profiling. Shops like SIA (Sports Inter Action, out of Costa Rica) offer inflated lines (e.g., if the "market" line is say Patriots -4 (and thus Colts +4), they'll post Patriots -5/Colts +5). However, betting too many of those off-market lines marks you as an advantage bettor and you'll get, depending on how much you've won, your account closed or your limits cut.
Most all manufacturers have warrantees. If a product breaks down on it's own, you can send it in (up to a year). On the other hand, if you have a service plan, you get about 3 years of coverage, you can take it back to the store for an instant return (rather then waiting for the mail) and the service plan covers you if you break it yourself (such as a broken screen on a PDA).
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
In person. Hell, i was in a bank one day while my friend was just cashing some checks, i was just standing over by another (uniocupied) counter and happened to be wearing a suit for whatever reason and had 3 people coming up and asking me if i needed help with safe deposit or personal banking. It was quite strange.
"Sic Semper Tyrannosaurus Rex."
My job was to show up and help sell Product X for this company by answering customers questions, showing how my company's Product X is better than the competitor's, etc. Of course, the other companies usually had their own reps there too, so there was a little competition for customers there.
This was a blessing for BB in that, when we were there, the company's own employees could go to a different aisle and concentrated on the customers there. It was a problem, though, because Best Buy has quotas. Each store is required to meet a certain "attach rate" for accessories & warranties.
So, we were constantly being harrassed by BB management. We were told "sell warranties," "sell accessories" and "if you don't meet our standards for attach rates, we'll refuse to allow you in the store anymore."
Basically, I was told that if I wasn't as big an asshole as the BB management about attachments, they would effectively get me fired by refusing to allow me in their store anymore.
Worse, I would occasionally make a really good sale to someone who didn't need the accessories. In that case, I wasn't going to get aggressive... after all, a sale on Product X still gets BB money right? Apparently not enough, because on several occasions one of their more aggressive sales managers would swoop in and badger the customer into taking the accessories. Several times, they were so offensive in doing so that the customer left the store without Product X because they were so angry. The manager cost the store (and myself) a sale, just because they're so worried about their attach rate.
I never had that problem in CompUSA. They still want attachements, but I was never pressured or badgered about it. They were glad to have extra help on the sales floor.
I mean, how am I supposed to tell the difference between 2 DVD players if their "product descriptions" are the same five words and there's a 30 dollar price difference? Did I hear you say, "But certainly you researched this ahead of time and knew everything about every model of DVD player?" Is that really what I have to do? I guess so, since the Best Buy droids (no less than 5 of them) who wanted to sell me a DVD player didn't even know what a region code was, much less the difference between the players. Well, except that one had a silver finish while the other was black.
If I'm a bad customer, it's only because I prefer not to go shopping before I go shopping. And I won't buy something just because a clueless salesperson and their "product description" tell me it's a great deal.
It sounds like you may need a career change.
I work for a major department store chain as a your basic associate (younger geeks have to find crap first jobs as we all know). Now I agree with all of you when it comes to the shopping experience: leave me the hell alone, if I need your help I'll ask for it.
But the thing is, it's not how you or I want your shopping experience to be, it's how the management wants your shoppping experience to be.
I didn't say hi to you within 30 seconds of your walking into my department? Bad associate!
I did say hi to you, but a manager walked by so now they insist I have to say hi to you again, even though that just makes you mad.
Done shopping? NO! How about more of the stuff you've got now, but in different colors/styles or accessories even though you told me you only came in for a pair of socks.
Now you're done shopping? Would you like to put this on our store issued credit card? Don't have one? Well what's holding you back from opening a 25% interest account? I must insist!
(Incidentally they feed us BS saying that the real reason they issue cards is because those customers who have them tend to be more loyal and spend more than on your standard everyday credit card, but if that was the case why charge so much interest?)
Now that our transaction is complete, and all you want to do is get the hell out of here, would you like to fill out a feedback card describing your shopping experience and determing my worth as a human being to my superiors?
Unless your dealing with just a complete asshole, odds are the employee is as equally annoyed as you are by pushing those nonsense extras.
Cut us some slack ehh?
Don't blame me - I just teched there at #216.
http://bestbuysux.org/cust.html
Striking fear in the authors of godawful fanfiction, I am here, appearing in darkness, Tuxedo Jack!
they undoubtedly make a lot of money for the likes of Best Buy. It's probably a cash cow for them. That said, I've purchased a product warranty a grand total of once from them. And guess what? I needed to use it. I bought a laptop from them and about 2 months before the extended warranty ran out, the battery on the laptop wouldn't hold a charge.
So, I brought the laptop in, talked to a tech there who agreed with my diagnosis. He issued me a RMA style authorization receipt and sent me on my way. I used the contact info on the receipt and BAM!, about a week and half later I had a working battery for my laptop. I suspect that it was a refurb, but I didn't really care about that.
So, some people might get screwed. The warranties don't always make sense (hell, they're not going to stop you from buying one if your chances of ever needing it are practically nil). So FWIW, my experience was good. Maybe I'm just an anomaly, maybe not.
I think that most of the quality and satisfaction issues concerning warranty and product servicing are going to be around the more complex cases. My case was simple.
Please mod this post only if you think others should/n't read this. I have enough ego^H^H^Hkarma. Thanks!
They said they didn't have the phone in stock and I should call the 800 number for a replacement, so I did, they told me I had to go to my nearest dealer for a replacement.
So I went back, they said I would have to wait 2 days for them to get it in stock. Pissed me off, but fine.
So I went back two days later to get it, still not in stock, well I was leaving to Florida for business that night, and I needed my damn phone, and at this point I was way pissed, I demanded they give me a phone, any phone, and they refused, they would sell me a new phone for full retail.
I told the manager I would switch services to get a free phone long before I would give him a damn red cent, and that is exactly what i did, I called Verizon reported the incedent and cancelled every plan in my company. We took our numbers to Tmobile and couldn't be happier.
So that Jack Ass lost 27 subscription customers because he couldn't bear the thought of taking care of a customer. Plus I am now an avid Verizon naysayer, nobody I meet or know will ever be a verizon customer again or ever so long as I can help it.
Vending Machines
I have worked for best buy for over 4 years now, and well best buy sucks. But for a lot more reasons than what most people bitch about. I wont go into that stuff.
First humans in general are assholes. Humans work at best buy and humans shop at best buy. So people on both side are going to be aggrevated.
Now to my main few points.
rebates: Not all rebates are offered by Best Buy(the actuall company). Most rebates are manufactures rebates, so for the people who bitch about not getting those, call the manufacture.
PRP/PSP: For all the people who dont get them, yes there is a quite a people who actually do. I dont believe that a PRP/PSP necessary on all thebvitems that we sell, but on quite a few i think its worth it.PS2 for instance i get the damn PRP in a heart beat, best buy sends soooooooo MANY defective ones back it ridiculus. OR maybe a overpriced really big tv. Because they tend to produce the customers best buy wants to fire. Costumer buys $999 TV and it breaks 30 days later, cant return it and they didnt buy the service plan. SO they come to best buy and they throw a big tantrum. Sorry for ya, then i got to call the cops cause they wont leave.
and yes the sales associates can be a little pushy, but its not their fault, if they dont they get fired plain and simple.
oh yeah one more.
advertised price: If allcostumers actually came to buy an item at ad price best buy wouldnt be so upset. But alot of the customers that come in the first thing out their mouth is "what kind of deal can u get me?" These are the customers that best buy wants to fire. they want to wheel and deal and try their hardest to get a few extra bucks off of something thats already on sale. They take the longest to get to buy something thing and yes it ends up costing Best buy money.
Best buy is not the best company in the world, but it is in the business to make money.
I fired BestBuy long before they could fire me!
Start a Co-op & own the store.
It's only because employees like you are willing to put up with that kind of managerial bs, that they can get away with it. Just ignore those ratbastard managers and do what you think is reasonable. Or tell him that he doesn't pay you enough for that (well, unless he does). If he fires you, you were better off working somewhere else anyway.
There are nice managers out there. You just have to find them. Some managers think they are God because they are paying you $6/hr. I would laugh at this but it is not at all funny.
Quite an experience to live in fear, isn't it? That's what it is to be a slave.
If you work in customer service and you believe that harassing customers about crap like PSPs is the proper way of going about your job, you seriously need a new job. I've worked in customer service for over 6 years, and now manage a store. If any of my employees ever treated a customer the way I'm reading in this thread about Best Buy customers being treated, that employee would be thrown out on their ass in no time at all.
Customer service is NOT customer harassment. They are two very different things. Good customer service/salesmanship is saying "we also have an extended service plan available which gives you these extra benefits (lists benefits). Would you be interested in finding out more about that?" Then, if the plan is well presented in a curteous manner, the customer may be interested in finding out more, and the sales rep can tell them more and get them signed up. If on the other hand the person doesn't want it, a good customer service/sales rep will back off, sell them the product, find out if there are any other items they may need ("do you need any cables to get that hooked up?" or "especially since you won't be covered by the extended service plan, you should be aware that the biggest killer of these widgets is power surges... do you have a quality surge supressor or UPS?"). Then the customer leaves well informed and having made a purchase, but feeling as though they were helped by a truly caring person instead of feeling harassed and pushed into buying something they didn't want.
You say you "see people all the time who enjoy getting pissed off at customer reps." Did you ever stop to consider that probably many of them have good reason? Yes I get the occasional inconsolable asshole in my store, but I probably have at most 1 or 2 pissed off customers every month.
All in all, customer service is what you make of it, and customers will typically treat employees much as they are treated by the employee. If the customers are treated with respect, they will typically treat the employees with respect. If the rep is rude and pushy, the customer will also be rude and pushy, to an extreme.
I think the company wants them to do it because its obvious if thats the way it is at all of these stores.
at least for electronic equipment. Why pay extra $$$ at a retail store so they can have salesmen, flashy color advertising, a physical store, etc.? Unless it is an emergency, or small stuff where S&H would cost more, I buy everything online and out of state. No tax and practically nothing for S&H. This always saves me at least 10% or more compared to retail prices. The only downside is having patience waiting for it to arrive, but so what? I cut my costs.
Honestly, if you want to play games with your customers, you are going to teach your customers to play games. It's like one day, these jokers are going to wake up and realize that hey, maybe it wasn't such a good idea to inflate the prices on 99% of your inventory so we don't lose money on the other 1% that is on sale this week.
This crap more than anything is pushing me to local independent and online retailers (which really can't move merchandise like this because there are no salespeople and a significatntly lower personal investment in travel/time). Forgive the analogy, but it feels like dealing with Microsoft Office for crying out loud! 25 features I don't need -- and now have to figure out how to turn off -- so I can make it work like the five-year-old version I wanted.
I don't know how any company stays in business by annoying their customers to death. As far as I'm concerned, every single one of these large national franchise chains can just take their stupid idiotic corporate policy shell games and shove it.
"Lawyers are for sucks."
- Doug McKenzie
Can you read? Each person asked repeadetly. Once should be enough.
Life's a bitch, then she kills you.
and not these corporate giants. Plus the local seller would love to have your business nowadays, whereas the large stores would "fire" you if they could.
If you submit a rebate then return something you never intended on keeping in order to pocket the rebate, you are for lack of a better term, a piece of shit. There are certain situations where the timing is just bad...you buy something and send off the rebate, they try it and decide you want something different and return it. Problem is they can't read your mind to know if it's scam or not. Apparently they can't electronically cancel your rebate, maybe they need that kind of linkage to the rebate center to solve the problem.
In the case of taking up a salesperson's time asking questions about a product when you were always intending to buy online or somewhere else...is so clearly ethically wrong it's beyond debate.
Clearly there is value in using a customer's historical data to make an evaluation...if the customer typically spends $1000 a year at your store, it makes no business sense to risk losing them over an occasional $50 dispute. Let them win. If there's a pattern of habitual abuse of your leanient return policy, then there's less of business case for pleasing them. At a big electronics retailer on the west coast I actually saw someone try to return a older model printer with no receipt, box or manual. Just walked in the printer, dumped it on the counter, and wanted their money back. Clearly the type of customer a business does not want sucking up the oxygen of good customers.
If I'm seeking data, I'll go the local univerisity. If I'm seeking wisdom, I'll go the local truck stop
I am fine being an asshole, but I usually only extend that courtesy to my friends :p
I will have you know, though, that not once did I raise my voice, insult the employees or take a smile off of my face. I very politely declined every offer to sell the PRP until I politely told them I wasn't spending my money there.
You see, when I get angry, I don't take it out on other people (especially undeserving ones like these employees). I may rant about it online, and I may never shop there again, but you can rest assured that I didn't raise my voice at these people.
"However," replied the universe, "The fact has not created in me A sense of obligation."
I know. I guess I didn't say it well enough in my grandparent post, but I did politely decline every offer for the PRP. My anger is certianly not directed at the sweet kids that tried to sell me the PRP, but the management (which is forced by the corporate office to do this).
I have worked in retail (and may again soon, damn economy), so I try my best not to take it out on those that don't deserve it.
"However," replied the universe, "The fact has not created in me A sense of obligation."
Which is why I love them. Retailers and manufacturers expect up to 60% of the rebates offered to never be filed, so they calculate the cost of their promotion at about 40% of face value. So I go after the heavily-rebated items and carefully track my rebates, setting up to-do alarms to remind me to check on a rebate. And there's a pretty good cottage industry of services set up to answer inquiries about pending rebates, so I make use of that, too. I see the whole thing as a tax on people too lazy to file their rebates on time - a tax that goes primarily right into my pocket.
If you mod me down, I shall become more powerful than you can possibly imagine.
I KNOW why they use rebates. I STILL think that they just need to simplify somethings by just OFFERING IT AT A LOWER PRICE. I was thinking if you reduce all the overhead on store specific rebates, then you may be able to charge everyone the lowest price in the first place.
I just want to post one HAPPY story in this thread:
This week I had had it with my iPaq. It started to get to be a pain in the butt to charge. Something was going bad in the sync connector you use to charge the device. I bought one of the final tap plans with it offered by Compusa that include things like ooops I dropped it and you walk in and they replace it deals. It's not what I would call a extended warantee, but assurance program that helps Joe Sixpack get more comfortable with new technology. ANYWAY, I took my reciept and iPaq in to CompUSA and they of course did not have the model I had (5555....has only been out a year and is already discontinued...not like Toshiba's who have a model they had just brought out 6 months ago and you already can't get it). Anyway, I had paid around 650 for the iPaq last summer(when it was first released). They only had about 4 or 5 models to choose from with Windows Mobile OS. One of these was the 4350. Only 2 or 3 things it does not have that the 5555 has. The manager felt bad they did not have a equal model so they gave me that one (which is just fine), a free new tap plan (one where I mail it in and they fix it or ship me a refurb if I drop it and kill it) and 100 dollar gift card. When they were ringing the replacement up, they also had a 50 dollar gift card rebate and I got that as well. The manager just really had to give me a replacement and nothing more and he gave me a deal I will probably never get again. It's things like this that make me want to go back to the store. Of course when you talk rebates though, CompUSA is definitely the KING of rebates. I have no problem with rebates, but here's the thing:
DO NOT ADVERTISE PRICE AFTER REBATES!
Cell phone companies are guilty of this as well. I won't say that I get suckered in, but people like my Mom do sometimes. My thing is....advertise the price I need to pay at the register. If you want to say there's a rebate on it in the ad, then do so, but don't make it like that's the price I am going to pay at the register. Also, if a customer ONLY buys during sales...that SHOULD tell you something. It should tell you your price is too damn high!
Best Buy, I have no problems with you keeping lists of customers who commit fraud, but please don't penalize me for waiting until you put something on sale.
Gorkman
Well here's the thing: I don't. Whenever posssible, I treat you exactly as I want to be treated. Damn thing is, eventually this reaches my manger, which eventually reaches the store manager, which eventually reaches faceless higher up and so on. The store works in waves. It starts off at the peak. You have to do this, this, this, and this. Over a couple of weeks in becomes lax, and then a few weeks pass and a few more, and after a while we're at "bottom" (which ironically is more ideal). All this consists of is you handing me your money and my selling you the product. After this goes on a while we'll get a report from some bigwig "YOU'RE STORE IS NOT ON PAR WITH THE COMPANY'S PLAN!!!" and a crack down will ensue until we're back at the peak. And the cycle will then begin to repeat itself, over and again. I have told the managers about their BS (The credit card/interest lie, or how I'm annoying the hell out a customer because of them) they'll smile repeat the bogus lie, and walk away before you can confront them any further. And I agree with you. I am DYING to quit. But I can't leave yet until I've secured another position.
Selling PRPs is typically the job of the operations team, that is customer service and the cashiers. Salespeople are suspossed to mention the PRPs but usually don't sell them.
While I agree with most of what you said I think it is important to recognize that customers aren't always right. Too often customers think they deserve more then they really do and demand services or discounts they have no right to. Customer service isn't about kissing ass but doing the appropriate thing. I think it is important to take care of customers and make things right. But I think it is not all right to bend over backwards for demanding, ungrateful or rude people.
Ahh... but you see I have been basically asked to harass people. "Here comes [standard managerial figure], go talk to that customer" "But I already did" "Go do it again then!" "Sir, did you need any help?" "I fucking told you the first time, NO." Or what about if the service your asked to push really just plain sucks?
They just opened a store up in Renton, worth the extra distance compared to Beast Buy in Tukwila.
Their salesmen are attentive, and the way they seem to have the departments set up is at least 10 salesmen at any given time. One salesman had to take off while I was perusing scanners, but that was understandable, since I was browsing for over 10 minutes.
Their checkout counters are incredibly fast and efficient as well. I'm sure in the cases of sales there may be more congestion, but on the last day of one sale (dual mode DVD-+R/W for $69, and 25 blank DVD-Rs for $17), I was in and out of the store within just 30 minutes (including drooling at their HD sets and drinking at the coffee bar).
Ahhh, the coffee bar. They have a decent coffee shop with *gasp* reasonable prices! Can you say root beer float with real vanilla ice cream for $2 and change? That alone makes the trip worth it.
Just because you can mod me down, doesn't mean you're right. Shoes for industry!
At the end of 2002, I was delighted to find a pair of CDJ-1000 CD players on sale at bestbuy.com for the ungodly low price of $800 and change each. I bought two immediately. Then I received an email indicating that they were revoking the offer. That's not allowed under the law, so I called them up and offered to file for fraud with the FTC.
They treated me like shit, and refused to honor the price. I filed against them at the FTC (yeah, a lot of good that did me--ho hum). I also demanded that they not process the charge on my card.
Not only did they charge my credit card, they double-charged it to the tune of $4000! Consequently, I spent the week Christmas 2002 with my credit card maxed out for a pair of turntables that I wasn't getting.
Obviously, Best Buy should be shot dead on the spot and dragged through the streets like the scum-sucking frauds that they are.
As an MBA student I think it's important also to point out that businesses with comprehensive cost tracking (which Best Buy certainly has) are very aware of the cost of attracting customers. That's right, getting customers costs money. If a customer costs more than they are worth, who's to say it's wrong for the firm to de-emphasize serving them?
It's their store. They have the right to serve whomever they wish (barring discrimination against protected minorities, of course.) If that offends you, you have the right to shop somewhere else.
I don't necessarily think it's a good idea to single out cheapskate customers, but I certainly don't think it's somehow immoral, either.
I (unfortunately) work at an Office Max, and we have some customers who habitually try to abuse the system. We have one person who buys a printer, then wants to return it just before the end of the return period. After, of course, using up ALL the ink. Needless to say we no longer accept returns from him. Another went through 5 Palm Pilots, in about 10 days. I'm not sure what she did to break them, but these are the only five allegedly "defective" Palms we had all year. It's hard to believe it was just bad luck. When she returned the fifth one we told her that we wouldn't take any more Palms back from her, she'd have to go through the manufacturer warranty if she bought another Palm from us and had problems.
Then of course there's the "vultures" who come in every Sunday (arriving about an hour before we open and banging and kicking the doors because we won't open early for them) and get everything that's "free after rebate". They'll get things like Hard Drives but don't even own a computer, they just plan to sell them. Thank God we stopped doing "free" stuff.
On the other hand, we are FORCED to try to sell protection plans (and lose hours if we don't sell enough) and pester people to buy extra stuff. It's one thing to offer a USB cable when they buy a 3-in-1, but we're supposed to do it if they just buy ink or paper also. That radio in our ear is "reminding" us all the things that could possibly be associated with whatever your buying. At my store, at least, we make some attempt to have only one sales droid pester any given customer, instead of all of us one after the other.
BTW, the best way to keep the sales droids away is to hold a cell phone to your ear and pretend to be having a conversation. It's far from guaranteed, but it will help. And mail in rebates are, IMO, just a way for the store to make interest off your money. That's why they take 3 to 4 months to send the check. Wait untill the specified product is sold out and you may get (if it's a manufacturer rebate, not a store rebate) the substitute item at the "after rebate" price at the register. I picked up a DVD +-RW for $60 cash that way (list was $199).
Open Source for Open Minds
I found this article and all the comments really interesting.
Last fall, I needed a new refrigerator and saw one in a Best Buy ad that was at a decent price and was really just what I was looking for. I like it pretty well and had made up my mind to buy it, but then the Best Buy sales staff entered. I didn't *even* get to the arguing about the extended warranty part before their general rudeness had so thoroughly alienated me that I told them "I changed my mind; your bad service and attitude just blew the sale for you" and walked out.
I then drove a few miles to Sears, where I found a fridge with all the same features, and free delivery (which made it the same price as the one at Best Buy), and the sales people were great.
Best Buy's staff is the best advertisement their competitors could wish for. That would have been my first time to buy at a Best Buy store, and now I will not set foot in one again. I wouldn't care if they were beating Fry's, Circuit City, and everyone else on the price of every item, I'd rather pay more somewhere else than buy from Best Buy.
They'll take anything you bought there back anytime, under almost any circumstances. You know why? Because enough customers respect that and buy there because of that to offset the abusers. As a business person, you should not be so narrow minded as to assume that ANY of your customers are scamming you.
Well usually each store has to sell so many psp or credit apps a day or week to they are penalized in the number of hours budgeted for the following month... I worked at target were we have to so many (25 a day) credit apps for the target visa or the store looses wages for the following month/week... This really sucks cause me and about 15 others went from 35hours to 12 cause they weren't getting enough out the door. Rarely is it ever the store fault they simply are trying to not get punsihed for not meeting a quota set by upper management in what it think it's reasonable number of object out the door each day. This is on top of having to meet a min sales number each day or getting punished again... and if your short in both for the year your budge for the following year is lower then that years so that means pushing less wage slave to more work in less time then is reasonable
My university's bookstore is called the Varsity Mart, affectionatly refered to as the Larceny Mart by students for overcharging on everything. Their computer/electronics section is roughly the size of the men's and women's bathrooms at Best Buy. HOWEVER, they somehow manage to massively undersell BB on cables. A 25 foot S-Video cable is one dollar more at the VMart than the 10 foot cable at BB, and the VM was "gold plated". However, the worst of the worst are Firewire cables: the lowly VMart undersells Best Buy by twenty dollars a cable.
Best Buy's prices suck unless they have a good rebate, and I only take those if they are the instant variety.
Laura Gainey, vice president of client segment strategies, said the bank's phone system sends certain customers to the front of the line, where they get the most experienced customer service representatives, depending on criteria that includes their account size.
So much for "Every customer is important to us."
The interesting thing about preferential treatment is when your on both sides of the prefered-nonprefered divide simultaneously. A few years ago when I was in Chicago I banked at First Chicago (now Bank One). I lost my atm card and I needed it replaced. At the time, I had fairly long hair and looked kind of scruffy. I went in to the bank and went up to the customer service guy and said, "I need to replace my atm card. I lost it."
He looks up, then goes back to his terminal and says rather gruffly, "There's a $10 fee.".
"Whatever."
"What's your name and address."
I tell him. Apparently my account balance came up, because all of a sudden he became REAL friendly. "Oh Mr. Surname! I'm so sorry you lost your card. We'll deactive that right away, and don't worry about the fee. Just try and keep better care of this one. Okay? Thanks for banking with us!"
My response? "Amazing how different you're treated based on your account balance."
The saddest part of this experience was the realization that they waved the fee for the people who could afford it the most, but don't for those that can't. Bravo.
Those employees are most likely being harassed even worse than you were by their managers over their PSP and PRP percentages.
The horror stories I've read and experienced myself as an employee in another chain of stores describe it well enough.
I tried every decent and legal way I could think of to resolve the issue w/the business before I rented the chicken suit
Call me un-American, but I like to pay cash. Helps stop that paper trail that all the various corporations like to generate, and I actually don't like owing anybody anything.
So I go over there around Christmas-time last year to buy some blank minidiscs. Unfortunately, they are the only people in town who sell them. Of the six registers they had open, only one could handle my cash transaction, so I got to stand and wait much longer than everyone else for that particular cashier.
You'd almost think they want you to charge it. Especially on your Best Buy card. With a minimum APR of 19.8%...
NO, I don't want to charge it.
NO, I don't want a Best Buy card.
NO, I don't want the extended warranty.
And, NO, I don't want my 8 free issues of whatever magazine you're trying to pitch this week!
What a load!
I have spent some time in retail, and I can easily say that there are "special" customers. The reality is very simple, without customers (demons and not), there would be NO Best Buy.
It is all too often I get into the conversation of "Where has the customer service ethic gone?" Well, it certainly was thrown out of the handbook at Best Buy (and many other establishements). These Stepford type sales people are absolutely the WORST, they will do/say anything to make a sale, it is no wonder they have "Demon Customers"
One major problem is the completely convoluted marketing practices. It is no wonder you have "gun shy" customers, because they (many retailers) are always working some angle on you. Everyone wants you to be a part of their "club", or sell you some Extended Warranty plan thats got so many gaps for them to wiggle out its like swiss cheese.
"No, I don't want a $10 extended warranty on my $2.99 ethernet cable, I'll take the risk"
Sales Person: "You do realize that if you are a member of our buyers club, you would receive an additional $2.00 off the price of this $5000 LCD, just fill out this form...by the way, have I talked to you about that warranty?"
Customer: "No thank you. I bought the warranty, remember?"
Sales Person: "Well now that you decided to take the warranty, how about the super duper deluxe warranty for just $100 dollars more?
Customer: "What is that?
Sales Person: "Thats the In-Store warranty that we actually honor, the other one is for tech support only, in India."
Customer: "I'll just take the standard warranty, thank you."
Sales Person: "Would you like to buy a $100 pre-paid calling card? It's a great rate! You can put it with your warranty information in the event you need to call tech support, it's in India you know"
Customer: "uhhh...Sure, thanks for the tip"
Sales Person: "I see you got the standard $29.99 installation kit, so you'll be needing a power cord since it doesn't come with one, but I'll cut you a discount on that. Should I put that on the warranty too, it's only an extra $5.00?
Customer: "uhh...sure"
Sales Person: "Do you have an Internet connection now, or do you need an installation CD?"
Customer: "I have DSL, why?"
Sales Person: "Great! you'll be able to download the new version of AOL dial-up service quick! It's a great service, and think about it, you'll be getting it FREE for 1 year and then it will only cost you $14.99 per month for the next 3 years and it's saving you $100 on this great TV!"
Customer: "Oh..Yeah, thats right.... Hey, this thing does do HD, right? How come it doesn't say so here on the box?"
Sales Person: "Oh, yeah baby, this thing has everything and if you have any problems, just give me a call, and I will help you out myself.
Customer: "Great, thanks again".
Later that day...
Customer(On the phone with Mgr):"Listen, could you help me out for a second, I am trying to find the HD connections on th---"
Mgr: "Sir,like our sales person informed you and our AD says, the sale model is not HD , I don't have time for this, but luckily you bought the warranty, just give our tech support a call!"
CLICK!
Manager: "Damn Demon Customers!"
If you penny pinch to find the best deal, try to price match or spend more than 10min with a sales rep, you are probably costing them cash.
To view the story from the other side of the fence, check out http://www.customerssuck.com
I always wondered why this complicated rebate exists in the US. Here in Europe there is no such thing. Exactly, why not just lower the price directly? But I think I don't understand, it must have something to do with artificially increasing their sales figures, and deducting rebate returns from their tax as advertisement costs or so. Can someone confirm this?
I have learned many things being a former employee for bestbuy, hence why I am a former employee due to the fact that i despised so many of their practices.
For starters, the best buy in brentwood tennessee, i have known the managers there to throw customers out or not let them purchase very large items in home theater if they were not willing to get the service plan, and this was a manager. This stuff happened all the time if people refused to purchase accessories or more stuff all over the store.
Second, I started working in the computer department, wanting to kill a day and get paid for it, i sat down and read the whole computer department training manual. I found out a few weeks later that I was the only person in the history of that best buy to actually fully read one of the training manuals, most of the time they dont even read them. In the computer department i would walk by and hear some of the most outlandish claims thrown out by salesmen, and most of them confided in me that they didnt know the first thing about computers, they only knew prices, not what was best for the customer. Lastly are the service plans. Best buy used to have a policy fo judging sales people by their service plan sales but it had been cancelled a few months before i joined. I would offer the service plan to those people and items I thought it would actually be useful on, mainly emachines since if they broke they had a policy of not trying to fix it but just replacing it with whatever model was equal to the price that person purchased theirs at, a hell of a deal if your pc breaks every 6 months. I had been talked to many times for not hawking the service plans extremely hard, even if the person obviously did not want one.
One final item, which may not be unusual for a corporation of that size, but still pissed me off. One of my friends working there completely destroyed his back doing lifting for them. A few days after his accident while he was working he was fired, due to some lame excuse about paperwork which no one does. Of course the friend filed suit but was constantly followed by a private investigator to make sure he wasnt doing anything that could be used against him in court.
Anyway, thats just my 2 cents from a former employee, I still purchase things there but usually only on sales.
They complained about scammers that send in the rebate and then return the item. RTFA, not just the last few paragraphs. They didn't complain about people who bought products and sent the rebates in.
They did complain about people that only purchased during big sales, which is kinda stupid. If you can't make a profit (albeit, slim) during a big sale, then don't mark the price down so much.
Tequila: It's not just for breakfast anymore!
Former BB Employee here... all of you should be sharing your experiences @ http://www.bestbuysux.org there are litterally thousands of complaints from customers and employess alike.. I'm one ofthem.
/. shares their stuff too, a point may be made.
Perhaps if
I frequent the Best Buy in Industry, California, and one day I stopped there to purchase some CDRs (this was a few years ago), and to check out all the usual new stuff. While I was standing at the tech section looking at memory, I heard an employee yell "HERE, CATCH!" and when I looked up, he was throwing a laptop that had been brought into service to another employee that was about 7 feet away. The receiving employee nearly dropped the thing and they had a laugh about it.
I don't know what the laws are in the rest of the country but what you speak about is illegal here in New York. The store has to honor the price on the item and if the store refuses you can call the police.
If the rebate is enough to make you care you can ensure you get it. Fill out all the forms and make a copy. Now if you know a notary that will help you out, or you want to go find one, get them notarized and THEN make a copy. Either way, send the orignals in certified mail, with return reciept. Here, you have a record they were delivered from the USPS, and a rebate centre is going to have a hard time claming they are lying.
When you do it like this, in most cases you'll get a rebate no problems. If they fail to send you one, well no problem. Sue them. This is why small claims court exists. No lawyers and cheap to file ($20 usually). File a suit for the rebate amount plus court costs. You have a certified mail reciept plus notarized compies, the trail won't even last 5 minutes, assuming it even goes to trial.
Remember: When companies fuck you, don't get mad, don't do something stupid (like cause trouble in the store), get even. The court system can, and does, work for the little guy. You just need to keep some documentation, and not be afraid to file.
For the last ten years, the big watch-word in IT was CRM - "Customer Relationship Management" - the idea that you had to really treat the customer right and constantly get in the customer's face with how wonderful a company you were so they'd all want to do business with you since you were such a great friendly place.
I knew it was a fucking joke the minute I read about it - because I KNOW management - and management's idea of CRM is dropping spyware on your computer so they can bombard you with crap advertising for products that don't work and nobody wants - and treating their employees - those people who are the front-line to their customers - like dirt.
"CRM" is a joke concept given the nature of business in this country (for that matter, in most of the world.)
The Corporation is NOT your friend any more than the State is.
Richard Steven Hack - This sig is TOO GODDAMN SHORT TO DO ANYTHING USEFUL WITH! MORONS!
Secondly, if you want attention from employees and can't seem to get it, there are two ways to guarantee a conversation with an employee. The first is to dress nicely (collared shirt, nice slacks, belt) and act really confused. They will see a person with money and little technical knowledge and will pounce. The second way to get attention from employees is to look kind of scruffy and act as if you are about to shoplift something. I promise that an employee will come right over and ask in a rather stern voice, "can I help you?"
The last thing that people seem to be bitching about is the salespeople pushing PRP/PSPs. There are a few ways to avoid this.
1. don't shower (this is a little gross)
2. act as if you don't speak English/or are deaf
3. wear a thinkgeek shirt (whenever I wear my Linux shirts I get A LOT more respect from the salespeople)
4. start to hit on to the salesperson.
5. inform them that you are allergic to "stupid" (and then start to cough)
6. just say yes to whatever they want you to buy, and then when you get to the register, don't buy it!
In a situation like this you go and pull out our cellphone (you likely have one), or if you don't have one go get another phone, and call the police. When it's all an video, it's all nice and clear cut. You would be amazed at what the threat of jail time can do to attitudes. Don't wait until later to get a lawyer or some such, call the police then and there. You may have to wait an hour or so (face it, getting pushed in a Best Buy doesn't rate as high on the list) but they will come, and if you press the issue, those repsonsible will be charged.
Stay away from the Blossom Hill - Winfield branch in San Jose, CA. The bank manager cares more about the new Starbucks store recently opened in the branch than customers. In fact, she told me so. The average customer's money is not worth anything to her. Luckily not all branches share this philosophy. Even the Consumer Market Manager couldn't believe this bank manager said that. I have since transferred my accounts to another branch (where I've never had a problem and the employees were always glad to accomodate my needs), where they (including that branch's manager) were also shocked by what she said.
Some of you may say, "Oh this person's just a *disgruntled* customer." I wish I were making it up, because it still sounds so outrageous to me. I related the full story to the Consumer Market Manager, as well as the bank manager (and account exec) at my new branch. And you might also claim my story is suspect since I'm posting anonymously. Well, BofA knows exactly who I am, they already know the full story, and they know how to contact me, so I'm not too concerned with whether or not joe slashdot can reach me -- there is no libel in this message.
Avoid the Blossom Hill - Winfield branch at all cost!
So use cash! If you don't use a card you don't get tracked! Sheesh! You yougins are stoopid!
Get in. Find what you want--make sure its not a ripoff. Most things are as they round up all their prices. How about a Radeon 7000 64MB for 100 dollars? But anyways, you simply have to get in fast, ahead of the salesmen. Get what you want, and then leave. If the cashier wants you to purchase a service plan, say NO. Like really no. They offered me a 2-year service plan on my MX510 logitech mouse--which COMES WITH A 3-YEAR WARRANTY. Bastards.
Like with MP3 players - if it doens't work the way it was advertised to work, I'm much more prone to break the damn thing and THEN return it - just because I don't want to pay 15% because I was lied to about the capabilities of the player.
feh. stuff.
Ok, since this is a Best Buy Bashfest, I'll spill my story (the short version).
Went into BB the day after Thanksgiving '03 to buy a doorbuster DVD for $20. 6am, got in, got the player, and was headed out. Guy at the door stops me, insists on seeing my receipt. I have always refused such requests (politely), just on principle (Don't treat your customers like shoplifters by default). Years ago, when I worked at Computer City, I was advised by the manager that while we could request to see receipts at door checkpoints, we had no entitlement to it. If someone refused, we had to make an instant decision if we really thought that they were a risk, and detain them for the police. He said if we detained, we better be right! Anyway, after politely refusing to show my receipt, I paused to dispose of my now-empty coffee cup in a nearby can, and when I look up, here's this guy again, now just inches from my face, and he has his hands on my package (the DVD, pervs!). I immediately requested the manager, my full intention being to show my receipt to the manager, and while we were both inconvenienced, to explain to her how offensive the checkpoint policy was. As soon as she approached me, she advised a nearby employee to call the police. I then released my grip on the package to retreive my receipt from my back pocket, when the employee decided he was going to snatch the box out of my hands. Well, since he didn't meet the same amount of resistance as he expected, his motion toward me was very exaggerated, and (this sounds funny, but just visualize it) in a downward motion, his head struck my hand. THey took my DVD player, and returned it to my credit card for me. (where I come from, we call that stealin'!). When the police arrived, I was charged with Battery. The police refused my request to review the Surveillance tapes, and just said to "tell it to the judge". I am still battling this thing, but I intend to win. The court offered me a simple $100 fine to plead guilty, but I have opted to pay the several thousand in attorney's fees to defend my good name (and to ensure that the status of my CCW permit is not affected). After several hearings where Best Buy has failed to provide the videotape that would corroborate my story, they have been threatened with Contempt of Court. Oh, and it is in the police report that the mgr on duty stated that there _was_ video coverage of the area in which the incident happened.
Lastly, It should be noted that what started the whole thing was an accusation of shoplifting, but when they found that they were mistaken, they fabricated the battery story just to show me who was boss. If anybody has any similar horror stories regarding the LV locations of BB, I'd love to hear them.
I had one of these 10-station Pelican switchboxes in my hand for video game, tv switching, etc. BB employee comes up and says he's got it and loves it. Asked me if I wanted the service plan and I said no, not for a $100 solid state unit. He then says, "oh, I've been through three of them already". Would you love a box you had to return a few times?
I failed to get my 2 last rebates from them. Two separate rebate applications and being careful to submit everything properly. So I don't buy stuff on rebate anymore and when it's off rebate either since it's artifically overpriced. So basically, there's a bunch of products I won't buy from them, ever.
your a fucking dildo.
A reprint of an April 30, 2004 Washington Post article is at http://student-voices.org/news/index.php3?NewsID=1 0915
Quotes from the article:
"The principal of a private high school in the District has accused the new Best Buy store in Tenleytown of discriminating against the school's black students by having them followed as they shopped, subjecting them to searches and, in one instance, letting in a group of young white students to shop but barring a group of young blacks."..."Jennifer Schwab, a representative of Best Buy's customer care office, wrote that she was "disappointed we did not meet your expectations when a couple of your students were shopping in our store." She provided no response to the specific allegations."..."The principal decided to go public with his complaint after he said his students were subjected to further discriminatory incidents, including one witnessed by another school official."
People do that online, too. My store has customers come in that say, "I can get this at $xx" online". Well, we don't do sales just to keep things simple, and our prices are always low as hell. We do have a few customers that point to loss leaders online from fly-by-night online companies, and if they bitch, I suggest that they buy that product there. Most of the time, they get screwed, and may even have the balls to come back whining to us. At that point, we don't really bother to help them. If price is the only thing that's important to them, then fuck them. We don't want them as customers. They can go buy their ultra-cheap shit online, and deal with the problems when they don't get it/can't return it/it's expired, etc. I completely agree in firing customers.
We also have customers who will ask us to special order stuff repeatedly, then decide that they don't want that item. Well, fuck them. No more special orders for them. We've lost several customers that way, and it's improved our bottom line!
Of course customers aren't "always right".
:). If they were always right the only reason for a consultant would be to shift blame (which does happen, but those jobs usually aren't nice).
Mine are closer to "always wrong", that's why they need me and I have a job
While they are wrong, customers should be treated with courtesy and respect as far as possible - like guests in your house (it's hard when they're stubborn idiots and have outstayed their welcome...).
But I don't see the big deal. Aren't there plenty of alternatives to Best Buy? Is Best Buy really cheaper or better after all that?
Think about it, if they give you so much hassle while you are _buying_ their stuff, how would you expect to be treated when you have problems with their stuff?
Doh.
Of course, that may be a luxury small businesses can afford and larger ones may run into logistical problems with. But, I see no problem with them refusing to serve certain customers. Best Buy's service will, in all probability, continue to suck...but then I can always refuse to do business with them as well.
.. the pony
there has to be a pony
Suchetha
learn from yesterday, plan for tomorrow, party tonight
or one out of three ain't bad
In my time at BBY, I saw many customers who would time up a salesman for hours at a time, only to buy a barebones eMachine.
These are the same people who will come back a day later to buy a $30 printer, and then the next day come back to bitch out a manager because the printer didn't come with a cable. This usually ends up with the customer getting a discount on the cable (which I admit is marked up very highly).
This customer then returns a month later demanding that a virus be removed from her computer for free, even though they haven't applied any Windows Updates, and such removal is not covered under any factory or extended warranty.
SmashTech - No smashing of tech involved
Best Buy offers rebates to screw some (mostly lazy) people... and in turn gets screwed themselves.
I think i'm one of those demon customers. I go in, install linux, (qnx once) on a whole row of computers and then ask a rep if I can get my computer like theirs (put on dumb face) Of course they eventually see that it was me and my friend and we get (literally) chased out of the store to avoid confrontation. The funny thing is, the second you stick an alternative os on them people seem to be more intrested with something they haven't seen before, and a few of them had people starting up snake and tetris.
Why?
Well, for starters the rebates,the rewards programa and the warranty policy.
For instance I purchased a laptop for $1300 once I took the 10 minutes out of my day to fill in,copy the rebtes and send the rebates, I paid $1000. With the cash I would be saving from the rebate I purchased the warranty. The clerk said "if you bring it in 3 times we'll replace it". OK.
I purchased my washer/dryer intrest free for 18 months with $100 3 year warranty.
So far in 7 months I have received $500+ in rebates.
$150 120GB HD - Free after rebates and reward zone points from the washer/dryer.
When I go to Best Buy I alreadr know what I am going to buy but for fun I'll let the sales clerk think I have't a clue and want the "most expensive because it's the best". Then I say thanks and go and purchase what I intended to buy.
So, I must be one of the customers that should be "fired".
I like-a do-the cha-cha.
I have worked in customer service all of my working life, I am excellent at it. In my many years of experience I can confirm one thing as a hard fact NO CUSTOMER IS EVER RIGHT. No business has ever held a gun to a customers head and forced them to use their product, service, or retail outlet. You, the customer, have options EXCERCISE THEM dont be lazy and bitch at me about a product or service you chose to purchase from a business you chose to patronize. No business has to suck up because their will always be other customers.
Your dignity, nigga.
Target and Wal-Mart do the same things at their font ends. If your not making your goal for the day for pushing Target Visa's or Wal-Mart Visa's, the managers yell and scream at their front end staff. Their jobs are on the line if they don't make their goals for the week. Its a bunch of crap. Who in their right mind would sign up for a 24% Interest store credit card? Not me!
Besy Buy sucks! My wife bought the extended wty. for her computer. This was before we ever started dating. When the machine had problems we took the machine back in and they would not honor the wty.
Oh we found nothing wrong with the cd rom drive that you said intermittantly works. You owe us $70 bench fee. Ive never steped foot in a best buy since then.
Since then I said I was sick of getting ripped off. I now have means to protect myself against garbage like this.
http://www.prepaidlegal.com/hub/cyannella
"Rebates are a practice I tolerate because I have no choice - and usually take months for the cheque to arrive - and oh yeah, the bank will charge you a service fee to deposit - another 50-cent insult..."
If you stay with a bank that charges 50 cents everytime you make a deposit, you really are an easy customer that Best Buy would want.
Chain stores (like Best Buy) often do things specifically to drive their smaller competition out of business, like have really good sales. Then they say the customers are evil for taking advantage of those very sales.
Can I mod something +1 Scary if it's true but I wish it weren't?
Guy at the door stops me, insists on seeing my receipt.
You're still on their property, and I think they have a right to monitor what is leaving their store. It's not like they searched your pocekts or anything.
The mentality that says, "I'm insulted if I have to participate in security screening" bugs the crap out of me.
Evil is the money of root.
...there are clueless salespeople, and there's clueless customers. Yet there's a big difference between "smart" shoppers (buy stuff only on sale, no extras/warranties/use all rebates) and "abusive" shoppers that make unreasonable demands, suspicious returns, hold up all your support time etc. Or maybe instead of "smart", I should say "fair", since I've seen people spend lots of time/fuel to save a few bucks.
I'm a smart shopper. I know what I want, usually spend a minimum of time in the store (unless there's something I need to actually examine in-store), and rarely throw in unplanned extras. My mom is an abusive shopper. More often than not, the salesperson/manager will stonewall because of her behaviour. And it is of course the store's fault that they can't deliver yesterday at sub-cost prices.
I've never met the really annoying pushy sales person - mostly because most shops here are thinly staffed (Norway has some of the highest labor costs in the world). Waiting in line though, that happens. Clueless salesmen or salesmen trying to sell more expensive products / add-ons yes, but they immidiately take a clue if you're not interested, without having to repeat yourself.
I suppose it is a cultural thing. Either that, or I'm not in the target group for having stuff pushed at me. I certainly haven't experienced anything like what you people in the US describe Best Buy like...
Kjella
Live today, because you never know what tomorrow brings
On a few a occasions I've purchased discounted eMachines computer bundles from BB to discover that a few rebate receipts were missing. When I went back and told them to fix it they're response was that such and such component was out of stock and that the replacement which they didn't tell me about, did not have a rebate. My response has always been a polite "Well that's not my problem, you need to get me the rebate" and they've always written me a store check for money (not a gift card) for the rebate amount.
OK so it's a pain to go back to the store and have to haggle with them but they've always made it right.
But they send your materials back, after the submission date
Nice
We still believe in the state protecting the weak from the abuses of the strong. But then I remember that those American business practices have already substantially eroded our culture. How long will this one last? How long will it be before we lose all that and have to beg to be allowed into a store promising to spend whatever the manager deems appropriate.
--
USA: home of the world's largest terrorist training camp.
If BestBuy is so annoyed with the rebate thing then why is it EVERY Sunday I get a flyer with pages and pages of products with *"Price after Rebates" attached to the price?!!!
Of course I am going to buy it if it's on sale. That's what sales are for!!
I like-a do-the cha-cha.
This was pretty radical stuff back before 1998 - then Peppers & Rogers began pushing it in the CRM space.
Of course, this has nothing to do with CRM products like siebel, vantive, etc. But instead has everything to do with methodology - in this case Relationalship Marketing. In this methodology Peppers & Rogers are the thought leaders:
http://www.1to1.com/home.aspx?ItemID=548
As far as bestbuy identifying their worst customers. That's fine, nothing really that wrong with it. It will probably just result in them *not* sending promotions, sales info, etc to those customers.
Best Buy can kiss my arse. I received the worst possible customer service from them, the one and only time I went in to buy a keyboard. So I blacklisted them accordingly and never went back. Having read this, well, there's nothing more I can do after blacklisting them.
or who buys only during big sales
If you're going to complain about people only buying during sales, then don't have big fucking sales! Is that so hard to understand?
Which lunatic thought of that?
Last December Best Buy had some XBOX games on their website for $5 a piece. I ordered a few from the list that looked interesting. It turns out that the pricing was a mistake, and that some people abused it by ordering one copy of every game that was mispriced. Best Buy's solultion: cancel most, but not all orders. When I called to find out what was going on I was informed that among other things bestbuy.com reserves the right to cancel any order for any reason, and that their customer service reps do not report to anyone (i.e. I could not talk to a supervisor.) This ended up being such a fiasco that they gave customers who ordered one of the games a limited time coupon, but even that took a lot of complaining. It is clear that they don't care much about the customer, but then what do you expect from a "big corporation." The only reason I'll shot at Best Buy any more is when albums are on sale, and I'd love to see them tell me that I can't buy only sale items any more.
The real problem behind this is that they know enough of you to tell that you are a bad customer/scammer. Each store has customers they want to get rid of, and there is nothing wrong with that, as long as they call each other by the first name.
What scares me is customer profiling. What this guy says is nothing less then not giving the best offers to some people, because they know who they are from the IP, phone numbers, e-mail, AND their record.
A few years ago I was refused to get a pizza delivered for me when they heard the address. I never thought this would be normal business practice, but the time is near.
Customers are NOT always right. But then, neither is Best Buy.
You see? You see? Your stupid minds! Stupid! Stupid!
These service plans specifically exclude things like "negligence" (or in your cage, sabotage). Manufacturer warranties also don't. So if you're going to intentionally break something, you better do it in a very very non obvious way.
The solution is simple. Pay with cash, the ultimate privacy tool. Don't get "shopper club" cards, and pay the price difference (our supermarket here, Farmer Jack, has actually ditched requiring them for savings). Anybody who pays with a credit card should know their transactions are logged, and I see nothing wrong with that. After all, that costs the retailers money; the least they can do is get some return on it.
What the hell?! I'm a 'demon customer that should be fired' because I demand and search for the cheapest price, with the result being that I typically shop during sales?! Would you rather not have my money AT ALL, because I'm more than happy to oblige.
Thanks to me, a link via email to this story is making the rounds to my colleagues, under the subject line "Something to keep in mind during your next trip to Best Buy...", with instructions to pass the email on. How do you like that, Best Buy? If businesses keep these sorts of tactics up, they will find their customers increasingly reluctant to spend money at all. Then where will these companies be?
I swear, what he says is true. People just don't read signs anymore. You could have it in size 72 font with no conditions applying, and people would still screw it up. I've had someone ask me where a product was, when the sign saying where it was was directly behing my shoulder!!! That, and people only want to hear what they want to hear.
If you are implying that black people scam best buy more than whites, you're probably mistaken.
Things like rebate scams and false exchanges typically are perpetrated by younger middle class white adults. (17-30s) Smash and grab or simply run out of the store with something seems to be done by mainly black males between 15-30.
This is from my retail experience.
I don't think your experiences are uncommon, Americans are used to and expect that kind of treatment. The perception from American customers is basically "I don't care how nice you are to me, as long as the food doesn't suck." There is a level of service expected, but its below what I've experienced in foreign countries.
... not in a thousand years.) My girlfriend and I actively avoid buying things at these stores. We go out of our way (and pay a little extra) to shop at our local neighborhood pharmacy, despite its lower selection, and we use Peapod to have our groceries delivered (initially to avoid dealing with the dehumanizing experience of being treated as vermin by a minimum-wage earning illiterate jackass at Jewel, now for the convinience of never facing lines at a checkout).
Or he may have visited large American cities.
I live and work in Chicago, and as an American who expects exactly what you describe (a bit of surliness at the diner if the waitress has had a long day, or a casual 'here you go' when someone brings out one's food in a more casual restaraunt) I can tell you that the staff at most of the stores (Jewel, Osco, Wallgreens, etc.) is absolutely appalling. Rudeness to redefine the term. You are a bug in their dirty ointment, a smear on their windshield as they assault their way through their workday, a worm to be despised.
In short, they feel (from their point of view, they "know") they are entitled to their job, they are entitled to their pay, and your presence as a paying customer needing service is an irritant they shouldn't have to endure simply to get the paycheck which is their God Given Right(tm). Spoiled, arrogant, entitlement children (many of adult age).
Buying groceries, you will be lucky if any words are spoken to you beyond "Ninety five thirty one." ("...is your total" is optional and generaly left off. As for "please", "thank you", or even a gruff "hello"
Smaller cities and towns have less of this in my experience, but in downtown Chicago civilized service, much less polite service, is virtually unheard of outside of the high-end department stores. (Restaurants are the exception, as they are working for tips. But go to a McDonalds or Wendy's and you'll discover just how quickly you become a worm once again.) What is even more appalling than the fact that these people do not get fired for this behavior (indeed, some of them, based upon their skills, should be unemployable without serious remedial training, and perhaps shock therapy), is that so many people are quite willing to give the businesses their money anyway.
The Future of Human Evolution: Autonomy
The large chain store my wife used to work at would "trespass" people (inform them that they are not welcome in the stores; if they insist on coming back they can be arrested).
Of course, they would only do this if you were a thief, fraud returner, abusive to employees, etc. You had to be a *real* shit to get that treatment. But this isn't really a new idea; just easier maybe to determine when it makes sense to do, and easier to enforce, with today's technology.
I admit, I didn't RTFA but as far as data mining goes, can't you just refuse to give your phone number? I was @ Best Buy this weekend and just said No when she asked for my number. Of course, that's not to stop them from tracking my sales via Credit Card. Then there's the Best Buy Credit card I have. Damn. Let the mining begin.
----
Spam subject of the moment: Offshore account secrets -nashville disrupt
Unfortunately I was once a Best Buy employee and didn't like it. It wasn't that you were mistreated as an employee but you were just mentally abused by all the bullshit. Every morning you'd go to work and have to watch a movie and/or listen to a long speech of how terrible the "team" was doing. I got so tired of hearing the word team that I was ready to hit someone by the time I left.
Thing is though, after a while it doesn't just settle in. It nags at you worse as time goes by. I don't think it's the managers' fault though. They have a job the same as I did and they were just relaying their orders on to the employees. I don't know who to blame but it's rediculous how much they push you to sell the service plan.
You think the service plan is bad though? It IS! However, you should also take into account of all the other miserable means of sales you have to go through. There is a "process" in which you are required to sell things. This entire process is what you had to watch in those movies in the morning.
Anyway, you were required to great the customer, shake their hands, introduce yourself and your name, ask the customer his/her name, little small talk in between (even though they didn't "advertise" that), ask them lifestyle questions, find out what they were into, match them up to things that fit the style of the person (which never worked), start the sales pitch on the service plan or replacement plan early in the conversation. After getting the sale you were then required to "attach" at least 2 accessories because a sale isn't a sale unless they get the complete package. After that you were then required to try and finish them off on the service plan.
Upon succeeding or failing on the service plan sale you were then required to do even more. Now it's time to pitch the sale of services and subscriptions. That includes DirecTv, Satellite Radio, NetFlix, Msn, Comcast Cable, Reward Zone, Magazines (which were just coming into play as I quit thank god), and Rhapsody. Of all those mentioned, the only one worth a damn was Reward Zone. NetFlix was cool but it wasn't for everyone yet we were chewed out because of that. Satellite Tv and cable internet were things that most people already had or they didn't want anyway.
It's just a shame that Best Buy is the way it is. I told them the day I started working there that I loved their store. I also told them I was coming to work because I loved the environment and how things worked and that it wasn't because of the money. The day I left I told them that I wish I had never worked there because it made me hate the store with a passion that I'd have never had, or at least not for a good while anyway.
So the moral of my rant here is that Best Buy employees aren't always the prime reason of hte problem. You guys will never understand the pressure they put on you to sell something and how low they run you into the ground mentally if you don't get the sale their way.
It seems to me that slashdotters always get the end of the stick in every situation! Whether it is the quality of customer service they receive at a well-known store, or they registry magically dissapearing on their "relative's" windows box. I virtually live at Best Buy, Circuit City, Sears, and any other store which satisfies my needs to see the latest and greatest devices out there. In all the time I have spent in these places, I cannot remember a single time experiencing, or witnessing employees bombarding me or anyone else with sales pushes.
I know this post was about BB, but in general the customer is NOT always right. Having worked in retail I can say that some customers come in and make scenes and argue and threaten just to get something for free. Some customers seem to make it a game to push the very limits of what they can get away with. They'll try to haggle with you, assuming wrongly that prices are flexible. I'm sorry, but prices are as posted! If you want to haggle, buy a used car. I swear these people would try to talk a dollar off the price of bread and milk at the local grocery store!
Nope. Customer's are not always right.
Not Best Buy, but CompUSA.
I was having a computer repaired. The woman and her husband in front of me were arguing viciously with the manager that they should be able to buy a memory card that was on sale two days prior at the sale price.
She was in a wheelchair, she was vulgar, abusive, played the pity card, etc. Her husband was no better. They even lied that they had called in and the "manager" had told them they could. (note: she was talking to said manager)
The manager wouldn't budge.
I was amazed and amused at the gall these assholes exhibited and watched as the worked their way out of the store and through the parking lot. Making *very* sure everyone saw how upset the poor, crippled woman was.
Upshot. When they got back to their truck, the "crippled" woman got out of her wheelchair, picked it up, and TOSSED it into the truck .
I told the manager what I'd seen and all he could do was shake his head.
And people wonder why retailers come to despise some people.
This coming from a dwarf tosser.
Clue: tipping is really not optional. While you may subscribe to the tightwad's notion that it is, rest assured that you are wrong.
In case you didn't know Aussies are generally regarded as vying for the lead in assholedom.... slightly edged out by the French. (Atleast the French tip.)
Perhaps you should ask yourself why you had more problems in one week than I have in a year. The common denominator in your experience is you.
And they say Americans have a false sense of entitlement. From your post sounds like we aren't the only ones....
PS Atkins is for fatties who rue the thought of jogging 20 minutes a day.
I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
He'd describe the mascots and the slogans and so on, and I was convinced it was some sort of surreal ghost of a Chinese History class, about the "cultural revolution." Nope, just a bunch of guys trying to sell a TV, with Monster cables for the DVD player. Whacky.
(Once before the Christmas rush at one of the book stores I worked at, we were subjected to a superbly inane video about service at gas stations causing word-of-mouth sales. Um -- that'd be self-serve in 99.5% of all cases; you're wanting us to learn to deliver perky service from the guys at Holiday Station??)
"Fundamentalism" isn't about divine morality. It's about human authority.
Maybe if Best Buy actually had enough helpful sales people, they would make more money. I've walked out of Best Buy at least three times because I was unable to get help.
I wanted to buy a Radeon 9800 Pro there a while back (When CompUSA had them for $200, which was even cheaper then Newegg's price for a built by ATI radeon. I was gonna have them price match it), and they called CompUSA to determine if they had it in stock before they matched their price. What the heck is that? Why would I even be buying it at Best Buy if the CompUSA across the street had it in stock, with $30 rebate (They wouldn't include that, but it was still really cheap)? And technically, what kind of difference would that make to them? It seemed more like bad PR to me then anything else.....
In undeveloped countries, the consumer controls the market. In capitalist America, the market controls you.
Or Play Station Portable...
Glad someone else caught that.
Come on the financial community is based on the better customer philosophy.
Actually even good customers get better deals, you pay all your bills on time, and have a good credit rating, you pay less interest.
My old ISP I told them to read my customer log and got transfered to the more senior techs, I'm sure someone else on slashdot has used this to get past the reboot clones.
Many banks/advisors give different and improved service if you have 'at least XXX in investible assets."
How going to a car dealership with a friend. One of you buy a nice expensive luxury car, the other a used economy car. Come back within the warranty period with a complaint about a rattle or something small, guess who gets better service.
That being said I bought an economy car, but I get first rate service. Unfortunately I hear this is a rare experience.
After a few more problems with the way BB treats its customers I don't shop there anymore. There is a Circuit City right across the street.
My family has had several great experiences with Circuit City. We bought an open-box big screen TV (for a good bit less than a new one), which promptly broke a week later. As frustrating as that was, Circuit City delivered a brand new one the next day, at no cost to us. When this same TV broke again a few years later (bad model, i suppose) we called in to have it serviced under the extended warranty. Also another poor experience at first, as the repairman seemed relatively clueless and couldn't fix the TV, but a few weeks later when the TV still hadn't been fixed, Circuit City gave us store credit for the full price (unopened box) of the TV when it was new. That let us upgrade our 4:3 standard resolution TV to a bigger 16:9 HDTV for something like $60 more.
As much as I hate those 'extended warranties', Circuit City's definitely turned out in our favor.
I was at Best Buy one day when my friend shoplifted behind my back, and now I'm perma-banned from Best Buy, you know what, FUCK THEM! Circuit City is cheaper anyway, and nicer too, and you know what else? Fuck asshat cops, because they are fucktards who are DAMN PIECES OF SHIT. FUCK THE MOTHERFUCKING SYSTEM DAMNIT!! I didn't do anything wrong, fuck them to hell. I would like to state, I have applied for a JOB there only a short two weeks before! WHY THE FUCKING HELL WOULD I SCREW UP A CHANCE FOR A JOB?! I mean, I'm still unemployed...
Karma: Good, or bust!
I just thought I'd point out that all retailers' insurance policies aren't as crappy as Best Buy's. A friend of mine bought a video card (one of NVidia's) at CompUSA and got the insurance plan. Not only did it cover product failure, but it entitled the owner to free upgrades if a new card became available. Well, it did and he got a brand new, several hundred dollar, NVidia card for his old one.
What about demon retailers who only have the mail in rebates because they know less than 1/2 the people send them in. If a few buy get the rebate then return, more power to them.
About 6 months ago, bestbuy.com had a deal - buy the Tenacious D DVD, get a free four-song EP with unreleased tracks. Considering the DVD was selling for less than I had paid for their full-length CD (and it was a 2-DVD set at that), I ordered it, and decided to pick up the DVD at the store that night and have the CD shipped to me.
When I picked up the DVD, the spindle inside the case they gave me was broken, and as a result, one of the discs was so horribly scratched I couldn't play it. "No problem", I thought, "I'll just return it as a defective item and get a new copy." The customer service rep I dealt with said that because I ordered the DVD online, they'd have to void the sale, charge the price back to my card, then create a new sale, but the end result would be the same - I'd get an unscratched DVD. They even let me open the box right there to insure that the discs were OK. So I went home, new DVD in hand, and was happy.
A few days later, when I was checking my credit card online, I noticed the original charge from bestbuy.com, and an additional $17 charge dated the next day. I called their customer support, and was told that since I voided the sale of the DVD, they were charging me full price for the EP. I spent about half an hour on the phone arguing about Best Buy's return policies (she suggested that I should've shipped the DVD I picked up at the B&M store to them at my expense in order to get the replacement), then asked to speak to her boss. Of course, he was unavailable, but I got his name, direct phone number, and a promise that he'd call within 24 hours.
I never did hear back from the manager, but after leaving him a voice mail (where I used phrases like "never shop with you again" and "I will call the Better Business Bureau"), I got the ridiculous price of the EP refunded.
I've never had a problem with the staff at the B&M stores, but it'll be a cold day in hell before I buy from their website again.
Yes, but if you don't file the rebate almost immediately you won't get it at all.
The companies bring this on themselves. I'd love to just have the store drop the price at the time of purchase.
1. Those damn rebate slips!
2. Constant pressure to buy useless extended warrenty, even when I tell them in plain English that I don't want it.
3. After purchasing a washer and dryer at Best Buy and paying to have them installed, after three attempts of coming to my house they were still unable to get the darn thing installed. (First time they broke my exhaust hose then proceded to leave a big stinking dump in my bathroom, second time didnt have necessary parts and didnt know what parts I needed to purchase to make it work, etc). In the end, I installed it myself with a couple friends.
I wish they'd stop trying to pitch me crap like game hintbooks and Netflix and all of that bullshit of the week offers that they always get. I just want to zip in and zip out with my stuff with no hassles. I always get stopped about 3 times on my way to the DVD or video game section.
Everyone hates mail-in rebates. Get rid of them, problem solved!
If they have "fired" any customers just for purchasing only during sales, they are going to be in deep legal trouble. Those customers were doing business with the store on the terms that the store advertised. They can probably sue and get a court order requiring the store to do business with them. That suit can be filed as a class action. Once that happens, getting rid of the customers who are an actual problem, such as the ones who are verbally abusive to clerks and the ones who return everything, is going to become much more difficult.
In the end, a store is not a public place. They can refuse to do business with customers they deem abusive. But when the store has set the terms and the customers respond by purchasing sale items, those customers are manifestly not abusive on those grounds.
"Do not mention the fucking PSP again, this is abusive, I have stated clearly 3 times that I am uninterested and have also kindly asked you to simply just stop talking to me about it at all. You don't seem to get it. Here can you understand this "I don't want the fucking PSP"
Rule #1: Never drop the f-bomb. It gets you noplace and changes the basis of the conversation. Forty years ago, it was shocking and people would react by surrendering. Today it just makes them angry and you immediately lose any opportunity to win the argument.
I bought UT2004 a few months back ago, and they automatically ring you up for free issues to either Sports Illustrated or Entertainment Weekly.
They bill it as "free issues for x weeks" when actually it's "Free issues for a few weeks, then they start auto-billing you". Who in Best Buy marketing thought that was a great idea? I instantly canceled as soon as I got home.
I think the next time any BB employee tries that I'm going to just grab the slip from them before they scan it in. I honestly don't need more shit charged to my CC.
I quit.
... my mother would never be able to buy another galon of milk. She regularly uses coupons with sales to buy $50 worth of groceries for under $10. Once in a while the store winds up "owing" her money (though of course they never pay)! Yes I realize that the stores get money back for the coupons, but still.... If sales make a company unprofitable, then they just shouldn't have sales. Don't blame the customers.
On the other hand, those who buy, file for rebate and return... Something needs to be done about that. How about a database that the product company can check and update before sending out the rebate, and the store can check and update before accepting the return?
I bought a camcorder for my wife. By the time I gave it to her, and she wanted a digital camera instead, it was too late to return it. It was unopened and they would not take it back for refund/exchange/store credit/ or with restock penalties...Argggggggggg..
So, it sucks how they try to shove the PSP's up your ass like that, but they *are* pretty good service plans.
Yup, for some products these plans (Best Buy's and others) can be VERY good. For example, the Radio Shack service plans for cell phones include battery replacements. If you've every had to replace one of them, you know that they cost at least half as much as the phone's list price. But for 10-15% of list price you can buy a three-year service plan that offers you a brand new battery every year. Given the lifetime of some batteries, this is a major win.
I have no problem paying a little more if I get good, knowledgable service.
UNIX/Linux Consulting
If you call the police you are elevating the situation. Then it becomes you against the employee, the coworker and the manager.
You'll find out some of those cameras aren't taped (fun).
If you try to sue, you won't get squat because you didn't minimize your damage.
"The situation was getting hostile, and you didn't just leave to avoid it getting worse? WEll I really wanted the TV", it doesn't take Judge Judy to guess what happens next.
Really did you need this TV so bad right now that you needed to put up with this crap? Why not pay a few bucks more and go to a reasonable merchant.
We just ordered a table and chairs. The sales guy was really pushing the "fabric protection" crap that they spray on for another $45. I declined several times and he went ahead with the sale. We were sitting on a couch waiting for him to do paperwork when the store manager came by and said "whenever someone declines the fabric protection I have to find out why." We explained that we don't feel the need. I said I'd get it if they waived the sales tax (which they do for larger purchases). They ended up taking off 3 percent (tax is 6) which made it about the same price WITH the fabric protection. I spent the whole trip home trying to figure out why that's so important. My conclusions is the manager must get a bonus for selling this stuff and did so at the stores expense in this case - We paid the same price and got the stuff in addition to what we were willing to take home for that price.
I agree completely. I recently moved to the DC area from Ottawa to be with my partner for a year. This is my first time living in the US, and I have to say that I've been quite surprised by the differences in customer service.
The best example I can think of is in shopping experiences at Home Depot. I know two managers of two Home Depot stores up in Ottawa, and they have a strict employee policy that if a customer asks you where an item is, you have to immediately stop what you're doing and take the customer to that item (or find a customer service representative who knows, and have them take the customer to the item). I was expecting that this was probably a policy for the entire chain, but I was definitely shown to be wrong - twice I had to ask for the location of an item here at a DC store, and both times, the salesperson, who barely spoke English (and then, instead of speaking slowly so I could understand him, just barked at me when I asked him kindly to repeat himself) shoved me off: the first time, the salesperson shouted, "Aisle 5" (which I couldn't understand the first two times he said it), and the second time, appallingly, I was told, "I don't know" and the representative proceeded to run off without even looking back.
I know, from my manager friends, that you'd get fired in a second for such behaviour up in Canada, and the reason that Home Depot is doing so well up in Ottawa is because it's customer service is far superior to the old Canadian chains.
Another prime example is fast food. About eight years ago, back when I was a teenager, I used to work at McDonald's. As a cashier, we had an obligation to be friendly and would receive negative documentation in our employee file if we didn't greet customers with a smile and a welcoming phrase. Admittedly, these days, the service in Canada has gone down, but the majority of cashiers still seem personable. I've been to both Chipotle and McDonald's here in DC, and at both locations, the cashiers looked very unhappy to see me, like I was more of an annoyance than their responsibility.
It just makes me wonder if I've had bad luck or if this is a trend, and if it is commonplace, why you Americans don't demand better treatment and service from businesses. You're paying good money and certainly deserve it.
...but not when a business does it?
... fundamentally they're out to cheat us," Selden said in a telephone interview. "It's not a large number of customers, but they can have a material impact on a business."
"Then there are those customers that are just evil customers
Why isn't this type of predatory behavior only called on moral grounds when businesses do it? I don't see anyone calling cell phone, or banking institutions evil for invoking ungodly amounts of fees.
Remembering that you are going to die is the best way I know to avoid the trap of thinking you have something to lose.
The state governments like rebates also. They get the sales tax on the full amount of the sale.
If it were a discount instead of a rebate, they would get less tax revenue.
Leon's furniture.
The Brick furniture.
Radio Shack.
All of them try and upsell you on worthless warranties. I know personally that Radio Shack gives much higher commissions on the extended warranties, which is precisely why the salesmen are so damned pushy with it.
I also find it moderately funny that this topic shows up just 1 week after I walked out of Leon's after refusing the "extended fabric care package" on a couch I purchased. The exchange between myself and the salesman:
Me: "I'll take this couch."
Salesman: (blurb about how great the protection package is.) "So do you want it?"
Me: "No thank you, I'm not interested."
Salesman: "You realise you're buying a hamburger without the bun, eh?"
Me: "That's OK, I'm not interested, thank you."
Salesman: "What're you going to do when you stain it?"
Me: "I won't stain it, and besides, I have family that does professional fabric cleaning."
Salesman: "Well are they going to replace it when you stain it and it can't be removed?"
Me: "I'm leaving. I'll shop elsewhere."
I wrote an angry letter to head office, they called and asked about the situation. I explained it to them. Their response: "We actually train our salespeople to be like that."
I've spent $5k at Leon's in the 3 years I've been living on my own, and will never spend another dime there again.
It's a sad day when the consumer can't go somewhere, buy something they like, and leave without being bothered.
My wife is a waitress who works very hard and provides great customer serice. Liquor laws are so stringent in the US that you can get fined in some places for not asking to see ID no matter how old they are. I'm not kidding, I've seen a guy who was obviously past 60 have his beer taken from him at a retail store because he couldn't produce ID. Anyway, a waitress who is making $2 an hour or a clerk who is making $7 can't really afford a $1500 fine for not asking to see some ID. Don't take it personally, they probably feel like an ass for asking.
As far as typically rude service is concerned. A lot of that depends on where you are in the US. Urban areas will tend to be worse than your rural areas. People in the south have a tendency to be more polite. I remember years ago I took my wife to Florida for a vacation. She's from Maryland and I grew up in the south. We stopped for a couple of burgers at a fast food place and the girl behind the counter was very pleasant. This prompted my wife to turn to me and ask, "Why is she being so nice to me?". Having lived in the DC metro area her whole live she was completely unaccustomed to having friendly service and thought something was up. I had the opposite reaction when I moved up here. I was completely unaccustomed to the frequently rude service.
Also be sure to tip well if you get good service. Wait staff in most places in the US get paid less than minimum wage(under $3 an hour in Virginia) and have no health benefits. They work for the tips and it's hard work, especially when you consider that a lot of people don't tip. Three groups of people have reputations for not tipping well, foreigners, blacks and orientals. Of course not all of the people in these demographics are poor tippers but the majority of them tip poorly. Sometimes wait staff will not work as hard for people they think are going to tip poorly. Another thing that seems to be true of the poor customers in other areas, the poor tipper also has a tendency to be the most demanding customer. It sucks pretty bad to bust your ass for a demanding customer and then receive a crappy tip or no tip at all.
Just some things to think about.
In case you weren't aware, Best Buy makes at most 1 to 2% on the products they sell. It's why they are often just as cheap as Walmart. They make their money on the service plans, which is why you have to put up with it. If you realize this before you go in you'll be fine.
When someone asks you if you want to buy the service plan, say (in your politest voice): "I don't want a fscking service plan." They won't ask again. If they do, drop it and leave, come back some other day.
I didn't have a specific incident like you did, but I got fed up with their "service", and stopped shopping there. I pass their store every day, and they're the only good place for music and movies in 20 miles or so, but I don't shop there.
The funny thing is, I'm an "angel" customer. I never talk to the salespeople, except to make a purchase. The only thing I ever returned was a refrigerator that didn't work (because of their delivery people). And I spent thousands there.
Best Buy should spend as much time trying to figure out why the good customers are leaving as they do trying to get rid of the bad customers.
I work at Walmart in Canada and our store does "fire" certain customers on occassion. The biggest and most common reason for banning certain problem customers is usually because they are caught stealing. This usually results in a 6-month ban from all Walmart stores in that city.
However, I was involved personally with a very "bitchy" customer who would ALWAYS be VERY VERY rude, obnoxious and often try and cheat us out of money and products. She was observed over the course of about 4 months and after more than 3 dozen complaints from staff ranging from her calling them stupid to her yelling at them all kinds of peronal threats she was banned indefinetly from all Walmart stores in Canada.
Personally, I believe that it shouldn't take so long to recognize these customers. It would save many retail employees from experiences which we are not paid nearly enough to put up with.
I can't believe this guy...
"Those customers, they're smart, and they're costing us money."
The implication being that its the stupid customer they make money on?
Brad Anderson, Best Buy's chief executive, said:
"That would be directly equivalent to somebody going to an ATM and getting money out without putting any in,"
Um... isn't that the whole purpose of an ATM... you take out money without puttiny any in?
I tend to purchase the insurance at best buy for small items that *are* likely to break: For example Palms; Laptops; Phones. For the palms and phones, I have broken a few and had them replaced immediately. A few days ago my laptop stopped functioning, however rather than replace it, they send it to a depot for thirty days before deciding what to do.
I am now waiting and using my old 2.5lb 500MHz Acer as a backup....
I guess they can't just give me a $laptop-price in store credit like they did for the palms.
At least you won. I purchased an open-box Viewsonic monitor years ago, with the promise (printed on the box in huge letters) that Best Buy would honor the manufacturer's warranty. Six months later, the monitor went Kaput. Best Buy no longer carried it, or ANY monitor that met the specs it had-- and refused to replace it. I was offered store credit only. Nothing they had would match the refresh rate and resolution of the broken monitor. I went around and around with them for months, finally receiving an email from customer service that "this was the last email I would receive on the subject."
While I'll admit to having bought a DVD or two there in the intervening four years, they haven't seen a dime for hardware or software. Which, as in your case, has been a significant amount.
The problem, though, is that there is no real alternative. When BB screwed me, I tried other stores-- but when my HDTV failed it took HHGregg (local electronics chain) 4 house calls followed by SIX WEEKS in the shop to diagnose and repair it, despite promising 1-week turnaround. They missed four promised delivery dates to return the set after that.
Circuit City hasn't done it yet, but I can't imagine they're any more honorable than the rest.
What do you do when ALL your choices are like that? Stop buying, I guess.
...that George Costanza reads slashdot.
All of these retail companies got themselves into a bit of financial trouble over having "sales" and more importantly price-matching competitor's sales.(Those from the internet in particular.) The "store rebates" were a way to eliminate price matching and rain checks without people realizing that's what was happening. Had they just posted "we not longer price match or offer rain checks" they would have lost a ton of business.
Best Buy: Hmmm, Mr. Smith, it appears you've declined the extended warranty upgrade on your last 3 purchases. Smith: So? BB: Well, one more purchase without an upgrade and I will have to revoke your right to buy. Remember, shopping here is a sacred priviledge... You wouldn't want to lose it, would you?
We bought a fridge there. White-Westinghouse. No PSP.
Before six months were up, the thing had failed catastrophically twice, and the repair guys (provided by White-Westinghouse under the factory warranty, not Best Buy's) had managed to screw it up worse. We ended up with a fridge that had been "waiting for parts" for longer than it had been keeping our food cold. What was White-Westinghouse's oh-so-generous response? They graciously offered to extend our warranty by adding six months to the end. Be STILL my freakin' HEART!
I ended up calling Best Buy's corporate customer-service line. He gave me a number to call at White-Westinghouse for Best-Buy-specific customer service, and said if that didn't get results, call him back. It didn't get results (I think that's actually when they finally offered to extend the warranty), so I called the guy at Best Buy Back, and said I wanted a new refrigerator, of a different brand. I ended up with a new fridge (a Whirlpool), free pickup/delivery and an icemaker thrown into the bargain. Twelve years later, the Whirlpool is still happily working fine.
Now, that's the appliance end of things, and not the electronics, so I dunno if there's a difference. Only other bad appliance story I have is shopping for a dishwasher, and having a slimy salesman at Montgomery Ward telling me not to go to Best Buy, because they were about to stop selling their large appliances and we'd have trouble getting any warranty work. That was ten years ago, and Best Buy is still selling appliances, and MW's not selling much of anything at all. (We didn't buy the dishwasher there, though, as I recall.)
That said, though, if there'd been any silliness about "rebates" or such, we wouldn't have bought the fridge there in the first place...
Slashdot's token middle-aged housewife
If he really cared he would have known ahead of time that your food was late, given you a discount on the meal and politely asked you to not penalize the waitress for the cook's error.
Keep in mind, waitresses get paid less than minimum wage in the US. Not leaving a tip on a $400 bill is literally taking food out of the mouths of that waitresses kids(or from her tuition, rent whatever). You probably ruined her whole day. My wife has come home crying because people somehow think that they don't have to pay a tip.
Actually I'm kind of surprised they didn't add gratuity to the bill. Usually a bill over 100 will automatically have it added to protect the wait staff from tightwads.
Next time, don't take it out on the waitress if she did her job. Demand that the manager cut you a break on the bill and then tip based on the full bill(15 to 20%). Otherwise you're being an asshole and contributing to the sterotype that foreigners are poor tippers.
I fired Best Buy as an authorized vendor.
Dump the IRS - http://www.fairtax.org
I bought a $90 Rio CD/MP3 player some number of years ago which broke (I dropped it.) I had the service/replacement plan and wasn't sure how it would work since the problem with the player was clearly due to physical damage and not any kind of defect. What did Best Buy do? They gave me a brand new player. Actually, more than that--the model I had was discontinued so they gave me the current (better) model. I was a bit shocked as I expected to be turned down completely.
I turn down the service play on anything less than $100, but I usually get it on big purchases. Guess my experience doesn't help support your "damned ripoff service plan" argument. Sorry.
has identified "demon customers" like those who file for a rebate then return the item. OK, I get that one
I don't get that one. Shouldn't the company offering the rebate request info from Best Buy to see if it something was taken back? or how about this...shouldn't Best Buy contact the company to see if a rebate was sent and decrease the return value at that point.
Remember you have to submit the rebate receipt and the original purchase receipt for the rebate so the information should be verified by both companies. If they aren't then it is their own fault not the fault of the customer who has successfully received a rebate.
Of course I hate Best Buy...I had a credit card of $700 with them. In the last year and a half I moved. I notified the credit company which Best Buy is associated but in the process of the move I received my bill late (past the due date in fact - and it had the corrected address) I paid immediately. The next bill came (with the Post Office mailing address changed - it had the old address) three days before the due date - and a again I paid the bill (and it had a penalty for a late payment from last month.) The following month it arrived on time (with corrected address and again a late payment was assessed) and I paid it on time. Two weeks later I was told that my credit was revoked and the special no interest charges were revoked and being assessed at the regular interest rate. I called and they said because I hadn't paid the bill that it was revoked but when I told them that on each of these bills they placed when they received the payment and it was properly credited. There was a pause and then it was determined because I was late when I explained that the first bill was sent to the correct address but I didn't receive it until well past the due date which wasn't my fault but theirs I was told I shouldn't have moved to another state. I paid the entire bill off and returned the credit card.
I haven't stepped into a Best Buy since and I wrote the store that they just lost a customer for life and which included my entire family (seems all five of my siblings had the exact same problem in the last three years) I never had a response.
Save Pangaea!! Stop Continental Drift!!
I think we need a law against it
Legislators don't need to add even more complexity to the code of statutes; ordinary laws of business will suffice. For instance, supermarkets in Indiana tend to require a $10 additional non-age-restricted purchase along with any loss leader item.
Because wait staff at restaurants get paid less than minimum wage. They work for the tips. People at fast food joints get paid minimum wage or maybe a little more. If you work at a restaurant they take your taxes out of your paycheck for your claimed tips and often you get a check for $0. Yes, zero dollars.
If you want customer service from them you have to twist and break arms and legs. Even then you have about a 25% chance.
I need to stop going in there. They've screwed me more than once you'd think I would learn my lesson.
The funniest thing was that I bought a compaq notebook from them and the next day I saw they had a sale on VPR Matrix notebooks (best buy exclusive brand). The matrix was a much nicer notebook for the same price so I tried to take the compaq back but I didn't buy the extended warranty so they wouldn't do it.
So I went home and modifed boot.ini to boot off of an invalid partition and changed bios to boot off of floppy and there was no floppy drive. Then I took it back to them for their techies to analyze. "Bad hard drive" was the diagnosis.
They took it back and I ordered my matrix. The funny thing is they lowered the price by $100 on the matrix the next day on bestbuy.com so I managed to twist and turn arms until I got $100 back. They were tired of dealing with me. "Bestbuy.com is not Best Buy the store, blah blah blah" I was like whatever I just want my $100 back. I finally got it. It took some time though.
These notebooks are really nice. I've got two of them. Too bad I'm tied to best buy for any form of parts or support. I don't think I'll buy anything from them again. I've said that before but now it's time to stick to it.
The man who trades freedom for security does not deserve nor will he ever receive either. - Benjamin Franklin
the ones best buy offers are pretty much crap. They don't even seem to cover as much as the manufacturer warrantee.
In general the replacement plans are a gamble. I've bought a few that I've never used, and I've bought a few that I have used, and a few times when I didn't buy one and ended up wishing I had. It's a crap shoot, sometimes it saves you money, sometimes it's a waste, I think I've done better than break even over the years which is a lot better than my casino record.
The latest one I came out good on was the plan I got my PDA. The LCD when bad in just under a year, I could have mailed it and had it fixed but decided to use the replacement plan. They (NOT best buy, they have nothing I want) didn't have a "compairable" replacement for the same price as I originaly paid so I had to wait 4 days for the claim for a store credit to be proceessed. It came through and they even gave me a prorated credit on the remainder of the old warrantee. For $30 out of pocket I got a much better PDA and a free 2-year replacement plan because it was an open box item.
So, the plans aren't complete crap, but they are a gamble. I'd probably buy one for anything with an LCD in the future.
- Disclaimer: Information in this post deemed reliable but not guaranteed.
The customer/vendor relationship is not a one way street. Just as there are bad vendors, there are also bad customers. Any successful business seeks good customers and sheds bad customers just as any good consumer seeks good vendors and shuns bad ones.
If a customer is not making you money, you should not do business with them. They are ripping you off. That's all Best Buy is up to here.
Best Buy isn't really all that bad... I went to BB once, got a huge plasma screen TV, DVD player, sound system, and over 50 DVDs, didn't have to buy the PSP, didn't get harassed by a single rep... it was a bit dark in the store, but didn't even have to bother with any other customers, lines, or anything! Oh wait... maybe I shouldn't be posting this...
However, it's been my experience that BB more often then occasionally won't have a rebate item on stock/shelves right when the store opens on the first day of the rebate sale. 3 cases where I've tried to get a rebate item (modem, HD, monitor) I'd get there and be the first few when the doors open only to find the item NOT on the shelf. Ask a salesperson and they'll say there's no more in stock. When questioned about the promotion, it's the usual B.S. "The item has been on sale for the past week, so we ran out".
In point of fact, this is usually the case on any good priced sale item. I've seen it time and time again. I worked at Best Buy back in the late 90's, and this *always* happened. The real reason is that the items simply did not arrive on the truck. They have a scheduling system whereby the items in question either arrive a week early or fail to arrive until three days after. Usually three days after the sale starts. Understand that a) the circulars are printed on a national or regional basis, not on a store basis and b) the stores get them about 1 day before the sale itself. So half the time when an item was a good sale item, we wouldn't actually have the item in stock because it hadn't shown up on the truck yet. Invaribly there would be customers complaining about "bait and switch" or other tactics being used, and the only response we could give was "What the fuck do you want us to do? The item has not shown up at the store yet. I can't sell you what we don't fuckin' have." Best I could do was offer a raincheck at that point.
Whether this is intentionally planned or just the result of shitty planning in terms of truck arrivals, I never did find out. But it happened like clockwork, on at least one or two really good deals in every sale. Usually in the computer stuff, which is why I dealt with it so much.
- Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day, but set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.
Pay Cash?
No CC/Address information/Identification makes it hard for them to put you on a "list".
Read my story. After being chased into the parking lot for failing to be searched by their door nazi and threatened with police action, Best Buy has guaranteed that I won't be back.
-- Mark Lyon http://www.marklyon.org
Welcome to Canada - land of a handful of banks. 5 consumer banks, to be exact; and they want to reduce that through mergers.
Good old bait and switch. When I started with the Toronto-Dominion, it was $5 for unlimited chequing, online, etc. Then they absorbed Standard Trust, and adopted a usurious fee schedule comparable to most other banks. One of my wife's co-workers found her service fees jumped to $70 for a typical household account. (It's 50 cents a transaction over 20 per month - imagine using a bank card for a $5 McPurchase - that adds up quick!) That's one reason why I never use my bank card, except to withdraw $200 cash at a time.
One of the other banks here is advertising $5 no-hassle unlimited accounts now. I wonder how long that will last. I wonder what the fine print is...
"The customer is always right" doesn't mean that you need to bend over to agree with them. If a customer says that you suck and doesn't shop at your store any more, it doesn't matter if he's factually wrong, you're still not getting his money.
Best Buy and Circuit City are both on my list of stores where I will never shop again.
Then some woman decided she'd check my ID for beer (I'm creeping up on 30 if you don't mind. But hey, nice to feel under 21 again), in a manner which made me feel like I did something wrong.
;)
In many states in the US, it's the law that they must always check your ID, period. Regardless of how old you look. So don't take it as a compliment, because the majority of the time, it's not.
- Give a man a fire and he's warm for a day, but set him on fire and he's warm for the rest of his life.
Actually, I did have one issue recently, but that was with the individual not the store. I brought a TV abck that had a large magenta spot in one corner. After waiting for at least an hour in line, and being passed up several times for people who hadn't waited as long, I finally made the guy deal with me. He plugged the TV in, ran a magnetic wand over the screen, then said "there, it's gone." It most certainly wasn't, if anything it was worse, and I said as much. He argued for a minute, then I just said "look, it's still there, and I want a replacement or a refund, period. I'll talk to someone else if I have to." Without another word he put it through, I went and grabbed another, and that was that.
That was one guy, I've never had a problem like that before, and it was extremely busy that day so I couldn't really blame him for being on edge, though there's not a chance in hell he didn't see the spot, so he was deliberately bullshitting me. Whatever.
I can't say there are no problems at Best Buy, but that's not a universal experience.
Needless to say I installed it myself and needless to say when I needed a new fridge a few weeks ago I went straight to Sears. It prolly cost me a little more than if I would have bought it at Al's discount scrap heap, but knowing that Sears Service won't try to rip me off when something goes wrong made the difference.
"Avoid employing unlucky people - throw half of the pile of CVs in the bin without reading them." -- David Brent
You built a fuckin' store the size of Texas and have an inventory of goods bigger than some 3rd world countries. Yet, you only have 2 cash registers of your 30, actually open at any one time because you want to save money. Here's an idea, open all of your cash registers every operating hour of the day and advertize..."No lines in our store, ever" The sales from that will more than pay for the shitty wages that you think you're saving. I don't know how many times I've dropped my items and walked out of Best Buy/Home Depot/etc. because those idiots had 2 registers open with a huge line.
I was at the Mall recently, and was parked such that walking through BB made sense. The DVD racks are on the main aisle, so my wife and I paused to look through them. We saw a movie we had been wanting to buy - it was $22.95. We started to buy it when I noticed that there was a "holiday special" or some such - that same movie and another by the same main actor (we wanted that movie too) were in a pack for $19.95. So, save $3, get another movie. There was another such pack with 2 other movies we wanted for the same price, so we got it too.
While I would never go to BB before that day, I now start to think about it on holidays - just to check out the dvd bundles ;)
You're.
Dumbass.
Being an ex-Best Buy employee myself, this little article does not surprise me. First things first, Best Buy cares very little about the customer. How do I know that? Well, that statement is based on hands-on experience and how the company itself is structured. District managers and corporate officers spend most of their time thinking about the numbers and how to better push those numbers higher with more services and better sales tactics. Store managers themselves are brainwashed by corporate to think about those numbers on a constant basis (else they lose their jobs!) and are encouraged to push their employees to get those number higher with 'quality customer service'. Let me tell you somthing...'quality customer service' is an illusion at Best Buy. They care more about the bottom line than they do about actually servicing their customers and making them happy. I know this because many of the managers and supervisors I worked with would do everything they could to get the most money from a customer. Now, granted, that's just the corporate machine at work...and I know that...nothing wrong with it. However, when you cheat your customers; when you get to the point of borderline stealing from then, that's where I draw the line! And that's why I left that company! Any company that encourages its employees to steal from customers is a bad company in my opinion! I was asked to charge $60 for a software installation that normally goes for $20...that's stealing from the customer! And not one person got fired for doing this! Unbelievable! And it was not just this store either....I have personally witnessed similar instances at other stores! Trust me...this story is as it appears...complete BS in a nutshell!
Jeff Whitfield jeffwhitfield@gmail.com "I can learn to resist anything but temptation..."
I used to work at the Best Buy outside of Washington, DC, across from Pentagon City in Pentagon Center.
I worked in the PC/Home Office section. Originally, we had a cage above the shelves in our section where we stored the laptops.
We moved the cage to the end of the store, so most customers would not know whether we had laptops in stock or not.
Why you ask? We were explicitly told that if a customer was interested in a laptop and was not interested in the PSP (product service plan), we were to tell the customer the laptop was out of stock.
It was the policy of the store to only sell laptops if customers bought the extended warranty.
And they're worried of the customer taking advantage of BestBuy? Fuck 'em.
I make my family and myself only buy from Circuit City.
Vote with your dollar!!! ChopSueyAR
Rebate forms aren't hard to come by; you can usually download them from the manufacturer's Web site
That's true for many manufacturer rebates, but the Best Buy rebates that are offered by Best Buy themselves (the ones that go to Calais, Maine) are different. The form that prints out at the cash register is only valid for in-store purchases, and the forms on the Best Buy website are only valid for online purchases. This is in the fine print on the bottom of the rebate forms.
I have blog like everyone else
Tough.
They have to suck it up. They can ask you to leave, but if they touch you they go to jail and the store gets sued.
Cursing, if provoked, is not crossing the line. Pushing is. Period.
but the management (which is forced by the corporate office to do this).
The managers are just greedy bastards. They win trips and get bonuses. The whole thing is a pyramid scheme. I used to work at BBY. The managers are Nazis.
I try to avoid BB as much as possible.
They think only those that love loud, hard music shop there. When I complained to a chasher, She said the music was the only thing that got her through the day. I filled a complaint on line and got not response. I wonder if OSHA could fine them.
I also have had a run-in with buy the ESP or else.
I currently own 7 computers, but no more from BB.
Never trust a man wearing a coat and tie!
(Incidentally they feed us BS saying that the real reason they issue cards is because those customers who have them tend to be more loyal and spend more than on your standard everyday credit card, but if that was the case why charge so much interest?)
Really? I think it's partially because they want to charge ridiculous interest rates. Bit I think it's also for this reason:
Try buying something there on six or twelve months no interest plan. Then wait a number of months, then buy something else on a similar plan. When you send in your payment, enough to cover both minimums, can anyone guess what they do? Anyone? They apply the entire mount to the latest purchase making you "miss" your minimum payment on the oldest one. This allows them to nail you for 25% back to the beginning. I've had numerous angry phone calls with them over this.
Of course, this should be no surprise. Credit card companies are loan sharks anyway. I simply don't use any of them anymore.
Disconnect your television. Do your own research. Draw your own conclusions. They're probably lying. Don't be a sheep.
After writing the above, I realize that if the bastard had pushed me, *I* would have been the one arrested.
For *attempted* murder, if he was lucky...
The clerk committed a felony against a customer. By any reasonable social standard, he should get fired.
A Pirate and a Puritan look the same on a balance sheet.
Basically, he was eating 5000 calories a day - double the recommended amount, high in sugar, starch and fat, low in vegetables, fresh fruits, fiber etc. Do you think he didn't know what was going to happen? And, his girlfriend was a vegetarian, so his body REALLY wasn't acclimatized to this diet either.
McDonald's sells what people want to buy. If you want healthy, they have salads, they have small regular burgers, they have frozen fruit'n'yoghurt parfaits, and - hey! - they have SMALL soft drinks. Maybe 200 calories of sugar water is a better idea than 700?? They have plain milk too!
Someone else is now doing a movie about losing weight by eating McDonald's food. They're going to eat healthy and sensibly... Do you think it'll get as much publicity?
BTW the guy in the movie said that he wasn't picking on McDonalds (hmmm...) After all, he said, their food is pretty much the same nutrition as any other fast food places. It's the sheer volume that causes the health problems.
Remember when a regular coke - those little greenish bottles - was 8 oz.? Probably before your time, but that was what passed for a regular serving then. Now, you only see that small a serving on the nutrition label "suggested serving" of packaged foods...
BB screwed me over years ago with its anti-costomer policies.
I haven't been back and always direct people to other stores and better buys.
If every pissed off customer just walked out without getting his name and complaining to management, all that management knows is that he has a 100% success rate in upselling customers.
You were part of the problem that kept him there, not the solution that might have helped.
'McCuskey, an industrial chemical salesman, said he shares Best Buy's frustration with "extreme price shoppers" who are so low-cost oriented that it's tough to make money off of them.' This comment floors me. It's like they're blaming the customers for having low profits. As if they deserve to be more profitable.
I understand you have a new policy concerning customers, and I believe that I am the customer you are targeting with that policy. I hereby put you on notice that I *will* only buy things from you when they are on sale because they are otherwise overpriced in your store (MSRP, my ass). And if I buy it with a rebate, fulfill the rebate and then find that I am unsatisfied with the product, I *will* return it, and you can worry about the rebate issues.
On the day that you stop having good sales and rebates I will no longer buy from you. I am a veteran of the dot-com boom when everyone and their mother sold things at outrageous prices and then disappeared. I was there when 800.com sold 3 DVDs for $1 with nothing else to buy and they are now gone. Egghead.com had great sales when they went online, but no longer offered competitive pricing so good riddance. Treat me and my fellow customers like crap and you won't even have a store left in your native state of Minnesota. Until then I will suck you dry since (shocking as this may be to Best Buy's management) I am not there to give them as much of my money as I can in each individual product I buy. I want the most bang for the buck.
To those that were actually physically accosted by an employee, I don't know what magic restraint you have, but I would have put that person into an armlock at that point. NOTHING gives them the right to touch you, especially when they are trying to coerce your hard earned money in that fashion.
"Beware of he who would deny you access to information, for in his heart, he dreams himself your master."
(Incidentally they feed us BS saying that the real reason they issue cards is because those customers who have them tend to be more loyal and spend more than on your standard everyday credit card, but if that was the case why charge so much interest?)
Just FYI, there are two parties at work here. The retailer (such as BestBuy) and the credit issuer (I beleive BestBuy uses GE Credit).. So BestBuy doesn't have it's own credit agency. They just essentially stamp their name on a card issued by a 3rd party. The 3rd party sets the rate, and for these specialty retail cards they generally do it at a REALLY high rate, because that's in their best interest. The store is pushing these cards for the obvious reasons (they do tend to lock people into buying at the store, they provide a goldmine of customer data, and they provide a means to do all sorts of special promotions), which makes it easier for the issuer to slip in those obnoxiously high interest rates.
Turn s60 photos into awesome videos with mScrapbook for all S60 3rd edition phones!
Start buying from the little guy and see all of this disappear.
Seriously - most slashdotters seem to be on the left of centre and don't like the big corporations -- So stop shopping from them.
Where does the money end up anyway? Probably with someone who's got way too much money, drives a huge SUV and pollutes the world on their huge yacht.
Want to make a difference? Stick with the little guy who's been recommended by a friend. You'll have less stress and probably make a much more positive impact on your community than the big box stores with their huge parking lots.
So it costs $20 more? So what? Put your money where your mouth is.
One of my friends worked for them, and they get just about everything in the store for what it costs Best Buy to purchase it, plus a 5% markup. Those monster cables and things you pay $30-$60 for? Yeah those are like $5 to employees. I had this friend buy me a $500 digital camera a while back, and it ended up costing me around $425. They wanted something like $125 I think for the service plan, but he could get it for $15 as an employee so I hooked it up. The warranty is transferable so he transferred it to me. I already used it once to get a completely new camera because the USB port wasn't working right. It would have been a big hassle to ship it to the manufacturer for their warranty.
;)
There is a reason I shop sales only, these people mark stuff up like crazy. Even when they have "big sales" they are still making their money just fine. The warranty plans are useful, but usually not worth the price unless you do like me and use an insider.
Exactly ..... they're a gamble. Next time you're in a bookie's shop -- preferably around the time of some important sporting fixture, so it's nice and packed -- add up the estimated total wealth of all the punters, and compare it to the estimated total wealth of the owner.
On which side of the glass is there more money?
That's not to say you can't make money out of gambling, far from it. If you can estimate the odds better than the bookie, then you're on a winning ticket. But electronic component failure is fairly random -- more like the lottery or the roulette table -- whereas performances in sports are somewhat predictable (and, crucially for a gambler, can be influenced by events occurring after the odds have been fixed, but before the game is played).
Je fume. Tu fumes. Nous fûmes!
>younger geeks have to find crap first jobs as we all know
You'd be lucky to get a job at all. Where I live, as a younger geek, no one even bothers you to interview you after you turn in an application, getting even a crappy retail job has about the same chance as getting struck by lightning.
>But the thing is, it's not how you or I want your shopping experience to be, it's how the management wants your shoppping experience to be.
Who listens to management? Where I used to work, even the manager didn't do what the store owners said unless they were around. Management will care more about keeping customers.
I'm suprised that most of the posts I've seen so far are against Best Buy or any store. From my experience, customers are ALWAYS far worse than the staff. While working in retail, I'm nearly led to believe that 95% of the world's population has a behavorial disorder. There were so many customers everyday trying to abuse policies. Customers even trying to do things that common sense tells them not to(No, you cannot use two coupons! Every coupon in the world says so. No, you cannot use an expired coupon, why do you think those dates are on them?!).
When I worked at a restaurant(not a family restaurant but not fast food either), many customers acted extremely selfish and irrational. For example, we prepared about 5 or so of each item ahead of time and kept them in a warmer. But we never kept anything more than 30 minutes so that they were always fresh. Even when we had just replaced everything a couple of minutes ago, some customers refused to believe us and demanded we cook itemx for them which on a slow day meant we'd waste food because probably the ones in the warmer didn't get sold. Then there were the customers that wanted a specific item from the warmer instead of what I'd give them. Each item of the same type was in a row going toward the back of the warmer. If we were to take one that was not from the front, goods are damaged because it takes longer since the door is open and air is allowed in longer. The goods are also damaged because trying to get something from the middle or the back caused other items to be ripped.
The customer is not always right, in fact the customer is often greedy, selfish, and abusive.
If you have any questions about BestBuy or its policies, try WWW.BESTBUYSUX.ORG
I've never been denied a rebate. Why? Because immediately after purchase of the items, I read the rebate instructions carefully and follow them exactly to recieve my rebate. Sure enough, X weeks later I do get my rebate check.
Rebates are somewhat tricky, and I agree that the plot of the rebate is that Joe Consumer forgets about ther rebate or fails to follow the proper instructions to recieve the rebate. However, if you follow the instructions to get your rebate, you will get it in most cases.
"You spoony bard!" -Tellah
Once you get through all the marketing hype, all CRM is is an infrastructure to unify channels of contact with a customer. Take a large company, let's say Citigroup. Let's say you're a customer and you fax some request to Citibank. Nevermind that your fax was probably received in Nevada and transcribed in Bungalore, you are a customer and you just see Citi. Not some massive company with many businesses each with many divisions who have a hard time knowing what each other are doing. When you walk into your local branch, you expect your banker to know you faxed Citi. When you call the 800 #, you expect the CSR in Bangledesh to know you just opened an account in Topeka, Kansas.
That's what CRM is. Enabling large organizations to provide their customers coherent service by having all the customer's "relationship" data available across the organization. What said organization does with the data and how well they treat their clients is up to them. But, anyhow, now you know what CRM is.
"Avoid employing unlucky people - throw half of the pile of CVs in the bin without reading them." -- David Brent
Very often, after 2 years, the "Insurance Company" that serviced the PSP will go "out of business" leaving you high and dry. This is a very typical scam. And if you read the fine print in the contract, you'll see that WorstBuy doesn't do the PSP, their "insurer" does.
And it's worse than that. These "insurance companies" are actually tax shelters for the rich (like the principals of Best Buy) so they don't have to pay any income taxes. (You can find something about these here and an explanation of how you can use them not to pay taxes in the book "Perfectly Legal" (do an Amazon search).
Best Buy can have you arrested
I paid for a car in cash once and you seriously just have to be ready to walk out on those assclowns and go to the next dealer in the area. I went to a couple of Honda dealers when I bought my car, knowing that I would pay cash but keeping it a secret since they are more willing to bargain if they think they can make interest off of you. First thing out of their mouths is always "What kind of payments are you looking at?". Anyhow, by persistence that I would not go above what I believed I could spend and what was reasonable for the car I ended up taking $2100 off the sticker price (a two-year old used Civic, mind you). Everytime I gave them my final offer they came back with some number in the middle. Eventually I just got up and started walking out, told them I was going to the other Honda dealer down the highway, and after he "talked with his manager" the car was mine for the price I budgeted.
While I wouldn't go so far as to call them "demon customers", I can understand that "the customer is always right" belongs to an earlier era...one where people seemed to have a bit more integrity as shoppers. I always thought it should be updated to "the customer is frequently right, but can at times be horribly misinformed."
Two things I've done about stores like Best Buy. First, whenever you return something to the store for exchange, mark in heavy black marker on the inside of the box what's wrong with it, the date and, if you're feeling altruistic, give a throw-away email address.
Reason? Many retail stores don't bother checking returns to see if they work (or not) as the original purchaser stated. They simply re-wrap it, and put it back on the shelves. If someone else comes behind you and purchases that unit, they'll see what you wrote (write BIG), and learn to never deal with that store again.
Also, if you left an email address, they can contact you to let you know what happened (and possibly thank you). I was the "second buyer" in that scenario - (thanks, GeorgeC!), and will never buy from that store again (local chain).
Second tip, ask the store selling purchase plans if you can take their "details" home with you -- don't purchase anything...yet. If they tell you that their "Purchase Plan" is only viewable after you actually buy something (as is the case with one major retail chain, iirc), you're getting "MS EULA'd".
- Jack
I went to a Future Shop in Winnipeg to buy a digital camera after Best Buy took them over.
The saleswoman asked if I wanted the PSP. I said no, if it breaks, it will break in the first year, and it has its own 1-year warranty.
She said if it breaks and I don't have the PSP, then I'll have to ship it to Canon and it could take months to fix. And, if they don't sell that model anymore, they don't *have* to fix it.
So I said, "you're telling me that it has a 1-year warranty and they don't have to honour it?"
She looked kind of sheepish and said, "well, that's what the store told me."
I bought the camera and have been using it for almost 2 years without a problem. (Canon Powershot A40.)
well he would say that, wouldn't he?
I already shop at Amazon and Circuit City you insensitive clod!
Snowden and Manning are heroes.
Best Buy has been on my dirt list ever since they had the police arrest some guy who was collecting price information (for publication on his web site) in their store in Reston, Virginia, 4-5 years ago. Sure, it's their right to tell him not to come onto their property, but if they're going to prevent people from comparison shopping, they're going to the bottom of my list.
"Who controls the past controls the future. Who controls the present controls the past." -- George Orwell
Threaten to sue and maybe they'll budge. They shouldn't be able to change the terms of a signed contract. Of course as I say this I am reminded of credit card companies, but at least you have the choice to discontinue service if they change terms.
When I was in customer service, I experienced a handfull of customers I dubbed "the insatiables". Managers reviewed their service call logs, determined that they were costing the company 2 or 3 times what they brought in as revenue, and cancelled their service. Their demands were usually totally irrational (e.g., 100% uptime for every web site they wanted to visit).
This was rare, but it happened. Usually a company will carry customers at a loss rather than have bad PR of "firing" a customer.
For all intensive purposes, "whom" is no longer a word. That begs the question, "who cares"?
I'm wondering...how many of these horror stories are from psychos who went nuts on store employees, are were trying to cheat the system???
Best Buy sucks. Don't shop there. Also, don't believe half the crap you here about abusive clerks and fraudulent practices. Frankly, the mass of BS out there tends to bury the true reasons not to patronize places like best buy.
My own boycott is based on sound economic principle. When are you people going to learn (from me)?
About 10 months ago, I stopped by BB on my way home to pick up an iRiver IGP-150, because it supported Ogg and had 1.5 GB storage for a decent price. In checkout, the Cashier asked me to buy an ESP. I said, No thanks. She said "You HAVE to get one because your MP3 player could get a virus from "downloading mp3s from the internet", and that wasn't covered under the warranty." I laughed lightheartedly, and informed her politely that she was mistaken, this was impossible, and she shouldn't tell people this because it was wrong. She got uppity with me, told me "NO, YOU'RE WRONG," told me I was making a huge mistake and finished the sale. I walked right past the door, over to customer service, returned it, told them exactly why I was returning it, and informed them that I'd never shop there again-- and I haven't. This is the best way to deal with these people-- especially if it's a non-sale/rebate item.
Hell, do it for fun. Just go in there and tell them you're buying a widescreen TV or a plasma, and when you get up to the front, and they ask you to buy the plan, say no thank you. When they ask you again to buy it, (and you know they will) just snatch your card back and walk out the door.
Hell, I might do that at lunch.
If you don't like your previous Best Buy, here's the easy solution: Don't buy at Best Buy.
If you want to contribute to making your experience not happen to others, complain to the Store Manager AND write a letter. In fact, if you're going to do one of the two, just write a letter. Not an email. Not a phone call. Maybe even write it to their corporate headquarters, but be specific: mention the store location, the time and date, and (if you know them) the names of the employees involved.
(Heck, if you want to scare the employees into treating you better, take notes as you're talking to them!)
If you don't mind shopping at Best Buy or the like, but one or two things bother you about your shopping experience (like the product replacement plan pitch), let them know (in writing, natch). Let them know you'll take your business elsewhere because of it.
As for rebates, most consumers find them annoying and frustrating. So don't play the game. I used to have a hard time not playing the rebate game, but I finally figured out it just wasn't worth my time. So what if I can get $8 off by filling in a rebate? If it takes me even 15 minutes to read the minutiae of the rebate terms, cut out the appropriate UPCs, fill out the form exactly as described (oh, and waiving my privacy, BTW), buying the stamp, mailing it off... then waiting 6-8 weeks for a check that MIGHT come through if you did everything right (factor in interest from the cash that could've been sitting in your bank account, not theirs)... then making the trip to the bank to cash that measly check... how much is your time worth to you?
Further, do NOT trust Best Buy (or other megastore employees) for tech advice. Get a second opinion from a techie or another user. Read Consumer Reports and other reviews. And don't trust that just because a sales employee says they'll make good on it if it doesn't work, that they'll do it. Get it in writing if you're concerned. Otherwise, figure that you may have to throw away money if it doesn't work, and that you're taking a chance.
I honestly believe that somewhere in the Best Buy training manual, there is a section under computer/technical questions that says: "If you don't know the answer to a customer's technical question, make something up that sounds good." I have personally tested BB employees by asking them technical questions I know the answer to (or know there isn't a good answer) and heard some pretty entertaining made-up answers. I encourage you to try this.
Finally, just a pitch for the local guy: Instead of going to a megastore like Best Buy for your computing needs, go to a local mom&pop computer store. You're pretty much guaranteed not to get the best price on computer components, but you can ask all the tech questions you want and not deal with a faceless minion. You'll get better quality service and heck, if you act halfway decent to them, probably exceptional service.
First off... here's something I usually do at Best Buy (when I'm not just going there because I want to buy "something").
:)
I go to BestBuy.com and find everything I want and order it for In Store Pickup. You pay for the merchandise online, an employee will walk around the store and pick out everything and bring it up to the customer service desk. Then they e-mail you saying your order is ready. You just show up at best buy, show them the printed e-mail and the card you used to purchase it and be on your way. This is *wonderful* to do at Christmas time. I love walking into Best Buy, walking right up to customer service and leaving while watching the wrap around the store line. And I didn't even have to find any of my items. Use it!
Last time I went to Best Buy I bought a logitech wireless keyboard/mouse combo that cost me about $100. I'm used to the first thing out of my mouth being a "no" once I hit the cashier. It went something like this (keep in mind I worked customer service at a store for about 2 years so I know what goes on).
Rep: "Would you like to buy the service plan for $10?"
Me: "No."
Rep: "Well I work at customer service too and I see these come back a lot and if it breaks you'll need the service plan."
Me: "No, if it breaks due to it being faulty you'll exchange it without the service plan."
Rep: "Well... some people find that the range isn't long enough on this product so you'll need the service plan to bring it back if it's not good enough."
Me: "No, if it's not good enough I have several days to make that call and bring it back for a full refund."
Rep: *blank stare*
I really don't get what he was getting at. From past experience in customer service I know I probably could have returned the keyboard and mouse to them covered in peanut butter without a receipt and gotten my money back and a $25 gift card. Being persistent and pleasant tends to get you results. I almost wanted to not buy the product on the basis that if it was that bad of a product I should probably get something else... although I've yet to have problems with it.
The only two things I do have their service plan on is my TV (the tube did go out and the model was discontinued so I ended up better off for it anyhow) and my digital camera because I bought the display one (which was discontinued anyhow) and since they knocked a decent amount off the price it made up for the purchase of the service plan. Plus the plan entitles me to new free batteries for 3 years after I got the plan and the plan was $40 and the batteries cost a good $30. I've already gotten one new battery. Both of my service plans have been useful for me.
Now to go place an order on the BestBuy web site to pick up after work...
It seems that the management at Best Buy wants to turn the its stores into an Arab market and all its personnel into an army of hawkers. That would be a nice idea, if not for the fact that Arabs can do it with cetain grace and without annoying the heck out of the customers, while American clerks can't.
I wonder if such behaviour is commonplace in other chain stores.
Future Wiki -- If you don't think about the future, you cannot have one.
Ah! The infamous "I was just following orders" defence...
Future Wiki -- If you don't think about the future, you cannot have one.
I have a friend who works at a furniture store. The get a very small commission (2-5%) on the actual item but extra things like extended warrantees, etc. they can get upwards of 50%. VERY strong incentives to sell the add-ons.
cheers,
Kris
In Soviet Russia, hot grits put YOU down THEIR pants.
Okay, we all know how annoying BB is about the PSPs, but, having worked there for extra cash a couple Christmases ago, I would like to speak in defense of the sales associates.
While it's true they don't get commission, they WILL get fired if their personal numbers don't look good enough, and the main consideration there is how many PSPs they move. Increasingly, the only people who can move those damned things are the ones who are willing to outright lie about them. I sucked at it, but it's either that or get fired.
So although associates are supposed to offer it 3 times and let it go, it sometimes gets belligerent if their numbers are looking bad. That's one response to customers who aren't willing to throw their money away. The other (that I reluctantly started using) was just abandoning customers who wouldn't buy one. If you're finding that you are being hot-potatoed from one associate to the next, it's because no one's numbers are good enough that day to afford selling you that naked laptop (BB makes almost nothing on laptops if you don't throw a bunch of accessories and the PSP on it).
It's an extremely high-pressure job, which can be terminated at any moment, so please keep that in mind when you go there.
Here's how you get around the mess, though: If you're buying computer products, don't talk to an associate if you can help it. Look around the department for where the item is kept, and if it's accessible, pull it from the shelf yourself and take it to the front. The people on the front registers don't have the time or the sales experience to push the PSP more than one time.
If the computer product is not accessible in the department, look above the phones and TVs in the right-back corner. If there are some up there, you can ask one of the TV guys to get it for you. They don't know anything about the computer stuff, and your sale won't affect their departmental or personal numbers, so they will probably just get it for you to get you out of the way.
And regarding rebates, I think someone else already said this, but PHOTOCOPY EVERYTHING. Keep your own copies of everything, because the companies need the originals. Keep accurate records. Neither BB nor the manufacturer is going to be terribly proactive about GIVING you money, so you very well may have to fight them.
And finally, my thoughts on the BB business model: It's fucking doomed. Fewer and fewer people are willing to buy PSPs and ridiculously overpriced accessories--the only things BB makes any money on. BB is going to have to find a way to make money ON THE ITEMS IT SELLS. I kicked ass at loading customers with every cool gadget under the sun, because I knew about every cool gadget under the sun. But then I had to switch from "Isn't this cool?" to "Now I'd like to talk to you about our PSP," and sometimes the customer would just walk. As the business model is set up now, that customer walking is not seen as a bad thing, because the store is losing money on them. But what the model doesn't take into account is that that person probably never shops there again. And tells his friends. BB is flushing their reputation down the toilet, and they don't see it yet. They used to make money with volume and low overhead, but they are increasingly raising that overhead with pretty stores, resulting in them having to find products that don't exist, but that people will fork over money for. It's a crazy system and it's doomed to fail. People go to a store to buy SOMETHING, not NOTHING. If you can't make money on what people come to buy, you're fucked.
Isn't it ironic then that we Americans are also the same ones who tip a higher percentage or that our service workers are more dependant on our tips for income than those in other countries?
EvilCON - Made Famous by
I don't mind sales people... there is the entire scale of them -- from the not in your face, to the in your face... from the not pushy to the pushy, etc.
Personally, whenever I walk into a store and they come up to me -- they usually ask if I need any help and I say no.. and they leave me alone. I guess they have done their job and I don't feel pressured.
*IF* I get one that's in my face, I just stand there... I free like a deer in headlights and I don't say anything or respond. I just GLARE at them. Believe me, they will leave you alone.
If you're actually interacting with a sales person... and then they start the pitch -- PSP, whatever... upsell... just GLARE. Is it rude? are they being rude? You don't have to swear at them, you don't have to be mean... but whenever they go down their track, you politely ask them not to do it... if they continue, you just stare. If they continue past that, you just walk away.
I'm serious... if they won't listen, you just walk. You don't have to swear or get angry.
Sometimes, I tell them that if they "bother" me, I will leave. Some just don't get it -- but that's ok. I *will* get what I want -- regardless of their tactics.
I went to circuit city and bought one of those $39 dvd/mp3/photo-cd players.. the guy asked me if I wanted a +2 year service plan. I thnk my question to him was "are you serious? you actually think I am going to pay $49 for a 2 year service plan on a $39 piece of equipment" I think the guy started to explain the benefits of the plan -- again, I just stood there... no response, no movement. Either they get the message, or I walk.
For fun, try that at a car dealership. I think those guys think it's a sport to abuse you.
Um... isn't that the whole purpose of an ATM... you take out money without puttiny any in?
If you keep taking money out of your bank account and never put any in, you'll eventually run out of money and overdraft. There are other ways to put money in besides the ATM (ETF, wire transfer, ACH, etc), but the ATM is the most common way, and the point is that you have to put money in before you can take it out.
i once baught a sony digital camera and this guy trued to push the waranty on me and told me if the camera broke i coudent return it i said thats fine but i have 14 days non the less (working retail for soem time i kno how to deal with these guys) and then i was walking away and he said its gonna break on u so i turend arround and said wat was that and he tryed to deny it but i herd it and i was like u meen to tell me that this 400 dollars sony camera is going to break on me beacuse sony sucks then y did u sell me the product sir how about i go to coustomer service and return this prduct right away and then he tryed to stop me and i was like im not gonna retun this beacuse i need it but ied like to speek with ur manager after 10 min of didcking with him i was like call ur manger now or im not comming back when his managers got out thir i bassicaly got him fired it was fun after that i have never been pressured to buy a plan again
Here's a tip - Australia isn't part of Europe.
Hmm. Take it you mean they confuse it with Austria (don't see how they could get Australia mixed up with Europe otherwise).
If this is the case, then paint them the picture of Adolf Hitler with one of those cork hats and a "tinny" of Castlemaine XXXX (or whatever it is you lot actually drink- i.e. *not* Fosters!). This is about as stupid as their mistake and might get the difference into their heads.
"Slashdot - News and Chat Sites Deviant". (Click "homepage" link above for details).
I haven't been back to a Best Buy ever since buying my laptop and that was quite a long time ago. It's a bit embarrassing but I got suckerd into buying a "service plan" for my laptop, only to realize that it really wasn't worth it.
And like what a lot of you have said, I also find it odd how the clerks always mention , "I don't work on commission." , its obvious they have been trained to say this, as if Best Buy thinks that if their clerks say these 5 magic words customers will think that the clerks are doing everything in their ability to help the buyer.
C'Mon give me a break!
But, as with most PHB's, reducing the figure in the 'revenue' column is always more painful than reducing the figure in the 'cost' column.
"Stop whining!" - Arnold, as Mr. Kimble
Yeah, I've gotten burned by other customer's returns at Fry's in Palo Alto/MtView, LA/Topanga, and Mission Valley San Diego. I've gotten to the point that even when I'm buying a motherboard in a plastic-wrapped case, I MAKE the cashier open the box in front of me and I inspect the contents before I even deign to sign the credit card receipt.
That his company's policies lost him a $600+ sale on a new stereo.
My wife had purchased a DVD for me and it was defective (it was actaully physically damaged); we were unable to find the receipt, but decided to take it back anyways.
Far from just telling us that we had to have the receipt (in order to exchange for the exact same item, the "customer service" agent I spoke to explained to us that they had a lot of problems with theft and people trying to return items that had been stolen without a receipt. She went on to explain that as I didn't have a receipt, she had to assume I had stolen this disc and thus was not able to exchange it for an identical replacement.
We drove straight over to Circuit City and purchased our stereo. Larry, a hint for you - calling your customers thieves does NOT endear you to them. Just ask RIAA.
Insanity is a gradual process; don't rush it.
>the bank will charge you a service fee to deposit
Parent poster is in Canada. I worked in Canada one summer about 10 years ago and could not believe how customer-unfriendly the banks were. (Made BB look like Nordstrom's...)
Do Canadian banks *really* charge you a fee to accept your money? If so, and you're in Toronto or somewhere else close to the border, why not use a US bank?
The SCO lawsuit makes me wish my company were in Utah. We need a new building.
I realize this won't apply to the whole world, and maybe not most of the US, but if you can, go to Tweeter. The prices are higher then Best Buy and Circuit City, but the service has always been fantastic. The stores are calm, and easy to deal with, the sales people aren't pushy, and even listen to reason. They even know about the products they're selling. I've spent a few grand there over the years, and I would do it again in an instant. Only one time did I have a problem with a damaged item on delivery, and the next day, a brand new one was brought to replace it.
-Patrick
"They never stop thinking about new ways to harm our country and our people, and neither do we."
You are so wrong and obviously have not read the PSP brochures.
A PSP on a laptop covers the SCREEN, KEYBOARD, TRACKPAD & BATTERY! The PSP overrides the manufactures warrantee because they don't cover the SCREEN, KEYBOARD, TRACKPAD & BATTERY.
It does not cover customer abuse you are correct but who does?
A nice move with the company sales pitch ever wonder why nothing is ever in stock? They will just make you purchase it from best buy's corporate sales...
I've never been charged a fee to deposit money.
I assume it depends what bank you're with.
They're on to me! The bastards!
From the article...
Selden worked as a consultant for Royal Bank of Canada, which at one time traced checks faster for its most profitable customers, while other customers waited up to five days, he wrote. While that's a bit out of date, the bank now has other ways of prioritizing customers.
Seems Selden is a specialist in "Screwing with Customers". One wonders if he also provided his services to CIBC--the bank that decided to "serve students better" by closing on-campus branches. and replaced most of its ATMs with its own "white label" Amicus machines so it could make $1.50 per transaction off its own customers.
Of course, the Royal Bank of Canada is also the same institutuin that decided that investing in SCO would be a good gamble. Not it seems they have a long-standing policy of ignoring smaller customers. I suggest to Canadians to perhaps give the Bank of Nova Scotia or TD CanadaTrust a try...they probably do the same types of thing though...
I went in to buy GE fridge from Lowes. Sales clerk pushed hard to buy crappy + 4 years service plan because GE provides only "1 year" plan.
Imagine my surprise when I discovered it already has 5 years parts & labor warrantee from GE.
Corporate cheaters...
(Yes i guess I am unprofitable customer)
When approached or at register mimick your favorite accent and say, "No speak english well" in response to any and all questions. Works wonders.
I think the point of the movie is not so much that you can get fat eating McDonalds, it's that McDonalds is more interested in getting you fat than having you eat healthy. It's precisely the drive to super size everything that belies their claims about healthfulness. What's the highest margin item in the store? It's the super sized soda.
I mean, if they asked "would you like 500 more sugar calories and 1000 more fat calories?" instead of "super size?" how many people would go for it.
I'm not arguing against personal responsibility. I'm saying that McDonald's is talking out of both sides of their mouth by claiming to offer healthy food, meanwhlie upselling the absolute unhealthiest things in the store.
I do remember when a serving of coke was 8 oz. Diet Coke was one calorie "per serving" which meant that 12 oz can of diet coke actually had 1.5 calories in it. I believe, but I"m not sure (because I don't have a coke can handy to examine) that they have since changed the labeling to make the serving size and associated nutritional information fall in line with the size of the container. Like anybody ever bought two cans of coke and split them among three people...
It reminds me of the cereal ads "part of a balanced breakfast" where they show toast, juice, maybe some fruit, and a bowl of Cap'n Crunch. You'd have a healthier breakfast there if you just got rid of the sugary cereal.
If anyone is not convinced Best Buy is really worst buy, why not visit one of these lovely stores?
And when it finally hits you, ask yourself the next question: what's it like to work inside one of these places?
There are lots of resources online about this, but the basics are the following:
1. Absolutely no employee training.
2. You have to sell up. You have to get customers to take expensive guarantee and support policies.
3. If you don't gut the customers the way they want, you get in trouble.
It's a nightmare for any human being. They run their chain like a freaking ghetto. No one should be in the least surprised by this latest move - what's the other shoe? Asking customers to pay extra for the privilege of shopping with them?
'Best Buy' is a direct lie.
But...
Lots of businesses and services don't seem to have found out about a neat bit of applied mathematics called "Operations Research". OR will help you to find out nice things about statistical patterns of use and predict (though not perfectly) future patterns of use.
In a case like this it would give the ISP a good way to measure current use and figure out how best to buy bandwidth to accomodate it. If an ISP offers unlimited bandwidth, they should be willing to back up that offer - and figure how how best to satisfy the customers and minimize cost while doing that.
Similar things apply to stores with long lines at the cashiers, to doctors/HMO's and so on - the patterns of use are measurable and usually predictable and the service provider should be able to accomodate them.
The math is interesting although not always trivial but simulations can help.
And the poster says I still managed to offer a premium service... but makes it clear that that premium service is only being offered to customers who are not seeking the premium (unlimited bandwidth) advertised.
I couldn't agree with you more. I've had plenty of mcjobs in my day, and these bullshit policies come from the very top. These half-wit CEOs probably don't even shop at their own store (rather, they hire consultants to not shop there for them) because if they did, they'd have a clue as to just how terrible an experience it can be. Point is, don't ever argue with a salesrep--you're just wasting your time. They have neither the knowledge nor the authority to do anything beyond what management tells them.
Companies like BestBuy save a lot of money by training their employees half-assed, and then try to make up for lost revenue from shitty service by firing customers. Rather than deal with this managerial genius, just shop somewhere else. Fire your electronics supplier instead.
I must be a "demon customer." When you think about it, most often electronics are "want items" not "need items." This means that you can afford to wait for the really good deals and this is what I do. When the big day to buy the new electronic item comes, I'm up early and hit the store just as the doors open. I walk directly to the department and try to locate the item. If I can't find it I ask a salesperson where it is. If I can, I simply ask them to point me in the direction of it and I get it myself. I try not to get "sales person assistance" if I can help it. I then take my purchase directly to the check out and I decline any "service plan" that is offered me.
If a sales person pushes, I tell them in no uncertain terms that I am not interested in plans, accessories, or other things. If they push a second time, I tell them I will not be pushed and that I do not appreciate their interference. That always stops them. If they make a "final comment" I will either abandon the purchase or ignore them (depending on how bad I want it).
When I have to make a return, I try to be as perfect as possible. I save even the plastic and the tiewraps and put the package back exactly as it was when I opened it. I return the bag and even the plastic outer-wrap. I never make up excuses, if it quit working, I'll say that. If it didn't meet my expectations, I'll say that. If I am making a return, only rarely will I accept an exchange. If the return is not going smoothly, I will give the clerk two choices, either immediately accept the return or call the manager. If they call the manager, I will tell him/her there are two choices, either accept the return or I will cancel the transaction on my credit card. That always works.
As far as I am concerend, I am the customer. In a sense I vote with my money. I am free to spend it where I want, when I want. If you want my money, you will do it my way or I will go somewhere that they will.
I guess that makes me a demon customer and damn I am proud to be one. It is what makes good companies profitable and bad companies go out of business. Businesses need to compete for my money. They need to offer products at fair prices, provide a good shopping experience, and give great customer service or I will vote them off the island. I am a demon and am proud of it!
I couldn't be happier that I chose to buy that service plan on my laptop. My laptop turned out to be a lemon and I ended up with a much better laptop a year later with 2 more years on my service plan, plus more mail-in rebates. If I hadn't bought the plan, I'd have a $2000 paperweight, now I have an much better $2000 laptop and I paid just $1400 after my double rebates.
They love those extended warranties, don't they? I was buying a statistical/engineering calculator there, and predictably, she tried to sell on the extended warranty. I listened patiently and said, "No, thank you." She said, "If it breaks, you can't return it." I said, "I'll take my chances. I owned a similar model for 8 years and it never broke." She rang it up and PUT THE FUCKING EXTENDED WARRANTY ON IT ANYWAY. I told her to take it off. She said, "I thought you said you wanted it." I said, "No, I told you I do NOT want the plan." She picked up a phone and called a manager over, who asked her what was going on. She said, "This guy doesn't want the plan but I rang it up already." He looked SHOCKED, and said, "You ... don't want the extended warranty?" I said, "No, I don't." He said, "Well, do you realize if something goes wrong, you can't return it?" I said, "I realize that, and I don't care. It's not going to break." He said, "Don't be too sure, this is a brand new model, new models tend to break more." I said, "I bought a DVD player here in 96 and you told me the same thing about it. New technology, would break. I've been using that DVD player for the last 8 years and never had to so much as clean it, and it works fine. No extended warranty." The guy shook his head, and they cleared the service plan off the register. He looked at me again, and shook his head like I'm a total idiot, and walked off. The gal said, "You really should get the service plan, because that thing will probably break or you'll drop it or something." I said, "I'm sorry, but I have more faith in your products than you do, I guess."
Geez. I've quit shopping there.
Good story - painful to read, though...
Reason is the Path to God - Anon
Best Buy) Its probably best if i publish this one anonymously - sigh :(
There are a few threads that are coming up repeatedly in this discussion that I want to address namely customer service and extended warranty (specifically regarding consoles).
First off. I have not gone back to that store, nor will (if I can help it) I ever got back to any Future Shop or Best Buy store, nor will I ever recommend these stores or their products to any of my friends etc.
First off the "Why do they push PSP?" Well of course its incredibly profitable. That's pretty straightforward. Now - not as a defense of pushing PSP aggressively (I'll get to that) - but the reason that they push so hard for the Product Service Plan (PSP) / Extended Warranty is the absolute shit margin on Consoles, and everything else in comparison to how it was a number of years ago.
The margin on Playstation 2s/Xbox was 3-5%. 3-5%!!! We were making 10-15% on PS1s at the time so our company (Compucentre) FORCED consumers to buy bundles of accessories and games with Playstation 2s to drive up our margin. After launch we backed off on this but still pushed hard on accessories.
@ FutureShop the response was Extended Warranty and Accessories. At both places I was able to see the costs of the items. FutureShop's costs ones were slightly adjusted in the computer (iirc) as compared to 'real cost' in that iirc they accounted for shipping and such into the base cost of the product we could see on our terminals while Compucentre did not.
So that is why they push so hard especially on consoles and computers. Staff pricing @ FS was a bit under 10% above the cost listed in our computers. It was ALWAYS cheaper for staff to pay RETAIL for computers (especially laptops) than to pay staff for them. These really are low margin items.
AGAIN THIS DOES NOT JUSTIFY PUSHY SALESPERSONS. But if you can understand the "fear" pushed at Sales Staff from Management it makes a bit more sense.
The problem with customer service @ Best Buy and Future Shop and the like is management. Management is not promoted on the basis of Customer Service ability but on the basis of Sales ability. Certainly there are exceptions to this rule, but this is generally how it goes. I personally have been in retail sales for about 4 years or so and I have always prided myself on customer service - the customer really comes first for me and always has.
Selling appliances (especially appliances) and electronics if a customer issue comes up it is important to deal with it properly so that the customer is happy and all is working for them. This is especially important with appliances because these are essentials - you can probably live without your tv for a few days - your fridge or washer/dryer - not so much. I sold appliances in a great little Sears store in Rural Canada before I came to a bigger Canadian city and sold appliances @ FutureShop.
(Getting to the point presently I promise)
When I get to FutureShop I have to spend a lot of time dealing with customer issues. That is fine that is my job. The DIFFERENCE however between Sears & Compucentre & Futureshop was that @ Sears & Compucentre CUSTOMERS WERE FIRST. I know that not all Sears/Compucentre's are like this but at FutureShop you were berated by management if you took the time to properly address a customers concerns and ensure they were dealt with as they needed.
Customer service training is almost NIL. In fact the entire sales traning procedure is pretty piss poor. How to push PSP, How to approach customers, and company policy regarding returns/extended warranty etc. That's it. Not how to help customers to ensure they have the best possible experience. Even if "professionalism" was occasionally stressed by our management team they NEVER exhibited it themselves. A few of the Department Sales Managers were ok but the vast majority & store managers were not. Sales not Service focused.
I remember talking to a customer
We had an excellent experience with Sears yesterday when we went to buy a stovetop. We wanted a Frigidaire and I was expecting the salesperson to try to steer us to store brands. But no one did. He just took our order and only asked once if we wanted the extended warranty (we didn't). And this isn't the first time I've had good experiences with Sears.
That contrasted with buying a TV at Best Buy last year with my father. I've never heard a salesman put down his own product so in order to try to sell us a PRP. "Oh, those flat screen TV's are terrible. They don't last much more than a year." He didn't succeed either, but we went out of the store feeling dirty, like we'd been in a fleabag motel. Never again.
Case in point: Do you think Nordstrom has CRM? (hint: they use Siebel) Now do you think they would ever be caught dead treating their customers poorly? Hahahah. No way.
You've gotta separate the technology from the company.
"Avoid employing unlucky people - throw half of the pile of CVs in the bin without reading them." -- David Brent
I worked at Best Buy while looking for a full time programming job and I can tell you everything you want to know about the computer department.
:(
It is true that the managers receive bonuses based on the performance of their departments but it is based by monthly performance, so if you don't want to buy a PSP and don't want to be badgered by pressured sales people, go to buy from beginning to mid month.
Also, as any customer service or sales representative will tell you, being hostile will get you nowhere. If you antagonize me or address me as if I am beneath you, you will not get any help from me. From someone else, you will get some lip back, because it is not a job people regret losing (low paying, crappy hours, dealing with customers like you).
Last but not least. PSP (at least in my store) was a good buy ON CERTAIN ITEMS. (like emachines) We had an extraordinary number of them returned due to problems and Best Buy does not deal with manufacturer warranties. The reason people tell you "You know that you can't bring it back here if it breaks" is because many idiots bring an item back without a service plan, past the return period, and demand Best Buy to repair or replace the item. It wears down everyone in the customer service and the tech department when the customer should know that they need to contact the manufacturer.
That said, I worked in a great store, while it was a great store. Rule of thumb is: Go to a newly opened Best Buy if possible, or one where there is a lot of competition. The managers there are more experienced and customer (as well as staff) oriented because they are either:
a) training new staff or,
b) trying to retain customer base.
Our good management went away after a while (promoted internally) and supervisors, while good sales people, moved up into management and just were not so good. After that our entire computer dept. left because we could not deal with the management.
After my stints in sales, and customer service, I was amazed at how many people can be just plain rude and hostile just because someone has to ask one question (I never repeatedly asked for PSP, but I was knowlegeable about computers and thus had a better sales record, and thus was retained as an employee)
My dream is to make a "How to be a good customer" website, describing techniques of being nice AND getting what you want from the sales person (not mutually exclusive).
TANSTAAFL
I can't say that these warranties make sense every time, but for Car Stereo equipment they DEFINETLY make sense. Atleast, they did for me. Here's my story:
:(. Since then the car that all of that equipment in has died, so I salvaged the subs, the amp (which died finally out of warranty) and the cd player. I gave the cd player for my brother, bought a new amp and a fancy sony cd-mp3 player and used the old subs and speakers that came with the car to build my new system. And you better BELIEVE that I bought the warranty for the new amp and cd player.
;)
1997, bought Blapunkt CD player, Cerwin Vega front and rear speakers, generic 10" subs+box combo, Pioneer floor model AMP, and warranties for all.
Since then, with no money changing hands (except as noted), the warranty did this for me:
* First blapunkt CD player died, received replacement
* Cerwin Vega rear speakers got blown, received replacement
* Cerwin vega front speakers got blown, received replacement
* Subs got blown, received replacement
* Second blapunkt CD player died, paid $20 and upgraded to SONY since that model wasn't carried anymore
* Sony CD Player starts skipping, they ship it out for repair (much to my suprise, since Blapunkt was a replacement.. apparently sony doesn't like to replace). The repair doesn't fix it, 3 more times later I get a new cd player under lemon policy (that part sucked, but hey I got a replacement eventually)
* Amp finally dies (it was a floor model) receive replacement Rockford Fosgate (since they no longer had pioneer) at no cost to me
* Subs die along with amp, pay $50 to upgrade subs to pioneers and better bandpass box (they didn't have the old sub box any longer)
Now all of that happened during my 4 years of owning all of that equipment. If I had no warranties I would have been really screwed
It may come in handy some day.
I have all the receipts to prove this for any nonbelievers out there, and no I don't work for best buy (I'm not advocating THEM in particular here), I'm just a "demon customer" I guess
...unfortunately no one can be told what The Mat^H^H^HGoatse is...they must experience it for themselves...
I would *love* to receive fewer offers from Best Buy. The flyer in the Sunday paper is quite enough for me. I need something, I come to the store. I see what I like at a price I can live with, I hand over the price and walk away with the thing. THAT is the Shopping Experience; all else is unnecessary.
All that CRM stuff is things that only management likes -- many customers would be happier to avoid all the hassle.
One of my pet peeves: The sales clerks who come up to me, say "Are you all set?" and walk away -- generally when I'm trying to find something that isn't where it should be, looking for the price on something that isn't marked, or in the pet shop needing someone to catch me a fish.
Children in the US are generally raised to feel that saying "no" is rude -- to the point of saying "yes" and throwing subtle hints that it means "no" in social situations when the correct answer would be a flat-out "no" or promising to do things, then weaseling out of them later, because they feel it would be rude to refuse outright. Smart sales people know this, and always present questions where a "yes" answer will lead to further sales.
The default answer to "Are you all set?" (which translates to "You don't need any help, right?") is of course "yes", which allows the lazy sales clerk to get right back to whatever important goofing off they were doing at the time. They know what they're doing, and it baffles me that their managers don't put a stop to it. It does not improve the customers' feelings about a store, let alone their likelihood of finding or buying what they're looking for, to have someone say "I don't want to help you, just give me an excuse not to."
I worked for Radio Shack 10+ years ago when it was one of the pushiest hard-sell shops in the business. I quit because I didn't agree with their policies and sales tactics, especially granting credit to low-income people and then pushing them to buy flashy-looking products that were utter crap. They trained store staff intensively in how to sell, and it worked. You don't sell by saying "give me an excuse not to help you," you sell by not giving the customer a yes-or-no option but saying "How can I help you?" and getting them engaged with you. Joe Hourly might not give a flying whistle, but his boss's bonus is based on store sales, so why he allows that kind of behavior escapes me entirely. Just changing one phrase -- changing from "Are you all set?" to "How can I help you?" will make a difference in sales, not to mention in customer satisfaction.
My sister worked in a (Canadian) sports bar where many of the customers were American. Apparently the Americans tended to be much better tippers - perhaps because the service here surprisingly better?
Sweet Jeebus, I wish it had been me the salesguy had pushed. The best course of action would have been to, visibly and violently, fall to the floor (like a "fouled" NBA player) the nanosecond the salesperson touched you.
Extra style and legal attack points would've been awarded for crashing through an end-cap display case and going into a frothing grande mal seizure in the middle of the main aisle.
Then your pre-coached companions should've immediately started screaming stuff like, "Oh my GOD! What have you DONE! You've KILLED him!!!" and fumbling with medicine bottles.
I predict you would have had your pick of ambulance-chasers before you were stretchered out the front door.
The last hard drive I bought there was an amazing deal with large in-store and manufacturers rebates. When the drive was broken right off the bat, I returned it (within a few days) to get a replacement. I had already sent in the rebate stuff but that promotion had ended by the time I returned it. When I got there for the replacement, they INSISTED that the drives were now on sale and that they should give me $40 back! I'm pretty sure I wasn't entitled to that money, but I told them that about 4 times and they insisted that I was. Maybe it's not their customers that they should be worrying about!
They're a camera and AV store but have a bunch of different electronics related to that field. B&H Photo in manhattan. They have a website too here
I'm not a regular customer that goes in and spends a few hundred dollars every week but I have spent quite a bit there and I have sent friends and family there as well that have spent a lot of money there but they have no idea that I have done that.
One day I went in to get a bunch of stuff for my darkroom. A couple hundred bucks worth and I spent about the same the week before. There was one item I bought that came in two varieties. One with a floating lid the other without. I wanted the one with the floating lid and asked for it at the store when I physically went in. When I got home I relized that they gave me the one without it. There's a 39 cent different between the two but to buy the lid seperately would cost over 3 dollars plus either shipping or another 6 dollar toll to drive in and pick it up.
I called customer service to tell them. The rectified the problem by sending out the lid at no cost via ups.
They track all purchases whether you're in the store or not and maybe if I routinely pulled this kinda thing I may not have gotten that type of response.
I wanted everything for that weekend and was ticked off that I got the wrong thing but they really made up for it. When I find a place that has good customer service I like to promote it as much as I can. They're sales people are very knowledgable and helpful and not pushy. They have really good prices as well.
Even if shipping me that item at no cost wound up making my last order break even (which i highly doubt) they helped make a loyal customer even more loyal and they have easily made it up in future business from me and others I've referred.
On the same token, I can see how some customers can cause problems, but the way Best Buy sets up their business and treats their customers I'm not surprised.
Open Source Java DAO Generator
Is now owned by Best Buy, but was originally a Canadian company. And I'm sure you know how sensitive we Canadians are to being invaded by Americans. So they are keeping the Future Shops around till they can transition us over to the Best Buy. It's not like I ever spent a lot of money at Future Shop, but I'd rather spend it at a Canadian chain. However I don't look a good price in the mouth when I need an item. A Linksys Wireless G card comes to mind.
Your CPU is not doing anything else, at least do something.
Or so I watched on a special about shoplifting.
I wonder - do they have cameras and theft security in their back areas? (They should.)
I am very small, utmostly microscopic.
When you have very few choices, they can all start giving you crappy quality products and crappy customer service....because they know you won't be treated better anywhere else.
:)
What bugs me is when people say, "well, that's capitalism." No its not. Adam Smith, the founder of capitalism, wrote at great length about the harm that cartels (and monopolies) do to a capitalist economy. Capitalism thrives on the competition...once a single group wins, the competition goes away, and you no longer have a true capitalism.
It boils down to this: in order for people to receive the benefits of capitalism (good quality, good service, low prices), there must always be great competition. No one can ever be allowed to win, however.
"Those customers, they're smart, and they're costing us money."
Wasn't the market segment Dogbert was going for the stupid and rich? I pity the fool who has to sell things to the smart and frugal.
In other news 50% of the cars sold in the U.S. are SUV's.
It would seem to me that most of the problems you guys have with BB are due to your overall lack of social skills. I have had plenty of situations where I was not satisfied with something that happend at a big store like BB or Comp or circut city. Never has it involved me needing to drop the f-bomb, yell or fight anyone. In general, if you are polite and keep a cool head you can get what you want. You guys have all been in BB before. You know the score. They are goign to try to sell you a bunch of shit you don't need. It sounds like you guys go into the store looking for a fight or somekind of conflict. If you don't like the PSPs and the security checkpoints don't shop there. It sounds like, based on the way you do things, mail order might be your best method of intereaction with people.
Anything small/lightweight. Buy it online, small items are easy to package up in a box and send back and the returns policy is normally fixed and you at no point get pounded by repeated people sayin buy the 3 year cover plan.
For bigger orders buying online can be a bigger hastle, often only available by places like best-buy, but it does allow you to forgo the pressure of sales staff, first place I checked online if yore item is faulty they will come round and try and repair it, charge you 50 dolars if it wasn't broken, or if they can't fix it replace it for you.
Saves a lot of 'Can I help you sir'.
There was a case against K-Mart where one of the door natzi's stuck a letter holder into a guy's hand. K-mark paid over $1M.
Fight Spammers!
You know, I started doing this in 1992 when I started college. This was before the BB days, but I went to a HiFi Buys (which subsequently became Tweeter) and bought a receiver. It was cheap, but they still offered the PSP... I declined, but then got the idea to just take that $40 or whatever it was and stick it in a savings account. So, for the past 12 years, for big ticket items like TV's and Laptops and other stuff that would suck to have to replace, I've declined the PSP, but put the cost of the PSP in that savings account. Whenever something has broken beyond repair, I've used that money to replace it.
Today, 12 years later, I'm SO ridiculously far ahead of the game. By simply self-insuring on breakage, I've managed to amass about $4K in that account (and a lot of it is interest).
Just think about all of the cell phones, TVs, appliances, CD players, and other crap the average person buys in 12 years... a PSP is usually about 25% of the cost of an item, so you can well imagine that can add up to a large sum. With a failure rate of around 3% (infant mortality excluded because it's covered under manufacturer's warranty), that's a gigantic profit...
the great thing about capitalism is that you don't have to shop at best buy, and if enough people stop shopping at best buy all of a sudden those "demon customers" won't look so bad.
lose != loose
When I was in college, Nationsbank (now part of Bank of America, IIRC) tried to charge $3.00 for every time you went to see a (human) teller. They pretty much got laughed out of town on that one (as the bank next door quickly put up a sign advertising truly free checking for students), but they stuck with their guns for at least a few months. I can only imagine the sort of PHB that would come up with that gem of an idea...
...but if they touch you they go to jail and the store gets sued
Jeezus, what a nation of pansies we've become. 'Boo fricken hoo, the bad man touched me!'
Some Best Buy loser 'touches' me, he'll end up touching my fist with his face, repeatedly and with vigour.
Mod down people who tell people how to mod in their sigs
I don't know... a lot of times, this comes off as just another sales tactic.
For example, I remember buying a tv/vcr combo about 8 or so years ago at Circuit City. The salesman wasn't pushy or anything, but he did say something about how tv/vcr combos tend to need servicing once every year or so, and that the service would be covered under the warranty plan the store offered. I declined the offer. I have not had one problem with the unit, and I still use it on a daily basis. Servicing my bum--it was just a way to try to sell up the store's warranty plan.
"Righteous speed demon and trust fund party darling of justice"
Welcome to the wonderful world of Pricing High For Discounts!
This kind of idea is exactly why you need medical insurance in the USA. The insurance companies are discounted down to as little as 10% what a cash-paying customer would.
To keep their discounts as low as possible, the insurance companies have to play stupid games like refusing a certain percentage of legitimate claims. The hospitals, on the other hand, raise their cash prices higher and higher so they can use "But look at the discount!" as a negotiating tool.
It sounds great until you realize what you're essentially doing is forming a quasi-governmental price-fixing organization and replacing a free market process with a political one. All manner of backstabbery naturally ensues.
In the end, the price-fixing organization becomes parasitic yet indispensible. Those who are in it enjoy a little slice of communism, with shortages, queues, people telling you what (or from whom, in this case) you may buy, and general lack of consumer choice, while paying for the privelege. Those who are outside the iron curtain enjoy hostile, punitive pricing and service specifically designed to drive people to join.
Or better yet, reduce the price of the item by the amount of the rebate and do away with the rebate! WoooHOOO - no more pesky little pieces of paper or annoying sales pitches (an the mouths they come out of)...not to say what that would do to the number of "bad customers".
Fuck 'em!
The last time I went into a Best Buy was a couple of weeks ago to buy a washer-dryer set for my step-daughter and son-in-law, who had just had a baby and couldn't afford it themselves.
I had already shopped around (without any salesperson help) and knew exactly the units I wanted to buy. When I got there, the salseman in the Appliance dept. was busy with a customer, but he acknowledged me within 5 or 10 minutes and promised to get somebody there to help me. He did not, however, page anybody or do anything else, he just went back to helping the elderly couple he was with. After standing there for about 30 minutes, I finally got fed up, went to the front of the store, and told the guy who guards the door that I knew what I wanted, but could get no help in the Appliance dept. He had to page 2 people before a manager finally showed up to help me. After all that, they were out of stock on the dryer, so I had to go to another store anyway.
I will say that the manager was helpful in locating another Best Buy store nearby with both units in stock.
But I ask, who is the "demon" here? Why does Best Buy think their salespeople's time is more valuable than mine? Not to me! I'm probably on their "demon" list because I ALWAYS refuse the ripoff "extended warranty". On the other hand, I usually already know exactly what I want and where to find it, so I very seldom require sales assistance.
But if this is going to be Best Buy's attitude, they can count me out as their customer. I'll go away on my own. Perhaps they'll find that policies like this tend to "throw the baby out with the bath-water" and are counter-productive. It should be obvious - maybe they should consult with Wal-Mart before embarking on this path.
Now, if only Fry's would come to Kansas City! The 10 or so Best Buy's in this town will all disappear overnight when that happens. Fry's would blow them away!
Now you're done shopping? Would you like to put this on our store issued credit card? Don't have one? Well what's holding you back from opening a 25% interest account? I must insist!
(Incidentally they feed us BS saying that the real reason they issue cards is because those customers who have them tend to be more loyal and spend more than on your standard everyday credit card, but if that was the case why charge so much interest?)
Actually, the real reason they push those cards is to save on transaction fees. Think about all those credit card transactions that a retail store processes daily. Then think about the fee that they pay for EACH transaction. When I worked for a clothing store that will remain nameless I was told they pay about 5 million dollars in transaction fees a year.
Now if only they passed on the savings to the customer.......
I never really liked them anyway.
--
If I actually could spell I'd have spelled it right in the first place.
I'm not kidding. I noticed on Fatwallet that a MP3 player was being sold for $50 with a $50 rebate. Yea it was not the greatest, but who cares, it would ultimately cost me only tax plus time waiting for the rebate. When I went to the register, the guy said, "I guess you don't want the PSP huh?". I said if this sucker breaks, it goes in the trash. They have to ask the question, but at least this guy was intelligent enough to realize it made no sense.
The funny thing was when the rebate arrived, it was already past its "cash by date". I called and bitched about it, and ended up getting 2 checks due to a screw up on their end.
Thanks for bringing this up since I intend to buy an HDTV in the nxt 6 months and planned on getting the PSP (If I'm dropping ~2500 on a TV, I don't want to drop another ~2500 once the warranty runs out). I will read the extended warranty info VERY carefully now.
-truth
I had a steady B+ in my AI class until I failed the Turing test...
Heh. Thinking about how all those credit card companies are looking for people with great credit ratings, carrying over high balances month to month, and never ever missing a payment.
You could sum up all of these business strategies as looking for that most ephemeral and elusive market segment: rich fools.
"Provided by the management for your protection."
AppleCare is the one extended warranty that is ALWAYS worth it. Seriously. I'm not an apple emloyee, just a fanatic. Who has bought 3 machines with AppleCare, and each time saved at least twice the AC cost in repairs. Things like getting my powerbook's HD replaced because later models were much quieter. Getting 85% of the machine replaced two years into owning it due mainly to a dim screen and some power issues. With a little creative timing of repair requests, AppleCare is an AWESOME deal.
I always assumed that they just scanned the reciept barcode when processing the rebate. That way they could keep track of which ones have been issued. This would help eliminate duplicate submissions, and if a rebate check had already been sent, they could know that when accepting the item for a return.
Did you mount a military-grade, variable-focus MASER on an unlicensed artificial intelligence?
Every business has customers who are a royal pain in the a**. Even when waiting tables in a restaurant, you get to know the dreaded customers who always have something to complain about. You can never make them happy, no matter how hard you try. After bending over backwards for them, they leave an insultingly small tip. Most of them are cheap bastards/bitches who will complain about the slightest thing just to get a voucher for a free meal. However, it is bad PR to be overt about telling such losers to bug off. It will just cause them to badmouth your business to friends.
I can't believe Best Buy is trying to say that customers are trying to screw them. Best Buy is trying to screw the customers. They know very well that when they offer rebates, only 50% is ever redeemed (via lost mail, illegilbe receipts, or just pretending they never got it). No matter how much the rebate is. Add that to the fact that they collect sales tax on the full price, and only have to pay taxes on the ending price, and they make more than we think. ($50 - $50 rebate = $0 profit? $50 + $5 in taxes - $50 rebate - $0 tax (because no profit) = $5 in their pocket......hmmmm....)
Best Buy is just complaining because they can't screw the really smart people.
http://www.geocities.com/zippy55512/bestbuy/
I understand the issues over PSP's. How about the hassles of getting those rebates??!! I've gotten two computers in teh last year...one Compaq and one HP. Both offered manufacturer rebates and one offered a store rebate (Circuit City). Both of the manufacturer rebates took me months to receive. I know they offer those rebates in the hopes that most people won't bother persuing them. Well I'm one that does. I'm not turning down the $100 or so rebate. It takes at least 5 or 6 phone calls to the rebate center after you send it in to get them to process it. One of the companies told me I never sent them a copy of the sales receipt. I kept copies of everything I sent them. So obviously, I mailed them a second set of copies (receipt and rebate forms). After having them write me again that they never received the information, I asked for their fax number. I faxed the copies to them so there was no question that they were recieved. Rebates should not be such a hassle to get! Now I don't even bother figuring on a rebate if I want to purchase something.
Credit card companies do that regardless.
And of course, it's in "your best interest"...
I go to a store, and buy a $1200 item, with a year to pay, no interest. Comes out to $100 a month, no problem. 2 months later, I go in to my local store, purchase $50 worth of something. My $100 check that month, rather than going toward the outstanding 1000, pays off the 50 I just spent first (which has the 25% interest rate), then whatever's left goes to the 1000 balance (0% interest).
Sometimes, you can make this work for you. Recently, I received a CC offer (the "checks" various CC companies like to send cardholders to encourage you to carry a larger balance) with a 4% forever rate on transfers. Needless to say, I maxxed that card out quickly (and paid off a few others). Now, anything that I pay on that card, goes to the new balances, not the 4% balance... and it will until I pay off the new charges.
So, sometimes it's a good deal. Sometimes, it just sucks. Personally, I'm looking forward to being out of debt, and not having any credit cards....
I am dyslexia of borg - your ass will be laminated.
Lots of talk here about how bad Best Buy is, and how people shouldn't or even don't shop there anymore. If you are serious about affecting change with your buying power as a consumer, you need to be prepared to pay more somewhere else.
I haven't shopped at Best Buy for two years, and I haven't looked back, but I have paid more for items that could've been bought more cheaply there. I chalk it up to the cost of better service.
I agree that the customer is not always right. Dishonest and unscrupulous "customers" will take advantage of even the most honest businessman. Best Buy, however, is the last business that deserves to judge its customers in this fashion. Their staff are underpaid and undertrained, and in some instances, pushy and insulting. No Best Buy employee has ever been able to answer my questions about the technical specification of any product. And their selection is more and more limited every day.
For instance, if I want to buy a CD, I'll get a better selection, better service, and knowledgeable staff at the local record store. I'll pay more, yes. But I will get more in return, in the long run.
If you are not willing to do the same, then there is no sense in complaining about Best Buy. Their policies, along with their prices, are a direct result of cost-cutting, and the first cost to be cut is service.
1) The customers want sales. They demand sales. A significant percentage of customers will not buy from you unless the item is on sale. It's the US version of haggling.
/.ers have been refering and easily understood: offer item A cheap to bring in the customer, hoping that people will buy regular priced item B as well, and/or get in the habit of coming to your store anyway. (Creatures of habit, these humans....)
2) Sales lure in new business
These really ought to be listed as three parts.
1) Sales imply to consumers that something is more worthwhile, and therefore consumers infer it is worthwhile. (Ah, the marching morons....)
1.5) Sales allow you to extract smaller (but still positive) marginal profits from the marginal customers who are willing buyers at a price somewhere between your regular price and your break-even price. The value-of-information, time-value of money, and joint time/infomation value analyses implied are left as an exercise for the student. =)
2) The part that most
//Information does not want to be free; it wants to breed.
I (nor my family) haven't stepped a foot in a Best Buy in over 2 years, before that is was over 3 years. I refuse to do business with them based on the 2 whole times I have entered their store.
If Kerry was the answer, it must have been a stupid question.
The UN - The largest "political" cause of death.
My advice...save your money and/or buy one component at a time...get quality, good matching equipment, proper crossovers, fuzing.....and you will get the best sound, and nothing blowing. It is not normal for a good system to blow....a well put together system (allowing for occasional factory defects) of quality components should easily make your ears bleed with clean, un-distorted sound before anything in the system blows.
Light travels faster than sound. This is why some people appear bright until you hear them speak.........
And then that best buy looser sues you and you go to jail. It's just a push, drop it. Now if it's a violent push, then he started the fight, and you were in danger. drop him like a hot plate.
--Forest C. Adcock--
When I opened a Best Buy account, (just to take advantage of their 0 interest program), the form had a option to also ask for a Household Mastercard, which I declined. I checked NO on the box to decline it, and the sales person protested, saying that it was a great card t have. I again said that I didn't want one.
They opened a Mastercard acount for me anyway, and sent me a card, which I never activated, because I never applied for one.
Then, a few months later, they sent me a letter saying they were closing my account for either 1. bad history on my credit (which there is none), or 2. for Overuse of other credit lines (which isn't there either.).
I wanted to contact them, and explain that I never even applied for a Mastercard account, and to tell them to remove that from my credit report, as it now shows up as and opened and then closed account. They didn't include a phone number on the letter, and I never bothered to mail them anything, as I don't think having it opened and then closed actually damages my credit history.
STill it's annoying, as they never should have sent me a Mastercard in the first place.
-- -- Warning. Do not stare directly at the sun.
I found this article timely: Miami Beach man's bomb threat arrest questioned
I get down to basics - are they selling what I'm there to buy, at a price I'm willing to pay? That's all there is to it. If they are, I usually pay cash. I ESPECIALLY don't do rebates unless it's awarded at the register during checkout. And I NEVER buy extended warranties. Ultimately, my business will go to whomever can give me the best deal with the least amount of hassle.
Same with groceries. I am a value buyer. I buy what's on sale, what I need, and nothing more. It would be damn funny if I was told not to come back because I didn't buy enough of the over-priced brand-name crap they're selling.
hey i work for best buy and i do know that all that psp bs is a rip off unless its for a cell phone or laptop battery or subwoofers for cars all those things dont even get second looked for excahnages unless an lcd screen is broken but any who heres a way to screw them over juss go to any store phone (the grey ones) and dial in 60 its their PA system juss yeah it will be fun but you have to kinda yell for pepople to hear it. i hate the company and i regret ever working there all i work there for is the hot girl in the summer ive gotten quite a few numbers and thats prety much it. oh yeah and they hire the cashiers on how well they preform if ya get my drift.
Now thanks to Best Buy, we can start to tell really annoying co-workers and colleagues to STFU about how they did on the Tiger Woods golf game and let us get some work done already.
I worked for Chimp USA in college. Most people there didn't know a damn thing about comuters, so I was the 'go to' guy when a customer asked a 'difficult' technical question. ("Does this computer have 66 or 100 speed RAMS?")
They had extended warrenty plans that they tried to sell people, that they called 'spiffs'. (can't recall what it stood for, but some coporate weasle doubletalk.) They were basically insurance plans. They were legit, and if your stuff failed in the time period, you got a check back for repairs or replacement. The catch was that most people don't keep paperwork for the warranties for 3-5 years. (Most people can't find a manual in 6 months, let alone reciepts.)
They didn't pay comissions to the salespeople, but they gave small bonuses for selling spiffs. I imagine that playing real comissions would cost too much, corp management seemed to be REALLY cheap. One career salesman quit because the comissions were so lousy compaired to most other jobs.
We also had 'cheapskate customers' that would come in and suck up all the little sale items. Typicaly, most stuff that went on sale there was basically junk. They got stuff for 'free' (after rebate) or really cheap, but you only get what you pay for. I personally buy name brand electronics, and I have NEVER been dissapointed.
I imagine that BB is probably the same way. Stupid staff (because they are too cheap to hire real talent) and overworked money grubbing managers.
HA! I just wasted some of your bandwidth with a frivolous sig!
Or did you just charge him a "service fee". You probably already know all about this but in most states you would need to become a reseller and get a permit to do that. The way many consultants deal with computer hardware is to just sell items at cost as a service to clients and then add on a "servie or consultant fee". I just pointed this out because it sounded more like you did this as a one time thing as opposed to being an actual reseller who does this sort of thing all the time.
If you wanna get rich, you know that payback is a bitch
Yeah, as far as "product replacement policies" go, I will never buy another one again.
I bought a iPod a while back from BB, and bought the $40 PRP for it (I was told there were many, many instances of iPods dying within just a couple years). Anyway, I thought, great, now I am good to go if I get a DOA battery or whatever (very common with iPods).
Sadly, a few days after my purchase, I scratched the screen to the iPod pretty badly (with a plastic key card, whoops).
A few weeks later, my battery stopped holding a reasonable charge (would only last about 1 hour). I thought to myself: Thank $DIETY that I got that PRP, it'll save me a few weeks of being without my iPod (if I sent it in under warranty)!
Anyway, I take the iPod into BB, and they flatly refuse to exchange it. They claimed I was lying about the battery problem, and that I was trying to get a replacement because the screen was scratched. I told them I didn't care about htat, and it should be a simple thing to replace the battery, no need to replace the whole thing. They told me they didn't do work on iPods (fair enough). So then I told them to try it themselves (overnight if necessary!), but they refused to do that too.
At that point, after getting called a liar by the customer service rep, I escalated the situation by going to one of the managers, and after several minutes of arguing (and several threats to call the BBB (and other watchdog agencies), never coming back to the store (I've purchased a lot of junk there) I finally got the replacement.
To make a long story short, I'll never buy a PRP again, and probably will avoid BB too.
The moral of the story is Worst Buy isn't the only gig in town.
people that deliberately missuse electronics like that to abuse store policies is why it's such a hassle to make a claim on "insurance", and why it costs so much.
it's the same thing as why car insurance costs so much... because of fraud.
it only takes one bad apple....
"I have no special gift, I am only passionately curious." - Albert Einstein
Well as long as we are all telling stories about Bes t Buy, here's mine.
:P
I bought a DVD Player at a Best Buy once. This sales guy sees that I'm getting a DVD player and tells me "You have to buy this cable or it won't work" while holding a quite pricey component video cable in his hand. I told him no, thinking I could buy it somewhere else for much cheaper, which I did.
After refusing to buy the cable at least 3 times and telling him finally "I will not buy this cable no matter what you do", he walks away and I go about my shopping.
A few minutes later I take a look into my shopping cart, and there lies the component video cable in all its glory. I was furious and amused at the same time. I tried to find the pushy sales guy to confront him but he must have been watching me from a distance or something.
Even if I hadn't noticed the cable in the cart, I would ultimately see it at the cash register. What might he think I would do? Buy it, because it's there already ??
Oktay (forgot my username/pass)
I believe it was Mr. Simpson who stated: "Extended warranty?! How can I lose?"
...when charges are "pending" the CC company won't cancel them yet, but they still diminish your spending limit. That's what CapitalOne does anyway, and I'd imagine they're industry standard.
And I believe that State law was on my side. I doesn't matter anyway, since they didn't change the price for at least another few weeks. I lost patience with the channels of recourse for these things. Consumers are screwed in these situations. At least I went on record with the FTC and the NY State AG's office. There's too much red tape to justify actually pursuing this type of claim, though. Also, documenting the transaction and the website's offer is a pain in the ass, and subject to defenses by Best Buy that the printed docs are forged. In other words, I gave up and put Best Buy on my shit list and call them out as bastards every chance that I get.
Read this article and you will see that a very successful business can be built on a customer focus (the urban legend is a peripheral point): link.
> he got a fantastic deal on the Jaguar...
there is no such thing as a good deal on a jag... except for the repair shop.
... hi bingo
If you called the police (at least here in Texas), they would show up and probably arrest YOU, since you were (in their minds) causing a disturbance at this fine, upstanding establishment. I've personally seen many interactions between police and citizens where, right or wrong, the interests of "public order" are weighed above individual rights.
Classic example. My girlfriend came to pick me up at my apartment complex. She parked in my spot, but had no parking sticker. Within the two minutes it took for us to get to her car, a tow truck (contracted by the apt. management) had swooped in and hitched her car. I explained that he was making a mistake, it was MY spot and I wanted that car in it. Tow truck guy didn't care. I called the police, the police showed up and (I swear to God I am not making this up) said that not only were they not going to stop the tow truck guy from taking my girlfriend's car, but that they were going to hang around and make sure I didn't give the tow truck driver a hard time or else they would arrest me.
"Stop throwing the Constitution in my face, it's just a goddamned piece of paper!" - George W. Bush Nov. 2005
I work for Vons, a grocery store chain in southern california. I know exactly what it is like to have customers that will go out of their way completely for a dollar. Being a checker, I typically either A) give them the dollar to go away so I can help customers I like or B) tell them they must speak with my boss.
Typically if they are bothersome enough will simply give in. Mostly it depends on the item and the customer. We are a small store and we know our customers because have the employees are friends with them.
If we have a wrong price on the shelf and the item comes up higher, we give it to you free, but only the first one. We have one customer that looks for these particular items and bitches every single time.
We have other customers that we call coupon shoppers. They buy everything on sale, and they have a coupon for each and every item. We the first unique coupon. These customers generally leave with $100 of stuff for under $10. To make matters worse, they send each and every child they have with another club card (its one per family, not person) and a whole set of exactly the same coupons. As a checker you could very well end up ringing up the same exact order 5-10 times a day. This by the way is why many products are out of stock all the time. We order enough for normal customers, we do not order enough to stock other people's small business.
Sorry about the rant, but people who have never worked retail just do not understand.
Brendan
I tried to buy the new Nikon D70 online. They cancelled my order 48 hours after I made it. So I called them and they said it had been cancelled for fraud. The only reason they could give was that my address on my purchase and the address on my best buy credit card didn't match. I did have a different shipping address, but the billing address was the same. After calling the bestbuy credit card people a few times and then calling the bestbuy.com support back the bestbuy.com support person put the order in again after verifying the address and changing my middle initial from 's' to 'S'. Within 48 hours it was cancelled again. This time I got both the bestbuy.com support and the bestbuy credit card company on the line together. THey both said that the information matched. No one could give me a real reason as to why the order was being marked as fraud and cancelled. One person said that it was an automated system that does the fraud checks, the other said it was a team of people. They offered to again put my order in but could give NO promise that it would not be cancelled. So another 48 hours of online status checking and calling bestbuy.com support and hearing things from 'i see no reason your order should not go through' to 'your order will likely be cancelled again' the order was cancelled. I called the office of the general manager for bestbuy.com. He was of course unavailable but his assistant was quite helpful. She put me in contact with one guy who promised that he could help. He looked over the order and resubmitted it promising to check up on it and make it work. This guy gave me updates a couple times a day and did whatever needed to be done to get the order through. My order was shipped 72 hours later. After countless hours on the phone, and much pulling out of hair I got my order. Their customer support is AWFUL. I will still sometimes browse their retail stores, but they will NEVER get a large order from me, and NEVER _ANY_ online business.
I'm not saying that every service plan BB pushes is good. But there are times when their service plans do pay for themselves.
2 cases in point.
I purchased a laptop from BB back in 98. I bought the extended warranty out of concern for the LCD which I had had problems with on a previous laptop. 2 years 11 months 22 days later the hard drive died. I brought it in, they confirmed that it was still under warranty and 5 days later I had my laptop back with a new HD (and 3x more space than the original).
Shortly after that I purchased a pda, again I sprung for the extended warranty. A year later when the screen stopped working, I brought it in. They grabbed another off the shelf and replaced it on the spot.
All in all I would have to say that I have had a good experience with BB extended warranties.
If you just be careful with what you buy them for they can actually be quite useful.
Minne-snow-da: Winter is comming...
Running an ISP is not high-profit on a per user basis.
You get people paying a $20/month individual account fee but they want the services of a $600 dedicated connection.
So you have a choice...you limit what they can do, you ask them to leave, or you raise everyone's prices to make up for their behavior The ISP who provides me two T-1 lines as well as my home DSL service discovered 95% of it's DSL bandwidth was being used by the same 3% of the users. They had a choice; put on some limits or raise the price for everyone else.
Buffets can and sometimes do ask people not to come back, and ISPs can do it as well. It's not fair to ask the rest of us to pay $50 a month because you are a "data glutton" who does not care to pay for what he uses. If you want a commerical connection, then pay for the damn thing.
I worked at best buy while I was in high school. If you listen to the intercom is most stores you will hear a long series of number being read. "Home office dial 23", "home audio dial 12", "PC tech dial the operator". Those are the percentages of PSPs/PRPs to total sales. So, the next time you are at best buy, listen to the intercom to see how many suckers there are out there.
I was in some kind of weird mood, so instead of just saying "No", I said "I'll forego that opportunity, thank you."
She misunderstands. She thinks I'm saying "yes". She looks at my Visa and says "this doesn't look like a Sears card." I say, "It isn't. It's a visa."
She says, "oh, my mistake. Well, you got 10% off!"
I leave the store, all smiles.
One of my close friends works in the corporate headquarters of Best Buy answering customer calls and "solving" their problems. Best Buy does all sorts of shady stuff. If you pay with a credit card, they track your purchases. Then they flag you if you return an excessive amount of items or other things of the like.
Guess what else - they don't answer your call in the order it was received. Nope - if they know who is on the line waiting for service, the computer checks your purchase history. Then it gives you better service if you've been feeding their budget better.
Oh, one last thing. Slashdotters might appreciate this one - they lie over the phone during technical difficulties. You see, it looks pretty bad when they're helping a customer on the phone with their PC and the Best Buy PCs are crashing, so they say "Sorry, our system is currently UPDATING" hehe, LIARS!
Or... fall backwards from his "push", land on your ass and start wailing at the top of your lungs. Get a good crowd gathered around, and then pull out the cellphone and start dialing 911... See if they let you hit 'send' before you get the free TV.
-T
Clubs are what every shopper needs to carry. When a saleman tries to do his sworn duty and extract extended warranty or some other fraud, Whump, smash them with the stick! Expired rebates for overpriced merchandise? Wack! Bait and switch, Blammo! All from one simple device.
Yes, I've been a retail sales dude. I hated the sleazy sales guys who followed along with the company's greed. They were such sheep, earning their crappy five bucks an hour. The most they could hope for, was 20k/year if they are lucky enough to have any form of profit sharing. Places that think the customer is wrong generally have punishment plans in place for employees too. They need the clue bat!
Friends don't help friends install M$ junk.
Witness your fear of using the word "balls" on Slashdot.
--
"Outlook not so good." That magic 8-ball knows everything! I'll ask about Exchange Server next.
I'm not afraid to admit that I work for Best Buy. I don't agree with everything that goes on (sometimes I feel like there's major brainwashing happening. I've rolled many an eye.), but from day one, I have been highly impressed by the quality of the customer service that is provided by my particular store. I've worked retail before...CompUSA for about a year and a half, and I saw all sorts of bad. In fact, not much long after I left, pretty much all of the managers were either fired, transfered out, or forced to leave. At this Best Buy, I've seen employees go above and beyond for the customer. It's not to say we're going to bend over and take shit from a trouble customer, but we do everything we can to keep the customer happy. And this is not hack, this is sincere. I'm about as cynical as they come. I'm highly impressed by the employees at my store.
A little about me. I pride myself on being an honest, trustworthy person. I have no need to lie to customers on anything, be it answering a simple question or selling a computer system (I sell computers, by the way). When I first started working there, I decided that I would do a personal experiment: I would sell with complete honesty, and see how well it works. How did it go? Since the beginning, I had been given practically full time hours, and I am now a full timer. I'm often referred to as one of the best salesmen (sincere or not, I don't know, but I believe it). I don't lie to customers. I don't say "Oh yeah, this PSP covers everything." No, in fact I point out some of the major things the PSP isn't going to cover, and that hasn't seemed to cost me a PSP sale. The thing is, what a PSP doesn't cover aren't even covered by manufacturers (accidental damage, cosmetic damage, viruses and software issues), so it's not like they're losing out.
When I don't know something about a product, I don't fudge it, and I don't understand why people even try to fudge it. My geek credibility means a lot to me, and I don't feel the desire to make up some bullshit story when somebody asks me "what does this do?" and I have no idea. I tell them, "You know, I'm not really sure, but I would think that maybe this is what it does...but that's just a theory." Is that so hard to tell a customer? I know some customers that obviously know what they're talking about try to test me. They want to see me squirm. I don't give them the satisfaction. I don't work at Best Buy because I like selling, I work there because I like talking to people about computers.
Those who disagree with this article or raise a stink about it either A) are the customers who this article is targeting, or B) have never worked retail in their lives. I never, ever, in any job, believed that "the customer is always right." This is simply not true. This gives customers the right to be assholes, the right to demand being treated superhumanly because they decided to speak up, the ability to think that they are right and you're wrong. In all my experience in retail, I love the asshole customers the most. It brightens my day to see some prick go off the wall about something. "Oh, you mean I bought these computers from you and you won't service them?" "Did you buy the PSP?" "No." "Well, the reason why we offer the PSP is because things like this do happen. Unfortunately when you purchased your computer, you made the decision that you would not need it, and unfortunately that means we cannot service your system free of charge." I've dealt with that many of times...I've seen many an asshole customer.
The PSP is hardly a scam. If you knew the insides and outs of them, you could see the benefit and then make an *informed* decision as to whether you want it or not. If someone offers it to you and you flat out deny it, you didn't even give the guy a chance to explain it to you. If someone flat out says "No" after I say "Let's talk a little bit about the PSP," I say "You know, I'm sorry but this is part of my job. If you'd allow me to explain a few things and then you can make your decision..." I don't com
Faith: A system of perception that relies upon the merits of the object of faith for substantiation and justification rather than the perspicacity of the subject. (contrast empiricism and rationalism to flesh out the idea)
When the only tool you have is a claw hammer every problem starts to look like the back of someone's skull.
technicaly (we love that word around here), playing the lottery is gambling too :P
- Disclaimer: Information in this post deemed reliable but not guaranteed.
My rule of thumb for "Stacking the Deck":
If it is new tech or portable get the service deal! portable mp3 players come to mind fairly new and untested. Even if you break it yourself by dropping it they will fix or replace.
If it is older, tried and true technology just skip it.
I have had portable cd players replaced multiple times when they were still fairly expensive, and I have already had my mp3 player replaced (and upgraded) through a service plan. I wish I had gotten a plan for my first 1X external cd burner way back in the day, the technology was just not mature enough to create something reliable.
It's only illegal descrimination when you're manipulating prices or offers based on the so called "protected classes" mentioned in the laws. "One who frequently breaks stuff" is not such a class...
This is a good point. This was a question on the company harrassment test we had a few months ago-- it involved a company run by dog owners letting a hard-working guy go because he didn't like dogs. I automatically assumed that was discriminatory-- but it's not! Since "People Who Don't Like Dogs" are not a protected class of people under US anti-discrimination laws, you can discriminate against them as much as you'd like.
I think in my original post, I didn't make clear what bothers me so much. Yes, obviously customers who spend lots of money are going to get some perks. But customer service reps need to have a minimum standard for decency in the treatment of a customer. Making a large business owner not wait for his meeting at the bank is one thing, but treating customers like garbage just because they don't have as much money is another. Getting somewhat slower service is different than being treated rudely by some customer service rep. or having to spend hours resolving a simple billing error. What bothers me is that it seems that many large companies are drifting way too far to the extremes of treating their lower-priority customers like dirt. Sure, that's capitalism, and no it shouldn't be illegal (notice I qualified with words like "almost"), but it doesn't mean that it doesn't suck. And, believe it or not, some companies that DO bother to spend a little more money on customer service see it pay off.
I'm simply lamenting the fact that companies like cell phone providers seem to use the facelessness of customer service transactions to provide "service" that seems increasingly worse. Sure, I can take my business elsewhere, but in a lot of cases, the question is "where"? For instance, it seems that every single cell phone provider gives crap service these days. Yeah, that's capitalism and no, it shouldn't be illegal, but hell, you would hope that some company would be decent or smart enough to think that they could gain an advantage over their competitors by making an effort to provide decent customer service.
Calling a liar a liar sounds like something this guy does on a regular basis.
He runs a video game rental store in Canada, and doesn't hesitate to give shit to people who are trying to rip him off. "I'm sorry, I'm afraid I subscribe to the theory of intellectual osmosis. As such, I must now cease our conversation and move away from you before my intelligence begins to drop. Good day." is one of the far, far more polite ones.
You cannot apply a technological solution to a sociological problem. (Edwards' Law)
The flip side is we have one of the most sophisticated clearing systems in the world. This means things like debit, direct deposit, direct withdrawl, etc, are practically universal (here in Alberta, even little gas stations in the boonies have debit, which is incredibly convenient at times), unlike certain other countries to the south of us. Moreover, because the banks that do exist are quite large, you never have to worry about one of them running out of business. 'course, that's no excuse to crank user fees like the banks have (all in the name of profit, the greedy SOBs), but there are certain advantages to having a handful of large banks, rather than a huge population of small ones.
Incidentally, I don't see the bank market dwindling much more than it has. The government is relatively savvy regarding these issues, and they can't possibly miss the impact on competition that further consolidation would have (heck, all you have to do is look at the results of the big media mergers to the south).
Watch out for that warranty. My in-laws recently tried to get warranty service on their GE refrigerator.
It was going to cost $100 for the service call and $70 an hour for the technician to check it out, even if the problem was covered by the warranty. They were also informed that nobody could look at it for about 17 days. That's a long time to be without a refrigerator/freezer.
Considering the fact that the tech probably wouldn't be in a hurry, would be motivated to find issues that wouldn't be covered, and would be looking to sell them parts and labor above the minimum, the in-laws decided to just buy a new refrigerator.
But not a GE model.
About three weeks ago, I went into Best Buy and bought four 50-packs of 4X Verbatim DVD-R blanks ON SALE for $172.36 out the door, which was a very good price (non-sale price would have been $301.66).
I noticed a couple days ago that they had an even better deal: 25-packs of 4X Verbatim DVD-Rs for $14.99 each. So I took back the 3 unopened packs I bought three weeks ago and got a refund of $129.27. I then went and bought EIGHT 25-packs for $129.21 for a net gain of 50 more DVD-R blanks and $0.06. And you bet if I wouldn't have opened the first 50-pack I would have taken that back too. 30-day refund policy is certainly helpful here.
So I ask: Am I a "demon customer" or just "smart"?
At least in this dimension it isn't. The customer isn't always right but is never wrong? Apparently Sears has writers from a different dimension where logic doesn't apply.
What's that? You mean that "wrong?" My mistake. I must have misunderstood the entire english language.
Is there any chance there's enough folks from /. to buy up 51% of BestBuy stock and then remove the PRP's entirely? :)
I worked a return desk for a little under 2 years at a discout department store. That pretty much killed off any compassion for my fellow human, after cranky, whining, obnoxious people trying to return blatently damaged by themselves stuff.
Holidays, ugh. Aside for the personnel staff saying no one was going to get time off holidays off was just lame. Then of course, in the season of guilt that happens every December, every shopper seems to become horribly cheap because the neighbor 3 blocks away that they never talk to just sent them a gift and now they feel guilty for not first sending a gift.
All working retail tought me do to was return stuff, hit the right buttons w/ the low paid person at the counter. Demon shopper, me, probably, and I'm fine w/ that.
Of course, customer service in general is dead. The larger markets, and bigger chains can afford to blow people/customers off because they'll draw in enough new people because they are who they are (BB are you listening?!?). I live in SE MN, pretty much middle of nowhere MN (I get told a lot of the chains that "our stores in the Twin Cities have it"). There are some chains, and yes, a BB, that I try to avoid (no I don't need your help, no I don't need you to install it, no I don't wan't the useless, waste of money PSP, I'll get CDs and DVDs there, that's about it). Anyway, for a few years just about every store had a "Help Wanted" sign, meaning all the overly paid burger flippers could go down the street to another job and abuse the customers if they didn't like the current gig. At this point, customer service didn't exists, no staff at any chain store cared. Now that there seems to be a low-paid lackey for hire surplus, things are slowing getting better at some locales.
Of course, once the department gets the sense to leave you alone, when you really do need there help, you can't find staff. There's a reason I'm a good store shelf climber, since I can't find staff when I want them.
I have learned that the mom and pop shops in the city where I live are quite useful, helpful, knowledgeable and non-nagging. They know they can't afford to blow people off, and it shows.
When in danger or in doubt, run in circles, scream and shout.
-FL
technicaly (we love that word around here)
:P
Sorry, I don't understand. What language is this word from, and why do you all love it?
playing the lottery is gambling too
Where in the post was the implication made that the lottery is not gambling. In fact, that was the whole point. Both the lottery AND the roulette table were used as supplementary examples of gambling with ideally non-deterministic outcomes.
I hope for your sake that you don't claim English as your first or only language.
Signed me up for Sports Illustrated on one visit and Entertainment Weekly on another, when I've always declined the (annoying) offer.
I always wish they'd use a little common sense when they make those sales pitches. The fact that I have long hair, glasses and am buying Puny Puny Poemi (anime, for those not in the know) should be a clue that I'm very very likely NOT interested in SI or EW or pretty much anything else they've tried to pawn off on me lately.
Sounds like I should start clipping the damned coupons! Why on earth would anybody blow $90 without needing to?
I feel for you, though. I worked retail as well for a couple of years. As they say, "the buck stops at the cash register." If this were a perfect world, store policy would be written by the clerks.
-FL
T.S. Quint: Haven't you ever heard the phrase "The customer is always right?"
Shannon Hamilton: Let me tell you something. Let me give you a little secret, okay. The customer is always an asshole!
(There is no sailboat, there is only Zu'ul!)
Just because you can mod me down, doesn't mean you're right. Shoes for industry!
judging by all the complaints... maybe the price is due for a correction so i would sell.
right now it's at $48.96, maybe the slashdot effect has dropped it's price by 30 cents?
Where's my fucking invite you son of a bitch!?!
That's why I noted that you could have either hung on a little and bought what they advertised at a good deal, or sued. I just didn't point out the Bait&Switch, as I don't know if they went far enough for you to get them for it in your jurisdiction (which varies widely in the USA, let alone in English speaking countries to the world).
I don't read AC A human right
Did the clerk own stock or something?
Sheesh.
I went once with a girlfriend to help fend off the vultures when she was buying a printer. When the inevitable commissioned sales clerk tried to push all manner of extras and warranties on her, I luxuriated in making him look like an ass. --I know he was "just doing his job", but frankly, that's a piss-poor excuse. If deliberately exploiting people's lack of knowledge rather than informing them and helping them to find a good buy is what he does, then he bloody-well deserves to be punished. --And it's easy enough to do; you just stand there and ask all kinds of long and embarrassing questions which illustrate exactly how morally bankrupt a sales clerk is while wasting tons of his precious floor time which he might otherwise be using to rip off other customers.
In that particular case, I easily saved her from spending more than double the listed amount on a dorky inkjet.
-FL
I'm in Canada (with Scotiabank, but friends with others tell me the same story), and I NEVER had to pay to deposit money. And, unlike so many of our neighbours in the US, we don't pay extra to talk to a teller either.
If you're paying to deposit a cheque, ask about what kind of account you have. Some of the 'my first bank account' type programs, or very restrictive ones for high credit risks or people with no income, or the regular, but very basic accounts, those may have some charges like that, for example, free 10 ATM transactions and 5 cheques per month, after that you pay a service fee. If you consistantly carry a positive balance on your account, you can always switch to something better. Or close your account and move to a credit union.
"Hot lesbian witches! It's fucking genius!"
Does the store keep a log of what an employee sells and how many of those items have a PSP? Otherwise, why the hell would they actually REFUSE a sale? Makes no sense. I'm guessing employees don't make money off comission of sales per se, but comission off sales of PSPs?
So what- They don't want customers?
Screw'em, I don't want to shop there anyway.
Their shit is overpriced anyway.
Thanks for the invite though!
Do you work at Express/Structure?
my blog
> I eat at McDonald's BK, KFC, Wendy's for a reason - I know what I'm getting
Yeah, as long as you steer clear of evenings and weekends when they put
the bad help on.
> McDonald's couldn't care less if you order nothing but a small coffee and a
> cup of water
Nope, you can do that, no problem. Of course, they've priced the small coffee
and the water so that they don't lose money if you do that. (They don't make
as much as if you buy an Extra Value Meal, but still it completely covers the
costs associated with serving you, so you're not hurting them at all.)
You want to make McDonald's hate you? Go through their drivethrough at about
11:50am and sit at the speaker saying "Hmmmm...." and trying to figure out what
you want to order for about ten or twelve minutes, all the while having lengthy
and loud non-order-realted conversations with your passengers. Periodically
laugh hysterically, say, "Now, where was I", and go back to figuring out the
part of your order you already went over a couple of minutes ago, only revise
it in some arcane way. ("You're sure that comes with three packets of
Sweet-N-Low, right? I need three packets with that. No, better make that
four. Four should be enough, shouldn't it honey? Hey, did you hear the one
about the bear and the gorilla?")
They lose money if you tie up a register for a long time during a busy
time, _especially_ at lunchtime and _extra_ especially in the drivethrough.
Nothing you can (legally) do (without assistance from an expensive lawyer)
will annoy them more than this.
Cut that out, or I will ship you to Norilsk in a box.
This is all True. Most store credit cards are basically contracted out to third party credit card companies. I know a guy who works at the credit card company that handles the Future shop card (For those of you that havn't read this whol thread - a store in Canada owned by best buy), and Future Shop is appherently "Their worst customer" (ironic eh? Best buy complaining about bad customers and all). This is becasue bascially - this shit happens all the time. Store reps promising a sale price and changing full on the card. Not issuing chargebacks properly. ect. ect. ect.
Have you see BestBuy latly. The place is run like ass. The staff and managers mickey mouse all the way. I hope BestBuy business burns out and blows alway. I guess I'll just buy my crap online.
Actually, I inadvertently found out how to get the Best Buy sales folks to clam up and stop bothering me. I went in to a store to look at the DVD players. A guy came over to "assist" and I asked if they had any "region free" players. He said no, and shrinked off, and noone got near me after that. Not sure why that would have triggered such a response, but it sure seemed to. Maybe they figured I was an MPAA plant, looking to get on their case for telling customers how to pick a region free "capable" player, etc. In any event, it worked great, I was then able to browse unannoyed.
I am a former sales manager for future shop / best buy, focus is put on sales and not customer service. I must give credit to the customer service staff who arent really given any insentive to do anything "beyond the call of duty". In most cases they are the only individuals who consider it there job to help customers much rather than seeking the bigger better dollar. I could tell alot of storys about pressure and bad sales tactics but in reality you can never make every customer happy, because every customer has a diffrent set of needs. I have been in sales my entire life (which is long enough to know) that in most cases it has very little to do with the $100 price difference, but customer experience. If future shop / best buy could only learn that if people really wanted it they would ask for it, and it is ok to give a recommendation but to push is not "partnering" with people. This subject can be summed up: Best Buy needs to focus on customer experience, and there opinion of customer service is building a multi million box is WRONG. The service plan is worth dick shit all unless it is a replacement warranty and it is far to expensive. Lastly, for god sakes train your people an average future shop or best buy is taking in roughly 2000 people per day and there are only 3 senior managers in the whole store! who is making that long lasting impression?
Best Buy is getting their just deserts with this type of customer. Best Buy thinks it is OK to treat their customers like crap but it's not OK for customers to do the same to them.
Boo-hoo, poor Best Buy, they're so incompetent at inspiring customer loyalty they no longer even pretend to and instead just outright treat them badly. A sign of severe desperation, and a failing business model.
Bye-bye, Best Buy.
On the other hand, if they treated me like I'm treated when I go to Trader Joe's (the food store), I'd be willing to pay a little more and would shop there first. A few weeks ago, I was in a Trader Joe's, and the checkstand lines started getting a little long. A checker briefly got the manager's attention, and he immediately got on the horn and said "all hands on deck" and EVERY EMPLOYEE IN THE STORE dropped what they were doing and immediately went to the front to either open up another checkstand or to bag for the existing ones in order to deal with the line-- and within about two minutes the problem was solved and they went back to what they were doing. There's an example of a company who believes in creating a positive experience for their customers. I've NEVER seen that kind of thing happen in one of the "mainstream" grocery stores, they usually just have two or three checkstands open (even though they have an array of 15-20 in the store) no matter how big the lines get. Trader Joe's is usually cheaper too, but even if they weren't I'd still be shopping there first and only going to the others if I couldn't get it at Trader Joe's.-- And sure, grocery stores may need better customer relations than Best Buy because they have repeat customers that come back every week when Best Buy probably couldn't expect that level of repeat business no matter what they did due to the nature of their products, but the point remains, you treat your customers like crap, you shouldn't be surprised if they give you the same in return.
I buy a cell-phone, I have 14 days to evaluate it, but I like it immediately so I file for the rebate, but two days later I realize that the cell-service sucks really bad, so I cancel the service within the 14-day mandatory federal evaluation period (still paying the first month and the activation fee but avoiding a hefty early-termination fee) and return the phone. The rebate takes an inexpliciable 8-10 weeks to "process", so when it arrives, it's mine.
You got a problem with that, you give me the "rebate" at the register so it's on the receipt when I return the phone.
Cool.
Repost e-mail please.
> "What we're trying to do is not eliminate
> those customers, but just diminish the
> number of offers we make to them," Anderson
> said.
I for one am thankful that they decided not to
eliminate those customers... for now. I
should plan to move out of missle range,
before they change their minds.
-I like my women like I like my tea: green-
> If society didn't have a high tolerance, and dare I say expectation, of lying,
> don't you think there'd be some sort of law against it?
No, and you're bordering on willfully ignorant to think so.
Our society does not legislate morality except in a few extreme and well-defined ways (murder, theft, etc.). Saying "lying is legal, so it's okay" is just as wrong as saying "being an asshole is legal, so it must be okay." If you're happy to do anything that isn't illegal---including terrible emotional manipulation and abuse of your family and those who love you---you're seriously morally deficient.
Being an asshole still makes you an asshole, and being a liar ain't much better. "Legal" != "right"
Well, I used my machine for a long time. Of course, maybe I used it too much. It's probably a bad sign when you get out of school, and boot it up to play some MP3s on the walk home, and find out you blew all your batteries on games of Go in class.
So, eventually, I get up one morning, and try to start the machine. No go. I can't even do a hard restart on it. So, after work, my mom and I go down to Best Buy (I was a minor in '99, so it was all in her name). At first, they won't take it. No proof of purchase. So, for the next few weeks, we're comming back and forth with different forms of proofs of purchases. Eventually, we call up the Best Buy corporate office and have them fax us a copy of the recipt.
So, now we're getting somewhere, right? Now, remember, this is Winter, and I live in Minnesota. Every time I go into Best Buy, they have to put a little sticker on the PPC to make sure that I didn't steal it. Now, I walk into the store, and take the PPC out of my pockets, with my gloves still on. I hand it to the guy, and it slips from my hand and falls to the ground. When we go to the service counter to get this all wrapped up, the guy refuses to service it. He said he was us drop it, and pointed to a small plastic piece that was exposed, pointing out the obvious physical damage. Now, this was no physical damage. originally, this piece was covered by a chunk of rubber, but to affix the flip cover, you had to remove the rubber chunk, and clip it into the plastic piece. Either way, the guy won't service it.
from then on out, we've never been happy with Best Buy. In fact, the next PDA I bought was from OfficeMax, and was a Visor Edge, specifically because Visor offered a proctetion against droppage clause in their warrantee and because OfficeMax had never screwed us. To this day, OfficeMax has yet to screw us.
Rawr
First off, I think it said he only supersized things like 9 times over the course of the month. They don't always ask you to supersize (maybe they're supposed to, but if they think you know what you want they usually don't bother). Also, he had to eat everything on the menu at least once, so there was a limit to how much he could "stack" the meals he ate over the course of the month.
My problem with the movie was the amount of exercise he got. He walked the amount the "Average American" walks a day. I don't know how he got that number, but I remember him stating one time that he used up most of his steps (he kept track of the distance by number of steps) on the way out of his apartment building.
The place he got that data was the editor of some sort of "walking" magazine (guess they have magazines for everything now). He obviously wants to bring attention to how little people walk so the statistic may be skewed.
No sig for you.
I'm curious to know, so far this thing has over 1500 messages. Is this the longest thread on slashdot? As far as I know it's the longest thread I've seen. Does it tell you something about how much people dispise Best Buy?
Stage one - May 18, 2001
* The 10-day cooling off period takes effect. This applies only to goods or services worth $50 or more that are not delivered at the time of sale or paid in full at the time of purchase.
Stage two - August 3, 2001
* The cooling off period will be extended to apply to all sales made at the consumer's home, whether the goods are delivered or services are provided at the time of sale or afterwards, and regardless of whether payment is made in full or in part.
* The only exception to the cooling off period is in a case of emergency home repairs, and then the consumer must have approached the seller and have requested the services to be provided within 10 days of receiving the written contract.
* Consumers may cancel any direct sales contract if goods are not received or services not provided within 30 days of the date promised.
* All direct sales contracts must include:
o a description of the item and price
o delivery dates and charges
o start and completion dates, and
o the buyer and seller's name and address.
Recently came to study in Canada from the UK, where pretty much the only things banks charge you for are bounced cheques/unauthorised overdrafts or dealing with foreign currency. Transactions are all free, whether electronic, ATM or teller. Chequebooks are free. There's no charge for using other banks' ATMs - everyone just uses the nearest one. Every kind of account pays interest (often pretty good, even for current (chequing) accounts), and lots of places will offer freebies (gift vouchers and the like) for new account holders (especially students).
Being expected to pay monthly for a limited amount of cash withdrawals at a limited number of ATMs to get at my own money that wasn't earning any interest anyway came as quite a shock...
Some banks do, some banks don't. Most banks will let you deposit for free, but might charge a small amount to withdraw from the ATM, or pay a bill. Most banks have monthly plans, for around $10, that will let you have a certain number of transactions during the month. And they will usually waive that fee if you keep a minimum ($1000, $2000) balance.
For my $10/month, I get free deposits at any branch (ATM or in person), free direct-deposit for my paycheque, 30 transactions (ATM, in-person, bill payments online or in branch, transfers to other accounts, cheques, etc.), cheques when I need them, a monthly statement, a really nice web-banking system, a phone-banking system, and a couple of other things. If I keep a minimum balance of $2k, they don't charge me the $10. I can get all of that for something like $6 if I want to cut back on the number of transactions each month, and then they charge me $.35 per transaction when I go over my limit.
All in all, not a bad deal. Some banks offer most of that for free. Some charge more, some charge less. I keep my bank because they are open until 8PM most nights, and until 5PM on Saturdays, which is sure handy when I actually need to go in and talk with someone.
"Tomorrow's forecast: a few sprinkles of genius with a chance of doom!" - Stewie Griffin
Get this-- I was moving into a house with some friends; we agreed that I'd buy the fridge and they'd buy the washer and dryer. Well we picked out the items we wanted, and I asked the lady to ring my debit card up for the fridge and gave her my card. She accidentally rang me up for the fridge AND washer/dryer, to the tune of $1400.
I pointed out the mistake, and she said she would charge it back. She ran the refund/cancellation/whatever through the machine, then had me sign for it, then rang me up again for just the fridge.
Well, the next day I find out the $1400 is still deducted from my account. I call Best Buy and explained what happened, and they tell me it will take 2 weeks to reverse the charge! Meanwhile I am moving, need to pay my first and last month's rent, etc., and am dead broke without the $1400 (OK, so I should save like my mom taught me, but that's not the point). I drive down to the store, go to the customer service desk, explain the situation, and they tell me it will take 2 weeks. I respond that this is unacceptable and ask for the manager. He says it will take two weeks to process the refund and they can do nothing to change this. I ask for the corporate number, which they give to me, call it up and get the same story, but the guy makes it sound like it's my fault:
Him - "Sir, it will take two weeks to void the incorrect transaction. That is the risk you take when using debit."
Me - "Are you saying I am taking the risk that you will charge my card for more than I agreed to then refuse to return my money?"
Him - "That's the risk you take, sir."
I ask for his higher up, who gets on the phone and gives me the same story. He says they can't do it any faster becuase it's up to my bank. I get his extension then call my bank. They say it is up to Best Buy to refund it, and that a chargeback would take longer than the two weeks they're going to take.
I put my bank and the Best Buy guy on the phone with each other, hoping that will settle things, but they basically both state their positions then hang up. So I end up waiting two weeks for my freakin' money.
Needless to say I've mostly stayed away from BB after that, except for my Day-After-Thanksgiving spree there which they DEFINITELY lost money on (got two carts full of loss leader items). Thinking about that incident still gets my blood boiling. It's kind of sad/hilarious that we all have our own Worst Buy horror stories!
---
WARNING:Slashdot karma not redeemable in the afterlife.
Well you see the problems with worst buy are their own greed. They are their own worst enemy. I have a computer that is now experiencing age and some of the issues with being a computer owned buy a technomancer. Worst Buy says: Oh it's not responding to x y z. I even asked the guy infront of me to get someone that knows about computers. He had a fit, the manager had a fit, and I had to have a temper tantrum to get what I originally required: help repairing the computer lacking the time to do so. This is a greed problem.
Sounds like you're still on the wrong plan, or you don't have enough money in your account. I was with Canada Trust until they merged with TD, and I think my plan is called Preferred Chequing, or something like that. In a typical month, I pay no service fees. Now, I do keep a $1000 minimum balance, only use a couple of cheques a month, and usually don't use my debit card or make any withdrawls at all. The interest is basically zero (.25% on the balance over $5000, I think?), but most of my money's in an ING Direct account or long-term investments.
How does that work? I mean I have never gotten a rebate back with time enough to actually take the product back. and you'd think that before they issued the check they'd check to see if the item was returned.
Best Buy has done horrable things to my family reguarding not honoring their extended warranty contract.
Circuit City, however, has always treated us great with their extended warranties. They are great with stuff like free cleanings for our double-decker VCR. My most recent experience with CC was reguarding a DVD player that died with only two months left on its extended warranty. They didn't carry that player anymore so they offered to replace it with the current price equivalent or store credit for the entire price of the player plus the prorated remaining value of the extended warranty!
Basically I a new player and got to use the old one for the past two years for just the price of the extended warranty.
Yeah, Circuit City definitly is getting continued business from us. We are like the people in the article in that we actually use the extended warranties for repairs and free cleanings, but we also buy our expensive stuff from them and recomend them to all our friends.
"Never, never suspect the dreams within the dreams of dreaming children." ~The Amazon Quartet
Looking at the mail address ajs318 might be british. I don't know if they have legally mandated coverage, but here in Denmark we have 2 years (with a change in the "burden of evidence" after six months, after that the customer needs to argue that the defect was not caused by treating the item wrongly)
:)
Actually, here in the UK, since last year, we have (virtually) the identical law here - probably based on some EU directive - even though "1 year" is frequently advertised with a little note:
"This does not affect your statuory rights"
I have always found this amusing but there are some many people who don't know their rights that companies get away with it.
Even better though - here in the UK - we have something here called the Sales of Goods Act which predates the above law (its from the 70's) and actually means that goods have to last a "reasonable" amount of time - with "reasonable" defined as up to 6 years! (slightly different period in Scotland) depending on the goods.
i.e. a cheap toaster won't be expected to last 6 years but you are on much safer ground with say a TV or a Washing Machine - especially if its not a bottom of the range one.
And the judges in the UK "Small Claims Court" always always seem to favour the consumer - and its the judges view of whats reasonable that counts!
In these cases, purchasers can demand damages (which a court would equate to the cost of a repair or replacement) - not bad hey - free (upto) 6 year guarantees in the UK..
If only more people knew their consumer rights here!
Regards
Sunil
Best Buy is terrible on payments. I have even driven to the Post Office in Carol Stream IL where they have their payment P.O. Box and tried to get it in days early. They still claim late payment and demand late charges. Their credit department is from Hades.
I'm a long time Best Buy Customer and am currently working there due to some unforseen lack of gainful employment.
Think Best Buy salespeople are pushy and irritating? It's likely due to pushy and irritating middle and upper management who commence extensive wet noodle beatings daily for "not making numbers". Additionally, all the departements in all the stores are ranked daily by Extented Warranties sold, reward zone cards sold, and overall sales. Nevermind if you sold a bunch of stuff, if you're not in the top 1/3 of all best buy stores you're CRAP, work harder, SELL SELL SELL.
Since Best Buy sales people are not on commission, the motivaiton to sell junk has to be external. It seems like a good idea on the surface becuase it insulates customers from unethical salespeople. The problem is that it exposes customers to unethical management who spur their underlings to emphasize that they are not on commission to lull the unsuspecting customer into huge sales they would otherwise avoid, thereby making oodles of cash for the company while the honest, hardworking salespersons get their measly hourly wage.
In a commission based system a sales person knows why they should push certain items: better commissions. In a commission free setup the salespeople are typically as ignorant as most customers as to the markup, margin, and overall value of items on the retail floor.
Best Buy, Circuit City, and all other "superstores" are corporate monsters that care about one thing: money. I will say Best Buy seems like one of the better superstores out there given the better-than-average pay and treatment they give their employees, but they expect a lot of performance in return.
Contrast the Best Buy workplace to another retail environment like Walmart and it's like watching a bunch of people on speed as compared to a bunch of people on Queludes, respectively. I'm not sure which is better for the customer, but it would be nice to find a happy medium somewhere.
I don't misunderstand anything about the concept of CRM.
I am quite aware of the principle of customer focus. As I have said, I've read TONS of IT articles on the subject in the last ten years. I know what it is SUPPOSED to do.
I'm also quite aware that most management have no fucking clue what "customer focus" means - or how to do it without being clueless assholes about it.
That was the point of my post.
The concept is a joke because of the people trying to implement it - not because the concept is necessarily bad.
Richard Steven Hack - This sig is TOO GODDAMN SHORT TO DO ANYTHING USEFUL WITH! MORONS!
For the most part I would agree with you - with the exception of laptop computers.
As a highly portable item, they experience more wear and tear than the typical desktop device in normal usage. It is not uncommon for laptops to suffer from stress related failures 18-24 months after purchase, such as hinge problems causing video issues, unexpected casing fatigue which is sometimes covered by manufacturer recall programs, but that doesn't always result in a fast enough resolution to a problem.
But then, I would also strongly recommend real insurance for a laptop
Sara
Designer, Gamer, Macgrrl in an XP World
For an X-Box or standard TV set, it makes very little sense. The service contract is a high percentage of the replacement cost, you can live without one for a while, and the out-of-warranty failure rate is very low.
For automobiles, it may be worth it (depending on complexity and that make's durability). In the case of my wife's FWD V6 mini-van, one look under the hood convinced me. There's no way I would attempt anything beyond routine maintenance at home. Access to major engine components (heads, manifolds, etc.) requires dropping the entire power train, which means dismantling the front suspension. It took roughly 8 hours of shop time to replace a leaky intake gasket. Required tools included a coil spring compressor and a wheel alignment rack. The insurance company lost money on that bet.
But for my 4 cylinder RWD pick-up, it would be silly. Everything is easily accessible for DIY repairs, the parts don't cost much, and it has none of the expensive-to-fix options. I can afford to assume the foreseeable repair costs, so I won't pay the insurance company to assume that risk.
I worked for Best Buy for 2 years, and now I'm a cell phone rep in Best Buy stores. Here's the scenario that I QUITE often get from customers like a lot of you on here.
Sales Rep: Blah blah PSP blah
Customer: No, I don't think I want it.
Sales Rep: But it covers blah blah
Customer: I don't want it.
Another sales rep: Well, I've used it for this and this
Customer: I don't want it.
Cashier: Did you know that BBY offers a 2 year service plan on this item?
Customer: I don't want it.
**6 months later**
Customer: What do you mean it's gonna cost me $300 to replace this cellphone?? I only paid $100 for it 6 months ago!
Me: Do you have a service plan on the phone? That problem IS covered by it.
Customer: I was never offered the PSP, and now you're trying to rip me off by charging me the upcharge on this phone. I'm going to buy this phone, but I'm only going to pay the price on the tag.
Me: Well, I can't sell it to you for that price until you're eligible for upgrade--which won't be until you're 20 months into your 2 year contract. They only let you get the subsidized price every so often.
Customer argues ad infinitum that they were never offered it, and shouldn't be punished for that. Is the PSP/PRP worth it on everything? No. Is it a good idea on a lot of things? Probably.
It's important to note that Best Buy corporate policy says that as long as you offered the PSP/PRP and explained its benefits, you've done your job. But corporate policy and what the store-level management does are 2 different things.
Dude...what the FUCK is up with that subject heading?!?
All these Best Buy horror stories illustrate the need to have a great relationship with your credit card company (read "relationship" as "having good credit"). If I buy something from any store, and something is wrong, and they won't let me return it, I make one 15 minute phone call and they don't recieve a dime. Let them try calling me for a change.
Interesting, Retailers like bestbuy are constantly trying to race to the bottom by undercutting the competition, and now that they have hit bottom, decide they dont like the clientel.. What did they expect?
So, buy a 100$ dvd player & a $30 rf modulater before xmas...get the right modulator at radio shack instead and wait until feb to return...OOPS.
Wal-Buy will not take a return after 30 days, even for unopend stock, still for sale, with reciept, still in the same quarter. Inbound cashflow only. I live near 5 BBs and the new laid-off-staff-to-pay-for Corp headquarters...and have NEVER been back.
Why pay retail to any of the be-a-consumer-or-die machines that treat customers like scum and employes like dirt (google for: Altering of Worker Time Cards )
Electronics now come from eBay.
CDs from used try before you buy stores.
Long story short - one of my clients wants to get a test box for his latest project, and stops in a BB to pick up a box.
He grabs an EMachines - open box deal. The tape on the outside says "BEST BUY INSPECTED AND VERIFIED. EVERYTHING'S INSIDE". The sales reps say everything's inside...
My genius client being the trusting soul, takes their word and brings the box back to the office. I unpack it and proceed to discover that the restore CD's have a piece of masking tape w/Blue marker (best buy blue?) on it stating "BAD CD 3". CD 3 has a giant gouge in it...
Oh well... it's an open box deal - we'll call Emachines and get a new set of disks - no biggie right?
Wrong. The box doesn't boot - so you need the CDs to restore the thing. None of us want to rebox it, navigate back to that store down the fucked up streets under construction, and on and on... So we call eMachines.
Navigate their assinine voice menu system which has us on hold for 10 minutes, and are then told by Phone Droid #12999388844400032222005 that we were on hold for 40 seconds... *whatever* We tell the droid what the deal is, and they ask for the serial #. We read it off, and they ask us if we're "Karen Israel". No one in the office knows a Ms. Israel, or is named "Israel". So we say "Ummm. No."
The droid asks us if we live in a nearby town. We don't. Droid says the machine was previously registered 3 months ago, and to return the box.
The client and I pack it up. He returns it to Worst Buy. The manager says they don't have the same model. My client wants the next model up and is willing to pay the difference. Manager says no.
Argument ensues. Manager credits my client's credit card and throws my client out of the store.
My client sends a letter to BB Legal dept. They basically send back a letter saying "yeah so, you got your credit what do you want?".
My client and I went over to CompUSA and bought a test box. Works great. We explained to the manager what we were doing, and she gave us a deal on the 15 other BRAND NEW computers we needed! Guess where we go for stuff now? Like a new flat panel TV, video card, games, blank CD's and other goodies...
Fucken Best Buy - I absolutely can't wait for the day when I can attend their bankruptcy sale and bid on lots of their shit to auction off on eBay... May they rot in hell for eternity...
Ya know - it's a funny thing when 250,000 geeks from pretty much all around the world (but perhpas mostly in the US) all get together and comment on a company's lack of customer service.
I read the entire first page of comments - NOT A SINGLE one had anything good to say about Best Buy from either an employee, ex-employee, or customer point-of-view.
One could only hope and pray that someone at the FTC or Postal Inspectors would be reading these comments and decide to launch an investigation against their business practices. How about our old friend Elliot Spitzer from NY - surely he's done weeding out the fools in the securities industry and is ready to take on big-box retail.
Read the thread earlier... had to come back and post this link, sorry if I missed it among the items beneath my current threshold.
CtrlAltDel
On a tangent of the same note, used to work at RadioShack and they pushed the same warranty stuff.
Ahh, but you see my department store is big enough to have their own bank. There's an option to have it a joint Visa account, but at the very minimum it's us that you're borrowing money from.
One of my recent colleague's illustrations was a fishing boat crew that decided to all purchase new cars - cash - at the same time and figured the best way would be to have one spokesman negotiate a volume discount. The first car dealer took one look at this scruffy guy asking about buying 10 cars and showed him the door. The dealer across the street somehow managed to sell 10 cars that same day. Since some of the people and businesses involved were still in town, it makes it that much funnier .
That first dealer probably lost a few future sales as well. Definitely lost face.
Along similar lines, making weird, non-standard web pages that lockout browsers or screen resolutions are in effect a way of showing the customer the door. BTW search engines are text only and if you're locking out text only visitors, you're locking out search engines and the people (with and without money) that use them.
Beta is broken and the link to classic doesn't work. Stop wasting our time or there won't be anybody left here.
You do not own a space in an apartment complex, in fact you do not own anything. Thus, the manager, acting as an authorized agent for the owner, had the right to have the car towed. Now, if you have a contract (lease) saying different then that is between you and the owner (breach of contract). However the police were doing their duty in removing a vehicle as requested by the authorized agent of the owner.
Same applies where I live, a condo complex. Here I actually DO own something, one of the units and a share in the common land. However, my contract stipulates that the control of the common area is in the hands of the board, and they appoint a management group as an authorized agent. If secuity calls to ahve a car towed form my spot (which nearly happened once), the two truck and police are doing their job by removing, despite if I protest. What I then need to do (and would do) is talk to the board about breach of contract (which declares I have exclusive control over my spot) and, if they failed ot respond and pay the fines, hit them with a lawsuit in small claims court.
In an apartment complex, you likely don't even have exclusive control on your spot. My lease, when I lived in one, declared that only vehicles authorized in writing would be allowed to park there. As in I had to give them a make, model and license plate for a car to be legit in that spot. Hence, no friends allowed.
So, unless you encountered a real prick of a cop (in which care you talk to IAB, the civilian review board and a lawyer), you'd be fine. You leave the store after being pushed, call the cops and wait. Nothing illegal on your part and yes, you CAN press charges for assult, even in a case of pushing.
I had a 32 meg Cassiopia Wince PDA with a broken replaced with a 64meg iPaq, but I think it was at Comp USA, rather then Best Buy.
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
1) hire a lawyer. The fact that it says "we can change these terms whenever want" dosn't mean they actualy can. I seriously doubt that clause would stand up in court.
Smash up the motherboard. Or pull some components off of it. What are they going to do then?
autopr0n is like, down and stuff.
One reason why there are so many jerks in this world is because people put up with their crap. Same goes for businesses.
Best of luck to you, sir. I hope you win the case, win back your attorney fee's, and get Worst Buy a whole bunch of bad publicity.
You remind me of my boss at work, who got screwed over by Sears when some guy in their auto shop messed up his car. They were all about not fixing it, when he told them in no uncertain terms that he would make it cost far, far more for them to not fix it. Something about getting a second full time job just to pay a lawyer for a couple of years. Unlike your Worst Buy employees, they caved.
Somehow, they've gotten people to accept the notion that it's normal for you to pay the bank for the priviledge of storing your money there.
I don't pay anything whatsoever to have a bank-account. In the contrary, I get interest, which would seem normal as a bank-account essentially lends my money to the Bank.
I still pay the grand sum of zero, regardless of how many transactions (inland or international) I have, regardless of if I need online banking or phone-banking. There's no demand for any balance, I'd still be paying zero if my average balance was $10.
The same for a stock-depot, to establish a house or car-loan and so on. The only exception I'm aware of is that if I purchase stuff billed in a different valuta, then I'll be charged the exchange-rate + 0.75%, so if I buy something from the US for $100.00 I'll actually be charged the equivalent of $100.75
IMHO a lot of the problem comes from the fact that Best Buy tells their "associates" they have ultimate authority and will back them up. In my experience they will back them blindly with no reference to the facts.
A ways back I bought a Mandrake Linux on sale $19. I get home and there's nothing in the box! No CD - no boot floppy. I take it back to the store and stood in line forever (30 minutes) while 3 "customer service" guys were falling all over themselves to help a cute skirt with her return. When I finally get up there I'm already steamed and the frosting on the cake was when they told me that I could not return or exchange it because it was software! I demanded to see the manager so after another 10 minutes this guy saunters up and asks what the problem is - I told him about no software in the box and threw in the inordinate wait time and he said that "every customer was valuable". I said that's good but doesn't explain one guy doing the work and two others were "standing around pulling their pud" (I admit I did say that in my anger). He decided that I was not welcome and kicked me out of the store with instructions to "don't come back". The corporate office said the manager was within his rights. All in all I wasted about an hour and no software.
Regards
This whole 1 year warranty on refrigerators crap is what's keeping me holding on to my 20-year old Frigidaire that I got from my dad. The light bulb doesn't work, but it cools and freezes fine. While we would love a nice side-by-side with one of those fancy places to put gallon milk jugs, I just can't replace a 20-year veteran with some piece of junk that the manufacturer only has enough confidence in to warrant for a year.
Call (206) 338-5780 COLLECT for information about a genuine BA, BS, MA, MS, MBA, or Ph.D.
I've bought their "service plan" on two different items now and have used it twice without a problem. Once it was to get a replacement TV when my (out of warranty) one died on me. The other was to get a newer, nicer dvd/vcr combo when mine died and the manufacturer didn't make or fix mine anymore. I also like their sales... sure the rebates are a pain in the ass, but if you actually do send in the forms and get the cash, it's a great deal. Drew
you did not. you told him that you don't like insurance and therefore tend not to buy it. then you told him that you could fix it yourself. silly.
So, you've got a lot of money in the bank and you never spend it...
Sounds to me like the bank should be sending you free hookers.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
When did McDonald's ever try to bill themselves as "healthy"? I remember they made some sort of "lite" burger ten years ago, and people didn't buy it in droves.
I've no sympathy for people who go to McDonald's and don't eat well. What did they think was going to happen?
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
"If you can estimate the odds better than the bookie, then you're on a winning ticket. "
Just a quick note...bookies don't work like that. It's the people placing bets that determine the odds on sporting events. The bookie will constantly recalculate who has bet on what side, and what odds they had when they bet. They will them change the 'odds' continuously, so that they make money no matter who wins. Its the same sort of system that they use at horse racing tracks, except that they lock people in at fixed odds when their bet is placed.
In movies you often see bookies portrayed as experts at sports handicapping, but it isn't really necessary for a bookie to know anything about the teams who are playing or who is likely to win.
That's odd. I just went on a road trip in the USA last week and I didn't run into a single gas station that lacked debit capability. Most US banks are going the route of higher fees, but not all. Most towns have a bank with convenient hours and low costs. As for me - I use an internet-based bank and don't pay any fees at all and get interest even on my checking account.
As far as bank failures goes - who cares? I doubt my bank will fail anytime soon. If it did there is the FDIC which ensures all US deposits to the tune of $100k. It isn't like I have my retirement funds in the bank anyway - I'd just lose out on my monthly spending money for a few months. It would be inconvenient to be sure - but I'd get it back fairly quickly and I'd just have my next paycheck delivered by mail and open an account elsewhere.
I ran into a relative last week who pays a fortune each year for a book on bank ratings, convinced that the apocolypse will be upon us and those of us foolish to not personally audit our bank's financial statements will be starving in the streets. Of course, if my bank fails there's the FDIC. And if the FDIC fails, the dollar bills you can get from a solvent bank probably won't be worth anything anyway. And if all of society completely collapses I doubt that the banker who lives 500 miles away who owns the loan on your house will be showing up with a shotgun to evict you anytime soon. And unless the government starts paying in gold I doubt the local police will care to evict you either...
Being paranoid over bank failures won't buy you any security - just a lot of grief (and some expensive books on banks). It makes sense to not put all your eggs in one basket, but when it comes to the global economy - there is only so much you can do to escape hard times should it collapse.
I think the USA just has a head start over Canada when it comes to having millions of 10-branch banks. Pretty soon we'll see the effects of consolidation here as well...
"The Customer Is Always Right: The biggest and most successful marketing campaign in history. Put that sticker or sign in your store and it does two things; reminds your staff to smile and be tolerant for as long as possible, and gives the customer an instant boost of confidence which usually manifests itself in them buying something.
Of course it backfires when you get a "demon customer" but they would be in the minority. It's cheaper than specially chosen psychoanalysed store music
The truth is that the customer was never right. The customer is to be TOLD that they are right, even if they are wrong, because telling them they are wrong loses them as a customer - even if they buy during sales and make rampant use of rebates you still make money from them. The truth is that most customers are f**king idiots. The sign merely makes the customer feel less like a prick (== purchases) and the staff less likely to call them a prick (== purchases).
Neko
It's an honor to be trolled, sir, and I'm bored enough to answer.
That's an odd definition of "stealing," but just to give everyone else involved an idea on how disorganized they are, I *DID* call to tell them they over-refunded me, and the guy who answered said that that was impossible, because Dell doesn't issue credits for past sales at all. I laughed, assured him they'd given me money, and tried again-- but he told me I must be mistaken.
At some point, you just walk away. Did you miss the part where I placed three separate orders that they lost? It took SEVEN WEEKS to get a single order through their system.
To use your rather bent girlfriend analogy, that's a little more like your wife teasing you nonstop for six weeks while witholding sex, and then finally consenting to it, but only if you get a second full-time job. At which point, you are forced to spend a week and a half in and out of a divorce court that continually loses the evidence of mistreatment you bring them, and can't even find its copy of the law books regarding marriage. At some point, a randomly assigned court clerk mistakes you for a bum and drops $170 and a gift certificate for a free mail-order bride into your coffee cup, which you try to return, but he refuses, claiming that he never gives money (or free brides) to anyone, and that's impossible. He then forgets he's ever seen you, assigns you to a different amnesiac court clerk, who refuses to believe you were ever married in the first place and tells you there's nothing he can do. At which point, you take your dirty, tired, self home and enjoy the $170-- because it's as close to fair and equitable as anyone's ever going to get.
But seriously, the extra $80 I made was nice-- I won't complain about that. But the fact that I spent at least eight hours on the phone over the course of a week and a half to correct an order they had managed to lose three consecutive times, and during which they were unable to consult neither records of my previous order attempts nor current item prices.
Best Buy can Kiss My Ass! After all the bad service, rude employees, idiotic answers to questions and horrible customer care policies, this article and it's implications are all I need to start shopping elsewhere. Of course, I'm sure a big company like Best Buy won't miss my $5000.00 per year in tech purchases.
But Officer, I DID read the f**king article!
I've bought a new Canon G3 digital camera at BB for $450. As it turned out later, the box was open and the power supply missing. I was left without photographs for that weekend. When I returned it to the store, I was charged $100 for the missing power supply and %15 restocking fee.
Life is a sexually transmitted, 100% lethal disease.
One of my guilty pleasures is Best Buy. Doesn't matter that for the most part the staff is woefully uninformed about the stuff they are selling, it's still great fun to roam around from department to department and see what they are selling...especially at sale prices. I'm also a rebate junkie, because I've had consistently good luck with them being returned (althought some do require the phone call). I have twice submittted rebate materials (I do it right away) and then returned and item. Not on purpose, but because the thing didn't work. One was an Epson scanner and the other was a ?Dazzle? A-D external video capture device. These both quit working (or never did) within 48 hours of unpacking, and I have zero guilt about replacing them with non-identical products and accepting the rebate.
Since I sometimes hang in Best Buy while my wife is killing an our (and the checkbook) in an adjacent Bed Bath and Beyond, I'm fascinated by the "advice" the sales staff sometimes offers the non-technically proficient customers.
Evil customers my ass.
I know what I'm getting when I eat at MCD or BK. I'm getting crap. I have never had a worse burger at $DINER than I'd get at a fast food place. It may be a buck or two more expensive, but at least they keep the coffee coming.
Give me Classic Slashdot or give me death!
It *IS* another sales tactic. The employee is there to make sales. A good customer recognizes and expects this. But while the employee is there to make a sale, they are not there to be rude. Using a sales tactic to try to sell a service plan is not a bad thing. Using it repeatedly after the service plan has been declined *is* a bad thing. Therein lies the difference.
I work in an electronics store and we sell esp's. I have seen more than my fair share of broken stuff that people bring back, and sometimes they have one and sometimes they don't. We will send the product in for repair either way, but when it's not covered under warranty for them, we will explain that the cost of buying a new one will most likely be only $20-50 more than the repair, which is why we try to sell them an esp to begin with. At that point, it's more economical to buy a new one, which comes with a fresh 1-year warranty anyway. It's not malicious, it's common-sense. Yes, the esp's are profitable for the business, but that's capitalism at it's finest. It's not evil, it's our way of life in the U.S. If the companies weren't out to make a buck off of the consumer, they wouldn't be businesses. I am not defending Best Buy's horrid customer service - as I myself haven't shopped there in almost 5 years due to the way they treated me. Customer service is very important to me and I try to treat every customer the way I would like to be treated. Does that mean that I don't try to sell them things? No, it means that I am respectful and honest with them, even if that means telling them when they make the purchase what the repair cost will be if they choose not to buy the esp. After they decline, I don't toss their stuff around or get snotty with them, I thank them for their business and invite them back if they have any questions.
I work in an electronics store - no, not Best Buy - but we compete with their prices to retain business. My company is much smaller, we only have 150 employees and only 10 stores. We're not national. Any customer that comes in to my store get immediate, wonderful customer service - before, during and after the sale. Any customer that feels less than satisfied by their experience can immediately call the President of my company. We have to care about customer service, or companies like Best Buy would run us out of the market. It's our ace in the hole! In addition - I've been reading this thread and people keep talking about how overpriced Best Buy is. Best Buy is NOT OVERPRICED. For example, we sell an item at my store for $399. Best Buy sells this same item for $299. Our COST - to get it from the manufacturer - is $330. When we meet BB's price, which we do because we need business - we are LOSING MONEY. They sell that item below cost to get you inside that store. If they let you leave without selling you the over-inflated PSP - they LOSE money! Our item is priced as it should be, and our PSP is pretty cheap - much cheaper than BB's. And lastly, people who have been posting on this thread are complaining about the company trying to make a profit off of consumers. Uh...Hello?...this is still America, isn't it? We are a capitalistic society? Our business are out to make a profit. That's what they do! If they didn't do that, they'd go under. Last time I checked, BB wasn't a nonprofit or charitable organization. If that's what you're looking for, shop at the Goodwill store!