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MacWorld Keynote Announces x86 iMac & Laptop
Steve Jobs began giving his keynote at 9am local time, PST. The action was posted live at MacRumorsLive, and Engadget. From the Engadget liveblog: "How many [iPods] did we sell last quarter? Some of the estimates were getting astronomical - 8 million, 9 million. I'm really pleased to announce that last quarter we sold 14 million iPods .. that is over a hundred every minute, 24/7 throughout the quarter. And it still wasnt enough. We've now sold over 42 million iPods -- as you can see the curve is going up again" MacWorld and Ars Technica has coverage as well. The shiniest news: MacBook Pro. iSight, Front Row; $1999 1.67 Core Duo; 667 DDR bus, Radeon x1600; $2499 1.83GHz. Intel chip.
Macbook sounds offensive and computer illiterate.
What do you guys think?
-Sj53
My son has one. I can't because they won't let me take it into work (a CD player only).
Ouch!
Thanks, but for the rest of us non Apple fanboys it's good enough.
So much for the bogus 42" and 50" media center plasmas.
... I'm throwing OSX on my intel box!
;-)
Those laptops do look sweet though. Screw windows/linux now
ps I know X is based on free bsd
but will it run Linux|Windows? Will there be offical drivers?
Anyone know what the projected Euro price is going to be? My girlfriend has been waiting for this release before she buys herself a laptop (she's a pro photographer) and its definitely going to be top of the list ..
.. how do you other geeks deal with girlfriends whose laptops are better than yours? aarrgghh ... :)
Man, dunno how i'm gonna feel on my lowly powerbook though
; -- the corruption of government starts with its secrets. a truly free people keep no secrets. --
I guess many of us will need to start saving now... Damn!
It's worth mentioning in the summary that these new Macs are Intel based. The linked articles state this. The first Intel Macs are here, ahead of when they were expected.
I'd hoped for a drop in pricing when apple moved to "commodity" processors...
Hate the name, hate it hate it hate it. I know the Power implies the use of a PPC chip.. but they had the Power name way back before PPC, so I really see no reason to drop it. "MacBook Pro" sounds like a kiddy toy But I've got to say, I love the specs. Finally good mobile graphics. Good CPU power, comparable on price to Dell's, which is really nice (even better deal for students w/ Apple). The iSight/frontrow stuff is just icing on the cake. Oh, and that magnetic no-trip power cord... that's just slick apple engineering right there.
http://www.apple.com/macbookpro
Dropped FW 800 and cardbus.
You're buying a design and an OS...
Admittedly it's the best design around and the OS isn't so scrappy, but it makes Apple a very strange chimera in the hardware/software/services area. In all honesty, Apple is now just an intellectual design powerhouse. They sell Good Ideas, not appliances, not computers...
As a purchaser of the last version of the iMac G5 (20-inch w/Front Row, iSight), I feel a twinge of jealousy, although it's not like I didn't know this was probably going to occur sometime in the new year. I'm glad that the transition to Intel seems to be going as well (or better than) expected; perhaps I'll console myself with a MacBook (yeah, right!)
concrete5: a cms made for marketing, but strong enough for geeks.
http://www.apple.com/ has been updated with new yummies! go look
Promote Charity on Myspace, Show Your Colours!
Can you load easily dual boot Windows on the new iMac and on the MacBook Pro? If you can then this opens up a new market of tepid switchers. It seems that Steve didn't mention this sort of functionality at all which leaves it as a big question mark for now.
Lasers Controlled Games!
well, that was pretty decent, but kind of strange, yes new powerbooks were to be expected, but now the imacs are faster then the low and midrange powermacs.. i'm assuming in a few weeks we'll see them all go quad core..
i wonder how long till ibooks and mini's
Live EVERY week... Like it's Shark Week
So, this new Apple news is freakin' awesome! I want one of these right now! Now I just have to wait and see if Apple/Mac will finally be validated by the geek community before I can get one. Its long had the approval of the artsy-fartsy and recently, the trendy, but could this be the news that finally gives it approval with my oh so important "Linux or nothing else" loyalist friends? I mean it's a UNIX based OS, dual core chip in a laptop!! Look at the facts people, this is as geeky as it gets.
The fun isn't even beging yet. These probaly wont ship out for a while. but you know the minute someone gets one, they are going to take it apart. then the real fun begins.
sorry 'bout the mess...
Despite all sorts of rumors and analyst predictions, there was no new iPod (even though the Shuffle is a year old) and no new news around content for iTunes. Coming off CES with the Microsoft announcement around Urge and the Google Video announcement, I'm surprised that Apple didn't do something to extend in the music/video space. That said, the iPod sales numbers for the holidays were very impressive.
I like how Apple reinvents pheed and calls it "Photocasting" as well as "incredibly new".
Thanks Steve, but the Associated Press has been standardized on pheed for well over a year now.
Get over it. Or are you still using a Motorola 68k-based Mac?
"I'd rather be a lightning rod than a seismometer." -Ken Kesey
Its already on sale!
check out the new mac books in the apple store!
The war with islam is a war on the beast
The war on terror is a war for peace
Hate the name, hate it hate it hate it. I know the Power implies the use of a PPC chip.. but they had the Power name way back before PPC, so I really see no reason to drop it. "MacBook Pro" sounds like a kiddy toy
But I've got to say, I love the specs. Finally good mobile graphics. Good CPU power, comparable on price to Dell's, which is really nice (even better deal for students w/ Apple). The iSight/frontrow stuff is just icing on the cake.
Oh, and that magnetic no-trip power cord... that's just slick apple engineering right there.
Let me just say that I would hate to have just purchased a new PowerBook G4.
Personally, I am looking forward to seeing a benchmark comparison of the Intel iMac, the MacBook, and the current PowerMac G5. I'm especially interested in Rosetta benchmarks taken from these production machines.
Do you like German cars?
yes, and please refrain from calling a Dell XPS an XPS Dude, it is a fucking product line.
We CANNOT allow "MacBook Pro" to take off. Everyone needs to keep calling them Powerbooks. I don't care what Apple says. If customers keep coming into the stores asking for Powerbooks maybe they will come to their senses.
Really, all the top Mac news sites and blogs need to get on board with this. It is NOT a "MacBook Pro". It is and always will be a Powerbook.
Apple is distinctly moving away here from the hallmark of maturity and erudition that "iMac" and "iBook" represented
Thanks, but we'll keep calling them Macs for so long as they run Macintosh OS.
This is my post. There are many others like it. If you don't like what you read here, go try one of the others.
Why are they using 2GHz intel chips on the high end iMacs when 3Ghz ones are available on the PC?
Apple has sold Personal Computers (PC's) since 1976. What part of "every Macintosh is a PC" don't you understand? Cheers,
The next pasture is always greener
The enclosure is the same as the current powerbook. Compared to Sony it's really thick. Why only 1.67Ghz and 1.83ghz? Isn't Intel up to 2.33 now and aren't competitors using those chips already? It seems the only advantage is that the machine runs a nice user interface on top of BSD on the machine. Is that worth the premium?
This isn't the first "Duo" Apple has released in notebook form. The original PowerBook Duo was a very cool machine for its time.
Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government.
Will I be able to dual boot Windows or Linux with this thing? And regarding Linux, will the existing drivers work for the components or will new ones have to be written for it? No successors to the iBook yet. Just the MacBook taking over where the Powerbook left off. Apple's going to be losing a few market share in this regard since the iBooks were always the ones that competed best against PC laptops regarding Price/Features. And here we were expecting Mac Minis and the iBook to be first to be offered with Intel Inside. I once again nominate Apple to run the CIA.
WTF?
I guess the real question is can it run Windows, Linux and OS X? What kind of black magic will we need to do to make it work?
Macbook sounds offensive and computer illiterate.
What do you guys think?
The art of choosing strategically well thought out product names is a declining art these days, I need only point to "Windows Defender". While most of us nerds know that Windows is on the defensive in the malware department there is no reason to let the uninitiated masses of Windows users know about it, they think the current situation is normal.
Not that I really care about the 'stupidity' of the MacBook name and I do agree with you that it is kinda clumsy. What I care about is what this MacBook can do and how soon I can get my filthy paws on one. Now if you will excuse me I have to go and empty my piggybank....
Only to idiots, are orders laws.
-- Henning von Tresckow
Satan bought a scarf, gloves and wooly hat.
I thought they had always sold Personal Computers.
__
Thou hast besquirted me, O leotarded one.
Surely, you jest! How can we call it a PC, when it lacks viruses and spyware?
The series is called macintosh , Mac for short. ( pavilion,aspire,deskpro and other crap systems ) ... mac .
It's a computer and is mostly personal.
So this PC is a mac is a PC just like the PowerMacs that are powered by Power PC's like in a mac.... pc
Anycow,
It is very important to note that you are a total and complete flamebaiting fucktart.
Retep.
What happened? Where's the Firewire 800? I can understand, maybe, leaving it off the iMac but surely the MacBook should have one? My 15" Powerbook has Firewire 800. I just don't get it. I can't imagine they'd abandon Firewire for USB.
I just bought a powermac recently, came with iLife 5. Anyone know the procedure for upgrades? I have coupons with this mac that indicate I have iLife 5 and Mac OS 10.4.3, can I use these somehow to upgrade to iLife 6 for free? How?
Ironically, the word ironically is often used incorrectly.
Wow, Apple stock is up almost 7% on this news.
Aren't you tired of always being overpowered by PCs?
AMD > Intel
Worth noting that the CardBus slot has been replaced with a ExpressCard/34 slot.
In a related note, apple has gone to a 1024 web site layout now.
__
Thou hast besquirted me, O leotarded one.
If you're going to have "PRO" in the name, you better give pros the tools the want and need.
Will it run Windows?
Wait thats not right...
An iPod that has an FM tuner? True, it's just an accessory, but did anybody contact the ninth level of hell to see how if a blizzard suddenly appeared?
Well, there's spam egg sausage and spam, that's not got much spam in it.
I'm disappointed that there was no new Intel IBook. This is the one the rumor sites were all sure would happen. $2K is too much for a laptop for me. I held off getting an iBook for Christmas waiting for today, and now I don't know what to do. I don't know whether to wait another six months and see what happens or go ahead and get one today. Very disappointing!
This is it. Never Microsoft Windows again. Not one more second of pain.
In fact, while I was always die-hard Apple supporter (I'm typing this on my fourth Apple-branded laptop) I appreciate the fact that now I will be able to dual boot in Windows and play the games not-yet or not-at-all released for MacOS. I actually do have a copy of "Deus Ex 2" waiting for the release of Intel-based Macs. Now I'll be able to dust it off... and play on a soon-to-be-mine iMac.
Although how many ExpressCards can you buy at the moment?
... okay products I suppose. Sadly my boss, who purchased 2 iMacs and a Powerbook a month ago, will be miffed if he hears of this.
Hope they come out with a Firewire 800 ExpressCard!
Anyway
Dude, that sounds to me like "all our previous benchmarks were bogus"!
Next time you know they will say "now with twice the mouse buttons and productivity!"
I don't think you understand what it is that makes a Mac a Mac.
Now that Apple is joining the upper eschelon of consumer products, it has to think broader than it's own niche market.
For instance, the MacBook was named such because of the possible tie ins with other proven products.
Apple will soon be announcing the Big MacBook Pro. It will feature a larger screen, two all-beef patties, a sesame seed bun, and be cross advertised with McDonalds.
NMG
> Dropped FW 800 and cardbus.
So much for using this nice EVDO card with it. Oh well, it can stay in my PB Titanium...
Power Up With MagSafe
The new power adapter with MagSafe connector is designed to magnetically guide your cord into place and disconnect smoothly if someone (else) trips over it.
---
I think that's awesome. I can't tell you how many times I've grabbed my PowerBook thinking it wasn't plugged in, only to have the chord yanked out, or worse, have the laptop almost pulled out of my hands.
I like big butts and I cannot lie.
When OS X is hacked to run on Dells can we start calling Dells Macs too?
"Remember when the U.S. had a drug problem, and then we declared a War On Drugs, and now you can't buy drugs anymore?"
Send $79 to Apple for iLife 6. $99 if you want the family pack.
Strange women lying in ponds distributing swords is no basis for a system of government.
What do you mean by "obsolete"? I have a 2+ yo 3G ipod and it works just dandy. Just because I can't squint real hard and watch the newest U2 video deosn't make it "obsolete".
MACBOOKPRO! ~ PC OR KABOOM!
He who knows best knows how little he knows. - Thomas Jefferson
"If I'm going to be forced to use a garbage architecture like x86 in the future,"
You get better performance and a longer battery life. The only way you would be able to tell the difference between it and a PowerPC without digging around in the low level stuff is that it's faster and the battery lasts longer. PowerPC is clean in ways that don't benefit the user, while stagnating in the desktop/laptop areas. For better or worse, x86 has consolidated the desktop/laptop by getting better results than anyone else.
I think it's unreasonable to expect others to avoid a clearly better choice because it's not aesthetically pleasing for you.
I rarely criticize things I don't care about.
According to the Macbook Pro page, this will be the URL that the new keynote will be posted at. If you keep refreshing (although that's apparently a felony now...) you can let everyone know when it goes live!
How to use coral cache: http://slashdot.org.nyud.net:8090/~oscartheduck
Is the change to x86 a stealthy move which will in the future enable people to buy Mac OS X to run on their formerly MS Windows PC?
If this is the true objective, I'd say it is brillant!
Who will guard the guards?
What the hell are you talking about?
I just priced a Dell laptop with relatively the same specs and the price came up to $2621 for a 9400 with a 17" screen (They don't offer a Core Duo with a 15.4" screen) And it's still a fucking Dell. So how's the Mac overpriced?
What part of "It's faster than the G4" and "We tried, but couldn't fit a G5 in it" don't you get?
The product mix has stopped making sense, although only temporarily. In the portable line they have iBook G4 and MacBook Pro intel; in the desktop line they have iMac intel and PowerMac G5.
iMac that's as powerful as a PowerMac? Who's gonna wanna buy PowerMacs for the next couple months? Does Apple expect to make so much profit from the iMac intel over the coming months than the forgone profit from lost PowerMac G5 sales? I would think that the PowerMac G5 made a much higher profit than the iMac.
And a MacBook Pro that's 10x more powerful than a iBook?!? There goes the iBook market...
Anybody else see the logic of transitioning the consumer desktop and pro laptop first, rather than starting with the consumer desktop and laptop, or the pro desktop and laptop, or the pro desktop and consumer laptop, or some other combination?
I'm not sure if's already been posted, but here is an Ad for the Intel on Mac...Intel Ad
What are your thoughts?
Apple has sold PCs since back in the days of the Power PCs, and they have always been Macs. There are a couple fundemental differences between what the average geek refers to as a PC, and a Mac. A PC runs windows, and a Mac runs Mac OS. This hasn't changed. A PC can be assembled without the permission of a PC manufacturer, while a Mac is built by Apple, and delived as a whole system. Always. As far as I know, this hasn't changed. A Mac will NEVER be missing drivers for what is inside of it. A PC will almost always be missing drivers for some insignificant piece. These are still Macs.
Remember, any other PC runs that Microsoft abortion.
So they did have to take two very interesting -- can we say essential? -- features to get a decent notebook with Intel processors. Sad. What could have the MacBook been if they had stayed with Power or went AMD? Or if they had went with Alpha in the first place?
I was all for Power, and FireWire, and I don't want to be limited by the lack of CardBus in such an expensive machine. And I try to run all free software. So this launched has killed the Mac for me. Good-bye, Apple. Hello, Pegasos
Leandro Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA
DA, DBA, SysAdmin, Data Modeller
GNU Project, Debian GNU/Lin
Finally, a graphics card in a mac that doesn't suck donkey balls!
I have never owned a mac, and have never wanted one... until right now.
Am I the only person who thinks that 1440x900 is a pretty low resolution for a 15" laptop?
My 10" laptop has 1280x768 for goodness sakes.
badness 10000
I think a lot of us will have a lot of thinking to do about these new offerings.
It's tempting.
The articles mention the "Apple Remote". Is this a new remote, or is it the same as the old Apple Remote? The old remote lacks the ability to navigate outside of your current playlist on an iPod, and has a very large "Menu" button which only works with a new iMac. Judging by the reviews, most people want more features in this remote.
Is this the same remote, or has the remote been updated to allow better navigation?
"Can of worms? The can is open... the worms are everywhere."
This is not a troll but...
"Let me just say that I would hate to have just purchased a new PowerBook G4."
I've felt that way for almost 2 years. The PB is old old old and it did not age gracefully the last two years. You only bought a powerbook the last two years if there was somethign about a PB that made it worth the huge premium over an ibook.
One thing that seems to have been overlooked in all of the hoo-ha about the new Intel machines is that there is a new iPod Radio Remote that acts as both a replacement for the old iPod remote, and adds radio functionality!
'The best thing about deadlines is the wonderful WHOOSHing sound they make as they go by.' - Douglas Adams
Why has there been no price reduction in the ibooks? Obselete technology should be reduced in price,
The new "MacBook Pro" - what a dumb name for a nice laptop - is supposed to ship in February, that's right. But the new Intel-based iMacs are supposed start shipping tomorrow.
Switch back to Slashdot's D1 system.
I'm a little disappointed by the graphics on the new, uh... MacBook (going to be a while before that rolls off the tongue). The Mobility 1600 is a decent card, but they could've done better on a $2000 machine. I know Apple has deals with ATI, but the nVidia 7800 would've fit better, especially at the high end. (And before you say "Don't game on a laptop", sorry, but people do. I have a high-end rig I built for gaming and a Dell Inspiron with a 6800 Go for on the road gaming. It holds its own until I get back to my rig). If Apple shipped one with a really high-end card, I'd jump on it immediately.
Everything else (the dual core, engineering, etc) look solid. I'm a little scared about that magnetized cord (let's hope no one gets floppies or, more likely in this day and age, a spare hard drive near that thing). And there's a little note about moving the WiFi antenna from the screen to the latch. What's that all about?
It looks just like my G4 Powerbook. What's so different?
It's notable that the new MacBook doesn't have Firewire 800 (a single 400 port only). I'm not sure if this could be any indicator for future pro desktop models, but it does seem like Apple's backing away from it a bit.
OK, let's do this one right from the start. Can we please call the new MacBook Pro a McBook, or McBook Pro.
MacBook just doesn't roll off the tongue very nicely...
If you don't know what AltaVista is (was), get off my lawn.
as another poster noted, they dropped firewire 800 (now it's just 400) on the macbook (nice, uh, name guys). seems like there was a recent story about the demise of firewire -- as if apple was phasing it out. this sure would support that claim -- anyone know the digs? mr c
"Physics is like sex. Sure, it may give some practical results, but that's not why we do it." - R. Feynman
I'm looking at the QTVR, and I see a Powerbook with one button.
Just griping.
Happy to see you, MacBook, don't get me wrong, but you forgot a button!!
(I expect this to be answered later by a post describing the new pref for button assignment)
I want a MacBook with an order of fries -- hold the special sauce, please.
Will Virtual PC 7.0 run on this thing? Kind of being a smart ass, but kind of serious, too. I can't wait for the first virtualization product to hit the streets -- something like VMWare would be sweet. Despite everything they say, there are still a couple of things I use windows for.
--Jim (me)
Come on moderators. lol
The Acer Travelmate has the same components, faster processor, more ram, more storage space, but a cheaper price.
Apple's doom is sealed if they are going to start charging more for the same thing you can get in the PC WORLD!
Only difference, Apple is running OSX, so Apple should charge less then the Acer Travelmate, Acer has to pay Microsoft for Windows, Apple doesn't have to pay anybody for OSX.
Apple doesn't get it. They have become PC OEM retailers and with the exception of the OS, every component is made by PC OEM manufacturers, but Apple thinks they can charge more for it. Brand recognition might drive big sales in the first few months, but eventually people are going to realize you can get the same performance in a PC product for cheaper without paying more for the branding, as has been the case for the last few years.
Apple DIDN'T EVEN REDESIGN THE CASE!
MacBook Pro = the biggest joke yet. Apple claims it is more then a PC, it IS a PC, just costs more.
We can finally compare Apple's to Apple's now, I can't wait for the benchmarks that prove Apple isn't anything more then a PC with a different logo. Considering OSX has had lousy comparisons to similar Linux and Windows concepts (like threading performance, etc) which have been provem kernel related, I am sure that we will find that performance on the Mactels are probably not as good as with the same system running Linux or Windows.
Good luck Apple! After a year of hype you have come out with a product that has already been on the market for months.
I haven't thought of anything clever to put here, but then again most of you haven't either.
I've used Macs since 1984. It didn't matter that they were more expensive: they consistently used the best technology available, and this made them worth it. This is not the first time that Apple has stepped back from that -witness the switch to ATA drives over SCSI- but it is the final straw for me. I don't intend to move to Windows, anyway; it's Linux all the way for me.
By the way, the x86 switchover isn't the only reason I'm switching. The TPM module is another. Even if they'd stuck with a superior architecture, I refuse to use DRM-crippled hardware.
I moved to the iBook G4 this week and if what they have said is true I'll be even more excited. I can seemlessly do my webdesign on my laptop with PHP/Apache/MySQL, work on it on the train and sync the changess when I get home with my FreeBSD server. I love having a completely stable and usable GUI on top of UNIX. Plus it runs all my music recording and synth software, yes I know, still not for everyone.
"...the soul of this machine has improved..." Douglas A. Maske
First: its supposedly lithium-polymer (60 Watt-hour instead of old 50). Second: it has an 85 Watt power adapter (!!!), and most importantly NO QUOTED BATTERY LIFE figures. I would assume if the numbers were good we'd see them listed immediately. So Mac Book Pro, you'll love it for 1.5 hours (welcome to Intel processors).
Welcome to the party, Apple!
Guess what, you are only 20 years late...
geez, you're right, every consumer (mac, linux, and windows users) has heard of pheed. stupid apple...trying to make technology easy for not-bleeding edge consumers/non-nerds.
I'm just damn excited about the MagSafe connector. Probably half of all the laptop hardware repairs I've done were to replace the power connector. It's one of the weakest points in current design, and I'm glad to see someone finally innovating along that front. Although, if this catches on it will mean declines in laptop repair revenue....
---- El diablo esta en mis pantalones! Mire, mire!
I hope someone can get of hold of a new MacBook Pro on demo at an Apple store. It'd be great to hear informal, biased, first-hand responses of how loading a cached application feels a little 'snappier' than on their home DinosaurPowerPC.
Sorta annoyed me too, but at least we have an ExpressCard slot. Should be some decent peripherals for it at some point.
Sound like Steve Jobless is actually making marketing sexy and a lot of computer science students would be better off in marketing. What would you rather do: design the iPod or read about the iPod sales figures? According to this story, the engineering is merely a path to what you really want, getting great sales figures.
1.67/1.83GHz doesn't sound to sexy to me.
BC
Thes MacBook looks wonderful and I think I will be buying one, but I find it strange that they decided to eliminate the Firewire 800 port. Firewire 800 ports are standard on the 15" and 17" G4 Powerbooks.
Does anyone want to speculate on this move? I was considering getting a Firewire 800 external hard drive for doing audio and video. On paper at least, they outperform Firewire 400 drives by a good margin. It would seem that pro users would want a Firewire 800 port on pro laptop product line.
Yes, the new kit is all shiny and spurty and sweet and so forth. But I'm one of The Unhappy Few who's still running Classic. I'm wondering how long it'll take until somebody gets that going, or VMWare gets ported - the apps I use have Windows counterparts, so with the move to intel it's no longer a question of buying updated MacOS X software - it's an issue of switching to windows or waiting on emulators.
Any word on the expected battery life of the MacBook Pro? I couldn't find any info anywhere, so I'm expecting it to be adequate at best. This is the laptop that finally replaces my 867 powerbook, but I might wait until the first revision. Battery life and heat ouptut are big considerations for me.
2x faster? 4x faster?
We've been lied to horribly for the last 3-4 years. Clock for clock intels are as powerful as PowerPC. So when I bought my 1.8GHz iMac G5 it was already slower than equivalent PCs. Now thats all very well and good, except that Apple were screaming that it was faster, better, stronger. That you would be mad to even think about buying Intel, and I sucked it up. Its not even like they didn't know the truth. They've been developing Mac OS X on intel for the last 5 years, so they new they were onto a looser with PowerPC and they still over sold.
Now I'm very happy with my Mac, but the smug sense of superiority that I bought with the Mac has been wiped out. I miss being inside the RDF.
Scared of flying, pointy things snce 1979!
Yes, yes, MacBook Pro is a clumsy name, but get used to it. The iBook occupies an important position for Apple, and something has to fill it. That the new Intel laptop is the MacBook Pro implies that there will soon be a MacBook that is not pro.
Anyone else find that the battery life numbers are mysteriously absent. Didn't hear them in the keynote and can't find any mention in the specs posted on the Apple website. Troubling...
I see the Apple marketing engine has wowed you with all the fancy specs no one has noticed that the display on the MacBook is still not HD (1080i) and where the hell is the 17" version?
Surely now Intel can complete their rebranding... "Intel Incider" ?
OH HECK YEAH, AN FM TUNER FOR THE IPOD.. oh wait.. ... day late, dollar short. :(
yesterday was howard stern's first day on Sirius Satellite radio.
meh.
I've been waiting for this release for years now. Since the original Developer Releases of Mac OS X we all knew that Darwin could perfectly run in a generic x86 box, so the outcome was trivial: Steve was planning to switch to Intel, almost half a decade ago. It was becoming annoying to have a machine priced twice as high as a usual PC but with half the performance. C'mon, even though this Intel Core Duo notebook is brand new, 4 ~ 5 times the performance of the old G5 is laughable at best. Let's throw away the nonsense discussion around the "MacBook" name, the RISC VS Post-RISC (CISC), the Mac OS X VS Windows VS Linux, Power VS Intel, this is being picky, don't matter. The bottomline is simple: the Power is out of the game, the Mac OS X can grow the installed base faster, linux doesn't need to support yet another hardware architecture, open source can grow faster on Mac machines now. Virtualization, hypervisor and alikes will help people bring Windows on top of Mac faster than before. There's room for a lot here, can't wait for the next releases.
Would you like macFries and macCola with that macBook?
Pretty inflammatory marketing tagline. I wonder if Apple cleared that with Intel?
No, they have a standard bios, like the dev machines.
Those of us if the OS X on Intel scene have not seen an Intel release of 10.4.4 yet but as of 10.4.3 we have managed to bypass the TPM and SSE3 requirements so that you can install OS X on a beige box so to speak. (assuming you hardware works with Darwin)
In fact I am posting this from an OS X box that started life as a Toshiba Laptop.
Once they ship, I predict it will be a matter of weeks before you can download an install DVD to install OS X on your beige box. Granted, without SSE3 rosetta is veeeeeeery slow but with native apps, it is currents much faster then native PPC apps.
What part of "It's faster than the G4" and "We tried, but couldn't fit a G5 in it" don't you get?
The part where they didn't bother using their research and development to improve an elegant and clean architecture, as Apple has had a long history of doing in the past. Contrary to their marketing, IBM was more than capable of delivering the goods, as was shown barely a month after the initial announcement.
I'm sorry, but "pheed" looks stupid. I like photocasting much better.
"Sufferin' succotash."
And that while it may not have FW800, it does have Firewire 400.
Wonder how long it takes before we see the retail osx these ship with running on various non-apple intel based products....
... or run a VMWare-type app to let me have it in a VM.
Perfect.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
The MacBook Pro looks like a great desktop replacement; I have half a mind to suggest my company get one in lieu of the iMac we were about to buy.
But as a personal user of an IBM X31 who's been eyeing that 12" Powerbook I was really hoping for an x86 ultraportable Powerbook.
Ah well, wait and see.
Considering I've happily managed on my 12" iBook with neither, no big deal. Seriously, what does FW 800 give you that FW 400 isn't already overkill for?
"Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
--Dr.W.Edwards Deming
An x86 Mac! Are we finally on the verge of a system that does it all? The questions that keeps looking, will Windows run on it? Linux? Will they do it natively? Perhaps VMWare will provide the final solutions. A laptop (dual core no less) that can run any operating system desired (at 90% of actual speeds or faster) is the geeks ultimate play toy.
But this does raise another interesting question. I do recall JObs professing that this version of OS X will only run on a Mac with Intel architecture. We all already know that the OS can be found and run on current x86 systems. How long, though, do you think it will be before Apple offers OS X as an alternative platform for everyone's personal home computer? Afterall, MS made its mammoth foundation on their OS's. And would such a stance really hurt Apple? They could still sell their laptops as "Mac certified" or something. "Use the best with the best" etc, etc.
Interesting times lay ahead. Right now, I just want to play with one!
For castles made of sand must eventually return to the sea.
Intel based system Apple came up with. One interesting thing of
note, they don't (as of 5 minutes ago) list batttery life in the
specs. That kind of scares me.... I can't believe they would forget
that in a laptop spec.
Unless battery liife is really bad, I'm going to pull the trigger
once someone manages to multi-boot this baby. This is the ultimate
developers machine until the H/W virtualization stuff comes out..
They also dropped the built-in modem, which is a bit annoying for road warriors. (You know, the people who use the portability of their laptops?) Yes, you can get a USB modem, but it's one more dongle to pack in your case.
I noticed the lack of FireWire 800 as well. But they kept FireWire 400 -- so at least DV users and professional musicians aren't left out in the cold! But this trend does worry me. Perhaps Apple did a study and found that almost nobody used the FW800 ports, only the FW400 ports? Of course, a single FW400 port isn't so great either, but at least you can daisy-chain FireWire devices.
Hell has frozen over.
I suppose I am being a bit more inflammatory than I might otherwise be. But it's not my intent to troll. I honestly believe what I'm saying here, and I am in fact done with the Mac. The Apple tax used to come with superior technology, which made it worth it. Now it doesn't. So I'm done.
Was really hoping for a new Mac Mini. I'd like to get one for the living room and connect it to my HDTV. The current Mini apparently has fairly crappy DVD playback.
Vote Libertarian
That's what it sounded like to me. I can't check the Apple site since its slowed to a crawl.
About three months ago, they announced the upgraded iMac G5. I bought my iMac G5 on Nov 19, 2005. Less than two months later, it's obsolete.
bitter bitter bitter bitter.
Start Running Better Polls
Man, I wish I were Apple's accountant. There's something a bit screwy about the price of the new MacBook Pro (apart from the name sounding like a word processing application, rather than a computer):
USA:
PowerMac G5 Dual 2GHz: $1999
MacBook Pro dualcore 1.67 GHz: $1999
UK:
PowerMac G5 Dual 2GHz: £1399
MacBook Pro dualcore 1.67 GHz: £1779
Now, I know not to expect UK/USA price parity (taxes different, working conditions expensive, all the rest of that) but why are two products the same price in one country, at an almost £400 difference in another?
Where will I ever get that kind of money? Not in this year:( Ill just wait for the next updated version, with scratch free screen :)
An FM tuner is announced and there's No bitching about OGG? I am so disappointed in all of you.
No. Pain you keep, Pain you always keep. It'll just be new pains on the new OS. Along that line, I can now crash a fully patched WinXP P4 box consistently by attempting to open a Start Menu subfolder and the error reports are going their merry way to Microsoft.
From the Apple Imac specs page:
"Support for external display in extended desktop and video mirroring modes "
To me, that is a big deal, to have monitor spanning without a hack. Nice.
"What could have the MacBook been if they had stayed with Power" Slower. "or went AMD" or hotter.
It has an expansion slot, and if history is any indicator, Apple's inclusion of that slot will push acceptance with peripheral manufacturers. Heck, in three years, you might even be able to get one on a Dell.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
Hallelujah! Finally, NPR on iPod. I am going to buy a black sweater . . .
uh, if apple had gone with Alpha, they _still_ wouldn't have a laptop. those things run hotter than a p4.
So they did have to take two very interesting -- can we say essential?
Not really. Firewire 800 never went anywhere, and there's an ExpressCard slot for expansion.
What could have the MacBook been if they had stayed with Power
Um, a lot slower?
So this launched has killed the Mac for me.
That makes no sense whatsoever, but ok.
How to solve most of our problems: 1.Lots of nuclear plants. 2.Cure aging.
There's a link in the new product pages for the Keynote Address (as of 11:30pst, it isn't working yet, but it's a safe bet that they'll have it up soon) http://www.apple.com/quicktime/qtv/mwsf06/
StupidChildren...the reason jesus is crying
All well and good, I'm drooling, yada yada...
BUT, will this boot Windoze too so I don't have to lug two laptops?
We also have the iMac and PowerMac - probably will become MacPro?
MacBook Pro, as others have observed, is not a good name. It's quite clunky - I keep thinking of the word "brick" when I say it - not a good image when applied to a laptop. My suggestion if they really want to ditch "Power":
iBook - ProBook
iMac - ProMac Simple, and more Apple-like I think.
STFU, fatty. You're just mad because someone made a geeky product that pretty girls can use without having to have an engineering degree first. OMFG ITS NOT TEH OPEN SOUREZ!!! TEH GATESBORG IS DRM-ING THE FREEDOMS OF AMERIKKA!!!!!
Go recompile your kernel, you douche. I'm going to go outside where the three-dimensional people are and talk to some chicks.
Two of my brothers and my partner just got Powerbooks in the last six months. I feel bad for them, but they could not have gone without laptops all that time. OTOH, they'll miss out on all the first-generation what-will-break-now excitement, and the oh-yeah-this-isn't-a-universal-binary-either game.
My PowerBook will be three years old in March, and I'm full of anticipation...
Everyone is entitled to his own opinions, but not his own facts.
Come on, they wont even say how long the battery lasts? I've been looking everywhere. Not good...
the MacBook looks "cream your pants" good. i can't wait to take out a loan to get one of my own
You lucky Americans will be getting the 'MacBook Pro' at a discount of about US$500 to us Brits. The starting price at current exchange rate in the UK is $2,523 - which I believe is just over price for the high-end model in the US...
Shame that, I was considering it for a minute, then I saw the disparity between prices when I went to the UK site to see if it was available and thought 'nah'. Quibble all you want about things 'always being more expensive' in the UK to the US, it doesn't change the fact they're effectively asking $500 for a UK keyboard layout, and UK plug.
well, I ordered one with a 7200 rpm 100 GB; big jump from my current pismo G3 400 (10x ?) that runs 10.4.3, will post specs and pics when it arrives
dropped a built-in dialup modem as well (a usb version available as an option)
Yes, Apple does have amazing products. Lots of us (including develoers) are switching from Windows platforms to Mac ... BUT if you were thinking of buying AAPL stock because of all this good news, I encourage you to think again.
Technical people, such as computer scientists and engineers are notoriously bad at stock trading. One of the main reasons is we fail to comprehend how the financial / stock world can fall way out of line with reality.
In the case of AAPL stock, the price has gone up 8x in just two years. In stock traders terms, AAPL and GOOG are definitely bubble stocks -- nobody is doubting that the companies are great, but the stocks have gotten out of hand. A high stock rise like this indicates extreme expectations of where the company will be in a couple years. However, it is highly unlikely that a company as old and large as AAPL can grow that fast.
Anyway, my point to this is that before you go and buy AAPL stock just because you think ipods are cool, consider that you are buying at a tremendously high price because a mountain of other people have already priced in very great expectations from the company. It is really unlikely that AAPL stock will make you a capital gain over the medium or long term; just beware that whenever you buy a stock, you should very closely monitor it (every week for sure) so that if it starts to fall, you exit without suffering too great a loss.
Why not package the new iMac guts in a case without a monitor? I understand the desire to use their allotment of Yonah processors in the machines that will give them the highest markup, but all the PC fanboys are going to complain now that they don't want to pay for a monitor just to upgrade their machines... and even Mac fanboys aren't going to buy PowerMacs, iBooks, or Mac minis when iMacs and this ( IMHO poorly named ) "Mac Book Pro" are so far ahead of them and clearly on the way out, if not already gone.
Anyone have thoughts on why there were no Mac mini, iBook, or eMac updates ( or Intel conversions ) today ? What is going to happen there ?
If the MacBook Pro allows dual boot of Windows XP/OSX I predict a major sucess! Who will be the first to report of a successful boot of Windows XP?
Standards Schmandards
So how cheaply can I get into a Mac laptop now?
Computers are useless. They can only give you answers.
-- Pablo Picasso
"Click, squeeze, and scroll Mighty Mouse"? That's inhumane.
The Core Duo based iMacs are already shipping
"The way we can tell it's C# instead of Haskell is because it's nine lines instead of two." -- wadler
3 minutes after the end of the show, it was up and running for about 10 minutes now, it is quite dead.
Superb technical demonstration, Apple did not provide any live info: showing how easy it is to publish a podcast, and finally leading people to read text from a read only IRC channel (thanks macrumors!). Obviuosly, there is something strange in the message... Maybe they'd better use new intel imacs to power their website, instead of xservers (I assume)... I hope to see something really soon on that link.
going to buy me a powerbook G4 on ebay, should be great deals on it really soon!
You are going to buy a Pegasos laptop? Where?
Lasers Controlled Games!
totally overpriced
I use FW800 drives for all my video work, and while fw800 is backwards compatible with fw400, it is a nice feature and using it to move around GIGs of files is very nice.
I realize there is an express card slot, but it probably doesn't support fw800 target disk mode, which was a great way to get projects from my G5 onto my powerbook quickly.
Everything else is fine, and I can see why apple is not removing the powerbooks from production. This is the transition machine, if I were heavily invested in carbus mixing stuff (midi expansions, etc.) i would probably go with another g4.
It will also be nice to see if the expansion card slot business will take off again with useful devices.
Is the max memory really 2GB ou it suports 4GBs (intel's latest mobile chipset is supposed to support it) ? Is the processor and the mobo soldered or are upgradable ?
an intel based apple notebook? how sexy... how long before it runs ubuntu?
Quote: ... 10.4.4 ... you can download it today, it's got all these new widgets."
12:25 PM - "We've got a new release of Mac OS X Tiger
What is Steve talking about that 10.4.4 will be available? I just tried software update and there was an update for Quicktime but nothing for 10.4.4. Perhaps it will be available later today. *shrug*
We knew there would be a new PowerBook, sorry MacBook, but I am surprised that no accouncement was made as to an Intel powered Mac Mini. There were strong rumors before the show that it would be announced. Guess not.
www.apple.com/store seems to have been slashdotted!
appreciate the fact that now I will be able to dual boot in Windows and play the games
Actually, this is the most important remaining question about this entire announcement. Is it really the case that one can install Windows on Apple's new hardware? Can any geeks out there truly verify this? Has anyone actually gotten the shipping hardware and tried to install Windows on it and successfully gotten it up and running with a dual-boot configuration?
It wouldn't surprise me if Apple has implemented some kind of unique encrypted handshaking between the OS X installer and the hardware so that only Apple's OS can be installed on it, so that they can avoid receiving support calls from people who put Windows on Apple hardware. Keep in mind that even if they refuse to provide support for such a configuration, the bulk of a support call's cost is in the customer placing the call in the first place. If someone calls only to be told "we don't support that", that has already cost Apple a good bit of money.
Moderator hint: a comment is neither "Flamebait" nor "Troll" if it is true.
Why was Intel CEO, Paul Otellini, wearing a bunny suit?
Please don't pelt me with small rocks for asking.
ACSony VAIO N505VE: power connection killed by my son when he started learning to crawl and pull himself up things
/. I'm guessing it's the kids thing.)
Thinkpad A32: power connection killed by my son about 6 months later
Dell 5160: power connection killed by my daughter as she's learning to crawl and pull herself up things.
Thinkpad R52: power connection seems OK so far. Crossing my fingers.
(Those of you who are thinking, "Well, duh, just keep your laptop away from your kids" either don't have kids or don't have a serious computer addiction. And since you're on
The lack of FireWire 800 - External FW800 hard drives are great and very popular with Powerbook users, why give it up? Put the controller where the now gone modem used to be.
The ExpressCard/34 slot chosen by Apple is not form factor compatible with current PCMCIA cards - No more Verizon 3G wireless broadband until (And if) they release a compatible card - BAD, BAD, BAD!
It's not there yet. But a link off the MacBookPro page says that the keynote will be viewable(I presume shortly) at: http://www.apple.com/quicktime/qtv/mwsf06/
I can't wait to get myself their new 20 inch iMac.
The ONLY thing I will still need windows for is to have a service like GoToMeeting where I can share my screen, or let someone else share their screen with me and I can control their keyboard and mouse (other party needs to be windows, mac optional but nice to have). Has to be firewall friendly, not VNC. Anyone know anything like GoToMeeting where I can host meetings on Mac? For many reasons I don't want Virtual PC as part of the solution.
Apple kicks ass. Seriously. What a sweet box with *nix goodies inside. I give them props.
$999
without IR Remote Control
without Built in camera
without Superdrive just standard CD-RW/DVD-ROM
$899
without Bluetooth
without WiFi 802.11 g
80GB drive
The Macbook Pro should have retained FW800 port. Upsetting your professional user base is not a good idea. Many of the external drives we have from LaCie and OWC come with the FW800. Was looking forward to using it on our newer computers. The Apple Remote for Frontrow really should have been Bluetooth based. I would have loved to see this used on Powerpoint and Keynote presentations as well (what where they thinking?). The ATI gfx chip is slick and overall good news.
One burning question remains...can you install Windows XP, will Mac OSX (x86) 10.4.4 HFS+ jounrnaled partition coexist with an NTFS volume on the same disk? Finally, what about virtualization and Vanderpool. The next coming months should be interesting.
Would my Debian work our of the box ? Soon ?
Notice on the tech specs page for the MacBook Pro http://www.apple.com/macbookpro/whatsinside.html no mention of battery life? Does this mean the battery life on the MacBook is poor, since they tout it on iBook & PowerBook tech specs?
I have a Developer Transition Kit intel powermac, and installed windows with no problem. Games played pretty terribly though, maybe that aspect of it was intentionally crippled. Never did get linux working very well, but I'm not really much of a linux user.
MS Office is 50% off with any new Mac purchase. This is for people who are considering picking up a new Mac after this Intel announcement. Valid until the end of January 2006.
o mo_popup_con.html
http://store.apple.com/Catalog/US/Images/officepr
Does this mean that the Pro desktops will be named MacMacs?
"It is our blasphemy which has made us great, and will sustain us, and which the gods secretly admire in us." - Zelazny
"Mobile users will love the new power adapter featuring the MagSafe Connector -- a magnetic DC plug that both ensures a tight connection and enables a clean break from the power port when there is undue tension. It prevents the MacBook Pro from being pulled off of a desk when the cord is accidentally tripped over, and it protects the power cord from wear and tear."
Nobody but a careless klutz would ever trip on their power cord and pull the laptop off a desk. Would they?
*whistles as I rock on my heels*
Well, this got my attention. Four times faster?! How can that be? Ohhhh a dual processor and double the clock speed. Well there goes the Apple arguments that clock speed doesn't matter.
But I have to admit they got the price right (i.e. no increase over existing models). Or is it? I seem to remember my Powerbook (which works GREAT!) only started at $1500. Oh, but I got the 12 incher, which isn't available with this "new" processor. Nice trick Apple. Almost fooled me there for a bit. Even the press is saying the prices are the same, except of course, for those of us who would really rather have a smaller box.
My plan to get more or less the same capability is to get a dual core AMD chip in a laptop (these are already available by the way). That way I can be sure it will run Linux on day one. And, of course, the AMD machines start around a grand.
SEE!? Now the price comparisons are much easier. Why buy and Apple when I can get the same or better for less. I'm no longer confused by that old PowerPC mumbo-jumbo. Thanks Stevie!
Battery life? At that level I say 1.5 hours?
No one else seems to have mentioned the lack of battery specs, which used to be a main boasting point. My brother's 17" PowerBook gets nearly seven hours on a full charge. But I can't find battery life specs on the Apple site anywhere. Are they that bad?
:)
Nice, the built-in camera, though I hope we can still use the external cameras easily. (Handy for showing off the baby to grandma without getting mushy Cheerios in the $2500 keyboard.). And THANK YOU for the new magnetic power cable!
Still, it's fun imagining Steve Jobs going over to Intel and single-handedly motivating them to get the new processors done in time for the keynote.. New use of the reality-distortion field effect. Looks like they cut the timing really close.
Everyone is entitled to his own opinions, but not his own facts.
What's the battery life of the Macbook Pro? I can't find that info on Apple's site.
So Steve is nixing the PowerBook name because they want to have "Mac" in the name of every product. And appending "Pro" to the end of the professional products, ala the MacBook Pro. But, he intends on keeping the "i" in front of the consumer products, ala the iMac.
If this logic is followed, the consumer laptop would stop being called the iBook and would become the iMacBook. And the pro desktop would be called the PowerMac Pro. Or maybe just the Mac Pro. Damn, those are ugly names....
Dropped FW 800
I don't use firewire for anything that _requires_ 800 speed, but don't some people, especially video people need this, and couldn't this be an issue for them?
One of the many things I like about my PowerBook is that I can plug anything into it -- including FW800. Any ideas here?
Bill Gates buys Birnam Wood and moves it to Cupertino. Which leads to another question, "Are the Borg 'of woman born'?"
Some mornings it's hardly worth chewing through the restraints to get out of bed.
Why not just name it the AwesomeBook and be done with it? Obviously it is a more awesome name.
I think a good comparison with the high end model can be made with the 8200:
s p
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,1907155,00.a
2GHZ, 2GB ram, 120GB HDD, x1600M 256M, 15.4", GigE, etc. $2499
Apple:
1.83GHz, 2GB ram, 120GB HDD, x1600 256M, 15.4", GigE, etc.
$2899
The acer has a faster CPU and has a better camera
The apple is about a pound lighter, remote control, and some good apps.
-- Have you ever imagined a world with no hypothetical situations?
Would be nice if a Mac could come out with spec's meeting or topping those of a comparably-priced Intel machine. Especially now that they ARE Intel machines.
I love my PowerBook, but its getting harder and harder to justify to myself the expense of a new one when Dell and such have become so much cheaper.
As far as Powerbooks go, though, the lamely-named "MacBook Pro" is admittedly hot.
Your entire post makes no sense. Staying with Power would be idioitic as its not advancing fast enough. Going with AMD would be unwise as they don't have the capacity to produce enough chips to satisfy Apple's demands and their current PC customers. But hey if you want to continue to use a slow architecture be my guest.
Mac OS X and Windows XP working side by side to fight back the night.
To make matters worse, they're still selling the PowerBook G4 (including the 15" model) alongside the MacBook Pro.
Actually I think it makes a lot of sense to support users who want stability over speed at the moment. The Intel MacBooks are going to be bleeding edge for a little while at least...
And Powerbooks have good resale value (yes, even going forward) so it's not like you will take that much of a hit unloading it.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I like how Apple reinvents pheed and calls it "Photocasting" as well as "incredibly new".
Oh, didn't you hear?
Technology does not exist until is has been thoroughly repackaged, branded, and marketed properly...and for those unfortunate technologies that are not controlled by one company, they do not exist until a new name is thought up for them which is both trendy and annoying at the same time.
There was no such thing as ordering a product from a remote company until e-commerce.
There was no such thing as browsing a website until surfing.
There was no such thing as false-identity scams until phishing.
There was no such thing as malicious computer code until viruses.
There was no such thing as an online journal until blogging.
There was no such thing as downloading mp3s until iTunes.
There was no such thing as downloading mp3s of people talking until podcasting.
And there was no such thing as sharing photos with people until Photocasting.
You must have missed the memo.
For security, the MD5 hash of this message and sig is 09f911029d74e35bd84156c5635688c0.
The PowerBook becomes the MacBook Pro.
Does this mean the iBook is going to become the MacBook? They kept "iMac". Having a MacBook Pro without a MacBook seems daft.
Does the PowerMac become the MacMac Pro?
My latest external Firewire drives offer both firewire 400 and 800 ports. The 800 is noticably faster. I use it with FCP and DVD Studio Pro along with After Effects...
Also absolutely no mention of battery life, apart from a vague "Battery life depends on configuration and use."
I think we may be looking at a return to 2hr. battery life. When you configure a new Powerbook, err, MacBook Pro, at the Apple online store, the first recommended product is the "Rechargeable Battery - 15-inch MacBook Pro - Buy an extra battery to double your battery life when traveling." Hmmm.
From the commentary on the various live feeds, it sound more like Apple re-invented Flickr.
.Mac, and the person you want to share with uses iPhoto, you can basically feed images straight from your iPhoto to theirs. No email, no web pages, no nothin'.
More or less, yeah, but they've taken the 80% task of photo sharing and made it even easier and more direct than Flickr or email, within some constraints. If you've got
I think that's pretty cool, even if it's not utterly groundbreaking. I would expect more photo apps to add this exact feature (both publishing and subscribing) in the near future. Up until now the publishing has all been by uploading your pictures to Flickr (or elsewhere), and the subscribing has all been in newsreaders designed around text.
Don't become a regular here -- you will become retarded.
The best part is no visible Intel Inside badging!
who needs old cardbus when u have the brand new expresscard ?
It probably will not be that much longer before we see lower end Intel Macs as well - they said the whole range will have an update by the end of the year.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
Well if you install the X11 application from the Mac OS X disk and install the XCode developer tools (also on the disk, but can be downloaded from apple/developer) you might get all that you asked for.
I know OS X may not have the geek factor, but I really want to use my computer, not compile the OS again, and again.
Whatever floats your boat I guess.
Weirdly, Apple have decided that modems are now optional extras on Laptops. That makes sense for the iMac - but not on a PowerBook.
PowerBook is now MacBook...
Hum..
It makes PowerMac as MacMac!
Confusing if you have 4 processors....
for what it's worth, i just got off the phone with apple sales and asked them if i could install windows on the new yonah laptops. here's what they said:
"we're working on it. we just have a couple licensing issues we have to resolve."
when first i asked him he started talking about how much better osX was than windows which i immediately conceded. i then told him windows was unfortunately a requirement for what i do and told him i almost ordered a new dual core ibm yesterday (which is true - the x60) but would much rather have an apple. that's when he conceded they were "working on it". anyway thought i'd share.
We've been lied to horribly for the last 3-4 years. Clock for clock intels are as powerful as PowerPC.
What are you talking about? These are not old Intel chips, they are new. These chips didn't exist before. So what were you lied about? The PPC chips were faster (in some ways) than the Intel chips available before. They did the benchmarks and you can look it up.
The Yonah processor Intel developed for laptops and is selling under the Core Duo name is not just a generic x86 proc (much faster than a VIA EPIC, faster AND better power conserving than AMD Turions and -does Transmeta still sell cpus?- MUCH faster than Transmetas).
Really sad when the anti-Intel bias of the poster can't even give Intel credit for making a processor that enables twice the FP perf and many times the int perf of the previous Power chips Apple used (or at least that's what Steve said).
In fact, looking over the blogger transcript I saw, Steve never said x86 ONCE -he jus talked about a great Intel processor.
Take a break from the Intel bashing for a few minutes...
He is 100% right. Why is it considered flamebait? Apple made the Mighty Mouse with multiple buttons but its new Pro offerings still have 1? It doesn't make sense!
I had a power adaptor die when someone tripped over the cord (thankfully the laptop was OK) and all of the plugs in the working adaptors I have are all somewhat bent. That was a smart feature to add.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
It would make perfect sense for AMD to get together with the Apple cloners at this point to produce a much cheaper notebook.
Intel might let Apple slip by without an 'Intel Inside' sticker on the case, but I don't think they're going to fork a load of co-marketing dollars Apple's way for a machine that bears the 'Power' moniker.
'PowerBook' was one of the most admired product names in the industry, and probably one of the best known portable lines, alongside ThinkPad. I wonder how much it cost Intel to bury it forever?
A: Clock for clock the G5 is faster than the Pentium 4 architecture, so you were told the truth.
B: Clock for clock the Pentium M based Core Duo chip is faster than the G5. So again the truth.
Mix in some marketing (aka exagerations) and you have your situation.
Statement A: was meaningless because the P4 architecture always ran at a much faster clock speed which made it faster in actual use. So Intel in practical terms has pretty much always been faster.
It helps to ignore marketing and think for yourself what you want.
I never bought a Mac before but I might get one this year becasue I like the new architecture. I am waiting on a new Mini. I hope it uses the new Core Duo and runs cool and quiet. I hope they aren't putting the core solo in the mini as I would have to keep waiting...
Keynote will be avalible here: MacWorld SF 06' Keynote Soon. -hackajar
Sheesh ...
What bugs me a bit is the huge price difference between the US and European webstores.
For example, the new MacBook is $1999 in the US. With 16% VAT added and a few bucks thrown in for good measure, that should make an even 2000 Euros here in Germany. But the announced price in the webstore is 2499 Euros - where do the extra 499 Euros come from?
"Oh, a lesson in not changing history from Mr I'm-my-own-Grandpa." - Dr Hubert Farnsworth
There's funny talk shows I like on AM. Why this FM only? Music? There's radio stations that play music worth hearing?
Ok, when you said you used it for video work on your laptop I was all like, "wow, it's actually plausible that this guy has a raid array or something hooked up and actually needs the bandwidth." Then you had to go and say, "which was a great way to get projects from my G5 onto my powerbook quickly." There is no way your puny laptop drive is actually taking in input faster than fw400 can spit it out.
--
WHO ATE MY BREAKFAST PANTS?
The PPC macs are not really obsolete for several more years - I guess you didn't get the memo that "Universal Binary" means it runs on BOTH kinds of macs (hence universal).
Indeed for a while the PPC macs will be valuable because they are a somewhat more stable platform that can run some apps quicker than the newer Intel macs.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
http://www.apple.com/quicktime/qtv/mwsf06/ - file not found.
This relationship will not last long. I mean look at Apple's main site for the Macbook. It doesn't use Intel's new logo, just some stupid Apple gif. Hah, some partnership....
Is that Burst is spoiling Apple's, and therefore everyone's, anytime anywhere video future with oppressive licensing stipulations. Someone somewhere has to come up with an example of technology previous to Burst, therefore Apple can buy that company or show that Burst wasn't the first to invent it. Then M$ can sue for their money back!
I use multi-button mice on desktop Macs. But for laptops a single button, along with the use of a keyboard as button modifier, is actually much easier and quicker to use. There is no accidental hitting of the "right button" nor an awkward reach for a badly placed button - just Option-click.
I've used Windows laptops before from Dell and IBM and the button arrangements just did not work well.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I think the even bigger question is the reverse: can you install Apple's new OS X on your PC?
I know that they probably used the best DRM available in order to prevent this from happening, but just like all other attempts, somebody will figure it out.
I recall someone at Apple saying that they had no intention to prevent other OS from running on the Intel Macs. On the other hand, Windows XP does fairly nasty stuff with any existing MBRs, so unless OS X is designed or patched to cope with the XP installer there would be a problem.
A neater solution would probably be a native version of VirtualPC or an equivalent, as you can then copy and paste between Windows and OS X.
Clearly you don't actually do business travel. The point of a modem is when you need connectivity in a place that doesn't have high-speed networking (wired or wireless) and likely doesn't get cell reception. Even in a city, have you ever tried to get a decent cell signal in a tall building? Or more than 5 feet from the window in modern steel-framed buildings? Or maybe tried to check your e-mail in a basement conference room where the hotel wants to charge you $900/day for ethernet? I thought not.
True, it's not as useful anymore for most people, so I understand dropping it on the desktops, but it can be a real life-saver on laptops.
But hey if you want to continue to use a slow architecture be my guest.
It's not a slow architecture. It runs hot, but is in many ways better than Intel, but not where it counts for Apple (which is heat and power consumption).
Apple will not "preclude someone from running [Windows] on a Mac. They probably will."
It wouldn't surprise me if Apple has implemented some kind of unique encrypted handshaking between the OS X installer and the hardware so that only Apple's OS can be installed on it, so that they can avoid receiving support calls from people who put Windows on Apple hardware. Keep in mind that even if they refuse to provide support for such a configuration, the bulk of a support call's cost is in the customer placing the call in the first place. If someone calls only to be told "we don't support that", that has already cost Apple a good bit of money.
They won't support that, but they declared already that they will do nothing to prevent it. After Apple Intel FAQ:
After Jobs' presentation, Apple Senior Vice President Phil Schiller addressed the issue of running Windows on Macs, saying there are no plans to sell or support Windows on an Intel-based Mac. "That doesn't preclude someone from running it on a Mac. They probably will," he said. "We won't do anything to preclude that.
If Apple replaced Power... with Mac... Pro, would PowerMac be renamed MacMac Pro?
Notice how Apple doesn't call the CPUs "Pentium M". That's because Apple has worked so hard over the years brainwashing people into thinking "Pentium == crap". Now that they actually use one, they must _really_ not let their loyal customers know, or else Steve Jobs will be assassinated in a matter of days by crazy Apple zealots.
Will the "Macintel" systems be able to run Windows?
Officially, no. However, on June 6, 2005, Apple Senior Vice President Phil Schiller stated that Apple will not "preclude someone from running [Windows] on a Mac. They probably will." Apple Director of Software Product Marketing, Brian Croll affirmed that "Apple doesn't plan to sell or support Windows, but we're not planning anything on the hardware side that would preclude it from running."
Source
Also Linux has run on macs for ages.
Thanks Steve, but the Associated Press has been standardized on pheed for well over a year now.
Have they been using iPhoto, too? Gee, maybe there's room in the world for more than one way to put photos in RSS feeds. Flickr has been publishing RSS and Atom feeds of photos since 2004, and they don't use Pheed.
I like how Apple reinvents pheed and calls it "Photocasting" as well as "incredibly new".
Pheed is just a specification (for what, 2 elements?), and a not terribly exciting app. That iPhoto now implements something one could do with Pheed doesn't make the feature of publishing and subscribing to RSS feeds within the app any less "new". For all you know, iPhoto uses Pheed, The fact that it wouldn't make a difference one way or the other if it did says something about how important Pheed is.
Don't become a regular here -- you will become retarded.
I am constantly amazed by Apple and the Ipod Explosion. I bought 3 for my teens last Christmas and bought 3 more this year for my niece and nephew. That's thousands of dollars in Ipods. Now I think at 35 I want one myself *smile* Lori W http://www.neverlandmall.com/
The Intel roadmap has the new server and desktop processors coming out in the 3rd quarter. http://common.ziffdavisinternet.com/util_get_image /10/0,1425,sz=1&i=105032,00.jpg
Probably one of those code-names will be our powermacs ("Conroe"?)
Several readers have asked "Why choose the iMac and MacBook Pro (Powerbook) for Intel chips".
I offer this analysis:
iMac: Best selling consumer model for Apple to select because Pro Apps what are not yet ported aren't used on these systems (at least, that isn't the target market).
MacBook Pro: in DIRE need of a refresh since the G5 could never make it into the line. Also, Pro apps are less likely to be required for a purchase decision because they are so long in the G4-tooth.
Mac mini: As the low cost Mac, upgrading this to an Intel chipset would canibalize sales of higher end units. In addition, the smaller margins of the Mac mini would be eaten up with the redesign and more expensive (and more powerful) chips from Intel.
PowerMacs: The Pro Apps aren't ready. Waiting allows time to announce them when the Pro Apps are available and gives Intel time to offer faster cores.
iBooks: best selling Apple notebooks aren't hurting for more power. Their price point is right for the student/home user and with limited resources/chip allotment, this doesn't offer as compelling a need.
Honestly, I was surprised to get two systems updated to Intel. It is a major switch for Apple and they have done an amazing job busting these two systems out in just 6 months from the announcemnet of their intentions last summer. Even vendors with massive resources due to their market share don't refresh and entire product suite overnight. Give Apple some grace. The (fill in the blank you are waiting for) is coming soon.
I imagine that this summer we will see a "One year ago we said we were switching to Intel and today the entire product line is Intel based" announcemnet.
I only came here to do two things; kick some ass, and drink some beer...looks like we're almost out of beer.
I have a feeling it will be available later today or tomorrow, just like you mentioned. I just checked again and there was an additional update to iTunes 6.0.2 that wasn't there an hour ago so it looks like the updates are being spread through today and maybe tomorrow.
Another interesting question is, will existing x86 Linux distros run on the new Intel Macs? Perhaps there will be some trouble with the hardware, but once drivers are included, will the same old x86 distros run on these Macs? Is there anyone who can verify this?
:).
It will be interesting to see if in the future, regular x86 distros also run on the x86 Macs. If that happens, we would be able to regard Macs as simply a special kind of PC
There were rumblings about the Intel Macs dropping Classic support, but now it looks official. Compare the software specs for the PowerBook G4 to the MacBook Pro.
Quote:
"...I appreciate the fact that now I will be able to dual boot in Windows..."
it's not because there is an *ntel chip inside that the whole architecture is PC-like, with the idiotic memory layout and whatnot. I bet you cookies to doughnuts that the arch is totally different, the only common point with a *ell laptop being the brand of the processor.
Before making such statements (or was it wishful thinking?), you should check out the hardware reference documents.
Think about it, why would Apple re-use a design that, despite all the advances made in the last 25 years (2006 - 1981), is still just a sped up IBM PC 5150? Why get hobbled with limited IRQs, I/O channels, 640K barrier, etc.?
RIP POWERPC 01/18/2006
Going with AMD would be unwise as they don't have the capacity to produce enough chips to satisfy Apple's demands and their current PC customers.
I also don't think that Apple chose Intel over AMD based on the current merits of their processors. They plan to switch their entire product line by the end of the year, and by then the situation would be probably a lot better for Intel.
If you don't fail at least 90 percent of the time, you're not aiming high enough. (Alan Kay)
Maybe you should join the Euro :)
my password really is 'stinkypants'
I dunno but for the extra ~$550, I could get a much faster laptop than the MacBook *or* I could get the Gateway and have the money in my pocket.
Yet again somebody makes the case for buying a Kia instead of a Benz. And before anybody is tempted to start bitching about the analogy being invalid since both the Dell and the MacBook have more or less the same 'engine' please note that if the outgoing PowerBook line is anything to judge by you get a bit more than just $550 worth of Software with the MacBook. That would include both consumer software like iMovie, iDVD, (plus a whole slew of other consumer software) and a pretty sophisticated development package. Does the Dell ship with a decent Movie editor, DVD authoring software and a full featured copy of MS Visulal Studio (according to MS that will set you back $799, upgrade: $549) as well as Windows XP? Another point is that the MacBook is likely to remain the only computer on the market able to stably triple boot OS.X Windows, and Linux which for me is a major reason to buy one although personally I probably will settle for running Windows 2003 and LINUX on some Virtual PC type setup.
Only to idiots, are orders laws.
-- Henning von Tresckow
... Windows?
:)
(oh well, here goes my karma
Rediculous is ridiculous!
Could anyone spot the intel logo? I hate that sticker on the laptops. I was betting apple won't put that ugly stuff on they machines. The picture I saw, couldn't spot one.
-Shree
So what on earth is a performance? Please, if your are going to give stats, at least specify the units for the stats. What on earth is performance anyway? Does this mean better FP or integer math? or does it simply mean that it can shove data through faster. SGI systems were slow when it came to FP math, but only a idiot would have called them "low" performance back then. Their bandwidth was awesome.
Apple Hype
Man is the lowest-cost, 150-pound, nonlinear, all-purpose computer system which can be mass-produced by unskilled labor.
Any Mac app will still run on the Intel chips. However, the PowerPC-only ones will run slower. The figure quoted at WWDC last year was about a third of its native speed.
The advantage of the PowerMac is its expandability and replaceable graphics cards and the like, as it's always been. Who will be buyng them? Simple: Executives who throw money at any and all computing problems because more expensive is always better. They've formed the bulk of the Powermac's market as long as the iMac has existed, and will continue to do so.
I just spec'd out a Dell laptop with similar specs to the high-end MacBook Pro, and it came in nowhere near as inexpensive as the MacBook Pro.
My Dell is configured as follows:
Precision M70
Pentium M single core 2.26GHz w/ 15.4" WUXGA LCD (This is going to be slower than a dual core 1.83, period.)
WinXP Pro
1GB RAM, 1 DIMM
100GB HD
8x DL DVD-RW
802.11g (This is a miniPCI card, not internally integrated like the Mac)
256MB Quadro FX Go1400 graphics
Bluetooth
1394a (FireWire) CardBus (again, this is an add-on, not internally integrated like the Mac)
Price for this Dell? $3,747. Compare that to the MacBook Pro at $2499. And the Dell doesn't include an IR sensor and remote, built-in 30fps VGA video camera, iLife, motion sensor, aluminum casing, etc.
That Gateway you mentioned? It uses Centrio chips, this is HARDLY the same as the brand-spankin' new Yonah based chips that the MacBook Pro is using. Also, the display isn't as high of a resolution. And the HD is 20GB smaller.
Basically, you didn't bother to do any real comparison or research, and I doubt you're all that knowledgable about computers if you missed those very simple details.
Does anyone know about the intel compiler for the apples? Specifically is it going to be free for non-commercial use as it is for linux?
Don't forget, no S-Video output means no more PowerBook (err, MacBook) movie night on the tv (strange indeed)
The licensing fees are $1. Some of that money even goes back to Apple, IIRC. I they broke backwards compatibility because some accounting tool decided that FireWire support wasn't worth the $1 x 14 million iPods, despite the fact that while the iPod didn't have USB2 support people were practically forcing vendors to put FireWire in computers... This is the only explanation that I can come up with that makes any sense. It's also explains the slow decline of the included accessories with the iPod.
Apple, leader in pushing advanced technology that costs "a bit more" (successfully too), is too cheap to include their own. I'm not impressed.
which only bodes well for the next PowerMac ("MacDesktop Pro"? "Mac Pro"?)
I'm hoping for something more classic, like Apple Macintosh. Re-branding the PowerMac as 'pro' would be kind of an affront to everyone that uses their PowerMac at home. Maybe they'll continue the X-obsession and go with "Macintosh X" which we'll all colloqualize as "Mac-Ten".
Read Heinlein's 1953 Revolt in 2100, now more than ever.
...might be the best way to go. Boot one OS or the other; the non-active hard drive is powered down. That way, OSX is more difficult to corrupt by a Win32 virus that fdisks the drives.
Perhaps the Win32 hard drive could even be usb, and the support outsourced.
I like Apple hardware, but I don't particularly care for OS X--it's better than Windows, but I'd rather be running Linux. Unfortunately, PPC Linux has always been way behind on packages.
Having x86-based Macs means that I can run all mainstream Linux distributions at native speed, either under something like Xen, or dual-boot. Furthermore, I can also run Windows at native speeds at least under an emulator.
I predict that we will see a massive upswing in the amount of hacking (== hacking, as in "hacking the Xbox") OS X to run on commodity hardware. Not only will there be an order of magnitude more people with x86-based install disks, but a general buzz around the product -- look! it works!
-- Have you ever imagined a world with no hypothetical situations?
It is up --- Its overloaded, but it is there.
Get over it, seriously.
It's pride and flashiness that sells products, and builds dynamic brand images.
You won't be able to maintain a trendy brand without being flashy like that. No one ever got fired for choosing IBM, but when was the last time IBM was considered a trendsetter?
Apple's brand identity requires them to function as they do, and its pretty harmless. Don't judge a book by its cover; Apple's machines are better engineered than their competitors; let them have their fun.
WhiteWolf666 an exBush supporter. All you new-school,compassionate,save the children Republicans can rot in hell
I still don't understand Apple's pricing theories. Althouh I can understand variations up to 10% due to differential occupational expenditures, I cannot see how the company can warrant that the price is a whooping 3300$ (!!) [2729] for the lower-end macbook in Belgium/Luxembourg!!
sounds like "matchbook". signifies the move to intel processors..
Then you had to go and say, "which was a great way to get projects from my G5 onto my powerbook quickly." There is no way your puny laptop drive is actually taking in input faster than fw400 can spit it out.
Also, they include this great technology in the MacBook... Gigabit Ethernet. I hear it kicks ass at file transfers.
I think the laptop looks weak and conventional, and not like an Apple, because it's not on a white background. Really, what's the deal with that ugly "grey letters over black" theme they introduced? What a terrible idea! When the background was white, all of their gear really looked like works of art. Now even their fancy gear looks like ordinary warez.
Apple has stated they won't be doing anything to block putting Windows on these. They will try to protect OS X from non-Apple hardware, but not block windows.
I'd be more worried about trying to install Windows and having it rewrite your boot record/loader and locking you out of OS X, and I'm not sure if OS X supports multi-boots either.
You have a point. I still don't like being spoken down to by a vendor. You can say "we rock!" without outright saying "we rock, and you suck!".
------- "From bored to fanboy in 3.8 asian girls" ----------
MacBook pro starts at $1999 in the US, forex converts this to 15 226,58 SEK.
;)
1 US$ = 7.62 SEK
However as we all know Apple have their own exchange rates, so:
1 Apple$ = 13.25 SEK and the price in Sweden wents up to 26.495 SEK.
(no, I'm not calculating the fact we have 25% vat, but anyway, it sucks to buy apple hardware in Sweden, I could pay 11.300 SEK for a travel to the US and buy it there...)
The american prices of Apples are ok, the Swedish ones are just retarded.
Of course I want a mac, but not at any price, especially since I haven't got a work
So, shall I buy a Dell (with I can get an extra 30% or so of from) and run Linux/FreeBSD instead? I hate how we are always getting screwed by Apple.
I had thought of and wanted a magnetic power connector like this for many years. I'm curious: what's the prior art on them? Are there any other companies that use them? Are there patents on them? I found a few patents, but nothing that looks like a fundamental patent, either by Apple or by anybody else. Can we expect to see these power connectors in other laptops as well?
My 2 Questions are, do the new machines have a BIOS ?
and do they still support Target Disk Mode ?
But they're talkin' 'bout Windows!
Jesus, you didnt even mention that the new "mac books" are intel based! Which is obviously the biggest news... and half your summary is a quote from steve jobs about how many ipods they've sold... no one cares! Give us the news that matters :P
Joseph?
I won't miss FW800 (I'm glad they at least kept FW400), but the loss of CardBus kinda sucks. I use my PowerBook on the road constantly, and I depend on my Verizon Wireless EVDO card, which is the only CardBus device I've ever really used. Checking the VZW site, they don't appear to have any cards in the new form factor so far, which means that I won't be upgrading until I can find a way to accommodate that.
Otherwise, the MacBook Pro is looking like one slick piece of hardware.
-- Josh Turiel
"2. Do not eat iPod Shuffle."
So they renamed the PowerBook line to MacBook Pro... What is the PowerMac line going to be renamed to? MacMac Pro?
That's fair. There isn't really any reason for them to be negative.
;-)
I still like my Powerbook, though
I like my Linux Desktop better, but I'm very happy with my powerbook.
WhiteWolf666 an exBush supporter. All you new-school,compassionate,save the children Republicans can rot in hell
"It wouldn't surprise me if Apple has implemented some kind of unique encrypted handshaking between the OS X installer and the hardware so that only Apple's OS can be installed on it, so that they can avoid receiving support calls from people who put Windows on Apple hardware."
I have no doubt it will be a headache to put Windows on a Mac. At the same time - the kinds of users who are going to be attempting this are not beginner or ever intermediate ones but rather advanced users who will probably be able to figure it out on their own or find a FAQ to help them on the internet.
That being said the kind of 'desktop' product being released at the moment (Imac) probably appeals less to the 'enthusiast user'. It may very well be that the products targetted more towards beginner/intermediate consumers have these restrictions while products like the PowerMac's might not.
AMD has more than enough capacity to satisfy Apple. Not only do they have their current fabs, their new fab became online not long ago. Then they have joint capacity with IBM, and they have a deal with Chartered, which says that they can outsource some of their production to them, if needed.
AMD has the capacity. Apple's reasons are elsewhere.
Lesbian Nazi Hookers Abducted by UFOs and Forced Into Weight Loss Programs - -all next week on Town Talk.
In the UK at least.
$1999 -> £1132 + VAT -> £1330
So why do Apple want to charge £1429?
That's an extra $175 for nothing, around 8%.
Ripoff Britain strikes again.
All of the recent LaCie external drives have a single FW400 port and a pair of FW800 ports allowing chaining. I have a pair of them (320GB and 500GB) on my shelf and when I am doing video editing I plug a single cable into my PowerBook, giving me two big, fast drives to use. I could use FW400, but it is slower. USB 2 is even slower (in the real world - I know it's 80Mb/s faster in theory) and has a much higher CPU load.
I am TheRaven on Soylent News
Just curious why the absence of firewire 800 is such an issue.
http://macworld.apple.com.edgesuite.net/mw/index.h tml
.. this nickel and dime crap.
* USB robs CPU cycles (yes, I want all of them)
* USB does not chain
* You don't connect DV devices over USB
* USB on-the-go does not bring it to feature parity with FireWire
* USB has nothing on FireWire in terms of bandwidth
I don't buy Macs because they are missing advanced technology. I buy them because they have it by *default*. I get the latest USB and Bluetooth standards. If I am paying $3,000 for a high-end laptop it better damn well have the latest and greatest version of FireWire that cost them $2 to put in.
This is a horrible mistake that apple also made on the mini. Then they seemingly wonder why no one is using 800. Know why fw800 isn't taking off? They don't even use it themselves! Apple is so lame sometimes it's hard to imagine how it can happen.
"You're right," Fisheye says. "I should have set it on 'whip' or 'chop.'"
Last time i checked, my G5 had fw800 on it also. Making it run in target disk mode over fw800 is significantly faster that fw400.
Also capturing to an external hard drive over fw800 from my fw400 camera was faster and had less chance of dropped frames than capturing to my 3.5" internal drive or to another fw400 drive on the same bus. Doing final cut work with the media on the fw800 bus meant that render times were less and I had better playback options also (realtime, etc.).
Considering I was doing most of my video work for all of 2004 and half of 2005 on this powerbook with external fw800 drives, I would say I was using the port quite a lot.
Also gigabit ethernet is not an option when you need to dump video from a G5 lab machine that is locked down. My powerbook would show up as an external hard drive.
The first thing I would get with a macbook pro would be an express card fw800, since I use it all the time. And then a eSATA card, be nice if they made a two in one deal.
Comment removed based on user account deletion
iMacBook Pro!
MacBook Amateur!
MacPamphlet Pro!
Inspiron!
MacBook Con!
PodBook HaloWhore 2000!
http://www.theinquirer.net/?article=28890
Check out the last sentence before they fix it:
Apple's cher price was up sharply to over $81 on the news.
I thought everything on iTunes was 99 cents but I guess the market will pay $81 for Cher.
It has crappy Intel integrated graphics, roughly comparable to a GeForce 256 in terms of graphics chips made by real manufacturers. In other words, a piece of shit.
ROMANES EUNT DOMUS
I must admit I'm not terribly familiar with the various Core Duo processors, but from looking over the specs at Apple and comparing to Intel's Core Duo specs it looks like the MacBooks are using the T2400 (for the 1.83 MHz) and L2400 (or L2300, for the 1.66 MHz).
I mention this because it was also my understanding that Core Duo T's seem to be the desktop line.
Anyone have any more info on which processors are actually going to be used in the MacBooks, and whether a Core Duo T might present an issue with respect to heat and power use? (Not that my Powerbook G4 gets anything better than mediocre battery life.)
But got MacBook. Burgers, anyone? Double-layered, perhaps?
Or would that make it sound too much like the Apple][?
"Learning is not compulsory... neither is survival."
--Dr.W.Edwards Deming
"I actually do have a copy of "Deus Ex 2" waiting for the release of Intel-based Macs."
For your own sake, I hope you didn't enjoy the first one. Because if you did, playing the second will be a physically and emotionally painful experience.
So all I want to know is... where and when will the crackas release osX?
Why would you trust a testimonial when choosing hosting?
Posting this from a powerbook 15", I'm a bit scared by the MacBook price I see on the different european site of Apple:
- Apple.com (US): starting US$1999
- France: starting 2699 (close to US$3250)
- Belgium: starting 2729 (that's more than US$3290!)
- UK/Ireland: 1429£ for UK so close to US$2520), and 2179 for Ireland (US$2630)
- Switzerland: 3699sFr (that US$4462,104!!!!)
WTF??? I mean, I'm french, so I'm definitly not going to purchase my MacBook on Switzerland, but come on: I'm not going to pay US$3000 for something that should cost 2000! Or is the european model comes with 18 carats case instead of the alu one?
--
[Arkan]
So now that OSX for x86 is out in a legit way, how long until something like MacOnLinux is working for OSX86? The pirates have already done some pretty impressive things with leaked builds, but very soon the real thing with real drivers will be out there to play with. Would it be possible to set up VMWare to run this well? Could PearPC be reworked to emulate only the parts of the hardware that distinguish it from a beige-box PC?
Keep in mind that even if they refuse to provide support for such a configuration, the bulk of a support call's cost is in the customer placing the call in the first place. If someone calls only to be told "we don't support that", that has already cost Apple a good bit of money.
So, how does this stop people from calling and asking "Why can't I install Windows on this thing?"
The MacBook Pro says it has a Radeon X1600, which is by no means a bad card.
However, Vista should run on them. So, I'm sure you'll be able to play Duke Nukem Forever on your Mac.
I know of a lot of PC users that have "multimedia" software and hardware but it just sits there unused after the initial excitement wears off.
I used iLife '05 to put up photos from my rome trip in a matter of minutes from iPhoto and edited my DV footage from the trip into a 19 minute Widescreen DVD with iMovie HD and iDVD 5. The DVD featured a music soundtrack from the composer that did Gladiator and the woman who sang in the background. It was a snap to include any song I wanted from my iTunes music library (including iTMS songs).
I'm not a professional or video editor but I was able to create a home DVD with high production values in about half a day without reading any manuals. Laying soundtrack and adjusting audio levels is a snap in iMovie and you can preview transitions in realtime if you have a fast enough machine.
If you would get over yourself and actually go try out a mac in a store, you might get an idea of what I'm talking about. The ease of use of the software is the key to productivity and that is what Apple has got right. You can think what you want about Steve Jobs. I really don't think he give a damn what you think of him personally. Michael Dell is a a**hole too, so is Balmer, Linus and Bill Gates but what is important is which company/organization creates products ordinary people actually enjoy using.
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
i don't care if windows will run on the new macs. what i want is to install OSX on my x86 frankenstein boxes.
Why? I mean really. Why in the name of all that is holy would ANYONE want to put Windows on a Mac?
I switched FROM Linux (which I was fairly happy with as a longtime user) to OS X about 6 months ago. Comming from Linux - I actually GAINED games that I can play. That being said - around 1995 I switched from Windows to Linux. I just learned to live without Windows specific software. It really does not take much. What gaming I could not do with Linux I substituted with a console. I can see why some people would want to dual boot Linux (I still feel that open source has great merit and the urge to tinker is hard to overcome), but Windows?
To put it another way - WHY would you go out and buy yourself a Mercedes, drive it home happily, then promptly put a nice set of square wheels on it?!?
There is just SOO much crap in the way of viruses and MBR issues that you'd be creating for yourself that would ruin the reason you own a Mac. Why do that to yourself?
Why should you take it personally when they are putting down windows? Did you write windows?
Jesus was a compassionate social conservative who called individuals to sin no more.
It's really painful to see that apple, a modern company with good technologies and a really good architecture, has turned to another ugly x86 architecture company...
http://naerey.switch-case.org
And for all the complainers... you can get a firewire 800 card for that ExpressCard slot.
Even I thought they would start with the low end machines...
Apple pulled it off, as far as keeping everyone guessing wrong.
And who else was so sure there would be a new Mini??
Did anyone think the iMac was getting remade??
The Admin and the Engineer
To be fair, that's not the result of any feature of FW800 -- it's the result of using two different busses. If you used a usb2 device and a fw400 device in the way you've described, you would get the same result. That or just two fw400 busses.
Someone with an inside track, quick tell me: do they have OpenFirmware or PC-BIOS?
I'm in the same boat. Had a 15 inch powerbook for years and my first cardbus product was the Verizon EVDO high speed wireless card which I bought about 10 days ago :)
Works great but is it obsolete when I upgrade (which will be soon as I hate having a biz notebook that is out of applecare coverage)?
Google hints of compatability options or adaptor cards but I can't find solid info. Hints, tips and URLS appreciated!
-chris
Google has released a mac osx version of google earth. hooray
"Now we'll finally be able to combine the security and ease of use of Windows with the flexibility and low cost of Apple hardware!"
(first read somewhere here on Slashdot, I'm sure)
ClutterMe.com - easiest site creation on the Net. Just click and type.
Obsolete! Too big! Too old!
Build a man a fire, he's warm for one night. Set him on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life.
Why not! Half my customers call any computer a Dell, no matter what it is. It'll just help to confuse them even more.
rm -rf
I would "Make the Switch" and order a MacBook Pro today if it weren't for one thing: Apple continues to hobble their laptops with relatively low-resolution displays. 15.4" displays with WUXGA (1920x1200) resolution have been available for years now.
Before anyone responds with, "But 1920x1200 is too much for a 15-inch display," please let me make that decision for myself. I have a laptop with such a configuration today and I find the display resolution indispensable.
In any case, the MacBook Pro is a work of art and a damn impressive piece of engineering--I have yet to see any of the Wintel notebooks cram a top-of-the-line graphics chip into anything approaching a sub-six-pound package. That Apple has done so with such finesse is a testament to their design and engineering prowess.
Way to go, Apple--now can we please have a WUXGA option for once?
OS X.
I just bought my dad a 15" Powerbook G4...oops. One really big thing that seems to be missing (besides FW800 and the modem) is the Dual Layer Superdrive. Is it just me, or should this be standard on the higher-end notebook? Maybe we can expect this with the 17"?
Comment removed based on user account deletion
Ooooh, this is bad. Swedish prices are similar too.
I'll be paying this Mastercard bill for a looooong time.
---
Aaaah, I wish God was alive to see this...
I was ready to buy two of them. One for the living room to hook up to the stereo and tv and the other to replace an aging PC running Linux that is sitting next to my PowerMac.
Is the MacBook the first widely-available laptop with ExpressCard/34? That's the long-overdue successor to PCMCIA, right?
If Happy Fun Ball begins to smoke, get away immediately. Seek shelter and cover head.
Well, it's obvious why they changed the name of the laptop from 'Powerbook' to 'Macbook'... Apple once had a line of laptops called 'Powerbook Duo', and the new core is called 'Core Duo': It would harken back to the old 68K days, and we cant have that.
Pro video people use PowerMacs. If I'm not wrong, can't FW800 devices drop down to 400 speeds? So those FW800 devices ( if you find one ) would still transfer data to your FW400 device... just slower...
Sorry, but you'll get no sympathy from me. Blame yourself, or if you must, the politicians you elect; they must pay for all the socialist care-taking systems in your countries somehow.
Most people, if given the choice between even high income taxes or import tarriffs, object to the former and choose the later thinking it won't affect them. Politicians understand this.
Apple has said that they will do nothing to prevent people from installing Windows on the x86 Macs. Sorry, I don't have a link...
If I could just edit the "Microsoft" out of the PC, but still run off-the-shelf made-for-Windows apps, that'd be far better. I'd buy one today if I could do that.
How's Wine doing in that regard?
I can't fathom why they'd introduce a new generation of hardware like this and drop back on features that are almost a no-op to keep.
I don't know what kind of crack I was on, but I suspect it was decaf.
Does anyone know if NeoOffice/J will be ported?
"Yields falsehood when preceded by its own quotation" yields falsehood when preceded by its own quotation.
Anyone else notice that the optical drive specs went from an 8X DL to a 4X SL? Think that's a typo or a "feature"? I was really looking forward to this update and while that won't kill the deal, I don't know why there would be a regression.
http://www.apple.com/remotedesktop/
Thats just bad logic. You hinted at the answer to your question. Games. That is what windows gets you that a Mac does not. Yes there are games, but not as many. windows>mac>linux as far as games go. Its not like putting square tires on a Benz. It's like putting studded tires on a Benz. Studded tires are horrible for everything except gaming...er driving on the snow.
It's easy to multiboot non-ancient macs- the bios (well, it's called "open firmware" or something) is much more complete. It looks a bit like grub.
I think by Apples strategy is to keep a constant revolving door so to speak with their new products. I understand the company is going through changes, however if you do not standardize your computer lines you do nothing but become another "Dell". Macbook and iMacs were announced...a bit lopsided upgrade if you ask me and obvious others on /.. The iBook needs the most revision out of any of them. New hardware released every 3-5 months pisses your comsumer base off. Please Apple, standardize your computing line like it once was so those of us who *JUST* bought computers from you dont feel like asshats when a new release is announced.
FYI, that's a larger form-factor ExpressCard/54 card, as are all of the FW800 cards that I dug up from a (very hasty) Google search. The /54 cards won't fit in the MacBook Pro's /34 slot; it's too wide (though the contact/electrical interface is the same). But it seems a no-brainer to expect that someone will start selling a FW800 ExpressCard/34 on the heels of the MacBook Pro announcement.
as a long time Mac user, the transition to Intel CPU is not something I have been looking forward to. But now I find the following little gem on the apple site
"Most existing applications will continue to run, thanks to Rosetta. Pro applications from Apple -- including Final Cut Pro, Motion, Soundtrack Pro, DVD Studio Pro, Aperture, Logic Pro, Logic Express, and Final Cut Express -- are not supported by Rosetta. For these applications, you can upgrade to the Universal version for minimal cost (see "Apple Applications" to right). Third-party applications that require precision real-time playback may perform better with a Universal version."
if I am reading this right, apple is saying "go buy our new intel macs, and oh, BTW, our own pro apps require $$$ updates, and other apps may not work"
well, why would I go do this, get a new mac with its intel CPU, then have to pay more $$$$ to make apples own apps run on it
and yes I am a user of the pro apps, plus all sorts of other apps which I have no idea are going to work at all, let alone as well as they currently do on my PPC boxes
another little gem from the same page on apples site http://www.apple.com/rosetta/
"Rosetta dynamically translates most of your PowerPC-based application to work with your Intel-based Mac. "
note the "most" comment in this one, a real case of butt covering if ever I saw one
now all we need is for the shipping version x86 OSX to be hacked to run on non-apple hardware (if its not already been done), and its the beginning of the end for apple, then comes the very likely "windoze for mac" from the beast, which will reduce apple to iPods, and little else
think about it, why would anyone buy apples hardware when they can run the same software on something much faster, for less $$$
>>Only the future will tell us if this was a good idea, but frankly if Apple was able to increase the processor's speed by 2x with the same battery life and thermal design, I don't care if there's a squirrel in there.
I know it's early in the year, but I'm going to go ahead and nominate this for quote of the year.
First Impressions from a traveling 'portable professional music system' user: "Careful, Jack!"
I think that the MacBook systems look very tempting, but in my own case, I have a large investment in the very technologies that are being dropped, namely:
-1) Firewire 800 drives; I carry one or two of the 1 TeraByte drives with me, and would now have to retool to USB 2.0.... ouch!!
-2) My main audio interface is a PC-card solution. I am not even aware of a manufacturer that makes an 'Express Card' professional multichannel audio interface.
-3) Traveling a lot, I need the Lindt in-flight power adaptor for my Powerbook. This new solution means having to purchase a new type if and when it becomes available
Adding all of it up, it makes me have to invest a lot more than the price of the laptop, not to speak of the fact that some of the peripherals might not be available with the needed connectivity.
I think I will let others be on the bleeding edge, and will keep using my souped-up Dothan laptop under XP for a while (most of the apps I use are cross-platform) until the rest of the peripherals are available, and hopefully all of the first-gen kinks are ironed out. As well I must say that I am quite surprised that they did not introduce a 17-inch model with kick-ass processor and extra connectivity, but this will undoubtedly appear later in the year.
Z.
This sucks. Royally.
:(
:(
I've been peeved about the lack of firewire on current-gen iPods, and I speculated that it was because there would be no firewire on Intel Macs. Now that they've hit, I was right.
Goodbye Target Disk Mode. Farewell easy deployment with Carbon Copy Cloner.
Sayonarra easy workstation migration.
Karma: Chameleon (mostly due to the fact that you come and go).
The iMac has a Radeon x1600 as well according to the apple store. Where did you see integrated intel?
Low end iMac:
17-inch widescreen LCD with 1440x900 resolution
1.83GHz Intel Core Duo processor with 2MB shared L2 cache
512MB (single SO-DIMM) 667MHz DDR2 SDRAM (PC2-5300)
160GB Serial ATA hard drive
Slot-load 8x double-layer SuperDrive
ATI Radeon X1600 graphics with 128MB GDDR3 memory
Built-in AirPort Extreme and Bluetooth 2.0
if the replacement for the PowerBook, Apple's professional laptop range, is the MacBook Pro, does that mean that the replacement for the iBook, Apple's consumer laptop range, will be the MacBook Con?
(It's a joke. Laugh. I have a PowerBook 1.25 GHz on my desk right now. Waiting for rev 2, and more money in the bank, for my upgrade.)
Mac Powerbook - PowerPC = MacBook
Doesnt' exactly roll off the tongue, but it makes perfect sense to me.
Learn from the mistakes of others. You won't live long enough to make them all yourself.
All of the copies that got out were leaked developer copies that had to be altered/cracked in various ways to allow them to run on non-developer boxes...
[All Your Fish Are Belong To Us]
Id own sony right now...or try to at least.
Sorry to hear about your loss.
-My condolences
I wont buy it until I can install linux/turn 6 into a beowulf cluster
I for one need to run certain Windows only applications, and I guess I'm not alone...
That's interesting. I didn't know what ExpressCard was, so I just looked into it a bit.
/54 form factor device is because you can't deal with the space or heat dissipation constraints of the /34 form factor. There's no other obvious benefit to making the larger card. Your observation that the only available Firewire 800 cards are /54 leads me to think that the reason Apple is moving away from Firewire 800 is that they haven't been able to make it small or cool enough.
Seems that the only reasons to make a
Maybe it's about heat, not money. Hmm.
With reasonable men I will reason; with humane men I will plead; but to tyrants I will give no quarter. -- William Lloyd
now that sounds rational.
.
. hmmm
GP said he has an intel developer transition kit, and games run like crap on it. the integrated graphics chip is why.
ROMANES EUNT DOMUS
On when Photoshop and such will be native? Oh to be free of carbon!
if they'd dropped the G5 iMac to $899 I would have bought one ...
Obviously our computers are better. Oh, you meant that we... heh, nevermind.
I wish I had a girlfriend that was better than my online one. She doesn't put out like she used to... switched to 56k, she did.
Nobody's gay for Mole-Man.
He's talking about the Developer Transition Kit, which is basically a barebones P4 stuffed into a G5 case.
The security cable "port" is still in the middle of the right hand side though, a bad design feature I've commented on before. As is, the cable runs backwards along the right side, blocking all the other ports there. Better placement would be back near the power port, as a notebook locked down at a desk would also tend to be plugged in...
Any sect, cult, or religion will legislate its creed into law if it acquires the political power to do so.
Office will be soon available with Universal Binaries. What about Adobe- and Macromedia-products? Isn't the target consumer group of Apple Designers, Artists and ppl like that? These are the Pros who are buying professional products like Powerbooks. Why should I buy this new Powerbook when it doesn't support pro-applications right now?
You know, if you ever accidentally do that to a fingernail, even if its totally off, tape it back on with duct tape and don't bother it for 2 weeks or so. I've had a fingernail and a toenail (the really painful big one) reattach well that way.
Deus Ex 2 wasn't that bad. Despite not being nearly as cool as the first one, it was better than 95% of the other crap that comes out. I bothered to finish it, which says a lot for any big commercial PC game from the last 3 years or so. And I didn't have to tape any parts back on when I was done.
Speaking of such things, will these Intel macs run Windows games? I would consider getting one if I was A) rich, and B) able to play Jets n' Guns, Alien Shooter, Worms, and a few other games on it. I'm fairly certain that Lux already runs on OS X.
I know I personally can't wait to run the old VirtualPC on my new mac using Rosetta, the PPC translator. Emulating emulation is teh coolest!
They could've really done something special: put out a quite functional computer running OS X that's cheaper than their highest-end iPod. Instead, they don't drop a single product under $1,800.
Shit, the least they could've done was manage a $1,000 iBook. I'd've been interested in that. But I would have bought, without question or hesitation, a $500 Intel Mac mini, and I fucking hate Macs. They would have switched someone who hasn't been interested in Macs since the 68k days, and they couldn't, or wouldn't, do it.
Why? I'm tired of modding Xboxes into semi-functional Intel PCs, and I'm still waiting for AMD to put something complete together in a mini-sized form factor that I don't have to build myself. Apple could have pioneered the low-to-mid-price PC market with this keynote. Why didn't they?
The conclusion: every company has more and less durable models.
Pining for the fjords
I got them with each machine I bought and an ilife upgrade. The coupons seen useless. (I've never seen them redeemed anywhere).
The parent post is flamebait, because any post mentioning the one-button mouse on Apple's machines is usually flamebait. But, I'll also say that the touch-pad can be activated as a second button, negating the whole problem. Really, on a laptop, hitting cntrl and the mouse-button is very easy to boot.
Anyone who whines about being modded down should be.
I think there's a natural resistence to the use of magnets in the computer industry. I think it has something to do with hard drives reacting badly to them. Apple's the first I've seen to use small magnets for useful purposes. The latching mechanism on the power books is magnetic, the latch recesses inside the top, but then just as it approaches the bottom, a magnet pulls it out and allows it to latch. It's quite clever.
This sig has been temporarily disconnected or is no longer in service
Go recompile your kernel, you douche. I'm going to go outside where the three-dimensional people are and talk to some chicks.
Your mother and sister don't count.
Hot potatoes, Oxford shores, Puck to make amends!
Hopefully soon WINE & various virtual machines will allow you to run Windows software without rebooting, but not quite yet.
There are no trails. There are no trees out here.
iWish they would stop using iWords for every single product. :P
-Shippy
What I really want to know is how other Intel-based OSes fare in emulation or virtualization on this puppy.
I see VirtualPC going away, unless MSFT can add significant value to a new version other than "it interprets the Intel instruction set real fast.. fast as molasses in Minneapolis on a not-so-cold day".
Hmm. Bochs and plex86 might actually be useful on this thing. And I wonder if the good folks at VMWare have scented this opportunity yet.
--- The American Way of Life is not a birthright. Hell, it's not even sustainable.
Yet they are usually the ones that drives the ferrari.
Excuse me, are you from 1995?
The 640K barrier disappears as soon as the processor switches into protected mode, which is basically the first thing your bootloader does. Real mode still exists, but only for historical reasons.
Limited IRQs and I/O channels went the way of the dodo many years ago with the unveiling of PCI, though support for PCI in Windows was surprisingly poor until Windows 2000.
I have seen the future, and it is inconvenient.
I think it should have been:
What's an Intel chip doing in a Mac? It ain't the windows...
--Phillip
Can you say BIRTH TAX
Interestingly, Apple dropped the modem from their MacBook Pro. This is probably to help make the notebook smaller (similar to dropping FW in the 5g iPod). Probably a good idea too, now that everyone uses broadband.
-- Wanted dead or alive - Schrodinger's cat
A less obscure source of "inspiration" might be flickr's photostream.
It's a damn electric cord, not a musical chord.
I'm completely puzzled as to why anyone would ever type that extra "h" -- it's a silent letter, so I would expect the natural inclination would be to leave it out, not insert it unnecessarily.
Explanations, please?
--
Don't like it? Respond with words, not karma.
Running MS Windows on a MacBook Pro is like letting a retarded kid drive a Ferrari. Well if the new "Macs" are Ferrari's then every vendor sells Ferrari's.
This guy are sick.
Looks good on paper. But for a power user? Or should I say, a "Mac Pro"? Not too cool.
No modem
No firewire 800
No SVideo
Things that it won't run: Final Cut Studio 1.0, Final Cut Pro 1-2-3-4-5, Aperture, or Logic Pro 7.1 DVD, Studio Pro 4, Motion 2, or Soundtrack Pro, not even with the intel emulator (rosetta)
"...And, it bears repeating, if your Mac is powered by the Intel Core Duo, that performance will be nothing less than astounding -- up to 4X what is possible on PowerPC-based machines."
Let's examine this claim. The legal department claims 4X faster, and when you zero into the benchmarks, clearly there is ONE(1) application (Modo beta) that renders 4X faster. Doom 3 came in a distant 2nd at 2.2x faster. A practical application like Safari (1.9x faster).
The fumes don't get any fainter when we also uncover that Modo (beta) is engineered with clean code, unique and designed specific for the intel architecture. i.e.. the one application that doesn't need an emulator. Which is all good, but the fact they are milking the 4X faster flag based on this one single app is kinda tacky, IMO.
There are a few items that run 2 times faster, but there is two times the processor, so go figure...
The whole operating system is an emulator. For the expected arrival dates of Universal versions of third-party applications, Apple says sorry, check with the manufacturer-it's up to them.
Can I have a
-Big Mac menu
-A McChicken®
- A McFlurry®
-and A MacBook pro
do you want anything with it?
No that's all.
That will be $2.004,95
"The test of the morality of a society is what it does for it's children." -Dietrich Bonhoeffer
It looks like the new Macs will be all that we hoped. According to this page,they use EFI for their bootloader. So once the rest of the hardware is supported, linux support should not be an issue, and neither should windows (though I have no idea about Windows support for EFI).
Vive la Apple ;-)
Right on. Obsolecence is my favorite feature on my 10GB 3rd Gen iPod. Once you don't care anymore, you can just put the fucking thing in your pocket and use it as a portable music player. No case to keep it pretty, becuase why bother.
I mean no disrespect, but if you are doing any video editing and post-production work on an apple platform machine, why aren't you doing it on a powermac?
Because you can't bring a Powermac into a war zone. Or a flood. Or any kind of disaster. Or anywhere where there isn't stable power. I know people who specialize in disaster footage. They get in, shoot it, run back to their camp/Explorer/hotel and edit, and squirt it out to their clients in a matter of two or three hours. (As a side note, they told me that it was pretty strange that in southern Mississippi during Katrina Sprint's cell phone service went down for days in their area, but data stayed up. Go figure.)
That's one application. There's probably others.
-- I'm old enough to have lived through six different meanings of the word "hacker."
AMD has the capacity to produce the chips, but Apple needed an entire chipset and motherboard suite to start out the new line. AMD may be an option down the line, but to get this stuff started Apple needed someone with a broader range of skills.
-- I'm old enough to have lived through six different meanings of the word "hacker."
Not available as portables yet.
Leandro Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA
DA, DBA, SysAdmin, Data Modeller
GNU Project, Debian GNU/Lin
I knew a dedicated TiBook user that moused with the corner of his thumb, and used various fingers for keys.
It looked extremely uncomfortable.
I mostly do that. I don't see why you think it's more uncomfortable than typing generally - what I like about the chording is that your fingers are on the keys already so it's very natural to just press Option while moving the mouse and clicking. Also clicking and dragging is easier if you use your thumb as the mouse.
If the Mighty Mouse was such an innovation, why not carry it over?
It's a small confort for laptop users, especially those on windows. (I know many of them tote a mouse along, but should they have to with an Apple?)
You don't understand. I always had to cart a mouse around with those damn Windows laptops. I bought one to use with the Powerbook but realized after a year I had not used it once, so I gave it away. That's why I like the current setup MUCH better, because you do not need a mouse like you do with just about any Windows laptop if you really want to get work done. Chording is just as practical and comfortable as using a "real" mouse.
Look around sometime at a convention or other large gathering of people with laptops at how many Powerbook users are using mice vs. PC laptops.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I'm up 70% so far on my AAPL. Thanks for the advice, though.
I noticed in the that the MacBook Pro has a lithium-polymer battery instead of a lithium-ion battery like the PowerBook G4. The battery in the new laptop is 60 watt-hour vs. 50 watt-hour for the old laptop. Can anyone tell me why apple would choose a lithium-polymer batteries over lithium-ion.
What happens if Ithe owner trip over the power cord?
Does it detect the fact and drag the MacBook onto the floor, or what?
No, that's what it does today as the power adaptor tries to hold onto the Powerbook - happily it usually fails to do so, and instead of sending the Powerbook/iBook to the floor just bends the connector... a few too many times though and you're looking at a new adaptor.
The new cord is much nicer as it breaks away, so you wouldn't really trip so much as send the end of the cord flying a bit. That's why were all so pleased with it.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
I was talking about your mother and sister. Easy pickins tonight! w00t w00t!
There appears to be no such thing as 'a European price'.
www.apple.de: 2099
www.apple.nl: 2139
www.apple.fr: 2149
www.apple.be: 2179
I guess Apple Belgium will have a hard time explaining why, depending on language of choice, a Belgian should either pay an additional 30 or 40 euro's...
"Money is a sign of poverty." - Iain Banks
I agree. However, Dell is notorious for having big sales (30% off coupons, or more) and that works so in real life if you wait for a good deal (they happen a lot with Dell) you could get the $2600 Dell for around $1900. You do get a great deal for Macs in part because of all the good software they come with.
If yes sign here http://www.petitiononline.com/oftsucks/ It's time to take the gloves off!
I like em used and cheap with linux on em very much. Keep making em switch crap every 12 months.
Lol good one, Blackadder!
It's 12v DC by the time it gets to the computer end of the power converter. At worst, that'll tingle a bit.
News for Nerds. Stuff that Matters? Like hell.
People who are asking if the new Intel Macs can boot windows are not asking for enough. Dual bootting is never a good option. What I want to to be able to run Mac OS and simply double click on a Window application icon and it "just works". In other words something like Wine for Mac or "Virtual PC" for Intel Mac or maybe even "VMWare Player" for the Intel Mac. Heck all three of these options may become available by the end of next year. OSX can run OS9 apps. It should be able to handle Windows XP apps in a like manner. I'll bet some third party will make this happen. BTW I expect one would need a copy of Windows, just like the current Virtual PC does. Currently, today, I can run QEMU on my Linux system and have Linux, Windows XP and the Power PC version of Apple's Darwin all runing onthe same desktop at the same time. I see no reason for this not to be possable on the Intel iMac I plan to buy ASAP.
"Why? I mean really. Why in the name of all that is holy would ANYONE want to put Windows on a Mac?"
Because there are a shitload of programs that are Windows-only, and some people's jobs depend on using these programs.
With the exception of a relative handful of OS fanatics, most people don't buy computers for their operating systems. They buy them for the APPLICATIONS. There are a ton of video people using Macs who bought them ONLY for Final Cut HD and the related applications. There are people who use PCs specifically for Windows-only graphics programs, such as 3ds max (I'm one of them; it's how I make my living.)
If Apple were smart, they'd ABSOLUTELY show off Macs dual-booting into Windows XP -- they'd get a ton of PC-using people switching to Intel-based Macs as their next "PC," and getting access to OS X and Mac-only programs like Final Cut as well.
But you've got it.
Although I do all my pro video work on a PowerMac, Apple has very heavily advertised PowerBooks for field video work. Literature for Final Cut Pro has included shots of it running on the PowerBook for quite some time, as the ultimate mobile video solution.
So I think this will actually disappoint many people.
However, I will note that my problems with video capture using FireWire 400 vanished when I went from a G4/dual 450mhz to a G5 dual 2ghz. This implies that perhaps the CPU is more important than bus speed in capture, and that would make FireWire 800 pretty much irrelevent. It's very possible that this system will capture video just fine even on an external drive thanks to the fast CPU.
I think those of us who edit video on our PowerBooks - which may include me due to an upcoming trip - are going to be awfully happy with dual cores. The new Intel PowerBook is probably going to be almost as fast as the G5 dual 2ghz system that is my current video workstation.
For that matter, the new iMacs are likely to outrun all current PowerMacs but the dual dual core. That's bound to be a bit of a marketing problem.
D
if the morons want choice switch to linux and run on anything dec alpha comes to mind ...idiots..
Well WinBook and MacDaddy were already taken
* Winners compare their achievements to their goals, losers compare theirs to that of others.
There is a Firewire 400 port listed in the technical specs.
The name of this thing sucks. Had Apple not already been using the iBook name for their low-end laptops and attaching i to everything, we would have probably been calling this an iBook (as in intelBook). They should have just kept it in the same series. Like PowerBook M or something like that to replace the PowerBook G4.
In undeveloped countries, the consumer controls the market. In capitalist America, the market controls you.
Will we at least have one more run of G-series Apples before they pull the plug?
Some of us really dont like the ix86
---- Booth was a patriot ----
Simply not true. And if Firewire didn't became more popular, it was Apple's fault, first by failing to including it in initial iMacs and then trying to charge US$1 per port.
Never heard about these. How they compare with CardBus? Why only one?
More efficient?
But in fact, Apple has killed the PowerPC much earlier, when it botched the Mac clones. You can't have an architecture with a single vendor.
Leandro Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA
DA, DBA, SysAdmin, Data Modeller
GNU Project, Debian GNU/Lin
Since Apple has said it won't actively prevent Windows booting on Intel Macs, Microsoft could probaby modify Windows to work around any problems, allowing them to sell copies of Windows to that last 4% or whatever of the market. I don't know if they will, but I bet they at least consider the idea. It probably wouldn't be an enormous technical hurdle just to change Windows (Vista maybe) not to interfere with OS X's boot system.
So I guess it looks like Mac dropped the video out port on the 15" MacBookPro.
I currenly have a 15" powerbook, and I like hooking it up to my TV for watching encoded QT movies or TV shows or whatever.
I guess I won't be able to hook the new one up to my older TV anymore.
1. When can we expect to see the iBooks and mac mini's switched and what will be in them? I suspect they will be out by the end of march so people preparing for college can buy them. 2. Is everything about them x86? For example, can I buy a 6800 gt and throw it in there without dealing with flashing it or anything? That would be wonderful. Therefore, I would predict windows and any other x86 os will be able to boot on them.
You may hate WinDoze, but the fact is that many of us are FORCED to use it for work and/or school.
If the new Macs were dual boot machines (that could support WinHozed and Linux along with OSX) then Apple would see a flood of new sales.
Many of us are tired of having to buy both a Mac and a PC. We want it all! And now the potential is there.
Why would I ever buy a PC again if I could run WinHozed on my Mac? WHY?! As it is I have to alternate my new hardware purchases between PCs and Macs. I'd rather spend all that money on a single platform and update it more often.
Mr. Jobs do you want more of my money? Do you want it more often?
I am ready to plunk down the cash Mr. Jobs...just give me a reason to!
how long until world of warcraft is ported to the new hardware? until then, maybe i'll be able to actually use the mac book for what i purchased it for (music recording).
MORTAR COMBAT!
I'm sure whan Apple designed this, they didn't say "Who is our primary market? I know, people who shoot disaster footage".
People in that particular niche can pay for a Firewire 800 card to go in the expansion slot without much trouble.
I'm curious what kind of battery life these things get, but the Apple site is missing battery life estimates. Clearly, there's a Republican conspiracy involving aliens here.
$_.=["a".."z"," "]->[rand 27] while !/just another perl hacker$/;
What, you mean you have to do that every time someone says MacBook?
The issue is horse power and power consumption. The Portables haven't really has any major revision. The only thing that have had are incremental updates. The reason being that neither IBM or Freescale were willing to provide a low-power high horse-power CPU. Because of this the portables have been left behind. This is why the PowerBook range was an ideal candidate for the upgrade. Most people were expecting this. The PowerMacs and Xserves already have all the horse-power they need and power consumption is not an issue for them. For this reason Apple prefered to concentrate on models that needed an overhaul.
Now why the iMac over the Mini? You guess is as good as mine, though maybe the iMac has a bigger margin and is more important to Apple than the mini.
Jumpstart the tartan drive.
Like it did with Firewire 800 and internal FireWire? Don't kid yourself.
Leandro Guimarães Faria Corcete DUTRA
DA, DBA, SysAdmin, Data Modeller
GNU Project, Debian GNU/Lin
I’s always wondered about this with Mac OS X. (Disclaimer: I am a complete Apple junkie.) Apple has been pushing Display PostScript for a very long time. Quartz was supposed to usher in a new era of display technology where the implementation details of a display were abstracted away as details that software didn’t care about. You say “I want the menu bar to be 1cm tall” as opposed to “I want the menu bar to be 100px tall.” In the former of those two cases, you do not worry about DPI or resolution or any other factor and that makes you future-proof. But it still seems that OS X applications think in the old model and raster graphics are everywhere. Is Apple sitting on this until we have 300DPI displays? Is it just not practical yet?
Join Tor today!
A 500 cpu for my pismo! hell yeah. 8hrs battery life and runs gnome very well also.
I also share your concern!
So now what are the odds of me being able to install an x86-compatible retail copy of OSX on my home-built P4 rig?
Can somebody please explain to me why the Apple Remote still uses IR and not Bluetooth?
I feel sure that there must be some reason, even if it isn't a very good one. But I can't think of a thing.
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something" - Plato
Cheaper and easier. No pairing your remote with your computer (something the technical set can do easily, but not necessarily ma and pa), and even at large volumes Bluetooth chips are still quite a bit more expensive than plain ol' IR.
If it ain't broke...
I don't think that's what he was getting at :) I think it was more of /.ers not HAVING girlfriends in the first place; or maybe Pamela Handerson or Thumbileena and her 4 friends.
actually, can i get that as with a double boca patty with soy cheese, wrapped in lettuce and hold the special sauce.
> AMD has the capacity. Apple's reasons are elsewhere.
You are failing to understand what Apple is. Apple is not a hardware maker, flextronics and co do that. Apple is not a software maker, if software were a profit center they would be selling it on Dells. Apple is selling a high end Brand Experience to the sort of people who wouldn't be caught dead in a brand of jeans also sold at Walmart. To do that, any other branded subcomponent must also be seen as a premium Brand Name. Intel is that and AMD is not.
What the longterm effect of Walmart selling iPods is going to be on the prestige of Apple's brand remains to be seen.
Democrat delenda est
I believe it's right here:
c id=14439119
http://apple.slashdot.org/comments.pl?sid=173554&
There is no theory of evolution. Just a list of animals Chuck Norris allows to live.
I work with long form video. I have a dual proc, dual core at work and a 17" powerbook fpr home and travel. I regularly have to edit and encode 1 hour, 2 hour plus programs and the quicktimes are generally about 10 to 20 gigs and more. The encoded program stream mpegs for broadcast playback are much smaller. I have to regularly transfer files over our gig-e network and filled up my powerbook's 100 gig drive two-thirds full with apps and supporting files. I HAVE to use a firewire drive for protability. Then I have to transfer them to and from our SAN (which my and other workstations are connected to by fiber). Transfering a large file is faster with firewire 800 as opposed to 400.
I think the new intel based notebooks are lacking 800 to diferentiate the initial product offering from the current maxed out powerbooks. Never mind that FCP wont work on it for the next 6 months anyway. Plus Intel is all about USB...
I thought the reason FW800 wasn't taking off were the bugs on both platforms that often kept it so it was slower than FW400.
It does sort of sound like something you'd be asked if you want fries with...
Good point, I hadn't really thought of that. I suppose that's only going to be a *real* problem for people doing HD video, though, huh? I mean, I don't know what the cause of your problems were, but I've *never* had problems importing DV via FW800, even on a ( really ) 800Mhz G4 iMac... maybe there was a controller issue you were having?
In any event, the "MacBook Pro" is undoubtedly much more ready to edit video on-the-go than current PowerBooks, and FW400 is fine for importing DV-quality video, and USB2.0 is there as well, so... I'm guessing the only issues that might *really* arise fo rthe on-the-go video editor is if they're doing HD or want faster access to disc drives than FW400 or USB2.0 offer. Sadly, I see a lot of things going to USB2.0...
Of course, I suppose you could always use that ExpressCard slot to host a Firewire 800 card, though, couldn't you? Since it's such a specialized need, I guess Apple could be forgiven for providing the ports more commonly needed...
For that matter, the new iMacs are likely to outrun all current PowerMacs but the dual dual core. That's bound to be a bit of a marketing problem.
Only if selling iMacs instead of PowerMacs is a problem, really, I guess :-). They'll get their PowerMacs updated by the end of the year, probably in less than 6 months or so... I'm guessing it's not really going to be a problem. Forget PowerMac sales, though... who is going to buy a Mac mini now??
"we all see the irony comparing today with Job's vitriolic hatred of Intel when he returned to Apple in the 90's,"
Jobs never "hated" Intel and to think he did misses an important point.
Jobs is a salesman, and he doesn't love anything except what he's trying to sell you now. He never loved power pc anymore than he hated intel. He doesn't love the ipod except that it makes money.
Do you perhaps get the point?
With all this buzz, I wonder. What the #*$( is the battery life on this beast? The mac site is completely devoid of details on the matter.
about pro apps (such as Photoshop) not being available in native versions yet. You won't want to get her an Intel-based Mac for another six months or so.
Aaah-haa! Oww!
I was thinking more about USB, DVI, and 802.11. But whatever.
Why yes, I AM a rocket scientist!
The CrackBook Ho. (Props to Ed.)
So I can see how GP might see a connection. I'd be more concerned about Bush's warrantless internet wiretapping though.
I don't think the government would have much luck slipping the code by us proles unless Apple_iSight.kext is NOT part of the open source Darwin core. According to Apple Developer Documentation, that kext is primarily concerned with iris state. I am unsure of source availability.
It is also worth mentioning that various intelligence agencies of the US government *physically disable* built in microphones in their computer hardware routinely before deployment. I would assume the same would go for a built in camera.
Can't wait to leech Mac OS X 10.4.4 off BitTorrent! 10.4.1 runned like a piece of shit on VMware, now it's still gonna need acceleration for nVidia graphic cards tho.
You just got troll'd!
I know everyone is fixed on the hardware issues, but has anyone noticed the amount of space Aperture takes when fully installed? 5GB! Why so much?
Hell, if I can get a magnetic power cord in a rice cooker, why should I get this Apple thingy? Just because it looks cool?
Apple seems to think that their fancy "Dual-core processors," "Unix-based OS," "Bundled multimedia and productivity software," "Integrated full-motion webcam," and "remote control" are useful features. All people really want is a quick-disconnect power cord (and maybe some capability for heating food.) Apple may be riding high on the strength of the iPod now, but sooner or later everyone except the elitist beret-wearing arts majors will realize that they can get a magnetic cord for thousands less. When that happens, mark my words, Apple's stock price will crash to earth.
The US free market: two halves of a government-granted duopoly are free to set the market price.
OK, so they have OSX for X86. But what about the apps? What if I like a particular little freeware thing that was done for OSX PPC? I can't run it on X86, can I?
http://store.apple.com/1-800-MY-APPLE/WebObjects/A ppleStore.woa/wo/StoreReentry.wo?productLearnMore= M9267G%2FA
The MacBook Pro does have DVI-Out, and the above adaptor will give you the S-video. I've heard thought that a lot of the new TV's coming out have DVI inputs as well, which is why they probably dropped the S-video.
Well, personally I vehemothly hate the x86 instruction set. It is woefully inelegant, backwards, and should have been replaced with something much better 20 years ago before everybody jumped on the bandwagon. I am dreaming of a brand new computer with a brand new, elegant architecture and with a brand new operating system, but I don't think that will ever happen, thanks to compatibility and other issues.
I also disagree with the Mac users saying that the core of the Mac is ONLY the operating system, as if the architecture and hardware meant nothing. To me, nothing is further from the truth. Let's say that you can buy a Dell with OS X for $299. Is it a Mac? Well, under your definition of a Macintosh, it is. Are those AMD64s with cracked versions of OS X for x86 Macs, too? Under that definition, they're Macs, too. The Mac, to me, is much more than an operating system. The Mac (and the NeXT computers; I'll include them here) not only had the best overall operating system, but was also equipped great hardware and they were different. That nice, sleek looking Mac 128k, Mac SE/30, NeXTSTATION, Quadra 640, PowerBook G3 Pismo, iMac G4, or Power Mac G5 on your desk weren't just your typical PCs; they had some of the best and most innovative hardware that you can find. The Mac is more than just an operating system; it is the sum of all parts. It is not only a very good operating system, but it had very good and unique hardware and very good design (especially of Macs made from 1998 onward). Unfortunately, that uniqueness is now gone.
However, I'll credit to Intel when credit is due. Intel did do a few things right in the last few years. Sure, their instruction set is a heaping pile of crap, and they went down the wrong road with their Pentium 4 and their Itanic^WItaninum fiascal. However, instead of Intel sticking to their Pentium 4s and promoting the megahertz myth, they decided to do work on processors that didn't heat your house yet performed just as well. The end result? The Pentium M and the Yonah chips. They run cool and they perform well, to the point that the beat out the G5 in performance, which is a very great chip. The only thing that sucks about these Intel processors now is their instruction set (which doesn't reflect its internal architecture; ever since the Pentium Pro days, Intel learned that they can design RISC-like processors yet keep a compatibility layer for their old instruction set). And the instruction set is only of importance to programmers and computer scientists; how many Joe Average types need to interact with the x86 assembler to get their work done?
Apple chose Intel because the PowerPC architecture wasn't getting them what Apple wanted. Apple needed cooler chips that performed well, and that wasn't on IBM's roadmap.
Yes, some of the unique characteristics of the Mac are gone now. I still feel, just like you, that an Apple Macintosh computer has now turned into just another x86 PC. I wish that there were more choices on the market; instead of having to buy an x86, I can buy from a selection of architectures. I still feel that the worst architecture (x86) won out (look at Alpha, SPARC, and the PowerPC now), and many of us x86-haters feel like we lost our last friend to the x86 giant. However, Apple's switch had nothing to do with marketing numbers, Intel bunnies, or anything like that. It had to do simply with Apple's needs.
In the meanwhile, we can dream of Cell machines running an operating system that is superior to OS X in every way. If only....
/nt
Forget installing Windows -- who cares? Let's get Mac on Linux running on these suckers, and then you can have your cake and eat it, too...
If I recall, Firewire uses a separate controller, thus another chip in the tight design. USB uses the processor to keep the implementation cost low.
Further you don't have as much customer confusion between ports and cable types and powered vs unpowered ports.
I mostly agree with you, but this sentence is exactly backwards.
With USB, you have two completely different cable ends: "A" and "B", to geeks. Every cable has both. Want to plug your two computers together? Get a Firewire cable, because USB can't do this directly.
With USB, the power/bandwidth mystery is truly a mystery (and I'm a USB developer!). Your PC has USB2.0! -- but not on the keyboard, where it's only USB1.1 (and 40 times slower). And 1/5th of USB's already-wimpy power there. Does anybody actually like having to use separate power bricks for all their USB devices that require more power than a keyboard? Oh, and even if you have a USB2.0 hub, it likely has only one transaction translator, so you get USB1.1 bandwidth shared among all USB1.1 devices on it, even though you've got plenty of upstream bandwidth.
It would be cool to see Firewire 800 take off, because it offers even more advantages: more flexible topologies, longer cable runs (up to 100 meters!), more cable types. Basically, the bandwidth of Firewire 800 is one of the least impressive things about it, which speaks volumes, because it's twice as fast as Firewire-400 or USB2!
::sigh::
POWER is alive and well, and Apple is certainly not the only vendor, in fact they're a minor reseller. I love Apple POWER based machines, I have a g4 powerbook and love it, but honestly POWER is being pushed far more by, say, the fact that all 3 of the next gen game consoles are POWER based, or the massive amount of ppc based servers sold by IBM, or the various integrated circutry that uses paired down ppc architecture.
Frankly, to IBM, Apple's business was almost insignificant, they sell far more CPUs elsewhere than they ever did to Apple...
Apple didnt kill ppc, they never had it to kill. Sure, there won't be many all purpose consumer ppc based machines when Apple is done killing their ppc lines, but the Architecture as a whole is alive and thriving, and far more ppl will buy the Xbox360, the PS3, or the Revolution than would ever buy Apple...
"goodbye and hello, as always" ~Prince Corwin, from Zelazny's Amber series
Oh... you said Dell :-P
I think the motherboard in these new Powerbooks are using a pretty generic Intel MB and that is how they were able to get them to market so quickly. I would guess that a future rev with more design input from Apple will add FW800. Is FW800 even a part of Intel's standard chipsets?
What, $2? $5? When did Apple become Dell / Wal-Mart?
If your line of sight is broken, so is your control. But I did just think of a good reason: battery life.
"Wise men talk because they have something to say; fools, because they have to say something" - Plato
Sorry, but you are totally full of crap. They are EFI, not BIOS. If you have never seen 10.4.4 for Intel, your information is pretty old.
Here is the link for the keynote: http://macworld.apple.com.edgesuite.net/mw/index.h tml
Attitudes make the difference between Space and Time: we want to MAX our temporal, and MIN our spatial extension.
I slid on my 2nd Gen iPod when I crashed my motorcycle. It has a big jagged scratch on one edge (to match the corresponding hole in my leather vest's pocket), but it continues to function flawlessly.
It's not offtopic, dumbass. It's orthogonal.
Personally I'm disappointed that Apple didn't provide the option to buy the 2 and 2.16 ghz processors. I assume they are either saving these for the 17" model or for the next revision when production volumes are sufficient. Also, what's with rolling a one new model of notebook when you have 3 models in each of your two lines?? To me it would seem likely that there will be another annoucement sometime in the next 3 weeks. And what about the Mac Minis?? All these rumors of new killer mac mini PVRs and then nothing. I'll definitely buy one of these new macs when they hit 2/2.16 ghz but until then I'll put up with Windows.
Surely VirtualPC (once it's recompiled under Rosetta) will SCREAM on these new machines. Isn't that even better than running two OSs in isolation?
The G4-based Macs have already been obselete for a couple of years - they just haven't been replaced yet.
My 667MHz Powerbook disagrees.
It cannot run Aperture but that's about it - I am still using it for Photoshop and inDesign work quite well.
I also have a G5 desktop so I know what speedy is, but even very old G4's have a lot of work left in them - ask Adobe, as Lightroom will run on 'em. If they are obsolete why do they keep getting new software and OS updates?
You must be thinking of Windows where you have to have a 3GHz processor to have enough cycles left to run a word processor after the virus scanner finishes with the CPU. I know that as well, since I have such a beast at work.
"There is more worth loving than we have strength to love." - Brian Jay Stanley
PowerBook : MacBook :: PowerMac : MacMac
cat
I'vehonestly never understood the whole PC thing. PC stands for Personal Computer doesn't it? And aren't macs Personal computers?
Even Apple doesn't call its own computers "PCs." Just visit apple.com and look at the first words in big bold letters at the top of the page.
Not hardly. Firewire is usually lots faster than GigE (lots of overhead for TCP and NFS or SMB, not to mention it's processor intensive). Of course, a single hard drive can't really keep up to any one of them.
Is "do you want fries with that?"
I wonder when the McDonald's comparisons are going to start.
+++ATH0
One reason is work!
.NET and Java applications. Developing with .NET I need VS.NET which only runs on windows.
:)
As a consultant I develop
Even as a Java developer every company I ever worked has a Microsoft/Active Directory environment which specifically mandates which Windows to use as well as what other software (Updates, Remote Desktop facility, etc) that need to be installed. Though we always deploy to a corporate Unix or Redhat AS, we must develop in a windows environment.
My current setup is:
Home: iMac G5
Work: Windows XP / Fujitsu Lifebook
I would idealy love being able to have Windows XP running on a Mac laptop, and dual booting to OS X when i get home.
Windows on Mac would allow my next laptop to be a MacBook.
Besides who wouldn't want to play F.E.A.R, Far Cry, DOOM 3, and Half-Life 2 on a Mac
How could the intel duo be faster than my g5 supercomputer? :(
They should lock it so that MacOS can run on anything but nothing can run on Macintoshes but OSX. That might sacrifice a bit of performance and apple wouldn't like that. But it would introduce a subset of people to OSX and therefore, they will in turn, like it or not, and if they like it, chances are, they will buy a Mac.
Like the other guy said, get a DVI adapter. They actually used to ship them with Macs for a while.
The feature I'VE been waiting for (and the presumably last line of Powerbooks has it too) is the optical digital audio out... movie night in surround sound!
I had trouble editing video on a PowerBook with FireWire 400 and a PowerMac G4. When I upgraded to a PowerMac G5, using its FireWire 400, the problem disappeared. So my point is that differences that people attribute to using a slow interface are actually due to a slow processor. This is probably what Apple discovered in testing. I doubt that they simply abandoned FireWire 800 customers without some thought.
I seem to recall, in fact, that even FireWire 400 data rates were substantially faster than most disk drives and so it should matter little to nothing if you're using FireWire 400 or 800 in that application.
It seems intiutive that the new PowerBooks are likely to be very similar in speed to the PowerMacs we have now, with the exception of the Quad-G5. I guess any "Mac Pro" models (since the word Power is said to be dead) are going to have to be pretty powerful to surpass their portable brothers.
It's looking like quite the exciting year. I hope they create a 17" Intel PowerBook - I just got a 17" PowerBook and really love the big theatrical screen experience, so I would be loath to return to a 15" model even to get the promised 4x speed increases.
I'm pretty happy with my purchase, which is less than a month old, even though it's now theoretically "obsolete". If they'd introduced a 17" MacBook, I would probably be a lot grumpier.
D
I bought a 17" mac 2 weeks ago, not knowing that the conference was on and not being told by the store I bought it from so I am fuming. I am interesting to see if I should expect some kind of service from the apple store that I bought my mac from.
See blog: Blog.
Why do that to yourself?
Because I can. Your needs may vary, but the reason I love linux is because I can tinker with it at any level. That will never be possible with OSX or windows
Not necessarily.
This sig left blank for page turns.
I bought a DualG5 2.5 GHz because I need a fair amount of cpu power and the MacOS to run a variety of audio/video/dsp apps simultaneously in realtime. I was right on the brink of selling the DualG5 to buy a QuadG5 as I have no trouble peaking out the CPU's on this machine and I figured the Quad would be an easy transition. Steve Jobs just told the world in his Keynote address that the entire product line will be migrating to Intel. As everything transfers to Intel, so do the apps I depend on. At this point it just doesn't make any sense to buy a QuadG5 as I'm afraid the software designers will ultimately abandon the PPC platform and the value of the Quad G5 will also plummet by the end of 2006 as apple introduces the new high performance tower. Not only will the power of the new machine dwarf the Quad G5, but by then, the world will realize that G5 software support is quickly running out. I'm sure at some point apple will introduce a reverse version of Rosetta just like they did for the 68k platform.....However:
This wouldn't be such a pressing issue if it weren't for the fact that I need my apps to run natively so that they can monopolize the cpu's as needed. I bought the dualG5 because I need the performance of both the machine and the OS and the unique apps that run in MacOS only. It appears as though the resale value of a DualG5 is about to plunge as well. Even the new intel iMac gives it a run for its money.
Normally depreciation is only affected by the performance of new hardware. Now current hardware will depreciate twofold as the extinction of the platform is on the horizon.
People in that particular niche can pay for a Firewire 800 card to go in the expansion slot without much trouble.
Actually, probably not. People who do that kind of work usually live paycheck-to-paycheck existances without health insurance, retirement plans, or a company behind them. They're only as good as the last piece of video they turned in and have no contracts or job security whatsoever. You obviously have no idea what you're talking about.
-- I'm old enough to have lived through six different meanings of the word "hacker."
Uh, it's not a Pentium Pro, dude. The Pentium brand is no longer existant, in that there will never be another new "Pentium" CPU developed. Intel has abandoned the Pentium brand and is creating a whole new processor brand. It's kind of been like, all over every news site, including this one, so yeah... heh.
BTW, the processor is called the Intel Core Duo.
The replacement for the missing S-Video port is the Apple Video Adapter that has been shipping since the Powermac G5 systems and works with the Mini. It would make sense for it to work with the MacBook Pro.
Wine works GREAT like darwin works for PPC but you need to recompile software(Because win exe's are x86 binaries and would need emulation for PPC) So basically now mac is x86 you WILL be able to run wine, Though wines support for some stuff is pretty bad and may cause problems in the future(Dotnet framework for example) Personally if i can i will partition use a REAL bootloader(LiLo or Grub) install Windows,Strip it down for the shit i dont want, a few registry hacks etc etc etc. But the real thing people are forgetting in all of this dual boot stuff is driver support, While most hardware there will be win drivers im sure there will be proprietry shite in there somewhere.
Alternatively, they could just use their Bluetooth phone to send and receive faxes from their Mac.
All editorial writers ever do is come down from the hill after the battle is over and shoot the wounded.
It's true that it's not very upgradable. However, given that everything in it is going to become obsolete at more or less the same rate anyway, why not just sell it and get a new one each time Apple releases a new model? Macs have good resale value, you know, so it would probably be cheaper than getting new $500 graphics cards all the time...
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
Half-Life (1 and 2). Find me a Mac or Linux version of it and I'll never use Windows again. Of course, I'd really have to grit my teeth to install Windows even for that; I'm really hoping I can use something like WINE instead.
"[Regarding the 'cloud,'] ownership was what made America different than Russia." -- Woz
OT: I love your sig.
Why would they bother with trying to preclude Windows from the Apple hardware?
I'm sure they'd like to sell as much hardware as they can, and wouldn't mind all that much if people went and purchased it from them (regardless of what they do with it afterwards.....
No apple product has ever had a CD Key or anything similar.
Well, none did until the release of iWork '05. I can verify that it requires the use of a CD Key type validation after installation to work.
I can't imagine anyone would ever need more than (1^100)^(1^100) bytes of RAM... Me need more than one byte of RAM.
dum de dum de dum de dum de dum
I just bought iWork a few weeks ago, and had to enter a CD key when I installed it.
Build a man a fire, he's warm for one night. Set him on fire, and he's warm for the rest of his life.
Its still the same basic core as the original pentium pro oh so long ago. There have been some improvments (tacking on some SSE versions, new steppings and processes) but the basic core is the same. The pipeline length and stages are identical. Not much has really changed.
It's easier to fight for one's principles than to live up to them.
Unlike power, ethernet actually locks into the port. I'd be more worried about ethernet pulling stuff down. Or... does everyone just use wireless these days?
I hope the don't go from PowerMac to MacTop.
I was at MacWorld today and the Verizon people said that they have a ExpressCard/34 based EVDO "AirCard" coming out very soon. So no worries!
Really, it was designed for consoles first, with the PC version as kind of a lackluster afterthought. As a result, the inventory system is fundamentally horrible and resembles Resident Evil 1. The story is OK, but I think it suffers from the Matrix Re-suckage phenomenon: you already know about aliens, the illuminati, and the Helios AI. The whole game does not show nearly the polish and love that the first one did.
Get Half-Life 2. You won't be disappointed.
Any clues?
So, to upgrade from the "lower end" model to the "higher end" model, first let's make them as comparable as we can.
1. Add 512 MB of RAM to the "lower end" so that it is 2x512 (1 GB) --> $2099
2. Downgrade the "higher end" from single 1 GB chip to 2x512 MB of RAM --> $2399
We now have a $300 difference. What we get for this $300 (14% increase in cost):
1. Upgrade processor from 1.67 GHz to 1.83 GHz (10% increase)
2. Upgrade HDD from 80 GB to 100 GB (25% increase)
3. Upgrade VRAM from 128 MB to 256 MB (100% increase)
Let's say that I will not be doing any DVD editing, 3D modeling, or gaming. The primary use of the machine will be for sound editing. Is the $300 worth it for the only part of the upgrade I'll take advantage of, the 10% increase in CPU clock speed?
MORTAR COMBAT!
Umm, Pentium Pro was phased out in what 96, 97? And you are telling me it has been all over this news site as if it is some new fad I missed out on? It was a damn joke.
--
WHO ATE MY BREAKFAST PANTS?
good info, bad news for productivity. :(
MORTAR COMBAT!
I hope so - with that problem solved, the MacBook Pro would make an ideal laptop for my purposes. Now all we need is for EMC to announce that VMware Workstation will be available for the Intel Macs (should be easy enough - it already runs on Linux) and these could be darn close to perfect!
-- Josh Turiel
"2. Do not eat iPod Shuffle."
The last time I was in a war zone, I was forced to split a man open with my canteen because I couldn't get the full 800Mbps transfer rate to my external hard drive. Nevermind the fact I couldn't find a power supply for that thing anywhere in the desert... that mofo had to die!
"Quoting famous computer scientists out of context is the root of all evil (or at least most of it) in programming." - K
But they're the same person.
I looked for that too. One of the features I love the most is that I can sit on the couch working on my Powerbook after dinner and work until Leno or Letterman is half over, at which point I go to bed. I feel sorry for those poor souls, including myself, when I buy my own personal MacBook at the end of the year. Maybe I'll just get an iMac and throw my mini on top of the TV. Hack a little FrontRow, buy a remote, a little AppleScript to tie it all together. But I digress...
I'm not sure how it's going to be four times faster, either. Most everything I run on my 1.67 PowerPC seems to run about the same as my old 3.0 P4 w/HT. Maybe with the Mac OS it'll be faster (than Linux or WinXP)...
Have you seen their commercial?
The intel chip. For years it has been trapped inside PCs. Inside dull little boxes; dutifully performing dull little tasks, when it could have been doing... so much more. Starting today, the Intel chip will be set free, and get to live life, inside a Mac. Imagine the possibilities.
Apple's Intel ad.
And a lesser question is can it run OS 9 apps in the Classic environment? (Some of us still have some beloved old pre-OS X apps.)
That that is is that that that that is not is not.
[...]looks less like an Apple product and more like a laptop from a company that rhymes with "Hell"
The guy's got x-ray vision... he can see the intel, inside.
So now that PC's and Mac's will share the same architecture, will this mean an end to all the fighting over which is faster?
- Signature, Not Today.
And who rushes out to get brand new laptops as soon as they're released? Not people who live paycheque to paycheque..
Hey, I'm with ya, bro. They already in foment over on Ars. What we gotta do is Stand Together.
To the barricades!
Unfortunately, there are some environments where carpware like Auto-Carp are de-rigeur and the reason Macs are not the platform of choice is entirely because of the CEO of auto-carps relationship with bill-the-gates. Hopefully for those now trapped in that cesspool, WINE will... A: be available, B: not require payment of tribute to micro-carp and C: not be susceptible to windoze viri.
The most important bit of the keynote came near the end: "In 2006 ALL of the Apple products will move to Intel processors." So that means that even the PowerMac G5, the so called "Pro" machines, are moving to Intel processors?
"It usualy starts with some screaming. Afterwards there is much running around."
Hey, I won't tolerate you destroying my fantasies with logic! EN GUARD! *wields plastic lightsaber*
windows?
you thought i was gonna say linux, heheh! no seriously, could this run windows?
btw, did anyone notice that the official site http://www.apple.com/macbookpro/ doesn't even show the official intel logo, weird!?
http://www.apple.com/se/macbookpro/ says "Wait no more. MacBook Pro starts at just 26,495 kronor.", but the apple store webpage says 21.295,00 for the cheapest one and 26.495,00 for the more expensive modell, so I guess they just made a small misstake and posted the wrong price. Still more expensive in Sweden but not THAT bad.
:)
For the same price as a 1.66ghz dual core, 512MB, 80GB 5400 rpm, x1600 128MB, 15.4" 1440x900/990 MacBook you can get a 1.66ghz dual core, 2GB, 80GB 7200 rpm, 7800 go 256MB, 17" 1920x1200 dell inspiron 9400 thought.
Are the quality of the later ones really that bad? Awesome specs
IIRC Firewire becomes slower than GigE when you start daisy chaining devices. Firewire devices on a chain compete for bandwidth. GigE devices on a network don't have to compete for bandwidth.
I'm just wondering how this got modded as "informative".
Thanks, but we'll keep calling them Macs for so long as they run Macintosh OS.
;)
*ahem* They don't run MacOS anymore, or at least not the same one
Of course, the original post is wrong, since trademarks don't have to be tied to the actual technology, but I see a point here. (Compare how on the articles about new Amigas in the past, we had to wade through hundreds of "But it's not an Amiga!" whining, which strangely often got modded up whilst pointing out the same here is a Troll.)
I currently can pack a laptop off somewhere and do some work on the application while I'm there. I can meet client needs while I'm away if needs be.
Until I can get a Mac running Windows to do this, I'll stick with a PC, which isn't my first choice.
Sell off the Powerbook for a premium, and get yourself a z60m or wait for the T60p. Unlike Apple, they're quite well documented in repairs, and can be upgradable as they're built to be worked on(but are fine without it).
If you really have to be this concerned with power in the laptop, Apple really isnt going to go that direction with portables, and the closest you really can come is a T42p/T43p/z60m or wait for the dual core T60p.
Twitter supports and protects racists - by smearing their critics with the "Hate Speech" label.
If their job depends on getting a $100 expansion card, they will of course do it, and write it off on tax. They would have to do the same with any laptop anyway, since very few have Firewire 800. When you are buying a $2000 laptop, an extra $100 for an expansion card is not much if you really need it.
IntelMacintosh, apparently
Maybe they should remoniker it Imac.
"We are all geniuses when we dream"
- E.M. Cioran
I could probably live without doing it, but I'd rather have the option that if the client calls me, and I'm away from home, that I can change it.
It's not primary, though. Essentially, I want OSX and that Unix base. Just that having the choice to use Windows too would be great.
Woah, I wasn't paying attention much. Now I really want one. I would more than likely run Windows 90% of the time, but boot back to OS X for DVD authoring and that really neat looking videoconferencing app (assuming it works well).
Upon further examination, I may be full of crap about the "right now" bit. Depending on whether Apple changed the motherboard configuration, Winders might not directly install easily.
So it might take a little time before people work out how to dual boot. But it'll be done.
There are no trails. There are no trees out here.
On the other hand, Windows XP does fairly nasty stuff with any existing MBRs, so unless OS X is designed or patched to cope with the XP installer there would be a problem.
The new macs are using EFI as their firmware, which means no MBRs. (Well there is a legacy MBR, but the firmware ignores it.) You should be able to have as many OS's as you want co-existing, although I don't know anyone who has actually seen Apple's implementation yet. As an aside, EFI should also manage all the functions of the traditional boot-loader.
The same question has been asked with each generation of the iMac line. The original CRT G3 machines were priced very attratively for performance next to the pro models when they were released. Same with the lampshade G4s, and with the flat G5s.
When the iMac line gets to the point where it's slipping next to the pro models, it's been freshened with a new design. Apple's extremely conscious of how their range of products fits the spaces in the market, as anyone who's considered an iPod knows. Start thinking about a shuffle, and you ladder up by $50 increments until you hit your sweet spot.
The one case where the "pro" line hasn't bumped up to compete was the languishing G4 PowerBook line -- so hello "MacBook," and the intel processors necessary for it.
"Fundamentalism" isn't about divine morality. It's about human authority.
Though, for their top end apps like Logic Pro and Final Cut pro, there have been dongles.
And I lift my glass to the awful truth which you can't reveal to the ears of youth except to say it isn't worth a dime.
about 2 weeks ago, I bought a 20" imac (before I heard about the new intel chips in the imacs). I guess I should have waited till after Macworld but didn't think that Apple would update the iMac so soon. Should I try to exchange the imac or am I screwed either way- the one I have now is slower than the intel version but the intel version is running software not optimized for it? What am I better off with and what are the trade-offs? Advice appreciated
Another big reason is battery life. There's a lot more overhead with bluetooth, a constant connection maintaining protocol, as opposed to an event driven model for IR which only has to use power when it actually wants to send a command. which would you prefer, battery life of a few days/weeks or a few months/years?
- tristan
I guess I'd have to ask details like "what sort of trouble did you have editing video", but the point I was making is that I *frequently* edit video on an 800Mhz G4 iMac without issues. Also, the point of an interface like Firewire is that the CPU is completely uninvolved in the I/O transfer; your CPU should technically have no impact on your Firewire performance.
I doubt that they simply abandoned FireWire 800 customers without some thought.
I'm sure they didn't, too... I think they noticed that everyone is using USB 2.0 hard drives, and that Firewire400 is *faster* than even an HD data stream requires. I think they thought about it very, very carefully, and decided that the extremely small number of Powerbook users who absolutely require Firewire800 performance would be savy enough to get an ExpressCard Firewire800 adapter.
I hope they create a 17" Intel PowerBook
I'm sure it's just a matter of time... but it'll probably be at least 8-12 months, so you'll have at least a little bit of time to enjoy that 17" laptop before getting *too* grumpy.
"Really, on a laptop, hitting cntrl and the mouse-button is very easy to boot."
Stop staying this. It is not. I dont' know how you compute...but it's an awful compromise.
Why not use the mighty mouse technology where a tap on one side is different that a tap on the other side.
Would all of you guys stop apologizing and making up stuff when Apple does something utterly dumb? Its real old and no matter how much you defend apple's stupid decisions, its still a stupid decision. Stop it already.
I would really like some manufacturer to develope an eSATA Express Card adapter for these new MacBooks. How about it? Anyone know of someone with this product currently? It would awesome to have that throughput with multiple external eSATA drives (for audio and video of course). I'm pretty sure that the new Express Card format allows for a larger amount of designated bandwidth than the old PCMIA card slot. I would love to have a Raptor drive in a eSATA case right beside me whilst editing! Much faster than firewire 800.....
They do if you want to talk to them from the same computer. Your machine has one GigE connection, so if you want to talk to two network devices at once, they have to share that bandwidth. If you have two devices on the same Firewire bus then they also have to share that connection.
Switchted Ethernet is good if A wants to talk to B and C wants to talk to D. But if A wants to talk to B and C it's no different than Firewire.
I used a Mac in 1995 and it didn't even have color!
I'll never use a Mac again!!
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Comment removed based on user account deletion
The developer kits have long been known to be quite different internaly from anything they plan on shipping.
James P. Barrett
I'd like to point out one thing everyone seems to be ignoring:
OPTICAL FUCKING I/O
They can call it SourGrapesBook for all I care, the damned thing finally has optical I/O on-board. Now if they can just get that into AirPort Express... which they probably will. They can rename it SuperHappyFunRouter... see if I care, I'll be WAAAAY too busy streaming 24/96 audio directly to my stereo.
Well just type "photocasting" in google and check out your first hit. Is it Apple? No, currently it is a post from over two months ago from chris pirillo's web site showing how to setup PHOTOCASTING with flickr and the PSP.
/ 1337933.html
http://chris.pirillo.com/blog/_archives/2005/11/2
Attribution is just not in Apple's DNA.
-SR
Very insightful comment. The level of silly fantasizing on rumor sites is strange indeed, and you've aptly nailed it.
Can somebody please tell me if this Core Duo chip is 64 bits? I can't find that one bit of information anywhere. Perhaps my google mojo is dead...
Oh, and if you have an answer, feel free to flame me too.
My amazing wife - Artist, Author, Philosopher - Laurie M
Just in case someone has interesting insights on this question, I'm going to answer.
When I tried using my external FireWire 400 drive to edit video on either my G4/450 dual processor or my G4/400 TiBook, I was able to capture video OK but when I tried playing it back it was jerky to the point of unusability.
As far as FireWire 400 versus 800 goes, I'm afraid the egos of users may get in the way of common sense. Sure FireWire 800 didn't actually improve performance that much, but it felt good to be cutting edge with your fancy new LaCie drive with FireWire 800. I'm afraid this, and not real capacity, may be the actual issue here.
Maybe the next generation of PowerBooks will have Fibre Channel adapters? That seems like the next logical step.
Or, better yet, a new 17" PowerBook with the whole case filled with 120gb drives (or whatever the maximum capacity is by then). I'd say you should be able to squeeze 3-4 drives in this case and that would be enough for all but the most demanding remote production applications. Of course that would require a mammoth battery too, but of course the drives would only spin up when they were being actively used.
I love this machine - for the project I'm doing now it's nearly ideal - but I do salivate at the dual core processors on the new model. I doubt that it would benchmark all that much faster, but being able to process photos and video in the background while doing other work would make it well worth the price.
D
The nerve!
I love you theatre geeks. You all just made me more at home on Slashdot than ever before. Now is Charles Manson supposed to go kill Steve Jobs' wife while he's off at Cupertino directing the creation of the MacBook?
/.? I guess we'll find out soon when something wicked this way comes (the mods).
Note: I cannot find any links for this, but Roman Polanski was directing MacBeth in 1969 (released in 1971) when his pregnant wife Sharon Tate was murdered by Charles Manson's "family". Is this too macabre for
They dropped the iPod Mini without a moments notice when it was the best-selling mp3 player. A company that does that... could do anything. :)
Everyone is entitled to his own opinions, but not his own facts.
The MacBook Pro's got 1.05 performance/Watt, while the old G4 had 0.27 Performance/Watt.
AC's modded -6. I don't see you, I don't mod you, anything you say is lost. Don't like it? Don't be a coward.
Uh, 450 and 400 Mhz G4s? In video playback, dual processors isn't going to help... how much memory did these systems have? Were any other programs running?
It could simply be that the CPU wasn't quite up to the task at hand, or that there wasn't enough available memory to keep the video fully updated. In any event, it certainly isn't likely that Firewire figured into the equation at all, unless the video was on an external FW drive, and even then... it sounds like processor, disk, or memory are more likely issues. Just guesses, of course.
Maybe the next generation of PowerBooks will have Fibre Channel adapters? That seems like the next logical step.
For what, running a network server on your laptop? Mabye someone might make an ExpressCard/34 adapter for that, but... talk about overkill... nah. No need for all of that. You're hard-pressed to use up FW800's bandwidth.
I do salivate at the dual core processors on the new model. I doubt that it would benchmark all that much faster
Well, on multi-threaded benchmarks, it should be nearly twice as fast, really...
Also, the new has a 60 watt hour lithium-polymer battery, and the old had a 58 watt hour lithium-ion. (Is there a difference?)
The same dual CPU system worked great in video editing as long as I was using internal drives. It was when I went to external drives that there was a problem. The system had 1.5gb RAM. Mail and Safari were usually running, but I seem to remember shutting them down and finding that it didn't affect the results.
... except when he used an external drive. Even though the Protools instruction manual tells you to use an external drive instead of the system disk, I found that copying the data from the external drive to the system disk solved the problem, just as it did when I ran Final Cut Pro on it years ago.
I recently loaned that system to a music composer using Protools who needed a machine. I figured the low CPU performance would be compensated for by the Protools hardware, and so it proved
So there seems to be something about external drive support on at least that particular Mac model that gave it hideous performance problems, even on expensive LaCie drives.
Hope that was interesting.
D
Others can tell you better than I, but it has something to do with the relative value of "funny" vs. "informative" in slashdot-ville. There is some advantage to the poster to be rated "informative."
Currently hooked on AMP
It was. The only data point that I can offer is that I and a friend of mine edit video on external FW400 drives without issue using our 800Mhz and 1Ghz G4 iMacs. I can only assume that there's some issue with the firewire chipset on the laptop, or something else about the design of the system that caused this problem. Weird... this is the first time I've heard of anything like that, but then again... I can't think of anyone I know who has tried to use their laptop to edit video.